from the furious rage of Satan and malice of wicked men Here are many mights rashly and falsly supposed of Christ but not a mite of Salt or truth in them Is it lawfull for you Sir Defender to dreame what you list of Christs sufferings and when you are required proofe thereof to say It might be so extraordinarily What absurdities and heresies may not thus be maintayned if euery addle braine shall frame to himselfe new Passions and strange Temptations in Christ and all on this ground forsooth it might be so Their eares must exceedingly itche that will leaue the writings of the Euangelists and Apostles and listen to your extraordinarie might be But what might be Might Christ vpon all this spirituall fury and subtilitie of Satan or concurrence and cooperation of the Iewes haue his Faith hope or loue of and in God faile or decrease could he mistrust or doubt that he might perish and neither saue himselfe noâ⦠vs why Role you thus with Roperick Termes and frights of franticke men when you speake of Christs Temptations as if hell or Satan were to strong for the Spirit and grace of God in Christ or could seuer the vnion made with the mightie hand of God of Christs humane nature into one Person with his Diuine It may be your strange fansies doe often put you to such plunges but he that stedfastly beleeueth in the Sonne of God and knoweth the truth and force of his Masters words when ready to goe to his Passion he said to his Disciples d Iohn 16. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã be bold or consident I haue ouercome the world will neuer doubt such dangers as you dreame of For in the world which Christ ouercame is the Prince thereof comprised euen the diuell whom before Christ pronounced to haue nothing that is no part nor place in him And to me that am assured the diuell could doe nothing against Christ but what Christ himselfe would and that the Sauiour of the world had power enough not onely to resist but also to represse the furââ¦e and subtilitie of Satan with his word or becke saue what him selfe would permit to let the diuell see his violence endured his asââ¦aults repelled his temptations reiected and his whole kingdome despised aud troden vnder foote these Tragicall Termes of yours are but blusterings of a busie Brayne and blastes of an vnstayed Tongue that would say somewhat and can not tell what and therefore hideth his ââ¦isformed fansies vnder the visard of strange and incomprehensible conceites e Defenc. pag. 85. li. 1. Here now we may see how vniustly you conclude that Satan could no other way assault Christ as an Instrument of Gods wrath but onely by executing torments on his Soule euen in such wise as he tormenteth damned Sââ¦ules in hell We see you haue opened your packe of strange wares and wastfull words and otherwise besides your owne liking you haue brought nothing for all this pelââ¦e and Trash that you haue vttered My words that are short but expressing the same which you with many circumductions fetch about to couer the presumption of your cause you much mislike and yet if you weigh them well you shall see they containe the very summe of your deuices To be tempted with suggestions of malediction reiection confusion desperation and damnation so they take no place noâ⦠find no harbour in the hart of man can haue no such incomprehensible sorrowes nor hellish Torments as you talke of The Hart by Faith presently and throughly resisting quencheth all those fierie Darts of Satan as flaxe vnder foote And therefore you must either take from Christ present and perfect resistance by deââ¦reasing his faith and sââ¦aggering his hope or else you can neuer sinck him into such sorrowes as you suppose You giue him f Trea pa. 45. li. 25. a glorious conquest at the last but in the meane while you leauâ⦠him not onely fearing and fainting but euen ouerwhelmed and all conââ¦ounded with these strange temptations and incomprehensible sorrowes which sometimes you say come from g Ibid li. 24. the immediate hand of God and sometimes from the diuels h Defenc pag. 15. ââ¦i ââ¦8 as Gods Instruments working the very effects of Gods wrath vpon him And these paines you say were not onely as sharpe as any are in hell but euen the same which the damned doe suffer Now wherein haue I wronged you except with too much sparing you What in saying you defend that Satan executed Torments on Christs Soule such as he doth on the demned Your words import no lesse The diuels you say were Gods Instruments to work on Christ the very effects of his wrath Now what are the effects of Gods wrath h Defenc pag. 15. ââ¦i ââ¦8 equall to all the paines of hell and i Pag. 12. li. ââ¦0 the same which are in ââ¦ell but the torments of the damned Soules in hell But you would haue Christ as well inwardly tempted as Tormented by the diuell and where you defend both I reported but one Pardon me that wrong I would haue hid your folly but you will not suffer me Howbeit I refuted the one and left the other as worthie none other answere then that where in the Scriptures the diuels confesse Christs word and presence did torment them you without Scripture haue found the diuels tormented Christ. k Defenc. pag. 85. li. 4. That can be say you no other way then by Satans verie possââ¦ssing of those soules Which grosse and infernall speculations of yours for trueths you can not make them I vtterly leaue to your owne discussing Are your fansies become so fine that what the Scriptures teach of Satans possessing mens soules or bodies must be grosse and your inuentions without wit or reason must be spruice What sayd I in any of these things which the plaine words or maine grounds of the Scripture do not confirme That the diuell can not worke but where he is Will you giue him more then an almighty power to worke where he is not or will you affoord him an omnipresence equall with God that he may be euery where to the end he may worke euery where as God doth Satan may torment the soule you will say and not possesse it The diuels that could not worke on swine but they must first l Matth. 8. enter them before they could make them runne headlong into the sea can they worke in men before they enter and possesse them The Cananite that intreated Christ to haue m Matth. 15. mercie on her daughter who was m Matth. 15. miserably vexed with a diuell receiued at length this answer n Mark â⦠For this saying goe thy way ââ¦he diuell is gone out of thy daughter The father that brought his lunaticke sonne to Christ confessed o Mark 9. he had a dââ¦mbe spirit which did teare him and cast him often into the fire and into the water to destroy him and Christ confirmeth his words in
which are nothing like nor neare the paines of hell For example in harty and true repentance how great is the griefe and paine of euery part and facultie of the soule detesting and abhorring sinne and fearing and feeling the power of Gods wrath and yet I trust ech penitent person doth not suffer the paines of hell Feare griefe and sorrow then the soule of Christ might deepely tast when he suffered for sinne and yet be farre from the paines of hell But your collection from my words is more absurd for where I say the soule of Christ might suffer for sinne yet by no meanes could it receiue the same wages of sinne which we should haue receiued you inferre not only without any words of mine but directlv against my words ergo I meane or I ought to meane that the soule and mind of Christ suffered the paines of hell from the immediate hand of God and so where I auouch Christ by no meanes could suffer the same wages of sin which we should haue suffered you paraphrase Imeane or I ought to meane Christ suffered the selfe same which we should haue suffered and of my negatiues you make affirmatiues and then tell the Reader I contradict my selfe But in plaine termes I allow in Christ all those afflictions and passions of the Soule which naturally and necessarily follow paine and this ALL reacheth vnto moe then meere bodily paines it includeth the soules proper and immediate paines also Where you learned to reason I doe not know but you haue the best grace to disgrace your selfe that euer I saw and if this be all the learning you haue you may clout shoes with this Al. Doe the torments of hell naturally and necessarily follow paine then whosoeuer in any part or for any cause is payned suffereth the paines of hell or at least the soules proper and immediate paines which you make extreamest and sharpest in hell Babes and boyes may thus bable it is a shame for men to talke so much out of square Let my words stand simplely as you bring them and allow in Christ all those afflictions and passions of the soule which naturally and necessarily follow paine what conclude you out of them your sight is very sharpe if you see any absurditie in them Howbeit you draw my words from their right course and sense by leauing out what pleaseth you My words are When the auncient fathers affirme that Christ dyed for vs the death of the body only we must not like children imagine they exclude the vnion operation or passion of the soule but in the death of his body and shedding of his blood they include all those afflictions and passions of the soule which naturally and necessarily follow paine and accompany death Christ suffering for vs a painefull death how could it be otherwise but such afflictions ââ¦nd passions of the soule as naturally and necessarily follow paine and accompââ¦ny deââ¦th should be found in the soule of Christ vnlesse we giue him an insensible flesh or impassiole soule both which are errors in the nature of Christ His flesh waâ⦠sensible and his soule passible as ours is because they both were humane Paiâ⦠then and death in my words are plainly referred to the body of Christ whose ââ¦lesh could not be wounded and blood shed as his was but naturally and necââ¦ssarily his ââ¦le must feele the paine thereof And yet if my words wââ¦e not limited to the paine of Chââ¦sts body as indeed they are I see no inconueniencâ⦠growing from them nor helpe for your fansie coÌtained in them Yet plaiââ¦er as fauoââ¦g your error I say ãâã paine griefe of body or mind be it neuer so great will commend Christs obedieââ¦ce patience And the punishment of sinne which proceedeth from the iusââ¦ice of God and ãâã ãâã that Christ might and did beare Yea he suffered death with all painfââ¦ââ¦ut no sinfull ãâã or ââ¦onsequents How good a sempsteâ⦠you are doth well appeaâ⦠by your short cuââ¦ing and ââ¦ide ãâã ââ¦hing my words together The first sentence you take our of a Section of my ãâã wherein I purposely shew that not only the paines of hell but euen the feare oâ⦠ãâã must ââ¦e farre from the soule of Christ. The suffering of hell paines in the soule of Christ I there refuse as not consââ¦t to the Christian ãâã but ãâã ãâã to the ãâã ââ¦ertaintie sanctââ¦ie of Christs person ãâã ãâã and ãâã with God Immediatly after the words which you bring I say ãâã Christ there could beâ⦠no apprehension of hââ¦ll paines as due to him or determiâ⦠for him but ââ¦e mââ¦st ãâã ãâã ââ¦are that God would be inconstant or vââ¦st which are more then ãâã ãâã Yea to these very words which you ãâã I ââ¦oyne this exception in the same ãâã but the sense of damnation or separatââ¦n from God or the feare or doubt thereof in Chrââ¦t as they quench faith and abolish grace so they dissolue the vnion and commuââ¦on of ââ¦ath ãâã natures or else breed a false persuasion and sinfull temptation in the soule of Christ. Who can be so sottish as not to see that my former words import Smart ãâã and gââ¦fe of body and mind which haue in them neither senââ¦e nor seare of hell paines that is of damnation or separation from God since no man is damned but vnto the pââ¦ines and place of hell and is first separated from God Wââ¦th as great discretion you fasten on an other sentence of mine where though ãâã ââ¦position be not generall but indefinite and hath two restraints euen from your ãâã ãâã to wit in this liââ¦e where Christ suffeââ¦ed in â⦠like to vs who aâ⦠his ãâã ãâã you throw off all forgetting what your selââ¦e obiected and whereto I ãâã ãâã ââ¦nswere and suppose that here I fully concurre with your conââ¦ites But ãâã ãâã your owne obiection and that will rightly guide my solution Your reason which you proudly boasted could not be refuââ¦ed by the wiâ⦠of man ââ¦as as you call ãâã ãâã from the lesââ¦e to the more Thus doe the members of Chriâ⦠ãâã the terrors ãâã God and sorrowes of hââ¦ll therefore of necessitie Christ suffered the likâ⦠Pââ¦ooue you by this Aââ¦gument that Christ aââ¦ter this life suffered the terrors of God and sorrowes of hell I doe you wrong to ââ¦pect it for it is open impietie so to thinke or say Then do you more wrong to imagine that I extended my words farther then to refell your reason As you spake of this life though you expressed it not so I replied that the puââ¦shment ãâã sââ¦nne which proceedeth from the iustice of God in this life and is no sinne Christ might and did beare but in no wiââ¦e those terrors and feares of consciââ¦nce which procâ⦠from sinne and aââ¦gment sinne Now I pray you what allowance finde you here for your new erected hell or how force you my words to fit your deuises Terror of conscience and feare of hell could haue no
know not where to rest The first was vnspeakeable smart and paine from Gods immediate hand inflicting What torments the Defenââ¦er hath deââ¦sed for Christes soule the same anguish on the soule of his Sonne that he doth on the damned spirits For this you haue neither script nor scrole text nor title in the word of God it is a bold and lewd deuice of yours presuming what you please of Gods hand because it is diuersly taken in the Scriptures From thence you lept to diuels and made them Gods instruments to torment the soule of Christ with strange temptations and incomprehensible sorrowes suggested into the soule of Christ. Then you made Christs owne heart conceaue and discerne from the wordes and acts of the Iewes fired and enraged by Satan the dreadfull and painfull strokes and stings of Gods anger and iust indignation against him for our sinnes and yet all these are but the tumultuous dreames of your owne head and certaine wastefull words that may be drawen to diuers senses besides which you haue neither expressed nor confirmed any thing Now you begin to make Commentaries vpon the Apostle to the Hebrewes which are as cleere as a coale and as sound as a satchell of saw-dust p Defenc. pag. 86. li. 10. First en ho in that which himselfe suffered signifieth either the 1 Defenc. pag. 86. li. 10. matter wherein Christ is able to succour vs or the 2 Defenc. pag. 86. li. 10. meanes whereby he becommeth readie and fit to succour vs or els the occasion and 3 Defenc. pag. 86. li. 10. reason why he is the readier to succour vs euen in that he himselfe suffered and was tempted Your expositions be like your conclusions they haue neither root nor rinde Here are in shew three parts of a diuision all which indeed you say are q Defenc. pag. 86. li. 31. but one and the same in effect and so your triple diuision senselesse and needlesse the parts importing one thing and the r Li. 27. first way seemeth to you not the vnlikeliest which if you put any difference between them is the falsest farthest from the Apostles meaning For that Christ helpeth men in nothing but what himselfe first suffered that he suffred al particular degrees speciall sorts of afflictions as well in soule as in bodie which may befall any man these are so lowd lies that but you no man would make either of them the apostles speech or purpose But your lucke is to light on the worst or your choise leadeth you to fansie the foulest that you may differ fro other men be singular in your own sense For your selfe see say s Li. 35. all the particular kinds of crosses in the world neither could nor can possibly come to any man and so not to Christ. Why then make you that the likeliest meaning of the Apostles words that Christ suffered all the matter that is all those kinds of paines wherein he succoureth vs If you meane generally that Christ tasted all sorts of paines that is both corporall and spirituall then shall you neuer conclude that he tasted this or that kinde of paine in speciall but it sufficeth that Christ had not only a diuine respect in mercie but an humane sense and experience of our miseries both outward and inward to assure vs that he is compassionate and tenderly affected in our infirmities and extremities because he himselfe felt the sharpnesse of feare sorow shame and paine whiles heere he liued and hath not forgotten how neere they pinch the weakenesse of mans nature And more the Apostle meant not in those words then to shew the Sonne of God would in his owne person and humane nature feele our infirmities and miseries that he might haue an humane commiseration and compassion of vs when we are afflicted by the remembrance of his owne sufferings which the words doe fully fit For t Heb. 2. en ho in that or in as much as he suffered when he was tempted or tried he is able with more tendernesse of heart to helpe those that are tempted u Defenc. pag. 86. li. 18. Which way soeuer of these three we take the words yet they plainly inferre that Christ him selfe felt all the miserie and smart of our sufferings and Temptations which at any time we feele The smart and griefe of reiection confusion desperation and such like Christ neuer tasted because they are faithlesse and gracelesse feares and sorrowes in vs. Yet in these Christ can and doth sââ¦ccour vs not because he suffered the same but for that he knoweth what affliction of spirit feare and sorrow bring with them by his owne experience not of the same obiects which are sinfull but of the same affections which are naturall And none of these waies which you mention came neere the concluding of any such thing except you vrge the first against all truth and sense acknowledged euen by your selfe where you say x Defenc. pag. 87. li 21. I speake not of euery particular in each of them or which euery man meeteth withall Graunt then that Christ in his manhood would ââ¦eele the sharpest impressions that feare or sorrow shame or paine could make on the Body or Soule of Man but still without sinne is that a proofe that Christ ââ¦ed reiection confusion or damnation because he tasted how deeply feare could afââ¦ct mans nature What ignorant and vncoherent Collections are these Christ tââ¦ed the sharpnesse of all our affections as namely of feare sorrow and shame ergo he had all the same causes and obiects of feare sorrow and shame that we do and may ââ¦eele Who reasoneth so that hath any reason left in his head or hart This ãâã the ãâã KATA PANTA in all things doe fully import The words kata panta in all things or altogether may haue out of the very Text of the Apostle to the ãâã foure seuerall references and none of them neere the false construction that you make of them The first is he must be like his bretheren in all the parts of Mans nature for ââ¦e ãâã not the nature of Angels but the Seede of Abraham Wherefore in all things that is in all the parts and necessarie consequents of Mans nature he muâ⦠be like ãâã Bretheren 2. He must be like not this or that Brother and so not like any particular Persons in any speciall cause or Circumstance but wherein they all aââ¦e Bretheren each to other y Hebr. 2. in all those things he must be like them all 3. It is but a likenesse that the Apostle vrgeth in all these things there is no equalitie much lesse an Identitie required in those words not that Christ in patient suââ¦ering of afflictions did not paâ⦠all but these words import a Similitude and haue no farder force 4. These and all other things that were in Christ must be in him without sinne z Hââ¦r 4. he was tempted in all things after a likenesse but without sinne
much deceaued when he said vnto him that stood there in presence Thou art the sonne of the liuing God and Christ himselfe was more then deceaued when he answered s Matth 16. Blessed art thou for flesh and bloud hath not reuealed it vnto thee but my Father which is in heauen Then speaketh not Athanasius of Christs diuine nature but of his person which was t Athanasius contra ãâã serm 4. ALWAIES in his father that is before he spake those words and after And euen when he spake those words the father declared saith Athanasius by the miracles presently following that he was THEN ALSO in his sonne incarnate as euer before Doth not this directly conclude that Athanasius intended God was in the speaker of those words euen when he spake them and that at no time the father forsooke the person incarnate no not when he spake those words since God to shew that he had not forsaken him who then spake vnto him made heauen and earth to witnesse how much he esteemed the person that so complained u Defenc pag. 113. li. 35. Touching Christs humanity Athanasius denieth not but God might for sake it for so the Scripture saith The question is not for the word but for the sense You finding the word of forsaking to be vsed in the Scripture put what sense you list to it and thence would prooue the death of Christs soule with as strange positions as the maine error it selfe For you grant Christs manhood was not forsaken neither of Gods FAââ¦OVR nor GRACE nor of continuall and constant ioy in God much lesse of What contrarieties the Defender is driuen to the fulnesse of Gods spirit which rested on him and yet you say he died the death of the soule for want of comsort As if there were no comfort neither in the grace nor in the fauour of God nor in the ioies of his spirit nor in the hope of his promises all which were most assured to him to the highest degree that any creature was capable of Did you meane that he had no ease of his paines nor end of reproches whiles he liued as also no deliuerance from the hands of his persecutors nor protection from death all these might be borne with since the Scriptures giue manifest testimony that these things he suffered till he died but these things that are true will not serue your turne you vrge his soule died because he had no heauenly life such as he tasted in his transfiguration where x Matth. 17. his face did shine as the ãâã and the clothes were as white as the light which prooueth his soule to be no more dead in his passion then it was all his life long besids and that will no man in his right wits auouch of Christ or of his Saints here in earth y Defenc pag. 114. li. 1. 4. Your fift exposition is Leos conceit without warrant farre fetcht hardly applied Origen is also here as weake Pricke on in your pride despising all the world besids your selfe and skorning euery mans opinion that hitteth not right with your fansie though The fift sense of Christes complaint on the crosse few men speake or write so absurdly and falsly as you doe Leos exposition vtterly subuerteth your hellish assertion and that maketh you fling it away with such disdaine as you doe Otherwise it hath more vicinity with the circumstances of the text then yours by many degrees For there is nothing in Leos interpretation which accordeth not with the Christian faith and hath his foundation in the very words of the sacred Scriptures in both which your hellish and harrish application faileth He saith z Leo de Pass Dom. serm 16. Vox ista doctrina est non querela those words were an instruction not a lamentation And his reason is past your refuting Cum in Christo Dei hominis vna sit persona nec potuerit ab eo relinqui à quo non poterat separari pro nobis trepidis infirmis interrogat cur caro pati metuens ex audita non fuerit Since in Christ there was but one person of God and man he could not be for saken of him from whom he could not be seuered he ASKETH for our sakes that are fearefull and weake why flesh fearing to suffer was not heard Which of these things can you refell with all the witte in your head the coniunction and communion of both natures in one person of Christ you were not best meddle with lest you sowe damnable heresies as thicke as you haue done notable absurdities He saith further Cur for quare and non exandities for relictus Aske the Boyes in Pauls schoole what difference betwixt cur and quare both signifying WHY and being both interrogatiues as Leo rightly obserueth concurring with that of Saint Austen who said as we haue heard before a August epist. 120. Causam commonuit requirendam cum addidit vt quid dereliquistime Christ warned them to search for the cause when he added WHY HAST THOV FORSAKEN ME His exposition of the word forsaking he taketh out of the very Psalme whence Christ cited the rest For so Dauid ioined them together My God my God why hast thou forsaken me and art so farrc from sauiââ¦g or deliuering me I crie by day and thou hearest not So that not to heare and not to deliuer is the forââ¦aking which Dauid ment in that place and which in all likelihood our Sauiour intended as Saint Austen thinketh if he spake of his owne person b August Ibid. Quare me dereliquisti tanquam diceret relinquendo me hoc est non me exaudiendo longè factus es à salute mea praesenti scilicet salute huius vitae Why hast thou forsaken me as if he should haue said leauing me that is not hearing me thou art farre from sauing me to wit from the present safety of this life So saith Leo. c De Passione serm 16. In ipso tantae victoriae exaltatus triumpho causam rationem qua sit relictus id est non exauditus inquirit Christ exalted in the triumph of so great a victory inquireth the cause reason why he is forsaken that is not heard The reason therof he giueth soberly learnedly and truely howsoeuer your humour like it not d Idem de Pass Dom. serm 17. That the Lord should be deliuered to his passion it was as well his Fathers will as ââ¦is owne vt ãâã non solum Pater relinqueret sed etiam ipse se quadam ratione desereret That not only the father might leaue him but that after a sort he should forsake himselfe not by any fearefull shrincking but by a voluntary cession For the power of Christ crucisied conteined it selfe from those wicked ones and to performe his secret disposition he would not vse any manifest power He that came by his passion to destroy death and the author of death how should he saue sinners if he would
Agonie after an Angell appeared from heauen and comforted or strengthened him with a message from God it seemeth rather an effect of Christes intentiue prayer which the Scripture there mentioneth than a consequent to any other passion or paine Christes intentiue prayer after comfort receiued by an Angell from heauen might proceed from his ardent desire care and zeale of our redemption from the wrath of God and protection from the rage of Satan And therefore as the Prophet foreshewed he should not onely beare the sinnes of many but pray for the Trespassers Christ might spend all the spirits and powers of bodie and soule in most vehement and feruent prayer euen vnto a bloudie sweat to haue all his members pardoned their sinnes and reconciled to God by the sacrifice of his bodie which he would offer for them and also to haue Satan cast out from accusing them and in the end trodden vnder their feet If Christes bloudie sweat were supernaturall we must aske no cause thereof but leaue it to his sacred will who could aboue nature doe what he would That it was no proofe of hell paines appeareth plainly because Christ after in greater paines on the Crosse did not sweat bloud and of all those whom these men imagine suffered hell paines in the Scriptures no one can be produced that euer sweat bloud The word forsaking vsed by Christ in his Complaint on the Crosse doth not in all the Scriptures inferre the paines of the damned but in the wicked it noteth reiection desperation and feare of damnation and in the godly it argueth want of protection or decrease of consolation in their troubles In Christ it might shew the time the cause the maner or the griefe of his being so long forsaken and left to the rage and reproch of his persecutors without any sensible signe of Gods loue towards him care for him helpe in his troubles or exse in his paines but it doth not prooue that Christ thought himselfe forsaken of Gods fauour grace or spirit which feare or doubt could not be in him without a manifest touch of error and want of faith Christ neuer feared nor doubted that he should or could perish vnder the hand of God persuing our sinnes in the bodie of his flesh but for the ioy set before him endured the Crosse and despised the shame and as S. Peter sayth of him at the time of his suffering he alwayes beheld God at his right hand that he should not be shaken and therefore his heart reioyced and his tongue was glad and his flesh rested in hope because his soule should not be forsaken in hell nor his flesh see corruption Christ was made a curse for vs in that he suffered the temporall and corporall curses of the Law threatned vnto sinners as all sorts of afflictions belonging to this life and in the end a painfull and shamefull death by which he abolished the spirituall and eternall curse of God due to vs for sinne but he was neuer inwardly truely nor eternally accursed of God since by tasting of our externall curse for a time he made vs partakers of his spirituall and celestiall blessednesse for euer Christ who knew no sinne was made sinne for vs that is either the punishment of our sinnes or the sacrifice for our sinnes for we were healed by his stripes and he gaue himselfe for vs a sacrifice of a sweet smell to God Being then an holy and acceptable sacrifice to God for sinne he was neither defiled nor hatefull to God with our sinnes but suffered the iust for the vniust that is he tooke vpon him the punishment of our sinnes though he were most innocent and by the holinesse of his person submitting himselfe to the death of the crosse purged our vncleannesse by his innocencie couered our guiltinesse and by his fauour with God reconciled vs that were enemies Christ bare the full punishment of our sinnes that is not all which we should haue borne for then he must haue beene euer lastingly reiected confounded and condemned to hell fire which are most horrible blasphemies but he bare so much of the punishments of this life where he suffered as in his person by the iust iudgement of God was most sufficient for all our sinnes TOuching Christs descent to hell the words are plainly cited by Peter out of Dauid that Christes soule after death should not be left in Hades which Saint Luke in his Gospell vseth for the place where torments are prepared for the wicked after this life And in that sense is the word vsed thorowout the New Testament as likewise the Greeke Fathers tooke it for the place vnder the earth whither the soules of all men were condemned for sinne and where the Diuels detaine and torment the wicked That Christ likewise descended to the lower parts of the earth and to the bottomlesse deepe after death is vouched by Saint Paul whereupon the whole Church of Christ from the beginning hath confessed his descent to hel to be a point of Christian pietie Peters Sermon in the second of the Acts intended not simply to proue that Christ was risen from the dead as Lazarus and others were but affirmed farder of him That God raised him vp to set him on Dauids Throne that is to make him King of Glorie This he prooueth In that Christes flesh could not see corruption nor his soule be forsaken in hell which was verified in none no not in Dauid who were all dead and saw corruption but only in the Messias It was therefore impossible that either death or hell should detaine Christ but he was to rise Lord of death and hell and the Sauiour of all his from both as appeared by his ascending to heauen and sitting at the right hand of God Neither was this strange to the Iewes who were taught to expect that to be performed by the Messias which God promised by his Prophet O Death I will be thy death O Hell I will be thy destruction Sheol in the Olde Testament signifieth the Graue and Hell that is the places whither the dead bodies of all men went and whither the soules of the wicked dead in sinne descended after death And therefore where it is distinguished from the death of the bodie or referred to the soule after death as it is in Dauids words applied by Peter to Christ it apparently signifieth Hell The ends of Christes descent are likewise deriued from the Scriptures as the destroying of the Diuels kingdome and triumphing ouer powers and principalities and making an open shew of them spoiling them by deliuering all his Elect dead liuing and yet vnborne from the right power and feare of eternall death taking into his hands the Keyes of Death and Hell that he might be Lord of all in Heauen Earth and Hell The Creed is not a Collection of Greeke or Hebrew phrases vnknowen to the people but a short summe of the Christian faith prouided for the simpler sort of men to learne by heart And therefore as
you be not of your manifest follies But Christ suffered you say the substance of hell-paines though not the circumstances of place and time which the damned do suffer for they are not of the nature and essence of hell To make God the tormentor of Christs soule heere on earth with his immediate hand and so of all the damned soules in hell you brought vs the words of the Prophet Esay the Lord ââ¦ayd vpon him the iniquitie of vs all for this seraphicall sequestration of the substance from the circumstances of hell which mysterie of iniquitie you begin now to broach what Prophet or Apostle can you produce Dare you Sir Discourser out of the hazard of your owne head pull in pieces Gods setled reuealed and eternall iudgement against sinne and with the worme of your owne wit wrest in sunder the substance of hell from the circumstance thereof What will you not aduenture in earth that attempt this in hell or what shall be free from your forge that offer to make vs a new essence and nature of hell and heauen If you can deââ¦se or intend to mingle your toyes with Gods truth and with sillie sleights of Sophistrie which you thinke Philosophie subââ¦ert maine points of Diuinitie your leasure is great but your labour is leaud In the secrets of the next world none of the godlie euer presumed to debate or determine any thing speciallie touching hell or heauen without the manifest precedence or sequence of holie Scripture You had need therefore Sir Deuiser to be well aduised it is no small presumption and intrusion against Gods wisedome power and counsell to eleuate and frustrate the paines which he hath appointed for the wicked in hell and to coââ¦e fresh and new in stead thereof which God hath not ordained I professe to all the world I dare not depart from so often and earnest words of Christ himselfe nor allegorize the sentence of the Iudge which shall be pronounced on the reprobate both men and angels and executed in the sight of all the elect not by any figures and metaphors but by the terror of the things themselââ¦es matching the trueth of the words which Christ shall vtter And he ãâã I assure thee Christian Reader I ââ¦warue not either from the continuall tenor of the Scriptures nor from the full consent of Christs church howsoeuer this Deuiser flatte himselfe in his new inuention But let vs trace him in his owne path and controll him with the leââ¦ell of Gods trueth What can be more substantiall to any iudgement or punishment than the sentence of the Iudge and specially of such a Iudge as with his will word and power decreeth pronounceth and setlââ¦th all things in heauen earth and hell If then this Iudge in his sentence of condemnation appoint the PLACE and TIME to be parts of the punishmenââ¦s inflicted on the damned tell vs I pray you why some parts of the sentence be moââ¦e essentiall to the punishment than others or why all being parts alike they should not all be equally of the substance of the iudgement Depart from me ye cursed unto euerlasting fire prepared FOR THE DIVELL AND HIS ANGELS is the sentence to be pronounced on all the wicked that shall be damned Of the continuance there can be no question but here it is expresly mentioned that it shal be EVERLASTING For the place it is as plaine by the witnesse of the Scripture which maketh no fire euerlasting but onely hell-fire Our Sauiour twice in one chapter ioyneth the one as an exposition to the other and thrice almost with one breath affirmeth euerlasting fire to be the fire of hell It is better to enter into life mââ¦imed than hauing two hands or two feet to be cast INTO HELI INTO THE FIRE THAT NEVER SHALL BE QVENCHED VVHERE their worme neuer dieth AND THE FIRE NEVER GOETH OVT No fire is euerlasting but onely hell-fire Christ therefore in his sentence including the one implieth the other as part of his iudgement against the reprobate and maketh both time and place essentiall parts in the punishment of the damned And when he sayth DEPART from me ye cursed forsomuch as there shal be then no places left but heauen for the blessed and hell for the cursed he doth not exclude them from the one but by appointing them to the other Besides that fire which is prepared for the diuell and his angels is no where but in hell and therefore adiudging them to that fire he doth euidentlie adiudge them to hell fire Since then no man is or shall be damned but only to hell and that for euer the place and continuance are expresse and so essentiall parts of the iudgement and consequently of the punishment that is and shall be inflicted on all the damned For the iudgement which then shall be openly pronounced is immutablie decreed and alreadie reuealed by the Iudge himselfe and therefore vnchangeable to all that aââ¦e or shal be damned and executed on that part of the wicked which is extant I meane their soules assoone as they depart this life though their bodies be yet in the dust as afterward shal be shewed Most vainly then and falsely doe you slide betweene the substance and circumstance of hell-paines since the name of hell-paines doth necessarilie and naturallie import the place of torment where those paines are which is hell and out of which place they are not els might they be called aswell aëriall or terrestââ¦iall paines as hell paines if they were found aswell in the aire or on the earth as in hell But the Scripture hath resolued vs there is a â⦠place of torment after this life which is called hell and the torments there so farre exceed all the paines of this life not only for perpetuitie but also for intolerable acerbitie and grauitie that they are iustly called hell-paines as proper to the place where diuels and damned persons shal be punished with euerlasting fire And where you would seeme out of the dregs of Philosophie to borrow the difference of the substance and circumstance of hell-paines you vnderstand not what you say For euen by the rules of Philosophie there are no circumstances in things perpetuall and immutable Circumstances must often varie els are they no circumstances if they be eternall and necessarie consequents Since then time and place do not alter in anie of the damned for all that are damned are cast into hell for euer though all suffer not like paines if there be any circumstances in hell they are rather in the degrees and differences of paine which you make the substance of hell than in the place or perpetuitie of the torment which neuer varie in any of the damned And since you will needs be medling with Philosophie I pray you Sir Discourser if Christ suffered the substance of damnation as you auouch doth not your doctrine plainlie conclude the Sauiour of the world to be damned for which shall truely attribute the name of anie thing
against them Doe I set my selfe to prooue that in hell there is materiall fire and yet am I now almost afraid so to call it It is your wont Sir Discourser not mine to take vp termes that may be turned euery way and to plant your chiefe strength vpon the doubtfulnesse of their Signification Doe I any where apply the word materiall to hell fire or doe any of the places which I cite so call it If they doe name them if not how set I my selfe to prooue materiall fire in hell without any words or proofes sounding that way Know you my meaning without my words or doe you boldly presume of my meaning against my words If by materiall fire you meane that which is maintained by wood or by such like matter as nourisheth fire and without the which fire will quench for that is one of your chiefest obiections which you say is vnanswered then doe the places which I bring plainely prooue that hell fire is not materiall For Lactantius sayth of it It burneth of it selfe without any nourishment And Gregorie It is neither kindled with mans industrie nor nourished with wood but contrary to the nature of our fire it consumeth not what it burneth but rather repaireth what it eateth as Tertullian sayth of it So that neither my positions nor probations gaue you any cause to coniecture I meant your materiall fire The places produced by me expresse the contrary and mine owne words are S. Austen long since hath plainly resolued the fire of hell is not only a true fire which were my words but a corporall fire that shall punish both men and diuels And closing I make it a point of Christian doctrine deliuered by the Prophets and Apostles and receiued by the Fathers of all ages in Christs church that the fire of hell shall be visible and sensible to the bodies of the wicked and shall eternally and corporally punish the damned according to their deserts It was therefore your foolish obiection that hell fire must be materiall if it be not allegoricall according as you dreame it was no resolution of mine nor so much as mentioned by me I saw the ambiguity of the word well enough and for that cause did refraine it from the beginning For though materiall may be that which consisteth of matter and forme and so all things that are corporall as the wind the aire the heauens are likewise materiall yet in our vulgar speech and vnderstanding to which I framed my selfe that is materiall fire which is nourished with some MATTER apt to burne and consume and in that sense hell fire is no materiall fire The end of your answer in this place is farre woorse than your entrance for there you wittingly and wilfully peruert my words by adding ONLY and ALL vnto them directly against my meaning yea when I openly admonish the Reader to the contrary I inferred by occasion of former proofs therefore the iustice of God both temporally and eternally punisheth the soule by the bodie which words are most euidentlie true since in this life without all question the soule is punished by the bodie and after iudgement the bodie being cast into hell fire shall eternally afflict the soule My words then bearing in them a manifest trueth you take the paines by interlacing them to wrest them to an open falsehood for you make me say Therefore the iustice of God both temporally and eternally punisheth the soule ONLY by the bodie Now this is as false as the former was true for God in this life doth often punish the soule by her selfe and vntill the last day it is as certeine the soules of the wicked departed hence are punished without their bodies which so long lie dead in the dust of the earth What conscience this is for nothing in you must be impudence though it be neuer so shamelesse of an euident trueth to make a palpable errour by adding ONLY to my wordes which I carefully and purposely did auoide let the Reader iudge But the proposition inducing this conclusion you will say is generall to wit all prouocations and pleasures of sinne the soule taketh from her bodie all acts of sinne she committeth by her bodie the conclusion thereof you thinke should be likewise generall therefore ALL the soules paines for sinne both temporally and eternally is by the bodie Your thoughts Sir Discourser bewray your owne follie they must not marshall my reasons I can expresse mine intent without your helpe Out of a generall assumption what Art hindreth me to auouch an indefinite and particular conclusion especially when I meddle with Gods matters whose power and will in iudgement no rules of reason can binde or limit And if I would needs expresse the forme of a syllogisme as you vainly imagine I meant to doe in these words I neuer learned out of a negatiue for the maior to draw an affirmatiue for the conclusion but had not your eyes stood in your light it was easie for you to haue seene both what the conclusion must be by force of the premisses and how in respect of him that is all-iust and yet allmighty I thought not good to restraine him to my conclusions but to inferre in sted thereof that which sufficiently depended on the conclusion and could haue no question either in holy writ or dayly vse Both the premisses are orderly and plainly set downe in my writing and not loosely and ignorantly misplaced as yours are by putting the cart before the horse and taking that for the maior which with me is a part or appendix of the conclusion My words stand thus Nothing is more proportionable to Gods iustice than to ioyne them in paine that were ioyned in sinne and to retaine the same order in punishing which they kept in offending But all prouocations and pleasures of sinne the soule taketh from the bodie all acts of sinne shee committeth by the bodie What boy now knowing the first principles of Logicke doth not presently perceiue the conclusion must be therefore nothing is more proportionable to Gods iustice than both temporally and eternally to ioyne bodie and soule in paine which were ioyned in sinne and to make the bodie the instrument of her paine as it hath beene of her pleasure This conclusion is an vniuersall negatiue and yet doth not exclude all paine of the soule without the bodie to be vnagreeable to Gods iustice as you pretend I meane but auoucheth no paine to be more agreeable than where bodie and soule are both ioyned in suffering as they were in offending And because no punishment is more agreeable to Gods iustice than where both soule and bodie are coupled in paine as they were in sinne though it be no way against Gods iustice to punish the soule for a season without the bodie Therefore which is the inference that I vse the iustice of God both temporally and eternally punisheth the soule by the bodie that as it hath beene the instrument of her
haue reuealed it yet that is no iust cause to doubt the trueth thereof or to preiudice the power of God who hath spoken the word as if he could not or would not performe it but rather for certaine to know and confesse that God can punish the mightiest of his Angels by the weakest of his creatures and as in sinning they haue exalted themselues by pride farre aboue their degree so in punishing them for their sinne God can and will depresse them as farre beneath their originall condition to teach them that all their strength depended on his will and pleasure So that we haue no neede to runne to the immediate hande of God alone to make him the sole tormentor of spirits as this Discourser doeth for extracting a new Quintessence of hell fire the will and word of God as it gaue to men and Angels all their power and force so may it take the same from them swelling against him when he will and subiect them to the force of any his creatures which he can endue with might to performe his commandement against all the transgressours and despisers of his righteousnesse and holinesse In summe we see that Christ suffered no part of that which the Scriptures make substantiall and essentiall to the paines of hell and damnation of the wicked I meane of that which is included in the sentence of the Iudge pronounced against them but this Discourser as he hath deuised a new kind of redemption neuer mentioned in the Scriptures nor deriued from the blood of Christ so hath he framed vs another hell then the word of God reuealeth and changed the whole course of the sacred Scriptures with his dreames and deuises that though the text of holy writ doe no way fauour his sansies yet by flying to allegories and heaping vp a number of metaphores he might entertaine some talke when his proofes did faile To vphold that Christ suffered the true paines of hell before we could be redeemed by his death bloodshed he minced hell paines into substance and accidence and least this geare should seeme grosse he shadowed the substance of hell fire with figures and allegories and sent vs at last to the immediate hand of God for all punishment of sinne in the life to come not vpon any iust ground or proofe out of Scripture but because his Mastership knew not otherwise how to carrie his conceites cleanly he vnloaded them all by tropes and metaphores vpon Gods immediate hand from which onely as he saith though very vntruely the Soule hath her proper and principall suffering But examining the parts we find no such metaphysicall substance of hell as he pretendeth no such metaphoricall fire as he affirmeth no such immediate hand of God vexing Soules and deuils in hell as he imagineth we rather find the cleane contrarie to wit his circumstances to be of the substance of the Iudgement pronounced vpon the wicked the fire in hell to be a true and substantiall fire and by that as by a peculiar meanes decreed by the will strengthened by the power and reuealed by the word of God the damned both soules and diuels to be perpetually punished and tormented each of them according to their demerits though the inward powers and faculties of the minde shall not cease most grieuously also to afflict the damned and despayring spirits And touching Christs sufferings to which all this must be referred and for which all this is discussed we finde him most free from darkenesâ⦠destruction confusion remorse of sinne from malediction dereaction and desperation with their consequents and from the torment of hell ââ¦ire either in soule or bodie which is the second death that is in deede from all the parts of damnation noted in the Scriptures to be prouided for the reprobate which are the true paines oâ⦠hell and so this deuisers dreames to bee as farre from trueth as they are from all testimonies of holy Scripture which mention no such things suffered by Christ nor make any of them needefull for Christ to suffer before he might pay the price of our redemption We doe not contend to expresse what iust measure of Gods wrath nor precisely in what manner it was reuealed and executed on Christ. Onely we knowe that whatsoeuer it were Gods very wrath and proper vengeance for sinnes though outwardly executed on the bodie yet it could not but sinke in deeper euen into the depth of the soule aââ¦d be discerned by Christ and conceaued to be such and so sustained as proceeding from God and so wound the Soule properly yea chiefly though the anguish thereof bruised his bodie ioyntly also You haue labored Sir Discourser in twentie pages of your Defence by many lame distinctions and false positions to shew vs the MANNER MEASVRE of Christs suffering the paines of hell for the sin of man The manner you made to be Christs suffering them properly yea onely in his very soule from the immediat hand of God euen as the damned do The measure you tooke to be all Gods proper wrath and vengeance for sinne yea the selfe same paines for their nature which are in hell and which are extreamest and sharpest in hell Your twelfth page told vs in plaine words These paines then in this very manner inflicted Christ felt indeede not being in the locall hell yet those being the selfe same paines for their nature which are in hell yea which are SHARPEST in hell And he discerned and receaued them properly yea ONLY in his very soule You beginne now to tell vs another tale that you doc not contend to expresse what iust measure of Gods wrath nor precisely in what manner it was reuealed and executed on Christ. Onely you know that what soeuer it was Gods very wrath and proper vengeance for sinnes though outwardly executed on the bodie could not but sinke in deeper and so wound the soule properly yea chiefly By a long processe you made vs beleeue the soules proper and immediat suffering must be from the hand of God alone without inferiour meanes and instruments and not from the bodie because that kind of suffering is common to vs with beastes and maketh not properly to our redemption And so by your refined diuinitie the stripes wounds blood and death of Christ could not properly pertaine to the price of our redemption by reason those sufferings which come by the body were common to Christ with beasts Thus reuerently and religiously to prooue your selfe a pure Christian you resolued touching the bloodshed and death of Christ sustained on the Crosse. Now as almost tyred with that blasphemous toy and perceiuing how hard it would be to please the learned with this leauen or to seduce the simple with these vnsauerie shifts which haue neither foundation nor mention in the sacred Scriptures you beginne to turne an other leafe and to tell vs you doe not contend for the iust measure nor precise maner of Christs suffering the wrath of God Only you know
