gospel_n be_v rather_o to_o be_v have_v by_o the_o interpretation_n of_o the_o father_n and_o use_v of_o the_o church_n than_o the_o bare_a word_n of_o scripture_n and_o prove_v it_o by_o this_o that_o if_o we_o lie_v aside_o the_o interpretation_n of_o father_n and_o use_n of_o the_o church_n no_o man_n can_v be_v able_a to_o prove_v that_o any_o priest_n now_o in_o these_o time_n do_v consecrate_v the_o true_a body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n which_o be_v the_o same_o that_o he_o say_v after_o in_o other_o word_n in_o nostra_fw-la missa_fw-la in_o our_o mass_n that_o be_v mass_n in_o these_o time_n not_o say_v he_o that_o this_o matter_n be_v now_o doubtful_a but_o that_o the_o certainty_n thereof_o be_v have_v not_o so_o much_o out_o of_o the_o word_n of_o the_o gospel_n as_o of_o the_o interpretation_n of_o the_o father_n and_o use_n of_o so_o long_a time_n which_o they_o have_v leave_v to_o posterity_n for_o say_v he_o again_o though_o christ_n of_o bread_n make_v his_o body_n 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22._o q._n 1._o hoc_fw-la facite_fw-la in_o meam_fw-la commemorationem_fw-la not_o bare_o but_o as_o they_o have_v be_v ever_o understand_v by_o the_o church_n which_o be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v against_o we_o that_o we_o may_v rather_o urge_v it_o against_o you_o upon_o the_o same_o occasion_n that_o bishop_n fisher_n do_v to_o wit_n for_o proof_n of_o the_o necessity_n of_o tradition_n and_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n for_o understanding_n of_o scripture_n and_o so_o by_o this_o it_o be_v manifest_v how_o much_o you_o have_v abuse_v this_o holy_a bishop_n meaning_n as_o you_o do_v other_o two_o bishop_n that_o follow_v 18._o the_o one_o be_v gul._n durandus_fw-la bishop_n of_o mand_v out_o of_o who_o it_o seem_v you_o will_v prove_v the_o word_n this_o be_v my_o body_n not_o to_o be_v of_o the_o essence_n of_o this_o sacrament_n for_o what_o else_o you_o will_v have_v with_o he_o i_o see_v not_o but_o special_o because_o have_v cite_v he_o thus_o in_o english_a christ_n bless_v the_o bread_n by_o his_o heavenly_a benediction_n and_o by_o virtue_n of_o that_o word_n the_o bread_n be_v turn_v unto_o the_o substance_n of_o christ_n body_n then_o you_o put_v these_o word_n in_o latin_a tunc_fw-la confecit_fw-la cum_fw-la benedixit_fw-la they_o he_o make_v it_o when_o he_o bless_v it_o whereby_o you_o seem_v to_o put_v the_o force_n of_o this_o testimony_n in_o those_o word_n as_o if_o by_o they_o you_o will_v prove_v out_o of_o durandus_fw-la that_o christ_n do_v not_o consecrate_v by_o the_o word_n this_o be_v my_o body_n but_o by_o that_o blessing_n but_o durand_n himself_o shall_v disprove_v you_o sir_n knight_n for_o thus_o he_o say_v benedixit_fw-la benedictione_n caelesti_fw-la &_o virtute_fw-la verbi_fw-la qua_fw-la convertitur_fw-la panis_fw-la in_o substantiam_fw-la corporis_fw-la christi_fw-la to_o wit_n hoc_fw-la est_fw-la corpus_n meum_fw-la he_o bless_v it_o by_o the_o heavenly_a blessing_n and_o power_n of_o the_o word_n by_o which_o the_o bread_n be_v turn_v into_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n 14._o durand_n rat_n cap._n 41._o n._n 14._o to_o wit_n this_o be_v my_o body_n hoc_fw-la est_fw-la corpus_fw-la meum_fw-la which_o last_o word_n i_o will_v glad_o know_v sir_n humphrey_n why_o you_o cut_v of_o but_o i_o need_v not_o ask_v for_o any_o man_n may_v see_v it_o be_v because_o you_o will_v not_o have_v that_o powerful_a benediction_n whereof_o this_o author_n speak_v to_o consist_v in_o those_o sacred_a word_n but_o durand_n both_o in_o this_o very_a sentence_n and_o often_o in_o the_o same_o place_n attribute_v most_o plain_o that_o power_n to_o those_o very_a word_n not_o to_o any_o other_o blessing_n as_o may_v appear_v in_o that_o he_o say_v that_o we_o do_v bless_v ex_fw-la illa_fw-la virtute_fw-la quam_fw-la christus_fw-la indidit_fw-la verbis_fw-la by_o that_o power_n which_o christ_n have_v give_v to_o the_o word_n 19_o odo_n caemeracensis_n be_v the_o other_o bishop_n that_o follow_v who_o for_o the_o same_o purpose_n you_o cite_v and_o as_o much_o to_o the_o purpose_n his_o word_n be_v these_o as_o you_o bring_v they_o christ_n bless_v the_o bread_n and_o then_o make_v that_o his_o body_n which_o be_v first_o bread_n and_o so_o by_o blessing_n it_o become_v flesh_n for_o otherwise_o he_o will_v not_o have_v say_v after_o he_o have_v bless_v it_o this_o be_v my_o body_n unless_o by_o blessing_n it_o he_o have_v make_v it_o his_o body_n which_o word_n you_o put_v in_o the_o margin_n in_o latin_a imperfect_o and_o translate_v even_o they_o corrupt_o benedixit_fw-la suum_fw-la corpus_fw-la you_o translate_v christ_n bless_v bread_n qui_fw-la priùs_fw-la erat_fw-la panis_fw-la benedictione_n factus_fw-la est_fw-la caro_fw-la which_o in_o true_a english_a be_v thus_o that_o which_o be_v bread_n before_o by_o blessing_n be_v make_v flesh_n you_o translate_v otherwise_o as_o may_v appear_v by_o your_o word_n though_o i_o see_v not_o to_o what_o end_n you_o shall_v so_o
and_o you_o minister_n 14._o basil_n see_v tert._n the_o praescr_n cap._n 21._o epiph._n chrisost_o basil_n the_o particular_a testimony_n you_o may_v see_v in_o bellarmine_n to_o who_o i_o remit_v you_o only_o for_o s._n aug._n i_o can_v omit_v to_o make_v more_o particular_a mention_n of_o he_o in_o this_o place_n by_o reason_n of_o a_o certain_a sentence_n which_o you_o have_v bring_v in_o the_o end_n of_o this_o §_o as_o alsoe_o of_o every_o one_o of_o the_o 6._o 7._o damascen_n &_o alios_fw-la ap_fw-mi bell._n de_fw-fr verb._n dei_fw-la lib._n 4._o cap._n 7._o forego_v §§_o still_o conclude_v with_o this_o say_n of_o that_o holy_a father_n sive_fw-la de_fw-la christo_fw-la five_o etc._n etc._n whether_o concern_v christ_n or_o concern_v the_o church_n or_o concern_v any_o other_o thing_n that_o pertain_v to_o our_o faith_n i_o will_v not_o say_v we_o who_o be_v no_o way_n to_o be_v compare_v to_o he_o that_o say_v but_o if_o a_o angel_n from_o heaven_n shall_v preach_v unto_o you_o beside_o what_o you_o have_v receive_v in_o the_o legal_a and_o evangelical_a scripture_n let_v he_o be_v anathema_n and_o in_o the_o end_n of_o every_o one_o for_o the_o most_o part_n add_v the_o particular_a controversy_n of_o that_o §_o as_o for_o example_n in_o this_o of_o indulgence_n you_o say_v if_o we_o or_o a_o angel_n from_o heaven_n preach_v unto_o you_o any_o thing_n concern_v the_o faith_n of_o indulgence_n beside_o that_o you_o have_v receive_v etc._n etc._n and_o so_o in_o every_o of_o the_o other_o particular_a point_n whereby_o you_o will_v persuade_v your_o reader_n that_o saint_n aug._n will_v have_v nothing_o believe_v but_o what_o can_v be_v prove_v by_o express_a word_n of_o scripture_n wherein_o i_o appeal_v to_o your_o own_o conscience_n as_o bad_a as_o it_o be_v whither_o this_o be_v not_o damnable_a dishonest_a deal_v both_o towards_o s._n aug._n and_o towards_o your_o reader_n for_o if_o you_o have_v read_v s._n aug._n as_o you_o pretend_v how_o can_v you_o be_v ignorant_a how_o many_o point_n of_o faith_n he_o do_v defend_v against_o several_a haeretique_n either_o only_a or_o chief_o by_o the_o tradition_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n 23._o de_fw-fr bap._n câ—nt_fw-la donat._n lib._n 2._o cap._n 7._o &_o lib._n 5._o cap._n 23._o as_o single_a baptism_n against_o the_o donatist_n consubstantiality_n of_o the_o son_n divinity_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o even_o unbegottenesse_n of_o the_o father_n the_o first_o person_n in_o trinity_n against_o the_o arrian_n and_o the_o baptism_n of_o child_n against_o pelagius_n to_o say_v nothing_o of_o prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a 118._o cont._n maxi._n lib._n 3._o cap._n 3._o &_o ep_n 174._o de_fw-fr genes_n ad_fw-la literam_fw-la lib._n 10._o cap._n 23._o de_fw-fr cura_fw-la pro_fw-la mortuis_fw-la ep_v 118._o observation_n of_o the_o feast_n of_o easter_n ascension_n whitsuntide_n and_o the_o like_a nay_o this_o truth_n be_v so_o ground_v with_o he_o that_o he_o count_v it_o most_o insolent_a madness_n to_o dispute_v against_o the_o common_a opinion_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n which_o be_v of_o so_o great_a authority_n with_o he_o as_o that_o he_o say_v in_o one_o place_n that_o when_o we_o follow_v it_o we_o follow_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o scripture_n these_o be_v his_o word_n scripturarum_fw-la a_o nobis_fw-la tenetur_fw-la veritas_fw-la cum_fw-la id_fw-la facimus_fw-la etc._n etc._n 33._o lib._n 1._o cont_n crescon_n cap._n 33._o the_o truth_n of_o the_o scripture_n be_v hold_v by_o we_o when_o we_o do_v that_o which_o seem_v good_a to_o the_o whole_a church_n which_o church_n the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n themselves_o do_v commend_v that_o because_o the_o holy_a scripture_n can_v deceive_v whosoever_o be_v afraid_a to_o be_v deceive_v by_o the_o obscurity_n of_o this_o question_n may_v have_v recourse_n to_o the_o church_n the_o which_o the_o holy_a scripture_n without_o any_o ambiguity_n do_v demonstrate_v 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thou_o be_v not_o to_o be_v the_o author_n but_o the_o keeper_n not_o the_o institutor_n but_o a_o scholar_n not_o leadinge_n but_o follow_v so_o as_o by_o timothee_n the_o whole_a church_n be_v understand_v as_o the_o same_o author_n say_v or_o especial_o the_o whole_a body_n of_o pastor_n it_o follow_v that_o the_o church_n creat_v not_o any_o new_a article_n of_o faith_n but_o teach_v only_o that_o which_o she_o have_v learn_v of_o the_o prophet_n and_o apostle_n 6._o from_o which_o follow_v that_o other_o thing_n which_o i_o mean_v to_o tell_v the_o knight_n for_o his_o learning_n which_o also_o i_o touch_v before_o in_o a_o word_n to_o wit_n that_o when_o point_n of_o doctrine_n before_o in_o controversy_n and_o undefined_a come_v to_o be_v define_v by_o the_o church_n the_o doctrine_n be_v not_o therefore_o new_a because_o it_o be_v de_fw-fr fide_fw-la or_o matter_n of_o faith_n now_o which_o it_o be_v not_o before_o as_o he_o most_o false_o and_o fond_o suppose_v for_o a_o undoubted_a truth_n and_o upon_o this_o his_o own_o idle_a fancy_n build_v many_o goodly_a argument_n like_v so_o many_o castle_n in_o the_o air_n for_o out_o of_o this_o he_o think_v it_o to_o follow_v that_o we_o vary_v in_o our_o doctrine_n that_o because_o forsooth_o there_o be_v many_o thing_n now_o the_o fide_fw-la which_o be_v not_o before_o and_o whereof_o doctor_n do_v dispute_v which_o see_v we_o may_v not_o now_o doubt_v of_o therefore_o the_o faith_n be_v in_o his_o judgement_n alter_v but_o this_o show_v nothing_o but_o the_o poorness_n of_o his_o judgement_n for_o by_o this_o he_o may_v prove_v that_o the_o sun_n as_o it_o rise_v high_a and_o high_o and_o by_o spread_v his_o beam_n give_v light_n in_o some_o place_n att_o noon_n where_o it_o do_v not_o in_o the_o morning_n that_o therefore_o it_o be_v change_v in_o itself_o than_o which_o what_o can_v be_v more_o absurd_a 7._o and_o that_o it_o be_v the_o same_o of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o sun_n 6.9_o cant._n 6.9_o appear_v by_o that_o place_n of_o the_o canticle_n quae_fw-la est_fw-la ista_fw-la quae_fw-la progreditur_fw-la quasi_fw-la