lyen in the dust and have trusted God with our names There is indeed a great complaint in the World that they know not what we would have Yet ingenuous Brethren in the Assembly have professed that they understood what we would have as well as our selves so cleare have we been in discovering our mindes upon all occasions We have lately in a Committee appoynted by the Lords and Commons for Accommodation declared what we would have in relation to what already is established professing that in all things that we had not mentioned in our desires for forbearance we agreed with the rule they had established If you would know what we would have it is soon told you 1. We would have the ruling Power of Ministers not to extend further then their pastorall Charge over their People for the feeding of them by the Word Sacraments 2. We would have the Saints separated from the world not in a negative way only but in some positive arguments of some work of God upon their hearts that accompanies Salvation so far as man may be able to judge and that they freely joyn in Spirituall Communion yet so as the rule of edification be observ'd amongst others that there be a cohabitation in those that joyn and that all that are fit to be members that doe cohabit doe joyn as much as may be 3. We would have no coactive violence used against such men who carry themselves religiously and peaceably in their differences from others in such things onely as godly and peaceable men may and doe differ in Were these 3. things granted we might live together as Bretheren in peace and love Are those the men that are the hinderers of reformation and the disturbers of the peace who would be satisfied with these 3. things and if they cannot have them peaceably by the permission of the Magistrate are resolved to sit down quietly to suffer or to go to what places in the world liberty may be enjoyed in these and yet must these be judged the disturbers of the peace But while men think there is no way for peace but by forcing all to be of the same minde while they thinke the Civill Sword is an ordinance appoynted by GOD to determine all Controversies in Divinity and that men must needs be chained together by fines and imprisonments or else there can be no peace that except all men be of the same minde themselves are of all will come to confusion whilst these Principles prevaile with men either there must be a base subjection of mens consciences to slavery a suppression of much truth whilst they seek to suppresse error or else exceeding disturbance in the Christian world Happy those men their memories shall be blessed Not who bluster and are violent and furious in forcing others to what they conceive right for these are certainly the disturbers of our peace but those who shall find out some expedient whereby Conscience may not be enslaved truth not suppressed and yet error not countenanced the spirits of men each towards other sweetned Peace procured Brotherly love recovered strengthned confirmed for the raising up of such for the blessing of God upon such and their endeavours I shall not cease to pray who am desirous of nothing more then Truth and Peace but the Lord rebuke turbulent and violent spirits But seeing you mention a Committee of Lords and Commons for Accommodation why did not you joyn in a way of Accommodation with your Brethren Nothing would satisfie you but a Toleration Answ Before there was any Rule established we laboured what we could for Accommodation to get the Rule so qualified that we might come under the same Rule with our Brethren professing that we desired nothing more but that we could not effect It was then pleaded Let the Rule be first set and then we shall see how neere we can come to it or where the difference will lye and then some way may be considered to Accommodate in But when the Rule was set we knew no way but to shew wherein we could not come up to the Rule and to desire forbearance in such and such particulars which the Order of the Lords and Commons gave us power to doe which we accordingly presented to the Honourable Committee professing our selves to agree with our Brethren in all Fundamentals in Doctrine and in the substance of Worship according to the Directory and with the Reformed Churches as they doe and for the Rule of Discipline that we likewise agreed in all other things except those we mentioned wherein we desired forbearance But you say you would not have the Ruling power of Ministers goe beyond their Pastoral Charge for Word and Sacramente what help then can there be if the Elders of a Church or a whole Church shall erre Ans The Church is a spirituall Society gathered for spirituall ends it hath within it selfe no help against spirituall evils but spirituall and these can onely prevaile with men so far as they are spiritual and conscientious If the declaring the mind of Christ by other Churches if the protesting against the erring Elders or Churches and withdrawing Communion from them will not strike upon Conscience what shall Can the adding of an Act of formall Jurisdiction whose Divine Institution few see and is doubted of by those with whom it should