that you should professe your selfe a Method-master to this Realme When I tooke occasion from my text to lay downe first the contents then the effects of Christs crosse as the Scriptures did deliuer them that is what Christ suffered on his crosse for vs and what he performed by his crosse to vs say good Sir out of your new found art what fault you finde either with the matter or with the method Christes crosse you say signifieth here no such thing but the afflictions of Christ and his members That is the vanitie of your errour that is not the trueth of my text Christ crucified in his owne person for mans redemption is the full purport of Christs crosse in my text as in my Sermons I shortly declared in my conclusion I more amplie proued and now I trust I haue therein fully satisfied the Reader That standing good I note what Christ suffered which I call the contents of his crosse and to what end he suffered which are the effects of his crosse both these are aptly and fairely closed in my text and by other places of Scripture iustly proued to be comprised in my text This forsooth your mastership liketh not but I must make syllogismes out of euery word conteined in my text or els I make the Scriptures such an instrument as they ought not to be Silly Sir you vnderstand not what you say first learne and after teach lest you teach that you neuer learned When it is sayd Giue vnto God the things which are Gods can you out of these words without the aid of other Scriptures firmely conclude what things are Gods and how they must be giuen vnto him or must you proue that by other places of holy Scripture Euen so when I had shewed what was iustly inclosed within the words of my theme I made direct ful proofe thereof by other places of holy writ which I take to be a sound and sure way of well vsing the Scriptures to that very purpose they should be applied notwithstanding your palterie prouisoes that no man must after speake any thing that can not firmely be concluded by the sole and single words of his text which is a rule fit for such a Rouer as you are that neuer soundly proue any thing but not for him that will fully diuide and rightly deliuer as well the sense as the sound of any sentence of holy Scripture which he taketh in hand to vnfold To shew your selfe a firme and fine concluder vpon texts you exemplifie your skill and inferre that in three speciall points I my selfe by my very text ouerthrow my selfe in the first entrance as all men may see First in that I expresly grant the proper sufferings of Christes minde may rightly be in the contents of his crosse contrary to my maine opinion that Christs bodily sufferings ALONE were the full price of our redemption Secondly that Christs soule in a large sense may be sayd to be crucified if I suppose my text to signifie the whole contents of Christs crosse which I reproued in you with great contempt Thirdly in that I quite ouerthrow my second question for if it be a detestable thing to reioyce but in the crosse of Christ then Christes descent to hell after death must either be a part of the contents of his crosse and so he must suffer among the diuels and damned spirits or els he did vs no good there if we may not reioyce in his descending thither These iarres in my selfe you say I must reconcile els men will thinke I haue not handled my text indeed very rightly These iarres good Sir for so much as concerneth me are soone reconciled Your first obiection is a plaine falsitie your second an open follie your third a meere mockerie The contents of Christs crosse I extended to those griefs wrongs and paines which Christ suffered in his passage to his crosse as namely his submission in the garden his apprehension accusation illusion flagellation condemnation and such like all which he felt before he was fastened to the tree and though indeed they were precedents to his crosse yet because the griefe and smart of them continued and increased with his hanging on the tree the Scripture doth not exclude them from the crosse of Christ which often meaneth by that word the whole course and maner of Christes death and passion as well in comming to his crosse as in hanging on his crosse As for the proper sufferings of the minde those be none of my words yet if you thereby meane care and feare shame and sorrow not repugnant to the condition and perfection of Christes person let them in Gods name come within the contents of Christes crosse as antecedents or consequents to the paines which he suffered But if vnder the proper sufferings of the soule you conuey the suffering of hell paines or the death of the soule from the immediate hand of God which is your dreame keepe your errours for your owne accounts my words haue no such matter nor meaning How then can my maine opinion be true that Christs bodily sufferings ALONE were the full price of our Redemption which I would also ground on all the Fathers though very vntruely How can your obiections be waightie that speake neuer a true word By Christs bodily sufferings I no where exclude either the sense consideration or affection of the Soule discerning the paines which and the cause why the body suffered as you falsely imagine I only except the death of the Soule and paines of hell in Christs sufferings and to barre that I shew by many sufficient testimonies of the auncient Fathers which you shall neuer ouerbeare for all your bragges that Christ dyed for vs the death of the bodie onely and not the death of the soule In this case I vse the word ONLY as hath beene often told you otherwise to exclude the vnion operation or passion of the soule from Christs sufferings I neuer vse it And where I so often and instantly vrge that Christs death and blood-shedding are specified in the Scriptures as the full price of our Redemption and true meanes of our reconciliation to God You foolishly by their fulnesse would turne out all the rest of Christs sufferings as superfluous but my words throughout my sermons are expresse to the contrarie The crosse blood and death of Christ are euery where mentioned in the Scriptures as the very ground-worke and pillars of our Redemption And the things which are named in the Scriptures as they were the last so are they the chiefest parts of Christs sufferings the rest being vnderstood as antecedent to them and not eminent aboue them So that by the death and blood of Christ I neither did nor doe exclude the rest of his sufferings before he came to his crosse only I make them Antecedent to that not eminent aboue that which he suffered on the crosse For as the end of euery thing presupposeth a beginning and a middle and the
Whereupon Pilat maruailed that Christ was so soone dead And the Lord himselfe said None taketh my soule from me but I lay it downe of my selfe I haue power to lay it downe and power to take it againe To which it pertaineth that is written he bowing downe his head gaue vp his spirit for other men first dye and then their heads hang but Christ first laid downe his head and then voluntarily rendered his soule to his Father Many moe might be brought of all ages and places confessing the same but if these suffice not what may be enough I doe not know To decline the Scriptures and Fathers that make against him the Discourser hath deuised two shifts very like the rest of of his tenents that is void of all truth and iudgement I deny not saith he but Christ might shew some strange vnusuall thing apparantly to the beholders in vttering his last voice which might very much mooue the beholders and hââ¦arers Adde hereunto that experience sheweth as Phisitians say how some diseases in the body bring death presently after most strong and violent crying Namely in some excessiue torments as of the stone Things reported and expressed in the Scriptures touching the strange and wonderfull manner of Christs death you deny and dreame of things there no way mentioned to coulour your matter and cosin your Reader That Christ did render his soule into his Fathers hands when as yet neither speech sense memory nor motion began to faile is diligently obserued by the Euangelists and was greatly marueyled at by the Centurion which saw the manner of his death As also that he breathed out his soule of his owne accord when he had spoken those words without any former or other degrees or pangs of death appearing in him is likewise witnessed by the Scriptures and constantly auouched by all the Fathers Saint Luke saith and speaking these words he breat hed out his soule Saint Mathew and crying with a loud voice he dismissed his spirit Saint Marke and sending a strong voice from him he blew out his Soule This did he of his owne accord and power None taking his soule from him as in death they doe ours but declaring himselfe by laying of his soule when he would and as he would to be Lord and master of life and death This is fit for all Christians to confesse least they dishonor the death of Christ by depriuing his person of that power and glory which he openly shewed in the eyes eares of all his persecutors This you shift of and instced thereof imagine some strange and VNVSVALI accident in the manner of Christs death which neither the Scriptures report nor you can expresse wherein you shew your selfe forward to inuent what is not written and backward to beleeue what is written which is the trade of such men as meane to make a shipwracke of their faith That a man may dye crying as Christ did you haue found at length if not from Diuines at least from Phisitians for I perccaue you haue sought all sorts of helps both farre and neere to vphold your fansies Pââ¦rchaunce Phisitians may tell you when a painefull disease possesseth the parts which are no fountaines of life or sense a man may cry till sense and strength begin to faile and so hasten his death by the violent spending of his spirits but that a man may by any course of nature retaine perfect memorie sense motion and speach to the very act of breathing out his soule I assure my selfe no wise Phisitian will affirme And if any more humorous then learned will wade so farre without his Art he must vnderstand that his word may not ouersway the Rules of Diuinitie and Principles of nature For what are the powers and faculties whereby the soule is conioyned with the body but life sense and motion so long then as they last the soule by nature neither doth nor can forsake the body But when sense and motion first outward and then inward are oppressed and ouerwhelmed then life also perisheth and the soule may no longer abide in her body the vnion by which she was fastened vnto it being wholy dissolued Wherefore death which is the priuation of life by Gods ordinance for the punishment of sinne by degrees surpriseth and in the end quencheth all sense and motion and so forceth the soule to forsake her seate which by Gods appointment is violently parted from hir body whether she will or no but neuer till the effects oflife which are sense and motion be first decayed and abolished A sowne is the suddainest ouerwhelming of the powers of life which any natural experience doth teach vs and yet therewith though outward sense and motion doe faile at an instant and the inward be very weake and almost insensible the soule doth not presently depart but stayeth a time till all sense and motion without and within except the partie be recouered be vtterly extinguished Wherefore in all men by necessitie of nature the powers and parts of life decav in some sooner in some later before they die and therefore in Christ on the Crosse it was MIRACVLOVS and aboue nature that hauing full perfect outward and inward sense speech and motion he did in a moment when he would and as he would render his soule into the hands of his Father without any farder decayes or other degrees of death precedent then the very act of breathing out his soule which left his body presently and perfectly dead Thou hast gentle Reader the causes and prooses that mooued me to obserue the manââ¦r of Christes death to bee different from ours which whether they be consonant to the Scriptures and rightly conceiued by those learned and ancient Fathers which I haue named vnto thee I leaue to thy discrecte iudgement assuring thee there is nothing to hinder the maine consent of so many old and new writers in a matter of so great consequence but onely the headdinesse of this discourser who vpon a bare pretence of one peece of Scripture not well vnderstood and worse applied thinketh he may worke wonders and conclude all these graue and sound Expositours to be so ignorant of the sense of that place and so vnable to reach to the depth of those words Christ was LIKE VS IN ALL things that with one accord they would affirme a sine fable a Paradoxe in Nature and contrarie to Scripture Howbeit it is no newes with this man to defend that Christ was distempered ouerwhelmed and all confounded both in all the powers of his soule and senses of his body He boldly auoucheth it was so with Christ before his death in the Garden and on the Crosse and therefore hee presumeth it might much more befall him at his death But let him keepe these secrets to himselfe I doubt not Christian Reader but thou wilt be well aduised before thou put the Sauiour of the world and the Sonne of God out of his wits or senses to make way for
it is which the Scripture so calleth were not coherent with that incorruption which they shall haue there The one is not the other but the one is so consequent to the other that without holines in earth no man shall euer enioy happinesse in heauen And to both doth the imitation of Christ and signification of fire in the holocaust direct vs. Comming to the next reason you reprooued me for saying Sacraments are earthly Elements they can not set out the spirituall and ââ¦uisible effects in Christ. There was iust cause I should tell you that this your asseââ¦tion did mainly crosse the very nature and definition of a Sacrament For Sacraments are visible signes of inuisible graces that is of the spirituall effects of Christs power and grace abiding in him and yet working in vs. Wherein did I wrong you you ment they vsually represent not spirituall and inââ¦sible effects or acts in Christ him selfe but onely the externall and visible parts of his passion The two Sacraments of the new Testament Baptisme and the Lords Supper doe they represent onely the externall and visible parts of Christs passion Doth Baptisme shew no more in Christ but that actuall and substantiall water ranne out of his side after he was dead Is this the whole signification and repââ¦esentation that baptisme offereth vnto vs Surely you must leaue Catechising and learne to be catechised if this be all your skill in Sacraments The bread and wine on the Lords table besides the reference which they haue to the body of Christ broken and his blood shed doe they not plainly shew the flesh of Christ is meate and his blood drinke nourishing our soules to euerlasting life as the elements support and maintaine the life of the body Water in Baptisme doth it not declare the power of Christs death washing our soules and of his spirit renuing our minds These you say are spirituall effects wrought in vs not in Christ. Power to clense quicken nourish and strengthen to eternall life is that Christs or ours We indeede are the persons that are clensed quickened nourished and strengthened but the force and grace working these things in vs is Christs and not ours We receiue it as flowing from the fountaine but it naturally springeth in him and from thence is deriued to vs. The Sacraments then teach vs that the fulnesse of power and grace dwelleth in Christ really and truely which he is content shall worke in vs but neuer leaue him The water washing the bread nourishing the wine comforting note no power in vs to do any of these things it is euident impietie so to thinke or say onely they assure vs that as Christ the true owner of all these things by his obedience vnto death was made the onely disposer of them so he will performe the couenant with vs which the Sacraments doe seale vnto vs and that is the couenant of mercie and grace in this life and of glorie in the next which the Sacraments could not seale except they did signifie those gifts and effects to be actiuely and originally in the giuer as they are passiuely in the Receiuers VSVALLY Sacraments doe not represent spirituall effects or actes in Christ. When text and trueth faile you your fashion is to flie to phrases and so still to say somewhat though it want both learning and vnderstanding For example Sacraments you say doe not VSVALLY represent spirituall effects or acts in Christ. Did you speake of nature which often faileth or of men who change their minds vsuall and vnusuall might serue for some purpose but what is this to Sacraments they constantly and continually keepe the same order in their significations and representations so that vsuall and vnusuall in them are all one The nature of the Element is still the same the action prescribed may not be varied the promise annexed neuer faileth on Gods part So that what any Sacrament once resembleth or signifieth it alwayes expresseth and obserueth the same Will you diuert your wordes to diuers Sacraments and make that vsuall to one which is vnusuall to another This which you vsually exclude from Sacraments is common to both the Sacraments of the New Testament of which we reason and being common to them both as I haue shewed to signifie spirituall effects or acts in Christ himselfe with what trueth say you now THEY do it not vsually speaking of both whereas both do it apparently and perpetually It is your selfe indeede that denieth the very definition of a Sacrament for your maine assertion is that neither the Iewish sacrifices nor Christian Sacraments doe signifie any more then the bodily and bloââ¦dy death of Christ which I hope was a visible and no ââ¦uisible thing Your Reader will shortly take you so often tardie with foule-lies that hee will skant beleeue you when you speake a trueth Is it any position of mine that the Iewish sacrifices and Christian Sacraments doe not signifie any more then the bodily and bloudie death of Christ Indeede I afââ¦irmed they signified none other death of Christ but only that which was bodily and bloudie which I gââ¦ant was visible but as for other effects of Christs power grace by which we are grafted into Christ and quickââ¦ed and nourished vnto life euerlasting Ireferred them to the Sacraments of the new Testament as vnto Seales confirming the couenant of mercie grace and glorie made to vs by the death of Christ in the same words that I now speake it And so conclude of them as I doe now These propose vnto vs no inuisible paines of hell but the body of Christ wounded and his bloud shed for the remitting of our sinnes and vniting vs vnto Christ. Therefore your turning no inuisible paines of hell which are my words into no more then a bodily death which are yours and vnder pretence of those words excluding from the Sacraments all other significations and representations of Christs inuisible power and grace proposed by them sheweth your accustomed vain of misconstering and altering my words when you cannot otherwise impugne them You make me to crosse the institution of the Lords table because I said the Ceremonie of breaking the bread cannot properly belong to Christs body But euen here doe I not expressely say that it sheweth forth how Christs body was broken for vs Where by Christs institution the bread was BROKEN to note vnto vs the breaking of his body for our sinnes and Paul expresseth that similitude of the bread broken to Christes body in saying The bread which wee breake is it not the communion of the body of Christ and to verifie that resemblance reporteth the words of Christs institution in effect to be these This is my body which is broken for you you to make a siely shew that the Sacraments declare Christs suffering of Hell paines auouch that the. breaking of the bread cannot properly belong to the body but to the soule and to the body by Sympathie
neerer in soules to the right signification of bruizing than the mangling tearing and contusing of Christs body which he suffered from the violent rage of the Iewes Your other word of the very same nature keepe to your selfe When your proofs faile you in this you may not be suffered to roue at your pleasure and to reach after other words out of your own vnlearned skill to vouch they are of the very same nature Wherefore there is no cause why the coherence of Esaies wordes should be cut in sunder by your vnhandsome deuice of the peeces and powder of soules but as the first words in that sentence he was wounded for our transgressions and the last with his stripes we are healed are plainly referred to the punishments of Christes bodie so the middest he was bruized for our iniquities should haue the same relation and intention especially the Prophet foretelling the people what they should see in their Messias and how they should misiudge of him We sayth Esay did iudge him as plagued and smittââ¦n of God but he was wounded for our transgressions and bruized for our iniquities and with his stripes are we healed Neither is it any strange thing in the Scriptures to ioyne this very word which you talke so much of with wounding as with a word of the same nature and force For besides that Moses sayth None wounded with any bruizing or ââ¦utting of his secret parts shall enter into the Lords congregation Dauid saith to God Thou hast bruized Rahab as one that is wounded Where wounding bruizing are more properly lincked together as words of like force and effect than your breaking of soules into pieces or beating them to powder The verie same word is also vsed in the Scriptures to note the bruizing of mans bodie by sicknesse or of his estate by wrong and oppression Dauid in a grieuous sicknesse complaining that he felt nothing sound in his flesh nor any rest in his bones addeth I am weakned and bruized very much Bruize not the poore in the gate sayth Salomon that is oppresse not the poore in iudgement The children of the foolish shall be bruized that is oppressed in the gate and none shall deliuer them And when it is applied to the soule it may note that to be either wounded with sorrow oppressed with wrong or humbled with obedience but as for powder and pieces from which you would pull a iust proportion which nothing can answere but the paines of hell it is a sicke conceit of your owne braine it hath no deriuation either from the Prophets or Apostles words You did not meane that the soule might be properly broken in pieces but that thus it is neerer and better applied to the soule than to the bodie which was only pierced and boared thorow Then was your former opposition out of the Scripture very licentious and your conclusion as friuolous In that a bone of Christes was not broken you inferred that Esaies words He was broken for our sinnes could not be properly meant of Christes bodie flesh and bones as if there were no breaking of ioynts veines sinewes flesh or skinne but only of bones And yet as if the soule of Christ which is by nature altogether indiuisible might properly be broken in pieces you conclude the breaking of the bread can not properly belong to the bodie of Christ BVT TO THE SOVLE Had you denied the breaking of the bread properly to belong to either your words must haue beene It can belong properly neither to the bodie nor to the soule but you denie the one and auouch the other It can not belong properly to the body but to the soule Whether those words of yours doe not expresly import that the breaking of bread doth properly belong to the soule of Christ as to the trueth wherein they must be verified I leaue it to the iudgement of the discreet Reader Howbeit you denie not but broken applied to the soule of Christ is figuratiue And so you grant there was no cause you should take such exceptions as you did to the Apostles wordes This is my bodie which is broken for you For since it can not be verified of the soule but figuratiuely as you now confesse it may so be most iustly verified of Christes bodie without any sense of hell paines suffered in the soule of Christ. And if the consent of the English Latine and Greeke tongues may be trusted for the vse of a word breaking may properly be affirmed of Christes bodie which can not be of his soule for so much as his ioynts veines sinewes flesh and skinne were broken and torne in sunder though his bones were not And but that your fashion is to follow no man farder than your fansie leadeth you you might haue seene with what reuerence and conscience Master Beza that otherwise vpholdeth the sufferings of Christes soule referreth this word KLOMENON to the tearings and torments of Christes bodie being hereto led by the Apostles assertion By the word broken in Pauls wordes is designed the kindâ⦠of Christes death because besides that the Lords bodie was torne bruized and euen broken with most bitter torments though his legges were not broken as the theeues were Christ breathing out his soule with a most violent death was as it were rent in two parts according to his humane Nature This word then hath a MARVELLOVS EXPRESSE SIGNIFICATION that the figure should fullie agree with the thing it selfe to wit that the breaking of the bread should represent to our minds the verie death of Christ. Peter Martyr hauing made your obiection that a bone of Christ was not broken resolueth But heereof I will not greatly contend for somuch as this breaking is by many Fathers referred to the body of Christ. With whom the wordes following doe make broken for you which indeed leadeth me to consent vnto them and to acknowledge a double breaking one in the bread another in the bodie of Christ. Bullinger sayth The bread is properlie sayd to be broken the bodie of man to be slaine howbeit in the Hebrue tongue to breake is to waste to kill and destroy And so the visible bread which in our sight is broken with our hands doth certeinly set before our eyes that bodie of Christ which was broken or done to death by vs or for vs. So Haymo q Christ himselfe brake the bread which he deliuered to his Disciples to shew that the breaking and suffering of his bodie came not but of his owne accord Which wordes he tooke out of Beda vpon the Gospels of Marke and Luke Before whom Prosper When the host is broken and the bloud is powred out into the mouthes of the faithfull what other thing is designed than the doing to death of the Lords bodie on the crosse and the shedding of the bloud out of his side And likewise Austen The table of thy spouse sayth he to the Church hath bread
but thereby it plainly appeareth you take not the paines to reade the Fathers words in the places where they are written but rashly catch at them to serue your turne without all respect to the antecedents or consequents which would declare the writers meaning In that Chapter whence these words are taken Cyrill treateth not of the punishments which Christ suffered for our sinnes but of the passions and infirmities of our nature ALL VVHICH Christ receaued and suffered to rise in himselfe that they might be repressed by him and our nature reformed And therefore in those words Christ suffered all to free vs from all Cyrill euidently meaneth all the naturall infirmities and passions of our flesh And those are his expresse words twice or thrice in that Chapter When thou hearest saith he that Christ wept feared and sorrowed acknowledge him to be a true man and ascribe these things to the nature of man For Christ tooke a mortall bodie subiect to all the passions of our nature sinne alwaies excepted And againe How commeth it to passe that these men know not that all these things must be applied to mans nature in Christ which he truely tooke vnto him with all the passions thereof but still without sinne And the very recollection of the words which you stand on conuinceth Cyrill spake of the naturall passions and infirmities of our flesh For when he had exemplified his generall wordes Christ suffered all to free vs from all by death feare and sorrow which are naturall to our corrupt condition he concludeth it a singulas passiones carnis fuisse in Christo absque peccato commotas inuenies vt commotae vincerentur natura nostra reformaretur ad melius AND LIKEVVISE ALL THE PASSIONS or affections of our flesh shalt thou finde mooued in Christ but without sinne that being mooued they might be repressed and our nature reformed to the better What is this to hell paines which I trow are no naturall infirmities or affections in man or to the proper sufferings of the soule which you would hence establish since heere is no mention but of the naturall infirmities and affections of the flesh which Cyrill calleth the passions therof as both Diuines and Philosophers doe ' Thus I take Bernards meaning to be when he saith Christ spared not himselfe who knoweth how to spare his Your taking may soone shew you to be a wilfull mistaker but it concludeth nothing for your cause Doth Bernard say that Christ suffered hell paines and therein spared not himselfe you would faine haue him say so but he is as farre from it as you are neere it Bernard in that Chapter which you cite but neuer saw for you went no farder for all your authorities then my sermons speaketh of the sixt and seuenth time Christ shedde his blood for vs and when he commeth to the piercing of Christs hands and his feete with spikes of iron to fasten him to the crosse wondering at Christes patience and loue towards vs that endured such things for vs he saith God which either shortneth lightneth or taketh from his seruants the force of their torments did in nothing ease vnto himselfe the wine-presse of his passion he spared not himselfe that knoweth how to spare his Doth this conclude that Christ suffered the paines of hell or that he shedde his blood vnto death for vs not sparing himselfe from that or in that which he suffered though it were painfull and greeuous to him But I my selfe confesse that Christ suffered and endured all to the vttermost with exact obedience and patience Euen as Bernard fauoured your vntoward fansies and said nothing for them so doe I but doe either Bernards words or mine import that Christ suffered all which else we should haue suffered as you enterlace Cyrils words to make them sound somewhat to your purpose are you so seely that you can not or so slie that you will not see the plaine seames of humane speech If a man should saie you affirme all things boldly you prooue all things weakely you translate al thinges corruptly Doe his words imply that you translate Euclide and Aristotle that you prooue the roundnesse of the earth and the bignesse of the Sunne or that you affirme the sea burneth and the Moone melteth Is it not the vsuall course of al speech and speakers when they expresse how things are done to restraine the word all with a relation to the same person and action whereof they spake as you affirme all things which you affirme boldly you prooue all that you prooue weakely and you translate all whatsoeuer you translate corruptly Doth not the Scripture obserue the like The people said of Christ he hath done all things well Will you inferre that Christ made ships built Towers cast Lead and did whatsoeuer because he did all things well or did they intend that whatsoeuer he did he did it well The true light saith Saint Iohn lightneth euerie man that commeth into the world Where if you take all men without exception you plant a palpable error vpon Saint Iohns words if you restraine them to all that are lightned his speech is a manifest trueth in Christ and an excellent honour to Christ. So said I of Christ that he suffered all that he suffered with exact obedience and patience not expressing there what he suffered but how he suffered to wit obediently and patiently Which wordes of mine giue you no great cause of aduantage if you looke well vnto them and abuse them not after your idle maner But such poore shifts you are forced to seeke to set some colour on your cause which otherwise would bewray it selfe to want all good groundes and proofes As you deale with me so you doe with Tertullian Ambrose Ierom Cyprian and Cyrill whose words partly you mistranslate partly you misconster and build vpon them what best pleaseth your selfe without any precedence or sequence of their text Tertullian saith sic reliquit dum non parcit So God left his Sonne whiles he spared him not If this make for you why quote you not the Apostle Paul as one of your partners who spake the word before Tertullian and whom Tertullian citeth by name for that word God spared not his owne Sonne saith Paul but deliuered him for vs all This place you baulked because it expoundeth Gods not sparing his Sonne by deliuering him for God spared not his Sonne but deliuered him that is God did not spare him from deliuering and also for that it excludeth your imagination of Gods immediate hand tormenting the soule of his Sonne with the substance of hell paines For if God deliuered his Sonne for vs all he deliuered him to others and not to himselfe and consequently your dreame of Gods immediate hand inflicting hell paines on the soule of his Sonne is against the Apostles words God deliuered his Sonne Which Christ himselfe expoundeth very often in the Gospel saying The Sonne of man shal
be deliuered into the hands of men and they shall kill him And againe The Sonne of man shall be deliuered to be crucified and immediately before his apprehension Behold the houre is come the Sonne of man is deliuered into the hands of sinners This deliuering of Christ into the hands of men to be crucified was the not sparing him which the Apostle meant and was that for saking which Christ testified on the Crosse as Tertullian thinketh Filium dereliquit dum hominem eius tradit in mortem Hoc Apostolus sensit scribens si pater Filio non pepercit Sic reliquit dum non parcit sic reliquit dum tradit Ceterum non reliquit pater filium in cuius manibus Filius spiritum suum posuit Denique posuit statim obijt Spiritu enim manente in carne caro omnino mori non potest Ita relinqui á patre mori fuit filio God left or forsooke his Sonne as Christ complained on the Crosse whiles he deliuered his humane nature vnto death This the Apostle meant when he wrote if God spared not his Sonne So God left him whiles he spared him not so God left him whiles he deliuered him Otherwise the Father forsooke not the Sonne into whose hands the Sonne commended his spirit He laide it downe and presently died For while the spirit abideth in the flesh the flesh can not die at all Then to bee left of the Father was as much in the Sonne as to die Here are Tertullians words in order as they stand Where first he maketh the Sonne to die when hee laide downe his soule into his Fathers hands This death by which the soule of Christ departed from his body was that deliuering that not sparing which Paul meant and that forsaking which Christ spake of on the crosse What finde you here for the paines of Hell or for the proper sufferings of the soule You may peruert any mans words if you will but of them selues these are very coherent and euident In Ambrose you finde more hold He saith Minus contulerat mihi nisimeum suscepisset affectum Christ had done lesse for me if hee had not beene altogether affected as I should haue beene Though you be no good concluder yet are you a notable translatour For you can turne the English not onely cleane from but quite against the Latine Where Ambrose saith Christ had done lesse for mee if taking my nature vnto him hee had not also taken my naturall affection vnto him as feare sorrow and such like you misconster affection for punishment and mine that is naturally mine for that which I should haue suffered in hell and adding the word altogether of your owne you make Ambrose say that Christ was altogether affected that is punished in soule as I should haue beene in hell if I had not bene redeemed But by what Grammar doth affectus signifie hell paines Feare griefe and sorrow are naturall affections in all men and passions of the soule they signifie not in their owne nature the torments of the damned How shall we know this to bee Ambrose meaning Hee that hath but halfe an eye may see by that whole Chapter the roote of this sorrow to bee the infirmitie of our nature in Christ and the cause thereof to be his compassion and pitie had of vs and for vs. The next words to those which you bring are Ergo pro me doluit qui pro se nihil habuit quod doleret And presently taedio meae infirmitatis afficitur Christ therefore sorrowed for me who had nothing in him selfe for which he should sorrow he is affected with the tediousnesse of my infirmitie The tediousnesse of our infirmitie affected him not the torments of hell suffered in his owne soule Neque speciem incarnationis suscepit sed veritatem Debuit ergo dolorem suscipere vt vinceret tristitiam non excluderet Christ tooke vpon him not the shew but the trueth of our flesh Hee was therefore to feele griefe as a consequent to our nature that he might ouercome sorrow and not exclude it Tristis est non ipse sed anima Suscepit enim animam meam suscepit corpus meum Anima obnoxia passionibus Christ was sorrowfull not in person but in soule For he tooke vnto him my soule and my body Now the soule it is that is subiect to passions Is hell with you of late become a naturall infirmitie and affection that wheresoeuer you reade either of these words you streight inferre the paines of hell The causes of Christes sorrow will put all out of doubt and are plainely recited by Ambrose in the ende of this Chapter though stifly reiected by you because they sort not with your conceits Tristis videbatur tristis erat non pro sua passione sed pro nostra dispersione Christ seemed sorrowfull and indeede was sorrowfull not for his owne suffering but for our dispersing You say Christs sorrow was for the suffering of hell paines in his soule Ambrose saith in expresse words Christ sorrowed not for his owne suffering which of you twaine shall wee thinke best vnderstoode Ambrose meaning him selfe or you Christ sorowed saith Ambrose for our dispersion he sorrowed because he left vs orphanes he sorrowed for his persecutors All these occasions of sorrow in Christ at the time of his passion mentioned by Ambrose you vtterly disauerre and in spite of Ambrose teeth you will haue the infirmitie and affection of mans nature in Christ to signifie hell Yet Ierom shall helpe at a neede who saith That which we should haue borne for our sinnes the same Christ suffered for vs. You might haue done well to haue put quicquid for quod as one of your fellowes hath done alleaging this place that where Ierom would not say Christ suffered for vs whatsoeuer we should haue suffered your selues may speake it in his name Neither is it so strange a thing with you to translate all for some In the very next Page before citing Ambrose words hoc in se obtulit Christus quod induit Christ offered that in him selfe which he tooke of vs you render it Christ offered in sacrifice ALL that which he assumed which translation is euidently false whatsoeuer the illation be This place of Ierom I haue already answered in the conclusion of my Sermons and but that the booke happely will not alwaies be at hand I would spend no moe words therein The particular can not hurt me if it be simply graunted and the generall is not affirmed by Ierom. Howbeit Ierom in plaine speech presently expresseth what he ment Christ suffered for vs. By this saith he it is manifest that as Christs body whipt and torne bare the printes of the stripes and wrongs so his soule truely sorrowed for vs. What neede we any other exposition then his owne that Christ suffered for vs smart of body and griefe of minde which were due to vs in this world
God an infirmitie of the soule As if it were weaknesse in man not to be stronger then God or imbecilitie not to be able to resist his power Feare and sorrow are infirmities and Fulgentius sayth whatsoeuer infirmitie that is whatsoeuer feare or sorow may be in the soule the same Christ tooke and suffered These must be your collections if you open your mouth to make any and these bee so grosse that no boy would engage himselfe with them For the name of Infirmitie doth naturally note the speciall kindes thereof by which they differ from other things that are not infirmities it doth not import either degrees to which they may grow or the causes from whence they may rise Is it then any consequent that if Christ tooke vpon him all kinds of infirmities and passions of the soule he must therefore vndergoe all degrees and all the causes of feare and sorrow that may be in the soule Christ did feare and Christ did sorow for those without question were infirmities of his humane soule Will it thence follow that Christ suffered all those dangers losses harmes which men in this life doe and may feare If these will no way follow vpon Fulgentius words how will the paines of hell be thence deriued which I vtterly denie to be any infirmitie in mans soule since no creature is so strong though he were an Angell as to decline or resist the hand of God in punishing Fulgentius wordes therefore that Christ tooke vnto him euery infirmitie of the soule doe not inferre that Christ suffered euery degree or euery obiect of feare and sorrow but onely that he feared and sorowed which maketh as much for your hell paines as feathers doe to reare a fortresse The wordes of Fulgentius at your best aduantage doe you little good his true meaning doth you farre lesse For going onward to debate this matter more at large he addeth two conditions to the infirmities and affections of Christs soule the one that they were naturall that is necessarily consequent to the nature of man the other that they were voluntarie in Christ though in vs they be necessarie These limitations are very often in that Booke expressed whence your words are taken Animae tristitiam perturbationem quam voluntariam in anima Dei filius habuit sic habuisse credatur vt etiam ipsas humanae animae passiones voluntate veras in veritate voluntarias non nââ¦gemus The sorrow and trouble of soule which the Sonne of God had voluntarily in his soule he must be beleeued so to haue had that we done them not to be true because they were voluntarie nor to be voluntarie because they were true This hee maketh common to bodie and soule Quia verum hominem suscepit ideo cunctas humanae naturae infirmitates veras quidem sed voluntarias in eadem veritate naturae duntaxat humanae sustinuit Because Christ tooke vpon him to be a true man therefore he sustained ALL the true infirmities of mans nature but yet voluntarie in the trueth of the same nature onely If you know not what naturall and voluntarie passions in Christes manhood doe meane you may learne of Damascene whom an adherent of yours much esteemeth and often alleageth though Damascene make nothing for his or your purposes Wee confesse sayth Damascene that Christ tooke vnto him ALL NATVRALL AND BLAMELESSE passions For he assumed the whole man and all that pertained to man saue sinne Naturall and blamelesse passions are those which are not in our power and whatsoeuer entred into mans life through the condemnation of Adams sinne as hunger thirst weakenesse labour weeping corruption shunning of death feare agonie whence came sweat and drops of blood These things are in all men by nature Christ therefore tooke all these vnto him that he might sanctifie them all Howbeit our naturall passions were in Christ according to nature and aboue nature According to nature they were stirred vp in Christ when he permitted his flesh to endure that which was proper vnto it Aboue nature they were in Christ because nature in him did neuer goâ⦠before his will For there was nothing forced in him but all things voluntarie When he would he hungred when he would he thirsted when he would he feared when he would he died The naturall infirmities and passions then which Christ tooke vnto him as Damascene teacheth were common to all men by nature and so are not the paines of hell they were in this life so aâ⦠not the other they were sanctified so cannot the torments of hell be they were voluntarie that is they mooued not in Christ but at his owne will Wherefore by Damascenes iudgement Christ did not suffer your hellish torture from the immediate hand of God by which he was wholy amazed and ouerwhelmed as you say with the waight and anguish of them which could not be with his will I haue stood to Fulgentius words more then which you did not aske will you now likewise be tried by Fulgentius testimonie whether you teach an errour exiled from all Christian hearts in his age Or if you will not your Reader will soone perceaue that what was then reiected for an absurditie and falsitie I will spare heauier termes till I come to fuller proofes can not now be professed as pietie Touching Christs death by which wee are redeemed that it had in it neither the death of the soule nor the paines of hell Fulgentius is very plaine euen in the same booke where you would haue him so much forget himselfe as to speake the contrary Quis ignoret Christum nec diuinitate sed in solo corpore mortuum sepultum Who can be ignorant if he be a Christian that Christ died and was buried not in his diuinitie but onely in bodie and againe In morte solius carnis immortalis fuit Christ was immortall nothing dying in him but his flesh And so Cum sola caro moreretur resuscitaretur in Christo filius Dei dicitur mortuus When onely the flesh died and was raised againe in Christ yet the Sonne of God is said to haue died And as though no repeating were susficient In tota humanitate traditus idem Christus secundum solam carnem mortuus secundum solam carnem de sepulcho surrexit The same Christ deliuered in his whole humanitie died in his flesh onely and rose againe onely in his flesh And least you should wrench aside as you afterward doe that the name of Christs flesh containeth soule and bodie besides that the word bodie directly excludeth the soule which can not be the bodie and so doeth the buriall and resurrection of Christ for so much as the soule of Christ neither was neither could be buried nor raised from the graue Fulgentius in full and faire words exempteth not only the deitie but the soule of Christ as well as the deitie from death Moriente carne non solum deitas sed nec anima
Christi potest ostendi commortua When Christ died in the flesh neither can the godhead nor the soule of Christ be shewed to haue bene also dead And of hell paines he saith Dignum fuit vt animam dolor non contigisset inferni quam seruitus nequiuit tenere peccati It was a meete and right thing that the paines of hell should not touch that soule whom the seruitude of sinne could not fasten on Yet Cyrill in the place aboue cited SEEMETH to acknowledge A KIND OF DEATH EVEN OF THE SOVLE from which Christ reuiued againe But of that in due place hereafter Is the death of Christs soule so slender a matter that you may collect it by a seeming and a kind of death without any mention or occasion of any such thing comprised in Cyrils words The Reader may there obserue what your maine intent is and whereon you fasten your eyes all this while euen on the death of Christs soule to be requisite for our Redemption though you finde no such thing in Scripture or Father but miserably and childishly slide it in at last with a seeming Now if there be no such thing in Cyrils words nor any such seeming how wel deserue you to be hissed out with hands if not to be hurled out by the heeles for a seeming sleeper if not for a waking dreamer what are those words of Cyrill that seeme to acknowledge the death of Christs soule Christ bestowed his flesh as a ransome for our flesh and made his soule likewise the price of redemption for our soules although he liued againe being by nature life it selfe It is lawfull for you to further euery place you bring with a mayned and forced translation Cyrils true words stand thus ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Without constraint of any Christ of himselfe laide downe his owne soule for vs that he might be Lord of dead and quicke yeelding his flesh in recompence as a gift fully worth it for the flesh of all and making his soule or life a ransome for the soule or life of all though he reuiued againe being life by nature in that he was God The words which you would cite are heere no perfect sentence as hauing no principall verbe in them and therefore must be ioyned with the former and depend vpon the verbe ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Christ layd downe his soule which gouerneth the whole as appeareth also by the two participles ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã yeelding in recompence and ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã making which must be directed by the same nominatiue case that ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã is and likewise by the opposition of the verbe ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã he reuiued Of what death Cyrill here speaketh is more then manifest by the words of our Sauiour here vsed and deriued from the Gospell where he said None taketh my soule from me or constraineth me to die I lay it downe of my selfe and likewise the Sonne of man came to giue his soule or life a ransome for many What kind of death those words of Christ imported I made it appeare but a little before by the full consent of Scriptures and interpreters old and new and of Cyrill himselfe who all with one accord referre both those sayings to the death of Christs bodie and the losse of his life on the Crosse when his soule departed from him Set that downe in Cyrils first words for the death which Christ died by the constant assertion of Scriptures Fathers New writers and of Cyrill himselfe and then the words which you alleage shew plainely the force of his corporall death to be auaileable for the bodies and soules of all men in that his flesh yeelded to death was a recompence or exchange for all mens flesh and his soule laide downe without constraint of any was the ransome of all mens soules and he notwithstanding rose againe the third day to life by his owne power as being God and life it selfe against whom death could preuaile no farder nor longer then hee him selfe would Where are the words that acknowledge the death of Christs Soule or that so much as seeme to acknowledge a kind of death in the soule of Christ Here are the cleane contrarie For if the death of Christs bodie by which he laid aside his soule for vs be sufficient to redeeme the bodies and soules of all men then superfluous and needlesse euen by these words was the death of Christs soule the whole being fully perfourmed without it But he gaue his flesh to be a ransome for our flesh and his soule for our soules you say and yet liued againe Cyrill doth not say by seuerall deaths but by one and the same death which was the laying down of his soule or life for vs as Christ himselfe in the Gospel said he would If those wordes inferre the death of Christes soule why bring you not the words of Christ himselfe saying The Sonne of man came to giue his soule a ransome for many You saw the Scriptures themselues and the whole Church of Christ first and last I meane all old and new writers translators and expositors would condemne your folly therin in most exact words taking soule there for life which must needes import the death of Christs bodie And therefore you thought it more safetie to catch at the same words in some Father for whose meaning there could not be brought so many and so sound deponents But all in vaine For if Christ had no meaning in those wordes to point out the death of his owne soule then Cyrill alleaging and obseruing the words of Christ can haue no such purpose as to crosse the Scriptures himselfe and all the Fathers of Christs Church in a matter so dangerous and desperate as the death of Christs soule amounteth vnto In the meane while his words conclude no such thing neither in saying nor in seeming and so your embracing them to that end argueth your good will to seeke but your euill lucke to finde any such thing as the death of Christs soule in all the Fathers Cyrill doth not say Christ rose againe which properly belongeth to the body but he reuiued or liued againe which seemeth to be spoken of the Soule Then Saint Paul maketh more for you then Cyrill doth for he affirmeth both os Christ to this end saith he Christ died and rose againe and reuiued that he might be Lord of dead and liuing And indeed resurrection properly noteth from whence Christ arose to wit from the graue Reuiuing expresseth the blessed and glorious life which he enioyed after he was risen from the dead Christ himselfe saith of his they shall come forth of their graues vnto the resurrection of life to separate them from the wicked who shall come likewise forth vnto the resurrection but of iudgement and condemnation Notwithstanding in Christ there is either no difference betwixt them the one euer implying the other or if we make any Christs reuiuing alwaies presupposeth
his Resurrection as antecedent since he possessed not that immortall and heauenly life which now he hath but vpon his arising from the dead And so the Apostle placeth them Christ died and rose againe and reuiued into such power and glory that he was made Lord ouer dead and quicke And Cyrill who often times vseth this word he reuiued of Christ meaneth the third day after Christs death when the Scriptures affirme he rose from the graue So Cyrill and the Synode of Alexandria that ioyned with him in writing vnto Nestorius say of Christ. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã he reuiued the third day hauing spoyled hell and so in his second confession of the true faith to the religious Queenes ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Christ spoyling death reuiued the third day And in his Epistle to those of Egypt Christ is said in the Scriptures first to haue died as a man ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and after that to haue returned to life by that which he was by Nature If then he died not in the flesh according to the Scriptures he was not quickned by the Spirit ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã that is he reuiued not againe So that Cyrill hath not any seeming words for the death of Christs Soule but saith as Christ said in effect before that the Sonne of man gaue his soule or life to be a ransome for the life of all and not for the Soule of all which in the singular number is neither good English nor good Diuinitie though to smooth it you put the plurall and say for our soules which is not in Cyrill The words of Ambrose will prooue that Christ offered his Soule for vs hoc in se obtulit Christus quod induit Christ offered in Sacrifice all that which he assumed Besides that you falsifie Ambrose by adding ALL to his words which haue no such thing in them you ââ¦est Ambroses words against Ambroses meaning For though it may well be graunted that Christ offered body and soule as a Sacrifice of holinesse and obedience vnto God and that Christs Soule likewise was laid downe vnto the death of his body to feele the smart thereof and to be seuered by the force thereof in which respect Esay saith that Christ powred forth his Soule vnto death Yet Ambrose speaking of Christs sacrifice for the sinnes of the people meaneth as the rest of the Fathers doe that part of the Sacrifice which was slaine which was by his and their confession Christs body and not Christs Soule Heare Ambrose him selfe In quo nisi in corpore expiauit populi peceata In quo passus est nisi in corpore Wherein did Christ sacrifice for the sinnes of the people but in his body wherein did he suffer death but in his body And so Theodoret Christ was called a Priest in his humane nature ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and offered none other Sacrifice but his owne body Athanasius nameth what Christ put on and what he offered The word of God that made all things was afterward made an hie Priest ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Putting on a body that was borne and made which he might offer for vs. Nazianzene saith to Christ. Thou art a sheepe because thouwast a Sacrifice thou art an hie Priest because thou offeredst thy body Augustine also Sacerdos propter victimam quam pro nobis offerret a nobis acceptam Christ ãâã a Priest for the Sacrifice he tooke of vs that he might offer it for vs. What that Sacrifice was he sheweth saying Assumpsit a nobis quod offerret Domino ipsas diximus sanctas primitias carnis ex vtero virginis Christ tooke of vs that he might offer to the Lord we meane the holy first fruits of his flesh taken from the wombe of the Virgine Theophylact A Priest may by no meanes be without a Sacrifice It was then necessarie that Christ should haue somewhat to offer Quod autem offerretur praeter eius corpus nil quidpiam erat necessariò ergo mortuus est Now there was vtterly nothing that he might offer besides his body it was needfull then he should die This that Christ tooke a body to offer is most agreeable to Ambroses mind as well in the booke which you cite as in other parts of his writings Ex segenerauit Maria Marie conceiued of her selfe to wit of her owne body that what was conceiued of her might be the true nature of a body And alleadging Saint Pauls words that Christ was made of the seede of Dauid according to the flesh Rom. 1. and made of a woman Galat. 4. He concludeth Ergo ex nobis accepit quod proprium offerret pro nobis vt nos redimeret ex nostro Then Christ tooke of vs that which hee might offer as his owne for vs to the ende he might redeeme vs by that which was ours And declaring what he meant euen by the words which you bring Christ offered that in himselfe which hee put on Ambrose addeth Non igitur diuinitatem induit sed carnem assumpsit vt spolium carnis exueret Christ put not on the nature of his Diuinitie but he tooke flesh that he might put off the spoyle of his flesh when he should die Now if the flesh of Christ were subiect to all iniuries how say you that Christs flesh is of the same substance with his Godhead What else doe you in so saying but compare Adams slime and our earth to the Diuine substance Here Ambrose plainely confesseth what hee meant Christ tooke vnto him and offered for vs euen Adams slime and our earth whereof his body was made Which elsewhere hee precisely auoucheth saying Corpus suscepit nostrae mortalitatis vt pro nobis haberet quid offerret Christ assumed our mortall body that he might haue what to offer for vs. And least you should after your trifling maner aske whether we exclude an humane soule from the body which Christ tooke of the substance of his mother and which hee offered for vs to death on the Crosse I answere with Ambrose Cum susceperit carnem hominis consequens est vt perfectionem incarnationis plenitudinemque susceperit Nihil enim in Christo imperfectum Where as Christ tooke vnto him the flesh of a man it is consequent that hee tooke vnto him the perfection and fulnesse of incarnation for there is nothing imperfect in Christ. And what neede was there hee should take flesh without a Soule when as an insensible flesh and an vnreasonable soule was neither subiect to sinne nor capable of reward An humane soule was a necessarie sequell to Christs body which he tooke of the seede of Dauid and substance of his mother as it is to all ours before we can be men but the soule is not comprised in the name of the body much lesse doeth it receiue the same conditions and properties which the body doth Though then I make no doubt but Christ at his birth and
