may_v look_v in_o poss_n bibl_n select_v lib._n 8._o cap._n 32._o nor_o do_v i_o see_v what_o that_o mean_v that_o you_o say_v of_o man_n that_o live_v for_o outward_a thing_n in_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n where_o they_o dwell_v for_o if_o it_o be_v so_o that_o they_o may_v make_v show_n of_o one_o thing_n outward_o and_o mean_v a_o other_o inward_o as_o i_o see_v not_o what_o you_o can_v mean_v else_o than_o i_o say_v it_o be_v the_o most_o damnable_a &_o dangerous_a dissimulation_n of_o all_o other_o &_o the_o most_o sure_a way_n not_o to_o be_v save_v in_o any_o religion_n for_o neither_o the_o outward_a profession_n of_o a_o religion_n without_o the_o inward_a belief_n nor_o inward_a belief_n with_o a_o outward_a contrary_a profession_n can_v save_v a_o man_n what_o then_o be_v it_o you_o will_v say_v a_o man_n may_v see_v you_o be_v in_o strait_n fain_o you_o will_v not_o go_v absolute_o against_o that_o which_o many_o protestant_n say_v that_o a_o catholic_a may_v be_v 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from_o the_o protestant_n or_o any_o other_o sect_n therefore_o the_o knight_n chief_a answer_n to_o the_o argument_n be_v a_o plain_a denial_n that_o a_o papist_n can_v be_v save_v especial_o in_o england_n or_o in_o any_o protestant_a state_n where_o there_o be_v a_o course_n take_v to_o bring_v he_o to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o contrary_a though_o yet_o he_o do_v not_o pronounce_v damnation_n on_o our_o person_n as_o he_o say_v we_o do_v on_o he_o but_o wherein_o do_v we_o pronounce_v damnation_n upon_o their_o person_n more_o than_o he_o on_o we_o he_o and_o other_o of_o his_o opinion_n say_v our_o doctrine_n be_v damnable_a and_o consequent_o that_o no_o man_n can_v be_v save_v by_o it_o we_o say_v the_o same_o of_o his_o doctrine_n and_o that_o no_o man_n can_v be_v save_v by_o it_o for_o this_o or_o that_o particular_a man_n we_o do_v not_o take_v upon_o we_o to_o give_v any_o absolute_a judgement_n but_o that_o we_o leave_v to_o god_n 6._o but_o now_o for_o that_o which_o he_o say_v of_o we_o that_o we_o can_v be_v save_v and_o that_o it_o be_v far_o from_o the_o thought_n of_o good_a man_n to_o think_v the_o point_n of_o controversy_n between_o catholic_n and_o protestant_n to_o be_v of_o a_o inferior_a alloy_n so_o as_o a_o man_n may_v hold_v either_o way_n without_o peril_n of_o salvation_n i_o will_v appeal_v only_o to_o his_o own_o man_n and_o to_o such_o as_o i_o presume_v he_o will_v not_o deny_v to_o be_v good_a man_n at_o lest_o chief_a man_n of_o his_o own_o church_n for_o the_o point_n therefore_o in_o controversy_n as_o frewill_n prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a honour_v of_o relic_n real_a presence_n transubstantiation_n communion_n in_o one_o or_o both_o kind_n worship_v of_o image_n the_o pope_n primacy_n his_o be_v vicar_n of_o christ_n and_o head_n of_o the_o church_n auricular_a confession_n and_o the_o like_a they_o be_v all_o acknowledge_v some_o by_o one_o some_o by_o another_o not_o to_o be_v material_a point_n so_o as_o a_o man_n may_v without_o peril_n believe_v either_o way_n and_o one_o main_a point_n to_o wit_n the_o real_a praesence_n be_v say_v by_o some_o to_o be_v but_o as_o it_o be_v the_o grudge_n of_o a_o little_a ague_n the_o several_a author_n be_v perkins_n cartwright_n whitgift_n fulke_n penry_n some_o spark_n reynolds_n bunny_n whitaker_n john_n frith_n in_o fox_n in_o his_o act_n and_o other_o english_a writer_n beside_o melancthon_n luther_n and_o other_o latin_a writer_n who_o name_n may_v be_v see_v in_o the_o protestant_n apology_n where_o their_o very_a word_n be_v set_v down_o 14._o protest_v apolog_fw-la tr_fw-la 2._o cap._n 2._o sect._n 14._o and_o place_n of_o their_o work_n exact_o cite_v which_o therefore_o for_o brevitye_n sake_n i_o omit_v here_o to_o do_v and_o shall_v only_o content_v myself_o with_o cite_v some_o for_o the_o other_o point_n which_o the_o knight_n deni_v to_o wit_n that_o we_o may_v be_v save_v first_o note_v by_o the_o way_n that_o here_o be_v a_o full_a jury_n of_o good_a man_n and_o true_a in_o the_o judgement_n of_o any_o protestant_n who_o give_v up_o their_o verdict_n against_o our_o good_a knight_n sir_n humphrey_n as_o