4. ad 11. 2 Cor. 11. 23. ad 28. and if mighty meanes were such a mighty means to make able Ministers of Christ as is pretended by you Clergymen that tell the State they may as well set Carpenters to build without tools as send forth Ministars without liberal maintenance I wonder there are no better Ministers at Rome where they are maintained more like Monarchs then Ministers of Christ but t is a true proverb that their golden cups made them become such wooden Priests Cum ecclesia peperit divitias filia devoravit matrem you tell the Magistrates that they l discourage persons from medling therwith if they allow not large maintenance to the Ministry But I pray God they may never meddle more with the Ministry that are incouraged to enter on it with respect to maintenance such ever more maimed then maintained the Gospel such which loved the gold of the altar dearer then the altar and Corban more then conscience and minded the wages more then the work as exceptis excepiendis some few onely excepted the national Ministry ever did since donations of dignities from Temporal Princes fell upon them were ever more murderers then Ministers of the Gospel nil tam sanctum the Heathen said but gold would expugne it You would be rich and so fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish and hurtful lusts that drown men in destruction and perdition your love of money was the mother of all mischief which while you coveted after you were seduced from the faith yea in these daies wherein you vow and protest for the faith as if you would fain follow on to find it fully as t was once delivered to the Saints you l neither find it further nor follow it faster then it keeps pace with your outward enjoyments so that we may say truely Quantum quisque sua nummorum servat in arcâ tantum habet et fidei so much money as you can get by it so much faith religion reformation you l be for and no more yea like Lawyers that look more at the greatnesse of the fee then the goodnesse of the cause nay being feed better leave their old Clients and turn to the other side so do many of you in these daies wherein many run to and fro that knowledge may be increased turn to and fro that livings may still be established on you from masse to liturgy and back again and back again and then to the directory from all which while you stood in the practise of them there was no moving you by Scripture nor reason but qui pecunia non movetur hunc dignum spectatu arbitramur But you plead that the mouth of the Ox must not be muzzled that treadeth out the Corn that t is the will of God that such as have sown in the Church spiritual things should reap their carnal things that such as preach the Gospel should live of the Gospel I answer t is most true there is a power and liberty allowed for such as serve the Church to eat and to drink and to subsist in case they cannot subsist otherwise at the charges of the Church when she sets them apart for her service 1 Cor. 9. but it is most commendable and thankworthy in the Ministry to serve the Church and preach the Gospel freely and as far as t is possible not to be burdensome in this kind at all as namely in case they have any estates of their own or can improve themselves in any such outward employment labor or lawful calling wherby to obtain a competent livelyhood and lay out themselves and the gifts that Christ hath freely given them in the service of Christ freely too as men may do many times if they be not idle and loving their own ease more then to ease the church of Christ of unnecessary pressures in their purses And thus the Apostle Paul and the first Ministers of the Gospel did and though they pleaded a power to live upon them in case they could not live without them that the Church might know it to be their duty freely to minister to their Ministers necessities when they saw them willing freely to expose themselves to necessities for the truths sake rather then seek supersluities to themselves yet they did not use that power they had much lesse abuse it too make a trade of it but did rather suffer all things that they might make the Gospel as little chargeable as might me 1 Cor. 9. 12. 18. yea they received wages sometimes when they went out to warfare i. e. to preach the Gospel up and down so as was utterly inconsistent with the totall maintaining of themselves which while they abode more settledly at one place they did attend to with their own hands for its evident that to this end they might not hinder the Gospell from taking place in mens hearts by seeming too much to make a trade of it they laboured working with their own hands as ost as they could conveniently and their own hands ministred to their own necessities and they had some honest outward occupation as also Christ himself had and sollowed too till he was wholly taken up in travel to preach the truth therefore Mark. 6. 3. is not this the Carpenter wherein they wrought at all times saving when they were actually imployed in some service of preaching to the world writing disputing visiting c. as is plain to him that consults these Scriptures in the last of which least any should think they did more then Ministers now need to do Paul saies plainly they did not use their power that they might be an ensample to others to follow them so Act. 20. 35. and therefore howbeit he bids Timothy that was a Minister of the Gospel not entangle himself in the affairs of this life for t is not good indeed that Ministers mind the world so much as to cumber themselves with over much business in it that they may be more free then other men to please Christ who calls them in a more special sense then all Christians to be his souldiers yet I believe he is far from prohibiting him in that speech from following any civil calling at all for in the very verse before 2 Tim. 2. 3. 4. he bids him endure hardnesse as a good Souldier of Iesus Christ yea Ministers of all men should be patient of all things for the Gospel sake that they hinder it not by their delicacy viz. of hard work sometimes and hard fare too if occasion be and hunger and thirst and cold and nakednesse and extremities and necessities and distresses rather then lie too heavy upon the flock of Christ which is a little flock and those few mostly poor folks too in this world though rich in faith that may have more mind then ability to Minister to their Ministers and many of them more need to be ministred to by their Ministers if at any time they have abundance then to have their houshold-stuff
