the Lordes daie Here you cauill that there is no mention of Saturdaie or sondaie much lesse of celebration of either and least of all of the changeing of the Sabbath into an other daie But if it please your Censurship are you ignorant what day of the weeke is called dies Dominicus the Lordsday whether saturdaie or sondaie if it be sondaie as al professors of Christes name confesse here is as much mention thereof as is needfull for the daie into which the change is made Or if that be not sufficient you maie haue further Act. 20. 7. 1. Cor. 16. 2. And whie is the first of the Sabbath called the Lordes daie but in respect of the celebration there of in honour of the redemption of the world by Christ For otherwise all daies of the weeke are the Lordes daies in respect of their creation Thirdlie seeing the Lordes daie was one daie in the weeke vsed for the assemblie of the Church for their spirituall exercises of Religion it is certaine that the change of the Iewish Sabbath was made into that daie except you would be so waywatd to saie there were two daies in euerie weeke appointed by God to be celebrated whereas the lawe of God requireth but one and giueth libertie of bodelie exercise in sixe daies So that the change of the Sabbath daie is sufficientlie prooued out of the Scripture into the Lordes daie The sixt point is about foure Gospells and the Epistle to the Romanes which Master Charke saith to be prooued out of the scripture but yet he quoteth no place of scripture where onelie he saith the inscription expresseth the names of the writers But what a mocker is this you saie Are the bare names of the Apostles sufficient to prooue that they were written by them who can prooue by scripture that these names are not counterfet as in the Epistle to the Laodiceans in the Gospells of Bartholomew and Thomas c. But abide you sir your question hath two branches the one that the 4. Go spells are true Gospells the other that the epistle to the Romanes was written by Saint Paul and not that to the Laodiceans To the former it is answered that they are prooued by other vndoubted bookes of the scripture both of the olde testament and the new secing they declare that to be fullfilled of Christ which was spoken in the lawe in the Prophetes and in the Psalmes To the other it is answered that admitting the Epistle to the Romanes to be scripture the inscription of his name is sufficient to prooue that it was written by Saint Paull And so of therest Although the name of the writer is not materiall vnto saluation when the booke is receiued to be Canonicall as diuers bookes of scripture are receiued whose writer is vnknowne That Epistle which is called to the Laodicians is not receiued and therefore the inscription is vnsufficient as the Gospelles of Bartholomew and Thomas and such like which are knowne to be countefet by the dissent they haue from the other canonicall scriptures Whereas you require one place of Scripture to prooue all the foure Gospelles to be canonicall you declare your wrangling and wayward spirit But name you anie one point of Doctrine writen in anie of those foure Gospells and the same shall be aduouched by other textes of scripture and so maie eucrie point conteined in them if neede were But you affirme that Origen saith he reiecteth the Gospell of Saint Thomas onelie for that the tradition of the Church receiued it not Which is false He saith he hath read the Gospell after Thomas after Mathias and manie other Sed in his omnibus nihil aliud probamus niss quod Ecclesia idest quatuor tantùm euangelia recipienda But in all these we allowe nothing els but that which the Church alloweth that is that onelie foure Gospells are to be receiued In these wordes he affirmeth that he approoueth the iudgment of the Church he saith not that the iudgement or traditions of the Church was the onelie cause whie he reiected those Gospells for he said before they were receiued of heretikes and wherefore but in maintenance of their heresie which is contrarie to the holie scriptures That all counterfet Go spells were reiected by the Church it is confessed but the Church had this iudgement of discretion confirmed by the canonical scriptures against which Epiphanius saith nothing But when Faustus the Manichie denied the Gospell of Saint Mathew saie you saith not S. Augustine Mathaei Euangelium probatum aduersus Faustum Manichaeum per traditionem The Gospell of Mathew was alleged against Faustus the Manichie by tradition August lib. 28. Cont. Faust. c. 2. If you aske me I saie no he hath no such wordes Yet doth he auouch the Gospell of Saint Mathew in that Chapter by testimonie of the Church from the Apostles by continuall succession euen vnto his time against the Maniches but in far other words then you haue set downe in steed of Saint Augustines wordes by which the reader maie once against perceiue how impudentlie and ignorantlie you ailedge whatsoeuer the note booke which was neuer of your own gatheriug because you vnderstood it not did minister vnto you For these are the wordes of the collector of your notes not of S. Augustine Maie not the papists haue great ioie of such a Cenfure defender Yet you triumph like a Iustie champion and aske what can be more euident then all this to prooue our opinion of the necessitie of tradition to confound the fonde madnes of this poore Minister Alas poore defender what waightie euidencethou hast brought to prooue the necessity of tradition which prooueth thee to be a blind beggerlie yet a bolde brocher of other mens notes which thou vnderstandest not thy selfe The seuenth doctrine which is required to be prooued out of the scripture is that God the father begat his sonne onelie by vnderstanding him-selfe Here Master Charke in steede of these darke wordes out of Thomas how the father begat the sonne wisheth cleare and perfect wordes in so high a mysterie which you saie are plaine and vsuall to those which haue studied any thing in diuinitie As though there were no diuinitie in the holie scriptures and so many of the auncient fathers which haue neither this question nor these wordes but that al diuinity were included in the brest of Thomas Aquinas and such doctors as he was That he quoteth a place or two of the scripture to prooue that Christ was the onelie begotten sonne of God you make smal account of seeing the question is of the māner how this generation maybe which the Church de fendeth against the aduersaries And here you insult against M. chark as ignorant in those high points of diuinitie whereas Catholiks know what the Church hath determined herein against heretikes and infidels as though either of both cared for the Churches determination if the one were not vanquished by scripture the other by right reason
from part of his sinne and bound in the other part but he that forgiueth the guilt and faulte of sinne which the Prophet calleth iniquitatem peccati he releaseth no daies or yeares but he forgiueth the verie fault it selfe Neither is there any eternall punishment which can be eased by any number of daies were they neuer so many Take you from an infinite and endlesse thing how much you list and it shal be eternall still Then it is onelie temporal punishment which before God and the world is limited by certaine proportion of the wickednes committed and of that satisfaction which gods iustice requireth at the partie penitent which can be released by daies or yeares in part or in whol And therefore the Popes or Bishops Pardons onelie forgiue temporall punishment enioyned or at the left due for answere of Gods righteousnes to be enioyned Wherein also the Magistrates of the Church haue such care and consideration that they remit not so much as any one daie of enioyned penance or deserued punishment but by recompence of the lacke of mans satisfying with some portion of Christes abundant desertes applied by the vse of their keies to the reliefe of such as doe lacke and for their zeale and deuotion are not worthie to receiue benefit by the singular treasure of the common wealth to helpe them in their priuate neede But for this matter looke for more toward the end of the booke FVLKE This first reason is verie feeble some pardons haue this clause de poenitentys iniunctis of penance inioyned therfore in al other pardons in which is expresse mention not onelie of penance inioyned but also of pardoning of sins either al or some part of them the temporall punishment onely is meant to be pardoned The second reason is as good Sinne is vndiuisible and so is the punishment for sinne and eternall therefore it is onelie temporall punishment which is released by daies and yeares But what saie you then to moste full pardons of all sinne and all punishments where there is no limitation of daies nor yeares what saie you to the release of the third part or the seuenth part of all sinnes beside many thousand yeares of punishment remitted as I haue shewed before in the Pardons of Alexander the fourth confirmed by Pope Leo the tenth within these eightie yeares The third argument is that the magistrates of the Church remit not so much as one daie of punishment due to Gods iustice for sinne but by recompensing the want of mans satisfaction with some portion of Christs abundant desertes applied by the vse of the keies c. But what intollerable blasphemie is this to applie the merites of Christ but onelie in defaulte of mans satisfaction whose bloode is the onelie purgation of our sinnes whose righteousnes is the wholl propitiation for our iniquities whose redemption by his death purchased is eternall for all them that are sanctified Againe what an horrible blasphemie is it to make a marchandise of the merites of Christ our sauiour as the Pope doth in the saile of his pardons And finallie what scripture giueth anie dispensation of Christes merites vnto anie mortall man and lest of all to the Pope the man of sin if it be lawful thus to imagine implie applie forge and faine without al ground of the holie scriptures religion shal be nothing but as it pleaseth men to make it as it is plaine in the Popish synagogue ALLEN And now vpon the fore said declaration let this be as it were agreed vpon and let the aduersaries well vnderstand this to be the meaning of the Catholike Church that an Indulgence or pardon is nothing els but a remission in parte or in whole of the bond of that punishment which is enioyned or deserued after the mortall sinnes be remitted Gods iustice being otherwise for the said sinnes recompensed by the common treasure of Christ and his Saints satisfaction which is applied vnto the parties vse by the keis of iurisdiction graunted to such as Christ made the Stewards of his household the disposers of his mysteries For the Church of God and her Pastours though they be mercifull inclining to remission rather then rigour yet they take not vpon them neither in the sacrament of penance to remit sinne and damnation neither out of the sacrament to release anie paine or parte of punishment enioyned without recompence thereof by Christes copious redemption and the communion of holie workes that is betwixt the head and members of this mysticali bodie of Christ. FVLKE So often as you repeat this vntrueth so often it must be tolde you that it is false that the popes pardon by the meaning of the giuer and receiuers is nothing els but a remission of punishment enioyned or deserued after mortall sinnes be remitted when it is expressed in the same that it is either for all sinnes at well as paines or els for some parte of the sinnes as well as some part of the vaines except you will accuse the Pope of manifest falsehoode and cosonage to promise that which he meaneth not to giue and wotteth well is not in his power to giue Againe where you saie that Gods iustice is otherwise recompensed we know his iustice is throughlie satisfied by the obedience and suffering of Christ as wel for al our sinnes as for the punishment due for the same therefore your Popes pardons are needles where God forgiueth our sinnes iustifieth vs freely for Christes sake But where you ioyne the satisfaction of saints vnto the common treasure of Christ it is exceeding blasphemous against the sufficiency of his satisfaction and the grace of Gods free iustification For all haue sinned and are destitute of the glorie of God beeing freelie iustisied by his grace through the redemption which is in Christ Iesus whome God hath set forth to be a propitiation by saith in his blood But admit all these lies and blasphemies hetherto aduouched were graunted who gaue the Pope authoritie to applie the same by the key of iurisdiction How prooue you the key of iurisdiction to extend so farre For the keies of the kingdome of heauen whatsoeuer they are be committed to the wholl Church and not to one person onelie as Cyprian Augustine Chrysostome Ierome and all the auncient Doctors agreablie to the scriptures do confesse And God hath made all the Pastors of the Church stewardes of his household and dispensers of his mysteries And if euerie Pastour ouer his charge be a steward and dispenser of Gods mysteries as you seem to graunt why hath he not authoritie to release the penance by him-selfe inioyned or the punishment due for sinne remitted as well as the Bishop or the Pope Why hath he not the key of iurisdiction ouer his parish in as large and ample manner as the Bishop hath ouer his dioces or the Pope ouer all men seeing the keies are not giuen to one but to the vnitie as the auncient fathers teach Whie should the Bishop