prevaile can that doe it The former meanes wil remedy evils if men be conscientious the latter will not doe it if they be not conscientious If you say The Magistrate must come in and helpe Answ 1. Howsoever then in Church help there is little difference 2. If you interesse the Magistrates power he must then either by himselfe or by some Commissioners take cognisance of the jus and the fact wherein his power is to be exercised he must not act upon an implicite beliefe that the acts of the Church are right 3. Will you call in his power in all matters of difference wherein your selves cannot agree or will you onely desire his power to help when either the hainousnesse of the matter or the turbulencie of the carriage manifests stubbornnesse If in the former case then you make the Magistrate the Judge of all Controversies in Religion which I beleeve you are not willing to doe If in the latter onely we are agreed Why then is there such a stir such an out-cry against that which is called the Independent way as if there must needs be a confusion of all things if liberty in it be granted The Lord judge between us and our Brethren in this thing To him we refer our Names and our Cause FINIS
A VINDICATION OF Mr BVRROVGHES Against Mr EDWARDS his foule Aspersions in his spreading Gangraena and his angry Antiapologia Concluding with A BRIEFE DECLARATION What the INDEPENDENTS would have By JER BURROUGHES JER 20.10 Report say they and we will report PROV 18.8 The words of a tale-bearer are as wounds and they go downe into the innermost parts of the belly Tertul. advers Hermogenem Hermogenes natura turbulentus qui loquacitatem facundiam existimet impudentiam constantiam deputet maledicere singulis officium bonae conscientiae judicet LONDON Printed for H. Overton and are to be sold at his shop at the entring into Popes-head Alley out of Lumbard-street MDCXLVI A Vindication of Mr Burroughes Against M. Edwards his foul Aspersions ALthough I may venture upon the testimony of the consciences of those who know me to vindicate me from M. Edwards his foule aspersions Nec audiendi sunt quando reprehensa in aliquo negligentia sua per quā fit ut in malam suspicionem vemant unde suā vitam longe abesse sciunt dicunt sibi coram Deo sufficere conscientiam existimationem hominum non imprudenter solum verumetiā crudeliter contemnentes Quisquis à criminibus vitam suam custodit sibi bene facit quisquis etiam famam in alios misericors est nobis necessaria est vita nostra aliis fama Aug. de bono viduitatis c. 22. yet hearing there are some whose spirits are as dryed tinder to his sire if men were willing to be undeceived and not to runne away with foolish conceits I thought it might not be amisse to spend an houre or two upon this vaine man Augustine sayes Those are not to be hearkned to who having suspition raised of them which they know themselves to be free of shall say their conscience in the presence of God is enough for them and for the esteeme of men doe not onely imprudently contemne but in it are cruell That is as he after expresses himselfe against others which are hindred in the good they might get by them because the suspition raised is not removed For sayes he A good life is necessary for our selves but a good fame for others You doe well to your selfe in being carefull of your life but you are mercifull to others in being carefull of your name Wherefore though mine owne conscience is enough to satisfie my selfe against what ever M. Edwards hath written or said yet in mercy to others and that I may not be wanting to my duty in removing any stumbling block that might hinder the work of my Ministery which I was moved unto by a Letter sent to me from a good and worthy friend I shall now doe that which I had thought I should never have brought my heart unto viz. to spend time in the vindication of my selfe Might the hurt goe no farther then my selfe if I did not doe it the meanest imployment in the world should rather take up my time then this but something must be done John was of a most loving sweet and gentle temper yet having to deale with a man of an evill spirit he speaks contemptuously of him I will remember saies he his deeds 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 prating against us with malicious words Such a naughty spirit appeares in this man so be it he can get filth to cast upon men he cares not out of what kennel he rakes it as it is hard to meddle with him to answer him according to his folly without expressions against him grievous to a spirit that hath any sweetnesse of love or meeknesse in it had I to deale with him alone I should onely answer him in the words of the Angel Jude 9. The Lord rebuke thee Yet the man is very impatient that he hath no Answer he concludes and would have others to doe so too that all he sayes is truth because there comes forth no Answer to it It is a miserable thing that we must be at the mercy of every one who hath a mind to accuse and rayle so as to be bound to take off our selves from whatsoever imployments God hath set us about to attend the answering of whatsoever he sayes or writes I hope I shall give God a better account of