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Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
word_n	church_n	particular_a	visible_a	3,670	5	9.2317	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A95679	Gainsayer convinced: or, An answer to a certain scandalous paper, subscribed and sent by certain seduced and seditious people to a minister in the countrey: in which the calling of the ministry of the Church of England, the nature of a visible church, the power of the magistrate under the gospel, the right of tithes, with many other points now in controversie, are briefly, fully and plainly cleared, to the satisfaction of those that are wavering; also much of the spirit and many of the errours of the Anabaptists of these daies (who call themselves saints) discovered and confuted. / By T.T. Preacher of the word at Kemble in Wiltshire.	Thache, Thomas, b. 1616 or 17.	1649 (1649)	Wing T827; Thomason E568_1; ESTC R206240	79,821	83

unto fables 2 Tim. 4. 3 4. And if ever those words of the Apostles were fulfilled 't is in these times upon which the Lord hath cast us And certainly there was never any fable a more arrand device of man then some part of that Ministery of yours so much gloried in for sincere correspondence to the Primitive Institution Pap. In your sixth place you say you dislike not our zeal in Preaching against errors heresies and Hereticks Ans Truly we thank you for nothing 't is a wonder almost do you not indeed dislike it 't is well there is something that comes not under the penaltie of your dislike hut if you do not dislike it I marvell why you above others do so wince at it surely this argues that there is some gawled place Where i st you tell us something in the next place Paper You say we take not a Gospel-way to convince and to reprove them as first to prove them such 2ly by the same rule to reprove them and then cast them out if you are a Church of Christ which if you are we wonder at your disorder c. Ans We thank you for your instructions and teaching us how to reprove and convince heresies and hereticks And I desire to let you know that we have known and do know and have sufficiently proved and reproved some of your errors and shall if God permit do more in that way hereafter but for our casting them out in the first place you save us that labour for you separate your selves and besides if you did not the Church is at present so rob'd of her power that Ochim Zim and Jim Owles and Satyres all the devils in hell are broke loose amongst us and may have a quiet habitation amongst us and we are at present stript of all power but that of our prayers and the immediate power of Almighty God to cast them out You need not me thinks wonder so much at our disorder seeing we live in an age wherein all order and government in Church is counted Popery and Antichristianity and persecution of tender consciences For our disorders I shall say as Paul to his Galathians I would to God they were even cut off that trouble our order but they shall in their due time receive their reward and bear their judgement whosoever they be Gal. 5. 10. 1● But I cannot but take notice of your supposition if we be a Church which if you are we wonder at your disorder It seems you conclude us to be no Church because of some disorders what is it come to an if with you truly you have made haste to run thus far alreadie what are we no Church To satisfie you in this let me ask you do you know what makes and constitutes a true visible Church It appears you do not and therefore I will tell you According to the Scriptures and the joynt consent of all Protestant Churches in the world the sincere preaching of the Word and the due administration of the Sacraments constitutes or makes a true visible Church Again do you know what is a true particular visible Church It is a particular company of men professing the Christian faith known by the two marks above-mentioned viz the sincere preaching of the Word and the due administration of the Sacraments Now I tell you and if you have any thing to say in denyall of it I shall make it good to you that by Gods mercy we have the true use of the Word and Sacraments and all other essentiall gifts and graces of God to make us a Church and though at present by reason of many such disorderly fellows as your selves and by reason of the want of some helps in execution of that power and authoritie which Christ hath invested our Church withall there may be many disorders amongst us and we are annoy'd with many practicall evils but yet so long as the Gospel is it self amongst us so long as the aire of that is clear so long as we directly and inviolably hold the foundation I tell you that though every rayler may tearm us no Church and every Ignoramus may doubt whether we be a Church or no yet there is no Seperatist shall be able to prove us no Church If you can do it I desire to hear what you can say against us and I promise you if you can prove us no Church and prove your selves to be one I will be your disciple and I will acknowledge that you have received more new and miraculous light then all the * Dr. Featly Dipper dipt Russet Rabbies and Mechanick Enthusiasts that ever I yet heard or read of For surely though some of the Masters of your new way have bitterly inveighed against the Hierarchy and tyrannie of some of our Prelates yet the same tongues and pens have both justified our Church and extold it many have indeed opposed some of our Appendances and circumstances which we dislike with them but they have acknowledged and defended our substance And many of our late most rigorous Fathers have not more disliked our Episcopall Government then imbraced our Church we are but little beholding to your charitie who seem to question our true visibilitie of a Church and the world cannot but laugh at it and we cannot but pitie your ignorance that you for some corruptions and disorders amongst us should hold us to be no Church and so separate from us Again are we no Church pray then tell me what are you can you be so impudent as to deny this that some of you have been begotten again by the word of our Ministery will not your own consciences convince you lay your hands upon your hearts what saith conscience to ●his Have you not I say some of you acknowledged doth not conscience yet acknowledge that as Paul said to his Corinthians 1 Cor. 3. 