so shall thy nauel be hole and thy bones strong â–ª And Iâ— but is not we that can fynde out the almightie for in power equitie and righteousnes he is hiegher then can be expressed Let men therefor feare him for there shall no man se him that is wise in his own conceat we must not â—eke out the sâ—cretes of God for we shall not preuaile but bring our selues to consufion If we go about to establishe our opinions by gods secret will we must nedes fâ—ll in horrible darcknes and errors for who can know what the will of God is we must submitt our selues with all humilitie to the word and there with great reuerence search out such things as are written for our comfort and edification which we can not duelie vnderstand without the spirit of God to teache vs as it is written oh Lord who can haue knowledge of thy vnderstanding and meaning except thâ—w giue him wisdom and send thy holy Gost from aboue But if we prepare our selues with râ—uerence to read the word of God to the intent to vnderstand it to our consolation and with humilitie submâ—t our selues to do it God will open to vs so much as is ether necessarie or profitable for vs. ANSWER What confirmation our doctrine hath by the inuincible and most euident testimonies of gods holie scriptures I will not now dispute onely I must coÌ„pleine that maliciously and most impudently ye wrest our wordes and peruert our myndes And for the probatioÌ„ thereof I say that ye are neuer able to shew in any of our writings the wordes and sentences which in this place ye affirme vs to say ye be neuer able I say to proue that we haue written or taught that God by his reueled will will all men to be saued and yet by his secrete will he willeth many to be damned That by his reuâ—led will he willeth no wickednes but by his secret will he will Pharao to be hard hearted Semei to curse Dauid the Patriarkes to sell their brother Ioseph that by his reueled will he wolde not that Adam shoulde fâ—ll but by his secret will he willeth Adam to fall These propositions I say you be neuer able to shew in our writinges nether yet to proue that our doctrine did or doth tend to that end for we constantly affirme that God reueled vnto vs his most holie and most iust wil in his plaine and holie scriptures which do assure vs that a separation shal be made betwext the goates and the lambes that the one shal receaue the kingdom propared vnto them before all beginning and that the other shal be adiudged to the fyre which neuer shal be quenched That God stirred and raised vp Pharao that his power might be declared in him that these wordes God plainely spoke to Moises I know that Pharao shal not permitte the people to depart therefore haue I hardened his heart that I may multiplie my woÌ„ders vpon him that Dauid did represse the furie of Abisai and of his seruantes who wolde haue killed Semei saying suffre him to curse for the Lord hath commanded him the Lord perchance shal behold my affliction and shal reward me with good for his cursing this day That Ioseph said to his bretheren be you not moued with sorow y â— ye haue solde me for the Lord hath sent me for conseruation of a great multitude it is not therefore you that haue sent me hither but God who hath made me father to Pharao and Lord ouer his hole house None of all these I say do we cast vpon gods secrete will as ye falsly accuse vs but we do constantly affirme that his will is so plainely reueled in these maters that such as shall denie any of them to haue bene gods wil can not escape abnegation of his eternall veritie And further we say that the fall of man is plainely reueled vnto vs not onely by experience but euen by that same law which was imposed to him shortly after his creation the transgression whereof made Adam and all his posteritie criminall and giltie to gods iustice that nether against gods wil reueled nether yet against his secrete wil. for by his will reueled can no man further conclude but this that in what day soeuer AdaÌ„ should eate of the frute forbiddeÌ„ that he should die the death But Adam against gods command ement did eat and therefor did he iustly vnderly the sentence of death And thus do we referre to gods will manifestly reueled what soeuer ye imagin that we ascribe to his secret will Nether yet nede you to maruell if ye list to take such paines as to read our writiÌ„ges where that we finde the doctryne that we teach your surmised lie we cast vpon your selues seing that Moises the prophetes Christ Iesus and his Apostles in all writings do affirme the same But yet lest that ye should think that we attribute nothing to gods secret wil I will in few wordes confesse what we teach maintein and beleue in that case And that the rather because you gather agreate absurditie not of our doctryne but of that which ye falsely imput vpon vs in this maner for asmuch you say as the secrete will of God is knowen to none but to him self alone Who hath reueled it to you how can you say this is gods secret will if it was gods secret will that Adam should fall and you knew it â–ª then it is both secret and vnsecret both reueled and vnreueled both knowen and vnknowen What greate absurditie is this To the which I answere according to your impudeÌ„t foolishnes that because you fight with your owne shadowe these yo r dartes do hurt vs nothing for we do not affirme that we do knowe the fall of man by gods secret will but by his will manifestly reueled vnto vs by his holie scriptures Or more plainly to answer yo r reasons which you think inuincible we say that that wil which was secret in God before all time was reueled to man in time by his owne word and that from time to to time the same became more manifest as sainct Paul witnesseth in these wordes To me the least of all saintes is giuen this fauor or grace that I should preach amoÌ„gest the GeÌ„tiles the vnsearchable riches of Christe That I should bring forth to light before all meÌ„ what is y e coÌ„munion of the mysterie w c was hid from all ages in God who hath made all things by Christ Iesus that the manifest wisdome of God may nowe be notified to principates and powers in heauenlie things by the Church according to the fore appointment of the ages which he hath made in Christ Iesus our lorde so that we are now bold to say that albeit no creature did knowe before all time what ordre God should kepe in the creation and disposition of all thinges in time yet may we nowe I say be bolde to affirme that the secrete was hidde in the
then were his workes full of crueltie miserie damnation and destruction Now as touching this saying who is able to resist his will we must learne what is gods will If you ask the Lord he will answer you it is not my will that any man sinne neither is it my will that the sinner die but rather that he amend and liue but if he will not amend but continew in sinne him wil I punishe and him may I also punishe hauing power aboue all men as the potter ouer the clay Wherefor when any man suffereth iustly for his trespasse he oght not to accuse God and say who can resist his will â–ª as God wold absolutely the destruction of his creatures as ye teach God will all men to repent and amend and also that theâ— who will not repent and amend be punished this his will is iust and full of mercie against which will is no man able to resist for either must they repent and amend orels they must suffer As the potter wold gladly make of his clay a good vessell but if it will not frame he breaketh it and casteth it away and as the king wold all his subiects to be obedient vnto his lawes yet the vnworthiest slaue in his dominion hath power to break the kinges lawes Notwithstanding wheÌ„ he suffereth for his offence the kinges will is fulfilled eueÌ„ so thogh God both wille hand coÌ„man deth vs to obserue his law yet haue we power to offend against the former parte of his will otherwies we should all obserue â—he will of God and be saued and so should there be no reprobate But when for our disobedience we be punished the will of God is fulfilled which will is both good and iust and therefor oght no man to accuse it aÌ„d say who is able to resist his wil. No more theÌ„ clay when it framed not to be a good vessell doeth accuse the potter of breaking it ANSWER Ye be not able to proue that in any vehemencie we alledge those wordes of the Apostle in other sentence theÌ„ he wrote theÌ„ for all praise aÌ„d glorie be vnto God the mercifull giuer we haue not so litle profited in the schoole of Christ Iesus that we wold wrest the wordes of the holie Gost to a coÌ„trarie sense We are not ignorant that the Apostle pronouÌ„ceth these wordes in the person of carnall meÌ„ who hearing that God hath mercie vpon those that he wil and that also he maketh hard hearted such as he will do storm and furiously crye wherefor theÌ„ doeth he coÌ„plein who is able to resist his wil. These wordes I say do we not vrge to proue our doctrine for where we affirme that the onely will of God is the perfect reule of all thiÌ„ges which be done aÌ„d are to be done in heaueÌ„ and in earth we build our doctrine vpon euideÌ„t testimonies of the scriptures aÌ„d vpon the cheif principalles of our religioÌ„ and faith Dauid and Isaiah do both aggre that our God who dwelleth in heauen doeth what so euer he will in heaueÌ„ and in earthe that he formeth light and doeth creat darknes that is giueth aswel prosperitie as aduersitie Daniel affirmeth that the supreme God distributeth kingdomes as best semeth to his wisdom and Salomon doeth witnes that against the Lord there is no counsell can preuale The necessarie principalles of o r faith do teach vs that as in God there falleth no ignorance so in him there is no impotencie He doeth not as it were in suspeÌ„se aÌ„d doubt behold the eueÌ„t aÌ„d chaÌ„ce of thiÌ„ges ronning after to seke remedie but that in wisdom hath he disposed all thiÌ„ges willing nothing which he may not and doeth not bring to passe in time according to his eternall purpose and working nothing which is not most iust howbeit the causes thereof be hidde frome vs. Of these and many mo scriptures and necessarie principalles of our faith do we grounde our doctrine and not vpon that one place spoken in the rebuke of the stubborn and rebellious disputers with God ye burden vs that we accuse and make God to be the author of euill aÌ„d the cause of damnation That we cause many brest owt and say since his will and pleasure no man is able to resist let him lay it on him self aÌ„d not to vs if any sinne be committed And last ye affirme that if our sainges be true that then are gods works full of crueltie miserie damnatioÌ„ and destructioÌ„ and so of two thinges ye accuse vs and the thirde ye affirme ineuitably to folow of our doctrine if it be true Here after I will not greatlie labour to confute thy argumeÌ„tes which is a thing most easie euen to any godlie man how beit he had neuer sene arte nor studied the same But seing that thow and thy most pestileÌ„t sect be not content maliciously to sclander those that in such a case be most innoceÌ„t but that also with most impudent mowthes ye vomite furth your horrible blasphemies against gods maiestie I will most earnestlie and most vnfeanedlie require of all reulers Princes Magistrates and gouernors who in the fear of God do ruele aboue their subiects that as they will answer in the presence of the Lord Iesus for the administration of iustice committed to their charge that indifferently they iudge betwext you and vs. To witt that if we can euidently be coÌ„uicted of those crymes which ye most maliciously and most vniustly lay to our charge that then iudgement without mercie be executed against vs. But and if ye fail in your probation and also if ye can not proue crueltie to be in gods workes supposing that our doctrin remaine as that it is trew aÌ„d stable that then such order may be takeÌ„ for repressing of your vennemous tongues that neither ye be permitted thus openly to blaspheme gods Maiestie neither thus maliciously to sclander innocentes and to offend y e eares of all godlie hearers And to the end that meÌ„ shall not think that being at this time accused we beginne to deuise new defenses or excuses of our selues I will faithfully and simply bring furth of the workes as som what I haue done before of that singulare instrument of Christ Iesus in the glone of his Gospell Iohn Caluin such sentences as shall make plaine to all men what our opinion is of God of the fall of man of the woÌ„derous work of our redemption and of the most iust reiection and damnation of the reprobat Thus saieth he dependeth the perdition of the reprobate vpoÌ„ the predestination of God that the cause and the mater is altogither found in them the first man fell because the eternall iudged it expedient why he iudged it we know not yet certeÌ„ it is that he so iudged it not but that he saw the glory of his name thereby to be illustrate when that thow doest heare the mention of gods glorie there also remembre thow iustice to be for of necessitie it is that iust must y t
