for it is the earth shall help the woman Answ The courtesie the Saints received which was from them whose hearts was opened that the Lord had opened by his power that is not condemned But your taking Tythes of people you do not work for and casting into Prison till death for not giving it you How are you like the Apostles or like the Ministers of Christ or like the woman thou speaks of the Church that was persecuted Now you persecute this signifies she was persecuted And you persecute for meanes and hale up and down in Courts and Sessions and will take treble damages treble tythes of them you do no work for and so you will not stand to the courtesie of people nor wait for the power to open their hearts but are in a power that will take it by compulsion and by violence away from people So you have given judgment against your selves and are not of the number of them the Lord opened their hearts that ministred to their necessities and so unlike the Ministers of Christ that received the courtesies of the people whom the Lord opened their hearts Pr. Thou saith When people have no guide but what is within and that this principle be rooted it will turne all into Babel And thou questions whether it be not a principle of sedition to say that every man hath a light within him Answ All people in the world runs into Babel and Babylon and are building up and throwing down and so goes into confusion about Law and Gospel Prophets Christ and the Apostles words when they be from the spirit within of truth to lead them into all truth and up to God the Father of Truth of whom they learn that gave them forth and with that spirit are they seen in which spirit is unity which is the bond of peace And the light which doth enlighten every man that comes into the world leads all men out of sedition and they be in the sedition that denies it and sayes to the contrary and in darknesse and cannot comprehend it as John sayes which says this is the true light that enlightens every man that cometh into the world And Christ says Believe in the light And the Prophets said God gave him for a Covenant of light to the Gentiles and a new Covenant to the Jewes and he shall be the Leader of the people and salvation to the ends of the earth and every man that comes into the world is enenligtned He that believes is saved and he that believes not is condemned already Pr. Thou queries When the Act of the Commission for the Ministry was repealed since Christ said he would be with them to the end of world And thou saist It is not said simply they shall teach no more every man his neghbour but it is added Know the Lord. Thou saist that every man is enlightned onely with a naturall reason and the elect are enlightned with a saving knowledge Thou saist I bring John 4.23 to overthrow all outward worship Thou saist You can praise God with your bodies and spirits Answ The 7th of Matthew Matth. 24. Christ said false Prophets should come and should be inwardly ravening wolves having sheeps cloathing and John said they was come Chap. 2. Chap. 4. And in Revel All that dwelt upon the earth went after them and such killed the Saints When they had gotten a head they killed the Saints and the true Ministers and they that were of the false killed the true and since those dayes the false hath reigned which hath wrestled with flesh and blood prisoning killing the creatures and warring against them and not with the Principalities and spirituall wickednesses and powers of darknesse and such hath been out of the power the Gospell the Apostles were in hath killed them that kept the testimony of Jesus the spirit of Prophecy And it is said plainly Heb. 8. They shall not teach every man his neighbour nor every man his brother saying know the Lord for they shall all know me from the greatest to the least saith the Lord And so thou perverts the Scriptures and art judged by them for it that belies them And the light that doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world is the same Light that the Elect lives in which the world not believing in the Light Christ Jesus the Elect and covenant of light and life and peace promised to the world they are condemned already but he that believes in the Light is saved so that saving is sufficient And Christ sayes they that worship the Father must worship him in spirit and in truth Not at Jerusalem not at Samaria nor at the Mountain So say I not at your Masse-houses with a Crosse at the end of them which the Popes set up and you since the dayes of the Apostles So they that worship God must worship him in the spirit and in the truth Truth doth not change neither doth the Spirit and these be them the Father seeks to worship and hath found many And Christ overthrows the outward worship at Samaria and Jerusalem and the Mountain and so do we at your Papists Masse-houses and tell you God is worshipded in the spirit and in the truth and those are the true worshippers that God seeks to worship and that will stand when Masse-houses Samaria and Jerusalem is down the spirit and the truth that remains In the mouth of the wicked praises is not comely And as for your singing Davids conditions or the Saints conditions given forth from the spirit when you confesse you are not in the spirit as they was that gave them forth So then judged with it to be such whose mouths the praises are not comely that be in another state then they where that gave Scriptures forth And Adams state before the Fall thou knowest not but art found in the steps of the Pharisees and Papists As the Pharisees got words of the true Prophets and Moses out of the life so the Papists and you have got the words of Christ and the Apostles and be out of the life and persecuting them that be in the life as the Pharisees did and killing the just the just being imprisoned in your own particulars as it was in the Pharisees And you with your dark eyes have looked upon the Scriptures ever since the apostacy and ravened from the spirit of God the pure eye and so with that you are comprehended felt over and seen over and with that shall the principle of God in you all be answered that you are apostatized from the Apostles in life and power and doctrine and so are in heaps about their words out from that which is the ground of communion the bond of peace And all thy confusion in thy Book is thy own garments who with it is for the fire the witnesse in thy conscience in the day of thy condemnation shall witnesse it Thomas Tillam his Booke called The seventh-day-Sabbath His Principles answered as Followeth Pr. ALl
THE GREAT MISTERY OF THE GREAT WHORE UNFOLDED AND ANTICHRISTS KINGDOM Revealed unto DESTRVCTION In Answer to many False Doctrines and Principles which Babylons Merchants have traded with being held forth by the professed Ministers and Teachers and Professors in England Ireland and Scotland taken under their owne Hands and from their owne Mouths sent forth by Them from time to time against the despised People of the LORD called QVAKERS who are of the Seed of that Woman who hath been long fled into the WILDERNES ALSO An Invasion upon the great City BABYLON with the spoling of Her golden Cup and delicate Merchandize whereby She hath deceived the World and Nations And herein is declared the spoyling of her prey in this Answer to the multitude of Doctrines held forth by the many false SECTS which have lost the key of Knowledge and been on foot since the Apostles dayes called Anabaptists Independents Presbyters Ranters and many others who out of their own Mouths have manifested themselves not to be of a true descent from the true Christian Churches But it 's discovered that they have been all made drunk with the Wine of Fornication received from the Whore which hath sitten upon the Beast after whom the World hath wondred By GEORGE FOX And the Merchants of the Earth shall weep and mourn over her for no man buyeth their merchandize any more Rev. 18.18 And they cryed when they saw the smoak of her burning saying what City is like unto this great City And they cast dust on their heads and cryed weeping and wailing saying Alas alas that great City wherein were made rich all that had Ships in the Sea by reason of her costliness for in one hour is she made desolate Rev. 18 18 19. LONDON Printed for Tho Simmons at the Ball and Mouth near Aldersgate 1659. THE EPISTLE TO THE READER TO all the world to whom this may come to be Read that they read with a good understanding and hereby they may come to the perfect knowledge of the ground of difference between the Priests and Professors and all Sects in these Nations and Us who are in scorn called Quakers shewing that the conversie on our paâ—â— is just and equal against them all and tâ—â—â— we have sufficient cause to cry against them and to deny their Mâ—â—â—stry their Church their worship and their whole Religion as being not in the Power and by the Spirit 〈…〉 â—â—â—ng God as commanded of him or ever practiced by his Sain◠〈◊〉 â—ut 〈◊〉 â—â—clareth the gâ—â—und and foundation thereof to be anotheâ—â—â—â—â—g aâ—â—â—ot the same on which the true Church and Ministry anâ—â—â—actice 〈◊〉 worship and true Religion was builded in the daye◠〈◊〉 Apoâ—â—â—es And also this is an Invitation to all Sects and professioâ— of People to come forth and try if what they hold and professe be according â—o the Scriptures of truth and to do this in tryall by evident and sound Arguments and by the best spiritual weapons they have and to laâ—â—â—â—e all this persecution and unrighteous dealing and stocking and wâ—â—pping and imprisoning of us for speaking against their Religion and that they come forth in fair dispute to contend in the Spirit of meekness for what they professe and practice and to prove according to the Scriptures their Ministry Church and whole Religion that it is in and by the spirit and power of God or otherwise to renounce and deny all their Religion and the profession and practices thereof that every man may be satisfied who it is that are in the true and right way and of the true worship and true Religion and who it is that are not and this is desired by us who are called Quakers and also a true account of our first beginning and coming forth in the world and of that great sufferings we have sustained and how we have been carryed on and are preserved to this day The Lord God everlasting who is true and faithful hath fulfilled his promise in us and unto us and we are gathered from the mouths of all dumb Shepherds and out of the mouths of all Hirelings who have made a prey upon us and fed themselves with the fat and devoured souls for dishonest gain And we are come to the fould of Eternal rest where Christ Jesus is the chief Shepherd and he is the Shepherd and Bishop of our souls that feedeth his Flock with living bread that nourisheth us unto life eternal he hath called us by his Name and put us forth and he feedeth us in green pastures and we are fed with hidden Manna and lies down at Noon with his gathered Flock and out of Nations kindreds multitudes and peoples are we Redeemed to God and are come out of the world and out of great Babylon and out of spiritual Sodom and Egypt where the Lord Christ was and is crucified and lyeth slain to this day and a top of the world hath the Lord set us on the mountain of his oâ—n house and dwelling where we behold and feel the life and glory Crown of the world that hath no end and the world that hath an end is seen over and its Crown and glory is his footstool that Reigns among us And as for all that which this perishing world brings forth which men seek after only It s reckoned our temptation though all the sons of Adam are seeking its glory its Riches its Crowns its contentments But of that birth are we which hath no Crown no glory nor rest under the Sun and a birth is brought forth amongst us which is heir of another Kingdom and possessor of anoâ—â—er Crown whose glorying is in the Lord all the day long and he is ouâ— Refuge our Rock and our fortresse against all our Enemies and what though the wicked arm themselves and the ungodly bend their bâ—w what though all sorts of people from the Prince upon his Tâ—â—◠〈◊〉 â—he Beggar upon the dunghill exalt themselves against thâ— dâ—â—piseâ—â—â—ople of Lords inheritance who for his Names sake are kiâ—â—â—d all the â—ay long what though the wisemen bring forth their Aâ—â—â—â—â—nts anâ— what though the Rulers bring forth unrighteous Judgemeâ—â—s again 〈◊〉 â—eed that God hath blessed what though the revilers and scorners open their mouthes and reproachers and revilers cast out their bitter words as a flood against the remnant of the womans seed that hath long been fled into the wilderness and what then if the Teachers the Prophets and the Elders and the heads and wise men of the world set themselves to pray and Preach and Print against the chosen seed of Jacob yet notwithstanding all this though this is come to passe and hell open her mouth and her floods break forth to overflow and be much more increased yet shall the King of righteousness rule among his people and his presence will not forsake his chosen ones But the Lord is with us a mighty and terrible one and the shout of a King is amongst us and the dread and terror of
fully desires we might be brought to the Barr of true Justice together and in every particular of Principles and practices examined and tryed to the full and each of us judged in truth and equity whither it be they or us that are of the true Religion and true faith and true worship of God that the Apostles were in and which of us it is that are in a wrong way and in a false Religion and false faith and worship and in this we will joyn issue with them in the sight of the whole Nation if they will come forth to triall if what already is brought forth by them against us and by us against them for this seven years in disputes and in printing and otherwise be not sufficient for all people to try us in and judge us by whether they or we be in the right and whether in the wrong And now to all people in the Nation I do appeal to that of God in all their consciences to judge between the Priests and Professors and all the Sects and us ye have heard their Doctrines and ye have heard something of ours ye have seen their conversation and ye have seen something of ours ye have heard them long and something of us ye have heard for a little season and now give your evidence is it not with them as we have said are not your Priests in the steps of the false prophets and of the deceivers and do not they seek for their gain from their quarter as they did that Isaiah cryed against do not they Preach for hire and Divine for money as they did which Micah cryed against are not they such by whom you have not been profited as Jeremiah cryed against let that of God in you answer to these things and are they not proud men and covetous men and envious men and heady high-minded men and given to filthy lucre and are they not such as through covetousnesse makes merchandize of souls and that by good words and fair speeches deceives the hearts of the simple such as Paul and Peter declares against And are they not such as the true Prophets Christ and his Apostles cried against and doe they not bring forth the same fruits as did the false Prophets and fâ—lse Apostles I leave it to your consciences to be the judge compare them and lay them to the line of true judgement if you shut not your eyes you may see it is thus and have we charged them falsly or have not we spoken the truth concerning them we have said they are false ministers and deceivers and not true Ministers of Christ and is it not so let the light in your consciences answer we have said they have run and never was sent and that they have not profited the people at all and is it not so to the witness of God in you I do appeal and let that justifie that we have spoken nothing but the truth examine and try in all things that we have charged them with and are they not guilty in all things that we have charged upon them let the witness of God in you testifie to this and what do you judge of them are they not of that stock which Christ said should come and should be wolves in sheepes cloathing and should deceive many and which John saw was come in his dayes and which the world went after and the whole world run after them are not they in the nature of wolves devouring and tearing the Lambs of Christ and do they not tear people by causing their bodies to be imprisoned and their goods to be spoiled and do they not deceive many and yet they have the sheepes cloathing the Saints words and their practices but inwardly are they not ravening and doth not the world go after them and hath not the world run after them for many ages and is it not thus with them And have they received the gift of the holy Ghost or are they not made Ministers by the will of man and not by the will of God do they not differ and are contrary in call in practice in maintenance and in fruits and effects to the true Ministers and true Apostles and do they not agree and are they not according to the false Prophets and false Ministers and deceivers in their call practice maintenance fruits and effects search the Scriptures and lay them to that line and then let the witness in your consciences judge and answer and do not they prepare War against such as doth not put into their mouths and do not they feed with the fat and cloath with the wool do not they oppresse the Nation and the Creation and are not they such whose Call and practices and maintenance and whole Ministry hath a dependance upon Popery and doth it not all savour of Popery and in the main and Principal parts thereof were ordained by the Pope this may be fully made manifest And are not all Professors and Sects of people such as have the form but are without the power of godliness are not people still covetous and earthly minded and given to the world and proud and vain even such as professe Religion and to a seperated people is not Professors as covetous and proud as such as doth not professe and are not they given to the world and doth it not shew that they are unchanged nor translated but death Reigns among them and is it not manifest that they have taken up the form of the Apostles and Christs words and practices and are without the life and not guided by the spirit of Christ and the Apostles in their praying and Preaching and are not your souls lean and starved to the witness of God in you all I speak which may testifie that many people have a shew of Religion without life and therefore have not we spoken the truth of them in what we have said in the day of Judgement you shall answer it And as concerning the Quakers what do you say of them you have seen their conversation few Towns but some of them have been and are amongst you do not they fear God and do not they walk justly and truly among their neighbours and speakes the truth and doth the truth in all things doing to all no otherwise then they would be done unto and are they not meek and humble and sober and do not they take much wrong rather then give wrong to any and are they not such as delights in the ways of the Lord and do not they deny the world and its pleasures and forsakes all iniquity more then your selves and do not they take up the daily Crosse of Christ to all its wayes and earthly glories and do not they Preach in the power of God and reacheth to your consciences when you hear them and doth not the light in you answer that they speak the truth and is not their Call and practice and maintenance the same as was the Apostles and faithful Ministers compare them with the
