them peaceablie she was declared to be iust or iustified in the sight of men Therefore there are two kindes of iustification the one by faith before god the other by works before men therefore a man is not iustified by faith only but by works also which saying of S. Iamesis not repugnant to that we holde that a man is iustified before god sola fide by faith alone or by faith without the workes of the lawe as S. Paule saieth which is alone which comprehendeth al good works as also the examples of Abraham and Dauid in the 4. Chapter to the Romanes doc plainelie declare where the Apostle speaketh expreslely of circumcisiō which was a worke of obedience following the faith of Abraham And Dauid pronounceth the blessednes of a man to whome the Lord imputeth righteousnes without workes which must needes be vnderstood euen of workes following faith because Dauid speaketh of himselfe and of all men generallie that shall obtaine blessednes by the grace of god without merite of workes For to him that worketh reward is not imputed according to grace but according to debt Againe the Apostle writing to the Galathians which were faithful speaketh generally It is manifest that by the lawe no man is iustified before god for the iust shal liue by faith By which texts many more the conclusion is moste necessarie that before God workes following faith doe not iuslifie but faith alone without workes yet not a dead but a liuing faith which worketh by loue Further he saith they haue expresselie for absolution whose sinnes ye forgiue are forgiuen whose sinnes ye retaine are retained Iohn 20. but we haue no where that Priests cannot forgiue or retaine sinnes in earth But the controuersie is not whether the Ministers of God haue power to forgiue or retaine sinnes for we beleeue that they haue such power but whether absolute power properlie to forgiue sinnes and how the same is to be exercised is the question For we beleeue that God onelie hath power absolutelie properlie to remit sinnes according to the scripture man by declaring Gods will pleasure Yet againe they haue expresselie The doers of the lawe shall be iustified Rom. 2. And we saie euen as much but because none is found a doer of the lawe we saie with the same Apostle that it is manifest that no man is iustified before God by the lawe But our answerer inferreth moreouer that we haue no where that the law required at Christians hands is impossible or that the doing therof iustifieth not Christians yes we haue it expressely That which was impossible of the law in as much as it was weake by the flesh God sending his sonne in the similitude of sinfull flesh c. If there had beene a lawe giuen that had bene able to giue life righteousnes in deede had bene of the lawe but the scripture hath concluded all vnder sinne that the promis by the faith of Iesus Christ might be giuen to them that belecue Againe by the workes of the lawe no flesh shal be iustified before him therefore no Christians by the workes of the lawe shal be iustified before him Moreouer we are saued by grace through faith not of workes Ergo Christians for none els are saued are iustified through faith without workes Yet againe they haue expresselie Psal. 75. Vowe ye and render your vowes we haut no where vowe ye not or if you haue vowed breake your vowes we confesse the Prophet willeth the people to vowe yet he meaneth onelie thinges lawfull and in their power to performe we bid no man to breake his vowe if it be lawful and possible but if he haue vowed to goe a pilgrimage which is Idolatrie or to liue vnmaried which is not able to liue continentlie we exhort him to repent of his wicked or vnaduised vowe to serue God as he hath appointed or to vse the remedie that God hath prouided They haue againe expreslie Keepe the traditions which ye haue learned either by worde or epistle 2. Thess. 2. we haue no where the Apostles left noe traditions to the Church vnwritten Saint Paull willeth the Thessalonians to keepe the traditions or doctrine which he had deliuered vnto them either by word of mouth or by his epistle This prooueth not that the Apostles left any traditions which are no where written in the holie scripture because they were not all written in the epistle of Saint Paul to the Thessalonians But we haue expresselie that the holie scriptures are able to make vs wise to saluation to make the man of God perfect and prepared to all good works which things seing we haue fufficientlie in the holie scriptures we neither regard nor receiue any other doctrine vnder name of tradition of the Apo stles or of Angels from heauen Still they haue expresselie If thou wilt enter into life keepe the commaundements and when he said he did that already if thou wilt be perfect go sel all thou hast giue to the poore follow me And we haue no where that either the commaundements of God cannot be kept or that we are not bound vnto them or that there is no degree of life one perfecter then another We graunt that who so by good deeds will seeke to enter into life as that yong man did must doe the deedes of the commaundements which if he can doe he shal liue by them but albeit he boasted that he had kept the commaundements yet it followeth not that he did keepe them indeede and as god required but was a blinde hipocrite and sought to iustifie him-selfe according to the heresie of the Pharisies That we are not bound to keepe the commaundements as neere as God will giue vs grace is no article of ours but a slaunder of his Finallie we denie that anie mortall mans life is perfect yet we graunt that some mens liues come neerer to perfection then other some Neither doth our Sauiours words include perfection in selling his goodes nor in giuing them to the poore for if a man bestowe all his goodes to feede the poore and haue not loue he is nothing but he addeth that he must followe Christ and take vp his crosse and so by Christs grace he shal attaine vnto perfection which he falselie imagined that he he had obtained by a pharizaical obseruation of the lawe this fauoreth not Monkes and friers more then hipocrites and liers Beside this They haue expresselie worke your owne saluation with feare and tremhling Phil. 2. we haue no where either that a man can worke nothing toward his owne saluation being holpen with the grace of God or that a man should make it of his beliefe that he shall be saued without all doubt or feare The saying of Saint Paull we acknowledge that men should worke out their owne saluation with feare and trembling together with the next verse following for it is God that worketh in