my time then so Whatsoever M. Edwards hath written or said concerning me I blesse God I can with comfort spread it before him and intreat him to judge betweene us He thinkes he hath done God and his Bretheren good service but I am very confident and I am not alone in this my confidence that Bishop Wren was not more mischievous to the Prelacy then he hath beene to the Presbytery I doubt whether there ever was any in the Christian world who was looked upon as a man professing godlinesse in that height that he hath beene that ever manifested so much boldnesse and malice against such as himselfe acknowledges to be godly as he hath done Were there nothing but the Presbyteriall opinion that made the difference betweene him and me I should not abate my esteeme of his godlinesse in the least for I beleeve there are as godly Presbyterians as Independents But that fiery rage that implacable irrationall violence of his makes me stand and wonder at him not so much for recording stories that he hears but that hearing such vile reproachfull things against such as he ownes to be godly and the persons thus reproched living neare him in the City who it may be might satisfy him in the falsnesse of the reports so as to keepe him from publishing them yea when some of them hearing what he was about have sent to him to tell him that if he would Confer with them they would satisfy him about particulars they would clearly convince him that such men were traduced and himselfe abused in such reports yet that he should refuse to confer with them saying he had testimony enough and so fall a laying on take off who will or can herein following that wicked Jesuiticall Maxime Fortiter calumniare aliquid haerebit Calumniate lustily boldly no matter whether it be true or false somthing will stick I beleeve this example can hardly be paralleld in any age How is it possible that he should ever right those he has wronged if he saies he will recant if he can be convinced wherein any is wronged That will not doe it for how is he sure that his recantation shall come to the knowledge of all to whom his calumniation hath come is this enough for mens names so traduced by him for him afterwards to say I was told so I was misinformed I beseech God to touch his heart and the hearts of such as have any way encouraged him in such a foule worke There is an odious disease in nature casting up the excrementitious filthinesse at the mouth which is no lesse noysome then dangerous therefore the Physitians call it Miserere mei Deus Thus exulcerate minds affected with the like malady in morality being surcharged with superfluity
of choler and malice and not able to containe break forth into distemper of words and poure it out in unsavoury language such we must leave to a Miserere mei But is M. Edwards sick of this disease Doth not he professe his zeale for God his dependance upon God for assistance very often Ans Yes he doth but I feare he takes Gods name much in vain in so doing set aside the difference of his judgement I cannot beleeve that God will ever owne that way he takes and whether he hath that filthy disease mentioned if you can endure to look upon the loathsome stuffe that comes from him you may easily judge if I should relate much of it it would be nauseous I will give you one instance In the first page of his Preface to the first part of his Gangrana he speaks of Printed pamphlets where he sayes he was reproached but he was not willing to be provoked or to trouble himselfe at the barking of every dog and for this he quotes in his margin M. Woodward and M. Burton What is M. Burton become a dog now and M. Woodward who is a knowne ancient godly man a Schoolmaster yet for ought I know no Independent is he a dog in M. Edwards his mouth and pen If M. Edwards and his party rise in their spirits according to this proportion how can we live neere them what already got so above M. Woodward and M. Burton even whilst they are but in the shell and see power but hopefully to come into their hands that they can looke upon them as dogs beneath them I speak of M. Edwards and his party because he sayes so many have given him thanks for his Book In his last booke I finde him exceedingly fretting and vexing at a testimony Master John Goodwin had under my hand against the truth of a story in his Grangraena which he sayes is full of Jesuiticall equivocation Yea further no equivocation can free it from a lye Bona verba After master Edwards hath done fretting and chafing after his fit is over notwithstanding all he hath said that testimony is and must stand true and will be found in the plainnesse of it to be a witnesse against him what beyond equivocation no lesse then a flat lye This is the first time that ever any man gave me the lye But I pray Master Edwards how doe you know it is a lye How Master Allen he mistakes the mans name the man he means is Master Alle an honest understanding man he saies told him so and after justifyed it in Master Bellamies shop in the presence of many This is the onely witnesse Master Edwards hath against me as for Master Randal whom he mentions he speaks onely of Nicols his being with M. Greenhil