Scripture and then Judge in your consciences and do not they suffer many hard and cruel things even all manner of evil spoken and done against them falsly for the Name of Christ are you ignorant of their great sufferings through this Nation and what do you think is their suffering for evil doing or is it not for righteousness sake what harm do they do to any by work or word why are they reproached and mocked and scorned and why are they put in prisons and whipped and thus sorely abused is it for any evil doing or is it not because they are the servants of the Lord compare their fruits with the Priests fruits their conversation with the Priests conversation and see whether be liker the Apostles and these things I leave to you that you may come to consider and judge justly of all things for the Lord God is risen and his light in peoples consciences is shining forth and it shall answer to what I say in this world or in the day of Judgement when we and all mankind shall appear and come forth to tryal and every mans work shall be tryed and all shall receive according to their deeds And so gladly would we be made manifest to all the world if that after the reading of this book any be unsatisfied still in this matter And if any especially of the heads and Rulers have doubts or Jealousies raised in them concerning us and the Priests and that they further would be satisfied and resolved for that end let any wise men propound for full satisfaction of all sorts of people that we with the consent of the chief in Authority that have power in this Nation who may preserve peace and safety among people and thereby to stop all Jealousies may freely and chearfully four ten twenty thirty more or fewer of us give as many of the wisest and ablest of the Priests and Professors a meeting for dispute at any place in England at what place time and for what continuance as they shall ascribe and consent unto and to dispute and controvert betwixt us and them any such thing and every such particular as shall or may be objected by any of the heads and Rulers or other grave understanding men wherein they are doubful betwixt us and would thereof be satisfied that by such dispute and opening of such causes objected full and real and total satisfaction may be given to the whole Nation and every particular man and member therein Otherwise Let the Priests or professors or any of them object what they can against us in our principles profession faith and practice and our whole Religion And if they shall affirme and alledge any one or more things against us that any principle we hold or practice we profess in any part throughout all our Religion are false Principles and false practices and not according to truth nor the scriptures but shall affirme that our Religion is not the true Religion nor we of the true Church of of Christ and they shall have free liberty to give their best proofe and reason for what they affirme and alledge yet by the strength of Christ and in the power and authority of God and according to the scriptures we shall confute all their proofes and strongest reasons and on the contrary we shall joine our Principles doctrines and practices and all our Religion and every part and particular thereof to be the very truth and agreeing with the scriptures and according to that shall maintain by lawfull arguments and plea that our Religion and worship and all that we professe and Practice is according to the mind of the Lord and justified of him and that whatsoever is and may be spoken against us upon that account is utterly false and to be condemned and upon this we will ingage with them and with any of our enemies of what sect and profession soever to the intent onely that truth may be manifest and embraced and deceit and Errour discovered and denied And also upon such an engagement we should agree to have the liberty freely and soberly to object against the Priests concerning their Ministry their call their practice their maintenance and their fruits and effects and concerning their Church and principles and worship and whole Religion and shall hear patiently all that can be said in defence thereof by any or all of them and shall prove by the spirit of the Lord and according to the scriptures that their ministry is not the true Ministry of Christ nor they true and lawfull Ministers of the Gospel but shal manifest by evident arguments that their call practice maintenance fruites and effects are not according nor agreeing but contrary and differing to what the true Ministry was and its call practice maintenance fruites and effects were in the true Apostles and among the true Churches and furthermore by the Grace of God we shall prove their Church their worship and their whole Religion in all parts thereof to be degenerated from what the true Church was and the true worship and true Religion in the daies of the Apostles and true Churches of old and these things shall we make manifest by faithfull and sound arguments according to the scriptures that all the earth may know and all people perceive who is in the truth and of the true worship and Religion and who are in the contrary and whether the Priests and that which they professe and practice for Religion or the Quakers and that which they professe and practice for Religion be of God and according to him and whether are contrary that the end of this long travel and war and controvercy may be desided and justly ended between us and all people may be resolved and satisfied concerning us and them that do oppose us And let all the Priests and professors lay aside and give over their houses of correction and imprisoning people and whipping of them and stocking of us and dealing in this manner of violence and cruelty as for years by-past they have done in defence of their Religion and resisting of ours and let them lay aside their carnall weapons and fighting against our persons and imprisoning of us about our Religion and let them come forth in sound arguments the best they have and let us see what spiritual weapons they have to resist us and defend themselves let us try whether their spiritual weapons or ours be the strongest and the most powerfull and mighty let theirs that are so prevaile against the other be it ours or theirs and this is the way to try the truth and to make all things manifest and to deside and end all the whole controversies between us and them which hath been great this many yeares and let the truth be set up and exalted where ever it is and all deceit thrown down to the ground and let us war with the weapons of the spirit against errour and false religion one in the other but le ts not hurt creatures
nor imprison persons nor stock and whip creatures and make them to suffer but let us thresh deceit and whip and beat that and all false opinions let us throw them down where they are found whether in them or in us and let us fight with the weapons of the spirit that are spiritual let them sight no longer with such cruel carnal weapons and then let such as get the victory and overcomes appear to be in the truth of the Church and such as falls and is overcome be manifest to be in the error and of the false Church and Religion and let us love one anothers persons and let them act no otherwise towards our persons then we do upon theirs and towards them and let them take the liberty to deal with us and our persons as we deale with them and their persons and no otherwise And let such whether them or us that cannot prove ourselves to be the true Church of Christ nor of the true worship and true Religion nor in the truth but is found to be in the error and out of the truth let such deny their worship and Church and renounce all their Religion and confesse to all the world under their hands that they are and have been deceived and for ever hereafter stop their mouthes and never professe nor practice any more what they have done in such Religion And freely upon these Issues and conditions we will joine trial with them let them appoint time place and profer terms at their own pleasure and then to all the world it shall be manifest and to all people discovered whether we have not good ground and sufficient reason to war against these Priests and it may perfectly appear that what we have said and written against them these divers yeares have been upon a good foundation and we have had sufficient cause to speak and write against them as we have done and none thenceforth shall have cause to say or doubt that what we have spoken and written against them hath been out of malice or envy and without cause and good reason but on the contrary all shall know the ground of quarrel is sufficient and full of equity on our part And upon these or any equal tearms and conditions would we and are we willing to engage with these Priests and all or any one of these Sects in a lawful tryal in disputes or writings for the tryal and searching out of the truth and the true Religion And were it not equal reasonable that we had the same liberty among all these Priests and in their Church and Assemblies freely to declare our minds and to let forth our selves in what we hold and profess without being violently haled and beat and whipped and sent to prison as we have been this many years which liberty we do freely grant and allow among us to all to query or declare what is upon them without such violent dealing or whipping or sending them to prisons and houses of correction and the same and no other do we desire of others in this particular of freedom to declare the truth and what we hold then what we do and would allow to others and that no weapon be used by them against us nor dealing towards us but the weapons of the spirit the best they have or can bring forth against us and let them let creatures alone and not hurt nor do violence to them and no other weapons shall we use against them nor deal with them by any other thing but the weapons of the Spirit of God which is powerful and will bring down strong holds and as for creatures we shall not hurt nor do violence nor imprison them and whose weapons are the strongest let such overcome And such as are overcome is not the true Church for the true Church of Christ which is builded upon the Rock the gates of hell cannot prevail against and who doth overcome with such let it be manifest that God of a truth is with them and let them all cease to defend their Church and Ministry and Religion with prisons and whips and houses of correction for by such things was never the true Church Ministry and Religion defended but onely the power and Authority of God preserved them and resisted all their enemies and so it is at this day and let all cease to cry deceivers and being afraid to be deceived for if they be the true Church all or any of these Sects and Professions of Religions then if we be deceivers and come among them they cannot be deceived if they be in the election for no deceivers nor the gates of hell cannot prevail against the true Church of Christ nor against them that are elect which the Devil hath nothing in And if we be the true Church of Christ and in the election then if all the deceivers upon earth come among us they cannot prevail against us nor deceive us for the elect cannot be deceived and upon these tearms we may engage with any people and Sect upon earth therefore come to this and joyn with us take you the liberty to declare in soberness what you own and profess you shall not be persecuted nor your bodies nor persons harmed by violence and let us have that liberty to deelare in meekness and soberness and in Gods Authority amongst you what we hold and professe and let us not be persecuted and dealt violently withall and then let it appear whether we or our enemies hath a greater testimony and more powerful in the hearts of people And were not this a way full of equity for the tryal of all things But doing contrary as you have done these many years against us by violence and whipping and persecuting it shewes you have not the spirituall weapons nor the Authority of God with you nor among you and that is the cause of running to Magistrates and putting in Goals and whippings and all violence because the Authority of Gods spirit is wanting amongst you which all the false Sects and false Churches since the dayes of the Apostles have wanted to defend themselves and resist their enemies and so all sects have been fighting one with another and killing persons and creatures and defended themselves by prisons and inquisitions and destroying of lives and all this have been out of the power of God and not in it but by the power of the Dragon and of the Beast who hath caused all to worship and them that would not he hath had power to kill and hath killed them by fires and tortures and cruel deaths and all these have lost the spiritual weapons and been without the power and Spirit of God And what a Church is this of yours which hath need to be defended by Goals and prisons and whips and stocks and violent dealing this Church is not the Church of Christ for the power and Spirit of God defends her alwayes and not inquisitions and prisons and whips these are Cains weapons and
the Almighty covereth us and it goeth before us and compasseth us about and the Lord is working a work in the Earth mighty and wonderful he is gathering the scattered and binding up the broken hearted and his people shall dwell in safety and none shall make them afraid and no weapon that is formed against them shall prosper nor no hand that is lifted up shall prevail For Sion shall arise out of the dust her beautiful garments shall be put on and mourning and sorrow shall flee away and her light is risen that is everlasting and the Sun shall never go down but his day shall remain for ever and the night shall not again cover her brightness nor the Sun set upon her habitations the City that hath long laid waste shall again be builded and the dwelling that hath long been without inhabitant shal be replenished for the numberles seed of Jacob is coming out of Egypt that will replenish the whole Earth and the seed of Esau shall become bondmen and wherefore are you gathered together and to what purpose have the wicked spent their strength to oppose what the Lord is bringing to passe shall not all our Enemies be broken to pieces and will not the Lord grinde them to powder will he not marr their beauty and stain their pride will he not bring down their crownes and corrupt their glory and stain it with his fire of wrath and make them ashamed of their wayes and Doctrines Hear this ye Priests and howl and lament for the misery that is coming upon you the Lord hath laid you naked and made you bare and you are seen as you are and the Elect is risen amongst us which ye cannot deceive but alass wo is me how have you caused the people to erre and how have you led the blind out of the way and how is truth fallen in your streets and you have daubed falsely with untempered morter and have cried peace to the wicked and condemned the righteous and all this hath vexed the righteous soul and the Lord will now arise and is risen and you shall not resist and escape the stroak of his hand which will come upon you and bruise you as a milstone for you have caused the wicked to rejoyce and the righteous to mourn and you have made sad his heart whom God hath not made sad have not you fed your selves with the fat and clothed with the wooll and hath not the peoples souls been starved and leanness been upon them all your plants aâ—â— dry and barren trees that brings forth no good fruit and your pâ—â—ple are like a wilderness that is untilled and unploughed and undressed and your flocks are like wild asses upon the mountains that is untamed as rude as the Horse and mule that knows no bridle and now it is seen what the end of your Ministry is and what fruit it hath brought sorth the Lord hath taken notice and he hath beheld how you have loytered and laid idle and the Nations lies yet like fallow ground that bears no fruit and mens hearts are untouched with absence of Gods word and there is no sound true and perfect sence amongst your people of the dealings of the Lord nor of the operation of his spirit but they remain in great blindness and ignorance void of the knowledge of God for ye have not caused them to hear his word but you have told your dreams and your false visions and you have spoken imaginations of your hearts and not from the mouth of the Lord neither have you stood in his Counsel nor hearkened to his voyce and therefore people remains unprofited but what they and you know it s naturally and not by the spirit of the Father but as dry trees you are not taught of the Father and as rough goats in the nature of swine that is polluted in the filth of the world and in the nature of dogs and Lyons devouring another and biting one another and killing one another which things were not in the Churches of Christ and we have a great controversie with you and that from the Lord we have tried you searched you and disovered your foundation and it s not found nor will not stand in the triall we have fetcht your Line from the first original and we have found out your beginning and we find yours of that Race which Christ prophesied of that should come which should deceive many having the sheeps cloathing but inwardly ravening and which Iohn saw was come and went out from the Apostles and true Churches which went from the truth and went into the world and had the forme of godlinesse without the power here began the Race in the Apostacie of the Churches and when they Apostatized from the true faith then came your original up and the world went after them and all that dwelt upon the earth worshiped the beast that hath reigned through all this time of Apostacie which hath been since the daies of the Apostles and we find your original goe no further then to the false bretheren and false Apostles which went out from the true Apostles and run for gifts and rewards and preached for filthie lucre and through covetousnesse made merchandize of souls seeking monie and gain to themselves I say we find your Original begins there and your Line goes no further and never came your first rise so far as the true Apostles you were not in your beginning of their life nor birth nor cannot be reckoned from their Original for you succeed not them but you truely succeed the false Apostles and fals bretheren which Christ prophesied should come after his daies Iohn saw was come and coming in his daies and we find you of this stock and generation and now you are discovered to be contrarie to the true Apostles and agreeing with the false Apostles in call in practice in maintenance and in all things and the Line of true judgement is laid upon you all and you are measured and found too short and weighed and found too light and we wil deale truely with you in judgement first we do hold controversie with you as concerning your call your Ministery it agreeth not with but is contrarie to what the Apostles call was they were called by power from on high and were made Ministers by the gift of the holy spirit received from God and their Ministrie was an absolute gift from God and not to be bought and sold for monie and they were anointed of the Father by his spirit of promise and to preach the Gospel but your call is at schools and Colledges in such and such orders which are attained through naturall industerie such and such arts and sciences and degrees having been so many years brought up in studying naturall arts and naturall Languages this is your ordination and your call having no respect to receive or to wait for the gift of the holy spirit to be made Ministers thereby and this is different from the Apostles
