a reciprocal loue in you that the faults thereof may bee shewed and manifested by some of the great Rabbies of your side to the end that the weaknes of our cause being laid open I may be drawen to ioine with you in the religion you professe may be brought home to that fold out of which froÌ„ which I am sure in your iudgemeÌ„ts I am departed gone astray as a lost sheep Tâ—is is a charitable request ought not with any colours or sleights to be refused by any of those learned Priests in whom you haue interest since they know of how great merite the winning of soules is And they may the rather be incouraged thereto because these things as they are collected by me are but the doings of a meere lay man therfore if at all may with greater facility be refuted But if the same shall be past ouer with general tearms as heretofore it hath bin in the like as a thing vnworthy the answering Or that I am an heretike obstinate and not to be dealt with theÌ„ may you easily iudge that either your credit is small with those of your profession Or your loue charity very little to me that so earnestly out of the simplicity of my heart desire an answer Or else that the weaknes badnes of your cause cannot abide the touchstone of truth notwithstanding their great swelling brags of challenging vs to dispute with them be so often sounded iâ— your ears And I would to God I might truly say of you that I presume of my self that yoâ— would reade ponder these things with in differencie abandon partiality To the effecting wherof besides my praiers I haue no better meanes than the Apostles doctrine 1. Thess 5.21 Iames. 1. Cor. 2.5 2. Cor. 13.5 Iohn 4.1 Act. 17.11 who willeth you vs all to examine all things to hold fast that which is good and not to haue the faith of our Lord Iesus Christ with respect of persons but to try the spirits whether they be of God therein following the example of the men oâ— Berea who searched the scriptures daily whether those things were so Thus hauing some hope you wil folow this Councel coÌ„mandement comming from so high an authority as the Spirit of God and also for my satisfaction if not for your owne effect this my so charitable reasonable a request as the answering hereof I shal stil continue my prayers to opeÌ„ our eyes that we may see the truth and that we may be made one flocke one fold of that great Shepherd Christ Iesus the Bishop of our soules To whome with the Father and the holy Spirit be all honor and praise now and for euer Amen Yours in the Lord T. V. The Author to the Reader THis smal Tract Christian Reader was at the first composed out of a religious zeale and feruent desire I had to haue withdrawen some of my best friends from that Egyptian darkenesse of Popish superstition And this argument I the rather made choice of because it was often obiected though very vntruely that we durst not handle the Grounds of Religion After I had finished the same I recoÌ„mended it to my best friends as you may see by the Preface thereof the which was by them reciprocally receiued hauing no lesse loue and desire to reclaime me than I had to winne them To which purpose they sent it to some one of the learned on their part by whose sufficiencie the same might bee fully refuted which I assure my selfe by many probable coniectures was Doctor Norris After I had staied some thirteene weeks with desiee and expectation to see the answere therof hauing often solicited the same about that time I receiued a Letter as I take it from the said D.N. importing among many seuerall reproches wherewith hee had laboured to giue satisfaction to them and to impeach the credit both of me and my booke that if I would procure two or three of the best learned of our side to auow it vnder their hands to be the doctrine of our Church That then hee would take vpon him to proue 14. or 15. seueral absurdities and vntruths therein as by his Letter here likewise set downe verbatim may truely appeare This Letter I then answered as it is here likewise inserted And when I had stayed another quarter of a yeere and heard of no answere made or inteÌ„ded to be made I procured with much importunitie the redeliuery of the booke After which because I would leaue the said D.N. as I take it without all excuse and also let my friends see I would presse it to the vtmost I procured two reuerend and learned Ministers M.D. Sutcliffe and M. Anthony Wootton to subscribe the same booke vnder both their hands in this forme following viz The summe and substance of the doctrine contained in this booke is sound and shal be maintained by the grace of God against the whole packe of Iesuits and Masse-priests of the Romish Synagogue After this vpon the late discouery of those hellish and matchlesse treasons against our dread Soueraigne and the whole body of the Realm hauing heard that the said D. N. was apprehended and committed to Bridewel where I likewise vnderstood that he was not close prisoner I repaired vnto him and shewed him this my booke with the subscriptioÌ„ annexed and before specified demaÌ„ding of him whether he had seen the booke and were the author of that Letter Which hee denied affirming that he had neuer seen it till theÌ„ reseruing belike according to their maner of Equivocating that he had neuer seen it till then subscribed in that maner or with some such mentall reseruation All which considered though I am stil perswaded that he was the Author therof I haue preferred the publishing of it though therein mine own wants defects for the maner of handling might by the iudicious learned be in some sort taxed rather than to bury it in sileÌ„ce for that I hope it may bring some benefit not vnworthy my trauel to the indifferent Reader and may happily effect that which thereby I first intended when they shall see I am not afraid in regard of the doctrine therin to diuulge it to the whole world And the rather I am incouraged hereto for that the same is not onely the doctrine of the best learned writers of this our age Nation as it is by me collected but also is warraÌ„ted to be iustified by men of so great sufficiencie that I shall not need to feare shipwracke though the seas swell and the storme rise neuer so hie And so farewel in Christ T. V. The true Copie of the Letter I receiued I Haue perused your Treatise dedicated to your dearest Cousins which I find to be a vaine bundle of words without substance order learning or trueth and if you can procure that two or three of the best learned of your side will auow it vnder their hands to be the
obiections of the errors of Popes and Councels refuted So can I whensoeuer you shall instance any such particular refutation which may ease you of some paines if it be so sufficiently performed referre you to some of the authors of our side where the same reasons haue been with no lesse sufficiencie handled and replied to assuring my selfe That neither any of you haue or can make any obiections against the doctrine we professe that hath not beene already obiected and likewise by vs answered And if any will shew me the contrary I will be beholding to him neither will I shut mine eyes against the trueth If this which I haue sayd may any whit preuaile with you to make shew of that great learning whereof in your Letter you haue boasted by your liberall vndertaking to proue so many particulars which hitherto as great Clerkes as your selfe haue failed in I shall be ready and willing to performe whatsoeuer I haue herein promised Otherwise I pray you returne the booke as you receiued it and you shall see that some such course shal be taken as shal make you blush to haue censured so rashly Your friend in Christianity and Charitie T. V. A briefe view of the weaknesse of the Grounds of Popish Religion as is euident by these seuerall Obiections and Answeres following Protestant 1WHereupon doe you ground your Religion Papist Vpon the word of God interpreted by the Church which cannot erre Protestant 2 What do you vnderstand by the Word of God Papist The Scriptures and Traditions Protestant 3 What doe you vnderstand by the Church Papist Stapl. princi doct l. 7 ca. 10. l. 11 ca. 5 Hervaeus de potest pap R. Cupers Petrus de Palude de potest papae Aâ— 4. The Church is sometimes taken for the auncient Fathers sometimes for generall Councels Sometimes we preferre the head of the Church the Pope before both Protestant 4 Well that we may procéede orderly in the handling of these particulars Doe you receiue all the bookes of the Old and Newe Testaments with equall authoritie Papist No but following the Tradition of the Church we distinguish betweene the Canonicall and the Apocrypha Protestant 5 Which are the Bookes which you call Apocrypha Papist Wee hold as Apocrypha The prayer of Manasses the third and fourth booke of Esdras Also others that are not vsuall in your English Bibles as an Appendix to the booke of Iob The 151. Psalme A preface to the Lamentations of Ieremie The third and fourth booke of Maccabees Protestant 6 Well we agrée with you in the reiection of these Bookes And we likewise consent with you That all the bookes of the New Testament as they stand are to be receiued of all for Canonicall Scripture What are then the Bookes that are in question betwéene vs Papist There be 7. Chapters of Hester certaine Stories annexed to Daniel as Of Bel and the DragoÌ„ Of Susanna Of the three childreÌ„ Also the Epistle of Baruch ioyned to Ieremie Then the books of Tobie Iudeth The Wisedom of Salomon Ecclesiasticus Two bookes of the Maccabees These we repute as Canonical both by