his whole manhood Irather discharge you from it then burthen you with it onely I added if you should meane otherwise then your words were vttered which I did not say you did then your Antecedent had a flat contradiction in it selfe For so you should in one and the same reason affirme that Christ suffered all which he suffered in his whole Manhood and yet had some sufferings proper to his Soule But granting Christ to suffer all that he suffered in his whole Manhood yet Gods wrath as Gods wrath must you say be suffered properly and immediatly in his Soule The best part of your defence resteth on As and As it were and you take it for fome ââ¦ine tricke to face out your Reader with an As but where before you committed one absurditie now with helping that you incurre twaine For still you make one and the same fuffering proper to the soule and yet common to bodie and soule which in our countrey is a contrarietie notwithstanding your As and adding your As whereon you presume you now affirme that Gods wrath as Gods wrath must be suffered properly and immediatly in Christes soule and so the bodily sufferings of Christ by this latter resolution of yours were no part of Gods wrath as Gods wrath which is contrarie to your conclusion but the page before that all Christes afflictions small and great were the effects of Gods verie wrath and whatsoeuer Christ suffered was very wrath properly taken But you vnderstand suffering for discerning and so the soule onlie discerneth the wrath to be from God which the bodie suffereth Then by your vnderstanding Christes bodie suffered nothing at all because it discerned nothing at all and so Christ suffered nothing in his whole manhood which is contrarie to your maine assertion But heere you take suffering for sensitiue discerning which may be in the bodie through or from the soule If you may be suffered to leape to and fro with what significations of words you please to deuise you may reach what contrarieties you will for the principles of your faith and one As in the end shall mend all Were it worth the time or paines to oppose your trifling As I could aske you whether condemnation of sinne corruption of nature and infliction of death on the children of Infidels be no parts of Gods wrath as Gods wrath because they are not yet by age able to discerne the wrath of God or whether the curse which God layed on the earth and Christ on the figge tree were no curses because neither the earth nor the figge tree could discerne them But Gods intention maketh it wrath not mans discerning and in man it is wrath on either part bodie and soule though onlie the soule can discerne what and which is wrath from God As for the goodnesse of your reason if your say may stand for reason you haue sayd it indeed but any thing els that you proue there or elsewhere touching the proper wrath of God or the sufferings of Christes soule from the immediate hand of God truely I see not and that I likewise leaue as I do the rest to the Readers censure Hauing freed your selfe from contrarieties as your maner is with increasing them you hasten now to vnload your al surdities in which whatsoeuer I haue said I could thorowly fasten on you notwithstanding your new found shifts of directly and indirectly primarily and secundarily if it could stead Christs Church to haue your speeches proued absurd but because I seeke to mainteine the trueth of our redemption which is needfull for all men to know and not to publish your follies farder than the pride of your owne reasons compelled me as I shortly touched them at the first so will I now as shortly ouerrunne them to-let you see that I mistake not your words howsoeuer you will now amend them and not spend long time in displaying your ouersights which may be better bestowed about the matter itself You deny not your words that Christ assumed not our Nature nor any part of it but only to suffer in it properly and immediatly You would faine salue them if you could but how All men may see it to be manifest that heere you speake of Christes suffering for our redemption Why runne you then so vnaduisedly to his incarnation where Christ assumed our Nature and not in his passion Your meaning you say was no more bââ¦t to exclude that which I affirme that Christ tooke hiâ⦠humane soule to suffer in it only from and by the bodie Would you excuse your follies by belying my words Where do I affirme that Christ tooke his humane soule to suffer in it only from and by the bodie You talke of reasonable and iust aduersaââ¦ies what reason or iustice call you this to cite words in my name which I neuer spake nor wrote and so falsely to excuse your words by mine And yet there is good difference betweene these two sentences Christ tooke his humane soule to suffer in it only from the bodie and Christ assumed not our Nature nor any part of it but only to suffer in it properly and immediatly The first admitteth Christes sufferings as one respect why he tooke an humane soule which is verie true The other excludeth all other respects of taking bodie or soule saue only to suffer which is as false as the first is true That was not your meaning you wil say Then learne to ballance your words better before you so rashly powre them foorth and blame not your miââ¦ker who readeth the words but seeth not your meaning But come to your words affirmatiue since your negatiue are so farre out of square I grant Christ intended that his humane soule should suffer by Sympathie but yet this he intended not DIRECTLY nor PRIMARILY in taking two distinct parts of our humane nature our soule and our bodie You would seeme learned to the simple by your doughty distinctions of DIRECTLY and PRIMARILY and vnder this visard of empty words make them beleeue there lay some great mysteries But take backe your toyes wherein you put so much trust the Christian faith was preached written and receiued without these needlesse bon graces of direct and indirect primarie and secondariâ⦠they are but dennes of your deuices to lurke in Christ tooke our soule and our body vnto him purposely and fully to saue both which of the twaine hee meant directly and primarily to suffer in and which indirectly and secondarilâ⦠is a fruitlesse speculation of yours The Christian faith neither hath nor needeth any such questions For since man consisteth of both and without either can be no man the Sonne of God descending for vs and our saluation directly and primarily purposed to sane and suffer in both And because the body being made of earth was the weaker and baââ¦r part of man the soule in will and reason though not in power and lââ¦ght as yet drawing neere to the Angels of God and by
The sufferings which he receiued in his body were all vniust and violent proceeding from others that wickedly persued and oppressed him though in all his afflictions he beheld with his minde and with his will obeyed the hand and Counsell of God thus by the malice and ignorance of his enemies fulfilling those things which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his Prophets that Christ should suffer So that Christes obedience and patience in all his persecutions came from the same inward powers and graces of his soule from which all his actions did though the wrongs and violences were first offered his body by the wicked In his inward affections and passions of feare griefe and sorrow his minde was the first apprehender of the causes that mooued them and his will the admitter of them But as in all his actions he was holy and iust so in all his affections and inward passions were they neuer so grieuous vnto him he was not only righteous and innocent but religious and patient and other passions of the soule in Christ the Scripture knoweth none As for your suffering of hell paines in the soule of Christ properly from the immediate hand of God it is a deuice proper and immediate to your selfe which you would faine bring in as an other and chiefe meane of our redemption besides that which the Scripture speaketh of Christes sufferings Wherein you must pardon me and all true beleeuers for not accepting your fansies as any parts of our faith We reade that God is the Father of mercies that he is the tormentor of soules in hell with his immediate hand wee doe not reade much lesse that hee ââ¦o tormented the soule of his Sonne in the time of his passion which is the maine plat of your new found hell The iudge shall say Depart from me yee cursed into euerlasting fire prepared for the diuell and his Angels Which fire we confesse is created and established by the might power and hand of God as a meane to torment the damned both men and Angels according to their deserts but that this fire is nothing else but the immediate hand of God tormenting the wicked spirits in hell as it did the soule of his owne Sonne on the Crosse I take either of these assertions not to dissemble with you to bee a grosse and palpable error strange to the Scriptures and strange to the whole Church of God before these our dayes wherein some make it their glorie rather newly to inuent then rightly to beleeue what the Scriptures deliuer and the Church of Christ from the beginning receiued and reuerenced as principles of Christian truth and pietie The next point to wit that by your new found Rules you make Christes flesh needlesse to our redemption you graunt is an horrible heresie but you aske how it followeth vpon your words I did not charge you with maintaining purposely that wicked heresie but with reasoning so foolishly speaking so vnaduisedly that without your direct meaning that error was consequent to your words You would faine see how Truely it followeth stronger vpon your words then I would wish or you are ware For whatsoeuer was by Gods ordinance needfull to the worke of our redemption that made properly to our redemption But the sufferings of Christs soule by or from the body which you call by Simpathy did not make properly to our Redemption as you say ergo the sufferings of Christs Soule by or from his body were not needfull to the worke of our Redemption Now if the sufferings of Christs flesh were not needfull to our Redemption then was his flesh needelesse for our Redemption by your illation Which of these propositions can you auoyd but they are either plainly true as the Maior or fully yours as all the rest Our Redemption being no naturall thing but wholy depending on the counsell and will of God whatsoeuer God appointed as necessary for our Redemption that most properly made to our Redemption and things needlesse could not appertaine thereto but improperly Of all men you may not start from this force of the word PROPER For with you improper wrath is no wrath improper punishment is no punishment and therefore improper belonging to our Redemption is no belonging at all but needlesse to our Redemption And since Christs sufferings in his body by your assertion did not make properly to our Redemption it is euident they were needlesse to our Redemption and if the sufferings of his flesh were needlesse the flesh it selfe was needlesse to our Redemption euen by your owne Conclusions For Christ you say assumed not our Nature nor any part of it but onely to suffer in it properly and immediatly euen for the very purchasing our Redemption therebyOtherwise he had NO NEEDE to assume both but either the one part or the other You heare your owne Doctrine that except Christ suffered properly and immediatly in either part of our nature for the purchasing of our Redemption thereby he had NO NEEDE to assume both But Christ suffered not properly and immediatly in his flesh for the purchasing of our Redemption thereby if your words be true that bodily sufferings properly made not to our Redemption He had no neede therefore to assume flesh in which he suffered nothing that properly made to our Redemption Here are the Cart-ropes of your owne collections the sequels whereof if you deny you must recall your owne answers and arguments so peremptorily pronounced in your Treatise How false your Resolutions are and how dissonant from the sacred Scriptures will easily appeare to him that hath but halfe an eye For the sufferings of Christs body were not decreed by God to make no more to our Redemption then Christs hunger or his sleepe which are your Resemblances but they were directly intended by God himselfe in Christs incarnation and expresly foreshewed by the mouthes of his Prophets and necessarily to be borne in the body of Christ before we could be redeemed in respect of Gods will so setled and reuealed The Apostle to the Hebrewes going about to prooue that Christ was to offer his body and shed his bloud for our sanctification and Redemption layeth this for the ground Euery high Priest is ordained to offer gifts and Sacrifices Wherefore it was of NECESSITIE that this Man Christ should haue somewhat to offer For else he were not a Priest And concluding what must be offered Christ saith he being an high Priest of good things to come by his owne bloud entred in once into the holy place and found eternall Redemption for vs. Wherefore when Christ commeth into the world he saith Sacrifice and offering which are offered by the Law thou wouldest not but a body hast thou ordained me then said I Loe I come to doe thy will O God By the which will we are sanctified euen by the offering of the body of Iesus Christ once The suffering of Christs body and shedding of his blood were
conceale it and onely skirre at it here and there in SOME KIND OF SENSE Otherwise you offer nothing as yet to the Reader but the proper sufferings of the soule which I trust are not alwaies priuation of grace and exclusion from blisse For so the faithfull should neuer haue any proper sufferings of the Soule or else vtterly loose both the spirit and fauour of God which they neuer doe The other Authoritie which I cite In the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt die the death is not so sound you thinke For am I sure that death here is but the bodyly death onely and no more I no where say that death threatned in these words was onely the death of the body it is one of your rash and rude illations it is none of my assertions I knew that God gaue this Commandement and threatned this punishment as well to Adams posteritie as to his person Otherwise had this prohibition beene made to Adam alone neither could the woman haue beene within the compasse of it who was not then created when this precept was inioyned neither could Adams of-spring haue tasted of death as well as Adam if this penaltie had stretched no farder then to Adams person But he being the roote and stocke of all mankind as he receaued blessings by his creation which should be common to all that descended of him so by his transgression he lost them as well from his Issue as from himselfe and subiected them to the same death and condemnation that he did him selfe when he rebelled against God his Creator Death we see executed on all the children of Adam and therefore we may not doubt but death was threatned to them all before it was inflicted on them Howbeit the commination in this place is like to Gods thââ¦eats in all other places against the transgââ¦ssours of his Law It denounceth what shall ââ¦e due vnto all but it bindeth not God that he shall not haue power to release or mitigate what and to whom pleaseth him In death then here threatned I containe all kinds of death corporall spirituall and eternall either as expressed in the generall name of death which is common to them all or as consequent ech to other and coherent if by Gods goodnes and mercies in Christ Iesus they be not seuered Saint Austen learnedly and truely teacheth the same When it is asked what death God threatned to the first men if they transgressed the Commandement giuen them whether the death of the body or of the soule or of the whole man or that which is called the second death we must answere ALI When therefore God said to the first man what day soeuer yee eate thereof yee shall die the death that threatning contained what soeuer death there is euen vnto the last which is called the second death and after which there is none other If any man stand more strictly on the time and kinde of death when and which Adam should die by this Commination Saint Austen hath an other answere In that which was said yee shall die the death because it was not said deaths if we vnderstand that onely death whereby the soule is forsaken of her life which to her is God for she was not forsaken that she might forsake but she did first forsake that she might after be forsaken though I say we vnderstand that God denounceth this death when he said what day yee eate thereof yee shall die the death as if God had said what day yee forsake me by disobedience I will forsake you by iustice Surely in that death were the rest denounced which without Question were to follow For euen in that a disobedient motion rose in the flesh of the Soule disobeying for which they couered their priuie parts one death was perceaued wherein God forsooke the Soule And when the Soule forsooke the body now corrupted with time and wasted with age an other death was found by experience which God mentioned to Man when punishing sinne he said earth thou art and to earth shalt thou returne that by these two deaths that first death of the whole man might be accomplished which the second death at last doth follow except man be deliuered by the grace of God By Saint Austens iudgement concording with the Scriptures God threatned all kinds of death to the transgressor the death of the Soule the same houre to take place that he disobeyed the rest to follow in their order as next the death of the body and at last eternall death of body and soule if the grace of God by Iesus Christ did not release and free man from it That the death of the Soule tooke present hold vpon the disobeyers the Scripture giueth testimony sufficient when it noteth their shame feare and flight of Gods presence who before sinne was their delight ioy and blisse The death of the body was a long time differred in Adam euen nine hundred and thirtie yeeres before it did separate his Soule from his Body but it began presently to worke and shew his force in either of their bodies The sentence of mortalitie God called Death saith Theodoret. For after Gods sentence Adam euerie day expected or feared Death Beda saith the like That which God said In what day soeuer thou shalt eate thereof thou shalt die the Death was as if he had said Morti deputatus eris thou shalt be deputed or adiudged to death not that he should that very day die but be mortall Chrysostom imbraceth the same opinion In what dââ¦y soeuer yee shall eate of the tree yee shall die the Death But Adam liued still how then died he By the sentence of God and the nature of the thing it selfe For he that maketh him selfe subiect to punishment is vnder punââ¦shment sinonre tamen sententia If not by deede and execution yet by guiltinesse and sentence pronounced So that if we will rightly conceiue Gods commination to Adam we must so take the words of God as threatning Adam and his posteritie with all kinds of death to which they all should bee subiect as guiltie thereof and deseruing the same though hee would keepe to himselfe the dispencing and moderating thereof not binding himselââ¦e thereby but the offenders as euery supreame Iudge doth on earth after sentence giuen and before execution finished Else if wee ââ¦e God who is trueth it selfe to the rigour and tenor of those words without reseruing power to him to dispose of Adam and Adams of-spring at his pleasure and in the words Thou shalt die the death comprise the execution of all sorts of death which can not be reuoked then we conclude Adam and all his issue without remedie or mercie vnder all sorts of death that is vnder spirituall corporall and eternal death which is not onely an vtter ouerthrow to all Christian ââ¦eligion promising saluation in Iesus Christ but a mecre madnesse against all mankind deuoting them without exception or mitigation to eternall
with both parts as well with bodie as with soule and so Christ if your proportion were any thing needfull which I wholly reiect as needlesse in the Sonne of God by this reason of yours needed no proper sufferings of the soule without and besides the bodie Paul vnderstoode Rom. 7. vers 7. when hee became a Christian that the desiring of euill is sinne before the outward act bee consummate You alleage Saint Paul as you doe the rest for matters that he neuer meant Paul speaketh not there of the actuall desire of euill when the will hath thereto consented such as was in Adam when hee resolued to eate the forbidden fruite but of the naturall inclination and first motions to sinne which are in vs after Adams disobedience but were not in him before his fall For that precept thou shalt not lust conuinceth and condemneth our nature to be corrupt and sinfull to which originall concupiscence the roote and spring of all sinne in vs cleaueth so fast that euen in our cradles this corruption excludeth vs from the kingdome of God if we be not regenerate in Christ by water and the holy Ghost In Adam besore sinne there was no such thing his nature was vpright and sincere as it was first created and voide of all concupiscence intended by this precept as the best learned of our time teach till by his transgression sinne entred and infected both body and soule Neither doe you conceiue right of Paul as he was a Pharisee when you suppose he tooke the outward fact of sinne onely to bee sinne Neuer read he thinke you when he was a Pharisee the words of Esay Aram hath taken wicked counsell against thee but it shall not stand Nor of Salomon The thoughts of the wicked are an abomination to the Lord and the euill thought of a foole is sinne Could hee not tell what to iudge of Hamans thoughts against the Iewes or of Achitophels purpose against Dauid or of Balams counsell against the Israelites The very heathen Philosophers placed vertues and vices in the minds of men and the prophane Poets would haue mens enterprises measured by the intent not by the euent The Pharisees were neuer so blinde as to thinke all counsels thoughts desires and lusts to bee lawfull against the manifest and expresse words of the law and Prophets but they blindly mistooke the law of God as forbidding externall facts onely which are hurtfull to others vpon paine of malediction and damnation They rather stood vpon the Popish opinion of veniall and mortall sinnes and did not thinke that veniall sinnes did exclude them from the righteousnesse of the Law nor from the kingdome of heauen Of that opinion was Paul when he was a Pharisee but vpon his conuersion and better instruction by the spirit of Christ hee vnderstoode that not onely euill desires and thoughts were forbidden by the seueral precepts of Gods law as deadly sinnes which the Pharisees would not admit to vphold their owne righteousnesse but that euen the secret tentation to sinne and the inward propension and corruption of our hearts are interdicted and condemned by this precept thou shalt not lust as sinne sufficient to exclude vs from the kingdome of God Your doctrine is very strange where you teach that the soule properly committeth no sin but by with the body that is the soule in it selfe by it selfe alone sinneth not You say all prouocations and pleasures of sin the soule taketh from her body all acts of sin she committeth by her body which speeches are exceeding vntrue and hurtfull To him that either fully can not or rightly will not vnderstand what is said all things seeme strange otherwise set aside your olde ordinarie phrases of proper and meere without which you can say nothing and the matter which you so much maruaileat is very plaine as well by the rules of Scripture as proofes of nature Is it so strange a doctrine with you that the whole man and not this or that part of man is by the word of God charged with the committing of euery sinne and guiltie thereof in such sort that the whole person is defiled therewith and shal be condemned therefore Depart from me Lord saith Peter to Christ for I am a sinfull man Blessed is the man saith Dauid to whom the Lord imputeth no sinne O God be mercifull vnto me a sinner saith the Publicane Tribulation and anguish vpon the soule of euery man that worketh euill saith the Apostle By which as by infinite other places of Scripture wee are taught that the whole person which is man himselfe is the sinner by which part so euer he sinneth Euery one that committeth sinne is the seruant of sinne saith our Sauiour Can the soule be in bondage for sinne and the body bee free Cursed is the man saith Moses that keepeth not all the words of the law to doe them Can the soule bee accursed for sinning and the body be blessed as not sinning The wages of sinne is death saith the Apostle Shall death preuaile against the Soule for sin and the Body escape death as voyd of sinne Surely no. Sinne defileth the whole Man by what part soeuer it is committed yea the very thoughts of the hart coinquinate the whole man When the Pharisees held opinion that meate eaten with vnwashen hands defiled the Body our Sauiour reprooueth that error in them and teacheth his Disciples that nothing without a man can defile him when it entreth into him but the things which come foorth of him are they that defile the Man For from within out of the hart of Man come foorth euill thoughts couetousnesse wantonnesse a wicked eye pride foolishness All these euils come from within and defile a Man Where we see that enuie which Christ noteth by a wicked eye and pride and such like inward sinnes yea and euill thoughts defile the Man that is as well the Body which the Pharisees tooke to be defiled with vncleane hands as the Soule The Apostle stretcheth the infection of sinne farder euen to the meates them selues that are eaten of the wicked All things saith he speaking of meates which the Iewes counted vncleane are cleane to the cleane but to the vncleane and vnbeleeuers nothing is cleane but euen their minde and conscience is vncleane So that the vncleannesse of the inward Man defileth the outward Man and all things which the outward Man vseth This is so true that not onely the guiltinesse and filthinesse of sinne is in this life communicated from the Soule to the Body but both shal be therefore condemned in the righteous iudgement of God to euerlasting fire We must all appeare before the tribunal of Christ euery man to receiue the things done by his Body Where all sorts of sinnes in thought word or deede are by the Apostle called ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã or as others read ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã things done
times ouercame me When I repressed him I afflicted my selfe for I receiued backe the griefe when I cherished him I was impugned by him enduring his wanton assaults Therefore assigne not me alone to punishment ó Lord but either free me together with the bodie from these straits or cast that together with me into torment Howbeit the Iudge needeth no such supplication but as he gouerneth wisely so he iudgeth iustly restoring the bodie to their soules and so giuing to euerie one according to their deserts Damascene alledgeth the coniunction of the soule with the bodie and the cooperation of both in all vertues and vices as causes sufficient why the bodie must be iudged and rewarded together with the soule If the soule alone sustained the trials of vertue alone shall she be crowned and if she alone were intangled with pleasures iustly she alone must be punished ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã but because she had no seuerall being from the bodie neither passed thorowe vertue or vice without the bodie iustly shall both together receiue rewâ⦠of good or bad For the better conceiuing the trueth of these speeches we must know what these Fathers meane by the bodie and what powers and faculties of man they comprise in that name and why so shall wee the sooner discerne what cooperation in sinne mans bodie hath with his soule The bodie as it is the instrument or seruant of the soule to do good or euill is no dead nor senselesse lumpe of flesh but hath annexed vnto it besides life both sense and motion and those as well inward as outward For externall and internall sense and motion are not only performed by vitall and animall spirits which are plainly corporall though their vigor and force be from the soule which bringeth life and sense but so affixed to the bodie that they die with the bodie and are not found in the soule so long as she is separated from the bodie Those faculties these Fathers ascribe the rather to the flesh because in some sort they be in beasts who in their kinde haue sense and motion both outward and inward and sensitiue desires and affections depending thereon which all must needs be corporall for that brute beasts ledde only by sense to desire and delight in things present before them haue no spirituall nor immortall part from which they should proceed The same powers of sense and sensitiue appetites and affections in mans bodie these learned Fathers account and call corporall not that they discerne or moue without the soule but that the sensitiue and inferiour powers of the soule are mixed with corporal spirits in man and by them apprehend and desire externall sensible things by which corruption of senses and affections the soule is drawen to diuers delights and desires that are continuall occasions and inducements to sinnes Therefore Theodoret nameth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã the desires affections assaults and conflicts of the bodie seeking by pleasures and sundrie lusts to conquer the soule Neither want they the warrant of holy Scripture in so speaking Let not sinne reigne in your mortall bodies sayth Paul to obey it in the lusts thereof neither giue your members to be weapons of vnrighteousnesse vnto sinne So that the members of our mortall bodie are called by the Apostle the weapons of vnrighteousnesse by which sinne fighteth against the soule Whence are warres and strifes in you sayth Iames not hence euen from the pleasures which fight in your members Abstaine sayth Peter from carnall desires which fight against the soule I delight in the law of God sayth Paul according to the inward man but I see another law in my members fighting against the law of my minde and leading me captiue to the law of sinne which is in my members O wretched man that I am who shall deliuer me from the bodie of this death Where the inward man which is the mind lightned and the will directed by grace is diuided against the outward man which must nââ¦eds be the inferior powers of the soules ioyned with the parts and spi it s of the bodie wherâ⦠and whereby sinne still dwelling in our earthly aud irregenerate members iusteth agaââ¦nst the spirit and striueth against the minde which Peter calleth fighting against the soule To strengthen this doctrine which you thinke so strange it shall not be amisse to consider somewhat further what communion the soule hath with the bodie that thereby we may perceiue what vse the soule hath of her bodie in well or euill doing The habitation of the soule in the bodie and her coniunction with the bodie making one man of two contrarie parts mortall and immortall visible and inuisible reasonable and vnreasonable is so wonderfull a worke of God that the manner thereof wholly pasââ¦eth our vnderstanding onely by consequents and effects wee gather what she vseth in the bodie what she perceiueth by the bodie and what she imparteth to the bodie Howbeit her habitation in the bodie and vnion with the bodie composing one person of both called man is sufficient by the Scriptures if we knew no more of the communion that is betwixt them to make both parts guiltie of all sinne committed and liable to the punishment thereof both in this world and in the next And so much the Scriptures teach vs when they require confession of our sinnes or promise remission of our sinnes or threaten vengeance for our vnrighteousnesse wherein the bodie is not seuered nor excepted from the soule but both are conââ¦oyned in one person to whom and euery part of whom either mercie is afforded vnto saluation or iustice awarded vnto damnation And yet because the communion which is betwixt the soule and bodie will giue vs some light how the soule vseth the helpe of her bodie in accomplishing her actions I may not omit to speake thereof though happily it will be somewhat obscure to the simple and more remote from their vnderstanding then in this case I could wish As man was ordained of God to haue in him the seuerall operations of life of sense of reason so was the soule created with three diuerse faculties answerable to those three functions to wit with a vitall or vegetatiue for the first with a sensitiue and motiue for the second with a reasonable or intellectiue for the third The vitall facultie prouided for the quickning nourishing increasing and preseruing of the bodie in moderate strength to the discharge of our dueties to God and our neighbour is so fastned to the bodie that without the bodie it hath neither vse nor action The second facultie called sensitiue was giuen of purpose to the soule not onely to perceiue by sense the natures helpes and vses of all externall and sensible things and by voluntarie motion to pursue that which was profitable for vs but chiefly that by seeing the workes hearing the words of God we should come to the knowledge of his will and open our lippes to praise his name and to
himselfe you make him say the soule is sufficient by it selfe to do the lesse for it is able of it selfe only to thinke to will to desire to dispose Where the word solummodo ONLY which is added to the Verbes following you cut from them with a point and ioyne it to the Pronoune precedent saying it is able of it selfe only meaning without the body thereby to exclude the bodie from all communion and impression of the thoughts which Tertullian before did impart to the bodie And thus by wresting Tertullians words you make him cââ¦ntrarie to himselfe because he should not seeme contrarie to you which is the couââ¦se of your vnlearned skill vsed euery where by you when any thing standeth in your way Otherwise Tertullians words are plaine enough after his maner and no way repugnant to that which went before but haue in them rather an exposition what seruice and subââ¦ction the bodie yeeldeth to the soule in sinne without which the soule can accomplish no sinne For though desire cogitation and will are in the soulâ⦠as her owne and come from the soule to begin euery sinne yet she can perfâ⦠no sinne without her bodie Likewiâ⦠your colââ¦ection out of Tertullian that the soule now without the flesh receiuââ¦th iââ¦gement for such actions as of it selfe it was sufficient to doe hath neither any trueth in it nor concordance with your authors sense or words for Tertullian confidently pronounceth that the iudgement of God must be beleeued to be FVLL FINALI and PERPETVALL none of which agree to the iudgement that you pretend for the actions of the soule alone without the bodie It is NOT FVLL because the one halfe of man is absent it is NOT FINALL because an other iudgement and sentence shall follow after it is NOT PERPETVALL because it dureth but till the resurrection when both soule and bodie shall be cast into euerlasting fire it is NOT GENERALL because such of the wicked as liue when Christ shall come to iudge the quicke and dead shall not haue their soules punished apart from their bodies This doctrine therefore is verie false that sinnes mââ¦erely spirituall as you terme them namely Heresies Turcisme and Atheisme shall not be punished in or after the last iudgement when the bodie shall be reunited to the Soule because their punishment the soule alone must suffer since she alone committed them as you say without any consent or communion of her bodie Neither doth Tertullian call this punishment of the soule without the bodie simplie or absolutely IVDGEMENT but the TASTE or SHEVV of iudgement Hilarie saith rightly of it The day of iudgement is the repaying of eternall ioy or paine The time of death in the meane space hath euery one tied to his state dum ad iudicium vnumquemque aut Abraham reseruat aut poena Whiles either Paradise or punishment keepeth euery man for iudgement So Tertullian Cur non putes animam puniri foueri in inferis sub expectatione vtriusque iudicij in quadam vsurpatione candida eius Why shouldest thou not thinke the Soule to be comforted and punished below in the earth vnder the expectation of either iudgement of eternall happinesse or cursednesse in a kind of vsurping and foreshewing thereof That Tertullian here calleth degustans iudicium a foretasting of iudgement but no full finall perpetuall or generall sentence which are the properties of Gods iust iudgement against all sinnes of thoughts words or deeds Tertullian confesseth that the Soule doth not diuide all her works with the ministerie of the flesh and that the Diuine censure doth pursue the onely thoughts and bare Wills of men And therefore he saith Sensus delictorum etiam sine affectibus imputari solent anime The very purposes or desires of sinne without their effects are imputed vnto the Soule When Tertullian speaketh of sinne committed by the Soule alone without the Body or the helpe thereof he meaneth without any EXTERNALL PART of the Bodie concurring thereto as in outward facts when hands or feete or other members of the Body are imployed to bring the sinne to a sensible act and effect Take his owne example in both these places Qui viderit ad concupiscendum iam adulterauit in corde He that seeth a woman to desire her hath committed adulterie in his hart Is any man so childish as to thinke the Soule can see or desire a woman without corporall sense or concupiscence There is then in that case plainly the concurrence of the eyes and affections which are bodily but yet because the Act is not accomplished the sinne remayneth in the hart alone and proceedeth not vnto the DEEDE And so diuiding sinnes into thoughts words and deeds as Saint Austen and other Diuines doe when words and deeds are forborne they often say that men sinne in thoughts alone but this doth not exclude the inward coniunction and communion of the Soule with the Body in sinne which is denied to be corporall because it is not open to the sense Notwithstanding the powers of the Soule vsed therein are permixed with the spirits of the Body which are corporall in comparison of the Soule though spirituall in respect of the grossenes of the flesh in that they are aeriall and approch the nature and purenes of ayre to which the word spirit is vsually applyed So that the diuerse taking of the Body sometimes for the outward masse of flesh subiected to sense sometimes for the inward powers of life and sense tempered with the body causeth this difference of speech in Tertullian and the rest of the fathers who all concurre in this that except the body haue life and sense the Soule can commit no actuall sinne For we must not onely be liuing but awaked and aduised before wee can voluntarily runne into sinne Of sleepe which bereaueth vs of sense I haue spoken before of death which taketh life from vs it is also certaine that thereby sinne ceaseth in vs. He that is dead is freed from sinne saith the Apostle that is sinneth no more so Chrysostome expoundeth it ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã He that is dead is deliuered from sinning any more And Ierom. Mortuus omnino non peccat The dead doth by no meanes sinne Ambrose Impius si moriatur peccare desinit The wicked when he dieth ceaseth to sinne Epiphanius In the next world after a man is dead there is no righteousnesse nor repentance ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã nor any workes of sinne For as Hilarie obserueth Decedentes de vita simul de iure decedimus voluntatis When we depart this life we are withall cut off from all libertie of Will Theophylact. The Apostle speaketh thus of euery man For he that is departed from this life is iustified from sinne to wit he is loosed and deliuered from it Our new writers affirme no lesse Bullinger This is a generall Rule the dead doth not sinne at all yea he
the English Translation to be openly reade in the Church confirmeth not the Marginall appositions which may not be read in the Church though they may be receiued so farre as they haue manifest coherence with the Text or consequence from the Text in respect rather of their veritie then Authoritie For these notes at first were not affixed and in sundry editions they haue been altered increased as the Corrector liked euen this note which you alleage somewhat differeth from the Geneuian notes whence this and the most of the rest were taken The words of the Geneuian edition vpon this place are these The word Agonie signifieth that horror that Christ had conceaued not onely for feare of death but of his Fathers Iudgement and wrath against sinne The Printer of the great English Bible or his Corrector ouer against those words of the Text he was in an Agonie setteth this obseruation in the Margine He felt the horror of Gods wrath and iudgement against sinne I refuse not those words as if they gainsaid the Doctrine which I defend but I see no farder ground in them then ghesse when they ayme at the cause of Christs Agonie which the Scripture suppresseth Howbeit let the words stand in their full strength though by no meanes I acknowledge either Authentike or publike Authoritie in them they rather euert then support your opinion The vttermost here ascribed to Christ is HORROR that is a shaking or trembling feare of Gods Iudgement and wrath against sinne which all the godly finde in them selues when they enter into the serious cogitation of Gods holinesse displeased and his Iustice prouoked with their sinnes but this is farre from the death or paines of the damned except you make the vengeance of the Reprobate all one with the repentance of the faithfull This therefore is like the rest of your proofes no way tending to your purpose The feare of Gods wrath against sinne which is common to all the godly in this life though not at all times hath no fellowship with the feare of the Reprobate much lesse with the torments of the damned The one is a religious and godly sorrow for sinne which worketh saluation and yet agniseth with feare and trembling the iustnesse and greatnesse of Gods wrath against sinne the other is the beholding of the terrible and eternall destruction of Body and Soule prepared for them without all hope of ease or end In Christ there might be a double cause of this horror conceaued or felt by him as affections are felt in the Nature of Man the one touching vs the other touching himselfe Christ might tremble and shake at the terror of Gods Iudgement prouided for vs which was euerlasting damnation of Body and Soule in hell fire and the more tenderly he loued vs the greater was his horror to see this hang ouer our heads euen as we naturally tremble to see the desperate daungers of our dearest friends present before our eyes And if Paul said truely of him selfe we knowing the terror of the Lord meaning the terror of the Lords Iudgement against sinne how much more then did the Sauiour of the world know the same the cleare beholding of which might iustly worke in him a manifest horror to teach vs to take heede of that terrible Iudgement at the sight whereof for our sakes he did tremble in the daies of his flesh An other cause of that horror might concerne himselfe For since the wrath and Iudgement of God against our sinne was so terrible to behold that Christ in his humane nature trembled at it how could it but raise an horror in him to know that he must presently receiue in his owne Body the burthen thereof and make satisfaction therefore with his owne smart which how farre it would pearce his patience the weakenes of our flesh in him might well feare and tremble though his spirit were neuer so resolute and ready to endure the most that mans nature in this life could sustaine with obedience and confidence So that either the sight of Gods wrath against sinne due to vs or the satisfaction of the same which Christ was to make might vrge his humane nature to that feare and trembling for the time which these notes obserue and yet neither of these come neere the feare of the wicked or paines of the damned Besides that religious horror and feare is nothing lesse then the paines of hell inflicted on the Soule by the immediate hand of God which is the deuice that you seeke to establish Thus my Text of Scripture is also iustified that Christ gaue himselfe the price of Redemption for vs WHICH ELS VVE SHOVLD HAVE PAYD If wresting adding and altering may be called iustifying then is your sense of that text iustified indeed otherwise there is nothing yet alleadged that any way approueth that meaning of the text which you would inforce The price of our redemption Christ payd not the same which els we should haue payd had we not beene redeemed for so Christ must haue suffered euerlasting damnation of bodie and soule which was the payment exacted of vs but he payd a PRICE for vs that more contented his displeased Father than our euerlasting destruction could haue done You dallie therefore with the doubtfulnesse of the word PAYD which sometimes signifieth the enduring of punishment sometimes the yeelding of recompence The Price of our sinnes which we should haue payd that is the punishment of our sinnes which we should haue susteined was eternall destruction of bodie and soule in hell fire and other payment we could make none This payment due to vs or punishment which we should haue payd the person of Christ could not suffer it is most horrible blasphemy so to speake or thinke but he payd a price for vs that is a SATISFACTION and AMENDS for our sinnes which by no meanes we were able to pay And so much the word ANTILYTRON noteth euen a Price Recompence or Ransome in exchange of the punishment or imprisonment which the captiue should suffer This Price you will say was himselfe I make no doubt that Christ gaue himselfe to die but NOT TO BE DAMNED for our sinnes as we should haue beene Neither can the common custome of redeeming captiues inferre any more than the giuing of a price for the Prisoner And therefore I did iustly aske Who told you that the Scripture here speaketh after the common vse of redeeming Captiues taken in warre And where you answere the nature of the word ANTILYTRON importeth so much which is properly vsed in such cases you vndestand neither the nature of the word neither the maner of our redemption rightly For first the word ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã whence Antilytron commeth properly signifieth a mutuall redemption of ech other as Aristotle obserueth and so we should redeeme Christ as he redeemed vs. Wherefore the word is heere improperly taken and signifieth no more than LYTRON without composition Againe the common vse of
mans cause Hauing made so foule a shipwracke of your owne cause as to be forced to confesse that Christ did not suffer the whole curse of the Law which before you stifly affirmed to recouer some part of your losses you spurne at my speeches as hauing neither trueth nor colour but report them right and spare them not which I doubt you will not doe because you make your entrance with so false a colour For I no where make the curse which senselesse creatures beare like to the curse which Christ suffered for vs. Let the pages which you cite 262 263 in Gods name be seene but speaking of Gods curse against the sinne of man I sayd that not onely the bodies and soules of the wicked were cursed and consumed with plagues resting in them and on them but all that they tooke in hand and all that belonged to them was likewise accursed And citing the 28. of Deuteronomie wherein a Calender of curses is denounced by the law against sinners I added that Chapter perused would easily shew how farre the curse of God in this life persueth sinners besides the horrible torments of the next life kept in store for them So that I did not there compare or liken the curse of God on senselesse creatures to the curse which Christ tasted for vs as your idle imagination apprehendeth but I shewed how farre the curse of the Law extended and thence inferred that if Christ did not suffer all the things there mentioned he did not suffer all the parts of Gods curse in this life besides the graund curse that closeth vp all and continueth for euer Depart from mee yee CVRSED into euerlasting fire You close your eyes against the force of my reason which is euident and prie for that which is not there and when you finde it not you patch out this point with plaine vntrueth as if I made Christ and the senselesse creatures like in the curses which they suffered You make a reason to proue that hanging on a tree mentioned in Moses is not all one with this curse of the Law in Paul Neither did I nor doe I say that it was all one This I sayd and still say they were both of one and the same nature You take great pride in pouncing of proper speeches wherein you would shew your wit by wresting them to what please you A reason I made which for ought I see you do not vnderstand howsoeuer you play your part with my words which is neither to confute them nor conceiue them rightly but all is one with you so you say somewhat you care not how vnlound it be I obserued in my Conclusion that S. Paul in his Epistle to the Galatians cap. â⦠alleadged two kindes of curses out of Moses the one pertaining to the committing sinne the other to the suffering punishment for sinne Accursed is euerie one that abideth not in all things written in the booke of the Law TO DO THEM Here is the curse of doing euill to which all men are subiect immediatly vpon the fact not ten or twentie yeeres after when happily God ariseth to visit their sinnes and therefore this importeth not only a desert of future vengeance but the present detestation which God hath both of the deed which is euill and of the doer who is wicked An other kinde of curse the Apostle noteth out of Moses which is to hang on a tree Cursed is euerie one that hangeth on a tree Heere is a curse in suffering euill whereof the former is the cause for by Gods law no man should suffer euill but he that doth euill You in a iollity to aduantage your cause would needs pronounce it were vaine and senselesse to thinke the Apostle here spake of two seuerall kinds of curses taxing in your huffe not onely Chrysostome who expresly teacheth it was another curse and not the same but euen the Trueth it selfe to be vaine and senselesse which euidently conuinceth the one to be in nature very much different from the other For the detestation which God hath of sinne assoone as it is committed whereby he reiecteth the deed as repugnant to his holinesse and hateth the doer euen before punishment is a plaine distinct thing from the vengeance that is consequent and agreeable to Gods iustice Much more then doth it differ from the iudiciall punishments of men whereto Moses pointeth when he speaketh of hanging which though they haue a dependance vpon Gods will and law so farre as they follow the same yet must they differ as much as the persons punishments and powers of God and man doe Cursed sayth Moses is euerie one that abideth not in all things written in the booke of the Law This curse is present vpon ech sinne and generall to all the wicked in the middest of their greatest prosperity and securitie The punishment due to sinne is not so that is deferred till God see his time and then most dreadfull when men can not commit new sinnes as after this life Wherefore as all creatures reuenge mans sinne and yet are not all of one nature though in that seruice to God they alâ⦠agree so the plagues and curses of sinne be not of one nature notwithstanding they be powred on men to punish their offences I meane they are both of one and the same Nature that is true and proper curses of God Well crowed yet before your courage come downe Shall all things that proceed from one cause or that haue one generall wherein they agree be all of one and the same nature Then men and mise be of the same nature for they are both liuing creatures Then angels and andierns starres and strawes and all things created haue the same nature because they are all the works of God Then vices and vertues and all contraries be of one and the same nature in as much as they are inherent in one subiect and destruent ech to other And to go no farther then your owne example then hunger and hell fire are both of the same nature because they both are true and proper curses of God vpon the wicked Be they great or litle you will say they are all punishments So the rest are all the works of Gods hands and yet were it mad-merie Diuinitie to say they are all of one and the same nature The fruit of the bodie of the ground of cattell kine and sheepe are the blessings of God and promised to the obseruers of his LAw and yet I trust they be not of one and the same nature with the ioyes of heauen though little and great they be promises and rewards of obedience One was the whole the other a part but both of them the true and proper curses of God The one is the cause the other is the consequent or effect but not a necessarie much lesse an essentiall part of the other For a man may bee truely accursed and yet not
