myghtye wynde when he gaue hys holye spirite vnto hys Apostles Phylyp There is no doubte but he dyd it to The holye spirite sheweâ— in wynde signifie that as the winde suffereth the Rociers the litle and small trees and ouerthroweth by the rootes breaketh down broseth and maketh ruinous the greate myghtye trees So the vertue of thys holy spirite is to bring consolation to the hertes aflicted to purge the consciences to iudge the euile to ouerthrowe and sette downe the proude and to vpholde beare vp the weake and humble Natha If we wyll then haue anye thynge of God we muste obteygne it by Iesus Christe workynge in vs by hys holie spirite Phylip. It is euen so for by hym all the beleuers be vnite in one self body with their head Iesus Christe and be nourished and vinified in hym as by the soule and spirite all the meÌ„bres whyche be in one bodye be partakers of the goodnes which is in the same body Natha I beleue for that cause we put to by by after thys article the which appertayneth nyghe vnto the churche the whych is the bodye of Iesus Christ of the whyche thou speakeste of vinifiynge sanctifiynge by the same holy Gooste for we do saye by and by after the catholyke churche Phy. There is no doubte Natha In asmuch theÌ„ as we haue treated the other three partes The church of the crede that we be come to the fourth whyche concerneth the churche daughter of the celestiall father spouse of Iesus Christe tell me fyrste what thou callest the church Phy. Churche signifieth congregation and assemble Eph. v but I do take it and vnderstaÌ„d it here for the asseÌ„ble of the true and faythful christians whyche be vnite coÌ„ioyned by one selfe spirite and one selfe fayeth Natha Is there anye other church then the churche of the faithfull Phy. As we do cal the bodye and membres of Iesu Christe the churche so hath Antichriste hys body and membres whyche togyther make the malignaunt churche but for asmuche as that toucheth vs in nothynge we leaue it aparte and speake only here of the tru The malygnant church church of Iesu Christe therfore do we cal it holy Natha For what cause Phy. To put difference betwene hyr and the church of Antichriste and for asmuche as she is sanctified by the holye Goste for to be the temple and habitatioÌ„ of God Natha Wher fore doest thou also call it catholike what signifieth that worde catholyke Catholike Phy. It doeth signifie vniuersal and therfore do I saye I beleue the vniuersall churche bycause the churche doeth signifie all assembles and congregation where the fayethfull be assembled as is the church of Choâ—hi of Rome Galathiens and othere lyke I wyll declare that there is one catholyke churche that is to saye vniuersall and generall comprehending all the other the whyche is generallye sowen thorowe all the worlde onelye knowen of the onelye God whiche knoweth the hertes Natha If she be sowen thorowe all the world how is she a church seing that church signifieth coÌ„gregatioÌ„ asseÌ„ble so as thou sayeste it should seeme rather to disperation seperation and confution Phylype Therefore muste we considre thys The churche inuisible churche spirituallye and muste not thynke it to be a visible and local assemble sette and limited in a certaine place Nathana Howe vnderstandest thou thys or howe can the churche be inuisible seyng it is the assemble of the fayethful whyche be visible menne Phy. I denye not but that the men whyche be of the churche be visible but thys ioynynge togyther of the churche oughte not to be considered of the coniunction of the bodies but of the hertes spirits that be inuisible which none cause and therefore notwythstandinge I see the menne that be of thys churche wheÌ„ they be presente wyth me yet neuertheles I The churche mingeled thorowe all the worlde can not see them all because they be sparkeled abrode thorowe all the worlde and thoughe they myght be assembled all in one place yet coulde I not knowe them perfectlye because that the elected shal neuer be so wel seperated in thys worlde frome the infidels and reproued but there shall be alwayes manye hypocrites mingled amonge them the whyche we can not wel deserue nor iudge vnto such time as Iesus Christe shall make seperation of the Math. xxv goâ—es from the lambes and of the wheate froÌ„ the tares therfore do I saye that thys church is inuisible because the eye caÌ„ not se it nor the humayne iudgmeÌ„t wel deserue it therfore do we saye we beleue it for if we did se it at our eye wee beleued not but notwythstandynge we can not se it at our eye yet we beleue that the Lorde hathe hys elected whyche notwithstandynge they be sparkeled aboute thorowe all the worlde as touchynge theyr bodies be yet neuertheles so ioyned togither by the spirite of God that they be but one selfe bodye one selfe herte and one selfe soule Act. ii iiii Natha Thou wylt then saye that the vniuersall churche is a spirituall and inuisible asseÌ„ble of all the