that they haue any such power of healing bodelie diseases It is a better reason that you alledge out of Saint Augustine that remission of sinnes in the Church respecteth the iudgement to come but that he speaketh there of any temporal iudgement after this life you are not able to prooue Neither doth the citing of the text of Saint Paull I. Cor. II. helpe you which he citeth to prooue that temporall paines are laide vpon men in this life to them whose sinnes are done awaie that they should not be reserued to the ende as his wordes are plaine in that wholl Chapter Magis enim propter futurum iudicium fit remissio peccatorum In hac autem vita c. For remission of sins ie made rather for the iudgement to come For in this life it preuaileth so much which is written a heauie yoke vpon the sons of Adam from the daie of their comming forth of their mothers wombe vnto the day of their buriall into the mother of all thus we see euen litle children after the lauer of regeneration to be tormented with the affliction of diuerse euills that we may vnderstand that all which is doue by the healthfull sacraments doth pertaine rather to the hope of good thinges to come then to reteining or obteining things present Manie euills also seeme to forgiuen heere and to be reuenged with no punishments but the paines of them are reseruea vntill afterwarde For not in vaine is that called properlie the daie of iudgement when the iudge of the quicke and the deade shall come As on the contrarie side some things are reuenged heere and yet if they be remitted verilie in the worlde to come they shall not hurt Wherfore of certaine temporall paines which are laid vppon sinners in this life in them whose sinnes are done awaie that they should not be reserued vnto the ende the Apostle saieth for if we iudged our selues we should not be iudged of the Lord but when we are iudged of the Lord we are chastened that we should not be damned with this worlde Thus it is plaine by Saint Augustines iudgement that Saint Paull speaketh of temporall paines laied vppon sinners in this life to bring them to repentance not of temporal iudgement to be exercised after this life But you meane not that Popes or Bishops pardons should alwaies take away bodelie sicknes because Christ did not so vnto ai Nay rather because they are not able to heale a sore finger in any one man For Christ healed as many as he would if the Pope haue Christs power why should he not as well heale whome he will Your similitude that as Christ tooke away temporall paines so may Popes and priests holdeth not for there is great odds betweene Christ and his seruants he did what he would they may doe no more then he hath giuen chem power and charge And for releasing of times of repentance appointed to satisfie the Church they may by power giuen from him but for the releasing of debt to be paied in the world to come he gaue them neither authority nor cōmaundement That the priest doth dailie heale in your sacrament of aneling it is an impudent lie For first they anoint none in their dailie practize but such as are in dispaire of life of whom if any recouer by the wilof God it is sacriledge to impure it to the power of the priests anointing who hauenot the gift of healing as the elders of the Apostles Church had whome S. Iames willeth to be sent for to heale the diseased ALLEN But in Saint Paull we haue inuincible proofe of the authoritie and iurisdiction of Bishops and princivali pastcurs touching as well the power of enioyned pename and satisfaction for sinnes committed as the lawfull power of pardoning the same which before was enioyned and so in one fact of the Apostle a cleare practize of binding and loosing He first bound him by excommunication that had so greeuouslie offended and to shew what a terrible torment this kinde of panishment is and how much it is to be dred he maketh it euident by a slraunge corporall vexation that all Chrillian men might conceiue the miserie of those persons which be excommunicated hereafter when the externall signe and miraculous torment should ceasse in the Church I wili reporte the matter fullie There was amongst the Corinthians one of reputation that kept vnlawfullie his fathers wife the which being knowne to their Apostle Saint Paul who then was absent srom them and being accounted of him as in deede it was an exceeding grieuous fact and notorious he gaue in charge to the Church of Corinth to take the person that had so offended as excommunicated that is to saie to be separated from the sacraments the seruice and common fellowship of Saints But see with what a maiestie and might of operation with what force of wordes and authoritie of his calling with what a kinde of punishment Christes officer here correcteth the offender Thus runneth his determinate sentence on the offender that all the worlde may take heede and wonder at the Churches authoritie and condemne the vaine voices of them that doe restraine the power of Gods ministers onelie to the preaching of the Gospell I beeing absent in bodie but present in spirit haue alreadie giuen iudgement as well as if I were present that the person that hath thus wickedlie wrought should be deliuered vpto Sathan in the vertue of our Lorde Christ Iesus you there being gathered with my spirit in the name of our said Lord Christ Iesus and all for the vexation of his flesh that his soull may be safe in the daie of our Lord Iesus Christ. This in effect is the Apostles sentence on that incestuous person wherby he was temporallie tormented by the force of Saint Pauls power of binding sinners giuen by Christ and exercised no otherwise as you may see but in Christs vertue holie name Where it may be noted for a strange 〈◊〉 of mans word that the deuill himse fe should be therby appointed to torment a sinners bodie not as he would but as far as the diuine Magistrate shall limit him Diabolus enim quia ad hoc paratus est vt auerses à Deo 〈◊〉 in potestatem audita sententia corripit eos The 〈◊〉 saith Saint Ambrose who is alwaies readie to take them to his power that are turned from God sireight as soone as he heareth the sentence pronounced vpon sinners he doth afflict and correct them As it may also appeere by our Sauiours wordes in the Gospell of a woman that had spiritum infirmitatis the spirit of infirmitie whome the deuill had eighteene yeares together fast bound in sickenes for her sinnes to whome also Christ gaue a pardon by imposition of his holie handes Where we may haue an other example of his mercie in loosing the temporall band and punishment appointed for sinne But let vs turne to Saint Pauls patient whome we left by the key of the
learning which he would seeme to be For all men which know what belongeth to disputation will confesse that it is easier for a learned man to answere with commendation in defense of trueth then to oppugne a true cause with hope to winne credit Wherfore the inequalitie was in the cause not in the disputers parte which was appointed to Campian For if his positions had not bene false by answering he had the aduantage against the opponents Againe Campian did first take vpon him the opponents parte in publishing his booke of tenne arguments against vs which by our side was answered and therefore it was meete and agreable to order he should be appointed to answere and our side to oppose and that by the verie law of equalitie and indifferencie although as it is euident by the reporte of the conference he was permitted somtime to oppose and propounded such arguments as his weake cause could afforde him But you are sure and dare auowe to our faces that we will neuer deale with you at euen hand or vpon equall conditions while we liue You maie be sure that to maintaine your purpose of sedition for which your challenge was made that we will not deale with you at anie hand or vpon anie conditions But to shew your falsehoode ignorance and arrogancie manifest to the world we are readie to ioyne with you in anie conditions that our prince and magistrates will allow vs and shall thinke maie stand with the quiet of the state who seing our religion after lawfull and solemne conference by vs offered and shamefullie refused by your good masters is by law established will not rashlie admitt euerie vaine and ridiculous challenge of disputation that is offered by such as Campian you are who dare auow to our faces and yet dare not shew your owne faces before you be drawen out of your creeping corners and hiding holes as Campian and his complices were Yet you are in the name of all your fellow Catholikes torenew your bublike challenge of equall disputation Who are you and what Commission haue you from your fellow Papists that we may credit you If we knew either the one or the other we might the rather consider of your pretended publike challenge Edmond Campian did more like a Champion who when he cast downe his gloue of defiance spared not his name though he hid his head But you comming with so lowd a challenge so large offers so magnifical promises not of your owne countrimen but of straungers also of matters not in priuate mens power but of the graunt of Princes that in any kingdome and countrie which you call Catholike and moreouer rather then you would faile of disputation are ready to beare the expenses not onely of our countrie-men which are manie but of all the learned Protestants of Europe whome you giue vs leaue to call for our defense must needs haue great intelligence conference with all the popish states in Europe and a wonderfull large commission from them all which we would beglad you should shew for our assurance or els you shew your selfe the noblest foole in the world to thinke that any man will credit you in so weightie matters vpon your owne bare worde not knowing so much as whome to enquire for or where to finde you if we were disposed to confer with you about anie conditions of equalitie to be vsed in the pretended disputation or about the time place or persons to be emploied in the same Neuerthelesse to shew your confidence and desire of triall in all the haste you tell vs that albeit we thinke your cause to be greatlie weakened by the taking awaie and dispatching so you cal the iust execution of Campian Sherwine yet you are the same men you were before yea much more disirous of this triall then before Indeede I am perswaded you are no changelings but euen as the deuill hardneth them whome he hath once in possession so your obstinacie daylie encreaseth both in herisie and treason For the weakening of your cause we neuer accounted any greate moment to be either in Campian or Sherwine more then to the strengthening thereof They were of the ripest frie that your seminarie could afforde sparing the olde stores and yet they were but frothe for any sounde learning that was in either of them You say we were wante for more abasement of the other to saie that M. Sherwine was farre better learned then Campian him-selfe It may be some haue saide soe and they that haue had conference with both doe affirme that is the learned tongues Greeke and Hebrewe Sherwyn had some litle sinacke so that he could talke of them whereas Campian was as blind as a betle in them both Againe Sherwyn in reasoning had for the most parte the common shiftes and ordinarie answers of Papists to the places that were cited out of the Doctors Campian had nothing but friuolous distinctions framed of his owne heade vpon the seddaine seldome or neuer vnderstanding the argument of the booke or place of the Doctors that he was pressed withall So that it might casilie appeare that Sherwin was better studied Campian quicker witted In impudencie they were almost equall sauing that Campian was impudent with arrogancie Sherwine with more shew of humilitie I wil note one example of Sherwins impudencie and an other of his small knowledge in the Hebrewe tongue wherein yet the Papists would beare vs in hand that he was excellent When after some priuate conference had with him in M. Liuetenants lodging within the tower of London My Ladie Hopton chaunsed to speake somewhat against the licentious and abhominable life of the Cardinals and cleargie of Rome Sherwin said if any such thing were they should answere for it themselues but he tooke the eternall God to witnesse that those eyes of his neuer saw in the citie of Rome which he had often walkedouer that could offend his harte or conscience which shamefull protestation of his all that heard him did abhorre seeing that if Rome were the holiest citie that is in Europe as it is wellknowne to be the moste sinfull in 〈◊〉 yet noe honest and religious man could remaine so long in it but he should see some tokens of pride wantonnes couetousnes crueltie or vanitie that must needes be a greife vnto his harte to consider Now for the other matter In the conference itselfe he would haue taken vppon him no smal iudgement in the 〈◊〉 ewe language by auouching that he woâ—â—◠〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and notable corruptions in the Hebrewe text of the Bible when an example was required he brought forth the â—7 v of the 22 Psalme which by like he had learned of Gregoriâ— Martin as Martin had learned of 〈◊〉 here the Hebrew text saide he is C AR I I as a 〈◊〉 my handes and my feete but the truth is as the vâ—lgaâ—e 〈◊〉 station hath they have pearced my hands and my feete Heere when it was answered that of the Mazorites doe discharge this