a true and corporall punishment appointed by God for sinne though mans error inflict it on innocents or true repentance abolish the rest that would follow after this life if God were not reconciled vnto vs. In the wicked then which persist in their mischieuous purposes without repentance your reason taketh place that hanging to them is a part of that true and terrible curse the whole whereof shall be executed on them for their sinnes but in repentants it is starke false and in Christ of whom this question riseth it is irreligious and impious to say that he suffered the whole curse of the Law prouided for sinne or the death of the soule and of the damned which is properly due to sinners Now vnderstand Chrysostome thus as we before haue distinguished the punishment of Christ and of the damned and then we differ not Suppose Chrysostome to teach falsly and talke absurdly as you doe and then you may soone bring him to weare your badge but leaue him at libertie to tell his owne tale and hee is farre enough from your follies He sayth they were dââ¦erse curses in Christ and in the damned to signifie diuerse manners of one and the same curse in Nature He speaketh not of the damned at all he speaketh of the whole people of the Iewes which were vnder the curse of the Law for sinne till they were thence deliuered by Christ which the damned neuer were nor shall be His words are The people were in danger of another curse which saith Cursed is euery one which abideth not in the things written in the booke of the Law For not one of them had obserued the whole Law Christ then since he was not subiect to the curse of transgression admitted this curse to hang on the Crosse in steede of that to loose the people from their curse Chrysostome truely learnedly and consonantly to the rest of the ancient Fathers distinguisheth two kindes of EVILS or CVRSES incident to men which are sinne and the punishment of sinne The one is an vniust action pleasing man but displeasing God the other is a iust passion pleasing God but displeasing man Mala dicuntur Delicta Supplicia The OFFENCE and the REVENGE are both called ââ¦uils sayth Tertullian Duo sunt genera malorum peccatum poena peccati there are two sorts of Euils sayth Austen Sinne and the punishment of sinne For by Gods prouidence ruling all things as man doth the euill which he will so he suffereth the Euill which he will not Then sinne is not onely euill before it be punished but a greater euill then the punishment is since it is an euill in his owne nature repugnant to the righteousnesse of God Now as God is all good and therefore all blessed so sinne forsaking God falleth from goodnesse and so from blessednesse and is consequently more accursed with God then punishment is and ought so to be with men if they be rightly aduised as being the cause and continuance of their punishment For accursed signifieth as well detested and depriued of blessednesse as subiected to miserie or deuoted to destruction So that sinne in it selfe is a curse with God that is hated and detested of God and depriuing man of all communion and participation with the fountaine of blessednesse though no punishment did follow Yet because men would with neglect and despââ¦ght of God abide and reioyce in their wickednesse if sense of grieââ¦e and paine did not force them to feele theiâ⦠wretchednesse therefore the wisedome and iustice of God pursueth such as dwell and delight in their sinnes with sharpe and bitteâ⦠plagues that locââ¦ing on their miserie they may timely repent or eternally lament their obstinacie To these two kinds of curses Chrysostomes wordes and proofes doe leade The whole people were not damned as you deuoutly dââ¦eame but they had sinned and so were subiected to the danger of Gods displeasure foâ⦠sinne and of his indignation against sinne From this Christ was free for he did not sinne ãâã was guile found in his mââ¦uth as Chrysostom concludeth out of the Scriptures Since then Christ was not subiect to the curse of Transgression he admitted ââ¦other Curse euââ¦n the punishment of sinne which is a curse also for sinne though of an other Nature then the committing of sinne by one to dissolue the otheâ⦠that is by his owne paine to abolish the guilt of our sinne Chrysostomes woââ¦ds are as plââ¦ne as his proofes The curse of transgressing was another curse and not the ãâã which Christ suffered Yea Christ might not be subiected to that curse to which the people were for transgressing the law but changed that for another and so loosââ¦d their curse ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã another and not the same be as forciââ¦le woââ¦ds to shew different natures and persons as any the Greeke tongue hath and your shift of diââ¦erse degrees in the same nature is a childish toy since much and little like and vnlike sââ¦ew diuers degrees or measures in one nature but another and not the same thing directly noteth the substance or nature to be diuers Austen on whom you triumph is stretched beyond his meaning he deaââ¦eth against a Mainichââ¦e who denied that Christ had true human flesh Now he proueth that Christ truely died because the Apostle saith he was made a curse for vs in that he hanged on a Tree I haue cause to content my selfe that so leaââ¦ned and religious a Father as Saint Augustine was so highly reuerenced in the Church of God did more then twelue hundred yeers since in his conflicts with Hereticks refute the greatest part of your positions as repugnant to the faith of Christ and the soundnesse of the Sacred Scriptures And I thinke few men so foolish as in the grounds of our Redemption and saluation by Christ to reiect the Doctrine which he taught as false and receaue your scambling conceits as true And in my Iudgement you were best to take heed least if the resolutions which Saint Austen and other Catholike Fathers made against Heretickes disprooue your new found faith you be taken tardy with bringing Baggage into the Church of Christ long since condemned and banished from the Creede of all Christians What Saint Austen proueth you are no fit reporter except you did read more attentiuely and iudge more sincerely For did you euer peruse the words wrong course in so wise a Father if he meant purposely to prooue against the Manichees that Christ truely died for vs and not in shew onely as they supposed to ouerskip all the Testimonies and circumstances of Christs true death recorded in the Scriptures as his giuing vp the Ghost Pilates examining and the Centurions confessing the truth thereof as also the Souldiers perceiuing him alreadie dead and so not breaking his lââ¦gges but pearcing his side with a speare and the* gazing and watching of his ââ¦nemies and of the whole multitude ouer him
considerate Readers howsoeuer it may content you for the time But let vs heare the rest I answere it is not true which you say That Gods Law alloweth no Suertiââ¦s Vnderstanding here by Gods reuealed will and his most holy and gracious ordinance for vs. Though indeede this is not his Law properly but his Gospell You lacke here English as well as trueth except it be the Printers fault and not yours Vnderstanding here in your words hath nothing to follow it I thinke you would say Vnderstanding hâ⦠by Gods Law Gods reuealed will c. I neuer made doubt whether the Gospell proposed the wonderfull loue mercie good will and fauour of God the Sonne towards vs in offering himselfe to make the purgation of our sinnes in his owne person and likewise the wisedome power iustice clemencie grace and goodnesse of the whole Trinitie in accepting that offer for our saluation but such I said was the infinite dignitie of the person being true God that he could by no Law be bound but onely ledde by his owne good will and pleasure as a voluntary and free Sauiour Which libertie the iustice of God so farre tendred and preserued in the humane nature of Christ that he could not in rigour exact death as a debt from a Suertie but receiue it as a voluntarie sacrifice from a willing and free Redeemer for which cause neither the desert of our punishment nor the filth of our sinnââ¦s nor the trueth of our curse could cleaue vnto him but his death was innocent and altogether vndeserued though he died iustly to God as well in ââ¦espect of vs for whom he suffered who deserued farre worse as in regard of his owne will and offer who refused not the smart of death thereby to breake thâ⦠chaines of death and to deliuer vs from the power of darkenesse For the name of the law in generall how farre that word might be stretched I did not question since you spake directly of that law which accurseth and punisheth sinne as the Apostle doth alleaging in plaine words both the curse and punishment of Moses law Otherwise I knew the Apostles words in this verie Epistle Beare yee one anothers burden and so fulfill the law of Christ which is in libertie and loue to serue one an other as Christ did vs. No similitude you say can proue Christ in taking our person on him to be sinfull defiled hatefull and accursed I denie this saying vtterly I like your wit well that when you should go to proue your affirmatiues you fall to denie my negatiues This is a short way to shunne all paines and proofs for you to say what you list and when you denie the contrarie the matter is fully proued But Sir you forget that my assertion hath in it the plaine words of the Holy Ghost and the maine grounds of Christian religion that Christ as well in his nature and actions as in his sufferings and sacrifice was holie harmelesse seuered from sinners and vndefiled This you vtterly denie If you make no more bones in denying the words of God your Reader will as easily denie you to be a Christian whatsoeuer I do In his owne nature and in respect meerly thereof he suffered both at the Iewes hands and before God the iust for the vniust A faire gloze and full against the text When Christ died was it for himselfe or for vs that hee suffered He suffered not in any respect of or for himselfe no not before God and yet he suffered the iust for the vniust sayth Peter Which words Peter could not speake in respect of the Iewes who killed Christ for they tooke Christ to be most vniust and they had no meaning nor power to put him to death for the redemption of the world but Peter speaketh this of Christ who knowing himselfe to be iust and innocent in the sight of God was yet patient and willing when he suffered for the vniust By this example Peter often exhorteth the godly to follow Christes steppes and to suffer wrong patiently when they do well For that is more acceptable to God then when they are buffeted for their faults because they are blessed that suffer for righteousnesse sake as Christ did You turne the text cleane contrarie and would haue men beleeue that Christ was not only sinfull accursed and defiled with our sinnes but the greatest sinner and most vniust person that euer suffered as guiltie before God of all their sinnes for whom he died Yet this is not inherently but by imputation the Lord translating by his ordinance the sinne of men vpon him Afore we enter to speake farther of the filthinesse or guiltinesse of sinne inherent or imputed and the malediction on either I thinke it fit for the Reader to know what is conteined in those termes lest the Defender carie his conceits in a cloud as his meaning and maner is to do In sinne besides the auerting of the will from God by defection and hardning of the heart against God by rebellion the loue and affections of the soule which should be inflamed with sinceritie and puritie of Gods holinesse and goodnesse are wholly deiected and egerly fastened vpon base vile vaine and vncleane things and thereby the soule growing like to that which it loueth for loue causeth a societie and similitude with the things loued bââ¦ommeth base vile and vncleane in all her delights desires parts and powers Which impurenesse and pollution of the inward man when God beholdeth he reiecteth hateth and detesteth as well this corruption inherent in the soule as the deeds and acts of sinne past with vs but present still with him and accusing vs in his sight by the witnesse of our owne conscience which we can not auoid This when God setteth before the eyes of the wicked letting them see what they haue refused and what they haue embraced and how deformed and defiled they are in comparison of his beautie and sanctitie as also what they haue done against the light and leading of their owne conscience they fall ashamed of their vncleannesse and confounded with their guiltinesse finding the iust vengeance of God to hang ouer their heads with a desperate and most dreadfull expectation thereof These things are not doubted by any good Diuines and therefore it shall suffice shortly to touch some places teaching no lesse then I haue sayd To the vncleane and vnbeleeuing sayth Paul nothing is clâ⦠but euen their mindes and consciences are defiled Of euill thoughts and deeds proceeding from the heart our Sauiour-generally pronounceth These are the things which defile a man S. Peter sayth of the wicked They are led with sensualitie as bruit beasts perishing in their corruption and are not onely spots and staines but after they had escaped from the filthinesse of the world turne againe as swine to wallowing in the mire This is the vncleannesse of sinne as well inherited from Adam as
that iudgeth Iustly But if it be Ambitiâ⦠to let the Reader see that I follow the steps of so learned and approoued Teachers what is it for you being I trust no more then a Man to deuise a new Saluation a new Redemption which neither Scriptures nor Fathers either professed or published howbeit if these three Fathers whom you name and meane to cite make any way for your nââ¦w found fansies they shall content me also so you doe not peece out their Texts with your vntruths for then you alleage not them but your selfe vnder their shadowes The first who is Cyprian saith Christ sustained and suffered him selfe to bee called sinne and a curse by Moses and the Apostle because he had the like punishment as we should haue had bââ¦t not the like fault Cyprians words we haue already once heard and once answered there the Reader shal find them more at large they make nothing for you but rather against you For first it is euident by Cyprians sentence that Christ was callââ¦d sinne and a curse by Moses and the Apostle not for any guilt or fault deriued from vs but onely by reason of the likenesse of punishment with those that were sinners and accursed Then was not Christ defiled or sinfull by sustaining our person oâ⦠cause for so much as he had no likenesse nor communion with our sinne but only with our punishment Now the punishment which Christ suffered could not defile him but rather commend his obedience patience and charitie towards God and man But he had the like punishment as we should haue had Likenesse as well consisteth in the part as in the whole and if it were but like then was it not the same except you haue forgotten as well the rules of reason as of trueth Nullum simile est idââ¦m Nothing is like to it selfe If then it were like it was not the same What get yoâ⦠now by Cyprians words or what doe I loose by them Your slight answere that it was like in part not in all saluââ¦th not the matter It pleaseth not your affection but it fully remooueth your obiection and the trueth of it is most manifest For if Christs punishment were in all points like as we should haue had for our sinnes you know well enough by this tââ¦e how lewd and false that Assertion is which you would sow vnto Cyprian And therefore as likenes in part iâ⦠suââ¦cient to verifie Cyprians words so doth it iustifie his speech to be sober and sound which you would haue to be ââ¦ous and impious Cyprian meaneth Christs punishment was so like ours as waâ⦠possible We talke of Cyprians words which are extant not of his meaning which you know not and would faââ¦ne force to be like to yours This is a poore reply when you can say nothing out of Cyprians words against mine exposition of them for which I yeeld so iust ground to flie to your owne imagination of Cyprians meaning which yet is false and foolish For it was possible if we respect nothing but possibilitie omitting Gods Counsell and Decree for Christ to haue suffered longer time and other sorts of bodily paines as fire fleaing and such like at the Iewes hands so that your possibilitie was no part of Cyprians meaning but a waterish deuice of your own to frame Cyprians words to your fansie Alâ⦠by this your weââ¦ke answere you are contrary to your selfe in that you acknowlââ¦dge God vsed Christ as he doth sinners Well you may deuoutly dreame of Contrarieties but your eyes dasle too much to see them truely Doth euery Aduerbe of Similitude with you make a full and perfect Resemblance in all points I send yoâ⦠saith Christ as sheepe among Wââ¦lues Will you put hornes and haire vpon Christs Disciples to make them as sheepe The Sunne saith Dauid commeth foorth as a Bridââ¦groome out of his Chamber and reioyceth as a mighââ¦e Man to runne his Course Will you build a Chamber for the Sunne and allow him two feete and ten toes that he may leape and runne his race like a man As new borne babes saith Peter dââ¦ire thâ⦠sincere mââ¦ke of the word Will you bring men backe to their Cradles swadling cloââ¦ts and the teats of their Mothers that you may verifie this similââ¦tude in them There can nothing be more senselesse absurd and false then to require euery Similitude or Comparison to be full and perââ¦ct in all points Throughout the Scriptures any one thing that is common to many or any resemblance of that which an other hath ââ¦rueth to frame thence a Comparison or similitude So that any one punââ¦shment inflicted on Christ which Gods Law threatneth to sinners was suffââ¦cient to make good my words thââ¦t God vsed Christ as he doth sinners How then doe you conclude from my speech that Christ was vsed in all things as sinners are both here and in hell or that God laid on him punishment so lââ¦ke to that which we should haue had as was possible Tââ¦e it is though not by any force of my words alleaged by you that God by his secrââ¦te oââ¦dinance lââ¦id on his Sonne not onely the common Infirmities of mans Nature and miseries of mans life but also shame reproch paine and death which are by his Law reseââ¦ued and threatned to sinners but touching the death of the Soule or true paines of hell which all this while you fish for you finde nothing in my words nor in any of these Fathers whose names you abuse Athanasius saith Ipseper se sententiam soluit sââ¦b specie condemnati He himselfe satisfied and ãâã the sentence of the Law vnder the appearance of a DAMNââ¦D MAN Did not God then vse him as he doth sinners in all extremitie of punishment so far as was possible You doe wisely not to be ãâã in producing multitudes of Men. as you call them for you doe but shame your selfe and sincke your cause when you coââ¦e to shew the grounds of your Doctrine by the testââ¦monies of ancient Fathers As they say nothing for you so you vnderstand nothing in them no not the coherence or force of thââ¦ir words or sentences It is no small matter that here you vndertake out of Athanasius to prooue in Christ the appearance of a DAââ¦D MAN which by and by you interpret to be all extremitie of punishment vsed by God to sinners so farre as was possible the paines of the damned not excepted I would gladly aske you whether you purpose to cite places as you find them to seeke out the truth or only professe to picke out heere and there a word to make you availe to hide your head for shame You maruell what I meane I will soone tell you You alleage but fower words out of Athanasius besides Prepositions and Pronouns and in them you commit fiue notable faults and three of them grosse wilfull and wicked corruptions Sententiam you call the sentence of the Law Where Athanasius expresly noteth the sentence
neuer waded any farder vnlesse in one or two new writers that fit your fansie It doth approue likewise and appoint Erasmus Paââ¦aphrase to lââ¦e openly in the Church for euery man that doubteth of any thing in the nââ¦we Testament to reade for his instruction and yet you will not take euery word in Erasmus Paraphrase for the publike Doctrine of the Church of England For so you should ââ¦oone exclude the most of your new conceits But what saith the Catechisme that Christ was bound to suffer for vs or did endure the same damnation which we dââ¦serued It sayth that Christ was our Suretie The Catechisme goeth not so farre but sayth God dealt cum Christo quasi sponsore with Christ as it were with a Suretie Christ then did voluntarily assume some similitude but not the strict and exact condition of a Suretie euen by the tenor of the words which you cite though you guilefully translate them as if Christ had beene our Suretie It is one thing to hold Christ was our Suretie and ioyntly bound with vs by law to pay our debts which is your errour and another thing to say Christ was as it were a Suretie or did of his owne accord discharge our debts for vs. The Catechisme in this very section precisely noteth that he was not bound as Sureties be but of his owne will suffered for vs the cruell and wicked rage of the Iewes in putting him to death Haec quidem illi in eum crudeliter malitiose atâ⦠impiè perpetrarant verum ipââ¦e sua sââ¦onte ac volens haec omnia perpeââ¦s atâ⦠perfunctus est These things before described the Iewes did cruelly malitioââ¦ly and impiouâ⦠against him but he OF HIS OVVNE ACCORD and good will not bound suffered all these things And before he commeth to your words he sayth but it iâ⦠not vnusuall amongst men that one should vndertake and suffer for another By which he doth not meane that by right or law one man may be bound to suffer or die for another but by liking or loue men are sometimes thereto led Otherwise the law both of God man is directly against all such suffering Sancimus ibiesse poenaÌ ãâã est Peccata suos teneant authores nec vlterius progrediatur metus quam reperiaââ¦r delicium We appoint say the Emperours Arcadius and Honorius that punishment shall be there where the fault is Let offences binde their committers and let no feare of punishment extend farther than to such as be guiltie of the crime Gods law doth ratifie the same The wickednesse of the wicked shall be vpon himselfe The sonne shall not beare the ãâã of the father neither shall the father beare the iniquitie of the sonne but the same soule that sinneth shall die Wherefore the Catechisme if he vnderstood what he said as I truely thinke he right-well did could not deriue Christes bodily sufferings from any band or Suertiship allowed amongst men by Law but onely from Christes loue and will which is aboue all law by which indeed he humbled and emptied himselfe to the death of the crosse for our sakes when there was neither law nor band to compell him to it Also Cyprians words are plaine and can not beare any other sense than I make of them that Christ was a verie Suretie for his people and suffered such a forsaking of God touching sense of paine and want of present feeling of comfort in his paines as the damned doe I did well to say you neither vnderstood nor liked the meaning of Cyprian for where there is nothing in Cyprians words that bolstereth your error you haue made such a construction of them or rather such a contradiction to them that few men besides you could deuise the like For by them you bring the person of the Sonne of God in his humane nature that was alwayes full of grace and trueth To haue no MORE SENSE NOR COMFORT OF GOD for the time THAN THE DAMNED HAVE From which pââ¦stilent position though you kisse your hand in it I wish all the godly to blesse themselues But let vs first see on which words of Cyprian you graffe this golden fruit and then how true it is and agreââ¦able to the faith Your foundation ââ¦s because Cyprian sayth of Christ Thou diddest shew anxietates illius querimoniae verba esse dilââ¦ctorum tuorum quorum personam causam assumpseras the pensiuenesse of that complaint My God my God why hast thou forsaken me to be the words of thy beloued whose person and cause thou hadst assumed What is this to your purpose or how doth this patronize your violent and wicked assertion The dolors of Christs complaint on the Crosse that he was forsaken were the words of his beloued that is Christ spake those words in the name and behalfe of his Elect that they were forsaken of God not of his owne person as Austen saith of the same That was the voice of Christes members not of the head And Leo Sub redemptorum suorum voce clamabat Christ cried those words vnder the voice of his Redeemed Now this being Cypââ¦ans plaine speech that those were the words of his Elect finding themselues for their sinnes worthie to be forsaken of God how come you to turne Christ into his beloued that is the head into the members and his beloued into the damned and then to conclude of Christ that he had no more sense nor comfort of God in his paines than the damned haue Such another leape will easily bring you and your followers from faith to infidelity and if you take not heed the sooner from the number of the Elect to the rancke of the Reprobate which take so light occasion to draw Christ into the same desperation for the time with the damned Cypriââ¦ns words you say can not beare any other sense It is not enough for you shamefully to peruert Cyprians words but you must proudly proclaime in print that they can haue none other sense than you list to like of when his speech expresly doth import the contrarie If you had auouched so much of Christes words we would desire no better interpreter then Cyprian who saith those were the wordes of Christs beloued and so that forsaking had no direct application to Christes person but a mercifull relation to his members who might often inwardly feele that they were forsaken of Gods fauor and assistance for the time though not as the damned are MEE you thinke in Christes words must signifie his person and not his members But Cyprian is expresly opposite to you in that point and saith MEE there is as much as MY BELOVED or chosen members And for this exposition Cyprian hath the manifest precedence of the sacred Scriptures in which Christ often speaketh of his members as of himselfe by the verie same words Saul Saul why persecutest thou mee that is my members whom I loue and esteeme as my selfe and this is no cauilling euasion the Iudge at the last
ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã standing What an agonie is in doubt or feare to missâ⦠of that we vndertake we are agonized Galene the chiefe of Physicians and well skilled in the perturbations and commotions of the bodie that come from the bloud or spirits noteth of what affections an agonie is compounded ' Fââ¦are sayth he doth prââ¦sently driue the bloud and spirits inward towards their fountaine c Galenus dââ¦ââ¦ausis comatââ¦n li. 2. and contracteth them together by cooling the vttermost parts of the bodie and anger doth as suddenly heat them diffund and send them foorth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and that which in Greeke is called an agonie is compounded of them both and hath inequall motions according to the predominant affection Aristotle a great Philosopher in the knowledge of naturall things not only sheweth that there may be an agonie without feare as when we attempt things honest and commendable though diââ¦cult d Arist Rhetoricorum li. 1. cap. 9. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã for which men striue and are agpmozed without feare but also that sweating in an agonie commeth rather from indignation and zeale than from feare e Idem Problemat sect 2. quest 26. An agonie sayth he is not the passing of the naturall heat from the higher parts of the bodie vnto the lower as in feare but it is rather an increase of heat as in anger and indignation And he that is in an agonie is not troubled with feare or colde but with expectation of the euent Wherein Theophrastus not much behinde him agreeth with him f Theophrastus de Sudoribus 12. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã An agonie is not the remouing of the naturall heat but the increasing thereof as in anger And heat doth drie the outmost parts of the bodie I speake not this to bind Christes sweate in the Garden wholy to naturall causes but to shew that neither Diuinitie Philosophy nor Physicke doe permit that feare or sorow which coole the blood and quench the spirits should be the cause of this bloudie sweate but that rather as the Euangelist expresseth it came from strength and contention of zeale whiles Christ most feruently prayed for that which he was very desirous and in present expectation to obtaine An Angell appeared from heauen g Luc. 22. 43. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã strengthning him saith the Scripture no question with a message from God For Angels otherwise were not in this case to entermeddle And then Christ h vers 44. entring into an Agonie that is into a vehement contention of mind to preuaile against that which resisted or hindred him he prayed more feruently From this feruencie of zeale and contention of minde came that bloudie sweate which the Euangelist mentioneth which whether we make to be according to Nature or aboue Nature it could not proceede from feare or sorrow as some men imagine For feare doth driue the bloud inward and coole it and so can not thinne it and expell it by the outmost parts and pores of the Body The Physitian that wrote the Booke de vtilitate Respirationis amongst Galens works saith i Li. de vtilitaââ¦e Respirationiâ⦠Galen attribut ââ¦om 7. Contingit Poros ex multo aut feruido spiritu vsque adeo dilatari vt etiam exeat sanguis per eos ââ¦iatque sudor sanguineus It sometimes happeneth that abundant or feruent spirits doe so dilate the pores of the bodie that bloud passeth by them and so the sweate may be bloudie If we leane not to the course of Nature for the cause of Christs bloudie sweate then Hilaries Rule is very sound k Hilarius dâ⦠Trinitate li 10. It is no Infirmitie which power did aboue the custoââ¦e of Nature No man then may dare impute Christs sweate to weakenesse because it is against Nature to sweat bloud Beda followeth him in the l Beda in Luc. cap. 22. same words Rupertus in larger m Rupertus de victoria verbi Dei li. 12. ca. 21. This is vnwonted this is aboue nature the flesh whole the skinne not cut for bloude to runne out of all the body and to fall on the earth as it were sweate Lyra receaueth the same According to the Iudgement of diuers n Lyra in Luc. ca. 22. this was supernaturally done that bloud should come foorth in steede of sweate that so Christ euen then might begin to shed his bloud for our saluation Then neither in Diuine nor humane learning is there any necessitie that the feare of your hell paines should be the cause of this sweate which Augustine Prosper and Bernard ascribe vnto Christs wil and power for a mysticall signification as I haue shewed in my * Serm. pag. 38. 39. Sermons Thus see we by the words of the holy Ghost that in the Garden Christs Soule was affected with feare and afflicted with sorrow his prayer prooueth his submission and intention of minde after comfort sent him from heauen by an Angell and his bloudie sweate if we attribute it to nature must come from zeale if we referre it to Christs power aboue Nature might haue many causes to vs vnknowne in particular though we can ghesse at the generall Of all these circumstances actions and affections there can no one direct cause be designed in speciall except in large termes we will say the worke of our Redemption was the cause of them all but neither pains nor suffrings can precisely be determined to be the proper ground of them all since after comfort from heauen he fell to most feruent prayer and therein to his bloudie sweat much lesse can you conclude that hell paines were the right and true cause thereof So that I haue more reason to reiect your maior proposition as apparently false than you haue right to pronounce it firme because you can denie mine assertion by flinging off all the Fathers as vnworthy to haue their iudgements regarded outfacing the Scriptures with phrases and figures to bring them to your bent But in the kinds of paines which Christ suffered in the Garden we doubt as much as in the causes of his agonie You must therefore declare what maner of paines you meane in your proposition before we shall fully vnderstand you p Defenc. pag. 91. li. 16. You meane it seemeth that Christ suffered paines in his soule by reason of the strength and zeale of his holy affections and that those were the proper and maine causes of that his most wofull and miraculous agonie and complaint Therefore not only extraordinarie paines inflicted vpon him by way of proper punishment as my proposition intendeth You seeke nothing but by confusion to couer and colour your absurd and false doctrines and that maketh you huddle and heape things together without all distinction or exposition Christes agonie in the Garden was before any paines inflicted on his bodie or soule other than feare or sorrow which were painfull affections rising from diuers occasions and causes as we shall afterward see His complaint
Your fourth obseruation is like the rest that is voide of all reason and trueth For though you take vpon you to be bold with Moses and his praier which yet you cannot shew u li. 14. was directly against his owne saluation as you auouch what proofe haue you that Paul aduisedly and considerately writing to the The fourth errour pretended from the former examples Romans was amazed and had no remembrance that Gods election was immutable and certainly reserued for him and the rest of Gods chosen in the heauens will you tell vs that the Scriptures were written by men amazed and forgetting the first principles of religion euen in their writings you may do wel to make that your fift obseruation rightly matching your doctrine deuotion but I weene few wise men wil allow this or that audacious enterprise in you I did in those words of mine which you bring describe what astonishment by nature was to wit feare admiration so mixed that for the time both sense speach are suddenly interââ¦upted whiles the soule most earnestly beholding or declining that which she ãâã not or endureth not neglecteth the sense or speach of her bodie as regarding or attending greater things that presently or fearefully oppresse her What is this to Moses or Paul if they were astonished with feare then neither could they speake nor write how els they should be caried besides themselues I doe not see nor you doe not say Moses had often accesse to god and so feared not to speake or pray vnto him and at the first kindling of Gods wrath against the people for making the Golden Calfe Moses carefully and mindfully proposed in his x Exod. 32. vers 11. praiers to God both the reproch which the y 12. Aegyptians would breath forth against gods holie name and the z 13. oath made by God to Abraham Isaac and Iacob to giue their seed the land of Canaan for an euerlasting inheritance And the Scripture saieth that vppon that praier before Moses went downe from the mount a Exod. 32. vers 14. The Lord changed his mind from the euill which he threatned to doe vnto his people Lesse cause then had Moses afterward to be amazed hauing alreadie diuerted and pacified the brunt of Gods anger against the multitude and praying now for the quite abolishing of this sinne out of Gods remembrance and the continuance of his fauour and presence to goe before his people Augustine thinketh Moses was well aduised in his praier and knew Gods mercy to be such that he would rather spare the wicked then destroy the godly of which goodnesse in God Abraham presumed when he made request for Sodom b August in Psal. 77. God sayth Austen so spared that nation that he kindled not his whole wrath vtterly to roote them out and make an end of them which appeareth plainly in Gods speach and Moses praier for their sinnes where God said I will rase them from the earth and make thee a great people But Moses interposeth himselfe paratior deleri pro ipsis quà m ipsos readier to be cut off than they should ãâã apud misericordem se id agere qui quoniam nullo modo deleret ipsum etiam illis ipsis parceret propter ipsum knowing he should preuaile with him that was mercifull who would by no meanes destroy him but rather spare them for his sake So that Moses by the iudgement of S. Augustine was not amazed in his prayer as you falsly presume but remembred himselfe well enough and put his life into Gods hands as more willing to be slaine than the whole multitude should and knowing that God would rather spare them in mercie who were trespassers than slay him that was innocent For Paul you haue lesse reason since he doth not actually wish it but sayeth hee could wish it if it were lawfull and possible meaning he could be content to put bodie and soule into Gods hands to doe there with what pleased him so the trueth of Christ might be receiued and acknowledged of the Iewes His maner of speech which must be conditionall except you grant it to respect the time past proueth that he was well aduised in referring all to Gods will and reseruing as well Gods counsell as his word reuealed without touch or impeach And therefore that the Apostle so writing was amazed I see no ground besides the gulfe of your owne inuentions I am farre therefore from scofââ¦ing at them as if they were in a traunce in whom I see no such amazednesse as you imagine much lesse may you take vpon you for your pleasure to put the sonne of God into the same distemper as you call it with others since both his wordes and deedes recorded by the Euangelists declare him to haue beene not onlie full of grace and trueth but mindfull of the least circumstance that pertained to his passion and of purpose to direct his sayings and doings to all those issues which the Scriptures forespake of his sufferings c Defenc pag. 97. li. 20. Specially you should acknowledge that his maruelous perplexity might well be a meanes that his suddaine wishes against his owne constant purpose and Gods will were yet no sinnes That Christ might be somewhat astonished in the Garden I doe not deme because that was an affection incident to our nature and specially for that the Scripture applieth the wordes ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã d Mar. 14. he began to be afraid and astonished vnto him but that this astonishment continued all the time of his passion or of his praiers in the Garden and that it proceeded from the sense of hell paines inflicted on him these are your voluntarie fansies voide of all foundation in the word of God and wholly depending on your priuate conceits For were it an astonishment as it was suddaine so it must be short and though for the time it might suspend sense and memorie yet when Christ began to pray he resumed not only the power of speach which in a maze men want but of vnderstanding also since praier without faith is a sinnefull temptation of God and faith requireth as well knowledge what we aske as perswasion of Gods goodnesse that he will graunt our desires So that both the turning of Christs tongue to speake and the directing of his hart in praier doe prooue sufficiently that Christ speedily recouered both sense memorie if we grant he was on the suddaine somewhat astonished the cause whereof you boldly conceaue to be what you list as your maner is without any care to make proofe thereof But as your obseruations were most absurd and false so are your collections that Christ by his paines then felt and feared had e Defenc. pag. 97. li. 23. infinitly more cause to be in his mind amazed then either Moses or Paul since the Scriptures mention no paines then felt of him in his mind besides the affections of feare and sorow which though they be painfull
desert of sinne the whole masse of mankind was condemned If the Christian faith permit vs to say that we were condemned before we were redeemed since we could not be redeemed but from condemnation how much more lawfull is it for me to say that euerlasting death was deserued by vs and prepared for vs without Christ since the reward of sinne was first prouided for the diuell and his angels before man fell through his inticements and was neuer since vnprepared d Defenc. pag. 9â⦠li. ãâã The truth is he could not by any meanes pray against that or decline that onely vnlesse he were for the time in some astonishment and perturbation of his senses which by the infinitenesse of that paine he well might be yea he could not but be as is afore shewed to haue hapned in Moses and Paul There is as much truth in this as in the rest of your deuices Here are errors as thicke as hops shuffled in vpon your bare word the proofe whereof you bring after at leasure about latter Lammas 1. That Christ felt infinite painââ¦s of hell which you before named all the whole paines which our sinnes deserued 2. That by the infinitenesse of that paine he could not but be in some astonishment and perturbation of his senses which though here you mitigate with some yet afterward you straine it aboue the extreamest degree of astonishment that might be Your words are e Defenc. pag. 128. li 26. Therefore no maruaile though this astonishment in Christ were farre greater then is to be seene in any man that euer was or shall be Wherein you keepe the Sauiour of the world as long and as often as pleaseth yourselfe 3. That against these paines he could not by any meanes pray onely vnlesse he were thus astonished 4. That Paul in his Epistle to the Romanes expressing his affection for the Iewes was likewise astonished and amazed as not knowing what he said f Defenc. pag. 99 li. 8. This is the very point of our Defence affirme this and you affirme with vs all that we hold and professe When I am out of my wits I may chaunce to hold these conceits with you otherwise so long as God giueth me grace to be soberly minded and well aduised I will see other manner of warrant for all these weafes and straies then you yet shew before I affirme them or professe them g Defenc pag. 99. li. 9. Otherwise if you meane that Christ praied intentiuely to haue the whole and intire cup of eternall malediction and death passe from him which both the elect deserue and the reprobate sustaine that as it is pââ¦ssing strange doctrine so is it simply impossible For he could not intentiuely pray against that nor feare that which he perfitly knew concerned him not at all and by no meanes could euer possibly come nââ¦are him I premonished the Reader that I would there repeate the diuers iudgements of diuers men and so farre admitte them as they might accord with the Christian faith To this opinion of some men that Christ was in his agonie stroken with a feare of eternall death and so might pray against it I gaue two expositions how those words might be tolerated in Christian Religion without apparent impietie The one that h Sermo pag. 23. li. 21. Christ had no neede to pray for himselfe against that cuppe of eternall death but ONLIE FOR VS who then suffered with him in him The other that if we would conioine Christs person with ours feare must there be taken for a shunning and declining of that cup which he i Ibid. pag. 24. li. 10. religiously disliked For k Ibid. pag. 23. li. 29. touching himselfe albeit the innocencie of his cause the holinesse of his life the merite of his obedience the abundance of his spirite the loue of his father and vnity of his person did most sufficiently guard him from all danger and doubt of eternall death yet to shew the perfection of his humility he would not suffer his humane nature to require it on right but prostrate on the earth besought his father that cuppe might passe from him and was heard in that he shunned or auoided I repeate the selfe same words which then I vsed to lett the Reader see that I shift not hands nor change not mindes as there is no cause I should but that this Broker neglecting my manifest limitations to other mens opinions and euident speache as also suppressing my purpose would haue the world beleeue that I graunt Christ doubted and feared eternall death to come on his owne person Which in the maze that you put him in sir defensor might well be since you auouch hee knew not what he praied or els he sinned in praying against the resolute and knowen will of God but by my positions it is impossible that any distrustfull feare of hell or eternall death should fall on the soule of Christ for the reasons there shortly but sufficiently collected by me And this is your idle course throughout your Booke to catch at a word and neuer to regard what goeth before or after be it neuer so plaine and perspicuous to recall your misconstruing my speach Omitte then your wanton rouing or malitious swaruing from my meaning and saying and refute either of these limitations if you can And first least any man thinke I limite other mens words without iust cause I ment herein the words of the Catechisme which you would faine pull into your packe as also of some other writers whose sayings so long as they might be salued with any good construction I thought not fitte to repell as intolerable in Christs Church The Catechisme saieth l Nowels Catechisme Greeke and Latine pag. 281. Christum non communi modo morte in hominum conspectu mulctatum sed et aeternae mortis horrore perfusum fuisse horribiles formidines atque acerbissimos animi dolores pro nobis perpessum et perfunctum esse Peccatoribus enim quorum hic quasi personam Christ us sustinuit non praesentis modo sed futurae etiam aeternaeque mortis dolores atque cruciatus debentur Christ not onely died our common death in the sight of men but was also perfused The Translator of the Catechisme into Greeke allowed as well as the Latin saith ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã agonized with the horror of eternall death suffered and felt for vs horrible feares and most bitter sorowes of mind For to sinners whose person in some sort Christ here sustained were due the sorowes and torments not of this present death onely but also of future and eternall death Of the paines of the damned really inflicted in the garden on Christs soule by the immediate hand of God and of Christs extreame astonishment for the present Torments therof the writer of the Catechisme knew nothing these deuices of yours are later then the making of that Booke but he speaketh of Christes fearing the infinite wrath of God against
teacheth that we must follow the will of God though nature reclaime So that the preferring of Gods will before the desire of his owne nature and the limiting of his prayer with this condition If it were possible not to Gods power but to Gods purpose to saue the world without his death then he desired the cuppe might passe from him prooue apparently that Christ was not onely well aduised in that prayer but he meant to teach vs that neither the power of his enemies did oppresse his weaknesse nor his owne loue leade him to a needlesse death it was rather Gods determined and irreuocable counsell and will that he must die or we must perish By which we learne not Christes inconstancie as of a man amazed but an excellent mysterie of Christian religion that no sacrifice could take away sinne but onely The intent of Christs prayer in the garden the death of Christ on the crosse which he for our sakes earnestly desired though by his thrise declining it if we might possibly be otherwise saued he shewed how painfull and grieuous that suffering would be vnto him We are therefore by the one to collect how intolerable that cuppe would be to his flesh and by the other to beholde his ardent loue to vs and willing obedience to his Father which things if in your conceit they conclude Christ to haue beene therein amazed I shall coniecture that your wits are not to this houre yet well recouered since greater pietie and charitie could not be shewed in that infirmitie wherewith Christ was then compassed and acerbitie of paines to come which he did not dissemble Now let vs heare how you impugne this o Defenc. pag. 99. li. 26. The first of these foure maketh in my minde much for vs. For vnderstanding that Christ tooke all the infirmities and passions whereto mens nature is subiect to the end he might cure all and euerie kinde of them in vs then it followeth that he wanted not the paines and immediate sufferings of paines inflicted by Gods owne hand in his soule It is but your mind that maketh so much for you your collection is otherwise as wide from reason and trueth as any may be For what if Christ taking our nature vnto him tooke therewith all our infirmities and affections which you cunningly call passions a word indifferent to affections and sufferings doth that inferre that he tooke vnto him the paines of the damned because mans nature through the hardnesse of his impenitent hart is subiect after this life by Gods iust iudgement to euerlasting damnation for sinne are your eyes so ill matches that you cannot discerne betwixt naturall affections cleauing to all men from their birth and the reall suffering of hell paines inflicted as you defend by Gods immediate hand on the soules of the faithfull here in this life which in deed are reserued for the wicked in another world are somtimes feared of the godly here on earth when the conscience of their sin through want of faith calleth Gods fauor in question with their owne harts first proue that all the godly haue the pains of the damned inflicted here in this life on their soules by the immediat hand of God for nature is not proper nor priuate to this or that man but common and constant to all men and next that notwithstanding your hell paines thus suffered they are in constant and perfect faith and assurance of Gods fauour and his heauenly kingdome and then you haue some pretence for your purpose which now is none For touching the first I appeale not onely to the Scriptures which teach no such thing but to the consciences and experiences of all the faithfull whether this can haue any trueth in it that the true paines of the damned are really inflicted on all their soules here on earth by Gods immediate hand And secondly when they feele any feare of Gods wrath or doubt of Gods fauour whether that come not through the failing and shrincking of their faith which pressed often with the number of their sinnes feareth least God will visite their offences with a mercielesse iudgement because they haue so greatly prouoked him The feare of hell may iustly make them quake and tremble which they acknowledge they haue worthily deserued and the same terrour doth often though not alwaies pursue the wicked vnto desperation but other torments of hell actually inflicted by Gods owne hand on the soules of all the faithfull as the Scriptures deliuer none so you shall not be able to prooue any common to all mankind though God want not power to punish where and as pleaseth him If therefore you speake of naturall affections they were common to Christ with vs but in vs excessiue vpon euery occasion which in him were moderate till they were inflamed with piety or charitie and then they burned more in him then in vs by reason of his abundant giftes and graces farre passing ours But if you talke of some secret speculations priuate to your selfe and some others of your sort that dreame perchaunce of hell paines both night and day according to your owne fansies then no words of mine nor of any auncient father come neere those deuices of yours which are knowen to no man either by reading or feeling but to such conceiters as you are if happely you doe not belie or deceaue your owne hearts p Defenc. pag. 99. li. 37. This your authors here doe fully affirme Cyrill Ambrose and others as before we haue obserued Mine authors there are easily redde and if any such thinge be there mentioned or thence to be concluded I am content you shall be thought to speake some trueth which is almost a maruaile in you you wrie all things so absurdly to your senselesse fansies Of your fourth argument and of these authors I haue largely deliuered what I take to be true euen in the place where you produced them to this purpose And so I leaue this as lately refuted lest I lengthen the volume to much q Defenc. pag. 100. li. 1. It is most vnreasonable which here you doe if you doe as you seeme to vnderstand them of meere bodilie death and of the infirmities meerelie of his flesh Shew that they name or intend any other death then the death of Christes body on the crosse or els your otherwise conceauing them without any words of theirs is a plaine peruerting them to pull them to your part Of infirmities when they speake they meane naturall such as were no derogations to faith nor hope nor to any other the graces of Gods spirite in Christ and in them all Christ was like vnto vs whether they were infirmities of body or soule Whether feare and sorow be infirmities meerely of the flesh is a doubt fit for Feare may be intellectiuâ⦠or sensitiue your discussing they may be sensitiue or intellectiue according to their obiects and in Christ since they were caused by things rather foreseene then felt or at least
