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woman_n church_n time_n wilderness_n 1,494 5 9.8942 5 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A18933 The conuerted Iew or Certaine dialogues betweene Micheas a learned Iew and others, touching diuers points of religion, controuerted betweene the Catholicks and Protestants. Written by M. Iohn Clare a Catholicke priest, of the Society of Iesus. Dedicated to the two Vniuersities of Oxford and Cambridge ... Clare, John, 1577-1628.; Anderton, Lawrence, attributed name.; Anderton, Roger, d. 1640?, attributed name. 1630 (1630) STC 5351; ESTC S122560 323,604 470

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apostle_n do_v not_o see_v but_o only_o believe_v in_o pag._n 28._o and_o 29._o as_o also_o in_o some_o other_o page_n afore_o he_o much_o insist_v in_o the_o word_n speak_v of_o the_o woman_n in_o the_o revelation_n cap._n 12._o of_o who_o it_o be_v prophesy_v that_o she_o shall_v fly_v into_o the_o wilderness_n affirm_v that_o by_o the_o woman_n be_v understand_v the_o church_n which_o be_v not_o to_o be_v see_v in_o time_n of_o persecution_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v first_o this_o passage_n be_v take_v from_o out_o of_o the_o revelation_n can_v as_o evident_o to_o we_o man_n prove_v any_o thing_n see_v the_o revelation_n be_v deliver_v in_o vision_n &_o prophecy_n many_o of_o they_o be_v yet_o unaccomplish_v and_o figurative_a speech_n we_o can_v so_o easy_o apprehend_v the_o true_a sense_n &_o meaning_n of_o they_o second_o what_o diverse_a learned_a catholic_n and_o some_o protestant_n do_v understand_v by_o the_o woman_n in_o the_o revelation_n different_o from_o the_o urge_v of_o
this_o author_n be_v set_v down_o above_o in_o the_o first_o part_n or_o beginning_n of_o the_o former_a dialogue_n three_o admit_v that_o by_o the_o woman_n be_v understand_v the_o church_n in_o persecution_n yet_o follow_v it_o not_o that_o therefore_o she_o shall_v be_v invisible_a which_o be_v the_o point_n for_o which_o it_o be_v urge_v here_o see_v a_o church_n in_o that_o it_o be_v persecute_v even_o in_o that_o respect_n be_v become_v visible_a as_o be_v prove_v in_o the_o treatise_n above_o though_o otherwise_o it_o be_v grant_v it_o be_v not_o so_o glorious_o eminent_a as_o it_o be_v in_o time_n of_o prosperity_n now_o whereas_o the_o author_n pag._n 29._o from_o the_o woman_n mention_v in_o the_o revelation_n fly_v into_o wilderness_n thus_o dispute_v the_o true_a church_n be_v for_o the_o time_n out_o of_o sight_n in_o the_o wilderness_n but_o so_o say_v they_o mean_v we_o catholic_n be_v their_o church_n never_o therefore_o will_v they_o will_v they_o their_o church_n be_v not_o the_o true_a church_n here_o ignorance_n mix_v with_o extreme_a boldness_n dispute_v for_o whereas_o learned_a man_n both_o catholic_n &_o protestant_n as_o appear_v in_o the_o former_a treatise_n make_v a_o continual_a visibility_n to_o be_v a_o mark_n of_o the_o true_a church_n here_o the_o author_n diametrical_o cross_v all_o former_a authoritye_n above_o allege_v teach_v that_o that_o church_n which_o ever_o have_v be_v visible_a and_o never_o out_o of_o sight_n to_o use_v his_o own_o word_n can_v be_v the_o true_a church_n and_o consequent_o that_o the_o catholic_a roman_a church_n be_v not_o the_o true_a church_n thus_o he_o contrary_a to_o all_o other_o author_n make_v a_o inuisibility_n to_o be_v a_o necessary_a mark_n of_o the_o true_a church_n ad_fw-la hereto_o as_o afore_o be_v intimate_v that_o if_o in_o this_o pamphleteer_n judgement_n the_o true_a church_n must_v sometime_o even_o of_o necessity_n be_v out_o of_o sight_n and_o in_o wilderness_n or_o otherwise_o not_o the_o true_a church_n how_o then_o do_v not_o this_o main_o fight_v with_o the_o title_n of_o his_o book_n to_o wit_n of_o the_o perpetual_a visibility_n and_o succession_n of_o the_o true_a church_n in_o all_o age_n and_o why_o shall_v not_o the_o title_n thereof_o rather_o be_v of_o the_o interrupt_a and_o discontinue_v visibility_n of_o the_o true_a church_n and_o thus_o far_o of_o the_o first_o part_n of_o this_o pamphlet_n in_o which_o we_o see_v how_o painful_o the_o author_n have_v labour_v sometime_o to_o prove_v that_o the_o church_n of_o god_n must_v at_o certain_a season_n be_v more_o glorious_a and_o resplendent_a then_o at_o other_o though_o no_o catholic_a deny_v this_o and_o therefore_o the_o prouffe_n of_o it_o be_v but_o impertinent_o undertake_v at_o other_o time_n as_o in_o his_o last_o produce_v sentence_n and_o argument_n as_o also_o in_o some_o passage_n above_o cite_v to_o prove_v that_o the_o true_a church_n must_v be_v often_o whole_o invisible_a plain_o thwart_v the_o inscription_n of_o his_o book_n but_o his_o affect_a calumny_n