Selected quad for the lemma: book_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
book_n	church_n	old_a	testament_n	6,574	5	8.1314	4	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A88948	A reply to Mr. Rutherfurd, or A defence of the answer to Reverend Mr. Herles booke against the independency of churches. VVherein such objections and answers, as are returned to sundry passages in the said answer by Mr. Samuel Rutherfurd, a godly and learned brother of the Church of Scotland, in his boke entituled The due right of Presbyters, are examined and removed, and the answer justified and cleared. / By Richard Macher [sic] teacher to the church at Dorchester in New England. 1646.	Mather, Richard, 1596-1669.	1647 (1647)	Wing M1275; Thomason E386_9; ESTC R201478	144,474	133

do_v acknowledge_v it_o follow_v unavoidable_o thereupon_o that_o all_o congregationall_a church_n such_o as_o have_v neighbour_n and_o such_o as_o have_v none_o may_v exercise_v such_o entireness_n of_o jurisdiction_n since_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n do_v agree_v unto_o they_o all_o unless_o he_o will_v deny_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n to_o a_o congregation_n which_o have_v neighbour_n which_o he_o free_o yield_v to_o a_o congregation_n which_o be_v alone_o he_o must_v grant_v entireness_n of_o jurisdiction_n unto_o they_o both_o because_o he_o grant_v it_o to_o the_o one_o upon_o this_o reason_n that_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n do_v agree_v thereunto_o which_o reason_n if_o it_o agree_v to_o both_o how_o can_v i●_n be_v avoid_v but_o entireness_n of_o jurisdiction_n must_v be_v in_o both_o and_o how_o can_v it_o be_v affirm_v or_o imagine_v that_o a_o congregation_n have_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n afore_o and_o have_v neighbour_n shall_v lose_v this_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n when_o neighbour_n be_v add_v to_o it_o a_o family_n have_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o family_n now_o it_o be_v alone_o do_v not_o lose_v this_o essence_n by_o mean_n of_o other_o family_n add_v nor_o do_v a_o city_n that_o be_v such_o as_o it_o be_v alone_o lose_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o city_n by_o the_o access_n of_o other_o city_n and_o the_o same_o may_v be_v say_v of_o a_o corporation_n a_o province_n a_o kingdom_n or_o any_o other_o society_n whatsoever_o and_o that_o it_o shall_v be_v otherwise_o with_o a_o congregationall_a church_n that_o it_o shall_v lose_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n as_o other_o neighbour_n church_n do_v arise_v do_v seem_v very_o strange_a and_o unreasonable_a and_o let_v the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n be_v still_o retain_v by_o such_o a_o congregation_n as_o i_o conceive_v it_o must_v and_o then_o entireness_n of_o jurisdiction_n must_v not_o be_v deny_v to_o such_o a_o congregation_n since_o it_o do_v flow_v connatural_o from_o every_o church_n to_o which_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o church_n do_v agree_v if_o there_o be_v no_o more_o consociate_v with_o that_o church_n that_o be_v by_o accident_n and_o a_o extraordinary_a exigence_n of_o god_n providence_n as_o a_o master_n of_o a_o family_n be_v to_o educate_v his_o child_n in_o the_o fear_n of_o god_n but_o if_o god_n take_v all_o his_o child_n from_o he_o by_o death_n he_o do_v not_o transgress_v the_o ordinary_a rule_n of_o educate_v his_o child_n in_o the_o fear_n of_o god_n as_o he_o have_v none_o answ_n if_o this_o comparison_n do_v suit_n the_o present_a purpose_n and_o case_n in_o hand_n than_o this_o master_n of_o a_o family_n be_v a_o congregation_n and_o these_o his_o child_n be_v the_o member_n of_o other_o congregation_n and_o so_o as_o a_o master_n of_o a_o family_n need_v not_o to_o educate_v his_o child_n in_o god_n fear_n when_o they_o be_v all_o take_v from_o he_o by_o death_n so_o a_o congregation_n need_v not_o to_o govern_v the_o member_n of_o other_o congregation_n as_o there_o be_v no_o other_o congregation_n extant_a but_o itself_o be_v leave_v alone_o in_o a_o island_n in_o which_o kind_n of_o argue_v sundry_a thing_n may_v be_v except_v against_o as_o fir●●_n of_o all_o that_o there_o shall_v be_v such_o power_n in_o a_o congregation_n as_o in_o a_o master_n of_o a_o family_n over_o his_o own_o child_n which_o need_v a_o good_a deal_n of_o proof_n afore_o it_o may_v be_v yield_v in_o as_o much_o as_o the_o power_n of_o the_o one_o be_v plain_o and_o plentiful_o teach_v in_o the_o scripture_n as_o eph._n 4._o 6._o col._n 