aurora_fw-la consurgens_fw-la pulchra_fw-la ut_fw-la luna_fw-la electa_fw-la ut_fw-la sol_fw-la terribilis_fw-la ut_fw-la castrorum_fw-la acies_fw-la ordinata_fw-la who_o be_v she_o that_o go_v forward_o as_o the_o morning_n rise_v fair_a as_o the_o moon_n choose_v as_o the_o sun_n terrible_a as_o a_o order_a army_n of_o tent_n which_o word_v no_o man_n ever_o doubt_v to_o be_v literal_o understand_v of_o the_o church_n even_o then_o as_o the_o sun_n may_v go_v spread_v his_o beam_n more_o and_o more_o with_o out_z increase_n or_o change_v of_o it_o own_o light_n in_o itself_o so_o may_v the_o church_n go_v more_o and_o more_o spread_v the_o beam_n of_o her_o divine_a faith_n with_o out_o increase_v or_o alteration_n of_o the_o faith_n in_o itself_o and_o as_o the_o sun_n beam_n may_v shine_v in_o a_o valley_n or_o room_n of_o a_o house_n where_o it_o do_v not_o shine_v before_o so_o may_v the_o church_n spread_v the_o light_n of_o her_o faith_n show_v such_o or_o such_o a_o point_n to_o be_v a_o divine_a truth_n which_o before_o be_v not_o so_o know_v to_o be_v or_o which_o though_o it_o be_v a_o divine_a truth_n in_o itself_o yet_o it_o be_v not_o so_o to_o us._n 8._o for_o more_o declaration_n whereof_o i_o may_v yet_o bring_v another_o more_o scholarly_o example_n which_o be_v of_o the_o principle_n of_o several_a science_n which_o be_v to_o be_v the_o premise_n in_o demonstrative_a argument_n of_o those_o science_n in_o which_o principle_n or_o premise_n be_v contain_v diverse_a truth_n which_o may_v be_v draw_v out_o of_o they_o by_o many_o several_a conclusion_n one_o follow_v of_o another_o these_o conclusion_n be_v truth_n in_o themselves_o before_o though_o they_o do_v not_o so_o appear_v unto_o i_o till_o i_o see_v the_o connexion_n they_o have_v with_o the_o premise_n and_o how_o they_o be_v contain_v in_o they_o and_o by_o the_o many_o several_a conclusion_n which_o be_v so_o draw_v the_o truth_n of_o those_o principle_n and_o premise_n do_v more_o show_v itself_o but_o not_o receive_v any_o increase_n or_o change_v in_o itself_o thereby_o even_o so_o we_o say_v in_o the_o prime_a principle_n of_o our_o faith_n reveal_v immediate_o to_o the_o prophet_n and_o apostle_n and_o by_o they_o deliver_v unto_o the_o church_n be_v contain_v all_o truth_n which_o any_o way_n belong_v to_o our_o faith_n and_o whereby_o the_o church_n have_v in_o succeed_a age_n destroy_v several_a heresy_n as_o they_o have_v rise_v without_o create_v or_o coin_v new_a faith_n or_o alter_v the_o old_a but_o out_o of_o the_o old_a ground_n and_o premise_n draw_v those_o conclusion_n which_o destroy_v new_a heresy_n and_o show_v they_o to_o be_v contrary_a to_o the_o ancient_a faith_n and_o in_o that_o manner_n the_o church_n have_v grow_v and_o increase_v in_o knowledge_n by_o degree_n and_o shall_v still_o go_v grow_v and_o increase_v to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n 6._o greg._n moral_a lib._n 9_o cap_n 6._o as_o show_v s._n greg._n his_o discourse_n upon_o those_o word_n of_o job._n qui_fw-la facit_fw-la arcturum_fw-la &_o oriana_n &_o hyadas_n etc._n etc._n where_o he_o say_v thus_o vrgente_n mundi_fw-la sine_fw-la superna_fw-la scientia_fw-la proficit_fw-la &_o largius_fw-la cum_fw-la tempore_fw-la excrescit_fw-la as_o the_o world_n draw_v to_o a_o end_n the_o heavenly_a knowledge_n profit_v and_o with_o time_n increase_v wherein_o also_o she_o resemble_v our_o b._n saviour_n her_o chief_a lord_n and_o heavenly_a spouse_n who_o though_o in_o grace_n and_o knowlegde_v he_o never_o receive_v the_o least_o increase_n from_o the_o first_o instant_n of_o his_o conception_n 2.52_o luc_n 2.52_o yet_o the_o scripture_n say_v after_o proficiebat_fw-la sapientia_fw-la &_o aetate_fw-la &_o gratia_fw-la apud_fw-la deum_fw-la &_o homines_fw-la to_o wit_n because_o he_o show_v it_o more_o in_o his_o word_n and_o action_n 9_o this_o be_v far_a confirm_v by_o the_o manner_n and_o practice_n which_o our_o catholic_a doctor_n and_o father_n ever_o observe_v in_o and_o out_o of_o counsel_n in_o prove_v or_o define_v point_n of_o faith_n to_o wit_n by_o have_v recourse_n to_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n and_o tradition_n belief_n and_o practice_v of_o the_o church_n in_o the_o search_n whereof_o the_o holy_a church_n join_v humane_a industry_n with_o god_n holy_a grace_n and_o assistance_n for_o when_o any_o question_n or_o doubt_v of_o faith_n arise_v particular_a doctor_n several_o dispute_v and_o write_v thereof_o then_o if_o far_o need_n require_v it_o the_o holy_a church_n gather_v together_o her_o pastor_n and_o doctor_n in_o a_o council_n to_o examine_v and_o discuss_v the_o matter_n more_o full_o as_o in_o that_o first_o council_n of_o the_o apostle_n 15.6_o act._n 15.6_o whereof_o the_o scripture_n say_v conueneruntque_fw-la apostoli_fw-la &_o seniores_fw-la videre_fw-la de_fw-la verbo_fw-la hoc_fw-la the_o apostle_n ad_fw-la ancient_n assemble_v to_o consider_v of_o this_o word_n the_o pastor_n come_v so_o together_o and_o have_v the_o presence_n of_o our_o saviour_n according_a to_o his_o promise_n and_o his_o holy_a spirit_n out_o of_o the_o prophetical_a and_o apostolical_a scripture_n and_o tradition_n join_v therewith_o the_o authoritye_n and_o interpretation_n of_o holy_a father_n and_o doctor_n out_o of_o praecedent_a time_n she_o do_v infallible_o resolve_v and_o determine_v the_o matter_n not_o as_o new_o but_o as_o ancient_a orthodox_n and_o derive_v from_o her_o forefather_n make_v that_o which_o be_v ever_o in_o itself_o a_o divine_a truth_n so_o to_o appear_v unto_o we_o that_o now_o we_o may_v not_o make_v far_a question_n thereof_o 10._o seq_n vinc._n lerin_n cap._n 27.28.29_o &_o seq_n and_o this_o be_v the_o common_a doctrine_n deliver_v by_o our_o catholic_a doctor_n i_o think_v it_o not_o amiss_o somewhat_o far_o to_o confirm_v and_o authorise_v the_o same_o by_o a_o excellent_a discourse_n of_o that_o holy_a and_o ancient_a father_n vincentius_n lerinensis_n not_o recite_v his_o very_a word_n because_o it_o will_v be_v too_o long_o but_o only_o the_o substance_n which_o be_v this_o have_v prove_v by_o the_o word_n depositum_fw-la out_o of_o s._n paul_n that_o a_o pastor_n priest_n preacher_n or_o doctor_n there_o mean_v by_o timothee_n must_v only_o deliver_v the_o doctrine_n which_o be_v deposit_v with_o he_o or_o in_o his_o hand_n not_o find_v out_o by_o he_o which_o he_o have_v receive_v not_o invent_v whereof_o he_o be_v not_o to_o be_v author_n or_o beginner_n but_o the_o keeper_n or_o guardian_n he_o say_v that_o if_o such_o a_o man_n have_v ability_n for_o it_o he_o may_v like_v another_o beseleel_n adorn_v set_v out_o and_o grace_v the_o precious_a jewel_n of_o divine_a faith_n by_o expound_v more_o clear_o that_o which_o before_o be_v believe_v more_o
brag_v for_o from_o the_o time_n you_o have_v begin_v to_o be_v against_o it_o you_o be_v not_o of_o it_o and_o so_o much_o for_o that_o 18._o now_o for_o these_o point_n of_o doctrine_n by_o you_o name_v wherein_o you_o agree_v with_o we_o and_o which_o you_o have_v no_o succession_n of_o your_o own_o you_o can_v have_v it_o by_o any_o other_o mean_v but_o by_o and_o from_o we_o which_o therefore_o be_v we_o and_o not_o you_o we_o do_v not_o question_v you_o for_o your_o antiquity_n and_o universality_n but_o for_o these_o other_o point_n wherein_o you_o disagree_v as_o when_o you_o deny_v the_o doctrine_n declare_v by_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n when_o you_o deny_v our_o seven_o sacrament_n deny_v the_o truth_n of_o one_o of_o these_o two_o sacrament_n to_o wit_v the_o real_a presence_n of_o our_o sauiour_n body_n &_o blood_n &_o necessity_n &_o efficacy_n of_o the_o other_o to_o wit_n baptism_n deny_v our_o canon_n of_o scripture_n our_o number_n of_o counsel_n our_o tradition_n etc._n etc._n for_o this_o be_v your_o faith_n proper_o as_o you_o be_v a_o distinct_a company_n or_o church_n show_v your_o doctrine_n in_o all_o these_o point_n that_o be_v your_o denial_n of_o they_o to_o have_v be_v ancient_o and_o universal_o teach_v or_o even_o before_o luther_n time_n and_o you_o have_v say_v something_o which_o you_o not_o do_v i_o can_v but_o wonder_v to_o see_v you_o so_o silly_a and_o senseless_a to_o use_v your_o own_o word_n as_o to_o think_v you_o have_v say_v something_o to_o the_o purpose_n we_o ask_v you_o the_o antiquity_n of_o your_o doctrine_n that_o be_v wherein_o you_o disagree_v from_o we_o and_o you_o answer_v we_o with_o the_o antiquity_n of_o so_o much_o as_o agree_v with_o we_o which_o be_v to_o answer_v we_o with_o the_o antiquity_n of_o our_o own_o you_o have_v be_v please_v to_o shape_n yourselves_o a_o religion_n out_o of_o we_o and_o you_o plead_v the_o antiquity_n of_o we_o but_o that_o will_v not_o serve_v your_o turn_n that_o shape_n which_o you_o give_v it_o be_v the_o form_n and_o essence_n of_o your_o religion_n so_o long_o then_o as_o that_o be_v new_a your_o religion_n be_v new_a neither_o can_v you_o say_v the_o same_o of_o our_o point_n define_v in_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n as_o you_o seem_v to_o say_v by_o ask_v where_o our_o church_n wasâ—_n where_o our_o trent_n doctrine_n and_o article_n of_o the_o roman_a creed_n be_v receive_v de_fw-la fide_fw-la before_o luther_n this_o you_o can_v likewise_o say_v to_o we_o for_o the_o define_n make_v not_o the_o doctrine_n new_a but_o bind_v man_n by_o authority_n of_o a_o council_n to_o believe_v what_o they_o do_v believe_v plain_o by_o tradition_n 32._o vinc._n lerin_n cap._n 32._o as_o vincentius_n lerinensis_n say_v that_o the_o church_n by_o the_o decree_n of_o her_o counsel_n have_v do_v nothing_o else_o but_o that_o what_o she_o have_v before_o receive_v by_o tradition_n only_o she_o shall_v also_o by_o writing_n consign_v to_o posterity_n nec_fw-la quicquam_fw-la conciliorum_fw-la suorum_fw-la decretis_fw-la catholica_fw-la perfecit_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la nisi_fw-la ut_fw-la quod_fw-la prius_fw-la a_o majoribus_fw-la sola_fw-la traditione_n susceperat_fw-la hoc_fw-la deinde_fw-la posteris_fw-la etiam_fw-la per_fw-la scripturae_fw-la chirographum_fw-la consignaret_fw-la of_o which_o see_v more_o in_o the_o first_o chapter_n here_o 19_o after_o this_o you_o ask_v again_o if_o your_o doctrine_n lie_v involue_v in_o the_o bosom_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n which_o say_v you_o no_o romanist_n can_v deny_v if_o it_o become_v hide_v as_o good_a corn_n cover_v with_o chaff_n or_o as_o fine_a gold_n overlay_v with_o a_o great_a quantity_n of_o dross_n whether_o it_o must_v be_v therefore_o new_a and_o unknown_a because_o the_o corn_n be_v not_o sever_v from_o the_o chaff_n the_o gold_n from_o the_o dross_n before_o luther_n time_n and_o than_o you_o bid_v we_o because_o we_o call_v your_o doctrine_n novelty_n to_o remove_v the_o three_o creed_n the_o two_o sacrament_n the_o 22._o canonical_a book_n the_o 4._o first_o general_n counsel_n apostolical_a tradition_n and_o see_v whether_o our_o church_n will_v not_o prove_v a_o poor_a and_o senseless_a carcase_n this_o be_v your_o learned_a discourse_n sir_n humphrey_n to_o which_o i_o answer_v ask_v first_n what_o romanist_n do_v acknowledge_v your_o doctrine_n to_o have_v lie_v involue_v in_o the_o bosom_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n