10. according to the grace of God which hath been given to us some of us have layed the foundation of Christ in your souls though now another buildeth thereon as the Apostle said I am sure of this Other foundation ●an no man lay then that is layed which is Jesus Christ Now let every man ●ake heed how he buildeth thereon he that builds upon this foundation wood hay stubble this work will not abide but shall be burnt and he ●hall suffer losse and though himself be saved yet it will be so as by fire Again what saith Conscience to this have not many of you acknowledged that since your new birth you have suckt much consolation and strength from the breasts of our Church have not many of you been nourisht and grow'd thereby and are we now doubted to be a Church what 's the matter is the food changed is there any alteration in that or have you a sick mans pallate that can rellish no wholsome savourie food Surely surely it is not because there is no savour in the food but because of the distemper of the pallate The Lord help you to see

this and yet of no Religion if you have apostatized from this I would fain know what new religion you have found out what God ye acknowledge and after what way and in what manner ye do worship you tell me something in the following part of this branch of your Paper that after that way which we call heresie you so worship the God of your fathers you have been lately taught to say this in a Sermon of your new Pastors I see you can remember the text But I tell you and will make it good to you that if you worship the God of your fathers after that way which we call heresie your worship is incense in the devils nostrils and an abomination to the Lord. And this I doubt not but you will be convinc'd of anon when I come to shew you what way 't is that we call heresie Pray be so charitable for the time to come as to think that we are of some religion though it may be not of yours Paper You say in the next place that we are a hodg-podge made up of all like the Turks Alcoran of Heathenisme in permitting meer Atheists and prophane ones to be members of our Church and partakers of our Seals in worship of Jewish Tithes and oblations of Popish ordination and ceremonies of Episcopall pomp pride and avarice c. Ans What can you leave off so soon is this all have ye no more 't is wonder but let 's see what all this out-cry is for First we are a meer hodge-podge I would that you who pretend so to excell in Saint-ship and the Spirit would but once discover and manifest thus much that ye had learn'd common civility and how to give some civill language In what are we an hodge-podge you say we admit of heathens and prophane ones to be members of our Church and partakers of the Seals of our worship Truly no other Heathens nor prophane ones then such as you your selves are I know of no Atheists nor Heathens that have been admitted members as Atheists and Heathens to any of our Churches or any Church in Christendome it may be that some of you that charge us with this have been travellers and so may lye by authoritie according to the Proverb pray tell me let 's be informed by you a little where or in what particular Church of ours have any Atheists or Heathens been admitted members or to either of the Seals are any admitted to the first or second Seal but such as are born within the line of the Church of Christian parents professing faith in Christ Jesus are any but such admitted by us to the first Seal or any but such to the second Now will you make those that are born within the line of the visible Church and that do professe faith in Christ Jesus to be Heathens and Atheists what Brownisticall Anabaptisticall tenets are these wil not all the world that hears of this hisse at your madnes your simplicitie and non-sence and your witlesse groundlesse uncharitable charging and censuring of us Again where can you shew any meerly prophane ones who continuing openly such without profession of godly sorrow and desires of coming to the Lord Jesus for forgivenesse and for increase of grace that they might be inabled to lead a more holy life for the time to come that have been admitted by us to the Lords Supper This is as very a slander as all the rest and if they do desire to come in this way I would fain know of you where is your warrant and authoritie from Scripture to deny them To satisfie you further in this I long to see where your rule or your command is from Christ to require satisfaction by convincing Arguments of the true grace of every Church-member I am confident of it that if that were strictly stood upon by your new Pastor he would have but a thin Church I am afraid were an honest and sufficient impartiall understand●ng Ch●istian to be Judge of this the greatest part of the Ten Subscribers would be found tardy in this and so not fit to be members what ever you lay claim to What ever your new guide pretends to he must stretch his tender conscience in dispencing with and in taking many