Garden and be farre from doubting his owne saluation and our redemption So that Christes words doe no way touch your new deuice of hell paines except by contradicting it For where Christ sayd n Luke 12. v. 4. I speake to you my friends o vers 5. I will forwarne you whom you shall feare ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã feare him that hath power AFTER HE HATH KILLED to cast into hell you contrarie to Christes words auouch that God first cast Christes soule into hell in the Garden and after killed his bodie on the crosse where Gods course is as Christ obserueth after he hath killed to cast into hell or Gehenna where the paines of the damned are And so where Christ maketh the second death of the damned to come after the death of the bodie you make in Christ and all his members the second death to go before the first which is a grosse ouersight as well against order as against trueth saue that your conceits haue neither order weight nor measure p Defenc. pag. 104. li. 11. Here you haue a notable saying in the margent which must not be forgotten we must preferre Christs sufferings before all Martyrs not for his paines but for his Patience Not for his paines but for his Patience A rare distinction If you could make vs beleeue that the greatest patience is tried and discerned where the smallest paines are then you said somewhat The margin will prooue you fit to play with a feather and willing to embrace a bable before a better thing Doe my words there import or intend that Christs paines were lesse then the paines of Martyrs Hauing said before as much as I thought good touching the comparison of Christs paines with other mens I obserued here that Christs patience in suffering farre passed theirs whatsoeuer we resolued of his paines My words were q Sermo pa. 7. li. 10. Longer torments others haue endured but neuer greater for the time nor with like patience This as your manner is you ouerskip and where I refuse a needlesse contention what kinds of paines are sharpest here on earth but auouch Christs patience far exceeded the tolerance of Martyrs whatsoeuer Christs patience was greater than any mans whatsoeuer his paines were his paines did you neither remember what I before auouched nor what these words inferre but make your selfe merie with your owne folly We must preferre I said Christs sufferings before all Martyrs not for his paines the exact degree whereof I know not but for his patience Doth this hinder but that Christs paines were equall to any Martyrs sufferings though I tooke not vpon me to make them sharper then all the paines that euer were felt on earth My words before were plaine enough greater torments for the time others neuer endured And if such a Wyer-drawer as you are would goe to cafling which is the sharpest kind of paine it pertained not much to the purpose there could be no question but Christs patience in his extreame paines did farre excell all mens Indeede you little regard his patience for you put him in a maze all confounded and all astonished where neither obedience nor patience could haue any place and as for paines you will none other but the paines of the damned which passe the patience of men and Angels Wherefore that I would make men beleeue the greatest patience is tried in the smallest paines is a buzzardly deuice of your owne and howsoeuer I would not contend whether Christs paines were the sharpest that euer were suffered on earth yet I before resolued his paines to be as great as any mans euer were in this mortall body and his patience to be farre greater and painfuller to him The reasons whereof I gaue before in my Sermons though your course be to leape ouer what you list and to meddle with no more then you may entertaine with a wrest or a iest The eminence of Christs patience aboue all Martyrs I shewed to consist in these two points in exacter sense and perfecter obedience at the time of his sufferings then any man euer had or could haue For in others the more violent the tortures the sooner they ouerwhelme the sense and hasten death but in Christ whatsoeuer you dreame to the contrarie there was no confusion nor corruption of sense rather when his paines were sharpest and himselfe weakest then was his sense as tender if not tenderer then at any time before Againe in others euen in Martyrs when paine doth passe their strength the Soule struggleth and striueth to repell or auoyde the paine which when she cannot conquere nor resist she departeth the body In Christ it was otherwise when the sharpnesse of paine most fiercely assaulted him then did his obedience and patience rise to the highest degree So that nothing in him refused or declined the bitternesse of his paines nor so much as repined or shrunke at it but to the vttermost he put himselfe with all submission and patience aduisedly obediently and quietly to beare and endure the greatest rage and excesse of his intolerable torments which no mans strength or nature can performe And this I trust toucheth the triall and proofe of Christs patience and not the inward habite as you call it not so much as vnderstanding that my words concerne the vse and not the gift of Christs patience And if I would enterpret my words as you did Saint Austens a little before when they contained contraries not consequents as mine doe and so say Christs sufferings must be preferred before all Martyrs not for paines only but for patience also since there could be no vse of patience in Christ without paines then by your owne interpretation which in things consequent is very requisite you haue flowen faire and seased on a Butterflie r Defenc. pag. 104. li. 28. By this also we may see how vaine your next coniecture is that he feared in his Agony corporall castigation aboue his strength For why may not Martyrs and others feare as much crùeltie and extraordinarie torments at the hands of men as Christ had cause to doe You haue an habite of vnderstanding nothing besides that which no man vnderstandeth besides your selfe When I tell you that another thing s Sermo pag. 24. li. 18. which Christ might iustly feare and earnestly pray against though his soule were neuer so safe from the paines of the damned was the power of Gods wrath to be executed on his bodie t li. 22. for God was armed with infinit vengeance to afflict and punish the bodie about that the humane flesh of Christ was able to endure You answer why may not martyrs feare as much at mens ââ¦andes Wisely forsooth and as much to the purpose as chalke to make cheese Why should not Martyrs feare the power of men against their bodies as much as Christ feared the power of God against his body If you see not the cause aske one of the children that dwelleth at next house to you if
and bloudshed on the Crosse shewed in him no paines nor infirmitie but onely that voluntarily he made himselfe there the true Priest and performed the prefigured bloudie and deadlie sacrifice for the sinnes of the world As good reason altogether you haue to say so as to affirme it of his agonie No by your leaue for Christ did not actually offer two sacrifices the one ghostly suffering the paines of hell in the garden as you imagine the other bodily and bloudy yeelding himselfe to the death of the crosse m Heb. ãâã 14 With one oblation he hath made perfect for euer them which are sanctified n vers ãâã and we are sanctified by the offering of the body of Iesus Christ once made This sacrifice was presented and submitted to Gods will in the garden but finished and consummated on the Crosse which could not be without paines and infirmitie belonging vnto death In the garden where no Scripture saith Christ died I admit not the second death nor the paines of the damned which are thereto consequent And where you say I refuse all paines and infirmitie in Christes agonie it is one of your wonted trueths which in another were an open lie I admit not the paines of the damned or of the second death til you shew where the scripture teacheth that Christ suffered two deaths the first on the Crosse and the second in the garden and that afore the first Otherwise painefull affections of feare and sorow which were humane infirmities though voluntarily and religiously receaued by Christ into his soule I euerie where acknowledge and with Cyprian make them entrances to his oblation for the sinnes of the world o ãâã de ãâã ãâã vt fieret voluntas Patris sacrificium carnis a timore ãâã ãâã suberant victime desolatoriâ⦠carbones quos obedientiae liquefactus adeps extinxit ãâã tââ¦e will of the Father might be donne saith Cyprian and Christ begin the sacrifice of his flesh with feare and sorow consuming coales of feare and sorow in the gardeÌ were puâ⦠vnder the sacrifice which the sweet fatnesse of his obedience mââ¦lting did quench So that Christ beganne the sacrifice of his body in the garden offering that to be disposed at his fathers will for the life of the world and his entring to it was with feare and sorow the painfulnesse whereof his obedience abolished and so without all feare went to the rest of his suffrings before and on the crosse where he perfected and ended his oblation despising all torments and punishments that the wicked could deuice for him * ãâã ibidem ãâã vt sanaret inââ¦irmos timuit vt faceret securos Christ sorowed to heale our weakenesse and feared to make vs secure I beheld ãâã workes o Lord saith he and admire thee fastened to the crosse betweene two condemned Theeues now to be neither fearefull nor sorrowfull but a conquerer of thy punishments p Defenc. pag. 105. li. 6. You meane voluntarie in such sense that Christmas not also vrged thereunto by any violence of paines and feare procuring it in him naturally I meane by voluntarie that Christ had power enough to resist and represse the vehemency and painefulnesse of these affections ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã his affections as ââ¦e saw cause in him selfe and therefore against or without his will they could not trouble him For ãâã did not preuaile or exceed in him as they do in vs against our wils but he must be willing to submit himselfe to each affection of feare sorow before they could take hold of him or be grieuous to him Our nature though he tooke in substance yet the corruption and distemper of our sinfull nature he did not take and therfore as before our fall the innocency and rectitude that was in man could guide and gouerne as well the rising as the inflaming of his affections so much more Christ who besides sincerity from sinne and libertie from corruption had the grace and power of Gods spirite aboue measure in his humane nature could so restraine and represse in himselfe all affections of feare and sorow that till he was willing and thought it fitte they neither did mooue nor molest his humane flesh or spirit And when he suffered mans nature in him to feele the same affections that are in vs they were holy and righteous in him declaring his obedience to his Fathers will and not disordered as we find in the corruption of our flesh And where you adde that Christ was vrged to his bloudie sweat by violence of paines or feare procuring it in him naturally you speake not only against the trueth but euen against your selfe For within one leafe after you grant q ãâã 107. li. 16 it was aboue the course of nature led thereunto by Hilaries wordes that it was r Hââ¦lar de Trinitate li. 10. non secundum naturae consuetudinem not according to the accustomed course of nature And indeed how could it be naturall since feare cannot by nature cause a bloudy sweate and of all the men that you imagine did euer suffer the paines of hell you neuer read in the Scriptures or else where that any of them did sweate bloud Now if it were naturall to paine yea to your supposed paines of hell in this life to sweate bloud as many as you vrge suffered the same yea all the members of Christ to whom in these sufferings you make him like must needs at one ââ¦ime or other sweate bloud as well as Christ. Wherefore it is certaine that either you fitten and faine thââ¦se sufferings in other men or else Christ was not vrged NATVRALLY to this sweate by any ââ¦eares or paines of hell that oppressed him in the Garden s Defenc. pag. 10. li. 2. Of this Exposition with all the rest you pronounce that they are sound and well agreeing with Christian pietie Yet is it contrarie to your Resolution also yea it is contrarie to the Scripture expressing his feare and vehement sorrowes and discomfort to haue caused his Agonie Your words are of so small waight that a man would skant spare you Oyster-shels vpon your credit You know not the difference betwixt the occasion of Christs sorrow and sweate in the Garden and the exposition of his complaint on the crosse What I say of the one You more then negligently apply to the other As for my Resolution Pag. 290. prooue it contrarie to this position for exposition it is none since it concerneth the cause of Christs sweate and not the sense of his words and you shall after many failes and follies prooue somewhat Otherwise if these things in the Garden concerned Christs priesthood which is mine Assertion in this place I hope his Priesthood prooueth both his submission to God to whom he yeelded himselfe obedient and suppliant and his compassion on man for whose sake he refused not to make a bloudie and deadly offering of his owne bodie which is my Resolution in the Page
the one after the other that S. Iohn confirmeth it with his owne i vers 35. sight lest so strange a thing should not be beleeued k Defenc. pag. 106. li. 35. Though it be against the common course of our nature for any paines or feare to sweate bloud yet the diuine power with and through paines and feares might wring out of his body that trickling bloudy sweate As it is plaine that it did by the wordes next before in the text an Angell came to giue him some comfort Your head was troubled about some waighty worke when one sentence wrang from you such contrarieties and falsities But the l Pag. 105. li. 38. Page before you tooke speciall exception against me if I did not thinke that Christ was vrged to his bloudy sweate for thereof you speake in that place by violence of paines or feare procuring it in him NATVRALLY here you say it is against the common course of our nature for any paines or feare to sweat bloud Could it be naturally procured in Christ and yet against the common course of our nature againe if it be against the common course of our nature for any paines or feare to sweate bloud by what reason or authority doe you conclude hell paines out of Christes bloudy sweate for if no paines or feare can by the course of our nature procure a bloudy sweate how know you that Christ did sweate bloud for paines or for feare for hell paines you will say he might Not by any course of our nature For then all his members which at one time or other feele the like which Christ felt should sweate bloud as Christ did But that I trust is sensiblely false The diuine power might wring it out of his body So it may raise Children to Abraham out of stones Doth that inferre that men are made of stones and might not the diuine power wring this sweate for that is your phrase out of Christes bodie as well without hell paines as with them is it hard for God to make a man sweat bloud without the paines of the damned It is plaine that it did by the words next before in the text Doth the text name hell paines or the feare of hell what will you not aduenture that thus presume to outface the Scriptures the text nameth many thinges before and you like your crafts-master will make your choise though the Scripture doe not expresse what was the cause thereof The words next before the text are an Angell came to giue him comfort Then comfort belike cast him into this bloudy sweate if the wordes next before declare the cause thereof which were very strange that a man by comfort should be cast into a bloudy sweate Why may not I rather say that the vision of an Angell put him rather into this sweate then the comfort which was brought him since Daniel was m Dan. 8. v. 27. stroken sicke and astonished with a vision as diuers others of Gods saints haue beene yet I thinke neither of these to be the cause of that sweate but as I say in my Sermons it might be voluntary either for signification as Austen Prosper Bede and Bernard do thinke or for sanctification and consecration of his person and sacrifice answeareable to the manner of the legall oblation prefiguring this as the trueth or for vehement contention of spirit in praier which indeed is the next thing mentioned before his sweate and shewed his desire and zeale to be more then humane for the Redeeming and reconciling of man to God by the shedding of his bloud n Defenc. pag. 106. li. 27. You conclude that Christes agony demonstrating Christs Priesthood must not rise from the terror of his owne death and yet a little before you openly confesse and graunt that his agony did rise from the feare of his death The effect of Christes Priest-hood performed in the garden must in no wise concerne himselfe For he was not a Priest to make intercession or to offer sacrifice for himselfe but for vs. And therefore his praiers then vttered in his agonie with strong cries and teares if they pertained to his Priesthood they were made for vs and not for himselfe and declared his voluntarie profering and presenting his body and bloud to Gods pleasure to be the sacrifice for mans Redemption and his feruent supplications to haue it accepted as the full Ransome for his elect that the accuser and supplanter of his Church might be remooued from Gods presence and wholy subiected vnder Christes feete Now if this desire and offer for vs must not only be voluntarie but inflamed with wonderfull vehemencie then would not Christ sweat bloud for any terror of his owne death but for his infinite feruency to preuaile and obtaine his petition for vs. You permix Christes feare and his feruent zeale together and call the whole action his agonie though it containe both feare conceaued at first when he approched Gods presence in iudgement for sinne and comfort receaued at last by message brought from Heauen and out of this confusion you collect what you list and say what you please to no purpose That Christ might haue a naturall feare of death I then said and yet see no cause to recall it but that I said Christ did sweate bloud for feare of his bodily death this is one of your painted faces with which you would outface the trueth Howbeit this persisting in your ignorant folly without remembring or regarding what is said on the other side argueth ridiculous negligence or malitious diligence of which because I haue already spoken I will say no more o Defenc. pag. 106. li. 33. Why should Hilarie deny that Christes bloudy sweat came of infirmity or Austen that Christes feare and perturbation was of infirmity Because they had learned iudgments and sober considerations in these matters which you want They beheld Christes power which no force of hell or Satan could impeach but where and when himselfe would permit They saw the innocencie and integrity of Christes humane nature which could not be tossed nor troubled with inward affections but when and how farre he was content to admit them They knew the infinite loue of God to his son for whose sake we were all beloued and adopted and that the father was so farre from tormenting the soule of his sonne with his immediate hand that p Iohn 17. he gaue him power ouer all flesh and q Iohn 13. gaue all things into his hands euen before his death and against the time of his agony in the garden Wherefore as the r Iohn 14. Prince of this world had nought in him and for that cause neither sinne nor corruption were found in him and s Iohn 10. no man tooke his soule from him but he laid it downe of himselfe so neither necessity nor infirmitie of our nature could oppresse or possesse him but he must first giue place to it by his will and guide it by
power that in all as well sufferings as doings he might be obedient and yet righteous And had they heard such a ghest as you are tell them a tale of Gods t Defenc. pag. 106. li. 38. diuine power wringing out of Christes body a bloudy sweat they would haue rung you another manner of Peale For what is wringing but violent forcing and what is violence but inuoluntary constraint which is any thing rather then obedience and so where the Apostle professeth of Christ that he was obedient euen vnto death you haue spied out that Christes bloudy sweat was WRVNG from him and so no part of his willing and free submission and obedience vnto God u Defenc. pag. 107. li. 12. Where they say Nec infirmitas quod potestas gessit that prooueth the cleane contrarie for ideo infirmitas quia potestas gessit For the working of his power in him argueth the suffering of his infirmity The power of God is perfited in infirmity If you would ascribe neither Religion nor learning to two such Pillars of Christes Church as Hilarie and Austen were you should at least leaue them common in sight and vnderstanding of their owne wordes It is enough for a man of your sise to lacke learning trueth and sense They were very learned and wise or els the whole Church that hath hitherto esteemed and receaued them for such was much deceaued But you that haue found a new faith in the Scriptures no maruaile if you catch the fathers with contrarieties which others neuer drempt of The ground of their wordes is the cleare rule of reason nature and trueth confirmed in heauen earth and hell that contraries in one and the same subiect time and respect doe exclude one another As if any thing be cold it is not hoate if it be drie it is not moist if it be straight it is not crooked and so if it be weake it is not strong Hence they conclude if there could be in Christ no compulsion to feare and sorow then was there election if no necessity then liberty and consequently if no preualence of corruption against his fullnesse of trueth and grace then it was not infirmity that subiected him to these violent and painfull affections but it was his will and power that raised and restrained them in him selfe Against this what saith our master of new maximes nay it was therefore infirmitie because power did it This indeed crosteth their sayings but withall it crosseth all trueth if you take their wordes as they spake them But you meane as your marginer noteth therefore there was infirmity because x Defenc pag. 107. ad marginem li. 3. there was power He can neuer shoot amisse that neuer offreth to any marke Where was there infirmity where was there power in the person of Christ belike Hilary and Austen did not know that Christ was God and man and had in his person both the infinite power of God and the voluntarie weaknesse of man that being compared with his Godhead might well be called infirmity as the Apostle saiââ¦th Christ was crucisied concerning his infirmity that is in the weaknesse of his flesh but yet that voluntary weaknesse of God or in God the sonne was stronger then all the power of men or of Diuels whom his manhood spoiled and caried captiues with an open triumphe This is not their meaning to say that Christ had no infirme part in his person compared with his diuine power that is no manhood but only his Godhead and therefore your reply to that purpose is as senselesse as it is needlesse Where Christes diuine power did punish there his humane infirmity did suffer This is your wresting of their wordes against their meaning to bring them to your compasse but this is no part of their speech That weaknesse is patient where power is agent this may be but what is that to their words which are very true without your punishing power Hilarie sayth y Hilar. de Trinitate li. 10. To sweat bloud is against nature and so not a weaknesse in nature Since then it was aboue nature to sweat bloud he ascribeth it to Christes will and power performing that in his bodie which nature could not do z Ibidem Quis rogo furor est repudiata doctrinae Apostolicae fide mutare sensum religionis totum hoc ad imbecillitatem contumeliam rapere naturae quod volunt as est sacramentum quod potest as est siducia triumphus What madnesse is this here you Sir Defender how he requiteth you for peruerting the trueth of his words by refusing the faith of the Apostles doctrine to change the sense of religion and to impute all that to the imbccillitie and contumelie of Christes nature which was his will and a mysterie yea power considence and victory And againe lest you should thinke he wanted reason for his speech a Ibidem Quarogo side naturaliter infirmus fuisse defenditur cui naturale fuit omnem human arum infirmitatum inhibere naturam Forte stulta atque impia peruersitate hinc infirmae in ââ¦o naturae presumitur assertio quia trist is sit anima eius vsque ad mortem With what faith I aske is Christ assirmed to be naturally weake to whom it was naturall to heale all mans infirmities Happely by a foolish and wicked peeuishnesse he is therefore presumed to be of a weake nature because his soule was sorrowfull vnto death This ground of his speech is short but sure except you will deride Christ and say b Luke 4. Physician heale thy selfe or blaspheme him with the Pharises and say as they sayd c Matth. 27. He saued others he can not saue himselfe It was then in Christ not want of power to represse these passions or repell these infirmities that subiected himselfe vnto them it was his owne willing obedience that would taste them and power that did guide them lest they should breake into the distemper and excesse of our corrupt nature The power of God you say is perfected in infirmitie Those words I trust were not spoken of Christ and howsoeuer in some sort they may be verified of Christ yet is there no comparison betwixt our naturall infirmitie and his fulnesse of trueth and grace d Esa. 11. The spirit of counsell and trueth rested on him e Iohn 3. without measure wee wholly want it till Gods power in some degree confirme our infirmitie Againe infirmitie in these words doth signifie outward afflictions and miseries for so the Apostle there expoundeth it f 2. Cotin 12. vers 10. Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities in reproches in necessities in persecutions for when I am outwardly weake then I am inwardly strong So that those words can not rightly be referred to inward infirmitie and might they yet Christes gifts and graces of the Holy Ghost were not only farre aboue Pauls but in the greatest degree that any creature might haue them and
on him sundry waies and that directly from Gods proper wrath for our sinnes he felt his whole humane Nature for the time left all comfortlesse and alone without any ioyous assistance of his Deitie Doe you enforce all this from the word for saking or would you adde it to those words which Christ spake either way your ignorance or impudence is cleare and manifest For if you dare adde so many circumstances of so great importance to those words you are not a tolerable expounder but a notable peruerter of Christs words If you would conclude so much from the word you shew your selfe most ridiculous against all the rules of Diuine Doctrine and humane sense to deduce all those sequels from that one word For neither infinite paines nor from Gods proper wrath nor in Christs whole humane Nature nor all comfortlesse are necessarie consequents to that word and yet graunt all these so farre as any truth or experience conuinceth them to be felt in this life they no way amount to the second death or to the true paines of the damned which is the thing you should and would inferre from this complaint r Defenc. pag. 108. li. 7. I meane his Godhead as it were withdrawing and hiding it selfe from him for that season of his Passion gaue him no sense nor feeling of ease comfort or ioy Your owne mouth testifieth against you that you doe not expound but corrupt the Scriptures to serue your conceits Begin with the last Doth not the Apostle in plaine words say that Christ s Heb. 12. for the ioy set before him endured the Crosse Who could set any ioy before him in that case but God alone then apparantly did his Godhead set before him assurance of ioy and that euerlasting in the highest degree which was so great that it led him with patience to endure the Crosse. He had no present feeling thereof you will say So you must say or else in exact words you shew your selfe to contradict the spirit of God But if God did propose it and Christ did most certainly know it and expect it had faith and hope in him no present sense nor feeling had not Christ farre certainer and fuller knowledge and sight of Gods presence fauour and promises then any faith or hope in vs can haue t Rom. 5. If then we reioyce vnder the hope of glory did not he did not he know that he u Luke 24. was to suffer those things and so to enter into his glory when he called them fooles and slow of hart that beleeued not all that the Prophets haue spoken by the spirit x 1. Peter 1. forewitnessing the sufferings of Christ and the glory that should follow Did the spirit of God by Dauid beare false witnesse when he said of Christ and in Christs person I y Acts 2. beheld the Lord alwaies before me at my right hand that I should not be shaken therefore did mine hart reioyce and my toong was glad and my flesh shall rest in hope Ease from paine he felt none ne would he feele till by death he determined his sufferings but comfort in his afflictions he could not want because he was not onely patient and obedient to the will of God and so not void of comfort when he had done the will of God to receiue his promises but euen in the midst of his sharpest paines he saw the counsell of God for his glorification and our redemption and beheld God as his Father most highly pleased with him though iustly displeased with our sinnes the smart whereof he must feele in his flesh That therefore Christes whole humane Nature on the Crosse was all comfortlesse and alone is false doctrine and repugnant not onely to the words of Dauid that Christ z Psal. 16. beheld God alwaies at his right hand that he should not be mooued but euen to the manifest assertion of Christ himselfe who said to his Disciples a Iohn 16. the houre is come that you shall be scattered and leaue me alone but I am not alone for the Father is with me Now if God were alwaies present with Christ that he should not be shaken God was alwaies well pleased with him Yea God was ioyned to him not ingrace alone as he is with vs but in nature and person as he is with no man else nor Angel If then we haue comfort from Gods grace and spirit in our afflictions how much more did consolations abound in Christ euen as sufferings did for since God is b 2. Cor. 1. the God of all comfort who comforteth vs in all our troubles that as the sufferings of Christ abound in vs so our consolation should abound through Christ how is it possible Christ should comfort vs if he were himselfe all comfortlesse in his paines shall we deriue that from him which he had not or rather is it impietie so much as to thinke that any inward comfort wanted vnto Christ who was personally vnited to God and on whom the c Esa. 11. Spirit of God rested that is alwaies continued with all fulnesse of grace and truth c Esa. 11. euen the spirit of wisedome and vnder standing the spirit of counsell and strength the spirit of knowledge and of the feare of the Lord If this spirit neuer departed from him he could want neither peace nor ioy in the holy Ghost and so no comfort incident to mans nature afflicted as he then was and would be yea that was the least degree of his comfort which was common to him with vs who yet deriue all our comfort from him he had the nearest surest highest and plentifullest spring of comfort in his owne person that any creature was capable of To make therefore his whole manhood all comfortlesse without any inward peace or ioy from Gods spirit is a detestable doctrine subuerting the communion of both Natures in Christ and so dissoluing the vnion of his person if neither part of his humane nature had any sense or feeling of his Godhead d Defenc. pag. 108. li. 5. I say not he wanted now all assistance of his deitie If he wanted peace and comfort in the holy Ghost if he had no longer any certaine knowledge nor vnderstanding of his fathers will and if he felt inwardly in his humane soule no perswasion apprehension nor expectation of his fathers presence fauour and promises tell me what assistance he had of his Godhead when all these things failed in him ioious assistance Christ found no ioy in his pââ¦ine but comfort in his hope he had none Is it fit for such a wrangler as you are first to dishonour the sufferings of Christ with the leauen of your fansies and then to sprinkle them with the holy water of your Phrases how often hath it beene told you that for obedience to the will of his father the sonne of God would vse no power to repell his paines nor to diminish his sense thereof but only
Catechisme and the notes in the great Bible here to shew the cause of Christs agonie to be these horrible sorrowes and torments as the Catechisme sayth of future and euerlasting death Why then are you so nice when you fully intend it in shew to denie it why did you not refuse that in the beginning The causes that might concurre in Christs agonie I shewed in my sermons out of the auncient Fathers agreeing with the Scriptures why should I repeate it againe in my conclusion you bringing nothing against it but a few voluntarie and emptie words which I know no man so vnwise as to regard without better proofe f pa 118. li. 32 There is no other sorrow in the world to be found which can be imagined to be the cause possibly You erre as well in aggrauating Christs agonie aboue that the text auoucheth as in assigning a false cause thereof out of your owne fansie Feare and sorrow the Scripture affirmeth in Christ if we so interprete the words as you doe but such feare and such sorow as cannot be found in the world except the feares sorowes of the second death this is your bold assertion no way mentioned nor purposed in the Scriptures nor grounded on any sound reason or experience For where the paines of some kinds of bodily deaths be often greater then mans nature can endure and therefore violently part the soule from the body what did hinder the paines of Christs body on the crosse to be such that they pressed his patience to the highest degree since he would not strengthen his flesh to sustaine the paines of hell as you pretend but layd downe all power that he might feele the smart and anguish of his bodily torments as tenderly as any man could Now what paines in others ouerwhelme the senses and hasten death as passing the strength of mans nature why might not euen the same bodily paines in Christ so presse his humane weakenesse that he felt himselfe able with patience to support no more and so prayed on the crosse for an end thereof and foresaw so much in the Garden which made him earnest if it were possible to decline it What can be sayd against this sharpenesse and bitternesse of bodily paine since in all Martyrs and malefactours their deaths declare that paine in the end doth so preuaile that the rage thereof is vtterly intolerable to mans nature and therefore sundereth the soule from the body with extreme violence as exceeding all humanâ⦠patience and strength g Defenc. pag. 118. li. 34. My other words also which here you cruelly condemne shall stand well enough that Christ as touching the vehemencie of paine was as sharpely touched as the reprobates themselues yea if it may be more extraordinarily though you labour with might and maine to make them amount to heresie and open blasphemie My words were more moderate then your dangerous comparisons deserued h Conclus pa. 290. li 35. I prayed you in so waightie matters as might amount to heresie and open blasphemie not to play with generall termes such as you neither vnderstood your selfe nor any man else could conceiue your meaning You would needs tell vs that Christ in soule was as sharpely touched and with as great vehemencie of paine euen as the reprobates themselues and more if it might be I asked you not where you found this written in the word of God which is the rule of our faith an vnwritten creââ¦de must needs haue vnwritten conclusions nor how you prooued it for your owne will is your best warrant for your new faith but what you ment thereby The terrors of the reprobates in this life which we might collect by the Scriptures were i Ibid. pa. 291. remorse of sinne reiection from Gods fauour desperation of mercie here and of all ioy and blisle in the world to come and a dreadfull expectation of horrible confusion and euerlasting fire k Ibidem I thought you durst not I hoped you would not offer so much as the mention of the least of these to be found in the sonne of God What wrong did I here vnto you were it not with too much sparing you and how plainly did I prouoke you to expresse your selfe but that your cunning is such that then you did and yet you doe forbeare to vnfold your generall and ambiguous speaches You persist still in your old song and say that touching the vehemencie of paine this is true As though remorse reiection desperation and expectation of euerlasting confusion and fire were NO PAINES to the soules of the reprobates Why play you with the name of paine to and fro after this sort Why role you sometimes to feares sometime to sorrowes sometime to paines as the causes of Christs agonie and those sometime apprehended by the mind of Christ sometime really inflicted by Gods immediate hand what Christ did or might apprehend you neuer declare you thinke it enough to tell vs his l Defenc. pag. 52. li. 35. vnderstanding chiefly conceiued the furie of that hand which principally strooke those blowes vpon his humane nature and thus with Metaphors you delude vs when you should distinctly deliuer what Christ conceiued of those afflictions which he suffered from the counsell and power of God determining them for mans redemption Yea besides apprehension and conception of mind you bring in your hell paines at your pleasure as an inherent and absolute torment really inflicted on the soule of Christ by Gods immediate hand as it is on all the damned after this life for the vengeance of their sinnes and when you are asked the proofe of these things you affourd vs figures and phrases to stuffe out your wallet m Defenc. pag. 119. li. 1. Why doe you not bend your odious outcries and accusations against the authoritie before truely cited which maintaineth the same so fully and amply as I deliuer it The Catechisme hath some generall words that Christ conflicted with all the powers of hell not as suffering them but as resisting them and that he endured horrible feares and griefes of mind to satisfie the iudgement of God and to pacifie his wrath These words if you will stretch to what please you they may seeme to haue some seedes of your error though not the buds and branches thereof but as they be generall so if we reuoke them to the grounds of the sacred Scriptures which was no doubt the writers and the allowers meaning then may we extend them no farder then we haue warrant in the word of God to iustifie them The feares and horrors which you would conuert to the reall suffering of the temporall hell the Catechisme referreth to the feare and horror of euerlasting death which you confesse Christ n Defenc pag. 99. most perfectly knew concerned him not at all and by no meanes could euer possibly come neere him How then doe you concurre with the authoritie which you cite saue that you peruert some generall words there
and loue God as the great and chiefe reward the Lord saying when he appeared visible to the eyes of their bodies promised himselfe inuisible to be seene of cleane hearts he that loueth me shal be loued of my Father and I will loue him and will shew mine owne selfe vnto him n Defenc. pag. 120 li. 7. The transfiguration of Christ on the mount declareth that some reall part of heauenly glory may be heere on earth which you your selfe somewhere confesse cleane against your selfe You would needes tell vs in you Treatise that heauen was some foretaste of the infinite ioy prepared for the godly which you attempted to prooue by the Apostles words common to all the children of God and thereupon concluded thus you o pa. 80. li. 23. see that as there is heauen in this life in some measure euen so there may be hell I replied that if you p Conclu pag. 337. ãâã 34. affirmed of heauen as you did of hell that the VERY SAME IOYES which are in heauen or EQVALL with them are heere sometimes found in vs liuing on earth it was a wicked error flatly repugning to the trueth of Gods promises and to the very nature of our Christian faith and hope We reasoned not of Christs manhoode which q Colos. 1. in all things had the preeminence aboue and afore all the sonnes of God but OF THE CODLY whom you expressely named and of whom I accordingly replied and to whom those words of the Apostle cited by you for proofe of your purpose doe precisely pertaine For of Christ they are most false that his eye neuer saw nor his eare neuer heard nor his hart neuer conceiued the things which God hath prepared for them that loue him Now when you should prooue that mortall men and no more then men though the members of Christ liuing heere on the earth haue THE VERY SAME IOYES which are in heauen or EQVALL with them you run to Christes transfiguration on the mountaine and by that you would inferre that there was heauen euen in this life in some measure But first where can you shew that Christes transfiguration on the mountaine is called heauen in the Scriptures Next what deriuation can you make from Christs power knowledge and glory to ours heere on earth Christs soule had many parts and degrees of heauenly perfection in this life which ours haue not he was free from sinne and error which abound in vs he was full of trueth and grace which want in vs saue what we receiue from his fulnesse he was the way the light and the life that leadeth lightneth and quickeneth euery man comming into the world yea the crosse of Christ was the wisdome and power of God These and many other maine differences the Scriptures expresse betwixt Christ and vs so that from his perfection and preeminence to our weakenesse wickednesse and wretchednesse in this world no comparison can be made nor any consequent but that beleeuing in him louing him and obeying his commandements as we are heere regenerate and renewed by his spirit so we shal be conformed to his image to raigne with him in the next life if we suffer with him in this life Christs transfiguration then is not called heauen in any Scripture neither had it the perfection or condition of heauen since heauen is not a transitory taste of mutable ioy or glory but a full and euerlasting possession of all power honour and blisse communicable from God and proportionable to the receauer But if Christ had the reall fruition of heauen in his flesh heere on earth how much more in his soule which was alwaies full of trueth and grace light and life and hauing so reall a tast as you speake of and so immeasurable a fulnesse of life and grace as the Scriptures speake I greatly maruaile how you come really to place hell and heauen in one soule together and specially in the soule of Christ on which you inflict the very substance of hell paines when yet the abundance and continuance of heauenly ioy could not want in him As for my somewhere confessing cleane against my selfe that Christ transfigured in the mount tasted of that heauenly glory prepared for him I see not how that crosseth any thing auouched by me in the 337. and 338. page by you noted You shall do well when you challenge contrarieties not to let the report rest on your crackt credit but produce the words that your Reader may be iudge of both You are sharp enough to catch hold of any thing if there were any cause I called indeed Christs transfiguration on the mount a taste of that heauenly ioy prepared for him I called it not heauen A taste of things neither abideth nor sufficeth which heauen fully doth therefore it is rather a contradiction then a confession of your conceit For if you thinke that Christs heauenly glory may be defectiue or mutable as his transfiguration was you broch a wicked and impious error Christs transfiguration did not exempt him from feare sorrow shame and death following which if you imagine of his glorification in heauen it is a right hellish impiety And whatsoeuer we affirme of Christ touching his preeminence aboue all the children of men as that he was free from sinne and full of grace and had the perfect knowledge of Gods trueth and will aboue men and Angels I hope you will not deriue it to his members heere liuing in the flesh least you leaue no ground of Christian religion vnshaken r Defenc. pag. 120. li. 10. Onely this you haue to obiect touching men that faith and hope is the euidence of things not seene neither are our greatest ioyes the same nor equall to them which we shall possesse in the next world I haue also to obiect that it is not lawfull for you nor for any man liuing to determine of Gods kingdome without his warrant nor to auouch that to be heauen which the Scriptures doe not Take heed it is no pastime to play with heauen and hell as you do without better aslurance than you haue Know you not what that learned Father sayth s Tertullianus de praescrip aduersus haereticos Nobis nihil ex nostro arbitrio indulgere licet It is not lawfull for vs that be Christians to deuise any thing of our owne heads But t Cyril de fide ad Reginas li 2. it is necessarie for vs as Cyril sayth to follow the diuine Scriptures and in nothing to depart from their praescription u Defenc pag. 120 li. 14. I answere our reasons before do proue more than only hope in the faithfull sometimes And I replie that none of your reasons do any way proue the ioyes of heauen Gods answere to Moses must stoppe your mouth and the presumption of all such as you are x Exod. 33. Thou canst not see my face for there shall no man see me and liue Moses saw as much as in this mortall life any
momentarie transfiguration of his bodie and to neglect and ouerskippe the constant and continuall ioy and glory of his soule which far better deserued the name of heauen than the change of his bodie t Defenc. pag. ââ¦21 li. 2. We grant the ioyes of heauen here are nothing equall to those hereafter only we say the very same in nature may be and are by the effectuall working of Gods gratious spirit in his elect reuealed in some measure and sometime euen in this world Neither is this as your charity speaketh any lewd or wicked error My charity serueth me and my duty bindeth me to tell you that if you of your owne head without the word of God will make an heauen or defend that to be heauen which is imperfect mutable and often defiled not with misery and death only but with weakenesse and wickednesse also you maintaine an euident and pestilent error The graces of God are heauenly aswell because they are giuen from heauen and direct to heauen as also they assure men of heauen but the measure of grace or ioy which we haue heere on earth is not the heauen which we are willed to beleeue and expect where our reward is and where an incorruptible vndefiled and immutable inheritance is reserued for vs and whence we looke for our Sauiour Your distinction that our ioy is the very same in nature though not in measure which is in heauen is not only false but a void and idle refuge For the ioy of heauen The name of Nature in the graces of God and ioyes of heauen is a vaine distinction is the plaine vision of Gods face which bringeth with it a present perfect perpetuall and plenary possession of all light power loue holinesse and happinesse deriueable fââ¦m God which in this weake fraile sinnefull and wretched life no man hath nor can haue And therefore though there be the knowledge loue and ioy of God both in this life and in the next yet the differences are so many and so great that no man of any reason or vnderstanding will make the one to be the other for some agreements in some points whereas in the whole there is not only a substantiall difference betwixt them which is the sight of Gods face but so many parts effects and consequeÌts in the one which are not in the other that it is more then folly to make the one by pretence of nature to be the same with the other All ioy in nature is the same if by nature we meane the generall definition therof for ioy is the impression or inward sense of good present or instant yea hope is in nature all one with ioy since in hope there is ioy as in feare there is paine and in hope we reioice yet no considerate diuine will confound hope and ioy together because they differ but in time much lesse make the ioies in this life which are defectiue mutable and permixed with our infirmity misery and iniquity the very same in nature with the ioies of heauen which are abundant constant and sincere in all parts and effects of brightnesse mightfulnesse righteousnesse and blessednesse which men can possibly comprehend when they come to the presence of God The sight of God by his creatures by his iudgments by his word and by himselfe is the same in the generall nature of knowledge yet are there as great differences betwixt them as betwixt darkenesse and light The Apostle saith u Rom. 1. The inuisible thinges of God that is his eternall power and godhead are seene by the creation of the world considered in his workes and that which may be knowen of God is manifest in them Shall we then say the heathen haue the very same knowledge of God by his workes which the Angels in heauen haue by the sight of himselfe the Diuels know him also by his workes by his word and his iudgements x Ionas 2. Thou beleeuest saith Iames That there is one God thou doest well The Diuels also beleeueââ¦t and tremble Yea they know Christ to be the sonne of God y Luc. 4. I know who thou art said the Diuell to Christ euen the holy one of God Shall we then thinke that the Diuels faith is the very same in nature with our Christian faith of many castawaies which fall away from the grace of God and receaue it in vaine the Apostle saith z Heb. 6. They were once lightened and tasted of the heauenly gift and were made partakers of the holy Ghost and tasted of the good word of God and of the powers of the world to come Shall we auouch these reprobates were in heauen in this life because they had once the very same graces in nature which the elect haue If our knowledge doe differ in this life and the next Our loue and ioy do follow our knowledge then doth our ioy likewise differ From our knowledge of God riseth our loue of God and our ioy in God For we can neither haue loue nor ioy of that which we know not but as our knowledge increaseth so doth our loue and ioy And therefore when we see God infallibly as he is then shall we loue him vnfainedly as we ought and reioice in him vnspeakeably euen as much as we are capable of not by the strength of our nature but by the working of his power Till then as our knowledge is darke and in part so our loue is weake and our ioy is faint but then shall these very thinges not only rise to an higher degree and be of another nature but be replenished with all parts of light power and blisse without which we may defend nothing to be heauen indeed howsoeuer wee may vse figuratiue speaches to comfort or encourage the godly As then worke and wages labour and rest sowing and reaping running and obtaining striuing and crowning abroade and at home doe differ euen in nature so faith and sight hope and haning promising and performing that is our state in earth and heauen doth likewise differ though it be one and the same thing which is now promised beleeued and hoped for and which hereafter shal be receaued attained and enioyed a Defenc. pag. 121. li. 7. Now then if more then hope only euen heauenly ioies may be on earth surely it followeth that likewise more then feare euen hellish paines themselues may be in men on earth also If the ioies of heauen be not only constant in nature but perfect in measure and consist in the sight of Gods face which no man shall see and liue then certainly the ioies of heauen are not in this life imparted to any mortall and sinnefull man And though that might be which yet God expressely denieth shal be yet the other is no conââ¦quent that the paines of the damned may be likewise in this weake and fainting flesh because ioy is an affection that preserueth this life and paine if it be violent and aboue our strength presently seuereth the soule
to all that obey him but that he must be God aswel as man to be able to suffer the paines of hell the second death that is a new deuice of yours not conuerting the Godhead of Christ to the infinitenesse of his merits but abusing it to the infinitenesse of his paines to make place for your new-found hell from the immediate hand of God where Scripture mentioneth no such thing in the worke of our redemption but plainly and fairely teacheth vs that we are k Rom. 5. reconciled to God by the death of his Sonne who l Coloss. 1. by the bloud of his Crosse procured perfect peace in heauen and in earth and restored vs to the fauour of God through death in the bodie of his flesh in which he m Rom. 8. condemned sinne that we might be n Heb. 10. sanctified by the offering of his bodie once made on the altar of the Crosse. And this doctrine so euidently and frequently deliuered by the Holy Ghost in the sacred Scriptures is so sufficient that I see no cause nor need of your hell paines besides no warrant nor witnesse of them except we dreame that the spirit of God did not well vnderstand or could not aptly expresse your hellish mysteries which he alwaies ouerpasseth with silence when hee speaketh of the purgation of our sinnes and our redemption by the precious bloud of the Lambe vnspotted and vndefiled If therefore it be not lawfull in the highest points of faith to adde ought to the word of God nor to thinke that the spirit of Trueth faileth or defecteth in his instruction vnto trueth I do not see with what dutie to God you and others may be so bolde with the Sonne of God as to subiect his soule to the second death and to the paines of the damned when the Scriptures offer vs no such part or point of our beliefe o Defenc. pag. 121. li. 36. You seeme to grant vnto Christ all naturall sorrow and feare neither doe we seeke any more but you trust the paine of the damned is more than a naturall oppressing and afflicting of the heart with humane feare and sorow For sooth it is not It is no more than a very naturall humane feare and sorow It proceedeth immediately and principally from God himselfe who is the Nature of Natures Also mans nature is apt to receiue such sorow and feare from him Thus the very paines of the damned are meerely naturall If you make vs many such conclusions you will proue your selfe a meere Naturall For if all things be meerely naturall to man that God either bestoweth or inflicteth on man then grace and glorie are meerely naturall to man yea heauen it selfe is as naturall to man as hell and the Holy Ghost himselfe shall become meerely naturall to man for God doth giue and we p Rom. 8. receiue the spirit of adoption whereby we crie Abba Father yea the second person in Trinitie is inseparably ioyned to mans nature and as well the ââ¦ather as the Sonne q 1. Ioh. 4. abide and r 2. Cor. 6. dwell in all the Saints So that the coniunction communion and inhabitation of the godhead in man is meerly naturall vnto man by your doctrine and not only God but the Diuell is as naturall to man and so are those things which are most vnnaturall and most repugnant to mans nature For man doth and suffereth them by and from God or the Diuel As corruption and incorruption mortality and immortality righteousnesse vnrighteousnesse saluation and destruction eternall life and eternall death are meerly naturall to man by your learned discourse which if you persist to defend take heed least men doubt whether frensie be naturall to you or no. Natural I called not whatsoeuer is any way incident to men in this life or the next but that which is generall necessary to all men in that they are men Wherfore I make neither hell nor heauen naturall vnto men since the one God giueth by his power and grace aboue our nature for our nature is not to be as the Angels of God and in the other by iustice and wrath God worketh against our nature For that fire should euerlastingly burne and flesh euerlastingly dure therein and soules be extreamely tormented therewith are to my vnderstanding farre beyond nature except you beââ¦eaue God of his almighty power and will which the Scriptures confesse in him and call him by the name of nature which is no more but the condition and operation that he hath assigned in this world to euery creature If you would needs know whence I tooke the word naturall read either Fulgentius or Damascene and you shall soone see what they and I meane by nature s Tulgentiâ⦠ad Trasimundum li. tertio Because Christ saith Fulgentius tooke vpon him to be a true man ideo cunct as naturae humanae infirmitates ver as quidem sedvoluntarias sustinuit therefore he sustained all the infirmities of mans nature truely but voluntarily and so Damascene t Damas. li. 3. ca. 20. We confesse that Christ vndertooke all naturall and sinlesse passions Naturall and sinlesse passions are those which entered into mans life by the condemnation of Adams transgression as hunger thirst wearinesse labour weeping shunning of death feare agonie and such like which are naturally in all men So that what is geneââ¦all and necessarie to all men in this life is naturall to man which I trust neither hell nor heauen is though by iustice or mercie all men after this life shall feele the one or enioy the other u Defââ¦nc pag. 122. li. 6. Supernaturall I graunt they are if we meane this that they are aboue our natures state to beare or to comprehend them If your rule be true that men naturally receiue the paines of hââ¦ll why should not mans nature as well beare them or compââ¦ehend them as receiue them except you meane the bearing of them with patience or comprehending the end of them what punishment men receiuâ⦠that they beare x Gala 5. He that troubleth you shall be are his condemnation whosoeuer he be And againe y Gala 6. euery man shall beââ¦re his own burden And so elsewhere z Ephes. 3. I bow my knees vnto the Father of our Lord Iesus Christ that he will grant you that ye may be strengthened by his spirit in the inward man that ye may be able to COMPREHEND with all Saints what is the breadth length and depth and height and to know the loue of Christ which passeth the knowledge of man And if men shall feele the paines of hell why shall they not comprehend that which they feele They shall apprehend no end nor ease thereof but feeling is a comprehension of the paine though it shall be so great that they cannot endure it with any patience And yet since you striue for the paines of hell in the soule of Christ aduise you whether Christ shall
