into two Lutherans and Zuinglians As for Illyrians if you call them of Flaccius Illyricus they be Lutherans in opinion of the Sacrament and differ onely in ceremonies which can not diuide them from the faith Caluine and they that be of his iudgement agree plainly with Zuinglius so that of fiue names there remaine but two sortes differing in opinion whereunto you ioyne the Swenkefeldians and Anabaptistes Now to your question these be not all of one Church for the Swenkefeldians Anabaptists be detestable heretiks but the Lutherans Zuingliās as it pleaseth you to cal thē are of one true church although they differ in one opinion cōcerning the Sacramēt for although the one affirme a real presence the other deny it yet they both cōsent in this that the body of Christ is receiued spiritually not corporally with the hart and not with the mouth Wherfore this dissention is not so great though there be error on the one side but that they may be both of the Church of Christ as well as S. Cyprian the Martyr and all the Bishops of Africa and a great many of Asia differing with Stephanus bishop of Rome and the rest of his opinion in rebaptizing such as were baptized by heretiks 2 And if either they can proue vnto me that these being of such diuersitie in faith and religion make one Church WE haue alwaies abhorred the heresies of the Anabaptistes Libertines Swenkefeldians Dauidians Seruitians and all such But that Luther Zuinglius may be both of one Church differing onely in one opinion of the Sacrament is declared before 3 Or that each of their sects may giue saluation to their folowers being so disagreable one with an other in high points of our Religion SAluation is the gift of God and not in the power of any company or sect of men but this we affirme that out of that Church whereof we count Luther and Zuinglius notwithstanding their diuerse opinions which is but in one matter of the Sacrament to be members there is no saluation 4 Or that I should beleue all these rather then the Catholike Church or one of these more then another all making such a bold chalenge of the truth and Gospell NO man requireth you to beleue all these but the true Catholike Church onely Neither doe we requite you to beleue any one company of men more then an other but to beleue the trueth before falshood Now which of them hath the truth that they all brag of you must search in the word of truth desiring the spirite of truth that you may vnderstand and beleue the truth and so without doubt you shall come to the knowledge of the truth and of the Church of God which is the piller and stay of truth 5 Let the Protestants of all these kindes put their heades together and shew me a reason of these thinges and with all let them among them selues agree to what sorte of these sectes they woulde haue me and I will recant SVch is your impudencie in this matter as in all other that you woulde make men beleue that the Anabaptistes Swenkefeldians Libertins and other abhominable heretikes be Protestantes But it is well that you can make none but fooles thinke so as for the Protestantes they neede take no great deliberation to aunswere your demandes but you had more neede to laye your heades together to reconcile the Thomistes Albertistes Ockamistes Scotistes Reales and Nominalls which be all sectes of Papistes and especially your Canonistes and diuines about the articles of your religion that is whether the Pope be aboue the Councell or the Councel aboue the Pope Whether the Pope may erre and not the Councell or whether the Councell maye erre and not the Pope These two the Popes determination and the Councells determination being the rules of trueth in your religion and not agreed vpon how can any trueth be certeine in your Church As for Luther and Zuinglius they agree vpon one rule of trueth that is the worde of God and differ onely for the applying or laying of this rule yet but in one matter that not the greatest But you Papists some holding of the Pope and some of the Councell as rules of truth can haue no ground nor certainty thereof Therefore if you woulde haue me or any man to be of your belefe First determine how I shal know when I am in a right beleefe one sayeth if the councell alloweth it an other sayeth if the Pope alloweth what shall I doe when one of these is against an other yea when one Pope is against an other and one councell against an other shall I thinke that trueth changeth so often as they change Moreouer when one Pope graunteth that the councell is aboue the Pope and that the Pope maye erre Likewise one councell graunteth that the Pope is aboue the councell and that the councell may erre as it hath bene within the 200. yeares the councells of Constance and Basill determined that the councell was aboue the Pope and that the Pope maye erre Contrariwise the councell of Ferraria and Florence determined that the Pope was aboue the councell and that the councell might erre Martinus 5. the Pope chosen by the councell of Constance was of the same iudgement that the councell But Eugenius 4. that gathered the councell of Ferraria and Florence against the councell of Basill was of the contrarie iudgement Nowe I woulde saye he were a wittie fellow that coulde reconcile this geare together For if he be a Canonist that holdeth this opinion that the Pope can not erre whē the Pope him self graunteth that he may erre which waye shall he turne him selfe For if this proposition be true the Pope can not erre then this is true also that the Pope may erre for if he can not erre he can not erre in saying so And if the Pope erred in saying he coulde erre where he can not erre then this proposition is false the Pope can not erre so one proposition shal be both true and false which is impossible Likewise if he holde that hilde that the councell can not erre and the councell it selfe confesseth it that it may erre Gentle maister N. reconcile me these together which concerne a case that hath bene in practise and still is in the Papistrie and maye here trouble a mans conscience that woulde beleue your church and if he haue any wit restraine him for euer comming into your church If you can not vntie this knot nor winde your selfe out of this maze vnlesse you will be still obstinate it were wisedome for you to recant The 18. article hath but one demande I demande whether they were euer of the true Catholike church which either tooke to them selues newe names of religion according to the calling of any secte maister or liked not so well the name of Catholike or Christian as of their seuerall teachers as to be called of Arius Arians or of Caluine Caluinistes or of Luther Lutheranes
of the Arrians and being brought vp by them had learned that article to beleue the Catholike church which the Arrians would expound to be them selues if afterward by God his helpe this man vnderstood that the church of the Arrians was not the catholike church as he was taught it was but that Athanasius and a few other that were banished and persecuted were the true Catholike church he was bounde to leaue the Arrians commonly called the church and to ioyne him selfe with the secret banished hidde and persecuted church of Christ. But as for your Popish church in that time of blindenesse and error taught not the people that article nor any other but kept them backe from the knowledge as well of that article as of all other thinges that were necessary to their saluation for you taught them nothing els but to pronounce and that full il fauoredly like popingeys certeine latine wordes which they vnderstoode no more than stockes or stones So that the people had no instruction of you no not of the name of God in many places but that they receiued by vncertaine talke of their parentes as it were from hande to hande for how many thousand parishes are there in Englande that within these 60. yeares woulde declare that they neuer hearde sermon in their life As for that they hearde of their seruice they learned as much of it as of the ringing of their belles which was a sounde without vnderstanding Therefore you may be ashamed to speake of teaching the people their belefe and all thinges necessary for saluation when you haue counted it heresie to learne their creede in English or to reade the scripture in English in which is conteined all thing necessary to be knowen for euerlasting saluation Finally because you requier me to shew you that the Christian people of those dayes were bounde to beleue any other church than that which taught them the article of the church and baptised them I trow I will so shew it you that for both your eares you dare not deny it how saye you The Christian people of the Greeke church which were taught by the Greeke church that article of the church and by the same Greeke church were baptised whether ought they to beleue any other church but the Greeke church If you say no then you acknowledge the Greeke church to be the true church which denieth the Popes authoritie if you saye yea Then you are welcome home you recant The 22. article although it be very confuse yet it conteyneth in effect 3. demandes 1 I aske also whether any man for the space of that 1000. yeres of blindenes could be saued out of that secrete and small Church which they say was the true Church if they aunswer me there might be some saued with our Sacraments and in the Communion or fellowship of the Papistes out of the Protestants Church then there was a way to heauen out of Gods Church if they say that none could be saued by our Sacraments out of their close Church then all men yong and old perished for those yeares without any hope of mercy because they could not vnite them selues and be incorporate to that company and Congregation whereof they neuer neither hearde nor coulde by any meanes surmise Therefore let any man aliue proue vnto me that either any man could out of the true Church be saued NO man aliue that knoweth what the true Church meaneth will say that any man can be saued out of the true Church for he that is not a member of the body of Christ caÌ„ by no meanes receiue any benefit of Christ to his saluation Therefore how long so euer the true Church were hidden whether it were a thousand yeres as you beare men in hand that we should say or two thousand yeares it is not materiall this is certeyne that out of this Church none could be saued and though you count it smal as in deede in respect of the world it is but a small flocke and fewe are elected and fewe finde the streit gate of life Luke 12. Matth. 7. 20. yet is the number of it greater then mans eye commonly can discerne As when Elias thought that he only had bene left alone of the true Church God answered that he had yet reserued 7000. that neuer bowed their knee to Baal 1. Reg. 19. And as Esay declareth when the people shoulde be almost all destroyed yet a remnant should be saued which though it seemed to be small yet it should ouerflow and fill all the world with righteousnes Esa. 10. and though it shal be like a gathering of grapes when vintage is ended or the shaking of an oliue tree when men thinke they haue left noâ—hing vppon it yet there be two or three in the toppe amonge the boughes foure or fiue vnder the leaues in the highest braÌ„ches Esay 17. 24. 2 Or that any other company could be knowne for the true and onely Church but our common Catholike societie THe true Catholike Church was neuer so secrete or hidden but it might be knowne of all those that had eyes to see it whose hartes were lightened with the spirite of God and were enstructed by the worde of God that they might vnderstande the trueth and knowe the spouse of Christ from the common strompet of Antichrist 3 Or that all men were damned for a thousand yeares togither because they coulde not finde nor surmise of any other Church then that which practiseth all holy functions which Christ left for our saluation in the world and I recant WE take not vpon vs to medle with God his iudgments whom he condemneth for what causes further then the word of God teacheth vs namely that as many as haue not beleued in the onely sonne of God are condemned for their vnbeliefe other secret causes we remit to his secrete counsell and knowledge And wheras you say that the popish church practiseth all holy functions that Christ left for the saluation of his Church it is most false for first you doe not preach remission of sinnes in the bloode of Christ onely for either you preach not all or else you preach remission of sinnes in any thing rather then the onely merites of Christ as in mens owne merites workes of supererogation pardons masses beggarly ceremonies as holy water auriculer confession c. Secondly you minister not the Sacraments purely according to Christ his institution but either corrupt and defile them with mans traditioÌ„s as you do Baptisme or else cleane chauÌ„ge the vse of them as in the Lordes Supper which you make a Sacrifice an idoll a Priestes breakfast and defraude the people of the one halfe of the sacrament as though you were wiser then he that instituted it in both kindes Thirdly discipline you haue conuerted into tyranny and couetousnes reteyning nothing but the name of it alone Wherefore seeing you exercise no holy function after Christ his institution but cleane contrary to the same and doe
woulde haue robbed the Church of the actes of the Apostles A sect called Alogiani do refuse the Gospell of S. Iohn with the Apocalypse Martine illiricus Caluine and their companions that no man being but an heretique shoulde euer out pricke them will shoulder with the proudest and lifte out of our Bibles the bookes of Machabees with S. Iames Epistle and more when more nede requireth The which Epistle as also the Epistles of Iohn and Iudas were once doubted of not as conteining any matter wherof the trueth was vncertaine but as bookes not knowen to be of like force as canonicall scripture in the impugning of heresies or confirming articles of belefe as all workes be till Gods Church haue published their authority and declared all thinges in them conteined to be of the same credit that the spirite of God is and of Gospell like trueth And by that authority of the Church what booke so euer be allowed though it was not so taken before yet now we must needes accept it sicut vere est verbum Dei as the very word of god And so be these canonicall Epistles and bookes of Machabees as before is declared Here nowe euery man may learne that it is a very daungerous matter to geue lesse credit to any of these bookes or wauer in any point of faith written in them for such fellowes iudgements that nowe amongest them haue lefte vs neither olde nor newe Testament Such stubborne boldenesse had these willfull men in mainteinaunce of mischeuous doctrine VVhose open impudencie was counted handsome conueiaunce of their scholers and adherents which were very many notwithstanding the Catholike Christian men in all ages both meruailed and lamented their blindnesse And yet doubtlesse it is not much to be wondered at to see that man flatly forsake the scripture of God who is not abashed to refuse and condemne that sense and vnderstanding of the Scripture which the whole Church with all her learned men haue euer allowed and counted most holy VVell by the strength of this piller we haue chalenged and saued hitherto for all the barking of bandogges the Scripture of God with the knowne meaning thereof And so I trust we shall doe still from the new aduersaries by the assured promise of thassistance of Gods holy spirite which shall leade vs not onely to the true canonicall Scriptures with the sense of the same but also guide vs in all truth necessary for our saluation Let euery man therefore here take heede how he doubteth of the knowne and certayne sense that the Church of Christ by decree of councell or consent of doctors applyeth to any Scripture least by mistrusting the sayd sense he goe forward vnaduisedly from open deniall of the common to found a priuate meaning of his owne in the stubborne defense whereof when he shall against the truth malipertly stand he goeth vnluckely forward at the end blasphemously reiecteth the blessed word sacred Scripture of God as we haue proued the auncient enemies of truth to haue done and as in these new sect maisters we may to our great dolour see Yet loe euen these are they that in all ages as Vincentius sayth flye in their talke and teaching ouer the law the prophets the Psalmes the Gospell That cry out of pottes pulpits nothing but Gods word the booke of the Lorde the testament of Iesus Christ Paule scripture as it may be supposed and as in th ende it is proued to driue out of doores Paule Scripture Testament and Christ too and not to bring into the peoples heades or heartes the feare and loue of God the holsom precepts of Paules heauenly preaching nor the true meaning of any Scripture VVho being vrged will rather credit a minstrells ballat then the Machabeis or best booke in the Bible But now you may see that whiles these men thought to saue their credits by miscrediting the Scripture they haue wrought so wisely that they haue lost their owne credits both in this poynt and in all other for euer And as they hoped by deniall of Scripture to cloke their errour they haue wonne to them selues the property of an heretike by open shew of their owne folly 3 And euen as vaine friuolous is this discourse that followeth to shew what bookes of scripture were in olde time refused by what heretikes But you thinke to match vs with them for denying the Machabees where vnto you adde the Epistle of S. Iames. If Martine and Illyricus haue some times doubted of that Epistle they are not the first that doubted of it Eusebius sayth plainely it is a counterfect Epistle lib. 2. cap. 23. And yet he was not accompted an heretike I saye not this to excuse them that doubt of it for I am perswaded they are more curious then wise in so doing but whereas you ioine Caluine with them it is because you can not leaue to lye with out shame while you are an instrument to defend diuelish errors with out shewe of trueth For Caluine receiueth it defendeth it expoundeth it and in all his writings allegeth it as canonical scripture Therefore if he were as ill as you compt him yet it were shame to lye on the deuill But we shall not nede to â—ake among the olde heresies to finde what bookes of holy Scripture you Papistes refuse when it is an easy matter to take your owne confessions and bolde assertions by which it is manifest that you doe not as those heretikes which you name reiect some one or two bookes but the whole authority of all the canonicall scriptures For when you affiâ—me that no booke of holy Scripture is canonicall but so farre forth as your Church will allow it who seeth not that you doe abrogate all maiestie and authoritie from the word of God submitting it to the iudgements of men Moreouer when you will not admit any sence of the scripture but such as your Church wil allow although the same be contrary to the plaine wordes thereof what authority doe you leaue to the worde of God which you make to be but a dead lettre vntil you geue it such a sence as it pleaseth you Finally where you make decrees of men either priuate or common customes traditions vnwritten verities in which is no certainety at all not onely equiualent but also oftentimes superior to the auctority of holy scriptures what certainety credit or estimation doe you leaue to the scriptures of God aboue other writinges nay all other writinges are in better case then the scriptures are with you For other writings may be compted the workes of their authors with out your censure the holy Scripture may not be compted the worde of God except you list so to allow it which may as well refuse that which is Gods worde in deede as you receiue and obtrude that which is not the worde of God at all Other writings haue such sence as the authors haue expressed them selues in their workes and maye be gathered by their wordes The