do_v ever_o any_o man_n write_v so_o do_v ever_o any_o man_n say_v so_o unto_o you_o nay_o what_o romanist_n have_v ever_o forbear_v upon_o occasion_n offer_v to_o deny_v and_o deny_v it_o again_o you_o teach_v not_o only_o those_o be_v two_o but_o that_o there_o be_v but_o two_o sacrament_n which_o what_o romanist_n ever_o acknowledge_v to_o have_v be_v teach_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n one_o of_o your_o sacrament_n be_v a_o empty_a piece_n of_o bread_n and_o a_o sup_v of_o wine_n which_o what_o catholic_n will_v ever_o say_v be_v teach_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n you_o allow_v 4._o counsel_n and_o but_o 4._o you_o allow_v 22._o book_n of_o canonical_a scripture_n and_o but_o 22._o will_n any_o catholic_a ever_o allow_v this_o to_o have_v be_v catholic_a doctrine_n take_v away_o your_o yet_o and_o then_o it_o may_v pass_v but_o than_o you_o take_v away_o your_o religion_n but_o here_o be_v one_o thing_n that_o give_v i_o much_o cause_n of_o wonder_n which_o be_v that_o you_o talk_v of_o tradition_n as_o distinct_a from_o scripture_n which_o be_v a_o thing_n that_o i_o do_v little_o expect_v from_o a_o man_n of_o your_o profession_n and_o i_o ever_o take_v you_o to_o be_v so_o fall_v out_o with_o they_o that_o you_o make_v the_o denial_n of_o they_o a_o fundamental_a point_n of_o your_o religion_n and_o that_o therefore_o you_o will_v not_o endure_v the_o word_n tradition_n even_o in_o holy_a scripture_n where_o it_o may_v be_v take_v in_o a_o good_a sense_n but_o always_o translate_v or_o rather_o falsify_v it_o 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the_o word_n the_o presence_n of_o christ_n depend_v upon_o their_o efficacy_n which_o they_o have_v by_o the_o institution_n of_o christ_n as_o they_o be_v the_o form_n of_o this_o sacrament_n which_o may_v be_v separate_v from_o the_o signification_n though_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la it_o be_v not_o 1._o caiet_fw-mi in_o come_v 3._o p._n q._n 75._o a._n 1._o and_o so_o cajetan_v though_o he_o think_v not_o the_o bare_a signification_n of_o the_o word_n without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n sufficient_a to_o prove_v the_o presence_n of_o christ_n body_n in_o the_o sacrament_n yet_o he_o doubt_v not_o to_o affirm_v with_o the_o council_n of_o florence_n allege_v the_o very_a word_n thereof_o quod_fw-la ipsorum_fw-la verborum_fw-la virtute_fw-la substantia_fw-la panis_fw-la in_o corpus_fw-la christi_fw-la &_o substantia_fw-la vini_fw-la in_o sanguinem_fw-la convertuntur_fw-la that_o by_o the_o power_n of_o the_o very_a word_n the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n be_v turn_v into_o 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body_n yet_o all_o agree_v that_o out_o of_o the_o word_n as_o they_o be_v understand_v by_o the_o church_n transubstantiation_n be_v also_o prove_v you_o may_v therefore_o have_v spare_v gabriel_n authority_n which_o you_o begin_v with_o in_o these_o word_n how_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n be_v not_o express_v in_o the_o canon_n of_o the_o bible_n which_o i_o will_v have_v spare_v also_o but_o because_o i_o mean_v to_o lay_v open_a your_o falsehood_n in_o allege_v the_o same_o by_o half_n 40._o cab._n lect_n 40._o for_o thus_o he_o say_v notandum_fw-la quod_fw-la quamuis_fw-la express_v tradatur_fw-la in_o scriptura_fw-la quod_fw-la corpus_fw-la christi_fw-la veraciter_fw-la sub_fw-la speciebus_fw-la panis_fw-la continetur_fw-la &_o a_o fidelibus_fw-la sumitur_fw-la tamen_fw-la quomodo_fw-la sit_fw-la ibi_fw-la corpus_fw-la christi_fw-la a_o per_fw-la conversionem_fw-la alicuius_fw-la in_o ipsum_fw-la a_o sine_fw-la conversione_n incipiat_fw-la esse_fw-la 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you_o tell_v we_o think_v it_o possible_a that_o the_o bread_n may_v remain_v with_o christ_n body_n and_o that_o it_o be_v more_o easy_a and_o more_o reasonable_a to_o conceive_v whereto_o i_o answer_v what_o then_o what_o be_v this_o to_o your_o purpose_n if_o you_o be_v a_o lutheran_n you_o may_v have_v a_o little_a colour_n but_o see_v you_o be_v a_o caluinist_n or_o protestant_n or_o some_o such_o i_o know_v not_o what_o it_o make_v nothing_o at_o all_o for_o you_o not_o even_o in_o show_n but_o be_v you_o caluinist_n protestant_n lutheran_n or_o what_o you_o will_v it_o make_v not_o for_o you_o suppose_v that_o may_v be_v possible_a more_o easy_a etc._n etc._n what_o be_v that_o to_o our_o purpose_n that_o be_v not_o matter_n of_o faith_n for_o faith_n do_v not_o stand_v teach_v metaphysical_a possibilitye_n or_o impossibilitye_n what_o may_v be_v or_o not_o be_v but_o what_o be_v or_o be_v not_o and_o which_o be_v chief_o to_o be_v consider_v though_o this_o author_n think_v 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that_o a_o man_n will_v think_v the_o bishop_n by_o your_o cite_v he_o to_o be_v quite_o of_o another_o mind_n than_o he_o be_v for_o you_o will_v make_v one_o think_v he_o do_v not_o believe_v the_o real_a presence_n can_v be_v prove_v out_o of_o scripture_n 4._o io._n roffen_n count_v captiu_fw-la babylo_n c._n 4._o whereas_o the_o 4._o chapter_n of_o the_o book_n here_o cite_v be_v whole_o employ_v in_o proof_n thereof_o against_o luther_n out_o of_o the_o very_a word_n hoc_fw-la est_fw-la corpus_fw-la meum_fw-la this_o be_v my_o body_n by_o which_o he_o destroy_v lutheran_n companation_n and_o consequent_o establish_v our_o transubstantiation_n and_o teach_v plain_o both_o there_o and_o throughout_o this_o whole_a book_n that_o christ_n himself_o do_v change_v the_o bread_n into_o his_o own_o body_n and_o this_o out_o of_o the_o very_a word_n of_o scripture_n but_o in_o this_o 10._o chapter_n which_o you_o cite_v he_o prove_v that_o the_o true_a sense_n of_o the_o
general_n council_n as_o be_v the_o parliament_n of_o christ_n his_o church_n to_o which_o he_o have_v promise_v his_o special_a assistance_n but_o this_o be_v by_o the_o way_n 3._o now_o out_o of_o this_o authority_n which_o you_o grant_v to_o those_o ancient_a counsel_n i_o go_v a_o little_a far_o with_o you_o and_o ask_v what_o you_o can_v say_v more_o against_o the_o present_a church_n and_o present_a council_n of_o trent_n then_o against_o the_o church_n of_o that_o time_n &_o counsel_n of_o those_o time_n whatsoever_o you_o can_v say_v of_o the_o church_n now_o that_o it_o may_v err_v may_v as_o well_o be_v say_v of_o the_o church_n of_o that_o tyme._n for_o our_o sauiour_n promise_n for_o the_o perpetuity_n &_o infallibility_n thereof_o be_v as_o much_o for_o one_o time_n as_o another_o for_o our_o time_n now_o as_o for_o those_o then_o what_o you_o say_v now_o of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n that_o it_o be_v disclaim_v by_o a_o great_a part_n of_o the_o christian_a world_n may_v be_v say_v much_o more_o of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a which_o be_v gain_v say_v both_o by_o more_o &_o other_o manner_n of_o man_n than_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n &_o the_o same_o may_v be_v also_o say_v of_o some_o of_o the_o rest_n &_o so_o forth_o of_o any_o thing_n else_o that_o you_o can_v object_v wherefore_o to_o conclude_v if_o it_o be_v not_o atheism_n to_o say_v then_o that_o by_o question_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o nicene_n decree_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o whole_a christian_a faith_n may_v be_v question_v i_o see_v not_o why_o it_o shall_v be_v atheism_n to_o say_v the_o same_o of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n but_o you_o think_v it_o be_v atheism_n to_o deny_v the_o scripture_n alone_o to_o be_v sufficient_a for_o that_o be_v the_o sense_n of_o your_o inference_n but_o it_o be_v far_o otherwise_o for_o all_o catholic_n say_v they_o be_v not_o so_o and_o yet_o they_o believe_v that_o there_o be_v a_o god_n and_o honour_n and_o worship_v he_o as_o 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it_o as_o you_o translate_v be_v far_o otherwise_o to_o wit_n that_o there_o be_v but_o only_o two_o sacrament_n in_o all_o for_o first_o you_o leave_v out_o the_o demonstrative_a pronoune_n haec_fw-la make_v the_o speech_n more_o general_a as_o if_o bessarion_n do_v say_v there_o be_v but_o two_o sacrament_n whereas_o he_o do_v not_o speak_v any_o thing_n that_o way_n in_o these_o word_n of_o the_o number_n of_o sacrament_n in_o general_a but_o restrain_v his_o speech_n to_o these_o two_o in_o particular_a which_o rather_o import_v that_o there_o be_v other_o sacrament_n for_o if_o one_o shall_v say_v these_o two_o man_n come_v this_o way_n or_o these_o two_o horse_n belong_v to_o i_o will_v not_o any_o man_n gather_v that_o there_o be_v more_o man_n beside_o those_o two_o that_o come_v this_o way_n and_o more_o horse_n beside_o those_o two_o that_o i_o say_v belong_v to_o i_o for_o otherwise_o it_o be_v needless_a to_o add_v this_o determine_n or_o distinguish_v pronoune_n these_o 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word_n he_o prove_v it_o by_o the_o example_n of_o other_o sacrament_n thus_o conse_n bessar_n de_fw-fr verb._n conse_n hunc_fw-la modum_fw-la &_o apostoli_fw-la a_o saluatore_fw-la ut_fw-la crâ—dendum_fw-la est_fw-la &_o ab_fw-la apostolis_n sanct_n patres_fw-la postea_fw-la sumente_n in_o singulis_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la sacramentis_fw-la quemadmodum_fw-la materiam_fw-la propriam_fw-la sine_fw-la qua_fw-la nullo_n modo_fw-la fieret_fw-la quod_fw-la proponitur_fw-la ita_fw-la etiam_fw-la propriam_fw-la formam_fw-la statuerunt_fw-la quod_fw-la manifestum_fw-la est_fw-la si_fw-la quis_fw-la ad_fw-la chrismatis_fw-la sacramentum_fw-la mentem_fw-la converterit_fw-la this_o manner_n the_o apostle_n receive_v from_o our_o saviour_n as_o it_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v and_o our_o holy_a father_n from_o they_o as_o in_o each_o sacrament_n they_o have_v appoint_v a_o proper_a matter_n without_o which_o that_o can_v be_v do_v which_o be_v purpose_v so_o also_o a_o certain_a form_n which_o be_v 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decree_n that_o the_o holy_a image_n of_o ss_z shall_v be_v have_v in_o church_n &_o worship_v with_o great_a veneration_n be_v to_o ignorant_a people_n in_o place_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n whereto_o also_o frankincense_n be_v offer_v and_o taper_n be_v light_v and_o there_o add_v 2._o or_o 3._o counsel_n more_o decree_a the_o same_o again_o he_o conclude_v thus_o ecquis_fw-la igitur_fw-la tam_fw-la dissolutus_fw-la tantaque_fw-la audacia_fw-la praeditus_fw-la est_fw-la qui_fw-la velit_fw-la possitue_a dubitare_fw-la seu_fw-la aliter_fw-la somniare_fw-la ne_fw-la dicam_fw-la sentire_fw-la vel_fw-la cogitare_fw-la de_fw-la imaginum_fw-la cultu_fw-la ac_fw-la demum_fw-la sit_fw-la tot_fw-la long_o sanctissimorum_fw-la patrum_fw-la decreto_fw-la constitutum_fw-la what_o man_n be_v there_o therefore_o so_o dissolute_a and_o endue_v with_o so_o much_o boldness_n who_o will_n or_o can_v doubt_v or_o otherwise_o dream_n that_o i_o may_v not_o say_v judge_n or_o think_v of_o the_o worship_n of_o image_n then_o at_o last_o have_v be_v approve_v by_o the_o decree_n of_o so_o many_o most_o holy_a father_n thus_o far_o polydore_n to_o who_o demand_n