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A95679 Gainsayer convinced: or, An answer to a certain scandalous paper, subscribed and sent by certain seduced and seditious people to a minister in the countrey: in which the calling of the ministry of the Church of England, the nature of a visible church, the power of the magistrate under the gospel, the right of tithes, with many other points now in controversie, are briefly, fully and plainly cleared, to the satisfaction of those that are wavering; also much of the spirit and many of the errours of the Anabaptists of these daies (who call themselves saints) discovered and confuted. / By T.T. Preacher of the word at Kemble in Wiltshire. Thache, Thomas, b. 1616 or 17. 1649 (1649) Wing T827; Thomason E568_1; ESTC R206240 79,821 83

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stand for truth and justice as now they doe Secondly We dislike the misapplication as indeed is your common practice whereby youleade people in dark paths of that expression the base are risen up against the honourable who do you mean by base and who by honourable this Riddle wants an Interpreter these are but bals of wilde-fire to set the Kingdome fresh on fire and to fill the hearts of the sons of Belial with dishonourable thoughts of the Kingdoms Worthies in the Army But if truth may take place with our time-serving generation who are base but such who are content to be basely cheated out of all their priviledges spirituall and temporall by a few fine empty notions who basely betray the lives and liberties of themselves and posterities for present shadows who are base but such as basely falsifie and betray the trust reposed in them but such as seek their own advancement by a Kingdomes ruine And who honourable but such that venture their lives rather then they and theirs should be vassels to the base wils of any though never so great Is not that honourable service to bring Delinquents to punishment such Vipers that would eat out the heart of our liberties which is as dear as our lives which the Army only doth Doth not the Scripture declare that Righteousnesse exalts a Nation but what shall we say to this gainsaying generation or generation of gainsaiers who will not understand may it not be truly said to them as Christ said to Nicodemus Art thou a Ruler in Israel and knowest not these things or rather as Christ said to seeing blinde Pharisees that sin open-eyed Ioh. 9. last If you were blinde you should have no sinne but now you say we see therefore your sinne remaineth and this we fear is your condition because we cannot but remember carriage and zeal for those who you now condemn Oh! what pains was spent in their behalf what praiers was put up for them what The ANSWER Friends SO in charity I call you because you subscribe your selves so though your Paper from the beginning to the end be full of gall and bitternesse and savours as much as may be of that enmitie which God from the beginning did put 'twixt the seed of the woman and the seed of the Serpent Having received your Letter and perused it I took it and as Hezekiah did with the reproachfull letter of Sennacherib 2 King 19. I did spread it before the Lord who knoweth the secrets of all hearts and judgeth righteously And for Answer to it which you desired speedily in that I have been thus long about it I must say as Paul did to his Thessalonians 1 Thess 2. 18. I would have come unto you even I Paul once and again but Satan hindred me So I say to you in this case I would have answered you once and again ere this but Satan hindred me You desire me to answer you in Scripture language I promise you here in the beginning that I will indeavour in 2 Tim. 2. 2 last ver meeknes and love to answer and to instruct you with much patience if God peradventure will give you repentance to the acknowledging of the truth and that you may recover your selves out of the snare of the devil But me thinks 't is strange that you who desire Scripture language from others you who pretend so much to the Spirit should yet so farre forget Scripture language and so far put off the meeknesse of the Spirit in this your Letter as you do for I appeal to the world or rather to God who knows the hearts from whence these expressions come whether it be not fill'd up with that which St. Paul saith grieves the Spirit viz Bitternesse wrath anger clamour evill speaking malice Ephes 4. 31. whether it savour not of many of the works of the flesh reckoned up Galat. 5. 20 21. viz. hatred variance emulations wrath strife seditions envie with that reviling which the Apostle reproves 1 Cor. 6. 11. Look upon some of your expressions you call us Time-servers Weather-cocks blinde Pharisees Ministers of Antichrist false Apostles blood-thirsty men Popish swearers forswearers drunkards lyars seducers Jews Hereticks men of no Religion that our Doctrines are destructive and damnable yea Devils and the like and this you have set your hands to But I shall indeavour with the Apostle being reviled to blesse or as the Apostle commands us to imitate Christ who being reviled reviled not again but committed himself to God who judgeth righteously 1 Pet. 2. 23. I would willingly speak something to every materiall passage in your Letter but I shall passe by many of those extravagancies which I am willing charitably to beleeve did unadvisedly drop from your pen and not take notice of them for should I stay upon every piece of your madnesse and folly the profit redounding to you or me of such a work would not countervail the labour I shall therefore passe over all your bitternesse base slanders your reproaches your reviling and railing accusations with the words of Michael the Archangel contending with the Devill The Lord rebuke you and the Lord help you to see from what spirit they come I heartily pitie you as knowing the Author of these and that nothing of what you have sent comes immediately from your selves though by reason of your ignorance you have been easily seduced and led to set your hands to and in that to speak evil of those things you know not I shall therefore speak onely to such passages in your Letter as do demonstrate to any common eye the undeniable footsteps of the spirit of Error walking amongst you I hope the Lord will inable me so to discover it to you that you may at present be ashamed and grieve that you have been nursing fathers to any of Satans brood and that for the time to come ye may with all carefulnesse learn to avoid the deepdeceit of that seeming Angell of light To begin You first say you present me with such particulars as you could not but dislike except you should be as many now adayes meer Time-servers and men-pleasers and so prove perfidious to your principles and prof●ssions and make shipwrack of faith and a good conscience and betray your freedoms into the hands of your blood-thirstie adversaries that have so long sought your downfall To this I answer First that many of your dislikes presented in your Paper are such that if you father the ground of them upon me you are false accusers if you look into the 8. Joh. 44. ver Christ will tell you that the Devill is a lyar and the father of lyes And therefore look to it if I am not mistaken the one half of you at least who have subscribed this Paper and these exceptions against my praying and preaching were not present when either of those Sermons were preached yet it seems that beleeving by an implicite faith you have set your hands to them 't was bravely and boldly ventured 2ly