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A33929 A compendious discourse about some of the greatest matters of Christian faith propounded and explained between a minister and an enquiring Christian ... : and also may serve for an answer to two books, one called The practical discourse of the sovereignty of God, the other called The death of death, by the death of Christ, written by J.O. : whereunto is annexed a very brief appendix / written by T. Collier. Collier, Thomas, fl. 1691. 1682 (1682) Wing C5274; ESTC R20632 146,911 256

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can be no worse among the Heathen yet ●●d will in time be pacified towards them and return ●●●n when he returns his sinning People Judah and Is●●●l Ezek. 16. 53 61. Zeph. 3. 8. Where is declared ●● universal Judgment of the World and when that ●● finished verse 9. Then will I turn to the People a ●● Language that they may all call upon the Name of the Lord and serve him with one consent The same Judged People shall afterward serve the Lord he saith not my People but the People which fully agreeth with other Scriptures of the same import Psal 102. 22. When the People are gathered together and the Kingdoms to serve the Lord and 22. 27. 86. 9. And many more that might be mentioned and Luk. 12. 48. The servant that miscarried through ignorance shall be beaten little so the word is tho much in it self yet little compared with wilful Transgressors and little fully imports an end of beating and Eternal beating and striping can in no sense be said to be little or few stripes so that an end of or Redemption from the penal part of the second Death though not of loss to the generality of the World both of Jews and Gentiles in times to be effected is most apparent from the Scriptures of truth and I verily believe it 's nothing else but a Traditional Reception contrary thereunto that makes it so strange unto us And as for the threefold state of the World at that day by some so much stumbled at it 's likewise as apparent not only from Psal 64. 8 9 10 verse 8. are the Eternally Condemned ones verse 9 the generality of the World all men verse 10. are the Righteous with the Lord and Isaiah 66. is first a description of the Church in its Glory with Christ verse 10 11 12. 2. The gathering of all tongues and all flesh to worship verse 18 23. 3. The Eternally Condemned ones verse 24. But if our eyes were but half open we might read as much in Mat. 25. 32 c. Where we may necessarily understand three states two mentioned and a third not mentioned but implied 1. All Infants so dying are not there mentioned not being capable of such a sentence either to life or death viz. on the same ●●ounds for feeding or not feeding the Members of Christ which are not a small part of the World 2. All the Heathen World that never heard of Christ or his ●embers and as they have not been nor are capable to ●ew mercy to Christ in his Members so are they ●ot capable of such a sentence it being proper only to Gospel-Professors but indeed that World may not only admit of a threefold state but of three thousand ●a infinite as to us if it be true according to Scri●ure that God will render to every man according to ●s Works 1 Cor. 5. 10. Rev. 22. 12. Christ Some cry out against this Doctrine as grie●●● Heresie and scandalous to the Gospel Min. To this I shall say but little tho I could say much 1. For truth to be accounted Heresie is no 〈◊〉 and therefore no strange thing 2. After the ●●y they call Heresie so believe I and worship God 3. I ●eartily desire they may repent of this in time it being ●●oful sin to call good evil and evil good 4. To ●nder it Heresie and scandalous is to render the whole ●ord and design of God by Christ in the Gospel to ● Heresie and scandalous relative to the Judg●ent and World to come according to the true declara●on thereof as has been plainly and plentifully pro●d before 5. Suppose it true that it were Heresie ●hich it 's far from I query of them whether it ●ould possibly be any more than as a drop to the Ocean ●● respect of the Errours and Heresies held by them●●ves as has been before unvailed 6. And as for ●●s being scandalous to the Gospel I say 1. If to as●●t that God will Judge the World in Righteousness by 〈◊〉 Christ and render to every man according to his ●●rks penal punishment both for measure and time sutable to the Facts of men that he will punish none without a cause nor more than is deserved if this be in good earnest scandalous either to God or Man then I acknowledge I am guilty of this scandal and shall I hope till I dye I conclude this with the saying of Tertullian which I think is true viz. Good things offend none but such as have ill minds Christ Some say suppose all you say about these matters be true yet they question what advantage may be supposed in publishing thereof especially it being an offence to many Min. 1. If there were no worth at all nor advantage in the knowledge of the Glorious design of God to the World by Jesus Christ in the Restitution and World to come certainly he would not have filled his word with the discoveries thereof as he has he would not have made it the work of all his holy Prophets since the World began to speak thereof but to the end that we might understand and believe it to his praise things revealed belonging to us Deut. 29. 