that you appealed to me praying me to declare my mind concerning thâ—…se things whether they were Heresie or no which you charged the inquirer with Reply But not a word all this while was uttered either to prove the things to be as you call them or towards the satisfaction of the Auditory or Inquirer himself in the question Sirs is not this the clutter you commonly keep is not this the Clergies constant custome of confuting and their wonted way of with-holding men from all audience of what ever comes cross to your conceits when on the sudden you have not what to say against it viz. to break out into hydeous out-cries of Heresie Schism a Spirit of Error an Anabaptist an Arminian an Antinomian a Papist a Iesuit Popery Pelagianism Socianism Arminianism and such like when happily not five of fifty among you ever read Pelagius Fanstus Socinus or Arminius so as to know what they hold and why any more then by tradition one from another mistake me not for I am now neither justifying nor condemning these men with whom they being dead I have no great matter to do nor you neither but that you love to find your selves more business then you need for my part my business lieth mainly in the Word which is the Rule and being only attended to may for ought I know sooner set us to rights then either Austin or Pelagius the Remonstrants or Arminius for Regula est mensura sui et obliqui but I here take notice of and take occasion to condemâ—… the Popish practise of most Priests in Damning down for heresie in gross what they neither disprove nor prove to be Heresie when called to 't by their own calling it so before the people Report You relate upon your praying me to declare my mind concerning those things whither they were Heresie or no which you the Ministers charged the inquirer with that I said I knew that what ere he said yet he did not hold those things and that your reply was that the inquirer was a stranger and therfore you wondered his mind should be so well known to me that whatever his opinion was the question being whether his saying that one may be justified without faith and that children are not born in originall sin were heresie or no you desired me to answer positively to that but received no Answer Reply As to this Politick piece of your report wherein I perceive how fallaciously you represent me as tendering the inquirer as to my knowledge speaking contrary to his own mind I have many things to say and it matters not much which I hebegin with first First me thinks I see as you have set things down a certain Sophism of Amphiboly ly lurking iustar anguis in herbâ in these words Those things as you express them the second time in this parcel by reason of which if they be not understood by the Reader in a right sence I am set forth by you as guilty of a double crime from censure of which I see a call to clear my self and my friend whom you strive to stain together with in that case that truth may suffer dammage by us in nothing for if by those things be meant in that second place those two opinions of Iustification of infants without faith and their not having original sin which were indeed the things that he said then I am falsly reported not to say fowly belied by you in that passage wherein you relate me saying thus viz. that I knew that whatsoever the inquirer had said yet he did not hold those things and am made also to speak falsly against my conscience as my conscience tells me not that I did in all that day for verily as great a stranger as that inquirer was to your selves and the major part then present yet he was not such a stranger saving all your wonder to my self but that his mind was so well known to me in that that I knew he held those things viz. that infants have all the justification they have need of without faith and have no originall sin for I hold them my self in what sence since you ask me you shall see by and by and if I should have said thus viz. that I knew what e're he said yet he did not hold those things I should have been both a belyar of that my friend and also as very a â—…yar as your selves Sirs would herein fain make me seem to be but I was both well a ware what he held and confident that he did not say those things and not hold them But if by those things in that place be understood not those two opinions but those things which the Minister charged the Inquirer with viz. Heresie Popery the tenet of justification of Infants by works which were those things the Ministers so cried out upon him for in which sence it is in my speech to be understood then t is no other then the plain truth which I spake and to give you all the advantage that is possible to have by them I here say it again that I knew that whatsoever was then said by that our brother yet he held not those things i. e. that Heresie and Popery you then falsly accused him of And now sith you complain that you received no answer when you desired me to answer positively to that question whether Infants are justified without faith and have any originâ—…ll sin yea or no and whether the things as we hold them in contradistinction to your selves be heresie yea or no as you call them I must coâ—…plain of your selves as the sole persons then in fault that you received not as full an answer as you desired for I appeal not only to the whole people but to the â—…ame page of your own pâ—…pers also wherein in the very next line but one or two below this in which you charge me with the fault of giving you no answer your own selves are witnesses to me that I offered to answer you to all exceptions you had against us in an Entire Exercise which if you had heard and not lik't you should have had libertie enough to have replied to as long as you pleased but your selves only opposed it with all your might but to wave any further recrimination as concerning that at present and that you may have no occasion in future to feigâ—… as if we feared to answer you so positively whether those things viz. Infants Iustification without faith and their freedome from that which not so much in Scripture language as by an Epithite of mens own coining is called originall sin be heresie or no I answer no as to the first though Iustification of Infants by works is the Heresie of a Romish Clergy whether by works we mean the work of faith Ioh. 6. 29. or any other yet Iustification of Infants without that work of faith or any other work either of their parents or their owâ—… is the truth as it is in Iesus
deponing of that position you ground all on viz. that t is apparent the infants you sprinkle do believe and so a serving of our turn as much as we desire and as for that little which seems not so directly for us though by reason of not the profundity for t is shallow enough but the darkness and muddiness of the matter it be hard to see clearly to the bottom of it yet if I do truly sound the sense of it and reach to the utmost of your meaning in it it seemes to speak as liâ—…tle for your selves You tell us first that an Argument from comparison is subject to many objections and cannot hold unlesse caeteris paribus be first proved whereby you subject the most of your own Arguments in the present point to exception for I appeal to your selves and all men to judge whether they are not mostly drawn from comparisons between the children of the Jewes and the children of Gentile believers the circumcision of the one and baptism of the other and yet caeteris paribus is not at all proved by you to this hour nor yet ever can be sith caeteris imparibus I mean disagreement almost in all things between Jewes children and Christians between circumcision and baptism is so manifestly made appear by us that there hardly appears any analogy at all between them Besides Secondly So far as to the freeing of this Argument from comparison between infidels and Christians infants so as that it may hold without any exception caeteris paribus is granted by your selves for if by this parity in other things you mean an equality of souls by creation your selves assert that parity but a page above viz. p. 16. where you say all souls are equall in their creation and so the souls of believers and unbelievers