honest_a a_o middlessex_n juror_n as_o his_o father_n be_v and_o as_o great_a a_o friend_n of_o jurye_n as_o he_o be_v confess_v the_o point_n in_o controversy_n to_o be_v of_o a_o inferior_a alloy_n to_o keep_v his_o own_o word_n of_o art_n and_o which_o be_v special_o to_o be_v note_v whereas_o a_o main_n reason_n why_o our_o knight_n be_v loath_a to_o yield_v the_o point_n in_o controversy_n to_o be_v matter_n of_o indifferency_n be_v because_o the_o fresh_a bleed_a wound_n of_o the_o martyr_n of_o his_o church_n witness_v the_o danger_n of_o our_o religion_n among_o these_o author_n there_o be_v one_o john_n frith_n a_o famous_a foxian_a martyr_n who_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o matter_n touch_v the_o substance_n of_o the_o sacrament_n bind_v no_o man_n of_o necessity_n to_o salvation_n or_o damnation_n whether_o he_o believe_v it_o or_o not_o and_o the_o like_o the_o same_o man_n also_o say_v of_o prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a which_o mr._n john_n fox_n relate_v and_o not_o disapprove_v he_o be_v to_o be_v presume_v to_o approve_v and_o so_o both_o the_o martyr_n frith_n and_o fox_n the_o martyr-maker_n who_o authority_n i_o think_v shall_v be_v more_o worth_a than_o a_o hundred_o of_o his_o martyr_n be_v against_o our_o knight_n and_o notwithstanding_o all_o their_o bleed_a wound_n and_o suffering_n will_v give_v he_o leave_v to_o think_v his_o point_n of_o controversy_n to_o be_v of_o a_o inferior_a alloy_n and_o many_o of_o they_o not_o only_o so_o but_o even_o absolute_o condemn_v his_o very_a belief_n and_o doctrine_n as_o a_o man_n may_v see_v full_o prove_v in_o the_o examen_fw-la of_o john_n fox_n his_o calendar_n to_o which_o i_o remit_v he_o content_v myself_o with_o one_o only_a martyr_n who_o i_o presume_v our_o knight_n will_v acknowledge_v for_o a_o great_a one_o to_o wit_n 5._o v._o 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say_v thus_o it_o be_v not_o incredible_a that_o some_o such_o thing_n shall_v be_v after_o this_o life_n but_o whether_o it_o be_v so_o or_o no_o it_o may_v be_v a_o question_n you_o say_v also_o for_o the_o place_n where_o it_o be_v or_o how_o long_a soul_n continue_v there_o whither_o there_o be_v fire_n or_o water_n or_o whither_o material_a fire_n or_o no_o there_o be_v nothing_o certain_a among_o we_o you_o cite_v sir_n thomas_n more_o bishop_n fisher_n and_o bellarmine_n who_o word_n i_o pass_v over_o as_o needless_a and_o than_o you_o tell_v we_o that_o s._n greg._n who_o give_v the_o first_o credo_fw-la to_o purgatory_n say_v some_o be_v purge_v by_o fire_n some_o by_o hot_a bath_n and_o upon_o certain_a apparition_n and_o revelation_n relate_v by_o he_o and_o s._n bede_n you_o say_v it_o be_v come_v to_o be_v a_o article_n of_o faith_n but_o you_o conclude_v with_o a_o place_n of_o s._n aug._n quite_o against_o purgatory_n 1._o lib._n de_fw-fr vaâ—it_fw-la saecul_fw-la â—ap_n 1._o where_o he_o say_v that_o when_o the_o soul_n be_v separate_v from_o the_o body_n present_o it_o be_v either_o place_v in_o paradise_n for_o its_o good_a work_n or_o cast_v into_o hell_n for_o its_o sin_n i_o answer_v that_o you_o still_o go_v abuse_v s._n aug._n who_o be_v so_o plain_a for_o purgatory_n that_o no_o catholic_a now_o live_v can_v be_v more_o plain_a and_o in_o this_o very_a book_n of_o his_o enchiridion_n and_o place_n by_o you_o cite_v he_o be_v so_o plain_a that_o one_o mr._n anthony_n alcocke_n a_o zealous_a disciple_n as_o it_o seem_v translate_n it_o into_o english_a be_v fain_o to_o write_v certain_a animadversion_n upon_o the_o 110._o chapter_n wherein_o he_o confess_v s._n aug._n his_o opinion_n here_o for_o purgatory_n but_o he_o labour_v to_o obscure_v his_o meaning_n or_o reconcile_v he_o by_o fetch_v other_o place_n as_o wise_o and_o well_o to_o the_o purpose_n as_o you_o be_v wont_a to_o do_v but_o to_o be_v brief_a with_o you_o that_o which_o s._n aug._n say_v may_v be_v a_o question_n be_v not_o of_o purgatory_n or_o the_o be_v of_o purgatory_n as_o you_o say_v most_o line_v like_o but_o of_o the_o manner_n of_o pain_n as_o whether_o even_o as_o man_n be_v here_o trouble_v in_o this_o world_n more_o or_o less_o with_o the_o loss_n of_o worldly_a thing_n as_o they_o more_o or_o less_o