if it were possible that houre might passe from him Then he came and found them sleeping and said to Peter Couldest not thou watch one houre Watch ye and pray that ye enter not into temptation What signes or words are here of astonishment continuing astonishment stoppeth speech and motion as well as sense y Rhetoricorum ad Herââ¦nnium li. 4. Omnes stupidi timore obmutuerunt They all amazed with feare were mute sayth the heathen Oratour And so the Poet z Plautus in Epidiââ¦o Quid stas stupida quid taces Thou amazed thing why flandest thou still why art thou tongue-tied Yea Galen himselfe giueth euident testimonie that men amazed with feare neither speake nor doe any thing but stand still with their eyes open a Galenus in Aphorismos Hippocratis li. 7. apho 14. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Amazednesse is when men neither speake nor do any thing but abide silent with their eyes open like to men astonished with feare So that if Christ were astonished with feare or amazed he could neither haue done nor sayd any of those things which the Gospell reporteth he did and sayd and therefore vnlesse you can alter the rules of nature as you doe of Scripture Christ was in no such astonishment as you dreame of neither did his memory faile him in speaking those words for then how could he not haue rememââ¦red that they were spoken amisse and needed correction as you conceiue them Your selfe acknowledge that he might be It helpeth not you I sayd if we should so interpret the word which S. Marke vseth that Christ began to be afrayd or somewhat astonished for if b In verbo ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã be ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã to admire some sudden or strange sight as Phanorinus auoucheth then might our Sauiour approching Gods presence now sitting in iudgement to redeeme the world easily finde cause both of admiration and feare and yet be free and farre from suffering your hell paines And where you say my words are vtterly vntrue that c Defenc. pag. 123. li. 13. many things might astonish our Sauior for the time besides such paines they are truer than any thing you haue yet spoken or will speake of his astonishment For whether we respect the sight of his eyes or the apprehension of his minde he might either way beholde many things woorthie of that feare or astonishment which the Scripture describeth in him d Zanââ¦hius de Incar Christi li. 2. quaest 11. Thesi 2 de scientia Christi pa. 302. If with the eyes of his bodie cleered with diuine light Christ being in earth sayth Zanchius could see the things in heauen and being in heauen doth see what he will in earth as he saw and heard Steuen saying Lord Iesu receiue my spirit he saw and spake to Paul persuing him in his Church how much more can and could the soule of Christ see particular things in the word which is his Godhead So that either the eyes of Christ or the minde of Christ might beholde or consider the glory of Gods iudgement whereof he spake when he sayd e Iohn 12. Now euen at hand is the iudgement of this world or the greatnesse of mans sinne or power of Gods wrath or the vengeance deserued from which he was to ransome man and for which he was to satisfie God all these things might in more likelihood in some sort astonish the humane soule of Christ than the paines of the damned presently then inflicted on him with Gods immediate hand as you imagine but are no way able to proue saue by your owne conceit And therefore your second obseruation that these infinite incomprehensible and incomparable paines which you meane astonished is but the froth of your fansie for you shall neuer be able to iustifie any such thing by the text or historie of the Euangelists f Defenc pââ¦g 123. li. 20. Thirdly adde heereunto that which you rightly grant that it is true a mighty feare may so affect a man for the time that it shall hinder the senses from recouering themselues and stoppe the faculties from informing one another Likewise afterward astonishment draweth the mind so wholy to thinke on some speciall thing aboue our reach that during the time we turne not our selues to any other cogitation You take this to be true that I said and so do I but this vtterly subuerted your former position which now you recant that g Treat pa. 53. li. 32. Christ could not but be astonished forgetfull and all confounded in his whole humanity botâ⦠in all the powers of his soule and senses of his body If Christ according to your desperate doctrine were all consounded in his whole humanity were not his vnderstanding and memory confouÌded aswel as other parts of his humane nature If he were all confounded in all powers of his soule and senses of his body as your wicked error imagineth are not vnderstanding and memory powers of the soule and did not I charge you iustly and truely with casting Christ into an infernall confusion for the time since in hell it selfe they can be no more but all confounded in their whole manhoods both in all the powers of their soules and senses of their body Tell what confusion in hell is or can be more then all in all and I will yeeld I did you wrong If you cannot then bethinke your selfe how lewdly and loosely you aduentured all to confound Christ in all the powers of his soule and senses of his body in which case whether you leaue sense memory or vnderstanding vnconfounded in Chist I leaue to the censure of the discreet Reader h Defenc. pag. 124. li. 1. I say as you say he now on the suddaine might turne neither sense nor memory to any other obiect and so not thinke on any thing els but onlie on this terrible and mighty sorow and feare Your helpers haue aduised you to recall that forgetfulnesse and all confusion in all the powers of Christs soule senses of his body which before you sounded out with such waine loades of wordes as was maruailous and now you be come to say as I say that there was no confusion in the powers of Christs soule nor in the senses of his body but an intentiââ¦e cogitation on some fearefull or sorowfull thing which for the time so detained the powers of the soule as on a matter most importing and nearest touching the state of himselfe either in soule or in body that he did conuert them to no other obiect If you say thus with me then must you say farder with me that as soone as Christ beganne to vse speach or conuert his cogitation to praier this astonishment was eased and howsoeuer feare was not altogether dispelled yet he could no longer be said to be amazed or to seeke what to doe For praier to God without the mind intending and attending it is sinne which might not be in Christ and
that Christ did attend his praiers is most euident For he both added a condition to them and presently declared what he ment by that condition to witte that he desired the bitternesse of this cup to passe as much as Gods gratious will towards him should like and not as the sense of mans nature in him would affect So that here is nothing in Christes praier arguing any forgetfulnesse or not remembring but an euident confirmation rather of that which you would so faine denie or auoid if you could tell how that Christ did religiously and carefully conuert his cogitations in his praiers both to deprecate his Fathers wrath as farre as might be and yet to giue full assent to his Fathers wil. And therefore the difference which Origen Ierom Bede and others make betwââ¦ene the beginning and continuing of these affections of feare and sorow in Christ howsoeuer with a false shew you impugne it hath better ground in it then any thing you say against it i Defenc. pag. 124. li. 8. Natures verie instinct is in such dolours to wish and desire ease and the more vehemently it is pinched the more earnââ¦stly it desireth and this is Gods owne gift and workemanship in nature and simply thus to desire is in this respect truely to be reckned Gods owne expresse will Haue you now found that Christ did not manifestly in plaine words pray contrary to his Fathers knowen will But that expressing the sense of mans nature in himselfe as touching the paines which should assault him on the Crosse he desired that cup that is the sharpnesse of that paine might passe as much as was possible to stand with Gods good pleasure And yet least he should seeme in nature more to respect his owne ââ¦inart then his Fathers will he presently declareth himselfe that he ment no farder to be eased then might stand with Gods counsell and will foredetermining these thinges So that without your hell paines then inflicted on Christes soule by Gods immediate hand and without your confused and forgetfull astonishment the praiers of our Sauiour in the Garden did both answeare Gods ordinance in the frame of our flesh which is not brasse as Iob speaketh and yet preferre the will of God for the conseruation of his iustice before the liking of his sense or desire of his nature Which if you acknowledge then are your assertions false and wicked that Christ in plaine wordes praied contrary to Gods knowen will and this could not haue wanted sinne had he not been astonished when he so praied For the praiers are facred and sound without any maze or obliuion of his Fathers will and his owne purpose but rather expressely remembring both and preferring that which indeed should be preferred when and as it ought k Defenc. pag. 124 li. 22. It was contrary in the outward wordes and in the particular affection of his mind now wanting this remembrance but it was fully and wholly according to Gods wilâ⦠in the generall disposition of his mind and whole man You would faine vphold a contrariety to Gods will in the praiââ¦rs of Christ and though they be neither in trueth nor in sense repugnant to Gods will yet you say there is a repugnancy in the particular affection of his mind As appeareth by his adding Not my will but thy will be done Howbeit you heard before out of Zanchius a very learned and very sufficient Diuine l Zambius de triââ¦us Elââ¦him parte 2. li. 3. ca 9. Rââ¦sponsio 2. Quare falsum omnino est in Christo diuersam voluntatem a Patris fuisse It is vtterly false that there was in Christ a will diuers from his Fathers will The naturall dislike that man hath of paine and death which is the rule of Gods creation Christ calleth his will because it was the weakenesse of mans flesh in him as he forewarned when he said The spirit is prompt but the flesh is weake to abide the paine and horror of death but this naturall affection when he had confessed to be in himselfe both to shew himselfe to be a true man and naturally affected as we are and also to foreshew that his death should be very painefull and greeuous vnto him he wholly and fully submitted it to his fathers will which indeed was his will and desire euen as he was man as well as his Fathers His owne wordes are m Luc. 22. Desiring I haue desired that is I haue earnestly desired to eat this Passââ¦ouer with you before I suffer And againe n Luc. 12. I must be baptised with a baptisme and how am I grieued till it be ended He desired the time and fââ¦uit of his death he might not desire death in it selfe because it was not only the dissolution of nature but the touch of Gods wrath against the sinne of man and therefore no way to be desired but in regard of consequent effects Neither was there any contrariety in the particular affection of Christs mind to Gods will as you auouch It is a dangerous deuice of yours to make Christes will agreeable to Gods in the generall disposition of his mind but repugnant in his particular affection which you would excuse with a greater error of Now wanting this remembrance But Gods will was as Christes was that Christ in his humane nature should haue an vtter dislike and horror of death which yet for the loue of man and obedience to God he should submit to that will of God whereby he would haue the punishment of our sinnes tedious and grââ¦euous to the Redeemer least it should seeme a sport to ransome vs from the wrath of God Both these wills were in God the Father and the sense of the one and the submission to the other in the humane nature of Christ so that in either part Christs will was conformable to the will of God though his naturall dislike of death and paine yeelded and submitted it selfe to the will of Gods iustice by which he required and exacted the punishment of our sinne in the manhood of Christ. o Defenc. paâ⦠124. li. 30 If you abhorre this ââ¦n me yet see what Chrysostom taught These wordes NOT AS I VVILL BVT AS THOV VVILT do signifie two willes saith he one of the Father another of the Sonne contrary one to the other Thinke you as Chrysostom doth and then you shall easily be suffered to speake as Chrysostom speaketh For as power and weakenesse are contrary so were the two wills in Christ declaring his two natures the one despising and conquering death which was his diuine will answeareable to his Fathers the other fearing shunning death which shewed him to be a true man As then Christ had two contrary natures yet knit and vnited in one person so had he two contrary wills touching death yet both agreeing and concurring in one end And so much Chrysostom would haue taught you if you had read on the very same place which you quote for your error p Johan
Chrysostomus in ââ¦adem ââ¦ratione apud Theodââ¦retum Dialogo 3. If this were spoken saith he of Christs diuinity then were it a contradiction indeed and many absurdities would thence follow but if it were spoken of his flesh then was there a good reason for those wordes and nothing in them that might iusââ¦ly be blamed For that the flesh would not willingly die this is not to be condemned it is proper to mans nature And Christ shewed in himselfe all the properties of mans nature without sinne and that very abundantly to stop the mouthes of Heretickes When then he saith if it be possible let this cup passe from me and not as I will but as thou wilt he declareth nothing els but that he was compassed with true flesh which feared death For to feare and shunne death and to be astonished or perplexed therewith is proper to flesh Now therefore that is at this time when he spake these wordes he permitted his flââ¦sh alone and naked to her proper action that shewing the infirmity thereof he might confirme the trueth of his humane nature and sometimes he couereth it because he was not a bare man Graunt you by these words that Christ declared nothing els but that he was a true man and naturally feared and shunned death which is the dissolution of nature as we do and you shall haue leaue to call this affection different or repugnant in power and strength but not in purpose or petition to the will of his diuine nature q Defenc pag. 124. li. 33. I grant M. Beza vseth some termes differing from ours yet his sense is the selfe same with ours He sayd Christ corrected not his speech as if he had before spoken amisse I say he did correct his speech making it being good to be better You can not by your leaue thus winde out from your lewd assertion that Christs prayer could not haue wanted sinne had he beene in perfect remembrance without astonishment If Christes prayer were good without the latter addition which you call a correction ergo it was not repugnant to the knowen will of God much lesse sinne in it selfe but that Christ now wanted remembrance by reason of his infinite and incomprehensible paines You would faine daube vp these dangerous conceits and conclusions but your morter is vntempered If Christes desire were good as now you grant before this correction and how could any thing be but good which proceeded from him then which way inferred you your hell paines out of that prayer where is the ground of your conclusion that Christ sinned in that prayer if he were not astonished because it was in plaine words contrarie to Gods knowen will Is any thing good that is contrarie to Gods knowen will Faine you would and yet you know not how to keepe this geere vpright r Defenc. pag. 125. li. 7. Neither is this particular contrariety to Gods will any sinne namely when by Gods owne ordinance we know not what Gods speciall will is so that we alwayes remaine apt and readie there unto when we know it Is this all the GOODNESSE you grant in the former part of Christes prayer that it was no sinne because Christ wanted remembrance doth Chrysostome teach you any such doctrine It may be pardoned by your rule for want of memorie but that is no commendation of any goodnesse in it And yet if we venture to pray without faith it is sinne so to tempt God Neither can we be excused by want of iudgement or memorie we may omit somewhat for want of vnderstanding but if we commit ought vpon opinion or credulitie that it is good and lawfull for vs when indeed it is not so that doth not excuse our ignorance or forgetfulnesse It is the lesse sinne but sinne it is and farre from goodnesse If therefore this be all the goodnesse you ascribe to Christes prayer you expresly contradict Chrysostome who maketh it proper and lawfull for mans nature in the best remembrance to dislike and shun death so we still submit our selues to Gods will as Christ did not to like that which is against nature but patiently to suffer that which is according to Gods will and counsell towards vs. s Defenc. pag. 125. li. So did Dauid desire the life of his childe it was contrarie to Gods will one way as the euent shewed for the childe died yet he prayed well and rightly according to Gods will in natures affection seeing he knew not Gods secret will to the contrarie Dauid had pââ¦etie and charitie to leade him to pray for his childes life though the Prophet denounced vnto him that the childe should die Gods threats doe differ from his iudgements in this that his iudgements are irreuocable when they are once executed and his wrath is placable when he threatneth since he neuer particularly threatneth but when we are impenitent God willed Ionas to preach that after t Ionah 3. fortie dayes Nineueh should be ouerthrowen and yet was God neither inconstant in his will nor the Prophet false in his message when vpon repentance God spared them The Kings Proclamation was good diuinitie * Ibidem Let euery man turne from his euill way and who can tell whether God will turne from his fierce wrath that we perish not So sayd Dauid u 2. Sam. 12. Who can tell whether God will haue mercie on me that the childe may liue Gods secret will as we cannot know so doe we not resist so long as we seeke by repentance to preuent or auert his plagues but what is this to Christs case was he ignorant of Gods will which he so often foretold his Disciples what where and of whom he should suffer as also the cause why x Matth. 20. to giue his life a redemption for manie y Defenc. pag. 125. li. 16. Christs sudden not remembring Gods particular will by reason of his fearefull astonishment was all one as if he had not knowââ¦n it at all It is apparently false that Christ did not remember Gods particular will touching his death for he added if it were possible Christes prayer not repugââ¦ant to the will of God before his praier and stââ¦ll submitted his will to the will of God which if he had not remembred hee could not haue done The fearefull astonishment of which you dreame as if it still continued euen in his praiers is a needlesse inââ¦ention of such as seeke to make some pretence for their hell paines Christs praiers were earnest and often repeated and as the Apostle noteth he was heard in them and therefore they were not repugnant to the will of God howsoeuer he desired the cup that is the sharpnesse thereof to be mitigated and proportioned to his strength and patience which accordingly God his Father performed z Defenc. pag. 125. li. 25. You say I am captious against Christ in not supplying one Euangelist with another For so Christs desire will appeare to be but conditionall therefore not contrarie
Both these Christ affirmeth in the garden k Matth. 26. vers 53. Thinkest thou saith he to Peter that I cannot now pray to my Father and he will giue me more then twelue Legions of Angels how then should the Scriptures be fulfilled that it must be so And at the second time of his returne to praier l Ibid. vers 42. O my Father if this cup cannot paesse away from me but that I must drinke it that is thereof thy will be donne So that by the first frame of Christs praiers m Ibid. ver 39. O my Father IF IT BE POSSIBLE let this cup passe from me If we vnderstand either Christs purpose to make it appeare that his death reuealed in the Scriptures was now by Gods counsell necessarily required for our redemption and that it was no want of power nor neglect of his safetie that put him into the hands of his enemies but his owne good will obeying the wisedome of his Father for our saluation or els that he desired the sharpenesse of the Cuppe might passe from him so farre as was possible that it might not ouerpresse his strength and patience in either of these two senses the words stand well and haue no touch of declining or disliking the counsell and determination of God to ransome and reconcile the world to himselfe by the death of his Sonne If with Chrysostom Cyril Damascene and others we like to make it the voice of mans weake flesh in Christ but still subiected to the will of God there is no repugnance to the will of God which is alwayes preferred though there be a declining of his hand if it were possible to stand with his will For so long as obedience ouerruleth the sense of nature and nature sheweth nothing but that which is ingraffed in it by Gods power and will I doe not see what aduantage you can take Sir Defender at this third sense of Christes words though we grant the flesh of man to be so created that it shrinketh at the weight of Gods hand and would decline it if it might stand with Gods will Els were it not lawfull to pray that affliction might be ended or eased if we might desire nothing that were possible to be contrary to Gods will since we know not his particular will touching our temporall troubles but by the euent n Defenc. pag. 126. li. 16. Thus Dauids and Christs were not onely possible to be contrarie but contrarie in deede as the sequell shewed You may as well inferre that God himselfe had contrary willes when he repented that he made man when he threatned destruction to Niniââ¦eh and death to King Ezechiah and yet vpon their prayers spared both howbeit it were blasphemie to say that God hath willes indeede contrary one to the other as the sequell sheweth He hath an absolute will working and perfourming in heauen and earth whatsoeuer pleaseth him which cannot be resisted nor frustrated by any means He hath a conditionall will by iustice threatning and punishing vs when we are sinfull and carelesse and by mercy sparing vs when we repent and turne vnto him And this will in him though it worke contrary effects in vs yet it is in him onâ⦠and the same will wherewith he giueth his owne as he best liketh pardoneth the penitent and reuengeth the obstinate the one agrââ¦eing with his mercie the other with his iustice So Christ had two willes the one proportioned to Gods creation whereby the flesh shrinketh and shunneth paine the other measured by Gods determination which declared his obedience and in either of these he accorded with the will of God who ment not onely to strike but to haue the stroke felt with paine and griefe to mans nature in Christ. o Defenc. pag. 126. li. 17. Howbeit both their desires were neuerthelesse holy made in faith assured to receiue as conditionall desires may be directed aright prepared sufficiently yet only for this cause seeing Dauid simply knew not Gods contrarie will Christ knew it not at this instant Dauid repented his sin with which God was displeased the more earnestly instantly because he saw the dislike which God had of his fact was the cause of death denounced to his child So that Dauids desire to please and pacifie God with most humble and inward submission the rather if it were possible to auert the wrath of God threatned to his child for his offence had in it pietie charitie humilitie and other good points of godly repentance and his prayer for his child was pardonable because he knew not Gods certaine resolution to the contrarie though he heard the Prophet in Gods name denounce p 2. Sam. 12. the child should surely die which Dauid tooke to be conditionall as other Gods threats are oftentimes the rather to reduce sinners to more zealous and hartie conuersion vnto God But in Christes prayers no such thing can be pretended His not remembring what he knew most assuredly and beleeued most stedfastly could not make his prayers to be prepared sufficiently directed aright and assured to receiue For neither preparation direction faith nor assurance could be in the soule of Christ without vnderstanding and memorie since neither forgetfulnesse nor ignorance of that which we should know doe warrant our prayers to be holy much lesse to be perfect and such as are assured to be heard And if all these conditions of faithfull and Godly prayer were found in Christs petition in the Garden as you confesse shew vs how they could be indeed contrary to Gods knowen will I haue no doubt of all Christes prayers and speaches but they were well aduised rightly prepared and throughly assured to be heard that is perfectly holy as he intended them but Christes not remembring the will of God reuealed to him could not performe or effect these things in his prayer but rather contrariwise his full knowledge and present remembrance of Gods will with exact obedience and submission thereunto Otherwise not remembring that which he well knew might excuse from sinne if hee were so amazed that vnderstanding and memorie failed him but it could not make him assured to receiue since God doth graunt their desires to such as dewly remember and not in such as in part or wholy forget his will Againe not remembring the trueth of Gods will reuealed is not faith in any man since faith is the sure and full perswasion of Gods will and promises toward vs which if we remember not how may we be said to be fully assured and firmely perswaded of them Wherefore you make out this matter with emptie words as your manner is least you should be taken tardie with a plaine error and haue peeced together very vntowardly diuers mens places the head not agreeing with the hââ¦eles since you first defended that Christ was forgetfull and all confounded in all the powers of his soule and senses of his bodie or else he had sinned in praying against Gods knowen will and now you
anouch his prayers were made in faith sufficiently prepared directed aright and assured to receiue yet onely sor this cause seeing he did not remember at that instant when he prayed Gods will so plainly reuealed vnto him and so often foretold by himselfe And yet the wordes themselues which Christ vsed in his prayer are directly referred to Gods will and whatsoeuer Christ feared or felt according to your conceit he was right sure was inflicted on him by Gods immediate hand and consequently by Gods will whose hand doth not worke without his will and yet seeing and feeling it to be Gods hand and so Gods will you make him not remember that it was Gods will What else is this but to make forgââ¦tfulnesse to be faith and error to be assurance and confusion to be sufficient preparation of the mind vnto prayer which are more then monsters in Christian religion and from which our Lord and master must be as free as from sinne q Defenc. pag. 126. li. 26. All in vaine then doe you charge me that I stretch the Scriptures beyond their wordes and trueth when in my discourse I shew that Christ in the Garden was astonished and grieuously perplexed the text hauing onely he began to be astonished and grieuously perplexed You tooke vpon you in your Treatise without all proofe against the plaine wordes and plainer circumstances of the text to pronounce that Christ in the Garden r Treat pa. 55. fell amazed and sorgetfull of himselfe and s Ibid. pa. 53. could not be but astonished ouerwhelmed and all confounded in his whole humanitie both in all the powers of his soule and senses of his bodie and vnlesse this had beene in him he had sinned in deede The ground of all this geere you made the words of S. Marke ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã he began to be afraid and in great heauinesse I obserued out of Ierom that it is one thing to begin to be heauie or sorrowfull as the text saith another thing to haue the Passion of heauinesse or sorrow to ouerwhelme the mind as you would haue it In this you say I charge you all in vaine and why so because the Scripture doeth sometime vse the word to beginne where the continuance followeth Had Ierom made no farder reason then that Christ began to be afraid and so auouched that nothing beginning might proceede or continue the places of Scripture heere heaped by you might haue made some shew but Ierom giueth a good reason of his words that the passion of feare and sorrow might not be excessiue and dominant in the mind of Christ because it is the sinfull corruption of our nature to be so ouerswayed with immoderate and suddaine affections in which he could not communicate with vs. This reason you skip and bend your selfe to proue the Scripture vseth the wordes he began where the action had continuance As though any man doubted thereof but as well good as bad actions must haue their beginnings before they can haue any proceeding or continuing but doth that word prooue that euery thing once begun is brought to an end or that euery affection rising in mans nature groweth to the highest degree if the word stand indifferent to signifie the beginning of euery action or affection either interrupted before the end or proceeding and continuing to the end and height thereof then make those words nothing for your extreme confusion of feare sorow growing to the greatest height that might be as you imagine And that the word naturally signifieth a beginning in the Scriptures without any necessitie that the action or affection should continue though some might proceede and increase where the Scripture testifieth so much there can be no question In the fourteenth of Luke Christ shewing by a familiar example of a builder how ridiculous and odious it is to begin a good thing and not to performe it repeateth the common mocke that followeth such vaine enterprises This man ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã began to build but could not make an end So sayth the Apostle to the Galathians t Galat. 3. Are you so vnwise that ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã beginning in the spirit you will end in the flââ¦sh S. Matthew describeth how Peter walking on the water towards Christ and beholding a mightie winde was stroken with feare u Matth. 14. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and beginning to sincke cried Lord saue me And Iesus straightway stretched out his hand and stayed him So in many other places x Philip. 1. I am persuaded of this that ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã he which hath begun a good worke in you will performe it to the day of Christ. When the tenne Disciples heard Iames and Iohn desire that one of them might sit at Christes right hand and the other at his left in glorie y Marc. 10. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã they began to disdaine ââ¦ames and Iohn but Christ presently called his Disciples vnto him and by his speech repressed ambition on the one side and indignation on the other So Peter when those that stood by him in the high Priests hall charged him by his tongue to be one of Christs followers z Matth. 26. ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã he began to curse and sweare he knew not the man And immediatly the cocke crew and Peter remembring the words of Iesus went out and wept bitterly repenting his fault An hundred examples might be brought where the word is in the like sort vsed to signifie the beginning of any thing as well without continuance as with when the Scripture expresseth so much but these are so cleere that they admit no contradiction And therefore Ieroms obseruation is verie true and grounded on better reason than your refutation a Defenc. pag. 127. li. 2. As Christ was indeed astonished so he did at first but begin to be thus then afterward grew to the full That he began to be afrayd the Euangelist sayth that he afterward grew to the full no Euangelist writeth any such thing except you take vpon you to be the fift Euangelist boldly and falsely to auouch that which the other foure doe not mention And as you enlarge the circumstances of the Euangelists so doe you restraine the significations of their words as pleaseth you for ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã by all Interpreters and euen by such as were the first deuisers of Christes forgetfulnesse is rendered expauescere to be afrayd and not to be astonished Caluine doth thus ââ¦xpresse the words oâ⦠S. Marke Caepit expauescere moerore affââ¦ci b Caluin harmonia in Marci ca. 14. Christ began to be afrayed and affected with griese As in S. Matthew he translateth the word ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã affici moestitudine to be touched with heauinesse and timor moestitia feare and heauinesse are all the words that by any warrant of sacred Scriptures Caluin could finde Beza in his Latine translation keepeth the same word Caepit expauescere Christ
129. li. 17. Where you would wring out a contrariety in my words as if I had said that Christ being in the depth of his astonishment did then perfectly know that the dominion of death should not hold him you doe me wrong I say not so In that place I argue from your supposition I haue no desire to charge you with impudency but you wax sometimes so intolerable in your brags and shifts that I must either betray the trueth or tell you in plaine termes that you doe face a great deale more then you can any way fasten by iust proofe Let this example stand in steed of many If I heere doe you wrong as you pretend and you reasoned only from my supposition let me beare the shame of it with all Christian Readers but if it be plainely and expressely otherwise then I pray you Sir who is the shifter and outfacer Looke on the Page of your Treatise quoted by me viz. Pa. 59 and see whether they be not your owne words which I cited in your answere to an obiection and iustified by you out of the 10 of Marke verse 34. To an argument that a Trea. pa. 59. li. 16. Christ might pray that his bodily death might not haue dominion ouer him you answere This is absurd to say that he praied in such feare and terror of mind against that which he perfectly knew should neuer come to him namely that the dominion of death should hold him Doe you confesse of yourselfe that you speake absurdly or doe you meane it of the obiectors against whom you bring this as a reason that since Christ * Mar. 10. 34. perfectly knew the dominion of death could not hold him You thinke it very absurd to say he feared that And in the page precedent doe you not againe and againe auouch the same exactnesse of knowledge in Christ at the time of his praiers these are your owne words tripled and quadruplied to that end b Trea. pa 58. li. 30. Thirdly this prooueth that Christ knew it was Gods determinate will in that he tearmeth it an houre that is a time set of God for his suffering Fourthly because he so mightily feared it therefore doubtlesse he knew that he was appointed to suffer it Thus it is manifest in plaine words he praied contrary to Gods knowen will And least you should not be constant in your manifest contradiction doe you not insist on the same words in your defence c Defenc. pag. 99. li. 13. He could not intentiuely pray against that nor feare that which he perfectly knew concerned him not at all Where you giue to Christ in that extreame astonishment which you dreame of intentiue praier and perfect knowledge of Gods will in some things which againe in other things you deny vnto him So that by your leaue you gainsay your selfe and your denying it is as vnshame fast as your doubling it d Defenc. pag. 129. li. 26. To conclude this matter without colour of reason you wrest a plaine text which otherwise as it lieth maketh strongly against you They are our Sauiour Christes owne words Now is my soule troubled and what shall I say Father saue me from this houre but therefore came I vnto this houre You say these words doe import a deliberation of two parts But you speake against all reason considering the nature and frame of the very words A deliberation must needs be set interrogatiuely in both clauses New the text is not so Of this place I haue spoken enough before were it not that you challenge me with such hatefull termes of wresting a plaine text without colour of reason because I therein follow the iudgement of Chrysostom and Epiphanius who a man would thinke had not only colour of reason but substance of learning to discerne the force of that speech First the words as well by the nature of the petition and your owne confession in that it is for a temporall thing as by the supplie of the rest of the Euangelists must be conditionall and haue a secret reseruation of Gods will as in the like case the other Euangelists do expresse and namely S. Marke who sayth e Marke 14. Christ prayed if it were pââ¦ssible that houre might passe from him And so whether they be deliberatiue or positiue they make nothing for your purpose since not with resolution but with condition If it pleased God Christ desired to be saued from that houre But I wrest a plaine text because I auouch that the words import a deliberation of two parts which you say must needs be set interrogatiuely in both clauses Whence commeth this new Art of Oratory that euery deliberation must be interrogatiue As though a man might not doubt or deliberate either by intââ¦rrogation condition or simple subiection of the paââ¦ts in question When Christ asked the chiefe Priests and Scribes f Marke 11. whence the baptisme of Iohn was from heauen or of men they thought within themselues If we say from heauen he will say Why then did ye not bââ¦leeue him But if we say from men we ââ¦eare the people So the foure Lepers that sate at the entring in of the gate of Samaria when the dearth was there in Elââ¦zeus time disputed with themselues g 2. Kings 7. Why sit we heare till we die if wee say we will enter into the Cittie the famine is in the Cittie and we shall die there And if we sit heere we die also Now therefore come let vs fall into the campe of the Aramites if they saue our liues we shall liue if they kill vs we are but dead As heere they reason with a condition so might they haue said to the same effect by way of proposing and answering to themselues what shall we doe to saue our liues we will enter the city there is the famine we will sit still heere is likewise death Let vs goe to the Aramites they will kill vs then we are but dead they will saue vs then gaine we our liues Is it not all one in this deliberation whether we propose the parts by interrogation condition or proposition In the words of our Sauiour likewise Now is my soule troubled and what shall I say The answere to that patheticall question What shall I say might haue beene made either by interrogation Shall I say Father saue me from this houre or by condition If I say Father saue me from this houre or by simple supposition I will or I would say Father saue me from this houre but therefore came I vnto this houre Which way soeuer we propose the former words Father saue me from this houre Christes answere by way of full resolution and conclusion But therefore came I into this houre doth conuince that the former words Father saue me from this houre are by himselfe remoued or denied as no part of his finall determination though it were or might be a part proposed in his deliberation For either Christ must positiuely
determine cleane contraries in one sentence which were open inconstancie and no way imaginable in the Sonne of God or this latter must remoue the former being repugnant to the maine consent of his will and intent of his comming For therefore came he into this houre of mans redemption because he would not be saued from it with mans destruction And thus much the best and most skilfull Interpreters haue collected to be the force of the wordes following to which Christ addeth the coniunction aduersatiue ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã which in their iudgement supposeth heere a negatiue precedent So Chrysostom conceiueth our Sauiours words I do not say saue me from this houre And why Because the words following with an aduersatiue repugnance to the former words doe proue not the first but the last to be Christs full purpose h Defenc. pag. 129. li. 38. Chrysostom Epiphanius doe descant about it trying how the text may beare such a meaning but it can not stand being so euidently against the course of the text Indeed Chrysostom and Epiphanius are not comparable to you neither in learning nor iudgement you make vs such new positions and principles both of reason and faith that their Diuinitie is stale to yours but with all learned and wise men the yongest of the twaine will be trusted for the true sense of a text farre before such Dreamers and Deuisers as you are The course of the text is euidently against it you say What course of the text The words vsed by our Sauiour are with it But therefore came I into this houre What sense or meaning can this sentence haue but that Christ purposely comming into this houre had no resolution to be deliuered from this houre which being true the former words Father saue me from this houre may shew the desire or doubt of nature inclining to that petition but the present refusall thereof followeth expressing Christes will and purpose in putting himselfe into that houre These words then But therefore came I into thiâ⦠houre are in effect not so for therefore came I into this houre Which the best Interpreters olde and new haue obserued in the force of Christes words i Chrysost. in Johaââ¦nem homil 66. Therefore came I into this houre as if Christ had sayd sayth Chrysostom though we be moued and troubled yet we flee not death For I say not thus as my resolution Father deliuer me from this houre but Father glorifie thy name And Epiphanius k Epipha li. 2. Heres 69. What shall I say Father speaking by way of preparation and dubitation ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã This sayth Christ I will say but therefore came I into this houre For he came not against his will but willingly Theophylact l Theophylact. in 12. cap. Johannis For this cause sayth Christ came I into this houre that I might suffer death for all He teacheth vs very plainly by this that though we be troubled and perplexed with it yet we should not flie death for the truth For I sayth he am troubled being a true man and permit mans nature to shew it selfe yet do I not say to my Father that he should saue me from this houre but what say I Father glorifie thy name The later Writers of no meane iudgement allow the same sense Erasmus thus rendreth the summe of Christes words m Erasm. paraphra in cap. 12. Johannis I finde my soule troubled for the day of my death now approching And what shall I say For the loue of mine owne life shall I neglect the life of the world By no meanes I will applie my selfe to the will of my Father Mans weaknesse troubled with feare of death may say vnto him Father if it be possible saue me from this instant danger of death But Loue desirous of mans saluation shall presently adde Nay ra-rather if it be expedient let death which I desired come for somuch as wittingly and willingly by the leading of the spirit I haue offered my selfe to die These words n Bullingerâ⦠in ca. Joh. 12. Bullinger citeth and calleth an excellent explication of that text Gualter in like maner o Gualteruâ⦠homilia 118. in 12. ca. Johannis This is as if Christ had sayd Let no man thinke me as a cowardly captaine to exhort others to patience and constance being my selfe safe from danger For death approcheth me and that so cruell and bitter that the very remembrance thereof troubleth my soule What then shall I say when amongst men there is no hope To thee ô Father I turne saue me from the houre of this terrible death But what do I say Euen therefore came I into this houre What other thing then shall I aske ô Father but that thou shouldest gloriââ¦ie thy name Doe all these learned Interpreters wrest this text and speake they against all reason without considering the nature and frame of the wordes or doe they out of the very frame and force of the wordes deduce Christes resolution to be this Father glorifie thy name notwithstanding my former words since I came of purpose into this houre not to be freed from it The first words p Defenc. pag. 129. li. 36. pretend a plaine resolution or at least a great inclining towards resolution If a plaine resolution then Christ contradicteth himselfe with a plainer resolution in the end which to affirme of the Sonne of God aduise you whether it be blasphemous or no. As for an inclination since Christ made no idle deliberation but spake out of his naturall humane affection abhorring death that maketh wholly with my speech affirming that howsoeuer the sense of nature in Christ did incline to auoid death in this debating with himselfe yet he presently refused it by saying But therefore came I into this houre and fully resigned it when he sayd Father glorifie thy name which resolution of his God ratified with his owne voice from heauen I haue glorified it and will glorifie it q Defenc. pag. 130. li. 10. Hence I reasoned effectually before but no where you answere it If Christs such suffeings in his soule were ordained of God for him then certainly indeed he did suffer the same Certainly indeed a man shall scant meet with such another that disdaineth all mens reasons and interpretations besides his owne and when he commeth to conclude any thing can hardly discerne an Owle from an Eagle Here is a profound argument made for your hell paines that Christes soule was troubled with the foresight and remembrance of his death on the Crosse ergo God ordained that certainly and indeed he should suffer in his soule the paines of the damned Children in their cradles if they could prattle would easily match the goodnesse of this reason and other answer as it needeth none so it shall haue none for me how effectuall soeuer this fansie seemeth vnto you r Defenc. pag. 130 li. 17. Further you except that this was feare of eternall death which caused in
Christ this agonie and from his feare he was deliuered To say as you do that it was eternall death and euââ¦rlasting malediction which Christ here thus wofully and distressefully feared is the strangest speech in Diutnity that euer I heard You cunningly dissemble as your maner is that Pag. 22. which you quote I professed to refuse no mans opinion that s Seââ¦m pag. 22. li. 2. agreed any way with the rules of trueth and thereupon layed downe three things which Christ might ãâã in the Cup of Gods wrath and by his prayer accordingly decline them to wit ãâã ãâã corporall ãâã aboue his strength and the separation of his soule from hiâ⦠bodââ¦e by deââ¦th The feare of eternall death which is vrged by some of good learning and euen by the Catechisme on which you would seeme to stand so much if we admiââ¦ted in Christ himselfe I sayd must be taken for a Religious dislike and shunning of hell t Sermo pag. 23. li. 4. not for any distrust of his owne saluation or doubt of Gods displeasure against himselfe which we could not imagine in Christ without euident want of grace and losse of faith and these we might not attribute to Christs person no not for an instant Where then I alleage so many reasons Pa. 23. u li. 32. guarding Christs person most sufficiently froâ⦠all danger and doââ¦bt of eternall death thence you collect that I auouch Christ thus ââ¦ofully and distressefully feared euerlasting damnation which is a strange and ãâã falsehood though familiar with you as if without such grosse stuffe you could not ãâã out your pamphlet The Catechisme we heard before saying that Christ was Aeternae mortis horrore persusus wholly touched with the horror of ãâã death M. Caluin sayth as much x Caluin in li. 2. ca. 16. sect 10. Vnde eum oportuit cum Infââ¦rorum copiââ¦s ãâã mortis horrore quââ¦si consertis manibus luctari Wherefore Christ was to wrestle hââ¦nd in ãâã with all the power of hââ¦ll and with the horrour of ETERNALL death Others might be brought in like sort but these suffice to discharge me that I did not imagine these things of mine owne head but found them in men of good learning and iudgement which yet I did not receiue except we did expound their words to import in Christ a religious feare declining euerlasting death in himââ¦elfe or affectionately sorowing when he consideââ¦ed what was due to vs for ouâ⦠sinnes Wherefore if you make so strangâ⦠of these words stirre against your authorized Catechisme and Master Caluin who first vsed them y Defenc. pââ¦g 130. li. 20. You cannot helpe your selfe in making Christes ââ¦eare of this death to be onely a religious feare and a feare for others these imaginations I haue remoued before Then you perceiue well enough in what sense I admit their words but to aduantage your selfe you dispence with a slaunderous lie Your remoouing is like the roling of paper to make pipes withall you play still on one string and that so much out of tune that euery man is wearie with hearing it besides your selfe z li. 29. These affections you say were not likelie in him at all much lesse to be the causes of such effects As though Christ had none other causes of sorow but onely this And what vnlikelihood that these should be in Christ at this season sauing that your fansie leadeth you to what you list These are not feare properly they ought rather to be called a religious care and pittââ¦e which differ greatly from the nature of feare properly taken Did I professe that Christ feared euerlasting death properly did I not rather excuse or qualifie the vehemencie of their wordes who put in Christ an horror of eternall death you reason now against the Catechisme which you make shew to maintaine and not against me For other feare of euerlasting death in Christ then improper I acknowledge none You thinke the nature of enlabeia will not admit any proper feare Then doe you conuince your selfe to be a notable deluder and abuser of the trueth For you are not ignorant what I say but you peruert it of purpose to miscarie your Reader and countenance your cause a li. 38. What say you did Christ doubt eternall damnation and therefore feared it you lacke a woodden dagger to become your part better haue I any such wordes or sense I shew the generall signification of ââ¦labeia to be b Conclus pa. 305. li. 25. a carefull and diligent regard to beware or decline that which we mislike or doubt and that as well in priuate and publike affaires as in Religion and you applie this as if I had sayd Christ feared and doubted eternall damnation Whereas I neither mention eternall damnation in all that section nor so much as name Christ within fourtie lines of those wordes which shew how largely enlabeia is taken You speake so darkly that I know not how to take you You double so continually that I cannot tell what to make of you I haue in the same page 305. whence you tooke these wordes distinctly shewed what parts of Gods wrath Christ might be said to feare or suffer and in what sense and yet you complaine of darknesse when you shun the light and watch for a word applied to another purpose pretending you must needes stumble at that straw And therefore neuer come in with any after close what my meaning may be if my wordes be not plaine reprooue them if they be refute them except you receiue them This you say commeth neerest to the signification of the Greeke word I graunt it doth touching eulabeia but in Maââ¦ke the word doth import properly feare and that in extremitie It is happie yet that when you cannot chuse you will graunt that which is fully prooued to your face In your vnlearned Treatise you would needs make as vnlearned an obseruation that c Treatis pag. 74. li. 22. this very word not onely in other Authors but in the Scripture is vsed for a perplexed feare And when your ignorance is conuinced for enlabââ¦ia is not onely lesse then ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã which is feare in the Greeke tongue but contrarie to it because it is the d De placitis Philoso li. 7. in zenone declining of euill with reason and circumspection as Diogenes Laertius writeth you graunt that which you cannot gainesay With as much skill you auouch that ekthambeiââ¦thai doth import properly feare and that in extremitie whereas properly it noteth admiration at any strange or suddaine sight Whether feare be ioyned with it or no which sometime is according to the cause and circumstance of the place e Defenc. pag. 131. li. 8. My reason that Eulabeia heere signifieth feare properly yea a perplexed feare and not onely a religious deuotion as you say is grounded not so much on the nature of the word as on the circumstances of the place and the other wordes of the text Christ did as