at another time not of that meeting I testifie against nor any thing about my knowledge of him nor any thing that Master Greenhill denyes Howsoever then it is but ones I and ones No and yet how many have drunk in this report as dirty and foule as it is surely there is a spirit in men that makes them very thirsty after Calumnies and reproaches But what if this onely witnesse M. Edwards hath to prove me a Lyar shall give it under his hand that that testimony of mine is true what if that which M. Edwards in the strength of that witnesse shall say is a lye I shall be able in the strength of the same witnesse say is true where will the lye stick then After M. Iohn Goodwins Book came out I met with this M. Alle and in the presence of many caused him to turne to that page where my testimony is and to read it I then asked him Whether that testimony of mine were true or not He answered for any thing he knew it was true Some in the company desired him to set his hand to what he said He presently tooke pen and inke saying he would write according to what he apprehended and so farre as he knew and wrote these words subscribing his name That the Testimony of M. Burroughes which M. John Goodwin pag. 42. saith he hath under his hand about Nicols is true Thomas Alle. I have by me the paper where this is written with his owne hand and this M. Alle M. Edwards his onely witnesse in the presence of many under his hand witnesses that he thinks my testimony true in reference to the whole I had written to M. Iohn Goodwin By what witnesse then can M. Edwards prove a lye Something hath caused M. Alle since to mince the matter and to make a relation of some things that neither I nor M. Greenhill ownes but at that time when he gave my justification under his hand he was urged againe and againe in the presence of many to declare whether he could say any thing against the truth of any particular in my testimony and he professed he could not Surely if he could not how could M. Edwards who had all he had from him Besides this M. Alle sayes in what he hath printed that there are some things in M. Edwards his Book speaking in relation to what M. Edwards reports from him that never came from him and yet M. Edwards stands boldly to justifie that all from first to last is true But I pray consider further what are M. Edwards his arguments to prove my testimony a lye First this I say the story of Nicols and such a meeting mentioned pag. 79. is all false No sayes he some part is true The first part wherin is laid down Nicols his maintaining to M. Greenhils face those opinions How then came M. Burroughes his affirming that story M. Edwards hath of one Nicols to be false be in any sense justified to be true Ans See the sagacity of the man Take heed what you say against M. Edwards he is cunning he will find you out But M. Edwards looke back againe to what I affirme in that testimony under my hand you shall find I onely say this that all the story about Nicols in such a page namely pag. 79. is false now to prove me a lyar you tell the world that a part of the story in another pag. namely pag. 78. is true is this a good argument to prove a man a lyar who saies the story in one pag. of a booke is false But he lyes because the story of another page of the booke is true What brave stuffe is here to prove a lye I professe to all the world as in the presence of God I doe not now invent this to help to salve the businesse but what ever failing might be in the expression the reason of my mentioning the page was to limit my testimony to what was in that page concerning Nicols what was in that meeting there mentioned in reference to him I took not upon me to deny what might be between M. Greenhill and Nicols at some other time and all that M. Greenhill denyes in my testimony is that part of the
make us members of the Church These things are so palpably plaine to any that will understand that it is tedious to spend time about them He sayes further in the same page that I preaching before the Lord Major and Aldermen preached for a Toleration of all Sects and Opinions so they were not against Fundamentals in Doctrine and Fundamentals in Civil Government Ans Then I did not preach for an universall an unlimited toleration of all Religions of all things as both my selfe and others are very sinfully reported to doe What was the way of getting hands to a late Petition in London but this when some went from house to house Who are you for Are you for Presbytery or Independencie Many answering They knew not what Independencie was The Hand-gatherers replyed Independents are such as would have no Government as would have all Religions all Blasphemiss and Heresies tolerated as would live under no Laws Oh say they No we are not for them we will set our hands against them and thus hands might easily multiply Yea this is the weapon by which Ministers in their Pulpits where no body can answer them fight against Independency with But is this faire Doe not your consciences condemne you in this thing For my part as I never was so I now am not for a toleration of all things nay I should be loth to live in England if ever it