why_o may_v not_o i_o answer_v that_o sir_n humphrey_n line_v be_v the_o man_n so_o dissolute_a and_o audacious_a that_o dare_v not_o only_a dream_n but_o wake_v with_o all_o his_o wit_n and_o sense_n that_o he_o have_v about_o he_o and_o speak_v and_o write_v dare_v i_o say_v not_o only_o doubt_v of_o but_o absolute_o deny_v the_o lawfulness_n of_o the_o worship_n of_o image_n and_o not_o only_o this_o but_o even_o to_o bring_v thou_o o_o polydore_n virgil_n to_o witness_v with_o he_o against_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o all_o the_o ancient_a father_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n condemn_v the_o same_o what_o will_v this_o author_n say_v to_o you_o sir_n humphrey_n if_o he_o be_v alive_a to_o see_v himself_o abuse_v by_o you_o and_o which_o be_v yet_o more_o even_o after_o dr._n white_n be_v convict_v of_o this_o dissolutenes_n and_o audaciousnes_n yet_o you_o will_v be_v at_o it_o again_o hereby_o a_o man_n may_v see_v there_o need_v no_o other_o confutation_n but_o only_a right_n cite_v of_o your_o own_o author_n 17._o for_o peresius_n his_o word_n be_v nothing_o against_o we_o for_o they_o touch_v only_o upon_o a_o school_n point_n whether_o the_o picture_n be_v to_o be_v adore_v with_o the_o same_o worship_n as_o the_o prototype_n or_o thing_n represent_v or_o with_o a_o inferior_a worship_n the_o former_a opinion_n only_o he_o deni_v because_o say_v he_o there_o be_v neither_o proof_n out_o of_o scripture_n tradition_n of_o the_o church_n common_a consent_n of_o father_n or_o determination_n of_o a_o general_a council_n which_o very_a say_n of_o he_o be_v enough_o to_o condemn_v you_o who_o will_v not_o acknowledge_v sufficient_a authority_n in_o tradition_n father_n or_o council_n to_o believe_v a_o thing_n which_o you_o like_v not_o but_o to_o make_v it_o plain_o appear_v how_o much_o you_o wrong_v peresius_n in_o bring_v he_o against_o the_o worship_n of_o image_n i_o will_v bring_v a_o place_n 2._o leaf_n before_o that_o which_o you_o cite_v out_o of_o he_o it_o be_v this_o manifest_a habes_fw-la etc._n etc._n imag_n peres_n de_fw-fr tradit_fw-la cap._n the_o imag_n it_o be_v manifest_a that_o the_o use_n and_o worship_n of_o image_n have_v be_v universal_o in_o the_o church_n from_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o that_o the_o disesteem_v of_o they_o begin_v from_o forlorn_a and_o infamous_a man_n 500_o year_n after_o the_o church_n be_v plant_v and_o true_o if_o the_o worship_n and_o reverence_n be_v do_v devout_o and_o sincere_o this_o institution_n be_v holy_a and_o profitable_a which_o both_o apostolic_a tradition_n have_v introduce_v the_o use_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n affirm_v the_o consent_n of_o very_o famous_a and_o general_a counsel_n both_o in_o the_o east_n and_o west_n be_v add_v thereto_o which_o also_o even_o natural_a reason_n do_v dictate_v thus_o far_o be_v peresius_n his_o own_o word_n whereby_o any_o man_n may_v see_v whether_o sir_n humphrey_n you_o deal_v well_o with_o he_o or_o not_o to_o pretend_v his_o authority_n against_o our_o use_n and_o worship_n of_o image_n pp_n agobard_fw-mi de_fw-mi pick_v &_o imaginib_fw-la in_o bibl_a pp_n 18._o now_o for_o agobardus_n who_o you_o seem_v to_o make_v great_a acount_n of_o if_o you_o consider_v he_o a_o little_a better_a you_o will_v find_v little_a cause_n he_o write_v indeed_o a_o book_n de_fw-fr picturis_fw-la &_o imaginibus_fw-la the_o whole_a drift_n whereof_o be_v only_o against_o the_o idolatrical_a use_n or_o abuse_v of_o image_n against_o which_o he_o speak_v very_o much_o by_o occasion_n of_o some_o abuse_n in_o his_o time_n as_o it_o be_v meet_v he_o and_o every_o good_a man_n shall_v and_o for_o the_o same_o end_n he_o bring_v many_o authoritye_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n all_o which_o speak_v plain_o against_o idolatry_n and_o likewise_o he_o bring_v that_o canon_n of_o the_o council_n of_o eliberis_n which_o you_o bring_v out_o of_o he_o that_o no_o picture_n shall_v be_v paint_v on_o the_o wall_n understand_v it_o in_o the_o same_o sense_n which_o i_o allege_v in_o my_o second_o answer_n to_o that_o canon_n before_o to_o wit_n for_o avoid_v superstition_n in_o some_o young_a and_o unexperienced_a christian_n convert_v from_o gentility_n but_o for_o those_o word_n which_o follow_v in_o your_o citation_n of_o he_o to_o wit_n these_o there_o be_v no_o example_n in_o all_o the_o scripture_n or_o father_n for_o adoration_n of_o image_n i_o do_v not_o find_v they_o in_o he_o this_o i_o be_o sure_a of_o that_o they_o be_v not_o join_v with_o the_o former_a as_o you_o here_o join_v they_o thus_o indeed_o he_o say_v in_o a_o certain_a place_n habuerunt_fw-la antiqui_fw-la sanctorum_fw-la imagine_v vel_fw-la pictas_fw-la vel_fw-la sculptas_fw-la sed_fw-la causa_fw-la historiae_fw-la ad_fw-la
you_o see_v his_o meaning_n to_o be_v absolute_o to_o condemn_v idol-worship_n and_o approve_v image-worship_n neither_o do_v your_o note_n of_o the_o greek_a word_n in_o the_o margin_n in_o proof_n that_o s._n peter_n speak_v of_o idol-worship_n avail_v you_o for_o val._n speak_v only_o of_o the_o latin_a word_n which_o be_v more_o indifferent_a and_o in_o some_o author_n signify_v the_o same_o that_o imago_fw-la and_o even_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d though_o it_o be_v now_o by_o the_o use_n of_o father_n counsel_n and_o doctor_n determine_v to_o signify_v a_o empty_a or_o vain_a image_n of_o a_o thing_n which_o be_v not_o according_a to_o that_o of_o s._n paul_n idolum_fw-la nihil_fw-la est_fw-la in_o mundo_fw-la a_o idol_n be_v nothing_o in_o the_o world_n 7.4_o cor._n 7.4_o yet_o if_o a_o man_n respect_v the_o primitive_a signification_n or_o etymology_n it_o may_v perhaps_o be_v take_v more_o indifferent_o for_o it_o come_v from_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d which_o signify_v species_n or_o forma_fw-la the_o seem_a shape_n or_o beauty_n of_o a_o thing_n or_o person_n but_o it_o be_v true_a that_o in_o the_o signification_n of_o word_n we_o must_v follow_v the_o ecclesiastical_a rule_n neither_o do_v i_o allow_v valencia_n his_o use_n of_o the_o word_n simulachrum_fw-la and_o explication_n of_o s._n peter_n text_n or_o even_o his_o argument_n draw_v from_o thence_o though_o the_o point_n of_o doctrine_n which_o he_o defend_v be_v true_a to_o wit_n image-worship_n but_o this_o be_v to_o show_v you_o how_o he_o may_v use_v the_o word_n harmeles_o especial_o declare_v himself_o plain_o by_o other_o word_n though_o for_o you_o to_o stand_v trifle_v &_o contend_v about_o word_n when_o you_o see_v his_o meaning_n be_v a_o sign_n of_o your_o want_n of_o matter_n but_o here_o by_o the_o way_n i_o can_v but_o note_v how_o to_o urge_v the_o matter_n more_o against_o valentia_n you_o run_v yourself_o upon_o the_o rock_n for_o you_o observe_v that_o the_o word_n use_v by_o saint_n peter_n in_o that_o place_n signify_v idol-worship_n not_o image-worship_n wherein_o you_o seem_v plain_o to_o confess_v that_o image-worship_n and_o idol-worship_n and_o consequent_o a_o image_n and_o a_o idol_n be_v not_o all_o one_o whereby_o as_o you_o think_v to_o advantage_v you_o self_n in_o this_o place_n against_o the_o jesuit_n so_o you_o do_v not_o mark_v that_o herein_o you_o contradict_v your_o self_n and_o the_o whole_a currant_n of_o your_o own_o doctor_n who_o chief_a argument_n against_o image_n be_v certain_a place_n of_o scripture_n against_o idol_n which_o you_o also_o bring_v before_o for_o if_o a_o image_n &_o a_o idol_n be_v not_o all_o one_o then_o be_v all_o your_o argument_n nothing_o worth_a or_o if_o they_o be_v then_o be_v valentia_n argument_n good_a choose_v which_o you_o will_n and_o therefore_o if_o you_o cast_v up_o your_o count_n aright_o you_o will_v find_v you_o have_v lose_v more_o than_o you_o have_v gain_v by_o this_o citation_n of_o valencia_n 15._o a_o five_o point_n of_o uncertainty_n you_o deliver_v in_o these_o word_n concern_v the_o two_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n and_o the_o eucharist_n it_o be_v most_o evident_a say_v bellarmine_n but_o concern_v the_o rest_n of_o the_o sacrament_n it_o be_v not_o so_o certain_a and_o out_o of_o canus_n you_o say_v the_o divine_n speak_v so_o uncertaine_o of_o the_o matter_n and_o form_n of_o matrimony_n that_o they_o do_v not_o resolve_v whether_o it_o give_v grace_n or_o no_o thus_o you_o sir_n humphrey_n to_o which_o i_o answer_v that_o for_o the_o place_n of_o bellarm._n you_o be_v convince_v before_o of_o manifest_a corruption_n for_o whereas_o bellarm._n say_v it_o be_v certain_a fine_a cap._n 9_o §._o 4._o in_o fine_a but_o not_o so_o manifest_v you_o leave_v out_o not_o manifest_a and_o change_v certain_a into_o not_o certain_a beside_o what_o be_v that_o which_o bellarmine_n say_v be_v not_o manifest_v but_o certain_a that_o these_o two_o be_v sacrament_n the_o rest_n not_o noe_o such_o matter_n sir_n knight_n it_o be_v their_o signification_n which_o he_o speak_v of_o &_o yet_o not_o their_o signification_n of_o grace_n which_o they_o cause_n but_o their_o signify_v of_o the_o passion_n of_o christ_n which_o be_v the_o beginning_n and_o aeternal_a life_n which_o be_v the_o end_n of_o the_o grace_n give_v by_o the_o sacrament_n this_o signification_n he_o say_v be_v certain_a but_o not_o so_o evident_a in_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o sacrament_n for_o canus_n you_o corrupt_v he_o as_o foul_o also_o for_o first_o you_o join_v two_o several_a place_n together_o as_o if_o they_o be_v but_o one_o in_o canus_n himself_o &_o then_o make_v he_o say_v that_o the_o divine_n do_v not_o resolve_v whether_o it_o that_o be_v matrimony_n give_v grace_n or_o no_o which_o be_v most_o flat_o false_a for_o as_o i_o show_v before_o he_o grant_v it_o with_o all_o divine_n to_o be_v proper_o a_o sacrament_n his_o two_o place_n several_o be_v thus_o the_o divine_n speak_v so_o diverse_o of_o the_o matter_n &_o form_n of_o matrimony_n that_o it_o be_v folly_n for_o a_o man_n to_o resolve_v any_o thing_n certain_a this_o be_v one_o whereof_o i_o speak_v more_o before_o &_o show_v that_o his_o meaning_n be_v not_o to_o say_v that_o it_o be_v not_o certain_a whither_o it_o be_v a_o sacrament_n or_o not_o or_o whither_o it_o have_v a_o matter_n and_o form_n 4._o cap._n 9_o §._o 4._o for_o that_o i_o show_v to_o be_v most_o certain_a and_o by_o most_o express_a word_n of_o his_o own_o but_o that_o no_o man_n can_v say_v determinate_o which_o be_v the_o matter_n and_o which_o the_o form_n which_o as_o bellarmine_n say_v well_o be_v not_o so_o necessary_a for_o we_o to_o know_v but_o that_o without_o it_o we_o may_v and_o aught_o to_o acknowledge_v a_o true_a sacrament_n it_o be_v enough_o to_o know_v what_o be_v requisite_a for_o celebrate_v a_o true_a sacrament_n and_o what_o those_o thing_n be_v without_o which_o it_o be_v not_o a_o sacrament_n though_o we_o do_v not_o know_v which_o of_o those_o thing_n be_v the_o matter_n &_o which_o the_o form_n for_o example_n if_o a_o priest_n in_o baptism_n use_v true_a water_n and_o the_o right_a word_n he_o do_v administer_v a_o true_a sacrament_n though_o he_o shall_v not_o know_v which_o be_v the_o matter_n and_o which_o the_o form_n nay_o though_o he_o shall_v think_v the_o word_n to_o be_v the_o matter_n and_o