love_v they_o which_o trouble_n or_o tribulation_n s._n aug._n explicate_v to_o be_v that_o fire_n whereof_o s._n paul_n speak_v say_v that_o those_o that_o build_v hay_n straw_n stubble_n &c._n &c._n shall_v be_v save_v as_o it_o be_v by_o fire_n whether_o i_o say_v man_n be_v so_o punish_v in_o purgatory_n this_o s._n aug._n do_v not_o determine_v but_o whether_o there_o be_v a_o purgatory_n or_o no_o 110._o enchir._n cap._n 110._o let_v any_o man_n judge_v since_o he_o say_v there_o neque_fw-la negandum_fw-la est_fw-la defunctorum_fw-la animas_fw-la etc._n etc._n neither_o be_v it_o to_o be_v deny_v that_o the_o soul_n of_o the_o dead_a be_v relieve_v by_o the_o piety_n of_o their_o friend_n live_v when_o the_o sacrifice_n of_o our_o mediator_n be_v offer_v for_o they_o or_o alm_n give_v in_o the_o church_n dead_a note_v here_o 3._o or_o 4._o controversy_n decide_v in_o this_o one_o sentence_n of_o s._n aug._n satisfaction_n mass_n purgatory_n prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a and_o there_o he_o also_o distinguish_v 3._o sort_n of_o dead_a people_n some_o in_o heaven_n that_o need_v no_o such_o help_n other_o in_o hell_n that_o can_v be_v help_v by_o they_o a_o three_o of_o those_o that_o be_v not_o so_o well_o as_o not_o to_o need_v they_o nor_o so_o ill_a but_o that_o they_o may_v be_v the_o better_a for_o these_o help_n this_o s._n aug._n speak_v certain_o and_o more_o we_o do_v not_o say_v certain_o of_o purgatory_n the_o particular_n of_o place_n manner_n of_o punishment_n durance_n etc._n etc._n be_v thing_n disputable_a among_o divine_n which_o you_o have_v nothing_o to_o do_v with_o and_o if_o for_o such_o uncertainty_n you_o will_v reject_v the_o belief_n of_o purgatory_n by_o the_o same_o reason_n you_o may_v deny_v that_o there_o be_v a_o hell_n as_o it_o be_v like_o you_o do_v in_o your_o hart_n for_o else_o you_o can_v not_o say_v and_o write_v as_o you_o do_v now_o for_o s._n greg._n who_o you_o say_v give_v the_o first_o credo_fw-la to_o purgatory_n that_o be_v answer_v enough_o which_o i_o allege_v last_o out_o of_o s._n aug._n by_o which_o it_o appear_v he_o give_v it_o a_o undoubted_a credo_fw-la long_o before_o for_o he_o die_v near_o 200._o year_n before_o s._n greg._n but_o for_o sound_v the_o belief_n thereof_o upon_o apparition_n of_o dead_a man_n &_o revelation_n of_o this_o saint_n &_o s._n bede_n relation_n it_o be_v most_o false_a by_o the_o same_o argument_n still_o for_o how_o can_v the_o faith_n of_o s._n aug._n his_o time_n be_v ground_v upon_o the_o revelation_n of_o man_n lyve_v two_o or_o three_o hundred_o year_n after_o or_o indeed_o upon_o any_o revelation_n of_o any_o man_n faith_n be_v ground_v upon_o the_o revelation_n of_o god_n alone_o deliver_v unto_o we_o by_o his_o church_n therefore_o to_o the_o last_o place_n of_o s._n aug._n i_o say_v it_o be_v understand_v that_o present_o as_o soon_o as_o the_o soul_n depart_v it_o receive_v the_o doom_n either_o of_o paradise_n or_o hell_n that_o be_v whether_o it_o be_v to_o go_v final_o and_o that_o be_v both_o true_a and_o his_o meaning_n as_o appear_v by_o what_o he_o say_v of_o the_o same_o matter_n else_o where_o thus_o tempus_fw-la quod_fw-la inter_fw-la hominis_fw-la mortem_fw-la etc._n etc._n the_o time_n between_o the_o death_n of_o a_o man_n and_o the_o general_a resurrection_n contain_v the_o soul_n in_o hide_a receptacle_n as_o each_o be_v worthy_a either_o of_o ease_n or_o pain_n according_a as_o it_o deserve_v while_o it_o live_v for_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v deny_v that_o the_o soul_n of_o the_o dead_a be_v help_v by_o the_o piety_n of_o their_o live_a friend_n this_o place_n be_v so_o plain_a as_o not_o only_o not_o to_o admit_v any_o tergiversation_n but_o alsoe_o to_o explain_v any_o other_o that_o may_v seem_v obscure_a 12._o a_o three_o point_n of_o uncertain_a doctrine_n as_o you_o object_n be_v indulgence_n for_o which_o you_o allege_v durand_n and_o gerson_n for_o durand_n look_v in_o the_o §_o of_o indulgence_n &_o in_o bellarmine_n 2._o lib._n 1._o de_fw-fr indulg_n cap._n 2._o and_o there_o you_o shall_v find_v he_o not_o to_o doubt_v of_o indulgence_n but_o of_o that_o which_o we_o call_v thesaurus_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la