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A33929 A compendious discourse about some of the greatest matters of Christian faith propounded and explained between a minister and an enquiring Christian ... : and also may serve for an answer to two books, one called The practical discourse of the sovereignty of God, the other called The death of death, by the death of Christ, written by J.O. : whereunto is annexed a very brief appendix / written by T. Collier. Collier, Thomas, fl. 1691. 1682 (1682) Wing C5274; ESTC R20632 146,911 256

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can be no worse among the Heathen yet ●●d will in time be pacified towards them and return ●●●n when he returns his sinning People Judah and Is●●●l Ezek. 16. 53 61. Zeph. 3. 8. Where is declared ●● universal Judgment of the World and when that ●● finished verse 9. Then will I turn to the People a ●● Language that they may all call upon the Name of the Lord and serve him with one consent The same Judged People shall afterward serve the Lord he saith not my People but the People which fully agreeth with other Scriptures of the same import Psal 102. 22. When the People are gathered together and the Kingdoms to serve the Lord and 22. 27. 86. 9. And many more that might be mentioned and Luk. 12. 48. The servant that miscarried through ignorance shall be beaten little so the word is tho much in it self yet little compared with wilful Transgressors and little fully imports an end of beating and Eternal beating and striping can in no sense be said to be little or few stripes so that an end of or Redemption from the penal part of the second Death though not of loss to the generality of the World both of Jews and Gentiles in times to be effected is most apparent from the Scriptures of truth and I verily believe it 's nothing else but a Traditional Reception contrary thereunto that makes it so strange unto us And as for the threefold state of the World at that day by some so much stumbled at it 's likewise as apparent not only from Psal 64. 8 9 10 verse 8. are the Eternally Condemned ones verse 9 the generality of the World all men verse 10. are the Righteous with the Lord and Isaiah 66. is first a description of the Church in its Glory with Christ verse 10 11 12. 2. The gathering of all tongues and all flesh to worship verse 18 23. 3. The Eternally Condemned ones verse 24. But if our eyes were but half open we might read as much in Mat. 25. 32 c. Where we may necessarily understand three states two mentioned and a third not mentioned but implied 1. All Infants so dying are not there mentioned not being capable of such a sentence either to life or death viz. on the same ●●ounds for feeding or not feeding the Members of Christ which are not a small part of the World 2. All the Heathen World that never heard of Christ or his ●embers and as they have not been nor are capable to ●ew mercy to Christ in his Members so are they ●ot capable of such a sentence it being proper only to Gospel-Professors but indeed that World may not only admit of a threefold state but of three thousand ●a infinite as to us if it be true according to Scri●ure that God will render to every man according to ●s Works 1 Cor. 5. 10. Rev. 22. 12. Christ Some cry out against this Doctrine as grie●●● Heresie and scandalous to the Gospel Min. To this I shall say but little tho I could say much 1. For truth to be accounted Heresie is no 〈◊〉 and therefore no strange thing 2. After the ●●y they call Heresie so believe I and worship God 3. I ●eartily desire they may repent of this in time it being ●●oful sin to call good evil and evil good 4. To ●nder it Heresie and scandalous is to render the whole ●ord and design of God by Christ in the Gospel to ● Heresie and scandalous relative to the Judg●ent and World to come according to the true declara●on thereof as has been plainly and plentifully pro●d before 5. Suppose it true that it were Heresie ●hich it 's far from I query of them whether it ●ould possibly be any more than as a drop to the Ocean ●● respect of the Errours and Heresies held by them●●ves as has been before unvailed 6. And as for ●●s being scandalous to the Gospel I say 1. If to as●●t that God will Judge the World in Righteousness by 〈◊〉 Christ and render to every man according to his ●●rks penal punishment both for measure and time sutable to the Facts of men that he will punish none without a cause nor more than is deserved if this be in good earnest scandalous either to God or Man then I acknowledge I am guilty of this scandal and shall I hope till I dye I conclude this with the saying of Tertullian which I think is true viz. Good things offend none but such as have ill minds Christ Some say suppose all you say about these matters be true yet they question what advantage may be supposed in publishing thereof especially it being an offence to many Min. 1. If there were no worth at all nor advantage in the knowledge of the Glorious design of God to the World by Jesus Christ in the Restitution and World to come certainly he would not have filled his word with the discoveries thereof as he has he would not have made it the work of all his holy Prophets since the World began to speak thereof but to the end that we might understand and believe it to his praise things revealed belonging to us Deut. 29. 