water_v the_o form_n though_o the_o clean_a contrary_n be_v truth_n the_o other_o place_n of_o canus_n be_v that_o he_o say_v that_o matrimony_n contract_v without_o a_o priest_n be_v no_o sacrament_n because_o in_o his_o opinion_n the_o word_n which_o the_o priest_n speak_v be_v the_o form_n and_o of_o that_o kind_n of_o matrimony_n he_o consequent_o deni_v it_o to_o give_v grace_n but_o of_o matrimony_n absolute_o and_o as_o it_o be_v use_v in_o the_o catholic_a church_n he_o never_o make_v doubt_n see_v before_o his_o word_n 16._o the_o last_o matter_n of_o uncertainty_n be_v of_o our_o tradition_n which_o you_o say_v you_o be_v uncertain_a whereas_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v to_o give_v we_o certainty_n for_o this_o say_n you_o allege_v no_o catholic_n true_o nor_o false_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v count_v of_o be_v so_o manifest_o false_a for_o whence_o have_v we_o the_o certainty_n of_o the_o very_a scripture_n themselves_o but_o by_o tradition_n and_o much_o more_o of_o the_o sense_n and_o meaning_n of_o the_o scripture_n beside_o as_o i_o have_v often_o say_v and_o show_v this_o your_o prime_a principle_n be_v not_o only_o false_a but_o contrary_a to_o express_v scripture_n and_o contrary_a to_o the_o common_a consent_n of_o all_o father_n which_o the_o reader_n may_v see_v in_o whole_a treatise_n write_v hereof_o wherefore_o to_o come_v to_o a_o end_n of_o this_o your_o section_n of_o certainty_n we_o find_v nothing_o in_o matter_n of_o faith_n uncertain_a in_o the_o catholic_a church_n nothing_o certain_a on_o your_o side_n but_o only_o that_o you_o be_v always_o and_o every_o where_o sir_n humphrey_n line_v of_o the_o 11._o sect._n entitle_v thus_o 11._o chap._n 11._o the_o testimony_n of_o our_o adversary_n touch_v the_o great_a safety_n comfort_n and_o benefit_n of_o the_o soul_n in_o the_o protestant_a faith_n then_o in_o the_o romish_a chapter_n xi_o 1._o from_z certainty_n you_o come_v to_o safety_n whereof_o you_o need_v not_o have_v make_v so_o distinct_a mention_n and_o proof_n it_o follow_v necessary_o and_o manifest_o that_o that_o faith_n which_o be_v most_o certain_a in_o itself_o be_v also_o most_o safe_a for_o man_n to_o follow_v as_o also_o it_o can_v be_v safe_a without_o certainty_n wherefore_o as_o you_o be_v not_o able_a to_o prove_v it_o certain_a in_o your_o former_a
section_n so_o be_v you_o not_o able_a to_o prove_v it_o safe_a in_o this_o wherein_o notwitstanding_o we_o must_v hear_v a_o little_a what_o you_o say_v and_o first_o i_o wonder_v you_o talk_v still_o so_o much_o of_o prove_v the_o safety_n and_o comfort_n of_o your_o faith_n out_o of_o our_o author_n when_o you_o can_v name_v that_o man_n that_o say_v any_o such_o word_n for_o suppose_v you_o find_v one_o author_n or_o two_o of_o we_o that_o say_v something_o different_a from_o the_o common_a opinion_n in_o this_o or_o that_o particular_a point_n of_o doctrine_n do_v he_o present_o say_v the_o protestant_a faith_n be_v safe_a for_o example_n one_o say_v communion_n in_o both_o kind_n of_o itself_o give_v more_o gtace_n do_v he_o therefore_o say_v your_o faith_n be_v safe_a noe_o very_o but_o the_o same_o man_n do_v condemn_v your_o doctrine_n for_o most_o unsafe_a and_o dangerous_a and_o lead_v to_o the_o very_a pit_n of_o hell_n for_o even_o those_o thing_n which_o of_o themselves_o 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be_v less_o subject_n to_o the_o cut_a knife_n of_o haeretique_n which_o make_v they_o so_o mad_a at_o they_o for_o they_o can_v so_o corrupt_v they_o by_o put_v in_o and_o out_o at_o their_o pleasure_n as_o they_o can_v do_v the_o write_a word_n and_o this_o indeed_o seem_v the_o safe_a way_n in_o vincentius_n lerinensis_n his_o day_n for_o he_o be_v desirous_a to_o learn_v how_o he_o may_v discern_v catholic_a truth_n from_o haeretical_a falsehood_n receive_v this_o answer_n from_o every_o body_n as_o he_o say_v that_o if_o he_o will_v avoid_v the_o deceit_n and_o snare_n of_o haeretique_n and_o remain_v sound_a in_o faith_n he_o shall_v strengthen_v his_o faith_n two_o way_n to_o wit_n by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o divine_a law_n and_o then_o by_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n whereby_o you_o see_v the_o judgement_n of_o antiquity_n concern_v your_o safety_n and_o we_o 3._o again_o you_o say_v it_o be_v safe_a to_o adore_v christ_n sit_v at_o the_o right_a 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adore_v he_o in_o heaven_n too_o as_o well_o as_o you_o how_o be_v you_o more_o safe_a than_o we_o yea_o but_o you_o will_v say_v that_o we_o adore_v he_o on_o the_o altar_n too_o it_o be_v true_a we_o do_v indeed_o and_o to_o suppose_v it_o doubtful_a for_o the_o present_a whether_o he_o be_v there_o or_o no_o i_o ask_v wherein_o be_v you_o more_o safe_a than_o we_o if_o he_o be_v not_o there_o we_o be_v in_o danger_n of_o adore_v he_o where_o he_o be_v not_o if_o he_o be_v there_o then_o be_v you_o in_o danger_n by_o not_o adore_v he_o where_o he_o be_v and_o it_o be_v as_o much_o danger_n not_o to_o adore_v he_o there_o if_o he_o be_v there_o as_o not_o to_o adore_v he_o in_o heaven_n wherein_o i_o say_v then_o be_v you_o more_o safe_a though_o there_o be_v no_o more_o certainty_n of_o belief_n on_o our_o side_n then_o you_o 4._o three_o you_o tell_v we_o out_o of_o s._n aug._n it_o be_v more_o safe_a to_o trust_v whole_o in_o god_n then_o partly_o in_o god_n partly_o in_o ourselves_o so_o we_o say_v also_o and_o so_o we_o do_v wherein_o then_o be_v you_o more_o or_o we_o less_o safe_a you_o say_v we_o trust_v in_o our_o good_a work_n it_o be_v true_a thus_o far_o that_o we_o teach_v that_o man_n by_o good_a work_n may_v cooperate_v to_o justification_n merit_v grace_n and_o glory_n but_o that_o be_v but_o conditional_o if_o a_o man_n do_v such_o good_a work_n but_o yet_o we_o be_v far_o from_o nourish_v your_o confidence_n which_o you_o speak_v of_o which_o be_v not_o ground_v so_o much_o in_o that_o general_a principle_n of_o good_a work_n as_o in_o the_o particular_a that_o i_o for_o example_n do_v these_o and_o these_o good_a work_n wherefore_o i_o say_v it_o be_v false_a in_o your_o sense_n for_o we_o do_v not_o teach_v any_o man_n to_o persuade_v himself_o that_o he_o be_v just_a and_o holy_a but_o teach_v he_o to_o fear_n and_o doubt_v himself_o continual_o and_o in_o all_o his_o work_n according_a to_o the_o example_n of_o job._n verebar_fw-la omne_fw-la opera_fw-la mea_fw-la i_o do_v fear_v all_o my_o work_n and_o if_o a_o man_n do_v good_a work_n we_o teach_v that_o he_o can_v be_v sure_a that_o they_o be_v good_a as_o they_o be_v do_v by_o he_o that_o be_v that_o he_o do_v they_o with_o such_o a_o right_a intention_n and_o by_o help_n of_o supernatural_a grace_n and_o that_o therefore_o no_o man_n can_v be_v sure_a of_o his_o own_o justification_n according_a to_o that_o alsoe_o of_o job._n 9.28_o job_n 9.28_o etsi_fw-la fuero_fw-la simplex_fw-la hoc_fw-la ipsum_fw-la ignorabit_fw-la anima_fw-la mea_fw-la although_o i_o shall_v be_v simple_a that_o be_v good_a the_o self_n same_o shall_v my_o soul_n be_v ignorant_a of_o 9.21_o job_n 9.21_o again_o we_o say_v
that_o it_o be_v the_o image_n of_o a_o man_n he_o know_v not_o who_o which_o if_o it_o have_v be_v christ_n or_o any_o saint_n he_o will_v have_v know_v who_o it_o be_v neither_o will_v he_o have_v call_v the_o image_n of_o christ_n or_o any_o saint_n the_o image_n of_o a_o man_n and_o then_o he_o make_v a_o comparison_n or_o likeness_n between_o the_o hang_n of_o that_o picture_n and_o the_o picture_n of_o christ_n or_o some_o saint_n which_o show_v plain_o both_o that_o it_o be_v not_o christ_n nor_o any_o saint_n and_o also_o that_o it_o be_v the_o custom_n to_o hang_v the_o image_n of_o christ_n and_o his_o saint_n in_o the_o church_n it_o be_v also_o a_o idle_a senseless_a expression_n of_o you_o when_o you_o say_v a_o veil_n represent_v the_o image_n of_o christ_n for_o the_o veil_n be_v not_o the_o picture_n of_o a_o picture_n and_o therefore_o do_v not_o represent_v the_o image_n but_o represent_v the_o man_n you_o leave_v alsoe_o out_o those_o word_n nescio_fw-la cvius_fw-la 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tradition_n thus_o from_o whence_o be_v this_o tradition_n for_o the_o lord_n command_v we_o to_o do_v those_o thing_n which_o be_v write_v to_o which_o you_o say_v bellarmine_n make_v answer_n that_o s._n cyprian_n write_v thus_o when_o he_o think_v to_o defend_v his_o own_o error_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v no_o marvel_n if_o he_o err_v in_o so_o reason_v it_o be_v true_a sir_n humphrey_n bellarmine_n make_v this_o answer_n and_o it_o be_v a_o very_a good_a one_o and_o of_o itself_o do_v serve_v the_o turn_n for_o it_o be_v most_o true_a that_o s._n cyprian_n there_o write_v in_o defence_n of_o rebaptisation_n which_o he_o maintain_v and_o because_o he_o see_v it_o can_v not_o be_v impugn_a by_o the_o write_a word_n but_o only_o by_o unwritten_a tradition_n which_o s._n stephen_n pope_n then_o urge_v against_o he_o he_o reject_v that_o tradition_n and_o flee_v to_o scripture_n wherein_o the_o badness_n of_o his_o cause_n put_v he_o to_o that_o hard_a shift_n for_o proof_n whereof_o i_o will_v but_o only_o ask_v you_o whether_o you_o think_v s._n cyprian_n be_v then_o in_o a_o error_n or_o not_o i_o presume_v you_o will_v not_o deny_v but_o he_o be_v otherwise_o you_o must_v grant_v that_o we_o may_v baptize_v such_o as_o have_v be_v baptize_v in_o your_o church_n and_o be_v convert_v to_o we_o or_o that_o you_o must_v baptize_v such_o of_o we_o as_o fall_v to_o you_o because_o you_o may_v say_v you_o be_v no_o haeresy_n but_o rather_o we_o but_o whether_o soever_o you_o say_v of_o these_o two_o you_o i_o suppose_v will_v not_o nor_o indeed_o can_v grant_v rebaptisation_n for_o it_o be_v contrary_a to_o your_o belief_n &_o practice_n well_o then_o it_o be_v a_o error_n likewise_o this_o error_n be_v not_o otherwise_o maintain_v but_o by_o denial_n of_o unwritten_a tradition_n and_o can_v be_v overthrow_v but_o by_o hold_v they_o and_o therefore_o it_o must_v follow_v of_o necessity_n that_o it_o be_v a_o error_n to_o deny_v tradition_n or_o thus_o if_o this_o 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and_o worthy_o to_o communicate_v where_o first_o you_o wrong_v bellarmine_n in_o strain_v his_o word_n to_o the_o worst_a sense_n and_o as_o i_o may_v say_v true_o mistranslating_a they_o for_o whereas_o he_o say_v that_o s._n chrysostome_n speak_v this_o by_o excess_n per_fw-la excessum_fw-la be_v his_o word_n you_o say_v by_o exceed_v the_o truth_n which_o be_v false_a for_o it_o be_v not_o all_o one_o to_o say_v that_o a_o man_n speak_v by_o excess_n and_o by_o exceed_v the_o truth_n for_o there_o be_v a_o figure_n in_o rhetoric_n call_v hyperbole_n or_o excess_n which_o whosoever_o use_v be_v not_o say_v present_o to_o exceed_v the_o truth_n or_o speak_v untruel_o as_o you_o will_v make_v bellar._n say_v of_o s._n chrysost_o but_o only_o to_o speak_v by_o hyperbole_n or_o excess_n wherein_o the_o intent_n of_o the_o speaker_n be_v not_o to_o be_v take_v so_o precise_o to_o the_o utmost_a of_o his_o word_n but_o with_o a_o grain_n of_o salt_n as_o we_o say_v because_o by_o that_o 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all_o