the testimony of the Fathers and by the authoritie of the Church Protestant 7 Well Since I shall haue cause hereafter to speake of the Church I wil but briefly giue a touch to the reason of the refusall of these Bookes All Canonicall Scriptures in the old Testament were written by the Prophets We haue a sure word of the Prophets 2. Pet. 1.19 saith Saint Peter And Saint Paul calleth them The Scriptures of the Prophets Rom. 16 2â— But none of those Bookes afore named of Tobias of Iudeth and the rest were written by the Prophets Therefore none of those Bookes are Canonical All the Bookes of the olde Testament that were Canonicall were acknowledged of the Iewes and Hebrewes and written in Hebrew But the Iewes receiued none of these Books into the Canon of the Scriptures though to them were committed the Oracles of God as Saint Paul sayth neither were they in the Hebrew tongue Ergo they are not Canonicall But to the end you may sée how well the Church of which you boast agrées with the testimonies of the Fathers both ancient moderne Hier prol galeat Eâ—i ad Pauli in praefat â—i Reg in praefat in â—ro Salom. I wil giue you this taste briefly S. Hierom saith The Church readeth those bookes but receiueth them not amongst the Canonicall Scriptures The summe of all which is confirmed by these testimonies following whose particular spéeches to this purpose for breuitie sake I omit referring you to the places themselues as they are here following set down As Rufinus in his exposition vpon the Créede Cyril of Hierusalem in the 4. of his Catechisme Athanasius in Synop. Sacr. Scriptur Nazianzen in Carminis Epiphan li. de Mensur ponder Cyprian vpon the Créed Damasâ—en ca. 49. Hugo de Sanct. Victor de Sacram. in prol li. 1. ca. 7. Radulphus in Leuit. li. 14. c. 1. Lyra in prol in li. Apocry Hugo Cardina in prol Iosu All these contradict the opinion of the Papists in this controuersie yea Arias Montanus a chiefe Papist in his Hebrew Bible writeth in the forefront principal leafe of the booke There are added saith he in this Edition the bookes written in Gréek which the Catholike Church following the Canon of the Hebrews reckoneth amongst the Apocrypha The Councel of Laodicea Can. 59. Constantinop in Trul lo Can. 2. allured by a general Councel of Constantinople in Trullo did set downe the same Canon of the scriptures which both the old Church had our church doth hold commandeth Ne aliqui praeterea legantur in auctoritateÌ„ recipiaÌ„tur That none besides be read receiued into authority I omit many seueral contradictions in al or most of the books which we reiect they allow wherby they may be conuinced not to be written by the spirit of God which is alwaies one the same Sée the 4. Esdras 10.20 2. Maccab. 2.4 1. Mac. 1.6 8. touching Antiochus yea we wil confesse with Bellarmin Bellar. de ver Dei li. 1. cap. â— That the scriptures may be proued to be the Word of God by the constant perpetual truth of the Prophecies By the wonderful harmony consent of the holy writers of the Scriptures By the Spirit of God which is a principall witnes vnto vs By the scripture it selfe 2. Tim. 3. Lastly by the many great miracles wrought by the Prophets Apostles which do testifie for the truth thereof To the which touchstone if the Scriptures whith wee reiect were brought to the triall they would easily bee conuinced to bee but drosse and vnworthy to stand in the rankes of those that are Canonicall But how doe you knowe which are the Scriptures and in them which be Canonicall which be Apocrypha Papist I knowe by the testimonie of the Church which be the Scriptures and in them
which be Canonicall and which be Apocrypha Protestant 8 How do you know which is the Church And by what meanes may it be knowen that the Church hath authoritie to determine which be Scriptures and which of them be Canonicall and which be Apocrypha Papist There be many notes and markes reckoned vp by the learned of our side by which the Church may be knowen But we insist chiefly vpon these Antiquitie Vnitie Vniuersality Succession and the power of Miracles And for the authority of the Church it is prooued by the Scriptures Protestant 9 This answere is common to all Heretikes for they alleage somtimes the a Author ope Imper. in Mat. Ho. 48. Church sometime b Iren. adu Haere lib. 3. cap. 2. Traditions sometime c Aug. coÌ„tr Maxim Ariâ— episc li. 1. Councels sometime d De Bapt. c. 6. li. 3. Fathers sometime e In Ioh. ca 2. tract 13 Miracles sometime f De vnit eccle c. 16. Visions sometime g Epist 65. ad gener Succession of Bishops yea h Act. 19.27 Demetrius pretended Vniuersalitie And the i Act. 17 18 19. Philosophers Epicures and Stoickes Antiquity And k Vinc. Lir. ca. 6 ca. 4. Vincentius Lirinensis disproueth Vniuersalitie by the example of the Arrians and Antiquity by the example of the Donatists And for their l In Chron. Suput Rom. prat Sigon de Regn. Ital li. â— Vnitie let that appeare in the seuerall oppositions of their Popes one condemning the decrées of another and decréeing one contrary to another And therefore this is no sufficieÌ„t reason for a man to ground his faith and Religion if we beléeue the m StapletoÌ„ Fortresse Hart. ag Ra. pag. 118. Papists in the like cause for it is a common obiection by them that because Heretikes alleage the Scripture therefore they are no suffieient rule Moreouer this answere passeth the limits of the proposition for it presupposeth the authoritie of the Church to be prooued by the Scriptures and the Scriptures to be prooued by the authority of the Church which is Ignotum per ignotius Idem per idem A proofe of a thing vnknowen by a thing lesse knowen and so no proofe at all Therefore to procéede to the next part of the diuision what doe you vnderstand by Traditions Papist I vnderstand Apostilicall doctrine commonly called vnwritten verities and as D.B. P. in his booke against M. Perkins diuides them Some are Diuine some Apostolicall and some Ecclesiasticall all which according to the Councel of Trent are to be receiued with equall reuerence Conc. Trid. Sess 4. and religious affection as we do the Scriptures Protestant 10 How doe you proue Traditions or vnwritten verities to bee Apostolicall doctrine and that they be Diuine Apostolicall and Ecclesiasticall and that they are to bee receiued with equall reuerence and religious affection as we doe the Scriptures Papist 2. Thess 2 15. I proue it by the Scriptures interpreted by the Church Saint Paul saith Hold the Trations which yee haue learned whether it bee by word Conc. Trid. â—ess 4. or by Epistle which by the Churches exposition proueth vnwritten verities to be receiued with equall authoritie to the Scriptures and to explane the same D.B.P. aforesayd affirmeth that Diuine Traditions come from our Sauiour Christ Apostolicall Traditions from the Apostles And the Decrees of the Church hee tearmeth Ecclesiasticall Traditions which are likewise of equall authoritie with the Scriptures Protestant 11 This is a common fault with you to vse this point of Sophistrie called by the Logicians Petitio principij for you wil stil take it for graunted that you are the Church though you neuer prooue it And this is a necessary consequence That if the trueth be doubted of the church must néedes bee much more doubted of because the Church is the number of men professing the trueth And how can the professors of the trueth be seuered from others so long as the trueth by which they should bee knowen is in question Therefore the supposing your selues to be the church when your faith Religion should be tried is fond vain But if S. Paul in that place by Deliuered Tradition meane nothing but the doctrine deliuered to them by word of mouth yet comprised in Scripture too then must you graunt that you are deceiued to thinke that vnwritten Traditions are approued by S. Pauls Traditions Now what the things were which S. Paul deliuered by word to the Thessalonians is shewed in the 17 of the Acts saying Now as they passed thorow Amphipolis and Apolonia they came to Thessalonica where was a Synagogue of the Iewes and Paul as his maner was entred in vnto them and thrée Sabbath dayes hee discoursed vnto them out of the Scriptures opening and alleaging That Christ must haue suffered and risen againe c. In which wordes it is opened both what Paul deliuered to the Thessalonians by word and from whence From whence Out of the Scriptures What That it behooued Christ to suffer and rise againe Besides Saint Paul witnesseth both to small and great that hee said no other thing than that which the Prophets and Moyses did say should come Act. 26 22 The Traditions therefore that Paul doth exhort the Thessalonians to hold is the Tradition of the Gospel as Saint Ambrose writing vpon the same place calleth it very well which the reason also doth prooue that Saint Ambrose noteth that Paul doth there gather saying God hath raised you to saluation by our Gospel therefore stand ye fast and holde the Traditions which ye haue learned whether it be by word or by Epistle Now I hope there is none so impudent to denie that the Gospel is written But here another difficultie incounters vs If it were granted by the Churches interpretation that there were doctrines or Traditions Diuine Apostolicall or Ecclesiasticall deliuered by word of mouth vpon what sure grounds might wee be assured which be the Traditions that were so deliuered by Christ his Apostles or the Church Papist The ancient Fathers chiefe Papists doe plainely teach that many points of doctrine wherein you varie from vs as halowing the Font the blessing of the oyle the anointing the Baptized Exorcismes Fastes Festiuities prayer for the dead prayer to Saints worshipping of Images the oblation of the Sacrifice their Annealing their Primacie of Rome their fiue pretended Sacraments the merit of workes their satisfactions the numbring their sinnes to the Priest their Real presence their halfe CommunioÌ„ c. See the preface for Priests and See Master Middletons booke called Papisto-Mastix Sect. 5. almost all these things which you defend against vs are proued by the Fathers to be deliuered by Tradition Protestant 12 This sheweth euidently that you are guilty of the same fault that the Pharises were Mark 7.9 by Christs owne reproofe saying You cast aside the commaundements of God to maintaine your owne Traditions Mat 15.9 teaching for doctrine