whose workes the aduersaries woulde be glad of one likely sentence And whose life and doctrine are so glorious in Gods Church that their owne aduersaries raling at vs aliue yet dare not but with great feare once blemish their names departed Though sometimes it brastithe out in some one of them to their owne miscredit So beutifull is the light of trueth And on the other side howe miserable is their carefull case that followe and defende that doctrine the authors whereof they dare neither acknowledge nor name whome all good men with open mouth boldely doe reprehend and their owne scholars dare not defende Such a glorious maiesty this doctrine of theires beareth that pricketh vp with pryde those that be alyue and blotteth out of honest memorie her doctors that be deade 10 Nay M. Allen though those doctors build some hay or stuble vpon the onely foundation Christ their case is ten thousand times better then yours which build nothing but dirt and donge tempered with hay and stuble vpon no foundation at all except it be the sande and seeke by all meanes to digge vp the onely true foundation of our fayth Iesus Christ making him nothing better then a common person except his bare name and woe may be to such Catholikes as can finde nothing but hay and stuble where such store of precious matter is and the most precious corner stone the foundation of all excellency And happy be those which not regarding the streames of waters that runne through the vaynes of earth but seeking to the onely fountayne of heauenly truth conteyned in the holy scriptures haue certeyne comfort of saluation while they are aliue and sure possession of felicitie with Christ as soone as they are dead yea which dye not at all because they beleue in Christ which is life nor enter into iudgement but passe from death of this body which is temporall vnto life of body and soule which is eternall The first Author of that secte vvhich denieth prayers for the departed is noted his good condicions and cause of his error be opened vvhat kinde of men haue bene most bent in all ages to that secte And that this heresy is euer ioyned as a fit companion to other horrible sectes CAP. XIIII 1 BVt yet because they haue diffamed our practise in praying and offering for the deade by referring it to a later origine then the Apostolike authority and tradition seeing we haue fathered our vsage vpon such as the aduersaries dare not blame we will helpe them to seeke out the fathers of their faithles perswasion lest by the feare and bashfullnesse of their owne scholars they be vnkindly forgotten Mary to finde out these obscure loyterers it will be somewhat painefull because as theeues doe they kepe by wayes and lightly treade not in honest mens pathes For the finding out of recordes for the testimony of our trueth we kepte the day light the high waye of Gods Church All the knowen notable personages in the holy Citye of God offered them selues both to witnesse and proue with vs VVe droue this trueth from our dayes through the middest of that holy communitie which S. Augustine calleth the Citye of God and our aduersaries will not saye otherwise but they were the liuely membres of that happy and heauenly fellowship VVe brought the practise of it to the holy Apostles by plaine accompte we went with the trueth of our cause to the lawe of Moyses from thense by like light to the lawe of nature But nowe for the other sorte we must leaue the cytie of God and the fellowship of these noble personages of doctors Apostles Prophets and Patriarches and seeke on the lifte hande in the other citye which is of Augustine named the citye or common welth as a man might call it of the deuill in which body all practise of mischiefe and origin of error ishuing from that vnhappy heade to the corrupt and deadly limmes thereof is to be founde VVe shall heare of the aduersary perswasion then in the company of Anabaptistes of Arrians of Saduceis of Epicures where so euer the weedes of the common enemies corrupte seede groweth there shall we find amongest breares and brembles this choking weede with all For as the true preachers the Apostles of Christ Iesu did sowe in the beginning of the Christian church which was the springe of the worde of lyfe and trueth amongest other heauenly seedes of true doctrine that profitable practise for the reliefe of such as were hense departed in the sleepe of peace with the decent ordre which euer fithens the Catholicke Church hath obediently followed euen so Inimicus homo superseminauit zizania the common enemy came afterwarde and ouersewe darnell and cockle either for the vtter choking or else for the especiall let of that good seede which the Maister of this fielde by his houshold seruauntes had plentifully sowen before This common aduersarie as our maister him selfe expoundeth it is the Deuill who as he in all other thinges beneficiall to mankinde is a great staye so Christian mens commoditie in this point he notably hindereth by his wicked suggestions and deuilish deuise whereby he prouoketh many vnder the shewe of Gods word or bare name therof for that is the lambes cote which this wyely wolfe boroweth to maske in to be vnkind vnnaturall and with out all godly affection towards their departed frendes The which contrary corrupt seede of false doctrine we right well know came of the sayd aduersary because it was long after ouersowen learning further of Tertullian Id verum esse quodcunque primum id adulterinum quod posterius That to be true that was first taught and that to be false and forged which came latter CAP. XIIII 1 WHen the Apostolike writing can not be shewed it is but the poynt of an heretike to boast of Apostolike tradition So did the Valentinians although their heresie were newe when they were confuted by the Scriptures shrowed them selues vnder the name of traditions as we haue shewed before out of Irenaeus lib. 3. ca. 2. And therfore it is but vayne bragging that you promise to seeke out any other fathers of our perswasion then the Apostles of Christ by whose holy writings we neuer refuse to be iudged what if any heretike haue affirmed some thing that is true is truth worse in an heretikes mouth The deuills them selues confessed christ Their confession was true their testimony was refused So if any heretike haue confessed the truth we may receiue the truth and yet reiect his testimony For truth hath testimony of God his word and whether it be affirmed or denyed by the deuill it is all one The high way that you prate of is a bye way for the Scripture is the onely high way to the truth with the guidance of Gods spirite And yet that way which you haue taken hath so many hills and holes woods and thickets that you haue rather flyen ouer it in a dreame and imagination
doth recant The third article conteyneth 5. demandes 1 Shew me why our common knowen Church did not as well corrupt the text of the Testament as the true religion conteyned in the same THere may be diuers good reasons shewed why your Church commonly knowen to be the church of Antichrist did not as well corrupt the text of the Testament as the true religion conteined therein First because she coulde not the copies thereof being so many by the prouidence of God dispersed throughout the worlde Secondly because she thought it not so needefull hauing other meanes to worke her deuilish deuise For although she coulde not corrupt the scripture yet it made the lesse matter because she founde meanes to diminish and controll the authority therof by aduancing decrees of men Popes and Councells to be equall or of greater authoritie than the scripture Thirdly because she woulde be lesse in feare to be reproued by the scripture she prouided that the knowledge thereof shoulde be hidden from the vnlearned people by a strange tongue and from the learned by the tedious mazes of questions deuised by her Canonistes and Sententiaries Fourthly because she submitted all interpretation of the scripture to her owne iudgement and therefore woulde not be controlled by the iudgement thereof but woulde alwayes expound it as it liked her best As appeareth by Ockam and Duns who though they confesse that transubstantiation seemeth to them contrary to the scripture and reason yet they beleued it because of the authoritie of the church and for none other cause These are the reasons why the Romish church did not as well corrupt the text of the Testamēt as the true Religion And yet how corrupt that Latine translation is which they woulde needes thrust vpō vs is sufficiently knowen to all learned men euen in such texts as are the most coulerable places for the defence of Popish doctrine I will geue one example for all They alleage the text 1. Cor. 10. Qui stat videat ne cadat He that standeth let him take heede he fall not against the certainetie of faith whereas the Greeke hath not he that standeth but he that thinketh he standeth let him take heede he fall not Thus the popish church cannot altogether excuse her selfe from corrupting of the text of the Testament whether it was of fraude or of ignorance or of negligence the Lorde knoweth 2 Shew me why she kept not so safely and faithfully the true sense of God his word as she preserued the word it selfe BEcause it was against her owne estimation and profit which are the chiefe endes for which popish Prelates mainteyne popish religion Take away the Popes prerogatiue which is contrary to the sense of God his word downe goe Cardinalls Legates Prothonotaries downe goeth all the Court of Rome take away workes of supererogation which are contrary to the Scripture downe goe Abbeys Priories and Chantries Take away the sacrifice of the Masse Purgatory which are contrary to the word of God downe goeth the estimation and gaynes of all the popish clergie And this is the cause why the popish church kept not so safely and faithfully the true sense of God his word as she preserued the word it selfe although she preserued not the word it self in such safetie as becommed the Church of Christ. 3 Shew me why we should beleue the Papistes as you terme them for the word it self and rather you Protestants thā them for the meaning of the word WE doe not chalenge credit to our selues in any poynt so presumptuously as the Papistes that men must beleue it because we affirme it But because we proue it to be true by the worde of god And therefore for the meaning of the word you should beleue vs rather than them because our groundes proues are better then theirs or else we require not to be beleued better than they 4 Shew me why you beleued our Church telling you this to be God his booke will not credit her auouching this to be the true and vndoubted sense of the same booke IF we had no better ground to perswade vs of the authoritie of God his booke than the testimony of your Church you may be sure we would not beleue it But because we haue most stedfast assurance of God his spirite for the authority of that booke with the testimony of the true Church in all ages If you say it is God his booke we beleue you not because you say so but because we know it to be true But if you bring out a false sense we beleue you not because we know it to be false are able to proue by the word of God that it is contrary to the meaning of the holy Ghost To be plaine with you we geue as much credit to your Church as to the deuill When the deuill sayth it is written He shall giue his angells charge ouer thee and with their handes they shall hold thee vp that thou dash not thy foote against a stone We beleue that this is the worde of god But when he auoucheth this to be the meaning of it that we may cast downe our selues from a Church steeple without daunger we doe not beleue him because we know this sense is contrary to an other Scripture which sayth Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. So when you say these wordes are the Scripture of God This is my body We beleue it because we knowe it to be true But when you say this is the meaning of these wordes This bread is turned into my naturall bodye we beleue you not because it is contrary to all places of Scripture which proue the trueth of Christ his humanitie or naturall body Thus I shewe you why we beleue you if you say the Scripture is God his word namely because we know it to be true why we beleue you not saying this is the meaning of it that is because we knowe by the word of God that it is false 5 Last of all Shew me why you beleued the olde known church affirming this to be the word of God and will not beleue her affirming Luther to be an heretike shew me good reason or Scripture for these thinges and I recant IF you meane by the olde Church the primitiue Church whose testimony of the word of God we allow beleue I deny that the primitiue Church did affirme Luther to be an heretike or the doctrine that he taught which we hold to be heresie but I am able to proue that the primitiue Church from which you haue receiued the Scripture affirmeth your doctrine to be heresie your Church the Church of Antichrist But if by the old knowne Church you meane the Church of old knowne to be the Church of Antichrist which is the popish church we beleue the deuill if he speake the trueth and we beleue not an Angell comming from heauen if he bring any other Gospel than S. Paule deliuered to the Galathians Therefore when your
VVhere did they gather as in Councells to try the trueth of doubtfull matters AS God gaue them respight from your tyrannie they had conference one with an other and as for doubtes they tried them by the worde of God and not by number of voyces as you do in your councells as for the places where they met is nothing at all materiall at Prage at Lyons at Merindol c. 7 How might Christian men iustly offended with some of their brethern haue sought out your officers or Congregation to make complainct of him YOu are void of all reason that in a persecuted church will require all thinges to be so formall and orderly as in time of peace and quietnes I could choke you with putting like cases of your Church If a number of Papistes be carried prisoners into Barbarie or Turkey what Sacraments what discipline what Iudgement haue they among them if one be offended with his brother how shall he come to your officeâ—s or to your Church to complaine In such cases where the ordinary authoritie of the Church is hindred by persecution or otherwise the rule of S. Paule 1. Cor. 5. may serue and ought to be obserued If any that is called a brother be a fornicator or couetous or an Idolater or a rayler or a drunkard or an extorcioner with such one eate not So that if a Christian be iustly offended with his brother he ought to absteine from his company And if he may haue ordinary authoritie he may complaine further 8 Or how if it had liked any man to haue ben baptized of them or to haue receiued the communion of them or to haue bene married of them or to haue ioyned them selues in Fayth and Religion to them how might I say that secret contemptible and vnknowne company be founde in this case HE must haue sought them out as well as he could if he had bene perswaded that they onely ministred the Sacraments Ecclesiasticall rites sincerely according to the word of God it were no great matter for him to find them seing he knew by whom he was so perswaded and of them might also be informed where he should haue them I maruell you are not ashamed to demauÌ„d these questions as though it were materiall to discusse whether of vs hath the Church to haue the Church so manifest that euery man may see it Doe you not remember how many schismes haue bene euen in the popish church more theÌ„ twenty and sometime two Popes at once sometime three sometime fower which of them should a simple Papist take for head of the Church especially in the 22. schisme which lasted 39. yeares one Pope sitting at Rome an other at Auinion either hauing his court either hauing and making Cardinals either cursing other Or in the 23. schisme when the question was of one of the highest pointes in all popery and is not yet throughly decided among them Whether the Pope be aboue the Councell or the Councell aboue the Pope In the time of these schismes how might a man haue founde out which was the true Church which was Christes vicare in earth which had the right Sacraments and Sacramentalls to which Popes court should he appeale where did the principall Pastors sit in iudgement c. How should councells be gathered which Pope shoulde confirme their actes c When you are able to aunswere these questions for your owne church then you may better require them of ours As for that secrete contemptible and vnknowne company of our Church in the sight of the world was neuerthelesse manifest glorious and knowen to our Sauiour Christ and the liuely members of his body 9 If therefore you can shew me that any man euer sought Iustice or knowledge of trueth sacrament or faith or any helpe of Saluation at the Protestants secret and close congregation or any other where but of Gods knowen Catholike