for_o as_o much_o as_o it_o consist_v of_o the_o satisfaction_n of_o the_o saint_n and_o as_o for_o gerson_n who_o say_v that_o whether_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n extend_v only_o to_o such_o as_o be_v on_o earth_n or_o also_o to_o those_o in_o purgatory_n the_o opinion_n of_o man_n be_v contrary_a and_o uncertain_a it_o be_v most_o frivolous_a to_o object_v he_o for_o what_o do_v this_o pertain_v to_o faith_n or_o do_v it_o pertain_v only_o to_o indulgence_n be_v not_o the_o question_n common_a to_o other_o act_n of_o jurisdiction_n understand_v by_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n this_o be_v your_o argument_n divine_n dispute_v whether_o the_o pope_n power_n extend_v to_o the_o soul_n in_o purgatory_n ergo_fw-la the_o doctrine_n of_o indulgence_n be_v uncertain_a this_o may_v be_v answer_n enough_o but_o to_o display_v you_o a_o little_a more_o i_o will_v say_v a_o word_n or_o two_o more_o of_o gerson_n and_o first_o even_o in_o this_o point_n of_o extend_v the_o pope_n power_n over_o those_o that_o be_v in_o purgatory_n even_o to_o the_o remission_n of_o pain_n absolution_n from_o venial_a sin_n or_o excommunication_n before_o incur_v he_o be_v so_o favourable_a in_o this_o place_n by_o you_o cite_v as_o to_o grant_v the_o opinion_n on_o both_o side_n probable_a which_o be_v more_o they_o other_o divine_n grant_v and_o be_v more_o than_o need_v for_o apply_v indulgence_n to_o the_o dead_a so_o as_o in_o grant_v that_o probable_a he_o make_v this_o certain_a and_o this_o for_o indulgence_n in_o as_o much_o as_o they_o pertain_v to_o the_o dead_a now_o for_o the_o live_n or_o power_n of_o indulgence_n in_o general_a thus_o he_o say_v 12_o â—rs_n 2._o p._n the_o â—â—ulg_n con_fw-mi â—_o 11._o &_o 12_o indulgentiarum_fw-la concessio_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la parui_fw-la pendenda_fw-la seu_fw-la contemnenda_fw-la sed_fw-la amplectenda_fw-la in_o fide_fw-la spe_fw-la &_o charitate_fw-la domini_fw-la nostri_fw-la jesv_n christi_fw-la qui_fw-la potestatem_fw-la talium_fw-la claurum_fw-la ecclesiasticam_fw-la dedit_fw-la hominibus_fw-la the_o grant_v of_o indulgence_n be_v not_o to_o be_v little_o esteem_v or_o contemn_v but_o to_o be_v embrace_v in_o the_o faith_n hope_n and_o charity_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n
uncertainty_n and_o novelty_n of_o his_o own_o for_o which_o end_n you_o produce_v 8._o several_a place_n six_z whereof_o i_o have_v answer_v before_o and_o there_o also_o show_v that_o some_o be_v nothing_o in_o the_o world_n to_o the_o purpose_n other_o most_o gross_o falsify_v the_o 1._o place_n to_o wit_n that_o no_o man_n can_v be_v certain_a of_o his_o faith_n because_o he_o can_v be_v certain_a he_o receive_v a_o true_a sacrament_n because_o that_o depend_v upon_o the_o minister_n intention_n be_v answer_v and_o prove_v most_o foolish_a chap._n 10._o n._n 7.8_o etc._n etc._n the_o second_o place_n which_o be_v of_o transubstantiation_n as_o if_o bellarmine_n confess_v it_o probable_a that_o it_o can_v not_o be_v prove_v out_o of_o scripture_n be_v answer_v in_o cap._n 9_o §_o 2._o n._n 22._o concern_v which_o i_o only_o note_v that_o in_o this_o place_n you_o have_v a_o new_a corruption_n for_o whereas_o bellar._n say_v only_o that_o it_o may_v be_v doubt_v whether_o there_o be_v any_o place_n of_o scripture_n so_o plain_a as_o without_o the_o declaration_n of_o the_o church_n to_o enforce_v transubstantiation_n because_o some_o learned_a man_n as_o scotus_n do_v doubt_v thereof_o though_o bell._n say_v to_o he_o the_o scripture_n seem_v so_o plain_a as_o to_o enforce_v it_o here_o you_o make_v he_o say_v it_o may_v be_v doubt_v whether_o the_o scripture_n will_v bear_v it_o which_o be_v clean_o another_o thing_n for_o to_o enforce_v a_o sense_n &_o bear_v a_o sense_n be_v two_o several_a thing_n neither_o do_v scotus_n or_o any_o divine_a else_o ever_o make_v question_n but_o that_o the_o scripture_n will_v bear_v that_o sense_n but_o whither_o that_o be_v so_o clear_a and_o obvious_a a_o sense_n as_o of_o itself_o to_o enforce_v the_o belief_n of_o transubstantiation_n the_o 3._o 10._o bell._n lib._n 2._o the_o miss_n cap._n 9_o &_o 10._o place_n which_o be_v of_o mass_n