Christ hauing neuer béene prohibited as vnlawfull vntill the Councell of Constance which was 1400. yéeres after Christ But Controuersies may be ended and heresies abolished either by conuincing those out of the Scriptures that maintaine them as diuers heretikes were before either Pope or Councell were thought of Or by the authoritie of the Magistrate commanding for trueth and inioining their silence and obedience â— Chro. 14. â— 3 4 5. according to the examples of Asa the King of Iudah who commanded his people to doe according to the Law â— Chro. 29. c. And Ezechiah who restored the worship of God and diuers other Kings in the old Testament 2. Chro. 17 ver 3 4 5 8. ca. 19 ver 4 8 9 10 11 c 33. v. 11 12 13 15. câ— 34. v. 3 4 7 29.30 3â— 32 33. câ— 35. v. 1 2 3 4.5 6. as Iehoshaphat Manasses Iosiah and others yea Salomon did dedicate the Temple in his owne person and * 1. King 8. ca. 2. v. 3 cast out Abiathar from being Priest vnto the Lord and placed Zadok in his roume And Saint Austine in many places sheweth Kings are charged with Gods Law in respect of commanding it to others In the times of the Prophets saith he All the Kings which in the people of God did not forbid and ouerthrowe those things Aug. Epi. 5 which were brought in against the commandements of God are blamed and they that did prohibit and subuert such things are praised aboue the rest And for that part of the obiection that wee leaue euery man to his priuate exposition which though therein wee are wrongfully charged by our aduersaries yet the trueth is we challenge not to our selues as the Papists do the true interpretation of the Scriptures as if they were appropriated vnto vs But we submit our selues and our interpretations whatsoeuer according to the Generall and receiued doctrine of the Fathers in that point to be compared and tried by the Scriptures Or to auoide your cauelling if you will to the Church which are men speaking by the Scriptures Neither is this part of the obiection of so great weight or consequence as it may séeme at the first blush For most of the differences betwéene vs and the Papists are not touching the sense of the Scripture séeing it is confessed by learned Papists as I haue prooued in the preface of this booke that most of the doctrines wherein they vary from vs are grounded on Tradition And all men of reason know that where ther is no Text there néedes no Interpreter All the danger therefore lieth in the last part of the obiection when mens corrupt affections may take those things for trueth which are not and reiect those which are a thing impossible to bee preuented since euery man vnderstands according to the capacitie and conceite whereof himselfe is And herein likewise is the doctrine of Christ verefied as Saint Paul sayth 2. Cor. 4.3 If our Gospell bee hidde it is hidde to them that are lost For no man can come vnto mee sayth Christ except the Father which haue sent me drawe him Iohn 6.44 1. Cor. 3.4 6 Yea Paul may plant and Apollo may water but God must giue the increase For though the Sunne bée of most excellent brightnesse yet none can sée it but those which haue eyes euen so is it of the Scriptures which as Saint Peter sayth They that are vnlearned and vnstable 2. Pet. 3.16 doe peruert to their own damnation But shal we leaue the Triall of the Scriptures to which all the Fathers referre vs either because many peruert them or for that the diuel alleaged them or for that it is common to all Heretikes to make challenge and boast of them No for all Heretikes haue béen by the Scriptures rightly vnderstood confuted and confounded yea euen the deuill himselfe Mat. 3.7 as Christs owne example teacheth vs was conuicted by the same weapon wherewith hee thought to haue vanquished our Sauiour But to make this plaine by example what Lawyer will offer to defend a badde cause but hee will bring Lawe for his purpose and shall this debarre or preiudice the other that pleades against him That hée shall not by Lawe conuince the Errours and Sophistries or Quirkes and Quiddities which are brought against him Nay rather anie man of iudgement hauing heard both parties will readily distinguish and say The one makes a a shewe of Lawe but the other hath Lawe indeede And euen thus it rests in those controuersies that are betweene vs and the Papists touching the Sense of the Scripture onely and not for those differences which the maintaine by Tradition Petr. â— Soto adu Brent Canisi in catechi ca. 5. Lindan in pan li. 4. ca. 100. Peresius par 3. Rhe. Test Gal. 2. sect 4 which by the iudgement of their owne men as I haue already shewed are the greater number And albeit the Rhemists would insinuate That the controuersies betweene vs are whether the Iudge or the Euidence bee of greater authority yet that shift will not serue them for all men of iudgement knowe that that is not the question betwéene vs. But the difference is whether the Iudge or the Law bee of greater authoritie where euery wise man will graunt the Lawe to be supreame whereunto the Iudge is to obey and according to which to giue his sentence or else by the Lawe his erronious iudgement is to be reuersed Neither is there other Iudiciall authority in the Church than in the common wealth which is to determine controuersies according to the Lawe and the true meaning thereof And if there be question of the Sense of the Law The Lawmakers minde is to be discussed by his wordes and the circumstances and occasions of making the Lawe And euen so the meaning of the Scripture is to be taken onely out of the Scripture as Clemens saith â—iâ— 37. ca. â—elatum You ought not to seeke a strange and forraine sense without the Scriptures that you may confirme it by any means by the Scriptures But sense of trueth you must take out of the Scriptures themselues Saint Augustine * Confess Aug. praef ad lecto whose doctrine your selues doe acknowledge to be grounded on the lawes the maners the iudgements of all the Catholike Church whom you call a witnesse of the sincere trueth and Catholike Religion such a witnesse as no exception can be made against who assureth you as you say not onely of his owne but also of the common the constant faith and confession of the ancient Fathers and the Apostolike Church This Augustine hath written foure bookes of Christian doctrine wherein he purposely intreateth howe men should vnderstand the Scripture and expound it The summe of all his Treatise doeth aime at this marke That a Aug. de doct Christ li. 1. ca. 2. the meaning of the Scripture must bee learned out of the Scripture by the consideration of things
A BRIEFE VIEWE of the weake Grounds of Popery As it was propounded to D. NORRICE Priest by T.V. Gent and returned without answere AT LONDN Imprinted by Humfrey Lownes for Samuel Macham and Mathew Cooke and are to be sold in Pauls Church-yard at the signe of the Tigers head 1606. To my dearest Cousins A. B. C. D. MY dearest Cousins with what zeale and feruencie both in my prayers and other indeuours I haue euer desired wee might be of one mind heart God Act. 6. and mine owne conscience can best testifie and your selues may partly witnes with me For as touching the means to this our atonement namely conference with the learned of ech others side and reading their bookes you know well I for my part haue neuer refused it but euermore gladly imbraced and diligently sought after it that so if truth wherof great vaunts were made had been found on your side my heart first then my hand might readily haue subscribed thereto But when I consider the doctrine of your Rhemists Tit. 3. Sect. and the answerable practise of their disciples forbidding you not onely to reade our bookes but to hold conuersation much more to haue conference with vs who must be Heretikes because they tearme vs so yea when I see they blush not to affirme That we are not to be heard â—fâ—r 3. â—ect 2. no not though we speake the trueth I almost despaire of your conuersion seeing the means are prohibited Now how much meeter it were in a case of such consequence being no lesse than the eternal safegard of your soules to leaue them with their errors and to hearken rather and conforme your faith to the doctrine of Christ and his Apostles I referre it to any seeing iudgement For the vniuersall consent of all the ancient Fathers alloweth the Scriptures for the onely Rule of faith as conteining in them all doctrine necessary to saluation And albeit I haue sufficiently among others cleared that question in this smal Treatise following yet will I somewhat inlarge the proofe of it in this place to the end you may better knowe That though you send vs for instruction to to the Fathers yet they send vs backe again to the Scriptures