them-selues Whereof if there be no perticular vowe expressed yet seeing they vowe to followe the rule of Layolas which includeth whipping of them selues as you cannot denie Master Charke hath not belied the Iesuites as you note in your margent And as concerning the sect of heretikes called whippers you referre vs to Prateolus and Gerson to prooue that they helde manie wicked opinions for which they were condemned and aske what doth this make against the sober moderat chastisment which good men vse in secret vpon their owne bodies at such times as they esteeme them-selues for mortification to neede the same I answere there is no neede that any man for mortification should whippe him-selfe or els it is neede for al men so to whippe themselues except Iesuites haue more vntamed bodies then all other men And therefore it is but ethelothreschia a voluntarie Religion or a superstition after the precept and Doctrine of men in colour of humilitie and not sparing the bodie described by Saint Paul Col. 2. 23. and as for Gerson to whom you send vs doth not onelie condemne the hereticall opinions of those whippers but also their whipping of them-selues and that for diuers causes of which I will rebearse some First he accounteth it a tempting of God to laie such a burden vpon men as you do which make whipping needfull for mortification whereby it followeth that it is needfull for all men as mortification is not for Iesuites onelie Secondlie he saieth that the law of Christ ought no lesse in his seruice to auoide the superstitions of the Gentilles and Idolatours espiciallie these that are cruell and horrible then the olde law in the which yet there is expresse prohibition Deu. 14. where it is said be ye seruers of the Lord your God you shall not cut your selues where the glosse is you ought not in anie thing to be made like to Idolatours and in the hebrue it is you shall not teare or rend your selues Againe he saith for I doe but translate his wordes lex Christi c. the law of Christ is giuen sufficientlie in the tenne commaundements the keeping of which good simplicitie and plaine faith is enough to saluation especiallie of laie men and common people without anie new imposition of moste greeuous burdens according to the saying of Christ if thou wilt enter into life keep the commaundements Neither is it anie thing worth if it be said that the people doe voluntarilie take vpon them such whippings without any other commaundement while it is found that there-vpon they doe more licentiouslie contemne Gods commaundementes in manie thinges For the nature of man is stubburne which since it is forsaken of the state of originalliustice it is caried more greedelie vnto those things that are of mans inuention then those that are of Gods bidding And this is one degree of pride which Bernard saith is found among Religious men while they reioice more in abstinence or particular voluntarie praier then in all the regular discipline Againe the law of Christ being set forth sufficiently by the Apostles and holie Doctors is not found to haue appointed such nouelties of men whipping them-selues either by preaching or otherwise but rather to haue reprooued them as moste suspect and daungerous and which may growe to the slaunder of Christianes among the Iewes Saracens and Paganes as though the lawe of Christ were austere cruell and nourished in blood not in mercie Afterward he setteth downe reasons to dissuade this superstition as he calleth it Let diligent and earnest exhortation be made touching the praises of patience which hath her perfect worke preferring it before such voluntarie whippings as Augustine saith agreeablie to Seneca that the aduersities of this world are not so much to be laid vpon vs as when they happen patientlie to be suffered makeing thorough patience a vertue of necessitie I am not so madde saith Seneca that I would be sick but if I must be sick I will beare it patientlie Therefore there must be reckened vp diligentlie and seuerallie the diuers tribulationes sometime temporall sometime spirituall which daielie do giue and offer to vs whether we will or nill matter of patience such as are sicknes pouertie c and who is able to number all such tribulations which are such and so manie that we must not bring vpon our selues new sorowes for the valiant suffering of such dailie tribulations is enough for the purging of greater sinnes especiallie if contrition be encreased and humble confession in deede or purpose c. Yea the same Gerson saith farther Imò sicut non licet c. As it is not lawfull for a man of his owne authoritie to mayme or gelde him-selfe excepte it were for the healthe of the whole bodie So it is not lawfull as it seemeth that a man should violentlie draw blood of him-selfe except it be for bodelie Physick or els by the like reason a man might burne himselfe with an hotte iron which no man hath held or graunted hitherto except perhaps idolaters or false Christians such as are found in India which thinke that they ought to be baptized with fire Finallie Gerson alloweth no whipping except it be enioyned as penance and that it be executed by another man and that moderatelie and without offence giuing or ostentation and last of all without drawing of blood And this booke of Gerson as you wotte is in print to answere your question was there euer honest man but Master Charke that would haue obiected so impertinent a thing in Print as is the whipping of men by them-selues vppon anie falselie pretended neede of Mortification But Master Charke maketh you laugh when he saith the sect of whippers was condemned long agoe You aske how long and by whome For they began anno 1273. vnder Pope Gregorie the 10. and were condemned both by him and his successours by which authority Luther and Caluine are likewise condemned An high point in a low house as though the authoritie by which men are condemned is all the matter not the cause for which Adultery is condemned by Mahomet and by the same authoritie the Gospell of Christ is it not lawfull to approoue the one condemnation except a man allow the other No maruaile though you laugh at this matter for indeed it is verie ridiculous as moste of your collections be And whereas you affirme that Pope Gregorie the 10. did condemne these Flagellantes I suppose you are not able to bring any author of credit that so doth write For in his time they sprang vp and continued almoste fourescore yeares without anie solemne condemnation For anie thing that Prateolus or who so writeth most diligentlie of here sies can testifie Prateolus out of Carion sheweth that 1343. they came to Spire in Germanie when the diet of the Empire was kept and through opinion of great holines had good entertainment Tandem verò damnata est At length saith he this sect was condemned and extinguished with fire
witnesses concerning the rumor of Martine Luthers departure out of this life But Hosius was a Bishoppe and a Cardinall forsooth as though a malitious Papist when he hath a white rochet put on his backe or a redde hat clapt on his head were sopriuileged by his titles that he must needes be credited though he lie neuer so impudentlie Touching the dissention of Luther with others that professed the Gospell Master Charke doth graunt that in some points he disagreed from them and yet he saith there was a singular care among them of the vnitie in the Gospell But this our defender taketh in so euill part that he calleth it in tollerable impudencie speciallie that for profe thereof Master Charke citeth the acte of concorde agreed vpon at Marpuge Anno. 1529. vpon the reporte of Brentius which since hath shewed him selfe an obistinate heretike and author of the opinion of the vbiquitie of Christes bodie who reporteth that the Zuinglians were vanquished and yet he giueth them this testimonie that they desired with teares to be called bretheren which Luther refused But what the agreement was the booke of Acts printed both in Latine and Dutch doth testifie vnto the worlde The 15. Chapter of which conuention con cerning the matter in controuersie was this Credimus profitemur omnes de caena domini nostri Iesu Christi Vsum illius sub vtraque specie iuxea Christi institutionem obseruandans dum esse Quodque missanon sit vllum eiusmodi opus quo alto alteri qutsquam siue mortuo siue viuo gratiā consequi possit Quod item sacramentum altaris sit sacramentum veri corporis sanguinis Iesu Christi Et quòd esus spiritualis eius 〈◊〉 corporis sanguinis sit vnicuique Christiano homini inprimis necessarius Adhaec quòd vsus huius sacramensi perinde atque verbum ipsum à Deo opt max. sit institutus atque ordinatus ad excitandas ad fidem infirmas hominum conscientias per spiritum sanctum Quanquam autem inter nos hactenus non planè potuit conuenire num verum corpus 〈◊〉 sanguis Christi pani ac vino corporaliter insit debebit nihilominus tamen vtraque pars altera erga alteram declarare Christi anam charitatem quatenus idomnino cuiusque conscientia ferre potest Et vtraque pars deum opt max. diligenter precabiturrot is nobis per spiritum suum verum eius rei intellectum constabilire dignetur Amen Martinus Lutherus Ioann Brentius Iustus Ionas Ioan Oecolampadius Philippus Mclancthon Huldricus Zuinglius And. Ostander Martinus Bucerus Stephan Agricola Gaspar Hedio We all beeleeue and profes concerning the supper of our Lord Iesus Christ that the vse thereof in both kinds according to the institution of Christ is to be obserued And that the masse is not any such work whereby any one man may obtaine grace for another whether he be dead or a liue Also that the sacrament of the altar is the sacrament of the true body blood ofIesus Christ. And that the spirituall eating of the same his body blood is very necessary for euery Christian man Moreouer that the vse of this sacrament euē as the word it selfe is instituted ordeined of almighty God to stir vp vnto faith the weake consciences of men by his holie spirite And although it could not hetherto be altogether agreed amongst vs whether the true bodie and true blood of Christ be in the bread and wine corporallie yet neuer 〈◊〉 both parties ought to declare Christian charitie one towards the other so farre as euerie mans conscience can beare And both partes shall diligentlie pray vnto almightie God that he by his spirite may vouchsafe to establish vnto vs the true vnderstanding of that matter Amen Martine Luther c. The subscriptionof their names appeareth before You heare how farre forth they agreed and to a full 〈◊〉 indeed the Lutherans could neuer be brought nor Luther himselfe who in this point was out of measure hard intractable which seeing it is not denied by Master Charke or any of vs it is altogether needles that our defender spendeth two leaues and more in citing testimonies of his dissent from the rest that professe the Gospell which he calleth Zuinglians and Caluinists And to make the matter more large he 〈◊〉 the writings of Brentius Stankatus Ochinus men fallen from the truth into open errors condemned of all pattes against the professors of the truth But what care the godlie had to maintaine the vnitie of the Gospell may appeere by the harmonic of confessions of so manie diuerse Churches in the somme of Christian Religion and doctrine of the most necessarie points of faith vnto eternall saluation thoroughlie agreeing within them selues and against the heresies of the Papists and all other sectaries both olde and new That the Lutherans notwitstanding continue still their vncharitable iudgement against the other it is in deede to be lamented but yet noe cause for Papists to reioyce whoe whether it be by vs or them in al other points of their heresies are beaten downe and brought to confusion And still that remaineth true that Master Charke saide of Oecolampadius Bucer others although in some pointes they disagreed from Luther and other of his side yet was there among them a singular care of vnitie in the Gospell The entercourse of louing letters that you so earnestly require may be seene among Caluins epistles where there are louing letters betweene Caluine Melancthon Vitus Theodorus and other And now we are come to the odious inuectiues against the liues of Caluine and Beza taken out of a vile libell written by Ierome Bolsec an vnlearned vngodlie and vnshamefast knaue who once was a Carmelite frier and flying from his cloister came first aud deceiued the Dachesse of Ferrara for a time but his knauerie being knowne and he espied he was banished from her and then within three daies studie he professed him selfe to be a Phisition and came to Geneua where being contemned of the learned in that science he would take vpon him to be a diuine openly inueighed against the doctrine of prae destination not as a Papist out as a meere Pelagian for which he was condemned and banished the Citie and after for like troubles he was twyse banished the territorie of Berna After that when he thought the Churches of Fraunce should haue continued in peace he fained repentance and sought reconciliation of the Church of Geneua labouring ambitiouslie to be admitted into the ministery but when warre persecution befel vnto the Church contrary to his expectation he returned to his leech craft and reuolted againe to Poperte and in satisfaction of his Apostasie hath forged and refined these lies against Caluine and Beza Anp this is that reuerend man whome our defender commendeth for wisedome learning and honestie Whose impudent slaunders with noc indifferent man can finde anie credit seeing all law and common equitie alloweth exception against such a vile person to be