man_n as_o the_o article_n of_o the_o apostle_n creed_n and_o the_o ten_o commandment_n and_o some_o sacrament_n for_o the_o creed_n belong_v to_o faith_n the_o commandment_n and_o sacrament_n to_o manner_n for_o bellarmine_n speak_v here_o not_o only_o what_o be_v necessary_a for_o all_o man_n to_o believe_v but_o what_o be_v necessary_a for_o all_o man_n to_o do_v for_o obtain_v of_o salvation_n according_a to_o that_o commission_n of_o our_o saviour_n to_o his_o apostle_n go_v teach_v all_o nation_n baptise_v they_o in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o father_n and_o of_o the_o son_n and_o of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n teach_v they_o to_o observe_v whatsoever_o i_o have_v command_v you_o 6._o i_o do_v not_o say_v that_o we_o be_v not_o to_o believe_v these_o thing_n also_o for_o we_o can_v practice_v they_o unless_o we_o know_v they_o and_o some_o we_o can_v know_v otherwise_o then_o by_o faith_n the_o commandment_n indeed_o be_v principle_n of_o reason_n draw_v even_o from_o the_o very_a 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own_o and_o leave_v out_o some_o of_o he_o i_o may_v tax_v you_o with_o corrupt_v his_o meaning_n for_o your_o own_o purpose_n for_o by_o say_v that_o the_o explicit_a belief_n of_o these_o thing_n be_v necessary_a for_o all_o he_o do_v not_o mean_a as_o you_o will_v have_v he_o that_o it_o be_v free_a for_o any_o man_n to_o choose_v whether_o he_o will_v believe_v any_o thing_n else_o of_o those_o which_o the_o apostle_n preach_v for_o that_o be_v most_o false_a neither_o be_v it_o his_o meaning_n though_o he_o say_v those_o thing_n be_v necessary_a that_o therefore_o they_o alone_o be_v sufficient_a for_o all_o man_n and_o that_o no_o man_n be_v bind_v to_o know_v or_o believe_v explicit_o also_o any_o thing_n more_o for_o without_o question_v those_o thing_n which_o the_o apostle_n teach_v to_o praelat_n bishop_n and_o priest_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v by_o they_o explicit_o wherefore_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o apostle_n creed_n the_o ten_o comandment_n and_o some_o few_o 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faith_n therefore_o there_o be_v no_o cause_n to_o rank_n you_o with_o haeretique_n for_o this_o cognizance_n be_v not_o sufficient_a for_o a_o arrian_n with_o out_o the_o explication_n thereof_o in_o the_o nicene_n creed_n as_o may_v be_v gather_v out_o of_o theodoret_n before_o cite_v and_o so_o may_v i_o now_o say_v it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o distinguish_v a_o catholic_n from_o a_o lutheran_n caluinist_n protestant_n or_o other_o haeretique_n of_o these_o time_n without_o the_o explication_n of_o the_o trent_n profession_n of_o faith_n for_o this_o be_v now_o the_o touchstone_n to_o try_v who_o believe_v the_o apostle_n creed_n in_o deed_n and_o who_o in_o word_n only_o and_o this_o yourself_o must_v confess_v who_o term_v some_o sect_n haeretique_n and_o we_o catholic_n idolater_n nowithstand_v we_o and_o they_o profess_v the_o apostle_n creed_n which_o you_o call_v the_o cognizance_n of_o our_o faith_n 8._o now_o to_o that_o which_o you_o say_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o you_o be_v sister_n and_o that_o the_o roman_a play_v the_o harlott_n you_o go_v out_o of_o she_o i_o answer_v that_o this_o be_v so_o far_o from_o clear_v you_o from_o the_o note_n of_o haeresy_n that_o it_o do_v rather_o make_v you_o more_o guilty_a thereof_o your_o church_n indeed_o come_v out_o of_o we_o as_o all_o haeretical_a sect_n have_v ever_o come_v out_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n for_o so_o say_v s._n john_n of_o haeretique_n ex_fw-la nobis_fw-la prodierunt_fw-la sed_fw-la non_fw-la erant_fw-la ex_fw-la nobis_fw-la nam_fw-la si_fw-la fuissent_fw-la ex_fw-la nobis_fw-la permansissent_fw-la utique_fw-la nobiscum_fw-la sed_fw-la ut_fw-la manifesti_fw-la sint_fw-la quoniam_fw-la non_fw-la sunt_fw-la omnes_fw-la ex_fw-la nobis_fw-la 2.19_o 1._o io._n 2.19_o they_o go_v out_o of_o we_o but_o they_o be_v not_o of_o we_o for_o if_o they_o have_v be_v of_o we_o they_o will_v very_o have_v stay_v with_o we_o but_o that_o they_o may_v be_v manifest_a that_o they_o be_v not_o 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this_o prove_a succession_n of_o pastor_n in_o his_o church_n 4._o chap._n 4._o without_o which_o no_o church_n can_v be_v visible_a it_o be_v clear_a it_o do_v not_o but_o because_o this_o be_v a_o general_a fault_n throughout_o his_o whole_a book_n i_o will_v not_o stand_v note_v it_o in_o every_o section_n apart_o but_o this_o general_a note_n may_v serve_v for_o all_o to_o begin_v here_o with_o the_o title_n of_o this_o section_n if_o by_o popery_n he_o understand_v as_o i_o suppose_v he_o do_v that_o faith_n which_o we_o catholic_n profess_v under_o the_o pope_n as_o our_o supreme_a pastor_n than_o it_o be_v foolish_o say_v of_o he_o that_o some_o have_v renounce_v the_o same_o in_o part_n for_o no_o man_n can_v renounce_v the_o catholic_a faith_n in_o part_n it_o be_v indivisible_a but_o he_o that_o cease_v to_o believe_v one_o point_n cease_v to_o believe_v any_o one_o as_o he_o shall_v that_o be_v by_o way_n of_o true_a divine_a faith_n 2._o now_o to_o prove_v what_o he_o 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gentile_n do_v do_v not_o this_o answer_n you_o sir_n humphrey_n do_v you_o not_o here_o find_v a_o difference_n between_o that_o worship_n and_o we_o between_o idolatry_n and_o religion_n between_o their_o adore_v the_o creature_n of_o wood_n and_o colour_n in_o place_n of_o the_o creator_n and_o our_o adore_v the_o creator_n represent_v by_o the_o creature_n between_o their_o adoration_n of_o idolatrous_a damn_a philosopher_n and_o our_o worship_n of_o the_o bless_a saint_n and_o servant_n of_o god_n live_v with_o he_o in_o glory_n this_o be_v too_o too_o gross_a for_o such_o a_o subtle_a knight_n as_o you_o be_v now_o for_o proof_n of_o your_o doctrine_n by_o succession_n from_o the_o 2._o commandment_n it_o be_v ridiculous_a to_o call_v it_o succession_n though_o you_o take_v the_o place_n of_o scripture_n in_o the_o true_a sense_n as_o you_o do_v not_o for_o how_o do_v your_o doctrine_n succeed_v the_o commandment_n a_o man_n may_v prove_v his_o doctrine_n out_o of_o scripture_n 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not_o to_o the_o laity_n of_o which_o i_o shall_v have_v occasion_n to_o speak_v again_o afterward_o 10._o but_o to_o come_v to_o a_o end_n of_o this_o matter_n the_o knight_n draw_v our_o invocation_n of_o saint_n and_o angel_n from_o the_o angelici_fw-la our_o work_n of_o supererogation_n from_o the_o cathari_n our_o worship_n of_o the_o b._n virgin_n from_o the_o collyridian_n our_o forbid_v priest_n to_o marry_v from_o tatianus_n and_o the_o manichee_n who_o he_o say_v forbid_v it_o in_o their_o priest_n put_v down_o the_o latin_a word_n in_o sacerdotibus_fw-la as_o if_o those_o special_a word_n be_v in_o s._n epiphanius_n who_o he_o cit_v but_o this_o serve_v for_o nothing_o chron_n v._o gual_n chron_n but_o to_o show_v the_o man_n shamelessness_n more_o and_o more_o for_o the_o angelici_fw-la they_o be_v heretic_n swerve_v from_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o catholic_a faith_n by_o excess_n that_o be_v honour_v angel_n more_o than_o their_o dew_n or_o more_o than_o creature_n as_o 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begin_n to_o the_o end_n he_o name_v sometime_o one_o only_a man_n or_o time_n for_o the_o whole_a 1500._o year_n sometime_o not_o so_o much_o as_o one_o man_n but_o only_o a_o bare_a place_n of_o scripture_n corrupt_v or_o misinterpret_v which_o what_o succession_n it_o may_v make_v let_v any_o indifferent_a man_n be_v judge_v wherein_o it_o seem_v the_o very_a guiltiness_n of_o his_o own_o conscience_n do_v make_v he_o misdoubt_v a_o little_a that_o he_o have_v not_o sufficient_o perform_v his_o promise_n as_o may_v be_v gather_v out_o of_o these_o word_n of_o he_o if_o i_o have_v fail_v in_o calculate_v the_o right_a nativity_n of_o their_o ancient_a doctrine_n etc._n etc._n but_o for_o all_o that_o he_o say_v he_o be_v sure_a that_o we_o be_v utter_o destitute_a of_o a_o right_a succession_n in_o person_n and_o doctrine_n from_o the_o apostle_n and_o ancient_a father_n as_o he_o say_v shall_v appear_v by_o many_o testimony_n of_o the_o best_a learned_a among_o us._n but_o the_o 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pope_n one_o succeed_v the_o other_o in_o place_n and_o office_n exercise_v the_o same_o authority_n and_o jurisdiction_n in_o the_o sight_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n now_o out_o of_o this_o personal_a succession_n we_o catholic_n draw_v a_o most_o firm_a argument_n of_o succession_n in_o faith_n and_o belief_n as_o he_o call_v it_o as_o the_o holy_a father_n have_v ever_o do_v against_o heretic_n of_o their_o time_n which_o so_o long_o as_o it_o stand_v good_a it_o be_v in_o vain_a for_o sir_n humphrey_n and_o such_o man_n to_o cry_v out_o that_o we_o have_v no_o succession_n in_o doctrine_n let_v they_o show_v when_o where_o in_o what_o pope_n time_n and_o by_o who_o it_o be_v interrupt_v or_o break_v of_o or_o else_o they_o say_v nothing_o and_o so_o leave_v he_o to_o find_v that_o out_o i_o pass_v to_o another_o section_n 8._o chap._n 8._o of_o the_o 8._o section_n entitle_v thus_o the_o testimony_n of_o our_o adversary_n touch_v the_o antiquity_n and_o universality_n of_o the_o protestant_a faith_n in_o general_n chapter_n viii_o 1._o the_o title_n of_o this_o section_n promise_v much_o and_o the_o beginning_n of_o the_o section_n itself_o much_o more_o for_o in_o it_o he_o say_v that_o if_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n do_v not_o plain_o confess_v the_o antiquity_n of_o his_o church_n his_o tenet_n and_o the_o novelty_n of_o her_o own_o if_o she_o do_v not_o proclaim_v the_o universality_n of_o the_o protestant_a faith_n and_o confess_v it_o both_o more_o certain_a and_o safe_a he_o will_v neither_o refuse_v the_o name_n nor_o punishment_n dew_n to_o haeresy_n which_o how_o bold_a and_o unlikely_a a_o adventure_n it_o be_v i_o presume_v there_o be_v no_o man_n of_o judgement_n be_v he_o never_o so_o much_o friend_n even_o to_o sir_n humphrey_n himself_o that_o do_v not_o at_o the_o very_a first_o sight_n perceive_v how_o shameless_a and_o impudent_a it_o be_v i_o doubt_v not_o but_o upon_o a_o little_a examination_n i_o halbee_n able_a evident_o to_o declare_v and_o consequent_o how_o true_o both_o the_o name_n and_o punishment_n of_o haeresy_n be_v dew_n unto_o he_o even_o by_o his_o own_o doom_n wherein_o i_o shall_v crave_v thy_o attention_n good_a reader_n that_o perceive_v how_o well_o and_o truel_o he_o perform_v this_o promise_n so_o great_a and_o upon_o so_o hard_a condition_n voluntary_o undertake_v in_o case_n of_o not_o performance_n thou_o may_v frame_v a_o right_a judgement_n of_o the_o whole_a book_n by_o this_o one_o chapter_n and_o as_o thou_o find_v he_o to_o deal_v here_o so_o to_o think_v of_o his_o deal_n else_o where_o but_o not_o to_o say_v more_o i_o come_v to_o the_o trial_n of_o the_o matter_n 2._o he_o pretend_v then_o to_o bring_v the_o testimony_n of_o our_o author_n or_o to_o speak_v in_o