there_o be_v no_o such_o necessity_n then_o must_v he_o needs_o acknowledge_v the_o popish_a bishop_n to_o have_v power_n of_o ordination_n for_o as_o much_o as_o there_o be_v no_o other_o minister_n to_o ordain_v and_o from_o they_o they_o have_v receive_v ordination_n so_o that_o which_o way_n soever_o he_o shall_v turn_v their_o call_n will_v appear_v to_o be_v clear_a and_o certain_a neither_o can_v the_o opinion_n of_o the_o receiver_n null_n or_o annihilate_v the_o truth_n of_o their_o call_n which_o can_v not_o depend_v upon_o their_o opinion_n but_o must_v needs_o consist_v in_o the_o conformity_n of_o their_o ordination_n as_o to_o the_o substance_n of_o it_o to_o the_o primitive_a institution_n or_o the_o necessity_n of_o the_o susception_n of_o the_o work_n of_o the_o ministry_n as_o in_o a_o extraordinary_a case_n without_o ordination_n but_o he_o refuse_v either_o to_o receive_v satisfaction_n from_o or_o to_o make_v any_o direct_a reply_v unto_o this_o fair_a proposal_n 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member_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n and_o so_o have_v a_o true_a right_n in_o foro_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la to_o the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n aught_o as_o well_o to_o be_v baptize_v as_o the_o child_n of_o parent_n be_v to_o repeat_v the_o very_a word_n as_o i_o deliver_v they_o in_o public_a the_o more_o need_n there_o be_v that_o their_o child_n shall_v be_v solemn_o engage_v to_o god_n i_o judge_v it_o very_o necessary_a that_o a_o solemn_a obligation_n to_o the_o duty_n of_o christianity_n shall_v by_o baptism_n be_v lay_v upon_o they_o but_o i_o see_v not_o why_o mr._n ives_n shall_v enter_v his_o exception_n against_o the_o baptise_v of_o the_o child_n of_o wicked_a parent_n as_o such_o unless_o he_o seek_v to_o colour_v his_o opinion_n which_o have_v ever_o be_v explode_v in_o the_o christian_a church_n when_o it_o be_v well_o know_v he_o be_v against_o the_o baptise_v of_o any_o child_n at_o all_o 2_o as_o for_o what_o i_o speak_v of_o the_o five_o monarchy-man_n i_o mean_v 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these_o sect_n as_o bad_a as_o i_o have_v represent_v they_o i_o confess_v i_o be_o under_o a_o great_a mistake_n and_o i_o can_v hearty_o wish_v it_o be_v but_o only_o my_o error_n 3_o and_o as_o for_o that_o charge_n that_o i_o shall_v tell_v any_o gentleman_n that_o i_o be_v inform_v that_o mr._n ives_n be_v a_o jesuit_n and_o shall_v stir_v he_o up_o upon_o that_o account_n to_o apprehend_v he_o i_o must_v needs_o reckon_v it_o among_o those_o slander_n and_o reproach_n that_o have_v be_v most_o injurious_o raise_v against_o i_o for_o though_o i_o suppose_v you_o be_v not_o ignorant_a that_o mr._n ives_n be_v open_o and_o common_o report_v to_o be_v a_o jesuit_n though_o upon_o what_o ground_n i_o know_v not_o whether_o because_o of_o his_o erroneous_a principle_n and_o extravagant_a practice_n in_o his_o intrusion_n into_o the_o office_n and_o yet_o oppose_v the_o call_n of_o
