desire to confer with you if I may know who you are you shall herein do me a singular pleasure to teach me better which if ye do not or make me know who ye are I cannot think this counsell to be given in sinceritie Whereas I say ye sue for a Toleration and consequently for a Separation it is most true in the sense that I take a Separation viz. for a Separation from our Discipline and Sacramentall Communion as I have fully proved in this my Book whereunto all the Independent Churches in the world cannot answer for if ye be not separated from us but entertain union and communion with us what need ye more a Toleration rather then the rest of the members of our Church P. 18. Sect. 3. What I say of your undervaluing the Parliaments favour it is true and howbeit ye have not been yet accused before the Parliament or the Assembly yet doth not that justifie you but highly commend their great mercy singular prudence and charity in not taking notice of your indiscretions to say no more in calumniating nick-naming the Protestant Churches and publishing unto the world such unworthy Books against them yea against those whom ye acknowledge for your Benefactors Is not this I pray thee M.S. an undervaluing of so great favours is not this an extraordinary ingratitude to ward the Churches of the Netherlands who so lovingly received you and cherished you in the dayes of your affliction Well good men if yee esteem it not so they both may think their favours to have bin very ill bestowed upon so unthankfull men But this M.S. and C.C. tell us that they have done nothing but by Ordinance of Parliament What wretched men the very shame of this Kingdom I pray thee Reader pardon me if I give them not the titles that just anger would extort dare ye in face of Parliament and all the world so impudently father this indiscreet Book farced with little else save Calumnies upon the two most honourable Houses of Parliament Have ye I pray any order from either of the Houses to publish it unto the world Have ye any order from them to calumniate on this manner and to put nick-names upon the most orthodox Churches to call the Presbyterian an Episcopall Government Shall Protestants abroad read all this If they read it what I pray can they judge of this Parliament and their affection towards them unlesse they judge you to be lyers Well M.S. and C.C. yee speak both boldly and sawcily of the Parliament And as if all this yet were not enough thou M.S. to be sure to out-run C.C. tells us that the name of Stuart in foure men has been fatall to England and Scotland viz. in King James King Charles Doctor Stuart the Divine and in Adam Stuart here Pag. 22. Sect. 3. Hare-brained Fellow that thou art what has King James King Charles or Doctor Stuart to do with this Dispute canst thou not dispute calmly with me unless thou be snarling and biting like a mad Dog at every one that stands necre thee at Kings Parliament and all the best reformed Orthodox Churches of the Christian world I will not cast Horoscopes or consult Astrologues and Deviners as thou dost but if the Laws of the Kingdom be consulted God knoweth what a sad account thou mayest ere long bee called unto for such wilde expressions P. 19. Sect. 1. I am sory that yee vaunt your selfe that the Parliament resolved with a generall acclamation that your Apologie should be left unblamed and that ye threaten so many sorrows that should have befallen the Churches if it had been condemned If it be so it is a pittie but they should make great acclamations to so great and mighty Independent Ministers that thinke none of them so much as worthy to communicate with their Churches but will that they depend upon them But I beleeve that this is like to the rest of your vain braggings All that thou sayest P. 19. Sect. 3. they are but meere calumnies It is not I but the Independents themselves who sow the seed of Division betwixt themselves on the one part and the Parliament here the Scots and all Protestant Churches on the other only I declare what they are and I am glad if any of them have the grace to blush or be ashamed of it Nam pudor est virtutis color And so I answer thee in thine own words nec oleum nec operam perdo Those 6. things Proverbs 6.16 belong not to me but to thy selfe and as others say they are the very Essentiall notes of your Independent Churches Thou tellest also thereabout that thou divinest I wish rather thou wert a sound Divine then a Diviner To what thou sayest P. 20. Sect. 1. Because I have found thee and those who write against me such notorious lyers I must tell thee I cannot beleeve thee being my Adversary and I beleeve that no man will beleeve thee till that they have it from a better hand Ibid. Your Minister who preacheth us a tale beginning with In the name of God and ending with a Goose seemeth to have been some Independent Minister like your selfe happily your worthy selfe for that you take so great pleasure to fill up your Book with so worshipfull authorities Sect. 2. The Nick-names you take on you not to know they are 1. Calvinians Apolog. Nar. p. 20. 2. Bishops which ye your selves pin upon our Ministers p. 9. 3. An Idol that must be grinded to powder c. What ever ye say pag. 20. sect 4. I maintain that first in Conventickling your selves in Assemblies a part 2. In taking particular resolution a part 3. in taking of it against the resolution of the Assembly of Divines and 4. finally since in the thanks-giving to the Scots Commissioners such proceedings have been most cleerly howbeit indirectly condemned by the Synod it selfe no rationall man to speaking truly can call it other then an Assembly in the Assembly and against the Assembly And to say that particular Members of the Assembly may print what they please against the common opinion of the Assembly who ever sayes it he knoweth little or not at all how Ecclesiasticall Assemblies are to be governed What you say p. 21. sect 1. I see it is not reason but anger that maketh you to speak so And this may excuse you à tanto sed non a toto if now at length you be sory for it To your 2. sect where you give out your judgement in comparing another mans discretion and mine together he may be a man whose discretion I honour more then yours and mine own both but as for you I cannot but tell you Judicium praeceps insaeni judicis index Sect. 6. To shew his great skill in Phylosophy he quarrelleth with me for saying that the will is a blind Faculty and will needs perswade me most imperiously that the will of it selfe understandeth wherefore then I pray shall not the understanding likewise will Prudence choose and vertue
