learne the truthe more better of the Fathers and reteined the same more freshly in memorie For that Plato in Timeo was of that opinion and all the Stoikes also their owne writynges do beare witnesse yea moreouer this hath bin agreed vpon by a generall consent of the moste auncient writers that the worlde had a beginnyng whereof Linus the eldest Poete of all who liued before Orpheus writyng of the creation of the worlde beeginneth thus A tyme there was when all thynges framed were togither once as Diogenes Laertius reporteth S. There bee twoo speciall poinctes repugnant to your opinion whereof the one is alledged by the Aristotelians and the other by the Epicurians M. What bee thei S. The first is this Seeyng the worlde is rounde and of a Sphericall fourme there can neither beginnyng nor endyng bee noted therein whereby it commeth to passe that when it mooueth it mooueth circularly or rounde whiche motion also hath neither beeginnyng nor endyng but is a continuall and perpetuall motiō and is therefore eternall Now if the worldes motiō bee eternall the worlde also must needes bee eternall Thus the Peripatetikes by the figure and motion of the world doe conclude y the world it self is also eternall M. Truely this is a verie slender argumente For firste who will graunt vnto them that all the partes of the world doe mooue by that circulare and sphericall motion seeyng that as thei them selues doe write neither the fire neither the aier neither the water neither the earth dooe mooue by this motion but by a right line and a pendent to wit the fire and aire vpwarde the water and earth dounewarde Moreouer if wee deale thus liberally with them to graunte that the worlde is of a sphericall fourme and figure who is able to prooue notwithstandyng that there can bee no beeginning of motion assigned and obscrued therein Seeyng it is not mooued of it self but by an other too wit the greate God or as thei terme it by a certeine firste intelligence or Angell And whereas it is saied of a wheele of a sphere or of a circle that the beginnyng of the motion there of cannot bee assigned in this poincte of the circumference more than in another it is true onely in respecte of the thing the figure and not if you respect the hande that turneth it or the forcyng of the cause that mooueth it in respect whereof the poinct is called the beeginnyng of moouyng in the sphere or circle where hee beginneth to mooue it first that turneth the circle sphere or wheele about Wherfore although the worlde can haue no beginnyng of moouyng neither of it self neither of it owne figure notwithstandyng it hath of God who once beegan it and turned it from a certeine poincte of the circumference and a certeine place to wit from the East continually to mooue into the Weste whether it turneth now daiely beeyng by hym mooued and not of it self And although it bee vnknowne to vs nowe whiche parte of the circumference of heauen God first moued for you see how many and diuerse thynges men dooe affirme concernyng the greate yeere of the worlde whiche is that state of the worlde wherein Heauen and all thinges returne to their place where thei wer first created yet it is certein that heauen began sometyme to mooue from some one prefixed poincte and part of the circumference S. The other repugnancie is this Thei saie it is to absurde to saie that God did not create this world from eternitie and tyme euerlastyng For after so many infinite spaces of yeres paste what should moue hym at length that hee would Create the worlde Thei demaunde therefore why GOD remained so long sluggishe and idle why hee slept so long what he did then why hee ceased from dooyng somethyng so long why hee made not this noble and goodlie woorke sooner These and suche like floutes thei cast foorthe against the maiestie of God. M. You doe alleage the argument of Velleius the Epicure vnto whiche I will answere that which as S. Augustine writeth was spoken by a certein mery old man a Christian Who beeyng likewise demaunded by suche kinde of men what God did beefore hee created the worlde answered He made Hell wherein hee might tormente perpetually suche curious fellowes as doe demaunde suche questions For what wickednesse is this to go about to enter into suche secretes what impudencie to creepe so farre what blasphemie to looke that God should rendre an accoumpt to vs of his doinges and forepassed life who must bee our iudge what needed hee too haue created these thinges sooner whiche hee neither hath neede of too his existence neither thereby to liue in greater felicitie For God hath in himself and that from all eternitie a most perfect most happie and most full state of nature whiche is vnto himselfe sufficient for all thinges and he hath neede of none other thing neither of Angell nor man Psalme 16. and 2. ver Neither was GOD then idle that the Epicures maye not mock neither did hee sleepe in slouthfulnes beefore he made this world But euen then as also now he was inwardly occupied in his woorkes that is to say hee was wonderfully delighted in the contemplation of hymself hee enioyed then himself and his perfect and vnspeakeable glorie hee was busied in the most large and incomprehensible light of his substance and essence as may easily bee vnderstoode out of the Prouerbes the 8. chapter and 30. verse and Iohn the 17. chapt and 4. verse and likewise out of Irenaeus the 4. booke and 28. chapter S. This I vnderstande declare nowe what time thys worlde was created M. Doe you demaund this either of the day or of y Moneth or of the Yeere S. Mary of euery one of them seuerally M. Concerning the day mee thinkes this much may bee sayd that the beginning and first daye of the creation of the worlde was that day which wee Christians doe nowe call Sundaye and which the Jewes called the first daye of the Sabbathes and not that which wee commonly call Munday S. Howe so M. Bicause it is euidente that the Lorde wrought sixe whole dayes togither before the Sabbath seuenth daye And amonge the Hebrues in olde time that was the Sabbath and seuenth daye which wee nowe call Satterdaye whiche is the next daye beefore Sundaye and next after Fridaye For Christians to the entente that they woulde not retaine the auncient ceremoneis of the Jewes but deuoutly to honour the resurrection of our Lorde Jesus Christ wherby ther began a new state of the Church in stead of the Sabbath they chose the next daye following to rest on as it appeareth in the 20. Chapter of the Actes the 1. to the Corinthians the 16. chapter and the first Chapter of the Reuclation and also it is extant in the Ecclesiasticall historie which day they called the Lords day or Sundaye But if you woulde number sixe dayes beefore the Sabbath daye you muste begin vpon Sundaye not
earth For like as it is said in the 1. chap. and 11. verse of Genesis Let the earth bring foorth euery greene hearbe that beareth seede and let the water bring foorth fish the 1. chap. of Genesis and 20. verse so is it not likewise written and comaunded by God let heauen bring foorth the Sunne and the Moone but onely thus Let there bee lightes in the face of the open heauen Genesis the 1. chapter and 14. verse Whereby it sufficiently appeareth that the firste Heauen was not in suche manner the matter of heauenly things as it were a certein plentiful and frutefull Father of them neither that the matter of heauenly thinges was so ordeined as the earth was appointed by GOD too bee the matter and mother of earthly thinges S. Why would the Lorde haue thinges so diuersly to bee made out of those matters and that heauenly thinges should not bee made out of heauen as well as the earthly are out of the earth M. Not onely for this cause that like as they were made by hym of diuerse matter and differing in kinde although they bee all partakers of bodie so likewise it beehooued them to declare their vse and execute their duetie in diuerse maner too the ende their difference might bee vnderstoode and perceiued but also that God might reueale vntoo vs the better his mightie power and also his manifolde wisedome in so greate varietie of bringing foorth thinges So likewise in the framing of man onely God hath vsed one meane in creating his bodie and another his soule and by those meanes continually createth and maketh them notwithstanding that hee is able to make them both by one meane The. xxvii Chapter What is the fourme of the worlde S. HEthertoo concernyng the matter of the worlde saie sumwhat now if you can touchyng the fourme thereof M. I will doe so S. What therefore is the fourme of this so greate a woorke M. There cannot bee one onely and that substantiall thereof assigned For as I haue shewed beefore it is not possible that there should bee one onely and particulare soule of all the worlde whiche beeyng dispersed throughout euerie parte of the bodie thereof should wag stirre and mooue this so hugie frame and mole whatsheuer the Aristotelians and Platonikes doe suppose Likewise S. Augustine in his 7. booke de Genesiad Literam and 12. chapter doeth iustly deney that GOD is the soule of this worlde as of some liuing creature forasmuche as hee dwelleth aboue the bodie of the worlde and aboue euery Spirite and stretcheth beeyonde the endes of the whole worlde But God hath giuen vnto euery kinde his proper nature and forme ▪ whiche are disputed of in speciall treatises which are written of euery kinde of thyng As for roundenesse whiche some attribute to the worlde as the naturall fourme thereof it ought not too bee counted or called the inward or essentiall forme of the worlde but onely the outward and accidentall S. But dooeth not the Scripture attribute vnto the world partes and differences of situation as it were to a liuyng creature and countries and regions also distinct one from another M. It doeth so indeede but notwithstanding it prooueth not that there is but one and theself same fourme spirite and soule beelongyng to this worlde and that it is a liuyng creature S. Why so M. For forasmuche as there bee three kindes of bodies and ioynynges in composition one simple and continuall as a man the seconde ioyned and touchyng one another as an whole house the third disioyned as a flocke it is truely saied that euery kinde of bodie as it were a certeine whole thyng hath euermore some partes into whiche it is deuided and also sundrie differences of place and situation whiche may bee noted in it howbeeit euery kinde of bodie is not gouerned by one soule onely or one Spirite or one fourme but that onely whiche wee termed beefore simple and continuall as euery one of vs for example The xxviii Of the partes of the world and first of the Ethereall and Elementare region S. WHiche then bee the principall partes of the world whereof the scripture maketh mention M. They are of sundrie kindes For some bee integral which are the partes constituting the whole world whiche wee terme substanciall othersome distinguishing it onely and limited by reason of certeine vses and commodities S. Whiche are the integrall and constituting partes of the world M. There are briefly twayne for the most part proposed by the Scripture to wit the heauen and earth as it appeareth to the Colossians the 1. chapter and 16. verse and Genesis the 1. chap. and 2. verse and Isay the 1. chap. and 1. verse and in other places almost infinite although in Genesis the 49. cha and 25. verse heauen and the deapthes bee also reckned S. What did the Scripture then conteine vnder the name of heauen M. All that region of this world whiche is called by the Philosophers Ethereall and conteineth the celestiall and vnengendred bodies which continue and are not chaunged since the first day of their creation as sayth S. Peter 2. of Peter the 3. chapter and 4. verse S. And what vnder the name of the earth M. Not onelye this bodye and element whiche wee properly call the earth but also that whole region of this world whiche by the Philosophers is termed Elementare which conteineth in it such bodies as are engendred and are continually subiect to alteration S. Doe these twoo regions differ M. Yea very much both in name and effect In name for that the first is called heauen and this latter parte of the worlde is tearmed by the name of the elementes yea and that by the scripture For S. Peter in the 2. Epistle the 3. Chapter the 10. and 14. verses distinguisheth these words Heauen and y Elementes In effect for that this endureth and continueth in the old state the other is dayly chaunged and at one time is engendred and at an other tyme perisheth The first God hath reserued to himselfe the other hee hath giuen to the vse of man Psalme 115. and 16. verse The first as wee are taught shall perishe at the latter day but with sinale noyse and a lyght flashe of flame for that it consisteth of a fine and subtill nature but the other shall burne with great heat and bee dissolued with mightie rage of fyre eeuen in such sorte as looke how it hapeneth in our earthly material fire whē it flameth the stickes crack smoke sende foorth a vapour which proceedeth from the moyst partes therof so it is saide that the elementes shall glowe with heat and melt for that they are of an hard thick and clammie nature and not pure and cleane This difference also may bee obserued betwene the two partes of the worlde that the thinges which are in the first are the efficient principall causes of those thinges that are engendred in the other But the thinges that are in the second
vnto the leading away of the Jewes into the captiuitie of Babylon I meane that whiche beegan vnder King Ioachim are about 167. yeres or sumwhatlesse In this captiuitie the people aboade the space of 70. yeeres according as Ieremy the Prophet foretold them in the 25. chapter And from the departure of the Jewes out of the captiuitic of Babylon and from the day of the publication of Cyrus edict concerning the deliueryng and sendyng home of the Jewes into their owne coūtrey vnto the passion of Christ are 70. weekes of yeeres that is to saye 490. yeeres as the Prophet Daniell writeth Daniell the 9. chapter And from the passion of Christ vnto this our present tyme are 1578. yeeres So that if all these numbers be gathered toogether into one summe they make 5298. whiche is the distance of yeeres since the creation of the worlde although the Rabbines of the Jewes do dissent from this summe of yeres Howbeit we follow the Scriptures herein and also the best learned auctours that haue written most truely in this beehalf The. xl Chapter God created this world good S. THese thinges now I doe vnderstand proceede therefore vnto other poinctes whiche you proposed and promised to entreate of M. What other poinctes S. Declare now at the length in what kinde of state and maner God made the world M. I can easily tell you that and dispatche the whole matter in one woorde The worlde was created a good world not onely generally but also euerie parte thereof For after euerie dayes woorke Moses addeth playnly and perfectly these woordes And God saw that it was good for so it is written in the 1. Chapter of Genesis S. What doth that goodnes comprehend and signifie M. Uerily not holinesse of life and conuersation neither vprightnes of conscience For most of the partes of the worlde haue neither sense neither reason nor conscience without whiche there can bee no holinesse of life Wherefore this word Good seemeth vnto mee to signifie three things specially S. What bee they M. First the perfection integritie of the natures which God created and of the whole worlde secondly the beautie thirdly the commoditie I iudge to bee noted by that word For those thinges whiche are perfect and whole and likewise faire and profitable are called good and that by common custome of all men Although S. Augustine in his booke de natura boni against the Manichees besides the substance and essence of those three thinges hath set doune these three thinges as certeine vniuersall good thinges too wit measure fourme and ordre of whiche he saieth thus Therefore where these three bee great there bee great good thinges where they bee small there bee small good thinges and where they bee not there is no goodthing Howbeit I choose rather to follow mine owne opinion and to keepe the effect and meaning of these wordes and hee saw that they were good S. Expounde this more plainly M. This worlde and all thinges that are created therein were euery one of them good if wee consider of thē as thei were made by GOD at the beeginning in respecte of their owne nature For thei had it then perfecte and whole that is to saie in no parte failyng at that tyme sounde and strong and not as it is nowe weake sicke and wounded So that the Nature of Heauen and Earth was moste perfecte and likewise of all Beastes and liuyng thynges Hearbes Trees and other creatures of God their strength also pliant and forcible and not as thei bee now adaies weake and imperfect scarce able to susteine themselues or to doe theyr duety and function neyther alwaies able to dooe it Moreouer if wee consider the beautie of those thynges and of the whole worlde as it was made at the firste in respecte whereof bothe the whole worlde was good and euery one of his partes were good For thei had in themselues a merueilous comelinesse of outward fourme and shape and glistering beautie thei were pleasant and delectable to beholde and had due and conuenient proportion of all the partes and members in euery bodie in respecte whereof and also for that as yet there remaine many tokens of it it is now at this daie called by the Grecians Kosmos of the comelinesse thereof Thei had also a wounderfull order in respecte of the whole worlde For euery thyng was by GOD placed in conuenient and apte place moste wisely and thei agreed among themselues with wounderfull concorde and mutuall good will one toward another and heauen was answerable too the earth and the earth to heauen so farre foorthe and at what tyme the one had neede to helpe the other Whiche now discord through synne beyng dispersed amōg them dooe seldome helpe one another neither dooeth heauen yeilde raine in due season vnto the earth neither dooeth the earth sende vp erhalations and vapours vnto heauen in conueniente tyme and when neede requireth To bee shorte the profite also and commoditie of these thynges as thei were by GOD created was very greate in respect wherof the whole worlde and all his partes were called good For the strength and powers of euery one of them were soūd and of force to woorke and bryng forthe that wherevnto God had ordeined them Thei were frutefull bicause they reteined as yet the power and blessynge whiche GOD had giuen them whole and vndefiled synne had not yet hindred or diminished it whiche power is as it were now deade and buried so that there appeareth not so muche as the least part thereof vnto vs specially in this latter and as it were crooked old age of the worlde whiche so greate and manifold giftes of God should haue perpetually continued in all creatures if man had not transgressed ¶ The. xli Chapter What maner one this world is now at this present after sinne S. WHat maner one is this worlde nowe since Adams trangression M. Euen such an one as S. Paule describeth in one woorde to wit a creature now subiect vnto vanitie And therefore it sigheth and groneth looking for the restoaring of the sunnes of God Romanes the 8. chapter and 20. verse So that this vanitie is contrarie too that goodnes wherein thinges were first created S. How then did mans transgression take away the essence and nature of thinges M. Not so but it impaired the integritie and perfection of them For sinne brought in three thinges with it especially which are contrarie vnto those three aboue named commodities To wit weakenesse as it were a sicknes in the naturall powers disorder and disagreement among thinges for lacke of order and then when they are not fitly answerable one too another there followeth barrennes in ingendring and bringing foorth of young and fruites the 4. of Esdras the 5. chapter and 52. verse In so much that the strength and plentifulnes of the earth and of all other thinges decreaseth dayly and are nothing nowe in respect as God first created them whiche cummeth too passe by reason of mans trangression