upon charitable suppositions in this point or else his quarters would quickly grow as cold and as thin at Cirencester as they have been at other places and so he must again turn Traveller and an Itinerary Again I see you do not know poore men and therefore I would have you to go to your spirituall and gifted man to teach you what is the nature of a visible Church and lest he should be ignorant of it I will give you a hint or two of it The visible Church it is such a body whose members are never all gracious if you will beleeve the Scripture it is not like the Church invisible the Church of the Elect but it is an Heterogeneous body do you understand that word I 'le help you the parts of it are very dissimular some chaff some corn some wheat some tares a net of fishes good and bad an house wherein are vessels of honour and dishonour a fold of sheep and goats a tree of green and withered branches a table of guests some with some without a wedding garment In a word every visible Church is a society wherein many are called and few are chosen Except therefore you will alter the nature of all true visible Churches whereof the Scripture speaks we must grant and so must you that in every visible Church there are some members which have not true grace If you have any thing to say to this let me hear your Arguments and I shall answer you Paper Your next grounds upon which you say we are of no religion are because we receive Jewish Tithes and Oblations because of Popish ordination and ceremonies Episcopall pomp pride and avarice Ans For matter of Tithes you give me large occasion by and by after and therefore I will refer that till I come to it there Though your Paper be full of Tautologies to stuffe up your invective I shall shovell up as much of your filth as I can together into order in my Answer For Popish ordination if therefore Popish because by Bishops I have likewise formerly said enough alreadie to satisfie reasonable men though perhaps not you and therefore I shall say no more of that here neither For Popish Ceremonies we renounce them and are as far as the precisest Anabaptist of you all from tollerating them either in our selves or others where we may in a lawfull way hinder and remove them For our Episcopall pomp pride and avarice which you say is in us I tell you again you will be judging till you are judged if you leave not the sooner The Lord forgive you Paper To passe by much of your rubbish the next thing you give me occasion to take notice of is your zeal against evill in opinion and

Spirit If you call this a disowning of the Saints meetings to communicate to each other the things of God a discouraging of others from them and discountenancing of Saints practise we leave it to God Angels and men to judge betwixt you and us And truly seeing these are those last times in which there are many Antichrists abroad as St. John 1 Ep 2. Ch 18. I know not any counsell that can be more seasonable to you your selves then this if the Lord would give you hearts to receive and embrace it Your 12th branch is very large a great deal of Riffraff raked up together to make one dunghill much of the same stuffe that hath been spoken to before the fruits of that spirit that reigns in the Saints of these times I shall passe by and turn over as I promised you all your raylings and revilings and shall endeavour to answer a●l that deserves an Answer Paper In the beginning you cannot but wonder you say at our contradictions in that we would make the world beleeve that we are like to suffer the losse of all and to be brought to prisons nay stakes for our consciences by the Sectaries and yet condemne them at the same time for endeavouring a prodigious tolleration of all Religions what a strange contradiction is here say you Ans Have ye not read the story in 1 King 12. 13. how Jeroboam suffered all the people of Israel to go a whoring after the Calves which he erected at Dan and Bethel and that when the man of God came out of Judah to cry against his Altar upon which he offered to his Calves Jeroboam stretched out his hand against him and cryed out Lay hold on him We need not use many arguments to make the world beleeve that we are like to suffer the losse of all to be brought to Prisons and Stakes and that for our consciences The world sees it sufficiently that some of us have already been brought to prisons and some are now in prison and this not without losse and all have been threatned if not with stakes yet with as cruell deaths and all this onely for our consciences Again on the other fide that there is a Tolleration of all Religions endeavoured Heaven and Earth do see and surely this is prodigious and we may here cry out as the Lord by the mouth of the Prophet Jerem 2. 12. Be astonished Oye heavens at this and be ye horribly afraid be ye very desolate saith the Lord. Now if you will wonder wonder not that we speak of such contradictions when ye see such contradictions acted wonder at these things Paper But you undertake in the next place to justifie these proceedings where you positively say that we are indeed of no religion and so not to be tollerated by them Ans Doth this sound like the charity of Saints you are of no Religion let me a little look upon your names that have subscribed this Thomas Clutterbuck William Burge Giles Handcox Thomas Sheapheard Caleb Self c. one while you say we are Antichristian here we are of no Religion neither we nor our people nor our Churches can in this estate be judged to be so much as Christians What can any Devill in Hell say worse against us then this if we denyed the true God and whom he hath sent Jesus Christ if we denied every Article of the