and we are well acquainted with griefs yet in all our trials and afflictions the Lord never forsook us but his wisdome love and life and presence increased in us and with us Then in the yeare 1654 as moved of the Lord we spread our selves South-ward and entred into these South parts and came the first of us into this City of London in the fift Moneth that year and laboured in the work of the Gospel in continuall sufferings and oppressions divers waies and were oppressed and gainsaid by the wise-men and by the learned and had in reproach and contempt by all the high and lofty and proud professors and we were set at nought and rejected by the fat beasts of the South and it is well known to thousands in this City and South countrie what opposition we have had from all sorts of people opposed in our own meetings and scorned and slandered by envious and reproachfull tongues publikely and privately encountered withall by the wisest of the City and country chalenged invited and ingaged to disputes by the high Priests and Church-members so called written against and printed against by the chiefest of men accounted wise and religious which of any sect and who of all the wisest in profession and the most zealous in practices of Religion so called have not at some time or other beset us and encountered with us in high disputes and controversie opposing of us to our faces and gain-saying our doctrines and practices and denying of us and resisting of us wholly and crying against us to be deceivers deluders and hereticks and blasphemers and such like and that our doctrines were deceivable error and factious and what not that our practises were destructive to men Lawes and Government these things in the worst nature have been spoken against us without ceasing by the wisest and men of greatest parts and most Religious falsely so accounted for this certain yeares in the South aswell as in the North besides what losse have we sustained other waies in the South by beatings and strikings and abuses and slanders and false reproaches and halings before Magistrates and imprisoning and all the like dealing from Priests Rulers and people as we did in the North yea the same hard dealing and cruelty from all sorts of people we have suffered and doe daily as we did in the North Insomuch we are now accustomed to the yoke and well acquainted with sorrowes and griefes from all sorts of people and were not the Lord on our side our enemies would swallow us up quick and we had been long since devoured by the teeth of the ungodly so that I may now call to witnesse all the Goales and prisons in the South as in the North and all the Magistrates and Judges and Rulers and all officers of the Law what suffâ—rings we have sustained and what cruell and heard dealing we have undergone and what injustice and unequal and false judgement hath been executed upon us in this five yeares time which of the Goals may appear free where some of us have not suffered the losse of our liberties unjustly and who of any Justice of the peace or any other officer from the Judge to the Constable that can clear themselves from guilt in this matter and that they have not had a hand in our unjust sufferings and to the witnesse of God in all people of all sorts through this whole Nation and some other I do appeal concerning this matter how we have been dealt withall what we have sustained in our persons and in our names how many acts and words of cruelty and in justice we have borne and suffered and these Priests been as the fountain and cause of all this and the formost in all this iniquity and injustice by all what they could do to incense the Rulers and people against us by Preaching and praying and writing and printing for the space of this seven yeares yet notwithstanding all this the mighty power and presence of the Lord have been with us and preserved us from dangers great and many and carried us through trials and perplexities and sufferings and not onely so but he hath increased us in number so that thousands and ten thousands have and may own us and the truth which we give witnesse of live therein for the eyes of all people are beginning to be opened and the deaf eare is unstopped and the way of life eternall is made manifest and the Lord is gathering his flock which hath been scattered in the cloudy and dark day whilst these false idle shepherds these Priests and Teachers I meane have fed themselves with the fat and cloathed themselves with the wool and laid down in slumber and not gathered the flock nor fed them but scattered them and driven them away and with force and with cruelty have they ruled over the heritage of the Lord woe woe unto these sheepherds saith the Lord God they shall be confounded and put to shame perpetually and they shall be broken down and never builded any more and the Lord will pluck them up by the roots and they shall never again be planted And besides all there Petitioning the Magistrates against us and Preaching and praying against us and all the evil wickedness in work word desire brought forth against us from time to time yet here sober Reader thou hast a Catalogue and whole number of books Printed written against us and abundance of their Doctrines uttered against us and in opposition to us gathered up in this volume in a sum with our answers to them and if thy heart and minde be single thou maist hereby understand in measure the difference in Doctrine between them and us and compare each of them with the Scriptures and see whether their Doctrines and Principles laid down as the subject of their books or our Doctrines and Principles laid down in answer to theirs be according and agree with the Scriptures and if thou be impartial in this business and single in this search and Judgement I doubt not but thou wilt in a great measure satisfie thy self and be resolved concerning their Priests and Professors of England and us who are called Quakers and then when thou thus hast done own and deny â—â—â—ther them or us as the Lord shall perswade thee for thou maist fully perceive we differ in Doctrines and Principles and the one thou must justifie and the other thou must condemn as being one clean contrary to the other in our Principles And I wish also thou wouldst measure us and compare us in lives and conversations and truely Judge whom of us whether they or we do the more follow Christ and his Apostles in practise and conversation And in all things lay us and them to the line of true Judgement and with an upright heart Judge accordingly for know this there is not any Principle we hold nor any work which we practice in our Religion and worship but we are willing and
to the language of the Apostle and Christ who bid them be perfect and the Apostle spoke wisdome among them that are perfect and said they were made free from sin And it is the Devill speaking in man that speaks for sin while men are upon earth and speaks for the Devill holds up him who makes men not perfect which Truth makes men free again from the Devil and speaks in man and says be perfect Pr. He saith Christ doth not condemn men for being called of men Master and it is not the title but c. Ans Contrary to Christs words who saith be ye not of men called Master for ye have a Master in heaven even Christ and ye are all brethren And thus he tramples upon the commands and makes the commands of Christ of none effect which is one of the marks that Christ gives to the multitudes to know the hypocrites by and so doth not onely deny Christs commands but teacheth men to break them so crucifies Christ and sayes they are his Ministers but that 's the Antichrist that abides not in his doctrine as in 2 John Pr. And he saith people are tossed up and downe like a bundle of feathers and Novices c. Answ How should they be otherwise but be tossed up and down by you when ye deny perfection of being perfect and calls it the voyce of the Devil speaking that speaks of perfection and overcoming sin How should you but be the men that tosseth people up and down with every slight and blown up and down with your windy doctrine that is not perfect and so bring the Nations and people like unto waters For all the unperfection is out of Christ in the first Adam in sin and transgression and the Devill which is out of the truth and all the perfection is in Christ the second Adam the covenant of God out of sin and transgression and so who are in Christ are new creatures and old things passeth away and all things become new So in the second Adam in the Lord from heaven above the earthly the first man in the perfection out of the tossing that 's your imitated Church got up since the dayes of the Apostles not the true Church Pr. He saith a true Church is guilty of injury c. See page 4. Ans Contrary to the Scriptures where the Apostle saith the Church is the pillar and ground of truth without spot or wrinkle or blemish or any such thing Pr. He saith God hath commanded a sufficient maintenance in generall for Ministers and left it to humane prudence to judge what is sufficient c. see page 7. Ans By this he hath left the spirit to judge and the wisdome of God which acts by his commands and so runs into earthly humane prudence Therefore is there so much oppression for Tytheâ— and maintenance for Ministers and so much making havock and prisoning and persecuting for the same And the power denied which the Apostles had to eate and to drinke which Christ gave them and so you run into the lust for the money of whom you do no work for and the earth and whilst they coveted after that they lost the faith and that is the cause that people have lost the unity and run all upon heaps Their Teachers have lost the faith through coveting and love of money in which they should have had unity with God and one with another and have pleased him and had accesse to him and have given them victory over the world the Devill enmity and corruption Pr. He saith all that come into the world are lighted with the light of nature See page 7. Ans For so he calls the light which John calls the true light which is Christ that lighteth every man that cometh into the world so is ignorant of Johns doctrine and the Scriptures a man not fit to teach but is gotten up by an usurped authority and is not able to divide the word aright but with the Scriptures thou art corrected and the light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world the naturall lights were made by it the Sun and Moon and so forth And men that are born blinde are enlightned with that Light which was before the Sun was before all things was made which came a light into the world to enlighten every man that all men through it might believe Now all men may see how all men are mad against John Christ and the Apostles doctrine that bore witnesse to the true light and Christ bid believe in it Pr. He talks of and preacheth up an externall word See page 8. Answ Which the Scripture speaks notâ—ing of nor the Prophets nor Chrrst but saith the word that lives abides and endures for ever and of the Scriptures of truth that cannot be broken And of Gods words and Christs words and that is not external this is not agreeable to sound words that cannot be condemned but that is like his doctrine that knows not the eternal but the Ministers of Christ did not tell people of an externall word but an eternall word but you being made by the will of man speak to the people of an externall Pr. He saith He hath not seen God in glory nor any man c. See page 9. Ans We do believe thee and the Priests have not seen him but the Saints saw him and Job saw him and Isaiah saw him the Lord of hosts and Steven saw him and Abraham saw his glory and the Apostle saw him and beheld his glory the glory of God And you are as the Pharisees that stand against Christ that enlightneth every man that cometh into the world that Christ said never saw the shape of God Pr. He saith The word infallible is the pillar of the Popish Kingdome and the master-point of new Religion c. see page 9. Ans Now thou that calls infallibility a Popish point a new Religion Thy Religion thou hast manifested and thy points that are not infallible contrary to the Apostle who had many infallible proofs of the spirit of Jesus Christ they who have not are none of his and who have the spirit of Christ have that which is infallible and lets them see infallible proofs as thou mayst read in Scripture And who have the spirit of God have that which is infallible And the Religion which is out of the fallibility and out of the spirit of God is vain and there is thine and the Popes as your fruits have declared got up since the dayes of the Apostles in the apostacy fallible but that which is in the spirit of God is infallible Pr. And thou saith Thou hast no such revelation as the Apostles had as thou knowest of and the Apostles were brought to speak infallibly to the Church by an infallible spirit and thou nor the Pope hath no such infallibility as the Apostles had c. see page 10. Answ We do believe you for you are the false spirit you and the Pope that went
never finde him And as for the rest of thy lyes and slanders in thy Book and unsavoury expressions which are not worthy mentioning upon thy own head they will come one day and thy own words shall be thy burthen Jeremiah Ives his Booke called Innocency above Impudency or the strength of Righteousnesse exalted above the QVAKERS Weaknesse and Wickednesse His Principles are as followeth Pr. HE saith It is a rare thing to see any of the seed of the Devill grown up to that degree of impudence to charge a man that he hath done that which he never did do c. Answ The seed of the Devill always said that which was not true so not a rare thing to finde them for the Devill and his seed is out of the truth and when he speaks a lye he speaks of himselfe and so speaks a thing that is not and there thou art Pr. He saith The Apostle in his Catalogue of the evils of the times c. page 1. Ans Is it not better to call the Scripture a declaration as they call themselves then to call them a Catalogue and some of you vvill say it is a History and some a Catalogue and again ye vvill say it is the Word of God which the Scriptures of truth is words and God is the Word and thou art in the evill time out of the good and thy time and day is evill Pr. He saith The Quakers give that name as quaking to themselves and others do not give it them as a Nick-name c. See page 2. Answ The first that ever I did hear them called Quakers and the name given to them of Quakers was one Gervase Bennet in Darby a persecutor called a Justice of Peace though many years before the power of the Lord was witnessed yet I never heard them have that name of Quakers given before that corrupt Justice gave it them and misnamed them so and in scorn called them so and thou art one of his Scholers and Quaking and trembling we own though they in scorn calls us so and the salvation wrought out with fear and trembling we witness Pr. He saith The Devill speaks truth sometimes c. page 2. Ans Christ saith he was a lyar from the beginning and when he speaks a lye he speaks of himselfe and hath no truth in him and so he cannot speak truth as it is in him And the greatest professors upon the earth are there of the Devill that speaketh the words of truth but not as they are in it as so saith Christ to the Jewes they were of their father the Devill they speak of themselves So they that speak the Scriptures not by the spirit as was by them that spake them forth they speak of themselves as the Devill doth that abode not in the truth but a lyar from the beginning and thus the truth comprehended it For it is one thing to speak the truth in the truth and to be in it for he speaks not of himself but the truth in him but the other all speaks of themselves and there thou art and so doth the Devill and truth is not in him nor them and there with truth they are comprehended Pr. He chargeth us Whether ever any gave worse words to us then we did to others c. page 9. A. To speak truth is not to give bad words to tell a Cain he is a Cain or an Esau or an Ishmael to be an Ishmael or a Wolfe he is a Wolfe and say the evil Beasts are the evil Beasts that are worse then the common beasts And to say the greedy dogs that can never have enough are worse then the common dogs that are biting and tearing and are worse then the common beasts that feed in peace and eates their meate in peace Now to speak such words and names as these are to them that are not so that is a giving of bad names wrong names But the spirit that gave forth the Scriptures it gave such names to such as was found in those steps It le ts see now and the whole Nation may witness that friends may answer to his Challenge and the Gaols and the Courts doth shew the greedinesse of such and their persecution and their malice against the Lambs and so the Saints in the spirit doth give them their proper names to properties in their places among which names thou art found Prin. He saith Much of the Scriptures may be understood without the spirit c. page 12. Ans The Scriptures was given forth from the spirit of God and they are the things of God and the words of God and they are not known nor understood but by the spirit of God again for there is a spirituall understanding Neither can they understand any of the Scripture of truth which cannot be broken but by the spirit of God within that gave them forth which is of God of whom they were learned Pr. He saith Christ was not a Minister of the circumcision c. See page 14. Ans And the Apostle said they were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands and the putting off the body of sin of the flesh they were circumcised with the spirit but who was the Minister of this Circumcision For the Apostle saith it was the circumcision of Christ Coll. 2.11 And again the Apostle saith We are the circumcision that worship God in spirit and have no confidence in the flesh Pr. He saith What man in his right wits would say a wildernesse was a City c. page 14. Ans When the people have transgressed the Law of God they are erred from his wayes they are become a Wildernesse and bears the fruit of brambles and bryars and not seeing any way to get out till the Lords mercy be manifest to them which is further then the Law of justice And thou hast not seen thy wits end yet nor seen the Wildernesse in thy heart fenced though a City and the children of Israel were called a wildernesse in trangression though in Cities Pr. He saith He can tell things to come without the spirit of God And thou saith the Pharisees could tell by the skies what should be the weather and the dayes should bring forth and this without the spirit of God c. page 15. Ans That which gives to understand the Creation and the altering and changing of the Creation either in weather or dayes It is the wisdome of God and his spirit by which all things was made that knows these things in the truth who counts the Stars and numbers them in their kinde who sets the Sun to rule the day and the Moon to rule the night Now who understands these things it is by the spirit of wisdome who understands them aright and there may be a wilfull rejecting and a having these things in the form yet not a knowing these things in truth and so Christ calls them hypocrites And a man may know things by the spirit and go in the errour from the spirit
