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to_o withstand_v it_o but_o ignorance_n i_o have_v so_o much_o learning_n as_o make_v i_o see_v the_o worth_n and_o usefullnesse_n of_o learning_n and_o true_o my_o experience_n of_o the_o same_o enforce_v i_o to_o speak_v upon_o this_o subject_n among_o other_o thing_n which_o i_o know_v the_o squeamish_a stomach_n of_o many_o will_v not_o relish_v very_o well_o however_o i_o shall_v take_v comfort_n in_o this_o that_o i_o have_v do_v my_o duty_n his_o eight_o error_n that_o the_o ministry_n of_o england_n be_v antichristian_a this_o lie_v in_o the_o end_n of_o his_o book_n and_o i_o believe_v to_o persuade_v man_n of_o this_o be_v his_o end_n first_o in_o his_o intention_n though_o last_o in_o execution_n his_o design_n be_v not_o so_o much_o to_o make_v more_o preacher_n as_o to_o vilify_v those_o that_o be_v already_o as_o antichristian_a and_o no_o minister_n it_o be_v a_o heavy_a charge_n this_o that_o he_o bring_v in_o not_o against_o some_o but_o all_o minister_n i_o shall_v 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shall_v reply_v to_o somewhat_o that_o he_o have_v to_o say_v against_o something_o that_o mr_n hall_n speak_v in_o answer_n to_o a_o objection_n to_o this_o purpose_n the_o authority_n of_o a_o minister_n do_v not_o depend_v on_o the_o person_n ordain_v but_o principal_o on_o christ_n inward_a call_n discern_v by_o gift_n etc._n etc._n we_o have_v our_o ordination_n from_o christ_n by_o bishop_n and_o presbyter_n etc._n etc._n to_o this_o he_o give_v answer_v in_o these_o word_n you_o yourselves_o have_v conclude_v the_o bishop_n antichristian_a in_o their_o call_n rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v and_o be_v you_o christian_n a_o riddle_n do_v ever_o any_o of_o those_o that_o have_v plead_v against_o the_o usurp_a power_n of_o bishop_n reply_n reply_n say_v
that_o be_v beyond_o all_o dispute_n 2._o god_n never_o repeal_v the_o grant_n of_o this_o privilege_n to_o infant_n if_o he_o have_v do_v it_o let_v i_o know_v where_o can_v you_o think_v that_o a_o whole_a species_n or_o kind_n of_o person_n shall_v be_v cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o scripture_n be_v silent_a about_o it_o if_o the_o gift_n and_o grant_n of_o this_o privilege_n be_v not_o repeal_v than_o it_o remain_v to_o infant_n still_o but_o i_o shall_v prove_v the_o negative_a thus_o if_o god_n have_v revoke_v this_o merciful_a grant_n and_o gift_n of_o infant_n church_n membership_n than_o it_o be_v either_o in_o mercy_n for_o their_o good_a or_o in_o judgement_n for_o their_o hurt_n but_o he_o have_v neither_o revoke_v it_o in_o mercy_n for_o their_o good_a nor_o in_o judgement_n for_o their_o hurt_n this_o i_o shall_v prove_v in_o both_o part_n 1._o he_o have_v not_o revoke_v it_o in_o judgement_n for_o their_o hurt_n because_o many_o of_o they_o never_o break_v covenant_n with_o he_o either_o in_o their_o own_o person_n be_v in_o their_o infancy_n uncapable_a of_o actual_a sin_v or_o in_o their_o parent_n by_o virtue_n of_o relation_n to_o who_o they_o have_v a_o stand_n in_o the_o church_n many_o thousand_o of_o who_o be_v believer_n in_o the_o apostle_n time_n now_o god_n do_v not_o cast_v away_o they_o that_o do_v not_o cast_v away_o he_o for_o if_o he_o shall_v than_o he_o himself_o will_v be_v the_o covenant-breaker_n not_o man_n which_o will_v be_v blasphemous_a to_o conceive_v therefore_o he_o have_v not_o revoke_v this_o gift_n of_o church-member-ship_n as_o to_o infant_n in_o judgement_n for_o their_o hurt_n 2._o