You were They that first oppos'd Your selves to the Tyranny of the proud Spanyard and that first of all others stayed the violent course of his Conquests that like an impetuous Torrent was wont to bear down all before him So as from a very meane and low beginning of a suddain He was become so excessively great by possessing himself of the most commodious and considerable Estates of the World as that he was come to reckon his Crowns by Hundreds and Thousands Yet You that were but the least part of His Estates and that were accompted no better then Beggars Gueux in comparison of those vast Treasures that He drew from Peru You I say were They that first blunted the edge of His Conquests and knapt in sunder the Bonds wherewith he would have enslav'd You setting Free and at Liberty together with Your selves multitudes of others whom He out of an insatiable Appetite not knowing how to set limits or bounds to his over-swelling Ambition had fully purposed to make his Vassalls Moreover You constrained him though much against stomack to acknowledge You for Soveraigns such as depended not at all upon upon His Jurisdiction And not contenting Your selves with all this You went and found him out in his own Hereditary Estates and pursued Him with fire and sword even to his own doores Yea You Traversed God knows how many Seas as wel towards the East as the West setting at liberty those poor Barbarians over whose Bodies he exercised so many cruell and new devised Tyrannies and all this under the pretext of a false Donation by the Bishop of Rome And as if You had not an Adversary at home that would cut You out businesse enough nor an Object sufficient to entertain You You set Your selves on work to discover severall Lands that were altogether unknown to former Ages the which You subjected to Your own Dominions But yet all these Politicall and Martial Vertues are nothing in comparison of Your Christian Vertues and Your Zeal to the Reformed Religion For no sooner had You freed Your selves from the Yoak of the Spanyard but You willingly submitted Your necks to the service of the Son of God and made Your Country a Sanctuary and Refuge to the poor Protestants whether persecuted in France or elsewhere And those Barbarians that You subjugated in Asia and America You subdued no lesse to the Kingdom of the Son of God then to Your own Signory so joyning the glory of God together with Your own Interests and enlarging the Empire of his Son with Your own and marrying which is rarely seen and therefore seems almost impossible the Maxims of State and the Principles of Religion together Evidencing it to the whole world that You are no lesse good Christians then great Polititians These are the Reasons Most Excellent Lords that moved me to Dedicate this small Treatise to Your Excellencies to wit Your great Zeal for the glory of God and the Edification of his Church Your present worthy Employment and Embassy Your Troubles in Religion alike with ours and particularly the Honor which one of Your Universities hath lately conferred upon me Now I beseech God to give You length of dayes with all sort of Temporall Happinesse in this World and to heap upon You Eternall Blessings in the World to come To powre out the most benigne and pretious influence of his Grace upon Your flourishing Estates Provinces to blesse all Your worthy undertakings to make You proceed as You have begun and to give You evermore Victory over all Your Enemies both Spirituall and Temporall to the end Your Signories may continue as firm and stable as the Heavens So prayeth he that is ever Obliged to remain Your EXCELLENCIES Most humble and obedient servant ADAM STEUART To the READER Gentle Reader THou hast here two Treatises the first concerning the Iudgements and Opinions of the Reformed Churches touching the businesse of Independency which may very well be equipollent if not preferable to an Oeucumenick Counâ—â—â— For in a Councell it is no such matter of wonder that men that are continually together and evermore conferring one with another should agree in their Opinions But this seemes rather a thing altogether admirable that These severall Churches notwithstanding they are so separated and divided in regard of the distances of their Places should jumpe so harmoniously in the Vnity and Consent of their Opinions The second is the Duply of Doctor Steuart to a Booke of M. S. alias of two Brethren who for very shame thought it their best and safest way to conceale their Names expressing only their fond and erronious Opinions and conceits Now good Reader I shall entreat this one favour at thy hands that thou wilt conferre diligently Doctor Steuarts Observations and the pretended Answer of M. S. and thou shalt finde that they have answered nothing at all to the purpose for that they omit wholly many of the most important Questions as that Touching the Power of the Members of the Church c. and of those few they do cull out here and there they answer not all the Arguments brought by the Doctor for making of them good but only those they finde to be the weakest And those Arguments they do attaque him upon they do but only scratch at them and never give them any solid or substantiall Answer contenting themselves with their jerkes of Language their ralleries injuries or with some Rhetoricall Digression from the businesse in hand the which thou wilt easily perceive if thou please to conferre Page with Page Question with Question and Argument with Argument which I instantly desire thee thou wouldst doe So as it was no way needfull that Doctor Steuart should have written any Confutation at all or vindicated his Observations And in very deed these last Pieces that he hath written were not undertaken so much for the making good of his owne Arguments or the Refutation of M. S. as that he might treat more largely and fully some Questions which he had only briefly toucht at in his Observations As also that he might draw those Foxes out of their Holes bringing light out of their darke Writings and so give some satisfaction to weak Brethren who ordinarily suffer themselves to be carried away with the streame of Language rather then with force of Arguments Now I have entituled this Treatise Zorobabel to Sanballat not so much to compare the Persons as the Causes one with another betwixt which there seemes to be very great Affinity and resemblance For 1. The Jewes at that time were about the re-building of the materiall Temple and we at this present upon the re-building or the Reforming of the spirituall Temple 2. That People served the true God but were Schismaticks that refused to sacrifice in the Temple at Hierusalem These men in like manner serve the true God whom we serve and have the same Doctrine with us but are Schismatickes that refuse to joyne themselves in Synods with us 3. They came from