of his manhood thus he saith Quòd vnctio sit secundúm humanitatem nemo qui rectè sapere solet dubitabit quia absque omni controuersia minus à maiore benedicitur That the annointing of Christ should be meant of his humanitie no man doubteth that is of anie right vnderstanding For without all controuersie the inferiour and lesse euer receiueth blessing of the superiour and greater There can be no question then but all soueraigntie and supreme iurisdiction which he exercised ouer the Church being his bodie and spouse in that respect that he was either Priest and Bishop of our soules as Saint Peter calleth him or els as he was out head and pastour it is certaine that all this came vnto him by his fathers sending and the vnction of the holie Ghost and the benediction of the holie Trinitie to which he was inferiour accor ding to his manhood FVLKE That our sauiour Christ by his vnction receaued no gift or blessing of God but in respect of his humanitie it is more cleere then it needed to haue beene declared by the testimonies of Hilarius and Cyrillus but that all soueraigntie and supreame inrisdiction which he exercised ouer the Church in respect that he was Priest and Bishop of our soules or as he was our head and Pastor came onelie to his manhoode as Allen maketh it certaine it is vtterlie false and blasphemous against his godheade For vnto all soueraigntie and authoritie he hath full right in respect of his diuinitie and therefore the Apostle Heb. 3. 5. c. saith that Moses was faithfull in Godds house as a seruant but Christ as the sonne ouer his owne house which was builded by himselfe as God which hath made all thinges For what cause Allen speaking of the soueraigntie of Christ ouer his Church vseth the time past saying he was our Priest and Bishop he was our head and pastour it is easie to gesse seeing he laboureth to establish such a soueraigntie and supreme iurisdiction on earth as is derogatorie to the high authoritie of Christ in heauen But the scripture teacheth vs that he is an eternall Priest Heb. 7. 9. c. that he is the shepheard and Bishop of our soules 1. Peter 2. that he is and shall be to the end of the world the heade of his Church Eph. 1 ALLEN If thou doubt of his Priesthood in this case heare Theodoretus Christus autem quód ad humanitatem quidem attinet Sacerdos appellatus est non aliam autem hostiam quám suum corpus obtulit Christ saith he touching his humanitie was called a Priest and he offered no other hoste but his owne bodie But we maie haue more forcible testimonie hereof in Saint Paull him selfe who in sundrie other places that are knowen professeth euerie Bishop to be elected and chosen out among a number of men to offer sacrifice for sinne And that he is made the supreame gouernour head of the Church in his humanitie yea and in respect thereof is appointed to be the high minister of God the father in pardoning or iudgeing the world it is an assured ground of our faith approued not onelie by the consent of all Doctors but also by the Scriptures euerie where protesting that all power in heauen and earth is giuen to Christ in so much that the Apostle calleth him the man in quo viro statuit iudicare orbem tetratum In which or by which appointed man he will iudge the world All these thinges though they maie seeme to the simple to be farre from the matter yet they be both neare our purpose and necessarie to be laied vp in memorie for the further establishing of our faith in the Article proposed and diuerse other profitable pointes of Christian beliefe now impugned FVLKE We doubt not that Christ was a Priest as touching his humanitie as Theodoret saith but we beleeue that he was a Priest as he was the mediator God and man Fot as some ministeriall partes of that office did require that he should be a man áccording to which nature he might be subiect so other parts of the same office required the authoritie of God For none but God hath authoritie to reconcile man and to bring him into the holiest place into the presence and sight of God whereunto he hath full right of his owne nature and dignitie The forcible testimonies that Master Allen citeth out of the Apostle Heb. 5. 9. haue no force to prooue that Christ is not a Priest as he is God and man although they prooue that he is a Priest as he is man But contrariwise if these scriptures be well marked which the Apostle doth alledge out of the second Psalme Thou art my sonne this daie haue I begotten the and out of the 110. psalme thou art a Priest for euer after the order of Melchiseà ech they will make euident proofe vnto vs that Christ not onelie in respect of his humanitie but also in respect of his deitie is our eternall high Priest as he is our sauiour our mediator our redeemer as in other places the Apostle sheweth more plainlie and I haue argued purposelie and plentifullie against the slaunderous note of the Rhemistes in my confutation of the Papistes quarreils against my writings pag 64. vnto the end whereunto I referre the reader for more full satisfaction That Christ in his humanitie is made the supreame gouernor and head of his Church we do constantlie bleeue but that he hath this excellent authoritie in respect of his humanitie alone and not in respect of his diuinitie we can not acknowledge For in respect of his diuinitie his person is capable of all honour glorie power and authoritie which in the onelie respect of his humanitie it were not That he is appointed to iudge the world also in his humanitie we confesse according to the scriptures but seeing I haue prooued before that to be iudge of the world is proper to the deitie we must needes confesse that the man Iesus Christ is appointed to be iudge of the quick and the dead not onely as an high minister deputed of God in respect of his humanitie but as God him-selfe of supreame authority in respect of his diuinitie For to holde that Christ is no otherwise iudge of the world but as an high minister as kings and Princes are iudges of the earth as high ministers by deputation onelie of Gods authoritie committed to them and not by right of their nature I see not how it can be excused from grosse Nestorianisme The scriptures which protest that all power in heauen and earth is geuen to Christ are to be vnderstood in deede of the exaltation of his humanitie and crowning of his manhood with glorie and maiestie but thereof it followeth not that Christ enioyeth all that power that is giuen to him by the onelie right of his humanitie For except Christ were God as verilie as he is man he were not able to receiue such a gift which no
which only meane of preaching expressed in this place you with a Marie for all that fumble vp with I cannot tell what guidance because you cannot content your selfe to be a minister a seruant a subiect but you must be a Lord a Prince a ruler But the other text of Ioh. 20. yousay doth properlie concerne the commission giuen to the Apostles for the sacrament of penaunce and remission of sins But whether I praie you in the scripture shal we read of this your sacrament or the institution thereof what is the visible worde or element thereof yet you saie that this text doth in moste cleare and vndoubted sense giue to them the like right in that case that Christ him-selfe had by the sending of God the father that is to saie the verie same authoritie that he had in respect of his mediation and manhood So that be like Christ as Mediator hath no authority peculiar to himselfe in respect of the excellency of his person but that which is communicable vnto others and is communicated to his Apostles But that is a strange doctrine neuer heard of before in the Church of God except it were from the mouth of Nestorius or any of his disciples For our sauiour Christ receiued in his manhoode that which no other man is able to receiue because he one lie is God and man he receiued the spirit not according to measure Iohn 3. 34. as all men muste do that receiue it therefore no man can receiue such power by the spirit in measure which he receiued by the spirit infinitelie or without measure But Saint Augnstine is called to witnes that this text doth giue theverie same authoritie to the Apostles that Christ had in respect of his mediation and manhoode Whereas Saint Augustines words import no such thing but onelie shew that Christ though equal to his father in respect of his Godheade yet as he is our Mediatour is sent of his father in respect of his manhood But of the verie same authoritie that Christ had in respect of his mediation giuen to the Apostles he speaketh not a word That you ioyne his māhood to his mediation as though the mediator were nothing but man or as though the man Iesus Christ which is our onelie mediator were not Immannell that is God with vs it is not without some smack of Nestorian heresie wherebie you seeme so to separate the man from God as though any thing might be verified of the man which in respect of the vnitie of person might not be verified of God or as though there were not such a perfect vnion of the two natures in one person that although they both continue vnconfounded reteining their essentiall properties yet any part of the office and authoritie of Christ which he exercised in his humanitie might as latgelie as fullie and with the verie same authoritie be committed ouer to any other mortall man to be exercised as it was by Christ himselfe But Theophilact is cited to be an interpreter of Saint Augustine whoe saith vpon these wordes as the father hath sent me c. in the person of Christ take vpon you my worke and be sure that I will be with you meaning that he committeth to them the office of teaching whereunto he was sent by his father but of equall authoritie with him he speaketh no worde Which place you haue verie licentiouslie translated to draw it to your purpose For the words are no more but these as Philippus Montanus hath translated them Meum opus inquit suscipite confidite quod vobiscum sum futurus And in the ende he willeth men to consider the dignitie of priests that it is diuine For it perteineth to God to remit sinnes so therefore are they to be honoured as God For although they be vnworthie what is that they are the ministers of Gods giftes and grace worketh by them euen as he spake by Balaams asse For our vnworthines hindreth not grace so because by meanes of priests grace is graunted they are to be honoured Thefe wordes of Theophilact declare that although he ascribe much to the dignitie of Priests yet he doth not allowe them the verie same authoritie that Christ had in respect of his mediation but a farre inferior ministerie And excellentlie to our purpose wrote the holie father Cyril as well for the dignitie of the Apostolike vocation as for the honourable legacie in these wordes Ad gloriosum Apostolalatum Dominus noster Iesus Christus Discipulos suos vocduit qui commotum orbem firmarunt sustentacula eius facti vnde per Psalmistam de terra de Apostolis dicit quia ego firmaui columnas eius Columnae enim robur veritatis discipulisunt quos ita dicit se mittere sicut à patre ipse missus est vs Apostolatus dignitatem ostenderet magnitudinem potestatis eorum aperiret These wordes and the residue following concerning the same purpose goe thus in english Our Lord and master Christ Iesus promoted his disciple to a glorious Apostleship whoe becing made the proppes and staies of all the earth haue established the wauering worlde whereupon the Psalmist sayeth thus of the earth and the Apostles I haue surelie and firmelie set the pillers thereof For the disciples no doubt be the verie pillers strength and staie of trueth whome Christ saith that he doth send euen as his father did send him that thereby he might declare to the worlde as well the dignitie of their Apostleship as open to all men their excellencie and the might of their power and no lesse signifie vnto them what way they had to take in all their life and studies For if they be so sent as Christ him selfe was sent of the father it is requisite to consider for what worke purpose the father euerlasting sent his sonne in flesh to the worlde And that him selfe els where declareth saying Non veni vocare iustos sed peccatores ad poenitentiam I came not to cal the iust but sinners to repen tance in another place it is said God sent not his sonne into the world to iudge the worlde but that the worlde shold be saued by him al these thinges and other he touched brieflie in these few wordes Sicus misit me pater ego mitto vos vt hinc intelligant vocandos esse 〈◊〉 ad poenitentiam 〈◊〉 corpore simul spiritumale habentes Like as my father sent me so I send you that sinners should be called to repentance and be healed both in bodie and soule Thus farre spake S. Cyril of the excellent calling of the disciples of the cause of their large commission not restricted by any streighter tearmes then Christs owne commission was which he receiued from his euerlasting Father FVLKE The wordes of Saint Cyrillus declare no more then I haue said before that the Apostles were sent of Christ as Christ was sent of his father to call sinners to repentance by their ministerie of preaching not