he_o have_v not_o do_v it_o in_o mercy_n for_o their_o good_a for_o than_o he_o will_v have_v grant_v to_o they_o some_o other_o mercy_n instead_o of_o it_o for_o it_o can_v be_v no_o mercy_n to_o take_v away_o a_o mercy_n as_o church-member-ship_n be_v unless_o to_o give_v a_o great_a in_o the_o room_n but_o there_o be_v no_o great_a mercy_n give_v to_o infant_n in_o stead_n of_o church-member_n ship_n if_o there_o be_v then_o pray_v show_v what_o it_o be_v if_o any_o shall_v be_v so_o weak_a as_o to_o say_v object_n object_n that_o christ_n come_v in_o the_o flesh_n be_v a_o great_a mercy_n give_v in_o the_o room_n of_o church-member-ship_n i_o answer_v 1._o what_o a_o fond_a thing_n be_v it_o to_o conceive_v 1_o answ_n 1_o that_o christ_n shall_v succeed_v church-member_n ship_n as_o a_o thing_n that_o be_v to_o be_v end_v in_o he_o to_o any_o 2._o i_o will_v fain_o know_v how_o infant_n while_o infant_n have_v christ_n now_o more_o than_o infant_n have_v he_o then_o when_o they_o be_v admit_v church-member_n 3._o the_o church_n be_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n and_o be_v it_o not_o absurd_a to_o say_v that_o christ_n shall_v break_v off_o infant_n from_o his_o body_n that_o he_o come_n in_o the_o flesh_n may_v be_v a_o great_a mercy_n to_o they_o what_o be_v that_o but_o to_o be_v a_o great_a mercy_n than_o himself_o there_o be_v then_o no_o great_a mercy_n give_v to_o infant_n in_o stead_n of_o church-member-ship_n therefore_o it_o be_v not_o take_v away_o in_o mercy_n neither_o and_o so_o by_o consequence_n not_o take_v away_o at_o all_o which_o way_n will_v you_o shift_v from_o this_o argument_n object_n object_n if_o you_o say_v the_o church-constitution_n whereof_o infant_n be_v member_n be_v take_v down_o and_o dissolve_v and_o a_o new_a set_v up_o whereof_o infant_n be_v no_o member_n i_o answer_v 1._o answer_n 1._o 1._o many_o yea_o most_o of_o the_o jew_n be_v break_v off_o from_o the_o church_n of_o god_n for_o their_o unbelief_n so_o that_o it_o be_v true_a that_o individual_a church_n may_v be_v say_v to_o be_v dissolve_v even_o as_o also_o the_o church_n of_o smyrna_n thyatira_n laodicea_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n for_o the_o most_o part_n be_v also_o dissolve_v and_o take_v down_o but_o that_o the_o essence_n and_o nature_n of_o the_o church_n be_v alter_v so_o as_o that_o they_o be_v not_o the_o same_o church_n of_o god_n that_o we_o be_v now_o be_v most_o contrary_a to_o plain_a scripture_n as_o rom._n 11.17_o where_o we_o read_v that_o all_o the_o change_n that_o be_v make_v be_v the_o break_n off_o of_o some_o branch_n of_o the_o jew_n and_o the_o graft_n in_o of_o some_o of_o the_o gentile_n into_o the_o same_o olive_n i_o e._n the_o same_o visible_a church_n again_o the_o bring_n in_o of_o the_o gentile_n be_v express_v by_o a_o break_n down_o of_o the_o partition_n wall_n so_o make_v they_o one_o church_n by_o let_v in_o the_o gentile_n into_o the_o same_o church_n that_o the_o jew_n be_v of_o before_o and_o when_o in_o a_o vision_n peter_n be_v teach_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o gentile_n reception_n into_o the_o church_n act_v 10._o we_o find_v it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v by_o make_v the_o jew_n unclean_a but_o by_o cleanse_v the_o gentile_n to_o become_v clean_a as_o the_o jew_n be_v so_o that_o it_o be_v plain_a this_o be_v the_o same_o church_n stand_v upon_o the_o same_o foundation_n of_o the_o covenant_n that_o that_o do_v and_o therefore_o some_o infant_n be_v still_o invest_v