29. There being no truth in the Scripture more fully and frequently declared than the Restitution and World to come with the Glories thereof I think I may say the Scriptures abounds and excels in this Act. 3. 21. And what may we conceive from hence but the greatness of the truth thereof and the greatness of our concern to understand and believe it 2. If it be the Faith to which the promise of life in the World to come is made as has been before proved then certainly it concerns us to understand and believe it and the publishing thereof should be no o●ence unto any but rather their joy and though Christ sometime said Joh. 16. 12. I have many things to say unto you but ye cannot bear them now which is by some urged in this matter To this I say that the times before and after the sufferings of Christ much differed afterwards Christ did not forbear the publishing of that to them which they were not capable to bear before he suffered nor did the Apostle forbear the publishing of further truth to them that were dull of hearing Heb. 5. 11. with ch 6. 1 2 3. And the Apostle complains that he was become or esteemed an Enemy because he told them the truth Gal. 4. 16. And indeed a sin and a shame it is that any profest Christians should be offended at the Doctrine of the Restitution of all things the World to come with the Glories thereof it being the Crowning part of the Glorious Gospel of the Blessed God And if men will now be offended at the truth I know no help for it Christ Some say that the World to come is a Mystery and none are capable to understand the perfection of the Glories thereof yet you have undertaken to declare what it is and so have presumed beyond
themselves to do to others as they would they should do to them and the Gospel teaches the same Mat. 22. 37. to 40. and 7. 12. and this is written in all men by nature and is true rational and moral Philosophy and true Gospel Divinity and where it 's not effected it 's by the souls captivation by irrational immoral and sensual lusts and how would the Divine Law of Christ and in the Gospel united to our understandings and reason effect it if taken heed unto A sin and shame it is and dreadful will be the issue thereof that many Learned men who account themselves above others both in Philosophy and Divinity and yet are more immoral than many moral Heathens And as both moral Philosophy and Gospel Divinity unites in teaching the abhorrency of all ungodliness with the practice of all the contrary vertues and duties so would it teach us to abhor all persecution for Conscience sake if attended to it would teach us in this matter to do to others as we would they should do to us the contrary being not only unchristian but irrational No man in his right reason would be content to be forced to believe and worship God as others do contrary to his own light and conscience such in Justice reason it self and light of nature abhors and it 's likewise contrary to the Protestant Doctrine and Faith which is to make the Scriptures our rule in all matters of Faith and practice and not to be compelled to believe as the Church believeth which is condemned by Protestants to be the Popish Faith and not the Faith of Christ And strange it seems to be that Learned men who profess themselves to have most both of Philosophy and Divinity should be so great miscarriers herein I think it may be said without all just occasion of offence that throughout all ages of Christianity Learned men has lien at the bottom of most of the persecutions for Conscience sake surely it came not from their Philosophy or Divinity but from their enmity pride and prophaneness Ps 10. 2. or from some carnal and corrupt ends within themselves must be irrational and irreligious or at best from blind and ignorant zeal Joh. 16. 2. Phi. 3. 6. It 's true the Scripture warns us to take heed of being spoiled by Philosophy and vain deceit after the traditions of men and the rudiments of the World and not after Christ Col. 2. 