Church I recant ALthough it be to litle purpose to aunswere this demande because it is no reason to say these thinges hath not bene because chronicles make no mention of them yet that all men maye see how farre you ouershoot your selfe I wil partely satisfie your request Charles the great sought knowledge of the trueth of the sacrament of Bertramus Iohn Duke of Lancaster and diuers other noble men were instructed in our Religion by VVickleue The land of Bohemia was conuerted by Iohn Hus and Hieronym of Prage and sought the sacraments of them Finally you alwayes forget the Greeke church which you do not accompt parte of the Catholike church and yet you can not deny but men haue sought Iustice sacramentes faith c. of it Therefore if a man might trust you vpon your worde you recant The 10. article conteyneth in effect but 2. demandes 1 Moreouer I aske whether for all these many hundreth of yeares or euer els before there was any temporall Prince or Potentate that offered to be vnder God a minister of Iustice and an executor of Christian lawes in the right of your Congregation that euer maintained by lawes Ciuill or other your Faith and Congregation and I recant BEfore the general defection it is an easy matter to name you the Emperours and Princes which both offered to be ministers of Iustice in the right of our church and also mainteyned our faith and Congregation by Ciuill lawes as Constantine the greate Iouinianus Valentinianus Theodosius Archadius Honorius Marcianus Iustinianus Mauricius and diuers other But when the kinges of the earth had committed fornication with the great whore of Babylon as the holy Ghost foresheweth Apoc. 17. and 18. it is no preiudice to our cause if we can not shew any of them that haue mainteined our Religion Yet because you make so gentle an offer vpon the triall of such a matter which is of small force either to the hurt of our cause or the maintenance of yours I will let you vnderstande what I haue reade for this purpose Not doubting but other which haue reade much more and seene more auncient histories than I can shew you a great deale more I passe ouer as to well knowen how many of the Grecian Emperors resisted the setting vp of Images in so much that in the Greeke church to this daye they can abide none in their temples likewise I passe ouer Charles the great who wrote a booke against Images which is in printe who also declared that he liked not the heresie of the reall presence and transubstantiation which in his time was in forging in that he called Bertrame to declare his minde of that matter as appeareth by his booke which is also in printe I will not rehearse those princes that contrary to the Popes lawes defended their priestes that were maried For although these and such like defended some parte of the trueth which we holde against you yet lest you should obiect it was but in some one or two pointes I passe them ouer with silence But VVickleue I wene you will not deny
for as euery heretike chalengeth vnto him selfe the trueth of opinions so also doth he chalenge the possession of the church so that the church is alwayes in as great question as the doctrine And then is it to be sought out and tried onely by the scriptures as we haue declared at large in the aunswere to the 4. Article 2. demande Secondly whereas you demande whether she coulde be so hidde or close that no man coulde finde her because I haue aunswered to this demande fower or fiue times already I will now aunswere in one worde Although she was bidden and close from the worlde yet was she knowen to them that were her children 2 Or so harteles that she coulde succour no man nor instruct any man in his doubt of conscience or distresse of Faith proue me that there maye be such a decay of Gods spirite trueth and Church and I recant THe Church hath neuer bene afraide to do her office towardes her children and true members in teaching â—xhorting comforting confirming c. neither hath the spirite of God failed to leade her into all trueth and Christ hath bene with her euer more and shal be to the worldes end But that the spirite of God truth and the Church of Christ shoulde departe from the greatest numbre of the worlde is proued by S. Paule 2. Thess. 2. and by the Reuelation of S. Iohn Apoc. 12. Therfore if the spirite of trueth did leade you you shoulde recant The 26. article conteyneth in effect but 3. demandes 1 Shew me againe whether any man of yeares may be saued except he beleue the Catholike Church THere is no man of what age or yeares soeuer he be that can be saued except he be a member of the Catholike church But how necessary it is to beleue the Catholike church it is very doubtfull as you demande and as the conclusion of this article seemeth to require If you meane that it is necessary to beleue the Catholike church that is to say that God hath an holy vniuersall Congregation I graunt it is necessary to beleue But I vtterly deny that the Romish church is that holy Catholike church But if you meane as it seemeth and as the rest of the Papistes doe interprete that article I beleue the Catholike church that is I beleue what soeuer the church doth allow to be true I deny that it is necessary to saluation that a Christian man should so beleue the Catholike church both because the church may erre also because something may be commonly receiued of the church which is not materiall to saluation And that this is a false interpretation of this article of our Creede I beleue the Catholike church that is I beleue what so euer she doth set forth or maintaine to be true appeareth manifestly by the wordes them selues For who euer was so ignorant in the Latine tongue to thinke that Credere Ecclesiam and Credere Ecclesiae were all one in signification In deede if the wordes were Credo Ecclesiae Catholicae in the datiue case this interpretation might take place but when it is in the accusatiue case Credo Ecclesiam Catholicam A boy that woulde conster it otherwise than thus I beleue that there is a Catholike church were worthy to haue a doosen stripes for his labour Moreouer this common distinction of Credere in Deum that is to put our trust in god Credere Deum that is to beleue that there is a God and Credere Deo that is to geue credit to God that he speaketh the trueth plainely ouerthroweth this foolish and false interpretation For we say not Credo in Ecclesiam that is I put my whole trust in the Church for that were blasphemie against God in whome only we must beleue neither do we say Credo Ecclesiae that is I geue credit to the Church as though she shoulde alwaies speake the trueth But we saye and confesse against all heretikes and scismatikes Credo Ecclesiam c. that is I beleue that there is one Holy Catholike and Apostolike church whereof I am a member c. Finally when the articles following are spoken in one context and phrase it can not be chosen but that they must haue one kinde of interpretation Communionem Sanctorum Remissionem peccatorum Carnis resurrectionem that is I beleue the Communion of Sainctes the forgeuenesse of sinnes the Resurrection of the body c. whereof the interpretation must needes be this I beleue that there is a Communion of Sainctes that there is forgiuenesse of sinnes c. Euen so I beleue that there is a Catholike Church which is an article of our crede necessary to be beleued of euery Christian man but to beleue all and euery thing that the Catholike church by commoÌ„ consent doth maintaine is no article of our Faith and therefore not necessary to saluation 2 And that is it which hath in the face of all the worlde practised preachâ—ng the conuersion of nations to the obedience of the Gospell that hath alwaies had the ministring of sacraments the hearing of matters in controuersie power Iudiciarie in Ecclesiasticall causes the orderly succession of Byshops vniformitie in solemne ceremonies vnity in faith that hath in her selfe all holy functions of the spirite as working of miracles remission of sinnes the true sence and interpretation of Gods word that is bewtified by the diuersitie of states commended by Christ in the Gospell as with Virgines with Martyrs with Confessors and the rest BEcause these colewortes haue bene sodden twise or thryse already they are not worthy to be shewed in seuerall dishes but euen as they are here mingled all togither in an hochpotte Of these notes that you make proper to the Catholike Church as it hath bene declared before some are not alwaies necessary in the catholike church As open preaching in the face of the world open ministring of Sacraments and execution of discipline these are not to be required in a persecuted Church Some were proper for a time and then ceased as working of miracles and diuers other functions of the spirite Some are neuer necessary in the Church as succession of Bishops vniformitie in ceremonies c. But of all these notes there is not one that is proper to the Church of Rome for she hath not alwaies practised open preaching and neuer preached the worde of truth she hath conuerted but few nations to her Religion from Gentilitie and them rather by warre than by preaching she neuer had sence she first arose the ministring of sacraments according to Christ his institutioÌ„ she hath hard matters in controuersie not for furtherance of Iustice but for loue of money Her iudiciarie power may be dispensed withall for money She hath had no orderly succession of Bishops except an hore be an orderly Bishop of the Church of Rome And except so many schismes as they write of be orderly successions she hath not vniformitie in all ceremonies for diuerse nations and diuerse Churches in these nations haue diuers
Peace and reconciliation wrought by Christ whereby we knowing that we are iustified by faith haue peace with god Rom. 5. But neither of these Peaces are in the church of Rome for there is dissention in doctrine and their doctrine dissenteth from the truth as for the peace of conscience is altogether vnknowen vnto Papistes euen as the iustification of Faith by which onely it is obteined 31 Domus Refugij THe house of Refuge or defence may also be applied to the Church out of which is no saluation And in whose bosome it becoÌ„meth euery man to rest which shall looke for the refuge and defence of god But God forbidde that any man should seeke for refuge or helpe at your church which must be ouerthrowen with such violence as a great mylstone that is cast into the Sea and shal be founde no more Apoc. 18. 32 Domus Veritatis AS our church is the piller and staie of trueth so is she also the house of Trueth which knoweth nothing but him that is the Trueth it selfe Iesus Christ and his most holy Scripture In which this trueth is signed and testified But your Synagoge is the house of lyes where beside mens doctrines and traditions which are nothing but lyes there be also leaden legendes of lyes Promptuaries of lyes Festiuals of lyes and other infinite bookes of lyes 33 Societas Sanctorum HOw shoulde not our Church be the societie and fellowship of Sainctes which is sanctified and purged by the bloode of Christ which hath receiued the spirite of sanctification by which we crie Abba Father which is guided and gouerned by the most sacred and holy worde of god And how can the Popish church be the fellowship of Sainctes when she refuseth the sanctification of Christ his one oblation and sacrifice as sufficient to make them perfect which scorneth at the spirite of sanctification which can abide any thing rather than to be directed onely by God his holy worde Finally which acknowledgeth no sainctes but such as the most vnholy Pope for money doth canonize and make sainctes Proue vnto me therefore that these excellent and propre callinges can agree to any disordered companie or Congregation or to any vnknowen society of men but onely to the true Church of Christ spred throughout the whole worlde by Christes his promise and by vertue of his spirit continued in truth and grace from falshood sence Christes time and I recant AS many of these excellent names as in the worde of God or the doctors agreeing with the worde of God are propre or perteyning to the true Church of Christ so many haue I proued to be propre and perteyning to our most holy and well ordered CongregatioÌ„ And moreouer that they can in no wise be rightly applied to that most abhominable Idolatrous and disordered Synagoge of Rome which is vtterly departed from the faith geuing heede to spirites of error and doctrines of deuills being so liuely painted forth and euen pointed forth by the scripture to be that Antichristian church whereof the holy Ghost prophesieth that no man except he will wilfully be blinde can be ignorant thereof so that if you be not starke blinde and geuen vp into a reprobate sence when you consider these thinges you will recant Let any man therefore aliue answer directly and plainly without colour or fraude of wordes and vnprofitable digressions to the foresayd or any of the foresayd demandes and I shall willingly leaue the knowne Church playne way of Saluation and wander in the woodes to seeke after them and their congregation IF you had not added this conclusion we might haue conceaued some hope that vpon further instruction in such matters as troubled your conscience you would haue ben contented to be reformed after God his worde and good counsell But now you declare that you are so obstinatly bent that what so euer be proued against you you will not receiue it as truth but yeld vnto it perforce As for me Although I know there are very many which with more learning and eloquence coulde haue aunswered your demandes yet being such as they are I submitte my selfe to the iudgement of all them that be learned and godly minded whether I haue not directly and plainely without colour or fraude of wordes without all digression aunswered the same so that I doubt not but as many as are tractable and stayed vpon these doubtes onely may be fully perswaded by these not very long and yet sufficient Answers THE ENDE 1 A DEFENSE AND DECLARATION OF THE CATHOLIKE Churches doctrine touching Purgatory and prayers for the soules departed By VVILLIAM ALLEN Maister of Arte and student in Diuinitie 1 AN OVERTHROW AND CONFVTATION OF THE POPISH Churches doctrine touching Purgatory and prayers for the deade By W. FVLKE Doctor in Diuinitie 2 Mortuo ne prohibeas gratiam Eccle. 7. Hinder not the departed of grace and fauour 2 Such liberalitie as by any meanes may extende vnto them in burying their bodies honoring there memorie helping there posteritie TO THE READER 3 A Friend of mine very studious of the truth and zelous of Gods house one that learned to beleue first and then sought to vnderstand afterward which I take to be the naturall order of a christian schoole where faith must in most matters direct reason and leade the way to vnderstanding asked of me as of one whome he hartely loued and knew to be studious in such matters by my trade of life vpon what groundes the Churches doctrine and the Christian peoples faith of Purgatory and prayers for the departed stoode I aunswered him then presently as I could and shortly after as his further request was in writing somewhat more at large The which my doing though it was both rude and short yet he so measured it either by loue as it commonly happeth or else by a singular facilitie whereby he misliketh nothing that is meant well that he made it common to many moe then I would my selfe For though I was well contented that the simple people or any other should take profite or pleasure by my paine yet â—onsidering the matter to be full of difficultie and to reaâ—h to Gods iudgements in the world to come I called to my minde the saying of Nebridius who as S. Augustine reporteth of him with whom he was very familiar being much studious and inquisitiue of the secret poâ—ntes of our faith would be excedingly offended to heare a man aske of a matter of importaunce a briefe declaration his saying was that he loued not a short answere to a long question VVhereby I was me thought in a maner admonished that my treatise though it satisfied my friend and displeased not other yet could not written both hastely and briefly serue so long and large a matter I did feare with all to enter in this my lacke of yeares iudgement and knowledge into the search of such secretes as I knâ—w by that light vowe that I made of the matter before the orderly proceeding in