principles and causes of their beeyng and compoundyng And likewise that is the Generall part of naturall Philosophie which sheweth vs the generall maner and order of preseruyng and increasyng of all thynges beecause it deliuereth vnto vs all thynges in generall And these poinctes for the more part are comprehended in the first chapiter of Genesis S. Whiche is then the Particulare part M. That whiche diligently setteth doune the peculiare natures operations properties and effectes of euery kinde which are seuerally distinguished in these created and visible thynges as for example What is the Nature of a Man what of an Horse what of euery kinde of liuyng Creature with the operations also of Trees and Hearbes These thynges are partly conteined in the rules of Phisick and partly also in those treatises whiche by the Auctours thereof are intitled by the names of Histories of liuyng thynges and of Plantes and suche like certaine partes whereof and sparkes are founde shinyng heere and there dispersed in holie Scripture as it were beautifull precious stones Howbeit the whole historie general discourse of these thinges is not conteined in the Scripture since that Salomons Bookes whiche were written copiously of the Nature of all thynges are through the negligence of men perished ¶ The seconde Chapiter Whether Naturall Philosophie bee meete for a Christian S. IS there any profite in Naturall Philosophie M. Yea manifolde But that I may not run ouer them all for thei are almoste infinite I wil alledge fiue onely The first is that thereby wee knowe God not onely to bee the Creator of all thinges but also to bee euerlasting omnipotent and mercifull c. The seconde that by it wee learne the thynges that are created with their operations and natures The third for that therein wee see ourselues and perceiue what wee are of what thynges and partes wee consist and eche part of ours that is to saie what maner of thing our Soule is and what likewise is the state and condition of our bodie which all men do confesse to bee the best profitabliest moste excellēt knowledge of all other The iiii that wonderyng at in our myndes and beholdyng with our eyes these woorkes of God so greate so many so wonderfull beyng thervnto holpē by none other meanes than by this Arte wee are with greate zeale and affection stirred vp to set foorth the won̄derfull praises of God and to giue him thankes Whiche thing happened also vnto Galene yea although he were a prophane Philosopher that after hee had described the Nature of one of Gods woorkes that is to saie of Man and the partes of his bodie hee was enforced yea almoste against his will to syng an Himne to god Heerehence it commeth that suche multitude of hymnes so many Epodes and songes of praise so many Psalmes are written and celebrated The v. that wee vnderstandyng these thinges maie easily and plainly expounde and freely enter into many places of holie Scripture whiche vnto suche as bee ignorante of these matters are not onely obscure but also cannot possibly bee attained vnto or by any meanes vnderstoode Wherefore S. Augustine writeth that Naturall Philosophie is verie profitable and necessarie for a christen diuine What shall I speake of the singulare pleasure whiche this knowledge bringeth vnto the minde of the great cōmodities whiche it ministreth vnto the life of man S. How doe you prooue these thinges to bee true M. Specially out of these places of holie scripture The whole 104 Psalme The 136. and 145. Psalme 10. verse The 147. and 148. Psalmes Iob the 12. chapiter and verse 8. 9. 10. and the 36. Chapiter and 24. 25. 26. verses The 14. Chapiter of the Actes and 17. verse The first Chapiter to the Romanes and 20. verse Unto these moreouer maie bee added the 7. Chapiter of the booke of Wisedome and 9. verse with the nexte followyng and likewise the 13. Chapiter and 1. verse and the nexte followyng Likewise the holie Fathers S. Basill S. Chrisostome S. Ambrose in their Exameron or woorke of sixe daies doc teache the same thyng And moreouer the holie and absolutely learned father S. Augustine in his booke of christian doctrine and in the viii booke of Gene. vpon the letter the viii chapiter S. But there be certain obiections made declaryng that the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie is not onely vnprofitable but also vnwoorthie for a christian yea that it is hurtfull and dangerous for hym M. Yea truely And although many men haue gathered sundrie yet all of thē maie bee referred specially vnto twoo kindes of argumentes whiche are alledged againste the knowledge of these thynges whereof the firste is framed ab auctoritate from auctoritie The second a ratione turpi from reason and vnseemelinesse or from a moste hurtfull consequent S. Declare them M. First thei gather sundrie sentences partly out of the Scriptures and partly out of the Ecclesiasticall Fathers out of whiche afterwarde thei frame their reasons and make their conclusions S. Whiche bee thei M. Out of holie scripture this is specially alledged which is written in the Booke of Ecclesiastes or of the Preacher the 1. Chapiter and 15. verse in these woordes I set my harte to seeke and to finde out with wisedome whatsoeuer thyng is doone vnder heauen This euill exercise hath GOD giuen to the Sonnes of men to occupie them selues therein Unto whiche thei ioyne that saiyng of S. Paule the 1. to the Corinthians the 1. Chapiter and 20. verse God hath made foolishe the wisedome of this worlde with other suche places like vnto these whiche maie easely bee answered S. How I praie you M. Forsoothe that that in the Booke of the Preacher is not spoken absolutely but onely in comparison of the true woorshippyng of god Neither doeth Salomon cōdemne or disprooue the true knowledge of the nature of thinges whiche GOD gaue vnto hym as a greate benefite of all other moste surpassyng for then should hee haue bin of all men the moste vnthankfullest man to God and in respecte whereof hee was then greatly esteemed of by the Queene of Saba and other Princes neere vnto hym Howbeeit this knowledge of Naturall Philosophie if it bee compared with true Godlinesse if with faithe if with the true feare of GOD if with inwarde regeneration of the mynde if with the knowledge of euerlastyng life and saluation surely in comparison of these thynges it is but a light busiyng of the minde vnfruitfull rather weariyng vs then relieuyng or comfortyng our consciences For it bryngeth not the true felicitie as faithe to Godwardes doeth although a manne consume his whole life in it and as it were tyre his minde aboute it And as touchyng the place of S. Paule I see not how it oppugneth the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie seeyng S. Paule condemneth the wisedome of the worlde not the wisedome concernyng the worlde and thynges created But that is called the wisedome of the world whiche is wholy ruled by the counsell and iudgement of the
the worlde so that it is no maruaile that wee haue iudged that the true and Christian Diuinitie is partly busied also in matter of Naturall Philosophie and the settinge foorth thereof and that for that cause also the holie Scripture is in part occupied in settinge foorth of these things forasmuch as this knowledge also maketh to the aduauncement of gods glory For in these visible thinges the power wisdome and eternitie of God is to bee seene liuely S. What is the other argument of theirs that are of the contrarie opinion M. This forsooth that those thynges which Moses hath written are most plainely and simply set downe and in such kinde of stile which is fitted to our capacitie and applied to the weakenesse of mans sence and not truely and exactly expressed according to the truth of thinges and finally that Moses doeth neither throughly neither subtily search out or set downe the thinges themselues and their natures wherefore they conclude that the true distinct and perfect knowledge of the naturall part is other whence to bee drawne and learned S. What answere you vnto these thinges M. Uerily I confesse that these matters concerning Naturall Philosophie are not gloriously in a filed style set foorth by Moses although hee were the beste learned man that euer lyued but rather in a bare and simple kinde of writinge striped out of all ornament as it were out of apparrell wherby that which hee writeth may the more easily bee vnderstood But as it is to bee graunted that hee spake simply so can it not bee prooued that hee spake or wrote lyingly falsely and ignorantly of those thinges It is one thing therfore to acknowledg that Moses stile is bare simple which kinde of vtterauÌ„ce is meet for the truth and another thing to say that hee is a false man and a lyar which no man can affirme but whoso is of a corrupt conscience Wherfore simply but truely barely but rightly commonly but purely doth hee deliuer vnto vs those thinges which hee writeth concerning the worlde of the principall partes therof of the causes and effectes of thinges to bee beleeued holden and taughte among menne Uerily I confesse that Moses applyed himselfe to the capacitie of our seÌ„ses Howbeit I deney that which they affirme that therfore hee did not roue at the trueth of the matter or had not regarde vnto it for it was his purpose to set downe those things in wrâ—tinge easily barely and truely S. But some are of opinion that all those things which hee wrote in the first chapter of Genesis are to bee interpreted allegorically So neither do they think that those six dayes are the space of time neither that the woman in deede was made of Adams ribbe neither that all the residue are so to bee taken as Moses words doe pretende and sownde Which opinion if it be true what shall bee sure or certeine in all that whole chapter and such like writinges of other Prophetes as apperteining to the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie or that maye teache vs the same M. You saye well Indeede some haue benne of that opinion which notwithstanding S. Augustine confuteth in his 1. booke in the Proheme also in the 8. booke and 2. chapter de Genesiad Literam of Genesis vpon the letter S. Peter likewyse in the 3. chapter and 5. verse of hys seconde Epistle and in the epistle to the Hebrues the 11. chapter and 3. verse doth openly impungne this errour of the Allegorists affirminge that those things which Moses hath reported concerning the creation of the worlde are spoken naturally and plainly and not allegorically or figuratiuely S. And what at the length doe you conclude of all these thinges which you haue recited M. That forsooth which S. Augustine concludeth in hys 5. booke and 8. chapter of Genesis That those things which Moses wrot are true although they can be established by no other reasons For if a man will dispute to proue that these thinges are false or hee himselfe can say no certentie concerning the estate and gouerment of creatures or if hee saye not true will hee suppose these thinges to bee false in that hee himselfe vnderstandeth them not Who will beleeue that Aristotle or Plato did knowe any thinge concerninge the creation of the worlde and the causes of thinges whereof Moses was ignorant who first receiued the thinges which he wrote by most secret reuelation from god Secondly who was wel learned in all liberall artes specially in the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie and Phisick which two artes were at that tyme specially had in price amonge the Aegyptians as it appeareth in the Scripture Actes the 7. chap. and 22. verse And to conclude forasmuch as those that were the chiefest Philosophers amonge the Grecians traueyled into Aegypt to the intent to learne Naturall Philosophie as histories doe rport of Plato and Pithageras And most certeine it is as Diogenes Laertius writeth in hys first booke de vitis Philosophorum of the lyues of the Philosophers that all that parte of Philosophie whiche intreateth of the nature of thinges was deriued to the Grecians froÌ„ strange nations and from the Syrians that is to saie from the Jewes Shal we say theÌ„ against the assured faith of the scripture that any one of the cheifest Philosophers to wit Plato or Aristotle whiche were heathen men were called by GOD to counsell when hee went to framinge and creatinge of the worlde that they shoulde knowe more than Moses the seruaunt of GOD whom God himselfe taught and shewed vnto him such things as hee should commit to writinge to the behoofe of Posteritie and especially for the instruction of his moste deerely beeloued Church Surely this cannot bee thaught muchlesse spoken without notorious blasphemie against God himselfe But rather as S. Augustine teacheth in his 5. booke and third Chapter de Genesiad Literam of Genesis vpoÌ„ the letter that in that Moses speaketh so plainly hee doth it by the assured counsell and iudgemente of the holy Ghost to the intent that by the hight of the thynges hee maye terrifie the proude by the deapth hee may hold them attentiue by the trueth hee may feede the great ones and by hys affabilitie hee maye nourishe the little ones The fourth Chapter The difference beetween Christian and heathen Naturall Philosophie S. WHat differeÌ„ce therfore is ther betwen Moses Aristotle y is to say betweene ChristiaÌ„ and Heathen Natural Philosophers in thys kinde of learninge M. Uery great which notwithstanding maye bee especially perceiued in three poyntes S. Which bee they M. The firste is in the ende of this knowledge whiche thei bothe doe respecte and followe S. Declare thesame M. The Christian Naturall Philosophers whiche intreate of the thinges that are created dooe referre the summe of their disputatioÌ„ to this ende that our greate and good God who is the auctour Father and creatour of them all maie bee knowne praised and extolled and finally woorshipped the more ardently and more feared But
Aristotle and the Heathen Naturall Philosophers doe so dispute of the nature of thinges that thei maie wholy sticke vnto these thinges themselues as it were vnto certein lowe and meane degrees and an vncertein force whiche is respected after their Creation and whiche thei terme Nature thei dooe not arise higher neither doe thei ascende by meanes of these as it were by a Ladder vnto GOD the Creatour of them Wherefore through greate blindenesse of minde thei doe place seconde and onely instrumentall causes in steede of true and first causes And as touchyng the principall causes whiche are God and his Commaundementes and preceptes thei altogither let them passe Wherefore thei make the cause of the thyng of that whiche thei call the thyng it self whereby it cummeth to passe that this moste excellent knowledge among them is full of vaine ostentation of the minde of strife and of contention as for the glorie of God it neither setteth it forth neither once toucheth it so that verie many of those Natural Philosophers dooe at the length beecome indeede verie naturalles that is too saie fleshely men and Athiestes not knowyng or regardyng God. S. But the Italian Philosophers whiche haue handled matters of naturall Philosophie were called also Diuines suche as were all the Pithagorians for the moste parte who made mention of God the creatour Anaxagoras beegan his disputation concernyng the nature of thynges from a mynde that disposeth all thynges That golden Booke de Mundo of the worlde whiche whether it bee Aristotles whiche I dooe not thinke or Nicholaus the Philosophers who liued beefore Plutarche or Alexander Aphrodisiensis of later tyme or whosoeuer others it was surely hee ioyned a treatice concerning God togither with his discourse of naturall thinges M. You safe very well For this was an aunciēt custome among the firste Philosophers whiche wrote also of Naturall Philosophie in the Greeke tongue as hauyng learned the same of the Aegyptians or rather of the Syrians as Laertius saieth that is to saie the Hebrewes or of their Scholars but the Philosophers whiche afterwarde ensued how muche thei despised and laughed at this kinde and maner of handelyng matters apperteinyng to Naturall Philosophie and how farre thei haue expelled it out of the Schooles of Naturall Philosophers you are not ignorant Aristotles crue at this present beareth the greatest swaie and thei that would haue themselues moste truely too bee termed by the name of naturall Philosophers neither doe thei themselues in their disputations of Naturall Philosophie intreate of GOD the Creatour neither thinke that hee ought too bee intreated of So that now the Naturall Philosophie of the Stoike Philosophers hath gotten the vpper hande in the Schooles and the Italians is reiected whiche Stoike Philosophers haue ascribed the chief and principall causes of engendryng of all thinges vnto Nature whiche is to bee founde in euery thing and too thinges created as vnto Heauen the Sunne and the Elementes S. What other difference is there beetween Christiā naturall Philosophers and Aristotelians M. In declaryng the causes themselues whose knoweledge and handlyng dooeth muche beelong vnto Naturall Philosophie S. By what meanes M. Firste the Christian Philosophers doe both alledge suche causes as are true and also far other than thei do For who will doubt but that thei alledge suche as bee true since thei receiue them and learne them out of the fountaine of Truthe that is to saie the woorde of God And that thei make farre other causes the disputations and discourses of them bothe doe sufficiently declare For wee professe teache and acknowledge that God himselfe is the first and efficient cause of al thinges moreouer wee haue a speciall respecte vnto his voyce and commaundement as a moste mightie cause whereby a certaine peculiare force is giuen vnto euery thinge which is the cheifest and moste principall cause of all other that wee can possibly thinke of or imagine in our minde Thirdely wee make for one cause that force and vertue whiche GOD hath alotted and ingraffed in all things howbeit the same to bee onely a seconde and an instrumental cause and not woorking of it selfe as Esay teacheth in the 44. chapter the 3. and 4. verse not principally but depending wholy vpon another to wit y power cōmaundemēt of GOD without which God woorketh the same effectes when him pleaseth which hee is wont to do by meanes thereof So when a Hen sitteth vppon egges out of which afterwarde chicken are hatched what is she other than Gods bare instrument forasmuch as shee frameth neither the harte nor heade nor feete of hir chick within the shell wherein it is conteined but onely keepeth it and warmeth it So when a woman is with childe doeth shee fashion hir babe with hir owne handes whiche afterwarde shee bringeth foorth into the world No surely but is onely as it were the receiuer nourisher and keeper of the seede which the man casteth foorth into hir For God and the power and sownd of these woordes Increase yee and multiplye and fill the earth which as yet are in perpetuall force doe frame the infant within the woman facion it and bringe it foorth The Philosophers doe not acknowledge this cause For they holde opinion that this force and vertue which was giuen vnto things after that they were created is the first cause of all things So that they place the effected cause in steed of the efficient and the instrumentall for the agent which is a verie foule errour in a Naturall Philosopher Againe in that they do not submit the capacitie of mans wit which in deede is very simple vnto the vnsearcheable wisdome of GOD but rather make God subiect to them and to their capacitie they deuise and dreame of the causes of all thinges and their originall accordinge to the imagination of their owne braine likeninge GOD hymselfe the incomprehensible woorkeman vnto some Smith or Carpenter also that the matter wherof hee made all things was before prepared and made readie vnto his hand from euerlasting and at the length that the forme ioyneth it selfe vnto this matter for according to their iudgement this matter is rude and without forme and so they conclude that this matter and forme is the first principle of naturall things which comparison of most vnlike thinges togither S. Augustine woorthily laugheth at and reiceteth which as it thinketh nothinge honourably of God so doeth it also repugne playnely against the trueth of the matter and the ereation of this worlde S. Whiche is the third difference beetweene the Heathē and Christian Naturall Philosophers M. That consisteth in the meane maner and order of teachinge or handlinge the Art. S. I praie you declare it M. The Christian and godly men such as were the Prophetes of God although they diuersly recite these visible thinges according to the argument of the matter which they handle proceeding somtime from the highest to the lowest at another time from the lowest to the highest as it appeareth in the Psal