his Apostles and his messengers and truth is a top of him and them all and with it are shut out Pr. He saith honour is the expressing of the inward respect that we hear to persons and many Scriptures he brings for bowing and for master pag. 23. and so stumbles at thee and thou Ans Which shewes he never learned his accidence or Bible and is a transgressor of Christs commands who saith be ye not of men called master for ye have one master even Christ and ye are all Brethren and a transgressor of the Law which they that respects persons commits sin and are convinced of the Law as transgressors and reprobate concerning the faith which is held without the respect of persons And though they bowed in the old time several that bowed before the Angels yet Christ is come by whom all things was made the salvation to the ends of the earth to whom powers principalities Thrones and dominions must be subject to whom Angels and Thrones must bow yea things in heaven and things in earth and every tongue confesse him to the glory of God and every knee bow and there people comes into the unity and there they hold the head Pr. He saith the Quakers light teacheth to forsake the Scriptures and set up a spirit in man which will not be examined by Scriptures page 26. Answ This is he which is out of the truth speakes it for the Quakers have not received the spirit of the world but the spirit of God by which they know the things which are freely given of God and know the Scriptures given forth from the spirit of God and with the same spirit the Scriptures is owned again Pr. He saith Paul swore after Christ and the Angells swore page 27. He saith I wonder Paul should so forget himselfe and sin so fearfully in swearing c. So the Quakers light that denies swearing is of Satan and not the light of Christ page 28. Answ Christ the Light which Satan is out of who is the oath of God ends all oaths sworn by Prophets or Angels whatsoever And who swears be fallen into the condemnation of the Devill and it is no where said that the Apostle swore but such as thou art matters not what thou speaks So that spirit that preaches for swearing is not the spirit of Christ but is the spirit of Antichrist preacheth up that which Christ and the Apostles preached down and preached Condemnation to them that did swear Pr. He saith The light in the conscience that takes them from the Law of God is the light of Satan Answ The light Christ in the conscience is the end of the Law for righteousnesse sake And that which keeps men from that which doth end the Law is not the Doctrine of the true Apostles but the false And the light which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world which is the substance leads men off of all types and figures and signes who comes to enjoy him enjoys the end who comes off of all outward Elements as Bread and Wine and such things to the substance it self to look at things that are not seen For things that are seen are temporall but the things that are not seen are eternal Pr. He speaks of a new creature distinct from Christ and saith while we live sin lives And saith I deny that the righteousnesse of Christ whereby a believer is justified doth dwell in him page 36. Answ Is not the new creature in Christ He that is in Christ is a new creature and is not distinct from him and how hast thou divided the word here And Christ is justification sanctification and wisdome and righteousnesse and if he be not within ye ye are Reprobates And where Christ is he is not without righteousnesse Therefore they are not without righteousnesse and wisdome Justification and Sanctification if Christ be within that is within for where he is that is not wanting And the Apostle said they were made free from sin And let not sin have dominion over your mortall bodies minde mortall bodies which sin was not to have dominion over And old things passe away and all things become new Sin is an old thing from the old deceiver So while any sin is standing all things is not made new and sin hath its dominion Pr. He saith He hath not read where a believer dwells in Christs righteousnesse page 37. Answ Every believer that is true is born of God and he that is born of God doth not commit sin And he that dwells in Christ dwels in righteousness and truth is that which sin and the Devill is out of which blots out sin and transgression where the body of it comes to be put off Pr. And the light which teacheth men to say they have no sin is of Satan And saith The Quakers light teacheth them to deny prayer Answ The Apostles light taught them to say they were made free from sin they had put off the body of sin and their sin and transgression was blotted out Little children their sins was forgiven them that walked in the light the blood of Jesus Christ cleanseth them from all sin taught them to know the saith that gave them victory over the world that purified their hearts held in a pure conscience And this is the Quakers light which teacheth them the path of the Apostles and it teacheth men to be holy as God as holy and perfect as he is perfect This was the light of Christ and bid them to be as Christ is and said as he is so are we in this present world And the light that guides the Quakers doth not teach them to deny prayer but brings them to pray aright with the spirit and with the understanding which all prayers without it be in the hypocrisie Pr. He saith We acknowledge there is a thousand of perfect men in England as perfect as children tossed too and fro page 40. But he saith I deny that any man hath that perfect knowledge of Christ in this life c. Answ Christ is in you except ye be reprobates And the Scripture speaks of such as had both the Son and the Father And all those children that are tossed too and fro and are carried about with the windy doctrine which hath gotten up in the apostacy since the dayes of the Apostles that are ravened from the spirit of God Such their doctrines are windy and doth not settle nor doth not perfect not doth not bring into the unity of the faith nor the knowledge of the Son of God the faith that gives the victory nor to a perfect man nor to the measure of the stature of the fulnesse of Christ which was the work of the true Ministry which was before the Apostacy Nor none comes to the knowledg of Christ but by the light Pr. He saith The Church teacheth to pray without ceasing but you bid stay till the spirit moves us c. Ans The Church prayes not without the spirit which
is not meer carnal bread and wine after Christs institution to be used nor an ordinary bread and wine And he saith In the Lords Supper is Christs body and it is his blood page 188. And this is my body and blood the word of a Command do this page 191. And Christ fed not the soules with wheat bread and red wine c. Answ By all this what differ ye from the Papists have not ye laid their foundation and layd their ground Bread and wine is but bread and wine a temporall thing a thing seen and may turn to ashes but the body and blood of Christ will not do so And the bread is not spirituall and the wine is not spirituall but is a thing seen and visible And who eats the flesh of Christ and drinks his blood hungers no more and thirsts no more but who eats temporall bread and wine hungers more and thirsts more And Christ did say as often as ye do eat this bread drink this cup ye shew the Lords death till he come And that which the Apostle had received of the Lord he delivered to the Corinthians As often as they eate that and dranke that they were to do it in remembrance of him shewing the Lords death till he come But then saith the same Apostle to the same Corinthians in his last Epistle Examine your selves Know you not that Christ is in you except ye be reprobates And said while we looke not at the things which are seen for the things that are seen are temporall So bread and wine are things that are seen are things temporall but the things that are not seen are eternall Now bread and wine is but bread and wine not spiritual after consecration it is but the same bread as it was before and it is no nearer the body of Christ after they have consecrated it then it was before Who is in the life and power of God that gives every creature its being and causeth every creature to come forth is in the life and vertue of all creatures and the being of all creatures and the wisdome of all the Creation that is spiritual He giveth every creature its being and causeth every creature to come forth and gives the sense and feeling of all creatures that is spirituall And there comes up the soule to be known and the seed CHRIST his body and his blood Pr. He saith The worship of God in the spirit stands out of mans will and they must waite in the light to feele the Spirit but let all lost souls beware of this counsell And to bring people to the commands of the Spirit is opposite to the Scripture Letter page 204. Answ All true worshippers of God that he seeks to worship him is in the spirit in the truth that which the Devill is out of and in the spirit that gave forth the Scriptures that is that which mans will is out of where all poor souls comes to worship God aright and magnifie God and glorifie God and to pray in the spirit and to stand in the counsell of God For no prophecy of the Scriptures came by the will of man It was that which led them to speak forth Scriptures which was beyond mans will So mens will getting the Scriptures which no prophecy of it came by it they cannot worship God in the truth nor in the spirit but in their own wills But who be in the spirit and truth that led them to speak forth the Scriptures that learned of God the Father of spirits and God of all truth this is not will-worship Now will-worship is among them that have the Scriptures given forth by the spirit of God in their owne wills which no prophecy of it came by it and can sing pray preach read in their own wills and be out of the spirit that gave it forth they are in a will-worship out of the worship of God in the spirit And such are opposite to the Scriptures and cannot agree with the letter of the Scriptures that are fighting about words falls into sects and heaps about the words which the worship of God is in the spirit that gave forth Scriptures which learned of God the Father of spirits owns all the Scriptures in their places and nor opposite to it Pr. He saith Never was Psalms sung as they ought to be but had some musicall tune or Poetry page 205. And the holy Ghost made overseers and Elders over the Church but that was not immediate page 207. That no man can read out of Scripture that Paul was free from covetousness c. Answ Paul saith Let not covetousnesse be once named amongst you as it becometh Saints And no covetous one should enter into the kingdom and hee saith it is idolatry And the Apostle lived the life of the Son of God through the faith and witnessed he was made free from the body of sin and had victory over it thanks God and said there was no condemnation to them that were in Christ Jesus and Paul was in Christ where there was no condemnation which covetousnesse is out of And the holy Ghost is immediate that makes the officers in the Church It is the same as was in them that led them to speak forth Scriptures And the holy Ghost that leads men to speak forth the Scriptures and makes Elders and overseers in the Church these are not made by men but these see the fulfilling of the Scriptures and comes into that which fulfils it and are in it And your singing your Psalms and your Poetry and setting them in frame and a musicall way these are come up since the Pope as Tunes Organs since men have ravened from the spirit and gone from that they got up this Poetry and turned Davids conditions into a Meeter and given them to a people who are ignorant of Davids conditions And Psalms are spirituall songs and all are ignorant when they are from the spirit of God that led the holy men of God to speak forth the Scripture with which spirit of God all the Psalms and Spiritual Songs and Hymns are seen which from it was given forth and all the Scriptures and in that is the singing in the spirit And the Ministers maintenance which the Apostle said Have not I power to eat and power to drinks And as Christ said freely ye have received freely give This was not spoken to the Heathen nor Jewes nor Gentiles who were unconverted but spoken among the Saints who was a Vineyard and spirituall things sown and to such as they were made partakers of their hope which hirelings and those that taught for filthy lucre the love of money that minded earthly things that seek for their gain from their Quarter that beare rule by their means was all out from this judged with the Prophets Christ and the Apostles to be such spirits and have got the forme and taught for the earth and made the earth a Wildernesse and such got not out the Wheat nor plowed but
said It hath been said to them of old time thou shalt performe the oath of the Lord. Christ said so that comprehended time that was the end of that old time where had been the swearing But I say unto you now Sweare not at all and so it was not the frivolous oaths that was among the Jewes that swore but it was true oaths that Christ brought them off the oath that was to be performed to the Lord which Christ the oath of God ended who comprehends time and told them the danger if they went any farther then yea and nay And so your interpreting the Scripture which are the private Interpreters is but to wrest them to your own earthly wills and that which opposeth the commands and doctrine of Christ brings not honour to God is not a part of his worship nor is not divine but in that which is out of truth for none worships God but who is in Christ who sayes sweare not at all who is the end of the Law and the Prophets and Oaths and is but one of your dark consequences and so it is not mens duty in any case to swear for the duty of man is to keep the commands of Christ and there is none that is just that will swear that obeys the commands of Christ but such swears who are unjust and they be out of that which gives the last peale and ends all differences which ends all oaths and all strife and all controversie which is Christ Jesus the covenant of God for strifes controversies and differences is without the covenant of Light and Life Christ Jesus the oath of God and so thou art not a Minister of Christ that brings people back to the Law and tells them it is lawfull to sweare Here the Papists and thee art one both opposing the commands of Christ which would make people believe it was the frivolous oaths among the Jewes that Christ brought them off and not of the true oaths and says it was not a shadow I say yes it made peace and ended the strife amongst men the oath of God that was sworn by the Lord but Christ the oath of God ends the strife and ends those oaths that men were to swear by the Lord So it was typicall and ceremoniall and was to change and was mutable for Christ that comprehends time sayes in the old time the oath must be performed to the Lord but I say unto you now Swear not at all So that was to be changed and it did type forth something There you may see the substance of it Christ the oath of God in which men have peace who ends the strife between men and God who makes all things new And so they that bring men to the swearing bring men into the evill And they that bring men to the Law and Prophets that speaks of swearing brings men from Christ who is the end of the Law and Prophets into the old time Pr. The ground and occasion of Oaths yet remains and so a usefulnesse of Oaths for the ending of Controversies which must be established by Oaths for the ending of humane societies The Apostates taking for granted that the Christian Religion did forbid all Oaths it is false and ridiculous for the Prophet said every tongue shall swear And thou shalt swear by my name Deut. And men verily swear by the greater And men and Angels have made use of Oaths to confirme the truth and avenge falshood I see not how swearing by any creature can be exempted from idolatry He that sweareth must do it righteously in a lawfull just matter Those that swear falsely are highly guilty of offence against the God of truth Can a Blackmore change his skin or a Leopard his spots Answ Christ who hath ended oaths who ends controversies amongst men and brings them to peace one with another and with God and ends the Law and fulfils it and doth not break it and ends the Prophets who sware and Christ is the end of the Law to every one that believes and your humane societies which be of the earth from the ground amongst whom is the oaths the swearing be out of the doctrine of Christ and knows not the end of the Law and the Prophets and they be the Apostates and false and ridiculous apostatized from Christ and the Apostles doctrine that swear and teach men so and are not the true Christians and so you that will swear will forswear which be out of the truth for the truth Christ saith Swear not at all And the Apostle sayes above all things my brethren swear not at all So you be the false brethren apostatized from the truth and are come to be as black as the Aethiopians and the Black moors and the custome of the sin of your swearing doth take away the sense And men and Angels swearing and the swearing by the greater And to the Lord every tongue shall swear and performe their oaths to him and they were to swear by the name of the Lord. Now Christ to him the Angels must bow and as the people had sworn by Baal so the Prophet brought them to swear by the Lord to change their forme to swear by the Lord as a true oath and perform it to him But Christ the end of the Prophets and the Law as I said before and the true oath for saith he It hath been said to them of old time thou shalt performe thy oath to the Lord that was a true oath not a false oath let all take notice of that But I say unto you now sweare not at all So he came to end the true oath Christ the oath of God And so though the Angels or men in strife or Prophets or Moses the Law said swear Yet Chrst who comprehends time before the world was made who came to end that old time sayes Sweare not at all but yea and nay in all your communications and whatsoever is more then these cometh of evill And many men are undone by these false oaths and by swearing And you that call your selves Ministers of the Gospell and teach men to swear and Christ says sweare not at all have brought another Doctrine and so are to be accursed And again do not you swear by the Bible by the Prophets and Moses Christs and the Apostles words and swear by the Evangelists and Christ says swear not at all What a perverse generation of people of men are ye Professors and Teachers and people What an unchristian spirit have you And see have you not brought the judgement upon your selves to be the Idolaters For the true oath was by the Lord among the Jewes and you swear by the Evangelists and the Bible that tells you you should not swear Did ever the Prophets swear by Moses words or Moses by Enochs or the Apostles by the Prophets or Christs words Now is not this a frivolous oath to swear by the Bible which sayes sweare not at all And worse then the Jewes that swore by