with_o the_o privilege_n of_o be_v member_n by_o the_o first_o grant_n and_o if_o church-member_n then_o to_o be_v baptize_v 2._o that_o all_o infant_n be_v not_o cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n under_o the_o gospel_n be_v clear_a from_o rom._n 11.20_o where_o it_o be_v say_v that_o such_o branch_n as_o be_v break_v off_o be_v break_v off_o for_o their_o unbelief_n but_o the_o unbelief_n of_o some_o that_o do_v not_o believe_v can_v not_o cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n the_o child_n of_o the_o believe_a jew_n therefore_o they_o remain_v still_o in_o the_o church_n how_o plain_o be_v this_o i_o have_v drive_v this_o nail_n to_o the_o head_n and_o let_v he_o shake_v this_o truth_n that_o can_v i_o dare_v venture_v to_o let_v loose_a this_o single_a argument_n to_o all_o the_o anabaptist_n in_o the_o world_n and_o they_o will_v have_v somewhat_o to_o do_v to_o answer_v it_o the_o other_o two_o argument_n with_o many_o more_o that_o may_v be_v bring_v prove_v infant_n church_n member_n and_o therefore_o to_o be_v baptize_v for_o if_o infant_n be_v holy_a as_o in_o the_o 1_o cor._n 7.14_o if_o of_o the_o kingdom_n of_o god_n as_o in_o mark_n 10.14_o then_o to_o be_v admit_v church-member_n and_o so_o to_o be_v baptize_v there_o be_v not_o one_o cavil_n to_o be_v make_v against_o these_o but_o what_o be_v full_o answer_v by_o mr_n baxter_n in_o his_o book_n of_o infant_n church-member-ship_n and_o therefore_o i_o shall_v say_v nothing_o to_o they_o here_o have_v bring_v one_o argument_n to_o a_o head_n and_o one_o argument_n be_v enough_o to_o prove_v one_o truth_n if_o there_o be_v no_o more_o but_o here_o you_o see_v how_o false_a it_o be_v that_o he_o say_v that_o our_o consequence_n to_o prove_v infant-baptisme_n be_v no_o better_o than_o such_o as_o he_o sugge_v all_o thing_n be_v not_o true_a that_o such_o man_n dare_v speak_v yea_o and_o print_v too_o he_o that_o have_v the_o impudence_n to_o print_v manifest_a falsehood_n touch_v matter_n of_o fact_n upon_o hope_n of_o be_v believe_v by_o some_o that_o will_v not_o be_v at_o the_o pain_n to_o seek_v out_o the_o truth_n will_v you_o may_v suspect_v speak_v and_o write_v many_o more_o falsehood_n in_o and_o about_o matter_n of_o faith_n but_o i_o will_v away_o to_o his_o four_o error_n his_o four_o error_n that_o god_n now_o reveal_v his_o will_v not_o only_o by_o the_o write_a word_n but_o by_o dream_n and_o vision_n more_o credit_v than_o the_o word_n this_o he_o dare_v not_o so_o confident_o to_o affirm_v as_o he_o do_v the_o former_a i_o believe_v the_o prison_n where_o i_o have_v hear_v he_o late_o be_v in_o london_n for_o his_o heresy_n have_v do_v he_o a_o little_a good_a in_o make_v he_o to_o speak_v wary_o sometime_o in_o weighty_a matter_n though_o he_o think_v he_o may_v rail_v against_o honest_a man_n impunè_fw-la yet_o no_o less_o than_o this_o do_v he_o assert_v page_n 7._o in_o these_o word_n rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v if_o some_o do_v hold_v this_o principle_n be_v it_o strange_a and_o ridiculous_a unto_o you_o have_v not_o god_n former_o reveal_v truth_n to_o his_o people_n by_o dream_n and_o revelation_n and_o dare_v you_o deny_v it_o now_o be_v god_n limit_v answer_n answer_n here_o you_o see_v he_o affirm_v that_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v account_v a_o strange_a thing_n to_o hold_v the_o above_o mention_v principle_n and_o he_o give_v his_o reason_n for_o it_o god_n do_v once_o so_o reveal_v himself_o and_o he_o be_v not_o limit_v now_o because_o
