5._o where_o you_o revive_v it_o again_o then_o your_o chearse_v mr._n hooker_n sentence_n and_o there_o sinde_v that_o i_o do_v not_o accord_v with_o he_o if_o not_o than_o i_o pray_v lee_n this_o convince_v you_o that_o you_o have_v not_o speak_v right_o when_o you_o say_v i_o borrow_v my_o ground_n from_o mr._n hooker_n reader_n in_o your_o epist_n to_o the_o reader_n how_o do_v i_o borrow_v my_o ground_n from_o he_o to_o who_o i_o go_v cross_n as_o you_o say_v i_o do_v if_o i_o have_v do_v so_o mr._n hooker_n be_v a_o man_n of_o who_o one_o may_v borrow_v but_o i_o do_v not_o remember_v what_o ground_n i_o borrow_v but_o i_o be_v glad_a when_o i_o see_v so_o learned_a and_o holy_a a_o man_n to_o defend_v some_o thing_n which_o before_o i_o conceive_v be_v right_o but_o as_o to_o this_o difference_n here_o i_o be_o sure_a mr._n hooker_n be_v now_o alive_a in_o england_n he_o will_v not_o baptize_v all_o the_o child_n of_o any_o of_o the_o congregalon_n dâ—â—_n england_n without_o any_o more_o ado_n i_o can_v gather_v so_o much_o out_o of_o his_o book_n and_o therefore_o we_o do_v not_o differ_v in_o this_o then_o you_o come_v to_o my_o first_o premise_v which_o be_v the_o infant_n abstract_v from_o the_o parens_fw-la 3._o page_n 3._o give_v no_o reason_n why_o it_o shall_v be_v baptize_v this_o say_v you_o be_v otherwise_o propound_v by_o mr._n hooker_n then_o it_o be_v unlikely_a to_o be_v borrow_v of_o he_o then_o you_o tell_v i_o it_o be_v not_o right_o propose_v yes_o sir_n very_o right_a it_o be_v ordinary_a with_o divine_n to_o lay_v a_o proposition_n first_o further_o off_o 4._o page_n 4._o then_o to_o come_v near_o neither_o do_v i_o see_v that_o you_o have_v one_o whit_n consure_v it_o but_o yield_v it_o do_v you_o baptize_v any_o child_n in_o your_o parish_n without_o consider_v it_o in_o relation_n to_o a_o parent_n do_v you_o consider_v it_o in_o it_o selse_a abstract_a from_o any_o other_o and_o yet_o baptize_v it_o i_o pray_v make_v a_o argument_n out_o of_o that_o text_n in_o your_o title-page_n mar_n 10.14_o which_o i_o preslime_v you_o bring_v for_o infant_n baptism_n and_o consider_v the_o infant_n alone_o as_o abstract_v from_o the_o parent_n you_o say_v present_o here_o the_o child_n of_o england_n be_v christian_n bear_v how_o by_o reason_n of_o the_o house_n soil_n or_o the_o parent_n then_o it_o be_v a_o christian_a child_n and_o in_o relation_n to_o such_o a_o one_o it_o be_v baptize_v thus_o you_o find_v fault_n with_o mr._n hooker_n but_o if_o you_o will_v cross_v he_o 185._o diatr_n 185._o or_o myself_o who_o be_o not_o worthy_a to_o be_v name_v in_o the_o day_n with_o he_o lay_v down_o this_o proposition_n viz._n the_o infant_n of_o england_n quâ_fw-la sic_fw-la consider_v as_o abstract_v from_o any_o where_o aught_o to_o be_v baptize_v if_o you_o will_v maintain_v this_o than_o i_o confess_v you_o may_v find_v faule_fw-mi for_o your_o second_o answer_n when_o any_o body_n practice_v as_o you_o say_v there_o then_o let_v such_o a_o one_o consider_v it_o you_o may_v have_v spare_v those_o line_n for_o i_o know_v none_o such_o i_o do_v it_o before_o the_o child_n be_v bring_v then_o you_o come_v to_o the_o second_o premise_v the_o child_n be_v baptize_v as_o consider_v in_o relation_n to_o a_o parent_n one_o or_o both_o that_o be_v the_o sum_n you_o say_v m._n hooker_n and_o i_o mean_v the_o tax_v parent_n and_o this_o you_o have_v consure_v large_o that_o be_v your_o meaning_n in_o diatr_n p._n 187._o of_o that_o hereafter_o only_o now_o you_o add_v first_o your_o say_n thin_a ineffect_n be_v the_o same_o with_o the_o former_a one_o the_o negative_a the_o other_o the_o affirmative_a true_a sir_n i_o know_v it_o before_o only_o for_o clearness_n suke_n as_o we_o use_v to_o openiting_n first_o by_o show_v what_o they_o be_v not_o as_o say_v love_n union_n with_o christ_n etc._n etc._n then_o what_o they_o be_v so_o i_o do_v here_o and_o i_o hope_v no_o fault_n in_o so_o do_v second_o you_o tell_v i_o of_o two_o other_o way_n for_o child_n to_o come_v to_o baptism_n beside_o the_o next_o parent_n 5._o page_n 5._o of_o which_o hereafter_o next_o you_o say_v i_o take_v occasion_n to_o desine_fw-la a_o church_n a_o society_n of_o visible_a sain_n join_v together_o by_o way_n of_o covenant_n etc._n etc._n here_o you_o observe_v two_o thing_n 1._o that_o i_o own_v no_o cathelique_n church_n but_o a_o particular_a congregation_n nor_o any_o member_n of_o a_o church_n but_o of_o such_o a_o church_n than_o you_o climb_v of_o a_o man_n be_v a_o member_n only_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n and_o by_o virtue_n of_o that_o require_v baptism_n for_o his_o child_n 〈◊〉_d for_o a_o catholic_a church_n yes_o i_o own_v it_o neither_o do_v i_o know_v any_o understand_a man_n deny_v it_o but_o i_o doubt_v you_o forget_v one_o word_n you_o mean_v catholic_a visible_a church_n but_o if_o you_o have_v say_v so_o yes_o in_o i_o own_o that_o also_o but_o whether_o it_o be_v one_o organitall_a body_n i_o see_v some_o difficulty_n in_o that_o and_o leave_v in_o for_o further_a time_n to_o discover_v the_o congregationall_a man_n for_o aught_o i_o can_v discern_v own_o it_o so_o as_o nothing_o but_o nor._n and_o exit_fw-la part_v you_o and_o they_o in_o the_o conclusion_n in_o point_n of_o discipline_n i_o know_v for_o adminlstr_n the_o seal_n in_o another_o congregation_n which_o that_o notion_n bring_v in_o there_o some_o congregationall_a man_n differ_v and_o so_o for_o one_o minister_n to_o excommunicate_v in_o another_o congregation_n that_o they_o will_v not_o own_o nor_o do_v you_o but_o upon_o a_o call_n they_o will_v go_v along_o with_o other_o officer_n and_o assist_v they_o in_o clear_v out_o thing_n and_o help_v they_o what_o may_v be_v only_o they_o will_v not_o put_v forth_o such_o power_n against_o such_o to_o who_o they_o be_v no_o officer_n i_o trouble_v not_o these_o holy_a man_n in_o that_o those_o who_o will_v differ_v with_o such_o man_n upon_o these_o point_v i_o think_v do_v not_o well_o the_o other_o part_n do_v not_o concern_v my_o question_n neither_o be_o i_o so_o clear_a in_o it_o as_o i_o wish_v i_o be_v i_o shall_v humble_o propound_v my_o thought_n 1._o if_o a_o man_n must_v first_o be_v a_o member_n of_o a_o particular-visible-church_n before_o he_o can_v be_v of_o the_o catholike-visible-church_n than_o your_o notion_n will_v not_o hold_v but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a ergo_fw-la the_o consequent_a be_v true_a antec_fw-la i_o prove_v if_o a_o man_n must_v first_o be_v cast_v our_o of_o a_o particular-church_n before_o he_o can_v out_o of_o the_o catholic_a than_o a_o man_n must_v first_o be_v a_o member_n of_o a_o particular_a before_o he_o can_v be_v of_o the_o catholic_a church_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_v 〈◊〉_d ergo._n consequence_n be_v clear_a to_o i_o on_o this_o ground_n else_o i_o can_v see_v how_o he_o who_o be_v cast_v out_o of_o a_o particular_a church_n can_v be_v cast_v out_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n 17._o though_o excommunicate_v unjust_o yet_o till_o case_n be_v hear_v communion_n deny_v council_n saâ—â—ll_n can._n 17._o if_o a_o man_n be_v first_o a_o member_n of_o a_o particular_a church_n and_o by_o virtue_n of_o this_o come_v to_o have_v communion_n with_o all_o other_o church_n this_o latter_a depend_v on_o the_o former_a than_o the_o reason_n be_v clear_a cast_v he_o out_o of_o a_o particular_a church_n you_o cut_v he_o off_o from_o all_o communion_n with_o other_o but_o if_o a_o man_n be_v first_o a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n and_o his_o be_v a_o member_n of_o this_o particular_a church_n depend_v upon_o that_o than_o i_o see_v no_o reason_n for_o though_o you_o have_v cast_v he_o out_o of_o your_o particular_a church_n which_o be_v second_o yet_o his_o membership_n to_o the_o catholic_a church_n which_o be_v first_o and_o independent_a upon_o this_o still_o remain_v and_o you_o do_v in_o excommunication_n but_o cast_v he_o into_o that_o state_n he_o be_v in_o before_o he_o join_v to_o you_o so_o that_o still_o he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n and_o may_v demand_v ordinance_n elsewhere_o other_o church_n deny_v not_o communion_n before_o the_o particular_a do_v of_o which_o he_o be_v a_o member_n than_o they_o follow_v hence_o their_o act_n depefid_v on_o this_o if_o depend_v than_o not_o first_o 2._o this_o seem_v a_o little_a odd_a to_o i_o a_o man_n be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n only_o thence_o he_o will_v require_v baptism_n of_o this_o church_n of_o another_o church_n he_o will_v require_v the_o lord_n supper_n in_o another_o there_o he_o will_v bear_v to_o he_o may_v go_v to_o all_o church_n in_o