they do not vnderstaÌ„d But let vs deare brethren be assured that none other doctrine doth establishe faith nor maketh maÌ„ humble thankfull vnto God finally y â— none other doctrine maketh maÌ„ carefull to obey God according to his coÌ„maÌ„demeÌ„t but that doctrine only which so spoileth man of all power vertue y â— no portion of his â—aluatioÌ„ consisteth within him self to the end that the whole praise of our redemptioÌ„ may be referred to Christe Iesus alone whoÌ„ the Father of verie loue hath giuen to death for the deliuerance of his bodie which is the Church to the which he was appointed head before the beginning of all tymes To him therefor with the Father and holie Gost be all praise and glorie for euer and euer So beit THVS BEGINNETH THE BOOKE OF the aduersaries of Gods eternal predestinatioÌ„ The first error of the careles by necessitie ANSWER WE are not ignorant nether yet do ye dissemble whom ye accuse but how iustly you term our doctrine error and vs careles at this tyme I omit to speak becaus that after we shal haue occasion more largely to comoÌ„ with you in that mater Onely at this present I demand of you with what conscience can you burden vs with the odious name of stoicall necessitie which so often most impudently ye laye to our charge in this your moste vngodlie and confused worke seing that no men do more abhorre that deuelishe opinion and prophane name then we do It is easie to persuade you as I suppose that we dissent not from the iudgement of the reuerend seruant of Christ Iesus Iohn Caluin whome ye in skoffing and dispite vse to terme and call our God And therefore from hencefurth to put silence to your venemous tongues and to cause your impudencie more appere to such whose eyes sathan hath not blinded with like pryde and malice as in you are more then euident I will faithfully recyte his wordes and sentences in this behalf written thus in his Christian institutions Those saieth he that studie to make this doctryn meaning of Gods eternall prouideÌ„ce and praedestination odious falsly do calumniate that it is the Paradox that is doubtfull and hard opinion of the Stoiks who did affirm that all things chanced and come to passe by fatall or mere necessitie The which also was obâ—ected to saint Augustine As touching vs we do not willingly debate nor striue for wordes neuertheles in no case admit we nor receaue the terme which the Stoikes vsed in latyn called Fatum Aswel becaus it is of the nombre of those wordes the prophane and vnprofitable nouities whereof Paul willeth vs to auoyd as also because that by hatred of it our ennemies go about to charge the veritie of God As touching the opinion we are falsly and maliciously burdened therewith for we imagin not a necessitie which is conteined within nature by a perpetnal coniunction of natural causes as did the Stoiks but we affirme and menteine that God is Lord moderator and Gouernor of all things whom we affirm to haue determined from the beginning according to his wisdom what he wold do and now we say that he doth execute according to his power what so euer he hath determined Whereof we coÌ„clude that not onely the heauen and earth aÌ„d creatures insensible but also the couÌ„seles and the willes of men are gouerned by his prouidence so that they teÌ„d and are led to the scope and end which he hath purposed He procedeth further answering the obiectioÌ„ which may be made saing what then is there nothing done by fortune and chance I answer That wel and godly it is written by Basilius called the great That fortune and aduenture are the wordes of paynims the signification whereof oght in no wise to enter in to the heart of the faithfull For is all prosperitie be the benedictioÌ„ of God and aduersitie his malediction there remaineth no place the fortune in such things as come to meÌ„ And further to the end of that section he bringeth furth the mynde of Augustine concerning fortune whereof parchance we may after somwhat speake This one sentence is sufficient to coÌ„uict bothe your master and you of malicious enuie and most vniust accusation for herein doeth not onely Iohn Caluin and we all with him abhorre from the terme of Fatum called destinie but also from that diabolicall opinion which the Stoikes mainteined When I consider what should be the caus that thus maliciously ye should burdeÌ„ vs with that which so planely by word and writing we oppugne I am compelled to suspect that either ye vnderstaÌ„d not the nature of the terme which ye lay to our charge orels that ye haue a further fetch then at the first sight doth appere We planely do affirme that the opinion of the Stoikes is damnable and fals for they did place such power in the sterres and in their oppositious that impossible they affirmed it was to change or auoyd that which by their constellation and influence was appointed to come In so much that they helde that Iupiter him self whom they called the great and supreme God could neither alter nor stop the operation of the sterres and the effectes that should folow therevpoÌ„ and so they affirmed that the mutatioÌ„s of kiÌ„gdomes the honors of some men the deiectioÌ„ of others and finally that bothe vice and vertue were all togither in the power of the sterres Against this pestilent opinion strongly and learnedly disputeth Augustin in diuerse places but chefely in his fift booke of that worke intituled of the citie of God affirming that onely by the prouidence of God are kingdoms erected mainteined aÌ„d changed that sterres haue no power neither to incline man to vertue nor to vice that such blasphemies oght to be repelled from the eares of all men Which sentences becaus they do most perfectly aggre with gods infallible worde we reuerentlye embrace and constantly do beleue And so why that ye shuld thus impudently accuse vs of that which we neuer thoght wise men may wonder O say you ye take away the worde of Stoicall necessitie but yet ye affirme the selfe same thing which they affirmed I answer if ye can make no difference betwext the omnipotent moste perfect most iust and immutable will of God and the opposition of sterres called constellation you haue euill profited not onely in Gods scoole but also in those artes in which 〈◊〉 of you wold seme to be subtill Do we affirme that of necessitie it was that Pharao after many plagues susteined should with his greate hoste be drowned that Nabuchadnezer should be traÌ„sformed in to a brute beast that Cyrus should first distroy Babilon and after proclame libertie to the people of God after their long and dolorous captiuitie because the influence of the sterres did lead them to that end or do we not rather most constantly affirm that the aeternall counsel of God his immutable decre and most holie
wil which onely is the most perfect rule of all iustice and equitie did bring all these thinges to passe by such meanes as he had appointed and by his Prophetes fore spoken But here you storme crying in your accustomed furie What is this els but stoicall necessitie to make Gods wil the only cause of all thyngs be they good or bad How dull and ignorant you are if ye can not make differeÌ„ce betwext Gods will and that necessitie which the Stoikes mainteaned I haue before touched and how maliciously ye impute vnto vs wordes and sentences whereof ye be neuer able to conuict vs shall shortly God willing be declared But by this I perceaue where the shoe doeth wring you If Gods wil his counsel his prouidence and decre beare rule in the actions of maÌ„nes lief then foresee you and feare that your free will shall be broght into bondage and so can ye not com first to the perfection of Angels and in processe of tyme to the iustice of Christe by the meanes of your free will Whether I wrongously suspect you and so haue erred in my iudgement your own wordes shall after witnes For seing that we haue planely proued v t most vniustly and moste maliciously ye accuse and traduce vs of the vane opinion of the Stoikes I will procede to that which ye call our first error after that I haue for the better instructioÌ„ of the simple reader declared what we vnderstand by Prescience Prouidence and praedestination which termes do so offend you that ye can not heare them named When we attribute prescience to God we vnderstaÌ„d that all things haue euer bene and perpetually abyde present before his eyes so that to his eternall knowledge nothing is bypast nothing to com but all thinges are present and so are they present that they are not as conceaued imaginations or formes and figures whereof other innumerable thinges procede as Plato teacheth that of the form and exemple of one man many thousandes of men are fashioned But we say that all things be so present before God that he doeth contemplat and beholde them in their veritie and perfection And therefor it is that the Prophetes often tymes speak of things being yet after to com with such certentie as that they were alreadie done And this praescience of God do we affirm to be extended to the vniuersall compasse and circuite of the world yea and vnto euery particuler creature of the same Gods prouidence we call that souerane empire and supreme dominioÌ„ which God alwayes kepeth in the gouernement of all thinges in heauen and earth conteiâ—ed And these two that is Prescience and prouidence we so attribute to God that with the Apostle we fear not to affirme that in him we haue our being â—â—uing and lief We feare not to affirme that the way of man is not in his owne power but that his foot steppes ar directed by the eternall That the sortes and lottes which appere most subiect to fortune go so furth by his prouidence That a Sparro falleth not vpon the ground without our heauenlie father And this we giue not to God only praescience by an ydle sight and a prouidence by a general mouing of his creatures As not only som Philosophers but also mo then is to be wished in our daies do but we attribute vnto him such a knowledge and prouidence as is extended to euery one of his creatures In which he so worketh that willingly they tend and incline to the end to which they are appointed by his What comforte do the sonnes of God receaue in earnest meditations hereof this tyme will not suffer to intreate But at one word to finish alas to what miserie were we exponed if we should be persuaded that sathan and the wicked might or could do any thing otherwiese then God hath appointed Let the godlye consider Predestination whereof now this question is we call the eternall and immutable decre of God by the which he hath once determined with him self what he will haue to be done with euerie man For he hath not created all as after shal be proued to be of one condition Or if we will haue the definition of Predestination more large we say that it is the most wise and most iust purpose of God by the which before all tyme he constantly hath decreed to cal those whom he hath loued in Christ to the knowledge of him self and of his sonne Christ Iesus that they may be assured of their adoption by the iustification of faith which working in them by charitie maketh their workes to shyne before men to the glorie of their father so that they made conforme to the image of the sonne of God may finally receaue that glorie which is prepared for the vessels of mercie These latter partes to wit of vocation iustification of faith â–ª and of the effect of the same haue I added for such as thiÌ„k that we imagin it sufficient that we be predestinate how wickedly so euer we liue We constantly affirme the plane contrarie To wit that none liuing wickedly can haue the assurance that he is predestinate to lief euerlasting Yea althogh man and Angell wolde beare record with him yet will his own conscience condemne him vnto such tyme as vnfeanedly he turne from his wicked conuersation These termes I thoght good in the beginning to explane to the end that the reader may the better vnderstand our meaning in the same and that we be not after often coÌ„pelled to repete theÌ„ againe Now to that W c ye call the first error THE ADVERSARIE God hathe not created all men to be saued by any manner of meannes but before the foundation of the world he hath chosen a certen to saluation which is but a small flocke and the rest which be innumerable he hath reprobate and ordeined to condemnation Because so it pleaseth him ANSWER They are not onely reputed liers aÌ„d called fals witnesses that boldly and planelie affirme a lie in plane and expresse wordes but such also as in reciting the myndes of other men change their meaning by altering their wordes by adding more then they spake or by dyminishing that which might explane the thinges that remained obscure or more fully might expres the minde of the speakers And in all these thre vices are you criminall in this your first accusation or witnessing laid against vs. For our wordes ye haue altogether altered to them ye haue added and from the ye haue diminished that which ye think may aggrauate and make odious our cause And therefore I say ye are detestable liers and malicious accusers For probation hereof I appele to our writings be they in latyn freÌ„che ItaliaÌ„ or english in so many toÌ„gues this mater is writteÌ„ if that any of you be able to briÌ„g furth our propositioÌ„s in any of theÌ„ in this your forme aÌ„d coÌ„teining your whole wordes I offer to make satisfactioÌ„ vnto you
