Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	people_n	speak_v	word_n	3,971	5	4.1039	3	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A92774	The diatribē proved to be paradiatribē. Or, A vindication of the judgement of the reformed churches, and Protestant divines, from misrepresentations concerning ordination, and laying on of hands. Together with a brief answer to the pretences of Edmond Chillenden, for the lawfulnesse of preaching without ordination. / By Lazarus Seaman.	Seaman, Lazarus, d. 1675.; Simpson, Sidrach, 1600?-1655.	1647 (1647)	Wing S2174; Thomason E413_9; ESTC R203508	93,768	122

fort_n of_o zion_n and_o therefore_o have_v no_o ground_n for_o the_o hebrew_n phrase_n here_o use_v in_o the_o strict_a and_o proper_a acception_n of_o it_o 3._o how_o the_o apostle_n understand_v the_o psalm_n and_o this_o passage_n of_o it_o appear_v by_o those_o word_n act._n 4._o 27._o against_o thy_o holy_a child_n jesus_n who_o thou_o have_v anoint_v 3._o anoint_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d chrys_n in_o psal_n 3._o both_o herod_n and_o pontius_n pilate_n with_o the_o gentile_n and_o the_o people_n of_o israel_n be_v gather_v together_o here_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d in_o the_o greek_a answer_n to_o nasakti_n in_o the_o hebrew_n and_o both_o together_o imply_v that_o god_n have_v mad_a christ_n jesus_n who_o the_o jew_n crucify_v both_o lord_n and_o christ_n act_v 2._o 36._o 4._o as_o for_o the_o apostle_n that_o they_o may_v be_v say_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d to_o settle_v his_o kingdom_n by_o their_o preach_n we_o find_v no_o such_o phrase_n in_o scripture_n you_o do_v but_o dream_v in_o ●sing_v of_o it_o and_o though_o its_o true_a they_o be_v witness_n of_o christ_n glory_n yet_o it_o be_v also_o true_a they_o be_v more_o the●_n witness_n as_o you_o use_v the_o word_n in_o way_n of_o diminution_n but_o to_o 〈◊〉_d settle_v and_o establish_v christ_n upon_o his_o throne_n either_o by_o preach_v witness_v or_o other_o way_n be_v not_o where_o ascribe_v unto_o they_o thus_o you_o proceed_v and_o however_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d may_v be_v take_v sometime_o yet_o titus_n 1._o 5._o it_o can_v be_v take_v for_o make_v he_o a_o elder_n who_o be_v none_o before_o for_o what_o be_v enjoin_v there_o be_v to_o be_v do_v by_o titus_n only_o or_o by_o titus_n join_v with_o other_o minister_n for_o the_o text_n say_v i_o have_v leave_v thou_o to_o ordain_v but_o neither_o do_v the_o apostle_n much_o less_o may_v other_o minister_n make_v a_o minister_n by_o a_o sole_a act_n of_o their_o own_o answ_n how_o the_o word_n may_v be_v take_v sometime_o be_v not_o much_o material_a the_o ordina●●_n acception_n be_v chief_o to_o be_v look_v at_o for_o that_o must_v take_v place_n in_o titus_n unless_o some_o reason_n from_o the_o text_n itself_o or_o from_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o thing_n there_o speak_v of_o can_v be_v give_v to_o the_o contrary_n if_o all_o the_o place_n in_o the_o new_a testament_n of_o this_o kind_n where_o it_o be_v use_v be_v inquire_v into_o it_o will_v be_v find_v to_o signify_v either_o the_o make_n of_o he_o a_o officer_n who_o be_v none_o before_o or_o to_o give_v he_o a_o great_a power_n than_o he_o have_v at_o first_o for_o instance_n mat._n 24._o 45._o who_o be_v then_o a_o faithful_a and_o wise_a servant_n who_o his_o lord_n have_v make_v ruler_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d over_o his_o household_n to_o give_v they_o meat_n in_o due_a season_n luk._n 12._o 14._o man_n who_o make_v i_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o judge_n or_o divider_n over_o you_o act._n 7._o 10._o pharaoh_n make_v he_o speak_v of_o joseph_n governor_n over_o egypt_n and_o all_o his_o house_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d for_o the_o second_o sense_n see_v mat._n 24._o 47._o very_o i_o say_v to_o you_o he_o shall_v make_v he_o ruler_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d over_o all_o his_o good_n mat._n 25._o 21._o i_o will_v make_v thou_o ruler_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d over_o many_o thing_n the_o like_a in_o luk._n 12._o 42._o 44._o when_o deacon_n be_v first_o to_o be_v constitute_v in_o the_o church_n of_o jerusalem_n the_o apostle_n speak_v thus_o unto_o the_o multitude_n look_v you_o out_o among_o you_o seven_o man_n of_o honest_a report_n full_a of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o wisdom_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d who_o we_o may_v appoint_v over_o this_o business_n 3._o business_n act._n 6._o 3._o to_o produce_v like_o place_n out_o of_o the_o septuagint_n be_v as_o needless_a as_o it_o will_v be_v endless_a or_o out_o of_o the_o first_o and_o most_o ancient_a of_o the_o greek_a 6._o greek_a vide_fw-la council_n nicenum_n can_v 4_o ancyranum_n can_v 10._o &_o 18._o antiochenum_fw-la can_n 23._o laodicenum_n c._n 11._o &_o 16._o sardicense_n can_v 4._o &_o 6._o counsel_n one_o place_n out_o of_o clemens_n his_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n which_o be_v of_o great_a repute_n among_o the_o learned_a may_v give_v some_o light_n unto_o the_o text_n in_o hand_n speak_v of_o the_o apostle_n and_o of_o their_o preach_n in_o country_n and_o city_n he_o say_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d they_o make_v the_o first_o fruit_n of_o they_o that_o believe_v bishop_n and_o deacon_n not_o by_o popular_a election_n but_o by_o virtue_n of_o the_o spirit_n of_o discern_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 55._o 〈◊〉_d clemens_n in_o epist_n ad_fw-la corinth_n p._n 54_o &_o 55._o what_o they_o do_v themselves_o in_o this_o kind_n they_o do_v also_o appoint_v to_o be_v do_v by_o