thinges are especially tearmed visible for that our sight is the most certaine most excellent and most noble of all the senses of our bodie and for that also the actions of euery lyuinge thinge and the argumentes whereby we perceiue them to bee aliue are chiefly gathered by the sence of seeinge as moouing and breathinge Finally that bodily thinges are more exactly discerned by the eye than by tastinge or hearinge so that to saye that a visible creature is the matter and subiect of Naturall Philosophie is as much as to meane that wee wold haue euery creature whiche is sensible of it owne nature to be the true proper obiect therof whether the same be bodies as are the substaunces of thinges or whether they bee not bodies as are the vertues properties qualities motions and actions which vnto all corporall thinges by nature and their first creation and beeginning either cleaue vnto them without or are engraffed in them within All these kindes are as I haue sayd naturall thinges and created by God. S. I UnderstaÌ„d these things But tell mee now by how many maner of meanes doeth a Christian Naturall Philosopher handle and consider of these creatures M. Onely twoo waies the first to wit as they are all generally conteined in one and all comprehended as it were within the compasse of one bodie whiche incloseth them all which is called the world Or else euerie one in his kinde which are sundrie wherein the creatures are distincted and seperated one from another Whiche the particular Historie of the creation in the six dayes setteth downe vnto vs. S. How prooue you that M. In that the Scripture many tymes reciteth vnto vs all thinges created and visible vnder the name of the world as in Isay the 38. chapter and 11. verse Iohn the 1. chapter the 9. verse and the 9. chap. the 39. verse And many tymes the Scripture reciteth them distinctly and seuerally thereby the more to set foorth the wounderfull wisedome of God as in the 104. and 147. Plalmes and 8. verse and the 149. Psalme Wherfore wee muste also entreate of them after both these manners that sutch thinges as may bee gathered learned out of these creatures apperteinyng to the knowledge of God and setting foorth of his glorie according as the Scripture teacheth may bee by vs abundantly vnderstoode so that at the length wee may beecome perfect Christian naturall Philosophers S. With whiche of these twoo Methodes must wee first beegin M. Euen with that treatice which proposeth vnto vs all thinges generally comprehended in that one bodie which is called the world S. And why with that M. Bicause that way of teaching is more generall and more easie For whole thinges are better knowne than their partes for a man shal with more ease beehold an whole house than bee able too distinguishe or comprehend in his minde euerie part thereof And moreouer that whiche shal bee saied concernyng the whole world wil open vnto vs the way and entrance too the handling of the particular kindes of thinges For it shal bee as a foundation to the residue that shall ensue The viii Chapter What the world is S. DIscourse then of the world M. I will. S. What is the world M. The signification of the worlde is diuerse and manifold as the Philosophers doe teache vs as Laertius in his 7. booke and Plutarche in his first booke of the Philosophers opinions whiche signification wee must first distinguishe least beeing deceiued by the ambiguitie of the woord either wee do mocke the reader in this whole disputation or else deceiue him S. How many significations therefore are there of this woord world M. Three speciall First the world is taken for the creatures themselues whereof this whole visible frame and woorke consisteth So is it taken in Iohn the first chapter the 10. verse so likewise in the 2. Epistle of S. Peter the 3. chap. and 6. verse And moreouer for the corrupt and miserable condition of this world which falling vnto all these thinges by meanes of mannes transgression now hangeth vppon them whereby there is a most manifest confusion and a great disorder in al thinges So sayth S. Ihon in the 2. chap. and 16. verse and likewise the 5. Chapter and 19. verse Finally it is taken for one parte of the worlde and that the most noble and excellent to wit for men only and manye times for all men as to the Romanes the 5. chapter and 12. verse Ihon the 3. chapter the 16. verse and oftentimes for the faithfull and regenerat as in the 1. Epistle of S. Ihon the 2. chapter and 2. verse and at another time also for the reprobate and vnbeleeuinge as in the 1. Epistle to the Corinthians the 1. chapter and 21. verse and S. Ihon the 14. chapter the 17. and 22. verses Otherwise also if a man would call the definition of this woorde worlde vnto certaine chapters and speciall pointes wee maye saye that vnder the name of the worlde sumtime the place it selfe sumtime the substance of the thinges sumtime the men as the principall part thereof and sumtime the corruption of the same part that is to say of men is to be vnderstoode S. But the worlde was by the Latins called Mundus for the most beutifull order of all things therein coteined like as it was also tearmed by the Grecians Kâ—smoâ— of the cumlynesse thereof which reason of the name truely is repugnant vnto that signification whereby you saye that confusion of thinges and vice is sumtime signified by the name of the worlde M. Uerily you haue alleaged a true definition of thys woorde worlde from which notwithstandinge afterwarde the vse both of the Greeke and Latine tongue hath deflected For men vnderstoode that rebellion corruption and disorder was generally in all things and partes of the worlde they called the same by the name of the worlde bicause it is inseperably distributed throughout the whole aâ—d ingraffed as it were within the marrowe of euery singulare thinge By which meanes men are many times tearmed to bee the common destinie and miserie of men The Hebrues in their tongue call the worlde Gola which woorde the Apostles doe translate Euerlastinge as to the Hebrues the 11. chapter and 3. verse the 1. chapter and 2. verse to the Ephesians the 2. chapter and 2. verse not of eternitie as if the worlde had beene alwayes and from euerlastinge but rather of the fixed and certeine order thereof which the Lorde God hath established in it after that he had created the things that are in it which wee beholde to bee in it to continue in it euen vnto this daye as are the risinge and settinge of the Sunne and the chaunge and alteration of the foure quarters of the yeare And this shall indure so longe as this state of thinges shall continue as it appeareth in the 8. chapter of Genesis the 22. verse the 9. chapter the 9. or 10. verse Iob the 26. chapter the 10. verse
Ecclesiast the 8. chapter and 11. verse Wherfore wheÌ„ this age and figure of this worlde is past this order of thinges shall perishe also the 1 â–ª to the Corinthians the 7. chapter and 30. verse the 1. Epistle of S. Peter the 3 chapter the 4. and 7. verses but it shall continue vntill that time For the Hebrues themselues do plainle signifie that this worlde shall one day haue an end callinge the same worlde by the name of Chadel Psalme 39. verse 5. S. By which definition therefore or by whiche of those three significations muste the worlde bee taken in this disputation M. By the fyrst S. What is the worlde M. The worlde is not onely a certeine comprehensyon and heapinge togither of all these visible thinges but also a most orderly and wise distinction ordeined by God in euery kinde and space whereof hee made heauen and earth to bee the extreame partes S. Whence doe you prooue this your definition M. First out of the verie same places of the scripture by whiche I prooued that all thinges visible and whiche can bee seene are the matter of this Arte and also by that the scripture for the most part vseth to tearme the most excellently and beutifully ordered frame of thys whole worlde by the name of the worlde as in Genesis the 24. Chapter and 22. verse the 2. Chapter the 4. verse Mathew the 11. Chapter the 25. verse and in other places also almost infinite S. Why haue you comprehended both these pointes in your definition to wit that the worlde is not onely a general compreheÌ„sion of al things togither but also of them seuerally distinguished M. Bycause if wee wil conceiue in our minde confusedly all thinges whereof this world consisteth and is diforderly heaped togither or lyinge one vpon an other not yet disposed into any order but as it were the rubbishe of some house that were fallen downe or as it were stuffe prepared to build some house withall such an heape of thinges can not yet bee called a worlde It is rather that whiche the Grecians both Poetes others tearmed by the name of Chaos the Hebrues call the same Bohu that is to say a disordered heape from whiche some thinke the woord Chaos was deriued by a smal chauÌ„ge to wit of the letter B. into C. as though the Grecians beeing disdainfull hearers and vnskilfull Schollars had vnderstoode the woord rather after that maner Hereof that phrase and maner of speaking in the Latine toungue is knowne whiche Verrius the learned Grammarian hath noted that in the olde tyme the auncient people called the world Cohum and from thence this woord inâ—hâ—are to beeginne and leaue vnperfect was deriued But by the Apostle in the Epistle to the Hebrues the 3. chapter and 4. verse the worlde is called an houshold and compared to a familie well and orderly disposed neither is it a disordered heape in deede The. ix Chapter Whether the world may truely and Christianly bee called an vniuersalitie S. BUt in that this world is by some Latine Writers called vniuersitas an vniuersalitie and by the Grecians all and the whole doo you allow of it M. Although I know that so proud a name as that is doth scarce please well some very well learned and godly men notwithstanding forasmuche as graue auctours and also Ecclesiasticall Fathers and writers haue vsed that woorde truely I iudge that it is not to bee reiected For S. Augustine in his Enchirid the 10. chapt and in the 8. booke and 25. chapt of Genesis accordyng to the Letter and Tertullian also in some place and Ireneus likewise in the 2. booke and 12. is not afeard to vse this woord for the world that I may not also commende vnto you in this respecte S. Ambrose and S. Basill whose opinions perhaps may bee confirmed out of the 3. chap. and 4. verse of the E. pistle to the Hebrues For although besides this visible world there bee other creatures of God and those also many very excellent beutifull as are the Angels and the seates of the Sainctes and blessed men and this name vniuersalitie seemeth to bee an arrogant and bold name yet all men knowe in what sense they call it so and how wee ought to vnderstand it to wit that the worlde is an vniuersalitie not of all Gods creatures but of those onely that can bee seen and are corporall S. Hetherto concernyng the name of the world now let vs come to the thing it self M. Yes for so the order of the disputation requireth The. x. Chapter Whether the worlde and the thinges that are conteined therein bee sound bodies or certeine shadowes onely S. WHat things therfore may there bee taught out of holie Scripture concernynge the world M. Many thinges truelie and those all moste woorthy too bee knowne whiche apperteine too the praise and admiration of God the Creatour wherof some declare the nature of the world and othersome the causes of it S. Whiche bee they that declare the nature of the world and of this whole vniuersalitie M. Those questions for the most part whiche are diuersly tossed either by Heretikes or by Philosophers S. Which is the first of them M. Whether this world and the thinges therein conteined bee substances that is to say certaine sound bodies and natures truelye and in deede subsisting or whether thei bee certeine shadowes onely and the representations and images of thinges S. How should they bee so M. Bicause not onely Plato will haue all thinges that are here to bee the images of certein ideae or patterns and the shadowes onely of true natures whiche are in heauen and remaine in Gods minde but also the Valentinian heretikes contend that whatsoeuer thinges are in this world are onely the meere imagies of their Eternities and representations and transitorie shadowes of them In confirmation of whiche their opinion they alleage the testimonie of S. Paule the 1. Epistle the 7. chap. and 31. verse to the Corinthians The figure of this world saith hee passeth away as though they were but vaine shewes and no sound bodies whatsoeuer thinges wee beeholde here with our eyes what manner thing that was which the Poet described in these woordes And but his learned guide instruct hym did to let go by Those flittering teÌ„der fourmes not to touch those shapes that fly Whiche nothing bin but life and substance none but likenesse thin Hee would with them haue fought and did in vaine to beate beegin S. Can you answere vnto this M. Yea. S. How I praie you M. Firste as touching Plato let vs bid hym farewell for that hee is not onely an Academike and doubtfull of minde and vncertein in euery thing but also an Ethnike and nothing beelonging vnto vs Christians for the thinges that are without beelong not vnto vs as S. Paule sayeth But as touching the Valentinians who would bee called Christians they are sufficiently confuted and most sharply reprooued by S. Ireneus in the 2. booke and 7. chap.
of his woorke whiche hee wroat against heresies But what absurdities and inconueniences doe followe that opinion marke For they muste needes confesse that those thinges these heauenly ideae and Patterns whereof by their Doctrine these earthly thinges are shadowes too bee bodies which is an absurd thing Neither can a bodily thing be an image of thinges that are meere spirituall Moreouer all this whole most beutifull woorke of GOD whiche is called the worlde shal bee a fantasie and a meere dreame and not that thing whiche we suppose it to be which is blasphemous Also to se handle and feele shal bee nothing else but to bee deceiued and to be mocked and after the maner of madde and drunken men too bee sicke and to dreame and this which wee call sumthing shal bee nothing The meates whiche wee eate shal bee imaginations the men with whom wee bee conuersant shadowes the earth whiche wee goe vpon a vanishing shadowe not a sound body and an element And finally Christe himselfe who was made like vnto vs was an imaginarie man only and not a very man in deede and therfore his passion imaginary also And by what meaues might the madnes of the Marâ—iâ—nites bee better called out of Hell againe Yea the case should stande otherwise than hath the olde Prouerbe to wit that the life of man is a stage play and the world the Theater S. What answere you to S. Paule M. That hee doeth not holde with the Valentinians Neyther doth S. Paule speake of the thinges themselues and their nature what manner it is but onely of the state and condition of them howe transitorie and vncertayne it is that wee shoulde make no accompte of it S. How doe you prooue your opinion to bee true M. Beesydes the great absurditie of these thinges which wee haue beefore declared experience it selfe confirmeth the trueth adde here vnto also whiche maketh plainly for the confirmatioÌ„ of mine opinion the saying of S. Peter in the 2. Epistle of S. Peter the 3. Chap. the 10. and 12. verse and Psalme 102. the 25. and 26. verse And to bee short all those places of holy Scripture in whiche the Lorde witnesseth that hee founded the earth created all thinges and not that hee hath cast beefore our eyes vaine representations and emptie shadowes of thinges to deceiue vs with all The xi Chapter Whether there bee one worlde onely or many S. THis I vnderstande discourse now of such thinges as next are wount to bee moued concerninge the worlde M. That is this whether there bee manye worldes or but one onely S. Haue there beene some of opinion that there bee many worldes M. Yea truely And in thys point they are of two opinions S. Declare them M. Some thinke that there bee many and those of sundrie kindes Others also that there are manye but all of them of one nature S. What meane those first which think that the worlds are of sundrie kindes M. They make two sortes of worldes whereof the one is intelligible Ideall or as a patterne which indeede subsisteth but it is resideÌ„t aboue this world the other is earthly and figuratiue which God hath created according to the representation and image of that spirituall and ideall worlde which subsisteth also and it is this worlde which wee mortall men doe inhabite S. Doe some saye thus M. Plainely they affirme it And those not onely prophane â–ª Philosophers as Plato Philo Iudeus and Plu tarch in his booke of the Moones face but also graue men and some among the Christian writers not to bee contemned S. Is their opinion true M. No veryly For the Scripture in no place maketh mention of this ideall worlde as they call it and they that are of that opinion they speake to childishly I will not say reprochfully of GOD as if hee were an ignorant and an vnskilfull younge woorkman that could doe nothing vnlesse hee hadan example or patterne laid before him and that hee could deuise on nothing nor thinke vpon any thing in his mind nor vnderstand any thing without a fourme layd before his eyes All which how well they agree with the omnipotencie of God and his incomprehensible wisedome let them see for I cannot see Finally where and in what place at the length this spirituall world is and how it subsisteth whether it bee in Gods minde as one substaunce in another â–ª Surely it can not so bee For GOD is a most simple nature whiche receiueth and conteineth none other thing then it self but if indeede it were so whether were it as an accident and a certaine fourmyng or a phantasie fiction of Gods mind Truely it cannot bee so neither For there salleth no such accident vpon God who in that hee seeth the thinges that are present hee gathereth not in his minde the fourmes and representations of thinges that are obiect vnto hym when hee thinketh and meditateth hee discourseth not from one thing to another when hee woorketh and maketh somewhat hee doeth not consider of it and examine it according too some patterne which hee hath conceiued in his mind â–ª to the ende hee would not erre S. Howbeit the Lord coÌ„maunded Moses that hee should doo all thing accordong to the example and patterne which was shewed hym in the Mount as in Exod. the 25. chap. and 40. verse and in the Epistle to the Hebrues the 8. chapter and 5. verse M. First if I list I may make exceptioÌ„ that in that place are handled heaueÌ„ly things only not things appertaining to natural Philosophy Then again there is difference betweene God the most wise creatour and Moses a creature a man subiect vnto the same blindnesse infirmitie that other men were Wherefore to theintent hee might well execute that which hee was commaunded to doe surely hee had neede of suche an example or patterne This patterne also which the Lord shewed hym in the Mount did not indeede subsist nor was a substanciall thing as I am of opinion but it was sutch a representation and image sutch as were the images of many thinges to come whiche were afterwarde by God reuealed to the Prophetes and beefore that vnto Abraham and the Patriarkes S. They that defend that there bee many worlds of one kinde what doe they say M. This for sooth that like as wee inhabite this world so others inhabite other worldes in whiche is also an other earth like vnto ours and other heauens and another Sunne and a Moone and all other things in them as in ours Wherefore some of them suppose that there are an infinite number of worldes some moe some fewer Among whom are rekoned the followers of the Philosophers Epicurus and Democritus S. Are there in deede many worldes M. Fie vpon this infinite or multitude of worlds Ther is one and no moe although S. Ierome out of a certeine Epistle of Clements disputeth of the same in his Commentaries vpon the Epistle of S. Paule to the Ephesians the 2. chapter and 2. verse