29. There being no truth in the Scripture more fully and frequently declared than the Restitution and World to come with the Glories thereof I think I may say the Scriptures abounds and excels in this Act. 3. 21. And what may we conceive from hence but the greatness of the truth thereof and the greatness of our concern to understand and believe it 2. If it be the Faith to which the promise of life in the World to come is made as has been before proved then certainly it concerns us to understand and believe it and the publishing thereof should be no o●ence unto any but rather their joy and though Christ sometime said Joh. 16. 12. I have many things to say unto you but ye cannot bear them now which is by some urged in this matter To this I say that the times before and after the sufferings of Christ much differed afterwards Christ did not forbear the publishing of that to them which they were not capable to bear before he suffered nor did the Apostle forbear the publishing of further truth to them that were dull of hearing Heb. 5. 11. with ch 6. 1 2 3. And the Apostle complains that he was become or esteemed an Enemy because he told them the truth Gal. 4. 16. And indeed a sin and a shame it is that any profest Christians should be offended at the Doctrine of the Restitution of all things the World to come with the Glories thereof it being the Crowning part of the Glorious Gospel of the Blessed God And if men will now be offended at the truth I know no help for it Christ Some say that the World to come is a Mystery and none are capable to understand the perfection of the Glories thereof yet you have undertaken to declare what it is and so have presumed beyond
themselves to do to others as they would they should do to them and the Gospel teaches the same Mat. 22. 37. to 40. and 7. 12. and this is written in all men by nature and is true rational and moral Philosophy and true Gospel Divinity and where it 's not effected it 's by the souls captivation by irrational immoral and sensual lusts and how would the Divine Law of Christ and in the Gospel united to our understandings and reason effect it if taken heed unto A sin and shame it is and dreadful will be the issue thereof that many Learned men who account themselves above others both in Philosophy and Divinity and yet are more immoral than many moral Heathens And as both moral Philosophy and Gospel Divinity unites in teaching the abhorrency of all ungodliness with the practice of all the contrary vertues and duties so would it teach us to abhor all persecution for Conscience sake if attended to it would teach us in this matter to do to others as we would they should do to us the contrary being not only unchristian but irrational No man in his right reason would be content to be forced to believe and worship God as others do contrary to his own light and conscience such in Justice reason it self and light of nature abhors and it 's likewise contrary to the Protestant Doctrine and Faith which is to make the Scriptures our rule in all matters of Faith and practice and not to be compelled to believe as the Church believeth which is condemned by Protestants to be the Popish Faith and not the Faith of Christ And strange it seems to be that Learned men who profess themselves to have most both of Philosophy and Divinity should be so great miscarriers herein I think it may be said without all just occasion of offence that throughout all ages of Christianity Learned men has lien at the bottom of most of the persecutions for Conscience sake surely it came not from their Philosophy or Divinity but from their enmity pride and prophaneness Ps 10. 2. or from some carnal and corrupt ends within themselves must be irrational and irreligious or at best from blind and ignorant zeal Joh. 16. 2. Phi. 3. 6. It 's true the Scripture warns us to take heed of being spoiled by Philosophy and vain deceit after the traditions of men and the rudiments of the World and not after Christ Col. 2. 