3._o deut._n 6._o 7._o deut._n 21._o and_o many_o other_o place_n but_o i_o desire_v one_o clear_a place_n of_o scripture_n in_o all_o the_o book_n of_o god_n either_o old_a testament_n or_o new_a to_o show_v the_o like_a power_n in_o a_o congregationall_a church_n over_o the_o member_n of_o other_o church_n again_o when_o a_o master_n of_o a_o family_n have_v all_o his_o child_n take_v from_o he_o by_o death_n he_o have_v then_o no_o child_n of_o his_o own_o to_o govern_v but_o want_v a_o congregationall_a church_n &_o be_v leave_v alone_o in_o a_o island_n the_o presbytery_n of_o that_o congregation_n be_v leave_v alone_o but_o have_v still_o the_o member_n of_o that_o congregation_n who_o they_o may_v and_o aught_o to_o guide_v and_o govern_v in_o the_o fear_n of_o god_n which_o be_v another_o particular_a wherein_o the_o comparison_n fail_v but_o though_o the_o similitude_n as_o mr._n rutherford_n have_v lay_v it_o down_o do_v not_o confirm_v his_o purpose_n yet_o i_o conceive_v it_o may_v be_v so_o frame_v and_o apply_v as_o that_o it_o may_v well_o serve_v for_o the_o weekn_n thereof_o thus_o a_o master_n of_o a_o family_n have_v when_o that_o family_n be_v alone_o entire_a power_n to_o govern_v his_o family_n in_o the_o fear_n of_o god_n when_o other_o family_n do_v arise_v that_o become_v neighbour_n near_o adjoin_v he_o be_v not_o by_o this_o mean_v deprive_v of_o the_o power_n which_o he_o have_v before_o but_o still_o retain_v the_o same_o entire_a and_o complete_a as_o former_o it_o be_v even_o so_o the_o presbytery_n of_o a_o congregationall_a church_n have_v when_o that_o congregation_n be_v alone_o entire_a power_n of_o jurisdiction_n over_o its_o own_o member_n be_v not_o when_o neighbour_n congregation_n do_v arise_v deprive_v by_o this_o mean_n of_o the_o power_n which_o it_o have_v before_o but_o still_o retain_v the_o same_o entire_a as_o former_o it_o be_v again_o though_o when_o god_n take_v away_o a_o man_n child_n by_o death_n he_o be_v no_o long_o bind_v to_o educate_v and_o govern_v those_o child_n in_o the_o fear_n of_o god_n yet_o as_o long_o as_o his_o child_n live_v with_o he_o in_o his_o family_n it_o be_v not_o the_o sit_v down_o of_o other_o family_n near_o by_o he_o that_o can_v take_v away_o this_o power_n from_o he_o or_o discharge_v he_o of_o this_o duty_n even_o so_o though_o when_o member_n of_o a_o congregation_n be_v take_v away_o by_o death_n or_o otherwise_o the_o congregation_n or_o its_o presbytery_n do_v no_o long_o stand_v charge_v or_o bind_v with_o the_o oversight_n and_o government_n of_o such_o member_n yet_o as_o long_o as_o they_o live_v in_o the_o congregation_n it_o be_v not_o the_o arise_v of_o other_o congregation_n near_o to_o they_o that_o can_v free_v they_o from_o the_o power_n wherewith_o they_o be_v invest_v nor_o from_o the_o duty_n wherewith_o they_o be_v former_o charge_v towards_o such_o member_n thus_o the_o comparison_n run_v even_o and_o we_o see_v our_o brother_n cause_n be_v not_o a_o little_a disadvantage_v thereby_o but_o as_o he_o have_v lay_v it_o down_o it_o do_v so_o apparent_o fail_v that_o i_o do_v not_o perceive_v how_o it_o can_v afford_v he_o any_o help_n at_o all_o this_o argument_n suppose_v that_o the_o congregation_n have_v no_o power_n of_o excommunication_n at_o all_o either_o complete_a or_o incompleate_a as_o the_o midwife_n have_v no_o power_n to_o baptise_v either_o complete_a or_o incompleate_a answ_n suppose_v a_o congregation_n have_v a_o incompleate_a power_n when_o they_o have_v neighbour_n how_o shall_v it_o appear_v that_o when_o they_o be_v alone_o their_o power_n be_v now_o complete_a or_o how_o will_v it_o be_v avoid_v but_o by_o the_o like_a reason_n one_o elder_a alone_o may_v excommunicate_v in_o case_n there_o be_v no_o other_o elder_n to_o join_v with_o he_o for_o plain_a it_o be_v that_o one_o elder_n when_o their_o be_v a_o full_a presbytery_n or_o classis_fw-la have_v a_o incompleate_a power_n though_o not_o a_o complete_a and_o yet_o i_o hope_v this_o incomplete_a power_n in_o one_o elder_n when_o there_o be_v other_o elder_n join_v with_o he_o will_v not_o warrant_v he_o to_o exercise_v a_o power_n complete_a when_o he_o be_v alone_o because_o such_o a_o power_n must_v be_v exercise_v by_o a_o church_n with_o one_o elder_a alone_n can_v be_v and_o if_o one_o elder_a have_v a_o incomplete_a power_n when_o he_o be_v join_v with_o other_o may_v not_o exercise_v a_o complete_a power_n when_o he_o be_v alone_o how_o will_v the_o incomplete_a power_n of_o a_o congregation_n when_o they_o have_v neighbour_n suppose_v that_o in_o such_o case_n their_o power_n be_v indeed_o incompleate_a how_o will_v this_o i_o say_v warrant_v that_o congregation_n when_o they_o be_v alone_o to_o exercise_v a_o complete_a power_n for_o aught_o i_o see_v the_o complete_a power_n of_o the_o congregation_n be_v no_o more_o warrant_v upon_o this_o ground_n than_o the_o like_a power_n of_o one_o elder_a upon_o the_o same_o ground_n the_o case_n be_v alike_o in_o both_o neither_o do_v a_o congregation_n transgress_v any_o rule_n of_o christ_n at_o all_o when_o it_o exercise_v entire_a power_n of_o censure_n within_o