evangelist_n as_o they_o see_v occasion_n but_o you_o say_v however_o the_o word_n may_v be_v take_v sometime_o yet_o titus_n 1._o 5._o it_o can_v be_v take_v for_o make_v he_o a_o elder_n who_o be_v none_o before_o and_o your_o reason_n be_v because_o what_o be_v enjoin_v there_o be_v to_o be_v do_v by_o titus_n only_o or_o by_o titus_n join_v with_o other_o minister_n ans_fw-fr be_v it_o grant_v that_o titus_n only_o be_v to_o ordain_v what_o need_v then_o that_o other_o minister_n shall_v join_v with_o he_o and_o if_o other_o minister_n be_v to_o join_v yet_o that_o can_v be_v prove_v from_o the_o signification_n of_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d there_o use_v something_o be_v peculiar_o enjoin_v he_o for_o wherefore_o else_o receive_v he_o a_o commission_n and_o commandment_n from_o saint_n paul_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d as_o i_o have_v appoint_v thou_o that_o which_o follow_v thou_o the_o apostle_n much_o less_o other_o minister_n may_v not_o make_v a_o minister_n by_o a_o sole_a act_n of_o their_o own_a be_v a_o mere_a petitio_fw-la principii_fw-la your_o as_o for_o example_n be_v no_o proof_n be_v titus_n a_o minister_n to_o crete_n when_o he_o come_v thither_o or_o be_v he_o not_o if_o he_o be_v show_v we_o who_o act_n concur_v with_o saint_n paul_n and_o who_o authority_n he_o take_v in_o to_o settle_v he_o there_o as_o a_o minister_n to_o they_o thus_o you_o go_v on_o as_o for_o example_n act_v 14._o 23._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d &_o c._n the_o word_n translate_v they_o ordain_v in_o the_o plural_a number_n may_v be_v refer_v to_o the_o people_n as_o well_o as_o to_o paul_n and_o barnabas_n answ_n the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d in_o the_o one_o place_n do_v no_o more_o refer_v to_o the_o people_n than_o the_o other_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d when_o the_o people_n be_v speak_v of_o it_o refer_v to_o they_o but_o paul_n and_o barnabas_n only_o be_v here_o distinguish_v from_o the_o people_n to_o that_o which_o follow_v for_o it_o be_v such_o a_o word_n as_o proper_o belong_v to_o the_o people_n as_o well_o as_o their_o ruler_n when_o they_o give_v their_o vote_n and_o never_o to_o the_o ruler_n without_o the_o people_n answ_n the_o truth_n be_v it_o belong_v proper_o either_o to_o ruler_n or_o people_n to_o gether_o or_o a_o part_n as_o there_o be_v occasion_n your_o never_o to_o the_o ruler_n without_o the_o people_n be_v too_o confident_a a_o assertion_n if_o so_o be_v de_fw-fr facto_fw-la no_o instance_n can_v be_v give_v to_o the_o contrary_a yet_o de_fw-la jure_fw-la no_o reason_n be_v produce_v why_o it_o may_v not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d as_o suidas_n have_v it_o signify_v both_o plebiscitum_fw-la a_o law_n make_v by_o the_o people_n and_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d which_o be_v the_o ordinary_a word_n use_v in_o demosthenes_n and_o in_o the_o attic_a law_n for_o senatus_n consultum_fw-la a_o law_n make_v by_o the_o senate_n as_o when_o the_o people_n make_v a_o law_n they_o be_v say_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d so_o may_v the_o ruler_n in_o like_a manner_n in_o those_o law_n which_o be_v make_v by_o themselves_o alone_o what_o think_v you_o of_o this_o passage_n in_o julius_n pollux_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 1._o 〈◊〉_d julius_n pollux_n l._n 8._o c._n 9_o §_o 1._o the_o thesmothetae_n do_v privare_o prescribe_v when_o judgement_n be_v to_o be_v give_v and_o promulge_v public_a accusation_n and_o suffrage_n to_o the_o people_n who_o suffrage_n be_v these_o if_o not_o the_o ruler_n and_o of_o that_o in_o demosth._n phil._n 1_o cite_v by_o hen._n steph._n who_o you_o quote_v so_o often_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o of_o make_v a_o officer_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d

〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d intelligens_fw-la ut_fw-la opinor_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d prosiste_v sed_fw-la ita_fw-la sumpto_fw-la ut_fw-la quum_fw-la dicitur_fw-la sistere_fw-la cursum_fw-la posset_n tamen_fw-la aliquis_fw-la magis_fw-la etiam_fw-la proprio_fw-la verbo_fw-la utens_fw-la illud_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d eustathii_n reddere_fw-la appelle_fw-fr *_o in_o the_o latter_a of_o those_o page_n which_o you_o cite_v out_o of_o he_o viz._n p._n 1767._o he_o say_v that_o cicero_n phrase_n constituere_fw-la regem_fw-la be_v in_o greek_a 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o in_o the_o former_a of_o they_o viz._n p._n 1732._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d id_fw-la est_fw-la quod_fw-la cicero_n constituere_fw-la regem_fw-la dicir_n but_o what_o of_o this_o till_o we_o know_v what_o cicero_n mean_v by_o his_o constituere_fw-la be_v there_o therefore_o no_o difference_n between_o the_o people_n appoint_v two_o and_o god_n choose_v one_o or_o do_v the_o multitude_n and_o the_o apostle_n both_o or_o either_o constitute_v as_o king_n use_v to_o be_v constitute_v in_o the_o same_o sense_n then_o why_o shall_v the_o forego_n act_n of_o the_o people_n be_v count_v essential_a in_o the_o call_v of_o mathias_n and_o the_o deacon_n rather_o than_o the_o latter_a act_n of_o god_n alone_o or_o the_o twelve_o it_o may_v suffice_v you_o to_o say_v the_o act_n of_o t●e_v multitude_n in_o set_v seven_o man_n before_o the_o apostle_n be_v essential_a though_o the_o act_n of_o the_o apostle_n in_o set_v the_o same_o seven_o over_o the_o multitude_n be_v not_o but_o must_v you_o needs_o make_v the_o act_n of_o god_n in_o choose_v one_o of_o two_o to_o be_v a_o mere_a accident_n take_v heed_n to_o make_v the_o preposition_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o