for_o that_o end_n as_o god_n be_v the_o author_n of_o spiritual_a life_n so_o be_v he_o of_o natural_a life_n also_o if_o thou_o be_v one_o that_o can_v live_v natural_o without_o food_n i_o will_v not_o much_o blame_v thou_o if_o thou_o say_v thou_o can_v live_v spiritual_o and_o thrive_v in_o further_a discovery_n of_o truth_n without_o the_o help_n of_o any_o of_o the_o mean_n before_o express_v but_o i_o shall_v say_v no_o more_o to_o this_o question_n have_v say_v enough_o i_o think_v to_o prove_v that_o it_o be_v a_o gross_a error_n to_o say_v that_o god_n now_o reveal_v his_o will_n not_o only_o by_o the_o write_a word_n but_o by_o dream_n and_o vision_n which_o be_v to_o be_v credit_v equal_o to_o or_o more_o than_o the_o word_n i_o descend_v unto_o his_o next_o error_n his_o five_o error_n that_o the_o saint_n need_v not_o ask_v the_o pardon_n of_o sin_n and_o that_o it_o be_v form_n and_o custom_n that_o carry_v they_o to_o this_o petition_n forgive_v we_o our_o sin_n this_o horrible_a heterodox_n unchristian_a unsanctified_a principle_n he_o vent_v in_o his_o plea_n for_o the_o four_o error_n charge_v upon_o the_o anabaptist_n in_o these_o word_n while_o the_o soul_n live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n rout_v the_o p.g._n rout_v and_o love_n it_o be_v then_o form_n or_o custom_n that_o carry_v he_o to_o that_o petition_n but_o when_o a_o soul_n apprehend_v the_o want_n of_o pardon_n let_v he_o ask_v it_o see_v how_o he_o labour_v to_o deceive_v you_o answer_n answer_n and_o to_o give_v you_o out_o his_o poison_n in_o sugar_v word_n if_o any_o one_o apprehend_v the_o want_n of_o pardon_n let_v he_o ask_v it_o but_o immediate_o before_o he_o say_v a_o christian_a while_n he_o be_v in_o a_o good_a temper_n while_o he_o live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n as_o his_o word_n be_v can_v put_v up_o that_o petition_n except_o formal_o and_o customary_o be_v not_o this_o brave_a divinity_n he_o lay_v down_o nothing_o to_o prove_v what_o he_o say_v he_o hope_v the_o novelty_n of_o his_o doctrine_n and_o its_o compliance_n with_o the_o spiritual_a pride_n of_o man_n heart_n will_v make_v it_o pass_v upon_o his_o own_o word_n only_o but_o let_v we_o weigh_v somewhat_o of_o that_o which_o may_v be_v say_v against_o this_o licentious_a principle_n 1._o do_v not_o christ_n teach_v and_o command_v his_o disciple_n to_o pray_v forgive_v we_o our_o sin_n mat._n 6.12_o 2._o do_v not_o they_o live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n when_o this_o command_n be_v give_v they_o be_v they_o not_o such_o then_o as_o can_v call_v god_n father_n and_o i_o hope_v such_o may_v go_v for_o man_n live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n as_o by_o the_o spirit_n of_o adoption_n can_v come_v unto_o god_n as_o a_o father_n and_o own_v he_o in_o so_o near_o a_o relation_n now_o it_o be_v plain_a touch_v the_o disciple_n that_o then_o when_o they_o have_v a_o discovery_n of_o the_o near_a and_o sweet_a relation_n unto_o god_n and_o can_v come_v to_o he_o say_v our_o father_n i_o say_v even_o than_o be_v they_o bid_v to_o pray_v forgive_v we_o our_o sin_n 3._o though_o i_o shall_v grant_v that_o the_o apostle_n have_v not_o such_o a_o full_a enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n as_o this_o man_n pretend_v to_o for_o observe_v it_o nothing_o will_v satisfy_v this_o kind_n of_o man_n unless_o they_o may_v be_v think_v in_o some_o thing_n or_o other_o to_o be_v more_o excellent_a than_o apostle_n themselves_o and_o such_o extraordinary_a