a_o reply_n to_o mr._n rutherfurd_n or_o a_o defence_n of_o the_o answer_n to_o reverend_a mr._n herles_a book_n against_o the_o independency_n of_o church_n wherein_o such_o objection_n and_o answer_n as_o be_v return_v to_o sundry_a passage_n in_o the_o say_a answer_n by_o mr._n samuel_n rutherfurd_n a_o godly_a and_o learned_a brother_n of_o the_o church_n of_o scotland_n in_o his_o book_n entitle_v the_o due_a right_n of_o presbyter_n be_v examine_v and_o remove_v and_o the_o answer_v justify_v and_o clear_v by_o richard_n ma●her_n teacher_n to_o the_o church_n at_o dorchester_n in_o new_a england_n 1646._o london_n print_v for_o j._n rothwell_n and_o h._n allen_n at_o the_o sun_n and_o fountain_n in_o paul_n churchyard_n and_o the_o crown_n in_o popes-head_n alley_n 1647_o the_o author_n preface_n to_o the_o reader_n christian_n reader_n have_v publish_v some_o year_n ago_o a_o small_a treatise_n in_o way_n of_o a_o brotherly_a answer_n to_o reverend_a master_n herle_v i_o now_o present_a unto_o thy_o view_n a_o defence_n thereof_o against_o such_o objection_n and_o answer_n as_o have_v be_v return_v to_o sundry_a passage_n therein_o by_o reverend_a and_o learned_a master_n rutherfurd_n in_o which_o undertake_v it_o have_v be_v far_o from_o my_o intention_n to_o increase_v or_o uphold_v the_o difference_n that_o have_v appear_v of_o late_a year_n in_o england_n among_o the_o servant_n of_o the_o lord_n about_o matter_n of_o church_n government_n for_o i_o have_v much_o rather_o bring_v prayer_n and_o tear_n for_o the_o quench_n of_o such_o fire_n than_o fuel_n or_o oil_n for_o the_o increase_n thereof_o neither_o shall_v the_o same_o i_o hope_v be_v any_o thing_n at_o all_o increase_v by_o what_o here_o i_o present_v now_o thy_o view_n at_o the_o least_o this_o i_o may_v say_v that_o i_o intend_v no_o such_o thing_n but_o the_o contrary_a even_o the_o promote_a of_o truth_n and_o peace_n if_o it_o be_v the_o will_n of_o god_n so_o to_o bless_v my_o desire_n and_o endeavour_n true_a it_o be_v i_o have_v take_v the_o liberty_n to_o consider_v and_o try_v some_o thing_n deliver_v by_o that_o reverend_a brother_n who_o here_o i_o have_v to_o do_v withal_o but_o this_o i_o trust_v can_v be_v just_o offensive_a in_o as_o much_o as_o the_o spirit_n of_o the_o prophet_n be_v subject_a to_o the_o prophet_n 1_o cor._n 14._o 32._o and_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o apostle_n himself_o be_v examine_v by_o those_o noble_a berean_o who_o the_o holy_a ghost_n commend_v for_o search_v the_o scripture_n daily_o whether_o those_o thing_n be_v so_o act._n 17._o 11._o it_o be_v also_o true_a which_o our_o reverend_a brother_n say_v in_o his_o epistle_n to_o the_o reader_n before_o his_o peaceable_a plea_n that_o there_o be_v great_a cause_n of_o sorrow_n that_o all_o the_o lord_n people_n shall_v not_o mind_v one_o thing_n and_o sing_v one_o song_n and_o join_v in_o one_o against_o the_o child_n of_o babel_n nevertheless_o this_o may_v be_v some_o comfort_n against_o this_o sorrow_n that_o by_o the_o providence_n of_o the_o lord_n this_o diversity_n of_o opinion_n and_o dispute_n if_o it_o be_v christianly_o carry_v as_o it_o may_v may_v occasion_n and_o produce_v in_o the_o issue_n the_o further_o clear_v up_o of_o truth_n for_o as_o our_o author_n well_o observe_v from_o the_o collision_n of_o opinion_n result_v truth_n and_o dispute_v as_o strike_v flint_n cast_v fire_n for_o light_n due_a right_n of_o presbyt_fw-la epistle_n to_o the_o reader_n the_o desire_n and_o hope_v whereof_o together_o with_o the_o advice_n of_o such_o brethren_n as_o i_o consult_v withal_o be_v that_o which_o chief_o prevail_v with_o i_o for_o the_o publish_n of_o this_o reply_n wherein_o the_o reader_n will_v find_v sundry_a scripture_n and_o question_n controvert_v in_o these_o time_n discuss_v and_o consider_v so_o far_o as_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o reply_n or_o defence_n do_v lead_v thereto_o and_o i_o hope_v some_o or_o other_o through_o god_n blessing_n