here_o whereby_o he_o betray_v his_o own_o guiltiness_n in_o these_o his_o unworthy_a script_n be_v only_o to_o prefix_v this_o discourse_n of_o the_o church_n obscurity_n or_o rather_o inuisibility_n that_o it_o may_v serve_v as_o a_o excuse_n and_o for_o a_o plaster_v over_o of_o those_o few_o weak_a and_o false_a example_n of_o protestancy_n in_o former_a age_n allege_v after_o in_o this_o pamphlet_n by_o he_o for_o he_o hope_v that_o by_o this_o his_o former_a insinuation_n of_o the_o church_n obscurity_n the_o reader_n will_v less_o expect_v any_o full_a demonstration_n and_o certain_a argument_n of_o the_o protestant_n church_n visibility_n in_o former_a time_n and_o the_o rather_o see_v such_o a_o unterrupted_a visibility_n be_v not_o in_o this_o man_n ween_a necessary_a to_o the_o true_a church_n now_o here_o we_o will_v further_o track_v this_o author_n in_o his_o passage_n who_o whether_o he_o be_v d._n white_a or_o d._n fear_o or_o some_o other_o next_o begin_v with_o extraordinary_a calumnye_n &_o deceate_n to_o exemplify_v his_o protestant_n for_o certain_a age_n for_o whereas_o he_o ought_v to_o prove_v even_o from_o the_o title_n of_o his_o book_n and_o the_o controversy_n of_o the_o protestant_n church_n visibility_n now_o ventilate_v between_o we_o and_o his_o party_n that_o the_o protestant_a church_n see_v he_o presume_v it_o to_o be_v the_o true_a church_n have_v be_v visible_a for_o the_o space_n of_o sixteen_o hundred_o year_n for_o so_o long_o since_o and_o more_o it_o be_v since_o our_o saviour_n incarnation_n he_o produce_v example_n admit_v they_o for_o true_a only_o for_o four_o hundred_o year_n at_o the_o most_o and_o immediate_o before_o luther_n so_o leave_v one_o thousand_o and_o one_o hundred_o year_n and_o more_o a_o small_a time_n you_o see_v whole_o destitute_v of_o any_o one_o produce_v example_n of_o protestancy_n he_o salve_v this_o his_o omission_n or_o leave_v over_o these_o eleven_o hundred_o year_n in_o this_o manner_n follow_v what_o 100_o the_o old_a father_n teach_v mean_v the_o father_n of_o the_o primative_a church_n as_o be_v protestant_n we_o have_v time_n hereafter_o to_o show_v which_o time_n of_o his_o show_n what_o they_o teach_v be_v not_o yet_o come_v and_o of_o the_o suppose_a protestant_n between_o the_o primative_a church_n and_o the_o time_n of_o waldo_n he_o ascend_v no_o high_a than_o waldo_n be_v about_o six_o hundred_o year_n he_o use_v this_o preterition_n we_o shall_v 89._o not_o need_v to_o ascend_v any_o high_a meaning_n any_o high_a from_o luther_n then_o to_o waldo_n which_o otherwise_o to_o make_v plain_a be_v as_o easy_a as_o to_o deliver_v that_o which_o hitherto_o i_o have_v speak_v and_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v conceive_v that_o petrus_n waldo_n of_o who_o the_o waldenses_n do_v take_v their_o name_n at_o lion_n have_v his_o doctrine_n from_o no_o body_n etc._n etc._n be_v not_o this_o a_o very_a learned_a satisfaction_n think_v you_o or_o rather_o a_o satisfaction_n unworthy_a to_o proceed_v from_o any_o man_n profess_v learning_n for_o instance_v of_o the_o be_v of_o protestant_n from_o christ_n his_o time_n to_o the_o day_n of_o waldo_n contain_v about_o twelve_o hundred_o year_n or_o but_o little_a less_a for_o all_o which_o time_n he_o instance_v not_o in_o any_o one_o protestant_a but_o whole_o slip_v it_o over_o notwithstanding_o the_o catholic_n ever_o earnest_a provoke_v of_o the_o protestant_n herein_o or_o can_v any_o impartial_a judgement_n demand_v for_o instance_n of_o protestancy_n during_o all_o or_o any_o of_o those_o former_a age_n rest_z thus_o content_v here_o then_o good_a reader_n thou_o see_v how_o this_o author_n abuse_v thou_o who_o deal_v with_o thou_o herein_o no_o otherwise_o then_o if_o he_o just_o and_o true_o owe_v thou_o sixteen_o hundred_o pound_n shall_v in_o speech_n vaunt_o pretend_v that_o he_o have_v pay_v thou_o every_o penny_n thereof_o and_o yet_o he_o come_v to_o particular_a account_n and_o reckon_n with_o thou_o shall_v be_v able_a to_o prove_v that_o he_o have_v pay_v thou_o and_o this_o also_o but_o in_o counterfeit_n silver_n only_a four_o hundred_o pound_n affirm_v in_o lieu_n of_o further_a payment_n that_o he_o will_v be_v as_o able_a to_o pay_v thou_o all_o the_o rest_n as_o he_o have_v already_o do_v this_o lesser_a somme_n will_v thou_o not_o take_v such_o a_o one_o for_o a_o most_o dishonest_a and_o perfidious_a man_n the_o case_n of_o this_o treatiser_n be_v here_o just_a the_o same_o but_o to_o return_v to_o the_o father_n of_o the_o primative_a church_n of_o who_o he_o say_v what_o they_o teach_v he_o will_v hereafter_o show_v meaning_n belike_o in_o some_o other_o book_n hereafter_o to_o come_v forth_o of_o that_o labour_n he_o