as the onely and sufficient Rule to direct vs. And in handling this point I will not much insist vpon diuine authority since I know you relye chiefly if not wholly on the Fathers Onely I will vrge these few testimonies of Scripture which ought to preuaile more with euery true Christian than all the Fathers how learned soeuer First our Sauiour willeth vs to search the Scriptures for that in them we thinke to haue eternall life Io. 5.39 Mark 1224. And he taxeth the Pharises of error because they were ignorant of the Scriptures 2. Tim. 3.15 16 17. S. Paul likewise affirmeth that they are able to make vs wise vnto saluation that the man of God may be perfite instructed to euery good worke And if this perswade you not I haue no hope that any Father can for as Christ saith Luk. 16.29 30 31. They haue Moyses and the Prophets if they will not heare them neither will they beleeue if one rose from the dead Now as to the Fathers though your side pretend so much to reuerence them yet in this question they wholly reiect them and that indeede not without cause seeing their authority in this one point might proue the downefall of your whole Religion it being confessed by some great Champions on your side That many and most of the doctrines wherin you varie from vs are grounded on Traditions and not on the Scriptures as any that will take the paines to reade may see in Peter Soto against Brentius in the fift chapter of Canisius Catechisme in the * In fine fabulae 6. 5 booke of Lyndans Panoply yea * Scripto suâ— aedito tempore Trid. Concil Andradius saith That the greatest part of Catholike Religion is left vnto Traditions of the Church not written â—anopl li. 1. â— 22. demeÌ„â—ssimae insaâ—iae And the said Lyndan saith It is most extreme madnes to think that the whole entire Body of Euangelicall doctrine is to be fetched out of the Apostolike letters written with inke and out of that little booke of the new Testament And therefore so much the more are your leaders seducers to be taxed who perswade their folowers that the greatest differeÌ„ce between them and vs is touching the Sense of the Scripture wheras euery man of common sense wil easily iudge that where there is no Text there needs no Interpreter But let vs briefly see what opinioÌ„ the Fathers were of in this coÌ„trouersie betweene vs and how they haue vnderstood that Scripture which D. B. P. calles the Protestants Achilles which hee onely barkes at without further hurt â— B. booke â—gainst M â—erkins calâ—ed the 1. â—im 3. the â—rot Achilâ—es Hom. 9. Chrysostome vpon the same Text sayth If any thing be needefull for vs to learne or to be ignorant of there meaning in the Scriptures shal we learne it If to reproue falsehood from thence shal we draw it if any thing lacke to be corrected or rebuked which must be had vnto exhortation vnto comfort there also doe we learne it Likewise Ho. 8. vpon the 15. verse he saith The scriptures do teach both what things are to be done what not to be done Theodoret vpoÌ„ the same place saith The scripture is inspired of God Therfore he teacheth the kinds of vtilitie It is profitable to teach for whatsoeuer we know not we learne out of it To reproue It reproueth our wicked life To correct for it exhorteth that they which haue gone astray returne to the right way To instruct in righteousnesse for it teacheth vs the kinds of vertue that the man of God may bee perfit furnished to all good workes All these things doe attribute and ascribe perfection to the God of all Primasius saith Out of the scriptures he that is ignorant is taught Hee that is insolent is reprooued He that erreth is corrected He that can keep no measure is instructed to Iustice to euery good worke not vnto one Oecumenius sayth after he hath rehearsed the particular vtilities to teach all true opinions and good works to reprooue errors vice he concludeth that the man of God may be not onely partaker after a vulgar maner of euery goodworke but perfect and compleate by the doctrine of the scriptures Not to some kind of good worke and to some not But to all and euery good worke saith Theophilact Athanasius saith Atha contr gent. Chrys opeâ— imperf in Mat. Ho. 41. Aug. in Iohâ— Tract 44. The holy scriptures inspired from heauen are sufficient for all instruction of trueth Chrysostome saith whatsoeuer is requisite for saluation all that is fully laid downe in the Scripture S. Augustine sayth There were chosen to be written such things as seemed to the holy Ghost sufficient for
And Saint Iohn witnesseth that our Sauiour Christ saith Iohn 6.53 Except yee eate the flesh of the sonne of man and drinke his blood you haue no life in you and many other testimonies which I omit It wil conuince the Councell of Nice of error in decréeing for the worship of Images contrary to the second commandement But what shall I néede to descend to particularities it will conuince your late Councell of Trent and all other Councels in all those points of doctrine wherein you varie from vs if any Papist dare vndertake to bring the controuersies betwéene vs to that triall And surely since they will seeme to bring Scriptures to prooue the authoritie of the church and that the church cannot erre I sée no reason why they should refuse to make them iudge of all differences betwéene vs. But I maruell they vrge these places of Scripture to prooue that the church representatiue cannot erre séeing they are not able to shew that any one ancient Father hath so vnderstood them or that the whole church is represented in a generall Councell Name one Father that is ancient and not counterfeit for your credit sake that hath interpreted these places of Scripture or any other in that case as you doe If you cannot the world may iustly holde you for wranglers and abusers both of Scriptures and Fathers But let vs a little examine the force of those Scriptures which if they were all granted make nothing against vs if they bee rightly vnderstood The first is When two or thrée are gathered together c. This place is as pregnant for two or thrée faithfull men assembled in Christs name as to a Nationall or a Prouinciall Councell Neither doeth it giue any greater priuiledge to a Generall Councell than it doeth vnto them Bellar. li. 1. de Conc. ca. 12. though it bee alleaged by Bellarmine as the ground for the authorising of Councels All which promise notwithstanding your selues grant That both Nationall and Prouinciall Councels may erre The next place is the sixtéenth of Iohn where the holy Ghost is promised to the Apostles to leade them into all trueth which spirit of trueth is promised to the church and to euery particular member thereof for whome our Sauiour Christ prayeth saying Sanctifie them in thy trueth thy worde is trueth Ioh. 17.17.19 20. And againe I pray not for these alone but for them also that shall beleeue in mee through their worde But what maketh this for generall Councels more then the whole church or euery faithfull member thereof For although this prooueth that the holy Ghost shall euer remayne with the church and with euery true member of the same yet must wee not hereof conclude though it bee as pregnant for euery faithfull particular man as for the whole That either euery member of Christ or euerie Pastor that is the Apostles successour cannot erre Neither is this to be restrained to generall Councels or to the Pope neither must wee thinke that any visible Church may challenge all priuiledges that the Apostles had as necessary to the conuersion of the world Rhem. Test Iohn 16. But your Rhemists will tell you that to teach all trueth and to preserue in trueth and from error the holy Ghost is promised and performed onely to the Church and the choice gouernour and generall Councels Vpon which the Papists conclude that if the Church cannot erre the gouernours of the church cannot erre Is not this substantiall reasoning The whole church cannot erre Ergo the Pastors and preachers cannot erre Deale plainely and directly Do you hereby conclude that all Pastors cannot erre or that no Pastor can erre For to say that no Pastor can erre were apparant madnesse and to say that all Pastors cannot erre stands you in no stead neither is this a good argument The whole Church cannot erre that is all and euery faithfull cannot erre Ergo all Pastors cannot erre This is no kind of consequent for some of the faithfull may be directed to the trueth and they no Pastors nor preachers and many preachers may be preserued from error and they no Bishops and many Bishops may kept in the faith and they not assembled And a great number of those that be assembled may be righty affected and yet not the most part of them And the greater side may be well disposed and yet not the Bishop of Rome without whose confirmation you hold no Councell lawfull And therefore this argument is very childish The whole Church cannot erre Ergo Generall Councels cannot erre and specially the Pope of whom wee shall speake more particularly hereafter neither hath the holy Ghost filled with the vnmeasurable abundance of grace any but Christ Iohn 3.34 Iohn 1.16 for God giueth not the spirit by measure to him of whose fulnesse wee all receiue And it may well bee gathered from the Scriptures 2. Cor. 10.13 Eph. 4.7 that though the holy Ghost be giuen to the Elect yet hee hath giuen it by measure as I may say with Saint Paul not to this end that they may not erre but that they may not erre to death For what thing soeuer is receiued of another it is receiued according to the capacitie of that which