may_v receive_v some_o profit_n thereby_o and_o if_o the_o humble_a christian_a who_o desire_v to_o know_v and_o love_n and_o practice_v the_o truth_n shall_v receive_v any_o benefit_n or_o help_v for_o attain_v these_o end_n by_o mean_n of_o this_o labour_n of_o i_o it_o be_v that_o which_o i_o intend_v and_o aim_v at_o and_o for_o which_o i_o desire_v that_o god_n alone_o may_v have_v the_o praise_n and_o glory_n if_o any_o shall_v still_o remain_v otherwise_o mind_v yet_o in_o due_a time_n i_o hope_v god_n shall_v reveal_v even_o this_o unto_o they_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n diversity_n of_o apprehension_n in_o these_o point_n ought_v not_o to_o breed_v any_o alienation_n of_o affection_n among_o those_o that_o be_v otherwise_o orthodox_n and_o sincere_a it_o be_v a_o thousand_o pity_n if_o it_o shall_v for_o my_o part_n i_o can_v but_o approve_v what_o this_o reverend_a brother_n sometime_o profess_v that_o he_o do_v both_o love_n and_o dispute_v contradict_v and_o reverence_v at_o once_o peaceable_a plea_n epist_n yea_o he_o count_v himself_o a_o debtor_n for_o love_n charity_n honour_n and_o all_o due_a respect_n in_o christ_n jesus_n and_o a_o seat_n and_o lodging_n in_o his_o heart_n and_o high_a esteem_n to_o all_o those_o that_o be_v godly_a lover_n of_o the_o truth_n and_o sufferer_n for_o the_o truth_n against_o prelacy_n though_o possible_o they_o like_v not_o well_o of_o presbyterial_a government_n ibid._n in_o answer_v whereto_o for_o i_o will_v be_v loath_a that_o such_o love_n shall_v be_v lose_v upon_o we_o without_o due_a return_n of_o the_o like_a i_o will_v for_o my_o part_n profess_v the_o like_a dear_a and_o due_a respect_n to_o all_o those_o that_o be_v qualify_v as_o here_o he_o do_v describe_v of_o which_o sort_n i_o know_v there_o be_v many_o though_o possible_o they_o may_v like_v better_o of_o the_o way_n that_o be_v call_v presbyterial_a then_o of_o the_o congregationall_a for_o those_o that_o give_v apparent_a testimony_n that_o they_o be_v the_o lord_n and_o so_o that_o they_o must_v live_v together_o in_o heaven_n i_o know_v not_o why_o they_o shall_v not_o love_v one_o another_o on_o earth_n what_o ever_o difference_n of_o apprehension_n may_v for_o the_o present_a be_v find_v among_o they_o in_o some_o thing_n as_o for_o bitterness_n of_o spirit_n and_o tartness_n of_o contest_v i_o never_o think_v that_o to_o be_v god_n way_n of_o promote_a truth_n among_o brethren_n and_o therefore_o i_o have_v endeavour_v in_o this_o discourse_n to_o avoid_v the_o same_o for_o i_o believe_v there_o be_v more_o hope_n of_o do_v good_a by_o solidity_n of_o argument_n with_o a_o spirit_n of_o meekness_n and_o love_n then_o by_o sharp_a and_o tart_a language_n the_o fruit_n of_o bitterness_n of_o spirit_n wherein_o for_o the_o most_o part_n right_a of_o reason_n be_v want_v the_o passion_n be_v there_o most_o vehement_a and_o stir_a where_o the_o intellectual_n be_v most_o ●eeble_a and_o weak_a now_o if_o any_o ask_v why_o this_o defence_n have_v be_v so_o long_o defer_v it_o be_v now_o two_o year_n and_o more_o since_o master_n rutherfurd_n his_o due_a right_n of_o presbyt_fw-la come_v forth_o such_o may_v be_v please_v to_o consider_v that_o new_a england_n be_v as_o it_o be_v count_v 3000_o mile_n distant_a from_o old_a therefore_o many_o book_n may_v be_v extant_a in_o england_n a_o long_a time_n afore_o we_o that_o be_v so_o remote_a can_v so_o much_o as_o hear_v any_o sound_n thereof_o and_o those_o few_o that_o come_v to_o our_o knowledge_n be_v common_o extant_a in_o england_n a_o matter_n of_o a_o year_n space_n afore_o and_o sometime_o long_o in_o which_o respect_n many_o thing_n may_v be_v speak_v and_o print_v against_o we_o whereto_o it_o can_v be_v expect_v that_o we_o shall_v return_v any_o speedy_a answer_n and_o though_o it_o be_v now_o twelve_o month_n ago_o or_o more_o since_o master_n rutherfurd_n his_o due_a right_n of_o presbyt_fw-la come_v to_o my_o hand_n yet_o at_o that_o time_n my_o few_o spare_a hour_n from_o my_o constant_a and_o ordinary_a employment_n be_v whole_o take_v up_o otherwise_o so_o that_o i_o can_v not_o attend_v this_o business_n any_o soon_o which_o i_o desire_v may_v be_v accept_v as_o a_o just_a apology_n for_o the_o late_a come_n forth_o of_o this_o reply_n which_o as_o it_o may_v seem_v late_o so_o it_o be_v more_o large_a then_o in_o some_o respect_n i_o can_v have_v desire_v by_o reason_n that_o i_o do_v usual_o transcribe_v those_o word_n of_o master_n rutherfurd_n whereto_o i_o d●e_v apply_v my_o answer_n which_o course_n i_o confess_v i_o do_v not_o unwilling_o in_o some_o respect_n choose_v partly_o to_o save_v the_o reader_n a_o labour_n of_o turn_v to_o the_o place_n in_o master_n rutherfurd_n which_o i_o be_o speak_v too_o which_o else_o he_o must_v have_v do_v or_o