bee framed also for that the principall and as it were the partes of the whole in respecte of this worlde as are heauen water earth are by our senses themselues perceiued to bee sphericall and rounde vnto whiche it is credible that the compasse of the whole worlde is semblable Howe bee it I can affirme nothinge certeinly therof since although wee admit that this part whiche is neerest vnto vs the lowermost of the circūference of the high heauen which wee beehold and which enuironeth althing be bending holow round notwithstandinge it maye bee imagined that the farthermoste and highermoste parte of the same circūference is of some other forme and I knowe ther bee some that haue saide that the vttermoste and farthermost part of heauen is shaped like a bell S. But in the Prophecic of Isay it is said that heauen is stretched foorthe and sprede abroade like a webbe or a curteine Isay the 40. chapter and 22. verse wherevnto also accordeth that which is written in the 104. Psalme and 2. verse wherfore it is like to a plaine whiche fourme is quite contrarie to a circle For a circle turneth about alwayes in his owne rowmeth M ▪ Uerily both the places which you haue alleaged declareth not the forme but the vttermost top or ende of world which therfore is said by God so to be stretched abroad and to couer the earth both that men may the more commodiously dwell vnder it as it were vnder a most beutifull and wide rough whereof it commeth that wee French men call all such couerings heauen and in our countrey language vn ciell and also to the intente that this is a veile beeinge sprede beefore mens eies they maye bee restrayned from the ouercurious and deepe entring into and searchinge after the secretes and misteries of God. S. But since the same holy Scripture hath plainly distinguished the higher place frō the lower in this worlde as in Isay the 55. chapter the 9. and 10. verses it cannot then seeme to bee sphericall or round For in a circle no part can bee called high or lowe forasmuch as all lines which are drawne from the center to the circumference are equall and the circumference it selfe which way soeuer it stande is alwaye vpwarde and in the higher place M. Of this wee will speake afterwarde and that more at large But nowe to set downe so much as shall bee sufficient to take all doubt out of your minde vnderstande thus much That by the rules of the mathematicians there bee indeede and are noted these positions of the higher and lower place and that they are indeede distinguished one from an other For the middle of the circle which they call the center is the lower place and downewarde and the circumference which is the vpper line which beeinge hollowe and meetyng togither conteineth the whole rounde space within the circle is the higher place and vpwarde so that in that these positions and kindes of places and differences are found in the world you may conclude that which you would to wit that the whole receite of this worlde is not sphericall and rounde The xiiii Chapter Whether the worlde haue one onely soule S. NOW forasmuch as this world is but one onely and since it is finite is it gouerned by some one speciallsoule onely whiche is dispersed throughout euerie parte thereof as it were in the members as wee see the soule to bee in a mans bodie M. That this whole world hath a soule and that one onely certain Philosophers of noble fame haue long since bene of opinion ▪ as Aristotle certayne other whose opinion hath hee folowed who wrote in this maner Firste heauen and earth and of the seas that flitring feeldes and fines These glorious starres this glistringe globe of Moone so bright that shines One liuely soule there is that feedes them all with breath of loue One minde throughe all these members mixt this mightie masse doth moue But this is not so much a solemne sentēce or saying as it is a great errour as S. Augustine teacheth in his booke against Felicia Aria ▪ the 12. Chapter S. Why so M. Bicause those bodies which are conteined within the gouenrment of one spirite and one soule are all one not diuided as is the bodie of euery one of vs not separate one from an other as a flocke and not one touching or neere ioyning to an other as are the fingers of a mans hande houses that stande one close to an other As for the parts of this bodie which wee call the worlde they are not onely distinguished one frō an other but separated also diuided frō thēselues by distāce of space For euery sheepe euery horse euery tree euery particulare mā is a part of this world yet are they so deuided by place mole of body and by circumscription of distance that it cannot bee saide that all and euerye one of these haue one soule onely For what would come to passe if it were imagined that in deed there were one onely soule and spirite in all these thinges For sooth this absurditie That the soule which is a certein simple nature and altogither spirituall were to be diuided as bodily things are and not by imagination onely Neither can this inconueniēce bee auoyded seeinge that those thinges in which that onely and singulare soule is conteined are in truth separate and diuided by place and determined euerye one of them by circumscription of their owne bodye Moreouer it shoulde folowe that all the partes of the world had life as the Sunne the moone the starres the heauē it selfe yea all the celestial bodies which notwithstanding S. Augustine moste plainely denieth in hys booke against Priscillia the 8. 9. Chapters that thys opinion of S. Augustine against the Mamches is true the effect prooueth For who woulde euer affirme that the starres had lyfe or reason Finally since of the partes of the worlde some bee mortall as brute beastes and certeine immortall as men howe can it bee that this singulare and one onely soule of the whole world can admit in it selfe qualities and conditions so contrarie and repugnaunt one to an other that it shoulde bee one parte of it mortall and another immortall specially beeing it selfe singulare one and simple not double and compounded Moreouer amonge such thinges as die someperyshe verie soone as wormes and flies some continue verie long as Ceder trees the Crowe and the Heart by this reckonyng it cummeth to passe that this soule of the world which notwithstanding in these mens opinion is onely one and in number singulare and a lone may bee called partly dead and partly a liue All which how foolish false and repugnant they bee you see S. I see indeede and I agree with you in that you doe moste truely deny that there is one onely soule and that in number singulare of this whole world M. Yea farther beesides the reasons aboue recited wee will lastly alleage this
one out of holy Scripture as the strongest of them al. To wit that by this meanes the goodnes and wisedome of God who giueth vnto euery thing and ingraffeth within them their proper and distincte vertues is not only obscured but vtterly extinguished and plucked out of mennes mindes whiles wee attribute these vertues the administration and gouernment of those thinges not vnto GOD hymselfe but vnto a certaine other nature and soule contrarie to that whiche wee are taught too beeleeue and confesse Psalme 147. and 15. and 16. verses To the Ephesians the 3. chapter verse 20. and Iob the viii chapter the 5. verse S. If then there bee not one certeine soule of this whole vniuersalitie as you teache truely the opinion of the Stoikes Platonikes and of certeine other Philosophers and likewise of the Priscillianist Heretikes is ouerthrowen who say that this worlde is a liuyng creature and indued with will and reason M. You gather wel For their opinion is altogether foolish and vnreasonable For since that is only a liuyng creature and so to bee called whose partes and members are not conteined only in one continuall compas of the bodie but also gouerned by one spirite verely this worlde is not a liuyng creature For the mēbers thereof are disioyned and separate As for the auctoritie of the Stoikes and other Philosophers which you named erewhile it should mooue vs verie little had not S. Augustine sometyme written that hee doubted whether this worlde were a liuyng creature or not whiche thyng as hee would not deny so durst hee not affirme whose doubt notwithstandyng we ought not to followe or allowe of The xv Chapter That this world was made in tyme and is not eternall S. BUt I aske you this question whether this world beegan sometime to bee or whether it were alwayes and bee eternall M. Many argumentes doe prooue that the world once beegan to bee among whiche all Philo in his booke De Mundo of the worlde hath gathered fiue speciall ones We wil declare ours and those whiche bee most Christian S. Whiche be they M. These foure First the voyce and auctoritie of the diuine Scripture whiche speaketh in this maner In the beeginnyng God made heauen and earth Genesis the 1. chapter and 1. verse The second reason is certeine For if the world were coeternall with GOD it selfe also were God for eternitie is not only proper to diuine nature but also the most it selfe substance therof and the principall part and definition Exodus the 2. chapt and 14. verse Reuelat. the 1. chap. and 8. verse The thirde that forasmuch as this world shall haue an ende and euery thing hath meanes whereby it doth consist it followeth necessarily that it had a beeginnyng of beeyng For although that bee truely sayde not whatsoeuer had a beeginnyng shall haue an ende forasmuche as there bee many thinges made which through the singulare benefite of God are not subiect to death and corruption as Angels and the soules of men whiche are immortall notwithstandyng it is moste certeinly affirmed that whatsoeuer shall haue an ende the same also had beeginnyng of beeing Which Rule is so generall that it admitteth no exception Finally the fourth is this that not onely the causes of the creation of the worlde are set downe and also the certeine tyme noted but also for the preseruation of the perpetuall memory therof there are certeine spaces of tyme prescribed as the order of weekes doe plainly teache and also the space of fiftie yeares which is called by the Hebrues the yere of Iubile whiche God hymself commaunded to bee obserue whereby wee might easely knowe and vnderstande how many ages are past since the first beeginning of the world S. Concerning that auctority whiche you alleage out of the Scripture and the 1. chapter of Genesis some doe otherwise interprete it They graunte that all these things indeede were made in the beeginnyng but not in tyme For the meaning and signification of a beeginnyng or of this woord principium is manifolde and in that place they saye it must not bee vnderstoode of the beeginning of tyme. M. The signification of a beeginnyng or of this woord principium is threefold For it respecteth either the time either the thing the causes or else the order The beginnynge of time in those things which are brought forth in a certein time is that moment of an houre either wherein they are conceiued or are brought foorth into the world Those thinges haue onely the beeginnyng of tyme which are doone in tyme That which is called the beginning of a thing and is taken for the cause in those thinges which are of one age and time is that relation and affection whereby one thyng is the cause of the beeing of another So if wee make a conference beetweene the day and the night wee saye that the Sun is the beeginning of the daye and light although both of them do appeere vnto vs at one moment Sutch a beeginning a diuerse or certeine time doth not establish Finally a beeginnyng in respect of order is called that which ministreth the beeginnyng of numbryng in sutch thinges as are disposed in one order as for example The father is the beginning among the three persons in trinitie which are one god y magistrate is one amōg many of like auctoritie with whō in telling we do begin like as we do with our cheif Magistrate or Judge in this our Citie of Geneua S. In this respect then they woulde haue God to bee the beginninge of this worlde as beeinge the cause and woorkeman therof as hee that is first numbred is called the beginninge M. Marke howe absurde this is Firste what shall bee the sence and meaning of this saying In the beeginnyng God made heauen and earth if so be they wil thus expound it God in the beeginnyng that is to saye God in God created heauen and earth Moreouer why saide hee did create which woorde doth not onely determine a beginning of beeing but also the force of woorking and a determinate beeginning of time is therein manifestly comprehended and included Beesides will wee nill wee by this reason we shal fall into that damnable heresie of the Hermogenians who make the woorke to bee eternall with the woorkeman and so wee muste needes make moe Gods than one Of which errour me thinketh I shoulde speake sumwhat more at large were it not that Tertullian longe science had vtterly ouerthrowne it in a whole woorke yea the Scripture it selfe doth manifestly expounde this sayinge of Moses of the beeginning of time Prouerbes the 8. Chap. and verses 25. 27. and 28. Hee vseth also the same woords and the same comparison whē hee speaketh of the beginninge of the worlde wherein there muste needes bee vnderstood a beginning and moment of tyme and of beeing Neither can that which S. Paule repeateth so often speakinge of the beginning of the world bee vnderstoode of the laying of the foundations thereof to the Ephesi the 1. Chapter and
the maker and creatour of this world and that all thinges were fashioned brought foorth by his hande will power And that I may not traueill in the gathering togither of these testimonies I will here recite vnto you twayne for all the one in the Psalme 104. and 29. verse If thou hyde thy face they are troubled if thou take away their breath they die and returne vnto their dust if thou send foorth thy spirite they are created and thou renuest the face of the earth the other in Isay the 45. chap. and 18. verse For thus sayth the Lorde that created heauen God hymself that formed the earth and made it hee that prepared it hee created it not in vayne hee formed it to bee inhabited And therefore the auncient Fathers commonlie termed the worlde a woorke perfectlie wrought The xvii Chapter Of the causes of the worlde and first of the cause efficient thereof which is God not Angels nor Diuells S. WHiche bee the causes of this world M There bee foure first the efficient or producing cause the materiall formall and finall S. Can you declare them seuerally vnto mee M. I will. S. Tell mee then whiche is the efficient cause M. God and hee onely S. Haue you anye reason wherby you can prooue thys your so short resolution M. Yea I haue And first Moses proueth that it was God y made this world Genesis y 1. chap. In the beginning God made heauen earth And Dauid also cōfirmeth same in y 33. Psalme and 6. verse By the woorde of the Lorde were the heauens made and all the hoste of them by the breath of his mouth For hee spake and it was doone hee commaunded and it stoode Likewise Isay in the 44. chap. And Iob the 12. chap. And finally both the newe and old Testament The same also did Anaxagoras the Philosopher signifie sum what obscurely hauing before receiued it by some auncient tradition who called the mynde that is to saye God the Creatour of all thinges who although hee were therefore laughed at by the other naturall Philosophers of his tyme yet he helde the true opinion Howbeeit the Marcionites and after them the Manichees doe vrge farther They say that this world wherin there is sutch disturbance and disorder among thinges is vnworthy to bee called or counted Gods woork For what confusion what calamitie what perturbacion is there seene in this worlde and in all these thinges where wicked men doe rule good men are vexed the Summer sometyme is colde the Haruest greeuous and daungerous and sutch other like accidentes doe happen And therfore if wee say that God made these things God is not the auctour of order in the world but of greate confusion S. But what is your opinion hereof M. They iudge amisse for God is the creatour and producyng cause of all those thinges and substaunces wherof the world consisteth and not of the confusion and disorder whiche now is and afterward came vppon them for that is the effect of mans transgression and a great part of that vanitie wherunto in the beeginnyng through Adam all thinges were subiect Romanes the 8. chap. Therefore it is not caused by GOD neither ingraffed by hym nor proceedyng from hym For hee created all thinges first good and in good order and subiect to no disorder confusion or deformitie So Romulus builded the Citie of Rome not those seditions which many hundred yeres after his death sprang vp at Rome through y ambition of men Wherfore against the Marcionites and Manichees we ought to distinguishe and deuide the thinges themselues their nature and substance from the deformitie whiche afterward hapned and came vpon them For the Heathen Philosophers themselues as Thales for example haue called this worlde a beutifull woorke and counted it woorthy of God agreate deale better than those Heretikes haue doone S. Proceede then with that which you began M. It was God therfore that created and fourmed this worlde what GOD Forsooth hee which is one in substance and three in person to wit the Father the Sunne and the holy Ghost and so is it to bee vnderstoode that God made the world to wit that it is the woorke of them all three indifferently and not either the Fathers or the Sunnes or the holy Ghosts specially or principally the woorkes also of the whole Trinitie are vndiuided althoughe the woorkemanship of either of the persons is distinct in the self same woorke S. Declare this which you spake more plainely M. Meses teacheth in the 1. of the Genesis that the Father wrought in the creation of the worlde and also the woord that is to say the Sunne like wise the holy ghost The father createth by his wil the woord or y Sunne createth by woorkinge and bringing foorth and the holy Ghost treateth by implāting of strength and nature and by giuing of motion and life whiche is in euery thinge for the bringinge foorth and preseruation therof And therfore S. Ihon in the 1. chap. and 3. and 14. verses when hee had declared that all thinges were made by the woorde hee saieth afterwarde that the same was the Sunne of god Wherfore the Sunne is and is also rightly called the creatour of the world And the holy Ghost giueth strength to liue and to mooue and also susteineth both that they may exist and liue also continue bee preserued Wherefore hee also in the creation of the world woorthily challengeth vnto himselfe some parte of so woorthie a woorke which also by Isay in the 40. chap. and 7. verse and the 41. chapter 29. verse are plainlyascribed and attributed vnto him S. There bee othersome that doe otherwise interprete this which you saye and by this name VVoorde and also the holy Ghost do not vnderstand certain substances or any thinge existing of themselues but suppose rather that thereby the meane is taught by which this worlde was made to wit not that by anye engin or frame not by ironwoorkes not by any handie crafte so hugie a mole was framed and brought foorth but onely by the commaundement and the word of Gods will that is to saye onely by the declaring and publishing of Gods decree which of it selfe is of sufficient power and efficacie M. I doe not deney but that those thinges which vnto vs of their owne nature are misticall and incomprehensible are opened and declared by suche parables set and set foorth in such wordes metaphores as by vs they may bee vnderstoode To wit that the eternall Sunne of God is called the woorde and the holie Ghost which is that diuine person substancial vertue subsistinge by it selfe and proceeding from the Father and the Sunne and is distinct notwithstāding is called a spirite But forasmuch as the scripture in an other place teacheth that that woorde is not a certain sound or declaratiō of Gods will a certeine common enuntiane or spoken woord that the spirite is not a power and vertue infused into thinges but that hee