receiueth it The last is the 1. Tim. 3.15 The Church is the pillar and ground of trueth therefore it cannot erre If this argument were granted would it follow hereupon that general Councels could not erre but this is sufficiently refuted before And you knowe that Peter was a pillar of trueth and yet hee erred and was reprooued by Saint Paul Gal. 2. yea your Diuines of Paris Articuli Parisienses but lately resolued that Peter erred in faith when Paul reprooued him And the very drift and scope of the place sheweth That Timothie is not sent by Saint Paul to the church to learne his duety but to the Scripture These things write I vnto thée sayth hee hoping to come shortly but if I tarie long that thou mayest knowe how thou oughtest to behaue thy selfe in the house of God which is the church of the liuing GOD the pillar and ground of trueth This church then which Timothie was conuersant in is the church of Ephesus called by S Paul The pillar and ground of trueth But this church of Ephesus hath condemned the doctrine of the Popes supremacie Conc. Flor. Sess vlt. Chalcocondylas de Reb. Turc lib. 6. to which other churches of the East haue likewise condescended Therefore if that be true still which the Church teacheth because S. Paul calleth it the pillar and ground of trueth then the doctrine of the Popes supremacie is wicked and Papistrie is heresie yea euen this church notwithstanding it was called the pillar and ground of trueth is now left desolate to Mahomets wicked impietie But let vs sée by some few testimonies of the Fathers how they haue expounded this place and whether they haue applied it to generall Councels as the Papists do and not
Constant Sess 37 and an Heretike swaruing from the faith and a wilfull notorious manifest subuerter of the Article of our faith One holy Catholike Church Nowe can there bee any doubt that these Popes were neuer comprised in that prayer which Christ made for Peter Or that hel gates haue not preuailed against them When Pope Marcellinus did offer sacrifice to idols as appeares in the Synuessan Councel Pope Liberius subscribed to the Arrians as is testified by S. Hier. confessed by Nicholaus Cusanus and Alfons de Castro both Papists great schoolmen Pope Syluester the 2. was a Necromancer a CoÌ„iurer as Stella Platina Petrus PraemoÌ„strateÌ„sis Nauclerus Antonius do witnes And Pope Anastatius was a NestoriaÌ„ Heretike Li 1. de Haerca 4 as is witnessed by Alfons de Castro And many such instances might be prooued out of their owne stories Thus you sée in what sense soeuer the Papists vnderstand the Church it is proued That it may erre Wherefore are you not singular men to abuse both the scriptures Councels Fathers yea your silly seduced followers with such coÌ„clusions Are these good consequents at Rhemes Peter was set ouer the Church or made Pastor of the Lords flocke Ergo none but Peter Euen so may you reason with much more warrant from the scriptures to proue the supremacie to be in Paul For he saith 1 Tim 1. â—â— The glorious Gospel of the blessed God which is committed to me Ergo to none but Paul Yea he saith 2 Cor 11 26 The care of all Churches were coÌ„mitted to him Ergo to none but him This had béen a pregnaÌ„t place for the Papists if it had béen spoken of Peter according to such inferences as they make And to vrge you a little further It is your maner in the Rhemes Test to say often All the Fathers say this and this and I knowe you bragge much of them That you can prooue all the doctrine you hold by them I pray produce their ioint consent to prooue That all controuersies are to be determined by the Pope Or that he cannot erre Or that he must summon Councels Or that they are of no authority vnles they be confirmed by the Pope All this is Catholike doctrine with the Papists and yet I thinke they cannot name any one Father that is ancient and not counterfeit to confirme thus much or to auowe any of these points Is it not strange therefore that you should reiect the Scripture which is the onely rule of faith to build your Religion on such vncertainties as in this small Tract hath béen declared and shewed This Gerson a learned Papist sawe and therefore hée sayth Gers primâ—l part de exa doctrin considerat 5. That there is more credit to be giuen to one man learned in the Scriptures and hauing them of his side than either to the Popes sentence or to the decrees of a generall Councel This made Cardinal Caietane say In praef coÌ„ment in libr. Moyse That God hath not tied the exposition of the Scriptures vnto the senses of the Fathers And that if he fall vpon a newe sense agreeable to the Texte though it goe against the streame of the Fathers he doth aduise the reader not to mislike it Andrad defensi fidei Trid. li. 2. This made Andradius the defender of the Tridentine Councel to defend Caietan against Canus saying That experience forceth vs to confesse vnlesse we will bee vnthankfull to most excellent wits that very many things in Moyses and the Prophets are in this our age expounded more exactly through the diligence of learned men than euer they were before And concludeth that the holy Ghost the onely and faithfull interpreter of the Scriptures would haue many things to be knowen to vs which our ancestors knew not And hath wrought by meanes vnknowen to vs knowen to him that the Fathers noted good and godly mysteries out of very many places of the Scripture whereof the right and naturall sense hath beene found out by the posteritie Thus you sée that if wee bee deceiued Scriptures Popes Councels Fathers and learned and chiefe Papists haue deceiued vs who haue taught the same trueth that wee defend Papist Well What colours soeuer you bring of Scriptures Fathers Councels Popes and learned men of our owne side yet this is an vndoubted position that vnlesse you maintaine that the Church cannot erre and that thereby you vnderstand the definitiue sentence of the Pope you bereaue your selues of all meanes to settle your selues in the vnity of faith neither haue you any meanes to end controuersies For leauing euery man to his owne priuate exposition whiles one expoundeth the Scriptures one way and another another way This sense is plaine in the exposition of the one That sense is contradicted by the opinion of the other there can neuer be end of these differences And therefore there must bee some Tribunall on earth where trueth may bee found at all times and of all men that be willing to seeke for it Otherwise there should bee no stay for Religion nor end of contention euery man pretending his faith to bee trueth and no man hauing authoritie to decide which is truth which were most absurd And therfore since you must of necessitie yeeld to haue a Iudge for auoiding so great inconueniences who can bee fitter than the Pope and the Church Protestant This is Redire ad vomitum and for the auoiding of a lesse fault to fall into a greater Since it is prooued in euery sense where you haue taken the Church That it may erre And therefore how much better were it that there should be continuall disagréement about matters of Religion than to maintaine false doctrine Saint Iude saith It was needefull for me to write vnto you Iude ver 3. to exhort you that you should earnestly contend for the faith which was once giuen vnto the Saints 1. Cor. 11.19 And Saint Paul saith There must bee Sectes amongst you that they that bee perfect may bee knowen For as wee must respect Vnitie so wee must take héede that it bee Secundum Iesum Christum According to Iesus Christ An vnitie in veritie For better a diuersitie in vnitie than an vnitie in Poperie And therefore wee are commaunded 1 Ioh. 4. 1 Thess 5. to trie the spirits whether they be of God Trie all things and holde fast that which is good Ephes 5. Bee not vnwise but vnderstand what the will of the Lord is Bee renewed in your minde Rom. 12. that you may discerne what the good and acceptable and perfect will of GOD is Phi. 1.9 This I pray that your loue may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all iudgement that you may discerne the things that are best 1. Cor. 2. Hee that is Spirituall discerneth all things These exhortations were not giuen by the Spirit of God in vaine which of necessitie must follow if you debarre all Christians other