that they were sent with as large commission in euery respect as Christ was sent to be our mediator and redeemer The wordes of Cyrill which you haue mangled and chopped at your pleasure I will recite wholl together that the reader may see how iniutiouslie you would draw to farre other meaning then his saying wil yeald In Ioh. lib. 12. C. 55. vpon these words Dicit ergo eis iterum pax vobis sicut misit me pater ego mitto vos He writeth thus Ordinauit his verbis orbis doctores c. He ordeined thē by these words teachers of the world ministers of the diuine mysteries whome he sent as lightes to the lightening not of the region of the Iewes onelie which according to the measure of the legall commaundement extended from Dan to Bersebe as it is written but he commaunded them to lighten the wholl worlde Therefore Paul saith truelie that no man taketh honour vpon him except he be called of God For our Lord Iesus Christ called his disciples vnto the glorious Apostleship which staied the world that was moued beeing made the pillers thereof Whereof by the Psalmist he saith of the earth and the Apostles I haue strengthned the pillers thereof For his disciples are the pillers and strength of truth Whome he saith that he doth so send as he him-selfe is sent of his father that also he might shew the dignitie of their Apostleship and open to all men the greatnes of their power and with all might shew what way they ought to follow in their studies and in their life For if they be so sent as Christ is sent of his father how is it not necessarie to consider vnto what the father sent his sonne for so not otherwise they may be able to follow him But if expounding to vs the cause of his sending many waies one while he saide I came not to call the iust but sinners to repentance an other while The holl haue no neede of the Phisitian but such as be diseased And moreouer I came downe from heauen saith he not that I might doe mine owne will but the will of him that sent me And againe God sent not his sonne into the worlde that he should iudge or condemne the world but that the world might be saued by him All which thinges he signified in most few wordes saying that he doth so send them as he was sent by his father that hereof they might vnderstand that sinners are to be called to repentance that they which ar diseased might be healed both in bodie and in minde And in the dispensation of thinges they must not doe their owne will but the will of him that sent them and that the world by preaching and the doctrine of faith must be saued All which things with what great diligence they performed you may learne with small labour in the booke of the Acts of the Apostles in the Epistles of Paul Thus farre Cyrillus whose saying if you had not clipped and gelded for your aduantage would haue made no colour for your purpose but against it ALLEN And truelie it was the singular prouidence of God that beforē the graunt of the gouernment of mens soules to his Disciples beeing but mortal men mention should be made of his owne right therein that the wicked should neuer haue face to disgrace the authoritie of them that dependeth so fullie of the soueraigne calling and commission of Gods owne sonne This high wisedome was practized also to the vtter confusion of the wicked and wilfull persons at their calling to the office of preaching and baptizing The which function lest any contemptuous person should in such base men disdaine Christ alledgeth his owne power and preheminence to which the dignitie of priesthoode is so neere and so euerlastinglie ioyned that euerie dishonour and neglecting of the one is great derogation to the other And therefore he saith Omnis potest as data est mihi in coelo in terra All power in heauen and in earth is giuen to my handes Therefore goe you forward and teach all natious babtizing them in the name of the Father and of the Sonne and of the holie Ghost Thus before the institution of sacraments whereof God him selfe must onelie be the author as saith Saint Cyprian Christ voutchsafed for the quiet instruction of the world to declare his authoritie and prerogatiue that all men might farther vnderstand thereby that the ministerie and excllent founction in the vse of the same did orderlie proceed of that authoritie and supreame power that Christ hath receiued ouer all mankind FVLKE Cyrillus telleth you there is none other graunt of the gouernment of mens soules contained in these wordes but to be teachers of the Gospell and to be ministers of the diuine mysteries to preach remission of sinnes to the penitent and to seale it vp with the sacraments to denounce vengeance to the impenitent vnbeleeuers in all things to attend that they do not their owne wil but the wil of him that sent them And in so doing their authoritie is exceeding great deriued from God him selfe the onelie author of their Doctrine and of the sacraments they doe minister Wherein you seeme somewhat to forget your selfe which hitherto haue mainteined and still affirme that Christ did remit sinnes and gaue his Apostles authoritie to doe the same by power receiued from God in his manhoode and that the holie Trinitie would not remit our sinnes otherwise then by the seruise of the sonne of man But now you confesse with S. Cyprian that God himselfe must be the onelie author of Sacraments Wherefore if this power of remitting sins be a Sacrament as you holde Christ must be the onelie author of it as God himselfe not as man by power receiued from God by the holie Ghost ALLEN And this sequel of Christes reason hath maruelous efficacie and force if we will consider thereof All power is giuen to me both in heauen and earth therefore goe you and preach and baptize and remit sinnes If a man would aske the Priest or Apostle how he dare be so bold to exercise any of these functions he might vpon Christes word be so bolde to make him this answere marie sir I baptize because all power is giuen to Christ I preach because all power is giuen to Christe I remit sins because all power was giuen to Christ. For in my ministerie he practiseth daielie all these functions in his power I am become the lawfull worker of all actions that are so proper to Christ him selfe Therefore it was Christ saith Saint Augustine that baptized and had moe Disciples then Iohn and yet Christ baptized not but his Disciples onelie So saie you to all contemners of Gods ordinance it is Christ that pardoneth and enioyneth penance for mans sinnes and yet he doth it not him-selfe as in his owne person but Christ doth it daily by the power which he established after his resurrection and which
by them which haue the holie ghost in them-selues For when they remit or retaine the spirit which dwelleth in them remitteth or retaineth by them And that shal be by them as I thinke by two meanes first by baptisme and then by repeatence for either they induce men that beleeve and are approoued for holines of life vnto baptisme and diligentlie expill from them that are vnworthie or where the children of the Church doe offend they rebuke them indeede and pardon them that repent As Paul did once commit the fornicator among the Corinthians vnto the destruction of his flesh that his spirit might be saued and receiued him againe lest he should be drowned with greater sorrowe Therefore when the spirit of Christ dwelling in men performeth the worke of the true God how shall he not be God by nature which naturallie possesseth the power and dignitie of the diuine nature when he hath so excellent authority vpon the lawe of God This last argument of Saint Cyrill by which he prooueth against the Macidonian heretikes that the holie Ghost is verie God declareth that he neuer meant to deifie Priests with the same authority that is proper to god by which it should follow that the holie Ghost were not God if men had that authority of remitting sin that god hath wherefore it followeth that men are onely instruments by which the holie ghost speaketh declareth his own will of remission of sins not that the holie Ghost is subiect to the Censure of man which were intollerable blasphemie And therefore if the same father did anie where cal the ministers of the Church protectours an̄d curers both of bodies and soules it cannot be drawne to anie such meaning as though they were in deede deified and made as you would saie partakers of Gods nature to worke Gods owne office in the world but the ministers of God appointed to serue for the eternall saluation of the Elect both in bodie and soule Their order is diuine and they exercise the office of the holie ghost as S. Ambrose saith but yet so that nothing is communicated vnto man that is proper to God Who they were that did simplie and plainlie tearme the principall Pastours of the Church halfe gods not meere men you do not expresse perhaps you meane the Author of that blasphemous verse writen to the the Pope and by him not refused Nec Deus es nec homo quasi neuter es inter vtrumque Thou art neither god nor man but a neuter between both I finde in the scripture that ciuil princes are called not halfe Gods but whole Gods because they execute some parte of Gods authoritie among men Yet he that shall saie their persons̄ are therebie deified might well be accounted a most blaspemous flatterer We may now see out of what pudle the toades of the familie of Loue are crept that vpon pretence of the spirit of god dwelling in men moste blasphemouslie affirme that it deifieth their persons to make them of abilitie to exercise the workes of God whereas the power of remitting of sinnes is graunted euen to wicked Priestes in which the holie Ghost dwelleth not although he hath bestowed his giftes vpon them to make them sufficient in knowledge and vtterance to preach the gospell ALLEN But Saint Ambrose helpeth our matter with a long discourse all I will not now reporte for the present purpose thus he saith disputing against the Nouarians for the assertion of Priestly dignitie in assoyling our sinnes Qui Spiritum sanctum accipit sic enim scriptum est Accipite spiritum sanctum quorum remiseritis peccata remittuntur eis quorum retinueritis retenta sunt Ergo qui soluere peccatum non potest non habet Spiritum sanctum Munus spiritus sancti est officium sacerdotis ius autem spiritus sancti in soluendis ligandis que criminib est He thatreceiueth the holy ghost his meaning is in the taking of orders receiueth therewith the power to binde and loose For so is it written Receiue you the holie Ghost whose sinnes you doe forgiue they are forgiuen them whose sinnes you doe reseine they are reteined Therefore they which cannot forgiue mens offences they haue not the holie ghost that is to saie they haue not the gift of the holie Ghost which is giuen to the officers for their execution of their function in Christes behalfe for the gift of the holie Ghost is the office of the priest and proper right of remission of sinnes standeth in the holie Ghost Thus wrote Saint Ambrose against the heretikes of his time and both toucheth and ouer ouercommeth all the falsehoode of our daies against the minesterie of man which so ioyneth Gods spirit in all these diuine functions that it cannot without blasphemie and special contempt of God be contemned FVLKE S. Ambr. helpeth your matter neuera whit if you be not content with a mynistery a seruise a power subiect to the wil of God But you wil be halfe gods and more then men you wil haue your persons deified you wil be able to exercise the proper works of God For S. Ambr. reasoneth against the Nouatians which would take vpō them to binde them that were fallen but would not loose them nor receue them againe into the Church vpon their repētance signifying that the power of the one is as wel graunted to the Church as of the other that it was as proper to God to reteine sinnes as it was to forgiue them so that if they renounced the one they must renounce the other also by the same reason for it is the proper right of the holie ghost to doe the one as well as the other And the Nouatian heretikes were found transgressours of Gods commaundement who willeth the repentant to be loosed as well as the obstinate offender to be bound Ambrose therefore sayeth nothing for the deifying of mens persons but for the executing of gods commaundement of mercy as well as of iustice ALLEN But I remember Saint Augustine the Churches great Captaine against her aduersaries of those daies did euer in disputation against the Pelagians and other like enemies of faith make the greatest accoumpt of victorie and their ouerthrow when they were driuen to denie that which euer before had beene not onelie acknowledged of all men for trueth but also had beene vsed as a graunted trueth ground and principle for the notable euidence thereof to the impugning of other falsehoodes For there can be no doubt but that which our holie Fathers did vse without controlling and contradiction euen of their aduersaries to impugne their aduersaries withall there is no doubt but that it hath in it selfe exceeding much light and force of trueth as a thing hauing so litle neede of proofe that it may be made and taken for a probation of other matters that be doubtefull and vncertaine The matter which we haue now in hand is of that sort For the authoritie and power practized of priests in the