you must repeat that which is nothing like to your matter Paula was penitent for her sinnes with prayers almes and fasting and all for feare of purgatory So sayth M. Allen. But Ieronyme sayth not so M. Allen is here all the credit of the matter beleue him as you list But if any man had rather beleue Chrysostome speaking of such kind of workes as M. Allen and his fellowes count to be the chiefe workes of penaunce whether they serue for satisfaction for our sinnes vnto God let him consider what he writeth in his treatise de compunctione cordis lib. 2. Non requirit Deus ciliciorum pondus neque concludi inter angustias cellulae neque in obscuris antris tencbrosis sedere iubet hoc solum est quod exposcatur à nobis vt semper recordemur mala nostra c. God requireth not the burden of heauy garments not to be shut vp with the streights of a litle cell neither doth he commaund vs to sit in obscure and darke dungeons or dennes this onely is that which is required of vs that we should alwayes remember our euill life c. you see therefore by Chrysostoms iudgement that neither the satisfaction of Gods righteousnes nor any obedience of Gods commaundement hath banished the Heremites closed vp the Anachorets and cloyed the world with cloysterers but the superstitious and slauish feare of purgatory the blasphemous presumptuous pride of mens merites I passe ouer as not proper to your matter that for the honour of Christ you except his mother from confessing her selfe to be indebted to God and not to be in the numbre of those by whome the Lordes prayer is to be sayd Such honor neither doth God allowe her nor she arrogate vnto her selfe but acknowledgeth her owne basenesse and ioyfully accepteth Gods saluation It is greater honor to Christ to be sauiour of his mother then to haue such a mother as had no neede of his saluation He him selfe more then once is reade to haue reproued her wherein he had done her wrong if she had committed no trespasse Luke 2. Iohn 2. 6 But list you see how this doctrine of penaunce liked Caluine The shrew saw that by graunting of this satisfaction for sinne and the profitable vsage thereof in this life that it might argue of necessitie the residue of some paines in the next if it were here omitted or not ended And therefore I pray you see how substantially he aunswereth and how like him selfe Parumme mouent sayth he quae in veterum scriptis de satisfactione passim occurrunt video enim eorum nonnullos dicam simpliciter omnes fere quorum libri extant aut in hac parte lapsos esse aut nimis aspere dure loquutos I make small accompt of that which I often finde concerning Satisfaction in the auncient writers for I perceiue diuers of them shall I be plaine with you in a maner euery one that euer wrote till this daye in this point to haue bene fouly deceiued or spoken more roughly then they shoulde haue done Is not this a fellow a lone whether thinke you now our English bragger craking all the doctors to be on his parte or this man confessing plainely that they be all against him and yet setting not a butten by them all whether thinke you is more arrogant I am sure Caluine dealeth here more sincerely and the other more deceitfully If craking had bene a maisterie in sommer games as lying is our man might haue wone of all the worlde two games at a clappe But there is no remedy he must yelde to the learned that haue opened his impudencie Therefore I leaue him and take the benefit of this his maisters confession for further confirmatiō of my cause doubting nothing but that most wise men seeing by the aduersaries graunt all learned fathers to be on our side will accept it either as a full proofe or no small presumption of that trueth which we defend 6 But list you heare how this presumptuousse pratler can not conclude his chapter which he began with lying vpon Melancthon but by slaundering of Caluine He faineth that Caluine in the wordes by him rehersed confesseth all the doctors to be against him and yet setteth not a butten for them all The best reproofe of this calumniation shal be to sende them that be desirous to know the trueth vnto the whole discourse of Caluine vpon satisfaction Insti lib. 3. cap. 4 which who so list to doe shall plainely see whether Allen doth him not here open wrong But because euery man either can not for the lacke of the booke or will not for want of good affections towardes Caluine take so much paines as to peruse his owne writing I will aunswere in a worde or two After that Caluine hath most substantially proued both by authority of holy Scripture and also by consent of auncient doctors that their is no satisfaction vnto God for our sinnes but onely the death of Christ he cōmeth at length to speake of the worde of satisfaction which sayth he as it is often vsed in the olde writers so sometime hardely as improperly that M. Allen calleth roughly or if any of them haue erred about satisfaction it were not reason that their error shoulde preuaile against the open trueth And cleerely to conuicte M. Allen of a loude lye where he sayth that Caluine confesseth all the doctors to be against him his wordes follow immediatly after those rehersed by M. Allen Sed non credam eos ipsos adeo fuisse rudes imperitos vt eo sensu illa scripserint quo à nouis istis satisfactionariis legūtur That is how soeuer they haue either erred or spoken vnproprely of satisfaction yet I will not graunt that the same men were so rude and ignoraunt that they did wright those thinges in that sense in which they are read by these new satisfactionaries Then doth he bring forth diuers testimonies both out of Chrysostome and Augustine to shew what their iudgement was of satisfaction agreable to the Scriptures by which must be expounded what so euer they haue vttered that seemeth either erroneus or at the lest vnproprely spoken As for that reuerend father M. Iewell whome this arrogant Louanist calleth the English bragger how well he hath answered his challendge his owne learned labors do more cleerely testifie vnto the worlde then that it can be blemished by this sycophants braynlesse babling A briefe ioyning in reason and argument vpon the proued groundes vvith the aduersaries for the declaration of Purgatory CAP. V. 1 HAving vndoubtedly wonne thus much both by euidēt testimony of holy writ by the warraunt of all the learned fathers by good reason and by the aduersaries owne confession I will be bolde to bare the very iointes of the argument that both the simple may acknowledge my plaine dealing and the Protestant haue his vauntage if the reason stand not vpright VVith out colour or glose then thus I make my proofe
stand with trueth and be not repugnaunt to good life and maners And he hedgeth the diuersity of mens wittes in the exposition of scripture with in the double knot of loue which is towards God and our brother Who so euer sayth he taketh him selfe to vnderstand scripture or any parte thereof and in that meaning edifieth nothing at all the double loue of God and our neighbour he misseth the true meaning thereof But who so euer can finde out such a sense that may be commodious to the increase of charitie although it were not directly intended by the writer yet he is not harmefully deceiued nor founde a lyar therein so sayth he Now as for our matter I am well assured there dare no man though he were destitute of Gods grace yet not for shame of him selfe affirme that the doctrine of purgatory is hourtfull to vertuous life the only miscredit whereof hath vtterly banished all good Christian condicions or iniurious to the faith of Gods Church which is not only agreable but principally intended by the plaine letter of Gods worde and consonant to all other meanings that may be gathered by any such scripture as we haue alleaged there for and to be short receiued of so many fathers so wise and so well learned as we haue named for that purpose as a trueth most reasonable most naturall and most agreable to Gods iustice VVell then the misbeleuers can haue no shifte nor escape by the chalenge of Gods word or doctures or diuersity of sensies here is no holde for errour all I trust be safe and sure on euery side CAP. XI 1 YOu shoulde breake your olde wonte if you did not in this chapter ouerthrow something that you haue builded in that which went next going before He hath labored all this while to proue that purgatory hath grounde in the Scriptures now he cōfesseth franckely that there hath bene no text of scripture by him alleaged to proue it but it may haue an other meaninge and is sometime other wise construed of the fathers them selues I will aske no more to proue that purgatory hath no grounde in the worde of God which is not an ambiguous oracle that may be drawen euery way like a leaden rule hath but one true sence or meaning which is the right meaning of the holy Ghost For although diuerse men may geue diuerse interpretations of some obscure and harde place which all conteine no impiety or falshode yet the spirite of God meaneth but one thing and not what euery mans wit and iudgement will take it to be True it is that so longe as the proportion of faith is kept the Church beareth with them that geue wronge interpretations but the spirite of God which is in his Church alloweth not wronge interpretations for right And where as M. Allen alloweth all the interpretatiōs that the fathers haue made of the text by him alleaged as true so long as they affirmed no error he may by the same reason affirme that contradictories are true as in that saying of him that shall not come out vntill he haue payed the vttermost farthing some haue expounded that he shal be alwayes punished some that he shall not be alwayes punished One sayth he shal neuer be released an other saith he shall be released at length how is it possible that both these interpretations can be true and yet both these interpretations are founde in some writers But his suerest shifte is that the doctrine of purgatory was a knowen trueth in all ages But this is the whole matter in controuersie For how can it be taken for a knowen trueth in all ages which hath none so suer grounde in any text of scripture that cā be wrested for it but the same text may haue an other and that a true interpretation But of the antiquity of that error we shall haue better occasion hereafter to discusse in the second booke where this matter is of purpose intreated of In the meane time we wil take that which is here graunted so liberaly that there is no text of scripture alleaged for purgatory but it may be otherwise truely interpreted and not of purgatory and that the fathers haue so done by M. Allens owne confession 2 Their extreme and onely refuge is that the paine of Christes passion and his sufficient payment for our sinnes standeth not with our satisfaction or penaunce in this life nor with paine or purgatory in the next O Lorde how farre may mans malice reach that not contented to abuse their reason and the word of God in persuasion of errour but are bolde to referre Christes blessed death also to cloke together with falsehood wanton and licentious liuing Many vertuous persons haue bene prouoked by the meditation of our Sauiours sorowes to leaue the stattering welth of this worlde and to charge them selues with perpetuall vexation of body but that any did euer so rest vpon Christes passion that in respect thereof they might passe their dayes in idle welth of lust and liberty that was I trow vnhearde of before this sinnefull sect These fellowes argue thus Christ hath paide the full price of our sinnes ergo we must do no penaunce nor suffer any paine for them But S. Paule thus Christ by paine and passiō is entred into the glory of his kingdome ergo if we looke to be his fellow heires or partakers of his glory we must suffer affliction with him and ioyne with him in paines and passion S. Peter also thus Christ hath suffered leauing you an example that ye should follow his steppes therefore all his blessed life passed in paine must be a perpetuall sturring vp of toleration gladde suffering for his name againe Iohn our maisters messenger prepared the way of Christes death and doctrine by worthy fructes of penaunce and that was the beginning of Christes owne preaching therfore I dare be bolde to say these thinges are not abrogated by the teaching of the Gospel nor voide by Christs passion which onely maketh our workes and merites to be of that value and acceptation that all Catholike men counte them of which els to the satisfying for sinne shoulde be nothing auaileable nor to the atteining of heauen any thing profitable But it is foly to make ouer many wordes in a case so plaine seeing the example of both God and good mens dealing abundantly proueth mans punishment either temporall or eternall to stande well with the excellent value of our Sauiours death For if paine for sinne were iniurious to Christes death then the holy prophet Dauid that liued long in greuous penaunce were iniurious to his Lordes death then the Church were iniurious to her owne spouse his death that chargeth all offenders with penaunce then God him selfe were iniurious to his owne sonnes death that sharply punisheth sinne forgeuen then Christ him selfe were iniurious to his owne death that both by his example and holy preaching did euer commend sharpe penaunce and paine These
aultar And therefore seeing Victor contrary to the forme giuen by the Priestes in councell was so bold to make Geminus Faustinus an elder his executor there is no cause that oblation should be made among you for his falling a sleepe or that any prayer in his name should be frequented in the Church c. By these wordes it appeareth first that Cyprian in these termes sacrifice Priest aultar alludeth to the sacrifices of thankesgiuing in the lawe because he vseth also that name of Leuites by which he calleth Gods ministers For as for the sacrifice propitiatory was offered in the law only by the high Priest once in the yeare So that he meaneth no other oblation or sacrifice for the dead but the sacrifice of thankesgiuing which was for their godly departure And therefore he calleth it not a sacrifice for their sinnes but for their falling a sleepe And by prayer he meaneth nor prayer for deliuery of the deade out of purgatory but as Origen sayth for the faithfull liuing to haue the like godly departure as he had that was fallen a sleepe And therfore he sayth not that such a one is not worthy to be praied for but he is not worthy to be named in the prayer which was made for them that remayned to ende their dayes happily as such a one or such a one whose names were recited in those memories had already fulfilled their course For otherwise what so euer M. Allen iangleth of the seueritie of the churches discipline if they had thought the soules of the departed to be in so great torments and that prayer and sacrifices had bene such a necessary helpe for them it had bene â—o much crueltie for one offence that not so great either to condemne a man to so horrible punishment or to deny him vtterly all maner of helpe and comfort The discipline of the Church when it is most seuere is to bring to repentaunce them that are in life not to rage against them that are deade which can not repent Nor to reiect any man vtterly but him that is certainly knowne to be vtterly forsaken of god But this Geminius Victor of whom Cyprian thus writeth was a good Christian in somuch that Cyprian him selfe calleth him his brother Geminius Victor frater noster de saeculo excedens Our brother Geminius Victor departing out of this world c. Wherfore if the punishment had extended to the torment of his soule or the hinderance of reliefe vnto his soule being in tormentes the Churche would not haue bene so rigorous against a faithful brother for mayntenance of their owne decree which was not expresly forbidden by the word of god Wherefore it may appeare that this punishment was only a note of ignominy to Victor him selfe for his transgression at his departure especially an example for the rest of the brethren as Cyprian sayth that they cal not away the ministers of God from his seruice to worldly affayres lest they be likewise noted of infamy when they are deade 5 And here nowe our aduersaries must be called vpon and asked howe they can away with this geare whether this light of trueth be not ouer vehement for their bleared eyes owle light or moneshine I trow or mirke midnight were more fit for their darke workes and doctrine our waye is ouer much trodden for theeues All this course of our cause so agreeth with it selfe so standeth with reason so vpholden by scripture so ordered in all pointes that Momus him selfe coulde practise no art nor picke no quarelles here For such we must praye for those we must not praye in this case the sacrifice of Gods Church relieueth the departed in that case it is comfortable onely to the liuinge some men neede helpe after their death others helpe we neede and not they ours for open infidelles and heretikes prayers are not vsed for all secret offendres because their case is not knowen to the Church of charity towardes her children she openly prayeth some she punisheth some she pardoneth for all she merueillous tenderly careth This doctrine of trueth is purposely ordered by our elders euery point is touched and tried to our handes VVhat time of the day was it in Gods Church saye trueth and shame the deuill when holy Cyprian wrote these thinges when the Councell of Aphricke decreed these thinges when Victor was punished by lacke of sacrifice and prayers at his departure doeth your time of ignoraunce which you haue limited for your walke reach vp so high in Gods house but I will spare you to anone your aunswere is not ready 5 And here now our aduersary must occupy his goose quill like the gooses trumpet to awake vs to aunswere him as though we were a sleepe or he so well appoynted to fight against vs we must be asked howe we can away with this geare Surely as the sunne is not obscured with the dust that a cocke casteth vp wheÌ„ he scrapeth on the dunghill no more is the sonne of righteousnes our onely ful redemption or the light of his holy word darkned by all the myste of mennes deuises which Allen or his complices can rayse out of the whole heape of superstition and errour to deface the glory of his truth The Lord is our light and saluation therefore we will not be a feard of purgatory The word of the Lorde is a light vnto our steppes and a lanterne vnto our feete therefore we will not walke in the darkenes of mens traditions Our workes and doctrine shall one daye be tryed before God and therfore we make no accompt how we be iudged by mans daye and lest of all by such a mans dome as hath his tongue more ready to rayle and sclaunder then his hearte instructed to discerne and iudge your way is your owne way and not the way of the Lorde and because you take an other way vnto saluation then the onely right way Iesus Christ therefore by his owne sentence you are all theeues and murderers But because you gather your forces together to shew the strength of your cause I will also generally shew your feeblenesse to the ouerthrow of your purpose The course of your cause you say so agreeth with it selfe What els To proue that there is purgatory you vrge the satisfying of Gods iustice so extremely that beside the suffering of Christ and forgeuenes of sinnes yet there must needes be a suffering of the party that offended But when you will shew by what meanes this suffering maye be either mitigated or cleane taken away you cleane take away the extremitie of Gods iustice which before you so earnestly maintained O worthy agreemeÌ„t of your cause with it selfe Beside the agreement with it selfe it so standeth with reason Suerly howe reasonable so euer it seemeth to you that the merites of men shoulde winne that which the merites of Christ coulde not winne that the suffering of men shoulde satisfie for that which the suffering of Christ coulde not satisfie with the