notice_n of_o what_o answer_n have_v be_v give_v unto_o this_o as_o well_o as_o other_o query_n be_v it_o not_o vainglory_n to_o make_v the_o world_n believe_v that_o the_o london_n minister_n in_o their_o jus_o divinum_fw-la min._n ch_n 6._o from_o p._n 95._o to_o 103._o that_o mr._n collins_n in_o his_o vindication_n min._n from_o p._n 49._o to_o 56._o that_o mr._n thomas_n hall_n p._n 56_o to_o 59_o and_o many_o other_o who_o write_v concern_v this_o text_n have_v do_v nothing_o worthy_a mr._n ives_n his_o regard_n of_o it_o 1_o be_v not_o a_o extraordinary_a call_n by_o extraordinary_a gift_n such_o a_o authority_n from_o god_n that_o no_o ordinary_a gift_a brother_n as_o such_o may_v presume_v to_o have_v 2_o be_v not_o these_o in_o 1_o cor._n 14_o thus_o extraordinary_o call_v 3_o be_v they_o not_o express_o call_v prophet_n which_o be_v a_o office_n improper_o so_o call_v pro_fw-la tempore_fw-la 4_o you_o may_v all_o prophesy_v can_v this_o be_v mean_v of_o any_o but_o prophet_n be_v it_o a_o argument_n then_o for_o gift_a brethren_n but_o you_o say_v then_o be_v all_o the_o church_n exhort_v to_o covet_v after_o extraordinary_a office_n answ_n the_o word_n office_n here_o be_v somewhat_o improper_a again_o it_o be_v but_o temporary_a and_o well_o may_v it_o be_v say_v that_o they_o all_o ought_v to_o seek_v after_o these_o extraordinary_a gift_n which_o thus_o qualify_v they_o when_o a_o judge_n place_n fall_v all_o the_o sergeant_n in_o town_n may_v lawful_o seek_v for_o it_o though_o all_o can_v obtain_v it_o god_n have_v promise_v such_o gift_n and_o ought_v they_o not_o to_o seek_v for_o they_o query_n 14_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v say_v that_o prophesy_v here_o be_v a_o ordinary_a office_n than_o it_o follow_v that_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v exhort_v to_o covet_v to_o be_v ordinary_a officer_n which_o will_v be_v to_o make_v the_o whole_a body_n of_o christ_n monstrous_a if_o it_o shall_v be_v say_v that_o they_o be_v not_o exhort_v to_o prophesy_v as_o extraordinary_a or_o as_o ordinary_a office_n then_o i_o query_n whether_o they_o be_v not_o to_o do_v it_o as_o gift_a brethren_n since_o we_o never_o hear_v of_o any_o other_o way_n counter-query_a this_o query_n be_v worth_a nothing_o only_o i_o query_n why_o may_v not_o your_o whole_a church_n covet_v to_o be_v all_o ordinary_a officer_n as_o well_o as_o to_o be_v preach_v gift_v brethren_n if_o because_o it_o be_v monstrous_a to_o have_v so_o many_o roll_a head_n be_v it_o not_o as_o monstrous_a to_o have_v as_o many_o speak_a tongue_n in_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n query_n 15._o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o none_o ought_v to_o preach_v but_o those_o that_o be_v ordain_v except_o as_o before_o except_v i_o query_n among_o those_o several_a ordination_n that_o be_v in_o christendom_n which_o of_o those_o whether_o some_o one_o of_o they_o or_o all_o of_o they_o be_v that_o which_o christ_n approve_v of_o if_o you_o say_v all_o of_o they_o and_o that_o the_o error_n of_o the_o administrator_n in_o some_o circumstance_n do_v not_o make_v the_o ordination_n a_o nullity_n counter-query_a 1_o be_v not_o this_o the_o essential_a of_o ordination_n viz._n a_o set_n apart_o man_n to_o the_o ministry_n by_o minister_n 2_o be_v not_o this_o the_o purity_n of_o it_o viz._n when_o fit_a person_n be_v due_o set_v apart_o by_o gospel_n minister_n in_o that_o gospel_n way_n and_o for_o those_o gospel_n end_v a_o ministry_n be_v appoint_v there_o be_v no_o superstitious_a corruption_n accompany_v this_o ordinance_n 3_o may_v there_o not_o be_v some_o circumstantial_a difference_n even_o among_o those_o that_o practice_n this_o purity_n in_o this_o ordinance_n 4_o may_v we_o not_o say_v then_o that_o all_o the_o ordination_n in_o christendom_n be_v approve_v