his_o own_o phrase_n the_o confession_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n touch_v the_o antiquity_n and_o universality_n certainty_n and_o safety_n of_o his_o faith_n which_o whosoever_o hear_v will_v he_o not_o expect_v the_o 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section_n he_o bring_v only_o three_o catholic_n author_n adrian_n costerus_n and_o harding_n for_o the_o three_o several_a point_n of_o transustantiation_n communion_n in_o one_o kind_n and_o private_a mass_n as_o he_o call_v it_o in_o this_o manner_n he_o say_v of_o himself_o that_o when_o protestant_n accuse_v we_o of_o adore_v the_o element_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n we_o excuse_v it_o by_o say_v we_o adore_v it_o upon_o condition_n and_o for_o that_o end_n bring_v these_o word_n of_o adrian_n adoro_fw-la te_fw-la si_fw-la tu_fw-la es_fw-la christus_fw-la i_o adore_v thou_o if_o thou_o be_v christ_n so_o of_o communion_n in_o one_o kind_n when_o they_o accuse_v we_o of_o take_v away_o the_o cup_n from_o the_o laity_n we_o excuse_v it_o and_o thereto_o he_o bring_v costerus_n say_v that_o communion_n under_o one_o kind_n be_v not_o take_v up_o by_o the_o commandment_n of_o the_o bishop_n but_o it_o creep_v in_o the_o bishops_z wink_v thereat_o three_o when_o they_o accuse_v we_o 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there_o be_v no_o such_o matter_n in_o the_o world_n nor_o one_o word_n speak_v by_o any_o man_n by_o way_n of_o excuse_n as_o shall_v appear_v for_o no_o catholic_n but_o scorn_v a_o excuse_n in_o matter_n of_o his_o belief_n though_o for_o life_n some_o may_v have_v some_o what_o which_o may_v need_v excuse_n though_o in_o that_o case_n we_o teach_v a_o humble_a confession_n to_o be_v the_o best_a excuse_n 5._o but_o to_o come_v now_o to_o the_o matter_n let_v we_o hear_v what_o it_o be_v these_o author_n say_v adrian_z as_o he_o tell_v we_o excuse_v our_o adoration_n of_o the_o element_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n because_o we_o adore_v it_o upon_o condition_n if_o the_o consecrate_a bread_n be_v christ_n the_o latin_a word_n of_o adrian_n in_o the_o margin_n be_v these_o adoro_fw-la te_fw-la si_fw-la tu_fw-la es_fw-la christus_fw-la which_o word_n indeade_o adrian_n have_v but_o they_o be_v very_o different_a from_o sir_n humphrey_n english_a as_o any_o man_n may_v of_o himself_o see_v and_o speak_v by_o adrian_n upon_o a_o very_a different_a occasion_n as_o i_o shall_v now_o show_v he_o then_o dispute_v whether_o a_o judge_n may_v without_o sin_n wish_v he_o may_v lawful_o give_v judgement_n against_o justice_n and_o bring_v argument_n pro_fw-la and_o con_v as_o divine_n do_v for_o the_o affirmative_a he_o bring_v this_o that_o the_o deformity_n of_o the_o sin_n be_v take_v away_o and_o clear_v by_o the_o condition_n which_o be_v add_v which_o he_o far_o prove_v by_o two_o argument_n the_o one_o that_o the_o council_n of_o constance_n do_v excuse_v ignorant_a people_n adore_v a_o unconsecrated_a host_n because_o this_o condition_n be_v tacit_o imply_v if_o the_o consecration_n be_v right_o make_v the_o other_o that_o all_o doctor_n agree_v that_o a_o man_n may_v avoid_v perplexity_n between_o idolatry_n and_o disobedience_n when_o the_o devil_n so_o transfigure_v himself_o as_o to_o seem_v christ_n command_v one_o to_o adore_v if_o upon_o condition_n he_o adore_v thus_o i_o adore_v thou_o if_o thou_o be_v christ_n this_o be_v what_o adrian_n have_v wherein_o first_o any_o man_n may_v see_v he_o speak_v nothing_o of_o his_o own_o opinion_n but_o of_o other_o and_o that_o by_o way_n of_o dispute_n only_o second_o the_o condition_n which_o be_v tacit_o imply_v in_o the_o adoration_n of_o a_o unconsecrated_a host_n according_a to_o the_o council_n of_o constance_n be_v not_o that_o which_o sir_n humphrey_n put_v to_o wit_n if_o the_o consecrate_a bread_n be_v christ_n but_o this_o other_o if_o it_o be_v righty_a consecrate_v which_o be_v clean_o another_o matter_n for_o his_o condition_n ever_o suppose_v a_o right_a consecration_n make_v doubt_v whither_o christ_n be_v there_o or_o not_o which_o be_v most_o false_a the_o other_o condition_n make_v no_o doubt_n of_o that_o but_o
therefore_o correct_v he_o with_o one_o of_o your_o scornful_a taunt_n and_o say_v he_o understand_v it_o not_o whereas_o maldonate_fw-it speak_v only_o of_o s._n aug._n his_o exposition_n of_o that_o place_n of_o scripture_n which_o he_o do_v not_o also_o condenne_n though_o he_o bring_v another_o more_o agreeable_a as_o he_o think_v to_o the_o true_a meaning_n of_o our_o saviour_n in_o that_o place_n which_o true_o a_o man_n may_v do_v without_o any_o such_o arrogancy_n and_o scoff_v as_o you_o be_v please_v out_o of_o your_o ingenuity_n and_o gentlemanly_a breed_n to_o fasten_v upon_o maldonate_fw-it 28._o and_o so_o have_v clear_v the_o matter_n of_o s._n aug._n i_o come_v now_o to_o theodoret_n who_o indeed_o have_v a_o place_n in_o show_v a_o little_a hard_a to_o such_o as_o want_v will_n to_o understand_v he_o as_o it_o seem_v you_o do_v sir_n knight_n for_o it_o have_v be_v often_o clear_o and_o several_a way_n answer_v by_o many_o and_o even_o by_o valencia_n 7._o val._n de_fw-fr transub_n lib._n 2._o cap._n 7._o of_o one_o of_o who_o answer_n you_o think_v to_o make_v your_o advantage_n but_o it_o will_v prove_v to_o your_o disadvantage_n for_o he_o have_v bring_v two_o or_o three_o several_a and_o substantial_a answer_n at_o last_o conclude_v somewhat_o roundly_o with_o the_o haeretique_n in_o this_o manner_n that_o if_o no_o other_o answer_n will_v serve_v the_o turn_n but_o that_o they_o will_v still_o stand_v wrangle_v it_o be_v no_o marvel_n that_o one_o or_o two_o he_o mean_v theodoret_n and_o gelasius_n who_o both_o speak_v in_o the_o same_o manner_n may_v err_v in_o this_o point_n before_o it_o be_v discuss_v which_o last_n answer_v you_o only_o take_v hold_v of_o as_o if_o that_o be_v the_o only_o answer_v not_o take_v notice_n of_o any_o of_o the_o rest_n which_o as_o in_o the_o one_o side_n it_o show_v your_o bad_a deal_n so_o do_v it_o on_o the_o other_o show_v the_o goodness_n of_o his_o solution_n to_o be_v such_o as_o you_o can_v not_o tell_v what_o to_o reply_v against_o they_o fine_n b._n bell._n lib._n 2._o de_fw-fr euch._n cap._n 27._o suar._n 3._o p._n to_o 3._o disp_n 46._o sect_n 4._o fine_n bellarmine_n suarez_n and_o other_o answer_v it_o in_o like_a manner_n diverse_a way_n to_o who_o therefore_o i_o remit_v you_o only_o for_o the_o reader_n be_v sake_n not_o to_o leave_v he_o in_o suspense_n i_o shall_v here_o make_v one_o plain_a and_o brief_a answer_n and_o as_o i_o conceive_v out_o of_o the_o very_a word_n which_o you_o here_o object_n against_o we_o 2._o dialog_n 2._o which_o be_v these_o neque_fw-la enim_fw-la signa_fw-la mystica_fw-la post_fw-la sanctificationem_fw-la recedunt_fw-la a_o sva_fw-la natura_fw-la manent_fw-la enim_fw-la in_o propria_fw-la substantia_fw-la &_o figura_fw-la &_o forma_fw-la &_o videri_fw-la &_o tangi_fw-la possunt_fw-la sicut_fw-la prius_fw-la intelliguntur_fw-la autem_fw-la ea_fw-la esse_fw-la quae_fw-la facta_fw-la sunt_fw-la &_o creduntur_fw-la &_o adorantur_fw-la ut_fw-la quae_fw-la illa_fw-la sint_fw-la quae_fw-la creduntur_fw-la for_o neither_o do_v the_o mystical_a sign_n depart_v from_o their_o own_o nature_n after_o the_o sanctification_n for_o they_o remain_v in_o their_o proper_a substance_n figure_n and_o form_n &_o they_o may_v be_v see_v and_o touch_v as_o before_o but_o they_o be_v understand_v to_o be_v that_o which_o they_o be_v make_v and_o they_o be_v believe_v and_o adore_v as_o be_v that_o which_o they_o be_v believe_v to_o be_v these_o be_v the_o word_n of_o theodoret_n which_o sir_n humphrey_n you_o partly_o cite_v by_o half_n and_o partly_o corrupt_a by_o mistranslation_n for_o thus_o you_o cite_v he_o only_o the_o consecrate_a element_n remain_v in_o their_o proper_a substance_n and_o shape_n and_o figure_n leave_v out_o all_o the_o late_a part_n of_o believe_v and_o adore_v and_o all_o word_n which_o may_v signify_v any_o change_n as_o there_o be_v many_o as_o first_o in_o that_o he_o say_v the_o mystical_a sign_n do_v not_o change_v their_o nature_n by_o sanctification_n which_o why_o shall_v he_o deny_v unless_o the_o sanctification_n do_v work_v some_o change_n or_o why_o shall_v he_o make_v such_o a_o special_a matter_n of_o that_o that_o the_o mystical_a sign_n that_o be_v accident_n as_o i_o shall_v by_o and_o by_o show_n shall_v not_o change_v their_o nature_n unless_o the_o substance_n whereto_o they_o do_v belong_v do_v change_v it_o own_o nature_n for_o it_o be_v a_o ridiculous_a thing_n for_o any_o man_n to_o make_v a_o wonder_n of_o that_o that_o the_o colour_n figure_n and_o taste_v of_o bread_n shall_v remain_v the_o substance_n itself_o of_o the_o bread_n remain_v but_o this_o be_v change_v for_o they_o to_o remain_v be_v a_o wonder_n which_o may_v beseem_v a_o wise_a man_n to_o speak_v of_o second_o whereas_o he_o say_v these_o mystical_a sign_n may_v be_v see_v and_o touch_v as_o before_o you_o leave_v that_o out_o because_o it_o plain_o show_v there_o be_v some_o change_n for_o a_o thing_n can_v be_v otherwise_o then_o it_o be_v before_o without_o some_o change_n now_o the_o change_n he_o say_v be_v not_o in_o the_o accident_n themselves_o or_o in_o their_o own_o nature_n for_o that_o remain_v therefore_o it_o must_v necessary_o be_v in_o that_o their_o subject_n as_o philosopher_n speak_v or_o substance_n in_o which_o they_o do_v inhere_o or_o rest_n be_v change_v three_o theodoret_n speak_v of_o something_o which_o be_v wrought_v or_o make_v by_o sanctification_n and_o which_o be_v understand_v and_o adore_v what_o be_v this_o that_o be_v make_v here_o not_o the_o accident_n for_o they_o remain_v the_o same_o not_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n for_o that_o be_v before_o neither_o be_v that_o say_v to_o be_v understand_v or_o believe_v but_o see_v and_o feel_v much_o less_o be_v it_o or_o can_v it_o be_v say_v to_o be_v adore_v all_o this_o than_o you_o leave_v out_o sir_n humphrey_n we_o need_v not_o ask_v you_o why_o for_o every_o man_n see_v the_o reason_n thus_o much_o of_o your_o mangle_n of_o this_o authority_n 29._o now_o to_o come_v to_o your_o mistranslation_n whereas_o you_o translate_v signa_fw-la mystica_fw-la consecrate_a element_n i_o will_v be_v glad_a to_o know_v in_o what_o dictionary_n you_o find_v signa_n to_o signify_v element_n and_o mystica_fw-la to_o signify_v consecrate_v for_o though_o the_o holy_a father_n many_o time_n use_v the_o word_n mystical_a when_o they_o speak_v of_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n as_o be_v a_o mystery_n and_o which_o indeed_o can_v be_v so_o without_o consecration_n yet_o mystical_a and_o consecrate_v be_v two_o several_a thing_n and_o they_o have_v several_a relation_n or_o respect_n and_o consequent_o several_a signification_n for_o consecrate_v have_v relation_n to_o the_o word_n and_o action_n of_o the_o priest_n whereby_o it_o be_v sanctify_v and_o change_v mystical_a have_v relation_n to_o the_o secrecy_n or_o hiddennesse_n of_o it_o as_o far_o surpass_v the_o knowledge_n or_o comprehension_n of_o man_n or_o as_o be_v another_o thing_n than_o it_o seem_v outward_o to_o be_v but_o for_o the_o word_n signa_n i_o see_v not_o