well naturally feare that which he suffered as that which he shunned though he were heard in that onely which he religiously shunned and not in the rest which he suffered And therefore the other wordes of the text doe not inferre that enlabeia contained all that Christ feared but onely that which he religiously feared and from which hee was freed And where you f Defenc. pag. 131. li 23. graunt the Apostle may intend this also by the nature of the word that Christ notwitstanding all this dreadfull feare yet declined not a iot from a most reuerend regard of obedience to God which still he kept firme and safe You thinke with your mixtures to worke some maruailes For that one and the same word in one and the same place should haue two repugnant or different significations and the Apostle there intend them both this is newes to all men saue to you to whom no manner of absurdities are new And where you would knit a dreadfull feare of euill from God and a reuerend regard of obedience to God both together in one word you make Christ at one instant to decline that which he did desire and to desire that which he did decline For what he did feare that he did decline and what he so reuerently regarded that he as much desired which was obedience to God and so by one and the same word you conceaue not onely contrary minds but contrary matters in Christ. g li. 29. To like effect this word signifieth in that place of the Acts 23. vers 10. as the circumstances also will confirme We should soone haue heard of those circumstances if any such had beene but if you omit them as weake I neede not entertaine them as worthy of answere I see no such circumstances as you speake of much lesse any such signification of the word as you haue framed vs out of the Apostle Euery caution declining any thing feareth somewhat which it would preuent and so eulabeia when it signifieth to be warie of any euill hath a feare of that euill lest it should happen and therefore seeketh the best meanes to decline it h Defenc. pag. 131. li. 32. Where you argue Christ was deliuered from his feare of hell torments ergo he suffered them not I denie your sequell This prooueth directly the contrarie He feared the death of the soule ergo he did suffer it My sequell I thinke hath ground sufficient in nature and Scripture to make it good When the Saints so often prayed to God to deliuer them from the dangers which they feared or found comming towards them did they meane they would suffer them first to the full and after bee losed from them or else that they would bee freed from them and not suffer them I know there is a deliuerance out of the midst of troubles and so you may defend that Christ was deliuered from hell fire because he did not suffer it eternally But since feare by the rules of nature is of future and not of present euill if Christ were heard from his feare that is deliuered from that which he feared then certainly he did not suffer it But thââ¦nce you inferre directly the contrary for i li. 36. that feare is of that which is to come as you say I well obserue Surely your sequels be like rotten rindes they fall a sunder as soone as they be touched Did I auouch that feare was of that onely which necessarily must come or of that which possibly might come to our selues or to others Is there any man of common sense that euer affirmed as you doe that whatsoeuer a man feareth must befall him for that is your direct proofe of which you speake that all things feared must necessarily come to passe Otherwise if men may feare that which is imminent and yet be freed from it how will it follow that Christ really suffered what he feared k Defenc. pag. 132. li. 2. Such a manner and measure of feare as this manifestly was could not be but a very suffering Of what of feare or of the thing feared feare is an affection or passion of the mind foreseeing euill that is possible and afflicting it selfe for the approching or possibilitie thereof But he that maketh no difference betwixt the feare of future euill and the sense of present euill confoundeth all things Men may feare they know not what yea they may feare where no feare is that is without iust cause but this is the weaknesse or guiltinesse of mans mind persuing it selfe by fearing that which they need not or should not feare l Defenc. pag. 132. li. 5. My soule is saith Christ full of actuall sorowes euen vnto death When you adde anything to the wordes of our Sauiour you should take care to put nothing to them but that which is sensible and true since he was full of wisdome and trueth Now this that you adde in helpe of your conceits is neither For sorrowes are passions not actions of the mind and therefore to say actuall sorrowes hath no sense in it If by actuall you meane present then you exclude all future sorrowes against the plaine wordes of our Sauiour who noteth his should continue vnto death As for present torments inflicted on the soule of Christ by the immediate hand of God the word perilypos doth no way reach to them nor expresse any such thing You may be therefore suffered to say m li. 6. there is in this no doubtfull word for that which you adde is so absurd and senselesse that no wise man will iudge it doubtfull * li. 7. your comparisons of fearing captiuitie death loosing a purse c. are deuices vnsit for diuinitie I match them not with Christs sufferings good sir but by them I shew how lewtering your Logick is in saying a man suffereth that he feareth which is so farre from trueth that euerie child may soone confute it and well deride it n Defenc. pag. 132. li. 12. God you say might well heare Christ two waies Frst by sufficient sustaining him in it Secondly by deliuering him out of it in due time Adde this interpretation then to the wordes of Christs prayers in the Garden and what is become of your maine position Christ prayed in plaine words contrarie to Gods knowen will For since God did sustaine Christ in that he suffered and in the end deliuered him with honour and glory the cup by your constuction may bee said in both these respects to haue passed from him and so in either sense God heard him and deliuered him from it But else where you are in greater earnest that Christ could not intentiuely pray against that nor feare that which he most perfectly knew could by no meanes euer possibly come neââ¦re him namely that the dominion of death should hold him If there you were in sadnesse then now you doe iest or worse to tell vs that God might well heare Christ in that he neuer did or could pray
death for which we must not pray But whosoeuer is borne of God sinneth not that sinne and so neither Christ who was the true Sonne of God nor any of his chosen who are the children of God by adoption can sinne that sinne nor die that death because he that is begotten of God liueth by God who is eternall life to all that know him and cleaue vnto him without separation If then the sinnes of the Elect be not vnto death but such as we in pietie may and in charitie must pray for consequently the death of the soule here meant by Saint Iohn is such as is not incident to any of the sonnes of God and so not the temporall hell which you communicate to Christ and his members Heere are your eight places of Scriptures proouing as you pretend the second death of the soule which you ascribe to Christ in euery one of which saue the first and second there can be no question but euerlasting damnation is intended and in those two the guiltinesse of eternall death which is due to sinne may be comprised in the name of death which the Apostle iustifieth when he sayth t Rom. 5. v. 12. The offence of one came on all men vnto condemnation which is in effect that he sayd before Death went ouer all men forasmuch as all men haue sinned But that any of these intend your temporall hell brought into this life not by snares and feares working on the soules of men but by substance and essence and not eternall death in hell fire with the Diuell and his Angels you nor all your adherents shall euer be able by any ground of holy Scripture to make it appeare And therefore your presuming it vpon the bare shew of places concluding no such thing is a pestilent intrusion vpon the word of God whiles you sticke not to couple your conceits which are false and erroneous with his vndoubted and vndefiled trueth x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 31. First ordinarily and commonly it belongeth only to the damned wherewithall are the ordinarie accidents and concomitants desperation induration vtter darknesse c. with perpetuitie of punishment and that locally in HELL Generally and truely the Scriptures neuer vse the name of the second death but for the lake burning with euerlasting fire into which the Diuell and all the Reprobate shall be cast and whatsoeuer you otherwise pretend is your owne absurd deuice without the Scriptures and against the Scriptures to keepe your doctrine from open derision and detestation And since your selfe acknowledge that this is the ordinarie and vsuall doctrine of the Scriptures it shal be needfull for your Reader to hold you to that till you fully proue your extraordinarie deuice by the same Scriptures by which the other is euidenly confirmed and so much openly confessed by you y Defenc. pag. 135. li. 36. In this sense the Fathers generally do take it where they denie that Christ suffered the death of the soule and so do we If your cause haue so little holde in the Scriptures it hath lesse in the Fathers who in the necessarie worke of our redemption thought it sacriledge to say any thing that was not apparently proued by the Scriptures And as you light not on a true word when you come to deliuer vs the mysteries of your new hell so this is patently false that the Fathers generally take the death of the soule for eternall damnation only when they denie that Christ died the death of the soule They speake as the Scriptures leade them and confessing two deaths of the soule as the Scriptures doe which are sinne excluding all grace and the wages of sinne euen euerlasting damnation they generally denie that Christ died any death of the soule and haue for confirmation of their doctrine therein the whole course of the sacred Scriptures concurring with them x Defenc. pag. 135. li. 37. Secondly the death of the soule or the second death may be extraordinarily and singularly considered namely to imply no more but simply the very nature and essence of it You broach two apparent and euident vntrueths which you make the whole foundation of your presumptuous errour First that either Christ or his Elect in this life did or do suffer the very nature and essence of the second death Next that the Scriptures do singularly and extraordinarily reserue that kinde of second death for Christ and his members Shew either of these by the word of God before you make them grounds of your doctrine or els any meane Reader may soone conceiue you meane to teach no trueth confirmed in the Scriptures but a bolde and false deuice of your owne which you would extraordinarily intrude vpon the word of God a Defenc. pag. 136. li. 5. This is a death to the soule as before we haue shewed according to this sense the Scriptures and Fathers before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. When you glaunced before at the death of Christes soule you prayed vs to haue patience When the Defender shouââ¦d proue the death of Christs soule he sayeth bee hââ¦th proued it already till you came to the place where we should receiue a reasonable satisfaction and now you are come to the place where you should make iust and full proofe thereof you send vs backe againe and say you haue shewed it before What meaneth this doubling and deceiuing of your Reader but that you would seeme to haue many proofs when indeed you haue none and therefore you post vs to and fro to seeke for that we shall neuer finde In the 113. Page of this Defence you went about by your miserable misconstruing of certaine wordes vsed by some of the Fathers to enforce a shew of a death on the soule of Christ but against the haire as there I haue proued and therefore stand not on your former vnfortunate aduentures but either heere make proofe by the Scriptures that Christ died the death of the soule or leaue prating and publishing it so confidently as you and your adherents do for the chiefe part of mans redemption The Scriptures and Fathers you say before noted may rightly be vnderstood not to denie it in Christ. Is this all you haue to say for the death of Christes soule that the Scriptures and Fathers may be vnderstood not to denie it The Scriptures must affirme it before you can make it any point of Christian religion or part of our reconciliation to God b Rom. 10. Faith is by hearing and hearing by the word of God and not by not denying If that be your course to put any thing to the Creed which you list to say the Scriptures doe not denie you may quickly haue a large Creed containing all things which the Scriptures abused with your figures and wrested to your fansies shall not in expresse words as you thinke denie c Defenc. pag. 136. li. 9. Moreouer let it be obserued that if we had no proofes at all
of sacred and prophane writers for farder proofe hereof but these are enough to shew that Chrysostom Photius Oecumenius Theophylactus and other Graecians commenting on those words of the Apostle did not forget the propriety of their owne tongue when they expounded this text as declaring that Christ was heard for the reuerend respect of God to his sonne or for the religious submission of the sonne to his Father and the Latin Fathers Ierom Ambrose Primasius Sedulius Bede Haymo and others following the same translation did not erre of ignorance but duely considered the nature and force of the Apostles words Where then you haue made vs a stout conclusion that Christ thus fearing could feare nothing but the death of the soule or the second death you cannot iustly prooue by any words heere vsed that Christ had any feare much lesse such a feare as you imagine though I may safely grant a feare and such a feare as the Scriptures describe or expresse of Christ and you nothing the neerer to your presumptuous conceit Now if we giue eare to the auncient Fathers discussing this place your deuice hath neither strength nor stay in these words p Ambros. in 5. ca. epistolae ad Hebreos Beatus Paulus hic dicit preces cum et supplicationes fundere non timore mortis sed nostrae causa salutis Vnde in alio loco dicit sanguinem Christi melius clamasse pro nobis quam sanguinem Abel Blessed Paul heere saith as Ambrose writeth that Christ offered praiers and supplications not for any feare of his owne death but for the cause of our saluation Wherevpon in another place Paul saith the bloud of Christ cried better things for vs then the bloud of Abel And againe q Ibidem Totum quicquid egit Christus in carne preces sunt supplicationes propeccatis humani generiâ⦠All whatsoeuer Christ did in the flesh were praiers and supplications for the sinnes of mankind So saith Primasius r ãâã in ãâã ãâã ad Heââ¦reos All that Christ did in the flesh were praiers and supplications for the sinnes of mankind and the sacred shedding of his bloud was a strong crie in which he was heard of God his Father for his reuerence That is for his voluntary obedience and most perfect charity s Ibidem Christ heere is sayd to haue powred forth prayers and supplications not for feare of death but rather in the ãâã our saluation And we must note that reuerence as Cassiodorus sayth is taken sometimes for loue and sometimes for feare but here it is put for the exceeding loue wherewith the Sonne of God embraced vs and for the perfect obedience whereby he was subiect to his Father euen vnto death So Sedulius t ãâã in 5. ca. ãâã ad Hebreos Christ prayed with teares not soed for feare of death but for our saluation and was heard of God the Father when the Angel did comfort him For his reuerence either his with his fathers or his fathers towards him Haymo treadeth in the same steps with Primasius u ãâã in 5. ca. ãâã ad Hebrââ¦os The Apostle speaketh this of Christ meaning plainly to expresse what our hie Priest ââ¦id in his Priesthood What is in the daies of his flââ¦sh as long as he dwââ¦lt in this mortall body he offered vp praiers and supplications with strong cries and teares to God his father All that Christ did in the flesh were ãâã and supplications for the sinnes of mankind and the sacred shedding of his bloud was a strong crie ãâã herein he was heard of God his Father for his reuerence that is for his voluntary ãâã and most perfect charity God heard him in raising him vp the third day as the Psalmist saith thou wilt not suffer thine holy one to see corruption If then the Apostles purpose were to note as these Fathers affirme that Christ all the time of his conuersing heere with men shewed himselfe our hie Priest with strong cries and teares for vs to God that was able to saue him and his members from death or to raise him againe from death as conquerer thereof and was heard for his religious obedience and loue to God and man what shew hath the death of Christes soule in these words or what sequence from them Neither is there any part of this exposition that wanteth good warrant from the Scriptures and likewise allowance from the fathers For bââ¦sides that Christ said to Paul as yet a persecutor x Acts 9. Saul Saul why persecutest thou me not in person but in members the Apostle setteth these things downe for assuââ¦ed points of doctrine that y Rom. 6. our old man was crucified with Christ and we z ãâã 2. buried with him and raised vp and quickened together with him and a ãâã 2. made sit together in heauenly places in Christ Iesus b ãâã de ãâã ãâã ad ãâã li. 2. We were in him as in a second first fruits or new restoring of our nature praying with a strong crie and not without teares desiring the impery of death to be abolished and the life which was at first giuen to our nature to be restored But here of I haue spoken so much before that I may spare my paines in this place Only if we follow the ãâã which the Syriak interpreter proposeth agreeable to the greeke and latin Fathers that Christ c Testamentum ãâã ca. 5. ad Hebreos when he was compassed with flesh offered praiers and petitions with a vehement crie and teares to him that was able to raise him or quicken him from death and was heard We need none other subuersion of all your syllogismes For then the thing which Christ so earnestly desired with strong cries and teares was the resurrection of himselfe and of all his members after the death of the body into a perpetuall and celestiall life d Defenc. pag. 137. li. 22. When in the garden Christ praied against that cup which he feared that it might passe from him there he yeeldeth and submitteth himselfe presently to the vndergoing of it But it were I know not what to saie that Christ did euer yeeld and submit himselfe to vndergoe eternall death or to tast the cup of gods eternall malediction Therefore it was not this that he feared and heere praid against You are somwhat idle headed to make such a stur for that which I am farder from then you are At the sharpenesse of Christs bodily death which he would not frustrate nor mitigate and in the paines whereof he was to yeeld more perfect obedience and patience then all mankind besides was able to doe the weaknesse of his humane flesh might naturally somewhat stagger and the power of Gods hand against sinne which might be laied on his ââ¦oule or body he might vehemently but righteously feare and with strong cries and teares deprecate the force thereof and in neither of these is there any vicinity with the second death or with
these and such like actions and passions with the bodie For the force to doe and since to feele is from the soule and so in the death of the bodie the soule is partaker with the bodie not to lie dead and senselesse as the bodie doth but to feele the paine of death and suffer the separation from the bodie ãâã the effects of death appeare in the bodie But that the soule doth die when the whole compound of bodie and soule dieth is no consequent neither in Philosophie nor Diuinitie z Defenc. pag. 137. li. 20. The text heere speaketh as I iudge of the whole and intire sufferings of Christ. The text heere speaketh of death bereauing life which was after re-ââ¦stored when Christes bodie was againe quickned by the power of his spirit the rest of Christes sufferings during the whole time of his life are not comprised in the name of death otherwise Peter must haue sayd Christ was alwayes dead since his affections ãâã with circumcision if not before which is no part of Peters speach nor meaning yea rather it is repugnant to both since Peter saith Christ a 1. Peter 3. suffered once fââ¦r sinnes when he was put to death and not euer and alwayes whiles he liued on ââ¦arth b Defenc pag. 137. li. 35. Against this obseruation what pretended you some Scriptures palpably abused first Matthew where Christ speaketh of his Disciples that their spirit their inward regenerate man was ready to watch bââ¦t their flesh their corrupt Nature was weake and sluggish ãâã is this to Christs flesh and spirit If my authoritie were as good as yours and my learning as great I could say as you doe I iudge it so but if I shew not better reason for me to aââ¦firme those wordes Christ ment of himselfe then you doe or can that he ment them not of himselfe I am content your consistorian seeming shall goe before my laborious proouing my vse is not to relie too much on mine owne iudgement as you doe though I thanke God I can examine both your and other mens interpretations but when I finde a thing maturely and rightly considered and concoââ¦ded by the learned and auncient Fathers in matters of faith or exposition of the Scriptures I goe not easily from them Tertullian saith c Tertullianus de suga in persecutione Christ himselfe professed his soule was ãâã vnto death his flesh weake that he might shew to thee there were in himselfe both the substaââ¦ces of man by the propertie of heauinesse in the soule and weakenesse in the flesh Athanasius likewise d Athanasius de Passione Cruââ¦e ãâã A little afore his death Christ cried the spirit was willing but the flesâ⦠weakâ⦠that our aduersarie the diuell encountring him as a man might feele his diuine power Theophilus Alexandrinus e ãâã epistola Paschali prima contra Appollinaristas If Christ tooke onely the flesh of man and not the soule of man why in his Passion did he say the spirit is prompt but the flesh weake Ambrose f Ambros. ls 4. in ãâã ca. 4. If Christes body had beene spirituall he would not haue said the spirit is prompt but the flesh is weake Heare the voice of either in Christ as well of weake flesh as of a readie spirit The auncient writer among the works of Saint Austen g De Salutaribus documentis ca. 64. The trueth it selfe our Lord Iesus Christ saith of himselfe the spirit is prompt but the flesh weake Cyrill h Cyrill Thesauri li. 10. ca. 3. Though Christ abhorred death as a man yet as a man he refused not to doe the will of his Father and his owne as God and therefore he said the spirit is prompt but the flesh is weake Vigilius i Vigilius contra ãâã li. 5. ca. 4. What is that wherein he suffered and tried weakenesse but mans nature whereof he said at the time of his passion the spirit is prompt but the flesh weake tasting of which infirmitie he learned to helpe the weake Seuerianus k Seuerianus contra Nonatum citatur a ãâã contra ãâã hem My soule saith Christ is he auic vnto death And interpreting to what his Passions pertained the spirit saith he is ready but the flesh weake Remigius l ãâã in ãâã ãâã 26. ãâã a Tho. ãâã in ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã In these words Christ sheweth that he tooke true flesh of the Virgine and that he had a true soule Wherefore he now saith that his spirit is ready to suffer but that his weake flesh feareth the paine of his Passion Euthymius m ãâã in ãâã My God my God said Christ why hast thou for saken me that is why hast thou left me in this feare knowing my spirit is ready but my flesh weake What thinke you had I no more reason to say as I saide then you haue to denie it where also you may note that all these learned Fathers refuse your lame obseruation as well as I doe and so you had neede seeke some better authoritie then your owne or perhaps some one that ãâã you with this rule seruing to none other end but to helpe forward your hell fansie n ãâã pag. 139. li. 1. Thinke you that Christs soule was willing to suffer as God had appointed but that his flesh resisted veââ¦ily so you seeme heere to vnderstand and it is as likely as your applying of flesh and spirit to Christ in your pag. 104. Put on your visard before you take in hand to controle the iudgement of so many Fathers Your pride is greater then your wit in this and most things that passe your pen. Is it such newes to you for me or for them to say that Christes flesh was weake that is not so ready to suffer as was his soule seeth your mastership no difference betwixt weakenesse and resistance specially when in comparison of the readinesse of the spirit the flesh is said to be weaker that is lesse ready to suffer then the soule doth not the Apostle applie the same word vnto Christ when he saith Christ was o 2. Cor. 13. crucified through weakenesse and long before the Prophet said of Christ p Esa. 53. He is a man full of sorrowes and one that hath experience in infirmites So that your cholor was kindled without cause when you strooke such an heat with my saying that Christs flesh was weake the Prophet foretold he should be a man full of sorrowes and well acquainted with infirmities The vntrue conceit which you challenge in the 104. Page of my Sermons touching Christes flesh where I sayd it must haue force to cleanse and quicken when you impugââ¦e I will defend in the meane time it may serue I savd nothing but what our Saââ¦iour sayd before me q Iob. 6. vers 56. 54. He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my bloud dwelleth in me and I in him he hath eternall life and I will raise him vp at the last
day If you could take any hold I doubt not the sharpenesse of your teeth but your foolish conceits are caried like clouds in the aire they rest not before they vanish r Defenc pag. 139. li. 5. Then Luke where both spirit and flesh are not intended of Christ as our obseruation requireth but only the flesh Your obseruation is made to fitte S. Peters words to your fansie For there are not many places in Scripture where spirit and flesh are expressed and intended of the two natures of Christ though in other places some words adioyned doe prooue him to be God as well as man In that of S. Luke Christ doth not denie himselfe to be a diuine spirit for then he were no God since God is a s Iohn 4. spirit nor to haue an humane spirit for then he were no man but that which they saw with their eies he affirmed was flesh and bloud and not any apparition in the shape of a man And the words following t Luke 24. as ye see me to haue containe and note the other part of his humane nature which was his soule and spirit and consequently inferre that he was a man and had an humane spirit though compassed with flesh and bones as we haue u Defenc. pag. 139. li. 7. Then the Romans where I affirme that flesh signifieth the whole manhood of Christ according to the which he came from Dauid euen as well as Salomon or Nathan did who were Dauids sonnes in their intire and perfect nature Whether Christs body without a soule which was but a Carcasse be alwaies in the Scriptures intended by the name of Christs flesh this is not the question there is but one place in the new Testament where Christs flesh importeth his dead body as when Peter saith Christes x Acts 2. flesh saw no corruption but whether whatsoeuer is attributed to Christs flesh with comparison or mention of his diuine nature doe properly agree as well to his soule as to his body this is the thing in question betwixt you and me That the man Christ was borne of the Virgin and died on the Crosse there is no doubt but that his soule was made of the seed of Dauid and circumcised crucified as well as his body this is your error and for this you haue no shew in the word of God and therefore you seeke by rules of your owne making to draw it in by the heeles when you cannot by the head It is but a shift to saue your selfe when you tell your Reader that Christs whole manhood came from Dauid as well as Salomon or Nathan did The point is whether Christes soule were made of the seed of Dauid as well as his body was That I denie and haue the Apostle for my warrant that men are only the y Heb. 12. Fathers of our bodies and God is the immediate Father of our spirits Which if it be true in all men then Salomon and Nathan were the sonnes of Dauid not because their soules were made of the seed of Dauid but only their bodies and yet since they drew as much from their father as children by Gods ordinance do or may do therefore were they the sonnes of Dauid In Christ it is most sure which the Apostle saith that according to the flââ¦sh he was made of the seed of Dauid This by no meanes can be verified of his soule howsoeuer you would slubber it vp by calling his whole manhood the sonne of Dauid which I doe not denie Not that his soule was made of the seed of Dauid as was his body that is an open and an odious error but that his flesh made of the seed of Dauid which was the Virgins body was also quickened with a soule from God in due time that came not out of Dauids loines Euen so the whole man in Christ died on the Crosse not that his soule was depriued of life or left dead as was his body but that the coniunction of soule and body which maketh the whole man was dissolued by death his flesh lying in the graue without corruption and his soule remaining in the hands of God to which it was commended z Defenc. pag. 139. So likewise Christ was kinne to the lewes according to his whole humanity as well as Paul was When you can shew kindred in spirits as well as in flesh that is deriued from parents then say that Paul and Christ were kin to the Iewes according to their whole humanity till you proue that howsoeuer vse of speach may be endured which must be interpreted according to the truth you can neuer conclude there is consanguinity betweene soules as there is betweene bodies And spight of your heart if you will not maintaine vntrueths to vphold your credit as your maner is the Apostle teacheth you how to vnderstand those words that as we haue fathers of our bodies from whom our spirits come not but immediatly from God so kindred and consanguinity which commeth by the parents goeth by flesh and bloud receiued from them and not by soules infused from God S. Iohn leadeth you to the same rule that men are borne of bloud and of the will of the flesh and so by flesh and bloud commeth kindred God giuing soules to quicken their bodies Wherefore the Scriptures when they expresse kindred they note it by flesh and bone As when Laban said to Iacob Thou art my a Gene. 29. bone and my flesh So Iudah of Ioseph b Gene. 37. he is our brother and our flesh So Abimelech to his mothers brethren c Iudic. 9. I am your bone and your flesh And vsualy where kindred is claimed or yeelded the Scriptures expresse it by d 2. Sam. 5. 19 flesh and bones as Adam said to Eue e Gen. 2. This now is bone of my bone and flesh of my flesh So that howsoeuer you dreame or talke of the consanguinity of soules it is like the rest of your nouelties which haue no handfast but in your head and the exception taken by me will stand good doe you and your adherents what you can that in these attributes to the manhood of Christ you shall neuer prooue they properly pertaine to both parts but to the whole conioyned or to one part seuerally respected f Defenc. pag. 139. li. 21. Further that which you bring out of the Corinthians compared with this in Peter doth most cleerely open and confirme the same He was crucified touching his infirmitie but liueth by the power of God His soule had infirmities of suffering in it aswell as his bodie therefore his soule also is vnderstood here that it was crucified and died that is according to the condition thereof You proue not what you promise but pronounce what you please which if any man will suffer you to doe we shall soone haue a new Church a new Faith and all things new Afore you pretended rules at least though void of reason and trueth now you
ca. 1. epist. ad Rom. through the spirit of sanctification He meaneth by the holy Ghost which Christ gaue to the beleeuers in him Theodulus x Theodulus in cap. 1. ãâã ad Romanos through the spirit of sanctification that is by the holy spirit which Christ gaue to those that beleeued in him Theophylactus y Theophylact. in ca. 1. epist. ad Romanos by the spirit of sanctification that is by the spirit with which he maketh the beleeuers holy Haymo z Haymo in ca. 1. epistolae ad Romanos the spirit of sanctification is heere taken for the holy Ghost who giueth sanctity to men and Angels who also fashioned quickened and sanctified Christs manhood in the Virgins womb of the seed of the Virgin without the seed of man The new writers with one consent as Erasmus Zuinglius Peter Martyr Bullinger Musculus Gualter Hemmingius Aretius and Caluine himselfe follow the same interpretation so that your obseruation against and after all their iudgements is misbegotte and borne out of time and brought in of purpose to paue the way for your new found fansies which haue no ground but in your new made notes as much crossing probabilitie as authoritie Yea the obseruation wrongeth the distinction of the persons in the most blessed Trinitie and dishonoreth rather the Deitie of the Sonne of God then aduanceth it whiles the Sonne of God and the spirit of holinesse being both expresly named you take them both for one person and make the Sonne of God in his diuine nature to be lesse then the possessor or giuer of life and righteousnesse eueu a receauer of both For in all these places where you say the name of spirit is vsed to signifie Christs Godhead the power and worke of the holy Ghost is there intended and expressed as that Christ was a Rom. 1. declared to be the Sonne of God by the spirit of sanctification and was b 1. Tim. 3. God manifested in the flesh iustified by the spirit as also c 1. Pet. 3. mortified in the flesh but quickned by the spirit The spirit of sanctification is the title of the holy Ghost sanctifying as well the Manhood of Christ as his members and the giuing thereof declareth the Sonne to be true God whose spirit this is as well as the Fathers and by whom the Sonne worketh as well as the Father And where it is written that Christ was Iustified and quickned by the spirit if there you reade in the spirit meaning in the Deitie of Christ then Christes Godhead receaued life and righteousnesse which by your leaue is a speech ne allowed ne frequented in the Scriptures For though the second person in Trinitie by his internall and eternall generation receaued all that he hath from the Father who begat him yet of this generation which is secret substantiall and eternall the Apostles speake not when they say Christ was quickned and iustified but the one sheweth that Christes body which was put to death was raised againe to life by the power of his spirit the other noteth that he was God manifested in the flesh and iustified that is prooued and confirmed so to be by the mightie workes and graces of Gods spirit shewed as well in his owne person as in all his members For that is the intent of the Apostles wordes not that his diuine glorie was onely praised or acknowledged of men but that the world beleeued the Angels admired the spirit iustified that is most mightily and cleerely witnessed him to be God manifested in the flesh Then hath your obseruation his full discharge since there is no one place where these wordes the spirit and flesh are applied to Christ to note his two natures though his Godhead be testified and plainely prooued in most of the same places by more pregnant wordes then spirit which is common to Angels soules and windes and onely sheweth that it is no palpable or sensible body where the name of spirit alone in the Scriptures standing for the third person in Trinity noteth the power and grace of the holy Ghost by which these things were wrought for Christs manhood And in that place of Peter on which you most depend if you follow the Syriac translation to which your owne adherents so often appeale the Apostles words are Christ was dead in body but liuââ¦d in spirit which conuinceth first that flesh is there taken for the body of Christ contrary to your obseruation and that Christ still liued in spirit which euerteth your maine conclusion intended from this place for the death of Christs soule But were it as you suppose that flesh and spirit were ascribed to Christ to declare his two natures the one to be corporall and humane the other to be spirituall and diuine how doth it follow that euery thing affirmed of his manhood must properly agree both to body and soule by what Logicke conclude you that you may as well auouch that Christs soule is truely corporall or carnall because it is comprised vnder the name of flesh as that other attributes of the body are verified in the soule Which if you thinke absurd though the name of flesh by a figure of speach import the whole man because the Scripture speaketh not of a dead but of a liuing man then is there lesse cause that ech action or passion affirmed of the flesh should exactly or properly be referred to the soule since the common vse of speach intending the whole by a part is figuratiue and in figuratiue speaches as where the soule or the flesh are taken for the whole man the attributes cannot be properly restrained to ech part no more then the names are And euen out of those places by which you would collect death to be common to the body and soule of Christ the auncient fathers conclude death to be proper to the body of Christ and not common to the soule as Austin out of Saint Peter d August ãâã 99. Quid est enim quòd viuificatus est spiritu nisi quââ¦d eadem caro qua sola fuer at mortificat us viuificante spiritu resurrexit What other meaning hath this that Christ was quickned by the spirit but that the same flesh in which onely he was put to death rose againe by the quickning of the spirit And Cyrill e Cyrill de recta fide ad ãâã li. 2. Was it not a worke of infirmitie to endure the crosse I confesse saith Paul hee was weake in the flesh but he reuiued againe by the power of God And how was he weake by suffering his owne bodie to taste death for vs and restoring to life againe that very temple of his bodie not doing this by the weakenessc of his flesh but by the power of God Christ f Ibidââ¦m died for vs not as a man like one of vs but as a God in flesh giuing his owne bodie a ransome for the life of all Wherefore his Disciple Peter saith wisely and warily that
death haue had place in him if he had not had a mortall bodie And againe o Idem de incarnat verbâ⦠Death of it selfe could not appeare but in the bodie and therefore Christ put on a bodie that finding death in his bodie he might abolish it Ambrose p Ambros. de fide ad Gratianum li. 3. ca. 5. Who is he that would haue vs partakers of his flesh and bloud Surely the Sonne of God Quomodo nisi per carnem particeps factus est noster aut PER QVAM NISI CORPORIS MORTEM mortis vincula dissoluit IN QVO NISI IN CORPORE expiaââ¦t peccata populi IN QVO PASSVS EST NISI IN CORPORE Sicut supra diximus Christo secundum carnem passo How was he made our Partner but by flesh and by what death other than the death of his bodie did he dissolue the bands of death WHEREIN BVT IN HIS BODIE did he expiate the sinnes of the people WHEREIN BVT IN HIS BODIE did he suffer As wee sayd before Christ suffered in the flesh Chrysostom q ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã * ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã r We died a double death therefore we must looke for a double resurrection Christ died but one kind of death therefore herose but one kind of resurrection Adam died body and soule he died to sinne and to nature In what day soeuer ye eat of the tree said God ye shall die the death That very day Adam did not die in which he did eat but he then died to sinne and long after to nature The first is the death of the soule the other is the death of the body For the death of the soule is sinne or euerlasting punishment To vs men there is a double death and therefore we must haue a double resurrection To Christ there was but one kinde of death for he sinned not and that one kinde of death was for vs. He owed no kind of death for he was not subiect to sinne and so not to death Therefore he as free from sinne rose but one ãâã We as gââ¦e of sinne die a double death and so must haue a double resurrection This Sermon whence these words are taken thought it be not amongst Chrysostomes printed Volumes yet besides that it was published in print by FRONTO DVCââ¦VS it is found in the written Greeke copie of Chrysostom lying in New Colledge Librarie in Oxford whence these words are taken little differing from the printed copie Out of Augustine though much be sayd and much more might be yet thinke I not meet to omit some places as well for the cleerenesse as the rarenesse of them some of them being sufficiently witnessed vnto vs by others though they be not found at this day among his printed works And first of those that are found s August de ãâã ãâã 4 ca. 3. Vtrique rei nosâ⦠id est animae corpori medicina resurrectione opus crat Mors animae impiet as est mors corporis corruptibilitas Sicut enim anima Dco deserente sic corpus anima deserente nââ¦ur vnde illâ⦠sit insipiens hoc exanime Huic ergo DVPLAE MORTI NOSTRAE Salââ¦or impendit SIMPLAM SVAM adfââ¦ciendam vtramque resuscitationem nostram in Sacramento exemplo praeposuit proposuit VNAM SVAM Neque enim fuit peccator aut impâ⦠vt et tanquam spiritu mortuo in interiori homine renouari opus esset sed Indutus carne mortali EA SOLA MORIENS EA SOLA RESVRGENS EA SOLA NOBIS ad vtrumque concinuit cùm in ea fieret interioris hominis sacramentum ãâã exemplum Either part of vs that is both soule and body needed curing and raising The death of the soule is impictie and the death of the bodie corruptibilitie As the soule dieth when God for saketh her so the bodie dieth when the soule for saketh it whereupon the one is soolish the other senselesse To this double death of ours our Sauiour applied his single death and to make a double resurrection in vs he preferred and proposed his one kind of death for a Sacrament and for a Precedent for he was no sinner or wicked person that he should need any renewing as one dead in spirit but putting on mortall flesh and dying in that ALONE and rising in that ALONE he fitted that ALONE to both our deaths placing therein a Sacrament for our inward man and an example for our outward So againe t Idem contra ãâã Arianum ca. 16. ca. 18. Sensit mortem Christus sicut omnes sentiunt qui moriââ¦nte carne mentibus viuunt c. Credo mortuum esse filium Dei illa quae secundum naturam generalis est cunctis non illa quae specialis est malis Christ selt death as all feele it who dying in the flesh liue in their spirits I beleeue the Sonne of God died that death which by Nature is common to all not that which is proper to euill men The words which the second Councell of Hispalis doth cite out of S. Austins writing against Maximinus are woorth the hearing though they be not now in his printed works as many other things are not which Bede and others alleage out of him u Concilium Hispalens 2. ca. 13. ex August aduersus Maximinum Vbi resurgit nisi in eo quod potuit cadere Vbi resurrexit nisi in eo vbi mortuus Quaere mortem in verbo nunquam esse potuit QVAERE MORTââ¦M IN ANIMA NVNQVAM IBI FVIT Quaere mortem in carne planè ibi fuit Et paulò pòst Quid miraris Nec mortua est anima nec verbum mortuum est CARO TANTVM MORTVA EST. Where was Christ raised but in that which might fall Wherein did he rise but in that wherein he died Seeke for death in his deitie it could neuer be there Seeke for death in his SOVLE IT NEVER VVAS THERE Seeke for death in his flesh there was it indeed And a little after Why doest thou maruell Neither was Christes soule dead nor his Godhead ONLY HIS FLESH DIED Neither want the same words in effect in his printed Sermons x In Iohannem tractat 47. Hoc suscitabatur quod mââ¦ur Nam verbum non est mortuum anima illa non est mortua That was raised in Christ which died The Deitie died not yea his soule died not y Ibidem Quid fecit mors nisi corpus ab anima separauit in morte sola caro est a Iudaeis occisa What did death in Christ more than seuer his bodie from his soule in death his flesh only was killed of the Iewes The councell it selfe adding of their own saith z Concilium Hispalens 2. ca. 13 Prophetia quoque in psalmis passionem Christi in carne sola sic asserit Foderunt manus meas pedes meos dinumer auerunt omnia ãâã Vbi non deitatis sed tantum
you depriue him of saith hope loue grace truââ¦th or the spirit of God you leaue him in Infidelitie desperation hatred of God reprobation falshood and make him no way the Sonne of God since they onely are the sonnes of God who are ledde by the spirit of God Now what shamefull and impious enormities these are you can easily coniecture So that of force you must confesse the soule of Christ to be liuing and endued with all these parts and powers of the life of God or else you must professe your selfe to be nothing lesse then a Christian And euen the praiers which he made and obedience which he shewed in all and euerie his conflicts and agonies prooue his soule not onely to liue but to rest assuredly on the fauour and loue of God towards him which are no fruites nor effects of the death of the soule but exactly the conrrarie Yet paine you thinke Christ might all this while suffer and that most extreame which you call the death of the soule Your calling sweete sower good badde light darknesse and life death changeth not the natures of the things but conuincââ¦th your owne ignorant and wilfull headinesse You must call things in Christ not as pleaseth your fansie but as the word of God directeth and by witnesse thereof shall you neuer be able to proue that Christs soule was dead since thence so many sure demonstrations may be brought that Christs soule was alwaies u Iohn 1. full of truth and grace and of the Holy Ghost not only in a greater abundance then either man or Angel hath or can haue but aboue all measure And in this state if we should imagine with you that x Iohn 3. Christs soule suffred the greatest sense of torments that any creature can feele yet this doth not inferre Christs soule to be dead but expressely the contrary since all paine The soule of Christ in her greatest paines did most shew the life of patience and obedience to God yea if it were possible paine equall with hell it selfe suffered in this life with obedience and patience such as all Christs sufferings were except you will wrappe him as well within sinning as suffering doth conuince the soule of Christ to be rather liuing then dead as the martyrs of Christ had their soules then most liuing in their greatest torments when force of intolerable paine excluded their spirits from their bodies And therefore I doe not a little maruaile how lightly you leape to determine and defend the death of Christs soule since all paine endured with patience obedience and confidence prooueth the soule to be most aliue to God-ward euen when she departeth as not able to sustaine the fury and violence of the torment encreasing And heerein appeareth your notable error in calling that the death of Christs soule which the Scripture calleth his obedience and victory For he was y Phil. 2. obedient to the death euen the death of the Crosse that is in all his sufferings vnto the end he z Reuel 3. ouercame and sate with his Father in his Throne as we ouercomming shall sit with Christ in his Throne And other conquest in our conflicts there is none then constant resisting all temptations and patient enduring all afflictions which Christ did before vs and we must after him by his example both which are most ââ¦uident ââ¦ignes effects of the life and strength of the soule To beleeue and loue God to hope in him and call on him in proââ¦perity declareth the soule to be ãâã but in adââ¦ty and extreaââ¦ty to continue and ãâã those dueties of piety are as forââ¦ible powers and parts of the life of the soule as the Scripture maketh any Wherefore it is a grosse ouersight in you to call that the death of the soule which the Scripture maketh the life of the soule and to pronounce Christs soule to be dead in those respects which the word of God teacheth to be the chiefest proofes of the life of the soule If you slide from the sense of absolute and inherent paine to the feare and horror of dereliction and desperation in the soule of Christ for you role at your pleasure from one to another and are constant in nothing but in generall and doubtfull speaches as were the first authors of this conceit and make that the death of the soule No temptations without desparation kill the soule then know you that these temptations kill not the soule till they plant infidelity and desperation in the soule of man from which I trust you will cleere Christ or els I mââ¦st aske what difference betwixt you and a Turke For the Iewes were not so wicked as to take from Christ his trust in God they said of him as he hung on the Crosse a Matth. 27. he trusteth in God but they thought God had failed him in suffering him to come to that cursed kind of death wherein they knew not the wisedome or power of God But no Christian can be excused by ignorance if he diminish the faith hope loue patience or obedience of Christ in all his sufferings and those not decreasing it was no way possible for the soule of Christ to be but liuing yea full of life grace how great soeuer the paines were which he endured or the temptations which he resisted So that both fathers and Scriptures persue you narrowly to this straight that Christes soule must either alwaies liue and so your doctrine is vtterly false which auoucheth the death of Christs soule to be the ground of our redemption or if it died it must die with sinne since without sinne there is no death of the soule and all paines and torments that are possible in this life if they be suffered with obedience and patience doe rather demonstrate the life then confirme the death of the soule euen in the person of Christ Iesus b Defenc. pag. 142. li. 24. But our authorised Catechisme published by master Nowel and the homily sheweth that Christ suffered farre more sharpely then meere bodily death euen the infinite paines of Gods wrath in his soule which I pointed you vnto before but you fairely leape it ouer You belie the one and confute the other and then charge me with leaping them both ouer The homily which indeed is authorised hath no such thing as you report the Catechisme which is only approoued to be taught to children in schooles hath more then you any way like or receaue and yet not that which you now defend The sorow and paine which the Catechisme supposeth in Christs soule was the feare and horror of eternall death that you not only refuse in plaine words but refell with many reasons as you thinke The like you doe for Christs descent to hell which the Catechisme confesseth to be not the presence of Christs soule in Paradise but an effectuall force thereof in hell whereby the soules of the faithlesse saw their damnation to be iust and the Diuel himselfe perceaued all
worth but if they be diuers proofes of one thing though in place one before another they all haue one intention and must haue one construction Your maner is to make what you list of euery mans wordes my course is to shew by the wordes precedent and consequent that I take the right sense of each Writer not vpon the aduantage of one word wrested from the rest but out of the whole context to manifest the true meaning of ech mans speach If therfore Tertullian had said Haec mors est carnis animae this is the death of soule and flesh as he saith Haec vox est carnis animae this is the voice of soule and flesh It had been worth the obiecting and yet I must tell you that Tertullian being of opinion that the soule was traduced with the seed of the body when he diuideth a man into flesh soule and spirit as heere he doth by naming all three parts it may well be doubted whether he spake of the substance of the soule which is a spirit or of the powers of sense and speach which faile by death and are often comprised in the name of the soule But it is cleare by Tertullians owne words that Christs humane spirit was not dead or forsaken since he there vrgeth it was committed to the fathers hands and consequently was not forsaken nor left to death as the rest of Christs manhood was k Tertullianus aduersus Praxeam Caeterum non reliquit pater filium in cuius manibus filius spiritum suum posuit Denique posuit statim obijt spiritu enim manente in carne caro omnio mori non potest But the Father did not forsake the Sonne into whose hands the sonne laid downe his spirit For he laid it downe and presently died the spirit remaining in the flesh the flesh could not die at all The Father then left the flesh of his sonne vnto death but he tooke Christs spirit into his hands and so for the sonne to be forsaken was nothing els but for his flesh to be left to death This is Tertullians owne exposition of himselfe howsoeuer you would dally and deceaue both your selfe and your Reader by generall or speciall before or after l Defenc. pag. 145. li. 24. Cyrill also euen in that booke which you cite for you sheweth that he excludeth but Christs deity though he mention only his suffering in flesh Christ then is God impassible as God passible according to the flââ¦sh You put a whole But to Cyrills sense more then you find in his text and yet the words passible and impassible are not the things we striue for Impassible is that which by no possibility can admit any mutation or alteration by force or affection which is proper to God alone So no part of Christs manhood was impassible But though his soule were passible with diuers affections and impressions how will it follow from these or any other words in Cyrill that Christs soule died Cyrill hath in many words shewed which I before haue cited that Christs soule was subiect to all humane and naturall passions or affections but without sinne or corruption in this sense what doth it helpe you to haue the soule of Christ passible by nature and not impassible as his godhead is but you loue to loyter that thus still repeat one lesson not only besides your booke but against your booke m Defenc. pag 145. li 30. In a word so doe all the rest as before is partly noted A totall summe is as soone made of lies as of trueths All the answer you giue is they spake against other Hereticks not against you but this is the danger that if such points as they prooue against other Hereticks make against you you had need beware of the coniunction and communion between you and other Hereticks Against n li. 31. Nestorius they affirme you say the vnion of Christs natures Why skippe you o Sermo fo 331. Athanasius Epiphanius Ambrose and Augustine that neuer heard of Nestorius who teach directly that Christs suffering of death mentioned in the Scriptures was the suffering thereof in his mortall bodie which died and rose againe and by the death of this body was the ransome for vs all payd p Ambros. in Lucâ⦠ca 4. de ductu Christi in desertum What pray saith Ambrose could there be for death and Satan but his bodie You say his soule q August in Psal. 148. Accepit ex te vnde moreretur pro te Non posset mori nisi card Non posset mori nisi mortale corpus Christ tooke of thee sayth Austen wherein he might die for thee There could die in him nothing but flesh There could die in him nothing but his mortall bodie These and many such places yon cleanly skippe and tell in a word they are all for you r li. 32. They preserue the properties of ech They therefore holde not his only bodily sufferings Nay they therefore holde not the death of Christes soule since that is no necessarie propertie of mans nature assumed by Christ. Their reasons likewise and expositions of the Scriptures which you peruert exclude your conceit of the death of Christes soule most apparently ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã The Deitie could not suffer death say they because it was no bodie Then onely the bodie could suffer that death which Christ died And since the soule is no bodie that also must be free froÌ the death which Christ died These positions likewise of the Christian faith that the Son of God was wounded crucified dead and rose againe for vs all they expound to be expresly meant of his bodie wounded crucified dead and raised the third day so that where you would cauill that the name of Christes flesh importeth his soule as well as his body they directly refell you and pronounce all these things to be verified of his body and not of his soule or deity since nothing in him could suffer death but his body And the Scriptures that Christ by the grace of God tasted death for all and by death conquered him that had power ouer death and such like they exactly referre to the death of his body which argueth all your doctrine of the death of Christs soule to be meerely superfluous if not wholy pernicious f Defenc. pag. 145. li. 33. Is this then your great boast of all the Fathers and councels nay are they well vsed at your hands to be thus drawen clean from their purpose to an opinion which they neuer thought of is this good dealing towards Gods people to tell them that the Fathers generally teach the only bodily sufferings of Christ and denie our assertion of his soules peculiar suffering which they iustifie and conââ¦irme indeed Intrueth good Reader if I were not too well acquainted with this mans vnshamefastnesse I should thinke I rather heard a plaier on the stage then a Pen-man in the Church Is it possible for a