is God and the verie same that is called the dweller in our hartes Iohn the 1. chap. the 3. verse and the 1. to the Corinth the 6. Chapter the 19. verse both which persōs since it is taught in the scriptures in sundrie places that they wrought with the Father in the creation of the worlde howe can it bee doubted but that our opinion is right and true S. Foorth then declare whether God created all these thyngs alone M. Yea alone S. How prooue you that M. Out of the 44. Chapter and 24. verse of Isay I am the Lorde that made althinges that spread out the heauens alone and stretched out the earth by my selfe And Iob the 41. Chapter the 2. and 3. verse and to bee short this is the generall doctrine of the scriptures The same is also confirmed by reason For hee is alone which calleth those things that are not and brought them foorth into the lyght and finally hee alone is the aucthor and Father of all thinges S. But with what and howe manie armies of gaynsaiers are you nowe compassed about M. I am not ignorant of that For I shall bee uexed almost with innumerable rables of Heretikes Heathen Philosophers but Gods woord shall sufficiently defende mee and his holy trueth shall stande for me against them all S. Tell mee then what were those heretikes opinions or rather errours in that point M. I will gather them togither out of Ireneus cheifly out of the 1. and 2. booke Some of the Heretikes will haue it that this worlde was first thought vpon and conceiued in minde by one God and procreated and made by another as certaine of the Valentinians and Carpocratians do affirme Othersome by a certain other nature and farre differinge vertue than which ought to bee called a God and which gouerneth althing by whom they suppose this worlde to haue beene made as Corinthus held opinion whom at sumtime they termed Hystera a belly or a wombe at another Demiurgus a pronouncer of lawes doe distinguish him from the same whome they will haue to bee the true God call Propator Some again thinke that the world was made by angels only and not by God as the Simonians and Menandrians so many are the wandrings awry whē a man hath once departed out of the right way S. What say the Philosophers M. They holde opinion that the worlde was made by their deuils whiche they call Angels and make them to differ from the greate God in whole kinde as doe the Platonikes As for Epicurus who sayeth that thys world came by chaunce I accoumpt hym not among the number of Philosophers and as for the opinions of the other I haue no leasure now to rehearse them S. What haue you nowe to alleage against so greate a power of your aduersaries M. The woord of GOD and the reason also whiche is confirmed by the same Philosophers The woord of God that forasmuch as it is the proper and peculiare attribute or title beelongyng to GOD onely to bee a creatour the same cannot agree with Angels or any other thing My glory will I not giue to another saieth the lord c. Isay chap. 42. verse 8. and chap. 45. verse 12. Moreouer we should make so many seuerall Gods as there bee Angels creatours For who so createth the same also giueth and susteineth life and his woorke dependeth altogether of hym and of hym it hath it only beeing Wherefore the Angels also shal bee life giuers and susteiners Goddes and Iehouah that is to saye giuers of existence Whiche thing how mutch it repugneth against Scripture it may bee vnderstoode out of the 45. chap. and 18. verse of Isay Whereupon also S. Augustine in his 3. booke and 8. chapter of the Trinitie woorthily and truely denieth with vs that neither the diuels nor Magicians are able to create one S. Can you alleage any reason or opinion to be liked of that is defended by any of the Philosophers M. Yea this one to wit The nature of beeginnings loueth singularitie And therfore Aristotle reciteth and commendeth the woorthie opinion of Homer It is not good that many rule Let one our ruler bee who vsing likewise the same argument in his 12. booke of Metaphysikes affirmeth that there is one chief most excellent God among the residue who is King souereigne aboue them al. The same opinion hath S. Augustine also embraced in his first booke of marriage the 9. chapter and vndoubtedly experience it self teacheth that it is a most true saying Thus can hee also make small thinges that made the greate and the same God that made high thinges bringeth foorthe and fourmeth the lowe things also for hee is almightie as Father Ireneus saieth in his 2. booke and 44. chap. so that it is not onely not necessarie that there should bee many creatours of this world appointed but it is also against the nature of beginninges and the omnipotencie of God that there should bee more than one The. xviii Chapter That the world and all thinges that are therein were made by God of nothyng and not onely decked foorth or set in order or brought foorth out of a certeine disordred heape or matter whiche was extant beefore S. BUt after what maner or in what sense doe you saye that God is the producent and efficient cause of this world M. In respect that hee hath not onely giuen power and beutie vnto thinges but first hath brought foorth and made them out of nothinge hauing no matter preexisting or going beefore which is properly called to create S. Is there anye notablenesse or excellencie in the signification of that woorde which may bee reputed peculiare and proper to the power of God M. Yea mary For by that meanes GOD is verie farre separated from all sortes of other woorkmen and also from all other kindes of causes as are parents and seruants or else the naturall powers S. How so M. For that no woorkman bee hee neuer so mightie and skilfull is able to make anye thyng vnlesse hee haue stuffe ministred vnto him for if he haue no stuffe hee is able to make nothing Take away yron from the Smith timber from the Carpendour yearne from the Weauer what other good can they doe but stand still gaping in their shoppes For euerie Arte and occupation requireth naturally to haue some stuffe prepared for it wheruppon afterwarde it woorketh and bringeth foorth sundrie fourmes Yea not the causes themselues and powers whiche are termed naturall and are proper to euery thing are able to bring foorth any thing without conuenient matter and stuffe alotted vnto them For if a man searche throughly the greatest and whole vertues of the natures of all thinges notwithstandyng hee shall finde that to bee true which is generally spokē by the natural Philosophers Nothyng is made of nothyng Who euer reaped Wheate or Barly without sowing who euer saw trees growe without planting settinge or springing from some berrie or kernell or
proper and naturall force and signification of this woorde Create For in the 43. chap. and 13. verse of Isay the Lorde calleth himselfe the creatour of Israell which people notwithstandinge are knowne to haue beene borne of seede And againe in in the 65. Chapter and 18. verse of the same Prophet he saith Beeholde I create Hierusalem Whiche place whether it bee vnderstoode of the citizens or of the citie it selfe it is certayne that God made neyther of them without seede or matter but the men of the one and the Citie of the other For this woorde Barah is vsed in both places so that I am of opinion that wee ought not to sticke to religiously or percisely to the interpretation of one poore woorde Likewise they alleage this saying of the same Prophete Beeholde I create a newe heauen and a newe earth When as indeede the Lorde will onely renue these bodyes which nowe are heauen and earth and not make theÌ„ again of nothing M. It is writen in Isay as you say But these places doe plainly confirme mine opinion much lesse confute it For the woorde create is taken Metaphorically and wrested a litle from the proper significatioÌ„ wherby the power of God may appeare the greater more excellent in restoringe his people and holy Citie beesides al hope and other thinges beesides all ordinarie meanes For lyke as the thinges that are created are beesides the course of nature made of nothinge so likewise bycause the Lord promiseth that hee will restore and renue his people and Citie hee vseth properly the woorde of creating for that this which the Lord will woorke is as it were a new creation and a certayne wonÌ„derfull bringing foorth and generation out of nothinge Althoughe I will not deney but that the signification of this word Barah is ofteÌ„times translated and vsed more largely as when it is sayd Create a cleane hart within mee O God the 51. Psalme and 12. verse and againe The seat of the frowarde createth iniquitie Psalme 94. and 20. verse Of this sayinge and opinion of Sainct Augustine that I maye saye so much by the licence of so woorthy a man I doe not well alowe Who in his first booke against the aduersaries of the lawe and the Prophetes the 23 chap writeth thus And when there is anye difference made beetweene makinge and creatinge this maye bee the oddes beetwene those two woordes as I sayde that that is made which beefore was not at all and that created which is ordeyned of sumthinge that was beefore Hee distinguished those two woordes Make and Creat toto subtily whiche oftentimes are vsed one for an other S. How then should it bee M. Thus the Scripture plainly defineth to wit that God is the creatour of the world that is to say of all thinges that are who made framed brought foorth them all out of nothing and not out of any matter preexisting or made to his hande or whiche is coeternall with God himself or ministred vnto him by some other woorking God as the Manichees doe suppose For that opinion induceth two Goddes and in making twayne it leaueth none For either there is no God or there is but one Finally as saith S. Ambrose God should bee onely the diuiser of the figure and not the maker of Nature and hee had founde and receiued more than hee had made if there had bin any matter readie to his hande S. But there bee some that saie that this matter is signified in the scripture by this woorde Tohu where vpon afterward the Grecians and the Philosophers who receiued those thinges first of the Hebrues and of the Phenicians neere borderers to the Hebrues whiche thei haue written concernyng the beeginnyng of the worlde thei deuised this woorde Hyle by a small alteration of certein letters made according to the vse and proprietie of their tongue For this woorde Hyle saiethei signifieth among the Grecians as muche as a rude heape vnformed and as it were a certein moiste and waterishe yearth or quagmire or dregges out of whiche many thinges are engendred through the force of the heate whiche commeth vnto it From the whiche woorde Hyle is the woorde Hilys deriued which signifieth dregges and froath that is to saye a dirtie and moyst earth out of whiche many thinges doe growe in the Sea. M. I doubted not but those that goe about to defend the same errour of theirs concerning a firste matter pre-existing as though it were verie necessarie and they that haue throughly receiued the same doe deuise many suche foolishe fantasies But how small or none at all the affinity of these two woordes is Tohu and Hyle in writing of the Letters or rather how farre this is from the trueth your selfe doe see and it shall not bee needefull to seeke farther forasmuch as God is openly called the creatour of heauen and earth S. Yea God is termed Gosâ—he Ioâ—ser that is to say the maker and the fourmer as it is written in Isay the 66. chapt and 10. verse and Iob the 35. chap. and 10. verse and Isay the 54. chap. 8. verse as also in the 90. Psalme the 2. verse M. That was doone not rashly nor in vaine but to the intent to take awaye sutch errours as the spirite of God foresawe would grow afterward amongst men For there are twoo errours among men concernyng the beeginning of all thinges beesides the errour of the materiare heretikes For some thinke that first and alwaies there was existing a certein whole masse and that rude and confused whiche was the heape of all the principall partes and thinges of the worlde whiche now are existing and fourmed but then disorderly mingled togither which they call Chaos And this opinion Hesiodus folowed in his Theogonia whiche Ouid describeth in his Metamorphosis in these wordes Beefore the sea and lande were made the heauen that all doth hide In all the worlde one onely face of nature did abyde Whiche Chaos hight an huge rude heape and nothinge else but eeuen An heauie lumpe and clottred clod of feedes togither driuen Of thinges at strife amonge themselues for want of order due No sunne as yet with lightsome beames the shapelesse worlde did viewe c. This muche therefore they doe attribute vnto God that hee is the distinguisher trimmer and setter foorth of this so confused a Chaos mole and heape and not the creatour of it in time giuinge vnto it the first meanes of beeinge And therefore the Poet sayde There was as it were from euerlasting and not the same Chaos was made and created by god And for this cause they doe not call God the Creatour of the world but onely the beutifier and as Sainct Ambrose sayeth the deuiser of the shape and fourme thereof as though hee hadde giuen a certeine comlinesse and order vnto thinges that existed before and which had of themselues their owne proper strength and nature whiche hee accomplished by a certaine wise and apt distinction of them and by separating
distributing of euery part into it owne conuenient place Othersome there bee that doe attribute more vnto god For they holde opinion that the matter was a great mole from eternitie mary but matter onely and not that althinges were encluded and comprehended within it whiche the firste sorte doe also holde but that it was rude and vnshapen Which matter for that it was great GOD taking it in hande diuided it into smale peaces and as hee is a moste wise and cunninge woorkeman facioned it into sundrye fourmes And so endued euerye parte thereof with hys owne proper fourme which wee see them nowe rertaine Euen so out of one and the selfesame barre of yron cut into sundry pieces the Smith frameth forgeth a key an hammer a sawe fetters and many other thinges seruinge to sundrie purposes whereof they tearme God Demiurgus and not the creatour or maker Howbeit the scripture attributeth all this vnto god To wyt both that they bee thinges and also haue the same force power nature and fourme which wee see to bee in them And finally in that they are situate in such place and distinguished in sutch order as wee doe beeholde that they decke foorth this mole in such cumly sorte as in hugenesse beutie we do perceiue they do and in such maner as ther is no man able sufficiently to expresse Wherefore the Scripture saith that God doeth not onely Barah that is to say create And in the Greeke tongue Kâ—â—zin or Poem but also Gascha which is to say woorke And in Greeke also to doe some woorke or Demiurgin and also Iarsar that is to say to bring things into a cumly order which in the Greeke tongue is called â—â—smiâ— and that all things which are in this world which are seene do take their beeginning from God to bee thinges at all and to bee suche maner thinges as they are wee muste so determine moste certeinely with ourselues vnderstande so and confesse the same beeing thereto constrained by the force of truth S. Haue you any proofes to confirme this your opinion by M. Yea truely that especially out of these places of holy scripture Isay the 42. chapter and 5. verse the 43. chapter the 1. and 7. verses the 45. chapter the 12. 18. verses Likewise Iob the 26. chapter and 13. verse the 25. chapter 10. verse wher the onely and felfesame God is termed by so many and diuerse names The xix Chapter Of the ende for which God created and made this worlde S. WHat cause mooued God specially to make this worlde hee himselfe lacking nothing and dwelling in that euerlastinge felicitie vnto which there can bee no encrease of felicitie immortalitie added by meanes of al this gret woorke M. Euen his mere goodnes that is to saye his moste louing good will to communicate the same his felicitie vnto certeine thinges so farre foorth as the nature of those thinges whiche hee created was able to receiue the same Wherefore hee created Angels in heauen and men vpon the earth to the intent hee might make them after a sort companions and partakers of his felicitie beeing hymself most good moste louing moste perfect and also in himselfe and through himself most perfectly and wholy blessed S. How proue you this M. Both by auctoritie and reason And auctoritie is that whiche is cheifly taken out of the Scriptures as the the 36. Psalme the 5. verse Lord thy mercy stretcheth vnto the heauens Psalme 33. the 5. verse The earth is full of the mercy of the lord Psalme 34 the 9. verse See how good the Lord is and in the 103. Psalme the 17. verse The mercie of the Lord indureth from one age vnto another And in the 111. Psalme and 4. verse But specially in the 136. Psalme throughout and in the Psalme 145. and 9. verse The Lorde is good to all and his mercies are ouer all his woorkes And next out of the Fathers For S. Augustine in his 1. booke of Genesis vpon the letter the 8. chapter and also is his Enchiridion the 9. booke sayeth plainly that the only goodnes of God was the cause wherefore God made all these things The same is likewise affirmed by Ireneus in his third boooke the 45. and 46. chapters and also by Fulgentius in his booke de fide ad Petr. the 3. chapt And if you will also commend Heathen writers in this respect you haue Plato in Timeo a most graue auctour among them who beeing led by a naturall light and the testimonie of his owne conscience wrote in this maner whiche Cicero hath expressed is his booke de vniuersitate Let vs thaÌ„ seeke out the cause which mooued hym that made these thinges to beegin a new originall and frame of thinges Hee was good And hee that is good enuieth no man. And therefore some say thus God knew and would haue his felicitie to bee communicated to others For although that the diuine goodnes is and was in God most fully and most perfectly without al these thinges as it appeareth in the 60. Psalme and is also kepte vndefiled Notwithstandyng these things which are created are manifestatiue as they speake in the scholes do declare the excellencie of Gods goodnes that is to saye they shewe that the same goodnes is altogether agreeable vnto god This muche say they S. I haue heard the auctorities declare now the reasons M. Forasmuche as there proceedeth nothyng from vs men neither from the blessed and elect Angels wherby God may be more established in respect of his eternitie or more blessed in respect of his state and condicion as it is written in the 16. Psalme and 2. verse for it is not possible that any thing should bee added vnto hym who of himself is altogether perfect truely ther was no neede that draue him to make these thinges but only this one cause to wit his owne louing good will. Wherefore like as it is writen in the 3. chapter to Titus the 4. verse that the mere goodnes of GOD was the cause of mans saluation so was it also the cause of mans creation And if it were the cause of men doubtlesse it was also the cause of the creation of all other thinges The xx Chapter This world cannot bee called the Sunne of God. S. I Do wel vnderstand so much as you haue hetherto sayd of God who is the efficient cause of thys world not as a woorkeman onely or a discriber or painter or trimmer vp but rather as a creator and a bringer foorth of it out of nothyng Tell mee now this one thing more whether in respect of these causes this world may bee called the Sunne of God M. You renue an old question which S. Augustine plainly discusseth in his Enchiridion the 38. and 39. chapters Truely if we will speake properly and to vnderstandyng this world neither can nor ought bee called the Sun of god First bicause it is not made of the substance of god For they that are properly called
