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world_n church_n true_a visible_a 9,863 5 9.3078 5 true
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A85228 Certain considerations of present concernment: touching this reformed Church of England. With a particular examination of An: Champny (Doctor of the Sorbon) his exceptions against the lawful calling and ordination of the Protestant bishops and pastors of this Church. / By H: Ferne, D.D. Ferne, H. (Henry), 1602-1662. 1653 (1653) Wing F789; Thomason E1520_1; ESTC R202005 136,131 385

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or_o make_v it_o a_o part_n of_o reformation_n of_o the_o church_n to_o have_v no_o bishop_n etc._n etc._n yea_o they_o be_v worthy_a say_v calvin_n of_o any_o execration_n that_o will_v not_o submit_v themselves_o unto_o that_o hierarchy_n that_o submit_v itself_o unto_o the_o lord_n these_o censure_n he_o cite_v in_o his_o 13._o pag._n out_o of_o their_o tract_n de_fw-fr reform_v eccles_n for_o both_o write_v of_o that_o argument_n 16._o now_o to_o champny_n argument_n a_o true_a church_n be_v not_o without_o true_a pastor_n for_o as_o cyprian_n say_v ecclesia_fw-la est_fw-la populus_fw-la pastori_fw-la conjunctus_fw-la and_o again_o ecclesia_fw-la est_fw-la in_o episcopo_fw-la &_o episcopus_fw-la in_o ecclesia_fw-la but_o those_o reform_a church_n have_v not_o true_a pastor_n lawful_o call_v but_o only_o pretend_a elder_n which_o be_v make_v by_o those_o that_o have_v no_o power_n to_o ordain_v or_o send_v other_o therefore_o they_o be_v no_o church_n moulin_n will_v answer_v and_o 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it_o heretical_a for_o renounce_v the_o doctrine_n and_o communion_n of_o that_o church_n by_o which_o it_o receive_v christianity_n and_o join_v itself_o to_o that_o which_o can_v not_o prove_v itself_o christian_n i.e._n to_o have_v receive_v baptism_n any_o where_n but_o by_o those_o who_o it_o have_v forsake_v 16._o but_o if_o the_o prove_v of_o our_o christianity_n be_v mean_v of_o prove_v the_o truth_n of_o it_o as_o that_o the_o faith_n we_o profess_v and_o the_o baptism_n we_o receive_v be_v catholic_n and_o true_o christian_n or_o that_o the_o ordination_n which_o our_o pastor_n have_v be_v good_a and_o apostolical_a then_o we_o deny_v the_o assumption_n for_o cranmer_n and_o the_o english_a church_n be_v able_a to_o prove_v all_o this_o by_o other_o and_o better_a mean_n that_o the_o lineal_a that_o be_v champny_n word_n succession_n of_o that_o church_n which_o they_o have_v forsake_v viz._n by_o the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n and_o the_o uniform_a consent_n of_o antiquity_n lineal_a or_o local_a succession_n be_v but_o a_o empty_a conveyance_n of_o christianity_n without_o truth_n of_o doctrine_n assure_v by_o god_n word_n for_o be_v lineal_a succession_n the_o only_a or_o a_o good_a argument_n to_o prove_v a_o man_n or_o nation_n true_o christian_n than_o the_o arrian_n or_o other_o heretic_n who_o bishop_n be_v not_o intruder_n but_o of_o catholic_n turn_v heretic_n may_v have_v pass_v for_o good_a christian_n and_o true_a catholic_n 17._o retort_v the_o former_a charge_n retort_v after_o these_o argument_n by_o which_o he_o will_v fasten_v heresy_n upon_o our_o archbishop_n cranmer_n and_o the_o other_o first_o reformer_n he_o add_v a_o vain_a boast_n let_v the_o adversary_n retort_v all_o or_o any_o of_o these_o argument_n upon_o the_o ordainer_n of_o cranmer_n viz._n those_o of_o the_o romish_a church_n and_o i_o will_v confess_v they_o heretic_n but_o it_o be_v clear_a that_o as_o all_o his_o argument_n as_o direct_v against_o cranmer_n be_v too_o weak_a to_o prove_v what_o he_o will_v have_v so_o they_o return_v more_o forcible_o upon_o themselves_o for_o their_o charge_n of_o irregularity_n upon_o marriage_n we_o retort_v their_o irregularity_n by_o concubinage_n and_o for_o that_o of_o digamy_n we_o appeal_v to_o