diminutive_a be_v against_o all_o use_n and_o reason_n that_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d signify_v to_o place_v one_o and_o to_o place_v one_o with_o honour_n and_o be_v a_o authoritative_a word_n and_o as_o much_o as_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d may_v be_v grant_v in_o some_o text_n though_o not_o in_o these_o but_o that_o will_v not_o content_v you_o unless_o the_o compound_n signify_v less_o than_o the_o simple_a in_o good_a earnest_n let_v we_o know_v some_o reason_n why_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d may_v not_o signify_v pr●fic●re_o as_o h._n stephan_n say_v it_o do_v in_o those_o text_n of_o matthew_n and_o luke_n heretofore_o insist_v on_o and_o consequent_o to_o place_v one_o in_o honour_n by_o way_n of_o authority_n and_o as_o much_o as_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d why_o be_v the_o act_n of_o the_o people_n under_o authority_n a_o substance_n and_o the_o act_n of_o those_o who_o be_v over_o they_o in_o the_o lord_n a_o shadow_n i_o fear_v it_o be_v not_o so_o much_o for_o the_o truth_n sake_n or_o for_o the_o people_n good_a as_o for_o some_o advantage_n that_o you_o make_v so_o light_a account_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o god_n himself_o i_o will_v willing_o allow_v the_o people_n all_o right_a but_o i_o dare_v not_o say_v that_o alone_o which_o they_o do_v be_v essential_a authoritative_a and_o establish_v but_o nothing_o else_o if_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d be_v a_o authoritative_a word_n in_o that_o phrase_n we_o establish_v the_o law_n where_o the_o apostle_n speak_v but_o of_o a_o doctrinal_a establishment_n let_v we_o know_v why_o when_o he_o speak_v of_o political_a act_n and_o apply_v the_o compound_n to_o they_o that_o shall_v not_o also_o be_v as_o authoritative_a or_o at_o least_o authorittaive_n when_o you_o say_v the_o septuagint_n who_o luke_n be_v observe_v to_o follow_v use_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d for_o as_o much_o as_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d as_o 1_o chron._n 9_o 22._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d these_o do_v david_n and_o solomon_n appoint_v in_o their_o set_a office_n i_o hope_v by_o this_o time_n you_o see_v the_o mistake_n the_o word_n be_v who_o david_n and_o samuel_n the_o seer_n do_v appoint_v in_o their_o set_a office_n and_o if_o you_o mean_v that_o the_o people_n act_n in_o act._n 1._o 23._o and_o act._n 6._o 6._o be_v like_o unto_o that_o of_o david_n and_o samuel_n about_o the_o porter_n you_o be_v mistake_v david_n and_o samuel_n may_v be_v say_v to_o set_v appoint_v or_o ordain_v either_o as_o the_o one_o be_v a_o king_n and_o the_o other_o a_o judge_n or_o as_o they_o be_v both_o prophet_n but_o neither_o of_o these_o acception_n belong_v unto_o the_o people_n yet_o there_o be_v something_o in_o the_o close_a wherein_o perhaps_o you_o may_v speed_v better_o than_o you_o have_v do_v hitherto_o but_o especial_o consider_v that_o elect_v one_o be_v take_v up_o a_o office_n for_o he_o act._n 1._o 20._o 22._o and_o he_o that_o be_v elect_v be_v say_v to_o be_v number_v among_o officer_n act._n 1._o 26._o the_o lot_n fall_v upon_o mathias_n and_o he_o be_v number_v among_o the_o apostle_n number_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d communibus_fw-la suffragiis_fw-la seu_fw-la calculis_fw-la ad_fw-la scriptus_fw-la est_fw-la by_o common_a consent_n or_o vote_n he_o be_v put_v into_o the_o number_n or_o enrol_v among_o the_o apostle_n ans_fw-fr that_o elect_v one_o be_v take_v up_o a_o office_n for_o he_o i_o understand_v not_o but_o that_o by_o god_n election_n mathias_n be_v make_v a_o apostle_n as_o all_o the_o rest_n by_o christ_n be_v certain_a that_o there_o be_v two_o present_v by_o the_o people_n at_o first_o and_o afterward_o 1._o apostolos_fw-la solus_fw-la deus_fw-la eligit_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la accipit_fw-la apostoli_fw-la à_fw-la christo_fw-la solo_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la capite_fw-la ac_fw-la non_fw-la ab_fw-la hom●nibus_fw-la ut_fw-la paulus_n ad_fw-la galat._n 1._o 11._o eliguutur_fw-la jun._n ecclesiast_fw-la lib_n 3._o cap._n 1._o one_o accept_v of_o by_o common_a consent_n in_o way_n of_o obedience_n to_o god_n determination_n i_o very_o believe_v there_o be_v no_o other_o suffrage_n nor_o second_v lot_n though_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d sound_v that_o way_n for_o to_o refer_v the_o choice_n by_o lot_n to_o god_n and_o after_o to_o vote_n whether_o god_n decision_n shall_v stand_v be_v to_o tempt_v god_n but_o a_o acquiescence_n on_o all_o part_n in_o his_o as_o the_o last_o resolve_n calvin_n speak_v to_o this_o point_n a_o quibus_fw-la eligendi_fw-la sunt_fw-la ministri_fw-la say_v huius_fw-la rei_fw-la certa_fw-la regula_fw-la ex_fw-la apostolorum_fw-la institutione_n peti_fw-la non_fw-la potest_fw-la quae_fw-la nonnihil_fw-la habuit_fw-la à_fw-la communi_fw-la reliquorum_fw-la vocatione_n dissimile_n 13._o dissimile_n calv._n inst_z l._n 4._o c._n 3._o §._o 13._o and_o that_o the_o 120._o act_v here_o as_o a_o general_a church_n visible_a not_o as_o a_o single_a congregation_n be_v the_o rather_o to_o be_v believe_v because_o he_o that_o be_v choose_v be_v to_o be_v a_o apostle_n and_o this_o will_v make_v little_a for_o the_o right_n of_o congregation_n to_o have_v all_o power_n in_o elect_v of_o their_o officer_n yet_o this_o example_n may_v be_v of_o this_o use_n to_o teach_v we_o 1._o that_o the_o church_n consent_n or_o assent_n be_v in_o some_o case_n requisite_a unto_o the_o call_n of_o a_o minister_n 2._o that_o a_o minister_n call_v be_v not_o to_o be_v leave_v whole_o to_o the_o people_n