the perfection of their celestiall glory Otherwise against you and all that out of this place surmise that iust mens soules shall not be deliuered out of Sheol till the resurrection the sense and words of Dauid in this are pregnant enough For Dauid putting a difference in thââ¦se two verses betwixt himselfe and the wicked and that with an aduersatiue coniunction since the soules of the wicked are in Sheol presently vpon their deaths if Dauids must be there also what distinction doe his wordes make betweene himselfe and those others of whom he spake before Againe he saith God will deliuer his soule from Sheol ki cúm or quia when he shall receiue me or because he will receiue me Take which you will it is plaine by the Scriptures and by these very words of Dauid that so soonâ⦠as God receiueth the soule of man it is deliuered from Sheol But hee receiueth the soules of his Saints instantly vpon their deaths they are therefore presently deliuered out of Sheol and stay not there by any force of Dauids wordes vntill the resurrection Lord Iesus sayd Steuen euen as he was stoned receiue my spirit The begger died saith the Gospell and was caried by the Angels into Abrahams bosome This day shalt thou be with mee in Paradise said Christ to the theefe He that beleeueth in him that sent me saith Christ ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã is already passed from death to life If the faithfull passe so soone to life they bee as soone deliuered from Sheol by Dauids owne confession against which I will heare neither you nor any man liuing Againe that Psalme sheweth it also where it is thus written My soule is filled with sorrowes and my liââ¦e draweth neere to Sheol by his life he meaneth his soule the proper cause and fountaine of life in him which also in ââ¦e first part of the sentence hee nameth By these rouing and licentious glozes builded on the sands of your owne saying you thinke you may prooue what you will and all shall be expresse Scripture if you say the word Life you will haue to be soule drawing neere to be abiding in The graue to be the generall condition of soules deceased and to warrant all this your selfe is the soothsayer By his life he meaneth his soule which also in the first part of the sentence hee nameth as the manner of phrase in the Psalme is in the second part to speake of the same things that are in the former Many verses in the Psalmes doe illustrate the selfe same generall with diuers parts adiuncts and consequents but that the words be of all one force or signification in euery such verse this is an other of your new found methodes which is nothing else but a meere confusion of all things For will you see with your manner of phrase as you finââ¦ly furbish it what consequents hang on these kind of collections This life of which Dauid speaketh continueth not in Sheol because it is vtterly exstinguished by Sheol ergo the soule likewise is mortall and wholy perisheth in Sheol for so doth the life mentioned by Dauid which you say is all one with the soule Againe if both these parts import one sense then the iust in Sheol are filled with sorrowes for so are the former wordes of Dauid And if that be true how much hath the spirit of God deceiued vs who bad S. Iohn write blessed are the dead which hereafter die in the Lord euen so saith the spirit for they rest from their labours But that was the spirit of trueth and therefore the spirit of error in you sucketh these absurdities out of the Psalmes by your misconstruction of them Indeede I denie not but life may signifie heere the whole person of man and so may nephesh the soule also very well and then Sheol and Hades signifie not peculiarly and distinctly the graue which is only for the car casse but the condition of the whole man after he hath no being in this world And per aduenture so it is vnderstood heere in thââ¦se places in which sense Sheol and Hades are farre from signifying hell yea or heauen either yea or onely and meerely the graue but it signisieth destruction out of this world and not being heere any more as aforetime to the whole person that is both to the bodie and to the soule The idle deuices of this wild-gooseracer who would spend either time or paines to tracke when he reeleth to and fro like a man pot-shotten with it may be and per aduenture it is so and closeth vp all in the end with a dangerous destruction which he maketh to be iust nothing Boyes meanely Catechised can soone conceiue that death or the graue bringeth with it an end of all earthly things from which the wicked are loth to depart as hauing no farder nor better hope after this life and therefore to them death is a destruction indeed that is a ceasing of all their pleasures and an encreasing of all their paines To the godly who put not their hearts to the things of this world but desire to bee dissolued and to bee with Christ and in comparison of his presence account all earthly things to be base and burdenous death is a gaine and no destruction because they renounced the loue of all these worldly thinges before hand and sought for the permanent citie whose founder is God Wherefore to them this bodie is a burden this life is a warefare and this world is a desert full of snares and pits Wherein they wander as pilgrimes and strangers If then to lay aside these troubles and trifles and to be freed from all labours and dangers and to come home to the countrcy and citie which God hath prouided for the faithfull be in any wise mans sense a destruction then haue you some reason to call the generall condition of death as well to the iust as to the wicked a destruction but if that thought and speech be void of all religion and reason then doe you houer in the midst betweene heauen and hell and huddle saluation and damnation in one generall condition or state as you call it and when you sce what inconuenience will follow thereof you make it nothing but a meere priuation or an end of things past And this you would applie as well to the person of Christ whose soule you say was in no Sheol but this as to al his members whose soules shall not be freed from this destruction and Sheol till the day of resurrection Did you speake of the nature of death in it selfe or as it taketh hold on the wicked I would allow the word destruction which if it be well vnderstood is more then a mââ¦re priuation but when you presume to peruert the Scriptures with peraduentures and to sow to them what sense you list as may best fit your monstrous fancies lââ¦t no man be offended if I often thinke it fit to reiect your
inuisible place expresly Paradise if that were so you must then confesse your hades is not common to good and bad and hath in it not only an heauenly place but an happie state which I trust you will not allow to the wicked and so hades and heauen to be all one with you which thing you so much disclaime But by your leaue it is not so your friends and you are ouerbold with Ireneus to make him say what you list Six and twenty Chapters before this he saith the elders which were the Apostles Disciples deliuered that such as were translated that is remooued hence with their bodies without dying as Enoch and Elias were translated thither euen to Paradise and there remaine they which were translated euen to the end shewing now a beginning of incorruption Againe he further sheweth that in the Scripture he taketh hades to be al one with death or the dominion of death where he readeth the text thus Vbi est mors aculeus tuus Vbi est mors victoria tua Death where is thy sting Death where is thy victory You shew your selfe to be well read in the fathers that cannot tell whether Ireneus wrote in Greeke or in Latin and therefore in steed of a most learned and most eloquent writer as Ierom calleth him you bring vs the authority of an vnknowen and obscure interpreter Were there no more but the very place euen now cited and abused by your selfe the parts whereof are found in Ireneus thrice after three seuerall interpretations as for example in Terra sepultionis in terra defossionis in terra stipulationis it were enough to shew the Author neuer wrote in Latine that varieth so much from himselfe and that the translator was verie seely but there are other arguments infinite the Greeke wordes expressing the conceits of heretikes aboue 120 euery where be retained the stile throughout exactly resembling the Greeke phrase the manifold citations thereof by the Greeke Fathers as 18. whole Chapters by Epiphanius 22. peeces and parts thereof by Eusebius and 14. by Theodoret besides Polycarpe his instructor and teacher euen in his youth who was altogether a Grecian But we shall not need to seeke reasons for it since Ierom so many hundred yeeres agoe when the originall was extant numbreth Ireneus amongst the Greek writers We shall seeme saith he to crosse the opinions of many auncient writers of the Latins Tertullian Victorinus Lactantius of the Greekes o omit the rest I will make mention onely of Ireneus Bishop of Lions And againe To name the Greeke writers and to ioine the first and last together Ireneus and Apollinarius Ireneus then writing in Greeke and citing the Apostles words likewise in Greek you cannot proue by the rude and late translation of his works which we haue how he read the Apostles text Gregorie Bishop of Rome more then 600 yeeres after Christ saith Scripta beati Irenei iamdiu est quòd solicite quaesiuimus sed hactenus ex ââ¦is inueniri aliquid non potuit The writings of blessed Ireneus we haue long and carefully sought for but hitherto nothing of his can be found he meaneth in Latin for before and after euerie Greek diuine as Basil Cyril Theodoret Occumenius Aretas Anastasius Damascen Procopius Nicetas cite Irenaeus workes and words The Latin translation of the Apostles words 1 Corinth 15 Death where is thy sting death where is thy victory I shall haue fitter occasion by and by to examine Tertullian doth likewise For speaking of Inferi which he taketh for the same that hades is he noteth it as the place quo vniuersa humanitas trahitur whither all mankind must goe and therefore of Christes going thither he saith Because he was a man therefore hee died according to the Scriptures and was buried according to the same also heere he satisfied the common law of nature by following the forme of mens dying and going to the world of the dead If you should not peruert both Tertullians wordes and sense neither would make for your purpose And though you gain not much by corrupting the coherence of his wordes yet are you so vsed to haue all to your liking that you cannot hold your hand from disordering other mens speeches Christ saith Tertullian being God because he was also man and died according to the Scriptures and was buried according to the same euen in this satisfied the law by performing the course of an humane death apud Inferos in the places below In steed of Legi the law you say the common law of nature apud Inferos you translate going to the world of the dead These bee your fansies added to Tertullians wordes and no parts of his purpose In the meane while you dissemble and therein abuse both your selfe and your Reader that euen in that Chapter and the sentence before Tertullian describeth Inferi to be a place vnder the earth whither the soules of good and bad descend after death the good to a kind of refreshing which is plainely Limbus so much refused by your selfe the bad to punishment His wordes in the fiue and fiftie Chapter which you quote precedent to those which you cite are these Nobis inferi non nuda cauositas nec sub diualis aliqua mundi sentina creduntur sed in fossa Terrae in alto vastitas in ipsis visceribus eius abstrusa profunditas Siquidem Christum in corde Terrae triduum mort is legimus expunctum id est in recessu intimo interno in ipsa Terrâ⦠operto intra ipsam cauato inferioribus adhuc abyssis superstructo We beleeue Inferi to be no bare hollownesse nor any sincke vnder the world but in the gulfe of the earth and in the depth of vastitie and in the very bowels of the earth an abstruse profunditie For we reade that Christ was the three dayes of his death in the heart of the earth that is in an inward place within the midst thereof and couered with the earth and hollowed within the same and seated ouer mighty deepes below If this be your world of the dead let any man of vnderstanding iudge whether this be not a plaine euident description of that which the latter writers called Limbus and whether there can be any fuller delineation of it then a place vnder the earth and in the midst thereof euen hollowed in the bowels of the earth and couered with the same hauing vnder it mighty deepes And that in it there is as well rest for the good as torments for the wicked And the continuation of the very same sentence which you guilefully bring for your world of dead and the conclusion of both are deliuered by Tertullian in these words if Christ did performe the course of an humanc death in places below neither did ascend into the higth of the heauens before he descended into the lower parts of the earth there to make the
to the enemie The diuell therefore ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã thinking to kill one lost all and hoping to carie one to Hades hell was himselfe cast out of hades hell ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Hades hell is abrogated death no more preuailing but all being raised to life neither can the diuell stand vp any more against vs but is fallen and indeed creepeth on his brest and bellie And therefore of the Saints he saith ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and in fine they saw Hades hell spoiled Epiphanius in sundrie places expresseth the parts and purpose of Christs descending to hell or hades He was crucified buried ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Hee descended to the places vnder earth in his diuinitie and in his soule he tooke captiuitie captiue and rose againe the third day What here he calleth places vnder the earth whither Christes soule went after his death that elswhere he calleth Hades The Godhead of Christ would performe all things that perteined to the mysterie of his passion ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and would descend together with his soule to the infernall places to worke the saluation there of such as were before dead I meane the holy Patriarcks ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã c. that he might performe the things he would against hades in the forme of a man euen in hades that the chiefe Ruler HADES and death thinking to lay hands on a man and not knowing his Deitie vnited to his sacred soule Hades himselfe might rather be surprised and death dissolued and that fulfilled which was spoken Thou wilt not leaue my soule in Hades Basil Death is not altogether euill except you speake of the death of a sinner ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã because their departure hence is the beginning of their punishments in hades againe the euââ¦s that are in hades haue not God for their cause but our selues the head and root of sinne is in vs and in our willes And againe Dathan and Abiram were swallowed vp of earth the gulfes and clefts thereof opening vnder them Heere were not they the better for this kinde of punishment ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã for how should they be so that went to hades to hell but they made the rest the wiser by their example And writing on the 48 Psalme Because man turned himselfe from the word of God and became a beast the enemie caught him as a sheepe without a shepheard ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and put him in hades hell but when he sayth God will redeeme my soule from the power of hades he doth plainly prophesie ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã the descent of the Lord to hades who would redeeme the Prophets soule with others not to abide there Nazianzene in his second Oration against Iulian the Renââ¦gate ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Stop thou thy secrets and wayes that leade to hell hades I will declare the plaine wayes which leade to heauen And of Christ he sayth Christ died but he restored to life and with his death abolished death He was buried but he rose againe ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã He descended to hell hades but he brought backe soules and ascended to heauen Macarius When thou hearest that Christ deliuered soules ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã out of hell hades and darkeneââ¦se and that the Lord descended to hades and did an admirable worke thinke not these thinâ⦠to be farre from thine owne soule And thus he maketh Christ to speake to death and to the diuell ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã c. I command thee hades and darkenesse and death restore the soules inclosed And so the wickâ⦠powers trembling refund man that was inclosed Cyrill of Alexandria In olde times before Christ the soules of men departing from their bodies were sent to fill the receptacles of death ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã in dennes vnder the earth But after Christ commended his oââ¦ne soule to his Father he renewed the same way for vs ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã And now we goe not to bades from any place but we follow him rather in this and committing our soules to a faithfull Creatour we rest in excellent hope Yet of Christ he aââ¦firmeth The soule which was coupled and vnited to the word ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã descended into hades and vsing the power and force of the Godhead ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã shewed it selââ¦e to the spirits or soules there For we must not say that the Godhead of the onely begotten which is a nature vncapable of death and no waâ⦠conquerable by it ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã was brought backe from the dââ¦es vnder the earth Cyrill of Ierusalem like wise in his Catechismes vpon those words of the Psalme If ascend to heauen thou art there if I goe downe to hades tââ¦u art preââ¦ent sayth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã c. If tââ¦ere ââ¦e ââ¦ing higher than the heauens and hades be lower than the earth he that compreââ¦ââ¦eth the ââ¦owest doth also touch the earth And to those that were baptized he sayth When thou renouncest Satan thou hast vtterly abrogated the couenant had with him ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã c. euen the olde couenant ââ¦ith hades hell and the Paradise of God is opened to thee In the Homilies which Leo the Emperour made for the exercise of his stââ¦le and confession of his faith it is said ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Christ is risen bringing Hades prisoner with him and proclaiming lilibertie to the capitues He that held others bound is now in bonds himselfe ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã Christ is come from hades with the ensigne of his triumph the sowre and heauie lookes of those that are vtterly ouerthrowen ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã as of Hades death and the hatefull diuels Damascene ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã c. The soule deisied descended to Hades that as to those on earth the Sonne of righteousnesse was risen ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã so to those that sate vnder the earth in darkenesse and in the shadow light might shine The brazen gates were torne the iron barres were broken ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã and the keeper of Hades hell did shake for feare and the foundations of the world were laid open Cydonius ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã That there is in hades hell vengeance for all sinnes heere committed not onely the consent of all wise men but also the equalitie of the Diuine iustice confirmeth and strengthmeth this opinion Aeneas Gazeus He that in a priuate life committeth small sinnes and lamenteth them escapeth ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã the punishments that are in Hades hell Gregentius Christ tooke a rodde out of the earth which was his pretious crosse stretching his right hand strake all his enemies conquered them ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã that is Hades death sin and that wilââ¦e serpent Theophylact. The rich man dying is not caried by the angels ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã but
it It is a plaine true rule in mine opinion that the Euangelists and Apostles euery where by Hades intended hell and none of your wandring or stragling fansies Besides the Greeke Fathers with one consent vse Hades after the direction of the Canonicall writers for a place of darknesse vnder the earth prouided to receaue and detaine the Soules of men And in this sense neither the Scriptures nor the Fathers departed much from the auncient and true vse of the word amongst heathen and prophane Authors sauing that the Pagans made it common to the Soules of iust and vniust which the Scriptures neuer doe and the Fathers vtterly refuse after Christs Resurrection whatsoeuer they doe before Since then Hades by the manifest exposition of Saint Luke in his Gospell is the place of torment where the wicked after death are punished and the same Euangelist expresseth Dauids meaning to be this that Christs Soule after death was not left or forsaken in Hades what cause or reason hath any man to denie that Christ dying descended to hell there to spoyle powers and principalities and thence to leade Captiuitie Captiue that as he ascended to the highest heauens there to sit superiour to all the Elect Angels so he first descended to the bottomlesse deepe there to subiect the Reprobate Angels vnto his humane nature and to dissolue the power and sorrowes of hell of which it was impossible he should be held Here we must consider a maine obiection of yours euen those words of our common Creed he descended into hell originally it is he descended into Hades and in truth this is all you haue to alleadge for your opinion but I answere two waies first admitting then denying the Authoritie of these words in our common Creede You haue seene by this time what I haue to alleadge for that which I defend may besafely conceiued of the Creed The words themselues he descended to Hades haue euident warrant in the holy Scriptures and Peter exactly concludeth out of Dauids words that Christs Soule was not left in Hades What Hades is with S. Luke the writer of the Acts we likewise haue seene It is euen the place where the wicked are tormented after death Put these together and tell me what they want of Christes descending into hell before he rose from the dead The words in English he descended into hell are confirmed by the publike authoritie of this Realme as well in the Booke of common praier as in the Articles of Religion agreed on by the Conuocation and ratified by Act of Parliament So that all your euasions elusions of the priuation condition and dominion of death to be ment thereby are vtterly reiected and condemned by generall and full consent of Prince Pastours people within this Realme and Christs descent to hell after death hath beene constantly and continually professed and beleeued in the Church of England euer since the Gospell was here established What you haue said against it I leaue to the Readers wise and indifferent iudgement who wil easily tell you you must bring better sluffe then either phrases or fansies before the common Creede may be thus reiected and despised You enioyne vs three Rules to be exactly and precisely kept in the expounding of these words Namely 1. distinction of Matter 2. consequence of order 3. proprietie of words Might not those godly men thinke you misse in some such circumstances although the Scripture cannot The first compilers of the Creede meaning shortly orderly and plainly to deliuer the summe of the Christian faith as touching the three persons in Trinitie and the chiefest blessings which God bestoweth on his Church in this life and the next by Iesus Christ our Lord might not with any discretion in so briefe and compendious assume of Christian Religon proposed to the simple and vulgar sort of all ages and sexes vse either any needlesse repetition disordered confusion or obscure inuolution of things requisite to our Saluation To these Rules agree all that haue expounded the Creede in the Church of Christ to this very day saue your selfe and such as haue opened you the gap to these innouations And these Rules allowed do cleane cast your exposition out of doores For where it is most plainly said that Christ died and was buried which words no plow-man woman nor child of reasonable yeeres can mistake you after Christs buriall come in with a darke and figuratiue phrase of descending to Hades which in effect you confesse is no more but what was said before in knowen and open speech that Christ died And this obscure and strange circumlocution of death you will haue to be an Article of your faith as if euery Christian creature were bound vpon danger of his saluation to vnderstand what Sheol or Hades doth signifie in the Greeke and Hebrew Tongues which is a position meete for such a Diuine as you are Your exposition therefore is repugnant to all three Rules For it is a superfluous vnorderly enigmaticall iteration of that which was before expressed in due place with as plaine and easie wordes as any might be spoken by the tongue of man Now with what Arguments you or any man liuing Hu. Bro. not excepted can prooue that Hebrew or Greeke phrases are Articles of Religion and must be conceaued and beleeued of all men before they can be saued as yet I doe not vnderstand And this is the miserie of your cause that not onely you haue no word in Latine English nor in any tongue else answerable to your Sheol or Hades but when you come to lay open your owne phrases the exposition is more ridiculous then the Translation For by Christs descending to Hades which you call the power dominion and kingdome of death you meane no more but that Christs Soule seuered from his Body went to heauen to the rest of the blessed Soules there And here I report me to him that will vouchsafe to read your 196. 197. pages whether you haue any thing there but store of phrases extending intending enlarging amplifying the name power and dominion of death which when all is done and said amounteth to this much that Christes soule seuered by death from his body submitted it selfe to the base and low condition of the dead by taking the paines to goe to heauen to the rest of the Saints there This is all in effect that your Periphrasis and Emphasis moriendi doe containe and the great fall or whole casting downe of Christes person which you so Rhetorically set out with termes of the broadest and longest size hath nothing in it but only this that his soule after death which dissolued his person ascended to the societie of the blessed soules in heauen The rest is your emphaticall and paraphrasticall vanitie swelling with wordes and shrinking in sense which needeth none other refutation but sober obseruation that when two sides are spent nothing is said but you are where you began For would you not varie so many phrases
as you doe tending all to expresse one thing but seeke a little to shew vs what matter is contained in them you should soone see what labour you haue lost in this Carrecke of words which you haue newly brought vs home Your meere and simple death which you say is nothing els but the going asunder of the soule from the body hath of necessitie thus much in it It is the separation of the soule from the body which is the cause of life in the body It is the dissolution of the person which consisteth of body and soule It is the priuation of life which endeth with the departing of the soule It is the continuing of death since possibly there is no regresse from the priuation to the habite without the mightie hand of God working aboue nature For the soule departing neuer returneth till God commaund by whose word heauen and earth were made What now after death becommeth of both parts of man is no hard matter to conceaue Salomon saith Dust meaning flesh first made of dust returneth to earth as it was and the spirit to God that gaue it by him to be disposed and adiudged to ioy or paine as pleaseth him The body then goeth to corruption the soule receaueth iudgement where it shall remaine in hell or heauen till the bodie be restored againe which shall be at the last day Descending to hades after death cannot be verified of the whole person of man but in respect of the parts Referred to the body it is as much as buried and laide in the place where it shall putrifie and returne to dust Applied to the soule it must signifie the place to which the soule is caried which I say must be vnder earth since heauen is neuer called by that name nor expressed by that word either in the Scriptures or in any other sacred or prophane writers The power and dominion of death which you so much speake of is nothing else but Gods ordinance that from death there is no returne to life till hee appoint If then there be no dominion nor kingdome of death preuailing or ruling in heauen where the soules of the Saints are without their bodies then Christ in ascending to heauen descended not to Hades Againe with what trueth can you auouch Christes soule came vnder the full power and dominion of death since death had no power ouer the bodie or soule of Christ longer or farder then he himselfe would permit and his soule free from all bands and paines of death destroied the dominion and kingdome of death to which it was alwaies superiour and neuer subiect but onely that he might shew himselfe with greater power to be conquerer of death rather in rising from the dead then in declining the force of death as if he were not able after death and in death to dissolue the dominion and power of death Wherefore your exaggerating the power and dominion of death OVER THE SOVLE of Christ and that IN HEAVEN whither you graunt Christes soule went after death is not onely a vaine and idle flourish but a poisoned and pestilent doctrine if you take not heed to it since no power of death but Christes will to shew himselfe Lord of life and death either seuered his soule from his bodie or bestowed his soule in any place after death or detained him in the condition of death but he was free to die when he would and rise from death when he would which euerteth all power and dominion of death ouer him how much soeuer in wastefull wordes you auouch the contrarie Touching the proprietie of wordes that you say is as true as the rest For Hades hath no such natiue and proper sense as you talke of but exactly and directly when it is referred to a place and not to a person signifieth a place of darknesse where nothing can be seene as with one consent Heathen and Christian writers acknowledge And the word descending after death which you must applie to the soule ascending to heauen you childishly change into the fall of the person from lise to death or inconstantly varie you know not how to Christes submission when he died or his abasement by lying held and subdued so long time in death Where againe you incurre the same sands that you did before in affirming Christ was held and subdued of death for the time which is plainly false doctrine since he would abide that time in death least any should thinke him not truely dead but was neuer vnder the power and dominion of death And as for lying held in death that phrase is strangely referred to the soule of Christ which ascended to the third heauen with more honour and ioy then it receaued in this life heere on earth What Ruffine saith is not much to be regarded if we beleeue S. Ierom neither was Ruffines faith sound nor his authoritie any thing in the Church and yet were he woorth the respecting he maketh more against you then for you For first these wordes are not vsed as an exposition of Christs descent to Hades but Ruffine saith Diuina natura in mortem per carnem descendit non vt lege mortalium detinerââ¦tur a Morte sed vt per se resurrecturus ianuas mortis aperiret The diuine nature of Christ descended to death by his flesh not to be held of death after the law of mortall men but that rising of himselfe hee might open the gates of death Where he saith the diuine nature descended to death he speaketh not of the soule but of the godhead of Christ which words by your leaue require a sober interpretation and yet in respect of the diuine glory the phrase of descending vnto death signifieth Christes submission to die not his descent after death And withall he refelleth two of your fansies first that Christ was was not held of death which you say he was Secondly that he followed not heerein the lââ¦w of mans nature which you say he did And that Christes soule descended to hell by Ruffines opinion his wordes are plaine enough in many places He applieth that to Christ which Dauid saith Thou hast brought my soule out of hell and alleaging the place of Peter In his spirit Christ preached to them which were in prison heerein saith ââ¦e it is declared quid operââ¦ââ¦gerit in Inferno What Christ did in hell So that the lesse hold you take of Ruffine the better for you and your cause he will doe more harme then good If any thinke this to be somewhat figuratiue yet is it verely so familiar and easie to all people as that other word in the Creede is he sitteth at the right hand of God yea it is farre easier When you can diue deepe into your owne fansies you thinke them as familiar to all others as to your selfe If this were so easie and readie with the simpler sort as you make it me thinkes it should not so much trouble
doubtlesse he went not thither You profere vs reasons very seldome but when you push them forth they want all things that should support them Your maior heere hath no force in it your minor hath no trueth and so your conclusion is like a forward bud that shrincketh before it bloweth That Christ should triumph ouer powers and principalââ¦ies and all knees of those in heauen earth and hell bow vnto him was aswell for his soueraignty as for our safety Your maior then must haue both those parts in it that if Christs descent thither were neither for his glory not our good then was it needlesse But it was both He was to rise superiour to all his and our enemies that as in the crosse he submitted his life to the rage fury of Satan his members so when he rose he might be made Lord ouer heauen earth and hell It was therefore his right to haue the keyes of death and hell wherby Satans kingdom aswell in hell as in earth should be subiected to the power of his humane nature which could not be but beneficiall for vs whose redeemer and Sauiour he was Againe what need is there that you should know the depth of Gods counsels and reason of Christs doings in euery thing as though you were to take an account of him what cause he had to doe as he did If the Scripture beare witnesse that Christs soule was not left in hell though we could not discerne the precise purpose of his descent thither we may not therefore reiect it as superfluous But what say you to those two maine points expressed in Scripture the destroying of Satan and deliuering of vs from feare of death which Christ performed by his death The benefits all and euery one which you euery where rehearse I most vnfeinedly and religiously beleeue but what is this to his locall being in hell You acknowledge the words but not the deeds of Christs destroying and spoiling Satan through but not after his death and so in name but not in proofe you make him Lord ouer hell as where he neuer shewed the power and prerogatiue of his humane nature but onely by taking his body from the graue Now this doth not answere the reall and actuall subduing of Satans strength and kingdome mentioned in the Scriptures with so magnificent and euident words as the Apostle vseth that Christ led captiuity captiue and made an open shew of powers and principalities and triumphed ouer them in his owne person You call these blasts of vanity because I say they were performed on euery part of Satans kingdome and euen in the place where his chiefest strength and power was which was hell but your replies are rather beesoms of infidelity which would sweepe away whatsoeuer the Apostle saith of Christs most glorious triumph ouer Satan and his whole kingdome with the taking of his flesh out of the graue where it lay dead and ascribe no more to Christs conquest ouer death and hell then you doe to all the faithfull when they shal be raised from the earth to the fruition of eternall life This I say is not sufficient in Christs person For he must not onelie be free himselfe and the freer of all his from death and hell but all infernall places and powers were to stoope to him as Lord of all when God would bring him to the glory of his resurrection This conquest you say Christ purchased by his Passion but hee did not execute it till his resurrection If hee executed nothing till his resurrection and purchased all by his Passion then he did nothing in hell For his resurrection was distinctly after his supposed being in hell The Apostles wordes are plaine that Christes crosse was his humiliation Christ humbled himselfe being obedient to death euen the death of the crosse Then Christes Passion and death were parts of his debasing and not his triumphing ouer death or hell After death must his triumph beginne and not before nor at the time of his breathing out his soule but when the time of his resurrection came God loosed the sorrowes of death before his humane soule which was not left destitute of glory soueraintie in hell and raised his bodie from the graue restoring him to life as the subduer and Lord of all his enemies that is as well of hell as of death You would calculate the minutes and see what distance of time there was betwixt the returne of Christes soule from hell and the raising of his bodie from the graue but this is like the rest of your vanities to be more then audacious in blasing your owne deuises and curious in searching Gods secrets reserued to himselfe What time the soule of Christ ascended to Paradise or descended to hell we doe not know we must leaue that to God it sufficeth vs that Christes Soule by the witnesse of holy Scripture was not lest in hell nor his flesh in the graue but both restored to life as conquerers of death and hell Christes resurrection therefore containeth the bringing of hissoule from hell and the ioyning of it to his bodie that both might be restored to celestââ¦all and perpetuall glory and consequently the subduing of hell as his soule returned to his bodie is iustly reputed a part of the glorie of his resurrection I would willingly beleeue you but alas who sayth so besides your selfe or onely such as can tell no better then you If auncient Fathers and later writers if prouinciall generall Councels did not professe the same that I doe you might beleeue as you list but if they all concurre that this is testified in the Scriptures which you labour to elude with phrases and figures then pitie your selfe as stretching and shrinking the Scriptures at your pleasure pitie not me who haue the maine consent of all ages and Christian assemblies from the Apostles to this very time wherein we liue to interpret the wordes of the holy Ghost as I doe and to make Christes subduing of hell consequent to his death and precedent to his resurrection Neither can the Apostles wordes that Chââ¦ist through death destroyed him that had power of death and deliuered all them which for feare of death were all their life long subiect to bondage haue any full or effectuall performance if Christ after death and before the raising vp of his bodie did not in that part of his humane nature which lay not in the graue shew himselfe the conquerer of Satan and his Infernall kingdome that by Christes subduing eternall death and taking the whole power thereof into his hands we might be assured of our deliuerance from that which we most feared which was not the death of the bodie but the destruction of bodie and soule in hell fire This Conquest we both beleue neither may we much differ about the time since it must be through his death and so after he was dead and before his resurrection the manner is all that is
priuatiââ¦e condition of death they wââ¦l ââ¦ile at your presumptuous folly If it be a matter of faith it â⦠no phrase if we must beleeue as they teach that Christ after his death and buââ¦all deââ¦cended to hell you must shew vs some other hell to which Christ descended after death or els I conclude that the Lawes of this Land bind all men to beleeue and professe that Christ descended to that hell which the Scriptures acknowledge and not ââ¦hich your roling concââ¦its and totterââ¦ng tonguâ⦠would establish against the warrant and word of God whose only will should be the line whose only trueth should be the guide whose only praise should be the end of all our professions and actions THE TABLE SERVING for their vse that are desirous with more ease to finde out the speciall contents of this booke as they are handled in their seuerall places A A Brahams bosom pag. 552 the place therof vnknowen 656 Aââ¦yssus in the Newe Testamenâ⦠is hell 6ââ¦9 Aââ¦sed iââ¦nocents and penitââ¦nts ââ¦re not though hanged on a tree 238 Chââ¦t was noâ⦠Aââ¦sed how great soeuer his paines weâ⦠164. 165 S. Auââ¦s iââ¦dgement how Chââ¦ist was accursed 241 Men cââ¦n not be truly blââ¦ssed and accursââ¦d 253 Thââ¦t is ââ¦ccââ¦ed whââ¦ch God hateth 257 A sacââ¦ifice for sinne is not acââ¦ursed but accepted of God 258 Adam sinned aswell by bodie as by soule 183. 184 Was punished for his sinne after Christ was promised 147 What God threatened to Adam if he sinned 177. 178 Aeternall death fââ¦r whom Christ might feare 484 Against aeââ¦rnall death as due to him Christ could not pââ¦ay 378. 379 Aeternally God doth not punish one for anothers ââ¦ault 336 Affections are pââ¦infull to the soule 4ââ¦9 make sensible alterations in the heart 193. 194 Good affections of loue and zeale are not painfull 26 Euill affections are punishments of sinne 31 Inward affections make outward impressions in the heart 193 The heart is the seat of mans affections and actions  Christ couââ¦d represse and encrease his affections as he saw cause 400 The Aââ¦xe cleaueth to the Verbe and not to the Noune 216 Afflââ¦ctions of the godly are moderated punishmeÌts 9. 10. 11. 17. manifest Gods displeasure against sinne 14â⦠Agony what it is 339 Tââ¦e paines of hell were not the cause of Christs agony 58. 59 The causes that might be of Christs agony in the ââ¦ardeÌ 9â⦠they crossâ⦠not one another 97 I diâ⦠not resolue what was the cause of Christs agony  The precise cause of Christs agony is not reuealed in the Scriptures 338. 346. though the general occasions may be coniectured 346 The parts of Christs agony 339 An agony proueth rather zeale then feare 339 Feare and sorrow the Scriptures witnesse in Christs agony 342 Submission to God and compassion on men the generall causes of Christs agony 347 The first cause coÌcurring to Christs agony 347 The second 354 The third 370 The fourth 371 The fiââ¦th 375 The sixt 399 The Fathers determââ¦ne not the exact cause of Chrââ¦sts agony 371 How some vse the word agony 403 The different affââ¦ctions in Christs agony had different causes 558 Amazââ¦d neither Moses nor Paul were in their praââ¦ers 368 Christ was not amazed in his praier 369. 479 Christs praier prooueth hee was not then amazed 469 Christs ââ¦raier was no amaze 467 The Defender yeeldââ¦th perfect knowledge to Christ in his amazednes 481 Angry God was with our sinnes but not with Christs person 463 God is truely angry with his childrens sinnes 14 Angels sinned in their whole nature as men doe 197 Angels and good men receaued the bowing of the body 662 ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã ãâã signifieth For as well as From. 501 The Apostle 1. Cor. 15. speaketh onely of the resurrection to glory 640. What his wordes Hââ¦b 5. inferre 498. 499. 500 Beleeuers may not iudge of the apostles words 89 More Apostles then twelue 651 The diuers reading and translating of the apostles words 1. Cor. 15. 55. 639 Astonishment what it is 441 What astonishment with feare is 468 Christ did not pray in astonishment 441 Why Christ might be somewhat astonished 468 Athanasius lewdly falsified by the Defender 275 taketh Hades for hell 569. 600. 601 What Athanasius speaketh of Adam the Defender referreth to Christ. 275 Augustine not ignorant of the Greeke tongue 608 his iudgement how Christ was accursed 241 keepeth the sense of Peters word Act. 2. 626 is grossely mistaken by the Defender 627  Christ tooke our naturall but not sinfull affections 330 Christ might beholde the power of Gods wrath and yet not feare the vengeance due to the wicked 348 Christ prayed for vs and against Satan 352 Christ knew the burden of our sinnes must lie on his shoulders 353 Christ and his members must drinke of one and the same cup. 353 Christ wept for the desolation of Ierusalem and sorowed for the reiection of the Iewes 354 Christ wept and sorrowed when he would 355 Christ grieued at the wilfulnesse of the Iewes 357 Christ sorowed that his death should be the ruine of the Iewes ibid. Christ chose the time and place to shew his vehement affections 358 Christ could not be content to be separated from God for vs. 367 Christ suffered the likenesse of our punishment not of our sinne 273 Christ was not ordained to be damned for vs. 364 Christ feared not death but his Fathers power 370 Christ might pray to haue the deepnes of his sorrowes comforted paines asswaged 374. 375 Christ might pray against the sting of death which he was to feele before he died 381 Christ could not pray against eternall death as due to him but vnto vs. 378. 379 Christ was most earnestly to aske what God had faithfully promised to graunt 384 Christ felt all our affections not of necessitie but according to his owne power and will 386 Christ shewed in the garden how mans soule strugleth with the panges of death 388 Christ was weake to comfort the weak but stronger then the strongest on the crosse 388. 390 Christ saw the whole danger from which hee should redeeme vs. 392. 393 Christ teacheth all his to feare Gods power as himselfe did in the garden 393. 394 Christ presented and dedicated his body in the garden which he sufââ¦ered on the crosse to be done to death 399 Christ died not in the garden 400 Christ could represse and increase his affections as he saw cause 400 Christ found no ioy in his paines but comfort in his hope 411 Christ emptied himselfe of glory not of grace 412 Christ citing the 1. vers of the 21. Psalme noteth the whole to appertaine to his passion 434 Christ was mortified in flesh but not in soule 507 Christ might passe from hell to heauen 550 Christ needed no long time to deââ¦cend to hel 551 Christ presented himselfe in euery place 564 Christ was to rise full conquerer of hell and death 668 How Christs death was like the godlies 7 How Christ laid downe his soule for
vs. 132. 133 How Christ shall the second time appeare without sinne 27 How far Christs sufferings must be extended 343 How Christs soule was in his Fathers hands 549 How Christ was in Paradise the day of his death 549 How Christ was like vs in all things sinne excepted 86 How Christ might feare and yet be freed from it 486. ââ¦87 How Christ loosed the sorrowes of death 624 How Christ must rise from the dead 627 What Christ discerned in all his sufferings 317 What Christ vndertooke for vs. 324 What things Christ inwardly beheld in the garden 387 Why Christ might dislike the death of the body 398 The ioynt sufferings of Christ in his bodily death most auaileable for our saluation 68 Euery thing in Christ was meritorious but not satisfactorie for sinne 179. 180 Both body and soule must suffer in Christ. 130. 131 Christs bodily death part of the punishment of our sinnes 11 By Christs corporal punishment we are freed from spirituall and eternall 222. 223 Christs blood could not be shed but by Satan and his instââ¦uments 231 Christs recompence for the wrong receaued at Satans hands 232 Christs suffering without the gate of the city 113. 114 Christs death was most iust with God in respect of his will to saue vs. 262. 263 Christs death not exacted as a debt but ââ¦eceaued as a voluntarie sacrifice 264 Christs doings aboue mans reason 310 The nature measure and purpose of Christs sufferings 332 The paines of Christs soule as of his body were equall to the strength of his patience 334 Christs faith did not faile in the sharpest of his paines 335 All Christs sufferings were righteous and holie 344. 438 Christs words Iohn 12. auouch not contraries 482. are expounded 483 Christs senses were not ouerwhelmed with feare and sorrow 477 Christs feares and sorrowes not like the reprobates 448. 449. 450 We must not increase Christs sufferings at our pleasure 478 Christs passió did not kil his soul but his body 528 Christs conquest secureth our soules seuered from our bodies 670 Christs Soule was not tormented with Gods immediat hand 34 Christs Soule suffered but died not for vs. 133 Christ soule suffered by all her powers but not the death of the Soule 136. 137. 140 Christs Soule chiefe patient in paine and agent in merit 179 Christs Soule could not merit if it wanted vnderstanding and will 480 Christs Soule in her greatest paines did most shew the life of patience and obedience to God 524 Christs Soule was passible but died not 533 Christs Soule was not fastned to hell three daies 551 Christs Soule was in glory before his Body 669 Christs Soule liuing by grace could no way be dead 523 Neither Scriptures nor Fathers vnderstââ¦nd Christs Soule by his Body 426. 427 Christs Soule was not crucified through infirmity 510 Christâ⦠Soule was not vnder the dominion of death 650 What wee must beware in the sufferings of Christs Soule 536 Many writers teach the sufferings of Christs Soule without the paines of hell 536 Why Christs Soule and not his Body was to conquere hell 668 It is not against the faith that Christes Soule should conquere hell 622 Christs manââ¦ood praied for that with all humilitie which hiâ⦠person by ââ¦ight might haue chalenged 378 Christâ⦠manhood might feare the glory of Gods iudgement 380 Christs manhood miââ¦ht feare the power of Gods wrath against our sinnes which he was to beare 380 Christs manhood might feare the sting of death as horrible to mans nature 381 Christs manhoode was to conquere hell 667. though by power of his Godhead 670 Christs flesh found no ease in death though his Soule were full of hope 424 Christs flesh was weake though his Spirite was willing 508 Christs flââ¦sh could not putrifie 623 Christs praier in the Garden was well aduised 397 Christâ⦠praier was no maze 4ââ¦7 Christs praier was not against his Fathers will 397. 465. 466. 470. 471. 472 Christs praier was full of faith 474. 475 Christs praier was with condition and reseruation of Gods will 382 Compassion and pittie are alwaies painfull 27 Compassion is affliction though it be a vertue 438 Christ more compassiââ¦nate then Moses or Paul 359 Christs complaint on the Crosse. 409 How many senses it may beare 418. 420. 421 The first sense 416 The second sense 418 The third sense 421 The fourth sense 430 The fift sense 432 The sixt sense 433 The Saints compââ¦aint in their afflications 418 The euent of Christs coââ¦plaint on the Crosse. 419 No shame for Christ to complaine on the Crosse as he did 420 Leo maketh Christs complaint on the Crosse an instruction no lamentation 432 We were conceaued in sin before we were quickned with life 173 Mans flesh is defiled in conception before the soule is created and infused 174. 175 None can be euerlastingly condemned for anothers fault 363 Christs conquest ouer hell and death 667 was ordered most to Satââ¦ns shame 669 Contradictions obiected by the Defender are easily answered 69 Contradictions in the Defender 320 A shamefull contradiction of the Defender 423 The words of the Creed examined 648 How long this clause of Christs descent to hell hath beene in the Creede 653. 654 Hades in the Creede muââ¦t signifie hell 649 Hell in the Creede is no new translation 652 The Creede continued from the Apostles times 664 Twelue parts of the Creede ââ¦64 What Crââ¦sse of Christ it was that Paul so much reoiyced in 73. 74 75 How the Fathers and new writers expound that place 76. 77 How farre the Crosse of Christ extendeth it selfe by the Scriptures 79 We reioyce in the effects of Christs Crosse. 81 Christ was not voââ¦de of all comfort on the Crossâ⦠410. 411 What comfort Christ had on the Crosse. 412 The death of the Crosse the greatest exââ¦anition of Christ. 433 Christs Soule was not Crucified through infirmitie 501 Figuratiuely the Soule may be said to be Crucified 80 What Cup Christ dranke of 373 What Christ meant by the houre and Cup of his Passion 443 Christ and his members must drinke of one and the same Cup. 353 What part of the Curse Christ bare for our sinnes 234. 235 Hanging on a tree was not the whole Curse of the Law 236 A double Curse of sinne 236 Two kindes oâ⦠Cââ¦rses in the Law 239 The bodily death which Chââ¦ist suffered was the Curse which he sustained 240 Cursing and blââ¦ssing compared doe manifest each the other 249 What is true Cursing and blessing from God 250 How Christ was made a Curse for vs. 257 Christs death was a kinde of Curse 259 Christ vndertooke to satisfie but not to suffer our Curse 260 The Curse for sinne is triple 266 Cyprian wrested by the Defender 274 D D Amnation What paines are essentiall to it 37. 39 The horror of Gods iudgements not neere the paines of the Damned 227 The Godly in this life feele not the paines of the damned 320 Sharper paines are reserued for the damned then now they feele 334 Christ was not