and wordes in it That b Ca. 35. the ende whereto c Ca. 37. the matter whereof it is all written bee marked in generall d Ca. 35. 40. and all be vnderstood according to that end and matter e Li. 2. ca. 8 that all bee read ouer and ouer f Ca. 9. and those things chiefly noted which are set downe plainely both precepts of life and rules of beleefe because that all things which concerne beliefe and life are plainely written in it That obscure and darke speaches be lightened and opened by the plaine and manifest that to remoue the doubt of vncertaine sentences the cleare certain be followed that g Ca. 11. recourse be had vnto the Greeke and Hebrew copies to cleare out of the fountains if the translation be muddy that h Li. 3. ca. 2 3. doubtfull places bee expounded by the rule of faith which we are taught out of the plainer places of the Scripture that i Ca. 1. all the circuÌ„stances of the text be weighed what goeth before what coÌ„meth after the maner how k Ca. 10. the cause why l Ca. 17. the men to whom m Ca. 18. the time when euery thing is said to be short that n Ca. 27. we seeke to know stil the will meaning of the Author by whoÌ„ the holy Ghost hath spokeÌ„ if we find it not yet giue such a sense as agreeth with the right faith approued by some othe place of scripture o C. 18. If a sense be giueÌ„ the vncertainty wherof cannot be discussed by certain sure testimonies of scripture it might be proued by reason but this custom is dangerous the safer way far is to walke by the scripture the which being shadowed with darke and borrowed words when we mind to search let either that come out of it which hath no doubt coÌ„trouersie or if it haue doubt let it be determined by the same scripture through witnesses to be fouÌ„d vsed thence whersoeuer that so to conclude p Li. 4. ca. 3 all places of the scriptures be expounded by the Scriptures the which are canonical as being the Canon that is to say the rule of godlines faith All which rules we confidently imbrace And we constantly affirme that neither he nor any other auncient Father did euer attribute the expounding of the Scripture for the true sense therof to any Pope or bishop whatsoeuer And although D. Stapl. except against these Rules of S. Austin which is common to all Papists by special priuiledge when the Fathers make against them as I haue already partly proued and shal appeare to any that for a clearer manifestatioÌ„ therof wil take a view of their Index expurgator yet doth S. Austin iustifie himself De doctr Christia li 1 a Prolo saying If they who know these precepts cannot see the things which are obscure darke in the scriptures of God the fault is in themselues not in the precepts as if I should point with my finger at a starre which they would gladly see and their eye-sight were so weake that although they could see my finger yet could they not see the starre at which I point Let them saith he cease to blame mee and let them pray to God that hee will giue them eye-sight And to the ende I may giue some proofe of euery thing I affirme and to giue a taste of the vile practise of the Papists It shall not be amisse to set downe their owne words namely the iudgement of the Vniuersitie of Doway approued by the Censors of the Councel of Trent concerning the booke of Bertram according to the Decree of the Councel the Title Vt liber Bertram c. How the booke of Bertram Index expurg 8. pag. â—1 Priest of the Bodie and Blood of our Lord being amended may beÌ„ tolerated Although wee make no great account of this booke therfore we would not greatly care if either it were no where extant or vtterly lost yet seeing it hath been already ofteÌ„times reprinted hath been read of most men and being prohibited by name hath been made knowen to all men seeing also the heretikes do know of the prohibition thereof by diuers Catalogues and that he was a Catholike Priest and a Monke of the Abbey of Corbey and was welbeloued and reuerenced not so much of Carolus Magnus as of Carolus Caluus and doth helpe the story of that age And seeing that in other ancient Catholike writers wee beare very many errors and extenuate them excuse them and very often times by deuising some pretie shift we denie them Excogitato Commento and do faine some commodious sense vnto them when they are opposed aginst vs in disputation or in conflicts with the aduersaries wee do not see why Bertram doeth not deserue the same equity and diligent Recognition lest the Heretikes should Iangle against vs that wee burne vp and prohibite Antiquitie which maketh for them and therfore it is no maruel that so few things seeme to make for them when wee Catholikes do so vnreuerently hisse out and destroy antiquitie which but in shewe dissenteth from vs. Moreouer we feare least this booke not onely by Heretikes but also by vnruly Catholikes by meanes of the prohibition thereof may be read more greedily alleaged more odiously and doe more hurt being inhibited than if it were permitted And vpon these considerations they take order and shew how this booke at the next printing shall be falsified by adding putting out changing of the Wordes and Sentences and by peruerting the whole scope and meaning of the Author The last part of the obiection is that there must bee some Tribunall on earth to iudge which is trueth And in this Question they réele sometime to the Church and sometime to the Pope who they will haue to bee Iudge of trueth and that the Church which sometime they intitle to the Pope and sometime to Generall Councels are to be iudge of the Scriptures To this I answere That absolute Iudge of trueth can no man be for God is truth of God I trust no man may be Iudge The Sonne of God saith of himselfe Iohn 14. 1. Iohn 5. I am truth and S. Iohn testifieth The spirit is truth Therefore ye can be no Iudges of trueth vnles you will be Iudges of God And the Father hath committed all iudgement to the Sonne and my iudgment Iohn 5. 8. saith Christ is Iust Christ saith My sheep heare my voice They be no iudges of his voice which is the Scriptures A Iudge of the Law is no obseruer of the Law as S. Iames insinuateth since the whole Church is bound to obey the Law of God Iam. ca. 4. they be no iudges of the law S. Austin saith It is inferiour to vs Aug. in Psa Idem de vera religio ca. 31. whatsoeuer we be Iudges of And again The eternall Law of God therefore it is lawful
for cleane hearts to know it is not lawfull for them to iudge Idem coÌ„fes li. 13. ca. 23. And againe Wee must not iudge of so high authoritie neither of the booke which is thine because we submit our vnderstanding to it Contr Crescon li. 2 c. 31 And lastly To the Canons of the scripture pertaine certaine books of the Prophets and Apostles the which in any case we may not dare to iudge And this is the reason There may be no iudge of Trueth where no daÌ„ger of Error is And S. Austin saith Idem epist 19. ad Hier. It is wickednes to make a doubt speaking of the scriptures whether there be any error in theÌ„ or not Therfore there may be no iudges of them but the whole Church must be subiect to theÌ„ with all humility beleeue them And yet will the Papists assume vnto themselues to be Iudges of the scriptures appoint which shall be Canonical which shal be Apocrypha A Iudge we grant must haue two things before he be competent namely skill to discerne that he misse not the truth power to command that his iudgement may take place Now if he want either of these he is no fit Iudge And that the Pope hath neither of these thus I proue For the first I haue proued he may erre therfore no man is bound to his iudgment further thaÌ„ it is agréeable to the truth And to adde one proofe more the Councel of Basil saith This priuiledge Conc. Basil epist Syno 8 not to erre hath not been granted by a common or perpetual law to any not to the Angels for many of them fell not to our first parents for they were deceiued not vnto the chiefe Bishops for many of them are read to haue fallen into error and Heresie And as it is absurd to referre the iudgement to one man so is it also to intitle the church of Rome to be The Catholike Church since their chiefe Schoolemen and lights of the Papists Petr. a Soto contr coÌ„fess Wittenburg ca. de CoÌ„cil AlfoÌ„s à Castro aduer Haer. li. 1. c. 8. CoÌ„f. Petric cap. 24. contr BreÌ„t li. 2. Disput adu Luther tom 6. deauthoritat potest vniuers eccles ca. 5. Ibid. ca. 1. Sotus Alfonsus Hosius and Verratus doe witnesse that any particular Church may erre But that the Church of Rome is a particular Church the same Verratus affirmeth nor can the rest deme it And as he may erre so hath he no power to command princes or others but onely to propose the commandements of God vnto them as euery Bishop must and may by vertue of his vocation Further authority by violence to compell or by corporall and external means to punish no Prelate nor Pope hath by the Lawe of GOD since that belongeth to the Sworde which the Prince and not the Pope beareth Rom. 13. 1. Pet. 2. as Saint Paul witnesseth and also Peter from whose right the Pope makes claime to this superioritie But me thinkes I still heare them obiect that all this while wee appoint not who shall bee Iudges or at least Discerners of Truth And to that we answer Let him that maketh the claime vndertake the proofe for we find no place nor person to whom the Sonne of God hath referred vs for the right vnderstanding of his will but onely to himselfe and the Scriptures And that you may knowe this is not our priuate opinion a slander which you often obiect learne what Optatus S. Aug. hath set downe in this case Christ saith Optat. hath dealt with vs as an earthly father is wont with his children Lib. 5. coni Permenia Donat. who fearing lest they should fall out after his decease doth set down his Will in writing vnder witnesses if there arise debate among the brethren they goe to the testament Hee whose worde must end our controuersie is Christ let his Will be sought in his TestameÌ„t Which reason of Optatus S. Aug. vrging against the Donatists as he doth often We are brethren saith he to them why doe we striue Aug. in Psal 21. exposi 2 Our Father died not intestate he made a Testament and so died Men doe striue about the goods of the dead till the Testament be brought foorth when that is brought they yeeld to haue it opened and read The Iudge doeth hearken the Councellors be silent the Crier bids peace all the people is attentiue that the words of the dead may be read and heard He lieth void of life and feeling in his graue and his words preuaile Christ doth sit in heauen is his Testament gainesayd Open it let vs reade we are brethren why doe we striue let our mindes bee pacified Our Father hath not left vs without a Testament He that made the Testament is liuing for euer He doth heare our words he doth know