of works or natural light which was before the Covenant of works was or a natural light was created which ends the Covenant of works and thou art to be judged for thy words and with that light every man sees the Mediator believing in it if not it condemnes him Pr. That all the light they have is but the light of a natural conscience and that is a blurr'd one too Nay how comes it to passe that in old England we see so many hundreds that manifest no other light but a natural conscience and New England that have conversed with the Indians and never saw the least breaking forth of the light Answ The light which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world by whom the world was made was before natural conscience was or natural light either or the blurr'd light as thou cals it And many of the Indians do shew forth more in their conversations of the light then you do and as for old England what have you been doing all this while if you see so many hundreds manifesting no other light but a natural conscience But how should they manifest it when you keep them from it your work is to keep them from the light within But now there 's thousands that are manifesting the light on the house top by which the world was made which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world and you Ministers of Satan out of the light and truth are them that stands against it for the Devil that went out of the light and truth who sowed his seed in the hearts of people he would not have them to own the light in them and he would confesse a God without him and so he teaches them in whom he sowes his seed not to have the light within them the seed Christ the tree of righteousness the root of God Pr. I charge the Quakers to shew one Scripture that bids look to the light within the old trick of Errour the righteousness of faith doth not direct people to look for a Christ within this Scripture bids weary laden souls go to Christ is this to the light within them I am amazed at their ignorance Answ The righteousness of faith brings people to look at Christ within and what abundance of ignorance hast thou shewed who hath been a teacher of the people these many years and shews how contrary thou art to Christ and the Apostles in doctrine for in 2 Cor. 4. the Apostle tels the Corinthians the light that shined in their hearts to give them the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ Jesus this was the work of the true Apostles when the false Apostles and Devils Ministers and messengers was got among them for the Devil is out of truth and so are his messengers and they will draw people from the light within and blind their minds that they should not come to the light within to see the glory of God in the face of Christ from whence it comes so thou dost conclude thy self among the Devils Ministers and false Apostles and messengers and no wearied soul that is burdened that comes to Christ who is the souls rest but first comes to the light within which comes from Christ who is the souls Bishop with which light they see him he shines in their hearts it gives them the knowlege of him and the glory of God in the face of Christ Jesus and thou that leads them from the light within leads them from Christ and the glory of God who should save them from their sins and give them ease rest and peace Pr. I said looking to the light and living upon the light within will lead men to Hell and going to and living upon a muddy puddle of natural light That Christ is the light in all in a saving manner I deny for Christ to be the righteousness of men in Justification differs and to send a man to live upon a light within it not to send him to Christ and if he live upon it upon the light as it is Justication it is a plain Covenant of works Ans There 's no man lives but in the light which comes from Christ the light by whom the world was made in whom was light and this light is the life of men and this light and life is manifest in us for he that hath the Son of God hath light and life he that receives not this though he be enlightned hath not life that hates it such as lead people from it go from it in their own particulars they lead people into hell into its gates it prevails against them but who be in the light the gates of Hell cannot prevail against them and believes in it they are not condemned and so they live in the muddy puddle and goes into the naturall light that denies the light within which Christ hath enlightned every man that cometh into the world withall they live not upon the life but in the muddy puddle of darknesse and are Antichrist out the light and are against it in their particulars and against them that walke in it and such are unlike the Ministers of Christ Every man that cometh into the world is enlightned with the saving light and he that believes in it is saved he that doth not is condemned There 's no one comes out of the covenâ—nt of works but by the Light within which Christ the covenant of God hath enlightned him withall And there 's no one lives out of the covenant of works but who lives in the Light and who lives in the Light lives in Christ and Christ in him I in you and you in me and who hates this Light they live not in Christ it condemns them for they be in their owne Covenant oâ— works Who believes in the light hath entered into the rest and ceased from his owne work as God did from his And righteousnesse and justification is one where Christ is known and felt in man they are both felt in one For Christ the righteousnesse of God and the justification and Christ in you and see if thou canst read this who sayes they differ Pr. What warrant have you to go out to the Quakers Shall a man go hear the Jewes and Popish Masse because Paul bid try all things No no. Answ Paul bid us quench not the spirit and where the spirit is not quenched they may try Papists Jewes Protestants who quenches not the spirit but who quenches the spirit and draws people from the light within they draw from that they should see withall then you stuffe them up with old Authors and lying stories as you print abroad Pr. Christs revealed Will is the word of Reconciliation Answ The Scriptures is not the word of Reconciliation But Christ is the word of Reconciliation who reconciles man to God and satisfies the Father and gives men peace with God and this the Scripture declares And as for the Ministers of Newcastle who hath
Moones and sacrifices that the Actions Baptisme and breaking of bread are the signes of a Christian Sabbath its high presumption to alter the word of God in calling every day the Lords Sabbath and honouring any other day as the Sabbath So if we be followers of God as dear children and take the spirit to be our guide we must honour the Sabbath withall holy devotion Answ The Sabbath is mentioned with new Moons and sacrifices but the Apostle sayes they were shadowes of good things to come when this is come which was before the shadowes was which is the body Christ which was before dayes new Moons or sacrifices was the body who be in that ends them all and to that the Apostle brought people and not to the dayes now there was some brought them to observe dayes and he was afraid of them that did observe them and he brought them to the body Christ to whom all the Angels did bow for they as did observe the dayes new Moons and Sabbathes are worshipping of Angels neglect the body which is Christ and this was for the satisfying of the flesh and now what art thou satisfying which art teaching to observe dayes signes and shadowes which the Apostle brought people off to the body and to the head Christ Jesus and to worship God in spirit and brought them into that that ended all shadowes for the devil will lurk in a shadow or a type or a sign or figure and creeps into those things after the substance is come to keep people from the body and they will persecute such as will not bend to the shadow and come from the substance and breaking bread and baptisme is no sign of the Sabbath day of the Jewish Sabbath day the Sabbath was a figure of the rest and sanctification of the Creation and breaking of bread among the Saints was a figure of the bread Christ which the Saints eat and live for ever and the word of God cannot be altered and the word of God cannot change man may alter but the word of God cannot be altered but abides and lives for ever And the Saints which comes to the body Christ comes to honour him who ends the Sabbath which is a sign and a shadow and such honors God the Redeemer and Creator and Christ by whom all things was created and made and which are the dear children of God the Apostle speaks of he did not bring them into dayes and to observe Sabbaths and signes but brings them to the body Christ the Lord of the Sabbath and doth not set up that which thou cals devotion in holding up the Jewish Sabbath which was a sign on which they should rest the rest of the creation and the rest of all man kinde cattel and beasts that God would restore and redeem all things by Christ who is the word and gives rest and is the sanctification and gives rest to the whole creation Prin. Thou sayes this is the time of Gods worship observing the seventh day Christian look well to thy walkings see that thou make all things according to the pattern in the mount Answ They that worshipps God they come into Christ the truth the body which ends the sign and the shadow and the end of Moses who made a pattern which was a figure of that which was to come and he made it at the command of God and the Christians are not to make the pattern which was shewed to Moses in the mount for while Moses is read the vail is upon the hearts of Christians and all people whatsoever and the sign shadowes and figures the body is not seen nor come to which is Christ And Paul and the Saints the true Christians worshipped God in the spirit and in the truth who witnessed they was in the body that ended the shadowes and types and Moses the Law and the Prophets Christ Jesus him by whom the world was made before it was made and a pattern is not the thing there is the thing the pattern is of and that ends the pattern and lives in the thing and they need not have the pattern for the pattern was made of a thing that was to come Pr. Thou sayes if the Apostle of the Gentiles who was the rejecter of the ceremonies did constantly celebrate the seventh day Sabbath then much more them Apostles among the Jewes there 's not a plainer precept in all the Scripture then Pauls practice herein for the seventh day Sabbath if we tread in the steps of Paul he was but a man and sometimes a very angry man and he strictly requires all believers to follow his example as he followed Christ and certainly in observing the Sabbath and Paul reasoned with the Jewes on the Sabbath day and Christs custome and Pauls was to go into the Synagogue on the Sabbath day and was there difference betwixt Christs preaching and Pauls and where is the difference between Christs observing the Sabbath and Pauls Answ The Apostle never taught the Christians Neither Jewes nor Gentiles to celebrate the seventh day nor never mentions it to them to keep it not in all the Epistles there 's not such a thing but tels them they were shadowes the body was Christ and Christs and the Apostles going into the Synagogues and temple on the Sabbath dayes was to fulfill and shew the fulfilling of the types and figures of him and brings to the substance of the signes types and shadowes not to hold up dayes times offerings but to bring them to the body Christ as Colos 2. and so Paul and Christ doth not disagree for he Preached Christ the end of the Law and the substance and though Paul went among the Jewes and circumcised and did several things went into the Temple yet thaâ— was not to hold up the Temple or to hold up the offerings types and shadowes but to bring them to the substance And mind what the anger was as Paul was in and Paul followed the substance and was more then a man there was more in him then a man Paul nor the Apostles no where commands the Saints to observe the Jewes Sabbath day though he went into the Jewes and consented to many things to the intent to bring them out of them not to keep them in them but to bring them to the substance and that was the end of Pauls going into the Jewes Synagogues and Temple to bring them out of the shadowes types and signes to the substance and the end of Christs going thither was to bring them to the substance of which was typed forth that people might believe in him who was the body which was before heaven or earth was who fulfils every jot and tittle of the Law and to him did the Apostle bring the people to this body which types signes and shadowes signed shadowed and typed forth which the body of them all is Christ and in thy principles thou art confused and so who followes the Apostle comes to the body out of the sign and the
speak in that degree of the holy Ghost as the Prophets and Apostles did that spoke forth Scriptures Answ Then thou must take heed of exalting thy self above thy measure for thou canst not know Scripture but by the same degree of the spirit the Prophets and Apostles had Pr. And he saith He hath no command in Scripture to sprinkle Infants and he holds it not absolutely necessary he hath no command in Scripture against it and he hath a commandement of the Governors and so he is subject to every Ordinance of man Answ An ordinance of man that is not of absolute necessity consider what it is and that which the Scripture no where commands nor thou hast no example for it consider what that is and to say the Scripture no where forbids it it forbids all the traditions and doctrines of men so that is judged by the spirit of God that is set up by men Pr. Thou saist The Lord may give with the outward washing the spirit to the childe Answ Can man receive the spirit of God by following traditions of men and outward things Was not they all from it and from the spirit and doth it not judge them for setting up such things God never commanded Pr. And he speaks of Davids Psalms given to the world sutably Answ The world must repent and be in the spirit for it lyes in wickednesse before they can know Davids singing for the Prophet saith their songs must be turned into howling and Davids condition is not the worlds Pr. He saith men may respect persons in their places Answ That 's contrary to the Apostle who said God was without respect of persons and that the Gentiles should be accepted as well as the Iewes He that doth righteousnesse is accepted with God who holds the faith of Christ it is without respect of persons it is in the unity and they that be out of that be out of the unity So thou hast pleaded for that which art out of his Doctrine He that respects persons commits sin and is convinced of the Law for a transgressor as saith the Apostle W. P. thy works are tryed and weighed and found too light and condemned for the fire the witnesse in thy conscience shall answer but now in thy security thou art asleep but the wrath of the Lamb shall finde thee out And as for all thy lies and slanders thou heaps up in thy Book they are not worth mentioning but will come upon thy own self for they are thine own covering which is judged the witnesse in thee shall answer The Elders and Messengers of the severall Churches of Ilston Abergevenny Tredingnoge Carmarthen Hereford Bredwerden Cledacke and Liangors Meeting at Brecknocke whose Book is Titled An ANTIDOTE against the Infections of the TIMES Which hath shewed your selves full of poison and such as infect the Times but with the spirit of Truth ye are comprehended and judged Your Principles are as Followeth Pr. YOu say you are conceived in sin and brought forth in iniquity Psal 51.1 Answ David doth not say you who were conceived in sinne but I and W. P. saith John was sanctified from the womb and the Scripture speaks of such as were sanctified from the womb and children that were clean And so you do not speak as Elders and Messengers of true Churches or men dividing the word aright but you are one against another though you are all against them you call Quakers that be in the truth Pr. They say They observe the designe of Satan to cast down the walls of Sion and to remove the living stones thereof from the sure foundation the rock of ages the Lord Jesus Christ and draw them to build upon the sands Answ Is this like that the Elect should be deceived living stones should be drawn from the sure foundation the rock of Ages the Lord Jesus Christ for these living stones to be built upon the sand and drawn from the Rock of Ages this Doctrine doth not sound like men of understanding For the living stones are the spirituall houshold and the royall Priest-hood and there 's the foundation that stands sure the Rock the Devill is out of and the gates of Hell cannot prevail against it you in your Notions let living stones alone for none can pluck them out of the Fathers hand Pr. And they say No man can redeem the soul of his brother Answ Solomon saith the fruits of the righteous â—s a tree of life and he that wins souls is wise And he that saves a man from his evill wayes saves a soule from a multitude of sins Again thou saist No man the greatest of men can redeem the soule of his brother Ye should not have left out Christ the Saviour the Redeemer the man Christ Jesus the elder Brother so you are a company of blinde Pastors contrary to them that gave forth Scriptures Pr. To say heaven and glory is in man which was before man was they are sottish and blinde Answ There 's none have a glory and a heaven but within them which was before man had a being Pr. Wherefore take heed of depending upon any righteousnesse within you or any righteousnesse done by you Answ This is a strange Doctrine that men must take heed of any righteousnesse done by them or within them This is contrary to Scripture which saith the kingdome of heaven is within that stands in righteousnesse peace and joy in the Holy Ghost and the fruits of the spirit is righteousnesse and goodness and this is that which ends the righteousness of the Law and he that doth righteousness is righteous and Christ the righteousness of God is with them Prin. Man hath received a light from Christ as a creature but not as a Redeemer Answ That 's false For whosoever hath received a light from Christ hath received a Redeemer and a Saviour and he that doth believe in it is saved and he that doth not is condemned Pr. And they say If you love your souls beware of such delusions least ye perish eternally that say it is the true light that enlightens every man that cometh into the world following it it is sufficient to bring men to heaven which light is natural reason and conscience Answ The light that every man that cometh into the world is enlightened withall cometh from the salvation Christ which is the way to the Father whose throne is in Heaven and Christ saith believe in the light that ye may become the children of the light and he that believes in the light shall not come into condemnation All men is enlighened that through the light they might believe so you are not able to divide the word aright and all that be from this light are lo here lo there and so are in the natural reason and conscience which the light is not the light was afore they was Pr. They say none should never have known a Justification nor a Sanctification if it bad not been written Answ I do believe you had not