be_v now_o already_o prevent_v and_o therefore_o the_o reader_n may_v find_v in_o the_o conclusion_n to_o the_o former_a dialogue_n that_o by_o the_o confession_n of_o most_o learned_a protestant_n the_o father_n be_v absolute_a papist_n as_o we_o be_v call_v and_o be_v therefore_o by_o the_o say_a protestant_n utter_o reject_v in_o which_o former_a passage_n be_v also_o prove_v from_o the_o protestant_n like_o confession_n that_o all_o the_o professor_n of_o christianity_n between_o the_o time_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n and_o the_o day_n of_o waldo_n contain_v six_o hundred_o year_n at_o least_o be_v whole_o of_o our_o present_a roman_a religion_n and_o not_o any_o of_o they_o a_o protestant_n but_o let_v we_o now_o in_o this_o next_o place_n come_v to_o his_o particular_a instance_n of_o protestancy_n for_o the_o space_n of_o four_o hundred_o year_n only_o above_o mention_v in_o set_v down_o of_o which_o the_o pamphleter_n use_v this_o ensue_a policy_n for_o indeed_o he_o be_v a_o man_n whole_o make_v of_o sophistication_n deceat_n and_o collusion_n he_o do_v not_o begin_v
into_o the_o wilderness_n etc._n etc._n all_o which_o place_n be_v strange_o de●orted_v by_o some_o few_o iniudicious_a man_n to_o the_o defence_n of_o the_o church_n inuisibility_n and_o to_o the_o first_o against_o these_o inuisibilist_n i_o say_v touch_v those_o former_a word_n of_o elias_n first_o admit_v the_o jewish_a synagogue_n to_o have_v be_v then_o invisible_a yet_o be_v this_o example_n defective_o allege_v as_o apply_v to_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n since_o the_o prediction_n and_o promise_v make_v to_o christ_n his_o church_n who_o 8._o testament_n be_v establish_v in_o better_a promise_n be_v far_o great_a and_o more_o worthy_a than_o those_o of_o the_o jewish_a synagogue_n again_o the_o foresay_a example_n do_v not_o extend_v to_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o god_n before_o christ_n but_o only_o to_o the_o jewish_a synagogue_n be_v only_o but_o a_o part_n or_o member_n thereof_o for_o beside_o the_o jew_n there_o be_v diverse_a other_o faithful_a as_o melchisadech_n cornelius_n the_o eunuch_n to_o the_o queen_n of_o caudace_n etc._n etc._n second_o i_o say_v this_o example_n make_v whole_o against_o the_o alleadger_n of_o it_o since_o the_o word_n of_o elias_n be_v speak_v not_o general_o of_o all_o the_o jewish_a people_n but_o only_o in_o regard_n of_o the_o country_n of_o israel_n and_o according_o god_n answer_v the_o complaint_n of_o elias_n with_o restraint_n to_o that_o only_a country_n the_o text_n say_v i_o have_v leave_v to_o i_o in_o israel_n seven_o thousand_o which_o have_v not_o bow_v unto_o ba●l_n add_v hereto_o that_o in_o those_o very_a time_n the_o church_n do_v great_o flourish_v in_o the_o adjoin_v country_n of_o juda_n and_o be_v to_o elias_n then_o know_v and_o visible_a under_o the_o reign_n of_o asa_n and_o josaphat_n and_o thus_o be_v this_o objection_n answer_v even_o by_o melancthon_n 530._o and_o enoch_n clapham_n 17._o last_o admit_v these_o seven_o thousand_o be_v unknown_a to_o elias_n yet_o follow_v it_o not_o that_o they_o be_v unknown_a to_o all_o other_o of_o the_o same_o time_n much_o less_o than_o be_v this_o example_n of_o force_n to_o prove_v that_o the_o church_n of_o god_n may_v be_v latent_fw-la and_o invisible_a for_o many_o hundred_o year_n together_o as_o some_o of_o our_o ignorant_a brethren_n do_v teach_v not_o to_o one_o elias_n only_a but_o to_o the_o whole_a world_n and_o thus_o far_o of_o this_o so_o much_o urge_v example_n of_o elias_n to_o the_o second_o those_o word_n of_o the_o prophet_n the_o oast_n &_o sacrifice_n shall_v cease_v etc._n etc._n be_v to_o be_v refer_v to_o the_o overthrow_n of_o jerusalem_n and_o the_o cease_n of_o the_o jewish_a sacrifice_n even_o by_o the_o exposition_n of_o m●chae●_n chrysostome_n chrysost_n jerome_n esichium_n austin_n &_o other_o neither_o can_v the_o word_n be_v proper_o extend_v to_o the_o time_n of_o antichrist_n since_o we_o teach_v that_o antichrist_n be_v already_o come_v and_o yet_o we_o see_v that_o sacrifice_n do_v still_o remain_v to_o the_o three_o by_o the_o word_n departure_n mention_v by_o the_o apostle_n be_v understand_v either_o antichrist_n himself_o by_o the_o figure_n metonymy_fw-la because_o he_o shall_v be_v the_o cause_n why_o many_o shall_v depart_v from_o christ_n as_o chrysostome_n and_o theodoret_n upon_o this_o place_n do_v expound_v as_o also_o austin_n 19_o or_o rather_o be_v understand_v a_o departure_n and_o defection_n from_o the_o roman_a empire_n as_o ambrose_n sedulius_n primasius_n and_o diverse_a protestant_n 21._o do_v expound_v this_o text._n to_o the_o four_o i_o answer_v that_o by_o the_o woman_n