his owne word Let vs reade why doe wee striue Were not this a silly speach of S. Austin if Traditions were to be receiued with equall Reuerence to the Scriptures or that Councels or Popes had such absolute authoritie But it séemes S. Austin ascribed more to this Testament than to any Pope or Councel whatsoeuer And to conclude this point Optatus in the Question of the Catholikes with the Donatists whether one should be twice baptised Li. 5. contr â—ermen Doâ—at You saith he say it is lawfull Wee say it it not lawfull Betweene your it is lawfull and our it is not lawfull the peoples soules doe doubt and wauer Let none beleeue you nor vs we are all contentious men Iudges must be sought for if Christians they cannot be giuen of both sides for trueth is hindered by affections A Iudge without must be sought for If a Panime he cannot know the Christian mysteries If a Iew he is an enemie to ChristiaÌ„ baptisme No Iudgement therefore of this matter can be found in earth a Iudge in Heauen must bee sought for But why knocke wee at heauen when here we haue the Testament of Christ in the Gospel Belike Optatus and S. Austin were not so wise in those dayes as our Iesuites and Papists are now for they could easily haue put doubts and scruples touching the sense of the Scriptures and could skilfully haue inforced such obiections as these and in all doubts could easily haue assigned their Pope as an Absolute Iudge But it is euident by the iudgement of these two Reuerend Fathers that we can haue no fit Iudge on earth Ioh. 12. God must therefore iudge vs by his word To which all the Fathers doe submit themselues and their writings as is before prooued and alleaged Yea we are warranted by the Prophet Osea to iudge our Mother as it is in the vulgar Translation and to contend with her that she is not the spouse of Christ Hos 2. nor he her husband that she may take away her fornications and adulteries c. as it is more at large in the Text. Thus haue
euen by the learned Papists themselues and their Vniuersities yet doe they alleage them against vs in many of their bookes especially in the Rhemes Testament to giue countenance to Popish errors See pag. 23. 24. 25. 26. 27. 28. 29. 30. 31. 32. 33. 10 That the consent of the Fathers cannot be shewed nay scarce any ancient Father that all controuersies are to bee determined by the Pope or that hee cannot erre or that hee must summon Councels or that they are of no authoritie vnlesse they bee confirmed by the Pope And yet are these doctrines held Catholike by the Papists and reputed the chiefe pillars of Popery See pag. 75. 11 That al those places of Scripture which are brought by the Papists either to prooue the Popes prerogatiue or the authority of the Church or that the Church cannot erre are by the Fathers writing purposely vpon the same places expounded according to the Protestants sense giuen and contrary to the sense which the Papists giue So farre are the Papists from proouing the generall consent of the Fathers in expounding these Scriptures which they commonly obiect against vs as Thou art Peter and vpon this Rocke will I build my Church and the gates of hell shall not preuaile against it Or the promises of the holy Ghost to be sent to the Church to leade it into all trueth Or To thee will I giue the keyes of the kingdom of Heauen Or The Church is the pillar and ground of Trueth Or Tell the Church Or if hee heare not the Church let him be to thee as an heathen or as a Publicane Or whatsoeuer thou bindest in earth shall be bound in heauen Or any other place of Scripture to the sayd purposes to bee on their side as namely that those Texts should be meant of the Pope Generall Councell or the Church of Rome See pag. 66. 67. 68. 69. 70. 12 That Generall Councels haue erred haue beene contrary one to another haue been reiected by the Papists themselues and so are no sure Rule to build our faith on See pag. 48. 49. 50. 51. 52. 53. 54. 55. 13 That the Popes whom they would haue to be supreame Iudges in al Controuersies haue erred iudicially haue been heretikes as maintaining the heresie of the Monothelites subscribing to the Arrian heresie to the Nestorian heresie haue offered sacrifice to idoles haue been Necromancers and Coniurers See pag. 58. 59. 60. 61. 62. 14 That the Pope can be no competent Iudge and whereunto the Fathers referre vs. See pag. 93 c. LEt me request thee Courteous reader to take noâ—ice that the Texts of Scripture and testimonies of the Fathers cited by me in this Treatise should all haue been set downe in a different letter from the rest of the matter wherewith they are ranked accordingly as you see performed in the Preface and in the later halfe of the booke Now by meanes of my absence and want of direction giuen in this point it could not be discerned by the Printer howe farre the wordes of the Text and Testimonies so to bee distinguished might reach And therefore I cannot but free him from that blame as likewise 2. or 3. literal escapes only excepted from imputation of any the faults hereunder specified some of them being committed in my Copie and the rest through difficulty and darknes of the hand might easily be mistaken In the Text. Page 5. line 7. for allured reade allowed pag. 8. l. 17. Trations Traditions p. 11 l. 19. Priests proofe p. 29. l. â—6 addeth alleageth p. 29. l. 17. tehimony testimony p. 31. l. 2. for 25 15. p. 33. l. 7. fault fable p. 40. l. 9. châ—ice chiefe p. 72. l. 8. cannot which cannot p. 89. l. 1. sense the sense In the Margent Pag. 7. for De Bapt. c. 6. li. 1. reade De Bapt. cont Don. li. 3. pag. 7. prat reade pont pag. 8. 1. Thes 2. Thes pag. 12. 1. Pet. 2.18 1. Pet. 1.18 pag. 20. Aug. in Frut Aug. in Enar. pag. 14. de fulta de falsa pag. 35. li. 1. cap. 22. li 1. cap 23. pag. 36. Tim. Tit. pag. 52. Epist 16 7. Epist 167. pag. 59. against Pope Coelestine C. laudab de conuers Infidel is omitted
the ordainings of Formosus ought to be void And this * Pag 42. 7 Concil Rauen An. Do 898. Sigon de Reg. Itaâ— li. 6. Master Hart against Doctor Raynolds confesseth to be an error in faith And Iohn the ninth in the Councel of Rauenna condemned Stephen and his Councell and therein their new ordainings are forbidden and matched with new Baptizings Pope Coelestine the third did set forth a decrée that when of married persons one falleth into heresie the marriage is dissolued and the Catholike partie is free to marrie againe Mat. 19.9 flat against the Scriptures And Alfonsus Alfon. à Castro aduer Haeres li. 1. ca. 4. a famous patron of the Papacie doeth shewe that he defined it For that Pope Coelestine did erre saith Alfonsus about the marriage of the faithfull of whome one falleth into Heresie It is manifest to all men Neither was this errour of Coelestine such as ought to bee imputed to negligence alone That wee may say he erred as a priuate man and not as a Pope who in defining of any serious matter should aske counsel of learned men For this definition of Coelestine was extant in the olde Decretals which I my selfe haue séene and read Super quart decretal c. quanto de â—iuortijs â— IdeÌ„ siquidem de coÌ„â—ers infid c. audabilem Gratia dist 9. c. in â—omi § â—drian in 4 â—ent de conâ—irma ca. vlt. Gerson Almain Paâ—isieÌ„ses Theâ—logi Decret li 4. â—e diuort â—uanto â— Ibid. praedecessor Decretal li. â— de deâ—oÌ„sa duoruÌ„ 〈◊〉 licet praeter And this is confirmed by Cardinal Hostiensis who noteth the very paragraph of the Chapter in the which it was and speaketh of it as a Decretall And that the Pope may erre in iudgement of faith Gratian Adrian Gerson and Almaine the Diuines of Paris affirme Innocentius the third when he decided the cause confessed that one of his predecessors had decréed otherwise which saith the Gloze was Coelestinus whose resolution was in the old Decretals and it was euill that Coelestinus sayd Alexander the third in a matter of great importance sayd Quamuis aliter à quibusdam praedecessoribus nostris sit aliquando iudicatum Though some of our predecessors haue heretofore otherwise giuen iudgement And if you obiect for you will euer find some shift that these were matters of mariage and not of faith as though the seuering of those whome God hath ioyned did not touch the faith â—e conse â—istin 2. Ego Beren Nicolaus the second in a Councell of 114. Bishops appointed Berengarius to confesse That the very body of Christ is in trueth and sensually broken and bruised in pieces with the téeth of the faithfull And this confession the Pope receiued allowed and sent to the Bishops of Italy Germany and France as Catholike which your owne Gloze saith Ibid. c. dentibus is a greater heresie than euer Berengarius held vnlesse you vnderstand this of the outwarde formes of Bread and Wine and not of the body of Christ Honorius the Pope did hold and teach the Monothelites heresie 1. Tim. 3 16 Luk. 22.42 who whereas Christ is made our Sauiour and Redéemer by that he doeth consist of two natures God and man and as of two natures so of two willes agréeable to the natures they say that Christ hath but one will onely and by consequent but one nature The sixt general Councel hath handled the cause of the Monotholite heretikes in 18. actions as they are tearmed In the first action the 8. and the 11. the heretikes alleage in their owne defence that Pope Honorius taught as they do In the 12. 13. his writings are examined his heresie discouered himselfe condemned and cursed In the 16. 