without_o communicants_n i_o pass_v over_o before_o as_o impertinent_a to_o the_o purpose_n and_o so_o i_o may_v do_v here_o but_o for_o the_o reader_n be_v full_a satisfaction_n i_o answer_v bellarmine_n say_v that_o mass_n be_v ordain_v both_o to_o offer_v sacrifice_n to_o god_n and_o to_o nourish_v the_o people_n with_o spiritual_a food_n in_o which_o respect_n as_o it_o be_v not_o unlawful_a to_o offer_v it_o to_o god_n though_o there_o be_v none_o to_o communicate_v but_o very_o lawful_a good_a and_o holy_a so_o be_v it_o more_o perfect_a and_o as_o i_o may_v say_v in_o a_o certain_a sort_n more_o lawful_a where_o be_v some_o to_o communicate_v for_o than_o it_o have_v both_o the_o end_n for_o which_o it_o be_v ordain_v now_o what_o do_v this_o make_v for_o you_o sir_n knight_n or_o against_o we_o as_o also_o that_o which_o follow_v here_o to_o wit_n that_o there_o be_v not_o any_o express_a mention_n among_o the_o ancients_n where_o none_o do_v communicate_v but_o the_o priest_n alone_o but_o only_a conjecture_n for_o no_o more_o be_v there_o any_o express_a mention_n to_o the_o contrary_a that_o no_o priest_n may_v nor_o ever_o do_v say_v mass_n without_o communicant_n which_o unless_o you_o can_v show_v in_o bellarmine_n you_o say_v nothing_o against_o we_o neither_o if_o you_o can_v show_v it_o shall_v you_o therefore_o say_v any_o thing_n for_o your_o own_o sacrificelesse_a communion_n which_o have_v no_o affinity_n with_o our_o mass_n the_o essence_n whereof_o consist_v in_o be_v a_o sacrifice_n and_o communion_n in_o be_v a_o participation_n of_o the_o same_o sacrifice_n your_o protestant_a communion_n be_v but_o a_o bit_n of_o unblessed_a bread_n and_o no_o participation_n of_o sacrifice_n for_o you_o absolute_o deny_v all_o manner_n of_o visible_a sacrifice_n in_o the_o church_n now_o for_o bellarmine_n conjecture_n it_o be_v true_a he_o give_v they_o no_o other_o name_n but_o of_o conjecture_n but_o they_o be_v such_o as_o may_v with_o great_a probability_n persuade_v any_o indifferent_a man_n to_o conclude_v that_o many_o time_n and_o i_o may_v say_v much_o more_o frequent_o the_o priest_n say_v mass_n without_o communicant_n then_o with_o they_o and_o the_o lest_o of_o they_o be_v such_o that_o if_o you_o have_v but_o half_a such_o a_o one_o for_o any_o point_n you_o hold_v you_o will_v vaunt_v it_o and_o triumph_n as_o if_o you_o have_v a_o unanswearable_a demonstration_n but_o be_v it_o so_o or_o be_v it_o not_o of_o some_o of_o the_o people_n communicate_v whensoever_o the_o priest_n say_v mass_n what_o make_v it_o to_o our_o purpose_n which_o be_v whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o say_v mass_n without_o communicant_n or_o not_o they_o do_v not_o will_v you_o say_v in_o the_o primitive_a church_n i_o ask_v what_o then_o may_v not_o we_o now_o the_o people_n do_v communicate_v every_o day_n then_o must_v every_o body_n communicate_v now_o therefore_o every_o day_n all_o give_v their_o good_n away_o and_o live_v in_o common_a must_v every_o body_n do_v so_o now_o i_o believe_v sir_n knight_n you_o will_v not_o like_v that_o so_o well_o if_o the_o people_n devotion_n grow_v so_o cold_a as_o not_o to_o participate_v sacramental_o of_o the_o sacrifice_n must_v the_o priest_n grow_v so_o cold_a also_o as_o not_o even_o to_o offer_v sacrifice_n for_o his_o own_o and_o the_o people_n sin_n this_o be_v no_o good_a council_n sir_n humphrey_n almighty_a god_n reprehend_v it_o by_o his_o prophet_n 24.2_o isay_n 24.2_o that_o the_o priest_n be_v grow_v like_o the_o people_n sicut_fw-la populus_fw-la sic_fw-la sacerdos_n we_o can_v be_v glad_a sir_n if_o you_o can_v help_v to_o mend_v the_o people_n but_o not_o mar_v the_o priest_n which_o you_o will_v do_v enkindle_v their_o devotion_n not_o destroy_v their_o faith_n nor_o take_v away_o the_o holy_a sacrifice_n of_o the_o mass_n which_o afford_v many_o benefit_n even_o to_o not_o communicant_n though_o not_o so_o much_o as_o to_o they_o that_o do_v communicate_v sacramental_o but_o what_o do_v i_o in_o this_o discourse_n here_o it_o be_v enough_o to_o show_v that_o bellarmine_n do_v not_o patronize_v you_o nor_o weaken_v us._n the_o two_o place_n follow_v touch_v prayer_n in_o a_o know_a tongue_n and_o communion_n under_o both_o