the_o world_n if_o he_o can_v and_o demand_v any_o ordinance_n yet_o member_n of_o no_o particular_a church_n so_o let_v this_o man_n walk_v as_o disorderly_o as_o he_o will_v as_o the_o latitude_n sometime_o you_o give_v of_o a_o church-member_n will_v allow_v a_o man_n to_o be_v bad_a enough_o in_o this_o town_n or_o another_o town_n he_o have_v own_v no_o particular_a church_n only_o the_o catholic_a what_o have_v this_o particular_a church_n to_o do_v to_o meddle_v with_o he_o more_o than_o any_o other_o we_o must_v have_v catholic_a church-officer_n to_o cast_v he_o out_o who_o be_v such_o not_o only_a actu_fw-la primo_fw-la but_o actu_fw-la secundo_fw-la which_o you_o say_v no_o minister_n be_v to_o another_o that_o be_v not_o of_o his_o particular_a congregation_n unless_o he_o be_v call_v to_o it_o but_o to_o be_v sure_o this_o man_n will_v never_o call_v you_o to_o it_o who_o then_o can_v give_v you_o a_o call_v so_o that_o this_o man_n can_v come_v to_o be_v reform_v and_o yet_o he_o may_v go_v up_o and_o down_o to_o any_o church_n i_o be_o a_o christian_n therefore_o give_v i_o the_o ordinance_n excommunicate_v i_o be_o not_o for_o none_o can_v excommunicate_v he_o unless_o all_o the_o officer_n of_o the_o church_n in_o the_o world_n shall_v meet_v to_o cast_v he_o out_o if_o you_o say_v 194._o which_o you_o affirm_v diatr_n 194._o where_o he_o first_o come_v to_o be_v baptize_v of_o that_o particular_a church_n he_o be_v a_o member_n and_o that_o officer_n have_v power_n etc._n etc._n no_o sir_n i_o can_v believe_v this_o doctrine_n that_o my_o baptise_v of_o another_o make_v he_o member_n to_o our_o particular_a church_n i_o have_v have_v three_o of_o my_o child_n baptize_v by_o minister_n who_o never_o look_v on_o i_o as_o member_n to_o their_o church_n though_o i_o dwell_v in_o the_o town_n i_o have_v do_v the_o same_o for_o other_o be_v call_v to_o it_o yet_o none_o of_o my_o member_n yourself_o acknowledge_v baptism_n do_v not_o make_v a_o member_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n revie_n mr._n hooker_n c._n â—_o than_o not_o of_o this_o particular_a visible_a church_n if_o you_o say_v diat_a so_o you_o express_v your_o mind_n pag._n 194._o diat_a but_o a_o christian_n must_v not_o do_v thus_o he_o must_v join_v to_o a_o particular_a church_n the_o question_n be_v not_o what_o he_o must_v do_v but_o what_o he_o will_v do_v will_v not_o you_o baptize_v his_o child_n or_o he_o unless_o he_o will_v join_v if_o not_o you_o have_v say_v enough_o 3._o to_o be_v a_o church-member_n seem_v to_o be_v more_o than_o a_o christian_a i._n e._n a_o christian_a member_n of_o such_o a_o society_n and_o wâ—â—king_n under_o such_o a_o policy_n and_o that_o policy_n suppose_v officer_n you_o say_v there_o be_v no_o essential_a homogeneal_a church_n exist_v without_o officer_n mention_v in_o the_o scripture_n it_o be_v a_o fancy_n you_o say_v and_o repeat_v it_o again_o 77._o review_n master_n hooker_n pag._n 75_o 77._o oppose_v mr._n hooker_n a_o church-member_n than_o must_v be_v under_o officer_n under_o such_o a_o policy_n as_o in_o the_o catholic_a church_n but_o how_o that_o can_v be_v unless_o he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o some_o particular_a church_n which_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a as_o you_o say_v i_o know_v not_o the_o catholic_a church_n have_v no_o policy_n extra_fw-la ecclesias_fw-la particulares_fw-la the_o hard_a matter_n be_v the_o apostle_n baptise_v which_o be_v often_o abledge_v this_o make_v i_o doubtful_a on_o the_o other_o side_n only_o these_o thought_n i_o have_v bad_a 1._o they_o have_v such_o power_n as_o we_o have_v none_o they_o can_v exercise_v their_o power_n any_o where_n without_o any_o call_n paul_n be_v a_o actual_a officer_n to_o the_o jailor_n and_o so_o other_o apostle_n where_o they_o come_v hence_o they_o can_v reach_v they_o in_o case_n of_o irregular_a walk_n without_o a_o second_o call_v but_o so_o much_o can_v we_o 2._o i_o do_v not_o remember_v they_o baptize_v any_o 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there_o be_v this_o also_o if_o these_o two_o or_o one_o shall_v prove_v vile_a and_o scandalous_a what_o shall_v that_o minister_n do_v with_o he_o other_o scruple_n about_o this_o i_o can_v cast_v in_o but_o it_o concern_v not_o my_o question_n the_o next_o fault_n you_o find_v be_v that_o require_v a_o explicit_a covenant_n to_o such_o a_o church_n i_o seem_v not_o only_o to_o contradict_v myself_o but_o also_o to_o unchurch_n most_o of_o our_o english_a church_n here_o i_o must_v stay_v a_o while_n have_v occasion_n give_v to_o look_v back_o into_o your_o epistle_n what_o do_v i_o hear_v of_o contradiction_n again_o you_o have_v a_o strange_a art_n in_o find_v out_o contradiction_n but_o how_o come_v this_o about_o it_o seem_v i_o require_v a_o explicit_a covenant_n but_o sir_n be_v you_o sure_o the_o word_n explicit_a be_v in_o the_o definition_n nay_o you_o be_v sure_a it_o be_v not_o can_v there_o be_v no_o covenant_n in_o a_o church_n but_o explicit_a i_o suppose_v yes_o and_o i_o suppose_v you_o think_v so_o also_o so_o do_v appollonius_n we_o will_v hear_v he_o speak_v present_o be_v this_o faiâ—e_a deal_n to_o force_v a_o word_n upon_o i_o when_o i_o have_v clear_o before_o express_v my_o self_n another_o way_n i_o be_o far_o enough_o then_o from_o contradiction_n or_o from_o unchurch_v the_o faithful_a congregation_n of_o england_n though_o they_o have_v not_o a_o explâ—â—â—_n covenant_n yourself_o p._n 25._o mention_v the_o external_a covenant_n of_o the_o church_n but_o what_o you_o mean_v by_o it_o i_o know_v not_o you_o be_v a_o passage_n in_o my_o boistle_n which_o be_v this_o some_o minister_n scorn_v the_o notion_n that_o a_o explicâ—ie_a covenant_n be_v the_o form_n of_o a_o church_n visible_a and_o some_o professor_n be_v so_o rigid_a for_o it_o that_o without_o it_o they_o deny_v all_o church_n of_o the_o latter_a sort_n be_v mr._n hooker_n say_v you_o sir_n you_o wrong_v he_o exceed_o and_o i_o wonder_v a_o man_n of_o your_o grace_n shall_v do_v thus_o when_o he_o have_v so_o express_o declare_v his_o mind_n to_o the_o concrary_a to_o your_o knowledge_n the_o next_o word_n you_o mention_v show_v as_o much_o and_o in_o his_o epistle_n p._n 11._o he_o speak_v as_o plainesy_v but_o of_o he_o anon_o that_o passage_n shall_v clear_v i_o from_o make_v no_o church_n but_o where_o there_o be_v a_o explicit_a covenant_n i_o see_v in_o some_o congregation_n where_o there_o be_v both_o visible_a and_o real_a saint_n as_o we_o may_v judge_v when_o the_o lord_n supper_n be_v to_o be_v administer_v some_o professor_n will_v not_o join_v in_o the_o ordinance_n for_o want_v of_o that_o so_o far_o as_o i_o can_v learn_v suppose_v they_o be_v not_o in_o a_o right_a churchway_n now_o this_o i_o can_v not_o approve_v of_o since_o there_o be_v so_o many_o christian_n to_o depart_v from_o the_o ordinance_n upon_o such_o a_o ground_n in_o my_o own_o congregation_n i_o thus_o practice_v some_o of_o other_o parish_n have_v desire_v to_o join_v 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natural_a as_o i_o be_o a_o officer_n or_o free_a as_o for_o the_o explicitenesse_n of_o the_o covenant_n i_o have_v see_v so_o much_o order_n and_o comeliness_n in_o church_n by_o reason_n of_o it_o that_o if_o i_o can_v ever_o attain_v it_o i_o will_v and_o so_o will_v m_o gawdry_n have_v he_o see_v what_o i_o have_v seeen_n in_o n._n england_n yet_o i_o will_v not_o null_a all_o church_n for_o want_n of_o a_o explicit_a covenant_n i_o can_v distinguish_v between_o esse_fw-la and_o melius_fw-la esse_fw-la m._n hudson_n shall_v wind_v up_o all_o 19_o viâ—dici_fw-la cath._n pag._n 19_o i_o deny_v not_o say_v he_o but_o mutual_a consent_n of_o person_n within_o such_o a_o vicinity_n to_o join_v together_o constant_o in_o the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n under_o the_o inspection_n of_o such_o and_o such_o officer_n be_v requisite_a to_o a_o particular_a congregation_n now_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o examine_v a_o little_a what_o you_o have_v write_v against_o reverend_a m._n hooker_n since_o 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speak_v to_o the_o contrary_a but_o what_o be_v his_o ground_n this._n in_o n._n england_n say_v he_o they_o refuse_v to_o admit_v either_o our_o member_n though_o godly_a to_o the_o lord_n supper_n or_o their_o child_n to_o baptism_n unless_o they_o enter_v their_o express_a covenant_n this_o be_v the_o ground_n one_o passage_n i_o observe_v you_o call_v the_o godly_a one_o our_o member_n but_o do_v you_o look_v on_o they_o as_o your_o member_n who_o be_v go_v 3000._o mile_n from_o you_o never_o to_o see_v you_o more_o where_o you_o can_v never_o have_v any_o inspection_n over_o they_o let_v they_o walk_v as_o they_o will_v i_o be_o sure_a they_o do_v not_o think_v you_o be_v their_o officer_n nor_o do_v call_v you_o so_o how_o then_o they_o shall_v be_v still_o your_o member_n i_o can_v tell_v let_v therefore_o mr._n hooker_n speak_v for_o himself_o
so_o fair_a a_o conversation_n in_o holiness_n as_o may_v consist_v with_o true_a grace_n this_o be_v very_o fair_a and_o certain_o there_o will_v be_v some_o little_a positive_a sign_n in_o such_o a_o person_n and_o you_o may_v admit_v he_o by_o affirmation_n mr._n cawdrey_n have_v full_o confirm_v i_o in_o that_o which_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o my_o scruple_n for_o when_o i_o observe_v divers_a person_n come_v to_o demand_v baptism_n of_o i_o for_o their_o child_n and_o i_o find_v they_o gross_o ignorant_a in_o the_o necessary_a point_n of_o salvation_n and_o far_o from_o understand_v the_o nature_n of_o the_o sacrament_n and_o also_o when_o their_o conversation_n be_v prove_v by_o witness_n to_o 〈◊〉_d scandalous_a and_o far_o from_o what_o mr._n cawdry_n have_v set_v down_o i_o question_v whether_o i_o be_v bind_v to_o give_v away_o such_o a_o seal_n as_o this_o and_o do_v therefore_o love_o request_v they_o to_o forbear_v a_o little_a and_o lay_v in_o for_o more_o knowledge_n 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it_o you_o must_v not_o deny_v it_o but_o they_o have_v a_o remote_a right_n to_o the_o one_o as_o well_o as_o to_o the_o other_o but_o i_o suppose_v you_o well_o understand_v my_o mind_n that_o i_o 〈◊〉_d no_o more_o there_o there_o thâ—â—â—in_a the_o sâ—â—â—â—â—_n plaâ—â—â—_n which_o now_o i_o shall_v consider_v in_o may_v book_n 〈◊〉_d there_o you_o say_v i_o have_v it_o tâ—â—ies_n once_o from_o the_o 〈◊〉_d give_v of_o title_n to_o