society_n to_o end_n in_o monarchy_n whether_o will_v it_o not_o follow_v that_o the_o government_n of_o church_n must_v so_o end_v as_o well_o as_o that_o congregation_n must_v depend_v on_o the_o government_n of_o synod_n because_o the_o light_n of_o nature_n teach_v a_o communion_n in_o government_n to_o other_o society_n and_o whether_o the_o multitude_n of_o grecian_n and_o hebrew_n who_o ch●se_v the_o seven_o deacon_n acts._n 6._o be_v two_o congregation_n or_o one_o only_a page_n 159._o chap._n 21._o whether_o congregation_n may_v be_v excommunicate_v by_o class_n and_o synod_n by_o virtue_n of_o those_o word_n mat._n 18._o tell_v the_o church_n as_o contain_v a_o rule_n and_o remedy_n for_o all_o offence_n or_o at_o the_o least_o a_o church_n remedy_n for_o the_o offence_n of_o church_n and_o church_n member_n and_o if_o yea_o whether_o it_o will_v not_o thereupon_o follow_v that_o a_o national_n church_n must_v have_v the_o benefit_n of_o this_o remedy_n as_o well_o as_o other_o and_o so_o have_v no_o independency_n of_o jurisdiction_n within_o itself_o but_o be_v subject_n to_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o general_n counsel_n which_o yet_o mr._n rutherford_n do_v deny_v page_n 164._o chap._n 22._o when_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n be_v a_o profess_a enemy_n to_o religion_n whether_o then_o it_o be_v likely_a and_o usual_a that_o the_o great_a part_n of_o the_o people_n be_v sincere_o religious_a and_o whether_o when_o the_o great_a part_n be_v enemy_n with_o their_o magistrate_n it_o be_v then_o the_o duty_n of_o a_o few_o that_o be_v sincere_a to_o assemble_v in_o a_o national_n synod_n and_o there_o to_o enter_v into_o a_o national_n covenant_n and_o also_o to_o enjoin_v the_o same_o unto_o that_o great_a part_n page_n 170._o chap._n 23._o whether_o the_o word_n church_n be_v not_o give_v to_o a_o single_a congregation_n and_o whether_o a_o congregation_n be_v a_o company_n or_o church-meeting_n only_o for_o word_n and_o sacrament_n and_o not_o for_o any_o other_o spiritual_a duty_n and_o whether_o the_o divers_a duty_n 1._o of_o word_n and_o sacrament_n 2._o of_o discipline_n etc._n etc._n must_v needs_o argue_v divers_a church_n page_n 175._o chap._n 24_o whether_o those_o child_n of_o israel_n numb_a 8._o 10._o who_o lay_v hand_n on_o the_o levite_n be_v elder_n by_o office_n and_o as_o so_o consider_v do_v lay_v on_o their_o hand_n and_o whether_o this_o scripture_n do_v not_o prove_v that_o where_o there_o be_v no_o elder_n to_o be_v have_v there_o some_o principal_a member_n though_o no_o elder_n by_o office_n may_v impose_v hand_n on_o church-officer_n page_n 180_o chap._n 25._o whether_o a_o minister_n call_v consist_v in_o election_n or_o imposition_n of_o hand_n and_o whether_o of_o these_o be_v great_a and_o whether_o be_v prior_n or_o posterior_n whether_o 1_o tim._n 4._o 14._o acts._n 6_o 2_o 3_o 4._o acts._n 13._o 1_o 2_o 3._o do_v prove_v that_o the_o minister_n call_v consist_v in_o imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbeterie_n and_o that_o such_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v not_o a_o consummatory_n rite_n or_o benedictory_n sign_n also_o whether_o rom._n 10._o 15._o do_v prove_v that_o a_o man_n can_v be_v a_o minister_n except_o some_o presbytery_n ordain_v he_o before_o the_o people_n choose_v he_o and_o whether_o otherwise_o the_o people_n do_v send_v a_o minister_n to_o themselves_o and_o whether_o the_o people_n of_o god_n may_v not_o as_o well_o discern_v a_o man_n fitness_n to_o be_v ordain_v as_o his_o fitness_n to_o be_v elect_v page_n 196._o chap._n 26._o whether_o the_o epistle_n to_o timothy_n and_o titus_n wherein_o there_o be_v contain_v rule_n of_o direction_n in_o lay_v on_o of_o hand_n do_v prove_v that_o this_o action_n may_v not_o in_o any_o case_n be_v perform_v by_o non-officer_n but_o must_v be_v perform_v only_o by_o presbytery_n and_o whether_o the_o argument_n do_v not_o make_v as_o strong_o for_o the_o appropriate_a of_o lay_v on_o of_o hand_n to_o the_o prelate_n as_o to_o the_o presbytery_n and_o do_v not_o as_o well_o exclude_v the_o presbytery_n from_o meddle_v therein_o as_o exclude_v the_o people_n page_n 206._o to_o the_o christian_a reader_n in_o the_o year_n 1643._o there_o come_v forth_o a_o treatise_n against_o independency_n under_o the_o name_n of_o my_o