elected and chyldrene of God whyche be vpon the earth in what place so euer they be whyche notwythstandinge they be seperated and farre distaunte one frome a nother as concerninge theyr bodyes yet they be all vnite by one selfe spirite into one body misticall of the whyche Christe is the head Col. i. ii whyche dyed for to assemble the chyldrene of God that were sparkeled but if thys church be inuisible howe canste thou saye thou beleueste in hyr and that thou holdeste hyr fayth howe canste thou knowe what she is what she beleueth if thou know hir not Phylype I saye not that I beleue in hyr Natha Doeste not thou confesse I beleue in the holye Gost the holye vniuersal churche Phy. I do saye and confesse openlye I beleue in God the father and in Iesu Christ and in the holye Gooste but of the churche I do not saye I beleue in the holye churche but I beleue the holye churche Nathana Is it not all one what difference is there Phy. Verye greate For if I sayed I beleue in the holye church I should coÌ„fesse that I put my trust in hyr as I haue sayed before to beleue in God and the churche is not god but is an asseÌ„ble of men cursed is man that trusteth in man wherfore if I sayed I beleue Iere. xvii in hyr I should speake agaynste my self and should reuerse the fayeth which I haue coÌ„fessed hytherto Nathana Declare vnto me the differeÌ„ce Phi. By expositioÌ„s going befor it is opeÌ„ inough what seÌ„ce mi words should haue if I sayed I beleue in the church But when I do saye I beleue the holie churche that is to saye I beleue and confesse that ther is an assemble by the whyche I haue diffined the churche and that in the same I wyll lyue and dye Natha Howe wylt
thou lyue and dye in hyr when thou knowest not where she is Phy. Although I can not perceiue nor know al that be coÌ„prised in it yet neuertheles I haue certayne sygnes by the whyche I know am assured what she is Nathanaell What be those sygnes Phy. In all places coÌ„panies Syngnes to knowe the church by â— where as the worde of God is purelye opened receyued the sacrameÌ„tes of Iesu Christ obserued and kept I am certaine that there is of the shepe of Iesus Christe of the elected or otherwyse hys voyce should not be opened nor yet receyued Natha Thou wylt then saye that the worde of god the sacrameÌ„tes of Iesu Christ be indubitable signes of the same but manie speak of Iesus Christe and make semblant to heare hys worde whych be hypocrites beleue not in hym as Iudas was and suche â—yke And coÌ„trariewyse there be many vnknoweÌ„ which be estemed vnhappy damned yet haue faith shall atteyne to the kyngdome of heauen be fore them that shewe greate apparant as Iesus Christe dyd saye the harlottes publicaÌ„s Math. xxii shoulde obteigne it before the scribes phariseis Phy. Therefore haue I sayed that thys churche is inuisible vnknowen vnto me not bicause we se not with the bodily eyes the meÌ„ whyche be of it but because that man can not se the hertes nor can not deserue nor knowe whether the man that he seeth beleueth or no Ephe. ii how holie soeuer he seme nor none caÌ„ know it but the onlie God which gyueth the fayth knoweth the herte that receyueth it Nathan Thou art then ofteÌ„ begiled thinking that the church is wher the gospel is preached the in stitutioÌ„ of Iesus obserued seing that they that be ther do such thyngs may be such as Iudas Act. i. v. viii SimoÌ„ magus Ananias Saphira weâ— Phylip. Albeit that suche hypocrites maye be mingled in greate numbre amonge the faithful which be alwayes the lytle flocke yet neuertheles it is certayne that amonge them be some of Christes shepe for els God woulde not permit nor suffer that the preciouse pearles and margarites of hys holye Gospell shoulde be caste before dogges swine only Natha What if the wolues swine and dogs call theim selues shepe and in stede of the gospell sette forthe theyr owne dreames and humayne traditious howe causte thou knowe deserue the churche â— Cor. xii Phy. The Lorde hathe lefte vs hys holye scriptures for to iudge and deserue by the analogie of the fayeth and the rule of charitie whether the spirites be of God or not whether the spirit in the which I beleue do raigne the whyche is gyuen vnto the elected for to iudge all thynges for the spirituall man iudgeth all thynges and is iudged of no man Thâ— roman churche Natha And is not the romayne churche that holie catholyke church which thou beleueste and must be folowed Phy. If the romayne churche do abyde and perseuer in the apostolyke doctrine I wyl reknowledge hyr a churche of Iesus Christ inasmuche as she declareth hir selfe to be the spouse of Iesus Christe in obeying vnto him as vnto hyr heade and for to lyue vndre hys lawes and ordinaunces but yet maye I not take it for thys vniuersal church of the which we haue spoken for she can be but a meÌ„bre of that churche no more then other congregations and other christian churches that be abrode in the