a mans children or sunnes are beegotten of the fathers seede and substance Moreouer whatsoeuer is said to spring and come of another ought not by and by to be called the sunne of that from whiche it springeth For Lice doe breede out of a mannes fleshe yet are thei not called the sunnes of men or of their fleshe To cōclude since the comparison and respecte of GOD vnto the worlde is rather like the woorkeman to the woorke than like the Father to the Sunne truely the worlde may bee termed the woorke and perfected labour of God but by no meanes called his Sunne The. xxi Chapter What God created first to bee the matter for thinges that were created afterward S. HEtherto you haue discoursed of the efficiēt cause now saye sumwhat concernyng the materiall cause of the world M. What matter can I name vnto you since there was none at all as I haue sufficiently disputed and proued beefore as this woord Create declareth if you haue regarde to it owne proper signification Neither do I thinke it woorth the traueill to confute the opinions of the Philosopers who haue almoste euerie one of them stūbled at this block or else to conuince the heresie of the Hermogenians who reuoked that errour whiche was nowe long since extinguished in the Churche of God out of the scooles and opinions of the Stoikes and chose rather to learne how the world beegan at the handes of naturall Philosophers than of true Christians and out of Gods woord Al whose argumentes Tertullian hath confuted in a noble and profitable woorke whiche is now abroade in mens handes and is most worthie to bee read S. I doe not require after that which was not but this rather whether that among those thinges whiche God created of nothing there were any thing disposed prepared and brought foorth that afterward serued the turne and stoode in steede in the creation of other things out of which God did afterward facion and fourme al thinges else that remained to be made M. You mooue mee to enter into a difficult question which consisteth both of like number of weightie reasons and of auctorities of graue writers For among the learned auctours some thinke that Heauen and earth of whiche in the 1. chapt of Genesis and 1. verse it is writen In the beginnyng God made heauen and earth were made by God of nothyng howbeit first and before all thinges to the intent that they might be the prepared matter of all other thinges that were to be afterward created And therfore they say that God did nothyng the other daies following but onely distinguysh this matter and masse which was first confusedly brought foorth and conteined in it the seedes of all other thinges into the proper kindes and elementes and that euerie thing should be trimmed foorth in it owne kind and gouerned by it owne lawe Other dooe suppose otherwise that these thinges were only set downe in the beginning as it were in maner of a preface or supposition of some discourse that should ensue to the end that the summe of the whole matter following might be the better vnderstoode and the boundes of so great a frame as the world is bee drawne foorth In like maner cunning Carpenters when they are about to build some goodly and large house they firste drawe out a platfourme in certeine proportions and lines conteining the fourme of the whole woork that shal bee to the intent they may point out and place the other roomthes of the buildyng within that circuite so conteine themselues within those limites Thus say they heauen and earth are proposed by Moses and that in the beeginning of his Narration to the ende wee might vnderstande what limites the discription following and the whole woorke should haue Like as he also repeateth again those limites after the narration of the creation concludeth the whole woorke whiche hee set foorth after the same manner Genesis the 2. chapter and 1. verse Wherefore In the beginnyng God created heauen and earth that is to saye firste of all the summe of all Gods woorkes is layd beefore vs to bee thought on Moreouer Ireneus in his 2. booke the 10. 11. and 16. chapters sheweth that GOD is not like men as not hauing neede of any matter that hee had created or prepared before hand to finish or make his other woorkes of S. Howe then doe you thinke otherwise M. Truely the interpretation and opinion of the fyrste sorte seemeth vnto mee the more probable which hold that the heauen and earth in suche maner as thei are there spoken of were firste created by GOD of nothing howbeit as it were a rude matter of the whole woorke and bewtie that shoulde folowe out of which God by his mightie power brought foorth all the residue Although almightie God lacked no matter to create firste heauen and earth with all neither yet to bring forthe the woorkes of the other daies like as at this day also he needeth not the seede of man to bryng foorth men of if hee lust to doe otherwise notwithstanding in these questions wee must not enquire how much hee was able to doe sayeth S. Augustine in his 2. booke de Genesi but rather what the course of nature in things will suffer and what his pleasure is and what hee hath reuealed vnto vs by his woorde Neither doth this mine opinion want iust and sufficient confirmation either of the auctoritie of men or of reason And as for auctoritie there is none against mee seeing bothe Philo Iudaeus and the Rabbines commonly and the best learned of the Hebrues doe so expounde that place of Moses yea S. Augustine also oftentimes as in the 5. booke de Ge nesi ad Literam the 3. and 5. chapters and the 1. booke the 5. chapter S. Ambrose likewise in Examero and S. Chrysostome and S. Basile with others S. But can you confirme your opinion by any reason M. Yea by twaine And the first is that this exposition doth very well agree with Moses woordes and order and againe that it seemeth to be plainly confirmed by this woord Beeginning and the signification therof For a beeginning is sayd in comparison of other thinges And therefore to the intent hee might shewe how all other thinges were made afterwarde out of those twayne Moses plainly vseth this preface to wit that the same heauen and the same earth were created in the beeginning that is to saye beefore all the other woorkes that God made and also to the vse of all the other that is to saie from whence afterward the residue were taken and as it were made The very footsteppes as it were of whiche opinion howbeeit the trueth beeyng now and then manifestly intercepted do appeare to be exstant in Hesiodus in his Theogonia and Ouid also in that place of the firste booke of his Metamorphosis which is so well knowne Beefore the Sea and Earth c. This reason also may bee alleaged that the thing itself and specially
the earth is thus described vnto vs and is called by Moses Tohu and Bohu whereby it appeareth that there was a certein Masse stuffe and matter prepared by GOD for the world that should afterwarde bee made whiche was then firste onely and not prepared from euerlasting Yea it cannot bee denied but that at that tyme there was some confusion euen in heauen when as the heauenly and earthly substances were not as yet distinguished separated one from another whiche at length was brought too passe And that also there was no beutie nor brightnes as yet in heauen neither was there any light shining therein Howbeeit that confusion was greater vpon the earth And therefore in respect thereof it was called Tohu and Bohu The xxii Chapter The matter of Earthly thinges of what sorte it was and how commodiously by God prepared S. TEll mee then I praye you what these wordes Tohu and Bohu doe signifie M. First they signifie some vnformed rude confused thing but yet apt and disposed to admitte and receiue fourme and shape And therefore the scripture vseth this kinde of speache when it will signifie some vnpolished and vndigested thyng as it appeareth in Isay the 34. chapter and 11. verse and the 40. chapter and 17. verse Wherefore such was the shape of the earth at that time as for the most part the Poete Ouid expresseth in these woordes For where was earth was sea and aire so was the earth vnstable The aire all darke the sea likewise to beare a ship vnable No kinde of thing had proper shape but eche confounded other c Moreouer as ther are two chiefe kindes of althings one heauenly the other earthly euen so at the beginninge God created two sortes of matter God I say who knewe well ynough of what and how manifolde natures the thinges should bee that hee would make and did theÌ„ make but preparation for them For heauen was prepared as a perfect and heauenly matter of the heauenly partes of the worlde And the earth of the earthly which earth at that time moiste wet moorishe ouer which the water was spread abroad for this cause as it is writen in the 104. Psalme and 6. verse that there shoulde bee then onely one bodye extant consisting of two elementes And as for heauen Moses tarieth lesse time in the declaration therof what manner a thinge it was at that time for that it was a thing better formed and compounded But in discribinge the state of the earth hee vseth moe woordes For hee calleth that first and material earth Tohu and Bohu that is to say a certeine confused masse such an one as wee must needes imagine it to haue been if a man will in minde take from it that bewtie and order which the Lorde added vnto it afterwarde S. What therefore doeth this worde Tohu signifie in the Scriptures M. That which wee call emptie and desolate to wit that wherefore there is no vse commoditie neither bringeth fruite nor yeldeth profit and to bee shorte that is woorth nothinge Whereby it commeth to passe that this woorde is many tymes translated for Nothing as in Iob the 26. chapter and the 7. verse and in Isay the 24. Chapter the 10. and 40. verses a litle before the ende Wherefore the force and signification of this woorde Tohu excludeth that commoditie whiche at this present wee receiue out of the earth S. But what signifieth Bohu M. The same amonge the Hebrues that wee call vnshapen and vnformed and that is vnshapen from whiche all distinction order apte and conuenient placing of the partes is absent and that which representeth to the beholders nothing but confusion and horrour and yet notwithstanding this wanted not all forme as hauing a name and beeing called the earth And thus is it taken in Isay the 29. Chapter and 21. verse S. You tell mee of a merucilous strainge beginnyng and matter whiche GOD made for the creatyng of the worlde M. And suche maner of thyng it was needefull it should bee bothe that wee might the better thereby vnderstande the mighty power of our great and good God who as S. Paule saieth in the 2. to the Corinthians the 4 chapiter and 5. verse hath brought forthe so wonderfull a beautie and light and coÌ„moditie out of so great confusion and darkenesse of all thinges and also that that thing whiche was first ordeined to bee as it were the matter receiuer and mother of sundrie fourmes ought to bee suche a maner of thing Although I confesse that the earth had it owne proper fourme from the verie first moment of the creation thereof but yet suche an one in respect whereof wee take it for a matter vnto other thinges that might afterward receiue other fourmes And therefore you see how fairely and plainly this matter this earth as it is declared is prepared and disposed to receiue afterward the fourmes of thinges in it ¶ The .xxiii. Chapter Why the deapthes of waters couered this matter and yearth S. WHy so M. Bicause it is saied that at that tyme the deapthes and Pooles of waters were mingled with the same earth S. This encreaseth the horrible shewe of that so greate a confusion M. You saie true but Gods power thereby is the more declared Howbeit this coâ—unixtion of the water and earth togither was verie necessarie vnto this that wee speake of to wit that the earth should bee a good commodious and well prepared matter for all earthly thinges whiche it pleased God should rise out of it S. Expounde your owne woordes more plainly M. It behooued that the seede and matter of all thinges should bee apte to bee fourmed pliant and tractable whiche in the earth could not bee without moisture Wherefore the earth whiche of it owne nature is a drie and hard thing not cleauyng togither and not apt to bee drawne forthe in length or breadth vnlesse it bee made suche and tempered with some moisture that maie mollisie it and binde it togither had water ioyned with it And therefore that huge multitude of waters whiche is called the deapthes was created and comprehended in the same body vnder whiche the earth vnshapen was concluded and laye hid Wherby it appeareth that this whole masse was a greater Chaos more difficult to bee manifested out of whiche notwithstandyng God hath brought forthe so greate beautie order brightnesse comelinesse yea and that moste comely All whiche thinges I would in long discourse prooue too haue been of necessitie in the firste matter yea and that by the auctoritie of the Prophane Philisophers them selues vnlesse the place of scripture did confirme it plainly enough S. How M. Moses saieth and darknesse was vppon the deapthes and the Spirite of God mooued vppon the waters Genesis the first chapter and 2. verse so that wee are enforced to defende twoo poinctes whiche make for my side againste the opinions of all the Philosophers The firste is that the matter of all the woorkes whiche God made afterwarde was
and trembling Against whom Father Ireneus writeth cloquently and sharply in his 2. booke and 3. chap. But now that I may answere and alleage that which belongeth to this question I say that the Lorde who made all thinges to the intent hee might make the ritches of his glorie and power knowne would specially reueale hymself in creatyng the world by this meanes and maner and by vsing the same to that purpose Wherefore like as it was the parte of a moste wise God to finde out and choose the way that he thought most conuenient to reueale himselfe so is it likewise our duetie too allowe reuerence and adore the same that hee hath chosen For faithe ought to bee the rule and leader of our mindes to vnderstande these woorkes of God by whiche vnlesse wee followe wee shall conceiue nothing holsomly or profitably in all this whole woorke of God bee it neuer so wide and beautifull For as it is writen in the 11. chapt and 3. verse to the Hebrues By faith we vnderstand that the world was made And therefore wee ought not to followe the reason of our owne braines in defining these matters S. But doth not this mention whiche is made of darkenesse which was spread ouer the first matter coÌ„firme Aristotles opinion concerning priuation whiche hee maketh to bee the thirde beeginning of all naturall thinges in his 1. booke of Physikes Fye awaye with this Priuation as a dreame or dotage in respect of a beeginning of the world For how can a Priuation whiche is nothing bee called the cause of a thing as though a man would defend that fyre were the cause of cold Moreouer Aristotles PriuatioÌ„ sticketh fast infused in the matter but the darknesse whereof Moses speaketh was without the bodie of the matter and brought no commoditie to the taking of a fourme which Aristotles priuation doth yea the darkenesse rather tooke away al hope of receiuing fourme so that Aristotles opinion is quite repugnant to Moses The xxv Chapcer Why the spirite of God was vpon this mole and matter S. YOu haue discoursed of the firste matter of this world and of the wouÌ„derful confusion therof or as I may call it troubling togither declare now why Moses speaketh of the spirite of God. M. For many causes specially for three Firste that the creation of the world might bee vnderstoode not only to bee the woorke of the Father and of the Sunne but also of the holy ghost who is likewise in person distinct from them twaine Howbeit if wee consider more narrowly of the woord The spirit of GOD noteth vnto vs in that place not the third person in Trinitie whiche is infinite and comprehended in no place but onely a certein effect and power and presence which reuealed and manifested it selfe there But it is coÌ„mon in the scripture that the giftes and tokens of the holy Ghoste are taken for the holy Ghoste himselfe and when they are recited hee likewise is vnderstoode to bee there by his owne special meanes as appeareth in the 3. chap. of S. Matthewe because wee cannot know hym any other way than through those his effectes and giftes Whererefore the Spirite of God had also his owne proper function and office openly and distinctly in the creation of this world Secondly that wee might know by what power and spirite that first mole whiche was so greate was at the beeginning susteined and helde vp Truely not of it self neither by the waters that were round about it neither by the darknesse that was vppon it whiche rather couered that firste matter whiche was now a growing as it were in a wombe and made it an vntimely fruite but by the almightie spirite of God whiche susteineth and quickneth all thinges by his diuine power by whom that huge and vnprofitable mole of earth and water subsisted flourished was quickned was susteined was reteined and as I may saye made aliue to the ende wee should ascribe all these thinges and their vertues onely to the glorie of God. S. How prooue you that M. For that all thynges at this present doe subsiste and are susteined by the spirite of God although now thei haue gotten their peculiare force and nature and yet were not destitute thereof at that tyme as it is written in the 146. Psalme and 5. verse and the 139. and 7. verse Likewise in the 1. to Timothe the 6. Chapter and 13. verse and Actes the 1. chapter the 28. verse S. What is the third reason M. To the ende it might bee the better declared by what meanes moouing and proceeding all thinges were by God drawne foorth and framed out of that firste matter and mole Euen as wee see at this day that the firste Seeâ—es of thinges after that once they bee sowne by Gods power are not onely susteined but also nourished quickned and made warme and so doe burgein and sendfoorth that bodie which naturally they conteined with in theÌ„ so was it in y first matter of all thinges so that the same Spirite by his power did susteine and nourishe the first seedes of thinges and now also continually mooueth the same howbeit that same action was then more manifestly declared in that there was not as yet any ordinarie vertue of engendring or bringing foorth engraffed into things by the word of God for that was giuen afterwarde And therefore the spirite of GOD manifested himself mightily in those thinges and nourished that mole Whiche thing Moses also teacheth plainly in that kind of phrase which hee vseth S. Expounde your saying more euidently M. Moses woordes do not onely signifie this which I say but plainely declare it S. What woordes bee they M. These that folowe and the spirite of God mooued itselfe vppon the top of the waters S. What is the meaning of those woordes M. To wit that the Spirite of God had giuen a lyuely force vnto that greate mole not onely by whiche it should exist susteine and as it were beare vp it selfe but also that it ingraffed engendred raised vp in it a â—ertâ—uâ—e vertue where by it should afterwarde waxe hot as it were to conceiue and to bringe foorth For the Hebrue woorde Merachephet signifieth both those thinges not onely I saye to susteine and mooue but also to nourish as birdes do nourish their youÌ„g ous also to giue force to wax warme to moue it self Deuteron the 32. chapter and 11. verse which Sainet Paule seemeth to translate to cherish to y Ephesians y 5. chapter and 29. verse Likewyse as the same Spirite of GOD is sayde in the 139. and 7. verse to woorke and to bee sent foorth to the intent that at thys present also things may bee ingeÌ„dered brought foorth Who if hee shoulde cease or bee taken away nothing would grow although the seedes of theÌ„ were sowne and men labored and toyled all that they coulde but woulde lye choaked within the bowels of the earth wombes of their mothers S. But why is the action and woorking of