fly_v into_o wilderness_n s._n john_n mean_v not_o any_o local_a or_o corporal_a flight_n out_o of_o the_o knowledge_n and_o notice_n of_o the_o world_n but_o only_o a_o spiritual_a retire_n in_o hart_n from_o the_o allurement_n and_o pleasure_n of_o the_o world_n to_o penance_n mortification_n and_o contemplation_n of_o celestial_a matter_n and_o in_o this_o very_a sense_n bullenger_n interprete_v the_o church_n flight_n from_o babylon_n to_o the_o former_a text_n i_o may_v add_v though_o not_o above_o mention_v that_o passage_n in_o saint_n john_n 4._o venit_fw-la hora_fw-la &_o nunc_fw-la est_fw-la etc._n etc._n the_o hour_n come_v and_o now_o be_v when_o the_o true_a adorer_n shall_v adore_v the_o father_n in_o spirit_n and_o truth_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v that_o our_o lord_n here_o teach_v that_o the_o chief_a worship_n of_o god_n which_o shall_v be_v exhibit_v in_o his_o church_n consist_v in_o a_o internal_a worship_n of_o he_o but_o from_o hence_o therefore_o it_o follow_v not_o that_o the_o church_n be_v invisible_a or_o that_o all_o external_a worship_n be_v prohibit_v for_o our_o lord_n here_o speak_v not_o of_o the_o place_n where_o god_n shall_v be_v worship_v but_o of_o the_o manner_n and_o rite_n of_o worship_v chrysostome_n cyrill_n and_o euthimius_n upon_o this_o place_n do_v oppose_v those_o word_n in_o spirit_n to_o the_o ceremony_n of_o the_o jew_n as_o they_o be_v corporal_a and_o those_o other_o word_n in_o truth_n to_o the_o say_a ceremony_n as_o they_o be_v figure_n of_o thing_n to_o come_v now_o because_o diverse_a of_o the_o former_a passage_n of_o scripture_n be_v object_v to_o prove_v that_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n shall_v be_v invisible_a at_o the_o least_o in_o the_o time_n of_o antichrist_n i_o do_v reply_n further_o hereto_o say_v first_o that_o the_o former_a place_n of_o the_o apostle_n to_o the_o ephesian_n allege_v by_o ochinus_n touch_v a_o incessant_a &_o undiscontinue_v be_v of_o pastor_n &_o doctor_n in_o the_o church_n to_o remain_v even_o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n omit_v other_o text_n above_o cite_v by_o he_o as_o also_o the_o protestant_n confession_n of_o the_o church_n ever_o visibility_n hereafter_o to_o be_v deliver_v by_o michaeas_n do_v full_o answer_v and_o satisfy_v the_o suppose_a doubt_n suggest_v in_o the_o former_a text_n touch_v the_o church_n inuisibility_n in_o the_o time_n of_o antichrist_n second_o i_o reply_v that_o diverse_a learned_a brethren_n of_o we_o punctual_o and_o purposely_o with_o reference_n to_o that_o time_n do_v teach_v that_o the_o church_n shall_v remain_v then_o visible_a and_o to_o give_v some_o taste_n hereof_o d._n pulke_o thus_o write_v in_o 2._o the_o time_n of_o antichrist_n the_o church_n be_v not_o drive_v into_o any_o corner_n of_o the_o world_n but_o be_v be_v &_o shall_v be_v disperse_v in_o many_o nation_n and_o again_o he_o thus_o write_v the_o supra_fw-la true_a church_n though_o obscure_v and_o drive_v into_o wilderness_n by_o antichrist_n yet_o shall_v continue_v disperse_v over_o the_o world_n bullenger_n say_v the_o church_n in_o the_o time_n of_o antichrist_n shall_v be_v right_v 200._o famous_a but_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v then_o right_o famous_a it_o must_v of_o necessity_n be_v then_o visible_a to_o be_v short_a szegedine_n a_o learned_a protestant_n thus_o write_v the_o minister_n of_o god_n word_n shall_v preach_v all_o the_o time_n in_o which_o antichrist_n shall_v tread_v underfoot_o the_o holy_a 368._o city_n thus_o far_o in_o solution_n of_o all_o such_o chief_a passage_n of_o scripture_n usual_o object_v against_o the_o perpetual_a visibility_n of_o the_o church_n but_o now_o m._n doctor_n i_o think_v it_o be_v your_o turn_n to_o warrant_v the_o former_a truth_n from_o the_o write_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n and_o from_o argument_n of_o credibility_n which_o the_o force_n of_o reason_n itself_o do_v minister_v doctor_n reynolds_n i_o be_o prepare_v thereto_o and_o i_o will_v not_o press_v your_o memory_n with_o a_o needle_n overcharge_v of_o their_o sentence_n some_o few_o and_o those_o pertinent_a shall_v serve_v though_o otherwise_o they_o be_v most_o luxuriant_a and_o plentiful_a herein_o and_o first_o thus_o origin_n write_v ecclesia_fw-la math●eum_n est_fw-la plaena_fw-la fulgore_fw-la ab_fw-la oriente_fw-la usque_fw-la ad_fw-la occidentem_fw-la the_o church_n be_v full_a of_o fulgour_fw-la or_o brightness_n from_o the_o east_n even_o to_o the_o west_n cyprian_n discourse_v thus_o ecclesia_fw-la eccle._n dom._n etc._n etc._n the_o church_n of_o our_o lord_n be_v replenish_v with_o light_n cast_v forth_o it_o beam_n throughout_o the_o whole_a