you both to wil and to be hable to do for his owne good pleasure whereupon we conclude that though a man is willed to worke his owne saluation by walking in that waie which god hath appointed for them that shal be saued yet he can doe nothing by his owne strength but all that he doth is of the grace of god for by grace you are saued through faith that not of your selues it is the gift of God To be short we make not the grace of God an helper onelie but a wholl doer and bringer to passe in vs of our saluation and of all thinges tending thereto For we are not apt of our selues as of our selues to thinke anie thing belonging thereto but our aptnes is of God Nor I saith Saint Paul but the grace of God which is with me Againe we haue infinit places of scripture to prooue that a man ought not to dout of his saluatiō in respect of the truth of Gods promises although we ought to feare trem ble at Gods iudgements and although we cannot be alwaies voide of feare in respect of our own weakenes Furthermore they haue expresselie doe ye the worthie fruites of penance Luc. 3. we haue no where that faith onelie is sufficient without all satisfaction and all other workes of penance on our partes The fruites worthie of repentance we acknowledge to be necessaire to declare vnfained repentance but not for satisfaction of Gods iustice which is blasphemous against the satisfaction of Christes death But that a faith which is fruitles or voide of the workes of repentance should be sufficient to saluation or Iustification we doe vtterlie deny as a thing contrary to the scriptures Yet againe they haue expresselie that euerie man shal be saued according to his workes Apo. 20. we haue no where that men shal be iudged onelie according to their faith We confesse as the text is that euerie man shal be iudged according to his workes and so perhaps he would haue saide if the corrector had done his part neither doe we affirme that men shal be iudged onelie according to their faith for triall of their faith shal be made by their workes Once againe they haue expresselie that there remaineth aretribution stipend and paie to euery good worke in heauen Marc. 9. 1. Cor. 3. Apoc. 22. Ps. 118. we haue as he saith no where that good workes done in Christ do merite nothing In the 3. text quoted out of the new testament is all one word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth a rewarde whether it be freelie giuen or deserued by laboure To him that worketh saith Saint Paule 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 rewarde is not accompted according to grace but according to debt But God is debter to no man Neither is there anie merit of good workes once named in the scriptures but against the merit of good workes Christ saith epxresselie when you haue done all thinges that are commaunded vnto you saie we are vnprofitable seruants and the paie wages stipend merite or desert of an vnprofitable seruant is shewed Matt. 25. 30. Cast out the vnprofitable seruant into vtter darkenesse there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth It is therfore the grace mercie and trueth of Gods promise whereby we claime rewarde and not the merites desert or debt of our good workes To that he saieth they haue expresselie praier and sacrifice for the dead in the second of the Maccaebees We answer that booke of Macabes to be no holie Scripture out of which he might haue expresselie a man commended for killing himselfe Whether Angels present good workes and almesdeedes before God and whether Saintes departed do praie for them that are aliue which he gathereth out of the Apocriphal bookes of Tobie and the Maccabes we make no question as of matters not reuealed in the canonicall scriptures But if they were graunted to be so yet it followeth not that men aliue must or may praie to Angels or Saintes departed Last of all out of the canonicall scripture he saieth they haue expresselie that the affliction which Daniell vsed vpon his bodie was acceptable in the sight of God Dan. 10. and we haue no where that such voluntarie corporall afflictions are in vaine But which of vs saith that such voluntarie corporall affliction as Daniell vsed and to such end as he did vse them are in vaine No man verilie You see therefore that while he boasteth of expresse words of scripture against vs he is driuen either to glose vpon the text or to faine some opinion vnto vs which we holde not at all and that all his bragges are but winde and wordes without matter as of one that-fcareth no shame because his heade is hidden The third waie of triall is necessarie collections made and inferred vpon the scriptures which we are willing to acknowledge and admitte to be of as great authoritie as the expresse words of the scripture But to discerne what is necessarie collection and what is not necessarie collection when there is no expresse wordes of scripture there is no certaine waie but the iudgement of Logicke for that onelie is necessarie collection which out of expresse words of scripture or articles of faith or other groundes confessed to be necessarilie gathered out of the holie scripture may be rightly concluded in a true and lawfull syllogisme whatsoeuer cannot be so concluded is no necessarie collection But our answerer saith we must referre our selues to the auncient primitiue Church for this meaning and his reason is For it is like they knew it best for that they liued nearer to the writers thereof then we doe who could well declare vnto them what was the meaning of the same we doe willinglie yeald to consult with the auncient primitiue Church to be holpen with their collections but to admit all their collections without examining them were to admit many errors that euen the Papists doe condemne for errors and which are reprooued by the scriptures them-selues Let one example serue in stead of manie S. Ierome collecteth out of this scripture It is good not to touch a woman that therefore it is euill to touch a woman Euerie man doth see that this is an vnnecessary collection and so are many other in the auncient fathers writings Wherefore we must vse the gift of knowledge of right gathering and concluding which God hath giuen not to be vnprofitable vnto his Church but to be both beneficiall and necessarie Againe marke the feeble reason vpon which our answerer groundeth his saying It is like they knew it best he cannot say it is necessarie that they knew it best then how prooueth he that it is like because they liued neerer to the writers then we doe who could well declare the meaning vnto them In deede if we had the writings of them that liued so neere vnto the Apostles that they might heare their meaning of their owne mouthes it were some likeliehood and yet no necessarie proofe
aliquid dictum est sed vbi clara â—â—aperta sune testimonia id facere consueuerunt more quiaâ—â— haereâ—icorum etiam caetâ—rorum It is no maruel if the Pelagians endeuor to wrest our sayings into what senses they will when they are accustomed to do the same by the holie scriptures not where any thing is spoken darkely but where the testimonies are cleere and manifest after the manner indeede of the rest of heretikes These wordes of Saint Augustine doe as aptelie agree to the Papists as though they had bene by name vttered against them as in that which followeth you shall see verified in this Papist whoe both wresteth out sayings to such sense as himselfe pleaseth and also the holie scriptures themselues where they are most plaine and euident against him a right pranek of olde herenkes Note also by the waie that the scripture by Saint Augustines iudgement containeth most cleere and euident testimonies which though they be neuer so much wrested of herenkes yet in the conscience of all that loue the truth they doe manifestlie deliuer true doctrine and confute false and therefore be not as a nose of wax or a leaden rule by which no certentie maie be found or anie sure triall had by them as the Papists doe blaspheme The next quotation l. 3. cont Donat. ca. 15. is vncertaine because of diuerse treatises that S. Augustine did write against the Donatists but I gesse he meaneth his booke de Baptismo contra Donatistas where yet is nothing to his purpose or to anie purpose in hand but that the scripture of the Gospell If it be wholl is the same although it be alleadged by innumerable heretikes according to the diversitie of euerie one of their opinions and so Baptisme ministred by heretikes according to the institution of Christ is the same what opinion soever the heretikes haue of the wordes by which it is consecrated and ministred He saith also that the snares of heretikes and schismatikes are therefore very pernicious to carnal men because their proâ—ting in knowledge is shut from them their sentence of vanitie being confirmed against the Catholike trueth and their sentence of dissention being conâ—â—â—med agâ—inâ— the catholike peace These things are true of obstinate heretikes and consequentlie of Papists but they make nothing against Master Chark or for the triall of spirits which is the question now debated betweene him his aduersarie But that the scriptures are sufficient to beate downe al heresies and to reach all trueth necessarie to saluation and the onelie sure and certaine triall whereby all doctrine is to be examined and adiudged the same Augustine doth plentifullie and in manie places of his workes declare and euen in that same worke de Baptismo contra Donatistas lib. 2. Cap. 2. de vnitate Ecclesiae cap. 2 3. 