they_o whether_o they_o suffer_v not_o a_o priest_n or_o bishop_n to_o have_v one_o or_o mo_z concubine_n rather_o than_o to_o be_v marry_v once_o or_o twice_o for_o cranmers_n recantation_n or_o condemn_v the_o protestant_a doctrine_n we_o retort_v the_o example_n of_o liberius_n bishop_n of_o rome_n subscribe_v to_o arrianism_n and_o it_o be_v strange_a that_o champny_n shall_v not_o remember_v that_o the_o ordainer_n of_o bishop_n cranmer_n subscribe_v and_o swear_v the_o condemnation_n and_o ejection_n of_o papal_a authority_n and_o if_o some_o of_o they_o live_v to_o repent_v it_o in_o qu._n mary_n day_n so_o do_v cranmer_n revoke_v his_o condemnation_n of_o the_o protestant_a doctrine_n and_o seal_v it_o with_o his_o blood_n for_o his_o argument_n from_o the_o authority_n condemn_v our_o doctrine_n it_o be_v retort_v upon_o they_o when_o we_o answer_v it_o for_o that_o of_o our_o go_v out_o from_o that_o church_n it_o be_v show_v how_o it_o concern_v they_o who_o keep_v the_o same_o place_n and_o seat_n yet_o go_v out_o of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n be_v thereby_o conclude_v heretical_a the_o last_o also_o fall_v back_o upon_o themselves_o who_o have_v nothing_o to_o prove_v their_o new_a faith_n wherein_o they_o differ_v from_o other_o church_n but_o lineal_a succession_n from_o those_o first_o catholic_n roman_n bishop_n from_o who_o they_o have_v depart_v only_o keep_v the_o same_o place_n and_o seat_n which_o they_o hold_v have_v conclude_v as_o he_o think_v by_o the_o former_a argument_n that_o cranmer_n and_o the_o rest_n be_v in_o heresy_n and_o schism_n and_o therefore_o can_v not_o receive_v or_o lawful_o use_v the_o power_n of_o ordination_n he_o than_o exclude_v they_o from_o receive_v all_o supply_n of_o that_o defect_n for_o say_v he_o that_o must_v be_v by_o reconciliation_n to_o the_o church_n &_o confirmation_n by_o it_o as_o we_o see_v in_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n restore_v bishop_n that_o return_v from_o heresy_n but_o granmer_n can_v show_v any_o such_o reconciliation_n which_o indeed_o say_v he_o be_v impossible_a there_o be_v no_o other_o church_n in_o the_o world_n to_o which_o he_o can_v be_v reconcile_v but_o only_o that_o which_o he_o have_v forsake_v viz._n the_o roman_a so_o he_o answ_n this_o be_v nothing_o else_o but_o what_o he_o say_v above_o in_o his_o nine_o cap._n endeavour_v to_o reduce_v our_o english_a bishop_n to_o his_o impossibility_n of_o have_v the_o defect_n of_o their_o ordination_n supply_v which_o he_o say_v they_o be_v under_o by_o be_v ordain_v by_o those_o we_o account_v heretic_n viz._n romish_a bishop_n and_o the_o answer_n to_o it_o be_v give_v 18._o give_v cap._n 4._o num._n 16_o 17_o 18._o above_o the_o sum_n of_o it_o be_v this_o that_o cranmer_n if_o he_o contract_v that_o defect_n by_o be_v ordain_v of_o heretic_n than_o he_o recover_v the_o due_a use_n of_o his_o order_n by_o depose_v the_o heresy_n of_o his_o ordainer_n that_o cranmer_n be_v not_o alone_o but_o with_o he_o a_o whole_a national_a church_n and_o that_o the_o actual_a and_o solemn_a reconciliation_n of_o such_o a_o church_n with_o the_o bishop_n of_o it_o to_o the_o whole_a body_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v fit_v and_o of_o good_a use_n and_o example_n when_o the_o catholic_a church_n remain_v in_o such_o entire_a body_n and_o condition_n as_o be_v fit_a to_o receive_v such_o reconciliation_n but_o when_o it_o be_v otherwise_o with_o the_o state_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n as_o it_o be_v when_o arrian_n prevail_v and_o now_o in_o the_o distract_a condition_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n such_o reconciliation_n be_v as_o not_o well_o feizable_a so_o not_o so_o necessary_a for_o a_o national_a church_n only_o it_o be_v necessary_a such_o a_o church_n depose_v the_o error_n or_o heresy_n it_o have_v contract_v and_o profess_v communion_n