shall shew hereafter that ye are not Separatistae nominales but reales If the Church lie now gasping as you complain who I pray can be the cause of it but your selves that vex and torment her more then Papists Arminians Anabaptists Socinians and all other Sects and Heresies besides ever yet did P. 2. sect 4. Thou art a strange Divine that consultest Astrologues about the Horoscope of my Book But to that I say no more but what the Prophet saith Stand up with thine enchantments and with the multitude of thy sorceries if so be thou maiest prevaile Let now the Astrologers the Star-gazers the monethly Prognesticators stand up Jer. 10.12 I am not dismayed at the signe of the heaven for the Heathen are dismaid at them I tell thee with all thy Chaldeans and Sorcerers I feare you not all Christians feare not such Prophets God hath raised us up a Prophet like to Moyses whom we must heare and Moyses tels thee that they who doe these things that thou doest are an abomination to the Lord Deut. 18.10 11 12 13 14 15. After this sect 6. in the same pag. he giveth out his judgement upon the title of my Book but without the least judgement or reason at all P. 3. Sect. 1. He accuseth me to be too peremptorious in determining the question and so anticipating the judgement of the Assembly Answ 1. If I anticipate so I must tell him does he with the rest of the Sectaries of his Faction in determining the question for his party 2. particular mens Determinations cannot anticipate the judgement of the Assembly or take it out of their hands as most ignorantly hee pretends for particular mens private Determinations are evermore subject to publike Determination 3. Neither is it necessary that when ever Sects or Heresies creepe into the Church wee should presently all begin to suspend our judgements in things revealed in Gods word and already determined by the Church as this is as we shall God willing hereafter make appeare and so stand ever gaping after new Decisions I should doe my selfe wrong to answer the 2 Sect. Which conteineth only his unreasonable judgement against me who say nothing of Independents but what I prove by evident Reasons And the judgements of Protestant Churches abroad here printed will decide this Controversie But what he saith from the rest of the third page till page the 6. Sect 3. it shall be an swered in a particular question P. 4. Sect. 2. A.S. his Observations are like a man with a Pole-ax knocking a man on the head to kill a fly lighting on his heard Answ What this man meaneth by his Pole-axe I know not I strike at no mans head If I strike at any fly it must be some Wasp and then either a Hornet that stingeth to death the Horse of whose dung it is bred or a Wasp with which Tertullian not unfitly compareth Sectaries faciunt favos vespae faciunt Ecclesias Marcionite quid ni Donatista P. 6. Sect. 3. He propounds himselfe for a pattern to me in writing But hee must excuse me if I tell him plainly I hold him not worthy the imitating neither may I ever so much reverence any of his party as to quit my Christian liberty to refute their extravagancies where ever I meet with them especially when they appeare to be of so pernicious a consequence As for the title of Most revenend that I gave them I learn't it in part of themselves that they are reverend and since their reverence is independent what else could I take it for but most reverend that acknowledge no superiour Reverence Sect. 5. Howsoever of his liberality hee bestow the lie on me I must pray him permit me to return it home again for what I said before by his good leave I must say again it is most true that in your particular Opinions ye differ from all true reformed Churches at least so far forth as they are distinguished from Conventicles and Schismaticall Assemblies And as for your Reformed Churches in England viz. Independent from which ye differ not 1. they are invisible 2. they are Schismaticall 3. and erected without the Civill Magistrates consent and such Churches your selves hold unlawfull turbulent Schismaticall and punishable in N.E. And if in N.E. wherefore I pray not in old England also Sect. 6. And as for that his conjecture that I wil object some Manuscripts and Master Parkers letter from N.E. and another from Zeland it is his mistake for it was not my intention to dispute in a liminary Epistle only I say of Master Parker since he puts me upon this subject that if he were at his liberty in O.E. as he is in servitude under that oppression of N.E. he might happily say more then he will be allowed to say there P. 7. Sect. 1. It is also a great mistake in him to think that their Discipline can be abused to ill it cannot be abused but to good P. 8 Sect. 1. It is an abominable accusation and a black calumnie that hee layeth upon the Reformed Churches of Zeland viz. that there are in their letters many high passages seeming so prejudiciall to our worthy Magistracy that it justifieth that of the Apologie 2. for that letter speaketh not at all of the Magistrate or Magistracy of England 2. It speaketh only of their own wherof this little Independent Minister is too bold to thinke himselfe a competent Judge Neither will they depend of him howbeit he should a spire to be as Independent as Lucifer himself 3. They speak not of all their Magistrates but of some and especially of those who joyned with the Arminian Sect The Arminians crying up their authority in the Spirituall government of the Church and these unworthy Magistrates crying down the Doctrine 4. Because the Government of Holland and the Magistrates power there is not like to that of England the one being Monarchicall or rather mixt of Monarchicall Aristocraticall and Democraticall as it is commonly holden here and the other Aristocraticall or mixt of Aristocracy and Democracy and therefore the rules of the one Government cannot be well drawn in consequence for the other 5. This M.S. cognomento Calumniator in this matter should have done well and gone more honestly to work if he had cited those high passages so prejudiciall to our worthy Magistracy but he shewes himselfe more cunning then so to discover his calumny 6. As for his sententious conclusion of this point with Verbum sapienti sat est a man very well affectioned to the Zelanders in reading of it added in the margin of the Book sed non insipientis nedum decipientis It is as great pitty so good men should have harboured so ill and so unthankfull Guests P. 9. Sect. 3. He speaketh as if he were a Prophet sent to reforme all the Churches of the world so did Bur Jesu and bringeth us in I know not what a Master Davenport like another Salomon in the way of N.E. casting out his