should be here I doe and shall pray and endeavour against it But what I said before the Lord Major and the Aldermen had I been a Presbyterian I should have said it and were I a Presbyterian I should say it againe The Presbyteriall way had once need of such a doctrine and may have need of it againe I remember not the words that then I spoke but this I remember what I said was from the 14. to the Rom. and I am sure I have since said and published in that Treatise of Heart-Divisions three times as much about that Argument and that Scripture and yet I beleeve many hundreds of Presbyterians think what I have published there to be true doctrine onely M. Edwards has so much of the Prelacy and violence in him that he cannot digest it As for my Lectures that are printed upon Hesea that he mentions page 220. I am not willing to spend time in answering he mentions no particular words but refers you to the Lectures and pages They are to be seene I refer my selfe to all moderate Presbyterians let them judge whether there be any thing there that may not stand with Presbyterian Principles Never any have appeared against those Lectures but M. Edwards and lately M. John Vicars I reverence and teach others to reverence old age but it must know there are many infirmities attending it it is fitter for devotion then that it should interest it selfe in matters of contention If M. Vicars had told me some experiences of the work of God upon his soule or of the good providences of God towards his people and himselfe in the course of his life I should have diligently observed them and I hope might have got good by them But oh how unbecomming old age is that spirit of contention that appeares in his Bookes if he thinks those places he has cited will serve his turne surely his skill in Presbyterie is not great my pen was running in a hard expression but I will not provoke the old man yet I must be plaine with him How uncomely is it for an old Professor of Piety and Religion to be found jeering and scorning at Piety and Religion who would have thought that ever M. Vicars should have lived to that day Thus he does in the Frontispice of his Booke The names of the five pious Apologists and the names of the seven Religious Remonstrants Whereas the chiefe scope of his Book is to cast dirt upon these Apologists and Remonstrants Certainly the spirit of the man is much altered from what he heretofore seemed to be Can it become the gravity and wisdome of old age to charge and that publiquely his Brethren of unworthy double dealing of unfaithfulnesse upon no other ground then the relation of one man and that relation but upon one witnesse and yet this very witnesse gives it under his hand that what these men that he charges thus hath said is true and why must he charge Master Greenhill too Surely he did not thinke what he did for all that M. Greenhill said was he wondred to see such a thing in Master Edwards his Booke as a Relation of a meeting concluded of about Nicols where I and he M. Edwards sayes were what doublenesse or unfaithfulnesse in this for not onely M. Edwards his witnesse sayes he never told him so and such a thing never was but M. Edwards now confesses it Is there then weight enough for such a charge of M. Vicars not onely upon me but upon M. Greenhil The Lord I hope will cause M. Vicars to see cause to be humbled for this In the close of all me thinkes I see M. Edwards in M. Bellamies shop fretting and vaporing I will answer him I that I will I will reply I that I will like one Pise Jerome speaks of who though he knew not what to say yet he knew not how to hold his peace M. Edwards may be bold enough in Answering for I am perswaded he beleeves I will hardly ever be brought to trouble my self about him He is so foule who can meddle with him without dirtying his fingers I am resolved rather to lye under many prejudices and censures and commit my name and cause to God then to trouble my selfe further with him Though I will not fully conclude never to doe any thing further about him in publique yet this I engage my selfe unto that if any thing in what he has said or shall say shall stick in the hearts of any conscientious who desire satisfaction if they will but make it knowne to any that have or ever had any acquaintance with me I will if it be desired give them satisfaction in it but I confesse I am loth to promise this to strangers I have been so traduced by strangers who have come to me for satisfaction in some cases of conscience For instance in that about a late Petition of some of the Citizens which M. Edwards mentions page 110. of the first part of his Gangraena where he sayes some came to me the day after I preached to be satisfied about it who he sayes put me hard to it I confesse I spent neere foure houres with one company who came to me about it yet Master Edwards sayes I said little It may be some of them reported so How easie is it for any to come to be resolved in a case of conscience and when they are gone to say He said little Yet to those four who then came to me there was so much said that two of them went away satisfied and the other two fell off contradicting one