uniuersall world seperated both in places and bodies and yet ioyned in spirite and soule makynge all togyther one vniuersall churche Nathan But is not the Romayne church the heade of all the other vnto the whyche all the other oughte to obeye as subiectes Phy. If she be head she is no more theÌ„ nother spouse nor membre of hys body suche as the faythfull ought to be if she wyll haue dominion gyue lawes vnto other she is no more a churche of Iesus but is the churche of Antechriste whyche attributeth vnto hyr self the office appertayninge vnto Christe for the office of the churche is not to gyue lawes vnto hyr but receiue them of hym and to make hyr selfe subiecte vndre the same Natha The churche then whych wyll exarcise power ouer the other gyue theim other lawes then the Gospell of Iesu is no churche of Christe bycause hys spirite reygneth not ther but to what purpose serueth it to beleue the vniuersal churche Phy. Without that article al the reste goyng before shoulde serue me for nothyng For all that we haue sayed of God that we beleue of the father of the sonne and of the holye Goste hath regarde vnto thys churche without the whyche all oure faith should be vaine for in this crede we do not considre what god is in hym selfe but what he is towardes vs whyche be hys churche and by what meanes he hath willed hyr to be deliuered conserued ruled gouerned wherefore al that we haue treated here before pretendeth to thys end for we muste nedes haue layed thys fundatioÌ„ to buylde after thereupon thys edifice wythout the whythe the fundation shoulde profitte vs in nothynge if we were not surelye builded there vpon Nathana I vnderstande well that thou haste sayed of the vniuersall churche but I desyre yet much to knowe what thou vnderstandest by the communion of sayntes Phy. I vnderstande here no other thyng but that whyche I haue alreadye sayed that is to saye the holye vniuersall churche but this we put to the better to declare the vnite that is amoÌ„ge the faithful for as in one towne in one coÌ„mon wealth in one coÌ„munaltie coÌ„munioÌ„ amoÌ„ge the inhabitauÌ„ces citizens membres that be within it so likewise in the churche of Iesu christ ther is one vnite aliauÌ„ce burgelie brotherhede whyche after such sort conioyneth the bodie with hys head Iesus Christe all the membres the one wyth the other that they haue no goods that is not coÌ„mune amoÌ„g theÌ„ nor that the one doth not coÌ„municate vnto the other for Iesu Christ coÌ„municateth al his goodes to his membres al the goodes that he doth coÌ„municate to his churche returneth or coÌ„meth to euerie one of his meÌ„bres in perticuler euerye one receyueth his parte as the meÌ„bres the which the head doth coÌ„municate vnto them as the soule whyche is shed thorowe all the bodye giueth life vnto all the meÌ„bres of the same Nath. It is then no small benifite to be in the churche of Iesus Christe-nor no smal euil to be out of that churche Phy. It is with theÌ„ that be without as wyth the braunche that is cut of the vine or as the bowgh or twigge cut of the tre the which froÌ„ theÌ„se forth can haue nother nourishmente nor life but must neades drie away is good for nothing but to be cast in the fyre Na. They which be excommunicate be they out of thys coÌ„munioÌ„ Phylip. The word of
thyrd we shall set forth the fruite whyche of these thynges cometh vnto vs. In the forthe we shall speake of hys bodye glorified and of hys last commynge tell me then what foloweth and shewe vpoÌ„ what poyntes thou desierest most large and easye declaration Natha It doeth followe I beleue in Iesus Christe hys onely Beleue in Christe sonne oure Lorde etc. how vnderstandest thou thys and what is the sence of these wordes Phy. They signifie that I do truste all holye in Iesus Christe the true sonne of God and that I beleue in hun as in the father that bi hym the father hath deliuered me from death and eternall damnation and hathe reconsiled me vnto hym selfe receyued me vnto hys fauour by hys welbeloued sonne whyche hath satisfied for me vnto hys Iustice and hath obteyned me eternall lyfe Natha Thou confesseste then that Iesus Christe is God seynge thou beleueste in hym for thou haste already sayed that we muste not put our truste but in one only God Phylype If I dyd not beleue that he were trulye God of one selfe essence power and equalitie with the father I shoulde be vnhappye to beleue or truste in hym seyng that the prophet doeth pronounce Iudge Cursed Ieremi xvii be he that doeth truste in man and taketh flesh for hys arme Natha And Iesus Christ is he not man Phylype He is verye man and in all thynges hathe been lyke vnto vs excepte synne but he is not simplie man as we be but beyng made manne is neuertheles alwayes verye God and the verye sonne of God as alreadye it hathe bene expounded wherefore when I do say in the begynning of the Crede I beleue in God I do speake say ingeneral that which afterwarde