the Church By their naturall estate or condition I understand either their estate of integrity as that of the good Angels who continued in their Originall purity and of the wicked who afterwards apostatized and of Adam Eve before their fall or of corruption such as is that of all mankind after our first sin By the word called here must be understood the act of vacation by Gods word either internall speaking unto Angels or mens Consciences by the light of nature or supernaturall Inspirations 1 Cor. 1.9 1 Pet. 5.10 1 Thes 2.12 and 4.7 or externall such as is the vocall and written word of God or any other externall signe presented to our outward Senses by him as 1 Jo. 1.3 2 Thes 2.4 Heb. 1.1 And therefore the Elect before they be borne and called are not properly or actually but meerly potentially and vertually members of the Church 1. For how can he be a member of the Church who is not yet in Rerum natura 2. By the same reason the Church should have been actually before the Creation of the world and before she was created from all eternity for God elected his Church from all eternity 3. Men of age should be actually members of Christs Church without Faith for they have not actually Faith by Election but by their efficacious Vocation 4. And howsoever the Decree of Predestination or Election be requisite and be the first cause of the Church and of all the members thereof and it being put all the second Causes must needs be yet makes it not them to be when it is its self but in their own time and in due season when it is put in execution by some externall act of Gods Almighties power which can not be eternal as his Decree but temporal 5. Because Gods Church is an House a Family and a City which can not be built of stones that are not or composed of Domesticks and Citizens that are not in this world 6. A man cannot be the Brother of Christ and member of his church before he be regenerate or born againe how much lesse before he be generated or born unlesse ye will say that he may have his second birth or generation before he have the first Out of this naturall estate c. here is expressed Terminus a quo et ad quem from whence and whereunto the Church or the members thereof are called Terminus a quo or from whence is from the estate of Nature pure and incorrupt not incorruptible as was that of the Angels and of man before his Fall or of corrupt nature such as hath been that of mankinde since their Fal. Terminus ad quem or whereunto they are called or which can intend is Grace in this life and supernaturall Glory in that to come By supernaturall Glory must be understood supernaturall Beatitude or felicity which is the last aym their summum bonum or greatest good and perfection whereunto they tend or which they can intend And this in respect of entire and pure or immaculate Nature is absolutely called Beatitude or Felicity but in regard of corrupt Nature Salvation for it is not a man without sin as Christ or Angels that never sinned but Adam his posterity that are said to be saved from their sins and misery whereunto by sin they are subject Means are called convenient when they are fit to effect that which by them is intended such in respect of Angels was the Law of Nature printed in their Understanding answerable to their spirituall Nature some Supernatural Precepts also for they were bound to beleeve the Trinitie answerable in Adam before his Fall was the Law and such respect to the spirituall and corporall nature whereof he was compounded as the Morall Law and some supernaturall Precepts to beleeve the Trinity c. proportionate to the end and aym viz. supernaturall glory whereunto he should tend and which he should intend And in regard of all mankind since our Fall is the Covenant of Grace and the means to fulfill it as Faith Hope and Charity The Church in this vast and large signification contains 1. in it self the company of Angels 1. because the Scripture sayes so Heb. 12.22 23. 1 Pet. 1.12 2. because they are our Fellow-servants and our Brethren Apoc. 19.10 and 22.9 they belong to one society with us 3. because the Angels are our Con-disciples in studying the Gospel with us 1 Pet. 1.12 4. Because they are Subjects with us of one Celestiall Republike and Citizens of one Celestiall City 5. Because we aspire to the same Beatitude and Felicity with them viz. to the vision of Gods face and ardent Charity 6. Because in respect of our spirituall part and the Faculties thereof our Intellect and Will we are capable of the same union with God 7. Because Christ is head of the Angels as well as of Men Col. 2.19 Eph. 4.15.8 Because he is their Creator Conservator Mediator God gathered in one all things in Christ both which are in Heaven and which are in Earth and every thing in them Eph. 1.10.9 Because the Angels adore Christ Hebr. 1.6.10 Because all things yea the Angels are subject to Christ Hebr. 1.7 2. It contains men in Heaven and in Earth for the Church in Earth and in Heaven differ onely as a man travelling and one arrived to his Port or home All these that are or shall be saved those that are already born and to be born regenerate or to be regenerate howsoever they that are not yet born or regenerate be not actually members of the Church till they be born and regenerated This Church in regard of its materiall parts integrity and quantity may be distinguished 1. into the Catholike or universall and particular Church The Catholike Church is that which before we defined composed of all the Elect Angels and Men. 2. Again it is to be observed in passing of this Word Catholike Church that it is not a term of Scripture nor was any man called a Catholike in the Apostles time if we beleeve Pacianus epist 1. Ad Sempronianum neither in their time was the Christian Faith spread Catholikely or Universally through all the World and hence many Protestants infer that the Creed I mean that of the Apostles was not framed by them Neverthelesse we have some terms in Scripture equivalent unto it as that of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Heb 12.23 that signifies a generall Assembly Item the City of the living God the Heavenly Jerusalem ver 22. the Church of the first-born which are written in Heaven c. The Church then is called Vniversall 1. in respect of her Intrinsecall and Essentiall form viz. internall vertues viz. Faith Hope Charity and the Spirit of Christ which be all and the same in all the members thereof for howsoever the Church in respect of some Gifts otherwayes called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and by the Schoolmen gratia gratis data is distributed by Christ unto some of her members not so much for
their own as for other mens use and salvation to be a corpus heterogeneum dissimilare an Organicall Body composed of divers parts of different names and natures one from another and from the whole Body having different functions and operations as of prophecy government of Miracles c. as a man of his head legs and arms whereof the one is not of like nature or like name with an other or with the man for the leg is not the head nor a man as the Apostle declares neverthelesse in regard of her spirituall and saving gifts as Faith Hope Charity c. wherein consists her intrinsecall form conferred upon the Elect for their own use otherwayes called by Schoolmen gratia gratum faciens Grace that makes us acceptable to God it is totum homogeneum or similare a similary Body Composed of the like parts whereof every one hath the same name and nature one with another and with the whole Body for all the members of Christ have the like Faith inclining to the like Acts of Beleef the same Mysteries and a like Charity inclining to the like Acts of love to all men and especially to the Houshold of Faith So every particular Church is a Church one as another and as the universall Church I speak here of the redeemed Church