8 i. e. When our reason turns us aside from the Gospel either in matters of Faith or practice being corruptly exercised and so becomes vain and deceitful and is not pure reason that submits it self to the Divine Law of Christ in all things so far as it understands it And although Rational and Moral Philosophy was and yet is excellent in its time and place and in itself in its degree spiritual being of and from God yet the Gospel is more spiritual and by it men formerly arrived to much of the knowledge of God and themselves and so to a good life in moral virtues and yet might arrive to the same and doubtless were then accepted of God and may yet be so where the Gospel is not known yet where the Gospel comes it will not serve or avail us without the true faith and life of the Gospel but if it being captivated by sensual lusts reject or neglect the Grace of life it renders such the more liable to the Judgment and damnation threatned therein Learned Sirs The Reasons of my dedicating the ensuing Christian discourse unto you are 1. Because the things discoursed on are matters of great if not of greatest concern to the name of God and Christ the glorious Gospel of the blessed God and the spiritual and eternal good of men and therefore of weighttest concern to have the precedency in your meditations 2. Because most of the things discoursed on are not Novel but the controverted things of the past and present times the Doctrine of the Sovereignty of God as exercised towards men the Doctrine of Election and reprobation the general and special grace of God c. being the substance of the discourse and that on which all depends The eighth chapter may at first probably with some seem most difficult yet I doubt not but is founded in and fully comports with the universal design of God and undertaking of Christ in the general grace to the World in the restitution and world to come in times to be effected and seems to be of very great weight to be understood and to have room in our Christian Faith as the top-stone and glory thereof and without which we shall lose the understanding of and Faith in the greatest if not the most glorious part of Scripture and Gospel truth In the discourse I sometimes mention what some others have said about some of the things discoursed on and especially two Books viz. The Practical Discourse of the Sovereignty of God and The Death of Death by the Death of Christ Not designing a particular answer to them nor had I at all mentioned them had they not been sent in by some designedly to lead us aside from that which we believe to be the truth of the Gospel but have stated the truth about these matters to the best of mine understanding from Scripture light which if true the substance of both are answered and must fall to the ground And let none count it strange or tautologies that I so often go over the same things in the discourse it is to shew the incongruity of those invented principles and practices with Scripture light and right reason in all the ways mentioned it likewise being the method of God in Scripture frequently to mention the same things over and over again designedly thereby to inculcate it on the memory and heart that it might not be forgotten 3. Because I think we have ground enough at least to suppose that the Apostasie from the Primitive faith as it was then delivered to the Saints has been too much ushered in by learned ●●●en I suppose that it will easily appear that in all the parts thereof whether the Papabor others some learned man or men lieth at the bottom thereof And likewise has been chief actors in its propagation and therefore it greatly concerns you now at last to be at work for God Christ the Gospel and good of men in good earnest for discovery thereof and reformation therein O that you might have your share in this matter how might you honour God and season the Nation with the truth of the Gospel both in faith and life having the greatest opportunities and advantages in order thereunto in the sincere endeavours of which you may expect Divine direction assistance and blessing and O that this little Essay may tend to encourage herein it being the common advantage and good of all I really design I hope I have not I am sure I would not follow cunning devised Fables for the world and if I am in any
1. It derogates from the perfection of God from which they pretend thereby to escape denying him to be capable to be what he hath said he is and his Throne and dwelling Place to be where he hath said it is and to do what he hath said he doth and will do which is his perfection in a God-like way to do 2. It 's that which tends to end the Scripture revelation as the truth of God tending to make us wholly at a loss concerning his mind and will relating to us rendering him to have two Wills contrary to each other and that he intends not what he speaks and so leaves us wholly at a loss about the Divine revelation ●●ich is exceeding dishonorable unto God and perni●●rs unto men Christ Christ saith in the institution of the Sup●● Mat. 26. 26 28. Of the Bread this is my Body ●●● of the Wine this is my Blood c. And if we take ●●ccording to the Letter we know it is not so And it ●●●ise justifies the Popish Transubstantion Min. Much might be said to this but I shall in this ●●ce only say this unto it viz. That both Christ and ●● Apostle Paul fully explains these Words to be a fi●●ative Speech 1. that Christ explains it Luk. 22. ●● This do in remembrance of me to let them and us ●●w that he did not intend that it was he himself but ●● Ordinance instituted and left to the Church in re●●mbrance of him viz. Of what he had suffered for ●●m so the Apostle likewise from the mouth of ●hrist explains it 1 Cor. 11. 