8 i. e. When our reason turns us aside from the Gospel either in matters of Faith or practice being corruptly exercised and so becomes vain and deceitful and is not pure reason that submits it self to the Divine Law of Christ in all things so far as it understands it And although Rational and Moral Philosophy was and yet is excellent in its time and place and in itself in its degree spiritual being of and from God yet the Gospel is more spiritual and by it men formerly arrived to much of the knowledge of God and themselves and so to a good life in moral virtues and yet might arrive to the same and doubtless were then accepted of God and may yet be so where the Gospel is not known yet where the Gospel comes it will not serve or avail us without the true faith and life of the Gospel but if it being captivated by sensual lusts reject or neglect the Grace of life it renders such the more liable to the Judgment and damnation threatned therein Learned Sirs The Reasons of my dedicating the ensuing Christian discourse unto you are 1. Because the things discoursed on are matters of great if not of greatest concern to the name of God and Christ the glorious Gospel of the blessed God and the spiritual and eternal good of men and therefore of weighttest concern to have the precedency in your meditations 2. Because most of the things discoursed on are not Novel but the controverted things of the past and present times the Doctrine of the Sovereignty of God as exercised towards men the Doctrine of Election and reprobation the general and special grace of God c. being the substance of the discourse and that on which all depends The eighth chapter may at first probably with some seem most difficult yet I doubt not but is founded in and fully comports with the universal design of God and undertaking of Christ in the general grace to the World in the restitution and world to come in times to be effected and seems to be of very great weight to be understood and to have room in our Christian Faith as the top-stone and glory thereof and without which we shall lose the understanding of and Faith in the greatest if not the most glorious part of Scripture and Gospel truth In the discourse I sometimes mention what some others have said about some of the things discoursed on and especially two Books viz. The Practical Discourse of the Sovereignty of God and The Death of Death by the Death of Christ Not designing a particular answer to them nor had I at all mentioned them had they not been sent in by some designedly to lead us aside from that which we believe to be the truth of the Gospel but have stated the truth about these matters to the best of mine understanding from Scripture light which if true the substance of both are answered and must fall to the ground And let none count it strange or tautologies that I so often go over the same things in the discourse it is to shew the incongruity of those invented principles and practices with Scripture light and right reason in all the ways mentioned it likewise being the method of God in Scripture frequently to mention the same things over and over again designedly thereby to inculcate it on the memory and heart that it might not be forgotten 3. Because I think we have ground enough at least to suppose that the Apostasie from the Primitive faith as it was then delivered to the Saints has been too much ushered in by learned ●●●en I suppose that it will easily appear that in all the parts thereof whether the Papabor others some learned man or men lieth at the bottom thereof And likewise has been chief actors in its propagation and therefore it greatly concerns you now at last to be at work for God Christ the Gospel and good of men in good earnest for discovery thereof and reformation therein O that you might have your share in this matter how might you honour God and season the Nation with the truth of the Gospel both in faith and life having the greatest opportunities and advantages in order thereunto in the sincere endeavours of which you may expect Divine direction assistance and blessing and O that this little Essay may tend to encourage herein it being the common advantage and good of all I really design I hope I have not I am sure I would not follow cunning devised Fables for the world and if I am in any
multitudes of them did believe Act. 2. 4. and 4. 4. and 6. 7. and 21. 20. Christ The 7th Scripture I shall mention is Jude v 4. Which speaks of certain men of old Ordained to this Condemnation Hence some conclude that some are Ordained to be damned and cannot possibly be saved Minist Tho it 's true that God hath Ordained that wicked men persisting in sin shall be damned yet the inference as drawn from this Scripture is a great abuse and wrong to the Text. The word in the Greek is of whom it was written in time past or of old unto this Judgment and so Tindal renders it that is God had of old or in time past threatened such Judgment unto such sinners as a just reward of their sin It was written of old v 14. not that he made or Ordained them for that End So that the truth stands clear from the word of truth that God exerciseth his Sovereignty over men in a way of Righteousness according to his word and not from his own will to save and damn whom he pleases distinct from his Laws given to men on that behalf the assertion of which being the highest abuse and dishonour to God the Sovereign Governour of the world as can possibly be put upon him and therefore is to be abhor'd of all sober men Christ I shall at present enquire no further about this matter being well satisfied in what has been said and likewise that there has been and yet is great mistakes about this matter that is of so great and weighconcern rightly to be understood I desire you to give me some inferences by way of instruction from the whole Min. 1. To know and be assuredly established in this that there is no decree of God for your destruction distinct from sin as the just and deserving cause persisted in without Repentance 2. Take heed and beware of sinning against this Gracious Holy and Righteous God who tho he made not men to sin and be damned yet he will by no means clear the guilty but will wound the head of his Enemies and the hairy scalp of such a one as goeth on still in his trespasses Ps 68. 