by_o christ_n that_o differ_v but_o thus_o circumstantial_o as_o well_o as_o man_n of_o opinion_n different_a in_o many_o thing_n be_v accept_v by_o he_o query_n 16._o whether_o one_o may_v not_o by_o this_o opinion_n be_v lawful_o ordain_v at_o rome_n counter-query_a 1_o dare_v you_o say_v that_o rome_n observe_v that_o gospel_n purity_n in_o this_o ordinance_n 2_o though_o the_o substance_n may_v be_v there_o yet_o be_v it_o not_o exceed_v sinful_a now_o for_o we_o to_o submit_v to_o their_o impurity_n consider_v that_o these_o three_o thing_n only_o excuse_v in_o error_n circumstantial_a 1_o when_o the_o error_n be_v so_o slight_a that_o it_o be_v no_o prejudice_n to_o the_o substance_n nor_o do_v engage_v to_o other_o pernicious_a error_n do_v not_o ordination_n among_o the_o papist_n do_v this_o do_v it_o not_o oblige_v to_o obedience_n to_o and_o mission_n by_o that_o autichristian_a see_v note_v that_o the_o case_n follow_v excuse_n when_o this_o can_v be_v plead_v 2_o when_o a_o sincere_a aim_n at_o the_o substance_n be_v accompany_v with_o ignorance_n of_o the_o error_n in_o circumstance_n can_v we_o plead_v ignorance_n of_o the_o error_n of_o rome_n or_o shall_v we_o say_v that_o man_n have_v a_o sincere_a aim_n that_o shall_v go_v thither_o to_o submit_v to_o it_o now_o 3_o when_o a_o case_n of_o necessity_n be_v viz._n 1_o when_o we_o be_v bind_v to_o have_v the_o ordinance_n its_o self_n 2_o and_o when_o it_o can_v be_v elsewhere_o have_v but_o with_o these_o error_n and_o impurity_n 3_o or_o when_o great_a evil_n than_o those_o error_n will_v follow_v be_v this_o our_o case_n now_o with_o rome_n though_o preacher_n be_v bind_v to_o submit_v to_o that_o ordinance_n of_o ordination_n yet_o can_v they_o not_o have_v it_o else_o where_o than_o at_o rome_n in_o more_o purity_n answer_v sir_n be_v it_o not_o in_o more_o purity_n do_v by_o the_o minister_n in_o england_n than_o by_o those_o at_o rome_n query_n 17._o if_o you_o shall_v say_v the_o protestant-ordination_a be_v lawful_a and_o that_o only_a then_o i_o query_n which_o of_o those_o whether_o the_o episcopal_a presbyterian_a or_o independent_a ordination_n be_v that_o which_o be_v approve_v by_o christ_n to_o empower_v the_o minister_n to_o preach_v since_o all_o these_o be_v protestant_n and_o great_o differ_v in_o this_o thing_n counter-query_a do_v you_o not_o easy_o see_v by_o what_o have_v be_v say_v that_o the_o protestant_a ordination_n only_o be_v acknowledge_v to_o be_v lawful_a to_o we_o now_o do_v you_o not_o as_o easy_o see_v the_o episcopal_a presbyterian_a and_o the_o most_o sober_a independent_a minister_n own_o the_o essence_n of_o this_o ordinance_n viz._n that_o it_o be_v a_o set_n apart_o man_n to_o the_o ministry_n by_o minister_n 2_o that_o they_o practise_v the_o purity_n by_o set_v apart_o fit_a man_n in_o a_o gospel_n way_n for_o those_o gospel_n end_v a_o ministry_n be_v appoint_v without_o superstitious_a intermixture_n 3._o ought_v we_o not_o then_o to_o say_v that_o ordination_n by_o all_o or_o any_o of_o they_o be_v approve_v by_o christ_n and_o true_a christian_n to_o empower_v minister_n to_o preach_v notwithstanding_o they_o may_v differ_v in_o some_o circumstantial_o query_n 18._o if_o you_o say_v all_o of_o these_o be_v lawful_a then_o be_v not_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o episcopal_a way_n great_o out_o in_o cry_v up_o the_o ordination_n by_o bishop_n to_o be_v the_o only_a authoritative_a