infants But thirdly If by parity in other things which you would have proved you mean an equallity in their natural capacities and endowments of wit and ingenuity then either there is such a parity in infants of Christians and infidels or else so far as disparity is the excellency may much rather of the two be supposed to be in the children of Christians in whom yet caeteris paribus suppose them to have the same education and instruction there is no more inclination to believe in Christ by verrue of any habit of faith infused into them in infancy above the other then there is in the children of Indians Next you tell us If the Objector had considered c. he would not have concluded thus as he doth The objector you say is Reason so that Reason belike was much besides it self in arguing so unreasonably against your fiction of faith in the Infants of Christians but what if Reason should consider the very same that you here wish it would must its conclusion against the belief of believers infants be thereupon ere a whit the more unconcluded and what though among children born of the same Christian parents under the same education one gives a better specimen not onely in acts of piety and religion but of knowledge also may not therefore the habit of faith be more groundedly denyed to be in one then the facultie of understanding can be denyed to be in the other What still Sirs still will you make the being of faith in the infants of Christians of equall necessity with the being of the principle of reason and facultie of understanding in infants the faculty of understanding is an innate habit necessarily to be concluded and that in the highest degree to be in all infants t is in omni per se quâ ipsum but faith in Christ is by your own confession but an infused habit and by your own confession as not in all infants so in you know not which and which not till you see them act it and yet by your own conclusion to go round again t is in such not in such viz. not at all in Turks and Pagans infants for they are all in a damnable condition with you but in all infants of Christians even such as yet give no specimen of it and that so necessarily that a man may as truly deny that which is naturall to them even the faculty of understanding as deny the habit of faith to be in them Next in order to a fuller and more direct answer you prepare the way by a pannel of six or seven positions which you say you must necessarily hold concerning two or three of which we may say it s no great matter whether you hold them or no for any undoubted and infallible truth that is to be found in them in the sense wherein you take them or at least for any great matter of assistance that acrues to your cause by them and as for the rest of which you say you must necessarily hold them you might have said rather you must necessarily yield them to us for indeed they are the giving up of your cause and no other then the drawing of a dash with your own pen over all that ever you say throughout the residue of your works as concerning that sufficient appearance of faith you assert to be in believers infants yea he is blind that doth not see you thereby perfectly blotting out again what ever you penned in that particular with your own hands First say you the habit of faith must be before it can work I know no necessity of holding this for truth neither indeed would you hold it but that you imagine faith to be another kind of habit then it is for there are more kinds of habits then one though you speak of habit by the lump all along as if you were aware of but one for here 's ore and ore again habit habit habit habit habit but not the least hint of what kind of habit you mean you are never the men that distinguish of habits whereas qui bene distinguit bene docet there being some habits acquired and obtained no otherwise then by acting and faith it self is such a habit as will hardly be proved for all your confidence in the contrary to be any other at least to be apparent in any one or visible to the view of others till some act thereof hath past the persons in whom it is neither is any one in the world that I know of habitually a believer in Christ till having heard of him or his word he doth actually believe Secondly whereas you say the spirit of God infuses this habit I grant he infuses it if you take the word infuse in a true sense i. e. for begetting it in persons by the preaching of the word other infusion of faith if yet that may be properly called infusion which is a phrase rather of your own coining in this case the word knows none God indeed gives it but he gives it in the way of hearing the word of faith in the way of hearing Christ preached in which way he never gave it to infants neither is it his
gift to them in any other the spirit works it but not without the use of means not per saltum and in 〈◊〉 ocul i. e. so suddenly as you fancy but by the discharge of that office he bears from the father to that end and purpose towards the whole world i. e. moving striving perswading inwardly whilest the word doth without inlightning convincing a man of sin in himself of righteousness to be had and of a judgement to come wherein we shall be saved or damned according as we believe or believe not accept or neglect so great salvation upon which motions and convictions which are stricter and stronger in some then in other foure some yield and believe and obey the Gospel and some for all this rebel and obey not so that t is true the spirit thus effects the business within us yet not so as that he is said wholly to do it without us he is the supreme efficient the operative cause of it but we are to be concurrent cum causa operante we have a part to do as well as he when he hath done his part towards us i. e. to believe which if we do not he will not force us he will go no further nor shall he be blamed but we and we not onely blamed but damnd for not doing it accordingly but if we do believe and turn at his reproof then indeed there is a promise of an infusion or rather effusion of the spirit in other i. e. those more special and peculiar offices of a witnesse to our spirits that we are Gods children a seal a comforter a reveâ—…ler of the things freely given us of God a supporter under sufferings c. all which it performes towards the Saints and in respect of which onely its called the holy spirit of promise Eph. 1. 13. in this manner the spirit of God in order to that sweet infusion of it self into us may be said if you will call it infusion for which a fitter word may be found to infuse i. e. to work faith other infusion of faith into men much lesse into infants or such a downright infusion as I suppose you dream on the Scripture makes no mention of at all Thirdly in that you say he is not bound to work it in all the children of Christian parent nor barred from working it in any of the children of infidels this indeed you must necessarily hold as you say for t is undeniable truth but in holding it you must wholly let go â—…ll you held before concerning believers infants appearing to have faith and that in contradistinction to the infants of unbelievers for first you use to say as p. 14. out of Act. 2. that the promise of it is to believers and their seed i. e. as believers seed and so consequently to all and onely their seed not the seed of unbelievers for quod convenit qua ipsum convenit omni soli semper belongs alwayes to all of one sort and not any man of another and thereby you use to bind the spirit unlesse he will bee unfaithfull to work faith as without which you think he cannot give them salvation in all the seed of believers for a promise that is made to such or such a seed quâ—… siâ—… must needs be sure as the Scripture saith Romans 4. 