spake So the charge both of preaching and babtizing was giuen to a fewe chosen men then present but that al the world might preceiue that of his wisdome careful prouidence the charge authoritie pertained to the gouernours of the Church for euer no lesse then to them whome he then called to that function he added I will be with you to the end of the world meaning that they should exercise that office in his name assistance to the daie of iudgement Which in their own persons was not true but in their successours For this cause it is no doubt but what authoritie soeuer Peter had alone aboue the residewe of his fellowes that the same is by all reason to be diriued from him to all his successours and that caused Chrysostome to saie that Christ shed his 〈◊〉 to winne the sheepe which he committed to Peter and his successours to feed where Christ in person presentlie spake but to Peter alone and yet because he knew the like gouernment was both necessarie after Peters death as well as in his time and no lesse by Christs appointement to be continued in the Church after as before the Doctours doubted not to enlarge Christes worde vttered to Peter alone to al them that sis cceeded in the same roome Vpon these most strong groundes euerie man plainlie may argue the like power yet to be in the Church of God in euerie case euen as Christ did institute at the beginning when he gaue the charge to the Apostles first For looke what forme of gouernement and order of the Church was thought vnto his wisedome to be best then the same must needes be best now I speake for the substance of thinges for by diuersities of time and person some alteration may rise in the circumstances Therefore if it were good at that time that one should be the generall Vicar of Christ and pastour of all the sheepe for which he shed his blessed blood it is good yet also if some had authoritie then to consecrate Christs body some haue the same power till this time if some then must needes baptize preach other some must now also do the same finally if certaine then had commission by Christ the holie ghost giuen them to remit sins therewith power by his word both to pardon punish to bind to loose it must by force of the foresaide argument necessarilie be induced that some at this date must haue the like office For els Christ could not continue the same power office in the Church which he for the Churches sake did first institute which he counted of his heauenlie wisedome moste necessarie for the Chucrhes gouernement But I think no man hath yet so shaken of shame and feare of God that he dare holde that Christ was not hable to mainteine all power rule and iurisaiction with all kinde of functions which he instituted for the benefite of the people till the worldes ende both him-selfe and the holie ghost promised to be present for that purpose till the generall iudgement And that those functions were necessarie for his euerlasting common wealth his solemne institution and carefull prouision of them doe declare that he meaneth no lesse to establish the same which he then instituted not onelie the foresaid reasons but that saying of Saint Paull doth prooue He gaue vnto the Church some to be Apostles some to be Prophets some to be Euangelists some to be Pastours and Doctours and all this to the worke and maintenaunce of the ministerie for the persiting of the Saints and vpholding of Christes bodie till the time of the acknowledgeing of Gods sonne Thus doth Christ prouide for his deare Church in all manner of seruice and office euen til the last daie Wherebie it is most cleare that the power of remission of sinnes beeing once giuen to the Church can neuer cease whiles man of his continuall frailtie ceaseth not to sinne That which was then counted a necessarie refuge and remedie for sinnes committed can not now perish in the worlde where sinne is a great deale more rife and the remedie more needefull FVLKE There was a certaine power committed to the Apostles to haue a generall charge to preache ouer all the world which ceased by their death as that which was proper to the office of the Apostleship But such power as they had for the building vp of particuler Churches by preaching administring the sacramentes and exercising of discipline is perpetuall and died not with the Apostles And this authoritie is deriued vnto them immediately from Christ and not from Peter And therfore you abuse the name of Chrisostome to make him witnes of your deriuation for he acknowledgeth Christ him selfe in the wordes by you alleadged to haue 〈◊〉 feeding of his sheep to Peters successors that is to all preistes which be successours of the Aposties as Saint Hierome saith no les then vnto Peter him selfe for they are not Peters commissaries but Christes embassadours ministers and dispensers That one should be general vicar of Christ pastour of al the sheepe for which he shed his blood it was neither good not possible and therefore he instituted many and no one with such singular authoritie as is pretended The bodie of Christ is of perfect holines and therefore needeth no consecration of men but there remaineth authoritie with the ministers of the Church to consecrate breade and wine to be the bodie and blood of Chist that is the sacrament signe or figure thereof Likewise to preach and baptize to excommunicate and to receiue againe And that for which you bring in the rest to remit and reteine sinnes according to the pleasure of God reuealed in his holie Ghospell whereof the true dispensours are appointed to be true and faithfull interpreters and declarers ALLEN But to conuince them plainlie that thinke contrarie let them tell me whether Thomas beeing not then present as the Euangelist saith and therefore the wordes not vttered to him in person let them shew me whether he had not afterwarde by force of that institution power also to remit sinnes If he had as by reason I am sure they cannot denie as full preheminence and power to doe all thinges that then Christ charged his ten Disciples which were present to do in his name then the power of remission of sinnes was not so streightlie limited as the words might seeme to be vttered by which no doubt a sacramen was instituted to take force in the Church both then afterward to the worlds ende not that any man may of his owne head vpon force onelie of Christs commission giuen at that time to his Apostles take that high function vpon him but that he which ordinarilie shall be called by receiuing of grace and the holie Ghost in externall sacrament by laying on of handes of Priesthoode may likewise vpon his owne flocke and cure exercise that office no lesse then those holie men might after Christes calling thereunto occupie the
the leprous persons that is to say should onely discerne which were by God remitted or not remitted they could not that doo excepte they sawe the varietie of the saide sinnes by mans confession But now seeing they haue further interest in our matters and must properly both pardon and giue iust penaunce for sinne how is it possible they should doo this without exacte knowlege of entry of oure greeuous offences In deed a general confession such as is often made in diuine seruice to God or his priestes such as be Catholik doth some times take away the common infirmities of our sinfull life that our light trespasses be not imputed to vs or such as we haue so forgotten that we cannot by anie conuenient search call againe to our remembrance But other greater crimes and deadly sinnes for which the sacrament of discipline was instituted and the priestes iudgement seat erected in the Church are not discharged before God without seuerall contrition and distinct confession with readie in tent of the penitent to accomplish such fruites of penance as by the priest shall be appointed for the satisfying for his sinnes And what a marucilous disorder is brought into Christes Church by plaine flatterie of our selues herein whiles we holde that this generall confession is sufficient we see by experience of these our euill daies where there is now put no difference betwixt small offenders and most greeuous sinners no diuersitie of penance no more sorrow in one then in other no confession of the most wicked no more then of the smallest sinner or most honest liuer A common murtherer a filthie whoremunger a dailie drunkerd a false robber a greedie extorcioner confes as litle do as litle penance lament as litle yea a great deale lesse then the honest sort of people do for much more small and fewer faultes All men repose them-selues now of daies so much in Christes passion and there onelie no faith that they will neither confesse to God nor man neither sigh nor sorrow nor do satisfaction for their sinnes Well let all men be assured that God in the next world will not go by general Chapters but will haue an accompt of all our proper works and misdeedes till it come to our idle words and vaine thoughtes The which iudgement because Gods Church and ministers sentence to whome Christ gaue all iudgement of our sinnes in earth doth most cleerelie resemble we maie be out of doubt that the like particular discussing and examination of our owne selues here before his ministers must needes be had that we be not iudged of our Lord in the life to come FVLKE By seeing the varietie of sinnes though the Priest could see them as clearlie as he that committed them yea though he were present at the doing of them and did see all the circumstances of them he could neuer discerne which were by God remitted or not remitted except he could see the repentance of the sins according to which God doth either remitte or retain sinnes Therefore confession to this purpose is neither necessarie nor profitable For the further interest you claime you must bring better euidence then he therto you haue shewed forth or els we maie neuer yeelde it vnto you And greatlie I maruaile how you can affirme that the Priest can properlie pardon sinne when he can not to anie man pronounce pardon of his sinne except he be true lie contrite and penitent before god God onelie and the partie penitent are priuy to the con trition of his heart which in an Hipocrit with a thousand confessions maie be dissembled And I trow you will not saie that without vnfained contrition of the heart the priest maie pardon a sinner The doctrine of your masters is but with condition if the partie be contrite without counterfayting therefore he that can not pardon absolutely can much les pardon properlie Where you make generall confession auailable either for small and light offences or else for greater sinnes forgotten you speake without proofe and therefore your authoritite may be denied without doubt The disorder you speake of for lacke of shrift was greater when most mé went to shrift and not fearing the iugdement seat of God and thought they were sufficientlie discharged of their sinnes if they had powred them out into a priests lape or friers coule God be praised they that repose them selues moste in Christs passion and by the merites thereof beleeue to receiue forgiuenes of sinnes by faith in his bloode are more ready to confesse their vnworthines both before God man then any popish hypocrite that trusteth in the merit of his workes and his owne satisfaction for his sinnes and doe more sigh and sorrow for their sinnes although they be such as mans lawe cannot punish although they were knowne then they that whisper halfe an hower in a priestes eare for the sinnes of one whole yeare whereas one howers offences if they were particularie called to minde and repeated would aske longer time to confesse them We know that in the next world God will haue an account of al our misdeeds euen to our idle words thoughts therfore our wholl life ought to be a continuall meditation and profession of repentance yet we know by his word and assurance ofhis spirit that the same infinit multitude heape of our sinnes shal not be laid to our charge because out sauiour Christ is the lambe of God that hath taken them awaie and satisfied the iustice of God for them That Christ hath giuen al iudgement of our sinnes in earth to his Church and the ministers thereof you often affirme thereupon build vp your court of confession but by what wordes this may be prooued you are neuer able to shew For that text whose sinnes you forgiue c. imporeth no such manner of iudgement but an authoritie to pronunce a sentence declaratorie of Gods mercie in pardoning all them that trulie repent and of his iustice in punishing all them that obstinatly refuse the grace of God offered in the preaching of the Ghospel The examining iudgeing of our selues whch the Apostle requireth that we be not iudged of the Lord vrgeth vs not to commit our selues to the examination iudgement of othermen but to a diligent discussing of our owne conscience before god that we come not with hypocrisie or without dew regard of his presence and benefites to the participation of his sacraments ALLEN And this particular discussing Saint Paull meant when he commended vnto the Corinthians and by them commaunded all Christian men to prooue trie and iudge themselues especiallie afore the receipt of the blessed sacrament of Christes bodie and blood which requireth moste puritie of life in the receiuer that can be For to attempt to receiue the holie bodie of Christ before we haue in contrite manner confessed our selues and purged our consciences by the iudgement of Christes Church of the guilt of deadlie sinne is exceeding damnable to vs and much dishonour to