circumcision_n so_o long_o as_o church_n member_n for_o the_o jew_n i_o shall_v say_v this_o once_o for_o all_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v unto_o i_o that_o the_o ground_n of_o the_o jew_n administer_a circumcision_n be_v only_o the_o same_o and_o no_o other_o of_o our_o administer_a baptism_n than_o i_o shall_v be_v very_o much_o sway_v with_o argument_n you_o draw_v from_o they_o but_o if_o there_o be_v something_o peculiar_a to_o they_o as_o be_v such_o a_o seed_n and_o such_o a_o church_n which_o i_o do_v very_o believe_v and_o shall_v speak_v to_o 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notion_n all_o person_n in_o england_n do_v profess_v they_o believe_v in_o christ_n hence_o all_o be_v church_n member_n ergo_fw-la all_o be_v baptise_a my_o answer_n to_o this_o be_v thus_o this_o i_o confess_v as_o some_o disadvantage_n to_o i_o mr._n cawdry_a may_v have_v show_v i_o so_o much_o favour_n as_o to_o let_v his_o reader_n know_v that_o what_o strength_n he_o have_v against_o i_o i_o give_v it_o he_o know_o but_o he_o never_o mention_n that_o i_o see_v the_o difficulty_n though_o i_o have_v express_v it_o but_o triumph_n over_o i_o as_o if_o what_o i_o have_v say_v be_v unaware_o but_o i_o look_v for_o no_o favour_n as_o his_o hand_n for_o if_o a_o man_n be_v look_v upon_o as_o a_o visible_a saint_n and_o repute_v a_o member_n of_o be_v true_a church_n if_o that_o member_n be_v very_o scandalous_a and_o the_o church_n let_v he_o alone_o and_o not_o dâ—â—le_a with_o he_o that_o person_n may_v challenge_v any_o ordinance_n in_o the_o church_n both_o baptism_n and_o the_o lord_n supper_n this_o i_o have_v say_v and_o will_v not_o recall_v make_v of_o it_o what_o you_o can_v and_z here_o you_o have_v my_o mind_n full_o with_o the_o next_o word_n adjoin_v which_o i_o will_v rehearse_v present_o from_o this_o you_o have_v draw_v up_o a_o syllogism_n to_o show_v the_o world_n 15._o page_n 15._o how_o i_o have_v confute_v and_o comtradict_v myself_o and_o thus_o you_o have_v cast_v it_o the_o child_n of_o a_o sandalous_a member_n tolerate_v may_v be_v baptise_a but_o the_o child_n of_o a_o scandalous_a member_n not_o excommunicate_v be_v the_o child_n of_o a_o scandalous_a member_n tolerate_v ergo_fw-la it_o may_v be_v baptise_a and_o be_v minister_n may_v lawful_o baptise_v iâ—_n thus_o you_o have_v kill_v i_o with_o my_o own_o weapon_n but_o sir_n when_o i_o look_v on_o your_o syllogism_n it_o come_v at_o first_o view_n as_o if_o you_o must_v out_o off_o one_o of_o the_o seeâ—e_n of_o it_o for_o i_o 〈◊〉_d it_o 〈◊〉_d on_o four_o i_o pray_v wheat_n be_v this_o â—â—â—me_n and_o a_o minister_n may_v lawful_o that_o be_v the_o word_n bind_v he_o to_o it_o which_o be_v the_o pinch_n of_o the_o question_n baptise_v be_v dispose_v in_o the_o premise_n if_o you_o say_v it_o be_v include_v in_o the_o major_n when_o i_o say_v it_o may_v be_v baptise_a sir_n i_o can_v tell_v that_o if_o a_o minister_n will_v admit_v a_o man_n into_o the_o church_n as_o a_o member_n though_o the_o man_n be_v not_o qualify_v as_o you_o have_v tell_v we_o member_n must_v be_v but_o very_o scandalous_a in_o conversation_n and_o gross_o ignorant_a yet_o the_o minister_n think_v he_o have_v enough_o to_o admit_v he_o a_o member_n and_o consequent_o he_o baptize_v he_o such_o a_o minister_n may_v baptise_v he_o if_o he_o will_v he_o may_v say_v a_o member_n admit_v may_v be_v baptise_a but_o this_o be_v a_o member_n admit_v but_o the_o word_n do_v not_o bind_v he_o no_o he_o profane_v the_o ordinace_n though_o he_o will_v admit_v he_o a_o member_n however_o sir_n you_o shall_v have_v express_v this_o in_o the_o major_n as_o you_o have_v do_v in_o the_o conclusion_n than_o your_o major_a i_o will_v have_v deny_v you_o will_v say_v to_o i_o the_o major_n be_v my_o one_o proposition_n and_o upon_o that_o i_o argue_v and_o show_v you_o and_o the_o world_n how_o you_o have_v confuâ—ed_v yourself_o no_o sir_n i_o do_v utter_o deny_v it_o show_v i_o such_o a_o passage_n where_o i_o have_v say_v that_o scandalous_a member_n such_o we_o our_o english_a person_n be_v name_v in_o the_o question_n tolerate_v may_v have_v their_o child_n baptise_a and_o the_o word_n bind_v minister_n to_o do_v it_o show_v your_o reader_n that_o and_o then_o you_o say_v something_o but_o how_o far_o
i_o be_v from_o think_v or_o speak_v so_o the_o very_a next_o word_n unto_o that_o which_o you_o say_v be_v my_o sentence_n and_o out_o of_o which_o i_o have_v consute_v myself_o do_v declare_v my_o word_n be_v these_o but_o i_o conceive_v such_o a_o person_n be_v not_o sufficient_o qualify_v to_o make_v a_o member_n of_o a_o church_n nor_o aught_o to_o be_v continue_v a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n but_o the_o church_n ought_v to_o seek_v to_o reform_v he_o or_o if_o not_o to_o cast_v he_o out_o so_o that_o if_o the_o church_n will_v let_v such_o a_o person_n alone_o and_o give_v he_o these_o ordinance_n there_o will_v be_v guilt_n charge_v upon_o that_o church_n this_o sentence_n i_o conceive_v if_o the_o reader_n be_v but_o indifferent_a and_o not_o prejudice_v against_o i_o will_v save_v i_o from_o selfe-confutation_n if_o the_o sentence_n be_v not_o true_a but_o mr._n cawdry_n have_v prove_v that_o the_o minister_n be_v not_o too_o blame_v though_o he_o let_v he_o alone_o and_o yet_o may_v lawful_o baptise_v then_o have_v he_o speak_v to_o my_o scruple_n indeed_o and_o i_o will_v have_v thank_v he_o hearty_o but_o then_o i_o have_v not_o confute_v myself_o but_o still_o mr._n caw_n will_v urge_v from_o my_o own_o word_n thus_o i_o have_v say_v scandalom_n member_n if_o tolerate_v let_v alone_o by_o the_o church_n they_o have_v a_o remote_a right_n to_o baptism_n and_o the_o supper_n ergo_fw-la they_o may_v lawful_o have_v their_o child_n baptise_a and_o the_o word_n bind_v minister_n to_o do_v it_o to_o this_o i_o shall_v answer_v first_o to_o the_o antecedent_n then_o to_o the_o consequence_n to_o the_o antecedent_n i_o answer_v first_o according_a to_o our_o congregationall_a principle_n that_o which_o give_v a_o man_n the_o first_o right_n to_o a_o sacrament_n viz._n his_o interest_n in_o the_o covenans_fw-la of_o the_o gospel_n which_o you_o use_v very_o much_o against_o mr._n hooker_n take_v the_o word_n from_o himself_o this_o man_n have_v not_o for_o heâ—_n do_v visible_o declare_v to_o the_o church_n that_o he_o have_v no_o interest_n in_o that_o covenant_n and_o yourself_o deny_v it_o not_o by_o what_o you_o have_v affirm_v concern_v the_o qualification_n of_o church-member_n so_o then_o he_o have_v no_o right_a in_o that_o respect_n all_o the_o right_n he_o have_v be_v by_o the_o toleration_n of_o the_o church_n which_o the_o church_n have_v best_a look_v to_o now_o i_o do_v confess_v that_o first_o right_a be_v the_o main_a in_o my_o esteem_n though_o not_o all_o that_o be_v require_v as_o in_o a_o minister_n the_o great_a matter_n be_v the_o qualification_n of_o the_o person_n which_o be_v his_o inward_a call_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o all_o but_o his_o ordination_n be_v also_o requisite_a but_o if_o bishop_n or_o presbyter_n shall_v ordain_v a_o scandalous_a and_o ignorant_a sot_n not_o able_a to_o teach_v himself_o nor_o the_o church_n i_o shall_v extreme_o doubt_v of_o such_o a_o minister_n so_o here_o i_o conceive_v this_o first_o right_a be_v the_o chief_a but_o yet_o as_o mr._n hoolter_n say_v baptism_n he_o must_v come_v by_o in_o a_o right_a order_n i.e._n he_o must_v be_v a_o member_n of_o some_o congregation_n and_o not_o a_o individuum_fw-la vagum_fw-la belong_v to_o no_o particular_a congregation_n nor_o any_o body_n to_o have_v inspection_n over_o he_o but_o if_o minister_n will_v admit_v person_n that_o have_v not_o this_o first_o right_a and_o continue_v such_o among_o they_o here_o indeed_o be_v a_o kind_n of_o right_n but_o this_o let_v the_o minister_n look_v to_o 2._o i_o answer_v according_a to_o your_o principle_n you_o make_v a_o man_n christianity_n alone_o without_o his_o join_n of_o himself_o to_o any_o congregation_n to_o be_v that_o which_o give_v he_o right_o and_o you_o oppose_v mr._n hooker_n and_o the_o congregationall_a divine_n for_o require_v that_o join_n to_o any_o particular_a church_n before_o they_o will_v baptise_v thus_o you_o say_v all_o child_n of_o christian_n as_o christian_n have_v such_o right_n to_o baptism_n and_o in_o the_o same_o page_n 186._o diatri_fw-la p._n 186._o all_o child_n of_o christian_n as_o such_o have_v right_a to_o baptism_n thus_o in_o your_o answer_n to_o i_o p._n 12._o you_o say_v a_o person_n excommunicate_v give_v right_a to_o his_o child_n baptism_n because_o for_o state_n be_v be_v a_o christian_n and_o retain_v his_o baptism_n now_o sir_n i_o hope_v you_o mean_v it_o must_v be_v such_o christianity_n as_o yourself_o have_v say_v be_v fit_a to_o make_v a_o church-member_n i_o hope_v you_o do_v not_o mean_v such_o christianity_n as_o our_o question_n speak_v of_o by_o virtue_n of_o that_o say_v you_o he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholike-church_n now_o sir_n if_o that_o only_o give_v a_o man_n right_a and_o his_o child_n and_o yet_o a_o man_n have_v not_o that_o i_o can_v see_v no_o right_a he_o have_v at_o all_o it_o seem_v strange_a to_o i_o that_o man_n shall_v be_v member_n of_o a_o particular_a church_n and_o not_o of_o the_o catholike-church_n of_o the_o latter_a these_o be_v not_o member_n for_o they_o have_v not_o so_o much_o as_o shall_v give_v they_o a_o right_n to_o that_o membership_n if_o you_o will_v hold_v to_o what_o you_o have_v say_v about_o the_o qualification_n of_o the_o matter_n of_o a_o church_n