16. and made good or else God that cannot lie breaketh his word to all the seed to whom as such it is made But sith now you say that the spirit is not bound to give faith and salvation to believers seed nor barred from giving it to any of the seed of infidels which is as much as to say he is at liberty from all obligation of himself by promise to either of these above the other and to work it in which he pleases you will I hope unless you be more ashamed of seeming to have been ignorant then ashamed of your ignorance so as to give glory to God by confessing it relinquish that wonted position of a birth priviledge in this point in believers seed more tâ—…en in others which you ground and prove from that promise Aâ—…t 2. and ingenuously confesse that for ought you know the one hath no more ingagemeat of God to them by promise then the other so that unlesse there were more warrant then you have to single out one from the other as the special subjects of baptism and heirs of salvation you ought to baptize them all alike i. e. in very deed to let them all alone till you come as in infancy you confesse you cannot to presume what children have the habit of faith and what have not Fourthly whereas you say wheresoever the habit of faith is it inclines to holy actions when there â—…s opportunity and the season for bringing them forth whether this be necessary to be held or no yet wee l hold it to do you a pleasure in calling you thereby from your false cause for else its like to do you more displeasure in your cause of infants faith then you well considered when you penned and printed it for wheresoever faith is the opportunity and season for its bearing fruit and working by love and other holy actions is ever present and perpetual yea its never unopportune or unseasonable for him that hath faith to be acting obedience in one thing or other yea if any one say I have faith and have not works and holy actions much lesse if no inclinablenesse to holy actions that faith cannot save nor stand him instead faith without works being dead and profiting nothing therefore if where ever faith is it inclines to holy actions when opportunity and season for it is then I am sure there is no faith at all in infants for there is no opportunity or season at all in infancy wherein faith is found fruitfull in them and if you will say they have faith though you have no evidence of it and prove it is so because it is so then it is a faith without works and that faith is dead unprofitable and cannot save them Iames 2. and if so you would be better opinioned towards infants in my mind to hold them saved without faith then to hold they have a faith which cannot save them for better never a whit at all then never the better Fiftly whereas you say that this inclination to holy actions is not equally alike in all in whom the habits themselves are that may be so too yet Sampson and David are no such sufficient instances of it but that more sufficient might have been given for as there are many worthy things recorded which both these did by the power of faith Heb. 11. so he of whom you say he exceeded in acts of piety was in some things not to say as impious yet impious as well as the other besides to make comparisons between two such worthies as doing the one more good the other lesse both which by faith did no lesse the subdue and in their times fully deliver Israel from the
the sharpest seasons conversion falling out as ordinarily in winter as in summer whose present health both proves the falsnesse and reproves the madnesse of your prophet Yea I have cause to know a little better then every one and a little more then Mr. Baxter in this Expertus loquor I speak by experience against which no Argument of his availes I have seen since my five or six years converse among the commonly called Anabaptists many a one baptized totally in cold water and weather too by others besides toward two hundred by my silly self many of which have come forth covered though not with yee as Mr. Cook phrases it out yet with that water which yee truly covered but just before yet never saw I any one so baptized in all that time who was not if not better in meer bodily respects yet at least as well after it as before he tells you if you will believe him that totall dipping is for nothing but to dispatch men out of the world that are burdensome but then I wonder how the Creature called Anabaptist that is so burthensome to Mr. Baxter doth not dy out of the way by hundreds and thousands and so save him and others that labour of dispute against their growth but rather grow from hundreds into thousands so fast that they are not likely to be dispatcht out of the world till they are such a burthensom stone as will press them to death i.e. the whole Priesthood that is troubled with them He tells you if you will believe him that dipping will destroy men except they be preserved by Miracles why else doth he say speaking specially as to this ordinance of dipping God hath not appointed ordinances in his Church that will destroy men except they be preserved by miracles now if it be not so as hee sales viz. that it is a miracle to be dipped and not destroyed then what a strange man is he to say so but if it be so indeed viz a Miracle to be dipped and not destroyed then â—…o fools and slow of heart to believe the truth though the Lord confirm it to you with Miracles which are wrought day by day amongst the Disciples who are dipped Winter and Summer as occasion is yet are not destroyed Yea whereas Mr Baxter dares say that in Cities like London and amongst Gentlewomen that have been tenderly brought up and antient people and weak people and shopkeepers especially women that take but little of the cold aire dipping in cold weather would in the course of nature kill hundreds and thousands suddenly or cast them into some Chronical disease I dare say that in the City of London there is hundreds if not thousands dipped in cold water and as it happens in cold weather too many of which are Gentlewomen tenderly brought up and antient and weak people and shop keepers and women that take but little of the cold aire and yet by the course of grace they are preserved from perishing by either cold or suffocation yea and out of the City of London too for these hands have baptized of all these sorts in the Countrey viz. Gentlewomen most tenderly brought up very antient people very weak people shopkeepers and specially two women both alive at this day which I 'l become a fool in telling you of them sith Mr. Baxter compells me did take so little of the cold aire that one of them if my memory fail me not and if I were truly informed was but once out of her house in 5 year before by reason of a dropsy and that was with much adoe and but a little before her dipping and to hear this doctrine notwithstanding which weaknesse and such swellings that she was wellnigh twice as bigg as now she is and scarce able to