the glory of God And the Law was in their hearts and the Word was within them and the annointing and such had the gifts for the worke of the Ministery for perfecting the Saints for the edifying the body of Christ till they all come to the knowledge of the glory of God and to a perfect man in Christ Jesus Pr. He saith Christ is without his Saints in respect of his bodily presence Answ How then are they of his flesh and of his bone and eate his flesh and drink his blood And how have the Saints his minde and spirit and he with them and they with him and sit with him in heavenly places and he is the head of the Church how then is he absent Ye poor Apostates from him who feels not Christ with you but he is with the Saints and they feel him Pr. He saith Salvation and faith are the gifts of God distinct from Christ Answ They are all of him and from him and with him And how is he the Author of Faith in whom it ends from whence it comes Pr. He saith The light which discovers sin and iniquity in mans heart is not Christ the light the door Ans The first Adam was the door where all sin and transgression entered Christ the second Adam the light which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world saith I am the door the way the life which finisheth sin and transgression and brings in everlasting righteousnesse and the way of life out of death which Light discovers sin Pr. He saith To call Christ the light the gift the door the way is to take the Gardiner for Christ as Mary did Answ Christ the light that doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world we do not put him for the Gardiner We know him and as many as receives him he gives them power to become the sons of God and this thou sayest is not used power but prerogative authority and thus thou art wresting Scripture So thou should have been more meek and low in thy heart and then thou wouldst have bridled thy tongue and so have learned of Christ and so come to the light the sure foundation out of the errour of thy wayes and have kept in the footsteps of the flock and if thy tongue had been shorter and thy bridle streigher then wouldst not thou have mixt the Covenant of God with mans spirit and have compared it to the Law of works which Christ the light which doth enlighten every one that comes into the world is the end of And mans spirit in the Fall is polluted and his body but as the light is believed in and the minde changed his spirit is sanctified and his body and so comes to be a childe of the Light and his spirit witnesseth with our spirits that we are the Sons of God And none owns the Door Mediator the Life the Way but with the light which Christ doth enlighten every man that comes into the world withal which light is the door the way and the life Ellis Bradshaw His Booke called The Quakers quaking Principles which he directs to the PROTECTOR His Principles are as Followeth Pr. HE saith That Christ who doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world by an immediate illumination not the Elect themselves to bring them to salvation Answ Doth not Christ say I am the way the truth and the life And he is the Door and no man cometh to the Father but by him and learn of him This is my beloved Son heare ye him saith God And is not he the new Covenant in the heart by which men need not say Know the Lord And there is no other name by which men can be saved but by the name of Christ who doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world that all through him might believe And he that believes in the light abides not in darknesse but hath the light of life and they that believe not in it but hates its the light is their condemnation and the light that doth enlighten every one that cometh into the world is the salvation though men neglect it which the Elect walk in which condemns the unbeliever which is immediate and no man sees salvation but who comes to the light Pr. He saith The Word that was made flesh is visible and the Word is the Letter and they never received the spirit of life from it and that 's the Quakers errour Ans Such as had the Scriptures which was the words of God to them in old time and the ordinances the Apostle calls carnall which the Jewes stuck in and would not come to him that they might have life not to Christ And so if men have all the Scriptures and have not Christ they have not life For the Devill he may have the Scripture and hath he life therefore And the power of God Christ his name is called the Word of God The Word of God lives and endures for ever and the Spirit is not in the Letter and the Letter is not the Word which was made flesh and they be in the errour that thinks so for the Word is invisible Pr. Paul adviseth not onely to the Light within but is bidding them bring his cloak books and parchment and give attendance to reading Answ The Apostle did tell the Saints that the light that shined in their hearts might give them the light of the knowledge of the glory of God and bids them walk in the light And Christ bids them believe in the light and they should not walke in darknesse and there is no other name under Heaven by which men can be saved but by the name of Christ And the Scriptures none sees the substance of them nor the fulfilling of them but who walks in the Light whom God speaks to by his Son who is the end of the Prophets and there is the true reading and knowing of all books and pâ—rchments which none knows the Scripture but by the light which comes from Christ in whom they end Pr. And again thou sayst there is more words then one Ans God is the Word and the Scriptures of Truth are his words which Christ fulfills Pr. He saith They have fellowship with the Father but not in the like measure of the gifts of grace the Apostle had Answ Then you are not like none of you to understand the Apostles words nor to be judges of them but as you do come into the like measure and gifts as they was in else you will not be able to judge of their conditions nor know their words Pr. He saith There is no man justified through the faith in Christ that owns the Scriptures to be but a dead letter But that ownes them to be the Word of God in which there is spirit and spirituall life as words of eternall life Answ The spirit and the life is not in the Scriptures but was in them that gave it forth and many have the Scripture and not the
your order and Gospel since the dayes of the Apostles who are such as Christ said should come inwardly ravening forth from the Spirit of God and have got sheepes cloathing which since the dayes of the Apostles they have walked after you who have deceived the world and Nations But we see that the false Ministers the worshippers of the Beast Antichrist and the deceivers among whom is the Devil to deceive is now taken with the false prophets the Beast and Antichrist the Mother of Harlots and confounded and cast into the lake of fire and the Lamb and the Saints shall have the victory And the Gospel is immediate and he is cursed that Preacheth another the word I say is immediate it lives abides and endures for ever and the Ministers that are in the spirit are immediate and these are furnished with the mysteries of the Gospel and their calling is immediate and the Overseers of the Church which the Holy-Ghost makes are immediate and all that be in the life that gave forth Scripture which nones knowes the Scriptures but by it they are all immediate that which doth convince of sin is immediate But now your mediate Calls your mediate Ministry and Overseers knowledge Word Gospel and people Church are mediate we do believe you all this is so amongst you since the dayes of the Apostasie from the Apostles Doctrine power life and spirit which they were in with which ye are judged and who are in the life they are in that gave forth Scriptures which you are ravened from and are not like to talk of immediate Pr. The Scripture is the Word and the Rule Answ The Scriptures are the Words of God and Christ is the Word in whom they end and the Word of God is the end which fulfills all Scriptures which came to the Prophets which the Apostles Preached which they discerned and spoke forth the words and the fulfilling of the words which the Scriptures of truth cannot be broken but fulfilled by Christ the word and the spirit is the rule that gave forth Scriptures and that led the Saints into all â—ruth Pr. Thomas Castel went naked in the streets of Kendal and Thomas Holmes of Kirkby Steven Answ This hath been a figure of your nakedness who are Egypt spiritual and the Ethiopian black and the Prophet Esaiah did not put off all his clothes say they conrary to the Prophets words and he was to go among all the transgressors in Ethiopia and Egypt a figure of their nakednesse so since the dayes of the Apostles and the Apostasie ye have gone from the spirit of God inwardly ravening from that ye have wanted the cloathing with the spirit ye have had only the outside the sheepes cloathing but have been naked of the life such the Lord hath moved his servants to give a true sign amongst you and not a lying who have their cloathing of the spirit which ye want which ye shall witness the truth of the Lord God in the signe if ever ye come into the true cloathing of the spirit of God Pr. And ye say Christ did not mean as he speak when he said be not ye called of men Masters Answ Which shewes they are none of his Ministers which trample upon his Commandments and teach people that it is lawful to break them shewing the lawfulness of them to be called of men Masters so as for their calling of men Masters standing praying in the Synagogues their long robes salutations their Tythes and their Pulpits these are the works of the perfect Pharisees which all people may look upon their fruits their works and practices and see the very image and that they have their very garments and places according to their condition fruits and works and as for all the rest of their hard speeches lies slanders villifyings and railings which they have poisoned people withall will be their own burthen and fall heavy upon them and turn upon their own heads Their way is compassed their bounds is set and their limits and in this the day of their accompt every one shall feel his words to be his burthen And their patience had been better then to have uttered forth their folly and published it to the Nation But the day is come that tries every mans work and a witness is rising in people the morning is broak the Sun is rising the day-Star is risen that lies people do not make their refuge neither do feed upon them nor upon any thing but what comes from God but the living bread that comes from God above which who eats of it lives for ever Many have their bread and their water that hunger no more nor thirst no more The Worcestershire Petition to the PARLIAMENT which are said to be six thousand Pr. HE hath made a Law commanding all people to whom we Preach the Gospel to allow us a sufficient maintenance that we may not be hindered from or in his work Answ The Scriptures and the Apostles did not speak of any such thing that Christ did make a Law for them commanding all the world to whom they Preached to allow them a sufficient maintenance that they might not be hindred from or in their work What! will maintenance hinder them if they have it not was not this the command of Christ to give freely as they from him had received freely and then if any set meat before them they might eat it But if this Law commanding all the world a sufficient maintenance and allowance to the Apostles and Disciples had been first which they might have been sure of maintenance this had been the way to have clogged the the peoples minds have brought them into trouble which the Gospel was otherways glad tidings but if the Apostles had not Preached to the world without this law which ye speak of wâ—ich commands all the world to give them sufficient maintenance what a condition would all people have been in But they that had received freely was to give freely so you have manifested your spirits to be the deceivers of the people for means That ever 6000 people should say he made a Law commanding all the world to whom they Preach the Gospel to allow them sufficient maintenance When Christ saith they were to Preach as they went as the disciples went and they were to Preach if they did not receive them and they were to go into all Nations yet the Apostles did not plead a Law where they came that they were all to maintain them no they were in fasting often and would not use their power to eat among many people though they had power yet they would not use it and so the maintenance did not hinder the Apostles from their work for they Preached often in fastings and sometimes their own friends communicated to them when they were up and down among the heathen in other Nations Preaching the Apostles did not plead a Law to the Nations whom they Preached to and thus they brought glad tidings keeping
which comes from Christ the mystery though they may have the Scriptures Pr. They that will not put off the hat but say thee and thou to people this is a sin of their own devising Ans Thee and thou is proper language and a forme of sound words the hat is earthly Adam that 's earthly his honour which the second Adam never lookt for but gives this mark to know an unbeliever by who seeks it and looks for the honour below Pr. Is it not a shame for a boy to say thou to his Father thou to his Mother Ans Jephtha's daughter thou'd her Father the Judge of Israel and he did not look upon it as a shame And the children of God thou'd their Father and the Lord never rebuked them for it as we read in Scripture And as for all the rest of thy lyes and slanders in thy Book they are not worth mentioning but to redeem truth from them and that none at all may make them their refuge for they shall feel it if they do at the day of judgement Some of Philip Bennets Principles called Minister at Cartmel in LANCASHIRE Pr. HE saith That none knew another to be the child of God Answ Which is contrary to the Scripture 1 John 3. Ye are the sonnes of God And the Apostles knew others to be the children of God as the Ministers of God doth now Pr. Again he saith That he did not know why God did make a difference amongst men c. Answ So is ignorant of the Ministery which puts a difference betwixt the precious and the vile Pr. And he said None can give a reason of the elestion or know the elect of God Answ And so is out of the Apostles Doctrine who said they were elected before the foundation of the World and ignorant of the Scriptures which saith Christ is the Elect. Pr. Again he said He would never exhort people to take heed to that of God which is made manifest in them Answ Contrary to the Apostles Doctrine Rom. 1. Cor. 2.4 Colos 1. 1 John 2.27 Rom. 10.8 which brought people to the light within them and to the Son within them Christ within them Some of Adam Sands His Principles Pr. HEe said He hated that which may be known of God made manifest in man which God hath shewed unto him who said that was the Quakers foundation And it was told him it was the Apostle Pauls words and shewed him the place in the Bible to read and bid him see it he said again he hated it Answ So he is found in the nature of the Jewes and Gentiles that went astray who were not like to retain God in their knowledge while they are Reprobates from that which may be known of God made manifest in them and hate it Neither art thou nor no Professor upon the earth like to receive God or Christ Spirit or Faith while thou hates that of God in thee Pr. And he called those with him brethren and servants of God and yet a little before he said they had no grace in them Answ Contrary to the Apostle who said the brethrens hearts were stablished with grace And the grace of God which brought salvation appeared to all men which taught the Saints which you have turned into wantonness Pr. And he confessed That they were more and more ignorant of God and blinder and blinder every day then other Answ We do believe it How should it be otherwise with you who say ye are brethren and have no grace in you and hateth that of God in people But the grace of God which brings salvation hath appeared to all men which lets them see ungodlinesse So in that the Lyar speaks in thee for that which lets every one see ungodlinesse is the grace Roger Atkinson Reader at Turver Chappel in Lancashire Pr. THat the letter of Scripture was God and it was asked if the letter paper and inke was God and he said it was God and brought 1 John to prove it And again he said The letter was the Word of God Answ The Scriptures of truth they are the words of God and were all learned of God and are writings and Christ the Word comes to end all these words and all ends in him so the Scriptures are not God but they were holy men of God which learned of God that spoke them forth for he was afore Scripture which gave them forth Richard Stoaks called Minister at Grayrig-Chappel in Westmerland Pr. HEe said That the Scriptures is God He said that the Scriptures is a God And after he set his foot upon it and stampt upon it and he said It was but Hebrew Copies and Greek Copies and were not the Scriptures and said they were not true before near an hundred people Answ And yet a God and they God which the Scriptures of truth are the words of God and the carnall man and the Devill which is out of the Truth may get Scriptures but the word Christ that fulfils them stand against And the Scriptures of Truth are not God nor a God but are his words that cannot be broken and must be fulfilled by Christ the Word George Johnson Priest of Orford said Pr. THat the light which John bare testimony to is the light of Nature Answ Which is contrary to the Scriptures For the light which doth enlighten every one that cometh into the world was before any naturall lights or created lights were Pr. That the Americans were never ordained for grace and salvation and that the grace of God had never appeared to the Americans Answ Which is contrary to the Scriptures which saith The grace of God which brings salvation hath appeared to all men c. And I will give him for a light a Covenant to the Gentiles a new Covenant to the house of Israel and Judah and that he may be my salvation to the ends of the earth And many in America have received truth and salvation Pr. That none can be free from sin nor perfect whilst they live upon the earth and that none is able to keep the commands of God Ans So he hath denyed the one offering and himselfe to be out of the love of God and the Circumcision in the spirit which puts off the body of sin and the blood of the new Covenant These be the Principles of the Priests of Orkney Pr. JAmes Morrison said that Christ which is within men is a Devill and all who said they had Christ within them were Devils and Witches and so bid the people take notice of it Ans Contrary to the Apostle to the Colossians who said Christ in you the hope of glory And to the Corinthians he said Christ is in you except ye be reprobates And they be in the witchcraft and of the Devill that have not Christ in them and reprobates and this was and is the doctrine of the Ministers of God Witnessed by Luke Liddall Souldier with all the rest of the Priests hearers G. W. George Larcum His