elemētare part of the world are the materiall causes of those thinges whiche are heare engendred Wherefore they be in the things doe constitute and make their substance which vse and functiō the woord element when it is properly taken doth signifie S. How farre doth eche of these regions extend which bee the farthest endes and boundes of them both M. I will nowe touche them in fewe woordes and at an other tyme perhapes declare them more at large Some determine the ethereall and heauenly region from the highest heauen vnto the circle of the Moone And the elementare from that place whiche is vnder this circle sphere vnto the lowest center of the earth Howbeit othersome suppose rather that the Moone belongeth to the elementare and earthly region of the woorlde concerning which varictie of mens opiniōs reade Plutarches booke of the face whiche appeareth in the globe of the Moone Howbeit I haue alwayes thought the first opinion to bee truest S. What thincke you then of that generall diuision of thinges whereby all thinges that are in this worlde are diuided not into two partes but into foure generall kindes to wit of thinges that are in heauen vppon the earth vnder the earth and in the sea as it is to bee seene in the Reuelat. the 5. chapter and 13. verse And Sainct Paule likewise hath plainly distinguished three kindes of things to wit of heauen of the earth and of vnder the earth To the Philip. the 2. chapter and 20. verse M. Those generall diuisiōs of things wherof you spake and whatsoeuer other there bee may easily bee reuoked vnto these two generall kindes of thinges which I proposed For that which is called the earthly and elementare Region comprehendeth all thinges that are vpon the earth and in the earth in the waters yea those things also that are called things vnder the earth whiche for the most part are none other in the Scripture than the things that are in the sea as it apeareth by the interpretatiō which God himself made in the 20. chap. of Exodus and 4. verse And the ethereall region conteineth all things that are called heauenly The xxix Chapter Of the East West North and South partes of the worlde S. DIscourse now of that kinde of partes whi che you termed distinguishing and not constituting partes of the worlde M. These bee foure in number called thus in the Hebrue tongue Quedem Iamin Tsaphon Negeb or Iamita and amonge vs thus East West North and South all whiche Sainet Augustine thinketh to bee comprehended and signified by this woorde Adam applying the Hebrue woorde to the Greeke S. But what was the cause and reason of fyrst deuising these names M. It is not needefull to seeke out the causes and reasōs of the Greeke and Latine woords For they are commonly knowne And as for the Hebrue woords this I thinke is the reason of them The East is called Quedem bicause it is the firste or foremost parte of the worlde The west Iamin which signifieth the sea bycause in the West part of the worlde lieth the great sea which is called Mare Mediteraneum the midlande sea The North Tsaphon for that that part of the worlde was hid and vnknowne to the Hebrues in respect of the regions of the earth and of the people with whō they had no trafycque nor dealinge bicause of the distance of place beetweene them So that the case stoode contrarie with them and vs nowe who dayly beholde the North stare and poale And as for the South it is alwaies hidden from vs The South is called by them Negeb bycause that quarter of the worlde is drie barrein and burnt with the perpetuall heate and skorching of the Sunne or it may bee called Iamin the firste sillable beeing long that thereby it may differ from the fyrst Iamin whiche hath the fyrste syllable shorte bycause that when wee looke into the East y South is on our right hand not on our left S. Where doth the scripture make mentiō of these foure quarters of the worlde M. Almost in infinite places of whiche wee will alledge these few Genesis the 13. chap. and 14. verse and the 28. chap. 14. verse Psal 107. and 3. verse Isay y 47. chap. and 5. and 6. verses Psal the 75. and 7. verse S. Why do you call these onely distinguishing partes M. Bicause wee obserue them onely for the vse and commoditie of men S. For what commoditie M. Specially for foure whereof two do appertain to the publike and common vse of all men and other twoo do concerne the priuate commodity of euery place and countrey S. Declare this more at large M. This distinction of the quarters of the worlde was necessarie for the vse of man for two causes The first to the ende that the nations and people of this world might be distinguished one frō another wherof we say some dwel East some west some north some south Moreouer to obserue the course of the Sūne whose benefit al nations do enioye who rising in the East goeth by the south vntill at length he cōmeth into the West And finally to declare the force originall of the windes all which cannot possibly bee vnderstood and obserued vnlesse these foure quarters of the worlde bee distinguished And as touching priuat vse also it was necessarie that they should bee distinct First to the entent that the limites and situation of euery kingdom people and countrie may be discribed And also that it might bee signified and set foorth where the boundes and endes are of the houses fendes and places of euery territorie and so thereby in the ende all strife and contention bee taken from among priuate men concerning the boundes of their landes S. I vnderstād what you say But what are these regiōs distinct by nature or rather are they fantasied by the opiniō of men so that euerie priuate people or man may wheresoeuer hee will make East West North and South For that region of heauen and earth which is called by the Hebrues Tsaphon that is to say hidden and by vs the North the same is oftentimes vnto vs wide playne and open to bee seen like as that region of Heauen whiche was vnknowen too the Jewes is vnto all the Northren people And contrariwise the Southren Region of Heauen and the Poale of the worlde whiche was seen of them is hidden from vs as is also the Starre called Canopus with suche other Moreouer that parte of the worlde whiche is on the right hand to vs is oftentimes on the lefte hand to others whereof came that whiche Virgill spake of the Articke Poale This top ouer our heades aloft remaineth still in fight The other black Styx seeth below and ghostes that dwell in night And that saying also of the Poet Lucane Arabians you now are come into a strangie land Much woundring not to see thee shadowes fall on your left hand with other suche like to that purport M. No
truely For these quarters of the world bee by nature determined forasmuche as it can not bee Easte but where the Sunne riseth neither West but where hee goeth downe Neither North or South bee appointed but in plaine contrarie partes of the worlde the Northe where the Northren people dwell and South in the contrarie part And although wee doc here vse these woordes the rising and setting of the Sunne generally and strictly and not for anie one precise part or point in heauen for the Sunne riseth mone place in the Winter in another in y Spring and in another in Summer notwithstanding hee riseth alwaies in one certein place of the world neither doth he passe y determinate bounds which the Lorde hath appointed vnto hym too keepe his course in throughout the whole yere Wherefore this distinction of the partes of the world consisteth not in the opinion of men or at euerie mans pleasure but is defined and limited by nature true separation and experience S. Concerning those fiue quarters and zones which the Astronomers doe describe in heauen and vppon the earth of whiche Virgill hath writen thus Fiue zones there bee whiche Heauen whole deuide and that whiche followeth Again so many coastes there are vpon the earth below Whereof the middle vnhabitable is it so with heat doth glowe And twayne are drenched deepe in snow wherof the one lieth to the Northren Poale the other to the Southren as for the middie ones betweene them both he placed And with iust temperature of heate and cold hee interlaced and therefore are called habitable tell mee what is your opinion M. Although the scripture doe not so plainly distinguishe them yet it calleth one of them Arets and the earth the other Tebet and the habitable worlde Isay the 33. chapter 1. verse and the 38. and 11. verse wherby it is declared that certeine Regions of this worlde are more commodiously and commonly inhabited forasmuch as wee dauy see that the extreame force of cold and heate are many tymes intollerable vntoo men Psalme 149. the 17. verse and Psalme 91. and 6. verse and Psalme 121. and 6. verse Wherefore experience teaâ—â—th this to bee true neither doe I thinke that this partition is too vee reiected for that it serueth too some vse howbeit these places beeing searched out by the newe nauigations vndertaken by men of our age may bee the more commodiously knowne ¶ The. xxx Chapter Where these positions are to bee found high low beefore behind on the right hand and on the left S. DIscourse nowe concernyng the sundrie differences of situations and places whiche are noted and marked in this worlde M. Thei are in number sixe and thei are taken from those three dimensions whiche properly beelong vnto bodies To wit high lowe beefore beehinde on the right hande on the left S. How so M. For that is proper vnto euery naturall bodie too bee long broad deepe or thicke As for those deliniations whiche are plaine and flat thei are not bodies but superficies that is to saie vppermoste faces and therefore one of those three dimensions is noted and taken by a right line But there bee twoo extreme partes or endes of euery streight line Wherefore there bee sixe extreame partes or endes of those three dimensions or streight lines whiche doe distinguishe and make so many sundrie differences of place or situation And in lengthe wee terme one ende highe another lowe In breadth wee place those on the right hande and on the lefte hande In deapthe or thicknesse beefore and beehinde Howbeeit these twoo latter differences can not bee obserued in euery kinde of bodie but onely in that whiche is called the bodie of a liuyng Creature and is endued with sense S. How commeth this about that you recken onely thre dimensions of a bodie and S. Paule reciteth fower to wit length breadth height and deapth to the Ephesians the 3. chapter and 18. verse likewise in Iob the 11. chapiter and 8. and 9. verses the same are recited M. You saie truely Howbeeit these twoo deapthe and heighth are indeede and subiect all one and in reason onely distinguished S. Declare this more at large M. Like as it is the very same waie saith Aristotlâ— which leadeth from Athenes to Thebes and from Thebes to Athenes and like as in one and the self same ladder and staiers indeede and in respecte of the subiecte the goyng vp and the goyng doune is all one the goyng vp if a man climbe from the lowest step to the higstest the goyng doune if hee descende from the highest step too the lowest So in verie deede are highth and deapth but it is then called highth when a man looketh vp from the lowest to the highest and deapth when hee looketh doune from the top to the bottome so that we vse but one kinde for bothe these dimensioÌ„s And thus it commeth to passe that there bee onely sixe differences of place and not eight S. Maie there then or ought any regions in this world bee called on the right hande on the lefte hande firste last high or lowe M. Uerely if I should stande to declare how diuerse the opinions of men bee touchyng this poincte onely â–ª I should not onely bee wearisome but also farre passe the boundes of mine argument whiche I haue taken in hande For Astronomers doe otherwise and in other places appointe them and Southsaiers otherwise and Historicians otherwise To bee short eeuen in that verie pointe sundrie nations are of sundrie opinions as for example the Egiptians who will haue the East to bee the forepart of the worlde the West the hinder parte The North the right side and the South the left as Plutarche writeth in Iside contrarie vntoo that whiche Nature and common course of all thynges doeth admit The Easte is the right side of the worlde saieth Aristotle and the Weste the lefte for the worlde mooueth eeuen like a man that beeginneth at the right hande to set forthe vpon his iourney on whose right side then is the Northe and the South parte of the worlde on his lefte Varro in his 6. booke de lingua Latina is of an other opinioÌ„ to wit that the East is on the lefte hande the Weste on the right the Southe right beefore and the Northe beehinde But the Scripture saieth otherwise S. What saieth the Scripture M. It constantly calleth the Easte the fore parte of the world the West the hinder the South the right side and the North the left S. How prooue you that M. First out of that place of Iob whiche is in the 23. chapiter 8. and 9. verses and bicause it followeth necessarily that if you make the East the foremoste part of the worlde that then the Northe multe bee on the left hande and the South on the right it plainly appeareth vnto him whosoeuer shall looke into the East And likewise Dionisius Halicarnasseus teacheth that the same is necessarily gathered S. Why doeth the Scripture make the Easte to bee the
them somewhat and sum while that they cannot plainely be seene of many Howbeit they do not altogither obscure or wholy take awaie y appearing of those the vertues of God which he hath imprinted in his woorkes And moreouer forasmuch as these confusions as you terme them are the effectes of his iust iudgement if wee so consider of them as wee ought surely they shall the more set foorth the power and wisedome of God and not obscure it The xxxii Chapter What knowledge of God may bee had by the beeholdinge of this worlde S. BUT that knowledge of God which maye bee hadde by beeholding the worlde and the visible creatures is it sufficient of it selfe to get the perfect vnderstanding of him or rather doeth it conteine and deliuer vnto vs certeine principles thereof which wee must more perfectly and at full afterward seeke and learne by some other meanes to wit out of the woorde of God which is written and reuealed vnto vs For by the framinge and creation of the world wee cannot knowe that Christ is our Sauiour and mediatour vnto God for vs. M. You saye well For Sainct Paule aunswereth in the Epistle to the Romanes the 1. chapter and 20. verse that although the knowledge which is had by the worlde bee trewe yet is it not fully sufficient that thereby wee may vnderstande anye thing concerning our saluation through Christ but that it is in this respecte profitable that therby wee are made vnaccusable For it teacheth vs that God is our Creatour but it is not able to enfourme vs y he is also our redeemer thorow Christe For wee are not able to atteine to that knowledge without the preachinge of the Gospell Wherefore wee must not begin with that knowledge of God whereby wee vnderstande that hee is our sauiour but rather that hee is our creatour whereat wee must indeede beeginne and consequently proceed vnto better and higher things For the Heathen people Philosophers who chiefly folowed this knowledge of Naturall thinges neyther perceiued they the reason of mans saluation which is in Christ onely neither were thei theÌ„selues saued bicause they lacked faith It profiteth notwithstanding and it mutch profiteth too that wee seeke the true God that hath created all these thinges and when wee haue founde hym that wee woorship hym and praye vnto hym as farre as hee shall giue vs grace so to doe This much at the leastwise hee wringeth from vs whether wee will or no that he ought both to bee sought and worshipped who hath first created and now gouerneth al this world Wherfore if we neither seeke him neither woorship hym hee maketh vs vnexcusable S. But there bee many that either haue not seene at all that way of finding out God or when they were entred haue not perceiued that glorie of God whereof you spake or else by how muche the more they haue profited in the knowledge of this world and naturall thinges so muche the more securely and boldly haue they dispised God like as in times past did the Epicurian Philosophers and at this day also to many doe M. These are the greate imperfections and vices of men whiche you speake of and a sharpe accusation of the wonderfull frowardnes of mans nature not the woorkmans fault or want of the light of Gods glorie whiche shineth most brightly in his woorkes For that light shineth clearely enough in this world and in sutch sorte as it cannot bee put out and also is easily seene whoso will lift vp his eyes vnto it and looke vpon it For God hath engrauen in the world greate and wonderfull tokens of his goodnes power and wisedome hee layeth also beefore our eyes most manifest testimonies and documentes that may bee vnderstoode yea by the most ignorant persons Whiche whoso doeth not see let hym accuse hym selfe or his owne sluggishnes and not the hardnes of the booke which God hath sayd before our eyes or the difficultie of the style thereof or the dimnesse of the looking-glasse whiche indeede wee haue a most bright one in the contemplation of this worlde For the 19. Psalme doth sufficiently remooue this slaunder from God and his woorkmanship saiyng that hee hath founded his trueth in the heauens Psalme 89. and 3. verse Who hath distinguished and depainted with liuely colours the other argumentes and tokens of his praise in them as it were by a certein ingrauyng Therefore in that men of olde times haue not seene so manifest signes of God neither see at this day neither doe profit by them towardes the atteining of the knowledge of God it commeth by meanes of their owne fault who by reason of their sinne haue lost the true light of their myndes whiche if it had continued in the firste state of it owne creation truely then should they haue seen these signes not obscurely and fayntly but acknowledged them plainly and perfectly and confessed them too bee great and wonderfull S. How then commeth it to passe that if this world bee the lookinglasse of so great vertues in God and that so bright and so cleare why in another place is man and why also is Christ called the image of God wherin hee setteth himself downe beefore vs to bee seen and knowne It is in vaine that you tell vs of another lookinglasse if this world bee so faire an one as you make it Câ—lâ—sâ— the 1. chapter and 15. verse M. If wee saye that one thing may haue many images and that in sundrie respectes wee shall not graunt any absurditie So that although these three bee called looking glasses wherin God representeth himfelf yet thei be so called in diuerse respects with a large difference The worlde is not called the image of God which notwithstanding is verified of man Christe for the world is onely the looking glasse of Gods vertues as it is their subiect that is to say that wherein they do expresse and shew themselues by sundry meanes and effectes And man is the image of God and not onely the lookinge glasse of his power but also of his nature after a manner for man of all other creatures of the worlde commeth neerest to the nature of God and caried the very fourme of him in the light of his minde and the vprightnes of his will which was in him at his first creation But Christ who is God manifested in the fleshe who was without sinne in whome the Godhead remained who in his whole life and by al meanes shewed foorth the nature similitude fygure of God through his great power wisedome and clemencie is in a farre more excellent respect the image of God than was the first man althoughe hee were sounde and perfect Wherefore the world hath no such similitude and likelinesse with Christ who is vnto vs not onely the ymage and as it were the shadow of the goodnesse Wisedome and Power of God but also the most bright and selfesame representation of the fathers substance Hebrues the 1. chapter and 3. verse And therefore
hee is not called onely the image but also the liuely brightnesse of the Fathers glorye And yet farther to the intent it may bee the better vnderstoode what and how great the difference is wee must note that the world and man are a notable but yet a shadowed representation of those things which they do teach vs cōcerning god And Christ the expresse and liuely fourme in whose inward natural and substanciall brightnesse wee may most euidently behold the infinite power of God and incomprehensible loue towardes vs men Thus therefore when wee thincke vppon God and beholde him in all other thinges suche is our vanitie that immediatly wee decay and come to naught but when wee looke vppon him in Christ wee are quieted and stayed most firmely and substantially Wherefore there ought no comparison bee made betweene these which differ in kinde and manner of representation The xxxiii Chapter Two endes of the worlde not chiefe S. BUT bee ther not also other finall causes of the worlde M. Yeas there bee two but not chiefe S. What bee they M. The first is this to wit the vse of al men For this worlde was created for mans sake and man for god The seconde is for the Church or congregation For the worlde was created to the entent it should bee an house and dwelling place prepared for the Church and congregation that should bee hereafter where in it might remaine of it owne right which congregation God woulde establishe there and afterward bring to heauen S. Howe prooue you this M. First out of the 8. Psalme And secondly by that which S. Paule writeth to the Romanes the 4. Chapter and 13. verse The xxxiiii Chapter Of the meanes and engins whereby God raysed this so great a frame of the worlde and first of the woorde of God which was the meanes whereby this worlde was created S. HEtherto you haue declared the causes of this worlde nowe shewe the meanes and instrumentes wherby it was created And when mention is made of the creation of the woorlde some do demaunde what wedges what tooles and engins were occupied to the rearinge vp of so great a mole and they thinke themselues not satisfied vnlesse aunswere bee made vnto those doubtes of their minde M. Thei that seeke to know with what instruments this worlde was created do verie foolyshly forasmuch as this woorde create doth sufficiently declare that all this whole woorke is plainly miraculous and supernaturall For God vsed no tooles nor engins as carpenters vse to doe thereby to supplie the infirmitie of their strength But all his framing and buildinge and the woorkemanship of thys worlde doeth differ farre from all our meanes and pollices S. Tell mee then what it was M. In declaringe the meanes by which this world was created ther are foure things annexed which we must not pretermit and they perteine to the settinge foorth of Gods glory and omnipotencie wherof the fyrst is this that the worlde was created at the woorde and commaundement of God. S. Howe prooue you that M. Behold a most manifest place of the Scripture in the 33. Psalme 9. verse For hee spake and it was doone hee commaunded and it stoode fast and in the 148. Psalme and 5. verse Hee commaunded and they were created Moreouer Moses in the first chapter of Genesis beefore the creation of euery thing as they were made and created orderly in euery daye so doeth hee plainely shewe that the woord and cōmaundement of God went alwayes before And the Lorde sayde let it bee made c. Yea the Stoikes haue saide that the woorde of God was the efficient cause of the whole nature of thinges as Laertius writeth in his 7. booke in the life of Zeno. S. But there bee twoo impedementes that it can not bee so M. Which bee they S. The fyrst is that which is written in the 45. Chapter and 12. verse of Isay My handes haue stretched foorth the heauens Ergo God made not these things with his woord but with his handes M. Uerily this saiyng conteineth a most manifest Metaphore when hee attributeth handes vnto God and when in respect of the weakenesse of our vnderstanding God is cōpared to an handie craftes man which woorketh with his owne hāds the like wherof there are many authorities to be foūde in y scriptures And whereas this woorde of creating is vsed in the same place it plainly calleth vs backe vnto that diuine and extraordinarie woorke of God and to thinke vppon that meane onely which Moses hath recited M. The seconde impediment is that wheras in another place in like kind of thinges and semblable argument mention is made of the woorde of God notwithstanding Gods secret will is ment thereby whiche is not expressed in any woord or commaundemēt as in the 147. Psalme 15. and 18. verses where he speaketh of Ice Hee sendeth out his woorde and melteth it M. You say well Howbeit in Genesis the verye text also Moses minde teatheth vs that wee must say and thinke otherwise where it is plainly writen that God spake and cōmaunded that to bee which was made Wherfore the only bare and secrete will of God is not there to bee vnderstood and taken but that which is reuealed by the prolation and vtteringe of some woorde of his and commaundement Which opinion of mine is confirmed by an interpretation which the Scripture it self maketh noting that this was doone by vttering of some woorde or voyce For in the 33. Psalme and 6. verse after that it is declared that these things were made by the woorde of God for true exposition sake it is added by the spirite of his mouth For a voice is made by the breathing foorth of aire which is doone by the mouth S. But by this meanes feigning that God hath a tōgue roofe of the mouth and teeth with out whiche instruments no voyce can bee vttered you seeme to reuoke againe out of Hell the abominable errour of the Antropomorphites M. God forbid that I should thinke so wickedly of the infinite and omnipotent maiestie of god But like as the Lorde spake so as he might bee heard and vnderstoode when hee gaue the law in mount Sinai which no man can deney as likewise when hee spake to Moses whē he gaue answere by Vrim Thumim y Lord spake vttered a voice in the hearing of the people yet not withstāding we must not feigne y god hath a tongue a mouth a palate of the mouth teeth So in the beginning creation of the world when it is sayd that God spake his diuine shape was not chaunged intoo an humane fourme but it came to passe by a speciall prouidence and pollicie For the Lord tooke vpon him for a tyme suche meanes as were necessarie for the bringing foorth a cleare and audible voice wherof afterward hee left the vse S Doe you thinke then that the Lord spake plainly and distinctly M. Yea verely Howbeeit I am not ignorant what S. Augustine thinketh