16. de nup. conc lib. 2. cap. 29. de peccat merit remiss lib. 3. cap. 7. de natura gratia cap. 60. c. Three causes there be saith our answerer of appealing onelie to scripture The first to get credit with the people by naming of scripture to seeme to honor it more then their aduersaries doe by referring the wholl triall of matters vnto it To winne credit by cleauing to the authoritie of God expressed in his holie word written and to honor it by acknowledging the sufficiencie thereof for the triall of all matters of religion that maie comme in controuersie is no shift of heretikes or new teachers but the auncient practize of the best and most approoued Catholikes To pretend these things in shew and not to accomplish them in deed is the guise of hypocrites what religion soeuet they would seeme to mantaine The second cause saith he is by excluding Councells fathers and aunciters of the Church whoe from time to time haue declared the true sexse of scripture vnto vs to reserue vnto them selues libertie and authoritie to make what meaning of scripture they please and thereby to giue colour to euerie fansie they list to teach But Master Charke and his fellowes giuing the soueraigne authoritie to the onely scriptures do not at all exclude councells fathers and aunciters of the Church except it be in case where they teach contrarie to the manifest scriptures of god which doe either in expresse and plaine wordes or els by moste easie and necessarie conclusion deliuer vnto the Church all things needefull to be credited and knowne vnto eternall life as both the Apostle testifieth 2. Timoth. 3. and S. Augustine a worthie Father auncient of the Church consenteth Ep. III. Fortunatiano Neque enim quorumlibet disputationes quamuis CatholicoruÌ„ laudatorum hominum velut scripturas canonicas habere debemus vt nobis nonliceat salua honorificentia quae illis dcbetur hominibus aliquid in eorum scriptis improbare atque respuere si fortè inuenerimus quòdaliter senserint quà m veritas habet diuino adiutorio vel ab aliis intellecta vel à nobis Talis ego sum in scriptis aliorum tales volo esse intellectores meorum Denique in his omnibus quae de opusculis sanctorum atque doctorum commemoraui Ambrosij Hyeronimi Athanasij Gregorij siqua alioruÌ„ talia ita legere potui For we ought not to accompt the disputations of all men although they be catholike praise worthie as the Canonicall scriptures that it should not be lawful for vs sauing the reuerence which is due to these men to disalow and reiect something in their writings if perhaps we haue found out that they haue thought otherwise then the truth is of things by gods helpe either vnderstood of others or of our selues Such one am I in the writings of other men such would I haue other men to be vnderstanders of my writings Finallie in all these which I haue rehearsed out of the workes of holie and learned men Ambros Hicrott Athanasius Gregorie Andif I could so reade any like of other mens writings c. Also Ep. 112. Pauline 〈◊〉 scripturarum earum scilicet quae canonicae in Ecclesia nominantur perspicua firmatur authoritate fine vlla dubitatione credendum est Aliis verò testibus vel testimoniis quibus aliquid credendum esse suadetur tibi credere vel non credere liceat quantum meriti ea admonentem ad faciendam fidem vel habere vel non habere perpenderis What sceuer is confirmed by the plaine cleare authoritie of the holie scriptures of those truelie which are called in the Church canonicall without all doubt is to be beleeued But other witnesses or testimonies by which anie thing is counselled to be beleeued it is lawfull for thee to beleeue or not according as thou shale waigh what worthines he that counselleth those things hath to cause credit or els hath not Againe De doctrina christiana lib. 3. cap. 6. Magnificè salubriter spiritus sanctus ita scripturas sanctas modificauit vt locis apertioribus fami occurreret obscurioribus autem
their aduetsaries it is well knowne that Master Charke and the ministers of the Church are none such neither haue they anie such authoritie It remaineth then that he accounteth the Prince her councell magistrates and ministers of Iustice his aduersaries who indeede haue good cause so to be not onelie in respect of their heresyes but also in regard of their manifolde and almoste infinite practises of treason against the Prince and realme for which some of them haue suffered moste iustlie and not for offering of disputation as this traiterous heretike euerie where moste slaunderouslie doth avowe But nowe for their partes he saith they offere the best surest and easiest meanes that can be deuised or that haue bene vsed in Gods Churches for triall and they are manie in number The first is the bookes of Scripture receiued vpon the credit of the auncient Church of which we are content saith he to accept for canonicall and allowe all those and none other which antiquitie in Christendome hath agreed vpon But this is false for to omit that they receiue for canonicall such as the Church of God before Christ neuer receiued they receiue also such as the greatest and best antiquitie in Christendome receiued not as the Church in Origens time witnesse Eusebius more then the Church of Rome receiued in Saint Ieromes witnesse Ierome himselfe prologo Galeato and Ruffinus in Expossymb more then the Councell of Laodicea did receiue for canonicall as is manifest by the 59. canon The second way of trial is the expresse plaine words of Scripture wherein they must needs be farre superior for what one expresse plaine text haue they saith he in anie one point or article against vs which we doe not acknowledge liberallie as they doe and as the wordes doe lie yes we haue manie but a fewe shal serue for example God saith Exod. 20. Thou shalt not make to thy selse anie grauen image c. thou shalt not fall down to thē nor worship them Againe Matt. 4. Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God and him onelie shalt thou serue Which are moste plaine expresse and manifest against worshipping of Images and other creatures in anie vse of Religion Christ saith drinke ye all of this they be expresse and manifest wordes against the popish sacriledge of the cuppe The 14. to the Corinthians the first Epistle is expresse and plaine against publike praiers homilies lessons in a straunge vnknowne tongue 1. Tim. 4. in expresse and plaine wordes the spirite pronunceth the forbidding of marriage and meates to be the doctrine of deuilles And Heb. 13. Mariage is honourable in all men And 1. Tim. 3. Tit. 1. a Bishop Elder or Deacon must be the husband of one wife beside a great number more But the papists saith our answerer haue infinit texts against vs which we cannot admit without glosses and fond interpretations of our owne A bolde speach as alwaies he vseth but it shall alwaies be founde that if we doe in anie text departe from the grammaticall sense there is necessarie cause why as if it be a figuratiue spcach which is tried either by circumstances of the same place or by other texts of scriptures for the most parte hath the iudgement of the most auncient writers agreing with our interpretation But the most of these examples he bringeth haue nothing in shewe that the expresle wordes of scripture are with them or against vs but by their fonde false vnreasonable collections and such as they can neuer conclude in lawful true syllogismes as for example We haue it saith he for the supremacie expresselie saide to Peter that signifieth arocke vpon this rock will I builde my Church We answere that we might followe the interpretation of the most auncient and approoued fathers that the rocke here spoken of is Christ whom Peter confessed but graunting them that they could neuer euict we confesse that the Church is builded vpon the foundation of Peter the Apostle but not vpon him alone or more principallie then vpon all the Apostles who are all rockes or stones vpon whose foundation as also vpon the foundation of the Prophets the Church of Christ is builded Neither is it possible to prooue the supremacie of the Pope out of those wordes of scripture or anie other But they haue further expresselie touching the Apostles he that is great among you let him be as the younger Luk. 22. We haue no where there is none greater then other among you Neither do we holde that none ought to be greater then other among vs but that the greatest among the ministers ought to be seruant of all the rest and that none ought to exercise Dominion ouer the Lordes inheritaunce yet the primacie of order we graunt euen among the Apostles according to which Iames was president of the Councell at Ierusalem Peter the cheife Aposlle of the circumcision Paull of the gentiles all which will not serue one whit to maintaine the popish tiranny For Paul was nothing inferiour to the highest Apostles But for the reall presence they haue expreslie This is my bodie we haue no where this is the signe of my bodie Neither doe we denie the sacrament to be the bodie of Christ neither doe we affirme that it is a bare signe But that this is a figuratiue speach we haue expreslie This cuppe is the newe Testament in my blood and as expreslie the Apostle speaking of the same sacrament the rocke was Christ which prooueth that it must be vnderstoode in a sigue and after a spirituall manner and so doe al the olde Doctors interpretit as hath beene often shewed We haue expreslie saith he The bread that I will giue you is my flesh Iohn 6. they haue nowhere It is but the signe of my flesh And we confesse as much for we neuer saide that the signe of Christs flesh was crucified for vs but his verie naturall bodie which he promiseth in that text to giue for the life of the world which by faith and the spirit of God is made the spirituall foode of all the elect children of God and without eating of which none can be saued Ioh. 6. 53. But they haue expresly A man is iustified by works and not by faith onelie Iames. 2. we haue no where a man is iustified by faith alone no nor that he is iustified by faith without workes talking of workes that followe faith First we confesse the text that a man is iustified by workes As Abraham was when he offered his sonne and as Rahab was when she receiued the spies that is a man is declared to be iust in the sight of men For Abraham was iustified before God by faith before he offered his sonne whome God did not trie to enforme himselfe but to declare vnto men by the fruites of obedience that Abraham was a iust man euen so by faith the harlot Rahab perished not with the vnbeleeuers when the receiued the spies in peace but by receiuing
he nor Doctor Folke do vse any hereticall sophistrie to condemne all for the ill life of a fewe or to condemne a lawfull calling for the misbehauiour of them that are in that vocation and much lesse for that men liue not so perfectlie in the same as they did in the primitiue Church about which hereticall consequences manie words are spent in vaine But now let vs heare what you answer to such difference as Master Charke maketh betweene the olde monkes and the newe His wordes you recite in this manner It is a plaine iniurie saith he to match those auncient Monkes of the primitiue Church with those of the popish orders for the olde Monkes liued in their house without vowes as studentes in diuinitie in Colledges they were holie painefull learned they laboured with their handes Their societies were nources of good learning and godlie life to furnish afterward the Church whereto being once called they ceased to be Monkes and left their monasteries Here first you charge him with bolde slaundering as though he said that all Monkes and sriers are vnlearned vnpainfull and vnholie whereas he saith not so knowing that some are vnlearned though neither all nor the moste part no not in this learned age manie friers also take paines in preaching which with more commendation and credit might holde their peace Yet fewe Monkes labour that waye As for labouring with the handes saie you though it be not necessarie to anie if they be occupied in greater matters yet their is no monasterie wherein some doe not exercise that function But Saint Augustine in his booke deopere 〈◊〉 holdeth it to be necessarie for all Monkes to labour and admitteth not the excuses of praying singing of Plalmes reading or preaching the word of God for anie to be priuiledged altogether from not labouring with his handes cap. 17. 18. That some in euerie monasterie with you are appointed to that function as you saie it is but a mockerie of the olde labour of Monkes and left for a shadow of some similitude with antiquitie and not taking awaie the difference set downe by Master Charke That manie Bishoppes are chosen out of monasteries and that Pius 5. chose 70. Bishoppes out of one order it is litle to the purpose For the olde monkes were not onelie chosen to the office of rich and statelie Bishoppes but to serue in the painefull office of teachers and pastours and were as Master Charke saith the nources of good learinng of the ministerie of the Church as your popish orders are not out of which they may not depart to serue the Church without a dispensation and capacitie as they call it Your iest of his poore benefice by London and the barbarres shoppe are both a like and the latter as well agreeth vnto him as the former seeing it is wel knowne he neuer had anie benefice rich or poore in London by London or farre from London The first difference you confesse to be the greatest although you speake of it last where you saie he affirmeth that the Monkes of the primitiue Church made no vowes the contrarie whereofyou prooue by manie testimonies of the auncient fathers and in the end you conclud against Master Charke asking what he will saie to this and much more that mighr be brought for this matter And maie he not blush saie yon to haue made In saing that the religion of the primitiue Church made no vowes so open and manifest alie But may not all modest Papists blush in your behalse seeing your owne forehead as it seemeth is hardned against shamefastnes for that you haue made so open and manifest a lie in saying that