them you keep with clubs and staves lest any should be moved from the spirit of the Lord to speak amongst you from the Lord. And your Parishes and Flock which you undertake to prove to be a true Church alack for you that people should be so impudent to say these are pillars and ground of truth or the Steeple-houses be the pillars and ground of truth A company of Drunkards Swearers covetous proud persons given to pleasures you are like them that said they were Jewes and were not but the synagogue of Sathan a nest of unclean birds Pr. We expect not perfect unity till we have perfect knowledge and holiness Ans Have you cryed up your selves to be the ministers of Christ all this while and have not perfect knowledge perfect holinesse perfect unity The least unity is perfect in the spirit and the least knowledge and the least holinesse in the spirit and this you acknowledge you have not perfect unity perfect knowledge perfect holinesse and this hath been the cause you have kept all people since the Apostles in blindnesse out of the unity in that which is unholy who say you have not the perfect knowledge for the least of holinesse is perfect and in the holinesse is the unity in whith is the perfect knowledge though in the least degree and this thou hast confessed you have not and we doe believe you and so out of thy own words thou and you are proved unsanctified for who are sanctified have perfect unity perfect knowledge perfect holinesse Pr. I use notes as much as any man when I am laâ—y or busy c. Ans This is it which holds up your lazy minds which you gather out of books selling it again by the hour-glasse and make that day you call sabbath your market day selling both prayers and preaching who have not the spirit of the Lord to lead you to speak as it moves and to lead you to all truth as it did the Disciples so it is lazynesse indeed that hath set up your notes and reads them by the glasse for money and who have learnd seven years out of books Colledges and then gather up out of your authors books in notes and thus make a trade of them and then teâ—ls the people you are sent and it is the word of the Lord which it is but the reading of books and yet you tell people you never heard the voice of God if any aske you thus deluders are judged out of their own mouths who have a law if any are moved of the spirit of the Lord while they are reading their notes or speaking before or after none to speake against what they have gathered out of their books and studies which was not the works of the true ministry but the worke of those who were out from the true spirit and so were ministers of the letter and old authors and notes Pr. He saith They are unmercifull men that say more glorious dayes are appearing and that the Saints shall rule the world Answ In this thou hast judged thy selfe and there need no more words be spoken to it And the rest of thy lyes and slanders in thy Book which are not worth mentioning they will fall upon thy own head John Cole His Book printed 1658. His Principles in it as followeth Pr. IT 's a common thing for the young Harlot to say minde the Light within Answ The light which doth enlighten every man which cometh into the world all Harlots draws from and be out of it and such may beget proselytes and father them upon God which are not in the Truth but the day is come that all things are made manifest and by it doth appear and the light which every man which cometh into the world is enlightned withall is the offence to all the evill doers who be out of salvation and the Covenant of God and none sees salvation but by it Pr. The young Harlot can but mend evill old Adam by her exhortations and instructions and doings and threatnings and she doth fright some to her obedience Ans The Harlot is in that which evill old Adam is in in the transgression and so they which be harlotted from the spirit of God cannot mend and instruct the transgressor they themselves being in the transgression They may tell them of the Saints words and speak them as the Devill doth who is out of the Truth but thou John Cole art fallen into the earth and there art quarrelling And as for the rest of the stuffe in thy Book which is not worth mentioning but when thou feels the root and tree burn and fall into a fire about thee and thee in it then remember thou hast not that which doth not savour withal as thy confused childish workâ— do appear which in print thou hast published to the world Alexander Rosse his Booke which he calls A view of all RELIGIONS His Lies and Principles Pr. GOd is not in the quaking of the body Ans Was it not God that made the body of David to quake and Daniel and Habakkuk and Job and the mountains quake at the giving forth of his Law And doth not God say He doth not shake the earth but heaven also Now dost not thou manifest thy selfe to be one of them that cast them out that tremble at the Word and tells them that God is not among them And as for Alexander Rosse his lies and slanders in saying the Quakers said Christ had failings and distrusted God which thousands of thousands that can witnesse to thy face thou art a liar it is a sufficient proof to them that thy book is made up of such stuffe of lyes which is thy view from the Creation And the rest of thy Book is much like unto that and the false prophets studying a divination of their owne brain to get money by we deny but such as divide the word aright we own and all that pray and preach and sing for money and make a trade of the Scripture to get money by we disown but such as pray and sing by the spirit we own and all your Readings for money we deny but who reads freely we own and all your Seremonies we do deny and are come to the substance Christ Jesus before the world was made Pr. The leaves of a tree are not the fruits thereof and yet without them the fruit would not prosper Answ Art thou a fit man to give a view from the Creation of the World who erres thus in Naturals For pluck off the leaves of the Vines and see if the grapes will not prosper Art thou a fit man to give a view of Religion and blasphemy and errour from the Creation who art not able to give a true view of the Naturalls Pr. Thou sayest It is horrid blasphemy to say the Scripture is not the Word of God and to say the soule is a part of God Answ The Scriptures are the words of God in Exodus and the four Books of the
end of the types and figures and shadowes the substance Pr. And the woman that Paul speaks of that is forbidden to speake in the Church but must learne of her husband at home is the whore that drinks the blood of the Saints in Revelations Ans That is false for the woman the Apostles speaks of there that must learne in silence and must be in subjection aske her husband at home is in the state of Eve who must not teach but learne in silence as also said the Law for shee was first found in the transgression now the woman here hath a husband to aske at home and not usurp authority over the man but Christ in the male as in the female who redeems from under the Law and makes free from the Law the man may speak Christ in the male and female who are in the spirit of God are not under the Law but the whore who drinks the blood of the Saints is gone from her husband from under the Law to aske the whore-master that doth drinke the blood of the saints which Christ the seed judgeth upon to whom he gives judgement Pr. And the outward creatures which God had made and created and blessed are the serpents meat as the old Ranter of Bristow when he was gnawing a peece of plum pudding said he was eating the serpents meat Ans The Serpents meate is dust and he goes on his belly and so hath proved him selfe to be a serpent who eates his meat which the children of God the seed doth not and Christ who eate of the bread he did not eate the serpents meate he did not call it serpents meat and that is cursed and judged that doth so Francis Duke his book intituled The fulnesse and freenesse of Gods grace his Principles are as followes Pr. GGod made man perfection of parts in this life but not perfection in degrees Ans Perfection of parts is perfection of degrees for where there is a part there a degree so in this thou medlest with things that are too heavy for thee Pr. That God did elect that drop of humane seed to be personall God man as the text is the seed of the woman shall bruise the serpents head Ans The elect is Christ the seed and Christ the second Adam is not humane for humane is earthly so thou erres in thy judgement for as Christ the seed saies he that is born of the flesh is flesh and he that is born of the spirit is spirit and the election obtaines it and he that is of the earth is earthly but he that is from above is heavenly Pr. Men may obey imperfectly but truly Ans Truth is perfect Christ is truth who is perfect and they that obey truly obey perfectly for perfect obedience and true obedience is one Pr. The seed of the Serpent and the Devils seed remaines in the best of men in this life for without this seed of the Devil issuing in humane nature it is not capable of Eternal life Ans This seed of the Devill hinders men to be capable of eternall life and such as are sanctified from the wombe was capable of eternall life and such as were made free from sin and the body of death and sin put out of them could not sin because the seed of God remaineth in them and witnessed redemption the works of the Devill destroyed and Christ manifested in their flesh condemned sin in their flesh and Christ in them the body being dead because of sin which was borne of God and they did not commit sin they were past from death to life for sin brought death and where the Devill had the power of it which went out of truth but the seed having destroyed death and him that hath the power of it which is the devill and God the God of all peace have bruised Satan under the faints feet such is a top of the seed of the devill and they are capable of eternall life and tells thee thy doctrine is a lye Pr. Man may believe truly but never rightly Ans He that believeth truly and is in the true beliefe believes rightly and he that believes truly is borne of God and he whose beliefe is false and not born of God it is as his that is out of truth which is not right which the true beliefe in truth is over him in that the Devill is out of all his generation that stands in an outward beliefe Pr. The will of man remaines in good men and bad men in heaven and in hell and in earth Ans There 's noe prophesie of the scriptures came by the earthly will of man but that mans will be subdued denyed with the Crosse and power of God whereby he that doth the will of God abides for ever but he that doth his own will abides not ever and flesh and blood enters not into the kingdom of God and they that goe downe into Hell go down into their owne wills and wilfulnesse but he must be born againe before he can enter into Gods Kingdom he that is borne of the flesh is flesh and will persecute him that is born after the spirit for there 's the two wills and earth is their footstool Pr. The Saints affirme themselves that they are all unclean things and their righteousnesse as filthy rags Ans The Saints are cleane and are sanctified and are washed and are cleansed now are you clean saith the Lord ye were such and such and the saints rightousnesse is Christ such as never will grow ragged which was before the world was made which was before rags and ragged righteousnesse was this is the Saints righteousness and true believers and the saints are not unclean things for it is the unsanctified that be unclean Pr. The Saints have a twofold righteousnesse in this world Ans The righteousness of the Saints is one Christ and is in one in God from whence all righteosnesse comes and the true believers righteousnesse is Christ Jesus the end of the Law Pr. Thou saist that James envies those that brag of their faith without works thou saist the Lord attributes that to the eye which is not proper the eye is the light of the body but yet the eye hath no light in it selfe to enlighten the body so he attributes that to the eye which is not proper to the Light Ans James did not envy for envy was of Cain and of the devill and of the wicked one he did not envy them whose faith was dead without works and Christs speech was proper who said the light of the body was the eye and without the eye the body hath not light looke of it either inward or outward t is proper within and proper without for when the eye is blinded within the body is full of darkenesse when the eye is blinded without the body is darke and he wants the light and the light of the body is the eye that being single the body is full of light and that is perfect
your blind zeal the mouth of iniquity hath been open in you with all the world against the truth but with it in a great measure it is stopped Pr. The evils hath been so strong that they have wrestled all weapons out of the hands of Saints and Ministers that have been formed against them Answ These have been pitiful weapons that you Ministers and Saints have had in your hands that the evil wrestled them out they have been carnal not spiritual for the spiritual weapons the evil cannot wrest out of the hands of Saints and Ministers of God but with them they are plucked down his holds and high places and spiritual wickednesses the evil dares not come nigh the Saints weapons which are spiritual Pr. You say We desire no longer to rest in a testimony of words but take an effectual course that sin and sinners may be purged out of the house of God we desire the Church would set some days apart wherein they may bewail iniquity and pollution that Ministering Brethren would without respect of persons from house to house night and day bear their testimony to flie from those abominations Answ The Church of God you cannot which is the Pillar and ground of truth which Christ purchased with his blood without spot or wrinkle or blemish and the house of God you know not who talkes of purging of it who is established a top of all the mountains and all your abominations and pollutions and respecting of persons is out of the Church and the Law both transgressors of it and it is time to begin to stir up your selves and turn from the evil of your wayes and turn to Christ the Light who hath enlightened you that you may bear testimony against your selves and your Ministers and lightness and abominations in your own families and do not say it is the house of God and the Church of God but amongst your selves and we do believe it is but the testimony of words who have denyed the light and so denyed the power Pr. They may deliver themselves from the blood of souls having declared the whole counsel of God Answ Can dust and ashes declare the whole Counsel of God and cankered ones and pollutions and abominations can such declare the whole Counsel of God such be out of it for they that come into the counsel of God declares that and come out of pollutions and cankered with the world to him by whom the world is made who is perfect and makes them perfect who declares his perfect will and counsel Pr. Another evil we thought to have spread before you but wanting opportunitie shall now omit and that from Chard we have laboured in vain that which hath been brought forth hath been to little purpose Answ This you may speak to your shame and shew forth your own nakedness that you have laboured in vain and that which you have brought forth hath been to little purpose in this the Church of Christ believes you who hath been them that hath beaten the air and why do you Print abroad that there is another evil among you which you have not laid open had you not been better have held your tongues except you had mentioned it is not this Hams spirit who lays open one anothers nakednes to the world in Print but how can you do otherwayes who hath denyed the light that hath enlightened every man that comes into the world which comes from Christ Jesus and so wants the covering and as for all your dirt and drosse and dung which is not worth mentioning in your Epistle and confused words which you set forth thinking to your glory but it is to your shame had you been in the life that gave forth Scripture which the Saints was in that was of the Church you would have covered your nakedness and would not have said pollution was in the Church and in the house of God but for all these things you are judged and you and your Epistle and your words to be unsavory and is judged with the life of God that gave forth Scripture and them that be of the house of God and the Church of God where no pollution is nor comes nor canker the witness in your conscience shall answer it in the day of the Lord. By us Richard Baxter c. Pastor of the Church at Kederminster In their Paper called the Judgement and advice of the Assembly of the Assosciated Ministers In it their Principles as followeth Pr. THat ever there should be so much to do among Christians yea the leaders of Christs flock and to bring them to so clear a duty that after all there labour there is no more done Answ Ye have been them that God never sent and found to be such as Christ cryed wo against and so you have not profited the people at all And you have not been the leaders of Christs flock but been such as turned against them that hath been your duty so therefore be all the people on heapes Pr. That all men must know that we are Christs followers if we love one another for he that saith he loves God and hates his brother is a liar Answ In this poor men you have judged your own selves for is not debate and strife and vain glory and persecution and prisoning found among you Cain turning against his brother Abel and slaying and killing him whose blood cryes for vengeance upon you so it is a proof that you are out of the faith that works by love in which is the communitie and Love with God and one with another And so in stead of making up breaches you are wounding and bringing confusion being out of the faith and life that Christ and the Apostles were in so in heapes about their words Pr. It is not our business to change mens minds from infidels and heresie to the faith but to bring the Churches of Christ to understand each other to be true Churches which take the holy Scriptures for our Rule of your faith and lives and believe it to be the infallible word of God and this Rule is Divine so our faith is Divine had we but a humane Rule we could have but a humane faith proud men thrust their opinions into the Churches Creed Ans Your businesse it is true is not to change men form infidels and heresie and to bring them to the faith so not into the unity for you bring no people into that nor to the Faith and you bring no Church to know one another in the faith and the Churches of Christ knowes each other to be a true Church and you whose businesse is not to bring men off heresie to Faith know not the Church of Christ which is the pillar and ground of truth built upon Christ who is the faiths author and the scriptures which signifies writings as you say outward writings paper and ink is not infallable nor is not divine but is humane and a humane knowledge from it men get and so writings