for the Church of Angels and of men before their Fall be not parts homogeneall with the redeemed Church because of their dissimulary Covenant and intrinsecall formes and vertues Item the Church may be denominated universall in regard of her extrinsecall and accidentall forme consisting 1. in the externall profession of her intrinsecall Christian vertues by confession of her Faith Hope and exercise of Charity and holinesse of life 2. In her participation of the holy Sacraments according to Gods Word 3. In her extrinsecall sound Discipline and Government which should be in every Church Againe the Church may be universall in respect of some Circumstances viz. of time place persons and Ages 1. of time because the Christian Church from her first institution by Christ till the end of the world shall never decay 2. of place not positively as if it were in all places but negatively because it is not excluded from any place as that of the old Testament limited within the confines of the Holy Land but spread through all the world Psal 19.5 Mat. 26.13 Col. 1.6.3 of Persons of all Ages Sects and Conditions for no man is excluded from the Gospell neither Iew nor Greeke neither Servant nor Freeman neither Male nor Female Gal. 3.28 2. And it may be distinguished according to her materiall or integrant parts into the Church of Angels and of men But the Scripture has very little of that of the Angels so as we may let it passe 3. That of men may be distinguished according to the state and condition thereof into that which is Militant here on earth fighting against Sathan and Triumphant and victorious in Heaven reigning eternally with God 4. The Militant according to the state thereof and Covenant is distinguished into that which was before the Fall that after the Fall The Church before the Fall was composed of Adam and Eve alone and governed by the Law of Nature and some supernaturall Precepts and called to supernaturall felicity I say composed of Adam and Eve alone viz. actually for howsoever before the creation of Eve God or Christ was his head yet could he not be his Head as of a Church 1. For a Church is a company not of the Head and one member but of the Head and many members Rom. 12.5 Eph. 1.22 23.2 Because before the Creation of the Woman there was no symbolicall Law nor Sacraments of the Covenant ordained by God as the Tree of Life 3. Because the Church is a Family a City a Kingdome which cannot consist of one member Col. 1.13 Rom. 14.17 1 Tim. 3.15 Apo. 21.2 Matth. 13.11 Item a body composed of sundry members 1 Cor. 12. a flocke 1 Pet. 5.2 which is not composed of one sheep yea after the Creation of Eve it was not a perfect or compleat Church but in fieri tending to perfection by the propagation of mankind and perfected in its fieri when it was breeding for to a perfect Church is requisite a Ruler or Rulers and some to be ruled and not one alone 2. Because the Church is a Society like to that of a Kingdom or a City which can not consist of two persons only 3. Because howsoever three may compound a Colledge yet can they not make up an Ecclesiasticall or politicall Society 4. Because in a Church there must be power of Excommunication which cannot subsist in two for if the one should Excommunicate the other the Church should perish which is repugnant to the nature of Excommunication which is not given to the destruction but to the conservation of the Church 1 Cor. 5. 5. Because it was imperfect in its ayme in respect of man for it brought no man to felicity or glory 6. Because to every Reall Church correspond some Representative Church which is a sign of the Reall and not altogether the same but there could be no representative Church before the Fall correspondent to it different from it selfe because these were but two persons not differing from themselves notwithstanding it might have been represented by an Ambassadour but not by a Church The Militant Church after the fall is that which is redeemed by Christ called in him to the forgivenesse of their sins and eternall Glory 5. This in regard of time and state is either before Christ as that of the Old Testament wherein Christ was obscurely revealed or of the New since his comming wherein he is more cleerly revealed which for this cause is called the Christian Church partly because it is since Christ partly because Christ is more visibly revealed unto her partly because he in Person revealed himselfe and his Gospel for the Law was given by Moses but Grace was given by Iesus Christ Iohn 1. The particular Church is only a part of the Universall or totall Church And as the universall is universall 1. In regard of Time which comprehends all the Churches of all times 2. Of place which comprehends the Churches of all places or through all the world 3. Or of Persons which comprehends all forts of persons so the particular is either 1. in regard of time which only comprehends in its selfe the Churches of a certaine time as that of the Old Testament which was before the comming of Christ in the flesh and that of the New which is since his comming So we call the Church Primitive that which was before our times immediatly after Christ his comming and some time after 2. Or in regard of places as when we say that a Church is Nationall which is in one Kingdome or Republick Provinciall that is in one Province and Parochiall which is confined within the limits of one Parish 3. Or in regard of Persons which
comprehends a certaine number of persons of one or divers places Here it is to be observed 1. That the Church may be denominated universall or particular either absolutely or respectively in relation to another bigger or lesse so Absolutely the universall Church comprehends in its selfe all the Churches of all times of all places of all forts of Persons Angels and men of all Estates or conditions and Covenants As that in the Covenant of integrity naturall or supernaturall as of Angels and men before their Fall and that in the state of sin under the Covenant of Grace and in the state of Glory And according to this consideration the Church of the Angels is one particular Church That of Mankind another The Triumphant and Militant two others and in a word all the parts thereof may be called particular Churches Respectively the Church of Mankind is an universall Church in respect of its parts as of that before and after the Fall the Triumphant and Militant so the Church after the Fall is universall in respect of that of the Old and New Testament which be its parts and the Christian in respect of its parts in Heaven and on Earth of the Primitive and that of subsequent times that which is in all the world in respect of its parts in divers Kingdomes Provinces c. But that which is most to the purpose in this our Discourse is the Catholick Christian Church here upon earth 6. Againe the Militant Church whether she be considered according to her universality and totality or particularity in her severall parts and Assemblies in respect of her internall