I do more playnlye expresse and opeÌ„ declaryng howe that in the essence of one God in one deitie I do recognise and confesse the father the sonne and the holy Goste thre personnes in one selfe substaunce diuinitie Natha Thys same is meruelouse hye and difficullte to be comprehended For howe can I perceyue and vnderstande them to be thre and yet neuertheles they be but one Phylype Wee muste not be abasshed if these mistiries surmounte the capacitie of oure vnderstandynges for if we can not knowe oure selues nor the lest creature that is in the world perfectly and such as he is in hys nature no not so muche as a litle mouse or a litle grasse or herbe whyche we do euerye daye se howe is it possible that we shoulde perfectlye know the creatour of all the worlde and is not able to be comprehended but is incomprehensible vnto all creatures yea vnto the Angels themselues Nathanaell I do confesse it but canste thou not by summe maner of speakyng more clearly gyue lyght vnto these thyngs so profound and darcke Phy. I can not but by the printes impressions Images of God whyche God hath put of hys Image in hys creatures I wyll shewe as it were a shadowe but as for to paint him liuelye it is not possible vnto maÌ„ we can not better remeÌ„bre nor knowe hym then in theÌ„ portreture which he hathe made vs of hym selfe in hys holye scriptures and in the lyuely Images whyche he hath portretured wyth hys hande and imprinted in hys creatures as I haue all readye declared vnto the an example of the sunne Natha I take greate pleasure in suche similitudes and comparisous and principally bicause thou hast shewed me that the auncieÌ„t doctours of the church haue willinglye vsed the same could not find am other more coÌ„uenieÌ„t Phy. Wythout goynge or sekynge anye further let vs abide in the sunne fyrst when thou beholdest it thou seeste there is but one in all the worlde whyche neuertheles is sufficiente vnto all creatures and notwythstandynge that it is but one creature of God and one Image of that greate fountayne of al lyghte which is in the father of lyght Neuertheles it is not possible vnto the humayne eyes to comprehende it and caste hys loke stâ—ayâ—e into hym for if he do loke ryghte into hym hys greate clearnes and lyght wyl take hys syght frome hym and make hym in maner all blyude bycause that the littlenes weaknes and infirmitie can not beare it then if the eye whyche is created of God for to receiue lyght can not beholde the sunne in his substaunce nor beare hys lyghte how should the humayne vnderstandynge whyche is so streite and weake coÌ„prehend the great kynge of glorye and maiestie whyche compreheÌ„deth in hym selfe al creatures and can not be comprehended of them all togither suche as he is in hys maiesty Natha Here is all readie manye goodlye properties to gyue vnderstandynge what we maye knowe of God Phy. There is yet other considerations for all be it thou seeste but one sunne in hys substaunce yet neuertheles thou canste not se nor considre it but thou shalt se thre thynges the whyche can not be seperated the one from the other caÌ„ not be the one without the other yet neuertheles the one is that the other is yet alwayes the same is but one selfe sunne Natha It is verye true that when I considre the sonne I do se it an original grounde and fountayne of lyght the whyche neuertheles I can not se but by hys beames and by hys clearnes nor feele it but by his heate vertu Phy. Thou doest experiment in thys sâ—dane contemplation and apprehendyng one sunne doest fal into an vnitie after incontineÌ„t out of that vnitie thou falleste agayne into a trinitie in suche sorte that it doeth seme vnto the that there is three thynges and after consideringe thre thou coÌ„mest agayne in the ende alwaye to one and further if one shoulde aske the of the bodye of the sunne what it is what wouldest thou answer Natha That it is the sunne Phy. And if one shoulde aske the also of hys beames and of hys heate wouldeste thou not call it also the sunne Natha That is certayne for wheÌ„ his beames or hys heate or hys clearnes do enter into any place we do saye the sunne is entered and if by the heate of the sunne anye thyng be doÌ„e we do say the sunne hath done it Phy. Thou doeste se theÌ„ how it semeth that thou makeste thre sunnes and yet thou knowest nor doeste not confesse alwaies but one Nata It is true but maye we saye so of God the father the sonne and the holye Goste Phy. As well may we when we speake of the sonne and of the holy Goste cal them Goddes as we maye the heate and clearnes of the sunne the sunne But there is in this a greate differeÌ„ce for that which is a qualitie a thing accidental in the sunne is in God essence and a thynge essentiall and substanciall abyding alwayes resident in hym And euen as we do take a similitude and comparison of the sunne so may we do lykewyse of the humain Comparison taken of the soule soule for