sacrifice for the deade was instituted by Christ at his last Supper which the holy Ghost afterwarde did secretly suggest vnto the Apostles and they as secretly deliuered to the nations For no worde nor halfe worde therof is conteined in their writings which are to vs the only true testimony of their tradition Thus haue these heretikes no grounde of their heresie but shifte from the worde of scripture to secret tradition from tradition to the meaning of scripture from the plaine meaning of scripture to the vnconstant opinions of men from the variable and contrary opinions of men in times past to their owne obstinacy and continuaunce in error in time present yet he woundreth that we are so blinde that we can not see the cleere light of the trueth If Satan transforming him selfe into an angell of light hath so dasled their eyes that they can not see the true light they are iustly plagued because they haue refused the faithfull testimony of Gods worde which only geueth true light vnto the eyes as the Prophet saith and geuen heede to spirites of errors and doctrines of deuils by whom they are blinded in vtter darkenesse though it be with false imagination and dreaminge of light Yet see the confidence of the man he is suer that if we were examined of our conscience what triall of this doubt we woulde wishe there is none we coulde name but his cause might well abide it Why M. Allen we haue testified of our conscience longe agoe that the onely authority of Gods worde written shall satisfie vs as well in this as in all other matters if you were as desirous to satisfie vs as you pretend and as able to performe as you are to promise we should haue hearde before this time some sentence of scripture to maintaine prayer and sacrifice for the deade not standing vppon voluntary collection but either in plaine wordes or necessary conclusion For there is nothing that we are bounde to knowe nothing that we are bounde to doe but either in expresse wordes or in necessary collection which is as good as expresse wordes it is set forth in the holy Scriptures Beside this you shoulde bring a great preiudice against vs if you coulde bringe the consent and practise of the primitiue pure Church for the space of an hundreth yeares after christ But neither of these doe we looke to see we before see with our eyes the certainety of those thinges whereof now we contend in words and writinges The heretikes of our time and country be yet further vrged vvith the practise of prayers for the deceased their contrary communion is compared vvith the olde vsage of Celebration They are ashamed of the first original of their Christian faith they are vveary of their ovvne seruice they are kepte in ordre by the vvisedome of the Ciuile magistrates and are forced flatly to refuse all the doctors CAP. XII 1 THe chiefe argument that the Church of God vsed in olde time against Pelagius the enemy of Gods grace was this that at the holy altar the Priest prayed to God for to conuert heretikes and infidells to the faith and euill liuers wicked conuersation to vertue and honesty the which prayers had bene to no purpose if the grace of God had not borne the principall stroke in the chaunging of mans hearte But being assured of this as a grounde that the prayer of the Priest in the whole Churches name at the altar can not but beare singular strength and trueth it is necessarily concluded that seeing the publike minister so prayeth that we must needes beleue that God hath mans hearte in his hande and may turne it to the belefe of his worde or loue of his will as he liketh and listeth notwithstanding the perfect freedome of mans will which by Gods grace is neuer perished but alwayes perfected And in this assured foundation of the publike prayers S. Augustine who then was the souldier of grace so triumphed against one Vitalis a Pelagian that he ringeth him this peale Exerce contra orationes ecclesiae disputationes tuas quaÌ„do audis sacerdotem dei ad altare exhortantem populum dei orare pro incredulis subsanna pias voces ecclesiae dic te non facere quod hortatur homo in Carthagiensi eruditus ecclesia etiam beatissimi Cypriani librum de oratione dominica condemna Holde on fellow exercise thy contentious talke against the vsuall prayers of Gods Church and wheÌ„ thou hearest the Priest of God at his altar exhort the people to praye for the misbeleuers scoffe at the holy wordes and make him aunswere thou wilt not pray as he biddes thee And being brought vp in the Church of Carthage condemne withall S. Cyprians worke vpon our Lordes prayer wherein he teacheth the same I tary nowe the longer on this point that thou mayest learne to kepe an heretike at the bay and to fasten thy stroke so surely vpon him that which waye so euer he shifte he shall beare thy blowe vpon his necke and shoâ—lders It is not for our cause taken in hand that I now so much trauell for that is longe sith made sure enough for all the deuills in Hell or their followers in earth But I woulde in this one example of praying for the deade geue the studious a tast of all such wayes as the trueth of all other pointes in controuersy may be both surely defended and so plainly proued and vpholden that the aduersary shall not be able to say baffe vnto any one of the least of all the groundes wherevpon Gods trueth standeth Handeling then our good men as S. Augustine did the like say to them boldely that the same Church which exhorteth the people to pray for the misbeleuers doth geue vs example to pray for the soules departed Vitalis and Pelagius were heretikes for withstanding the one they must needes be as very heretikes for refusing the other It was the greatest extremitie that Pelagius coulde be driuen to by force of Augustines argument to mocke at the priests prayer made at Gods altar and that which then was so foule an absurditie for those false teachers can it be borne out of ours with honestie Vitalis the Pelagian had a foule foyle by S. Augustine â—hen he charged him with the contempt of S. Cyprians authoritie Byshop of Carthage being him selfe a â—hield of the same Church And shall they goe away so smouthly nowe a dayes not only with contempe of their owne English patrons and Apostles but with impudent deniall of all the doctors at once that euer were gydes of Gods Church sith Christes faith was taught It was of Augustine counted a singular arrogancy not to praye in that forme as Gods Church and ministers at the altar both praye them selues and exhorte other to pray and shall it be such prayse for our preachers to erect a new seruice to be checke mate with the olde to controele the rites and vsages of solemne supplication in all countries Christianed and with the
obscuro non ad propheticas voces non ad apostolicas literas nec ad euangelicas auctoritates sed ad semetipsos recurrunt Sed ideò erroris magistri existunt quia veritatis discipuli non fuerunt They fall into this folly which when they be hindered by any obscuritie to knowe the truth haue not recourse to the words of the Prophets nor to the writings of the Apostles nor to the authoritie of the Gospell but to them selues But therefore are they maisters of error because they haue not ben schollers of truth In these words Leo as great as you would haue him maketh the Scriptures not customes or traditioÌ„s the rule of truth But I will come to your demonstration which you call a sure way to try the beginning of any doctrine yet vnder correction of your demonstratiue Logike I may be bold to say it is not the proper way nor the way by which all doctrine may be tryed and so you breake 2. of those principal rules that Aristotle giueth for demonstration 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for the proper way to try all doctrine is by coÌ„ferring it with the word of God Againe the first author of euery heresie can not be named There was one heresie of them that were called Acephali because there was no head knowne of them It is harde to name the first authour of the Manichees whom the heretikes them selues call an Apostle of Christ. The Chiliastes the Ophâ—tes the Caineanes the Sethoites the Adamianes the Melchezedâ—chianes the Apostolike the Hemerobaptistes and an hundred more heresies shall they be thought to haue their heresie from tradition of the Apostles if the first author of them can not be named yet I weene it will be hard for him to proue out of any authenticall writer that any before Tertullian either named or allowed prayer for the deade who was almost 2. hundreth yeares after the incarnation of Christ. 2 If they answere me that this vsage is crept into the church sith the Apostles time though the first author can not be knowen I will also prouide that there no shift shall serue them Therefore I aske them whether that man which first preached it was resisted by the rest of Gods Church which before his preaching beleued the contrarie or no That is it say this doctrine of praying for the deade when it first came into the church did any of the true pastors free from the same error barke like a good shepheard against the beginner of that which they count so great a corruption of trueth Or all the Church was corrupted with it on one daye say what you thinke likest in this case aunswere with any probability or reason if you can saye plainely was our doctrine euer preaâ—hed against or neuer if it neuer were preached against then it neuer beganne as any noueltie or newe doctrine For it coulde not be that the Church being free from that doctrine shoulde straight without contradiction allowe that which they liked not before Howe can any man arise in the common welth and bring the vtter decay of all the olde ordres which he findeth and erect vp a new deuise of his owne and neuer man speake a word against him but all in one moment allow and like the same and that without all recorde by memory or monument of any chaunge But this thinge is most farre from the Churches and Gods pastors diligeÌ„ce that neuer receiued false doctrine without open contradiction and plaine noting the party that first began it as we shal plucke our gentlemen by the slieue a none All those that haue any skill in the antiquitie will beare me recorde that the pastors did neuer holde their peace when any wolfe did but once open his mouth against the sheepe They can tell that she did neuer beare the preaching or practise of any false and erroneous doctrine for one day together then it must needes consequently followe that the doctrine of purgatory and oblation for the departed with still consent of all nations receiued in the Catholike Church had no beginning after the first institution of our faith and worship of God but hath ioyned from the first grounde of our Christian institution in Christes faith with that sacrifice and due honour of God which the Apostles by the suggestion of the holy Ghost planted in all nations with the same faith Thus I make my argument euery falsehood was preached against and withstanded when it is first entered but this doctrine of purgatory and praying for the deade being alwayes vsed was neuer controwled nor gainsaide in Gods Church therfore it is no falsehood nor euer had any later institution then the Apostles owne prescription 2 Supposing that this errour crept into the Church though the first author thereof can not be knowne he demaundeth whether any man preached against it when it began first to be receiued I aunswere if the Pastors of the Church had done their duty to the vttermost it could not so easily haue preuayled And yet it is not to be thought but that some of the true Pastors in that tyme opposed them selues against it although the history of the Church in that time whâ—n it began to be spreade is to briefe vnperfect that we should be able to name who they were that preached against it Of so many heresies as Epiphanius nameth in his time it were hard to require and vnpossible to shew who preached against euery one of them at their first entrance yet they be damnable heresies In S. Augustines dayes of whose time the history of the Church is largely set forth vnto vs who preached or writte against that error which he and Innocentius Bishop of Rome al the church as he confessed did hold that infants must receiue the holy communion or else they should be damned Who preached against this error except perhaps the Pelagians that were horrible heretikes Was all the Church corrupted with it in one day If euery heresie had bene beaten down as fast as it sprang Antichrist should neuer haue set vp his throne in the temple of god If God had not sent into the world the efficacy of error that they which refused to beleue the truth should be iustly condemned to beleue lyes the man of sinne and sonne of perdition had neuer aduauÌ„ced him selfe aboue all that is called God. 2. Thessal 2. And therefore M. Allen plucke not vs by the sleue but your self by the nose you are the heretikes that refuse to beleue the truth you are they that turne away your eares from truth to fables you are they that attend to spirites of error and doctrines of deuills forbidding to marry and abstayning from meates which God hath created to be receiued with thankes giuing There is the brande marke of Romish religion that all the water in Tiberis nor in the Ocean sea shal not be able to wash out Must we finde out the authors of your heresies Nay iustifie
dayes they thinke they haue a good argument against the Catholikes Therefore they woulde father transubstantiation vpon this Councell the adoration of the Sacrament vpon that Pope indulgencies vpon that byshop c. For they be as saulcie with Gods Church Councells chiefe gouernors as we be with the Iacke strawes of Geneua And yet when they haue traualed to their heartes ake they can finde no one thing first inuented by any of them whome they falsely name to be the authors thereof But well seeing it is so stronge an argument of heresie to haue the ofspring of a later author with plaine prouisò of Gods Church for his markinge let vs adde so much strength to our cause to haue the father of the contrary falshood knowen and noted of the antiquity by his name 3 If you haue not a better vnderstander then you are a rule giuer your rule is false for though you hedge it in with many conditiōs yet you leaue out the chiefest which is that the opinion it self be cōtrary to the truth first preached by the Apostles or else it is no heresie though it may be truely fathered vpon any man priuate or publike sooner or later And here I muse why you put in the condition of a priuate man belike if the Pope inuent a new doctrine because he is a publike person that can not erre it must not be taken for heresie In your second rule except you vnderstand that the opinion of him which is withstāded be new and of his owne inuention the withstanding thereof no not by good men maketh it not false They that defended that heretikes should not be rebaptised were withstoode by Cyprian and all the Bishops of Africa who were notwithstanding their error in the vnitie of the Church yet were they not heretikes nor their opinion heresie because it was not of their inuention but of the word of god And wheras you affirme that we can not find any of those thinges inuented by them by whome we say they were inuented though we trauail vntill our hartes ake I aunswere though you seeke vntill your head ake lye vntill you haue worne your tongue to the stumpes you shall neither finde those things in the word of God nor to haue any other authors thē the writers of your owne sect haue named to be the fathers of most of them And that you charge vs with like saucines towards your Prelates that you vse toward the Iacke strawes of Geneua if you had not thereby confessed your selfe to be a saucy Iacke you might haue giuen vs occasiō to think no lesse of you For although perhaps you count the chief teachers of that Church for Iacke strawes yet the worlde can testifie that there is more grauitie and modesty in the lightest persons of all that Church then hath appeared of many Popes and Cardinalls of your Church of Rome 4 Epiphanius that notable man in his booke that he wrote for the confutation of all the heresies that were before his time and in other of his workes too nameth an obscure fellowe one Aërius to be the first author of this heresie that prayers and sacrifice profiteth not the departed in Christ. But what maner a fellowe he was and how lickely to be the founder of such a schoole thou shalt perceiue best by the writers wordes When Aërius coulde not obteine the byshopricke of Eustathius deposed after that he was once perfectly well skilled in Arius doctrine he inuented new sectes of his owne affirming that there shoulde be no offering for the departed and of him loe the scholars were called Aërians Let not the simple whome I woulde helpe in this cause be deceiued by the liknes of these two names Arius and Aërius for this later was the author of their secte and was a follower of the first called Arius in his doctrine beside And of the same sect and sectmaister S. Augustine thus sayeth following Epiphanius The Aërians were so named by one Aërius who taking snoffe that he coulde not get a byshopricke fell into the heresie of Arius first and then added therevnto other heresies of his owne makinge saying that we shoulde not offer sacrifice for the deade nor obserûe the solemne appointed fastes of the Church but that euery man should abstaine when he liste And there both he and Epiphanius doe recken moe of his holy opinions which I omit For it is enough for our purpose and to confunde all the heretikes of our dayes that this opinion was noted as it spronge vp in the primitiue Church for heresie and the authors not onely condemned as heretikes in that point but in many other thinges beside For I neuer reade of nor yet knewe any heretike but if he once mistrusted the catholike Church the Deuill was hable to perswade with him as well in a numbre of matters as in one And that is the cause that any man seduced falleth from one falshood to an other till he wholy be drowned in the waues of tempesteous doctrine And when he commeth once at the bottom then God knoweth he setteth light by the matter contemneth it and is often past recouery as it is sayde Peccator cum in profundum venerit contemnit Euen so did this Aërius first through ambitious pride fall to the Arians sect but because he counted it nothing glorious to be a scholar he woulde be a maister and that of a misheuous matter and a matter repugnāt to the sense of all Christes Church which before his preaching generally as after receiued and faithfully vsed prayers and oblation for the deade Of which consent of the vniuersall worlde and the heretikes follye in withstanding the same the sayde Epiphanius sayeth thus I will report his wordes in Latine because they sounde very well though him selfe wrote not in that language Assumpsit ecclesia in toto mundo assensus est factus antequà m esset Aërius qui ab ipso appellantur Aëriani quis autem magis de his nouit hic ne seductus homo qui etiam superest nunc an qui ante nos testes fuerunt c. Thus in english The Church hath receiued this trueth through the wide worlde it was sattled in all mens mindes before Aërius was borne or any of his secte that be nowe called Aërians And who I pray you is most like to knowe the trueth of these thinges this false wretche yet liuinge at this daye or else the faithfull witnesses that were before our time Beholde here you worshipfull maister ▪ you may suerly take greate cause of comforte in his liuely worde mary Sir he might haue bene an Archbishoppe in our dayes for he loued neither fasting nor praying He was fayne to be an heretike for anger because he coulde not be made a bishoppe then who now if he were in this happy age when the light is more plentifully powred vpon the people might haue bene promoted at Caluins decease to the ouerlooking of Geneua But his opinion was