what_o colour_n any_o man_n can_v have_v to_o translate_v it_o element_n be_v two_o such_o different_a thing_n without_o any_o connexion_n for_o element_n pertain_v to_o the_o very_a substance_n of_o a_o thing_n they_o be_v the_o prime_a principle_n of_o which_o any_o thing_n be_v make_v and_o consist_v signum_fw-la or_o a_o sign_n proper_o pertain_v to_o the_o accident_n of_o a_o thing_n which_o be_v the_o proper_a object_n of_o our_o sense_n and_o which_o do_v notify_v or_o signify_v unto_o we_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o thing_n bring_v it_o so_o to_o our_o knowledge_n and_o every_o thing_n be_v call_v a_o sign_n so_o far_o as_o it_o be_v apt_a to_o cause_n in_o we_o this_o knowledge_n wherefore_o this_o be_v a_o notable_a cunning_a trick_n of_o you_o sir_n knight_n by_o change_a sign_n into_o element_n to_o make_v all_o that_o 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see_v the_o man_n be_v abominable_a lie_v by_o this_o one_o thing_n may_v give_v a_o guess_n of_o the_o rest_n the_o council_n as_o he_o confess_v in_o the_o beginning_n accurse_v he_o and_o his_o doctrine_n and_o here_o he_o say_v it_o conclude_v with_o a_o well_o wish_v thereunto_o be_v it_o even_o so_o good_a sir_n your_o communion_n be_v allow_v by_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n you_o tell_v we_o news_n i_o pray_v you_o what_o canon_n what_o chapter_n what_o session_n be_v your_o communion_n once_o name_v in_o there_o you_o will_v say_v where_o the_o council_n wish_v that_o the_o people_n that_o hear_v mass_n will_v communicate_v not_o only_o spiritual_o but_o also_o sacramental_o be_v this_o your_o communion_n what_o have_v you_o mass_n sir_n humphrey_n take_v heed_n it_o may_v cost_v you_o money_n a_o informer_n that_o shall_v hear_v this_o may_v catch_v you_o by_o the_o back_n and_o bring_v you_o in_o for_o so_o many_o hundred_o mark_n as_o you_o have_v receive_v bytt_n of_o bread_n in_o your_o church_n which_o true_o may_v prove_v a_o dear_a ordinary_a for_o you_o and_o this_o you_o must_v either_o confess_v or_o let_v alone_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n which_o acknowledge_v no_o communion_n without_o mass_n for_o if_o you_o deny_v your_o service_n to_o be_v mass_n we_o deny_v your_o communion_n to_o be_v communion_n for_o no_o mass_n no_o communion_n therefore_o bethink_v yourself_o whither_o you_o will_v be_v content_a to_o have_v a_o mass_n or_o no_o trent-communion_n and_o while_o you_o stand_v study_v of_o this_o i_o will_v put_v you_o another_o thing_n to_o consider_v of_o which_o be_v this_o that_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n for_o the_o council_n to_o wish_v that_o the_o people_n will_v communicate_v because_o to_o hear_v mass_n and_o receive_v withal_o will_v be_v more_o profitable_a another_o to_o say_v that_o if_o there_o be_v no_o body_n to_o communicate_v or_o that_o such_o mass_n be_v unlawful_a as_o haeretique_n say_v the_o priest_n must_v not_o say_v mass_n what_o think_v you_o sir_n be_v not_o these_o two_o thing_n study_v the_o matter_n a_o while_n and_o tell_v us._n do_v not_o you_o then_o speak_v wondrous_a witty_o when_o you_o say_v that_o there_o come_v blessing_n and_o curse_v out_o of_o the_o same_o mouth_n as_o if_o the_o council_n do_v approve_v and_o condemn_v the_o same_o thing_n when_o it_o commend_v sacramental_a communion_n of_o the_o people_n together_o with_o the_o priest_n and_o yet_o condemn_v not_o those_o mass_n as_o unlawful_a wherein_o the_o people_n do_v not_o communicate_v yea_o approve_v they_o the_o like_a wit_n and_o less_o honesty_n you_o show_v alsoe_o in_o that_o you_o say_v that_o from_o the_o confession_n of_o a_o general_a council_n your_o communion_n be_v conclude_v to_o be_v more_o fruitful_a what_o affinity_n between_o your_o empty_a communion_n which_o be_v but_o a_o morsel_n of_o bread_n and_o a_o sup_v of_o wine_n and_o the_o true_a real_a &_o substantial_a body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n jesus_n which_o the_o faithful_a catholic_a receive_v the_o council_n commend_v daily_o receive_v of_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n as_o more_o profitable_a therefore_o say_v you_o it_o commend_v your_o communion_n which_o you_o use_v once_o twice_o thrice_o or_o 4._o time_n a_o year_n it_o wish_v that_o the_o people_n will_v receive_v sacramental_o as_o the_o priest_n do_v you_o make_v it_o say_v no_o but_o that_o the_o priest_n must_v do_v as_o the_o people_n do_v that_o be_v not_o celebrate_v but_o when_o they_o be_v dispose_v to_o receive_v be_v it_o not_o mere_a madness_n for_o you_o sir_n humphrey_n thus_o plain_o to_o abuse_v the_o council_n so_o contrary_a to_o the_o plain_a meaning_n thereof_o 3._o like_o to_o this_o be_v your_o folly_n in_o allege_v so_o many_o authoritye_n in_o favour_n of_o your_o communion_n as_o you_o think_v which_o whither_o you_o cite_v they_o true_a or_o no_o i_o do_v not_o stand_v to_o examine_v for_o it_o make_v no_o matter_n they_o say_v it_o be_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n to_o communicate_v every_o day_n with_o the_o priest_n i_o grant_v it_o what_o then_o therefore_o the_o priest_n now_o must_v say_v mass_n but_o once_o in_o two_o or_o three_o month_n or_o once_o in_o a_o twelve_o month_n or_o not_o once_o in_o seven_o year_n unless_o the_o people_n be_v so_o devout_a as_o to_o come_v &_o receive_v with_o he_o this_o follow_v of_o your_o doctrine_n be_v not_o this_o wise_a argue_v but_o to_o answer_n you_o another_o way_n sir_n humphrey_n you_o can_v be_v ignorant_a that_o there_o be_v not_o one_o of_o these_o author_n which_o you_o cite_v for_o the_o people_n daily_a communion_n that_o say_v that_o either_o it_o be_v or_o be_v of_o necessity_n so_o to_o do_v but_o only_o bear_v witness_n of_o the_o practice_n 5._o bell._n lib._n 2._o the_o miss_n cap._n 9_o &_o 10._o durant_n de_fw-fr ritib._n lib._n 2._o cap._n 4._o n._n 5._o whereas_o some_o of_o they_o as_o bellarmine_n and_o durantus_n 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manifest_a that_o even_o in_o that_o time_n the_o people_n do_v not_o still_o communicate_v every_o day_n as_o they_o have_v do_v in_o the_o begin_n for_o whereas_o people_n do_v communicate_v before_o without_o command_n only_o of_o their_o own_o devotion_n they_o be_v grow_v so_o cold_a by_o pope_n fabian_n time_n 3._o fab._n epi._n 3._o which_o be_v about_o the_o year_n 240._o be_v but_o the_o one_o &_o twentieth_o pope_n that_o he_o be_v fain_o to_o make_v a_o decree_n to_o compel_v the_o people_n to_o communicate_v at_o least_o thrice_o a_o year_n and_o this_o be_v almost_o one_o hundred_o year_n before_o the_o end_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n the_o like_a decree_n i_o may_v alsoe_o bring_v out_o of_o soter_n about_o the_o year_n 175._o which_o be_v 60._o year_n before_o fabian_n whereas_o notwithstanding_o then_o priest_n and_o bishop_n do_v celebrate_v every_o day_n as_o appear_v by_o s._n cypr._n ambr._n aug._n hierome_n 4._o lib._n 2._o cap._n 4._o etc._n etc._n cite_v by_o durantus_n and_o which_o be_v more_o those_o father_n s._n aug_n by_o name_n say_v he_o do_v neither_o commend_v nor_o discommend_v the_o daily_a communion_n of_o the_o people_n but_o wish_v that_o at_o least_o upon_o sunday_n they_o will_v communicate_v but_o with_o a_o mind_n free_a from_o desire_n of_o sin_v whereas_o he_o together_o with_o other_o father_n make_v frequent_a mention_n of_o daily_a sacrifice_n but_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o your_o purpose_n or_o to_o your_o communion_n as_o of_o all_o that_o be_v say_v by_o the_o father_n of_o the_o holy_a communion_n be_v mean_v of_o your_o sacrilegious_a communion_n 4._o now_o for_o your_o proof_n out_o of_o scripture_n as_o that_o that_o our_o saviour_n say_v to_o his_o disciple_n take_v you_o eat_v you_o i_o answer_v that_o as_o our_o saviour_n there_o speak_v to_o all_o his_o apostle_n who_o do_v all_o eat_n so_o out_o of_o this_o place_n a_o man_n may_v even_o as_o well_o say_v that_o all_o must_v communicate_v that_o 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say_v you_o to_o this_o sir_n humphrey_n have_v i_o not_o just_a cause_n here_o to_o tell_v you_o your_o own_o but_o i_o forbear_v you_o 23._o extreme_a unction_n be_v next_o of_o which_o you_o tell_v we_o that_o bellarmine_n say_v that_o that_o anoyl_v which_o the_o apostle_n use_v mar._n 6._o be_v not_o extreme_a unction_n &_o that_o caietane_n say_v the_o same_o of_o the_o anoyl_a which_o s._n james_n speak_v of_o 5._o p._n jacq_n 5._o likewise_o of_o hugo_n peter_n lombard_n bonaventure_n &_o altisiodorensis_n you_o say_v that_o they_o hold_v it_o be_v not_o institute_v by_o christ_n well_o what_o of_o all_o this_o be_v it_o so_o that_o one_o think_v it_o not_o to_o be_v mention_v in_o s._n mark_v another_o not_o in_o s._n james_n other_o not_o to_o have_v be_v institute_v by_o christ_n what_o then_o do_v therefore_o any_o one_o of_o all_o these_o deny_v it_o to_o be_v a_o sacrament_n nay_o do_v they_o not_o all_o say_v and_o maintain_v the_o contrary_n most_o express_o &_o which_o 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as_o both_o in_o one_o and_o other_o he_o do_v err_v for_o as_o much_o as_o pertain_v to_o the_o proof_n of_o those_o article_n out_o of_o scripture_n which_o be_v not_o so_o much_o the_o matter_n between_o you_o and_o we_o so_o do_v he_o not_o err_v for_o the_o thing_n themselves_o but_o have_v he_o live_v to_o see_v this_o sense_n of_o the_o scripture_n declare_v and_o this_o verity_n of_o extreme_a unction_n define_v out_o of_o hat_n place_n of_o s._n james_n by_o the_o interpretation_n of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n 1._o conc._n try_v sess_n 14._o the_o extr_n unct_n c._n 1._o he_o will_v have_v submit_v his_o judgement_n 24._o as_o for_o the_o sacrament_n of_o order_n you_o say_v that_o soto_n tell_v we_o that_o ordination_n of_o bishop_n be_v not_o crue_o and_o proper_o a_o sacrament_n well_o be_v it_o so_o let_v soto_n say_v so_o do_v he_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n of_o order_n in_o the_o church_n other_o deny_v the_o four_o lesser_a order_n to_o be_v sacrament_n and_o some_o 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riff_o raff_o stuff_n as_o your_o minister_n be_v wont_a to_o eke_o out_o their_o book_n and_o sermon_n without_o be_v able_a to_o show_v any_o bull_n of_o pope_n or_o testimony_n of_o good_a author_n of_o any_o indulgence_n so_o grant_v which_o though_o you_o or_o they_o can_v yet_o be_v be_v not_o to_o the_o purpose_n no_o more_o than_o your_o profane_a jest_n out_o of_o guiciardin_n of_o play_v a_o game_n at_o table_n for_o a_o indulgence_n for_o what_o suppose_v that_o be_v true_a may_v not_o a_o man_n think_v you_o tell_v as_o good_a a_o tale_n of_o some_o protestant_n who_o in_o their_o pot_n have_v make_v so_o bold_a with_o almighty_a god_n himself_o as_o to_o drink_v a_o health_n unto_o he_o and_o be_v not_o this_o a_o fine_a argument_n to_o prove_v that_o there_o be_v no_o god_n beside_o guiciardin_n history_n translate_v by_o coelius_n secundus_fw-la curio_n which_o i_o suppose_v you_o to_o cite_v for_o it_o be_v most_o like_o you_o be_v no_o italian_a be_v forbid_v in_o 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