is no doubte as all the spirituall goodes whyche be in Iesus Christe the husbande be commune vnto the churche hys spowse and also vnto al the membres of the same whyche is hys mistical body and haue all hys gyftes and graces in commune one with an other But if thou meane of the earthlye goodes that is an other matter for seyng that the churche is the kyngedome of Iesus Christe and hys kyngedome is not of thys worlde wee muste not therefore seeke in hys churche a carnall communion but a spirituall for as the spirituall kyngedome of Iesus Christ doth not aboleyshe nor take away the ciuile pollytie but doeth approue confyrme it euen so the spirituall communion of saintes doeth not aboleyshe the diuision of the earthlye goodes that is amonge menne but that it is lawefull for euerye one to possesse that whych is assigned hym accordyng to the humaine lawes Natha Thou wylte then saye that thys cōmuniō ought not to be vnderstand but of the spirituall goodes Phylyp I denye not but there is also a communion of the corporall and earthlye goodes amonge the fayethfull not that it is lawefull for euerye man to laye hys handes vpon the goodes of his neyghbour as it were his own so to make it his of his own authorite for if it were so it shoulde not bee a communion of Saintes but of robberye and a comminaltie of beastes and Dogges and not of christiās for so all ryghtes boeth diuine and humayne shoulde be violated and the commaundemētes Cōmuniō of beastes of God shoulde haue no place amonge menne for then thefte should be no more theft if it were lawefull for euerye manne to laye hys handes and take where soeuer he myght fynde and adultrie shoulde be no more adultrie if it were admitted that euery one might abuse the doughter and wyfe of hys neyghboure after the maner of the bruite beastes whyche haue no maner of reuerēce nother vnto cōsanguinitie nor matrimonie Natha I am of thine opinion for Iesu Christ is not come to make of menne beastes but to make of beastes menne and of men Goddes for the man that knoweth not Iesu Christe is worsse then a beaste but howe vnderstandest thou this communion of the earthly goodes Phyl. The practise of the primatiue church declareth inoughe vnto vs for that same charitie dyd make theyr goddes all commune amonge Act. ii iiii v. the fayethfull and yet for all that dyd euerye man possesse hys owne goodes and enheritaunce the whyche wyth out constraynte of theyr owne liberalitie they them selues dyd bringe vnto the Apostles to be distributed vnto the power neady brethren but it was not laweful for other to take it at their pleasure but as it was distributed vnto them by them vnto whome it dyd appertaygne as it doeth well appeare by the wordes whyche saint Petre had vnto Ananias Saphira Act◠v. Natha I vnderstande wel nowe what cōmuniō this ought to be for the gospel doth leaue vnto euery one that whych appertayneth vnto hym but the charitie whyche the Gospell aboue all thynges doeth sette forthe vnto vs doth teach vs how we ought to vse and how we ought to communicate the goods that we haue receyued of God vnto the poore membres of Iesus Christ but tell me nowe which be the sayntes amonge the whyche thys communion is Phi. Vnderstandeste thou not by that I haue answered to the before that they be the faithfull christiens Natha I vnderstande that well but bycause we do commonlye call them Sayntes which be in heauen and that thei whych be in thys worlde be all poore synners I haue here a litle Who be saintes doubte for I vnderstande not well howe we maye call synfull men Sayntes whyche be yet enuironed wyth thys fleshe of synne nor knoweth not whether we ought to vnderstand thys communion of Sayntes of them onely which be alreadie in heauē or onlye of thē which be yet in this world or of both togither Phy. As to the first I knowe wel whē we speake cōmonly of saintes the pore simple people vnderstande no othere thynge but of them that be departed and that they hold for saued but that cometh of ignoraunce and for lacke of vnderstandynge of the Apostolike doctrine which doth customably cal the faith ful christien saintes there is no incōuenience to call them saintes notwithstanding they be synners for as the churche is called holy euē so be the fayethfull called Sayntes of the whych she is cōposed bycause that God hath iustified pourged made cleane and sanctified them whyche he hathe elected for to serue vnto al holines and innocencie and for to make shyne in vs the Image of hys glorye therfore the church is called the spowse of Iesus Christ gloryousse wythout spotte or wryncle notwythstandynge that all we the membres of the same praye euerye daye vnto God and he pardoneth our synnes Natha It foloweth then that all the true christians be Saintes synners all togyther but Math. vi Luc. ii howe maye these thinges agre beynge so repugnaunte Phy. They be not repugnaunte if they be well vnderstande for ech man if we