betake her self to the water she was dipped and was rather better in body then worse after it and after sending for some elders of the Church toâ—… pray over her and anoint her with oile in the name of the Lord according to his own institution in that behalf Iam. 5. was within a while so asswaged in her swellings that she is now as slâ—…nder as in former times before ever he distemper took hold on her The other had scarce been out of her Chamber in two years together and durst not dip her finger in cold water and was ready to have her breath stopt with the least annoyance that could be yet was dipped and was better after it through Gods mercy for a pretty while so as to go abroad though she now is weak and much what as she used to be before If then you will not believe the words of God believe the works believe the Miracles for it is by Miracles that they are preserved who are dipt in cold water and not destroyed saâ—…es Mr. Baxter which if it be then God hath wrought very many Miracles among the men you nickname Anabaptists of late for they are constantly preserved from perishing by either cold or suffocation yea I have known many a one better in body but I nere knew any one of whom I could safely say they were the worse in body or Soul for being dipt save such as turned from the truth after turning to it for the latter end with such indeed is worse then their begining Yet how rashly do these men shoot their bolts to the murdering of the truth whilst they make the ordinary practise of it no lesse then flat murder it self and that undeniably to any understanding man unless there be a preservation by a miracle for else it destroyes men quoth Mr. Baxter it directly tendeth to overthrow mens lives in the course of Nature it will kill hundreds and thousands of them but if a man scape perishing with cold yet how can he i.e. how is it possible for him to escape being choaked quoth Mr. Cook and stifled with the water if he must be plunged over head to signify his death to sin 2. Secondly kept under water to signify his burial How can a man escape choaking Sirs if he be put and kept under the water why I tell you that either he can or else he cannot if he can why then he can and so Mr. Cook is confuted if he cannot in the course of nature without miracle then it being certain that thousands do scape choaking it should seem God by Miracle secures them and yet for all this nor Mr. Baxter nor Mr. Cook are convinced whether it be the more shame for them or no not to be so I leave it to themselves and all understanding men to consider Or perhaps Mr. Cook means how can a man escape choaking if he be kept three daies under water for so quoth he the disciple must as Christ abode three daies under water if Christs burial be represented but not onely his own party for mora sub aqua quantulacunque saith Tilenus quantumvis momentanea saith Bucan abode under the water for never so little a while doth most lively resemble
elsewhere even every where where the tares are resolved to stand alone and so Homo Homini Lupus Christianus Chriâ—…i no Diabolus men must be wolves and devils each to other throughout the world Besides if the power in any place be ignorant and under an erring conscience that conscientia errans will oblige him seemingly to himself at least to tread down truth and set up false hood and all this by a law yea if the Magistrate take the part of any religion against all other so as to establish it alone and root out them whether it be the true one or a false one that he sets up not tolerating all others but forcing them to submit to it the mischief is in a manner intolerable on either hand for if false have not we all felt the smart of being forc'â—… to false wayes Smectimnus as well as others if he hath not forgotten the groans that for liberty of conscience came once out of his own mouth while he was crusht under him that was crusht under the Popedom but in the Marian dayes above but if true the forcing men to own it before they see ground freely to receive it makes a world of formalists of nominal Christians who had as good be nothing at all as no better then they are of hypocrites which are worse then nought the worst sinners in the world for is it not better for me to remain a Jew under a blind conscience till I see the truth then to turn Christian against my though blinded conscience for fear of men before convinc'â—… or before I yet see it to be the truth a forced feigned profession for â—…ear of men if it happen to be of the truth it self is at best but splendidum peccatum a guilded sin Besides us to weave the spiders webbe as Isa. 59. to make laws and penalties to bind conscience which brawny conscienc'â—… men can creep ore let them be what they will as we see in Nebuchadnezzars dayes and in the Popes time and ever since all people for fear fall down and worship the golden image the King and Clergy sets up save such as fear God indeed And if it be thought that if the civil power take not the part of truth as I wonder where and when ever it did at least since Constantines times till of late it will be lost more in the croud of errors and Heresies that will ensâ—…e a general toleration then any other way it can I say let truth alone and turn it loose to plead fully for it self and it will work out its way and live and thrive maugre all the entanglements it can have from tares plain truth may be trusted to treat with the subtlest and proudest opposers it hath in the world that caeteris paribus do make head against it but if it be set against by the forrain power of a civil sword premi yet then too haud supprimi potest do but defend it onely from injury equally with others by the civil andâ—…then it will defend it self by the spirituall sword against them all Wherefore I again humbly represent that grave Councel of Gamaliel whose reason is good to all the civil Magistrates throughout the earth by whose subjects t is shâ—…rpely controverted and zealously quaeried what is truth viz. that they refrain from meddling more with men though they seem mad men to the world and besides themselves for the sake of truth in pretence left happily they be found fighters against God for if any way be not of God t will in Gods time come to nought of it self and ye cannot establish it if of God you cannot withstand it but t will come on in this juncture specially wherein it dawns toward the great day and God is about to pluck up every plant he hath not planted And if men be in your apprehension blind leaders of the blind in things of God yet let them alone if they will not go to the right way when called to it they will see when they both fall into the ditch And likewise I humbly beg that what is further and more clearly held forth concerning this subject of liberty of conscience by Mr. Blackwood in the first part of his storming of Antichrist may be well weighed by our Magistrates together with the thirty quaeries presented to them lately by Mr. Iohn Goodwin and his vindication of them against the Apologist neither of which ever will be answered solidly by their parish Ministers And as for the PPPriesthood it self though I hope the night is too farre spent for any save such as will be ignorant and if any man will be ignorant let him be ignorant saith Paul 1 Cor. 14. 