Master Charke affirmeth that the Monkes of the primitiue Church made no vowes whereas he saith not so but farre otherwise for these are his words they liued in their houses without any superstitious vowes Is it all one to saie they made no vowes to saie they made no superstitious vowes the like impudence you shew in charging him with cogging and foisting for placing his quotations of Saint Augustine in the margent right ouer against the matter of vowing which is both false and vniustlie laide to his charge the Printer had set them a litle wrie For the quotation beginneth right ouer against the name of Austen in the leafe or text although the taile of it extende to the line in which he speaketh of vowes The places that are quoted for vowes are speciallie against the mariage of them that haue vowed sole life yet haue we good testimonie of the fathers that such as are not able to keepe those vowes rashlie made ought to betake them-selues to the lawfull remedie of mariage Epiphanius Cat. Apostolic Haer. 61. Hieronymus ad Demetriadem c. Where M. Charke denieth Saint Augustine to be a Frier First you cauill which Austen he meaneth the Bishoppe of Hippone or of Canterburie and both you say were Monks and the later you make our first Apostle in England yet was he an Apostle from Gregorie not from Christ. What Doctor Fulke hath written of him he answereth in his confutation of Popish quarrels Pag. 43. But how prooue you that the elder Austen was a Monke as monkes were termed in his time you cite Ep. 89. tract 1. de com vita clericorum and Possidius or Possidonius in his life To the first quotation I answere that Saint Augustine in that epistle confesseth not that he was a Monke onelie he acknowledgeth that he once solde all that he had and gaue it to the poore But that he had priuate possession when he was Bishoppe Possidonius doth plainlie declare The second quotation is of no worke of Saint Augustines but of I know not what bable rule of some impudent counterfeiter whose style is as like Augustines as an asse is like a Lyon To the third I answere that the writer alledged saith that Austine when he was made prieste or elder of the Church of Hippo did institute a colledge or monasterie of studentes with in the Church which were especiallie appointed to serue afterward in the Church as they also that were afterwarde brought vp in other monasteries set vp by his schollers But neuertheles he neither calleth Augustine nor any of his schollers Monkes For these Monasteries by Augustine him-selfe are called diuersoria hostelles or Innes Demoribus eccl Cath. lib. 1. cap. 33. being distincte from Monkes which in those daies were onelie Anachorets or Caenobites both liuing in the wildernes whereas these liued within cities yet in streighter discipline then the common sorte vnder the gouernement of a verie Godly and excellent learned man in Christian charitie holines and libertie not in superstitious vowes are called by Augustine none otherwise but a laudable kinde of Christianes And all this maketh him neither Monke nor Frier You say he was not called so in English but in latine Frater and Monachus For the name of Monachus I haue answered that you are not hable to prooue it by authenticall author
the Church imbaryed from the vse and exercise of that office of remitting sinnes and such other the like spirituall functions FVLKE That the lacke of the fruit of any sacrament is most commmonlie in the receiuer rather then in the insufficiencie of the minister it prooueth that the minister doth not properlie giue the effect of the sacraments but the outwarde seales thereof as Saint Iohn Baptist doth moste wiselie distinguish them saying I baptize with water but he that commeth after me shall baptize with the holie ghost and with fire Saint Basill in the place by you quoted saying that the power of remitting of sinnes is not giuen absolutelie but in the obedience of him that repenteth c. declareth what manner of power this is contrarie to that you haue hetherto for the moste part maintained As also that he sayeth within few wordes after that the new testament doth promise remission of all sinnes to them that worthely repent he concludeth plainlie against your long discourse wherin you would haue it seeme as though the priest had absolute power of remitting and not an authoritie of declaring the sentence of God concerning such And Saint Cyprian or whoesoeuer is author of that worke De cardinalibus Christi operibus confirmeth that which I saide that the minister doth not properlie giue the effects of the sacrament but onelie the outwarde seales thereof as Iohn Baptist doth testifie His whol sentence I will repeate because you haue not so fullie set it downe not so truelie translated it Veniebat Christus ad Baptismum non egens lauacro in quo peccatum non erat sed vt sacramento perennis daretur autoritas tanti virtutem operis nulla personarum acceptio commendaret quoniam remissio peccaterum siue per Baptismum siue per alia sacramenta donetur propriè spiritus sancti est vt ipsi soli huius efficientiae priuilegium mancat Verborum solennitas sacri inuocatio nominis signa institutionibus Apostolicis sacerdotum ministerits attributa visibile celebrant sacramentum rem verò ipsam spiritus sanctus format efficit consecrationibus visibilibus inuisibiliter manum totius bonitatis author apponit plenitudinem gratiae vnctionis diuinae pinguedo sanctificationibus officialibus infundit remsacramenti consummat persicit Christe came to Baptisme not wanting that 〈◊〉 as he that was free from sinne but that perpetuall authoritie might be giuen to the sacrament and that no respect of persous might commend the vertue of so great a worke because remission of sinnes whether it be giuen by Baptisme or by other sacraments is properlie the holie ghostes and to him alone the priuiledge of this essectuall workeing remaineth The solemnitie of wordes and the inuocation of the holy name and the signes appointed for the ministery of the Preists by the Apostles doctrine and instruction doe celebrate the visible sacrament but the thing it selfe the holie ghost formeth and worketh and the author of all goodnes doth inuisiblie put his hande to the visible consecrations and the fatnes of the diuine vnction doth power the fullnes of grace into the ministeriall sanctifications and doth make consummate or make perfect the matter of the sacrament That the ministers desertes doth nothing alter the sacramentes or the effect of them it is no controuersie betweene vs howsoeuer you would make the ignorant beleeue that Caluine is of another opinion wherein his writings are moste manifest to the contrarie Where you approoued him that is lawfullie called to haue receaued the gift and grace of the holie Ghost which is the selfe same that the Apostles receaued of Christ for the like functions you take too much vpon you for the ordinarie and externall calling to exercise an outwarde ministerie where of Cyprian discourseth may be without receauing of the holie Ghoste Againe no man hath authoritie to giue the holie Ghost in ordaining more then in Baptisme or anie other parte of the ministerie of the Gospell Thirdlie where you require lawfull calling and ordaining in the minister of the sacrament that the receiuer being rightlie qualified maie obtaine like benefit of whomsoeuer the office is exercised you exclude lay men and women from ministring of the sacrament of Baptisme which your doctrine doth admitte Finallie where you assure the minister of the continuance of his authoritie by that gift of the