Eph. ii Rom. iii. Gal. ii i. Co. i. considre hym in hym selfe and in hys nature is the child of ire naturalli a sinner execrable worthi of death eternal dānatiō but if we cōsidre hym in Iesu Christ he is holy for by the fayth which he hath in him he is iustified and sanctified not that he is altogither wythout synne but bycause that Iesus Christe doeth make hym partaker of hys ryghtuousnesse satisfaction after suche sorte that notwythstādynge he be a pore synner yet is it not imputed Psal v. Rom. iiii vnto him but is couered and defaced and he reputed iuste before God by the meane of Iesus Christe nother more nor lesse then if he had not sinned at all Nathanaell Thys holines of the churche is not yet then perfecte Phi. No not tyl it be altogither deliuered frō thys worlde and perfectly conioyned vnite wyth hyr head Iesus Christe for duryng the tyme she shall be in thys worlde she shall haue alwayes battell agaynste the fleshe and synne and shall neuer be fullye and deliuered frome the spottes and imperfections of the same vnto the daye of hyr redemptiō whē Iesus Christe shall appeare in glorye therfore sayed Iesus Christe that he that is cleane and washede hath yet nede to washe his fete and therefore saye wee after thys article that we beleue the remission of synnes Nathanael Before we come vnto that article thou must first declare vnto me the pointes I haue demanded of the vpon thys the whyche we haue alreadye treated on Phy. Towchyng that thou haste demaunded me of the Sayntes wee maye vnderstande thys communion generallye of al the elected that euer hathe bene be or shal be but there is some difference as touching the practise Tru it is that all the goodes of Iesus Christe bycause they
father Natha They wyll replye wellynough vnto al that for they wil coÌ„fesse the of Iesus Christ all that thou wylte wyth theyr mouthes but they saye that notwythstandynge that Iesus Christe is oure aduocate towarde the father yet neuertheles as we haue neade of hym for to be oure aduocate towards the father euen so it is necessari for vs to haue other aduocates Intercessours to Christe Iohn xvi toward him for inasmuch as he is god we be sinners god doth not exalt and heare synners we haue neade of the sayntes which be more perfecte then we to be oure intercessours towarde hym Phy. We muste haue then a greate traine of intercessours and aduocates and in the ende we must haue intercessours towarde the saintes bycause we shall not be worthye inoughe for to addresse oure prayers vnto them Natha We haue them alreadye for the priestes monkes friers and nunes maketh vs beleue Intercessours to sayntes that they be oure aduocates and intercessours towardes the saintes and towardes God and therefore brynge we them money frome all partes and offre vnto them euerye daye gyftes and presentes as the clientes do to theyr counceylers of the lawe Phy. Thou maiste se nowe wel that the couetuousnes of priestes is the mother and nursse Intercession of lyuinge of thys Idolatrie and superstition I denye not but we haue commaundemente to praye the one for the other whyle we be in this presente lyfe but wee oughte not for all that to Timo. ii Iames. i. make marchaÌ„dise of our prayers nor to think they haue any efficatie but by the intercession of Iesus Christe nor that we muste addresse them vnto any other then hym onelye for to present them vnto the father for we haue neither commaundemeÌ„te nor exemple in the scripture to adresse our prayers vnto the saintes departed for we maye praye vnto diuers the which we knowe not whether they be saintes or no nor whether they be in heauen or hell but we be very certaine that Iesus Christ is in heauen and if we were assured they were in heauen yet we can not tell whether they know what we do here nor whether they heare vs or not nor whether they may healpe vs or no the scriptures witnes rather the coÌ„trari but of Iesus Christe we doubte not And yet further Wherefore shoulde we not wythout feare go vnto Iesus Christe rather then vnto ani other Is there any that hath more power wisdome and goodnes or that is more merciful Should our sinnes withdraw vs froÌ„ goyng vnto him Natha That is the cause they do aledge Phy. But that cause is against theÌ„ Christ calleth the sâ—nners selues for if I were no sinner I shoulde haue no neede of Iesus Christe if I were whole I had no nede of the phisitiaÌ„ but bicause I am Math. vi a sinner sicke haue I neede to go vnto hym whiche hath sayed Come vnto me al ye that laboure are laden I shal ease you doeth testifie hym selfe that he is not come for the iust but for the sinners nor for the whole but for the sicke They then which withdrawe vs Math. v. from hym be lyke vnto the scribes and phariseis whyche were offended and dyd murmure agaynste hym bycause he was conuersaunte wyth synners publicanes and they whyche make difficultie to go to hym haue suche a foleishe shame as they whyche