Christian Faith if we were the most damned Hereticks under Heaven what could you say more of us then this that we are indeed of no Religion you Thomas or William or Giles will you make this good to any one of us that we are of no Religion Certainly this uncharitablenesse is above all example monstrous Calumnies invented by Pagans against Christians have not been so horrible It could hardly have been imagined that the Devil himself had been able to have led any reasonable creatures into such an excesse of impudency and slander unto such unchristian-like reproaches yet these men would fain be accounted The Saints Well take heed lest while you run on in these wayes you hear old Jacobs words Cursed be their wrath for it was feirce and their rage for it was cruell Paper Again you are of no Religion which indeed is true Ans Freinds have ye not heard of nor read the stories of John of Leyden Kinpperdollin and David George Those famous or rather infamous Anabaptists and of the pranks they play'd in Germany and whither the Lord suffered Satan to lead those proud hypocrites who in their own eyes were such holy Saints as they could not but in the tendernesse of their consciences separate from the best reformed Churches of Christ as being of no Religion how they apostatized from that religion and service which the Scripture prescribed how they did put away baptisme the Lords Supper and the preaching of the Word and perswaded many poore ignorant people to follow their pernicious wayes to their destruction drawing them along after the directions of these new Prophets have ye not heard of these things whether or no the same spirit which was the author of that Anabaptisme and under that of all other their prodigious and horrible impieties in Germany doth not now make his appearance in England and walk amongst us I leave to all to judge who have but half an eye open and are any whit acquainted with those stories out of pitie and compassion and meer love to your souls the Lord knows I beg and pray for you that you be not taken captive in those snares Paper Again you are of no Religion which indeed is true Ans Of no Religion we acknowledge the onely true God Father Son and holy Ghost for our God and he hath acknowledged us to be his people he hath taken us into Covenant with him we beleeve that he hath given his Son Jesus Christ to dye for our sins and that he is risen again for our justification we enjoy union and communion with him in grace here being spiritually and mystically yet really and inseparably joyned to Christ as our Head and Husband we pertake of the virtue of his mediation in our justification adoption sanctification we live in expectation of everlasting communion with our head Christ Jesus in that glory of heaven the first fruits of which glory with Christ is communicated to us in this life as we are members of him our head and so in him are interessed in that glory which he is fully possest of And as an earnest thereof we enjoy the sence of Gods love peace of conscience joy in the holy Ghost and hope of glory and whilest we continue here in this life in the communion of Saints the Lord hath given us the presence the help and support of his own Spirit to teach guide direct and enable us to and to support us in his worship fear and service which we desire and endeavour to perform according to that rule which he hath given us for our faith and obedience in his holy Word All

fit your selves and then and not before to preach and that unlesse you do you must not preach Ans Oh ridiculous simplicitie and syllinesse may I not as well ask you Thomas the Clothier Giles the Mercer Roger the Shoomaker Samuel the Boddice-maker and William the Ironmonger you professe that Christ is your Lord and Master where 's his command that you should serve seven yeers under a Master at your Trade and that then you should set up your trade for your selves and not before I will answer your quaere in such a comparison Thus you know that it is God's will that every man have some or other lawfull Calling to abide in and to labour See 1 Cor. 7. 20. 22. 24. Now the Common-wealth in which you live hath in Christian policy thought it good to Enact such a Law that none shall have leave to set up any Trade in the Common-wealth till they have served such a time in the Trade And this is grounded upon severall reasons As first to avoid confusion in the Common-wealth 2ly that men might be thereby enabled and fitted for their callings lest entring upon them without knowledge they first abuse and undo their selves for want of skill and 2ly that the Common-wealth be not abused by their venting and selling Wares not vendible and usefull and the like To clear this to you in an instance if every man that had a will to it should freely set up the Trade of a Mercer Shoo-maker Boddice-maker Ironmonger Clothier c. who had not served at the Trade and had no knowledge in the Trade you would presently judge that here were like to be a fair Trade the Common-wealth was like to be well served and we should have strange commodities from them poore Cloth Shooes Boddice c. This by way of comparison And from this to shew you in like manner that the office of preaching the Gospel of Christ and administring of Sacraments is a distinct office in the Church It is the will and command of Christ that such as undertake and enter into this office should be qualified with abilities parts and gifts fitting for so great a work he must not be a novice 1 Tim. 3. 6. he must be able to teach others 2 Tim. 2. 2. he must be a workman so able to divide the Word of God aright as that he need not to be ashamed 2 Tim. 2. 