ordination_n in_o opposition_n to_o that_o of_o the_o presbytery_n and_o that_o they_o do_v so_o will_v appear_v if_o you_o consult_v dr._n jer._n taylor_n chaplain_n to_o the_o late_a king_n in_o his_o book_n call_v episcopacy_n assert_v page_n 120_o 121_o 122._o it_o be_v clear_a say_v he_o that_o bishop_n be_v to_o do_v some_o act_n which_o the_o presbyter_n can_v not_o do_v one_o of_o which_o he_o call_v ordination_n by_o imposition_n of_o hand_n which_o he_o say_v be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v by_o presbyter_n again_o the_o say_a doctor_n say_v that_o the_o apostle_n do_v impose_v hand_n for_o confirmation_n which_o say_v he_o be_v to_o continue_v in_o the_o church_n and_o can_v not_o be_v do_v by_o the_o seventy_o or_o any_o mere_a presbyter_n and_o for_o this_o he_o cite_v the_o constant_a practice_n of_o the_o father_n and_o the_o opinion_n of_o divers_a church_n therefore_o pray_v tell_v i_o if_o this_o be_v that_o ordination_n which_o a_o man_n must_v have_v without_o which_o his_o preach_a be_v sinful_a counter-query_a be_v it_o not_o unchristian_a to_o charge_v the_o error_n of_o one_o man_n though_o a_o worthy_a man_n upon_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o episcopal_a way_n be_v it_o not_o evident_a that_o the_o most_o of_o they_o judge_v themselves_o to_o ordain_v as_o minister_n and_o not_o as_o mere_a bishop_n do_v not_o mr._n baxter_n say_v in_o his_o second_o sheet_n that_o bishop_n usher_n do_v acknowledge_v ordination_n by_o presbyter_n without_o a_o bishop_n to_o be_v vallid_a and_o that_o he_o answer_v king_n charles_n by_o a_o instance_n that_o
cast_v out_o by_o any_o church_n censure_n be_v not_o a_o visible_a church_n to_o who_o belong_v all_o the_o ordinance_n 3_o do_v not_o he_o himself_o acknowledge_v such_o as_o these_o be_v to_o be_v the_o matter_n of_o a_o church_n though_o the_o former_a particular_a prove_v they_o actual_o a_o church_n to_o use_v his_o own_o word_n be_v it_o not_o then_o his_o duty_n either_o to_o convince_v they_o that_o they_o be_v not_o believer_n that_o they_o be_v scandalous_a by_o evident_a proof_n from_o their_o life_n which_o he_o never_o do_v yea_o before_o he_o know_v they_o he_o disclaim_v they_o yea_o in_o a_o book_n call_v pill_n to_o purge_v malignant_n etc._n etc._n he_o unchristian_o brand_v they_o with_o vile_a name_n and_o this_o as_o he_o confess_v before_o he_o know_v they_o o_o sad_a be_v this_o to_o come_v as_o a_o ambassador_n of_o christ_n among_o they_o or_o else_o if_o he_o can_v be_v it_o not_o his_o very_a great_a sin_n to_o see_v stone_n and_o timber_n fit_a for_o a_o spiritual_a building_n and_o not_o to_o build_v they_o up_o to_o be_v a_o church_n of_o christ_n much_o more_o must_v he_o not_o be_v accountable_a for_o pluck_v down_o and_o endeavour_v not_o to_o leave_v one_o stone_n upon_o another_o in_o that_o which_o be_v already_o a_o church_n of_o christ_n 4_o or_o must_v he_o not_o prove_v that_o some_o corruption_n unchurch_n they_o be_v not_o the_o corinthian_n some_o carnal_a 1_o cor._n 3.3_o some_o proud_a 1_o cor._n 4.18_o do_v not_o some_o go_v to_o law_n before_o the_o unjust_a ch_n 6.1_o be_v not_o some_o defrauder_n ch_n 6.8_o some_o drunken_a ch_n 11.21_o some_o unworthy_a receiver_n ch_n 11.27_o 28_o 29._o some_o ignorant_a of_o god_n and_o of_o the_o resurrection_n 1_o cor._n 15.34_o 35._o yet_o the_o corinthian_n be_v a_o church_n for_o all_o this_o as_o mr._n willes_n urge_v thus_o