17 18. Honor. haâ—retico Anthema the sentence which was giuen against him and the curse are repeated often againe and againe with acclamation of the Councel yea the principal point of his Decrées Vid Raynâ— ver Hart â— diu 2. pag 293. set forth to teach the Church was the Monothelites heresie this is confirmed by chiefe Papists Abbas Vrsâ—erg Ann. 1080. â—aâ—ciculus â—er sciendar â—n vita â—est Hildeâ—randi Pope Gregory the 7. was condemned by the Bishops of France and Germany as the ancient disciple of the Heretike Berengarius and swaruing from the true faith And in speciall words This is Hildebrands Decree in which hee erred from the Catholike doctrine and faith Now let the indifferent Reader iudge betwéene you and vs whether the Pope be a competent iudge But how may it appeare that to him is committed so great a charge and that his sentence is so absolute that all authorities of Scripture Fathers and Councels must submit themselues to his Censure Papist The absolute authority of his Holinesse is prooued by many places of Scripture as Thou art Peter Mat. 16.18 and vpon this Rocke will I build my Church and the gates of hell shall not preuaile against it â—uk 22.32 and I haue prayed for thee Peter that thy faith faile not and Thou being conuerted strengthen thy brethren and Feede my sheepe â—oh 21.17 Feede my lambes And many other places of Scriptures Fathers and Councels doe conferre this speciall priuiledge vpon Peter and Peters Successours By which means all Controuersies whatsoeuer may be determined Protestant This is strange Diuinitie and stranger Logicke Christ sayd Thou art Peter vpon this Rocke will I build my Church Ergo the Church is builded onely vpon Peter and the Pope The gates of hell shall neuer preuaile against the Church Ergo Peter and the Pope are the Church against which the gates of hell shall not preuaile I haue prayed for thée Peter that thy faith faile not Ergo whatsoeuer is determined by the Pope is not subiect to error And Christ sayd to Peter Feede my shéepe Ergo hée made him supreame head of the Apostles Or thus Christ did charge Peter to féede his shéepe But the Apostles were shéepe of Christ Ergo hee had the charge of féeding them also and so had absolute authority Nowe to make you sée the folly of this manner of reasoning obserue this argument and you shall by that meanes easily discerne the weakenesse of your owne reason Christ did charge his Apostles to preach the Gospel to euery creature But Peter was a creature Ergo they had charge of preaching to him also And this must néedes ouersway your reason if a man would play with words For Christ said not to Peter féede al my sheep but he said to the Apostles preach to euery creature And if these consequents bée good then is it an easie and a safe way to decide all differences and wee might well haue spared all these paines for it will necessarily follow that if the Pope cannot erre in any point of doctrine or discipline of the Church then the Scriptures Fathers Councels are superfluous Act. 15. Neither is that Gloze to any purpose that the Rhemists
make That the various meanes of determination triall and declaration of the trueth is necessary for the recouery of Heretikes and for the contentation of the weake who not alwaies giuing ouer to one mans determination wil either yéeld to the iudgement of all the learned men and Blshops of all Nations or else remaine desperate For since there is so variable censures of Councels Aene. Sylu. de Concil Basil contr Flor. Ferrar in Conc. indict Concil Const Sess 4. 5. some holding the Pope to bee aboue the Councell and some holding the Councell to be aboue the Pope If this point be soundly prooued That Peters Sée hath so the assistance of the holy Ghost that it cannot erre all other causes of the necessitie of Fathers or learned Bishops of all Nations is superfluous for if the priuiledge of not erring belong to the Pope and his successors why is it made common to them with the rest of the Church If it appertaine to the whole Church why is it appropriated to the Pope But why doe they bring Scriptures to prooue this speciall priuiledge to belong to the Pope Séeing Canus and Bellarmine two great Champions of the Romish Church doe both confesse that It is not in the Scripture but by Tradition that the Pope hath this supremacie Locor Theolo li 6. c. 8. First Canus doth graunt That it is not written in the Scriptures that the Pope succeedeth Peter in the supremacie And Bellarmine the great Iesuite sayth That whereas Canus thought that the stories haue sufficient ground to conuey Peters right vnto the Pope because they say Peter set his chaire at Rome there died yet sayth he Controu 4. q. 5. de pont finitae 26. Maij. An. 1578. if learned men shall not allow of that Another ground may bee that the Church receiued it though not by Scripture yet by Tradition And to put the matter out of controuersie he defineth that indeed it is a Tradition not of Christ Licet Romanos Episcopos Petro succedere in sacris libris nō habeatur Scriptum ab Apostolis tamen Ecclesiae quasi per Manus Traditum est Romanum pontificem esse Petri successorem in pontificatu totius orbis habetur extraditione Apostolica etri but of the Apostles and lest we should doubt of which of the Apostles he nameth the man Peter euen a tradition of Peter And therefore if you will follow the iudgement of this learned Iesuite which you all receiue with so great applause then renounce the vnlearned follies of your Rhemists and others who violently wrest the Scriptures to prooue the Popes priuiledge For when you vrge these places Thou art Peter and on this rocke c. and I haue prayed for thee Peter and Peter feede my sheepe You presume much of the simplicitie of your hearers otherwise you would neuer reason so absurdly For though Stapleton and some others vpon the 16. of Matth. by these words Thou art Peter c. alleage the first Popes of Rome most holy martyrs to prooue the Popes Supremacie by the Scriptures and do reckon vp Anacletus Alexander the 1. Pius the 1. Victor Zepherinus Marcellus Melchiades Locor Theolo li. 6. c. 8 Bellar. cont 4. q. 5. Iulius and others yet doeth Canus and Bellarmine prooue that it is grounded on Tradition and Canus doth cite for witnesses therof the first Popes of Rome most holy martyrs And the same Popes which are alleaged by Canus to prooue the Supremacie to be an vnwritten trueth the very same Popes are alleaged by Stapletō to proue that It is written euen Anacletus Victor Zepherinus Marcellus Melchiades Iulius yea the very same Epistles are alleaged by Stapletō which are alleaged by Canus Now if they be rightly cited by Canus how may we trust Stapletō if rightly by Stapl. how may we trust Canus if rightly by both what trim Popes are they the with one breath do say That the same thing is both written and vnwritten But the Iesuite dealeth more warily who séeing the danger of naming speciall men and places doeth shrowde himselfe in the generall tearmes of Councels Popes and Fathers Thus you sée how the Lord doth sheath the swords of the Madianites in their owne sides Iudg. 7.22 But let vs sée how the Fathers vnderstood these Scriptures that are brought to priuiledge the Pope from erring and set downe their sayings at large though we haue briefly before in the 14. Question part 3 vrged their authorities Aug. de ver Domini secundū Mat. serm 13. S. Augustine expoundeth the first place thus Thou art Peter saith Christ and vpon this Rocke which thou hast confessed vpon this Rocke which thou hast acknowledged by saying Thou art Christ the Sonne of the liuing God wil I build my Church that is vpon my selfe the Sonne of the liuing God will I build my Church I wil build thee vpon me not my selfe vpon thee S. Hillary saith Hillar de Trin. li. 30 This onely is the immoueable foundation This onely is the happy rocke of faith which was confessed by Peters mouth Thou art the Son of the liuing God Then vpō this rock of cōfession standeth the building of the Church Ambr. in 2. ca. epist ad Ephe. Saint Ambrose saith The Lord saith to Peter Vpon this rocke will I build my Church that is in this confession of the Catholike faith Faith therefore is the foundation of the Church for it was not spoken of Peters flesh but of faith That hell gates should not preuaile against it but that confession conquered hell Chrys Hom. 55. in Mat. Chrysostome sayth Vpon this Rocke will I build my Church that is vpon this faith and confession Bed in ca. 21. Iohan. Bede likewise Vpon this Rocke which thou hast confessed will I build my Church That Rocke was Christ vpon the which foundation euen Peter himselfe was to be builded 1. Cor. 3. These Fathers meane as Saint Paul doth saying Another foundation can no man lay than that which is already layd which is Iesus Christ Others there are of the Fathers that applie this rocke to Peter but not as though he alone were the foundation but including the rest with him Hiero. lib. 1. aduer Iouin As for example Saint Hierom saith Thou wilt say the Church is built on Peter notwithstanding the selfe same in another place is done vpon al the Apostles and they all receiue the Keyes of the kingdome of heauen and the stedfastnesse of the Church is equally setled vpon them Origen sayth If onely vpon Peter Origen in 16. Math. Tract 1. thou thinkest the whole Church to be built what wilt thou say to Iohn and euery of the Apostles shall wee dare say that against Peter onely the gates of hell shall not preuaile And that also vpon this Rocke I will builde my Church For if this speach To thee will I giue the Keyes of the kingdome of heauen be common to all why then should