15. Where this ability is wanting the Church of Christ is like to be as ill served as the Common-wealth by simple and unskilfull Tradesmen Now the Apostle tels us that the Scriptures are sufficient to make the man of God perfect and to furnish him throughly to all good works that is to all the services of his profession to those works of his calling he mentioned before viz doctrine reproof correction and instruction for these things the Scriptures are sufficient to furnish a man But now for the sufficient understanding and not perverting and wresting of the Scriptures learning is requisite and necessary 2 Pet. 3. latter end To clear this farther to you you must know that there be two great works which belong to this high calling first Instruction of the scholar 2ly conviction of the adversaries Now every understanding man can judge how many different parts of learning are requisite to the perfection See Dr. Reynolds Exp Psal 110. pa. 268. of these two services First there must be knowledge in the tongues for the better understanding of the holy Scriptures by their originall Idiom and emphasis for in Translations there may be and are some errors for though the Scriptures be the infallible Word of God yet the Translators are men which are subject to errour and may mistake 2ly There is required the knowledge of the Arts to observe the cōnnexion the argumentation and method of them 3ly there is required knowledge of ancient customes History and Antiquitie of the Babylonians Persians Greeks and Romanes without in-sight whereinto the full meaning of many passages of holy Scripture cannot be clearly understood and apprehended 4ly there is required School-learning for the discovering and repelling of the subtilty of the adversaries and because Julian the Apostate saw that the Christians in his time made excellent use of this in repelling and beating down his errors he therefore interdicted them the use of Schools of Learning whose examples many Apostates from our Church follow in these dayes who cry out against all humane Learning as the weapons of Gentiles and not fit for Christians to use Lastly there is required a knowledge of the Histories and Antiquities of the Church that we may observe the succession of the Professors and doctrines thereof the originals sprouting of Heresie therein and the better to answer the reproaches of our insolent adversaries who lay innovation to our charge In a word men cannot understand the Scripture in their originall languages without the tongues they cannot expound without Grammar nor perswade without Rhetoricke nor divide without Logick nor sound the depth of any controversie without Philosophy and school divinity Now seeing all this learning is requisite for the understanding expounding dividing the word aright and for instructiing exhorting and perswading thereby and for the convincing the gainsayers thereof You must know that there are but two waies that ever we heard of for the gaining of these requisites The first is extraordinary the immediate inspiration of the Holy Ghost and the miraculous gifts of Tongues and Prophecy And 2ly The ordinary acquiring of these by the means which God hath vouchsafed viz. Schools of learning and our applying our selves to and our endeavours in them The first of these waies viz. the gaining of these abilities by immediate inspiration and revolation hath ceased in the Church of Christ these many hundred yeares even ever since the time of the Apostles of Christ who being in themselves some of them before their calling to their Apostleship unlearned men did receive their gifts and abilities this way Acts 2. And many other Primitive Christians with them in those daies but those Irradiations Revelations and Inspirations of the Spirit together with the fiery Tongues have ceased for many hundred yeares and have not been seen in any Christian Church of late Therefore there remains onely that other ordinary way of gaining these abilities which I have mentioned viz. in the lawfull and diligent use of the means by going to the University as you call it or to some Schooles where learning is to be had to fit our selves Now then seeing the office of the Ministery is a distinct office seeing those that enter into it must be furnisht with abilities gifts and partes enabling them to teach and by the word to instruct to correct to exhort and to convince seeing these parts and abilities are not inspired miraculoully but acquired in and by the use of means seeing these means are the Schools of Learning seeing through the use of these means by Gods blessing on our endeavours we attain to

these abilities and parts And seeing the Spirit of God directs and enables us by these abilities and parts to divide the word aright to instruct exhort correct and convince c. I hope that the simplicity of your Quaere and the the sufficiency of our commission in this doth visibly appear to rationall men And before I leave this point let me tell you that we can never sufficiently admire nor detest the saucinesse of those bold Intruders in these dayes who venture to become teachers of the ignorant before themselves have been Disciples of the Learned who being rude and unlearned I had almost said illiterate mechanicks without calling and without knowledge do so boldly and presumptuously leap from their manuall Trades into this sacred and dreadfull office of which Paul himself could cry out who is sufficient And though some of them pretend to a calling to it and to gifts and abilities for their calling I would feigne know who is the author of it if they avouch God I would require that they should prove th●● their calling from God by some evident signe for whensoever it