and externall forme is either visible or invisible The invisible Church is that which cannot be seene but only is beleeved by Faith The visible is that which we see or behold where it is to be observed 1. That the word visible is not to be taken here strictly for the object of the sight alone or the word see or behold for the act thereof but in a more full signification for that which any waies is perceptible by the eye or any externall or internall Sense or by naturall Reason such as are the confession and profession of Christian vertues the exercise of their externall Acts whereof some be apprehended by the sight and Eye as the acts of Charity some by the hearing and Eare as the confession of Faith some by feeling as the assistance and attendance upon the Sicke some by the internall Senses some by Act of Reason only and the reason of this is because the word visible must signifie all that which is denyed by invisible now invisible signifies a negation of all that can be apprehended by any Sense or Act of Reason Ergo the word visible must signifie that which can be apprehended by any Sense or Act of Reason so that it belong to the Externall Form of the Church which represents the internall Forme thereof 2. Besides that it is here to be observed that the visible Church of it self is evermore visible and conspicuous but by Accident becomes sometimes invisible latent obscure and unseene and that 1. either because of the persecution Shee suffers by her enemies when Shee hides her selfe in the Wildernesse or 2. by reason of her slitting from one place to another as when Shee went from Hierusalem to Pella or 3. because of the weaknesse of the sight of the Seer as in Eli 1 King 9. verse 4. for want of sight as to those to whom as the Gospel so the Church professing the Gospell is hid and invisible 2 Cor. 2 3 4. 3. Finally It is not to be omitted that this is not a Division of the Churchinto two Species or two integrant parts or any waies into parts really but Accidentally distinguished For a Church altogether one in the same time and place and according to the same parts may be howsoever according to divers considerations and Formes which be the grounds of divers considerations it may be Visible and Invisible as the Church of Geneva which is visible in respect of her externall forme viz. Confession of the true Christian Faith the profession thereof and other christian vertues Item in respect of her Discipline c. And the same Church in respect of her internall Forme viz. Faith Hope Charity the Spirit of Christ c which be spirituall qualities altogether invisible in the sense before declared is altogether invisible 7. The Militant Church both in her totality and partiality may be divided into two integrant parts viz. into the Over-seers that preach teach rule c. and the Flock which is over-seene And they be the two principall parts concurring to its integrity without the which it cannot be a totall or whole visible Church and therefore a Church without Oversseers is not a whole visible Church I say a whole or totall Church for without Pastors it may be a totum essentiale i.e. essentially a Church for Pastors are not absolutely necessary for the essence but for the integrity of a Church Item I say without Over-seers 1. All Over-seers for it may be that a Church may subsist without Pastors alone or Doctoss alone or Rulers or Elders alone or Deacons alone but not without all 8. The Militant visible Church whether it be conceived in its universality and totality or in its particularity in severall Congregations is either Reall or Representative The Reall Militant Church is any visible Church here upon Earth composed of all its reall Professors of the Gospel The Representative Church is an Assembly of certaine Persons or Church-Officers in an Ecclesiasticall Iudicatory chosen out of the whole Body of the Reall Church to represent it as it is such be the Sessions or Consistories the Synods Provinciall and Nationall As for the Reall visible Church some thinke that it is very probable that it is never altogether without Iustifying Faith but it is probable that where there be very small Congregations of seven or eight persons they may be all without Faith and especially where the Church is corrupt or where the Members are all vicious and dissolute Their conjecture will hold more probable in great Congregations in Provinciall and Nationall Churches But in a Representative Church composed of very few Church-Officers it is very probable that sometimes they may all be without Faith howsoever they represent a Church of Reall Beleevers for to represent Reall Beleevers it is not absolutely necessary that they that are to represent them be Beleevers or have the same essentiall and internall Forme with those whom they represent but that they have the externall confession and profession of their Faith whereby they represent them nor represent they their Faith but their profession of faith So the Image of Caesar represents really Caesar without any humane nature such as is in Caesar and so may men without Faith represent them that have Faith By the word Church we must understand the Militant Christian particular and reall Church consisting of one Congregation These
question As if I should goe about to prove that Christ according to his humane nature had a Body his due dimensions or qnantitie because all men have so But you should except Christ for so no man can prove any thing for evermore my Adversary shall except that which is in question 15. If all the people promiscuously may judge then they may judge without their Presbyters and Church-Officers But the Consequent is false E. The Antecedent from whence it is inferred is false also They will not deny the Assumption and it may be proved thus For without their Pastors and Seniors the Congregation cannot make a compleat Church the People being but one halfe thereof and their Rulers the other Besides that there may be some Cases wherein the People cannot judge alone as in point of Heresie and touching the capacitie of Ministers admitted to Preach The Consequence of the first Proposition may be proved thus For if they be all Judges and of foure hundred or five hundred foure or five or fifteen chance to be absent the rest may judge the number of those that are absent being no wayes considerable in respect of that which is present But so is the Case in the first Proposition Item Because if of the people two three or foure yea 20.30 or 40. be absent the Church-Officers with the rest will judge without them Why shall not then the People have the same power also in absence of the Church-Officers fince they have all alike power to judge viz. every man one voyce This Argument ariseth out of our Brethrens Supposition viz. that every one has power to judge and rule 16. I Would willingly aske our Brethren whether or no they thinke that an Ecclesiasticall Judgement can hold without the Peoples presence and voyces If it can hold then the peoples