for_o only_o such_o christianity_n make_v man_n member_n of_o the_o catholike-church_n which_o these_o fall_n very_o short_a of_o we_o use_v to_o unwind_v a_o bottom_n the_o same_o way_n we_o wound_v it_o if_o you_o will_v wind_v the_o bottom_n thus_o a_o professor_n or_o believer_n such_o a_o one_o as_o you_o say_v be_v fit_o qualify_v as_o such_o have_v by_o vertus_fw-fr of_o his_o profession_n only_o a_o right_a to_o his_o own_o and_o child_n baptism_n than_o i_o unwind_v it_o the_o same_o way_n he_o that_o be_v noâ—_n a_o professor_n as_o you_o mention_v have_v no_o right_a at_o all_o such_o be_v those_o our_o case_n speak_v of_o now_o sir_n here_o lay_v my_o trouble_n that_o since_o these_o person_n in_o the_o first_o and_o main_a respect_n have_v no_o right_n but_o what_o they_o have_v be_v only_o by_o my_o toleration_n this_o question_n arise_v whether_o in_o the_o beginning_n of_o reformation_n wherein_n as_o innius_n say_v something_o will_v be_v extraordinary_a the_o person_n be_v numerous_a and_o not_o so_o fit_a it_o may_v be_v to_o excommunicate_v in_o regard_n of_o number_n 〈◊〉_d though_o in_o respect_n of_o their_o wilful_a igno_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o coâ—â—â—_n nue_v scandalous_a after_o admonition_n they_o desâ—â—â—_n 〈…〉_o not_o the_o church_n suspend_v such_o from_o the_o seal_n of_o the_o coverâ—â—â—_n a_o for_o thus_o i_o conceive_v while_o i_o first_o admonish_v people_n â—on_v their_o ignorance_n and_o scandalous_a live_n minor_n suspension_n be_v excommunicatio_fw-la minor_n and_o they_o refuse_v to_o hear_v i_o i_o do_v with_o â—â—e_z consent_n of_o the_o church_n suspend_v i_o do_v not_o rolâ—â—ortâ—_n but_o you_o speak_v as_o if_o there_o be_v nothing_o opposites_n to_o toleration_n but_o excommunication_n or_o thus_o according_a to_o our_o congregationall_a principle_n which_o maintainâ—â—_n a_o non-communion_n in_o case_n excommunication_n can_v be_v exercise_v against_o a_o multitude_n so_o i_o do_v here_o exclude_v they_o from_o such_o ordinance_n as_o do_v hold_v forth_o communion_n and_o so_o it_o be_v non_fw-fr commanion_n in_o effect_n non-communion_n or_o separation_n in_o some_o case_n when_o there_o be_v a_o 〈◊〉_d â—â—â—â—de_n the_o lâ—yden_n prosessort_v 28.29_o prosessort_v synop._n pour_fw-fr theol._n dicp_n 48._o thes_n 28.29_o maintain_v to_o the_o consequence_n i_o answer_v by_o deny_v it_o viz_o minister_n be_v not_o bind_v by_o the_o word_n to_o baptise_v all_o the_o child_n of_o person_n gross_o ignorant_a and_o scandalous_a though_o tolerate_v i_o still_o carry_v it_o in_o reference_n to_o england_n where_o you_o say_v all_o be_v christian_n and_o church_n member_n here_o now_o i_o shall_v speak_v more_o than_o i_o will_v have_v do_v feel_v the_o temptation_n of_o my_o brethren_n in_o my_o own_o hearâ—_n but_o your_o triumph_v over_o i_o and_o cell_z the_o world_n how_o i_o have_v at_o once_o confute_v myself_o make_v i_o by_o way_n of_o discourse_n to_o clear_v myself_o though_o i_o think_v it_o be_v do_v already_o thus_o than_o i_o argue_v 1._o if_o such_o member_n as_o the_o question_n speak_v of_o be_v continue_v such_o argumant_n 1._o argumant_n through_o the_o minister_n negligence_n and_o contifulnce_n than_o the_o word_n do_v not_o bind_v minister_n to_o give_v the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n to_o their_o child_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a ergo_fw-la the_o consequent_a be_v true_a the_o antecedent_n i_o have_v rather_o have_v apply_v only_o to_o myself_o than_o any_o other_o minister_n be_v far_o more_o holy_a than_o myself_o i_o
church_n why_o do_v you_o not_o take_v notice_n of_o the_o word_n almost_o which_o imply_v there_o may_v be_v some_o government_n without_o it_o but_o it_o will_v not_o go_v on_o so_o strong_o nor_o comfortable_o but_o cast_v what_o you_o have_v say_v into_o a_o syllogism_n and_o see_v how_o i_o recall_v it_o if_o expliciteness_n of_o covenant_n be_v requisite_a to_o the_o esse_fw-la of_o church-government_n â—hen_o a_o explicit_a covenant_n be_v requisite_a to_o the_o esse_fw-la formale_a of_o a_o church_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a ergo_fw-la i_o see_v no_o reason_n for_o the_o consequence_n but_o for_o church-government_n try_v you_o what_o you_o can_v do_v only_o by_o virtue_n of_o their_o christianity_n and_o implicit_a covenant_n i_o have_v try_v it_o and_o find_v it_o not_o sufficient_a but_o the_o other_o i_o have_v have_v good_a experience_n of_o but_o for_o church-convenant_a a_o few_o word_n first_o set_v we_o hear_v apollonius_n speak_v who_o be_v a_o presbyterian_a 17._o page_n 17._o concedimus_fw-la foedus_fw-la aliquod_fw-la tacitum_fw-la seu_fw-la virtuale_fw-la esse_fw-la inter_fw-la membra_fw-la unius_fw-la &_o â—jusdem_fw-la particularis_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la externae_fw-la quo_fw-la obligantur_fw-la ad_fw-la mutua_fw-la illa_fw-la officia_fw-la praestanda_fw-la quae_fw-la à _fw-la membris_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la visibilis_fw-la ad_fw-la particularem_fw-la svam_fw-la ecclesiasticam_fw-la communicnem_fw-la exiguntur_fw-la quod_fw-la nempe_fw-la suis_fw-la pastoribus_fw-la corum_fw-la curae_fw-la &_o disciplinae_fw-la subessâ—â—â—undum_fw-la publicum_fw-la divinum_fw-la cultum_fw-la frequentare_fw-la cadem_fw-la lege_fw-la &_o jurisdictione_n eccâ—â—â—â—sticae_fw-la gubernare_fw-la velint_fw-la ex_fw-la quo_fw-la foedere_fw-la etiam_fw-la jus_o sibi_fw-la acquirunt_fw-la ad_fw-la illa_fw-la qua_fw-la buic_fw-la particulari_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la ejuâ—qu_fw-la membris_fw-la sint_fw-la propria_fw-la &_o altis_fw-la ecclesâ—is_fw-la particularibus_fw-la now_o compâ—tunt_fw-la this_o man_n speak_v rational_o and_o those_o word_n be_v worth_a the_o observation_n ex_fw-la quo_fw-la foedere_fw-la jus_o sibi_fw-la acquirunt_fw-la etc._n etc._n so_o that_o all_o the_o right_a and_o power_n that_o officer_n or_o particular_a church_n have_v over_o their_o member_n arise_v from_o this_o covenant_n and_o this_o be_v certain_a for_o suppose_v one_o be_v a_o christian_n and_o suppose_v he_o own_o church-discipline_n yet_o how_o do_v i_o in_o particular_a come_v to_o be_v bind_v to_o dispense_v baptism_n or_o lord_n supper_n to_o he_o more_o than_o any_o other_o minister_n or_o how_o do_v i_o and_o this_o church_n in_o particular_a more_o than_o another_o come_v to_o have_v power_n over_o another_o in_o respect_n of_o discipline_n but_o by_o his_o covenant_n consent_v call_v it_o what_o you_o will_v with_o i_o and_o this_o church_n and_o not_o with_o another_o for_o else_o he_o will_v say_v though_o i_o do_v own_o church_n discipline_n yet_o who_o give_v you_o power_n over_o i_o more_o than_o another_o officer_n or_o church_n for_o i_o to_o say_v you_o dwell_v in_o my_o barish_n be_v a_o silly_a answer_n unless_o it_o can_v be_v prove_v that_o parish_n be_v by_o divine_a institution_n to_o such_o a_o end_n there_o be_v those_o in_o my_o parish_n that_o come_v not_o to_o hear_v i_o nor_o ever_o choose_v i_o to_o be_v their_o officer_n nor_o will_v own_o the_o church_n in_o this_o time_n of_o reform_v but_o i_o shall_v think_v it_o absurd_a to_o tell_v they_o you_o dwell_v in_o this_o parish_n therefore_o you_o be_v bind_v to_o hear_v i_o etc._n etc._n one_o word_n more_o about_o parish_n i_o will_v put_v this_o question_n it_o be_v a_o practice_n in_o england_n for_o a_o patron_n to_o present_v of_o late_a i_o know_v where_o a_o godly_a minister_n be_v choose_v by_o the_o people_n yet_o it_o be_v a_o sequestration_n the_o incumbent_n die_v the_o gift_n fall_v into_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o patron_n he_o be_v a_o idle_a companion_n turn_v out_o the_o godly_a minister_n and_o put_v in_o another_o that_o be_v etc._n etc._n the_o people_n with_o one_o consent_n do_v declare_v against_o he_o and_o oppose_v he_o at_o his_o come_n yet_o it_o seem_v because_o the_o law_n of_o the_o land_n will_v have_v it_o so_o this_o man_n be_v he_o that_o have_v the_o place_n but_o be_v he_o therefore_o their_o pastor_n because_o he_o preâ—chech_v in_o their_o parish_n i_o think_v it_o be_v strange_a for_o any_o man_n to_o affirm_v it_o and_o this_o practice_n be_v very_o common_a i_o hope_v the_o mere_a parish_n do_v not_o make_v he_o their_o pastor_n nor_o the_o people_n his_o member_n this_o be_v a_o woeful_a plague_n to_o godly_a people_n and_o teach_v the_o way_n to_o separation_n though_o it_o will_v not_o justify_v other_o where_o the_o case_n be_v not_o the_o same_o doctor_n ames_n tell_v we_o of_o a_o vinculum_fw-la speciale_a which_o he_o call_v foedus_fw-la 32._o medul_a thiol_n cap._n 32._o and_o so_o as_o no_o man_n be_v right_o admit_v into_o the_o church_n but_o by_o confession_n of_o faith_n and_o promise_v of_o obedience_n and_o this_o apollonius_n own_v pag._n 13_o 14._o the_o belgic_a church_n see_v something_o in_o it_o 9_o apol._n c._n 1._o p._n 9_o that_o it_o be_v conclude_v upon_o in_o six_o synod_n that_o those_o who_o come_v to_o the_o lord_n supper_n shall_v promise_v express_o to_o be_v subject_a to_o discipline_n and_o have_v the_o church_n of_o england_n the_o godly_a officer_n especial_o make_v all_o those_o who_o come_v into_o their_o parish_n and_o will_v have_v either_o baptism_n or_o supper_n to_o declare_v their_o choice_n of_o they_o for_o their_o officer_n and_o subjection_n to_o all_o christ_n ordinance_n they_o may_v have_v have_v more_o strength_n against_o the_o separation_n indeed_o they_o have_v strength_n enough_o against_o most_o of_o they_o who_o have_v own_v the_o minister_n and_o constant_o attend_v