holie Ghost be his life and desertes neuer so euill you saie verie much For what if he be an Idolater a persecutor of Christians or degenerated into Mahometisme wil you say his gift and authoritie doth still continue nay you saie it continueth though he be neuer so ignorant Then if he be a naturall foole or a mad man or one void of all Christian knowledge either when he was ordained or fallen since into such extremitie of ignorance yet by your rule he retaineth his gift Nay if he be for heresie schisme or notorious euill life lawfullie embarred from the vse and exercise of remitting sinnes and other like spirituall functions yet his gift of the holie Ghost continueth still with him This is in deede an indeleble character that is imprinted so deepe that nothing can scrape it awaie except perhappes a glasse or knife in degradation For as I take it you meane of him that is onely suspended from his office as though the practize onelie and not the authoritie for a time might be taken from him But to make an end of this matter I turne Caluins reason against him selfe He and his flocke be of that fond and blinde iudgment that the whole text of the twentith of S. Iohn wherin Christ giueth authoritie to the Apstoles to remit sinnes is meant onelie of preaching the Gospell for which function Christ gaue them the holie Ghost Now sir vpon this I vrge him with his owne reason I ask him first whether the ministers that by him cresent to preach the word of the holie ghost as for example Beza that he sent into Fraunce first or Richerus whome he sent to Coligninia or Hermam that came by the holie Ghostes sending vnto Flaunders Brabant had these the holie ghost or no If they saie yea as I think they will they be so bolde in an other mans house then demaund of them further whether the said spirit maie erre If they saie no as possiblie they will then conclude against them thus The holie Ghost can not erre ergo you haue not the holie Ghost and consequentlie you haue then no better right in preaching then poore Priestes haue in remitting or absoluing Therefore I leaue Caluine wrestling with his owne shadow and will follow on my purpose and course of matter which I haue in hande FVLKE Now we shall heare how cunninglie you can turne Caluins reason againste him selfe First you saie he and his flock be of that fond and blinde iudgement that the wholl text wherein Christ geueth authoritie to his Apostles to remit sinnes is meant onelie of Preaching the Gospell for which function
to Christianitie for they will giue all ouer them selues But briefllie to conclude vp the answere to their reason founded vpon Nouatus his principle touching Gods honour thus I saie That neuer derogateth to Gods honour which is agreable to gods ordinance but that priests should remit sinnes is the ordinance of God as is declared therefore the vse thereof doth not derogate any whit to gods honour Againe as great workes and as proper to god as remission of sinnes was practized by the Apostles and yet is vsed by the Bishops of holie Church without all dishonour of god giuing the holie ghost and gods grace by laying on of 〈◊〉 Ergo remission of sinnes may be also practized of priests without all iniurie to God and the onelie right therein FVLKE Whethersoeuer the force of trueth or prouidence of God driue heretikes we haue no purpose to follow them The gifts which god bestoweth on his Church and the ministers thereof with all humilitie and thankefulnes we acknowledge receiue and exercise to his glorie and the benefit of his Church although we arrogate nothing vnto our selues either in them or in any other thing that is proper to God And therefore it is both a vaine and a false complaint that the Church adorned with Gods blessinges is forsaken and a congregation barren of all Gods giftes imbraced All offices of ministerie in the Church that God hath ordained we admit and practise neither will we giue ouer anie thing for all your childish prating whereof we haue warrant to enioie it out of the word of God To your syllogismes I answere thus to the first That to exercise the Power of remission of sinnes in such sorte as it is ordained of God is no dishonour to God but a great honour To the second I denie that anie thing proper to God as remission of sinnes giuing the holie Ghost and Gods grace as it is proper to God was or could be practised by the Apostles or anie mortal man properly otherwise I confesse that remission of sinnes as Christ hath commaunded it may be practised without all iniurie to God and his onelie right therein For further proofe of the forsaid matter it is declared that neither Christ nor his euerlasting Father nor the holie Ghost doe giue ouer vnto man or resigne the power of remission or anie other holie function of the Church but doe themselues continuallie worke all those graces by mans mynisterie and seruice THE EIGHT CHAP. ALLEN FVrthermore we must here consider that what worke soeuer God appointeth man to exercise in his Church either in remission of sinnes or giuing grace of Gods spirit or what other holie action soeuer may in his name be done for the benefite of the people by the ministerie and seruice of man either by the meanes and mediation of any other instrumentall cause we must learne that in these workes so wrought either by man or through other creatures God doth not resigne his right to the waies and workers thereof and giue ouer the wholl title that is due to himselfe in the saide diuine acts For then in deede mans practize should derogate from Gods power and he should as it were succeed God in the right of his proper power and euerlasting inheritance which onelie to surmise as heretikes do were meere follie Christ is by euerlasting right made the head of the Church and he resigneth not this office to anie mortall man For if he did then the partie that should by his graunt occupie for a season the same dignitie were his fuccessour and should holde in like right the same office as he did before But that notwithstanding he hath made his substitute and vicegerent by whom in his corporall absence he ruleth now the Church as he did before in his owne person not giuing ouer his preheminence supreame power therein but now practizing that by another which afore he exercised him selfe in his owne person It had beene a great derogation to Christ that Peter should haue bin Christes heir and successour for then Christ had lost the perpeiuitie an other man gouerning after him in like right and preheminence as he had before But for Peter to rule the Church vnder him in his steade as by his euerlasting right with commission from him that holdeth that soueraigntie for euer by whomesoeuer the Church shall be ruled till the worlds end in earth this I saie is no derogation to God nor his sonne Christ at all but it much prooueth that Christ according to his manhood is the head of the Church for euer because by man in earth he ruleth the same til his comming again the whichman though he be his vicar vicegerent yet he is not his successour Saint Augustine did trimlie allude to the vse of the olde law comparing the ministers of Gods Church to the yonger brethren who were charged to marrie the elder brothers wife when he died without issue in whose name they did practize the worke of mariage and therefore could not call their children by their owne names but by the name of their elder breethren For as they raised seede to their brother and for their brothers honour so the Priests that haue taken vpon them as it were in mariage to gouerne Christes Church and to