voycing is not absolutely needfull nor ex instituto divino For it cannot hold nor be just without that which God requires to make it just If it cannot hold without the Peoples voyces I ask againe whether all the peoples voyces be requisite or that the major part suffice If all it is impossible Morally neither see we ever almost that in a great Congregation all can meet together or if they meet together that all consent together yea nor in lesser Assemblies If the major part suffice as it must be said then can it not hold for if many be absent and of those that are present the major part surmount the lesser by 4.5.6 or 7. voyces then the lesser part may complaine that all the people were not present and so desire the businesse to be remitted to another meeting so that in conclusion no businesse should ever end unlesse all the people were present which ordinarily never or rarely falls out Item they fall into that very inconvenience which they presse so hard against their Brethren viz. that they that are absent shall be led by the nose and consent by an implicite Faith to a Judgement of Doctrine or of Discipline of great consequence for other mens judgements sake whereunto Formally they dissented For if Judgements of Consistories composed of Church-Officers alone cannot hold because then the People should be led by the nose and assent thereunto by an implicite Faith no more should the Judgement of the People in this present Case The same inconvenience or worse should fall out in voycing for if there were in the Assembly of 20000. 10000. for one part and the rest for the other Here all the rest should be led by one implicite Faith to consent against their own explicite Faith for here things are carried by pluralitie of voyces which are not weighed but accompted If only the Masters of Families or all Servants have power to voyce and if that may not procure partialities when a Father may draw his sons and servants to his opinion to voyce with him as he will 19. Besides this our Brethren must determine how many they require to accomplish the Assembly to the end that the Judgement may hold and be valeable How many for the discussion and voycing of the businesse and after it is voyced and judged how many to draw up the Sentence or Judgement for in this all Nations doe not agree neither one Senate in the Kingdome with another in another Kingdome nor one Senate in the same Kingdome with another nor one Senate with it selfe in divers times And if they determine it we pray them to draw their Determination thereof out of Gods word since they will admit of nothing concluded by naturall Reason or drawn from the Law of Nature 20. We may bring many more Reasons to shew the impossibilitie or at least the very great difficultic that is in this sort of Judicatory as the Case there should fall in many incidents as about refusing of some of the Judges some witnesses the Protestation of the nullity of the Judgement for sundry Reasons that all the Judges were not well informed of the matter some of them having given their Judgement before-hand some having promised to the party to judge so or so some of them having solicited others to judge so or so if all these Incidents should be discussed and passe by the voyces of 20000. men when should it be ended Wee might also bring other Reasons to shew how that sundry things in this Government are altogether repugnant to Ecclesiasticall Government as 21. That a man should be borne a Judge in Christs Church without any Election or Vocation to such a place But no man taketh this honour unto himselfe but he that is called of God as was Aaron Heb. 5.4 And truly there is no reason that a man yea that all men should rather be borne Judges in Gods Church then in the State 22. The Hang-man and the most ignominious persons in the world should be Judges here 23. Nothing could ever be decided for in case there were 5. or 6. divers Opinions you could decide according to none for if you followed that which had most voyces with it all the rest would voyce against it if that which had fewer they that had more would not suffer it so what ever should be said or done it should be controlled 24. We only adde Christs Command Math. 18.17 Tell it unto the Church 1. Unto the Representative Church and not to every one of the People for that should be impossible This passage our Brethren bring for them but surely it makes rather against them for Christ here establishing an Ecclesiasticall Judicatorie alludes to the order of the Jewes in their Synagogicall Judicatories and Sanedrim in Censuring of Vice and redressing of the grievances that Brethren received of Brethren in the Church for he abolishes not such Judicatories Quoad substantiam since they are grounded on the Law of Nature but quoad Circumstantias in so far as they are ordained by Moyses Captaine and the leader of the people of God or did only bind the people of the Iewes and had for Object the
gift that is in thee which was given thee by Prophesie with the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery Item That which is said c. 5. v. 21.22 About laying on of hands and drinking of wine But all this should be ridiculous and superfluous The truth is that here as in other Epistles many Duties are commanded but not all to all but some to Publick persons as to Pastours to Church-Rulers Some to particular Persons And others are common to all And this here is commanded to Timothy a Pastour and in his name to all other Pastours as the same common Dutie of them all After Scripture they bring Reason but against both Scripture and Reason 1. VVhat concerneth all ought to be done by the consent of all But the Government of the Church concernes all E. A. If by the word Consent bee here meant Formall and Actuall explicit Consent it is false 1. Because our Brethren crave not the consent of VVomen and young Men and yet the Preaching of Gods word the Administration of the Sacraments and the Government of the Church concernes them all 2. Because scarsly is it possible or at least it falls rarely out that every one whom every Act of Ecclesiasticall Government concernes consents thereunto for Voyces and suffrages sometimes are divided yea among our Brethren in their voycing So that this is against themselves 3. In our Churches it is done by the consent of all either Formall or Virtuall since our Ecclesisticall Discipline and Government is established by all and our Church Rulers have the Power to rule according to Gods word by consent of the People so far forth as they actually consent thereunto or contradict it not 4. Either they understand here the generall Forme of Government and the power of Jurisdiction or the exercise thereof in actuall judging or the execution thereof after the matter is judged which they will to be done with the consent of all The first is established by God without our consent as they avow The second we deny it for in the Politicall Government the Judges doe Voyce and judge without the consent of