with_o all_o that_o do_v hold_v the_o catholic_a faith_n undefiled_a in_o such_o a_o measure_n as_o be_v needful_a not_o impose_v any_o different_a doctrine_n they_o hold_v as_o condition_n of_o communion_n with_o they_o chap._n vii_o of_o bishop_n ordain_v under_o king_n edward_n and_o the_o essential_a defect_n pretend_v to_o be_v in_o the_o form_n of_o their_o ordination_n and_o of_o presumption_n against_o it_o his_o 12._o chapter_n proceed_v against_o those_o bishop_n that_o be_v ordain_v in_o k._n edward_n day_n who_o he_o charge_v not_o only_o with_o the_o same_o heresy_n he_o do_v bishop_n cranmer_n as_o true_a indeed_o of_o the_o one_o as_o the_o other_o but_o with_o a_o special_a and_o that_o a_o essential_a defect_n in_o their_o ordination_n what_o be_v that_o the_o form_n of_o their_o ordination_n by_o which_o they_o be_v consecrate_v be_v new_a and_o invent_v by_o certain_a commissioner_n appoint_v by_o the_o king_n and_o therefore_o the_o ordination_n be_v altogether_o nul_fw-fr and_o invalid_a we_o grant_v the_o form_n be_v alter_v and_o different_a from_o that_o which_o before_o be_v use_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n but_o not_o new_a or_o change_v as_o to_o that_o which_o concern_v the_o substance_n of_o the_o order_n 1._o how_o the_o form_n of_o ordination_n alter_v under_o k._n edward_n how_o for_o the_o work_n of_o those_o commissioner_n be_v not_o to_o devise_v and_o invent_v a_o direct_a new_a form_n but_o to_o purge_v it_o from_o popish_a corruption_n cast_v out_o what_o appear_v to_o be_v either_o needless_a or_o superstitious_a addition_n and_o retain_v what_o import_v the_o substance_n of_o the_o order_n or_o add_v withal_o something_o to_o express_v more_o full_o the_o purpose_n of_o the_o order_n then_o collate_v according_a to_o the_o institution_n of_o it_o declare_v in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o such_o a_o work_n fit_v commissioner_n be_v appoint_v for_o number_v twelve_o for_o quality_n six_o prelate_n and_o six_o other_o learned_a in_o god_n law_n as_o we_o find_v they_o in_o the_o statute_n of_o 3.4_o edward_n 6._o c._n 12._o it_o be_v too_o light_a that_o champny_n lay_v hold_v on_o the_o word_n devise_v in_o their_o commission_n and_o bid_v the_o reader_n mark_v it_o as_o if_o they_o have_v power_n or_o go_v about_o to_o devise_v or_o invent_v a_o new_a form_n on_o their_o own_o head_n their_o work_n be_v to_o devise_v and_o consult_v what_o romish_a additional_n may_v be_v cut_v off_o what_o depravation_n purge_v out_o that_o so_o we_o may_v have_v a_o pure_a and_o just_a form_n express_v more_o simple_o the_o substance_n and_o purpose_n and_o collation_n of_o the_o order_n give_v 2._o mr._n mason_n have_v set_v down_o the_o form_n together_o with_o
according_o say_v he_o this_o good_a emperor_n do_v praescriptum_fw-la leonis_fw-la secutus_fw-la follow_v the_o prescript_n of_o leo._n pag._n 565._o now_o he_o make_v the_o good_a bishop_n speak_v and_o take_v upon_o he_o like_o one_o of_o the_o late_a pope_n well_o this_o agree_v not_o with_o the_o humble_a supplication_n make_v to_o the_o emperor_n but_o what_o say_v he_o to_o the_o thing_n supplicate_v for_o that_o the_o emperor_n will_v make_v void_a that_o council_n by_o a_o decree_n to_o the_o contrary_a i_o can_v find_v any_o thing_n in_o champney_n that_o answer_v to_o it_o but_o that_o leo_n desire_v a_o suspension_n of_o the_o decree_n and_o judgement_n of_o the_o former_a council_n which_o though_o short_a of_o that_o which_o be_v desire_v be_v enough_o to_o establish_v that_o authority_n which_o we_o desire_v to_o vindicate_v to_o king_n and_o emperor_n in_o matter_n of_o the_o church_n without_o wrong_v or_o invade_v the_o office_n of_o the_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n for_o both_o the_o emperor_n and_o they_o have_v their_o part_n in_o this_o action_n champny_n in_o stead_n of_o give_v we_o a_o good_a account_n