some_o of_o the_o seven_o church_n of_o asia_n be_v corrupt_v yet_o be_v style_v church_n still_o rev._n 3.14_o 15._o some_o of_o the_o church_n of_o pergamos_n hold_v the_o doctrine_n of_o balaam_n and_o of_o the_o nicolaitan_n thyatira_n v._o 20._o suffer_v the_o woman_n jezebel_n to_o seduce_v the_o laodicean_n be_v lukewar_n i_o etc._n etc._n 2_o but_o if_o his_o parishioner_n be_v a_o church_n i_o query_n whether_o do_v he_o separate_v from_o they_o as_o a_o church_n or_o as_o corrupt_v if_o as_o a_o church_n be_v it_o not_o a_o horrid_a schism_n such_o as_o the_o protestant_n just_o plead_v not_o guilty_a of_o to_o the_o papist_n or_o aught_o he_o not_o to_o let_v this_o company_n of_o visible_a saint_n to_o enjoy_v their_o own_o mean_n and_o meetingplace_n that_o they_o may_v get_v to_o themselves_o a_o minister_n that_o shall_v give_v they_o the_o ordinance_n how_o dare_v he_o in_o conscience_n hinder_v a_o church_n of_o christ_n from_z unite_n and_o from_o enjoy_v his_o ordinance_n which_o he_o have_v leave_v for_o it_o how_o will_v he_o answer_v it_o at_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n before_o christ_n ought_v not_o his_o own_o church_n as_o he_o call_v they_o to_o have_v a_o meetingplace_n of_o their_o own_o and_o not_o to_o rob_v these_o of_o their_o liberty_n how_o dare_v he_o thrust_v himself_o upon_o a_o flock_n to_o sheer_a the_o fleece_n but_o will_v not_o be_v their_o shepherd_n but_o if_o he_o separate_v only_o from_o their_o corruption_n to_o make_v your_o query_n sound_v any_o thing_n ought_v he_o not_o to_o show_v his_o parishioner_n that_o they_o be_v guilty_a of_o such_o corruption_n as_o make_v we_o separate_v from_o rome_n the_o papist_n worship_n saint_n and_o image_n and_o make_v more_o mediator_n than_o one_o these_o and_o more_o i_o can_v make_v evident_a upon_o proof_n can_v mr._n brook_v evident_o prove_v his_o parishioner_n to_o be_v guilty_a of_o these_o or_o such_o like_a corruption_n do_v you_o read_v of_o any_o that_o ever_o suffer_v so_o great_a a_o church-punishment_n as_o be_v keep_v from_o the_o ordinance_n be_v unless_o first_o there_o be_v conviction_n of_o a_o notorious_a scandal_n 2_o brotherly_a admonition_n matth._n 18.15_o 16_o 17_o 18._o 3_o and_o a_o cast_v out_o by_o church-censure_n 1_o cor._n 5._o again_o can_v there_o have_v be_v any_o corruption_n in_o that_o church_n but_o through_o his_o neglect_n for_o have_v he_o not_o power_n upon_o evident_a conviction_n to_o keep_v back_o the_o scandalous_a i_o say_v upon_o evident_a conviction_n for_o god_n never_o intend_v his_o minister_n shall_v search_v the_o heart_n of_o man_n as_o to_o say_v they_o be_v formal_a and_o wicked_a and_o censure_v their_o heart_n when_o they_o can_v evident_o prove_v nothing_o from_o their_o life_n be_v it_o not_o likewise_o his_o duty_n to_o instruct_v the_o ignorant_a be_v he_o not_o bind_v in_o charity_n to_o judge_v all_o other_o to_o be_v true_a visible_a christian_n how_o then_o can_v he_o plead_v that_o he_o separate_v from_o that_o church_n because_o of_o her_o corruption_n see_v it_o be_v his_o duty_n and_o in_o his_o power_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o gospel_n to_o have_v reform_v it_o will_v not_o these_o schism_n and_o separation_n lie_v heavy_a at_o his_o door_n and_o you_o ought_v you_o not_o to_o clear_v yourselves_o to_o the_o world_n query_n 34._o whether_o it_o have_v not_o be_v common_a for_o those_o of_o your_o way_n to_o