may by the example of Christ aunswere one question with an other why was it first reueiled to the Arians in councell holden against Christ that the article of his descent into hell was meete to be added to the creede and confession of faith which was not reueiled to so many godly meÌ„ as set forth the Symbole nor to the holy Nicene Councell Aunswere me if you can or any Robin good fellowe of your sect â–ª learned or vnlearned is it any preiudice to the trueth of that article or to the right that it hath to be placed in the creede that it was first added by the Arrians why was the trueth reueiled to heretikes concerning rebaptisation rather then to Cyprian and so many catholicke byshoppes why was it reueiled to the Pelagians that infantes might be saued without the participation of the sacrament of Christes body and bloude rather then vnto S. Augustine Innocentius byshoppe of Rome and as Augustine sayeth all the catholicke fathers of that time which thought it was as necessary for them to receiue the communion as to be baptised If heretikes shoulde not affirme somethinge that were true they shoulde neuer deceiue any man And sometime Satan affirmeth the trueth not because he will haue it beleeued but rather that proceding out of his lying mouth it might the sooner be discredited And therefore sometymes Arrians Pelagians Anabaptistes and such like by the subtilty of Satan haue affirmed somethinge that is true either to winne credit to their manifolde lyes or else to drowen the credit of that trueth among so many errors 7 Nay I will pose you further is not your preaching the very ready waye to all such extreeme blasphemies as they boldely mainteine did euer man fall from the Catholicke Church to those further heresies then you yet openly professe but he tooke yours by the waye as a plaine passage to extreme infidelitie yea your opinions doe so well stande with the other that they neede not afterwarde to refuse any one pointe of all your doctrine to mainteine their owne There is no article of Catholicke doctrine but it is as much hated of them as of your selues Helpe your selues here my maisters or else all the worlde will take you to be in your heartes of the same sectes wherevnto your faith is alwayes so dearely ioyned Put your heades together and tell vs whie your doctrine is so deare to the AriaÌ„s all wicked men so hated of the holy fathers of Christes Church If you frame not your aunswere well you liese your credites your scholars and your honesties VVell thus haue I pointed out your author his name was Aërius you must be called Aërians you maye kepe the name of Protestaunts or Euangelistes beside For a holy newe calling is lightly ioyned to such men VVhereby though some simple be deceyued yet wâ—se men be warned Or if the olde authors of this secte be not so glorious as these new reuiuers if they list and like so they may call them selues Lutherans or Caluinistes or what they will but Catholickes Although Martyn Luther graunted purgatory and prayers with this error that such as were there might yet by their diuers deseruinges winne or loose life euerlasting as men of doubtefull state as they were before in the worlde plaine against our Sauiours admonition and carefull warning veniet nox quando iam nullus operari potest VVorke whiele the day lasteth for the night shall come wheÌ„ no man can labour But I neede not to stande vpon this point which of neither parte is much regarded Neither will I spende any more time in getting them an author of their secte seeing they haue choise of diuers Let them goe out of the Citye of God from amongest the holy company and turne on the lifte hande and looke amongest the outcastes of all agies and they shall haue freindes and fellowes enowe 7 That you saye of our preaching to be the waye to so many heresies might haue bene sayed of the Gentiles and Iewes to the whole Church of Christians The Gentiles continued constant so did the Iewes without schisme in their errors when the professors of Christianity were rent and torne into an hundreth sectes and heresies There were no heretikes but they hated Iewes and Gentiles as much as the true Christians was therefore the religion of the Iewes and Gentiles better then the religion of the Christians Yea there neuer was since Christ any heresie or heretike but they agreed in many more thinges with the Christians then with the Gentiles and Iewes was therefore the Christian religion false or the Paganes and Iewes superstition true It is therefore no dâ—sâ—redit of our doctrine that Arrians or Anabaptistes of our time either haue any thing of yours or prayse any thing of ours Neither our credit schollers nor honestie are in daunger for their errors which they learned not of vs neither are your wit learning or heresie the greater for vttering this foolish conceipte which no more toucheth vs or defendeth you then it carpeth the religion of Christ and mainteineth the Idolatrie of the heathen The worlde seeth what vaine reasons you leane vnto being destitute of the worde of god An heretike helde this opinion therefore it is false The deuill beleueth there is one God therefore shall not Christian men beleue so why woulde God reueile any trueth to heretikes why did the Pharizees which otherwise were heretikes defende the resurrection of the deade This vaine frothe of wordes and smoke of foolish and vnlearned questions will euen fall downe and vanish awaye of it selfe though it be not blowen away by vs The latter end of this chapter hath one croppe of his olde custome to charge Luther with defending of Purgatory which either was while he remained in ignorance or else it is but a fained fable as many other of him and others are deuised by the Papists who as they erre from the trueth of God so they delight in sclaundering of good men but they shall not preuaile their madnes is made knowen to all men That their falsehood is condemned and the Catholicke trueth approued by the authority of holy Councells Their pride in contemning and the Catholickes humilitie in obedient receyuing the same And a sleight vvhereby the heretikes deceiue the people is detected CAP. XV. 1 ANd for our parte it is sufficient good reader that we knowe the first founder thereof and that we be nowe right well assured that he in his time and his scholars in theirs haue bene noted called and condemned for heretikes in this as in other fonde peruerse opinions beside not onely by the singular iudgements of diuers learned men but by the common sense and consent of the worlde and by auncient Councells both generall and particular as we maye reade in the Councells of Carthage the iiij of Bracharense and Vase the Decrees of which by occasion we rehearsed once before They are both auncient and of greate authority and honored with the presence of
church affirmeth Luther to be an heretike seeing we know that Luther did not obstinately and malitiously erre in any article of faith concerning the substance of religion we doe not beleue her and specially because she is a partiall witnesse against him whome God vsed to discouer so much of her wickednesse to her great hindrance there is no credit to be geuen vnto her when she goeth about to deface him by sclaunderous names and false accusations Thus I haue shewed these thinges that you require both by good reason and also by scripture Therefore if I may beleue you you recant The fourth article conteyneth 3. demandes 1 I demand what Church hath mightely gonne through borne downe and fully vanquished all heresies in times past aswell against the blessed Trinitie as other Articles of our religion I Aunswere the true Catholike Church hath alwayes resisted all false opinions contrary to the worde of God as her duty was and fought against them with the sworde of the spirite which is the worde of God and by the aide of God obteyned the victorie and triumphed ouer them So did Paule ouercome the Iewes Act. 18. So did the fathers of the primitiue Church from time to time confute heresies by the scriptures and declare in their writinges that by them they are to be confuted for examples sake of a great number I will alleage a few Hylarius writing of the blessed Trinitie against heretikes Lib. 4. sayeth Cessent itaque propriae hominum opiniones neque se vltrà Diuinam constitutionem humanae iudicia extendant Sequamur ergo aduersus irreligiosas impias de Deo institutiones ipsas illas diuinoruÌ„m dictorum authoritates vnumquodque eorum ipso de quo quaeritur auctore tractabimus Wherefore let opinions propre to men geue place and let not mens iudgements stretche them selues further than God his constitution Therefore against these vnreligious and vngodly opinions of God let vs follow the very authority of God his sayings and handle euery one of them by the aide of him about whome the question is Thus Hylarius woulde haue heresies against the Trinitie to be confuted not by mens iudgement but by God his word Basilius magnus very often testifieth that he woulde haue all good thinges proued by the scripture and all euill thinges confuted by the same In his moralles Dist. 26. Euery worde or deede must be confirmed by the testimonie of holy Scripture for the perswasion of good men and the confusion of wicked men And in his treatise of Faith we know that we must now and alwayes auoide euery voice or opinion that is differing from the doctrine of our Lorde And in his short definitions to the first interrogation whether it be lawefull or profitable for a man to permit vnto him selfe to do or say any thinge which he thinketh to be good without the testimonie of the holy Scripture he aunswereth forasmuch as our Sauiour Christ sayeth that the holy Ghost shall not speake of him selfe what madnes is it that any man shoulde presume to beleue any thing without the authoritie of God his worde By these and many other places it is manifest that Basilius woulde haue heresies and false opinions confuted by the holy Scriptures Chrysostome vpon Luke cap. 16. sayeth that the ignorance of the scriptures hath bred heresies and brought in corrupt life yea it hath turned all things vpsidown by which it appeareth by what meanes he would haue heresies kept away namely by knowledge of the scriptures It were to long to reherse all the places of S. Augustine by which his minde appeareth that he would haue the Church sought onely in the scriptures and heretikes confuted onely by the scriptures to whose onely authoritie in many places he professeth that he him selfe will be bounde as Epist. 19. ad Hieronymum Epist. 48. Vincentio Epist. 111. Fortunatiano Epist. 112. to Paulina contra Faustum lib. 11. cap. 5. Contra Cresconium Grammaticum lib. 2. cap. 31. 32. de Baptismo contra Donatistas lib. 2. cap. 2. De meritis remissione peccatorum contra Pelagianos lib. 3. cap. 7. De naturae gratia cap. 61. De gratia Christi contra Pelagium cap. 43. De nuptijs concupiscentia lib. 2. c. 29. In these places S. Augustine preferreth the authority of the Canonicall scripture before all writinges of Catholike Doctors of Byshops of Councells before all customes and traditions But that he would haue the true Church sought onely in the scriptures it is manifest by these places first in his 48. Epistle to Vincentius Nos autem ideo certi sumus neminem se a communione omnium gentium iustè separare potuisse quia non quis quam nostrum in iustitia sua sed in scripturis Diuines quaerit Ecclesiam speaking of the Donatistes he sayeth We are suer that no man could iustly separate him selfe from the communion of all Nations because none of vs seeketh the Church in his owne righteousnesse but in the holy Scriptures So if the Papistes woulde not presume of their owne righteousnesse but seeke the Church of Christ in the scriptures they would not separate them selues from the communion of Christes Church now by God his grace inlarged farther than the Popish church Also in his booke De vnitate Ecclesiae cap. 2. he hath these wordes Inter nos autem Donatistas quaestio est vbi sit Ecclesa Quid ergo facturi sumus in verbis nostris â—am quaesituri an in verbis capitis sui Domini nostri Iesu Christiâ— puto quod in illius potius verbis eam quaerere debemus qui veritas est optimè nouit corpus suum The question is betwene vs and the Donatistes where the Church shoulde be what shall we doe then shall we seeke her in our owne wordes or in the wordes of her heade our Lorde Iesus Christ I thinke we ought rather to seeke her in his words which is the Truth and best knoweth his owne body So the question is at this daye betwen the Papistes and vs where the church is let vs seeke in God his worde there we shall easily finde her To the same intent he speaketh in the third fiueth and sixtenth Chapters of the same treatise Furthermore that he woulde haue heretikes confuted onely by the scriptures he sheweth likewise in many places of his workes for writing against Maximinus the Arian lib. 3. cap. 14. a place commonly and often cited he sayeth but nowe neither must I preiudicially bring forthe the Councell of Nice nor then the Councell of Arimine for neither am I bounden to the authoritie of the one nor you of the other but let matter with matter cause with cause reason with reason contend by authoritie of the scriptures not proper to any but indâ—fferent witnesses to both partes If Augustine would not oppresse the Arrians by the authoritie of the Nicene Councell which was the first and the best generall Councell that euer was but only by the scriptures how much lesse woulde he
charge them with other authorities that the Papistes alleage beside the authoritie of holy scriptures And in his booke De Vniâ—ate Ecclesiae against the Donatistes the 16. chapter Sed vtril ipsi Ecclesiam teneant non nisi diuinarum scripturarum Canonicis libris oftendant quia nec nos c. But whether they holde the church or no let them shew none other wise but by the canonicall bookes of holy Scripture for we our selues doe not say that men ought to beleue vs that we are in the Church because we holde that Church which Optatus of Mileuitum or Ambrose of Millayn or innumerable other Byshops of our communion haue commended to vs or because it is set forth by the Councels of our felowe byshops or because so many myracles of hearing requests or healinges are don in the holy places which our fellowship doth frequent in the whole worlde so that the bodies of Martyrs which were hidden so many yeares which thinge if they will aske they may heare of many were reuealed vnto Ambrose and that at the same bodies one that had bene many yeares blinde very well knowen in the citie of Millayn receyued his eyes and eye sight either because this man dreamed or that man was rauished in the spirite and hearde a voice that he should not ioyne himselfe to Donatus or that he shoulde departe from the faction of Donatuâ— for when soeuer such thinges are don in the Catholike Church they are to be allowed because they are don in the Catholike church â–ª but the church it selfe is not therfore proued to be Catholike because these thinges are done in it By this Augustine declareth first that heretikes must be confuted onely by the scriptures and secondly that neither Councells succession of byshops vniuersality miracles visions dreames nor reuelations are the notes to trie the Catholike church but onely the scriptures Moreouer in his booke De Pastoribus cap. 14. Quaerit infirmus Ecclesiam c. A weake person seeketh the Church he wandreth and seeketh the church â–ª what sayest you The church is of Donatus side Enquire for the shepheards voice Reade me this out of some Prophet reade me this out of some Psalme rehearse me it out of the lawe rehearse it out of the Gospell rehearse it out of the Apostle out of them do I rehearse the Church dispersed ouer all the worlde And a litle after Tu accusas non Euangelium c. Thou accusest not the Gospell thou accusest not the Prophet not the Apostle of whome this voyce speaketh to me I beleue him other I beleue not But thou wilt bring forth decrees I will also bring forth decrees shoulde I beleue thine beleue thou mine likewise I beleue not thine neither do thou beleue mine then let mens writings be layd away and let Gods worde sounde betwen vs bring me one place of scripture for Donatus side c. These places maye sufficiently declare by what meanes this doctor thought the Church shoulde ouerthrowe heresies namely by the worde of God onely which thing also Leo the first byshop of Rome in his Epist. 10. ad Fabianum contra Eutychen plainely confesseth saying Sed in hanc insipientiam cadunt qui cum ad cognoscendam veritatem c. But those men fal into this foly which when they are hindred by any doubt to knowe the trueth haue not recourse to the voyces of the Prophets not to the writings of the Apostles not to the authoritie of the Gospell but to them selues And therefore they become maisters of error because they haue not bene schollers of trueth Of the same iudgement was the whole Councell of Constantinople the sixt as appeare Actione 18. Si igitur omnes simpliciter c. Therefore if all men from the beginning woulde haue simply and without subtiltie taken vpon them the preaching of the Gospell and haue bene content with the constitutions of the Apostles suerly matters shoulde haue bene well and in good case neither shoulde painefull contention haue bene exercised against the authors of heresies nor against the fauorers of priests Here the Councell confesseth that the heretikes and schismatikes grow so fast because they were not beaten downe by preaching of the Gospell and authority of the scriptures Thus I haue declared by example and authority of these Fathers that the true Church of Christ hath conuicted all heretikes onely by the scripture 2 And what Church it was that hath alwayes stande still and stedfast whilest all other Congregations as well of Arrians as Anabaptistes Aerians Nouatians Vigilantians Iouinians and the rest haue decaied THe true Church of Christ hath alwayes stoode stedfast and vnseparable from Christ her heade when all heretikes haue bene and shal be confounded But the true Church hath not alwaies florished in wordly peace and tranquilitie for vntill the tyme of Constantine the great which was Anno Dom. 339. the Church had small rest from cruell persecution in most places and soone after againe vnder the Emperors Constantius Constans and Valens it was greatly infected with the heresie of Arius what time also Tiberius Bishop of Rome was infected with the same heresie After that when Iulianus the Apostata was Emperor the temples of Idolls were opened and gentilitie againe restored so that the Church suffered great detriment To be short when the barbarous Goathes Vandales Alanes and other Idolatrous or heretical nations destroyed the Empire the Church of God suffered a great Ecclipse But when Mahomet in the East Antichrist the Pope in the West seduced the world with most detestable heresie then was fulfilled that which was reuealed to S. Iohn in the 12. of the Apocalyps the woman clothed with the Sonne which you your self confesse to be the Church was so persecuted by the Dragon that she fled into the wildernes there to remaine a long season Where she hath not decayed but ben always preserued vntil God should reueale Antichrist and bring her againe into open light which his holy name be praysed is now brought to passe in our dayes to our inestimable comfort and his euerlasting glory 3 And if it can be proued that either the Protestants Church or any other Church but ours hath mightely ouerthrowne these foresayd sectes and other of all sortes I recant IT hath bene already proued sufficiently that the true Catholike Church which is ledde onely by the worde of God as a most infallible rule hath ouerthrowne heresies of all sortes But the popish church which refuseth the only weapon by which heresies are cut downe to be sufficient for that purpose neuer was nor shall be strong enough to encounter with heretikes therefore she practiseth to vanquish those whom she counteth for heretikes not by authoritie of the Scriptures but by fire and sworde and cruell warre as appeareth by her dealing with the Waldenses Albigenses Bohemians and in our dayes with the true Christians But where her power of fire and sword could not preuayle there hath she not ouerthrowne such as she condemneth for