28. and so say I to doubt but that the day is dark over them and theirs they are blind leaders of the blind in many things which many others see of whom yet they are asham'd to learn and which is worse such as stand not a little in their own light by snuffing at it that the Russet Rabbies and Clergy of Laâ—…cks should presume to instruct them more perfectly in the way of God which God in these daies wherein the last must be first and the first last will subject the proudest spirited Priests in Christ'ndom to take from some illiterate and perhaps non-sensical yet honest hearted Saints stammerers in speech babes with them bablers as of old eloquent Apollos from Aquila and Priscilla or else it may be hid from their eyes And though what they would not that others do to them when they were underlings each to other they have done unto all other professions that were underlings to them in the day of their raign hasting what they could to the hunting of the Sectaries out of their synagogues or their native rights and enjoyments therein which they have subjugated to be their Synagogues counting the compasse of whole Common-weals and Kingdomes little enough for them to Lord it over and set their several names of Papal Prelatical or Presbyterian there confounding and Babilonishly blending Church State Power together so that t was hard for any to ken clearly which was which or to know where to set the sole of his foot almost upon European ground in any Nation buâ—… he and all his conscience and all must come under the command and fall within the verge of some or other of their mercilesse Church Monarchies yet neverthelesse my humble desire to the powers on their behalf is that they may be tolerated and protected in the practise of what profession Religion way of worship doctrine discipline or Church-government soever they see occasion among themselves and such as shall see occasion to cleave to them or any of them to set up so far as they shall desire to build their several BBBabels without that blood of souls and bodies of men in which they have imbrued both their own and the Princes hands of the Christian Nations in former dayes I heartily plead for a toleration for them if
Popes â—…oins the two P Priesthoods of the Protestant party might have lorded it longer like their father who will never be dead as long as they are alive had they not been as iron and steel against truth and true worshippers whom God makes as hard as slint against their faces that by their concussions against it he may the more fully fetch it forth the oppositions and imprisonments which Paul met with from the adverse party whereby they intended to smoother it in his daies fell out rather to the furtherance of the Gospel for it came to be the more manifest in all places by means of errors so earnest appearance against it 1 Phil. 12. to 19. Thus truth hath gained ground not a little in these latter daies by the ominous onsets wherewith falsehood fights it and would fain fright and force it to hide its head and wisdome works out it self not a little to light by follies flying so furiously at the face of it 3. That the truth might be better loved and more price set upon it we prize light the more by our knowledge of darkness health by our sense of sicknesse errour is a foil to a Diamond truth looks more lovely being compared with it The lilly looks most lovely and beautifull when it stands among black thornes 2 Cant. 2. the stars though ever obvious to us would never shine if there were no night contraria juxta se posita maxime eluâ—…scant contraries set together discover each other more lively in their severall loathsome or lovely formes the light of the Sun shewes brightest seemes sweetest when it breaks from under a dark cloud so does the Sun of righteousnesse now arising appear the more lovely by how much it hath been hid from the earth now of long time by that dismall darknesse and smoak of Heresies erroneous false worships and foolish figments with which the CCClergy hath filled all parishes throughout CCChristendome 4 For the punishment of hypocrites nominall Christians curious Minds such as have itching eares and heap unto themselves teachers stragling sheep fall into the wolves clutches such as will not keep the steps of the flock but go after the flocks of the Companions ever fall into most dangers of seducement all which is most plain by too woful experience in all Nations of CCChristendome for while Christianity and the Gospel was professed sincerely as it was saving some remote beginnings of mens traditions to take place against the commands of Christ in the first three hundred years wherein t was evidenced by the ten bloody persecutions that Christians served Christ for love then and not for loaves nor for lives sake neither for they loved not their lives unto the death there were not half so many Hereticks or Heresies as have been since but when once after Constantine Christianity comming into credit and being not onely owned by the Emperors themselves but established by their edicts in all things according to the pattern shewed them in the word not of Christ but of the Catholique Clergy convened in Councels as the Religion sub paena to be submitted to men turned Christians upon such sleight grounds and were born to that Name of Christianity without the Nature no otherwise then of the will of man and were no more then nomine tenus professors of it the Lord in his just and 〈◊〉 judgement to these nominal Christians permitted those Spiritual plagues that we â—…e Rev. 8. Rev. 9. seconded the sounding of the trumpets to fall thick and three fold upon the world suffered the Clergy to fall to contentions jars and janglings about their ambitious interests viz. primacy and universallity c and to Apostatize more and more from the plain primitive truth and to degenerate be degrees into darknesse till they came at last to be totally blinded in things of God and blind leaders of the blind Princes and people that implicitly gâ—…ve up themselves to be guided by them that both might drop together into the ditch yea he suffered that great star the Bishop of Rome that sometime shone very bright to fall as wormwood upon the third part of the waters the pure doctrine of the Gospel i. e. to foist in his heresies to the poisoning and imbittering of the doctrine so that many died even all that drank thereof because it was bitter and unwholsome and he suffered the third part of the Sun and Moon and Stars all the means and waies of Christs own institution and appointment to give light unto men by to be smitten and darkned corrupted covered with false glosses depraved with heaps of heresies and traditions c. crept in and authorized by the Pope and his Ecclesiastical Dâ—…ctors so that what with the damnable and horribly devillish heresies by means of Mahomet and his Alcoran infecting the Orientall Christians through all Asia and these Papisticall errors of those Arch-Hereticks the Pope and CCClergy and Scholastick Rabbies who with vain deceit seduced the Occidental part of the world from the simplicity that is in Christ the day shone not for a third part of it the might likewise i. e. the third part of that pure and pretious truth of Christ which shined in the primitive Churches was now exclipsed and extinguisht neither had men by the third part so much of that clear light of Christs Gospel that they were wont to have