of_o the_o former_a point_n think_v to_o cross_v we_o with_o another_o passage_n of_o the_o story_n flavianus_n say_v he_o the_o depose_a bishop_n appeal_v from_o the_o unjust_a sentence_n not_o to_o the_o emperor_n but_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n and_o deliver_v his_o appellation_n to_o his_o legate_n which_o be_v a_o acknowledgement_n of_o his_o be_v supreme_a judge_n pag._n 561._o but_o this_o can_v be_v conclude_v in_o champnys_n sense_n of_o supreem_v judge_n for_o it_o sound_v nothing_o but_o the_o primacy_n of_o order_n among_o the_o patriarch_n flavianus_n deliver_v his_o appellation_n to_o the_o pope_n legate_n because_o they_o be_v present_a the_o emperor_n be_v not_o because_o in_o order_n the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o first_o and_o because_o he_o know_v that_o leo_n be_v true_o favourable_a to_o his_o cause_n and_o will_v commend_v it_o to_o the_o emperor_n which_o he_o do_v and_o do_v it_o so_o as_o appeal_n himself_o to_o the_o next_o general_a council_n which_o the_o emperor_n shall_v gahter_n as_o we_o hear_v in_o his_o supplication_n to_o theodosius_n neither_o have_v the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n though_o chief_a patriarch_n the_o only_a or_o chief_a presidence_n in_o all_o the_o general_a counsel_n but_o according_a as_o the_o emperor_n see_v fit_a as_o appear_v by_o the_o act_n of_o those_o counsel_n but_o to_o conclude_v in_o replication_n to_o that_o common_a answer_n of_o romanist_n that_o king_n and_o emperor_n in_o command_v about_o church_n affair_n do_v but_o follow_v the_o determination_n of_o forego_v counsel_n mason_n have_v tell_v they_o that_o queen_n elizabeth_n for_o this_o power_n and_o supremacy_n have_v the_o determination_n of_o a_o synod_n under_o hen._n 8._o by_o unanimous_a assent_n acknowledge_v it_o to_o this_o champny_n reply_n what_o authority_n have_v that_o synod_n where_o the_o bishop_n be_v compel_v by_o fear_n to_o consent_v to_o that_o which_o they_o after_o voluntary_o revoke_v under_o queen_n mary_n or_o what_o authority_n can_v a_o snyod_n of_o the_o bishop_n of_o one_o kingdom_n have_v against_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n p._n 549._o 550._o but_o this_o of_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n be_v only_o a_o brag_n and_o it_o be_v yet_o to_o be_v prove_v that_o the_o late_a usurp_a jurisdiction_n of_o the_o pope_n be_v ever_o know_v to_o the_o ancient_a church_n or_o ever_o receive_v since_o through_o all_o the_o christian_a world_n as_o for_o compulsion_n and_o defect_n of_o freedom_n which_o he_o note_v for_o the_o null_n of_o the_o autorty_n of_o a_o synod_n we_o acknowledge_v the_o doctrine_n good_a and_o say_v he_o give_v we_o a_o just_a way_n of_o exception_n to_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n and_o all_o or_o most_o of_o the_o romish_a counsel_n that_o have_v be_v hold_v under_o that_o usurp_a papal_a supremacy_n since_o hildebrand_n or_o gregory_n the_o seven_o his_o time_n but_o we_o deny_v the_o application_n of_o it_o to_o the_o synod_n under_o hen._n 8._o see_v above_o cap._n 2._o num._n 3._o concern_v this_o allegation_n of_o fear_n and_o compulsion_n where_o there_o be_v cause_n to_o think_v the_o evidence_n of_o truth_n compel_v they_o consider_v what_o the_o most_o learned_a among_o they_o do_v voluntary_o write_v against_o the_o papal_a usurpation_n and_o i_o can_v but_o here_o acknowledge_v the_o providence_n of_o god_n so_o dispose_v of_o this_o business_n that_o the_o papal_a supremacy_n or_o usurp_a jurisdiction_n shall_v be_v vote_v out_o of_o this_o land_n first_o by_o the_o popish_a party_n as_o i_o may_v call_v they_o and_o that_o they_o which_o have_v twice_o be_v swear_v against_o the_o admit_v of_o it_o again_o into_o this_o land_n as_o many_o of_o the_o deprive_a bishop_n have_v be_v under_o king_n henry_n and_o king_n edward_n and_o then_o voluntary_o break_v