by reason of impoteÌ„cie wearines or weakenesse in God that he was six dayes in making it but bicause he is most wise by most wise good reasoÌ„ he would thus finish his workes For whatsoeuer is made requireth some order in the making And order requireth distinct time and number First therfore god putteth vs in minde hereby that hee wrought not confusedly nor out of order and so consequently that wee must not meditate and thinke vpon his works lightly and as it were a farre of in general but in order seuerally and particularly of euery one Hee sheweth moreouer howe great diligence wee ought to vse in considering of them seing that hee declareth that hee paused vppon the order of his woorks by this distinctioÌ„ of the daies labours Beesides this hee declareth that wee are not able sufficiently to comprehend his workes the reason therof and manner of creating them is such and so generall that wee haue sufficient matter in them to thinke vpon and beeholde euery daye in the weeke and so throughout the whole yeare For what other thinge is a yeare than a continuall repeating of one and the selfe same weeke For there was an whole day spent in the finishinge of euery part and worke Moreouer god wold not creat the world at once but by piece meale that is to say in some space of time for he ment immediatly after the creatioÌ„ of the world to declare the state law naturall order which the things that hee had made should afterward folow to wit that by which all thinges doe require a space of time for their beeing that is to saye are brought foorth in tyme and are not perfectly growne in a moment as wee see dayely So those thinges that growe out of the earth doe at this daye keepe this order that they springe not suddeynly but by processe of time So the woman is delyuered of hir child after a certaine season so seedes growe out of the earth so trees bringe foorth their frutes and there is nothing done suddenly but wonderfull miraculously Wherfore that time of creation was the fyrst lawe of thinges that shoulde afterward growe and bee ingendred S. And why did God at length cease the seauenth day M. Bicause he would haue it so for there can be no truer reason alleaged For in that hee would haue it so the reason is good although to vs it bee vnknowne For as touching those thinges whiche are disputed by S. Ambrose im his 39. Epistle and also by S. Augustine in sundrie places and likewise by certein others and finally by the Heathen Philosophers themselues concernyng the dignitie of the seauenth number I refer them to the Mathematicians and specially to the Arithâ—meticians and Pithagorians The. xxxviii chapter Of the place wherein the world was made S. HEtherto you haue declared what y worlde is what is the cause therof and what was the maner of making it Adde hereunto also that which may bee demaunded concernyng the place tyme and state of this created world so that at length wee may conclude this whole disputation M. I will doe so if you aske mee of them all in order S. Firste therefore I demaunde concerning the place wherin the worlde is made what it was and what maner one it was M. It must needes bee that it was some voyde place whiche the Grecians call Kenos the Hebrues Tohu wherin it should be created and placed S. Why so M. For bicause if the place wherein the worlde beeyng so greate a frame was placed had bin already full of bodies there could not bee another body placed in a roomth that was full alreadie For twoo bodies cannot bee togither in one place Moreouer this whiche I say is plainly confirmed The Hebrues say out of the 26. chapter of Iob and 7. verse He stretched foorth the North vpon the void place c. Although that before this worlde was made GOD occupied that place wherein the world now standeth filled it with his power which is vnknowne to vs and in an vnspeakable maner as now also hee filleth althinges after they bee made by the vertue and meanes of his presence maiestie and power whereof God is called Megonah that is to say that filleth all thinges Deuteron the 33. chapter and 27. verse notwithstanding in respect of this filling which cummeth by the creation of thinges verily the place wherin this world now standeth was a certein voyd place S. How then will you haue that there shal bee some void place in the world against whiche thing Aristotle contendeth so mutch and experience also M. To the ende that I may cut of all occasion of the vain errours of the Valentines concernyng Bythus whom Ireneus aboundantly confuteth in his 2. booke and 4. and 7. chapters thus I say That beefore the world was made the place and space wherein it nowe standeth was voyde but since the worlde was made that it is not voyd now but full S. But doe you leaue nowe any voide place within the compasse of the worlde M. Uerily if you call that onely ful that is filled with this aire whiche wee drawe in and breath foorth there bee many places too bee called voyd For all that space of the worlde whiche is aboue the Circle of the Moone which some say is very large is void But if you call that full whiche is replenished with some bodie and nature of it owne kinde then maye I call no parte of this whole worlde voide no not so muche as that whiche the Astronomers saye is conteined within the Globe and space of the Heauens but all full and occupied Not onely bicause God made nothing in vain for that is repugnant to his wisedome but also for that the whole stretching foorth of the heauens howe big soeuer it be is an heauenly body For ther is now no effect no vse of a voide place in the nature of thinges whiche is created but there are seene daylie many and most excellent vses in this pointe I meane in that nature will haue all thinge to bee full And that indeede ther is nothing voyd and emptie both the vse of cupping glasses in Physicke also in the plucking vp of Welles and waters into high places by Pumpes and other deuises sufficiently doe teache Suche Philosophers therfore as contend that there is some void place in this world are not onely theÌ„selues voide of wit and iudgment but striue also moste manifestly against certeine experience whom therefore I iudge not too bee esteemed of ¶ The. xxxix Chapter Of the tyme wherein the worlde was made S. YOU haue spoken of the place speake now also of the tyme wherein this worlde was made M. That this worlde beegan sometyme to existe and is not eternall neither of like antiquitie with GOD not onely the Maiestie of Gods holie woorde doeth testifie but also the opinions of the moste auncient Philosophers doe declare Whoe as thei were nerer too the beeginnyng of the worlde so did thei
vpon Mundaye and so shall you haue sixe daies after which followeth the Sabbath which is the seauenth Thus First Sunday then Munday Tuesdaye Wedensday Thurseday Fryday after which followeth the Seauenth whiche are the Sabbath dayes So that the Lorde began his woorke of creating the worlde vpon Sunday which is confirmed to bee true by a counsell holdeÌ„ in Iudaea as Eusâ—bius writeth in the 5. booke of his historie and the 23. and 25. Chapters S. But in what Moneth seemeth it vnto you that the worlde was made M. I will vtter in this poinct that whiche seemeth vnto mee most likely and I craue pardon herein that no man thinke mee to bee curious notwithstanding I muste needes vtter my minde for that this question is demaunded by many Uerily it semeth vnto mee that the worlde was created in that moneth which is called by the Hebrues Tisri and is answereable partly vnto our moneth of August and partly to September for doubtles it began after the Autumnal or Haruast equinoctium So that I doe nothinge agree vnto those that write suppose that the world was made in the Moneth of March and in the Springe S. Can you confirme your opinion by any reason M. Yea and that by diuerse And not onely this that in the time of Autumne or Haruast the earth is most apt to receiue the seedes of good fruites as of Wheat and Barly and such like For at that time it seemeth most meete and fit to conceiue as in the Springe to bring-foorth fruite and in Summer to yelde them vp and as for winter then the earth digesteth and concocteth the seedes that are coÌ„mitted vnto hir and embracing them in the middes of hir bosome frameth nourisheth them as a mother doeth hir young whiche notwithstanding shee bringeth foorth in the spring tune when they bee sumwhat growne and in Summer is quite delâ—uered of them as beeinge then ripe and perfecte Wherefore the springe and Summer doe seeme rather to bee as it were midwiues to the earth than to minister vnto it any force or vertue to bringe foorth whiche vertue notwithstandinge Autumne yeeldeth vnto the earth as beeing yet mindefull of the first creation of all thinges and of hir owne bringinge foorth of all manner commodities reteininge vnto this present the force effect and power of the auncient commaundement which the Lorde enioyned at that time So y the Hebrues will haue it that this moneth Tisri shall not be so called of must or newe wine but of iuce wherof the earth is full at that season And these bee the two reasons of mine opinion The fyrst for that as the scripture teacheth in the 28. chapter and 9. verse and so folowinge of Leuiticus this moneth hath beene alwayes since the firste age of man as farre as euer there can bee had any remembrance the beeginninge of the yeare and first moneth And therefore in contractes and bargaines in coÌ„mon and priuate affaires and to bee briefe in supputation of the yeares and age of the worlde which was done by the yeares of Iubilee the yeare euer beegan in this moneth among the auntient Fathers in old time and among the Jewes and ended also in the same So that the yeares age of Adam and the residue of the Fathers whiche liued both beefore the floude and since are to bee reckened from this moneth The seconde reason is this For that the feast of Trumpettes which God commaunded to bee kept vpon the first daye of this moneth seemeth to haue beene specially instituted by God to the intente that the remembraunce of the first originall and creation of the worlde whiche was doone vppon that day might bee holily preserued continued in the Church Truely it was not in vaine that the Lord would haue that day kept holy so great honour reuereÌ„ce attributed vnto these trumpettes Instruments whiche wee reade at that time were so tossed blowne But by that great and pleasant sownd hee ment to admonish and put in remeÌ„braunce men the whole world also of their first natiuitie which as by the special prouision of God it fell vpon the firste daye of this moneth so was it godlily and reuerently renued and remembred in the Church that the world might not bee ignorant of it owne byrth daye Whereby also it came to passe that God coÌ„maunded many feastes and holidaies to bee kept in the seauenth moneth which moneth was called also Aetanim that is to saye the Moneth of strength or strong thinges 1. Kinges the 8. chap. and 2. verse Yea some saye also that our Sauiour Christ was borne the same moneth and not without some reason S. But it is saide in the 12. Chapter and 1. verse of Exodus that Nisan was the first moneth of the yeare answering vnto our monethes of March and April and falling in the Uernall or Springe equinoctium M. You say well But therevnto I answere two waies First that Nisan or March was not alwayes the beeginning of the yeere but at length after that the children of Israell returned out of Egyt in the remeÌ„brance of so great a benefite that is to say for the conseruation of the memorie of the newe founding restoaringe of that people Moreouer Nisan was not the beeginning of the yeere for all things that were done among the people of God but onely in respect of their holie festiuall daies and of the tabernacle For the tabernacle as it had it owne peculiare reuolution and differinge from the common so had it also a proper beginninge of the yeere not agreeing with the order of the Politike yeere to the intent that men mighte knowe that there was a difference too bee put beetweene the Politike and Ecclesiastical gouernment and that the reason of them both is diuerse and their nature separate and distinct S. How many yeeres doe you now accoumpt since the world was first made M. As some doe suppose since the tyme that the worlde was made vnto this present yeere 1578. wherin this booke was written are about 5298. yeeres S. Howe doe you beegin this number or by what meanes doe you gather it M. Euen by this short reckninge FroÌ„ the creation of the world vnto the generall diluge whiche happened in the daies of Noe are numbred in the Historie of the holy Scriptures 1656. yeeres And from the diluge vnto the promise whiche God made firste vnto Abraham and his departing vpon commaundment out of Vr a Citie of the Chaldees and Charris a citie of Mesopotamia are 427. yeeres And from that promise vnto the departure of the children of Israell out of the land of Egypt which was vnder Moses are 430. yeeres as it is written in the 12. chapter and 40. verse of Exodus And from the departure out of the land of Egypt vnto the beginning of the building of Salomons temple which was begun the fourth yeere of Salomons reigne are 480. yeeres as it appeareth the 1. Kinges and 6. chap. And from that tyme
not of his woorke And nowe bycause wee are come to the day of Gods rest let vs reste also in this place and make an ende of this disputation whiche wee erewhile began So much as may seeme can bee saide generally concernyng the creation of the world and the first beeginning of all things apperteining vnto Christian Naturall Philosophie wee haue heere for the most part declared And wee giue thankes vnto God for that hee hath giuen vs a minde and abilitie to write those things which wee haue heere declared FINIS The Table What Naturall Philosophie is and howe manye kindes there bee thereof Cap. 1. follio 1 Whether Naturall Philosophie bee meete for a Christian cap. 2. fol. 2. From whence the knowledge of the Generall naturall Philosophie is to bee had most safely ▪ cap. 3. fol. 6 The difference beetweene Christian and Heathen Naturall Philosophie cap. 4 fol. 10 What and howe great the certentie is of the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie cap. 5. fol. 13 The endes of the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie cap. 6. fol. 14 The subiect of the knowledge of Naturall Philosophie is a creature visible and that can bee seene and first how farre and in what respect the world is a certaine vniuersalitie vnto thē al. ca. 7. fol. 15 What the worlde is cap. 8. fol. 20 Whether the worlde may truely and Christianly bee called an vniuersalitie cap. 9. fol. 22 VVhether the worlde and all thinges that are conteined therin bee sounde bodies or shadowes onely cap. 10. fol. 23 Whether there bee one worlde onely or many cap. 11. fol. 25 Whether this worlde bee finite ▪ cap. 12. fol. 27 Whether the world bee sphericall and rounde cap. 13. fol. 28 Whether the worlde haue one onely soule cap. 14. fol. 29 That this worlde was made in time is not eternall cap. 15. fol. 31 That the worlde came not of it selfe cap. 16. fol. 34 Of the causes of the worlde and first of the cause efficient thereof which is God not Angels nor Diuels cap. 17. fol. 35 That the worlde and all things that are therein were made by God of nothinge and not onely decked foorth or set in order or brought foorth out of a certeine disordred heape or matter whiche was extant beefore cap. 18. fol. 38 Of the end for which God created made this world ca. 19. fo 44 This worlde cannot bee called the Sunne of god cap. 20. fol. 45 What God created first to bee the matter for thinges that were created afterwarde cap. 21. fol. 48 The matter of earthly thinges what maner of thing it was and how commodiously of God prepared cap. 22. fol. 49 Why the deapths of waters couered this matter earth ca 23. fo 48 VVhy there was darkenesse vppon the face of the same mole and matter cap. 24. fol. 51 VVhy the Spirite of God was vppon this mole and matter cap. 25. fol 52 Of the matter of heauenly things that are visible cap. 26. fol. 56 VVhat is the fourme of the worlde cap. 27. fol. 57 Of the partes of the worlde and first of the Ethereall and Elementare region cap. 28. fol. 57 Of the East VVest North and South partes of the worlde cap. 29. fol. 59 VVhere these positions are to bee founde in the world high low beefore behind on the right hand and on the left cap. 30. fol. 61 The chiefe ende of creation of the worlde is the glorye and knowledge of God the creatour cap. 31. fol. 64 VVhat knowledge of God maye bee had in the beeholdinge of this worlde cap. 32. fol. 67 Two endes of the worlde not cheife cap. 33. fol. 69 Of the meanes engins wherby God raised this so great a frame of the worlde and first of the worde of God which was the meanes whereby this worlde was created cap. 34. fol. 70 Of the light whiche was vsed at the creation of the worlde cap. 35. fol. 72 That God made this worlde without any paine or wearisomnesse vnto him selfe cap. 36. fol. 73 The world was created by partes and not all at once cap. 37. fol. 73 Of the place wherein the worlde was made cap. 38. fol. 74 Of the time wherin the worlde was made cap. 39. fol. 76 God created this worlde good cap. 40. fol. 80 VVhat maner one this world is now at this present after sinne cap. 41. fol. 82 From whence poyson of hurtfull thinges sprang in the worlde cap. 42. fol. 83 Why thīgs that wer created are plainly said to be good ca. 43. fo 84 VVhether in the first creation of all thinges God made twoo Contraries cap. 44. fol. 85 In what sense it is said that God rested after the creatiō of the world cap. 45. fol. 86 FINIS Imprinted at London for Andrew Maunsell in Paules Church-yard at the signe of the Parret 1578.