in former dayes yea further in way of plague and punishment to hypocrites and meer nominal Christians the Lord at last suffered that star which fell before or angel of the Church of Rome when he was fallen from all his heavenlinesse and love of truth to earthlinesse and love of money and honour from beneath to open the bottomlesse pit i. e. the way to the very depth of hellish darknes and to raise up a smoak or thick fog of errors and heresies lies traditions which as the smoak of some great furnace darkened the sun and air i. e. totally put out the light of Scripture and pure administrations which were but 〈◊〉 part ecclipsed before so that now nothing could be seen as it were but Popish legends and such stuff by the advantage of which smoother the Locuâ—…s came out i. e. the Clergy that swarmed all over the earth in every parish one at least stinging hurting wounding to eternal death by their poisonous doctrines propounded under pretence of the word of Christ all persons save such as have the seal of God in their foreheads even a few witnesses to the truth that withstood their doctrins which locusts are said to be scorpions i. e. carrying a fair face but stings in their tailes and to have crowns because of their great power for under their great King Apollyon they rule all and reign ore the Kings of the earth These are they that outwardly wear the sheeps cloathing i. e. cloth themselves with the denominations of Clergy Gods heritage Spiritual men Priests men of God which are the true titles of the sheep but
where ere we are and what ere we say we submit not onely to your accesse but your exception also as you though in publique do not to ours You professe your selves desirous to have all things come to light before all that all things may be proved by your people and indeed though he that doth evil hateth the light neither â—…ometh to the light lest his deeds should be reproved John 3. 21. 22 yet he that doth truth cometh to the light that his deeds might be made manifest that they are wrought in God yet the means and courses by which truth should be tryed which are plain and not puzzling discourses upon the Scripture you smother by all the means and courses you can conveniently devise as for any entire discourses of such as are contrary minded to you though teachers of truth as t is in the word these you cannot away with at any hand not permit to be used in publique before the people while you have any powar to shut your pulpit doors upon them you bid your people now or then prove all things that they may find out which is good and shun the evil but by your good-evil will they shall hear no more then what you tell them and chuse whether they 'l take that for truth or nothing you bid them cut where they like and yet you 'l be their carvers and force them to feed upon what you offer them or fast and welcome for no more messes must be meddled with though they have never such a mind to cut and try then what is of your dressing that oft is no more then some sugar spot sententious Academical bespangled hide bound glasse measured spirit stinting stuff which may challenge the name of duncery baldnesse babling and prating more then that sincere milk of the word you commonly call so which hour of divinity when you have bookt down and cond with no little care is many times but Sed and sometimes but Red ore when all 's done neither yet oft times you crow couragiously upon your own dunghil you pay it soundly in your own pulpits with convincing and opposing the approach of heresies and argue so substantially against them that you carry the cause and win all but t is because you play there by your selves for if any chance to hear you that hath never so much wherewith to undeceive your deluded people yet they may not receive his interrupted reply to never so little when you in the first place have pleaded your cause the next thing to be done is for all them that hear and have ought against you to hold their peace they must not andere audire alteram partem least they be infected though wise men know there is no other way to be perfected in the knowledge of the truth and freed from that hobnob implicit faith which is wrongly acted when rightly objected then by hearing all that is to be said against it as well as for it yea the heathen herein may be thy Tutor O PPPriest Qui statuit aliquid c. You cry out they are not Orthodox that oppose you and so forbid all audience of them to your people whom you feed with a word and a blow a bit and a knock lest if they be not as well corrected into a refusal of all direction from others as directed by your selues they quickly discern difference between you and them yet you would fain be counted free and forward that all should have liberty according to their duty to try all but the niggard shall never be called liberall nor the churl said to be â—…ountiful for me for he deviseth not the liberal things whereby the liberal shall stand yea tâ—…e instruments of the churl are evil and he deviseth wicked devices to destry the poor with lying words when the needy spoaketh right things yea his heart works iniquity to practise hypocrisie and to utter error befor the Lord to make empty the soul of the hungry and to cause the drink of the thirsty to fail Isa. 32. 5. 6. 7. 8. As for pro and con discourse or disputation you smother that likewise with all your might for as you desire no more of it then needs must so you decline it what you can and disclaim it too as far as you dare for shame be seen in such a service as disputing against disputing is declaiming against it as a dismal thing of some dangerous consequence poison means of infection contentionem scabiem and such like being sensible of your sores you come not to the stake to be questioned in your waies before your blind admirers but when you cannot with credit considering your over shooting your selves sometimes in hasty challenges make a cleanly come off without it though it be to meet with those that are inferiour to your selves save that the Lord is with them for surely you see somewhat further then a mole into a milstone that things are no better with you then they should be why else should there be such loathnesse like that of the Elephant that 's loath to drink in fair waters for fear of seeing a foul face to come to the light as we find there is in the most of you as well as in Dr. Gouge who would at no hand vouchsafe any publique discussion of insant-sprinkling whether it wâ—…re of God or man nec per se ne per synodum in his parish with Dr. Chamberlain yet sometimes Euphoniae gratia for reports sake you make some pretty put offs in publike and put on tooth and nail for disputation but alas you curtail it into so narrow a compasse as namely half a day two hours or some odd end of an after-noon when two dayes is too little two weeks scarce enough two years not too much to discusse the truth in witnesse not onely Iude who bids the Saints of the last times saving Tertullian and Sir Henry Wottons dislike out contend for the faith once delivered to the Saints and Paul who for 2 years space disputed dayly in the School of one Tyrannus not such a Tyrant to the truth as you are it seems for if he had he would have admitted not a word out you confine it I say into such a corner of time that as Pilate askt what 's truth and when he had so said went his way without an answer so you hast to have an end not hearing half the half quarter that is to be said in opposition to your own opinions about that question And during that little while the busines lasts you carry all as much as you can above the reach and beyond the capacity of plain minded men and women that come together for resolution in Scholastick terms and conclave it from their cognizance under the lock and key of your Linsey wolsey Logick which is neither fine enough for the University from which you have a while discontinued nor home-spun enough for the Country which muddy way of mood and figure is neither