21. Therefore let not the Rebellious exalt themselves Ps 66. 7. As he is Gracious and full of Compassion so he is just it 's his name his nature and word Exod. 34. 6 7. Therefore I say take heed and beware of all sin 3. Take heed and beware of entertaining such notions about the Sovereignty of God as are not suitable to his name and nature his Word and Will in which his Goodness Mercy Justice Wisdom Holiness Truth and Faithfulness is so much concerned lest you dishonor him in thinking and speaking that which is not right concerning him and his Wrath be kindled against you as it was against Job's three Friends because they spake not the things that were right of him as Job did Job 42. 7. He is very jealous of his name and honor and accepteth not those that plead wickedly for him Job 13. 8. That renders God to be more cruel to the Creatures that he hath made his own offspring Act. 17. 28 29. than any of the Creatures that he hath made which are naturally loving to their own yea more hard and cruel to his own offspring than the worst and most cruel of the Sons of Men more cruel and merciless than Pharaoh who laid heavy tasks on the Children of Israel requiring Brick without straw yet it 's apparent he thought it was possible for them to get straw and to make up their full tale of Brick for he said they were Idle by which it appears that he thought they might work the harder and do it Exod. 5. But this principle renders God not only to require Brick without straw but to require all Men every where to repent and believe the Gospel Act. 17. 30. Mar. 1. 15. and will damn them for not believing yet has allowed them no power so to do but Decreed the contrary In a word it renders the Holy and Good God who is Good to all to be worse to his own Creatures his own off-spring than it 's possible for the Devil to be who is the common Enemy of Mankind and goeth about like a roaring Lion seeking whom he may devour 1 Pet. 5. 8. But he can devour none but by temptations and delusions he can devour none without their own consent but this presents the Holy God by his Sovereign Will and Power to have devoured almost all Mankind by Eternal Decree that he made them for that very end Had they fixed such things on the Devil as they do on the Holy God they might have been credited had he power so to do but to render God to be worse to Men than it 's possible for the Devil to be is to be abhor'd of all that love and fear him therefore take heed and beware thereof He would be accounted no Man but worse than a Brute that would beget Children designedly to breed them up for the Gallows abhor such thoughts of God 4. Be encouraged from hence to believe and obey the Gospel that you may be saved and know and believe assuredly in so doing you shall be saved It 's the Sovereign Law of Christ your Lord which is unalterable Mar. 16. 15 16. He that believeth and is Baptized shall be saved Heb. 5. 9. He is become the Author of Eternal Salvation to all them that obey him this is the Gospel Law of Grace to Men against which there is nor can be no Decree 5. And finally be not afraid nor discouraged be not affrighted nor amazed with any amazement either as from God or Men in this matter 1. From God in the untrue representations of his Sovereign Power as if he would save and damn from his own Will as if he had reprobated the far greater part of Men to Eternal Perdition without hope or means of help an amazing Doctrine it is that hath sent many serious Souls with sorrow to their Graves and it 's to be feared hath sent many to Perdition but look up lift up your head and heart God has determined no Damnation to any Man but for sin as the deserving cause therefore believe and obey the Gospel and you shall be saved 2. Nor be afraid of Men in your Faithful following of your Lord the Sovereign Power and Providence is over you and for you Joh. 3. 31. He that cometh from above is above all therefore be not afraid of Men. Isa 51. 7 8. But sanctify the Lord of Hosts himself and let him be your fear and let him be your dread And he will be a Sanctuary unto you Isa 8. 11 12 13 He ruleth by his Power for ever his eyes behold the Nations therefore let not the Rebellious exalt themselves Psalm 66. 7. For the Rebellious shall dwell in a dry land Ps 68. 6. Zec. 14. 17. Isa 66. 24. CHAP. II. Treateth of Election Christ I Desire to enquire into the