pleaseth God to change the ordinary course and to cal any man to any office extraordinary he declares that his good will and pleasure by some evident signe Now if the calling of our Anabaptisticall new teachers be ordinary let them demonstrate it by the Scripture if extraordinary let them prove it by signe and by miracl●● And as for their gifts and abilities in which they say they are spirituall men and have all the gifts from the spirit I shall tell you that whatsoever their pretences be to the Spirit and Revelations and Infusions yet seeing they cannot do as those Primitive Christians did seeing they come as far short of those Christians in extraordinary gifts as they do behind them in time seeing they are so far from speaking with strange Tongues that they cannot speake correctly See Dr. Featly Dipper dipt and coherently in their own mother-Tongue seeing they are many times so wide from the sence of some Scriptures they venture to expound and apply that their Expositions and Applications are oft without sence seeing they utter old broken Notes taken from other mens Sermons for new Revelations seeing they furbish up ancient heresies that have layen long in the dark for Christian Armour of light seeing in their Interpretations they not onely contradict Scripture but themselves seeing their prophecyings are but vain janglings though some of them have got a glib tongue and thereby slide into the approbation of the vulgar sort seeing in their contemplations they oft soar so high as that they loose themselves and vent blasphemies and grosse errors for visions and revelations of the Spirit Seeing I say that notwithstanding all their specious pretences these be their fruits as the very sad experience of these times do too well manifest to the world They shall give us leave to esteeme them no Prophets but Enthusiasts no inspired men but distracted no Seers but dreamers no Expositors but Impostors no workmen but botchers no fixed stars but wanderers no lights but exhalations incensed in the night which leade fools out of their way sometimes into thickets sometimes into ditches and quagmyres and many into Rivers over head and ears Paper Your next Quaere is where is our command that we should admit any to either seals before they can make it visibly to appeare that they are in Christ Ans Here you begin to speak a little plainly and to tell us now what Religion you are of viz. pure Anabaptists I know your meaning is where is our commission to baptize Infants for these cannot make it visibly appeare that they are in Christ I answer where is your command from Christ to require all those that would be admitted to the seals first to make it visibly appear that they have interest in Christ I here undertake to make it good to you from the Word of God first that it is an unwarrantable practice in you or any other and an unjust scrupulosity to require satisfaction of the true grace and reall holines of every one that is admitted a member of the visible Church what do you think of the Apostles baptizing Simon Magus Act. 8. 13. 't is true the text saith that he beleeved also and was baptized but all the world knows and acknowledges that that beleeving was but an externall profession of faith being convinced by miracles of Gods power did he or could he make it visibly appear that he had interest in Christ The Apostles tell him afterward in that Chapter that he was in the gall of bitternesse and the bond of iniquitie yet having before made but an outward profession of faith in Christ he was admitted to baptisme And where there is such an outward profession made you cannot answer the denying the seal of Baptisme to such a one And we have no warrant to require a farther satisfaction of their reall interest in Christ And therefore 2ly I likewise undertake to make it good to against you and your Goliah who ever he be that children of beleeving and Christian parents ought to be admitted to the first seal of the Covenant viz Baptisme and if you require a syllabicall command for this practise I desire to know of you on the contrary where Christ or his Apostles have in plain tearms forbidden or denyed them this ordinance or where we are commanded not to admit them because the Church wherein we live hath been for many hundred yeers and is still to this day in possession and practice of this ordinance I being alreadie satisfied in my own conscience must hear from you what you have to say against this practice before I spend more labour in the defence of it if you have any thing to say against it let me hear what it is and I doubt not but I shall easily make it appear to you that your denying the Sacrament of Baptisme to Infants of Parents professing faith is an hereticall opinion and practice and so convince you of your errour herein And I shall likewise in that shew you our commission from Christ for this practice Paper In the next place you ask us where is our command to admit prophane drunkards swearers lyars or raylers to the Lords table Ans First whosoever charges us with admitting prophane drunkards swearers lyars or raylers as such to the Lords Supper they are lyars and raylers 2ly I demand of you whether if a man hath once been a drunkard lyar swearer c. he may never be admitted because he hath been formerly such a one or whether those that have been such may not be admitted when they give visible testimonies and professions of their repentance of their desires to wait upon God in that ordinance for their receiving a seal of the pardon of their former sins upon their repentance and faith in Christ and for increasing confirming and strengthening that grace they have already received in their