reverend_n and_o learned_a brother_n mr._n charles_n herle_n the_o pastor_n of_o winwick_n in_o lancashire_n this_o treatise_n because_o it_o seem_v to_o be_v write_v with_o such_o a_o candid_a and_o peaceable_a spirit_n as_o may_v witness_v for_o its_o author_n that_o the_o thing_n he_o aim_v at_o therein_o be_v mere_o the_o disquisition_n of_o the_o truth_n and_o because_o the_o author_n thereof_o be_v many_o year_n ago_o of_o my_o reverend_a brother_n mr._n tompsons_n acquaintance_n and_o i_o therefore_o we_o think_v it_o may_v not_o be_v in_o vain_a if_o we_o shall_v love_o communicate_v to_o the_o learned_a author_n such_o apprehension_n of_o we_o whereby_o we_o be_v detain_v from_o concur_v with_o his_o judgement_n in_o the_o principal_a question_n dispute_v in_o the_o say_a treatise_n and_o therefore_o in_o the_o latter_a end_n of_o the_o same_o year_n there_o come_v forth_o a_o small_a script_n under_o our_o name_n in_o way_n of_o a_o brotherly_a answer_n to_o that_o his_o love_a and_o learned_a treatise_n against_o this_o answer_n mr._n samuel_n rutherford_n a_o learned_a writer_n of_o the_o church_n of_o scotland_n have_v allege_v and_o publish_v many_o objection_n exception_n and_o answer_n in_o his_o book_n entitle_v the_o due_a right_n of_o presbytery_n i_o may_v call_v they_o many_o because_o in_o that_o treatise_n of_o his_o there_o be_v no_o less_o than_o 24_o or_o 25_o several_a place_n wherein_o he_o bring_v up_o by_o name_n the_o say_a answer_n dispute_v against_o sundry_a passage_n therein_o as_o if_o they_o be_v not_o sound_a which_o passage_n if_o they_o be_v indeed_o erroneous_a and_o unsound_a be_v a_o great_a many_o to_o be_v contain_v and_o find_v in_o so_o small_a a_o work_n the_o whole_a book_n as_o it_o be_v now_o print_v contain_v in_o it_o 30._o leaf_n so_o that_o the_o leaf_n in_o the_o book_n be_v not_o much_o more_o than_o the_o place_n therein_o which_o this_o learned_a writer_n do_v object_n against_o which_o be_v consider_v i_o think_v it_o therefore_o needful_a to_o peruse_v and_o weigh_v as_o the_o lord_n shall_v help_v the_o several_a place_n of_o his_o forementioned_a treatise_n wherein_o he_o deal_v against_o the_o say_a answer_n and_o have_v so_o do_v i_o here_o present_a my_o apprehension_n to_o public_a view_n leave_v the_o prudent_a and_o judicious_a reader_n to_o consider_v and_o judge_v whether_o this_o reverend_a and_o learned_a brother_n have_v sufficient_o overthrow_v or_o weak'n_v the_o say_a answer_n or_o whether_o the_o same_o do_v not_o still_o remain_v agreeable_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o truth_n notwithstanding_o his_o objection_n against_o the_o same_o or_o such_o answer_n as_o he_o do_v return_v to_o several_a passage_n therein_o chap._n i._n of_o appeal_v from_o particular_a congregation_n and_o the_o true_a cause_n of_o appeal_v and_o whether_o by_o mr._n rutherford_n his_o doctrine_n in_o this_o point_n there_o may_v not_o be_v appeal_v to_o general_a council_n who_o power_n of_o jurisdiction_n he_o do_v yet_o deny_v first_o of_o all_o in_o his_o page_n 315._o for_o that_o be_v the_o first_o place_n wherein_o i_o find_v he_o meddle_v with_o the_o answer_n speak_v of_o doubt_n concern_v math._n 18._o 17._o tell_v the_o church_n in_o a_o 9_o the_o objection_n about_o that_o scripture_n beside_o other_o particular_n he_o have_v these_o word_n viz._n there_o be_v no_o reason_n to_o appeal_v to_o a_o high_a judicature_n because_o the_o inferior_a may_v err_v because_o all_o above_o a_o congregation_n be_v court_n which_o may_v err_v presbytery_n provincial_n national_n the_o universal_a council_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n may_v err_v and_o then_o for_o author_n of_o this_o part_n of_o the_o objection_n he_o subjoin_v my_o name_n and_o answer_v to_o mr._n herle_v cap._n 2._o pag._n 13_o 14._o answ_n when_o he_o be_v discourse_v of_o doubt_n concern_v that_o scripture_n math_n 18._o tell_v the_o church_n i_o know_v no_o reason_n why_o he_o shall_v bring_v those_o word_n of_o i_o at_o such_o a_o time_n or_o for_o such_o a_o purpose_n for_o though_o i_o do_v acknowledge_v that_o i_o write_v the_o word_n which_o he_o have_v set_v down_o or_o such_o like_a in_o the_o place_n by_o he_o allege_v yet_o that_o they_o be_v bring_v by_o i_o for_o such_o purpose_n as_o he_o do_v report_n viz._n for_o the_o clear_n of_o doubt_n concern_v the_o meaning_n of_o math._n 18_o 17._o that_o i_o do_v utter_o deny_v he_o that_o shall_v look_v upon_o the_o chapter_n and_o page_n allege_v will_v find_v that_o i_o do_v not_o there_o meddle_v at_o all_o