bring forth children not in their owne names but in the name of their elder brother and her departed Husband As when they bring foorth children in Baptisme as through the wombe of the Church they bring them not forth as for them-selues and in their owne names but in the name of Iesus Christ beeing their elder brother euen so it is in remission of sinnes also in which case Christ resigneth not his authoritie as though he lacked that power him-selfe but practzeth that mightie worke by the ministerie of man which before he exercised in his owne person And as the baptzing not in the name of Peter nor Paull nor Apolle but in the name of Christ the first husband of the Church after whome the Children be called Christianes not Petrianes nor Paulianes doth much set foorth the honour of the eldest spouse so it prooueth and augmenteth Christes euerlasting honour and moste iuste title in remission of sinnes that till this daie no lesse now in absence by the seruice of his Priestes then before when he was present by his owne worde and will sinnes be in his name and faith fullie remitted yea euen the verie function of Preaching the Gospell which they saie is meant by remitting of sinnes although they say most foolishlie therein and against the common sense of all the fathers yet euen that function is Christs still though it be vsed of man in earth FVLKE You are as plentifull in proofe of that which is confessed as you are naked and barren in proouing that which is denyed The title of your Chapter we will graunt you without proofe and according thereunto we are content to decide this controuersie But you will no longer abide by it
some to be obstinate or dissemblers he may know who is to be bound and who to be loosed which he cānot do by hearing the diuersity of their sins For if their sins be as red as scarlet if they be truelie penitent they are to be loosed and if they seeme neuer so small if they be not repentant nor humblie contrite in heart for them they are to be bound While you seeke to make a difference betweene the authoritie of the minister in the Ghospell of pardoning sinnes more properlie then the priest clensed the Leper you declare that you are not content with the sentence of Saint Ierome nor of so many of the auncient fathers as made the case all alike And where you saie it was not said vnto them as vnto ours whomsoeuer you punish with Leprosie or make vncleane he shal haue a Leprosie you speake beside the booke For this authoritie was giuen to them that they should make cleane or vncleane and whomesoeuer they made cleane he was admitted into the congregation and whomesoeuer they made vncleane he was so accounted of all men Yet properlie they made neither cleane nor vncleane but declared them so to be according to the institution which they had of Gods law in exercise whereof although they erred and so the partie might be receiued or refused according to their error yet was he neither cleane nor vncleane in deede by their sentence but by the work of God and so be sinners The blasphemie that you ascribe to Saint Hilarie I haue confuted before Your distinction of prius natura and quoad nos is foolish sophistrie in this case For except God first worke in our hearts by his holie spirit faith of forgiuenes we can haue but small comfort in the priests absolution That God doth alwaies wörke at the instant in which Baptisme is ministred it is false if Saint Augustines doctrine be true who reacheth that Baptisme may be receiued out of the Church but cannot haue effect but in the Church that is if the partie came from heresie and submit him selfe to the Catholike Church ALLEN And so it is in penance where God the principall and the priest the secondarie or seruisable cause ioyntlie forgiue together For so the words of institution of this sacrament doe moste plainlie conuince whose sinnes you shall forgiue they beforgiuen he speaketh in the present tence as though he would saie as you forgiue them or reteine them ipso facto I forgiue them or reteine them And therefore sauing the honour of the Master of the sentences he had not good consideration when he did holde as some other did after him that first mans sinnes be remitted by God in his contrition and purpose to come to the sacrament and afterwarde the same remission to be declared by the priests and as it were confirmed by his approbation in confession being therein partlie deceiued by the saying of Saint Hierome before alledged whome he tooke perchaunce to haue compared in all respects the office of the olde Priest for the viewe of the vncleane and ours of the new law in the iudgement vsed vpon mans sinnes and partlie as I take it by a sentence of Saint Augustine which compared together the receiuing of Lazarus by Christ and the Disciples loosing his bandes to Christes pardoning of sinnes first and then the priests loosing the same afterward in the face of the Church This to be shorte is a peece of Saint Augustines sentence Quid ergo facit Ecclesia cui dictum est Quae solueritis in terra erunt soluta nisi quod ait Dominus soluite illum sinite abire What doth the Church then to whome it was said vhatsoeuer you loose it shall be loosed Marie she doth that which our Lorde saied loose him and let him goe Wherein Saint Augustine meaneth nothing els but that Christ is the principall agent and that he properlie doth giue life to the soull the Priest for all that beeing his seruant and minister therein and therefore by nature is a latter agent in the same worke which els as I haue prooued ioynilie perteineth to them both for that the effect of a Sacrament commeth not to any man till it be receiued except it be in certaine cases of necessitie where the parties can not obteine the externall rse of the appointed element though they earnestlie desire the same But how the olde Priests office touching the Lepers of the law representeth our sacrament of the priests ministerie in the new Testament and how farre ours which is the truth excelleth that which was but a shadow of ours Saint Chrysostome doth excellentlic declare and therewith fullie may put out of doubt all men that our Priests properlie worke remission of sinnes as ministers in the same diuine action and not as declarers or approouers of that effect which before was wrought by God himselfe Thus he saith Corporis lepram purgare seu veriùs dicam haud purgare quidem sed purgatos probare Iudaeorum sacerdotibus solis liccbat at verò nostris sacerdotibus non corporis lepram verùm animae sordes non dico purgatas probare sed purgare prorsus concessum cst Quamobrem mco iudicio qui istos despiciunt contemnuntque multò sceleratiores ac maiori supplicio digni fuerint quà m fuerit Dathan vnà cum suis omnibus That is to saie To purge the Leprosie of the bodie or ells to saie as it was in deede not to purge but to discerne who were cleane was graunted onelie to the Priests of the olde law but it is fullie graunted to our Priests not to purge the bodilie lcprosie nor to snew who are cleaner purged but vtterlie to purge the verie filth of mans soull Therefore by my iudgement whosoeuer doe contemne or despise them they are much more worthie punishment then the disobedient Dathan with all his companie Thus saith this holie Father with many wordes moe which were worthie all consideration and rememberance in this case if the matter were not so abundant that it may not suffer ouer long abode in one place lest iniurie be done to other braunches of the cause no lesse necessarie to be knowne for full vpholding the truth thereof FVLKE Your argument taken of Christs speaking in the present tense is vaine and of no force to prooue that the forgiuenes or reteining of God and man concurre in one instant For in the latter sentence of reteining the verbe is of the preterperfect tense 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but in the same sense that the verbe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the former sentence which is of the present tence proouing Gods forgiuenes to goe before mans declaration thereof The Master of the sentences is litle beholding to you that doc so flatlie condemne him of error whereas he did write nothing in this point which was not commonly receiued in the Church of Rome in his time and long after For among the articles in quibus Magister non tenetur there is