all whom it concerneth As for the third if it concerne all particularly as Excommunication then it is published and if none contradict the Judgement they are thought to consent at least interpretativè since they contradict it not or if any man dissent his Reasons are to be heard which if they be just the proceeding is to be hindred if not he is to rest contented according to Gods word And if after sufficient satisfaction he acquiesces not he is to be punished according to the quality of his Fault Ob. If your Ecclesiasticall Senate judge alone as the Representative Church as ye call it then must it judge according to the Judgement of the People or Reall Church otherwise it shall no more represent the People or the whole Congregation then an Assent represents a Dissent or Black represents White But that can it not unlesse it know the Judgement of the People which cannot be known but by their Voycing and hearing of them E. R. I answer 1. to the Major it must be conforme to their actuall Judgement formall I deny it for the reason here alleadged to their vertuall Judgement I grant it for they professe actually that they will follow Gods word wherein vertually is conteined and they may be deduce if they will that the Representative Church judges not according to their erronious formall and actuall judgement and so the Assumption is false R. 2. To their actuall Judgement whatsoever it be I deny it To that whereby they will judge truly according to Gods word I grant it and then the Assumption is false R. 3. To all their Judgement I deny the Major for it is impossible to follow the Judgement contradictory of divers Persons or those of one man which actually and formally or virtually may be contradictory to themselves R. 4. I answer the Representative Church must judge according to the actuall Judgement of the Reall Church or People it is false For what if the People be infected with Heresie Shall the Ministers and Rulers of the Church in that case become Hereticks or judge in favour of Hereticks according to the Judgement Such as it should be according to Gods word it is true for the Representative Church is not so called as if it represented the Churches Judgement such as it is but such as it should be according to Gods word that rules them both yea if that should represent this actuall Judgement it should doe more then 20. divers Judgements which oftentimes are to be found amongst the People upon one subject And so we deny the Assumption of the Syllogisme To the confirmation thereof I answer that it should no more represent their actuall Judgement I grant it but it should represent their Potentiall Judgement such as they are bound to have howsoever their actuall Judgements be contradictory Ob. But what if the Judgement of your Ecclesiasticall Senate or Representative Church be wrong and that of the Reall Church sound A. That Case is extraordinary in respect of the order established in Gods Church for when it is said Tell it unto the Church and if hee heare not the Church c. It is supposed that the Church will judge the judgements of the Lord or according to his Law neither hath Shee any other order from God but in that extraordinarie Case supposed I answer that neither the People nor any particular man is bound to obey the Representative Church but every one hath power of God to contest lawfully the Judgement of the Representative Church and Shee is bound to admit them in their contestations and to heare them according to the Scripture and to amend their Judgement And if all the Church or the greater part of the Reall Church or Congregation oppose it selfe to their Judgement it cannot stand nor be put in execution yea I dare say that the Representative Church shewing her selfe pertinacious in her errour after sufficient conviction or refusing to heare her conviction is really Schismaticall or Hereticall according to the matter contested in Gods account And howsoever particular men cannot right themselves but are bound to suffer injustice so long as they stay in such Churches since they are not Ecclesiasticall Judges or to retire themselves out of the societie of such Oppressors to the end they may more easily defend themselves neverthelesse the Collective Body of the Reall Church or the greater part thereof if it have the Abilitie is bound to refute them to make them ashamed yea to contemne their Judgement and by all lawfull meanes oppresse such Oppressors And this is the Doctrine of our first Reformers oppressed by the Roman Antichristianisme against Papists which holds also in Reformed Churches For it is all one to me to find Antichristian Tyranny at Rome or at Edinburgh London Paris or Amsterdam It is not the place but Antichristian Tyranny or Doctrine that makes an Antichrist And to be quit with them here I aske againe what if the Judgement of the Consistorie be right and that of the People which ordinarily falls out wrong or if the Judgement of the greater part of the People be wrong and that of the lesser part right what then is to be done or followed Here they shall find themselves in no lesse straights then they think to draw us unto Ob. They say it is a thing never heard nor seene in any Kingdome of the world or in any Ecclesiasticall Judicatorie before Calvin and Beza that all the People should be secretly as it were in a Chamber of Meditation judged out of all mens presence by six or ten Ecclesiasticall Persons A. They that say so have not seen nor heard much of that which passes in the Christian world it is a thing very ordinary to see some civill Causes in civill Judicatories Pleaded with the doors shut by the consent of the Parties yea sometimes by the will of the Judges 2. And I would pray them to go no farther to tell me if every man hath libertie to enter in at the Parliament here at home They cannot deny but that the door is kept close and that ordinarily only the Members of the House have entry 3. And neverthelesse if the Parties desire to plead their Causes in the presence of so many as may enter I doubt not but the Reformed Church will grant it them yea there is an Act of the French Discipline to that purpose commanding that the Parties desiring their Causes to be discussed openly the doores cast open it should be granted Yea wee maintain that in such Cases when parties complaine of such secret Ecclesiasticall oppression the Church is bound by law and Conscience to proceed publickly and to justifie to the world her Proceedings otherwise shee is no wayes to be believed And this Argument I had willingly passed over if it had not been urged against me and that I had beene prayed to answer it by some of our Brethren that thought it so strong that it could not be answered But to answer ad hominem may not such faults fall out amongst them that object this Argument as we have Examples of it Our Question is not so much what is done as what should be done How to establish a Law against Abuses in the Churches and not How men abuse their owne Authoritie FINIS