and_o receive_v the_o ordinance_n from_o they_o of_o which_o i_o have_v speak_v elsewhere_o further_o i_o shall_v much_o desire_n that_o those_o who_o oppose_v the_o church-covenant_n will_v lay_v down_o a_o church-member_n in_o his_o estentiall_a cause_n than_o they_o teach_v clear_a as_o for_o profession_n christianity_n or_o what_o you_o will_v call_v this_o be_v but_o the_o causa_fw-la materialis_fw-la of_o a_o church_n member_n for_o it_o be_v not_o man_n quâ_fw-la sio_fw-la for_o then_o all_o but_o man_n quâ_fw-la profess_v as_o saint_n visible_a that_o be_v the_o materialis_fw-la causa_fw-la this_o then_o be_v not_o the_o formalis_fw-la causa_fw-la for_o to_o have_v the_o same_o thing_n to_o be_v causa_fw-la materialis_fw-la &_o formalis_fw-la respectu_fw-la ejusdem_fw-la effecti_fw-la be_v strange_a therefore_o till_o i_o see_v a_o better_a i_o must_v say_v that_o this_o christian_n consent_v or_o covenant_v with_o this_o particular_a church_n and_o these_o officer_n in_o it_o to_o walk_v according_a to_o the_o gospel_n etc._n etc._n be_v the_o formal_a cause_n of_o this_o church-member_n in_o some_o sense_n we_o may_v say_v the_o matter_n do_v distinguish_v thing_n a_o lump_n of_o gold_n from_o a_o lump_n of_o clay_n differ_v material_o but_o one_o golden_a vessel_n differ_v not_o from_o another_o but_o per_fw-la formam_fw-la christian_n as_o visible_a saint_n or_o church_n constitute_v of_o such_o differ_v material_o from_o all_o other_o society_n of_o man_n but_o how_o one_o church_n a_o golden_a candlestick_n differ_v from_o one_o another_o but_o per_fw-la formam_fw-la i_o know_v not_o which_o be_v this_o that_o our_o congregationall_a man_n speak_v of_o act._n 5.13_o of_o the_o rest_n dare_v none_o join_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d what_o be_v that_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d that_o glue_v they_o to_o the_o church_n they_o be_v not_o scare_v from_o own_v of_o christ_n or_o love_v of_o the_o disciple_n they_o may_v hear_v the_o apostle_n preach_v etc._n etc._n there_o be_v something_o express_v sure_a much_o more_o now_o when_o so_o many_o church_n the_o same_o word_n be_v use_v of_o the_o prodigal_a luke_n 15.15_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d the_o covenant_n between_o master_n and_o servant_n be_v the_o glue_n that_o join_v each_o to_o other_o so_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v it_o must_v be_v here_o you_o tell_v i_o epistle_n epistle_n that_o the_o relation_n of_o christian_n one_o to_o another_o be_v not_o free_a but_o after_o a_o sort_n natural_a as_o that_o of_o father_n and_o child_n i_o be_v there_o speak_v of_o church-government_n how_o we_o come_v to_o have_v power_n etc._n etc._n now_o it_o seem_v by_o you_o it_o be_v as_o natural_a for_o any_o christian_n to_o be_v under_o my_o power_n in_o particular_a and_o this_o church_n in_o particular_a as_o for_o a_o child_n to_o be_v under_o his_o father_n government_n and_o i_o may_v natural_o claim_v this_o official_a power_n over_o he_o whether_o he_o will_v choose_v i_o or_o not_o nay_o though_o he_o declare_v he_o will_v not_o own_v i_o for_o a_o officer_n this_o be_v strange_a doctrine_n be_v his_o relation_n to_o i_o
and_o out_o of_o he_o i_o will_v give_v you_o a_o answer_n and_o show_v you_o the_o reason_n be_v not_o as_o you_o say_v mr._n hooker_n thus_o the_o faithful_a congregation_n of_o england_n be_v true_a church_n member_n that_o come_v commend_v from_o such_o church_n to_o we_o here_o so_o that_o it_o do_v appear_v to_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n 11._o preface_n p._n 11._o whence_o they_o come_v that_o they_o be_v by_o tâ—em_n approve_v and_o not_o scandalous_a they_o ought_v to_o be_v receive_v to_o church_n communion_n with_o we_o as_o member_n of_o other_o church_n with_o we_o in_o new_a england_n in_o like_a case_n so_o commend_v and_o approve_v hence_o then_o sir_n be_v the_o plain_a reason_n the_o people_n that_o go_v from_o hence_o do_v quite_o depart_v from_o these_o church_n so_o that_o they_o never_o come_v more_o under_o the_o inspection_n of_o the_o officer_n and_o churchâ—s_n here_o they_o nâ—ver_o bâ—ing_v letter_n testimonial_a from_o you_o to_o show_v they_o be_v member_n still_o with_o you_o and_o approve_v by_o you_o and_o so_o commend_v as_o say_v mr._n hooker_n to_o those_o church_n there_o but_o thither_o they_o come_v free_a from_o all_o church_n even_o in_o their_o own_o account_n and_o there_o let_v they_o walk_v as_o they_o will_v there_o be_v no_o church_n have_v power_n to_o reach_v they_o unless_o they_o will_v join_v themselves_o to_o one_o there_o as_o they_o have_v disjoin_v themselves_o from_o your_o church_n here_o but_o now_o make_v this_o trial_n let_v there_o go_v out_o of_o the_o faithful_a congregation_n of_o england_n person_n who_o intent_n be_v not_o to_o disjoyne_v themselves_o from_o you_o only_o they_o go_v as_o merchant_n on_o some_o other_o errand_n let_v the_o godly_a officer_n of_o such_o congregation_n give_v a_o certificate_n under_o their_o hand_n such_o person_n that_o now_o à re_v come_v to_o you_o in_o new_a england_n be_v godly_a person_n member_n of_o our_o church_n and_o walk_v in_o church-fellowship_n with_o we_o and_o thâ—t_o orderly_o though_o we_o have_v no_o explicit_a covenant_n we_o desire_v such_o may_v for_o the_o time_n of_o their_o abode_n with_o you_o be_v admit_v to_o the_o lord_n supper_n if_o a_o child_n he_o bear_v to_o they_o let_v it_o be_v baptise_v and_o those_o person_n when_o they_o come_v there_o walk_v according_o i_o say_v try_v the_o minister_n there_o and_o i_o dare_v warrant_v you_o such_o person_n shall_v not_o be_v deny_v communion_n though_o you_o have_v not_o a_o explicit_a covenant_n and_o here_o sir_n they_o require_v no_o more_o of_o you_o than_o they_o will_v give_v for_o if_o any_o who_o be_v member_n of_o their_o church_n shall_v come_v over_o from_o they_o hither_o and_o bring_v no_o letter_n of_o recommendation_n to_o the_o church_n here_o show_v that_o they_o be_v member_n with_o they_o there_o and_o walk_v approve_o among_o they_o if_o such_o shall_v require_v the_o lord_n supper_n or_o baptism_n here_o if_o you_o will_v refuse_v they_o unless_o they_o will_v show_v or_o make_v it_o out_o that_o they_o be_v member_n there_o and_o walk_v orderly_a only_o their_o occasion_n call_v they_o hither_o now_o for_o a_o time_n or_o will_v join_v with_o you_o if_o they_o have_v leave_v those_o churches_n the_o church_n there_o will_v not_o be_v displease_v with_o you_o therefore_o the_o member_n that_o come_v from_o thence_o bring_v letter_n of_o recommendation_n with_o they_o show_v what_o i_o have_v say_v before_o and_o desire_v of_o church_n here_o their_o care_n over_o they_o while_o here_o they_o abide_v and_o now_o you_o have_v the_o plain_a reason_n but_o one_o word_n more_o pag._n 29._o you_o speak_v against_o those_o who_o meddle_v with_o other_o minister_n charge_n those_o who_o go_v to_o new_a england_n you_o call_v your_o member_n shall_v then_o the_o minister_n of_o new_a england_n baptize_v and_o excommunicate_a out_o of_o what_o church_n i_o know_v not_o but_o you_o for_o of_o they_o they_o be_v no_o member_n your_o member_n they_o shall_v meddle_v with_o your_o charge_n and_o do_v a_o strange_a act_n to_o excommunicate_v your_o member_n when_o yourself_o do_v not_o this_o be_v more_o than_o classical_a or_o episcopal_a power_n but_o here_o you_o will_v charge_v master_n hooker_n with_o a_o contradiction_n because_o he_o seem_v to_o be_v against_o this_o practice_n that_o member_n of_o one_o congregation_n shall_v partake_v of_o the_o sacrament_n in_o another_o congregation_n have_v mr._n hooker_n live_v to_o have_v file_v over_o his_o work_n again_o i_o do_v believe_v he_o will_v have_v consider_v this_o place_n again_o but_o the_o other_o place_n be_v most_o plain_a yet_o something_o may_v be_v say_v for_o he_o that_o master_n hooker_n shall_v be_v against_o the_o give_n of_o the_o sacrament_n to_o a_o member_n of_o another_o congregation_n who_o have_v occasion_n to_o be_v absent_a from_o his_o owâ—e_n and_o be_v commend_v and_o approve_v by_o his_o own_o church_n this_o i_o can_v believe_v i_o will_v give_v you_o my_o reason_n a_o near_a friend_n of_o i_o in_o new_a england_n live_v divers_a mile_n from_o mr._n hooker_n have_v occasion_n to_o be_v in_o his_o town_n on_o the_o sabbath_n my_o friend_n be_v a_o minister_n i_o can_v tell_v whether_o at_o that_o time_n in_o office_n or_o no_o to_o the_o church_n in_o the_o town_n where_o he_o live_v mr._n hooker_n get_v he_o to_o preach_v in_o the_o forenoon_n in_o his_o church_n at_o that_o time_n there_o be_v a_o sacrament_n in_o the_o church_n my_o friend_n when_o he_o have_v do_v preach_v bâ—ing_v sad_a and_o oppress_v in_o his_o spirit_n go_v down_o out_o of_o the_o desk_n and_o will_v not_o have_v stay_v the_o sacrament_n but_o mr._n hoo_n step_n after_o he_o and_o clap_n hold_v on_o his_o shoulder_n and_o pull_v he_o back_o again_o and_o make_v he_o stay_v the_o sacrament_n my_o friend_n tell_v i_o it_o be_v the_o best_a sacrament_n that_o ever_o he_o enjoy_v this_o practice_n of_o he_o clear_v he_o from_o contradiction_n and_o therefore_o that_o can_v be_v his_o meaning_n this_o than_o i_o presume_v be_v his_o true_a meaning_n it_o be_v the_o practice_n of_o divers_a of_o we_o in_o n._n e._n at_o the_o first_o plant_n we_o do_v join_v ourselves_o to_o this_o or_o that_o church_n afterward_o when_o other_o plantation_n be_v erect_v for_o conveniency_n of_o dwell_v the_o former_a plantation_n be_v too_o full_a we_o will_v remove_v and_o dwell_v there_o retain_v still_o our_o