sermon in such sorte that the common people might vnderstand it and in the 45. Canon they decreed that euery Christian shoulde learne the Creede and the Lorde his prayer Et qui aliter non potuerit vel in sua lingua hoc discat that is And he that can not yet let him learne it in his owne tongue Whereby they declare that they desier to reteine the latine tongue still but rather than the people shoulde be ignorant they commande them to learne their prayers and beleefe in their mother tongue Also by the 43. Canon wherein they iudge that no preeste can saye Masse alone it appeareth that the people commonly vnderstood the latine seruice for they aske how he shoulde saye Dominus vobiscum and admonish the people to lifte vp their heartes and diuers like sayinges where there is none by him but him selfe Nowe if the people vnderstoode not these sayinges it were all one whether they were present or absent Also in the Councell of Rhenes holden in Fraunce about the same time the like decree was made cap. 15. that bishops studie to preache sermons and homelies of the holy fathers so that all men maye vnderstand according to the property of their tongue Finally in the Councell of Laterane holden vnder Pope Innocent the third Anno Dom. 1215. in which Councell transubstantiation was first established the 9. chapter it was plainely decreed that forasmuch as within one citie and diocesse people of diuers languages be mingled together hauing vnder one Faith diuers rites and maners we streightly commande that the bishops of such cities and diocesses prouide able men which according to the diuersitie of their rites and languages celebrate vnto them the diuine seruice and minister the sacramentes instructing them both by worde and example Hereby it appeareth that when the latine tongue was either almost or altogether growen out of the common peoples vnderstandings order was taken that common prayers should be sayed and sacramentes ministred in the mother tongue of euery nation But the bishops which shoulde haue seene it put in execution either negligently omitted it or willingly refused to doe it because it was more for their profit to kepe the people in blinde ignorance So thus I haue shewed that sodenly the tongue of common prayer was not altered 10 Tell me what yeare of our Lorde vnder what Emperour vnder what Pope by whome these thinges were wrought vpon what occasion this marueillous mutation was made WHo can tell the originall of euery blind custome and peuish tradition of euery olde error and foolish fashion it is sufficient to shew that these thinges haue no grounde in the scripture of God they were not taught by Christ and his Apostles nor receiued in the church that followed immediatly after them and then we are bolde to say with Tertullian This preiudice there is against all heresies how soeuer they came vp or when soeuer they sprange vp That is true that was first and that is false that is latter therefore from the beginning it was not vsed to praye for the deade nor to the deade from the beginning common prayer was not in an vnknowen tongue Wherefore prayer for the deade and to the deade with prayer in a strange tongue are false when soeuer they beganne or how long soeuer they continued 11 VVho preached against it what historie maketh mention of it who of all your Pastors preached against it was God his Church so voide of the spirit of Trueth and strength that euen then when it most florished it had none that durst open against â—uch corruption of religion as it entred in and when it might soone haue bene repressed BEfore you demande what yeare the religion of the Papistes came in and whether it came in sodenly and as though we shoulde aunswere that it came in sodainely you demande who preached against it c. This is to fight with your owne shadowe for we say not that it came in sodainely but that it entred by small degrees at the first and therefore was lesse espied by the true Pastors especially being earnestly occupied against great heresies and open aduersaries that sought to beate downe the cheefe foundations of Christian faith as the Valentinians Marcionistes Manichees Arrians Sabellians and such like monsters So when Satan had gotten in one foote by such craftie pollitie he neuer rested vntill he had thrust in his whole bodie with the power of Antichrist 12 If it coulde not shew me then what yeare of the Lorde this mutation was made and who of all the true preachers did with stand this doctrine SO often as you demande one thinge so often must I aunswere after one sorte this mutation was not all in one yeare nor in one hundreth yeares nor in one thousand of yeares for transubstantiation no small article of your religion was not decreed vntill the yeare of God 1215. what preachers haue withstoode your doctrine at diuers times are declared before in the aunswere to the 8. Article 2. demande 13 Or note the name of him that euer first preached any article of our doctrine and if we note you not by their names euery one of your Capitaines and the seuerall errors that they tought and the time and the yeare when they arose against the former receyued trueth and the Councells in which they were orderly condemned if I saye this can be done of your side towarde vs or if we doe it not for improofe of your Church and religion I recant I Haue noted in the answere to the 6. article 3. demande the names of diuers heretikes that first preached diuers articles of your religion and further I note vnto you Pelagius and Coelestius which tought that free will without grace coulde doe somewhat towardes eternall saluation and that grace was geuen according to merite which article you teach also with culler of a distinction De congruo condigno which is a meere cauill for God is as much bounde vnto congruitie as to dignitie or worthinesse and as he can doe nothing against worthinesse no more can he doe any thing against congruitie which is a kinde of Equitie And whereas you bragge to note vnto vs euery one of our Capitaines c. except you note vnto vs the Patriarches Prophets Apostles Euangelistes and Christ himselfe you shall neuer be able to performe that you promise for we teache nothing but the eternall trueth of God wherefore we refuse not to be counted heretikes if you can proue that we holde any one article of faith contrarie to the scripture you may perchaunce note the names of them that preaching the trueth of our doctrine against your receyued errors were accounted of the world for heretikes but you must proue that their opinions are contrarie to the worde of God or els all your labour is in vaine we confesse also that some articles of our doctrine were taught by heretikes as there was neuer no heresie which had not many thinges common with true Religion but yet in
which we are iustified 2 Or in thinges where they doubt be contented to submit their seuerall meaninge to the iudgement of their Superiours THe Greeke church in doubtes will be ruled by the Patriarch of Constantinople and so will the rest of the Orientall churches by their cheefe Patriarches and bishops And the Protestants in Europe will also be ruled by their Superiours so farre as their superiors are ruled by Gods his worde 3 And to that communion and companie wherof they be name any companie of men agreeing and thus humbly affected in Christes Religion sauing the blessed fellowship and members of the Catholike communion and I recant TO the communion and company of the Grecians I name the Moscouites and Russians agreeing in Religion and so humbly affected and these are not of the fellowship that you call the Catholike communion Among the Protestants to the church of Saxonie I name the church of Dennemarcke or to the church of Helâ—etia the church of France or to the church of England the church of Scotlande but so that none of these allow any consent or submission but to the Truth which must be tried onely by God his worde And seeing none of these are of the Popish communioÌ„ if your promise be any thing worth you must recant The 16. article conteyneth one demande and one chalenge Furthermore name any one man that is confessed on both sides by the iudgement of the world to be holy and learned a member of the true Church in what age soeuer you list sence Christes time and proue him to haue bene in all articles of Faith of the Protestants meaninge SEeing you geue so large scope I will name S. Paule who I thinke is coÌ„fessed on both sides to be holy and learned and a member of the true Church whome I can proue by his writinges that in all articles of faith he taught the same which we beleeue And for triall of this because it woulde requier a whole volume if I shoulde proue euery particular article wherein we dissent from you Papistes If you will name an article wherein we agree not with S. Paule If I be not able to proue that we agree with him in the meaninge thereof I will reuoke that article and agree with you therein Yea if I bring not the aduersaries them selues to acknowledge in the ende him to be wholy against their doctrine in diuers of articles of great importance and therefore that he coulde not be of their church I recant YOu shall neuer bring vs neither in the beginning nor in the end to acknowledge that S. Paule is against vs in any article of our Faith but we agree wholy with him Neuerthelesse I know what you meane will not be afraide to vtter Forasmuch as immediatly after the Apostles time corruption entred into the Church which was hardly kept out while they liued as we maye learne by the Epistle to the Corinthians you thinke that we dare not depende vpon any one mans iudgement and therein you are not deceiued for we must depende onely vppon Gods worde But where you saye there is none but he dissenteth from vs in diuers articles of great importance you saye vntruely for you are not able to proue that Iustinus Martyr or Irenaeus two of the most ancient authenticall writers that the Church next vnto the Apostles had are against vs in any point of doctrine wherein we differ from you Yet are there certaine errors in them which neither you nor we allow as is touched before in the answere to the 11. article 1. deman But they are both wholly against you in diuers articles of your doctrine and namely in transubstantiatioÌ„ which is one of the greatest articles of Poperie as Irenaeus in the 34. cap. of his 4. booke Contra haereses Quemadmodum enim qui est a terra panis c.. Euen as the breade â–ª which is of the earth after it hath receyued the inuocation of God is not now common breade but the Eucharistie or breade of thankes geuing consisting of two thinges earthly heauenly so our bodies receyuing the Eucharistie are not now corruptible hauing hope of resurrection Here you see plainely that Irenaeus affirmeth the sacrament after consecration to consist of the earthly substance of breade which maye better be vnderstoode when we know that he reasoneth against such heretikes as denied the world to be made by God saying that he woulde neuer haue made so great a mysterie of bread which is a creature of the world if the worlde had not bene made by him Iustinus in his second Apologie to the Emperour 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. We doe not receiue these thinges as common breade and a common cuppe but euen as Iesus Christ our Sauiour was incarnate by the worde of God and tooke vpon him flesh and bloude for our saluation So we are taught that this meate for which thankes is geuen by the worde of prayer from him of which our fleshe and bloude are nourished by transmutation is the fleshe and bloude of Iesus that was incarnate Here he plainely affirmeth that the substance of the Sacrament is turned into the nourishment of our bodies Therfore it remaineth still after the consecration The other writers of later yeares as they haue some errors which neither you nor we doe allow in them so we are not afraid to confesse that they haue some corruption wherby you may seeme to haue colour of defence for inuocation of Sainctes prayer for the dead and diuerse superstitious and superfluous ceremonies yet not so addict to these nor ioyned with such absurdities as yours are But for the chiefe pointes of Christian Religion and the foundation of our faith that is for the honour of God the offices of Christ Redemption Iustification Satisfaction the fruites of Christ his passion Grace faith workes authoritie of God his word authoritie of the Pope reall presence transubstantiation Communion in both kindes Images c. the most approued writers Tertullian Cyprian Origen Epiphanius Hilarius Chrysostomus Ieronymus Ambrosius Augustinus c. are vtterly against you and therfore can not be of your church But for as much as they hold the foundation that is Christ though they haue diuerse errors superstitions they were doubtles the members of the true Church of Christ which because you are not able to disproue reason would you should recant The 17. Article conteyneth 5. demandes 1 I aske of them whether the Lutherans Zuinglians Illirians Caluenistes Confessionistes Swenkefeldians Anabaptistes and such like be all of one Church BEcause you would make simple men beleue that there be so many diuerse sectes of Protestantes as you haue giuen them names I will first discusse these sectes and afterwarde aunswere your question Lutherans you meane them that follow Luthers opinion of the Sacrament Zuinglians follow Caluines iudgement of the same Confessionistes them that exhibited their confession at Auspurge which were both the Lutherans and Zuinglians so these 3 names may be contracted