24 25 26. This do in ●●membrance of me and this do in remembrance of me ●●● as often as ye Eat this Bread and Drink this Cup ●● do shew the Lords Death till he come it was Bread all even when they eat it and the Cup viz. the ●ine was Wine still and it was to shew the Lords ●●ath and not the Lords Death so that it 's fully ex●●ained in the Divine Record to be a remembrance a ●●ure a shew and not the thing it self so that Tran●●bstantiation is not only irrational but unscriptural and so irreligious Christ I shall at present enquire no further but de●re you to draw up the sum of the whole as briefly as you ●●n and so to conclude the present discourse Min. I shall but before I so do and in order thereunto I shall briefly promise five things 1. That the Scriptures are the divine and revealed Word and Will of God and as so are our rule in all matters both of Gospel-Faith and Practice Isa 8. 20. 2 Tim. 3. 15. 1 Joh. 4. 6. and that whoever denieth this denieth the ground of all Christian Faith and Religion as likewise those who affirm that the promises and precepts are not God's intentions or purpose 2. That all matters of Faith especially of things fundamental viz. things to be believed and de●● without which we cannot be saved are plainly set down in the Scripture and are to be understood according to the express Letter of the Scripture or the plain Scope and Reason thereof and not to build our Faith on mens interpretations and additions otherwise our Faith must be built on mens interpretations and additions and not on the Word of the Lord which must needs be an uncertain and unsafe building and if we so build our Faith how far we shall be from Rome in this matter is easie to be understood by the weakest capacity 3. That had we not had this Divine Revelation of Gospel grace by Christ we should have been as ignorant thereof as the Nations that are without it 4. And therefore it much concerns us to believe it on its own authority and to prize it and cleave to it without adding or diminishing by interpretation● or additions of failable men especially in things fundamental 5. I add That what I have said in this Discourse or shall further say is not so much by way of interpretation otherwise than by comparing and uniting the Scripture in its own light language and reason so as that I doubt not but the meanest capacity being wil●●g may easily understand and the belief thereof impose on none further than it 's apprehended truth ●●d worth takes place in the understandings and con●●ences of men Having premised these things I shall result the whole ● briefly as possible I can in which if I am not very ●●ch mistaken is comprehended most of the Funda●entals of Gospel Doctrin and Christian Faith and ●●ligion in order to salvation united in the plain ●●ds sense and truth of Scripture as a golden ●●in of which not one link may be broken without ●●ger to the whole 1. That God is Heb. 11. 6. and that there is but one ●●d the Father and one Lord Jesus Christ 1 Cor. 8. 6. ●●d that this one God is an infinite incomprehensible ●●rious and eternal Being most holy wise just good ●●d gracious almighty omnipresent merciful and true ●●d faithful in his sayings Deut. 33. 7. Isa 40. 28. 1 Sam. 1 Psal 139. 7. 2. That this almighty wise and good God made all ●●●ngs by Jesus Christ Joh. 1. 1 2 3. with Ephes 3. 9. ●● 1. 16. Heb. 1. 2. and that he made all things good his own content Gen. 1. 31. and made man best of ●●l viz. in his own Image or likeness Gen. 1. 26 ● 28. and so did not nor could not make any de●rdly to sin and be damned it being contrary to the ●●dness of his nature and name and the truth of his ●ord and so impossible for so wise holy just and good God to make any of his Creatures designedly to so ●● an end 3. That man by transgressing the Law of his Maker● seil from that good estate in which he was made into an estate of sin and death Gen. 2. 16 17. and 3. 6 and that death threatned and inflicted was only the first death Gen. 3. 16 17 18 19. 1 Cor. 1● 21 2● and that this death came into and passeth upon all men Rom. 5. 12 18. 4. That God of his own free goodness and mercy immediately aft●r the sin and fall set him upon promise of recovery and restitution out of this fal● state by the ●●●d of the Woman that should brou●● the head design of the Serpent Gen. 3. 15. and afterward frequently renewed the promise of this Grac● to Mankind Gen. 22. 18. and 26. 4. and 28. 14. Psa● 72. 11 17. Joh. 1. 45. with Act. 3. 21. 5. That according to the promise of this grace who the fulness of time was comes God sent forth this promised Seed and Son made of a Woman Gal. 4. 4. th● Seed of Abraham the Son of David and the Son God truly God and Man Matth. 1. 1. Luk. 1. 32 3. Rom. 9. 5. as a real demonstration of love to the World according to the foregoing promises thereof Luk. 2. 1 Joh. 2. 16. 6. That this Son and Saviour being come into ● World for this