election_n for_o then_o what_o need_v either_o of_o a_o lot_n as_o here_o or_o of_o ordination_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o deacon_n and_o for_o all_o that_o yet_o appear_v in_o the_o discussion_n of_o this_o argument_n ordination_n may_v be_v estentiall_a to_o the_o call_n of_o a_o minister_n your_o five_o argument_n pag._n 11._o 5._o upon_o whosoever_o election_n fall_v ordination_n do_v necessary_o and_o therefore_o the_o call_v to_o the_o ministry_n lie_v principal_o in_o election_n as_o he_o that_o i●_n choose_v to_o be_v a_o king_n must_v be_v crown_v therefore_o his_o election_n give_v he_o the_o right_a to_o rule_v that_o ordination_n necessary_o follow_v election_n appear_v act._n 6._o 3._o where_o the_o apostle_n bid_v they_o look_v out_o i._n e._n choose_v as_o be_v explain_v for_o 5._o and_o he_o will_v appoint_v ans_fw-fr this_o argument_n fall_v short_a in_o the_o conclusion_n that_o therefore_o ordination_n be_v not_o essential_a and_o if_o ordination_n do_v necessary_o fall_v upon_o whosoever_o election_n fall_v then_o be_v ordination_n at_o least_o necessary_a after_o election_n if_o it_o be_v necessary_a it_o may_v not_o be_v omit_v when_o it_o may_v be_v have_v all_o that_o neglect_n or_o despise_v it_o be_v without_o excuse_n especial_o when_o the_o magistrate_n enjoin_v it_o agreeable_o unto_o the_o word_n and_o if_o it_o shall_v always_o follow_v upon_o election_n yet_o you_o can_v thence_o conclude_v that_o the_o call_v to_o the_o ministry_n lie_v principal_o in_o election_n marriage_n be_v begin_v by_o the_o motion_n of_o the_o man_n to_o the_o woman_n that_o he_o may_v have_v she_o for_o his_o

he_o only_o who_o be_v elect_v and_o that_o because_o he_o be_v elect_v ans_fw-fr upon_o what_o ground_n you_o entitle_v that_o book_n so_o often_o cite_v to_o the_o brethren_n and_o sometime_o to_o the_o church_n of_o scotland_n general_o i_o know_v not_o unless_o it_o be_v to_o de●●de_v the_o reader_n or_o upbraid_v the_o brethren_n and_o the_o church_n some_o of_o they_o have_v be_v long_o in_o england_n as_o commissioner_n from_o that_o church_n and_o have_v not_o be_v silent_a where_o they_o have_v occasion_n to_o debate_v beside_o their_o work_n speak_v for_o they_o as_o the_o great_a pain_n of_o reverend_a mr._n rutherford_n at_o large_a to_o the_o point_n in_o hand_n 241._o hand_n due_a right_n of_o presb._n from_o p._n 178._o to_o 241._o before_o their_o arrival_n here_o there_o be_v a_o learned_a tract_n of_o patrick_n forbes_n of_o corse_n to_o clear_v the_o call_n of_o minister_n in_o the_o reform_a church_n and_o particular_o in_o scotland_n against_o objection_n of_o the_o papist_n as_o to_o these_o particular_a passage_n here_o cite_v you_o wrong_v both_o the_o author_n the_o reader_n and_o the_o truth_n itself_o by_o leave_v out_o all_o those_o expression_n whereby_o minister_n and_o elder_n be_v interest_v in_o election_n as_o distinguish_v from_o ordination_n and_o by_o misapply_v those_o word_n which_o you_o have_v express_v but_o while_o say_v he_o we_o plead_v for_o the_o election_n of_o people_n we_o add_v 1._o let_v the_o clergy_n of_o the_o adjacent_a bound_n in_o their_o presbyterial_a assembly_n try_v and_o judge_v who_o be_v fit_a for_o the_o ministry_n 2._o even_o when_o it_o come_v to_o election_n yet_o populus_fw-la non_fw-la solus_fw-la judicat_fw-la sed_fw-la praeeunte_fw-la &_o moderante_fw-la actionem_fw-la presbyterio_n the_o word_n of_o junius_n let_v the_o elder_n of_o the_o congregation_n together_o with_o some_o of_o the_o clergy_n concur_v with_o they_o moderate_a the_o action_n and_o go_v before_o the_o body_n of_o the_o people_n will_v to_o god_n that_o these_o thing_n be_v observe_v by_o all_o i_o add_v amen_o for_o then_o a_o act_n of_o minister_n and_o elder_n in_o judge_v of_o the_o call_v of_o a_o particular_a person_n will_v always_o be_v find_v in_o praxi_fw-la and_o without_o it_o all_o choice_n by_o people_n alone_o will_v be_v count_v null_n and_o invalid_a whereas_o you_o say_v he_o speak_v of_o ordination_n in_o general_a and_o yet_o instance_n it_o as_o to_o a_o particular_a flock_n the_o truth_n be_v he_o speak_v there_o only_o of_o ordination_n to_o a_o particular_a flock_n and_o not_o of_o ordination_n in_o general_a until_o he_o come_v to_o the_o next_o page_n it_o follow_v say_v he_o to_o speak_v of_o ordination_n 168._o pag._n 168._o wherein_o with_o calvin_n junius_n gersom_a bucer_n and_o other_o learned_a man_n we_o distinguish_v between_o the_o act_n of_o it_o and_o the_o rite_n of_o it_o the_o act_n of_o ordination_n standoth_a in_o the_o mission_n or_o deputation_n of_o a_o man_n to_o a_o ecclesiastical_a function_n with_o power_n and_o authority_n to_o perform_v the_o same_o now_o that_o ordination_n at_o thus_o describe_v be_v essential_a to_o a_o call_v he_o himself_o imply_v by_o these_o word_n for_o how_o shall_v they_o preach_v except_o they_o be_v send_v speak_v of_o such_o a_o send_v as_o he_o have_v before_o state_v that_o minister_n shall_v not_o be_v obtrude_v invito_fw-la populo_fw-la against_o the_o people_n will_n be_v the_o sum_n of_o all_o which_o he_o plead_v for_o and_o will_v not_o be_v gainsay_v where_o the_o people_n be_v saint_n and_o orthodox_n but_o it_o will_v not_o thence_o follow_v that_o people_n have_v a_o power_n to_o make_v one_o a_o minister_n excluso_fw-la or_o invito_fw-la presbyterio_n without_o or_o against_o or_o otherwise_o then_o by_o a_o presbytery_n suppose_v a_o man_n have_v by_o election_n jus_o ad_fw-la rem_fw-la power_n to_o be_v a_o pastor_n yet_o he_o be_v not_o therefore_o or_o thereby_o a_o pastor_n actual_o and_o if_o ordination_n be_v that_o which_o give_v jus_o in_o re_fw-mi no_o man_n be_v to_o act_v as_o a_o pastor_n till_o he_o be_v ordain_v and_o if_o election_n do_v only_a design_n a_o man_n to_o be_v make_v a_o minister_n and_o ordination_n be_v that_o act_n whereby_o he_o be_v so_o make_v i_o hope_v it_o will_v be_v plain_a that_o as_o the_o introduce_v of_o the_o form_n be_v essential_a in_o create_v rather_o than_o prepare_v the_o matter_n or_o mass_n which_o i●_n to_o receive_v it_o so_o ordination_n will_v be_v find_v to_o be_v essential_a rather_o than_o election_n though_o election_n may_v precede_v in_o time_n and_o ordination_n follow_v after_o 6._o a_o minister_n may_v want_v and_o be_v without_o ordination_n in_o argument_n the_o six_o argument_n some_o case_n therefore_o it_o be_v not_o essential_a to_o his_o call_v thus_o gregor_n thaumaturgus_n be_v and_o other_o may_v be_v in_o time_n of_o persecution_n ans_fw-fr here_o you_o fight_v against_o yourself_o if_o one_o word_n be_v change_v a_o minister_n may_v want_v and_o be_v without_o election_n in_o some_o case_n therefore_o it_o be_v not_o essential_a to_o his_o call_v this_o be_v common_o judge_v to_o be_v the_o case_n of_o our_o first_o reformer_n and_o may_v be_v the_o case_n of_o other_o in_o time_n of_o extreme_a persecution_n you_o care_v not_o to_o wound_v yourself_o so_o as_o you_o may_v strike_v other_o there_o must_v be_v a_o voice_n from_o heaven_n i._n e._n a_o true_a ministry_n to_o bring_v man_n out_o of_o babylon_n 222._o babylon_n non_fw-fr pot●i●_n ecclesia_fw-la restitui_fw-la nisi_fw-la restituto_fw-la ministerio_fw-la de_fw-la formâ_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la visibilis_fw-la loquor_fw-la quia_fw-la non_fw-la alia_fw-la ratione_fw-la qu●m_fw-la praedicatione_n evangelii_n vel_fw-la instaurari_fw-la ecclesta_fw-la vel_fw-la instaurata_fw-la potest_fw-la conservari_fw-la sadeel_v de_fw-fr legit_fw-la vocatione_n min._n p._n 7._o verum_fw-la h●c_fw-la summo_fw-la studic_fw-la attendi_fw-la debet_fw-la quòd_fw-la vocationis_fw-la ministrorum_fw-la verbi_fw-la divini_fw-la necessitas_fw-la huc_fw-la usque_fw-la adstructa_fw-la non_fw-la ad_fw-la quod_fw-la vis_fw-la tempus_fw-la etiam_fw-la corruptae_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la atque_fw-la turbatae_fw-la salsa_fw-la doctrine_n atque_fw-la immani_fw-la persecutione_n nam_fw-la ubi_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la aut_fw-la salsa_fw-la doctrinâ_fw-la turbata_fw-la aut_fw-la persecutione_n dissipata_fw-la est_fw-la it_o aut_fw-la desint_fw-la qui_fw-la sinceros_n verbi_fw-la divini_fw-la m●nistros_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d vocate_n possint_fw-la &_o ●elint_fw-la hac_fw-la certè_fw-la rerum_fw-la necessitate_v extrema_fw-la concedit_fw-la deus_fw-la ut_fw-la quivis_fw-la qui_fw-la volunlotis_fw-la divine_a gnari_fw-la sunt_fw-la verbum_fw-la dei_fw-la praedicent_fw-la sacramenta_fw-la administrent_fw-la collapsam_fw-la veritatem_fw-la restaurent_fw-fr &_o quaevi●_n munia_fw-la sacra_fw-la citra_fw-la ordinariam_fw-la vocationem_fw-la obeant_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d p._n 222._o rev._n 18._o 4._o but_o who_o shall_v either_o ordain_v or_o elect_v when_o clergy_n and_o laity_n i_o use_v the_o word_n only_o for_o distinction_n sake_n be_v equal_o corrupt_v at_o such_o a_o time_n wherever_o god_n providential_o set_v up_o a_o standard_n his_o people_n may_v flock_v unto_o it_o and_o if_o they_o find_v a_o burn_a and_o a_o shine_a light_n it_o suffice_v that_o they_o know_v it_o be_v not_o of_o man_n but_o from_o heaven_n and_o that_o they_o ought_v to_o walk_v in_o the_o light_n of_o it_o but_o you_o add_v this_o argument_n voetius_fw-la press_v large_a and_o show_v even_o by_o confession_n of_o papist_n that_o one_o elect_v or_o choose_v may_v without_o ordination_n do_v all_o the_o office_n of_o a_o minister_n as_o excommunicate_v absolve_v and_o conclude_v it_o be_v no_o more_o to_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o minister_n then_o bow_v of_o the_o knee_n external_o be_v essential_a to_o ptayer_n to_o god_n or_o the_o lead_n of_o the_o bride_n and_o pomp_n of_o a_o wedding_n day_n be_v to_o marriage_n desper_n causa_fw-la papat_fw-la 266_o 267._o ans_fw-fr 1._o voetius_fw-la speak_v not_o of_o ordination_n there_o as_o a_o act_n of_o minister_n and_o elder_n distinct_a from_o the_o rite_n of_o lay_v on_o hand_n 2._o the_o papist_n distinguish_v between_o the_o power_n of_o order_n and_o jurisdiction_n though_o they_o grant_v election_n give_v jurisdiction_n yet_o it_o be_v but_o in_o some_o case_n and_o those_o thing_n which_o belong_v to_o order_n can_v be_v do_v by_o none_o but_o by_o ordain_v person_n according_a to_o their_o principle_n neither_o 3._o do_v voetius_fw-la produce_v any_o such_o confession_n of_o the_o papist_n as_o you_o here_o assert_v he_o do_v that_o one_o elect_v or_o choose_v may_v without_o ordination_n do_v all_o the_o office_n of_o a_o minister_n and_o the_o instance_n which_o you_o give_v of_o excommunication_n and_o absolution_n both_o of_o which_o belong_v to_o jurisdiction_n show_v plain_o of_o what_o kind_n of_o action_n the_o papist_n be_v to_o be_v understand_v and_o such_o be_v all_o those_o case_n which_o you_o

your_o naked_a argument_n will_v blush_v to_o see_v itself_o therefore_o if_o this_o may_v suffice_v to_o the_o whole_a yet_o i_o shall_v say_v something_o to_o the_o particular_n of_o amplification_n to_o election_n there_o go_v the_o trial_n and_o approbation_n of_o a_o man_n ability_n ans_fw-fr so_o there_o do_v to_o ordination_n and_o whether_o minister_n and_o elder_n be_v not_o as_o able_a at_o least_o for_o this_o as_o the_o people_n let_v the_o people_n judge_n in_o this_o respect_n therefore_o ordination_n may_v be_v as_o essential_a as_o election_n note_n election_n note_n as_o for_o your_o quotation_n here_o to_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o 4._o reason_n they_o be_v the_o same_o which_o you_o give_v we_o before_o p._n 7._o for_o the_o 8._o reason_n and_o serve_v only_o in_o this_o place_n to_o swell_v the_o margin_n for_o a_o show_n and_o therefore_o i_o pass_v they_o over_o and_o refer_v the_o reader_n to_o the_o answer_n of_o they_o in_o that_o place_n where_o they_o be_v first_o allege_v in_o election_n the_o church_n give_v up_o itself_o to_o god_n to_o take_v who_o he_o shall_v direct_v their_o heart_n unto_o and_o in_o choose_v one_o well_o 24._o act._n 1._o 24._o qualify_v they_o choose_v he_o who_o god_n will_v have_v choose_v ans_fw-fr in_o ordination_n minister_n and_o elder_n give_v up_o themselves_o to_o god_n to_o ordain_v he_o who_o he_o shall_v direct_v their_o heart_n unto_o and_o in_o ordain_v one_o well_o qualify_v they_o ordain_v he_o who_o god_n will_v have_v ordain_v where_o be_v the_o substantial_a difference_n that_o ordination_n may_v not_o be_v essential_a yet_o i_o pray_v you_o remember_v that_o which_o we_o read_v act._n 1._o 24._o speak_v of_o ●ods_n choose_v not_o of_o the_o people_n and_o where_o all_o the_o eleven_o apostle_n be_v chooser_n minister_n and_o elder_n be_v virtual_o a_o part_n there_o be_v two_o nominate_v at_o that_o time_n both_o well_o qualify_v and_o both_o refer_v unto_o god_n and_o he_o choose_v one_o if_o the_o people_n have_v all_o power_n in_o make_v minister_n why_o do_v not_o they_o apart_o from_o the_o apostle_n choose_v one_o alone_o when_o there_o be_v but_o one_o to_o be_v choose_v but_o to_o teach_v we_o that_o to_o the_o regular_a call_n of_o a_o minister_n something_o be_v necessary_a beside_o a_o mere_a election_n by_o the_o people_n in_o their_o choice_n they_o h._n e._n the_o people_n eo_fw-la ipso_fw-la separate_v and_o set_v he_o apart_o to_o the_o minister●_n ans_fw-fr those_o two_o who_o the_o hundred_o &_o twenty_o present_v act._n 1._o 23._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d be_v neither_o of_o they_o eo_fw-la ipso_fw-la set_v apart_o to_o the_o ministry_n but_o after_o the_o lot_n fall_v upon_o mathias_n eo_fw-la ipso_fw-la he_o become_v a_o apostle_n and_o be_v number_v with_o the_o eleven_o when_o the_o holy_a ghost_n say_v separate_a i_n paul_n and_o barnabas_n with_o fast_v and_o prayer_n by_o imposition_n of_o hand_n they_o be_v separate_v act._n 13._o 1_o 2_o 3._o so_o in_o ordination_n when_o a_o person_n well_o qualify_v have_v hand_n lay_v on_o he_o with_o fast_v and_o prayer_n eo_fw-la ipso_fw-la he_o be_v separate_v and_o set_v apart_o to_o the_o ministry_n 17._o ministry_n see_v the_o testimony_n former_o cite_v pag._n 17._o but_o where_o be_v either_o precept_n example_n or_o grind_v of_o reason_n for_o people_n to_o set_v any_o man_n apart_o by_o a_o sole_a act_n of_o their_o own_o and_o thereby_o to_o make_v he_o a_o minister_n when_o they_o may_v have_v minister_n and_o elder_n to_o join_v with_o they_o in_o choose_v and_o after_o to_o ordain_v he_o h._n e._n the_o minister_n they_o take_v as_o from_o god_n appointment_n and_o hand_n they_o offer_v themselves_o to_o god_n by_o he_o ans_fw-fr this_o be_v true_a when_o one_o be_v ordain_v for_o they_o who_o they_o accept_v of_o as_o make_v their_o minister_n by_o ordination_n and_o who_o accept_v of_o they_o as_o his_o cure_n and_o charge_n but_o when_o people_n choose_v one_o to_o be_v a_o minister_n who_o neither_o be_v ordain_v nor_o intend_v to_o be_v they_o give_v he_o to_o god_n so_o as_o they_o be_v the_o priest_n and_o the_o minister_n the_o sacrifice_n and_o god_n must_v receive_v he_o as_o a_o minister_n to_o he_o from_o their_o appointment_n and_o hand_n the_o truth_n be_v a_o minister_n shall_v be_v call_v in_o such_o a_o manner_n as_o he_o may_v come_v to_o the_o church_n from_o god_n and_o as_o a_o gift_n of_o christ_n yet_o so_o as_o it_o may_v appear_v that_o the_o church_n receive_v he_o as_o such_o and_o therefore_o as_o some_o testimony_n of_o the_o church_n consent_n be_v necessary_a so_o much_o more_o a_o ordination_n by_o minister_n and_o elder_n for_o otherwise_o well_o may_v minister_n be_v look_v upon_o as_o give_v by_o the_o church_n unto_o god_n but_o it_o can_v be_v hold_v out_o that_o they_o be_v give_v from_o god_n to_o the_o church_n in_o accept_v the_o choice_n the_o party_n choose_v undertake_v to_o be_v in_o god_n stead_n to_o they_o and_o in_o their_o stead_n and_o behalf_n to_o god_n for_o what_o else_o be_v it_o to_o be_v a_o minister_n and_o all_o this_o be_v do_v with_o prayer_n and_o mutual_a agreement_n 20._o 2_o cor._n 5._o 20._o ans_fw-fr all_o this_o be_v but_o a_o consequent_a of_o election_n and_o ordination_n both_o no_o substantial_a act_n of_o either_o but_o a_o effect_n the_o duty_n of_o a_o minister_n when_o he_o have_v a_o call_n towards_o god_n and_o the_o people_n to_o who_o he_o be_v assign_v not_o the_o formal_a thing_n whereby_o he_o be_v make_v a_o minister_n that_o a_o minister_n be_v a_o ambassador_n for_o christ_n god_n beseech_v by_o he_o and_o he_o in_o christ_n stead_n we_o learn_v indeed_o from_o 2_o cor._n 5._o 20._o but_o this_o make_v nothing_o at_o all_o for_o a_o call_v by_o popular_a election_n because_o many_o be_v true_a minister_n as_o prophet_n and_o apostle_n in_o all_o these_o respect_n who_o be_v never_o choose_v by_o the_o church_n to_o that_o end_n but_o by_o god_n alone_o and_o what_o be_v more_o improper_a then_o for_o a_o people_n to_o choose_v a_o ambassador_n and_o one_o to_o be_v in_o god_n stead_n unto_o they_o as_o he_o be_v to_o act_v for_o they_o there_o be_v some_o pretence_n for_o choice_n but_o no_o necessity_n for_o every_o highpriest_n yea_o every_o priest_n be_v take_v from_o among_o man_n and_o ordain_v for_o man_n in_o 1._o heb._n 5._o 1._o thing_n pertain_v to_o god_n and_o yet_o none_o of_o they_o be_v proper_o choose_v by_o man_n but_o all_o by_o god_n and_o as_o he_o be_v to_o act_v for_o god_n so_o its_o necessary_a there_o shall_v be_v some_o act_n whereby_o god_n send_v of_o he_o in_o his_o stead_n may_v appear_v the_o choice_n or_o call_n of_o ambassador_n belong_v not_o to_o they_o to_o who_o they_o come_v as_o ambassador_n but_o unto_o he_o from_o who_o and_o in_o who_o name_n they_o be_v to_o act_v and_o because_o god_n do_v not_o now_o adays_o make_v any_o extraordinary_a designation_n either_o by_o voice_n from_o heaven_n as_o at_o christ_n 17._o christ_n mat._n 3._o 17._o baptism_n and_o transfiguration_n 5._o transfiguration_n ch_n 17._o 5._o or_o by_o prophecy_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o timothy_n 14._o timothy_n 1_o tim._n 4._o 14._o or_o by_o some_o extraordinary_a and_o express_a signation_n of_o his_o spirit_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o paul_n and_o barnabas_n 2._o barnabas_n act._n 13._o 2._o or_o by_o vision_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o paul_n at_o first_o unto_o ananias_n or_o by_o lot_n as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o mathias_n 15._o e_o ch_z 9_o 15._o there_o remain_v the_o only_a way_n of_o ordination_n whereby_o we_o come_v 26._o f_o ch_z 1._o 26._o to_o know_v who_o be_v send_v of_o god_n and_o who_o be_v not_o now_o as_o where_o the_o church_n agree_v in_o a_o act_n god_n will_v be_v present_a to_o confirm_v that_o act_n mat._n 18._o 18_o 19_o so_o prayer_n be_v also_o a_o separation_n of_o one_o to_o the_o ministry_n act_n 13._o 2_o 3._o ans_fw-fr the_o word_n church_n be_v not_o use_v in_o either_o of_o those_o verse_n which_o you_o cite_v in_o matthew_n and_o in_o the_o 17._o verse_n where_o we_o find_v it_o it_o signify_v a_o company_n endow_v with_o power_n of_o bind_v and_o lose_v and_o consequent_o the_o presbytery_n minister_n and_o elder_n if_o they_o agree_v to_o ordain_v a_o minister_n their_o act_n be_v valid_a by_o virtue_n of_o this_o ●ext_n and_o if_o they_o ask_v of_o god_n the_o confirmation_n or_o blessing_n of_o their_o act_n it_o shall_v be_v grant_v they_o agreement_n must_v here_o be_v understand_v not_o only_o with_o reference_n to_o the_o person_n among_o themselves_o but_o with_o respect_n unto_o the_o right_a rule_n of_o act_v that_o people_n have_v a_o

ecclesia_fw-la constituti_fw-la a●d_v though_o after_o he_o show_v the_o invalidity_n of_o their_o call_n ex_fw-la ipsis_fw-la canonibus_fw-la quos_fw-la jactant_fw-la out_o of_o those_o canon_n which_o they_o boast_v of_o yet_o he_o bring_v not_o one_o reason_n to_o prove_v that_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v not_o to_o be_v include_v in_o the_o original_a word_n so_o much_o insist_v on_o and_o if_o the_o word_n elder_n use_v in_o that_o text_n be_v to_o be_v take_v synecdochical_o for_o pastor_n deacon_n and_o rule_v elder_n as_o he_o there_o expound_v it_o why_o may_v it_o not_o as_o well_o be_v say_v that_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d though_o it_o signif●●_n choose_v do_v also_o include_v ordain_v because_o it_o appear_v by_o act._n 6._o that_o with_o choose_v ordination_n by_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v also_o use_v this_o by_o the_o way_n to_o your_o parenthesis_n to_o the_o inconvenience_n itself_o i_o answer_v 1._o the_o ordination_n of_o rom●sh_a priest_n as_o priest_n be_v a_o mere_a nullity_n because_o the_o priesthood_n i●_n self_n be_v so_o but_o their_o ordination_n adonus_fw-la presbyterii_fw-la to_o preach_v and_o administer_v the_o sacrament_n be_v of_o another_o nature_n and_o therefore_o these_o must_v not_o be_v confound_v together_o the_o rather_o because_o in_o their_o manner_n of_o ordain_v they_o be_v real_o distinguish_v romanum_fw-la distinguish_v vide_fw-la pontisicale_n romanum_fw-la 2._o though_o some_o of_o our_o divine_n deny_v a_o lawful_a ministry_n and_o call_v thereunto_o to_o be_v in_o the_o roman_a hierarchy_n as_o *_o beza_n and_o sadeel_n not_o as_o make_v of_o it_o to_o be_v simple_o invalid_a and_o null_a but_o extreme_a sinful_a yet_o they_o must_v not_o be_v interpret_v too_o rigorous_o unless_o we_o mean_v to_o set_v protestant_n at_o variance_n among_o themselves_o to_o our_o own_o prejudice_n and_o that_o 1._o because_o the_o lutheran_n do_v maintain_v the_o ordinary_a call_v which_o luther_n have_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n as_o sufficient_a and_o 2._o not_o they_o only_a but_o divers_a also_o of_o the_o calvinist_n as_o voetius_fw-la forbes_n festus_n homius_fw-la etc._n etc._n 3._o they_o who_o say_v there_o be_v something_o extraordinary_a in_o luther_n call_v do_v place_n that_o extraordinarinesse_n rather_o in_o his_o spirit_n gift_n success_n and_o manner_n of_o ministry_n than_o in_o the_o call_v itself_o and_o therefore_o make_v his_o call_v mix_v 3._o the_o most_o judicious_a and_o best_a approve_a among_o we_o do_v hold_n that_o as_o baptism_n so_o ordination_n even_o in_o rome_n be_v so_o far_o forth_o valid_a that_o upon_o separation_n from_o they_o and_o join_v with_o we_o there_o need_v neither_o new_a baptism_n nor_o a_o new_a ordination_n 4._o we_o all_o agree_v that_o a_o call_v from_o rome_n be_v not_o necessary_a at_o all_o against_o the_o papist_n who_o make_v the_o pope_n to_o be_v the_o fountain_n of_o order_n and_o jurisdiction_n 5._o this_o inconvenience_n follow_v not_o at_o at_o all_o upon_o the_o opinion_n that_o ordination_n be_v essential_a but_o upon_o that_o mistake_n only_o that_o the_o lawful_a way_n of_o call_v be_v one_o only_o in_o all_o case_n and_o condition_n of_o the_o church_n wherein_o whesoever_o engage_v either_o for_o election_n or_o ordination_n apart_o and_o much_o more_o for_o both_o together_o will_v be_v sure_a to_o plunge_v himself_o into_o inextricable_a labyrinth_n i_o approve_v our_o man_n say_v reverend_a forbes_n who_o sustain_v our_o ordinary_a vocation_n in_o common_a but_o who_o plead_v so_o for_o it_o as_o a_o point_n absolute_o requisite_a for_o approve_v our_o cause_n and_o in_o such_o a_o case_n of_o the_o church_n do_v place_n all_o defence_n therein_o in_o my_o judgement_n they_o do_v wrong_o limit_v the_o holy_a one_o of_o israel_n against_o both_o the_o privilege_n of_o his_o power_n and_o his_o usual_a manner_n of_o deal_n in_o such_o case_n forbes_n defence_n of_o the_o lawful_a call_v sec_fw-la 28._o pag._n 60._o to_o your_o second_o inconvenience_n that_o then_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a church_n and_o spouse_n of_o christ_n i_o answer_v 1._o it_o follow_v not_o because_o in_o a_o false_a church_n there_o may_v be_v something_o true_a 2._o many_o protestant_a divine_n be_v not_o afraid_a to_o grant_v that_o in_o some_o sense_n it_o be_v a_o true_a church_n so_o at_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v not_o extinct_a in_o rome_n neither_o do_v the_o ministry_n altogether_o perish_v there_o pr●●_n there_o ●●a_fw-la ut_fw-la sicut_fw-la non_fw-la penitus_fw-la exti●cta_fw-la ibi_fw-la suis_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la sic_fw-la neque_fw-la penitus_fw-la interitrit_a ibi_fw-la mini●terium_fw-la zanch._n i●_n 4_o pr●●_n 3._o this_o objection_n be_v so_o full_o answer_v by_o all_o our_o writer_n of_o this_o subject_n against_o the_o papist_n that_o it_o be_v not_o worth_a the_o while_n to_o transcribe_v they_o vide_fw-la voetium_n quo_fw-la supra_fw-la 4._o those_o who_o be_v common_o call_v brownist_n be_v sufficient_o zealous_a against_o rome_n and_o yet_o even_o among_o they_o the_o more_o moderate_a part_n as_o johnson_n and_o his_o follower_n do_v not_o only_o grant_v that_o the_o society_n common_o call_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a church_n without_o all_o fear_n of_o inconvenience_n but_o labour_n at_o large_a to_o prove_v it_o 215._o it_o christian_n plea_n by_o fran._n johnson_n print_a anno_fw-la 1617._o hom_n pag._n 119._o ●●_o 215._o the_o more_o rigid_a of_o they_o who_o deny_v that_o which_o he_o grant_v as_o robinson_n and_o ainsworth_n yet_o acknowledge_v that_o in_o rome_n there_o be_v some_o true_a ordinance_n as_o baptism_n for_o instance_n and_o in_o grant_v the_o administration_n of_o baptism_n with_o those_o of_o rome_n to_o be_v valid_a and_o yet_o deny_v the_o church_n to_o be_v true_a they_o must_v needs_o reject_v your_o consequence_n as_o the_o lord_n have_v his_o people_n in_o babylon_n say_v robinson_n his_o i_o mean_v both_o in_o respect_n of_o election_n and_o of_o personal_a sanctification_n so_o have_v he_o for_o their_o sake_n there_o preserve_v notwithstanding_o all_o the_o apostasy_n and_o confusion_n which_o be_v find_v in_o it_o sundry_a his_o holy_a truth_n and_o ordinance_n among_o which_o baptism_n be_v one_o robin_n justificat_fw-la of_o separate_a ed._n ult_n p._n 232._o if_o the_o question_n he_o whether_o ordination_n or_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v not_o another_o ordinance_n retain_v in_o rome_n from_o the_o beginning_n the_o reader_n shall_v do_v well_o to_o weigh_v what_o follow_v here_o out_o of_o mr._n johnson_n one_o of_o no_o mean_a account_n among_o the_o brethren_n of_o the_o separation_n whereas_o one_o that_o be_v minister_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v after_o choose_v teacher_n to_o a_o separate_a congregation_n without_o any_o new_a imposition_n of_o hand_n he_o labour_v for_o to_o justify_v it_o after_o this_o manner_n in_o his_o ans_fw-fr to_o the_o letter_n of_o h._n a._n touch_v the_o division_n among_o themselves_o p._n 50._o &_o seq_fw-la the_o anabaptist_n hold_v say_v he_o that_o antichrist_n have_v utter_o destroy_v all_o god_n ordinance_n so_o as_o there_o be_v not_o so_o much_o as_o true_a baptism_n retain_v and_o have_v among_o they_o h._n e._n in_o rome_n or_o england_n thereupon_o they_o begin_v to_o baptize_v themselves_o again_o who_o error_n while_o we_o confute_v and_o while_o some_o of_o they_o object_v that_o we_o shall_v no_o more_o retain_v the_o baptism_n than_o the_o ministry_n there_o receive_v we_o have_v just_a occasion_n thereupon_o to_o consider_v thereof_o and_o so_o weigh_v with_o ourselves_o that_o one_o main_a and_o special_a reason_n against_o rebaptisation_n be_v because_o baptism_n be_v a_o ordinance_n of_o god_n which_o be_v have_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n before_o she_o fall_v into_o apostasy_n and_o have_v be_v there_o continue_v ever_o since_o the_o apostle_n time_n however_o it_o be_v co-mingled_n among_o they_o with_o many_o corruption_n and_o invention_n of_o their_o own_o we_o begin_v to_o consider_v whether_o the_o like_a may_v not_o be_v observe_v and_o say_v concern_v imposition_n of_o hand_n that_o it_o be_v have_v from_o the_o apostle_n in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n before_o her_o apostasy_n and_o be_v there_o continue_v to_o this_o day_n though_o mix_v with_o many_o pollution_n and_o devise_n of_o their_o own_o and_o enter_v into_o a_o consideration_n thereof_o we_o observe_v 1._o that_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v of_o god_n and_o not_o a_o invention_n of_o man_n not_o a_o post_n or_o threshold_n first_o bring_v by_o antichrist_n into_o the_o temple_n of_o god_n but_o have_v therein_o afore_o antichrist_n sit_v there_o 2._o that_o baptism_n and_o imposition_n of_o hand_n be_v join_v together_o among_o the_o principle_n of_o the_o foundation_n speak_v of_o heb._n 6._o 2._o which_o we_o think_v therefore_o shall_v in_o this_o behalf_n be_v well_o regard_v 3._o that_o imposition_n of_o