kind_n in_o the_o primitive_a church_n be_v also_o answer_v before_o &_o be_v only_o of_o the_o same_o kind_n of_o argument_n with_o this_o the_o 6._o place_n which_o be_v as_o if_o bell._n teach_v your_o two_o sacrament_n be_v answer_v in_o two_o place_n upon_o several_a occasion_n fine_n chap._n 9_o §._o 4_o fine_a and_z ch_z 10._o fine_n and_o in_o both_o be_v show_v your_o notorious_a corruption_n both_o of_o word_n &_o sense_n 2._o now_o for_o your_o two_o last_o testimony_n which_o you_o bring_v not_o before_o i_o shall_v here_o examine_v one_o you_o tell_v we_o be_v touch_v faith_n and_o good_a work_n of_o which_o say_v you_o it_o be_v bellarmine_n confession_n 6._o bell_n lib._n 3._o the_o â—ustif_a cap._n 6._o that_o the_o protestant_n do_v not_o deny_v but_o that_o faith_n &_o repentance_n be_v requisite_a that_o be_v a_o lively_a faith_n and_o earnest_a repentance_n and_o that_o without_o they_o no_o man_n can_v be_v justify_v to_o this_o i_o answer_v first_o that_o you_o propound_v the_o matter_n very_o imperfect_o and_o ignorant_o in_o say_v thus_o touch_v faith_n and_o good_a work_n it_o be_v bellarmine_n confession_n etc._n etc._n not_o tell_v we_o the_o particular_a controversy_n for_o which_o you_o bring_v this_o say_n of_o bellarmine_n there_o be_v more_o controversy_n than_o one_o between_o you_o and_o we_o as_o whither_o any_o thing_n be_v needful_a to_o justification_n beside_o faith_n or_o what_o faith_n it_o be_v that_o justifi_v and_o how_o and_o whither_o good_a work_n be_v necessary_a or_o no_o and_o how_o they_o concur_v for_o there_o be_v all_o these_o thing_n and_o more_o in_o question_n between_o you_o and_o us._n and_o a_o man_n will_v have_v think_v by_o your_o general_a title_n of_o faith_n and_o work_v it_o have_v be_v in_o proof_n of_o some_o of_o these_o that_o you_o have_v bring_v bellarm._n but_o it_o be_v for_o no_o such_o matter_n bellarmine_n in_o the_o place_n cite_v handle_v a_o clean_a different_a question_n to_o wit_n whether_o a_o man_n can_v be_v certain_a of_o his_o own_o grace_n and_o justice_n that_o be_v whether_o he_o be_v in_o the_o grace_n and_o favour_n of_o almighty_a god_n or_o not_o and_o for_o proof_n that_o a_o man_n can_v be_v certain_a thereof_o he_o bring_v diverse_a place_n of_o scripture_n which_o imply_v a_o condition_n on_o our_o part_n in_o our_o justification_n as_o if_o we_o turn_v to_o god_n if_o we_o seek_v he_o in_o our_o whole_a hart_n if_o we_o do_v penance_n if_o we_o believe_v if_o we_o do_v his_o will_n etc._n etc._n god_n will_v turn_v to_o we_o forgive_v our_o sin_n and_o the_o like_a which_o condition_n say_v
bellarmine_n we_o can_v be_v certain_a whether_o we_o fulfil_v or_o not_o and_o consequent_o we_o can_v be_v certain_a of_o our_o grace_n and_o justice_n and_o he_o say_v these_o place_n be_v so_o manifest_a that_o our_o adversary_n can_v deny_v something_o to_o be_v requisite_a on_o our_o part_n for_o though_o say_v he_o they_o deny_v the_o remission_n of_o sin_n to_o depend_v upon_o the_o condition_n of_o work_n or_o our_o penance_n faith_n or_o other_o act_n to_o be_v the_o cause_n or_o merit_n of_o justification_n yet_o they_o grant_v they_o to_o be_v requisite_a and_o that_o without_o they_o a_o man_n can_v be_v justify_v this_o be_v bellarmine_n discourse_n wherein_o he_o do_v neither_o confess_v any_o good_a of_o your_o haeretique_n nor_o any_o way_n allow_v or_o approve_v your_o say_n as_o you_o will_v make_v one_o think_v but_o bring_v your_o own_o confession_n against_o you_o and_o even_o by_o so_o much_o as_o you_o confess_v though_o that_o be_v far_o from_o enough_o overthrow_v another_o error_n of_o you_o to_o wit_n your_o vain_a confidence_n and_o certainty_n of_o your_o justification_n now_o then_o sir_n humphrey_n be_v not_o this_o honest_a deal_n in_o you_o to_o take_v a_o word_n speak_v by_o bellarmine_n for_o one_o purpose_n and_o to_o transfer_v it_o to_o another_o far_o different_a and_o again_o in_o favour_n of_o yourself_o to_o allege_v those_o word_n out_o of_o bellarmine_n as_o his_o confession_n which_o he_o allege_v only_o for_o you_o and_o to_o take_v it_o so_o as_o if_o his_o allegation_n be_v a_o approbation_n or_o allowance_n of_o they_o whereas_o he_o bring_v they_o but_o