membership_n in_o those_o church_n to_o which_o we_o first_o join_v and_o by_o virtue_n of_o it_o have_v letter_n of_o recommendation_n do_v partake_v of_o the_o sacrament_n in_o those_o church_n where_o we_o live_v and_o hence_o divers_a member_n live_v many_o mile_n twenty_o or_o sixty_o from_o their_o own_o church_n and_o from_o the_o inspection_n of_o those_o officer_n who_o have_v power_n to_o call_v they_o to_o account_v and_o observe_v their_o conversation_n and_o yet_o will_v partake_v of_o the_o sacrament_n six_o or_o eight_o year_n together_o in_o another_o congregation_n this_o indeed_o he_o oppose_v in_o so_o much_o that_o when_o i_o come_v away_o the_o elder_n will_v not_o suffer_v it_o any_o long_o this_o be_v but_o rational_a and_o this_o i_o conceive_v be_v his_o true_a meaning_n here_o then_o as_o i_o say_v be_v all_o the_o question_n whether_o or_o not_o if_o a_o godly_a man_n be_v member_n of_o no_o particular_a church_n and_o come_v to_o demand_v baptism_n may_v not_o i_o require_v he_o first_o if_o you_o will_v have_v baptism_n be_v it_o be_v a_o church_n privilege_n and_o christian_n ought_v to_o walk_v orderly_o then_o join_v to_o some_o particular_a church_n if_o you_o require_v it_o of_o i_o one_o or_o so_o if_o there_o be_v more_o officer_n than_o one_o then_o may_v not_o the_o officer_n demand_n do_v than_o you_o choose_v i_o as_o your_o officer_n to_o who_o you_o will_v submit_v under_o christ_n do_v you_o look_v on_o this_o particular_a church_n as_o a_o true_a church_n of_o christ_n and_o will_v you_o walk_v with_o the_o member_n of_o 〈◊〉_d according_a to_o christ_n rule_n will_v you_o subject_n to_o all_o christ_n ordinance_n i_o pray_v why_o may_v i_o not_o demand_v these_o consider_v what_o apollonius_n ames_n mr_n hudson_n have_v say_v the_o light_n of_o nature_n will_v carry_v as_o much_o for_o if_o this_o man_n will_v not_o own_v i_o for_o his_o officer_n if_o he_o will_v not_o join_v with_o the_o church_n if_o not_o submit_v to_o ordinance_n what_o reason_n have_v i_o in_o particular_a to_o baptize_v his_o child_n or_o i_o and_o the_o church_n in_o particular_a to_o take_v more_o care_n of_o he_o then_o any_o other_o church_n if_o you_o say_v by_o his_o requite_v baptism_n of_o i_o he_o profess_v all_o this_o no_o sir_n by_o no_o mean_n i_o have_v
be_v excommunication_n say_v m._n rutherf_n but_o to_o deny_v all_o communion_n with_o those_o who_o be_v once_o in_o the_o church_n 222_o peac_n plea_n 222_o but_o all_o communion_n be_v not_o here_o deny_v you_o will_v object_v as_o you_o answer_v pag._n 13._o all_o communion_n with_o himself_o but_o not_o with_o the_o child_n for_o that_o be_v bear_v a_o christian_a and_o so_o bathe_v right_a ans_fw-fr have_v the_o child_n right_o to_o communion_n any_o other_o way_n with_o the_o church_n then_o by_o the_o parent_n be_v it_o not_o he_o that_o bring_v he_o in_o as_o a_o branch_n of_o himself_o be_v it_o not_o a_o christian_a bear_v by_o virtue_n of_o the_o parent_n christianity_n but_o his_o parent_n christianity_n can_v give_v himself_o no_o title_n to_o church-priviledge_n as_o i_o say_v before_o of_o profession_n which_o be_v all_o one_o do_v the_o child_n plead_v a_o title_n distinct_a from_o the_o parent_n if_o so_o than_o your_o answer_n you_o give_v be_v something_o but_o i_o know_v of_o no_o title_n it_o have_v but_o the_o parent_n who_o express_v his_o own_o title_n for_o himself_o and_o his_o seed_n now_o it_o be_v veâ—y_o rational_a that_o if_o the_o child_n have_v communion_n give_v only_o by_o virtue_n of_o the_o parent_n communion_n for_o before_o the_o parent_n be_v admit_v a_o church-member_n the_o child_n can_v have_v none_o then_o the_o parent_n have_v forfeit_v communion_n for_o himself_o must_v needs_o forfeit_v it_o for_o his_o depend_v child_n also_o what_o tertullian_n say_v of_o excommunication_n apol_n c._n 39_o and_o l._n 2._o ad_fw-la vxorem_fw-la you_o know_v if_o classianâ—s_v his_o wise_n be_v a_o church-member_n though_o her_o husband_n be_v cast_v out_o 75._o aug_n â—p_n 75._o we_o do_v not_o approve_v his_o practice_n who_o will_v not_o baptize_v his_o child_n by_o virtue_n of_o she_o but_o it_o seem_v they_o apprehend_v that_o there_o be_v some_o equity_n if_o both_o be_v cast_v out_o no_o wonder_n though_o augustine_n be_v against_o it_o upon_o his_o principle_n 2._o if_o excommunication_n be_v the_o cast_v out_o of_o a_o member_n of_o a_o church_n 1_o cor._n 5._o ult_n and_o consequent_o render_v he_o a_o non-member_n than_o a_o excommunicate_v person_n can_v give_v title_n to_o his_o child_n baptism_n but_o excommunication_n be_v cast_v a_o man_n out_o etc._n etc._n the_o consequence_n be_v clear_a how_o can_v one_o who_o be_v a_o non-member_n of_o a_o church_n give_v title_n to_o a_o church-priviledge_n excommunication_n render_v he_o a_o non-member_n cut_v he_o off_o from_o communion_n and_o admit_v he_o to_o no_o other_o ordinance_n than_o a_o non-member_n be_v the_o phrase_n cast_v out_o show_v he_o be_v no_o member_n so_o the_o phrase_n of_o cut_v off_o 5._o aar_n rod._n l._n 1._o c._n 5._o which_o learned_a gillespy_n have_v excellent_o open_v to_o be_v mean_v of_o excommunication_n and_o there_o bring_v in_o buxtorf_n and_o godwin_n who_o report_n out_o of_o the_o rabbius_fw-la that_o their_o child_n be_v not_o circumcise_v this_o you_o say_v pag._n 14._o be_v not_o orthodox_n and_o it_o be_v a_o corrupt_a invention_n of_o the_o latter_a jew_n have_v no_o ground_n for_o it_o in_o the_o scripture_n you_o say_v elsewhere_o i_o think_v in_o the_o diatr_n that_o the_o scripture_n do_v not_o speak_v for_o nor_o against_o it_o so_o far_o as_o ou_fw-fr can_v seâ—_n but_o then_o sir_n what_o ever_o i_o make_v of_o it_o it_o concern_v you_o to_o prove_v it_o to_o be_v a_o corrupt_a invention_n though_o i_o can_v yield_v it_o from_o what_o i_o observe_v before_o of_o their_o circumcision_n and_o yet_o not_o hurt_v myself_o but_o you_o answer_v to_o this_o argument_n p._n 13._o that_o he_o be_v a_o member_n still_o though_o much_o disease_a he_o be_v much_o disease_v before_o whilst_o under_o church_n admonition_n suspension_n and_o because_o those_o medicine_n will_v not_o cure_v he_o he_o be_v cut_v off_o a_o member_n under_o cure_n say_v you_o his_o cure_n be_v non_fw-fr membership_n but_o this_o be_v pretty_a a_o man_n shall_v be_v cut_v off_o the_o body_n and_o yet_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o body_n a_o man_n shall_v be_v cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o yet_o shall'be_v within_o the_o church_n a_o man_n shall_v be_v no_o member_n of_o a_o church_n as_o say_v you_o p._n 24._o and_o p._n 14._o and_o yet_o be_v a_o member_n of_o a_o church_n how_o you_o who_o be_v so_o eagle_n eye_v to_o spy_v out_o contradiction_n in_o other_o man_n will_v now_o clear_v yourself_o i_o can_v tell_v member_n no_o member_n be_v contradicentia_fw-la i_o think_v and_o to_o find_v a_o medium_n in_o contradicentibus_fw-la be_v new_a logic_n to_o i_o i_o though_o ens_fw-la &_o non_fw-la ens_fw-la have_v admit_v none_o 3._o excommunication_n be_v the_o put_n of_o a_o man_n out_o of_o the_o visible_a kingdom_n of_o christ_n into_o the_o kingdom_n of_o satan_n so_o the_o best_a expositor_n i_o meet_v with_o 5._o 1_o cor._n 5._o master_n cartwright_n etc._n etc._n expound_v that_o deliver_v up_o to_o satan_n hence_o i_o ague_n to_o administer_v the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n to_o a_o child_n by_o virtue_n of_o one_o who_o be_v even_o ecclesiasticè_fw-la in_o the_o church_n repute_n under_o the_o kingdom_n of_o satan_n be_v very_o unwarrantable_a to_o make_v christ_n a_o political_a head_n to_o one_o under_o satan_n kingdom_n seem_v very_o strange_a 4._o excommunication_n be_v the_o render_n of_o a_o man_n as_o a_o heathen_a to_o the_o church_n mat._n 18._o we_o do_v not_o differ_v here_o but_o agree_v that_o excommunication_n be_v mean_v here_o what_o ever_o the_o erastians_n only_o erastians_n here_o let_v i_o have_v leave_n to_o put_v in_o a_o word_n the_o erastians_n expound_v this_o of_o civil_a injury_n or_o personal_a civil_a trespass_n only_o and_o will_v prove_v it_o by_o compare_v of_o luke_n 17.3_o 4._o with_o this_o his_o argument_n be_v because_o it_o be_v such_o a_o trespass_n as_o a_o brother_n may_v forgive_v mr._n gillespy_n bestow_v pain_n here_o and_o to_o good_a purpose_n but_o let_v it_o be_v suppose_v the_o text_n run_v parallel_v which_o m_n gillespy_n think_v not_o 1._o that_o luke_n 17._o say_v that_o a_o brother_n may_v forgive_v such_o a_o trespass_n as_o it_o be_v better_o a_o millstone_n be_v â—angedi_n about_o his_o neck_n who_o offer_v it_o but_o 2_o we_o find_v in_o 2_o cor._n 27.10_o that_o paul_n forgive_v and_o the_o church_n of_o corinth_n forgive_v what_o a_o trespass_n do_v against_o they_o no_o sure_a the_o incestuous_a person_n act_n be_v no_o evil_a trespass_n against_o paul_n nor_o the_o church_n yet_o they_o forgive_v if_o then_o they_o can_v forgive_v why_o may_v not_o a_o private_a brother_n also_o forgive_v thus_o it_o be_v suppose_v that_o the_o scandal_n which_o be_v here_o give_v &_o for_o which_o the_o private_a brother_n deal_v with_o the_o offendor_n private_o be_v but_o a_o private_a scandal_n for_o if_o it_o be_v public_a this_o way_n of_o deal_n cease_v if_o then_o this_o private_a brother_n deal_v with_o the_o offendor_n find_v the_o man_n to_o acknowledge_v his_o sin_n and_o repent_v why_o may_v not_o he_o be_v say_v to_o forgive_v he_o also_o as_o in_o case_n it_o have_v be_v a_o public_a fact_n and_o cast_v out_o upon_o his_o repentance_n the_o church_n forgive_v so_o that_o now_o he_o embrace_v he_o in_o his_o heart_n again_o proceed_v not_o to_o call_v any_o other_o to_o deal_v with_o he_o nor_o to_o tell_v it_o to_o the_o church_n but_o the_o scandal_n be_v bury_v forgive_v forget_v ecclesiasticè_fw-la i_o know_v no_o absurdity_n in_o this_o and_o so_o the_o forgiveness_n do_v not_o prove_v it_o to_o be_v a_o civil_a trespass_n only_o say_v have_v christ_n say_v let_v he_o be_v a_o heathen_a with_o reverence_n be_v it_o speak_v it_o shall_v seem_v not_o to_o have_v be_v so_o proper_a a_o speech_n for_o he_o may_v not_o be_v a_o heathen_a for_o he_o may_v hold_v his_o profession_n though_o cast_v out_o and_o so_o be_v not_o proper_o a_o heathen_a but_o as_o a_o heathen_a he_o be_v to_o the_o church_n now_o what_o that_o be_v mr._n gillespy_n tell_v we_o and_o not_o he_o alone_o but_o other_o plain_o 382._o aaro_n rod_n 382._o he_o be_v to_o be_v use_v no_o better_a than_o a_o heathen_a or_o profane_a publican_n and_o be_v not_o to_o be_v admit_v to_o any_o ordinance_n except_o such_o as_o heathen_n and_o profane_a publican_n be_v admit_v to_o but_o be_v they_o admit_v to_o the_o circumcision_n of_o their_o child_n 392._o page_n 392._o again_o he_o open_v it_o let_v he_o be_v esteem_v as_o one_o that_o have_v no_o part_n in_o the_o communion_n of_o saint_n in_o church-membership_a observe_v that_o no_o member_n then_o in_o the_o holy_a thing_n in_o the_o covenant_n of_o promise_n more_o than_o a_o heathen_a man_n