instrument_n as_o christ_n entrust_v in_o lay_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o gospel-church_n i_o say_v though_o i_o shall_v be_v so_o far_o indulgent_a to_o their_o pride_n and_o arrogance_n as_o to_o grant_v this_o yet_o will_v christ_n teach_v any_o of_o his_o people_n to_o pray_v for_o such_o a_o thing_n as_o no_o christian_a living_n in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n which_o every_o true_a christian_n ought_v to_o do_v can_v pray_v for_o but_o either_o out_o of_o form_n or_o custom_n that_o be_v strange_a if_o such_o as_o live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n i._n e._n such_o as_o have_v a_o discovery_n oâ—_n god_n mercy_n and_o love_n to_o their_o soul_n may_v not_o pray_v for_o give_v we_o our_o sin_n then_o see_v how_o necessary_o some_o or_o all_o of_o these_o absurdity_n will_v follow_v from_o matth._n 6._o 1._o either_o christ_n command_n there_o 〈◊〉_d not_o to_o be_v obey_v which_o as_o far_o 〈…〉_o judge_v be_v his_o opinion_n or_o 2._o the_o disciple_n have_v not_o the_o discovery_n of_o god_n mercy_n and_o love_n to_o their_o soul_n and_o if_o so_o then_o 3._o a_o man_n may_v be_v able_a to_o own_o and_o come_v to_o god_n as_o a_o father_n as_o they_o do_v and_o yet_o not_o know_v god_n mercy_n and_o love_n to_o his_o soul_n which_o be_v a_o contradiction_n 4._o it_o will_v follow_v that_o christ_n teach_v and_o command_v his_o saint_n to_o do_v such_o thing_n as_o if_o they_o be_v right_o inform_v can_v be_v do_v but_o formal_o and_o out_o of_o custom_n and_o be_v not_o these_o gross_a absurdity_n such_o as_o a_o pious_a christian_n can_v bear_v but_o believer_n be_v justify_v from_o sin_n object_n object_n and_o so_o may_v not_o pray_v for_o the_o pardon_v of_o sin_n because_o it_o be_v already_o do_v in_o their_o justification_n if_o this_o be_v good_a argue_v 1_o answ_n 1_o how_o can_v we_o justify_v christ_n command_n bid_v his_o disciple_n to_o pray_v for_o forgiveness_n of_o sin_n be_v not_o they_o justify_v person_n i_o hope_v none_o will_v deny_v it_o but_o to_o clear_v this_o 2._o we_o must_v distinguish_v of_o two_o act_n of_o grace_n in_o the_o justify_n of_o sinner_n viz._n to_o justify_v a_o sinner_n from_o all_o his_o sin_n that_o he_o stand_v actual_o guilty_a of_o and_o then_o a_o continuation_n of_o justification_n from_o sin_n as_o it_o be_v afterward_o daily_o commit_v for_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o pardon_n another_o thing_n to_o continue_v to_o pardon_v now_o this_o latter_a christian_n live_v in_o the_o enjoyment_n of_o mercy_n and_o love_n may_v and_o must_v pray_v for_o 1._o 1._o reas_n 1._o because_o all_o the_o sure_a mercy_n of_o the_o covenant_n be_v to_o be_v receive_v in_o a_o way_n of_o prayer_n see_v ezek._n 36.37_o where_o observe_v that_o notwithstanding_o the_o lord_n declare_v his_o purpose_n to_o take_v away_o their_o iniquity_n vers_fw-la 33._o and_o to_o give_v out_o to_o they_o other_o mercy_n of_o the_o covenant_n yet_o he_o lay_v in_o this_o caution_n vers_fw-la 37._o notwithstanding_o i_o will_v be_v seek_v unto_o or_o inquire_v of_o to_o do_v this_o for_o they_o he_o will_v have_v pardon_n sue_v out_o by_o prayer_n in_o order_n to_o the_o particular_a application_n of_o it_o in_o respect_n of_o particular_a fin_n daily_o commit_v 2._o 2._o reas_n 2._o christ_n he_o continual_o intercede_v and_o pray_v for_o believer_n in_o heaven_n and_o that_o for_o this_o particular_a favour_n viz._n pardon_v of_o sin_n see_v 1_o john_n 2.1_o 2._o my_o little_a child_n these_o thing_n