earth_n chrysostome_n joan._n say_v facilius_fw-la est_fw-la solemn_a extingui_fw-la quam_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la obscurari_fw-la it_o be_v more_o easy_a for_o the_o sun_n to_o be_v extinguish_v than_o the_o church_n to_o be_v obscure_v or_o darken_v final_o for_o great_a conpendiousnesse_n s._n austin_n be_v so_o full_a in_o this_o point_n as_o that_o he_o make_v the_o visibility_n of_o the_o church_n a_o mark_n for_o the_o ignorant_a to_o discern_v the_o true_a church_n of_o christ_n from_o all_o false_a conventicle_n thus_o write_v propter_fw-la hoc_fw-la enim_fw-la motus_fw-la etc._n etc._n 1._o by_o reason_n of_o the_o temptation_n of_o those_o who_o be_v weak_a and_o may_v be_v seduce_v by_o some_o from_o acknowledge_v the_o church_n
brother_n because_o a_o ospring_n be_v then_o beget_v of_o that_o former_a mariadg_n to_o wit_n the_o daughter_n of_o herodiades_n who_o so_o please_v the_o king_n with_o dance_v that_o she_o obtain_v the_o head_n of_o s._n john_n baptist_n that_o this_o daughter_n be_v the_o daughter_n of_o herodiades_n beget_v by_o the_o brother_n of_o herod_n be_v acknowledge_v by_o the_o testimony_n of_o matheun●_n chrisostome_n second_o i_o further_a answer_n to_o this_o example_n of_o herod_n that_o the_o sin_n of_o herod_n be_v not_o only_a incest_n but_o also_o adultery_n since_o herod_n do_v marye_n the_o wife_n of_o his_o brother_n he_o be_v yet_o live_v as_o s._n mathae●m_n jerom_n witness_v out_o of_o ancient_a history_n and_o 9_o josephus_n aver_v the_o same_o thus_o far_o then_o of_o this_o point_n to_o show_v that_o all_o the_o precept_n of_o le●iticus_n touch_v the_o prohibit_v degree_n in_o mariadg_n be_v not_o command_v by_o the_o law_n of_o nature_n and_o that_o they_o do_v not_o oblige_v christian_n by_o divine_a law_n for_o the_o ever_o observe_v of_o they_o but_o that_o some_o of_o they_o be_v in_o themselves_o dispensable_a and_o consequent_o that_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n may_v upon_o most_o urgent_a occasion_n sometime_o dispense_v with_o some_o of_o the_o say_a precept_n now_o hear_v then_o appear_v the_o inconsiderate_n and_o rash_a obloquy_n of_o our_o adversary_n charge_v the_o pope_n that_o he_o teach_v mariadg_n to_o be_v a_o sacrament_n consequent_o by_o his_o own_o doctrine_n undertake_v and_o presume_v to_o alter_v the_o matter_n or_o essential_a part_n of_o a_o sacrament_n which_o be_v first_o institute_v by_o christ_n and_o therefore_o inaltorable_a by_o man._n to_o which_o false_a aspersion_n i_o answer_v that_o neither_o the_o pope_n nor_o the_o church_n can_v change_v the_o essential_a part_n of_o this_o or_o any_o other_o sacrament_n for_o we_o be_v hear_v to_o conceive_v that_o the_o matter_n of_o this_o sacrament_n be_v not_o the_o join_v together_o of_o every_o man_n or_o woman_n since_o then_o this_o sacrament_n may_v be_v perfect_v between_o the_o father_n and_o the_o daughter_n but_o only_o the_o join_v together_o of_o lawful_a person_n now_o which_o be_v lawful_a person_n for_o mariadg_n christ_n do_v not_o appoint_v or_o set_v down_o but_o only_o a_o humane_a contract_n between_o lawful_a person_n be_v presuppose_v christ_n himself_o do_v advance_v this_o conjunction_n to_o the_o dignity_n of_o a_o sacrament_n therefore_o the_o church_n or_o the_o pope_n do_v only_o determine_v who_o be_v to_o be_v account_v lawful_a person_n for_o the_o contract_n of_o marriage_n and_o in_o this_o sort_n the_o church_n do_v only_o prepare_v the_o matter_n or_o foundation_n fit_v for_o this_o sacrament_n but_o do_v not_o nor_o can_v alter_v and_o change_v the_o essential_a part_n of_o the_o sacrament_n of_o marriage_n and_o herewith_o i_o conclude_v this_o short_a discourse_n touch_v this_o subject_n that_o the_o catholic_n do_v not_o expunge_v out_o of_o god_n write_v or_o reject_v those_o word_n in_o the_o decalogue_n thou_o shall_v not_o make_v to_o thyself_o any_o grave_a image_n etc._n etc._n but_o that_o they_o willing_o acknowledge_v they_o as_o part_v of_o the_o decalogue_n howsoever_o they_o be_v not_o sometime_o set_v down_o in_o cathechis●es_n and_o primars_n whereas_o the_o protestant_n do_v charge_n the_o catholic_n to_o conceal_v through_o their_o affect_a fraud_n in_o their_o catechis●nes_n and_o primars_n one_o commandment_n and_o so_o to_o expunge_v it_o out_o of_o holy_a writ_n to_o wit_n thou_o shall_v not_o make_v to_o thyself_o any_o grave_a image_n nor_o the_o likeness_n of_o anything_o above_o in_o heaven_n or_o on_o earth_n beneath_o neither_o of_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v in_o the_o water_n under_o the_o earth_n thou_o shall_v nor_o adore_v they_o or_o worship_v they_o etc._n etc._n this_o i_o say_v be_v either_o a_o fraudulent_a