separate_v from_o the_o papist_n and_o yet_o take_v their_o tithe_n and_o to_o use_v your_o own_o phrase_n sheer_a those_o lame_a and_o disease_a sheep_n which_o you_o have_v deny_v to_o admit_v into_o the_o fold_n with_o you_o counter-query_a be_v not_o tithe_n settle_v in_o parish_n for_o the_o maintenance_n of_o those_o that_o take_v the_o care_n and_o charge_n of_o those_o parish_n do_v not_o therefore_o the_o tithe_n belong_v to_o those_o of_o master_n willes_n his_o way_n that_o take_v this_o charge_n do_v mr._n brookes_n do_v thus_o do_v he_o not_o declare_v that_o he_o take_v no_o more_o charge_n of_o the_o parish_n as_o their_o minister_n than_o of_o any_o other_o do_v those_o of_o mr._n willes_n his_o way_n deny_v the_o papist_n any_o thing_n that_o be_v their_o right_n and_o due_a have_v not_o the_o church_n debar_v they_o from_o communion_n with_o we_o be_v it_o not_o equity_n than_o they_o shall_v not_o deny_v their_o due_n do_v master_n brook_n do_v thus_o when_o be_v his_o parishioner_n cut_v off_o from_o church_n communion_n how_o or_o by_o who_o have_v not_o those_o of_o mr._n willes_n his_o way_n the_o consent_n of_o those_o parish_n they_o take_v the_o charge_n from_o who_o they_o require_v their_o maintenance_n but_o have_v not_o mr._n brookes_n unworthy_o crowd_v in_o by_o might_n and_o yet_o never_o intend_v to_o take_v the_o charge_n for_o which_o the_o tithe_n be_v intend_v yea_o and_o have_v he_o not_o trouble_v his_o parishioner_n for_o the_o nonpayment_n of_o they_o query_n 35._o if_o you_o say_v they_o may_v if_o they_o will_v reform_v have_v communion_n with_o you_o i_o query_n then_o whether_o this_o very_a objection_n that_o cause_v you_o to_o exclude_v papist_n be_v not_o the_o reason_n why_o mr._n brooks_n refuse_v scandalous_a protestant_n and_o other_o profane_a people_n viz._n because_o they_o do_v not_o reform_v counter-query_a we_o do_v say_v if_o they_o will_v reform_v and_o turn_v protestant_n that_o the_o church_n of_o england_n will_v have_v communion_n with_o they_o will_v mr._n brook_n say_v thus_o of_o his_o parish_n nay_o will_v it_o not_o be_v a_o rejoice_v to_o many_o honest_a heart_n if_o he_o can_v make_v it_o manifest_a that_o he_o refuse_v none_o but_o scandalous_a and_o profane_a people_n and_o that_o because_o they_o be_v such_o and_o will_v not_o reform_v do_v mr._n brookes_n exclude_v the_o whole_a parish_n because_o scandalous_a and_o profane_a be_v it_o not_o evident_a that_o they_o be_v count_v profane_a and_o exclude_v as_o papist_n because_o they_o will_v not_o own_o his_o church_n and_o dis-own_a their_o own_o will_v he_o not_o own_o some_o of_o these_o very_a man_n and_o count_v they_o reform_v once_o if_o they_o will_v but_o own_o his_o schismatical_a way_n to_o who_o he_o never_o yet_o otherwise_o will_v tender_v the_o ordinance_n do_v ever_o christ_n intend_v that_o his_o ordinance_n shall_v be_v tie_v up_o to_o mr._n brookes_n his_o opinion_n how_o will_v you_o or_o this_o man_n excuse_v his_o conscience_n in_o this_o query_n 36._o if_o you_o shall_v deny_v this_o succession_n and_o say_v that_o there_o be_v none_o and_o that_o it_o be_v lose_v then_o i_o query_n whether_o this_o be_v not_o a_o singular_a and_o private_a opinion_n of_o your_o own_o differ_v from_o the_o rest_n of_o your_o brethren_n counter-query_a do_v you_o easy_o see_v by_o this_o time_n that_o we_o have_v no_o need_n to_o deny_v a_o succession_n and_o that_o your_o query_n have_v be_v