haue some secrete sikenes and had rather ieobarde lyfe then open and shewe theyr discease vnto Iohn xiii the phisitian or as Saynt Petre had whyche would not haue suffered Iesus Christ to haue washed hys feete wythout the whyche washynge he myghte not haue bene anye partaker of hys kyngdome Or els it is wyth theÌ„ Luke v. as it was wyth the same Peter after he had fished al the nyght gate nothing til he had raste hys nettes into the sea by the coÌ„maundemente of Iesus Christe drue vp so much fishe that the shyppe was full and sanke in suche sorte that they were constrayned to call for healpe of theyr fellowes and haueynge greate meruayle he sayed vnto Iesus gooe from me for I aâ— a synfull manne he would that Iesus christe shoulde go from hym bycause he did knowe the vertue holines to be hys and dyd knowe the synnes and imperfections to be hys owne and dyd repute and thynke hym selfe vnworthye to be in hys coÌ„pani wher as he ought rather to haue sought hym to the ende that by hym he mighte haue bene fanctified and made worthye Nathana I am muche aferde it wyll be wyth suche menne as it was wyth Saynte Petre whyche gatte nothynge wyth all nyghte fysshynge tyl he had caste in hys nette by the coÌ„maundemente Fishinge by nyghte of Iesus Christe and so I beleue that we fyshe by nyghte in al that we do and go aboute in darkenes and ignoraunce wythout the word of God and hys coÌ„maundemente and wythout directynge oure selues vnto Iesus Christe and he beynge out of our companye but I beleue also that when we haue hym wyth vs and gouerne oure selues by hys commaundemente that we shal neuer fayle to take plentye and haue good fisshing Phy. If we do otherwyse it shall come vnto Math. vi Mar. xv Luke viii vs as it dyd vnto the woman beynge syke of the bloudye flyxe we shal spende all our goodes vpon such phisike surgery medicines oure sykenes shall alwayes appayre and be worsse vnto suche tyme as we come vnto Iesus Christe the whych maye onely heape vs. Nathanaell I nowe well vnderstande all thys and do knowe that they whyche seeke any other aduocate then Iesus Christ do not perfectlye beleue that he is deade for theÌ„ ryseÌ„ and asceÌ„ded into heauen for if they beleued it perfectely they shoulde know the greate loue he hathe borne them the good wyll he hath towardes them and the power that he hathe in heauen in earth and woulde sticke cleane and content them selues better wyth hym theÌ„ they do But in asmuch as thou haste expounded vnto me the fyrste maner and waye how I oughte to haue in remembraunce and contemplation the death resurrection and ascention of Iesus Christe for to knowe the fruite that cometh vnto me and the efficatie of the same declare vnto me nowe the other maner and howe it serueth vs for an example Phy. We shal come to it but fyrste I wyl admonishe the of one poynte towechyng the ascention of Iesus Christe that is that thys article Colo. i. ii Ephe. ii doeth serue to shewe vs that Iesus christ is the onelye head of hys triumphaÌ„te churche and that there is neyther Pope nor lyuynge manne vpon the earth nor any creature what soeuer he be vnto whom that office maye appertayne for the heade can not be wythout hys membres hys office is to vinifie leade gouerne healpe assiste vnto all the bodye al the meÌ„bres Then in asmuch as the church is vniuersall and
sparkled thorowe al the worlde there is no creature nor liuynge man that can be the heade seynge there is not that can be in all places where she is nor that can gyue hyr ayde and assistence suche as to hyr is requisite but the onelye Iesus Christe the whyche by hys diuine power and by hys holye spirite fulfilleth the heauen and the earth and is present vnto all hys elected the whiche he doeth leade conducte gouerne and vinifie whyche non other can or maye do wherefore what so euer he be that wyll make hym selfe heade of thys churche whereof he oughte to be but a membre he is neyther heade nor mēbre but doeth make hym selfe a mēbre of Antichriste and hathe chosen Satan for his head in asmuche as he setteth him selfe in the place of Iesus Christe settyng vp hym selfe aboue hym not knowledgynge him for his head vnto whom boeth Angelles and men oughte to be subiectes for S. Paul shewyng the fruites of the resurrection and ascention of Iesus Ephe. i. iiii Colo. i. ii Christe wryteth howe that God hath exalted and set hym vp aboue all heauens and aboue all the thrones powers Lordeshyppes and dominions and hathe gyuen hym to be heade of hys churche Natha I vnderstande wel what thou wouldeste saye I shall holde me then vnto hym and wyll neuer acknoweledge other head of that triumphant churche but shall holde for hys ministers the true ministers and pastours of his churche and the other whyche wyll attribute vnto them selues that dignitie for verye Antichristes But lette vs come nowe vnto that thou haste promised me and declare vnto me what example we maye take of all