conceive_v be_v very_o true_o speak_v and_o thereupon_o it_o follow_v that_o there_o be_v a_o supremacy_n of_o jurisdiction_n in_o that_o church_n of_o antioch_n and_o no_o necessity_n of_o appeal_n from_o they_o to_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o other_o for_o ●ith_o the_o synod_n be_v only_o to_o command_v the_o church_n to_o do_v their_o duty_n and_o to_o remit_v the_o censure_n of_o offender_n to_o the_o church_n themselves_o to_o who_o the_o offender_n belong_v it_o plain_o appear_v thereby_o where_o the_o supremacy_n of_o jurisdiction_n do_v lie_v the_o other_o place_n be_v in_o his_o page_n 307._o where_o we_o have_v these_o word_n viz._n the_o power_n of_o jurisdiction_n ordinary_a intensive_a and_o quo_fw-la ad_fw-la essentiam_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la ministerialis_fw-la according_a to_o the_o entire_a essence_n of_o a_o ministerial_a church_n be_v as_o perfect_a and_o complete_a in_o one_o single_a congregation_n as_o in_o a_o provincial_n as_o in_o a_o national_n yea_o as_o in_o the_o catholic_a visible_a body_n whereof_o christ_n be_v the_o head_n now_o if_o there_o be_v such_o perfect_a &_o complete_a power_n of_o jurisdiction_n in_o a_o single_a congregation_n i_o know_v not_o how_o there_o can_v be_v such_o necessity_n of_o appeal_v from_o they_o to_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o other_o as_o he_o be_v plead_v for_o nor_o how_o that_o supreme_a and_o independent_a power_n in_o congregation_n can_v be_v deny_v which_o here_o he_o dispute_v against_o for_o let_v this_o complete_a and_o perfect_a power_n of_o jurisdiction_n be_v acknowledge_v as_o due_a to_o such_o church_n and_o appeal_v from_o they_o to_o other_o jurisdiction_n will_v be_v of_o small_a necessity_n or_o use_n i_o know_v indeed_o this_o reverend_a author_n say_v in_o the_o page_n last_o mention_v and_o within_o a_o few_o line_n of_o the_o word_n which_o i_o have_v here_o allege_v that_o a_o congregation_n be_v so_o a_o part_n of_o the_o presbytery_n that_o it_o have_v not_o a_o whole_a entire_a complete_a intensive_a power_n over_o its_o own_o member_n to_o excommunicate_v they_o and_o therefore_o the_o consociate_v church_n must_v have_v a_o power_n over_o the_o member_n of_o a_o congregation_n which_o word_n i_o confess_v seem_v not_o well_o to_o agree_v with_o the_o former_a because_o in_o the_o one_o entire_a complete_a intensive_a power_n be_v deny_v to_o a_o congregation_n and_o in_o the_o other_o the_o power_n of_o jurisdiction_n ordinary_a intensive_a be_v say_v to_o be_v as_o complete_a and_o perfect_a in_o the_o congregation_n as_o in_o the_o great_a church_n but_o it_o be_v not_o the_o latter_a word_n but_o the_o former_a which_o i_o do_v stand_v upon_o and_o by_o they_o as_o i_o conceive_v the_o supremacy_n of_o congregation_n be_v establish_v and_o the_o necessity_n of_o appeal_n from_o they_o to_o other_o jurisdiction_n be_v clear_o take_v away_o for_o if_o the_o power_n of_o jurisdiction_n be_v as_o entire_a perfect_a and_o complete_a in_o the_o congregation_n as_o in_o the_o great_a church_n as_o our_o brother_n express_o affirm_v it_o to_o be_v i_o know_v not_o the_o reason_n why_o there_o must_v be_v appeal_n from_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o the_o congregation_n unto_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o those_o other_o church_n if_o the_o power_n speak_v of_o be_v more_o imperfect_a and_o incomplete_a in_o the_o congregation_n than_o it_o be_v in_o the_o other_o church_n than_o there_o may_v be_v more_o reason_n or_o fair_a pretence_n for_o those_o appeal_n but_o since_o our_o author_n confess_v it_o be_v no_o more_o entire_a complete_a and_o perfect_a in_o these_o then_o in_o the_o congregation_n but_o as_o complete_a and_o perfect_a in_o the_o congregation_n as_o it_o be_v in_o the_o other_o i_o be_o yet_o to_o seek_v of_o a_o sufficient_a ground_n for_o the_o necessity_n of_o appeal_n from_o the_o jurisdiction_n in_o a_o congregation_n for_o be_v it_o reasonable_a to_o appeal_v from_o one_o judicatory_a to_o another_o and_o yet_o the_o power_n of_o jurisdiction_n be_v as_o entire_a complete_a and_o perfect_a in_o the_o former_a from_o which_o the_o appeal_n be_v make_v as_o in_o the_o latter_a to_o which_o the_o cause_n be_v bring_v by_o such_o appeal_n it_o seem_v by_o such_o appeal_v we_o be_v not_o like_a to_o be_v much_o helper_n nor_o much_o to_o mend_v the_o matter_n above_o what_o it_o be_v before_o and_o therefore_o the_o usefulness_n and_o necessity_n thereof_o be_v still_o uncl●●●●_n i_o think_v the_o brethren_n