me saith the Lord yea had you been sprinkled with holy water it self yet except you repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of the Lord Jesus for remission of sins through his blood which so doing saves even them that shed it you are not onely by eating and drinking unworthily i. e. disorderly at the Supper which baptism must precede in Gospel reformation but also by your cruelty to his disciples whom you would have crusht if you could tell how become guilty of the body and blood of the Lord however repent or repent not this I say unto you from the Lord that your bloody principle of persecution for conscience and forced conformity to your foolish forms canons creeds chatechisms dictates directories shall utterly perish from off the earâ—…h I wish the Independents for their turn 's next look to it in time and take heed of turning aside too much from that precious principle of depending upon no King but Christ in conscience cases neither state Councells nor Church councells nor Classes save onely for conscience to Christ to be subject freely in all meer civill cases to the one and for cognizance sake to consult in meer church and conscience cases with the other and whom else they please keeping Church and State as distinct as t is possible which the CCClergy have confounded so together that we have lost the true Peculiarities of either and as not suffering such sawcy doings as to have most general Assemblies of the Kiâ—…k quâ Church Assemblies to be tampering at all with state affairs so not troubling any officers of state qua State officers no not the highest nor Committees nor Sheriffs to wearinesse with representations of things pertaing purely to churches and church orderes expecting no more then a passive permissive influence from them to the church-ward i. e. to let all Churches and all religions Jewes themselves alone to their light till they see the true one so be they live faithfully under them and quietly peaceably and civilly one by another but me thinks I smell a mixt mongrel Independency too much on foot and creeping on an Indepency by the halves a Presbyterian Independency Independency too dependant in church work upon the state for state pay enquiring after parish maintenance telling some truth and taking as much tith as they can lay their hands on lending liberty to themselves to have no supper in the parishes when they please yet resolving to make the people pay for it so long as they preach whether they eat a bit of it at all yea or no A thing I cannot well tell what to call it that has a smack too much of Smectimnuus and yet t is not so tyrannical neither nor yet so tender towards a toleration of all consciences and Religions though of all tender conscienced Christians as that the poor Jew or natural Israelite can have any room or creep hole by it into the Common-wealth in order to his conversion he must keep out unlesse he be so converted before he come as to resolve heel own Christ and not speak against him as not the Christ which what power in any State under heaven can banish a Jew out of any nation for doing I plainly know not an Independency that is willing to let Israel go but not to let another Israel come into the Land so as to promulgate his principle which I'm sure is contrary to the principles of Christian Religion oâ—… if the Jew may deny Christ and yet live in the world in quiet why not another unlesse the word can gain him to the belief of it as well as he Independents a word or two with you by the way no hurt I hope if you will have but patience I find proposals presented Fâ—…b 11. 1651. that make me amazâ—…d to think that they should come from Independents for I took Independents till of late to be genuine Independents indeed but I see there 's nothing but may have something like it which is not the same and such is your Semi-demiindependency to me For supply of all parishes in England with Orthodox Ministers it s propounded that the Sheriff of each County give account to the Committee what parish hath no Minister â—…hat maintenance each such parish hath what Ministers that reside in each County have no livings and such of them as are Orthodox be placed there as the Committee shall think sit For settling right constituted Churches that all Churches that are or shall be gathered signifie to the Committee of the Universities or elsewhere whom they have or shall choose for their Pastors and that such and such onely shall be declared right constituted Churches whose Pastor shall be approved by the Committee to be able godly â—…nd orthodox Fye Fye Sirs that you will still have such a minglement of Sheriffs Committees Ministers Churches in a kind of Omnigatherum about the Gospell and your Churchwork and that you will trouble the Sheriffs to find what pay is in parishes what parishes want Ministers and what Ministâ—…rs lack means if your Ministers lack meanes cannot they look after it themselves and bestow them selves in some honest calling or other to get a living out on or if they cannot cannot your Churches see to them a little what they lack or do you lack to have the tithes and parish pay turned ore to you now as the Presbyters gaped after augmentations from the Bâ—…shops Deans and chapters lands if you do I hope the State will save your longing as they did theirs and take them sheer away root and branch and let those Churches that have Ministers maintain them if they need and let the Gospel be preached freely by Messengers from Churches to the Gentiles to the world without charging them with it till converted to it for such you suppose the nation to be now as well as we and not a Church of Christ why else do you gather Churches of Christ out of it will you gather Churches of Christ out of Churches of Christ what rule have you for that surely Churches must be gathered out of the world and if so that the nation be no true constituted Church of Christ it s no true Church of Christ for Christ hath no falsely constituted true Churches that I know of and so her Ministers no true Ministers of Christâ—… for Christs Ministers are not Ministers of no Church but such as came remotely as to their ordination and parish posture baptism and all from the Pope whom if you also look upon with such favourable construction as to own him and his ordinations and his baptism and administrations and what the Prelate and Presbyter sucks in a way of succession from thence as Apostolical so as to stand Ministers and baptized by it I shall think the world goes round then indeed and that whoever chances to get on horseback and sit in the Saddle here in England whether Prelate Presbyter or Independent they cannot chuse for customes sake but face about still