condition_n of_o the_o covenant_n of_o grace_n and_o that_o baptism_n respect_v one_o and_o the_o lord_n supper_n the_o other_o then_o there_o may_v be_v some_o aeson_n why_o the_o church_n shall_v look_v to_o one_o more_o than_o another_o but_o i_o know_v but_o of_o one_o condition_n 21._o page_n 21._o you_o say_v moreover_o the_o young_a child_n of_o member_n be_v unfit_a to_o be_v admit_v to_o the_o lord_n supper_n yet_o not_o to_o be_v exclude_v from_o baptism_n the_o reason_n be_v because_o more_o be_v require_v to_o the_o lord_n supper_n then_o to_o their_o baptism_n to_o which_o i_o say_v 1._o if_o child_n do_v as_o much_o depend_v on_o their_o parent_n for_o the_o lord_n supper_n as_o they_o do_v for_o baptism_n then_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v they_o may_v have_v as_o be_v the_o old_a custom_n the_o lord_n supper_n as_o baptism_n 2._o you_o shall_v have_v prove_v that_o less_o be_v to_o be_v require_v of_o those_o who_o do_v give_v they_o title_n to_o their_o baptism_n then_o for_o themselves_o to_o the_o lord_n suppeâ—_n 22._o page_n 22._o so_o that_o whereas_o you_o say_v all_o my_o false_a consequence_n be_v ground_v upon_o my_o first_o false_a premise_v supposition_n viz._n that_o the_o child_n have_v no_o right_a but_o in_o relation_n to_o the_o next_o parent_n the_o word_n next_o by_o your_o favour_n be_v not_o there_o put_v in_o derive_v i_o may_v consider_v the_o parent_n and_o child_n as_o argumentum_fw-la primum_fw-la &_o ortum_fw-la in_o logic_n primum_fw-la babet_fw-la arguendi_fw-la vim_o in_fw-la se_fw-la &_o à _fw-la se_fw-la ortum_fw-la in_o se_fw-la sed_fw-la non_fw-la à _fw-la se_fw-la it_o be_v but_o derive_v so_o i_o say_v your_o answer_n to_o this_o argument_n run_v upon_o a_o false_a supposition_n viz._n that_o child_n be_v baptize_v by_o virtue_n of_o a_o title_n distinct_a from_o their_o parent_n if_o you_o can_v prove_v that_o viz._n that_o the_o parent_n require_v baptism_n for_o himself_o by_o one_o title_n and_o the_o child_n by_o another_o title_n distinct_a from_o he_o than_o your_o answer_n will_v be_v strong_a else_o it_o be_v as_o weak_a and_o weak_a than_o the_o argument_n which_o you_o so_o much_o slight_v for_o the_o rest_n of_o your_o answer_n i_o have_v speak_v to_o it_o before_o and_o therefore_o repeace_v nothing_o for_o the_o example_n of_o scripture_n or_o history_n will_v you_o do_v nothing_o but_o what_o you_o have_v example_n for_o be_v not_o argument_n draw_v from_o scripture-ground_n sufficient_a for_o i_o though_o there_o be_v not_o example_n set_v down_o for_o the_o personal_a default_n i_o have_v speak_v to_o it_o before_o for_o my_o dilemma_n which_o you_o will_v turn_v upon_o i_o i_o see_v you_o take_v that_o for_o grant_v which_o i_o have_v not_o yield_v therefore_o my_o dilemma_n stand_v as_o it_o do_v before_o against_o you_o 23._o page_n 23._o for_o my_o querie_n whether_o the_o child_n may_v not_o be_v suspend_v in_o case_n the_o parent_n he_o suspend_v continue_v obstinate_a you_o will_v answer_v i_o out_o of_o principle_n which_o be_v not_o i_o i_o pray_v prove_v that_o juspension_n be_v a_o ordinance_n institute_v only_o with_o respect_n to_o the_o lord_n supper_n second_o minor_n be_v it_o be_v call_v by_o divine_v excommunicatio_fw-la minor_n prove_v that_o the_o case_n now_o stand_v with_o we_o as_o now_o it_o do_v in_o beginning_n of_o reformation_n we_o may_v not_o deny_v the_o signa_fw-la gratiae_fw-la as_o the_o layden_n professor_n say_v though_o by_o reason_n of_o the_o multitude_n we_o can_v proceed_v to_o excommunication_n 3._o why_o may_v we_o not_o proceed_v to_o non-communion_n my_o second_o argument_n be_v this_o such_o parent_n if_o now_o they_o be_v to_o be_v baptise_a ought_v not_o to_o be_v baptise_a ergo_fw-la they_o can_v challenge_v it_o for_o their_o child_n baptism_n belong_v primaty_o to_o the_o parent_n you_o again_o deny_v the_o consequence_n and_o the_o prose_n of_o it_o first_o you_o say_v it_o be_v a_o receive_a maxim_n among_o the_o lawyer_n quod_fw-la fieri_fw-la non_fw-la debuit_fw-la factum_fw-la valet_fw-la suppose_v a_o unfit_a person_n baptise_a his_o baptism_n be_v not_o null_a be_v be_v a_o member_n till_o legal_o exelude_v and_o so_o have_v right_a for_o himself_o and_o he_o to_o be_v consequent_a privilege_n hence_o first_o those_o indian_n who_o the_o friar_n baptise_a in_o the_o west_n indies_n without_o instruction_n 773._o heylen_n geog._n p._n 773._o have_v right_a and_o title_n for_o themselves_o and_o they_o to_o all_o church_n privilege_n the_o person_n be_v unfit_a who_o be_v baptise_a i_o anâ—â—â—â—_n yet_o say_v mr._n ca._n unfitnesse_n do_v not_o debar_v till_o exclude_v no_o nor_o then_o neither_o let_v other_o do_v as_o those_o friar_n do_v yet_o this_o argument_n hold_v second_o this_o answer_n earri_v it_o that_o baptism_n make_v a_o member_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n observe_v his_o word_n suppose_v a_o unfit_a person_n baptise_a member_n if_o unfit_a to_o be_v baptise_a then_o unfit_a to_o be_v a_o member_n his_o baptism_n be_v not_o null_a be_v be_v a_o member_n which_o way_n come_v this_o man_n to_o be_v a_o member_n not_o by_o his_o christianity_n which_o you_o use_v to_o say_v for_o he_o be_v a_o person_n unfit_a you_o say_v but_o his_o baptism_n make_v he_o thus_o which_o be_v first_o cross_a to_o your_o own_o proposition_n review_n of_o mr._n hoo._n p._n 94._o baptism_n do_v not_o make_v a_o man_n a_o member_n of_o a_o church_n second_o if_o baptism_n do_v make_v a_o member_n and_o consequent_o give_v the_o title_n to_o his_o child_n baptism_n then_o constantine_n valentinianes_n etc._n etc._n those_o who_o defer_v their_o baptism_n be_v so_o long_v no_o member_n of_o the_o church_n nor_o can_v give_v title_n to_o their_o child_n baptism_n three_o primum_fw-la in_o unoquoque_fw-la genere_fw-la est_fw-la meusura_fw-la aliorion_n so_o take_v the_o first_o in_o genere_fw-la baptizatorum_fw-la what_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o their_o baptise_v because_o cause_n they_o hear_v of_o the_o word_n teach_v believe_v and_o join_v to_o the_o church_n it_o be_v not_o because_o any_o other_o be_v baptise_a so_o the_o same_o hold_v now_o a_o person_n be_v repute_v a_o believer_n and_o a_o church-member_n whether_o in_o the_o parent_n or_o otherwise_o this_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o its_o baptism_n than_o it_o be_v not_o another_o be_v baptise_a that_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o my_o baptism_n four_o the_o ground_n of_o the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n be_v because_o the_o person_n appear_v to_o be_v in_o covenant_n not_o because_o it_o be_v first_o seal_v to_o another_o the_o child_n be_v look_v upon_o within_o the_o covenant_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o parent_n as_o be_v i_o shmael_v before_o abraham_n be_v circumcise_v if_o in_o the_o covenant_n than_o say_v you_o the_o child_n be_v a_o church-member_n than_o it_o be_v not_o the_o parent_n be_v baptise_a that_o give_v the_o title_n hence_o your_o notion_n in_o the_o same_o page_n 23._o if_o the_o parent_n sin_n do_v annul_v his_o own_o baptism_n it_o be_v a_o question_n whether_o it_o do_v not_o hinder_v his_o child_n baptism_n which_o also_o imply_v it_o be_v the_o parent_n baptism_n that_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o his_o child_n baptism_n come_v to_o nothing_o your_o second_o answer_n be_v from_o none_o of_o my_o principle_n your_o three_o i_o have_v speak_v to_o also_o i_o do_v not_o express_v excommunication_n as_o a_o qualification_n in_o the_o question_n it_o be_v true_a i_o have_v speak_v to_o this_o also_o before_o what_o you_o have_v say_v to_o the_o three_o argument_n i_o have_v also_o speak_v to_o before_o my_o four_o argument_n run_v thus_o to_o give_v the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n of_o grace_n to_o a_o child_n by_o virtue_n of_o one_o who_o appear_v to_o be_v in_o covenant_n with_o the_o devil_n be_v a_o profane_v of_o the_o ordinance_n to_o this_o you_o answer_v four_o way_n the_o last_o i_o have_v speak_v to_o but_o not_o the_o other_o three_o which_o i_o will_v consider_v 25._o page_n 25._o first_o you_o deny_v that_o such_o person_n as_o the_o q._n memion_n be_v visible_o in_o covenant_n with_o satan_n especial_o if_o tolerate_v for_o so_o long_o they_o be_v visible_o in_o the_o external_a covenant_n of_o the_o church_n what_o you_o mean_v by_o this_o externall_n covenant_n of_o the_o church_n i_o can_v imagine_v not_o baptism_n i_o hope_v nor_o the_o externall_n church_n covenant_n we_o speak_v of_o and_o you_o so_o much_o oppose_v for_o the_o covenant_n of_o grace_n they_o be_v not_o visible_o under_o that_o there_o need_v no_o covenant_n formal_o between_o the_o devil_n and_o we_o natural_o he_o have_v we_o strong_a enough_o though_o we_o make_v no_o formal_a covenant_n with_o he_o but_o when_o be_v man_n say_v to_o be_v under_o the_o covenant_n of_o grace_n be_v it_o not_o when_o