it was in the Apostles That the Church of God meaneth not to make all men partakers of the pardons which would seeme to be rel eued thereby but such onelie as be of sit disposition therefore and how they ought to be qualified that must be partakers thereof THE 10. CHAP. ALLEN IT is here necessarie therefore that we should aduertise al men that the Popes and Bishoppes of holie Church though they haue not onelie by Christes expresse worde but also by the warrant of the Apostles and practize of their predecessours authoritie to binde and loose yet cuerse of their Pardons or releasing of penance not alwaies to be beneficiali to euerie one that shall claime benefit thereby either in the world present or the next For the holy sacraments themselues doe not at all times attaine to that effect in man for which they were instituted by Christ through the vnworthines of the partie that should receiue them Therefore to make the Pardon 's beneficiall at there must be good consideration and respect in the giuer so the receiuer must by especiall loue zeale and deuotion be made fit and apt to be par taker of so singular a treasure The giuer of the Pardons because he is man may haue sinester respect to the parties person whome he seeketh to pleasure either for kindred for frindship for feare for ritches for honour and such like and they which required them maie for slouthfullnes because they lost not doe penance for their sinnes or for delicatenesse whiles they refuse to absteine from thinges that be pleasaunt for recompence of their pleasures past in these and such other cases some Popes may give by the abuse of their keies authoritie or by error proceeding on false suggestion a pardon as the penitent may also receiue in the face of man But let them assure them-selues that so be affected that God himselfe who cannot be deluded nor by sinester affection caried from iust iudgement will not here confirme the sentence of his seruant who was in this matter either himselfe to blame without cause to bestowe so pretious a pearle of Gods mercie or else the partie vnfit that required to be partaker of that grace whereof afore God he is prooued vnworthie Though the preheminence be neuer so great yet as 〈◊〉 the keie of order may erre through the fault of one partie in remitting sinnes in the sacrament as the keic of iurisdiction may erre in pardoning the inioyned penance out of the sac 〈◊〉 Therefore it is not good for 〈◊〉 man to leaue his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vndore or to omie such necessarie workes of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 at whereby he shalrather be unworthie to be partaker of a 〈◊〉 FVLKE If the poopish Church haue another meaning then the Pope the heade in meaning is deuided from the body The Popes meaning is 〈◊〉 by his wordes which he vseth in his Pardons If the Pope also haue a contrary meaning to his words what is he then but an impupent dissembler which 〈◊〉 great thinges and deceiueth them that pay for them which suppose that their ware is as good as it seemeth to be But by your determination the matter is altogether mistaken Your first reason to prooue that pardons are not alwayes beneficiall to the receiuers is that the sacramentes haue not alwaies their effect thorough the vnworthines of the receiuers But if the receiuer be disposed according to the conditions expressed in the pardon he is capable of it by the iudgement of the canonists Your second reason is the sinister respect or error that may be in the giuer But it is not right that the receiuer being a capable person especiallie hauing paied for his ware should leese his benefit thorough the default of the giuer if he be such a one as hath autority to giue That slouthfulnes or delicatnes should exclude a man from the benefit of his pardon that is in state of grace as they terme it I suppose you are not able to prooue by any groundes of popery The glosse vppon the Bull of Iubileie first graunted by Pope Boniface 8. saith that the Pope declared consistorially that penances inioyned before are also taken away by commutation of the satisfactotic worke in this pardon prescribed and that vowes also except the vow of Ierusalem are taken away by this paidon not onely those vowes which were inioyned for commutation of penance as for satisfaction of sins but also those vowes that haue no such respect as if a man being in daunger of the sea or in siknes doe vow to goe to S. Ieames So that if a man wil performe such penance or vowes it is but a worke of supererogation But if the Pope may so easily erre in occupying of his key of iurisdiction as here you pretende no man can haue confidence in any pardon or dispensation of the Pope because he can not be assured whether the keie did erre in that pardon or iurisdiction likewise seeing the key of order may so easilie goe awrie what trust may a poore Papist haue that his sinnes be forgiuen him that must hang vppon the hitting or missing of tow so vncertaine keyes ALLEN Christ our Lord pardoned Mary Magdelen of manie sinnes and by all likelihood forgaue her all the paine due for her greeuaus offences both eternall and temporall Marie she was wonderfully well framed and apt to receiue such a singular benefit for shee loued exceeding much and therefore much was forgiuen her She washed Christes feet with her teares and with her heare of her head she wiped them againe She honoured Christes bodie with ointment of price towardes his buriall with other such expresse tokens of passing loue of our Lord which did winne her a pardon of so manie sinnes For of loue it is written Charitas operit multitudinem peccatorum Charitie couereth a number of faultes And yet after all this large remission if we beleeue histories of the Church shee ceased not all her life to doe passing pennance FVLKE It is certaine that Christ pardoned the sinnefull woman whereof Saint Luke speaketh as well of all paine as of all sinne And shee was wonderfully wel framed to receiue his pardon by the grace of God by which shee was endewed with faith as he himselfe acknowledgeth saying vnto her thy faith hath saued thee And this her faith was not idle but wrought thorough loue which shee acknowledged ought to be the greater as shee had receiued the greater mercie so gaue forth great tokens therof But her loue was not cause of her pardon or forgiuenes of her sinnes but because manie sinnes were forgiuen her therefore shee loued much as shee had greater cause for he to whome litle is forgiuen ioueth litle as it is manifest by the parable of the two debters Neither doth charitie couer manie sins by winning a pardon for them but as S. Peter citeth the prouerbe out of Salomon whoe declareth that it is the effect of loue to hide our neighbours faultes where hatred contrariwise