write_v i_o unto_o you_o that_o you_o sin_v not_o and_o if_o any_o man_n sin_n we_o have_v a_o advocate_n with_o the_o father_n jesus_n christ_n the_o righteous_a etc._n etc._n mark_v it_o if_o saint_n sin_n they_o have_v christ_n for_o a_o advocate_n now_o wherefore_o shall_v he_o advocate_n or_o plead_v for_o they_o upon_o their_o sin_v if_o not_o for_o pardon_v now_o do_v christ_n plead_v for_o the_o pardon_n of_o believer_n and_o may_v not_o they_o for_o their_o own_o pardon_n be_v not_o christ_n intercession_n in_o heaven_n a_o good_a rule_n for_o our_o prayer_n on_o earth_n you_o have_v another_o place_n to_o this_o purpose_n heb._n 7.25_o from_o which_o scripture_n i_o do_v demand_v why_o christ_n be_v say_v to_o be_v able_a to_o save_v to_o the_o utmost_a in_o that_o he_o ever_o intercede_v unless_o it_o be_v because_o by_o his_o intercession_n he_o obtain_v a_o continuation_n of_o pardon_n and_o a_o application_n of_o it_o in_o respect_n of_o particular_a sin_n daily_o commit_v and_o shall_v any_o one_o think_v that_o there_o be_v need_n christ_n shall_v pray_v in_o heaven_n for_o pardon_n of_o sin_n and_o no_o need_n believer_n shall_v on_o earth_n ah_o it_o be_v a_o brave_a religion_n you_o shall_v learn_v of_o these_o doctor_n if_o you_o have_v a_o mind_n to_o credit_v they_o but_o it_o matter_n not_o what_o it_o be_v so_o it_o be_v new_a and_o contrary_a to_o the_o teach_n of_o the_o faithful_a minister_n of_o christ_n who_o this_o pamphlete_a labour_n to_o vilify_v i_o can_v bring_v you_o forth_o the_o example_n of_o many_o of_o the_o most_o eminentand_fw-mi precious_a saint_n in_o scripture_n
etc._n etc._n to_o this_o he_o answer_v three_o thing_n 1._o it_o be_v know_v and_o yourselves_o know_v your_o ordination_n come_v from_o thence_o rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v this_o be_v a_o bold_a falsehood_n as_o i_o shall_v evidence_n more_o full_o anon_o never_o do_v any_o protestant_n go_v to_o rome_n for_o ordination_n it_o be_v true_a in_o time_n of_o the_o first_o reformation_n begin_v by_o luther_n those_o worthy_n that_o be_v ordain_v minister_n in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n according_a to_o the_o corrupt_a way_n of_o ordane_v then_o in_o use_n after_o they_o be_v make_v sensible_a of_o the_o corruption_n and_o witness_v against_o it_o and_o become_v instrument_n of_o gather_v out_o the_o precious_a from_o the_o vile_a be_v not_o again_o ordain_v but_o by_o virtue_n of_o what_o call_v they_o have_v do_v ordain_v other_o after_o a_o more_o pure_a and_o regular_a way_n and_o have_v we_o our_o call_n from_o rome_n and_o antichrist_n therefore_o that_o be_v very_o strange_a but_o he_o add_v they_o viz_o the_o papist_n do_v not_o say_v that_o your_o ordination_n in_o its_o rise_n come_v not_o from_o they_o rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v but_o in_o the_o present_a its_o not_o approve_v of_o by_o they_o this_o be_v also_o a_o false_a hood_n reply_n reply_n as_o full_a of_o ignorance_n as_o the_o other_o be_v of_o boldness_n i_o believe_v he_o never_o read_v what_o any_o of_o they_o say_v as_o to_o this_o thing_n it_o be_v most_o evident_a that_o they_o do_v flat_o deny_v any_o succession_n of_o our_o ministry_n from_o they_o and_o therefore_o call_v our_o minister_n in_o queen_n elizabeth_n time_n and_o so_o downward_o bellarmunus_n downward_o scultingius_n bristous_n sanderus_n bellarmunus_n ministros_fw-la parliamentarios_fw-la and_o ministros_fw-la reginales_fw-la queen_n minister_n and_o parliament_n minister_n and_o they_o