in_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o objection_n against_o yourselves_o and_o there_o withal_o plain_o declare_v the_o difference_n between_o your_o error_n and_o our_o faith_n that_o you_o will_v not_o have_v faith_n or_o work_v to_o be_v any_o cause_n or_o merit_n of_o justification_n nor_o justification_n to_o depend_v upon_o work_n as_o upon_o a_o condition_n whereas_o we_o teach_v all_o the_o contrary_a which_o though_o bellarmine_n do_v not_o stand_v to_o prove_v there_o because_o that_o be_v not_o a_o place_n for_o it_o yet_o he_o plain_o show_v that_o to_o be_v his_o belief_n 3._o the_o second_o place_n of_o bellarmine_n you_o say_v be_v touch_v justification_n by_o faith_n only_o wherein_o you_o tell_v we_o he_o conclude_v with_o the_o reform_a church_n say_v that_o either_o a_o man_n have_v true_a merit_n or_o he_o have_v not_o if_o he_o have_v not_o he_o be_v dangerous_o deceive_v if_o he_o have_v true_a merit_n he_o lose_v nothing_o by_o not_o respect_v they_o but_o put_v his_o trust_n in_o god_n only_o but_o in_o this_o again_o as_o before_o and_o every_o where_o else_o you_o still_o line_v it_o egregious_o for_o here_o you_o make_v as_o if_o bellarmine_n do_v allow_v of_o your_o justification_n by_o faith_n only_o whereas_o he_o confute_v the_o same_o large_o and_o learned_o for_o 13._o 1._o lib._n 1._o de_fw-fr iustif_a cap._n 1._o whole_a chapter_n together_o begin_v his_o disputation_n thus_o hominem_fw-la non_fw-la sola_fw-la fide_fw-la iustificari_fw-la 5._o argumentis_fw-la principalibus_fw-la demonstrare_fw-la conabimur_fw-la we_o will_v endeavour_v by_o 5._o principal_a argument_n to_o demonstrate_v that_o a_o man_n be_v not_o justify_v by_o faith_n only_o how_o then_o do_v he_o conclude_v with_o your_o reform_a church_n he_o conclude_v against_o they_o &_o you_o tell_v we_o he_o conclude_v with_o they_o and_o this_o place_n which_o you_o bring_v out_o of_o he_o be_v above_o 50._o leaf_n from_o that_o where_o he_o begin_v to_o treat_v of_o justification_n by_o faith_n and_o be_v a_o argument_n for_o a_o far_o different_a matter_n to_o wit_n that_o it_o be_v most_o safe_a for_o a_o man_n though_o he_o may_v put_v some_o trust_n in_o his_o own_o good_a work_n yet_o in_o regard_n of_o the_o uncertainty_n he_o have_v of_o his_o own_o justice_n and_o danger_n of_o vain_a glory_n not_o to_o put_v any_o trust_n in_o they_o but_o all_o in_o god_n this_o late_a part_n whereof_o there_o be_v no_o controversy_n between_o we_o and_o protestant_n bellarmine_n prove_v by_o the_o reason_n here_o bring_v because_o if_o he_o have_v not_o true_a merit_n he_o deceive_v himself_o but_o if_o he_o have_v and_o yet_o trust_v not_o in_o they_o he_o lose_v nothing_o by_o not_o trust_v in_o they_o and_o what_o be_v all_o this_o good_a sir_n humphrey_n to_o your_o justification_n by_o faith_n only_o and_o consequent_o all_o that_o you_o have_v say_v out_o of_o bellarmine_n in_o this_o section_n to_o the_o antiquity_n and_o safety_n of_o your_o doctrine_n or_o the_o contrary_a of_o we_o not_o one_o word_n to_o any_o such_o purpose_n on_o either_o side_n and_o therefore_o all_o be_v but_o vain_a brag_n wherewith_o you_o conclude_v hereupon_o that_o our_o best_a learned_a confess_v that_o many_o principal_a point_n of_o their_o own_o religion_n yea_o many_o article_n of_o faith_n be_v neither_o ancient_a safe_a nor_o catholic_a wherein_o you_o speak_v ignorant_o in_o distinguish_v principal_a point_n of_o religion_n from_o article_n of_o faith_n for_o though_o every_o proposition_n which_o be_v de_fw-fr fide_fw-la be_v not_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n yet_o every_o principal_a point_n be_v and_o therefore_o some_o give_v that_o for_o the_o reason_n why_o we_o call_v a_o point_n a_o article_n to_o wit_n because_o it_o be_v a_o principal_a point_n but_o this_o be_v but_o to_o show_v that_o you_o can_v speak_v two_o word_n sound_o without_o falter_v and_o yet_o you_o must_v be_v show_v man_n the_o way_n forsooth_o 4._o have_v then_o say_v all_o you_o can_v out_o of_o bellarmine_n you_o tell_v we_o it_o be_v not_o the_o name_n of_o catholic_n which_o we_o assume_v that_o make_v good_a the_o catholic_a doctrine_n neither_o the_o opinion_n of_o learning_n or_o multitude_n of_o our_o side_n