or_o a_o ignorant_a mistake_n of_o our_o adversary_n for_o the_o truth_n be_v those_o word_n here_o recite_v do_v but_o make_v one_o and_o the_o same_o commandment_n with_o those_o first_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o have_v any_o other_o god_n before_o i_o these_o late_a being_n but_o a_o more_o full_a explication_n of_o the_o first_o word_n and_o consequent_o may_v be_v omit_v sometime_o in_o a_o short_a number_v or_o set_v down_o of_o the_o commandment_n this_o be_v thus_o prove_v every_o image_n be_v not_o prohibit_v in_o the_o decalogue_n or_o ten_o commandment_n but_o only_o that_o which_o may_v be_v true_o call_v a_o idol_n that_o be_v a_o image_n which_o be_v take_v for_o god_n or_o which_o represent_v god_n to_o be_v that_o thing_n which_o god_n be_v not_o therefore_o when_o it_o be_v say_v thou_o shall_v not_o make_v to_o thyself_o any_o grave_a image_n etc._n etc._n the_o exterior_a act_n of_o idolatry_n be_v forbid_v but_o in_o those_o first_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o have_v any_o other_o god_n before_o i_o the_o internal_a act_n of_o idolatry_n be_v prohibit_v of_o which_o point_n most_o at_o large_a saint_n austin_n 77._o discourse_v now_o that_o image_n be_v not_o absolute_o forbid_v by_o the_o law_n of_o god_n appear_v in_o that_o the_o scripture_n tell_v we_o that_o god_n himself_o command_v image_n to_o be_v make_v according_a here_o to_o we_o read_v in_o the_o book_n of_o king_n 7._o that_o god_n command_v the_o image_n of_o the_o cherubin_n lion_n and_o ox_n to_o be_v make_v in_o the_o book_n of_o number_n 21._o the_o brazen_a serpent_n and_o in_o exodus_fw-la 25._o the_o image_n of_o the_o cherubin_n to_o be_v make_v from_o whence_o we_o may_v infallible_o conclude_v that_o the_o make_n of_o image_n be_v not_o absolute_o forbid_v by_o god_n as_o a_o distinct_a precept_n from_o the_o first_o but_o only_o so_o far_o forth_o as_o the_o image_n be_v take_v for_o god_n and_o consequent_o that_o as_o be_v above_o say_v these_o word_n forbid_v the_o make_n of_o image_n do_v but_o make_v one_o &_o the_o same_o commandment_n with_o the_o first_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o have_v any_o other_o god_n before_o i_o and_o therefore_o the_o catholic_n do_v not_o fraudulent_o conceal_v one_o of_o the_o ten_o commandment_n as_o our_o adversary_n do_v in_o their_o pulpit_n tragical_o complain_v again_o if_o all_o image_n shall_v be_v absolute_o prohibit_v in_o the_o former_a word_n of_o the_o decalogue_n then_o shall_v it_o follow_v that_o the_o precept_n of_o the_o decalogue_n shall_v not_o be_v only_o ten_o but_o eleven_o or_o twelve_o a_o inference_n incompatible_a with_o the_o scripture_n 10._o itself_o which_o in_o express_a word_n teach_v that_o there_o be_v but_o ten_o commandment_n the_o necessity_n of_o this_o inference_n be_v thus_o prove_v it_o be_v grant_v on_o all_o side_n that_o those_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o have_v any_o other_o god_n before_o i_o be_v one_o precept_n that_o thou_o shall_v not_o take_v the_o name_n of_o god_n in_o vain_a be_v a_o other_o a_o three_o thou_o shall_v keep_v holy_a the_o sabbath_n day_n a_o four_o honour_v thy_o father_n and_o thy_o mother_n a_o five_o thou_o shall_v not_o kill_v a_o six_o thou_o shall_v not_o commit_v adultery_n a_o seven_o thou_o shall_v not_o steal_v a_o eight_o thou_o shall_v not_o bear_v false_a witness_n against_o thy_o neighbour_n a_o nine_o thou_o shall_v no●_n covet_v etc._n etc._n now_o that_o thou_o shall_v not_o covet_v etc._n etc._n be_v either_o to_o be_v divide_v into_o two_o precept_n so_o as_o the_o nine_o precept_n shall_v be_v thou_o shall_v not_o covet_v thy_o neighbour_n wife_n the_o ten_o thou_o shall_v not_o coact_v thy_o neighbour_n ox_n nor_o his_o ass_n nor_o any_o thing_n that_o be_v he_o or_o else_o those_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o covet_v etc._n etc._n with_o all_o the_o word_n follow_v to_o wit_n his_o wife_n his_o ox_n his_o ass_n or_o any_o thing_n that_o be_v he_o do_v make_v but_o one_o precept_n or_o commandment_n if_o they_o ought_v to_o be_v divide_v into_o two_o then_o follow_v it_o that_o those_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o make_v any_o grave_a ●mage_n &c._n &c._n shall_v be_v the_o eleven_o commandment_n contrary_a to_o the_o scripture_n or_o that_o this_o be_v not_o a_o distinct_a precept_n from_o the_o first_o videlicet_fw-la thou_o shall_v not_o have_v any_o other_o god_n before_o i_o as_o clemens_n alexander_n citum_fw-la saint_n 11._o austin_n all_o schoolman_n and_o latin_a catechism_n do_v teach_v and_o then_o it_o follow_v that_o not_o every_o grave_a image_n be_v forbid_v in_o these_o word_n but_o only_o that_o which_o be_v take_v for_o a_o other_o god_n now_o if_o suppose_v further_o that_o that_o thou_o shall_v not_o covet_v etc._n etc._n be_v only_o one_o precept_n as_o some_o other_o father_n do_v hold_v then_o to_o make_v up_o the_o ten_o commandment_n all_o those_o word_n thou_o shall_v not_o