whether ye will be worde or writiÌ„g y â— I haue hieghly offended in calliÌ„g you detestable liers But if ye be neuer able to shew any such wordes vsed by vs as plane it is ye be not theÌ„ yo r master Castalio aÌ„d you bothe are far from y t perfectioÌ„ to speake no more bitterly w t ye preteÌ„d For ye are manifest liers aÌ„d whose soÌ„nes they are called you can not be ignoraÌ„t accusing meÌ„ of that they neuer meÌ„t For thus formeth Castalio his first fals accusacion against Master Caluin God hath created to perdition the most part of the world by the naked bare and pure pleasure of his own wil. And this same ye affirme in mo wordes more impudently patched â–ª so bothe you and he do adde to our wordes of your own malicious mynd These sentences God hath created the most parte of the world which is an innumerable multitude to perdicion onely becaus it so pleased him you steall from our wordes and suppresse that which euer we ioyne wheÌ„ we make mention of gods predestination to witt that he hath created all thiÌ„ges for his own glorie That albeit the cause of gods will be incoÌ„prehensible secret and hid froÌ„ vs wheÌ„ of y â— same masse he ordeyned som vesselles to honor aÌ„d soÌ„ to destructioÌ„ yet it is moste iust most holie aÌ„d most to be reuerenced Now to y â— further declaratioÌ„ aswel of o r mynd as of your shameles malice I shall recite som sÌ„eteÌ„ces of master CaluiÌ„ as doth that godlie and learned maÌ„ Theodorus Beze against the craftie surmyse of your master Castalio I say faieth Iohn Caluin with Augustin that of God they were created whom without doute he fore knew to go to perdition and that was so done becaus so he wold Why he wold it apperteineth not to vs to inquire who caÌ„ not comprehend it neither yet is it conuenient that the will of God shall discend and come downe to be decided by vs. Of the which so oft as mention is made vnder the name of it is the supreme and most hie rule of iustice nominated And further we affirme that which the scripture clearly sheweth to wit that God did once by his eternall and immutable counsel appoint whom somty me he should take to saluation and also whom he should condemne to destruction We affirm those whom he iudgeth worthie of participation of saluation to be adoptate and chosen of his free mercie for no respect of their own dignitie but whom he giueth to condemnation to the same he shuteth vp the entres to life by his incomprehensible iudgement But yet by that iudgemeÌ„t that neither can not may be reproued And in another worke If we be not ashamed saieth he of the Gospell it behoueth vs to confes that which therin is manifestly taught that is that God of his aeternall good pleasure whose cause dependeth vpon none other hath destinate to saluation whom it pleased him the rest being reiected And whom he hath honored with his free adoption those he illuminateth by his Spirit that they may receaue the life offered in Christ Others by their own will so remaning vnfaithfull that being destitute of the light of faith they continue in darknes Also that which sainct Augustine writeth So is the will of God the hieghest rule of iustice that what so euer he will in so far as he willeth it it is to be holden iust Therefor when the questioÌ„ is why did God so It is to be answered Because so he wold But if thow procede asking why he wold thow sekest a thiÌ„g greater and more hie then Gods wil which can not be founde And after saieth he We must euer returne to the pleasure of his will the cause whereof is hidde within him self But to make this mater more euident I will adduce one or two places mo and so put end to this your forged accusacion for this tyme. In his book which he wriâ—â—th of the eternal predestination of God thus he saieth Albeit that God before the derection of Adam had determined for causes hid to vs what he was to do yet in scriptures we read nothing to be condemned or him except sinne And so it resteth that he had iust causes but hid from vs in reiecting a part of men for he hateth nor damneth nothing in man but that which is contrarie to his iustice Also writing vpon Isaie the 23. chap. vpon these wordes The Lord of hoostes hath decreed to prophane the pryde of all the noble ones c â–ª he saieth let vs learn of this place that the prouidence of God is to be considered of vs that to him we may giue the glorie and praise of his omnipotecie for the wisdom and the iustice of God are to be ioyned with his power Therefore as the scriptures teach vs that God by his wisdom doth this or that so do they teach vs a certen end why he doth this or that for the imagination of the absolute power of God which the scholemen haue inuented is an execrable blasphemie for it is as much as they should say that God were a tyrant that appointed things to be done not according to equitie but according to his inordinat appetite With such blasphemies be the scholes replenished neither yet differ they from the Ethnicks who did affirme that God iested or did sporte in the maters of men But we are taught in the schole of Christe that the iustice of God shyneth in his workes what so euer they be y t the mouthes of all men may be stopped and glorie may be geuen to him alone And therefor the Prophet rehearseth iust causes of this destruction meaning of the destruction of Tyrus that we shall not thinke that God doth any thing without reason Those of Tyre were ambitious proude auaricious lecherous dissolute What is he so simple which may not now consider and vnderstand what was your malice and deuiâ—ish intenion â–ª in patching vp this your first accusation not the zeale of gods glorie as you falsly pretend but the hatred which ye haue conceaued against them who haue soght your saluation For if ye had ment any thing simply ye should not haue added that which ye be neuer able to shew in our writinges neither yet can ye laufully proue that we haue spoken the same in reasoning with any of you We so taught by the scriptures with reuereÌ„ce do affirme that God for iust causes albeit vnknoweÌ„ aÌ„d hid to vs hath reiected a parte of men But you making no mention of any cause affirme that we holde that he hath created the most part of the world which is innumerable to no other end but to perdiction in which shameles lie your malice paâ—â—eth measure For neither do we rashly define the nomber of the one nor of the other howbeit the scripture in dyuers places affirmeth Christes â—â—ocke to be the little flocke the nomber to be few that findeth the way that leadeth to life
euidently declared in Isaakes two sonnes being yet in their mothers boson â–ª before they had done either good or bad as the Apostle affirmeth It was said by the voice of God the elder shall serue the younger By which voice of God reueled did Isaak aÌ„d Rebecca plainely vnderstand what was the cause of the battell which the mother felt in her bosom aÌ„d wombe to witt that because from her wombe were two peoples and nations to procede which could not be of equall honour and dignitie For the one had he determined in his eternall counsell to elect for his peculiar people the other to reiect and to leaue them in the common corruption as the other nations as the sequel in processe of tyme did euidently declare For the Edomites discending of Esau were cut of from the bodie of the church and became manifest enemies to the posteritie of Iacob becaus that their father was subiect to Iacob and pronounced to be his seruant Such as vnderstand this place of corporall seruice and worldlie riches or dignitie onely do nothing els but shew their own ignoraÌ„ce corrupting the meaning of the holie Gost. For sainct Paul in the 9. chapter to the Romains after that he hath affirmed that the promes and â—lection of God were sure albeit that many of the carnall sede had refused Christe preached he bringeth in this former sentence to remoue all sclaÌ„der Saing All are not sonnes because they are the sede of Abraham that is those that be y e soÌ„nes of the fleshe are not therefor the soÌ„nes of God but those that be the sonnes of promes are accompted for sede And so to proue that which before he had affirmed to witt hat all were not Israelites that came of Israel he added these wordes Not onely this but also wheÌ„ Rebecca had coÌ„ceiued of one our father Isaak while the children were not borne while they had neither done good nor cuill that the purpose of God shoulde by de according to electioÌ„ not of workes but of the caller it was said to her The elder shall serue the younger Such as be not more then blind may easely perceiue that the Apole looketh to an other end then to worldlie dignitie For his purpose was not in that place to dispute and reason who should be riche in this world and who should be poore who should be lordes temporall and who shoulâ— be seruants but his purpose and mâ—nd was to declare tâ— whom did that benediction promised vnto Abraham appertein and to whom it did not apperteine So that the holie Gost speaking by sainct Paule is a commentarie of the wordes spokeÌ„ to Rebecca And I doubt not but so she did vnderstaÌ„d them To witt that y t promes which appered to haue ben common with all the sede of Isaak of whom it was spoken In Isaak shall thy sede be called was now restreined and made proper to one head and to the people discending of him that is to Iacob who after obteined the name of Israel So that bothe the peoples neither were reputed neither yet in very dede were the Church aÌ„d chosen people of God but the one was chosen and the other was refused The one by grace and of the caller was honored with the name and priuiledge of his churche The other was cast owt as strangers vpon the one remained the benediction of the which the other was depriued In this maner I say did bothe Isaak Rebecca yea Iacob and Esau in proces of tyme vnderstand this oracle of God But yet becaus this former place of the Apostle is by many euill vnderstand and by som maliciously wrested from the simple meaning of the holie Gost in as few and plain wordes as I can I purpose to declare how aptly and properly the Apostle vseth the testimonie and wordes of Moises Christ beiÌ„g preached to the iewes who were reputed the chosen people of God to whom and for whose comfort and deliuerance the Messiah was especially promised The most part of the iewes remained vnfaithfull refused the Sauiour who was sent blasphemed him and cruelly did persecute him and his meÌ„bres This could not be withoute a greate offeÌ„se aÌ„d sclaÌ„der to many thousandes bothe of the Iewes and gentiles The Iewes puffed vp with pride because they were the peculiare people because to them were giuen the law promesses aÌ„d oracles did brag and boast that God could not reiect theÌ„ except â—hat he should be found a lier For to Abraham and to his sede had he made a promes And the geÌ„tiles might be troubled with the like cogitations for they might think if God shall refuse his own people which so many yeares he tenderly had norished what stabilitie can we loke for thogh we should receyue this Christ preached Against bothe these sortes of men most valiaÌ„tâ—y fighteth the Apostle and most aptly alledgeth the scriptures to the confutatipn of the one and comfort of the other First against the Iew he reasoneth that albeit they be Israelites after the flesh yet it may be y t they be not the verey israelites of God neither yet is God endebâ—ed vnto theÌ„ thogh they be discended of Abraham The reason is that God made no promes to the hole sede of Abraham but to a parte of it to Isaak And if they should say but we are of Isaak he granting that doeth neuertheles proue that God doeth not choose y e hole sede of Isaak but in the mothers woÌ„be as said is by his own decre he made the differeÌ„ce And if further they should replie ô but we are of Iacob he then commeth to the proof of his first proposition affirming that albeit they were of Iacob yet did it not thereof folow that they were all the elect people of God for what prerogatiue wold he say can Iacob haue aboue his father Isaak or what can Isaak haue aboue Abraham Abraham who many yeres faithfully obeyed God could not obtein that all his posteritie no not Ismael for whom he prayed should be reconed to be his sede Neither could Isaak obtein the same but God appointed and did chose whom it pleased him And shall Iacob haue greater prerogatiue theÌ„ had they bothe shall he that of grace was preferred to his brother when neither the one had done good neither the other had done euill giue that priuiledge to all his posteritie that without exception they shal be the chosen people of God No will the Apostle conclude but God noâ— after the reuelation of his dear Sonne Christ Iesus doeth make the same difference in the posteritie of â—acob that somtymes he made in the sede of Abraham aÌ„d Isaak That is he chooseth whom it pleaseth him aÌ„d reiecteth also such as in whom he hath no pleasure aÌ„d that not onely amongest the Iewes but also amongest the gentiles and that to make the riches of his glorie knoweÌ„ towardes y e vessels of mercie which he had prepared vnto glorie whoÌ„ he hath called euen
For his mouth pronounced destruction against Ierusalem and yet sendeth he the ioyfull tydings of his resurrection to his disciples with that most singuler coÌ„fort that God remained vnto them both God aÌ„d father and eueÌ„ so doeth our Prophet Isaiah for in the oâ—e place he speaketh to the obstinate contemners but in the other place he speaketh to the afflicted children Wey I besech you the scriptures of God with greater reuerence The wordes of Christ ye likewies falsifie for he speaketh not of any common loue which he beareth to all meÌ„ but affirmeth that our heaueÌ„lie Father geueth good thinges or as Lucas affirmeth giueth the holie Gost to such as aske of him Ye must proue first that all aske in faith and according to his will which be the peculiar prerogatiues of the childreÌ„ of God before that Christes wordes can serue for your generall multitude either yet that you shall thereof be able to proue that God loueth all men a like Ye take your pleasure in reasoning with vs whom ye terme Careles by necessitie I will not recompence raling with raling but I pray God that thow the writer of this book shew hereafter greater diligence in godlynes then of many daies thow hast done where so euer thow hast hanted We vse not to subiect God to our corrupt affections but with reuerence and fear we leaue to his godlie wisdom the ordering of his creatures neither yet can you be able to proue that we either by word or writing haue affirmed that the principall end of any maÌ„nes creation was perpetuall paine But we affirme as before we haue declared that God for him self and for the manifestation of his own glorie hath created all thinges But of this we must after more largely speake The finall conclusion which ye collecte of nature is that God hath created none to miserie nor pain For that your master Castalio feareth not most blasphemously to affirme sayiÌ„g y t if he hath so done he is more crewell theÌ„ any wolfe O heauen and earth reuenge this blasphemie That man which here suffereth miserie and much clamitie yea and that also shal be adiuged to the fyre inextiÌ„guible is created of God or as you affirme is the birth of God I suppose your selues will not deny And that he suffereth all miseries by gods iust iudgementes and by his will expressed in his worde the scripture bâ—areth record For God saieth to the woman in sorow and dolor shalt thou beare thy children To the man In the sweate of thy face shalt thow eate thy bread and also cursed is the earth for thy sake Which and many mo places plainely witnes that God hath inflicted pain vpon man whom he hath created You answere That did God for the sin of man I confesse But yet is your foot fast in the snare For after sin man ceased not to be the creature as ye will terme him the birth of God If theÌ„ God be subiect to the law of nature as before we haue said and now agane repete that your vanitie and ignorance may the more appere so that he is bouÌ„de to do the self same thing to his birthes that nature moueth vs to doto our childreÌ„ I ask first why did God suffer man created to his own image to fall in to sin assuredly no naturall father will wittingly and willingly suffer his children to fall into apit or dongeon to destruction And secondarely I aske why did not God who is omnipotent hauing all wisdom and goodnes prouyde an other medicine for man then by death to ouercom so many miseries Thirdly if God wold that none shoulde be borne to miserie why did he not clearly purge the nature of Adam why did he not stay that venom and corruption in our first father why did he permitt it to infect all his posteritie There is no shift that here can serue you For if you say God was prouoked by the sinnes of the posteritie which he did forese to be in them so to do I answer that he foresaw nothing which his eternall and infinit power might not haue remoued aÌ„d remedied if so had pleased his godlie wisedom for then as now was he the God who alone may do what so euer he will in heauen and in earth And further I say that the fouÌ„tain being shet vp the flowing of sin by naturall propagation should haue ceased To gods permission we shall after answer To put end to his mater if ye coÌ„sider nothing els in the great varietie of gods workes but the onely miserie of the sufferer aÌ„d sin which we denie not to be a cause of the same ye haue no better profitâ—d in the schoole of Christ then had the disciples wheÌ„ seing him that was born blind they demanded this question Master say they who hath sinned whether this maÌ„ or his parentes that he should be born blind No other cause did they se of his miserie but sin And to theÌ„ it was straÌ„ge that any man could sin so greuously before he was borne that for the same he should be punished with perpetuall blindnes during his life And that he should suffer such miserie for the offences of his Parentes appered to them to repugne to gods iustice and to that sentence which before he had pronounced by the Prophete Ezechiel affirming that the son should not beare the iniquitie of the father But Christe Iesus in correcting their error giueth to you a profitable lesson if ye can receaue it affirming that neither he neither yet his Parents had sinned that so he should be borne but that the glorie of God should be manifested in him If gods glorie be declared and made manifest euen by the miseries which som creatures sustein Dare you therefor accuse God of creweltie Consider your bold foolishnes and repent your blasphemies before that vengeance strike After that ye haue concluded as you thinke our opinion to be naughtie by arguments drawen from nature you make a bold promes to proue the same by plain scriptutes And yet your first entrance is but by a reason not well grounded vpon these scriptures which ye alledge Thus ye write If God hath ordeined the most part of the world to perdition then were his wrath greater then his mercie but the scripture witnesseth that his mercie is ouer all his creatures Ergó will ye conclude He hath not created the most part of the world to perdition To proue that gods mercie is greater then his wrath ye bring furth the wordes of Dauid Psal. 30. 45. Isaiah 54. and of God him self proclaming his own name vnto Moises for these wordes are not the wordes of Moises as ye alledge but were spoken by God him self in the eares of Moises To the Maior I haue answered before that falsly ye burden vs that we affirme that God hath ordeined y e most parte of the world to perdition for we presume not to define what nomber God shall saue and how many he shall iustly
proue it to be sothen oght you to be ashamed to burden God with such vnrighteous iudgement Doeth not God rather forgiue the offence alredie committed Let him be your God which condemneth the innocent afore he offend But he shall be my God which perdoneth and forgiueth the offence alreadie committed which in his verie wraithe doeth think vpon mercie And so with Iob will I conclude The great God casteth away no man ANSWER How ignorantly and how impudently ye confounde the eternall purpose of gods reprobation with the iust execution of his iudgementes I haue before declared and therefor here onely resteth to admonishe the reader that most vniustly ye accuse vs in that ye say that we hold and teache that God damned man before he offended This you be neuer able to shew in any of our workes for constantly in worde and writing we affirme that man willingly fell from God and made him self slaue to sathan before that death was inflicted vpon him and so neither make we death the reward of gods ordinance neither do we burden him with vnrighteous iudgement But say with the Apostle that death is the reward of sinne and that our God is righteous in all his workes and therefor be ashamed and repēt your manifest lie That God forgiueth the sin committed and doeth remēber mercie euen when he appereth in his hote displeasure to punishe his Churche with thankes giuing and ioy we acknowledge But that thereof ye cōclud ▪ as ye say w t Iob that the great God casteth away no man we can not cease to admonishe bothe you and the readers that either ignorantly orels maliciously ye corrupt and depraue the minde of the speaker in that place Elihu saieth not as ye alledge The great God casteth away no mā but saieth Behold the mightie God casteth away none that is mightie and valiant of courage He main teneth not the wicked but he giueth iudgemēt to the afflicted And in this behalf your master Castalio who notwithstanding that he vseth to take large libertie in translation where any thing may seme to serue his purpose is more circumspect and more faithfull then you be for thus he translateth that place Althogh that God be excellent yea excellent and strong of courage yet is he not so dissolute y t either he will kepe y e wicked or denie iudgemēt to the poore Althogh I say y t here is a greater libertie thē I wold wish a faithfull translater to vse yet hath he not so corrupted y e sense as ye haue done Elihu reasonīg against Iob affirmeth that albeit y e power of God be infinit yet cā not his workes be vniust but that they are wroght in all perfectiō of iustice how beit that often as we be dull and blinde we do not vnderstand nor se at the first the causes of the same yet God giueth daily declaration of his iustice in that the preserueth and somtyme exalteth the verteouse that before were afflicted and deiecteth from honors the wicked and the cruell oppressors Be iudge your self what this serueth for your purpose THE ADVERSARIE Some other be that grant that sinne was à cause why man is reprobate and there with they hold that gods absolute ordinance is also the caus this saing conteineth cōtradiction in it self for if it be gods absolut ordinance then is it not in respect of any other thing but as they say because it hath so pleased him if they ment that gods ordinance is the cause why sinners suffer death or that God ordeined that sinners for their sinne should suffer death I could agre with them but that were contrary to that which they haue said that God absolutly ordeined any man afore he was yea afore the world to death because so it pleased him for if death be the reward of sinne and for offence and sinne we do die then cometh not death by gods absolute ordinance And if I do grant that both gods absolute ordinance and also sinne are the causes of damnation after your meanyng marke well what inconuenience foloweth thereof first ye must grant me that gods ordinance is the principall and chefest cause for it can not be inferior to any other cause secōdly ye will grant that the first or principale cause called Causa Causae is the cause of the secōd ād inferior cause called cause causate so to cōclude gods ordināce which is Causa causae shal be the cause of sinne which is Causa causata As for a familiar exemple the heate of the son and the dew cause the grounde to be frutefull and God also is the cause thereof for he maketh the barren ground frutefull but forasmuch as God is the principall and first cause he must be also the cause of the same which is but the second cause Thus it is clerely proued that if gods ordināce were the cause of reprobation then gods ordinance should also be the cause of sinne and God should be autor of euill contrarie to the hole scripture contrarie to the opinion of all godlie men and contrarie to our faith But forasmuch as God willing I intend to answer at length to this wicked opinion in the confutation of the third error I will speak no more hereof in this place ANSWER No further answer nedeth to be giuen to these your most vniust accusatiōs then those which we before haue giuen for neither do we so vnreuerētly speake nor write neither yet do we vnderstād nor affirme that gods absolute ordinance is the principall cause of reprobation of sinne and of damnation but simplie we do teache that God in his etternall counsell for the manifestation of his own glorie hath of one maste chosen vessels of honor whom before all tymes he hath geuē vnto Christe Iesus that they in him should receiue lief And of the same masse he hath left others in that corruption in the which they were to fall and so were they prepared to destruction The cause why the one were elected we confesse and knowledge not to be in mā but to be the fre grace and the fre mercie shewed and frely giuen to vs in Christe Iesus who onely is appoīted head to giue life to the bodie Why the others were reiected we affirme the cause to be most iust but yet secrete ād hid frome vs reserued in his eternall wisdome to be reueled at the glorious comming of the Lord Iesus This one thing do we compelled by your blasphemous accusations repete oftener then we wold to the end that indifferent men may se what doctrine it is which you so maliciously impugne How so euer ye ioyn gods absolute ordinance and sinne togither we make so far diuision betwext the purpose and eternall counsell of God for absolute ordinance we vse not in that mater and the sinne of mā that we plainely affirme that mā when he sinned did neither looke to gods will gods counsell nor eternall purpose but did altogither consent to the will of
The first argument of them which abuse gods holie predestination is easely soluted their argument is this where so euer there is election ther is also reprobation of the same sorte But God elected som men afore the foundations of the world Ergo he reprobated som other men afore the world The first part of this argument is false That wher so euer there is election there is also reprobatioÌ„ of the same sorte for gods election afore the world hath no respect vnto his coÌ„trarie reprobation afore the world Yea there is no such word nor phrase in the hole scripture but gods election afore the world is generall to all men as his calling is generall without respect of persons This is all redie sufficiently proued yet som of you do grant gods calling to be generall but not his election And in this ye accuse God of hypocrisie you wold make him a dissembler lyke vnto your selues which often times with your mouth do offer and promes that which ye mind neuer to perfourme But God is faithfull which is willing to perfourme all that he promiseth euen to them that refuseth him And thogh they attein not the promes because of their vnbeleue yet all the tyme of their calling be they in the generall election as those whom the king called to the mariage Notwitstanding they came not yet were they chosen to be partakers of the mariage and the seruant to whom the master forgaue all his debtes was chosen notwithstanding he atteined not that wherunto he was chosen but became a reprobate abusing the goodnes of his master God is no hypocrite which calleth men owtwardly and forgeueth debtes onely with the mowth but eueÌ„ from the hearte willing to giue salâ—ation to all them to whom he offereth it And the cause why such do perish is their obstinatnes to gods grace and as the Lord saieth their stifneck which hath an yron vaine and their browes of brasse which dispyse the goodnes of God they became cast awayes Becaus as saint Iohn saieth they loue darknes better then light And as Esdras saieth thei kept not that which was soweÌ„ in them whereof we may gather that they becom reprobates because they rather refuse the grace offered and grafted in them then that they are refâ—sed NotwithstaÌ„ding both may be conueniently spoken for because they haue forsaken me I will also forsake them saieth the Lord. And agane saieth the holie Gost. Cometh not this vnto the because thow hast forsaken the Lord thy God further that this is vntrew where so euer there is election ther is also reprobation of the same kynd it may be easelie proued by the inconuenieÌ„ce which cometh therof Christ is the elect and chosen of God As then Behold this may seruant vpon whoÌ„ I lean my elect in whom my soule is pacified And in an other place Thow art my witnes saieth the lord and my seruant whom I haue chosen and wile you say therefor that there be mo Christes which be reprobate for ether this saying where so euer there is election there is also reprobation of the same kynd is false orels there must be mo Christes That were much lyke to the saing of a Iew which when he had talked with a faithfull man verie much concerning the temporall and worldlie dominion and honour of Messias the christian proued by the prophecie of Daniel aÌ„d also by the prophecie of Isaiah that Messias should be euill entreated euen of the Iewes and put to death as an offender Here the Iew being driuen to a narrow shift rather then he wold applie and confesse the trueth he rather confessed that there should com two Messias of whom the one should be dispysed and the other magnified And if ye be so mynded that rather then ye will departe from your error ye had leuer confesse mo Christes of which som be chosen and the others reprobate Surelie then I think it is no faithful mans duetie to reason with you ANSWERE Easie it is in dede to solute those argumeÌ„tes w c in our names ye falsly forge either by adding such patches as in our writings caÌ„ neuer be fouÌ„d orels by so peruerting our mindes yea and the minde of the holie Gost that if possible it were ye wold obscure the brightnes of the son aÌ„d take frome creatures the benefitt of the same to the end that in your darknes ye might still remaine And therefor â— can not but complain of your deuilish malice which causeth you to peruerte aÌ„d writhe wordes well spokeÌ„ and reasons godly and substancially made Shew if ye can in any of our writings that we affirm that where so euer there is election there is also reprobation of the same sorte Shew that clause I say of the same sorte and I will confesse that ye haue red more then I haue done of that mater which neuertheles I hardly can beleue But to the end that the simple reader may vnderstaÌ„d how we do reason of election and reprobation by the contrarie effectes I will adduce not our reasons lately inuented but twentie yeres ago committed vnto writing by that notable instrument of God Iohn Caluin who thus speaketh wonder it is saieth he that Chrisostom did not call to mynd that it is the election of God w c maketh difference betwext men We feare not to grante that which S. Paule in greate coÌ„stancie doeth affirm To witt that all together are wicked and giuen to malice but with him we adde That by the mercie of God it cometh to passe thaâ— we abyde not in wickednes Therefor seiÌ„g that naturally we all labor w t a like sicknes These onely receiue health and amend to whom it hath pleased the Lord to put to his curing hand others whom by his iust iudgement he passeth by do languishe in their corruptioÌ„ till they be consumed Neither yet from any where els doeth it com that som continue to the end and others fall in to the curse which was begonne for because that persuerance it self is the gift of God which is not commonly giuen to al but he frely giueth it to whom it pleaseth him If the cause of the difference be soght why som constantly continue and why others fall away by instabilitie none other cause may be assigned but that the eternall God susteineth and streÌ„gthneth the one sort by his own power that they perishe not and vnto the others he giueth not the strength that they may be documeÌ„tes and witnes of maÌ„s incoÌ„staÌ„cie c. Thus vse we to reason by y e diuersitie w c we sein meÌ„ y t one sort are elect and others are reprobate and not as ye ymagin vs to do We say that nature hath made vs equall as concerning corruption and yet we se great diuersitie amoÌ„gest men We ask what is y e cause of this If ye answere education w c som Philosophers do that will be prouen fals as before I haue declared if ye say mans fre will
blynd libertines attribute vnto him And assuredly the God of these men is an Idole which oght to be more execrable then all the idoles of the Gentiles And so furth to the end of that chapter he proueth that God committeth no sinne in none of the wicked of the earthe c. Thus far haue I recited the mynd and most part of the wordes of that godlie writer written by him now twelue yeres ago agaiÌ„st the libertines By the which the indifferent reader may iudge whether that iustly you accuse him and vs that we make God author of sinne In the name of God and of his deare Son Christ Iesus whose glorie ye studie vtterly to suppresse I require as before of all those that be placed in auctoritie by his worde whose handes he hath armed with the sword of iustice that earnestly as they will answer before his fearefull throne of iudgement they take triall in this mater that if we be found either in life either yet in doctrine as we be accused that God may be glorified in our iust punishments but if we can not be coÌ„uicted as we fear neither triall nor iudgement that then our accusers may acknowledge their offence The second thing which is laid to our charge is that we cause many other to brest owt and say Sithe his wil and pleasure no man is able to resist let him lay it on him self aÌ„d not vpon vs if any sinne be committed If the blasphemies of the vngodlie should be laid to our charge becaus that we teach a doctrin most true and most comfortable to the childreÌ„ of God then can not the Apostle saint Paul be excused for the same blasphemies were vomited first against him aÌ„d the doctrine which he taught Som crying let vs do euill that good may com of it others let vs abyde in sinne that grace may abound soÌ„ furiously roring as ye do did dispitefully cry wherefor doeth he coÌ„plean who caÌ„ resist his will But was the doctrine therefor damnable or was the Apostle criminal for teaching the same I suppose ye will be more fauorable in this cause then so rashly to condemne him whom God hath absolued If then our doctrine can not be impugned by the plaine scriptures of God why should we sustein the blame of other mennes blasphemies Howbeit in verie dede the blasphemies of none come so plainely to our eares as yours do â–ª for the verey Papistes and the insolent of the world are yet ashamed so impudentlie to lie vpoÌ„ vs. Who althogh they will not folow the puretie of the doctrine taught by vs yet either are they put to silence by the power of â—he holie Spirit orels they inâ—ent som coulorable lies and do abstein from such open blasphemies as you cast owt against God and vs. We lay to your charge say you none other thing then ye your selues do confâ—sse for ye affirme that God worketh all things according to his will and pleasure We answer that maliciously and deuilishly ye wrest our wordes contrarie to our mynd for alwayes we make a most plaine difference betwext the will of God and the will of the wicked and betwext the purpose counsell and end of God and betwext the purpose and end of man as in all this hole processe before intreated the indifferent reader may well consider If ye continue in your blyndnes and furiously cry But ye afâ—irme that without his will and against it nothing is done therefor that men think that euen when they sinne they obey gods will I answer by the wordes of the same writer whoÌ„ before I haue alledged Touching the workes which we committ the will of God is to be considered as he him self hath declared it for in vaine hath he not giuen his law by the which he hath discerned good from euill As for exemple when he commandeth no man to be hurt no man to be iniuried but that equitie and iustice be indifferently kept to all that no man steal defraude his brother that none committ adulterie fornicatioÌ„ or filthynes but that euerie man kepe his own vessell in sanctification and honor Here is the will of God euident and plaine What further pleaseth him in these cases oght no maÌ„ to inquire for we know that if we do these and other thinges that be coÌ„manded and do abstein from all things that be forbidden that then we obey the will of God And if we do not that we can not be acceptable to him If that any man shall steall or committ adulterie and shall say that he hath done nothing against the will of God he lieth most impudeÌ„tly for in so far as he hath transgressed the commandement of God by the which he was taught what was gods will he hath done against his will Let all men now iudge if that we giue occasion to man to flatter him self in sinne and to think that when they committe iniquitie against the expresse commandement of God that then they obey his holie will If any demand whether that any thing can be done against gods will that is if God may not if he wold stay and impede the sinne of man before I haue answered by the mowth of Augustine and now again by Iohn Caluine that nothing is nor can be done which he may not impede if so it please his wisdom yea vtterlye we must eschew that we inquire not of his prouidence which is hid frome vs when that the question is of our duetie His word declareth vnto vs what he approueth and what he condemneth with that we oght to stand content and by the same oght we to reule our liues leauing the secretes to God as by Moises we are taught To make the mater more plaine the case supposed that I be tempted with concupiscence and lust a nother mans wife in the which I long striue and in the end â–ª fathan obiecteth to me this cogitation follow thy purpose for by that meanes thow maest perchance be further humbled aÌ„d after thow maest taste more aboundantly the mercie and the grace of God Should I therefor louse the bridle to my wicked affections should I declyn from the plain precept and enter into the secrete prouidence of God God forbid for that besides the violating or breaking of his commandement were horrible temptation of his godlie maiestie and so in one fact were coÌ„mitted dooble impietie The sinnes I know of gods derest children are greuous â–ª and many and wonderous is the prouideÌ„ce of God working in his saintes but neuer or seldom it is that such perilouse cogitations preuale against them for the spirit of God so rewleth in them thaâ— commonly this sentence of SalomoÌ„ is before their eies such as vnreuerently search out gods Maiestie shaâ—be oppressed by the glorie of the same And so must it nedes com to passe as Iohn Caluin affirmeth that the pryde of such must be punisâ—ed and that with an horrible punishement the pryde of
same the godlie may be ware For this present I say first that Seruetus whom you iustifie did maintein and by worde and writing dispersed abrode wicked and most deuilishe opinions of God which might not onely make his Godhead to be dispised but also called in doubt and question He iudged those things nothing necessarie to saluation w c Christ hathe commanded and ordeined And last that impugning the true religioÌ„ he did most obstinatly maintein his diabolical erros did resist the plaine trueth to y e death His erroneous opinioÌ„s of God of his eternal Godhead were these Whosoeuer beleueth any trinitiâ— in the essence of God hath not y e perfect God but goddes imagined and elusion of deuils That Christ is the Sonne of God onely in so far as he is be gotten of God in the wombe of the virgin and that not onely by the power of the holy Spirit but because that God begat him of his owne substance That y e worde of God descending from the heauen is now the flesh of Christ so y t the flesh of Christ is from the heauen â–ª further that y â— bodie of Christ is the bodie of the Godhead the flesh of God godlie and heauenlie as it that is begotten of the substance of God That the soule of Christ is God and that the flesh of Christ is God and that aswel the flesh as the soule were in the verie substance of the Godhead from all eternitie That God is the father of the holie Gost. That Christ hauing the participation of the Godhead or of God and participacion of man may not be called a creature but one that doth participat with creatures As the worde descended into the flesh of Christ so did the holie Gost descend in to the soules of the Apostles That Christ so long as he was conuersant in the flesh receaued not the new spirit which he was to receaue after his resurrection That in all men from the beginning is ingrafted the spirit of the Godhead euen by the breath of God yet may the spirit by the which we be illuminated That the substanciall Godhead is in all creatures That the soule of man althogh it be not God it is made God by the spirit which is God him self That the soule is made mortall by sinne euen as the flesh is mortal not that the soule returneth to nothiÌ„g as nether doth the flesh but that it dyeth wheÌ„ that it is depriued of liuelie actions And that it is holden in hel languishing as that it should neuer after liue but these that be regenerated haue another soule then that they had before because of the substance which is renewed for the godhead which is ioyned That a like it is to baptise an infant as to baptise aâ— asse or a stone That there is no mortale sinne committed before the age of twentie yeares These I haue thoght sufficient to produce at this present to let the reader vnderstand that it is not without cause that I say that Seruetus whom ye iustifie is a blasphemer I haue omitted things more horrible grieuous to auoid the offence of godlie readers which sodaÌ„ly I am not minded to manifest except y t I shal vnderstaÌ„d that your vennemous tongues be not stayed by these I appeale to the coÌ„scieÌ„ce of Castalio him self if in euerie one of these former propositions which concerne y e Godhead there be not conteined horrible blasphemie For what is more blasphemous then to affirme that such as beleue in the Godhead three distinct persons haue no true God but the illusion of the deuilles That Christ Iesus is not the eternal son of the eternal father that there is no distinction betwext the father and the Sonne but in imagination onely That Christ hath no participation of mans nature but that his flesh is from heauen yea that it is the flesh of the Godhead That in Stockes stones and all creatures is the substantiall Godhead If these I saâ—e be not blasphemies worthie of ten thousand deathes especially being obstinatly mainteined against all holsom admonition let all those that feare God iudge yea euen you your selues how furious that euer ye be iudge in the mater eueÌ„ as ye wil answer before the throne of y e Lord Iesus That coÌ„tempteously he spake of baptising of the childreÌ„ of y e publyke preaching of the Euangill and of the administration of the Lordes supper that haue you common w t him for this is your glorie and persuasion to all your scolers that these things be nothing necessarie to saluation yea most streitly ye inhibit all of your sect to frequent any coÌ„gregatioÌ„ but your own And whether this be blasphemie of your parte or not to affirme those thiÌ„gs nothiÌ„g necessarie which Christ Iesus hath established and commanded to be vsed in remembrance of him to his againe comming I am content that iudgement be referred euen to those that be most indifferent betwext vs and you To supersede the rest of your blasphemies I return to your booke because that after I purpose to speake of your holie conuersation and of the great perfection y t is founde in you Ye accuse vs that we haue written bookes in a perpetuall memorie of our crueltie affirming it to be lawful to put to death such as dissent from vs in religion Notwith standing that some of vs were of an other mynd before they came to auctoritie â–ª and further that we haue giuen the sworde in to the haÌ„des of bloodie tyrannes Trew it is that bookes are written bothe by you by vs. for your master Bellius affirmeth that lawfull it is not to the ciuil magistrat to vse the sworde against heretikes To whome that godlie learned maÌ„ Theodorus Beza hath answered In which if you or your master thinke not your selues fully answered ye may put pen to the paper when you list looking to receaue answer with conuenient expidicion Iohn Caluin hath besides committed to writing the examination of Seruetus and the cause of his miserable death which bookes albeit to you they be a perpetual memorie of crueltie yet I haue good hope that to our posteritie they shal be profitable as now to vs be the godlie labors of those that before vs haue foghten the same battel against the obstinate heretikes And further seing bothe you and we must abyde the sentence of one iudge we can not greatlye feare the preiudice of your faction Where ye aske if these be y e shepe which Christ sent furth in the middes of wolues And if the shepe can per secute the wolues and I demand for answer whether Moses was a shepe or a wolf wether that fearefull slaughter executed vpon idolaters without respect of persons was not as great a persecution as the burning of Seruetus and Ioan of kent To me it appereth greater for to them was granted no place of repentance no admonition was giuen vnto them but with out further delay or
hereof let vs compare the deniall of Peter and y e defection of all the Apostles with the sinne of Dauid Albeit Peter was not called to be a wordlie priÌ„ce as Dauid was yet I thiÌ„k ye wil not denie but to be called to the office of an Apostle to be Christes scoller the space of thre yeres to be so familiare with Christ y t he alone with other two did se Christ their master traÌ„sfigured did heare y â— ioyfull voice frome heauen â–ª did se Moises and Helias speak with him my trust is I say y t ye will not denie but that those were graces no thing inferior to Dauids kingdom temporall and yet how horribly y t Petet did denie Christ Iesus ye are not ignorante Yea but say ye Peter wept and soght grace with repeÌ„tance But I ask when the holie Gost doth answere y â— it was after the cocke had crowen and that Christ Iesus had looked vnto him Proceded y t looke I besech you from loue or hatered It should seme in dede by the effect that it came from loue for then it is said that Peter remembered the wordes of his master and so weÌ„t furth and wept bitterly By all liklihode then were his masters vordes before qwyte blotted oute of his memorie But God be praised we nede not to depend vpon vncerten coniectures The fall and deniall of Peter as in an other place we haue declared came not by chance as a thiÌ„g whereof Christ Iesus was ignoraÌ„t He did forese it and before speaketh it And what coÌ„fort gaue Christ Iesus vnto him â–ª before he pronounced that sharp sentence before y e cock crowe thow shalt denie me thries This comfort I say which oght of all faithfull most to be exâ—olled Simon SimoÌ„ beholde SataÌ„ hath desired you that he may sift you as wheat but I haue prayed for the that thy faith faile not and thow being conuerted confirme thy bretheren Did Christ pray for Peter knowing that he should denie him so he affirmeth Doth the praier of Christ Iesus and the effect thereof vanish in a moment God for bid that such impietie take place iÌ„n our heartes The Apostle doth witnes that as his sacrifice is euer recent before God so is his praier effectuall euer for his elect Doth God vtterly hate detest and abhorre such as for whom Christ Iesus praieth yea commendeth to his mercie before they fall iâ—n to danger my hope is that the godlie will not so iudge The same I might proue by the stowte denial of Thomas besides the defection of all the rest who after that the glad tydings of Christes resurrection was confirmed by the testimonie of many did obstinatly say except that I put my fingers in the holes c. I wil not beleue Here ye se was no repentance of his former infidelitie but rather an augmentation and increase of the same And did it procede frome loue or from hatered that Christ cometh vnto him and doth offer to satisfie his curiositie in all thinges willing him to be faithfull and not to remaine an infidele Consider now how simply and plainely we haue opened our myndes vnto you God graÌ„t you his holie Spirit rightly to vnderstand and charitably to interprete the thinges that be spoken c. Now will I briefly go throughe these scriptures which ye abuse and violently wrest against vs not making so long discourse to amend your iudgemeÌ„t as I haue done to fore For if things alredie spoken shall not profit I must confesse my self destitute of counsell for this tyme. The wordes of the prophete where necgligently ye name Zacharie for Malachie nether serue your purpose nether yet are verefied in vs. for we be not as the priestes who in those daies permitted plaine iniquitie and contempt of God and of his statutes vniuersaly to be done by the people and yet they did not oppone them selues to the same Read the Prophete and conâ—ict vs of those thinges if ye can We are sorie that ye haue no better opinion of vs then that our hole studie should be to entyse the people to sinne Not that we do muche feare that by your wordes ye can persuade any except your own faction â–ª and hardly those to credit you in that behalf for all praise be to God our liues doctryn and correctioÌ„ of vice do witnesse the contrarie but our greatest sorow is for your condemnation which doubtles must ensue suche wicked iudgement if hastely ye repent not As the Sunne is not to be blamed albeit the carion by the heate thereof be more and more corrupted so is not our doctrine althogh that carnall men thereof take carnal libertie for that ye knowe did ensue the doctrine of S. Paule We do no les affirme both in worde and writing theÌ„ here you do affirme to wit That he who committeh sinne is of the deuil but herein I suppose standeth the difference that you and we vnderstand not that phrase alike we vnderstand that the man coÌ„mitteh sinne whose hole studie mynd and purpose frome tyme to tyme is bent vpon iniquitie and suche do we affirme to be of the deuil who sinneth from the beginning If you vnderstand that euerie action committed against the law of God maketh a man the sonne of the deuil we must liberally speak that so we do not vnderstand the mynd of the Apostle for plaine it is that he meaneth not of actioÌ„s particulare be they neuer so grieuous whereof a man after repenteth aÌ„d from the same desisteth but of a continual exercise delite and studie whiche man hath in sinne And this is plaine I say by the wordes which immediatly procede and go before he that exerciseth iustice saieth he is iust eueÌ„ as he is iust he y t coÌ„mitteth sinne is of the deuil for frome the beginning the deuil sinneth Here is the exercise of iustice put in contrarietie to the committing of sinne An exercise we know requireh a continual studie and practyse I think ye will not say that one iust worke maketh a man iust and so consequently the son of God except he procede frome iustice to iustice The same say we must be vnderstand of the committing of sinne for nether Adame nor Dauid did any longer committ their former sinnes then by grace they began to repent And so did they not remaine vnclean persons nor in bondage of the deuil Neither yet can it be proued that euer they were membres of the deuil nor of his kingdom albeit willingly they made them selues slaues to him whom Christ Iesus notwithstanding did vendicate to him self and delyuer from that thraldome Because of the fre gift of God his father they did appertein to his kingdome nether euer be you able to proue by any of these sentences that euer they were out of the election as before is declared The place of the prophete Oseas is of you euill vnderstaÌ„d â–ª the lacke of the hebrew tongue may be the cause of your
nomber Israell I answer as the one place repugneth nothing to the other so doeth it not explaine the other in such seÌ„se as ye adduce for it repugneth not to say that God man aÌ„d the deuil work in one fact actioÌ„ as in the histories of Iob Achab Semei and Pharao is manifest God for iust causes giueth his commandement and power to sathan as to his instrumeÌ„t be he neuer so wicked to do what in his eternal cousel was before decreed Sathan of a wicked and rebellious mynd chooseth such instrumentes and vseth such meanes as God likwies hath appointed Men in al wicked actions of their fre and voluntarie motion do folow their corrupt and wicked affections in declaring their pride vanitie malice or crueltie which wicked affections in so farre as they are wicked we confesse that God will not for he can will no iniquitie but yet that his eternal almightie power shall be iudged so ydle that it doeth nothing in such actions but onely suffer we can not admitte for such reasons as we haue before alledged wher that we did examine the differeÌ„ce betwext gods wil and his permission You retein your old nature and iustly I might say the nature of the deuill most maliciously affirming vs to say that what so euer God permitteth he willeth it absoluteâ—â— and so that absolutely he willeth all wickdâ—â—ces Which saying as ye be neuer able to proue vpon vs so do we coÌ„fesse it not onely erroneous but also so blasphemous that who so euer dare pronounce or affirme the same deserueth death for we most constantly in word and writing affirme absolutley God willeth no iniquitie for all his workes in so far as they procede frome his wisedom aÌ„d infinite goodnes are holie and iust and therfor do we make God author of no sinne which onely procedeth frome the fountaines that be corrupted that is from the deuil and frome man as in diuers places most euidently we haue declared Because I do perceaue that greatly ye delyte in your prignaÌ„t wittes I will not say foolish vanitie I will recicite your hole wordes by the which ye wold seme to proue contrarietie in God except that we wold grante a difference betwext gods will and his permission I say saieth the author of your book to vs that ye are the Prophetes if the deuill which teach such filâ—hie doctrine and ye say be the Prophetes of God Now of necessitie one of vs lieth for if ye be the Propheâ—es of God I lie And if ye be the Prophetes of the deuil ye lie And if God will vs to say the trueth he will not that we lie for then he should will two contraries which is impossible yet one of vs lie which must be by permission and suffering of God and not by his will whereof it foloweâ—h that there is difference betwext the suffering and the will of God It appereth that in this description of persons in which ye oppose your selues to vs ye wold more declare what is your iudgement and opinion of vs and what ye wold that we should be estemed of others then that ye greatly do trauale to proue any contrarietie in gods wil by the same for his eternall wisedom seeth the meanes how that his commandement and his will are not contrarious the one to the other albeit that he command one thing and yet for iust causes will wicked men to do the contrary which kinde of coÌ„trarietie and repugnance doeth so blind your eyes that you can not se how God caÌ„ coÌ„mand all men to speak trueth and yet for iust causes before sene and determined in his counsell that he wil y e deuil aÌ„d his slaues to delite in lies Albeit I say that the apperance of this contrarietie blinde you yet will not gods trueth cease of be trueth neither will the libertie of his eternall Godhead be broght into bondage to your corrupt iudgement His commandement and his will do nether debate nether fight betwext them selues but do agree in all thinges euen as do his mercie his iustice his wisedom and his power albeit oftener it is that his iustice doth punish such as vpon whom he hath determined to haue mercie Euen so he commandeth men to obeye his commandementes whom he not onely foresaw to be disobedieÌ„t but for most iust causes willeth his glory to appere euen in their vnrighteousnes lies And this he doth without all contrarietie in his godly will to the full knowledge wherof albeit ye can not atteine yet more profitable it were for you to be ignorant of such thinges as God reserueth to be reueled in the time appointed in his eternall counsell then thus without all reuerence and feare to trouble your foolish braines in deuising such absurdities as may seme to oppugne gods eternall veritie which in the ende wâ—l triumphe to your destruction â–ª shame and confusion if obstinatly you procede as you haue begonne For albeit that he loueth trueth and hateth lies and albeit that he commandeth man to speak the trueth and forbiddeth man to beare fals witnes yet feareth he not to giue a commandement to that wicked spirite to go forth to be a lieng spiritte in the mouthes of all Achabes fals prophetes Yea forther he gaue him power to worke that in the fals prophetes which he forbiddeth all men to do For he commandeth that no man shall deceaue an other and yet giueth he power to the deuill to be a lieng spiritte in the mouthes of the fals prophetes and to them he giueth power to deceaue Achab. If ye list to lay contraritie to the charge of God prepare your winges and with Nabuchadnezer of Babylon saye we will passe vp to the heauens and shall establish our seates aboue the sterres of God we shall passe vp vpoÌ„ the hight of the clowdes and we shall be like to the most highest yea if thus ye will call his secrete counsels to examination and triall ye must be iudges and superiors to him Thus iustly I might illude aÌ„d skoffe y o r reasoÌ„s as vanities most vnworthie to be answered But yet hauiÌ„g respecte to the simple I wil gather your argument and forme it as strongly as your selues can and I will answere so much of the same as ye think nable to be answered your argument is this God can not will two contraries but to speake the 〈◊〉 aÌ„d to lie are contraries Therfor he can not will them both But he permitteth men to lie and willeth them to speake the trueth There is therfor a difference betwene the will and the permission God can not will two coÌ„traries True it is in him selfe in one respecte and for one purpose he who is author of coÌ„cord can not will contrarietie but in consideration of his creatures for diuers respectes and sundrie purposes thiÌ„ges be not coÌ„traries the one to y e other which to our iudgementes haue apperance of contrarietie If you be so wel sene in your artes as some of
before he can see the kingdome of God that Christ Iesus must nedes illuminate those that be borne blinde orels without remedy they shall perish in their blindnes And thus I say the one text your master doth falsely and the other most violeÌ„tly wrest But now to yo r wordes God is slowe say you to wrath and ready to forgiue He will be intreated of all so that he biddeth all meÌ„ euerie where to repent and offereth faith vnto all men I will not question with you at this time why in this description of your true God ye make no mention of the Sonne which is the eternall word and wisedom of the eternall father nether of the holye Gost who proceding from the father is equall with the eternall Sonne But this is the one thing of which I did wonder in reading this your description y t ye omitte these properties which God attributeth to himself You do continually repete that God is slow to wrath ready to forgiue that he willeth all meÌ„ to be saued that he wil be intreated of all men that he willeth the death of no creature Which properties in God we confesse and w c sentences we acknowledge to be most true if they be rightely vnderstand But why do ye not likewise teach your scholers that God is zelous that he is a consuming fire that he punisheth the iniquitie of the fathers vpon the sonnes vnto the third and fourth generation and that his iustice can not suffer sinne to eskape punishment no not euen in his most derest children Ye haue accused vs that we deceaue the people teaching them a careles and libertine life And therfore here againe I require the indifferent reader to consider which of our doctrines giueth most libertie whether you that affirme that your true God wil be intreated of all or we that constantly mainteine that God heareth no sinners or that such as delite in iniquitie are so odious in his presence that althogh they crie and howle in their calamities yet will he not heare theÌ„ But now let vs examine your scriptures apart God is slowe to wrath say you true it is but yet he recompeÌ„seth the flownes of punishment with the seueritie of his iudgementes which hath bene and shal be executed against such as heape to them selues gods wrath by abusing his long sufferinges He is readye to forgiue we acknowledge this to be the voice of our God But we feare not to affirme that the remissiâ—n of sinnes is the free gift of God giuen to his Church by Christe Iesus like as are faith and life euer lasting which are not commoÌ„ to al men in generall but particularly do apperteine to gods children He will be intreated of all say you so that he biddeth all men euery where repent and offereth faith to all men Your first proposition is vtterly fals neither yet is there any such sentence conteined in the hole scriptures True it is that God is mercifull gentle liberall protector Refuge and Life to all But to w c all To such as hate iniquitie loue vertue lament for their sinnes past call vpon his Name in veritie and do vnfainedly seke for his helpe in the day of their trouble Of all these no doubte he will be intreated how wicked and vnthanckfull so euer they haue ben before But by the contrarie he will destroy all that speake lies He hateth all that worke iniquitie nether will he shew him self mercifull to such as maliciously do offend But all the sinners of y e earth shall drinck the dregges of that cuppe which the eternall holdeth in his hande For he will destroy all those that traiterously decline froÌ„ him They shal crie but he will not heare He shall answere vnto theÌ„ let your louers whom ye haue preferred to meâ— deliuer you Such as withdraw their eares froÌ„ y e crie of the poore shal crye but shal not be heard yea albeit the blood thirstâ—e wil multiplie praiers and streatch forth their haÌ„des yet will not God heare theÌ„ For his couÌ„tenance is beÌ„t agaiÌ„st all y t coÌ„mitte wickednes And thus I say youâ— shall neuer be able to proue y t God wil be intreated of al except you can confute the holy Gost and make him to recaÌ„t these and innumerable other places As mercy is promised to his children for they onely call in veritie they onely hate sinne and folow vertue So is seuere iudgement pronounced against the wicked of y e world None of these sentences God biddeth all men euery where to repeÌ„t and offereth faith to all men are founde in that sense and meaning that ye do vnderstaÌ„d theÌ„ in the hole scriptures True it is that Isai the Prophet and Christe Iesus him self with his Apostles do call vpon all to come to repeÌ„tance But that generalitie is restrained by their own wordes to those that thirst that hunger that mourne that are laden with sinne as before we haue taught That place of the Actes ye ether vnderstand not or els willingly ye abuse it For Paule saith not that God offereth faith to al but saith that he hath perfourmed to al y t promes w c he made to man w c was to send a Sauiour for maÌ„s redemption by whome also he wil iudge the world Consider the text and you shall vnderstand the meaning of the Apostle to be such you procede He is omnipâ—tent and may do and leaue vndone What so euer shall be his good pleasure The omnipoteÌ„cie of God fredoÌ„ of his wil we most constantly mainteine but we caÌ„ not admitte y t our God be variable vnconstant subiect to ignorance nether yet y t his godly wil depeÌ„d vpon y e wil and disposition of maÌ„ For that were not to leaue gods will at fredome but to bring it vnder y e bondage of his creatures Further these wordes God may do and leaue vndone what so euer shal be his pleasure do smell somwhat of one of your articles offered vnto vs in this churche wherein some of your sect do affirme y t God may be fully purposed this day to do one thing and y t to morow he may repent and be purposed to do the contrarie Which cogitations of of God are most blasphemous wicked For if his couÌ„sels be mutable and inconstant then ceaseth he to be y e God who nether is nor can be changed If you had said because y t God is omnipoteÌ„t therfor he may do and leaue vndone what so euer his good pleasure is you had said well vnderstanding y t the purpose of God is infinite y t therfor of his good will he so mollifieth y e heartes of some men y t of most cruell and enraged ennemies against his trueth and poore seruantes he maketh them and y t sodeinly preachers of his Gospell and protectors to his Church But when ye say he may do what so euer is his good pleasure ye offer occasion to the captious to suspecte y t
you wold affirme y t gods good wil pleasure may change and y t is to deny his Godhead But I will burden you no further then ye shall plainely confesse I onely put you in minde that y e holy Gost vseth no such phrase You procede saing Nether is it his pleasure aÌ„d will that ether pharaâ— Semei or any other should sinne and come to destruction Before we haue confessed y t iniquitie and sinne is so odious before God y t in it can his goodnes neuer delyte nether yet can he haue pleasure in the destruction of any creature hauing respect to y e punishment onely But seing y t gods glorie must nedes shyne in all his creatures yea euen in y e perpetuall damnation of sathan torment of the reprobate why shal not he wil and take pleasure y t so it come to passe Albeit your phrenetique braines can not comprehend y e brightnes therof yet wil he one day declare y t al his workes are wroght in iustice wisedom and equitie I thinke you will not deny but that pharao Semei Iudas and others came to destruction like as in the end shall all reprobate do Then do I aske if God at no time for no purpose respect nor end did so will how then came their destruction to passe By sinne say you that we denie not but yet the questioÌ„ is not answered For continually we demand if in God there was not power ether to haue impeded their sinne or yet after their sinne to haue called them to repentance if it had so pleased his eternal wisedom and goodnes Consider your foly and giue glorie to God who doth what so euer he will in heauen and in earth But now to that which foloweth For he will the death of no creature but will all men to be saued and to come to the knowledge of the trueth How violeÌ„tly you wrest the wordes of the Prophet and of the Apostle shall shortly appere after I haue reasoned a litle with you how these your propositions do agree with that which goeth before Ye haue affirmed that God is ready to mercie and slow to wrath in which wordes you â—hew and cofesse that in the God head there is readines to â—hew mercy and also that there is a iustice w c must execute wrath vpoÌ„ the disobedient And so in the nature of y e God head ye cofesse mercy ad iustice But here you say that God will the death of no creature but that he will all men to be saued which last wordes being vnderstand as ye do vrge them must destroy the former nature of God take awaye his iustice For if he absolutely will the death of no creature then will he no punishment to folowe sinne And if he will no punishmeÌ„t then willeth he his iustice to cease and so coÌ„sequently must one of the properties of his godlie nature cease Studie for an answere to make your former wordes and latter wordes better agree orels ye wil be compelled to coÌ„fesse that God for som respect willeth both death and damnation to come vpon some creatures Further if God willeth all men to be saued and to come to the knowledge of the trueth and yet many do perâ—sh in ignoraÌ„ce and shal be condemned as Christ Iesus doth pronounce then must it ether folow that gods will is mutable and so he vnconstant and not at all times like to him self or els that he is not omnipotent For if God at the first creation of man wold all men to be saued as ye alledge then wold I know when this will was changed After that man had offended say you Then yet haue I obteined that in gods will there was mutabilitie For after sinne he wold and by his sentence pronounced that Adam and his posteritie should suffer the corporall death yea and that the sede of the serpent should haue the head broken downe by the which is ment the spirituall death which nether of both as you affirme did God will before If you reply gods will towardes the saluation of all mankind did remaine the same after sinne which was before for a generall promes of deliuerance was made by the womans sede that was promised I haue before plainely proued that difference most manifest betwext y â— two sedes was made in that promes But admitting that the promes had bene generall so that the will of God this day remaineth the same which ye alledge it to be to witt that he willeth y e death of no sinner but that he willeth al men to be saued Can you deny but that a separation and diuision of the shepe from the goates of the elect from the reprobate shal be made at the glorious commiÌ„g of y e Lord Iesus Shall not these most ioyfull wordes be said vnto theÌ„ y t shall stand vpon the right hand Come ye the blessed of my father possesse the kingdome which was prepared for you from the beginning And shall not this most fearefull sentence be pronounced and executed against the other Depart ye cursed go to the fire prepared for the deuill and for his angels Shall the Sonne of God in pronouncing senteÌ„ce do any thing that day repugning to the will of his heauenly Father I think you will not so affirme Then if gods will in the day of iudgement shal be that many shal be adiudged to tormeÌ„t perpetual and his will in the creation of man was and this day yet remaineth that all men shal be saued then of necessitie it doth folow that gods will shall change If you say that death and damnation cometh not by gods will but by the sinne and vnbelief of man you haue releued your self nothing for if death be one thing and life be an other damnation one thing and saluation an other TheÌ„ if God this day will all men to be saued and so to haue life and yet that day he shall will many to be damned to torment perpetuall what causes so euer you alledge I shall obteine one of two to witte that ether gods will is and may be mutable orels that there is a power superior to his maiestie and godly will For if willingly he shall damne those whom before he wold and had determined to saue then is his will and determination changed And if he shall damne those vnwillingly whoÌ„ willingly he wold haue saued then is he not omnipotent Consider now vpon whom falleth the snowe and who do cast them selues in greatest absurdities Now it resteth to declare how violently ye wrest the wordes of the Prophet of the Apostle The Prophete speaking in the personne of God saith I will not the death of a sinner but rather that he conuert and liue And the Apostle affirmeth that God will all men to be saued and to come to the knowledge of the trueth Hereupon ye conclude God will the death of no creature this is your first violence which you do to the text For the Prophet
named Friderick brother to the Arch bishop of Collen This Bishop ether because he could not haue his health in those places or that he smelled some what in the mater departed theÌ„ce a litle before of his owne accord and being coÌ„tent with a priuate life he went into his owne countrey The people of Monster counâ—eling vpon this mater kept the messinger And vpon Christimas euen in the night they went forth to the number of 900 and comming vpon them vnwares they toke the towne and setting kepers at the gates lest any should escape they apprehended all The bâ—shope as it happened was gone from thence the day before They broght all the captiues into the Citie amongest whom were the chief prelates and diuers of y e nobilitie Of these the Magistrates asked what their intent was and whither they were minded to hinder the preaching of the Gospell any more They frely answered that they wold do their diligence that the Gospell might florish And by the occasion of this answer there was a pactioÌ„ made betwene them The copie wherof the magistrates sent to the Lantgraue desiring him that he wold assist them in the maintenance of the Gospell and their common welth Then sent he vnto them certen of his seruantes through whose comming vnto them â–ª y â— peace was made and being reconciled and the grief troden vnder foote they liued in peace togethers That the Gopsell might be preached in sixe churches and that y â— impieties and superstitions w c were in religion might be taken awaye That in the cathedrall church nothing should be changed and that the citizens should not thinke that to apperteine any thing at all vnto them This forme of peace in writing was signed by the LaÌ„tgraue by the Bishop and his adherentes with the noble men and all the people the 14. of Februarie the yere of our saluation 1533. After this maner thinges being appeased there came vnto Monster a botcher of garmeÌ„tes named Iohn Leiden borne in Holland which was a vehement anabaptist This man after he was entered into familiaritie with y â— preachers he priuely asked of them whether they thoght that it were mete to baptise children or no and when they answered yea he as one vtterly of the contrary iudgement began to laugh and dispise their iudgement w c thing when â—â—â—nard RotmaÌ„ of whom we spake before perceiued he exhorted y e people in his preaching to cal vpoÌ„ God that he wold giue them grace to stand and continew in the trueth and that he wolde kepe them from being corrupt with heresies and chiefly from the opinion of the Anabaptistes which now priuely do crepe in among them and gather them selues together For said he if their opinion gette the vpper hand the state not onâ—ly of the common welth but also of religion wil be very miserable and poore At the same time came to the towne one HermaÌ„ Stapred which being made companion with Rotman did publikely inuey against the baptisme of infantes He was scolar vnto one Henry of Rolle who a litle before was put to death at Traiectine for anabaptistry And this was as it were an other steppe forward in this new kinde of doctrine This came to pas that the Anabaptistes taught through all the Citie althogh it were in priuate houses secretely and none was receaued of them except they that were of their secte Further more there was none y â— made them selues knowen to be the authors of this opinion nor they did not teach but by night and when others were at their rest which time they wroght their mysteries but the thing being knowen and diuers of the citizens being greued at it saying that it was a great shame that such new doctrine should be soweÌ„ in secret and by night It came to passe that by the commandement of the rulers the captaines of them were commanded to auoyde the Citie which going out at one gate they came in againe at an other saying that they had a commandement from God that they should remaine there and applie their maters This thing moued the rulers not a litle and caused no smal wonder in the towne Therfor for the auoiding of greater tumult and danger the magistrates gaue in commandement as well to the anabaptistes as to the preachers of the Gospell that they should appere before them in the couÌ„sell house with certen other lerned meÌ„ Then Rotman bewrayed his iudgemeÌ„t which vntill that time he had concealed and condemned the baptisme of infantes as a thing wicked and abominable But one named Herman Bushe chiefly so defended the contrarie parte that the Anabaptistes were commanded to departe out of the Citie out of hand And when they did all edge for them selues that they should not quietly passe through the Bishoppes land the Senate obteined for them a safe conduite and gaue them wherwith all to bear their charges But they hauing long before determined not to depart from theÌ„ce to any other place secretly returning to their companions kept them selues closely for a time The magistrates in the meane ceason before that they came forthe of their corners againe caused all the churche dores to be shut one onely excepted For it was to be feared lest that the Anabaptistes who daily increased accompanied with their teachers should driue the preachers of the Gospell out of their temples After this in the moneth of Nouember the Lantgraue at the request of the Rulers of the Citie sent two preachers vnto them Theoderik Fabritius and Iohn Melsingerâ— but Melsinger seing the trouble and fearing the danger returned home againe The other with great diligence exhorted the citizens that they should beware of the doctrine of the Anabaptistes in this wise he ceased not to do his indeuour vntill that the Anabaptistes getting the vpperhand did driue the other out of the Citie as afterward shal be declared And to make all sure he wrote in a brief somme the effect of the trew doctrine and ecclesiasticall administration the counsell and people appointing the same Then by the counsel of the magistrates one Peter wirtaÌ„ began againe to preach but he had not preached long yer the Anabaptistes stirred vp by Rotman droue him away who being more fierce then before prouoked Fabritius and others to disputation the senate agreing thereunto but vnder this condition that the disputation shoulde be grounded vpon the word of God and other writings agreable vnto the same in the presence of some godly learned men which should be as it were arbitrers who hearing and trying the sentences and argumentes indifferently on bothe sides might giue iudgement and looke what iudgemeÌ„t they should giue y t it should be agreed vnto of all By which meanes discorde being taken away the peace of the Church might be restored This Codition Rotman and his companioÌ„s did refuse when they craftely auoyded to be bewrayed they beganne openly to be contemned of the common people But to wipe awaye this foule blotte they