the_o cudgel_n against_o you_o ed._n in_o his_o sermon_n before_o the_o l._n major_n on_o easter_n monday_n 1652._o p._n 28._o 2._o ed._n for_o he_o be_v so_o far_o from_o think_v that_o church_n shall_v excommunicate_v anabaptist_n if_o godly_a that_o he_o charge_v that_o church_n with_o schism_n which_o shall_v deny_v they_o communion_n because_o such_o expound_v it_o how_o you_o will_v so_o it_o be_v true_a that_o will_v show_v some_o difference_n and_o argue_v something_o be_v peculiar_a 5._o i_o say_v when_v the_o jew_n come_v to_o requite_v baptism_n it_o be_v not_o enough_o we_o be_v abraham_n seed_n ergo_fw-la baptise_v we_o this_o be_v enough_o to_o circumcision_n but_o john_n require_v repentance_n to_o this_o you_o answer_v it_o be_v a_o new_a ordinance_n in_o which_o repentance_n be_v require_v in_o the_o first_o parent_n 1._o but_o what_o then_o though_o new_a it_o be_v but_o a_o seal_n to_o the_o same_o covenant_n they_o be_v in_o before_o and_o they_o be_v visible_o under_o the_o same_o covenant_n why_o shall_v more_o be_v require_v of_o they_o if_o there_o be_v not_o some_o difference_n between_o the_o administration_n of_o these_o ordinance_n 2._o but_o be_v not_o repentance_n require_v in_o circumcision_n do_v not_o circumcision_n note_v the_o cut_n off_o the_o old_a man_n ix_o 2_o col._n ix_o and_o be_v that_o do_v without_o repentance_n if_o repentance_n be_v not_o require_v there_o as_o well_o as_o in_o baptism_n you_o will_v confirm_v i_o the_o more_o and_o weaken_v the_o argue_v from_o circumcision_n to_o baptism_n very_o much_o in_o my_o apprehension_n 6._o this_o make_v i_o to_o think_v so_o because_o when_o they_o fall_v to_o their_o foul_a apostle_n yet_o they_o circumcise_a i_o pray_v sir_n speak_v our_o plain_o if_o one_o of_o your_o member_n shall_v sacrifice_v his_o child_n to_o moleâ—b_v worship_v those_o vile_a and_o unclean_a god_n which_o they_o do_v will_v you_o baptise_v his_o child_n without_o any_o more_o ado_n if_o none_o but_o such_o as_o maymony_n before_o quote_v say_v aught_o to_o be_v circumcise_v than_o their_o circumcision_n be_v irregular_a for_o they_o throw_v oft_o abraham_n way_n and_o his_o god_n but_o if_o all_o abraham_n seed_n as_o such_o mere_o according_a to_o the_o flesh_n have_v a_o title_n to_o circumcision_n than_o it_o be_v peculiar_a to_o they_o and_o they_o be_v regular_o enough_o circumcise_v but_o this_o help_v not_o we_o 7._o that_o place_n ezra_n 10.3_o the_o child_n bear_v of_o the_o strange_a wife_n be_v to_o be_v put_v away_o vata_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d ut_fw-la proficiamus_fw-la vulg_fw-la eâ—iciâ—mus_fw-la vata_n as_o well_o as_o the_o strange_a wife_n it_o be_v very_o likely_a they_o will_v circumcise_v they_o but_o yet_o put_v away_o if_o they_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v circumcise_v or_o be_v not_o yet_o it_o will_v imply_v some_o difference_n for_o all_o the_o rest_n to_o p._n 29._o i_o have_v speak_v to_o before_o there_o after_o you_o have_v condemn_v my_o rigidness_n for_o non-admission_n of_o the_o child_n of_o some_o parent_n than_o you_o show_v your_o judgement_n that_o all_o aught_o to_o be_v baptise_a 1._o you_o say_v if_o one_o minister_n will_v not_o baptize_v another_o will_n let_v other_o do_v as_o they_o please_v i_o must_v give_v account_n of_o my_o stewardshipâ—_n not_o his_o it_o will_v increase_v division_n betwixt_o minister_n by_o other_o intermeddle_v with_o their_o charge_n i_o be_v never_o yet_o offend_v with_o any_o man_n who_o do_v baptise_v the_o child_n of_o such_o as_o dwell_v in_o our_o parish_n i_o think_v intermeddle_v with_o other_o folk_n charge_n have_v be_v no_o offence_n to_o the_o classical_a government_n which_o will_v excommunicate_v a_o person_n in_o another_o man_n charge_n 1._o it_o will_v make_v the_o next_o generation_n no_o better_a than_o infidel_n be_v unbaptise_v this_o may_v prevent_v abundance_n of_o sin_n and_o ignorance_n make_v parent_n look_v about_o they_o work_v as_o experience_n have_v prove_v in_o n._n england_n to_o real_a conversion_n as_o in_o charity_n we_o may_v judge_v at_o least_o to_o knowledge_n and_o outward_a conformity_n in_o divers_a here_o also_o in_o england_n in_o your_o own_o shire_n the_o proof_n be_v make_v a_o godly_a minister_n that_o live_v there_o tell_v i_o he_o will_v not_o baptise_v without_o a_o good_a account_n give_v he_o and_o to_o this_o day_n he_o tell_v i_o at_o the_o commencement_n two_o in_o his_o parish_n be_v unbaptise_v the_o people_n observe_v this_o he_o tell_v i_o they_o bestir_v themselves_o to_o get_v knowledge_n and_o give_v better_a account_n this_o be_v the_o fruit_n already_o try_v but_o what_o then_o if_o all_o minister_n do_v so_o because_o unbaptised_a ergo_fw-la infidel_n constantine_n valentinianus_n and_o other_o be_v unbaptise_v a_o long_a time_n therefore_o they_o be_v infidel_n and_o valentinianus_n die_v a_o infidel_n because_o he_o die_v unbaptise_v this_o will_v exasperate_v parent_n you_o say_v we_o must_v look_v for_o rub_n at_o first_o our_o life_n be_v not_o such_o as_o to_o have_v the_o good_a word_n and_o will_n of_o every_o body_n but_o this_o daintiness_n must_v come_v down_o 1._o whilst_o we_o have_v the_o civil_a power_n to_o stand_v by_o it_o may_v be_v do_v the_o more_o easy_o 2._o if_o one_o of_o the_o parent_n give_v any_o comfortable_a account_n it_o be_v sufficient_a 3._o wome_a their_o sex_n command_v they_o more_o modesty_n and_o their_o education_n help_v if_o there_o be_v knowledge_n they_o have_v advantage_n also_o of_o affection_n and_o so_o easy_o move_v upon_o by_o preach_v the_o word_n 4._o for_o number_v we_o shall_v find_v the_o most_o opposition_n will_v be_v in_o the_o poor_a sort_n where_o horrible_a ignorance_n beside_o profaneness_n abound_v 5._o it_o be_v but_o visible_a saintship_n that_o be_v require_v you_o have_v say_v enough_o in_o my_o opinion_n as_o for_o maintenance_n which_o you_o mention_v thousand_o of_o minister_n in_o england_n have_v the_o advantage_n of_o i_o n._n england_n voyage_n have_v break_v and_o spoil_v our_o estate_n but_o ordinary_o minister_n have_v land_n of_o their_o own_o and_o some_o good_a glebe-land_n wherein_o they_o be_v before_o i_o i_o observe_v but_o two_o thing_n 1._o for_o what_o you_o say_v you_o will_v have_v the_o magistrate_n settle_v aright_o government_n which_o all_o congregatious_a shall_v be_v bind_v to_o submit_v to_o sir_n you_o speak_v of_o a_o hard_a thing_n the_o magistrate_n must_v needs_o be_v trouble_v to_o know_v which_o be_v that_o right_a government_n when_o there_o be_v so_o much_o difference_n among_o the_o minister_n who_o call_v for_o it_o one_o say_v it_o be_v classical_a government_n another_o it_o be_v congregationall_a and_o both_o side_n very_o godly_a man_n the_o ark_n must_v needs_o shake_v when_o the_o ox_n stumble_v 2._o yet_o such_o be_v the_o nearness_n of_o the_o agreement_n between_o the_o congregationall_a and_o classical_a government_n that_o though_o one_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o submit_v to_o the_o other_o yet_o church-government_n may_v go_v on_o well_o enough_o be_v it_o not_o for_o this_o separation_n which_o will_v undermine_v both_o if_o there_o be_v brotherly_a yield_n on_o both_o side_n but_o a_o little_a if_o the_o peace_n of_o the_o church_n be_v as_o much_o value_v as_o it_o have_v be_v by_o other_o holy_a man_n before_o time_n we_o will_v not_o we_o dare_v not_o do_v as_o we_o do_v the_o magistrate_n do_v give_v leave_n for_o these_o two_o which_o in_o respect_n of_o government_n be_v so_o near_o that_o they_o need_v not_o be_v call_v two_o but_o this_o fearful_a blast_n of_o the_o ordinance_n by_o the_o sore_a hand_n of_o god_n and_o this_o horrible_a disunion_n between_o the_o congregationall_a and_o classical_a man_n and_o other_o who_o be_v godly_a say_v in_o my_o heart_n there_o hang_v a_o scourge_n over_o both_o congregationall_a and_o classical_a man_n and_o other_o professor_n for_o the_o rest_n p._n 30._o there_o be_v little_a to_o answer_v 2._o for_o your_o bring_n in_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n to_o reform_v our_o people_n as_o church-member_n this_o will_v be_v poor_a reformation_n i_o think_v church-member_n have_v be_v form_v and_o reform_v by_o the_o sword_n of_o the_o spirit_n not_o of_o the_o magistrate_n they_o can_v scarce_o make_v better_a law_n than_o they_o have_v make_v for_o reform_v of_o moral_a vice_n i_o think_v the_o fault_n lie_v not_o in_o they_o they_o can_v be_v judge_n and_o witness_n too_o for_o your_o last_o p_o 31._o that_o you_o will_v have_v we_o press_v the_o condition_n of_o the_o covenant_n on_o those_o that_o we_o baptise_v and_o that_o be_v sufficient_a now_o if_o i_o be_v only_o a_o teacher_n this_o may_v suffice_v but_o i_o think_v i_o be_o or_o shall_v be_v a_o ruler_n as_o well_o as_o a_o teacher_n if_o this_o