regard and receive but if one come in the Name of the Lord him you put out so you will not have the Lord nor his Christ to reign neither his servants to labour in his Vineyard Pr. Ministery is like a mighty tree whose fruit the Lord hath appointed for the healing of the Nations Answ But your Ministers and the Papists hath been them got up since the days of the Apostles that brings Nations all into heaps and into blood and doth not heale the Nations but wounds and burthens and kills and casts into prison as this your fruit declares it who casts into prison such as you doe no work for Pr. To the Law and to the Testimony pray to the Father of lights that he would enlighten us with his truth and shew us the way that he would have us to walke in and pray for us who watch for your soules as those that must give account Answ The testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy And the Law is light and the Law and Testimony was before Matthew Marke Luke and Iohn and the Epistles were written and the Revelations which outward Books you call Law and Testimony which the Scripture saith the testimony of Iesus is the spirit of prophesie and the Law is light Prov. 6. Are you them that are the makers of Ministers and Ministers who watch for the soules of people and yet do you bid people pray to the Father that he would enlighten you with his truth and shew you the way that you may walke in it How can you present soules to God that doth not know the way and are yet to be enlightned and yet to have the way shewed so you that you might walke in it Is this your conclusion of all you Ministers in Ireland Now I say Christ hath enlightned every man which comes into the world which is the way and though your darknesse cannot comprehend it and yet you pray that he would enlighten you When John saith he doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world and that is the true light Have you the light to seek and the way to seek and truth to seek and yet watchers for souls And the soule you that are called Ministers saith it is humane yea the soule of Christ the soule of man is appetite and lust and pleasure and humane from the earth from the ground Is Christs soule from the ground and appetite lust and pleasure wars against the soul in them that be in the unreasonablenesse You that have the light to seek truth to seek and way to seek are in the earth and so gives the soule the name of that which comes from the ground Now the soule is immortall God breathed into man the breath of life and he became a living soule It is that which came out from God who hath all souls in his hand that 's his power which hand goes against him that doth evill And Christ the power of God which is immortall is the souls Bishop which is immortall from whence it hath its nourishment and the immortall which is able to save the immortal soul And as for all the rest of your ignorance and non-sence in your Book which comes from your confused earthly spirit who are found in the nature spirit and stock of your Father the Pope who hath apostatized since the dayes of the Apostles with all the rest of your stuffe which is but fuel for the fire in that day of your account the witnesse in all your consciences shall answer it John Stillom his Book called Margent Notes His Principles as followeth Pr. HEe calls it the Quakers adoring their own light magnifying the light of nature The Church is ashamed of your doctrine and walking saith he Ans The Quakers light is Christ the truth in whom they worship God which light was before naturall lights were and this the Church owns and is not ashamed of in which stands the Doctrine by which light the Church is gathered up unto God the Father of light but the imitated Churches in the Apostacy are ashamed of it Pr. Not any man knows him speaking of Christ to be God till he finde him in Scripture and saith as deep things as the spirit hath revealed they are all in the Scripture Ans Many knew God and knew Christ and yet had not written Scripture to tell them of those things as Enoch and Abel and many again hath Scripture speaking of God and Christ and yet doth not know God and Christ and doth not finde him in Scripture As instance the Pharisees knew not God and Christ which had the Scripture and had not life untill they came to Christ the Scripture speaks of and many things the spirit did reveal which was not written in the Scriptures and was spoken to the Saints Pr. John meaneth not that there was any substantiall truth necessary to be known to salvation which is not revealed in the written Word but the spirit that ordered the Copies and mysteries of the Gospell to be contracted within a narrow compass of lines Answ Many knew their salvation as in the dayes of Noah Enoch and David which had not the written Scriptures And though people have the Copies that speaks of the Gospel of the mysteries of the Gospel put together and compassed and contracted into lines yet they do not know the Gospell nor the mysteries of it nor the Word though they testifie of these things and the Pharisees did not that had Scripture which Scripture doth not tell us of written words but that the Word is Christ and God which was in the beginning before words were given forth And Gospell and salvation and the mysteries of it is known by the Spirit and the Light which come from Christ Jesus which none knows it but by that Pr. Stillom adds not onely heart rising prophesie nâ—r breast-prophesie in the minde but written downe in books The Apostle excludes not heart-prophesie so he includes Scripture-prophesie but till the day-star did arise in their mindes by the reading and heeding of the Scriptures that is plain meaning Answ The Scriptures were given forth by prophesie and the spirit of it and no man knows but by the same spirit and the Apostle did not exclude heart-prophesie and the Day-star doth not rise in the heart by mens reading and heeding the Scriptures in their own wills and having them in books written down but as men do come to the life and spirit as they were in that gave them forth and heed that with that they heed Scripture and knows Scripture and with that they know the Day-star and Christ who is the end of them and so men must come to take heed of the light that shines in a dark place before they know the Day-star arise For the Jewes had Scripture and did not heed that for the spirit within of prophesie doth not deny any tittle of the Scripture without And in thy Principle thou hast confounded thy selfe who saith Not heart-prophesie heart-rising
sin whilst they are upon earth they can be but in their sin if they never preach to them But the scripture saith He that believes is borne of God and he that is borne of God cannot sin because his seed remaines in him 1 Iohn 3.9 But this is of another world to him who is called James Dorram Minister of Glasgow Minister of darknesse who puts no difference between the children of God and the children of the devill 1 Iohn 3.10 They would have sin whilst they are upon the earth and it is darknesse but the Apostles said they were made free from sin Rom. 6.22 whilst they were upon the earth Pr. Christ being sinlesse separates him from all others Answ Christ being seperated from sinners Heb. 7.26 who are in Christ are seperate from sinners and sin both 2 Cor. 6 17. But this James Dorram hath made the offering of none effect Heb. 10.14 which hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified And hath made the blood of Jesus of none effect which cleanseth from all sin 1 Iohn 1.7 And he hath made the everlasting Covenant of none effect which blots out all sins trespasses And he hath made the faith of the Son of God of none effect which purifies the heart and gives victory over the world Acts. 15.9 1 Iohn 5.5 Thou dost herein preach and hold up sin and doth not preach it down and yet thou saist thou preachest not to hold it up and yet thou preachest they must have it whilst they are upon the earth here is confusion in thy tongue Prov. 17.20 Thou shouldst have preached it down and have brought them to a Church where there is neither spot nor wrinkle nor blemish nor any such thing Eph. 5.27 if thou wert a true Minister but your Church is full of spots and blemishes and wrinkles whilst ye are preaching up zeale to stone people and sin while they live as Henry Foreside and Iames Dorram doth Pr. God be thanked the scripture speakes nothing for freedome from sin and perfection Ans Thou thankest God that thou maist live in thy sin and imperfection and art glad of this thy false hope but thou art a lyar thou art out of the truth in this for the scripture saith they were made free from sin Rom. 6.26 and they preached wisdome among them that were perfect 1 Cor. 2.6 and he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified Heb. 10.14 So the scripture speakes of freedome from sin and perfection and be perfect Pr. That the condemning power of sin is taken away Answ The believer doth not sin 1 Iohn 5.1 1 Iohn 3.9 but he that the believer overcomes commits sin 1 Io. 3.8 1 Io. 5.5 if the believer commits sin who overcomes the believer and so he that commits sin is under the condemning power of sin which thou saist not which thou and all other shall witnesse Pr. The believer is not in sin as the unbeliever is he sins not as the unbeliever doth and in an other place he saith the Law is the same to the believer that it is to the unbeliever Answ Here any may read thy confusion but I say unto thee he that believeth doth not commit sin but the unbeliefe is sin Rom. 11.20 and Christ is the end of the Law to every one that believes for righteousnesse sake Rom. 10.4 and yet thou puts both believers and unbelievers under the Law Lodowick Simerell priest of the new parish of Munckland his Principles and Doctrines Pr. THat it is blasphemy to say that the light in man which reproves of sin is the light of God is perfect is the gift of God Answ Contrary to scripture contrary to Christs words and contrary to the Apostles words is thy doctrine and Principles for every gift of God is perfect Isa 1.17 Isa 49.6 Iohn 1.3 Iohn 4. For Christ is the gift of God and he will give him for a Covenant of light to the Jewes and Gentiles which doth enlighten every man that commeth into the world which every one that doth truth comes to it which every one that doth evill hates the light and will not come to the light because the light will reprove him and so This is the condemnation of the world that light is come into the world and men love darknesse rather then light because their deeds be evill So this light is perfect which doth reprove every man of sin and is from above and it is the gift of God and thou art blind and in darknesse that comprehends it not And the light which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world Christ Jesus the gift of God him by whom the world was made this light was before any naturall light was made Sun Moon or Stars for all things that was made was made by the light which came a light into the world that all through him might believe for he that believes not in the light is condemned already and he that does believe in the light hath the witnesse in himselfe to set to his seale that God is true and the spirit of truth that doth reprove the world is perfect of God The light which every one that cometh into the world is enlightned withall is not conscience for the light was before any thing was made or conscience named So the light is that which exerciseth the conscience towards God and towards man where it is loved and the voice heard but where it is hated and the voice not heard the conscience is seared and the light is their condemnation whose consciences is seared which light was before conscience was The Priest would not have thee and thou to be to a single person and so is the man that would not indure sound words that cannot be condemned thee and thou was the language between God and his Saints and one another and you is to many and thou was to one and this was the language between Jeptha and his daughter and between the Saints and the Kings this shewes thou hast not learned the Accedence nor Bible nor art come to the forme of sound words Iohn Castaires called Minister of Glasgow his principles Pr. THis is naturall folks duty to pray to God and worship him although they sinfully keep themselves under a sinfull necessity to sin against God through ignorance Answ This hath been your worke to keep people in ignorance which you may be ashamed of A naturall man cannot worship God for he cannot receive the things of God nor a sinfull man but worship the Devill for he that commits sin serves him and he that serves sin serves the devill and worships him Iohn 8.34 And Christ said the Pharisees should receive the greater damnation for their pretended long prayers Mat. 23.14 and so he did not justifie them in their long prayers but rebuked them and said Wo unto them who draw near with their lips when their hearts were far off Isa 29.13 And they that pray and worship God must pray in the
it any other except such as the Pope gave to his ministers having your degrees in your schools and attaining from one art and office to another till at last you professe to be attained to the ministry but this is not Gods way of Commissionating but antichrists way and the Lord God is risen who will confound it for the Lord hath not spoken to you neither hath he revealed his glory to you you have neither seen his shape nor heard his voice neither is the tidings you bring effectual to convert sinners for you are climed up another way and enters not in at the door and the Ape is truly your figure for your deformity appeares to the saints and all the children of light does see you and your originall which came up in the falling away of the true Churches when anti-christ took the Throne and the man of sin got up into the temple which for many generations amongst you hath shewn himselfe to be God and hath been worshipped as God Pr. The complices of Corah Dathan and Abiram who usurps the Priests office were destroyed a warning-peece for such as usurp the ministerial function uncalled and unordained let them take heed when they persume to vent their illiterat rude incoherence and blasphemous stuff Ans This belongs to your selves ye men of unholy lives who hath usurped to the ministry uncalled and unordained of the Lord by his spirit and you may take warning at Chorahs destruction whom the Lord shall as surely destroy with the fire of his jealousie for while the beast hath had power over nations and the whore made Nations drunk all this time hath your authority been exalted by which you have been set up and your ministers without the life that the true ministers were in and without that call and ordination which they had for you are of man and by man and your effects not the worke of the true ministrie of Christ but are left desolate and are desolate of the presence of God being your selves unlearned in the doctrine of Christ venting your imaginations out of the truth and out of the power of God and there stands your ministrie Pr. Vnsanctified ministers may possibly convert to God Ans No he that is unsanctified is out of the power of God and the word of God abides not in him and he runs and is not sent and it is not possible that such can convert sinners who are themselves unconverted from their iniquities Pr. That some learned Christians have been able to squees the greatest mysteries of our Religion out of the writings of some Heathens Ans This is the sum of your principles you 15. Priests and here is the sum of your ignorance and wretchednesse discovered and the vanity of your Religion whose foundation is the writings of heathens and the heathens that knew not God out of their writings is your religion made up as you confesse this is the whores Religion that sits upon the beast that the world hath long wondred after and not the true religion which the Apostles and true Churches were in and they are no Christians no Saints nor true Christians that goes to the writings of Heathens to squees out mysteries they that do so are the Christians in the Apostacie who are falne from the life of righteousnesse such as you and thousands are at this day being without the spirit and without Christ therefore you run to the Heathen for knowledge and shames true Christianity and true Christians in reputing the heathen wiser then your selves who are faine to run to their writings to make up your mysteries and such is your religion deceit and vanity and the mysterie thereof studyed for out of the heathens writings this is Christianity in the Apostacie and the Religion apostatized from the life of true Christianity for the true Christian Religion the foundation thereof is Christ who is the mysterie of God and of life and salvation and the mysteries of our true Christian Religion which we live in that are come out of the Apostacie are revealed to us by the spirit of the father that dwells in us is in all that are in the true Christian Religion who denies the Heathens and your Apostatized Christians and are come into the mysteries of eternall salvation which is not squeesed by imaginations of men but revealed by the spirit of God the great mysterie Christ in us and the mysterie of the Kingdome all this is made manifest to us and to true Christians whose Religion stands in the power of God and not in the tradition of men nor fetched from the Heathens writings and this Religion will stand for ever but your Religion and mynistries and Church will the Lord confound the author of whom is the heathens writings and how then shall it stand it is out of the bottomlesse pit and ariseth out of that your Religion and mysteries and thither shall it be turned into the pit that hath no bottome oh how have you blinde leaders led the blind that have been professing to teach Christ this many years and faith in him and have you taken so much money of the Nations and do you now tell us that the greatest mysteries of your Religion are squeesed out of the heathens writings oh ye unrighteous men blind leaders the Lord God Almighty is now risen and the Nations can no longer be satisfied with this Religion but the Lord is a gathering out of your mouths and you must howl and lament all the Idols dumb shepherds and they shall be confounded and the soules delivered of which they have made a prey for the soules of men have been the merchandize of Babylons merchants they have bought and sold the souls of men they have blinded the eye of it and troden it downe and the immortall soule hath not been respected otherwise then to make merchandize thereof to get gaine thereby there has been many traffickers since the daies of the Apostles that have made merchandizes of souls but the judgement of the great Whore is come and of Babylon the Mother of Harlots and the Lord God and the Lamb will plead against her and the jawes of the wicked shall be broken and their hearts shall utterly faile in the midst of them and the Lord will reveal his righteousness from heaven and by his judgements shall he be known in the earth a mighty God and a dreadfull and his dread and terror shall take hold upon your consciences come down and sit in the dust for the Lords controversie is against you he will bruise you with an Iron rod hee 'l break you as a potters vessel and his hand ye shall not escape for ye are but like Bryers and thorns in battel before him and like the stubble in which the fire is kindled and you will be as the dross in time of purging and at reprobate silver the Lord God hath said it W. S. His Book called A Parsons guide concerning of Tythes and the Law of Tythes