give_v the_o reason_n non_fw-fr a_fw-fr legitima_fw-la consecratione_fw-la aut_fw-la inauguratione_fw-la catholica_fw-la sed_fw-la a_o regina_fw-la &_o parliamentis_fw-la svam_fw-la authoritatem_fw-la ementitam_fw-la derivant_n i_o e._n they_o derive_v their_o feign_a authority_n not_o from_o lawful_a consecration_n or_o catholic_a inauguration_n but_o from_o the_o queen_n and_o two_o house_n of_o parliament_n to_o this_o purpose_n speak_v the_o popish_a writer_n mention_v in_o the_o margin_n with_o other_o and_o yet_o do_v not_o his_o ignorance_n make_v he_o so_o bold_a as_o to_o say_v that_o the_o papist_n do_v not_o deny_v our_o ministry_n in_o its_o rise_n to_o come_v from_o they_o sure_o these_o man_n think_v there_o be_v nothing_o true_a but_o what_o they_o know_v when_o alas_o poor_a soul_n the_o lord_n know_v they_o have_v but_o little_a to_o help_v they_o to_o know_v very_o much_o but_o he_o add_v in_o the_o three_o place_n 3._o rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v grant_v by_o way_n of_o concession_n that_o what_o you_o say_v be_v truth_n yet_o be_v there_o but_o one_o antichrist_n in_o the_o world_n etc._n etc._n this_o he_o say_v to_o show_v you_o reply_n reply_n how_o our_o minister_n may_v be_v antichristian_a though_o their_o ordination_n come_v not_o from_o rome_n say_v he_o there_o be_v more_o antichrist_n than_o one_o to_o this_o i_o answer_v 1._o see_v here_o he_o begin_v to_o fear_v lest_o he_o shall_v not_o be_v able_a to_o make_v it_o good_a that_o our_o minister_n ordination_n come_v from_o rome_n and_o therefore_o seek_v a_o new_a start_a hole_n there_o be_v more_o antichrist_n than_o one_o therefore_o they_o may_v be_v antichristian_a though_o their_o ordination_n come_v not_o from_o the_o pope_n 2._o i_o confess_v there_o be_v other_o antichrist_n beside_o the_o pope_n the_o p._n g._n rout_v and_o the_o man_n of_o his_o principle_n be_v antichrist_n be_v against_o christ_n baptism_n ministry_n church_n if_o no_o more_o but_o i_o hope_v our_o minister_n have_v never_o ordination_n from_o they_o and_o therefore_o be_v not_o antichristian_a beside_o the_o pope_n on_o the_o one_o hand_n who_o be_v literal_a antichrist_n and_o the_o familisticall_a enthusiast_n of_o our_o time_n on_o the_o other_o hand_n who_o be_v mystical_a antichrist_n i_o for_o my_o part_n know_v no_o notable_a antichrist_n in_o the_o world_n if_o he_o have_v tell_v what_o antichrist_n our_o minister_n have_v their_o ordination_n from_o if_o not_o from_o the_o pope_n i_o shall_v have_v know_v what_o further_o reply_v to_o make_v but_o now_o i_o must_v follow_v he_o in_o his_o answer_n to_o the_o 4_o argument_n the_o four_o argument_n if_o their_o ordination_n be_v antichristian_a then_o can_v they_o with_o modesty_n accuse_v our_o minister_n as_o antichristian_a 4._o arg._n 4._o but_o their_o ordination_n be_v antichristian_a which_o be_v by_o the_o people_n whereas_o christ_n rule_n be_v that_o pastor_n shall_v ordain_v pastor_n act_n 14.23_o 1_o tim._n 4.14_o tit._n 1.5_o therefore_o etc._n etc._n to_o this_o he_o answer_v a_o goodly_a argument_n sir_n rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v as_o if_o because_o we_o be_v antichristian_a therefore_o you_o may_v be_v so_o by_o a_o law_n learned_a logic_n etc._n etc._n oh_o the_o stupid_a ignorance_n of_o this_o fellow_n reply_n reply_n be_v that_o the_o conclusion_n the_o argument_n conclude_v not_o that_o our_o minister_n be_v not_o antichristian_a but_o that_o the_o anabaptist_n can_v with_o modesty_n call_v they_o so_o because_o their_o