Catholike Church then can you no more condemne vs then Christ and his Apostles that were not onely not called the true Church but also were called heretikes deceiuers by the people of the Iewes which were as rightly called God his people as they that giue you the name of Catholike Church are called the Christian world It is well you haue nothing better to proue your Church then the honorable name of Catholike nor any thing more to condēne our Church then that we are not called Catholike and yet we haue as many nations and more then you haue that by publike authoritie call vs Catholikes and you heretikes although you most shamefully sclaunder vs that we doe refuse the name being offered vnto vs Seeing you boast so much of the name Catholike you shall heare what some of the old writers iudged thereof Chrysostome in an homelie that he writeth of Adam and Eue in the later ende hath these words after he hath tolde them that he hath no neede to repeate such depe questions as those men haue handled which haue fought against heretikes Satis sufficere credimus quicquid secūdum praedictas regulas Apostolica scripta nos docuerunt vt prorsus opinemur Catholicum quod apparuerit praefixis sententijs esse contrarium that is we beleue that what so euer the Apostles haue taught vs according to the foresayd rules is sufficient in so much that in no wise we thinke that to be Catholike which shall appeare to be contrary to the sentences before determined By this you may see that Chrysostome thought it not sufficient to haue the name of Catholike for he iudged nothing to be Catholike in deede that was contrary to the rule groūded in the writings of the Apostles Wherfore how so euer you boast of the honorable name of Catholike except you can proue that your opinions agree with the Scripture they are not Catholike in deede by Chrysostomes iudgement S. Augustine also in his booke de Genese ad literam imperfecto cap. 1. speaking of the Catholike faith sayth This is an article thereof that we should beleue Constitutam ab eo matrem Ecclesiam quae Catholica dicitur ex eo quia vniuersaliter perfecta est in nullo claudicat per totum orbem diffusa est That he hath appoynted a mother Church which is called Catholike of this because it is vniuersally perfect halteth in nothing and is dispersed ouer all the worlde S. Augustine here is not content that the Church be onely called Catholike but sheweth when it is that which it is called and therefore the popish Church not being vniuersally perfect as most Papists will confesse that many thinges in their church haue neede of reformation halting in many thinges from the truth of God his worde neither yet being dispersed ouer all the world but conteyned in a corner of Europa is not by S. Augustines rule the Catholike Church Furthermore S. Augustine cōtra Epistolam Fundamēti cap. 4. against the Manichees plainely declareth how farre forth not onely the name of Catholike but also how farre vniuersally consent succession antiquitie are to be allowed Vt ergo hanc omittam sapientiam c. Therefore to omitte this wisedom which you do beleue to be in the Catholike Church there be many other things which may hold me most righteously in her bosome The cōsent of people and nations holdeth me the authoritie begun with miracles nourished with hope encreased with charitie confirmed by antiquitie doth hold me The succession of Priestes from the very seate of Peter the Apostle vnto whom our Lord after his resurrection committed his sheepe to be fedde euen vnto this present bishopricke doth hold me Last of all that very name of Catholike doth hold me which name not without a cause this Church alone hath so obteyned among so many heresies that wheras all heretiks would be called Catholikes yet when a stranger shall aske where men meete at the Catholike Church none of the heretikes dare shew him either their principall temple or house All this you will say maketh exceeding much for vs yea but heare that which followeth Apud vos autem vbi nihil horum est quod me inuitet ac teneat sola personat veritatis pollicitatio quae quidem si tam manifesta monstratur vt in dubium venire non possit proponenda est omnibus illis rebus quibus in Catholica teneor that is But among you where there is none of these thinges that may prouoke or holde me there soundeth the onely promise of truth which if it be shewed so manifest that it can not come in doubt is to be preferred before all those thinges by which I am holden in a Catholike Church By this you may plainly see that though consent antiquitie succession and the name of Catholike be good confirmation when they are ioyned with the truth yet when a truth is seuered from them it is more to be regarded then they all it is truth that maketh Catholike to be estemed and not Catholike that giueth authoritie to truth Wherefore seeing it were better to proue your Church to be Catholike then to boast that it is so called to disproue our Church so to be then to say it is not so called The best way for you is to recant The 21. article conteyneth but one demande 1 Moreouer I aske of the Protestants whether in that time in which they holde the true church to haue bene hidden or lost the people that learned this article of their Creede I beleue the Catholike church was bounde to goe from that church which they sawe and taught them both the article and all other thinges touching their faith and by which they were Christened and receyued all other sacraments and commodities of saluation whether they were bounde I say to beleue this vnknowen and close Congregation which they coulde neuer come vnto nor by which they euer receiued or coulde receiue any benefit and so forsake that church by whom and in whom they receiued both their faith and sacraments Shew me therefore that the Christian men of these dayes were charged to beleeue any other church than that which taught them the article of the church and baptized them and I recant THis demande is like a drunken mans dreame hauing neither heade nor foote whether they shoulde beleue the church was lost whether they shoulde beleue the church that was vnknowen to them c. But if your demande haue any sense in it This is my aunswere The church was neuer lost but hidden from the eyes of the worlde Therefore if the people that where taught that article To beleue the Catholike church and were baptized to your church vnderstood that this church was not the Catholike church which was so commonly called but that God had a secret Congregation which was in deed the true Catholike church they were bound to forsake your church and to beleue the secret Congregation for if a man had ben baptized
obstinately defend the filthy whore of babylon against the cleare light of the Gospell the true spouse of Christ ye shall be damned except you recant The 23. article conteyneth 2. demandes 1 Againe shew me any Church or imagin if you can by good reason a church of Christ in which there is no gathering together for preaching no spirite of prophesying no rodde of correction no order of ministring nor any spirituall functioÌ„ that can be named proue me that there should be a true Church for a thousand yeares together and lacked all these thinges YOu would faine haue a great nombre of Articles and therefore you bring in one matter often times in diuers phrase of words that it might seeme a new matter when it hath bene vttered twise or thrise before as this Article is conteined before in the 5.8 and 9. Articles where you shall finde it more largely aunswered But let vs see what this strange demande requireth we must shew him a church or els imagine by good reason a church of Christ without preaching ministring and discipline for a thousand yeares together Although we will not graunt that it hath so longe continued without these exercises yet because you geue vs leaue to imagine we can imagine that it may as well continue without publike preaching ministring and discipline for a thousand yeares as it did for three hundred yeares before Constantine But you will say there was preaching ministring and correcting though it were not knowen to the tyrantes and persecutors so say I vnto you for that thousand yeres there was gathering together for preaching ministring and correcting though the Pope and his persecuting Prelates coulde not alwayes see it nor come to the knowledge of it for if they had once intelligence of it they smarted for it as is knowen by the stories of the Waldenses Bohemians c. Furthermore continuall exercise of preaching ministring of sacramentes and executing of discipline are notes of a quiet and peaceable Congregation not of a dispersed persecuted and disquieted Church How often doth S. Cyprian coÌ„plaine that the brethren could not be gathered togither for executing of discipline whereby it is certeyne that likewise they coulde not be gathered togither for other exercises Therefore the intermission of these exercises in a persecuted Church doth not proue the same to be no true Church But where so euer there be two or three gathered togither in the name of Christ there is he in the middest of them But whereas you require the spirite of prophesie except you meane the gift of interpreting the Scriptures the Church in the most quiet and flourishing state may want the spirite of shewing things to come as well as the giftes of tongues healing c. 2 And withall that there was an other vntrue Church which for those many dayes onely practised to the saluation of many all these offices and geue me a good reason why this Church that alwayes hath had these thinges should be a false Church and the other that wanted them to be a true Church and I recant WE vtterly denye that beside the true Church there was an vntrue church that practised those offices to the saluation of any man for once againe I tell you you haue neither the preaching of the word nor ministring of Sacraments nor execution of discipline according to the truth of God his institution but either altogither changed or else greatly corrupted And whereas you say that the popish church onely hath practised these offices I aske you againe whether the Greeke Church be a parte of your Church and whether the Papistes in England be a part of your Church The Grecians you will say are not but the English Papistes are Then haue I founde out by your owne iudgement the Church of the Grecians practising these offices being an vntrue church the church of the English Papistes not practising the same yet graunted of you to be a true Church Therfore you are bound to recant The 24. article conteyneth 10. demandes 1 Moreouer let any man shew how that Church can be the piller of truth which durst not for a thousand yeares clayme either preaching of Gods word or ministring of SacrameÌ„ts or shew her selfe against falshood or superstition AS the number of your articles doth draw to an ende so your matter is farre spent and therefore to make vppe your number you must repete one thing twise This demaund is conteined before in the 11. and 12. articles where also it is fully aunswered Notwithstanding seeing it commeth againe it shal be briefly aunswered in this place The Church is not called the piller of truth because it should stand alwayes in the sight of the world for then the defection which S. Paule speaketh of could not haue come neither should the Church flie into the wildernes as was declared to S. Iohn But it is called the piller of truth because that where so euer the Church is either visible or inuisible there is the truth So though the Church were hidde a certeyne time in the wildernes yet there was trueth with the Church You seeme to be a good Arithmetrician for no number soundeth in your mouth but a thousand Neuerthelesse how long so euer it was the piller of truth decayed not And as God gaue his spirite diuers times was bold to chalenge preaching and ministring of the Sacraments yea and so boldly that it cost many of the chalengers their liues As Berengarius Bruno Marsilus de Pandua Ioannes de Gaudano Ioannes VVickleffe VValdo Ioannes Hus Ieronymus de Praga c. Thus it is manifest that the Church hath diuers tymes chalenged her right and withstood falshood 2 Let any man shew that all giftes of the spirite and functions of the holy Ghost haue bene taken from her a thousand yeares togither and onely practised to the peoples vse by an aduouterous Church THere is no man can shew this for it is a false lye that all giftes of the spirite function of the holy Ghost were either taken from the true Church or giuen to the adulterous church And this hath bene shewed more then once or twise before 3 Let it be declared how the gates of hell haue not preuailed or Christes promise and warrant for her not bene voyd frustrate if a bastard Church exercising idolatry as they say hath spoyled the true Church of all holy actions and the whole gouernment and the whole name of Christianitie almost euer since Christes tyme. THe Deuill hath bent all his force and ordinance he hath armed all the power of darkenesse he stirred vp â—yrantes heretikes Popes Saracenes and Turkes to destroye the Church the dragon that olde serpent Satanas the Deuill stoode before the woman to deuoure her childe he persecuted her into the wildernesse he cast out of his mouthe a great riuer to cary her awaie he made warre with the rest of her seede that keepe the commaundementes of god Apoc. 12. but yet in despight of the deuill the
church of Rome may falsely interprete the scripture which you woulde beare them in hande were impossible 3 Or induce any error among the people THe true and onely church of God is so guided by God his spirite and directâ—d by his worde that she can not induce any damnable error to continue Yet as it is declared before she hath no such priuilege graunted but that she may be deceiued in some thinges for her knowledge is vnperfect and her prophecying is vnperfect 1. Cor. 13. And it is true that S. Augustine sayeth euen the whole church is taught to saye Forgeue vs our trespasses And if generall Councells be the church represented as you Papistes doe teache S. Augustine plainely affirmeth that they may erre De Baptismo contra Donatistas lib. 2. cap. 2. Quis autem nesciat sanctam scripturam Canonicam tam veteris quam noui Testamenti c. And who knoweth not that the holy Canonicall scripture as well of the olde as of the newe Testament is conteined within her certeine boundes and that it is so preferred before all later writinges of byshops that of it no man may in any wise doubt or dispute whether it be true or whether it be right what so euer is knowen to be written therin and that the writings of bishops which haue bene written or are now in writinge maye be reprehended if they haue gonne astraie any thing from the trueth both by the saying that is perhaps more wise of any man that is more skilfull in that matter and by the more graue authoritie and wisedom of other better learned bishops and also by Councells and that euen those Councells which are gathered in euery region or prouince ought to geue place without all doubt to the authoritie of the generall Councells which are gathered out of all the Christian worlde and that euen the very generall Councells may often be amended the former by the later when as by any triall of thinges that is opened which before was shut and that is knowen which before was hidden without any swelling of wicked pride without any stubbernesse of arrogance without any contention of peuishe enuie with holy Humility with Catholike peace with Christian charity Thus farre S. Augustine which cleerely affirmeth that generall Councells may often erre which maye often be amended but that the authority of God his worde is to be preferred before the writinges of all Doctors and Decrees of all Councells and that it onely can not erre The Councell of Carthage the 3. ca. 23. determined that all prayers at the altar shoulde be directed onely to the Father and not to the Sonne or the holy Ghost whether this be an error to define that it is vnlawfull to pray to God the Sonne and God the holy Ghost let euery man iudge But you will except that this was a prouinciall Synode and not a generall Councell But I aunswere you it hath the authoritie of a generall Councell because it was confirmed in the sixt generall Councell holden at Constantinople in Trullo And as for the Popish church that it maye erre what neede we better proofe than the prayer which it maketh after the ending of euery generall Councell Precamur scilicet vt ignorantiae parcas errori indulgeas that is we praye truely that thou wouldest spare our ignorance pardoÌ„ our error And againe Et quia conscientia remordente tabescimus ne aut ignorantia nos traxerit in errorom aut praeceps forsitan voluntas impulerit a Iustitia declinare ob hoc te poscimus te rogamus vt si quid offensionis in hac Concilij celebritate attraximus condonare remissibile facere digneris that is And because we are greued with remorce of conscience lest either ignorance haue drawen vs into error or perhaps rash will hath driuen vs to decline from Iustice therefore we praye thee we beseech thee that if we haue drawen vnto vs any offence in the celebration of this Councell thou wouldest vouche safe to pardon and to make it remissible c. If it be impossible for the generall Councell to erre what neede they pray to God to pardon their error and when their owne conscience condemneth them and compelleth them to confesse and that before God that they may erre what impudence is it in any man to contend that they can not erre Furthermore the second Councell of Nice determined that Angels and soules of men had bodies were visible and circumscriptible and therefore might be painted and this it affirmeth to be the iudgement of the Catholike church Con. Nice 2. Actione 5. If this be not to induce an error to make men beleue that Angells and spirites haue bodies visible and circumscriptible there was neuer anye error sence the worlde beganne Finally when they say the Pope can not erre they acknowledge that such generall Councells as condemned Popes for heretikes did erre as the sixt generall Councell of Constantinople in Trullo which condemned and accursed Pope Honorius for an heretike Actione 13. Euen as Pope Leo the 2. did also as appeareth in his epistle to the Emperour Constantine Also the Councell of Constance did erre which condemned Pope Iohn the 23. for denying the immortality of the soule and the resurrection of the body Session 11. which Councell Pope Iohn him selfe affirmed to be most holy and that it coulde not erre Session 12. And the Councell of Basile did erre which deposed Pope Eugenius the 4. Session 34. the same Councell being confirmed by Pope Nicolas the 5. Session 43. If you say these two last Councells did not erre in condemning and deposing these Popes Then the great generall and OEcumenicall Councell of Ferraria and Florence did erre in disallowing the determination of these Councells Thus it is manifest that the Romish church which they them selues confesse to be represented in a generall Councell may erre which hath so often erred And if it may erre and be deceiued it selfe what man is he that neede to doubt Whether it maye induce any error among the people 4 Or approue any vnprofitable or hurtefull vsage among Christians IF the church had not approued many vnprofitable and hurtefull vsages among the people in S. Augustines time what neede had he to complaine that many of God his coÌ„maundemeÌ„ts were litle regarded mans presumptions so highely esteemed Sed hoc nimis doleo c. But herewithall I am to much greued that many thinges which in God his booke are most holsomly commanded are lesse regarded and all thinges are so full of so many presumptions that he is more greuousely reproued which in his vtas hath touched the earth with his bare foote that he that hath buried his minde in dronkennesse Therefore if it be an vnprofitable and hurtefull vsage to preferre mans traditions before God his commaundementes the Church in S. Augustines time approued an vnprofitable and hurtefull vsage Furthermore if the Church can not approue an vnprofitable or hurtefull vsage wherefore are so many ceremonies as
Church only is this sure anchore which the popish church doth so much despise that she counted it heresie for vs to flie vnto Fayth tanquam ad sacram anchoram that is As to our only sure refuge 16 Vinea Domini THe Vineyard of the Lorde is of his owne plantinge dressed tilled by such husbandmen as he hath placed in it which will yeelde him frute in time conuenient This agreeth aptly vnto our Church which alloweth no plant but such as is planted by our heauenly Father This Vineyarde caