another mistake to suppose that there is no Excommunication but in giving the offender over to Satan That is indeed the highest degree of Excommunication but not all the degrees of it for there is another lesse and inferiour viz. in separating him from Ecclesiasticall Communion And so it is yet another mistake in you to think that in declaring your non-Communion with other Churches ye do not excommunicate them for what is Excommunication but a privation of communion the very word it self teacheth us all this 6. If any such Case should extraordinarily fall out how can it be denyed but that the particular Church offending might be excommunicated by the rest of the Churches offended if the offence should deserve it 1. For we finde nothing in Scripture to the contrary 2. For there is the same reason for the Excommunication of whole Churches as of particular persons viz. the taking away of scandall and the conversion of the sinner 1 Cor. 5.5 2 Cor. 2.7 2 Thes 3.14 1 Tim. 1.20 and that such a contagion infect not others 1 Cor. 5 6 7. And if a particular man may be excommunicated for denying and blaspheming of Christ wherefore shall not a particular Church be excommunicated for the like sin Neither can their number and consociation excuse them but rather aggravateth the sin for the more offenders there be the greater is the offence and the greater should the punishment be 3. If a Church compounded of ten persons may excommunicate four of their own number wherefore also may not ten thousand Churches excommunicate this inconsiderable Church compounded of ten persons for the same reasons that it excommunicateth four persons hath God given more power to ten persons over four then to all the persons and Churches in the Kingdom yea in all the Christian world over these miserable and wretched persons who it may be deny the Trinity the Incarnation of the Son of God and maintain all sort of impieties 4. If God in Heaven and in his Scripture declare a Church excommunicated wherefore shall not his Churches upon Earth also declare it excommunicated when they learn it in his Word Are not the Churches of God as well bound to ratifie his Sentence here upon Earth as he to ratifie theirs in Heaven 5. We have some examples of it in the Old Testament for the people of God say some of our Divines excommunicated Amalck for proof whereof they bring the Targum Cant. 2. Contriverunt Amalek per diram imprecationem They bruised Amalek by the fearfull cursing of the Lord. So did they the Samaritans because of the building of their Temple upon the Mount Garizim They brought as Drusius and after him Weemse relate it 300 Priests 300 Trumpets 300 Books of the Law and 300 Boyes They blew with Trumpets and the Levites singing accursed the Cutthaans in the Name of Totragammaton or Jehova and with curses both the superiour and inferiour house of Judgement and they said Cursed is be who cateth the bread of the Cutthaean These Curses they wrote upon Tables and sealed them and sent them thorow all Israel who multiplied also this great Anathema upon them from whence proceeded a great hatred betwixt them as we reade in the Gospel If in vertue of a small offence one Church may pronounce that dreadfull Sentence of non-Communion against many Churches wherefore may not many Churches pronounce Sentence of great Excommunication against one small Church for a great sin since crescentibus delictis crescunt poenae Besides all this I deny the consequence for howbeit God had not ordained Excommunication viz. the greater which here ye understand yet might there be some other remedy found by the light of Nature But ye adde p. 18. That your Sentence of non-Communication will be as effectuall as the greater Excommunication This cannot be 1. Because if the offender have any grace the greater will terrifie him more 2. Because in your way the Sentence may seem unjust in punishing all offences and Offenders greater and smaller with the like Spirituall penalties 3. Your way cannot so well awe Churches and keep them in their duties for since ye attribute no authoritative power or authority to all the Churches of Christ over any particular Church but judge them all to be equall amongst themselves and one to all as if a part were equall to its totall and pars esset aequalis Toti Totum non esset majus quilibet suâ parte as if the part were equall to its whole and the whole were no greater then its part viz. a whole mans body then his toe a particular Church may think her self no ways bound to obey any other Church or Churches and much lesse will ten Churches think themselves bound to obey one for Obediecce is a vertue in Inferiours towards their Superiours But if all Churches be equall there can neither be Superiours nor Inferiours and consequently no obedience or disobedience 4. If a particular Church in your way desire to be obeyed by fourty Churches pretending her self to be offended by their proceedings they may think her bold in calling them to an account and that the spirits of Prophets should be subject to Prophets one rather to twenty or two thousand then twenty or two thousand to one 5. In our way a Church offending may esteem her offence greater and fear it more since she may judge her self to offend two Authorities 1. that of God and 2. that which he hath given unto the Church but in yours she cannot think her offence so great since she conceives her self to offend one authority or authoritative Power onely viz. that of God for ye acknowledge no authoritative power in the Church or Churches and so your way breedeth a plain contempt of all Church Authority 6. In denying an authoritative power the offender may think you too busie bodies in intermedling your selves with other folks matters which concerns you not so much whereas if ye granted an authoritative power unto her it should be her own proper businesse in vertue of her authoritative power received from God So also our way is more efficacious in the Churches offended 1. in breeding a greater detestation of sin 2. in making them to shun and avoyd more the company of the offender 3. in making them to conceive the Sentence to be more just c. Item if this your way be as efficacious ye need no other power in your particular Congregations over particular persons a simple admonition without any authoritative power may suffice you Ye yet say That your way is more brotherly in proceeding without an Authoritative power Answ God in the Old Testament ordained an Authoritative power in the Church and yet they were all Brethren and he knew well enough what power was convenient for Brethren 2. So likewise in particular Congregations we are all Brethren neither yet will ye banish out of them all Authority 3. 2 Kin 6.21 1 Cor 14 15 2 Cor. 6 13. and 12.14 Gal 4 19. 1 Thes
Ecclesiasticall or Politicall Assembly of the Christian World wherein things are carried by plurality of voices it be ordinary for any inconsiderable number thereof to joyn in a particular combination among themselves and therein to take particular resolutions to publish them unto the world and so to anticipate upon the resolutions of the whole Assembly II. Whether in taking such resolutions they should not consequently resolve themselves to quit the Assembly and to appear as Parties And if any man or men should do so either in this Parliament or this Assembly if a connivence at such a matter should not be reputed for an act of great favour love and extraordinary tender affection towards them III. Whether such an inconsiderable member in so doing may not be refused by the parties as incompetent Judges IIII. Whether this Apologeticall Narration was necessary when ye found the calumnies mistakes misapprehensions of your opinions and mists that had gathered about you or were rather cast upon your persons in your absence begin by your presence again and the blessing of God upon you to scatter and vanish without speaking a word for your selves or cause And if the honour the Parliament shewed you in calling you to be Members of the Assembly was not sufficient enough to justifie your persons from all sort of aspersions and calumnies without any Apology Whether after the dissipation of such Clouds and such a justification this Apology was rather necessary then before when ye were under the cloud and not justified V. Whether this your Apologeticall Narration wherein ye blame all Protestant Churshes as not having the power of godlinesse and the profession thereof with difference from carnall and formall Christians advanced and held forth among them as among you be seasonable when the Church of God and this Kingdom stand in need of their Brotherly Assistance and particularly of that of the Scots against whom it is commonly thought to be particularly intended who at this very time so unseasonable according to their duty hazard their Lives and Estates for Gods Church all this Kingdom and you also VI. Whether as it is observed by sundry men of learning and as ye have noted your selves ye should not have done better to have sit down your opinions by way of Theses and so manifested unto us wherein ye agree or disagree with us or from us the Brownists Anabaptists and these whom ye pretend to hold the same Tenets with you in old and new England and the Netherlands then in a Rhetoricall and Oratorius way endeavour in the most part of your Book to publish your great Sufferings and extraordinary Piety and so to move us all to compassion and ravish us into admiration as if ye meant rather to perswade then to prove them VII Many also are very desirous to know whether this Apologeticall Narration published by you five alone be published in the name of you five alone or of all those also or apart of those whom ye pretend to hold your Tenets to the end we may know in what esteem to have it And if in the name of you five onely the Penners and Contrivers thereof Whether ye five can arrogate a power unto your selves to maintain these Tenets as the constant opinion of all your Churches having no generall Confession of their Faith thereabout If in the name of all the rest we desire ye would shew your Commission from all your Churches by what authoritie ye do it Or if ye do it without Commission and Authoritie from them if that be not to assume unto your selves a greater Authoritative power then that ye call Presbyteriall yea then ever was the Episcopall VIII It were also not amisse ye should declare Whether ye desire a Toleration for you five alone in your Religion or for all the rest Item If a Toleration in publike in erecting of Churches apart or to live quietly without troubling of the State as for the last appearingly ye may have it unsought but for the rest the Parliament is wise enough and knoweth what is convenient for the Church of God and the State IX And because your whole draught of this Book tends evermore unto a Toleration and consequently unto some Separation I would willingly know of you What things are to be tolerated or not tolerated in Religion not in private persons but in Conseciations And particularly when the whole Kingdom is joyned in one Religion What sort of new Consociations of divers Religions it may in good conscience tolerate and receive into it Item Vpon what ground Churches may in good conscience make Separation from other Churches that desire Vnion and Communion with them Whether they that aym at a Toleration and Separation be not rather bound to tolerate some small pretended defects not approved by those from whom they desire to separate themselves and especially when they that are so desirous of Separation are not pressed to be Actors in any thing against their conscience then to separate themselves from a Church that testifies a great desire to reforme the defects pretended to be in it Whether it were not better for them that aym at Toleration and Separation to stay in the Church and to joyn all their endeavours with their Brethren to reforme abuses then by Separation to let the Church of God perish in abuses Whether they do not better that stay in the Church to reforme it when it may be reformed then who quit it for fear to be deformed in it ANNOTATIONS Upon the INSCRIPTION Of this BOOK An Apologeticall Narration ALL Apologies presuppose some Accusation which here appears none or if it be intended as an Apologeticall answer to what hath been written against your Opinions it comes very short weak and slender and no way satisfactory to their Arguments Neither is it a meer Apologeticall Narration but also a grievous Accusation against all our Churches as destitute of the power of godlinesse c. So it is a mistake in the very Title of the Book which is either untrue or inadoequate to the subject whereof it treateth Humbly submitted So humbly submitted to the honourable Houses of Parliament as if they submit not themselves to your desires in granting you a Toleration for any thing I can see ye seem no wayes minded to submit your selves to theirs It seems also very probable That being Divines ye should rather first have consulted with the Assembly of Divines your Brethren then so ex abrupto gone to the Civill Magistrate that arrogates not to himself any directive power in matters of Religion This should have testified more Brotherly and Christian Charitie then here it does of politicall humilitie And it is more convenient to the spirit and power of godlinesse that the spirit of Prophets in such matters should be subject unto Prophets then unto the spirit of the Civill Magistrate who for this effect hath convocate an Assembly of Prophets and would not undertake it himself So this is a submission That this most just
Wherefore will ye not joyn with us and communicate as Brethren with us But ye adde a little after the middle part of this Section That ye both did and would hold a Communion with all those Churches as with the Churches of Christ But what communion is this ye hold with these rather then with Papists Brownists Anabaptists in England and the Lutherans If ye say in Doctrine that Union is not externall since ye testifie it not by your externall Communion in the Sacraments with us for ye will not admit all those to your Communion that we admit to ours 2. Neither will those of New-England whom ye cry up and extoll so highly admit those of our Church to their Communion or to be Members of their Churches unlesse of late they have changed their opinion and ye and they temporize in conforming your opinions to the times and commensurate them to Politicall ayms for Toleration 3. Neither know we whether they will communicate with us at least their Writings and Letters from New-England which heretofore we have seen testifie no such thing so that in this ye dissent from them unlesse they within this yeer dissent from themselves 4. By the same reason ye may communicate with Schismaticks and men that are excommunicated amongst your selves for their ill life viz. drunkards blasphemous persons c. 5. By the same reason ye communicate with some Papists in profession that beleeve all that we beleeve in Doctrine 6. And with them all and all Hereticks in part because they agree in part in the Doctrine with us If it be replied That they with whom they communicate must also be of good life I duply then it is not a meer Communion in Doctrine but in some other thing beside viz. In good life And then 2. If they have both sound Doctrine and be of a good life or have Faith which causes good Doctrine and Charitie the cause of a good life Wherefore desire ye a Toleration to make a Sect apart or what desire ye more to make up one Church with them But howsoever ye pretend this reall Profession of Communion with us yet ye overthrow it by your restriction afterwards viz. To such as ye know to be Godly that came to visit you in your exile But ye will not admit all the Members of our Churches but such as ye onely judge not we to be Members of our Church Ye say in the same Section That ye Baptize your Children in our Parishionell Congregations Wherefore then will ye not as well communicate at the Lords Table with us all And if so Wherefore will ye not likewise admit us all to your Communion In the 8. § And as we alwayes c. In this Paragraph or Section ye shew the judgement of forraign Churches concerning you how ye both mutually gave and received the right â—â—â—ds of fellowship How they gave you Churches to Preach in some Priviledges a maintenance annually for your Ministers c. So here in England hitherto ye have had libertie to Preach in our Churches and may have if ye will and some of you have some Benefices But if ye go on ayming at a Toleration and consequentlie at some Separation as we have shewed I doubt if ye shall or should have any annuall allowance at all or Churches to Preach in as before you had Moreover we know not upon what grounds ye were tolerated in the Netherlands whether it was not in consideration of your precedent afflictions hoping that ye might submit your selves to Presbyteriall Government in your own Countrey if it were well establisht or in favour of some Merchants by publike or private authoritie Ecclesiasticall or Civill or other wayes Onely we say That many Sects are tolerated there Neither howbeit ye were tolerated in the Netherlands Polonia or Germany where many Religions are tolerated and permitted out of Civill respects Is it equitable ye should be tolerated here where there is one onely Religion professed and one Goverment as we shall see hereafter In the 9.10.11.12.13.14 ye give account of your Practices in publike Worship Church Officers matter of Government and Censures and your directive principles in all this Hence in the 15.16.17.18.19.20.21 ye infer your Conclusion of Independencie of every particular Congregation As for the parts of your publike worship we consent with you In your Church Officers ye acknowledge with us four viz. Pastours Teachers Ruling Elders and Deacons But ye lash us a little with your Parenthesis about our Ruling Elders With us not Lay but Ecclesiastique persons separated to that service Here ye seem to accuse the Reformed Churches in France the Netherlands Scotland c. as if they all esteemed them Lay and not Ecclesiasticall Persons If this be your minde it is a great mistake in you and we can produce their writings to the contrarie if not we know not to what end ye inserted this particular Parenthesis As ye therefore inserted yours so do we ours but not Preachers or Teachers of the Word And therefore we desire to know of you if Ruling Elders have power to teach as it is maintained by other Independents and if they Preach or Teach how they can be distinguished from Preachers and Teachers For all Charges receive their unitie and distinction from their Acts and Ends Wherefore if the Ruling Elder Preach or Teach which is the Act and End of the Preacher and Teacher he must have the same Office with Preachers and Teachers 2. The Apostle also distinguishes them 1 Cor. 12. Wherefore then confound ye them Ye adde in this 9. Section concerning Excommunication upon obstinacy and impenitency this Parenthesis as worthy of some particular observation which we blesse God we never used as if your Churches were so pure that not one man should deserve it We cannot say so much of our Churches Neither can your Brethren of New-England say so much of theirs We know that some have been Independenters as we our selves have heard from their own mouthes that now are become Anabaptists And whether such men merited it or not judge ye If they merited it ye have been very partiall and unjust in not using of it So that proceeds not from want of demerits in the persons to be punished but of justice in the Rulers to execute it Neither do we deny but a number of very holy persons may be gathered together who may so carrie themselves for some time as not to commit any great offence with pertinacie to deserve Excommunication if the choice be good But to say that it may last long so in Populous Congregations and in a great number of Churches ye may tell us this news when your Churches are multiplied and become as Populous and have endured as long as ours We could tell wonders also of our Churches in some parts in the beginning of the Reformation But the question is not who liveth holiest but whose Discipline is most conform unto Gods Word Your Directive Principles were three 1. Gods Word and
in the World for since it is publiei juris published they will assubject your judgement unto theirs by way of Agitation or disputing of it amongst themselves as much as all the Divines of England yea whether ye will or not Again Since both Houses were pleased to make you Members of that Assembly was not that a sufficient Justification and Vindication of your Persons from all calumnies spread against you and already scattered without speaking a word for your selves § 24. Pag. 24. Truely it is to be supposed that the two Houses would never recommend men thither either ignorant or vicious but the learnedest and godliest of the Kingdom so this your Apology is unseasonable Onely this needs an Apology That being Members of the Assembly ye will not submit your selves unto the Assembly of Divines but take odde wayes proper to you five alone to publish particular Apologies and desire a particular Toleration which no other Members of the Assembly do But as for this transeat cum coeteris crroribus It sufficeth