err_v in_o this_o to_o teach_v that_o antioch_n have_v power_n to_o determine_v the_o controversy_n act._n 15._o when_o the_o church_n of_o syria_n and_o cicilia_n to_o their_o knowledge_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a question_n as_o verse_n 24._o may_v clear_v i_o doubt_v much_o if_o they_o have_v power_n to_o determine_v a_o question_n that_o so_o much_o concern_v all_o the_o church_n answ_n it_o be_v not_o clear_a from_o verse_n 24._o nor_o from_o any_o part_n of_o the_o chapter_n as_o far_o as_o i_o can_v find_v that_o antioch_n do_v know_v that_o other_o church_n be_v trouble_v with_o this_o question_n and_o if_o they_o have_v know_v it_o i_o see_v nothing_o therein_o but_o they_o may_v notwithstanding_o lawful_o end_v the_o matter_n so_o far_o as_o concern_v themselves_o for_o when_o this_o question_n be_v start_v among_o they_o by_o such_o as_o come_v from_o judea_n and_o teach_v this_o corrupt_a doctrine_n at_o antioch_n the_o text_n be_v very_o clear_a verse_n 2_o that_o they_o have_v much_o disputation_n among_o themselves_o to_o have_v end_v the_o matter_n afore_o there_o be_v any_o speech_n of_o send_v to_o jerusalem_n which_o disputation_n be_v a_o argument_n that_o they_o have_v right_a to_o have_v end_v it_o if_o ability_n have_v no●_n be_v want_v and_o as_o for_o our_o brother_n reason_n for_o the_o contrary_n take_v from_o their_o knowledge_n that_o the_o other_o church_n of_o syria_n and_o cicilia_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a question_n there_o be_v not_o one_o word_n in_o the_o verse_n allege_v to_o show_v that_o antioch_n have_v knowledge_n of_o any_o such_o matter_n nor_o be_v syria_n and_o cicilia_n once_o mention_v therein_o and_o though_o they_o be_v mention_v verse_n 23._o yet_o neither_o do_v this_o verse_n declare_v that_o antioch_n have_v any_o knowledge_n that_o this_o question_n have_v ever_o trouble_v those_o other_o church_n say_v it_o be_v true_a that_o indeed_o they_o have_v be_v trouble_v therewith_o and_o that_o the_o epistle_n from_o the_o synod_n do_v intimate_v no_o less_o this_o may_v prove_v that_o when_o the_o epistle_n come_v to_o be_v read_v at_o antioch_n than_o antioch_n by_o this_o mean_n may_v come_v to_o the_o knowledge_n thereof_o but_o all_o this_o do_v not_o prove_v that_o antioch_n know_v so_o much_o afore_o and_o therefore_o they_o may_v endeavour_v to_o end_v the_o matter_n among_o themselves_o as_o not_o know_v for_o any_o thing_n our_o author_n have_v yet_o bring_v to_o the_o contrary_a that_o any_o other_o church_n beside_o themselves_o be_v trouble_v therewith_o but_o suppose_v they_o have_v know_v so_o much_o i_o see_v nothing_o in_o this_o to_o hinder_v but_o antioch_n may_v lawful_o clear_v up_o the_o truth_n in_o the_o question_n and_o censure_v such_o of_o their_o church_n as_o shall_v obstinate_o hold_v and_o teach_v that_o false_a doctrine_n notwithstanding_o their_o knowledge_n that_o other_o have_v be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a doctrine_n and_o teacher_n suppose_v a_o christian_a family_n be_v trouble_v with_o lie_a child_n or_o servant_n or_o such_o as_o be_v disobedient_a and_o undutiful_a in_o one_o kind_n or_o in_o another_o suppose_v they_o also_o know_v that_o their_o neighbour_n family_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a shall_v this_o knowledge_n of_o they_o hinder_v the_o parent_n or_o master_n in_o such_o a_o family_n from_o censure_v or_o correct_v these_o that_o be_v under_o their_o government_n according_a to_o their_o demerit_n if_o not_o why_o shall_v antioch_n be_v hinder_v from_o censure_a offend_a member_n of_o their_o church_n only_o upon_o this_o ground_n because_o to_o their_o knowledge_n other_o church_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a offender_n a_o city_n or_o corporation_n be_v trouble_v with_o drunkard_n with_o thief_n or_o other_o vicious_a and_o lewd_a person_n and_o know_v that_o other_o city_n or_o corporation_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a a_o national_n church_n as_o scotland_n for_o example_n be_v trouble_v with_o obtruder_n of_o ceremony_n service_n book_n episcopacy_n or_o other_o corruption_n and_o know_v that_o england_n or_o other_o church_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a shall_v scotland_n now_o be_v hinder_v from_o remove_v these_o corruption_n and_o the_o obtruder_n of_o they_o from_o among_o themselves_o only_o upon_o this_o ground_n because_o england_n to_o their_o knowledge_n be_v trouble_v with_o the_o like_a or_o shall_v the_o corporation_n ●ee_z hinder_v from_o