own_o ministry_n be_v antichristian_a be_v contrary_a to_o christ_n rule_n and_o that_o i_o hope_n be_v undeniable_a whereas_o he_o go_v on_o say_v that_o as_o to_o the_o ordination_n mention_v by_o the_o people_n he_o know_v none_o such_o true_o i_o believe_v he_o because_o for_o the_o most_o part_n these_o man_n own_v no_o ordination_n at_o all_o but_o that_o ordination_n that_o they_o have_v where_o they_o have_v any_o be_v by_o the_o people_n as_o he_o confess_v if_o there_o be_v any_o sense_n in_o the_o word_n that_o follow_v but_o as_o yet_o i_o take_v they_o to_o be_v pure_a nonsense_n in_o a_o dress_n of_o new_a word_n to_o deceive_v affectour_n of_o novelty_n if_o there_o be_v any_o sense_n i_o say_v in_o what_o he_o go_v on_o to_o speak_v in_o this_o answer_n it_o affirm_v that_o their_o ordination_n be_v by_o the_o people_n and_o if_o such_o a_o ordination_n be_v good_a how_o be_v it_o that_o page_n 97._o he_o say_v it_o be_v a_o paradox_n to_o affirm_v that_o any_o one_o can_v give_v ordination_n to_o another_o that_o have_v it_o not_o himself_o sure_o the_o man_n seem_v to_o have_v a_o bad_a memory_n or_o we_o shall_v not_o read_v such_o gross_a contradiction_n their_o ordination_n be_v good_a though_o it_o be_v only_o by_o the_o people_n and_o yet_o our_o minister_n ordination_n not_o good_a or_o valid_a because_o those_o that_o ordain_v they_o be_v no_o minister_n if_o there_o be_v any_o reconcile_n of_o these_o two_o then_o may_v we_o reconcile_v fire_n and_o water_n light_n and_o darkness_n the_o five_o argument_n those_o minister_n which_o be_v elect_v 5._o arg._n 5._o prove_v ordain_v etc._n etc._n according_a to_o the_o mind_n of_o christ_n can_v be_v antichristian_a but_o the_o minister_n of_o england_n now_o be_v so_o therefore_o they_o can_v be_v antichristian_a to_o this_o he_o give_v a_o threefold_a answer_n to_o which_o i_o shall_v make_v reply_n in_o order_n 1._o tour_n minor_n i_o deny_v you_o have_v no_o such_o election_n rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v because_o you_o have_v no_o church_n of_o christ_n etc._n etc._n but_o profess_v hypocrite_n this_o be_v a_o unchristian_a slander_n reply_n reply_n need_v speak_v nothing_o to_o it_o if_o any_o man_n can_v think_v that_o all_o church_n except_o anabaptist_n be_v but_o profess_v hypocrite_n i_o count_v he_o not_o worthy_a of_o a_o answer_n he_o add_v 2._o rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v those_o church_n such_o as_o they_o be_v never_o elect_v you_o etc._n etc._n this_o be_v a_o downright_a falsehood_n reply_n reply_n like_o much_o of_o the_o rest_n of_o his_o book_n see_v as_o it_o be_v well_o know_v none_n be_v admit_v to_o place_n without_o a_o call_n from_o the_o people_n or_o the_o better_a part_n of_o they_o 3._o rout_v the_o p._n g._n rout_v you_o be_v say_v he_o never_o prove_v viz._n of_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o lord_n and_o his_o way_n but_o of_o your_o learning_n etc._n etc._n this_o likewise_o be_v most_o untrue_a reply_n reply_n and_o know_v to_o be_v so_o by_o all_o that_o be_v acquaint_v with_o the_o examination_n that_o such_o as_o be_v ordain_v pass_v under_o for_o when_o any_o one_o present_v himself_o to_o be_v ordain_v first_o of_o all_o testimoniall_n under_o the_o hand_n of_o man_n of_o undoubted_a credit_n be_v require_v to_o witness_v to_o his_o blameless_a conversation_n when_o such_o testimoniall_n be_v produce_v then_o be_v the_o person_n examine_v first_o concern_v the_o work_n of_o grace_n on_o his_o heart_n of_o which_o if_o he_o can_v