that ye see extraordinary testimonies of the Parliaments and Assemblies most tender affection towards you how they have tolerated much in you the like whereof hath not yet been tolerated in any Member either of Parliament or of the Assembly and all to the end to chase away all pannick fears from your mindes and pretended disadvantages which ye did forcsee § 26. § 26. Pag. 28. Howsoever ye commend much the Parliament and declare That ye grant more to the Civill Magistrate then the principles of Presbyteriall Government will suffer them to yeeld Yet even here ye rap him over the Knuckles as if in making you Members of the Assembly he should have been partiall in placing you there with so many disadvantages yea as ye say And therein also upon all sorts of disadvantages which we could not but foresee both in number abilities of learning Authoritie the stream of publike interest Trusting God both with our selves and his own Truth Answ I maintain that the Parliament has done you no wrong for ye were not forced to sit there If there be so great disadvantages ye might have chosen whether you would have sit there at all or not All rationall men think it a great favour which ye esteem so great a disadvantage And as for the Number 1. Think ye that the Parliament ought to have put in such a Number of you that agree not in your opinions amongst your selves as might have over-swayed all the Divines of the Kingdom to the end that ye might afterward have compelled us all to quit the Kingdom as your Friends of New-England have done to others 2. Were ye to be compared in number with the rest of the Divines in this Kingdom who are hundreds for one of you Justice consisteth not in an Arithmeticall but in a Geometricall propertion which here has been observed towards you and that with more equitie then Justice 3. Neither did the Parliament hinder you to call as many Divines of your Profession as pleased you to consult with apart 4. Neither need ye so great a number in the Assemblie for ye seem not for any thing we can see resolved to submit your selves or to acquiesse with any pluralitie of voices either of Parliament or Assemblie wherefore then desire ye so great a number As for Abilities in Learning 1. Ye might also have had with you if it had pleased you as many learned men as ye could finde 2. Neither beleeve I that any others of your Profession could prudently take such a businesse in hand without you Who ever knows you knows well ye want no abilities to dispute your opinion in any Assemblie in Europe Men of learning and of wisedome therefore think that you speak this rather out of modestie then otherwise What ye understand by Authoritie I know not it cannot be Ecclesiasticall since ye acknowledge none in the Church Then it must be politicall and namelie that of the King and Parliament since that no other at this present have power over you and then I could wish ye had spoken more considerately Publike interest Either this must be taken of publike interest in Religion and then it 1º or should be our sole aym and it is no disadvantage for you That both the Parliament and the Assemblie be led by this Interest Or in State and then ye wrong both the Parliament and the Assemblie as if they measured Religion by Worldlie Ends and Interests wherein in ye are not to be beleeved Neither will we retaliate unto you that you may have some further Interests yet that we know not of And consequentlie ye need not to fear for your Persons as if ye were in danger or had subject to fear persecution as in former time § 27. Pag. 28. Ye excuse your selves from false Doctrine whereof no man accuseth you § 28. Ye tell us that the Difference betwixt you and us is not so great the lesse it is the lesse should ye be suiters for a Toleration and if ye obtained it the greater should be your Schisme § 28. Pag. 30. Here also ye excuse your selves that ye have not made a Scholastique Relation of your Judgement whereunto we have already answered and in so doing your opinions remaining lesse known hardly can they be distinctlie refuted § 28. Pag. 39 30. Afterwards ye require two things of the Parliament That it will look upon you under no other Notion or Character then as those who do as little differ from the Reformed Churches and your Brethren yea far lesse then they do from what themselves were three yeers past or then the generalitie of this Kingdom from it self of late 2. Ye require an allowance of a latitude to some lesser differences with peaceablenesse Answ And we pray you do as they have done to the end the Parliament may look upon you as they do upon them 1. They never condemned all the Protestant Churches as ye do 2. They never desired a Toleration to make a Separation as ye do 3. Either they approved not the ill of the times past but patientlie endured it according to their light hoping and praying to God for better without Schisme 4. Or approved it but when it pleased God in his mercy to illuminate them they disapproved what before they had approved of and changed from worse to better which if ye do O what a joy shall it be unto them and to us all and what a contentment may it bring unto your selves And finally As for the latitude and tolerance ye sue for it is unjust and most pernicious both to Christs Church and the Kingdom as we have hear already cleerly demonstrated FINIS