the historie of oure lorde Iesus Christ Phy. That were very longe to be recounted and tolde for ther is nothynge so litle whiche cōteineth not greate sacramēts misterie but I wyll onelye sette forth the thynge vnto the in two wordes by the which thou maist iudg of al the reste The historie of our lord Iesus Christe serueth vs for an example in two maners and fyrste howe we oughte to confirme How the historie of Iesu christ serueth for exemple oure selues vnto hym as concernynge oure regeneration and spirituall lyfe whyche is hidden in him the other howe we oughte to confirme oure selues vnto hym in oure outwarde lyuynge cōuersatiō Natha The more thou wouldeste make the thynges shorte the more they seme darke vnto me wherfore I pray the thynke not muche nor spare me nother tyme nor wordes but expounde me the thynges so largly that I may haue cleare vnderstandynge of them and tell me the fyrste poynte what vnderstandeste thou by the spirituall lyfe of the whych the historie of Iesus Christ serueth vs for an example Phylype I vnderstande that all the lyfe of Iesus Christe oughte fyrste to serue vs as an allegorye by the whyche we oughte spirituallye to yelde oure selues to be conformable vnto Iesus Christe in that whyche verelye riallye hathe bene accomplished in hys bodie the which can not be in ours Natha Thou speakest not much clearlier thē thou dydeste therefore declare vnto me that whych thou wouldeste say by exemple Phy. I am contente Iesus Christe hath beene conceiued by the holy Gost borne of the virgyn Marye he hath bene crucified dead buried is rysen agayne and gone vp into heauē all whyche thynges can not be accomplished in oure bodies as they haue bene in hys But lette vs take payne that oure spirite maye in the same be conformable vnto hym oure bodies be conceyued and borne in synne and iniquitie not of the holy Goste in the wombe of a vyrgin but of corruptible seede and then for to be conformable vnto hym in thys lette vs nowe come vnto hys church beleue in hys Gospell and in the same whyche is oure mother and a virgin pure and chast we shal be conceyued and begotten by the incorruptible seede of the word of God our father and by Spiritual cōceptiō birth Gala. iiii i. Petre. ii Iohn xxxi Ephe. iiii the vertue of hys holye spirite shal be borne agayne chyldrene of God and shall be newe creatures and put of the olde manne and put on the newe bearynge the Image of the newe Adam whyche is Iesus Christe as wee haue borne that of the olde and of the synfull man Natha Beholde for thys is a holye conception and happye byrth Phy. Then in asmuche as we be all ready so conceyued of the holye Goste and borne of that pure virgin the churche whyche is the spouse of Iesus it muste followe also that the Eph. v. reste of oure lyfe be conformable vnto that of Iesus Christe accordynge to our spirituall conception natiuitie and byrthe We be not crucified nor put vnto death as he was but learne we of him to beare our crosse To be crucified with christ wyth him to be crucified vnto the worlde the worlde vnto vs as saynte Paule doeth write of hym selfe Nathana And howe can we be crucified vnto the worlde and the worlde vnto vs Phylyp When we dye vnto the world likewise dieth the world vnto vs. Na. These maner of speakynges To die to the worlde be verye darke Phy. They be darke vnto them whyche be not acquaynted or accustomed wyth the maner of speaking of the Apostles But I do vse ◠wyllynglye boeth to accustome the and bycause I do take pleasure in the stile of the spirite of God and of his Apostles To be crucified and dead vnto the worlde that is to be crucified dead vnto sinne and that is to forsake Rom. vi synne to haue no more acquayntaunce wyth hym and to do him no more seruice thē the dead do vnto the lyuynge for as the dead haue nothynge in commune wyth the liuinge but be seperated the one frome the other and haue no more acquayntaunce togyther euen so be they deade vnto the world which haue forsaken it to serue God and wyl no more be conformable vnto it that is to saye vnto the fleshe nor vnto hys concupiscences so is it impossible but they whiche be thus dead vnto the worlde liue vnto God and the worlde To liue vnto the worlde lykewise dead vnto them by the contrarye they whyche lyue vnto the worlde and vnto whom the worlde lyueth be dead vnto God as the Apostle doeth wryte of the voluptuous wydowe sayinge the wydowe whyche i Timo. ii doeth lyue in lustes pleasures in so lyuyng is dead and bicause that she lyueth vnto the worlde she is dead vnto God so then when we dye vnto the worlde we ryse vnto God and do practise in oure selues the exemple of the death and passiō of Iesus Christ spiritually whē we mortify our earthlye mēbres offer our bodies as lyuyng sacrifices vnto god Roma xii Colo. iii. and do kil by the swerd of the worde and do burne vp by the fyre of his spirite oure cōcupiscence carnall affectiōs lustes whiche be