of the Primitiue Church or to disprooue Beatus Rhenanus which denieth the same accusing both the noueltie and and the tyranie thereof and the danger that mens consciences haue beene in through it beside manie other knowne inconueniences ALLEN But now if you conferre with the Fathers of all ages and of euerie notable Church touching this confession to Gods Priests you may beginne if you list euen at this daie and driue vp both the trueth of the doctrine and the perpetuall practise thereof euen to the Apostles time In the late holie Council holden at Trent both the doctrine is confirmed and declared with all grauitie and also the aduersaries of that sacrament and the misconstructers of Christes wordes of remission to pertaine to preaching of the Gospell not to the verie act of absolution be by the consent of all Catholike states of the Christian world accursed excommunicated It was at Furence also decreed in a most generall assemblie of both the Latine and Greek Church that as wel the whol sacrament of penance as that especiall part which is called confession was of Christes institution In the great councell holden at Lateran there is so plaine charge giuen to euerie Christian to confesse his sinnes either to his owne ordinarie Parochian or to some other Priest that hath by him or otherwise authoritie and iurisdiction ouer the penitent that Protestantes affirme albeit verie false'y that confession was first instituted in the said Councel and this was more then three hundred yeares since And foure hundred yeares before that in a Prouinciall Councell that was kept at Vormacia there is a Canon made concerning the qualities of the priests that are constituted to be confessours and Penitentiaries where it is commaunded that they be such Qui possunt singulorum causas originem quoque modum culparum sigillatim considerare examinare That can particularlie trie out and examine the causes of euerie offender the manner and ground of their faultes FVLKE We are so well accquainted with your often bragges of Fathers and Councells that we neuer start for them seeing we knowe you haue nothing but the drosse of the latter times to cast at vs. For the Councell of Trentes decree we esteeme it as it is worthie being made by a few buckeram Bishoppes of Italie and some other Epicurian prelates of other countries to patch vp rather then to repaire the ruines and decaies of the kingdome of Antichrist In the late Councel of Florence I remember nothing decreed of this matter neither doe you note where we should finde it In the Lateran Councell that was kept litle more then 300. yeares since the Protestantes doe trulie affirme that the necessitie of auricular confession was first imposed vpon men of the Romish Church For in the councell of Wormes which you saie was 400 yeares elder there is neuer a word of confession or confessor but of wife consideration to be had of them that did penance by which are ment open offenders that did open pennance neither are you able to prooue the contrarie Paenitentibue saith the Canon serundum differentiam peccatorum c. To the penitents or such as doe penance let penance be decreed by the iudgement of the Priest according to the difference of their sinnes Therefore in giuing penance the Priest ought seuerallie to consider the causer of euerie one the beginning also manner of the faulies and diligentlie to examine and manifestlie to know the affection and sighings of the offenders also to consider the qualities of the times persons of the places ages that according to the consideration of the places ages or times or according to the qualitie of the offences the groning of euery offendor he turne not his eies from the holie rules Thus sarre the Canon after which follow the rules of penance to be apointed for diuers kindes of offences as for him that hath killed a Priest a pagane his parents or brother or for him that hath slain a man in his madnes or against his will and such like whereby it appeereth that the Canon was made for penance to be enioyned to publike offenders and not to compell men to confesse their secret sinnes ALLEN Which decree is borowed word for word almoste out of the last Canon of Constantinople Councell called the sixth generall which was long before all the forsaid Synodes Their discourse is long vpon the Priestes dutie which shoulde sitte on confessions whome they instruct by these wordes Oportebit qui facultatem absoluendi ligandi à Deo receperunt peccati qualitatem speculentur peccatoris promptitudinem ad reuersionem vt sic medicamentum admoueant aegritudini aptum ne si de peccato sine discrimine statuant aberrent à salute aegrotantis Those that haue receiued of our Lorde power to loose and binde must trie out the qualitie of euerie fault and the readines of the offender to returne vnto vertue that they maie prouide a medicine meet to the maladie lest if they should without distinct knowledge of their sinne giue iudgement they should erre in poruiding health for the sicke person By which Councell kept in Constantinople you maie easelie gather that neither confession was euer omitted by the lawe nor the common Penitentiarie long abrogated out of Constaninople Church And when I name these decrees of so manie generall Councels in diu rfe ages I do not onelie call them generallie to witnesse for my cause which were inough seeing euerie determination there passeth as by the sentence of the holie Ghoste and Christes owne iudgement of whose presence such hotie assemblance is assured but I appeale to eueric holy Bishop Priest and Prince of the world that agreed to the same and were there assembled euerie of which was of more experience learning and vertue or at the least of more humilitie then all our aduersaries aliue But now if you go to trie other the learned writers of all times for the practize of this point then our labour shall be infinite but our cause more strong and 〈◊〉 aduersaries sooner confounded I need not for that practize name the learned schoolemem of excellent capacitie in deepe mysteries because they were so late and because Heretikes can not denie but they are all vndoubtedlie against them and euerie one for vs Thomas Aquinas is ours Dionysius is ours I meane the Carthusian If anie man doubt of Saint Bernard let him reade the life of Malachie whome he praiseth sor bringing into vre the most profitable vse of confession in the rude partes of Ireland Saint Bede is prooued before not onelie to haue allowed confession to the Priest but to haue expounded Saint Iames wordes of confession for the sacrament of pennance and vttering our sinnes to Gods Ministers And he recordeth that in our Countrie of England before his daies confession was vsed to a Priest Whereof as also os pennance and satisfaction there is an example or two in the
they be but thinges indifferent you doe not wiselie to be contentious about them Finallie seeing a companie of heretikes maie erre in one article and teach soundlie in all other as the Arians Donatists Nouatians and such like a man maie followe the iudgement of such a companie in all other points and without follie or signe of fantasticall choise departe from them in that one wherein they erre And therefore your faith was as good as his that beleeueth there is a man in the moone because he heareth manie men saie so whome he dare credit in other matters and is loth to forsake them in this ' one But your Christian profession mooued you to follow the Churches iudgement in all things And what heretike will not saie as much without triall or proofe which is the Church or what is Christian profession Therefore what ground had you that your profession was Christian or your felowship the Church of Christ You confesse you had neither the determination of generall councells nor the decrees of the chife gouernours of your Church nor the practise of the people in diuers ages by which waies you saie the Churches meaning of doubtfull thinges is moste assuredlie knowne but onelie you deeme the Church allowed them So that you because such as bare the name of Christian folke and Catholike men did approoue them had nothing but the bare name of Christian folke and Catholike men to ground your deeme vpon And is the bare and onelie name of Christian and Catholike men so sure a ground to build faith vpon without either the authoritie of the scriptures reason determination of general councels or decrees of the chief gouernours of the same or the practise of the faithful in auncient times then surelie Iet all heretikes content themselues where they are and dwell togither for there they shall haue the name of Christian folke and Catholike men which you account to be the breefest rule in the worlde for an vnlearned man to keepe himselfe both in faith and conuersation with that companie which by the generall and common calling of the people be named Catholikes The rule indeed is verie briefe and you saie in the margent also that it is good But who I praie you prescribeth this rule doth God the author of trueth where finde you it in his worde shall the generall and common calling of the people be the vnlearned mans rule to direct him to the Church which is the piller and staie of truth then surelie the vnlearned Grecians Aethiopians Armenians and other that dissent from the Church of Rome and from the truth it selfe haue a good and briefe rule to holde them where they are for by the generall and common calling of the people in those partes of the world they be named Christians and Catholikes Yea the rule serueth them ten times better then you Papists the forgers of it for they haue the more generall and common calling of the people to be Catholikes in those places then you haue here in Europe by a hundred parts For there no man calleth them otherwise then Christians and Catholikes here you haue God be praised many hundreth thousandes of the people that commonlie call you Papists heretikes antichristians Cacolikes and such other names agreeing to your heresies If you will cauill that by the generall and common calling of the people they be not named Catholikes because you Papistes doe neither so call them nor count them they maie answere you by the same reason that you are not by generall common calling of the people named Catholikes because neither they nor we doe so call you or account you But it is fufficient belike that you call your selues so and the rule is to be restrained to people of these partes of the world and among them to Papists onelie and so it is as good a rule as that aske my fellow if I be a theefe A good rule indeed for vnlearned Papists because draffe is good enough for swine which had rather sleepe in the myre and puddle of ignorance then come to the knowledge of the truth by searching the scriptures in which Christ the waie the truth and the life is to be found and out of which all Christians ought to gather knowledge that they maie be able to giue account of that hope that is in them But Saint Augustine I wene should be author of this rule for vnlearned men although he himselfe were not vnlearned Contra epistolam Manichaei quam vocant fundamenti Cap 4. This is great impietie to faine so absurd a rule and then to slaunder so godly a father to be either the author or approouer therof For Saint Augustine indeed against the Maniches which were a particuler sect of heretikes confesseth that among manie other thinges the name of the Catholike Church did holde him in the bosome thereof but not that the onelie name of Catholikes was a good rule for vnlearned men to know the Church by But protesting to reason the matter with them without anie preiudice and to trie the trueth without anie rashnes as one willing to yeald vnto thē if they can perswade him with trueth so that they shall not require him to yeald before they can giue him a cleere reason without anie darkenes of allthinges pertaining to the saluation of his soule thus he beginneth In Catholica enim Ecclesia vt omittā c. For in the Catholike Church that I maie omitte that moste sincere wisdome vnto the knowledge where of a fewe spirituall men doe come in this life that they maie knowe it but of the lest part because they are men but yet without doubt for the rest of the multitude not the quicknes of vnderstanding but the simplicitie of beleeuing doeth make moste false Therefore that I maie omitte this wisdome which you beleeue not to be in the Catholike Church there are manie other thinges which maie moste iustlie holde me in her lappe The consent of people and nations holdeth me the authoritie begunne with miracles nourished with hope increased with charitie confirmed with antiquitie holdeth me The succession of Priests from the verie seate of Peter the Apostle to whome our Lorde after his resurrection commended his sheeepe to be fedde vnto this present bishoprike doeth holde me last of all the verie name of Catholike Church doth holde me which not without cause among so manie heresies this Church alone hath so obtained that whereas all heretikes would haue themselues to be called Catholikes yet to a straunger that asketh where men meet at the Catholike Church none of the heretikes dare shewe either their owne Church or house Therfore these so manie so great most deare bondes of Christian name doe rightlie holde a man that beleeueth in the Catholike Church although for the dulnes of our vnderstanding or the desert of our life the tructh doth not yet shewe it selfe moste openlie But among you where none of these things is that maie inuite or holde me there soundeth nothing