their_o double_a oath_n under_o queen_n mary_n shall_v be_v depose_v under_o queen_n elizabeth_n for_o that_o very_a cause_n of_o assert_v the_o papal_a supremacy_n chap._n x._o the_o exception_n against_o our_o bishop_n that_o they_o be_v not_o priest_n of_o the_o evangelical_n priesthood_n or_o ministry_n commit_v to_o we_o man_n and_o of_o the_o romish_a presumption_n in_o assume_v more_o his_o last_o exception_n against_o the_o call_v of_o our_o bishop_n ever_o since_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o queen_n time_n be_v because_o they_o be_v not_o very_fw-la sacerdotes_fw-la true_o make_v priest_n which_o say_v he_o be_v such_o a_o essential_a defect_n that_o it_o render_v their_o episcopal_a ordination_n altogether_o invalid_a cap._n 17._o we_o grant_v it_o of_o very_fw-la presbyteri_fw-la those_o that_o be_v not_o true_o make_v presbyter_n first_o can_v be_v true_a and_o complete_a bishop_n but_o for_o his_o very_fw-la sacerdotes_fw-la we_o say_v as_o there_o be_v no_o such_o priest_n under_o the_o gospel_n so_o be_v there_o no_o need_n that_o bishop_n shall_v first_o be_v make_v such_o for_o priest_n in_o the_o romish_a sense_n be_v such_o as_o in_o their_o ordination_n receive_v a_o power_n of_o sacrifice_v for_o the_o quick_a and_o the_o dead_a i._n e._n a_o real_a offer_v up_o again_o the_o son_n of_o god_n to_o his_o father_n and_o because_o we_o presume_v not_o to_o take_v this_o power_n therefore_o they_o usual_o reproach_v we_o that_o we_o have_v no_o priest_n none_o that_o can_v consecrate_v or_o make_v the_o lord_n body_n none_o that_o can_v absolve_v or_o reconcile_v penitent_n as_o for_o ourselves_o ministry_n our_o warrant_n for_o our_o gospel_n ministry_n we_o have_v sufficient_a warrant_n and_o commission_n for_o the_o power_n we_o take_v and_o use_v in_o the_o gospel-ministry_n to_o teach_v and_o baptise_v s._n mat._n 28._o to_o bind_v and_o to_o lose_v s._n mat._n 18._o or_o to_o remit_v and_o retain_v sin_n s._n john_n 20._o and_o he_o have_v give_v or_o commit_v to_o we_o say_v saint_n paul_n 2_o cor._n 5.18_o the_o ministry_n of_o reconciliation_n which_o stand_v in_o the_o dispensation_n of_o the_o word_n and_o sacrament_n priesthood_n what_o the_o romanist_n pretend_v for_o their_o priesthood_n now_o if_o we_o ask_v they_o to_o show_v their_o commission_n for_o that_o power_n of_o sacrifice_v they_o can_v direct_v we_o to_o any_o express_a word_n of_o god_n but_o lead_v we_o about_o to_o seek_v it_o in_o the_o figurative_a and_o hyperbolical_a expresson_n of_o the_o father_n from_o which_o they_o will_v force_v these_o two_o proposition_n that_o there_o be_v such_o a_o real_a and_o external_a sacrifice_n under_o the_o gospel_n and_o that_o our_o saviour_n christ_n do_v real_o and_o true_o offer_v himself_o up_o to_o his_o father_n in_o his_o last_o supper_n from_o whence_o they_o conclude_v if_o there_o be_v such_o a_o sacrifice_n then_o be_v there_o sacrificer_n and_o priest_n if_o christ_n offer_v up_o himself_o in_o his_o last_o supper_n than_o so_o it_o be_v still_o for_o he_o bid_v do_v this_o s._n luk._n 22.19_o i_o do_v not_o mean_v to_o follow_v champny_n here_o step_v by_o step_n for_o the_o run_v into_o the_o controversy_n of_o the_o propitiatory_a sacrifice_n of_o the_o mass_n heap_v up_o the_o say_n of_o the_o father_n usual_o allege_v by_o their_o writer_n and_o as_o often_o answer_v and_o clear_v by_o we_o i_o shall_v not_o examine_v those_o save_n particular_o but_o stay_v upon_o some_o general_n which_o may_v in_o brief_a show_v the_o meaning_n of_o that_o manner_n of_o speech_n the_o father_n common_o use_v in_o and_o about_o the_o celebration_n of_o the_o eucharist_n the_o high_a presumption_n of_o the_o romanist_n in_o take_v to_o themselves_o such_o a_o power_n of_o sacrafice_v and_o their_o vanity_n in_o reproach_v we_o for_o not_o assume_v it_o 3._o supper_n whether_o christ_n offer_v himself_o up_o in_o the_o jast_n