and_o samaria_n and_o again_o there_o they_o be_v receive_v of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o apostle_n act._n 18._o paul_n go_v up_o and_o salute_v the_o church_n now_o how_o can_v these_o text_n be_v possible_o apply_v to_o any_o invisible_a congregation_n or_o company_n of_o man_n furthermore_o s._n paul_n speak_v of_o himself_o that_o he_o persecute_v the_o church_n of_o god_n as_o in_o 1._o cor._n 15._o galat._n 1_o philipp_n 3._o in_o all_o which_o place_n the_o word_n church_n be_v use_v but_o it_o be_v well_o know_v who_o s._n paul_n do_v persecute_v and_o in_o 1._o timoth._n 3_o it_o be_v say_v how_o to_o converse_v indomo_fw-la dei_fw-la quae_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la dei_fw-la in_o the_o house_n of_o the_o live_a god_n which_o be_v the_o church_n of_o god_n but_o how_o can_v timothee_n know_v how_o to_o converse_v in_o the_o house_n of_o god_n except_o he_o do_v know_v which_o be_v this_o house_n to_o all_o which_o former_a text_n of_o scripture_n i_o annex_v this_o one_o note_n a_o point_n much_o to_o be_v consider_v that_o not_o any_o one_o place_n of_o scripture_n can_v be_v produce_v wherein_o the_o word_n church_n be_v name_v but_o that_o a_o visible_a and_o external_a company_n of_o man_n be_v necessary_o understand_v thereby_o to_o the_o former_a scripture_n may_v be_v add_v certain_a description_n of_o the_o church_n in_o other_o passage_n thereof_o as_o in_o isaiah_n 2._o daniel_n 3._o michaeas_n 4._o the_o church_n be_v compare_v to_o a_o conspicuous_a mountain_n which_o can_v be_v unseen_a according_a to_o the_o exposition_n of_o jerom_n locum_fw-la austin_n joannis_n and_o the_o protestant_n 2._o in_o like_a sort_n in_o psalm_n 18._o those_o word_n he_o place_v his_o tabernacle_n in_o the_o sun_n be_v thus_o paraphraze_v by_o s._n joan._n austin_n in_o manifesto_fw-la posuit_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la svam_fw-la etc._n etc._n he_o place_v his_o tabernacle_n in_o a_o open_a place_n his_o tabernacle_n be_v his_o church_n which_o be_v place_v in_o the_o sun_n not_o in_o the_o night_n but_o in_o the_o day_n thus_o austin_n another_o most_o illustrious_a &_o convince_a passag_n of_o the_o scripture_n for_o the_o church_n visibility_n be_v that_o in_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o ephesian_n c._n 4._o where_o it_o be_v say_v of_o christ_n he_o give_v pastor_n &_o doctor_n to_o the_o consummation_n of_o saint_n unto_o the_o work_n of_o the_o ministry_n till_o we_o all_o meet_v in_o the_o unity_n of_o faith_n that_o be_v as_o d._n 4._o fulke_n interprete_v for_o ever_o these_o word_n necessary_o import_v that_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n must_v at_o all_o time_n and_o season_n and_o this_o without_o any_o interruption_n have_v pastor_n to_o administer_v the_o sacrament_n and_o preach_v the_o word_n which_o exposition_n be_v grant_v imply_v necessary_o a_o ever_o visibility_n of_o the_o church_n for_o how_o can_v those_o doctor_n and_o pastor_n preach_v at_o all_o time_n and_o upon_o all_o occasion_n the_o word_n of_o god_n &_o administer_v the_o sacrament_n if_o they_o be_v conceal_v and_o lie_v in_o secret_a or_o how_o can_v the_o person_n to_o who_o the_o word_n be_v preach_v &_o the_o sacrament_n dispense_v become_v unknown_a or_o invisible_a that_o this_o be_v the_o true_a interpretation_n of_o the_o former_a text_n of_o the_o ephesian_n be_v general_o teach_v by_o our_o own_o learned_a man_n for_o according_a hereto_o d._n whitaker_n teach_v the_o preach_n of_o the_o word_n and_o the_o administration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n to_o be_v so_o necessary_a to_o the_o church_n that_o he_o thus_o say_v 249._o si_fw-la adsunt_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la constituunt_fw-la &_o tollunt_fw-la si_fw-la aufer_fw-la antur_fw-la with_o who_o conspire_v d._n willet_n thus_o say_v of_o the_o administration_n of_o the_o word_n &_o sacrament_n these_o 71._o mark_n can_v be_v absent_a from_o the_o church_n and_o it_o be_v no_o long_o a_o true_a church_n than_o it_o have_v these_o mark_n and_o hence_o it_o be_v that_o d._n whitaker_n further_o say_v that_o the_o preach_n of_o the_o word_n and_o the_o administration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n be_v ecclesiae_fw-la 260._o proprietates_fw-la essentiales_fw-la essential_a propr●etyes_n of_o the_o church_n and_o that_o d._n fulke_n thus_o affirm_v christ_n 569._o