building But as it was last inuented for none of the auncient Church for a thousand yeares and more euer heard of it so you haue done well to thrust it vnto the last end of your booke And first you beginne with an obiection vpon your owne ground that for answering of Gods iustice there remaineth a temporall paine after sinne remitted But because the obiection is such as you are neuer able to answer so well your principles of popery hang one vpon another you couer the hardest point and will not let it appeare namelie that Gods iustice requireth punishment of the partie him selfe that offended for satisfying his iustice which was not satisfied by the death and obedience of Christ which if it be true then can there be no remission by any other meanes sauing the iustice of God but by the parties owne suffering Yet let vs see how you auoid the obiection io fauourablie set downe for your seife to answer you saie that Gods iustice is otherwise satisfied by the aboundant satisfactiō made by Christ vpon the crosse and by the merites of his saints If this be true then is the other principle false that Gods iustice requireth temporall punishment of the partie for the recompence of Christs satisfaction and saints merites is not the parties owne punishment wherefore as in the obiection you runne from Christes most perfect satisfaction so in the answere you runne from the obiection which is no answer or satisfaction The scripture is plaine that the blood of Christ purgeth vs from all sinne and Christ by one oblation hath made perfect for euer those that are sanctified he hath once entred into the holie place by his owne blood and found eternall redemption The satisfaction for sinne the purging of vnrightcousnes the perfecting of the saints and euerlasting redemption can abide no reseruation of punishment either temporall or eternall in which the iustice of god is throughlie answered by the obedience and suffering of Christ whose stripes hauing healed vs there remaineth no suffering of our part for satisfying of his iustice And you confesse that there is a sufficient value in the suffering of Christ for the taking awaie of all temporall punishment if it be well applied by the Pope So that Christes redemption was but a power of redeeming and not an act of redemption a power depending vpon the will of man to applie according to his pleasure as you were wount to speake and not according to Gods determination and eternal election And so you robbe Christ of the effect of his death passion by which he obteined eternal redemptiō for al gods elect to enrich the pope with a treasure infinit and vnspendable for that word youlent me before which he might bestow and dispense at his pleasure But let vs a litle enter into your storehouse see what tresure there is and how you came by it First you tell vs of the infinite abilitie and the inestimable valew of euerie drop of Christes bloode c. to satisfie all debt due for all sinne and al paine for the same and yet you alow to the act and effect of his bloodie sacrifice the value but of halfe a drop denying the same to haue satisfied Gods iustice for temporall paine all the rest you claime for the treasure of the Popish Church which dreame was neuer hard of before the Iubilie graunted by Boneface the 8. in the glosse wherof it was first deuised where it is saied that pardons are founded vpon the merits of Christ and taken out of it Passio namque Christi excessiua fuit vnde excessus vocatur in Luca vbi dicitur quod in transfiguratione Christi apparuerunt Moses Elias cùm eo dicebans excessum quem completurus erat in Ierusalem vnica enim guita sanguinis tam preciost suffecisset pro redemptione totiu mundi Nam propter coniunctionem humanitatis cùm diuinitate 〈◊〉 passio Christi perpessa pro redemptione nostra habebat precium infinitum Noluit autem Christus quod excessus isie frustra fuisset quod de nihilo nobis 〈◊〉 sed volait quod esset Thesaurus Ecclesiae per suum vicarium Ro pontificem pro fidelibus loco tempore dispensandus dispensatur autem cum eis indulgentiae conceduntur For the passion of Christ was excessiue whereof also in Saint Luke it is called an excesse where it is said that in the transfiguration of Christ appeered Moses and Elias with him and they spake of the excesse which he should fullfil at Ierusalem For one drop of so precious blood might haue sufficed for the redemption of the wholl worlde For because of the coniunction of the humanity with the diuinitie neuer so small a suffering of Christ suffered for our redemption had an infinit price But Christ would not that this excesse should be in vaine and that it should serve vs for nothing but he would that it should be the treasure of the Church to be bestowed by his vicar the Bishop of Rome in time and place for the faithfull and it is bestowed when pardons are graunted to thē Marke vpon what text this treasure is grounded and how clarkely it is expounded Moses and Elias talked with Christ of his departure out of this life which he should finish at Ierusalem this departure being termed in the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the Latine excessum this Doctor interpreteth to be an excesse or superfluitie of the passion of Christ the ouerplus whereof lest it should be in vaine and serue for nothing is made the treasure of the Church to be dispensed by the pope But who wil graunt such excesse or superfluitie of the passion of Christ as you imagine or that neuer so small a suffering of Christ had beene sufficient for the redemption of the wholl worlde which if it were graunted seeing Christ from his infancie snffered many things for vs euerie one of them might haue beene our redemption and so the sacrifice of Christs death was vnnecessarie for our redemption So that his blood shed in his circumcision and much more in his scourging crowning with thorne had bin infinitely more thē enough although he had not suffered death and shed his blood on the crosse Againe as it doth moste excellentlie set forth the iustice and mercie of God to the euerlasting comfort of the faithfull that Christ by his obedience and suffering did moste perfectlie satisfie the one and moste plentifullie purchase the other to the eternall redemption and euerlasting felicitie of all Gods elect so it is against the iustice of god that he should require that his sonne should suffer infinitlie more then was needeful to answere his iustice work a perfect redēption as this glossary dreame of the Popish Churches treasure doth imagine Neither doth the argument of the coniunction of the humanitie with the diuinitie prooue anie such matter But if that were graunted by what scripture is the infinite ouerplus made a treasure of
argument he asketh him what he can laie against these witnesses As though it were not the easiest thing in the worlde to answere that all these though the noblest the best and worthiest of credit in their time yet were to far distant from the place where he liued to be eie witnesses of his naughty behauiour And therfore whatsoeuer they did write must needes proceede from the false suggestion of his enemies Where otherwise it is not credible that the Duke of Saxonie vnder whom Luther liued if he had known him to be so vile a person would haue suffered him to liue much les would haue reformed religion according to his preaching From Luther thus summoned to appeare he taketh vpon him as the Pythonesse plaied with Samuell to call vp Caluine out of hell to confesse that he kept a Nunne fiue yeares in his chamber vntill she was great with childe by him and that he married her to an Apostata channon that dwelled at Lausanna And this he saith that all the world knoweth If you aske him by what testimonie he produceth a slaunderous libellintituled passauant Parisien printed at Paris 1559. Against the falsehood whereof which neuer deserued credit with anie reasonable man the wholl citie of Geneua is readie to giue testimonie vnder their common seale if neede were that there was neuer any colour of such a slaunder so impudentlie deuised which in deed sufficientlie confuteth it selfe that in so manie yeares and among so manie enemies as Caluine had both in that city and abrode it could neuer be broched vntill the yeare 1559 which was 24. yeares after his comming to Geneua which vile slaunder Fowler in the description of his infamous picture setterh forth with blasphemous abusing of the holy name of the Gospell to signifie the most vile and filthie act of lecherie From Caluine our Frarine passeth to Beza whome with like impudencie he burdeneth with two hainous crimes and yet so confidentlie that he doubteth not to speake vnto him in these wordes Denie if thou dare Theodore Beza denie if thou canst for shame Would you not thinke he had manifest proofes of the crimes in such sorte obiected Let vs heare then what they are First he chargeth Beza to haue sold his eccleslasticall liuinges which he had in Fraunce before his departure to two diuers men for readie monié For which double dealing he was denounced excommunicate and so proclaimed in all the market places of Parris To prooue this crime he quoteth in the margent the preface of Bezaes confession But in that preface Beza indeed cōfesseth that the reuenewes of those Church liuinges which his friendes had procured for him were a great let to him for a long season to make open confession of his faith from the sweetnes of which gaine as a filthie dogg from greasie leather he could hardlie be driuen awaie vntill almightie God by an extreame sicknes so waked him out of that securitie that immediatlie after his first recouerie he left at once his countrie Parents and friendes and departed with his wife vnto Geneua But of selling his benefices in such an vnhonest manner there is no mention but contrariwise in the same preface he defieth all the world for any other crime of dishonestie then the setting forth of certaine wanton verses which were made when he was a child and printed while he was vnder the age of twentie yeares The second crime obiected is that he maried an other mans wife who was a tailor dwelling in Harpe street at Paris whome Master Charkes Censurer out of Bolsec affirmeth to haue dwelt in the Calender street that you maie know how wel the witnesses agree togither with further slaunderrs as that shee was called of Beza Mistres Candidae or mistres Bewtie in his bawdie verses Whereas it is well knowne that Beza in that poeticall fiction deuised after the imitation of auncient Poets meant no special person and least of all could meane his wife for that in those verses he commendeth Candidae being great with childe to the Gods Whereas his wife neuer had anie childe by him Further he saith that shee fled to the stewes because her husband hauing taken her in adultery had giuen her a gash with a knife in the hippe A pretie inuention if the gash had bene in her face or in anie other part of her bodie that might haue bene seene with honestie some or other should haue beene witnes of the scarre and therefore it is placed where none for shame might demaund the sight for triall An other cause of her flight vnto the stewes was as he saith because she had bene put in prison for that she fetched a friscoll when she was dawnsing in a tauerne with her customers said Hoigh one leape more for all Christian soules A sorie cause why she should flie to the comme stewes because shee had beene imprisoned Is it not more like if any such thing had beene or if shee had beene willing to depart from her husband that shee hauing so many customers as this tale pretendeth and specially Beza who could spend seuen hundred crownes by the yeare as he confesseth would not haue sought aid of him or them rather then to haue cast her selfe into a place of such publike infamie But all this fable is vtterlie denied of Beza as containing no sparke of trueth for his wife whom he maried priuilie in Paris in the presence of one or two onelie of his friendes was of so godlie and honest behauionr that she would not consent to the match but vpon expresse promise and condition that assone as he could conuenientlie al impediments set asside he should carie her into the Church of God and openlie confirme the matrimonie betweene them and also that in the meane time he should enter into none of the Popish orders both which conditions he faithfullie performed Here isnothing therefore brought against Beza or his vertuous wife but accusations without witnes slaunders without proofe lies without colour or shew of trueth The like I saie of that generall railing which followeth both against the schollers of this gospellish congregation as he scornefullie termeth them and the Mistres of the same whose wickednes in all kinde of horrible sinnes he affirmeth to be so great that if the lot had bin betweene the Protestantes and the papists which order of iustice he wisheth had bin obserued that whether haue most wickedly trāsgressed gods and mans laws should haue gone first to the gallowes there had not beene one Protestant left aliue to holde warre against the Papists I am ashamed to vse any wordes in confutation of such a monstrous a lie which no eninmie of the Protestantes being in his right wittes doth thinke in his conscience to bere any credit or similitude of trueth Many called Protestantes haue beene wicked liuers but that all should be condemned in capitall crimes beyond the moste wicked of the Papists it is too beyond measure a moste pestilent but yet a riduculous slaunder But