that_o must_v outface_v the_o truth_n for_o say_v your_o our_o saviour_n do_v special_o note_v the_o member_n of_o his_o body_n by_o the_o name_n of_o a_o little_a flock_n as_o if_o the_o paucity_n of_o true_a believer_n be_v the_o special_a character_n of_o the_o true_a church_n and_o for_o our_o learned_a you_o bring_v a_o say_n of_o s._n paul_n to_o the_o corinthian_n 1.26_o 1._o cor._n 1.26_o not_o many_o wise_a according_a to_o the_o flesh_n not_o many_o mighty_a 25._o mat._n 11_o 25._o not_o many_o noble_a and_o another_o out_o of_o s._n matthew_n i_o thank_v thou_o father_n because_o thou_o have_v hide_v these_o thing_n from_o the_o wise_a and_o prudent_a and_o have_v reveal_v they_o to_o babe_n and_o then_o you_o will_v we_o to_o reflect_v upon_o our_o own_o church_n and_o we_o shall_v find_v the_o mark_n of_o a_o false_a church_n foretell_v that_o it_o shall_v be_v after_o the_o work_n of_o satan_n with_o all_o power_n and_o sign_n and_o lie_v wonder_n and_o after_o a_o little_a of_o this_o rave_a talk_n you_o conclude_v with_o s._n augustine_n that_o miracle_n be_v not_o now_o to_o be_v expect_v thus_o you_o troll_v it_o out_o sir_n humphrey_n where_o first_o to_o begin_v with_o i_o may_v ask_v what_o all_o this_o be_v to_o that_o which_o the_o title_n of_o your_o section_n promise_v to_o wit_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o your_o doctrine_n out_o of_o bellarmine_n but_o that_o it_o seem_v prove_v but_o dry_a matter_n you_o take_v yourself_o the_o freedom_n without_o regard_n to_o the_o consequence_n of_o your_o discourse_n to_o talk_v of_o the_o church_n of_o miracle_n strong_a delusion_n and_o other_o such_o stuff_n good_a for_o nothing_o but_o to_o fill_v paper_n but_o this_o very_a discourse_n for_o the_o matter_n itself_o show_v your_o wit_n for_o you_o can_v have_v say_v nothing_o more_o to_o the_o advantage_n of_o our_o cause_n nor_o more_o to_o the_o disadvantage_n of_o your_o own_o for_o you_o show_v we_o to_o be_v the_o true_a church_n your_o own_o a_o false_a one_o which_o to_o be_v so_o i_o shall_v show_v not_o in_o my_o own_o word_n but_o in_o 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gentile_n do_v do_v not_o this_o answer_n you_o sir_n humphrey_n do_v you_o not_o here_o find_v a_o difference_n between_o that_o worship_n and_o we_o between_o idolatry_n and_o religion_n between_o their_o adore_v the_o creature_n of_o wood_n and_o colour_n in_o place_n of_o the_o creator_n and_o our_o adore_v the_o creator_n represent_v by_o the_o creature_n between_o their_o adoration_n of_o idolatrous_a damn_a philosopher_n and_o our_o worship_n of_o the_o bless_a saint_n and_o servant_n of_o god_n live_v with_o he_o in_o glory_n this_o be_v too_o too_o gross_a for_o such_o a_o subtle_a knight_n as_o you_o be_v now_o for_o proof_n of_o your_o doctrine_n by_o succession_n from_o the_o 2._o commandment_n it_o be_v ridiculous_a to_o call_v it_o succession_n though_o you_o take_v the_o place_n of_o scripture_n in_o the_o true_a sense_n as_o you_o do_v not_o for_o how_o do_v your_o doctrine_n succeed_v the_o commandment_n a_o man_n may_v prove_v his_o doctrine_n out_o of_o scripture_n 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bind_v unto_o the_o collyridian_n exceed_v the_o measure_n of_o honour_n dew_n to_o our_o b._n lady_n for_o they_o do_v offer_v sacrifice_n unto_o she_o as_o the_o antidico_n marianitae_n do_v err_v contrary_o deny_v her_o due_a honour_n who_o the_o knight_n do_v forbear_v to_o name_n lest_o he_o may_v seem_v to_o name_v his_o own_o sect_n now_o catholic_n go_v in_o the_o middle_n they_o do_v not_o offer_v sacrifice_n unto_o she_o that_o honour_n be_v dew_n to_o god_n alone_o but_o they_o give_v she_o all_o the_o honour_n that_o can_v belong_v to_o a_o pure_a creature_n tatianus_n and_o the_o manichee_n disallow_v all_o marriage_n but_o that_o they_o do_v disallow_v it_o special_o in_o priest_n i_o do_v not_o find_v in_o epiphanius_n as_o the_o knight_n will_v make_v man_n believe_v by_o put_v the_o word_n in_o sacerdotibus_fw-la in_o latin_a and_o in_o a_o distinct_a letter_n though_o indeed_o it_o be_v less_o allowable_a in_o priest_n then_o in_o other_o man_n 11._o it_o be_v then_o 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