will_v suffer_v no_o particular_a church_n to_o continue_v without_o a_o seruamt_v to_o oversee_v it_o and_o that_o 536._o pastor_n &_o doctor_n must_v be_v in_o the_o church_n till_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n even_o from_o christ_n time_n to_o luther_n age_n yea_o our_o say_a d._n fulke_v further_o affirm_v that_o these_o b_o pastor_n &_o doctor_n must_v resist_v all_o 11._o false_a opinion_n with_o open_a reprehension_n unto_o our_o former_a brethren_n accord_v other_o protestant_a divine_n thus_o write_v the_o 845._o ministry_n be_v a_o ossentiall_a mark_n of_o the_o true_a church_n final_o calvin_n compart_v with_o we_o all_o herein_o saying_n the_o church_n can_v never_o want_v pastor_n and_o doctor_n so_o true_o do_v we_o protestant_n interpret_v the_o word_n of_o isaiah_n upon_o thy_o 72._o wall_n o_o jerusalem_n i_o have_v set_v watchman_n all_o the_o day_n and_o all_o the_o night_n for_o ever_o they_o shall_v not_o be_v silent_a now_o from_o these_o premise_n we_o demonstracive_o prove_v the_o ever_o and_o uninterrupt_a visibility_n of_o the_o church_n a_o point_n so_o evident_a that_o our_o own_o learned_a protestant_n do_v according_a to_o the_o former_a doctrine_n define_v a_o visible_a church_n in_o these_o word_n a_o 2d_o visible_a church_n be_v a_o congregation_n of_o the_o faithful_a people_n where_o the_o word_n be_v preach_v and_o the_o sacrament_n minister_v which_o definition_n be_v also_o allow_v by_o doctor_n 54._o willet_n and_o which_o even_o in_o reason_n itself_o be_v warrantable_a since_o the_o church_n as_o enjoy_v the_o administration_n of_o the_o word_n and_o sacrament_n must_v even_o in_o that_o respect_n become_v visible_a as_o we_o say_v above_o and_o thus_o far_o of_o this_o prophecy_n of_o the_o apostle_n in_o the_o explication_n whereof_o i_o have_v stay_v the_o long_a in_o that_o it_o irrefragable_o convince_v the_o point_n now_o handle_v and_o here_o i_o end_n touch_v the_o necessary_a visibility_n of_o god_n church_n prove_v out_o of_o the_o sacred_a scripture_n neuseru_n you_o may_v have_v add_v ochinus_n to_o the_o former_a propheeye_n that_o it_o be_v in_o another_o place_n foretell_v of_o the_o church_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n that_o it_o pastor_n 33._o shall_v be_v daily_o multiply_v to_o minister_v unto_o god_n and_o this_o not_o with_o any_o interruption_n herein_o but_o even_o 66._o from_o month_n to_o month_n and_o from_o sabaoth_o to_o sabaoth_o that_o all_o this_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v of_o the_o church_n of_o the_o messiah_n appear_v from_o the_o annotation_n of_o the_o english_a bibles_n upon_o the_o chapter_n here_o cite_v print_v 1576._o you_o also_o may_v further_o have_v insist_v in_o that_o other_o prophecy_n that_o the_o kingdom_n 2._o of_o christ_n shall_v not_o be_v give_v over_o to_o a_o other_o people_n but_o shall_v stand_v for_o ever_o and_o that_o it_o ●0_n shall_v be_v a_o eternal_a glory_n and_o joy_n from_o generation_n to_o generation_n all_o which_o passage_n to_o be_v mean_v of_o the_o church_n be_v acknowledge_v by_o all_o learned_a protestant_n now_o how_o untoward_o and_o unaptly_v these_o passage_n with_o the_o former_a by_o you_o allege_v sort_n to_o a_o company_n of_o professor_n shut_v up_o in_o so_o secret_a a_o manner_n as_o that_o no_o man_n can_v take_v notice_n of_o they_o i_o refer_v to_o any_o man_n judgement_n not_o whole_o blind_v with_o partiality_n and_o prejudice_n but_o i_o fear_v ochinus_n i_o have_v wrong_v you_o in_o undertake_v part_n of_o your_o assume_v task_n therefore_o i_o will_v cease_v and_o descend_v as_o afore_o i_o promise_v to_o answer_v such_o chief_a place_n of_o the_o scripture_n as_o be_v by_o some_o urge_v in_o their_o silly_a write_n the_o impostumou_n swell_v of_o their_o frothy_a pen_n for_o the_o support_v of_o the_o church_n imaginary_a inuisibility_n d._n reynolds_n i_o pray_v you_o neuserus_fw-la proceed_v therein_o since_o obscure_a passage_n in_o any_o kind_n of_o learning_n not_o explayn_v do_v often_o suggest_v tacit_n objection_n perplex_v and_o intricate_a the_o judgment_n of_o the_o weak_a and_o ignorant_a neuseru_n i_o will_n and_o first_o for_o example_n be_v usual_o object_v those_o of_o elias_n when_o he_o say_v relictus_fw-la 〈◊〉_d sum_fw-la solus_fw-la i_o be_o leave_v alone_o as_o also_o that_o sentence_n of_o the_o prophet_n deficiet_fw-la 9_o hostia_fw-la &_o sacrificium_fw-la the_o oast_n and_o sacrifice_v spall_a cease_v and_o again_o that_o of_o the_o apostle_n nisi_fw-la 2._o venerit_fw-la discessio_fw-la primum_fw-la etc._n etc._n except_o there_o come_v first_o a_o departure_n etc._n etc._n and_o final_o that_o of_o the_o apocalypse_n the_o 12._o woman_n must_v fly_v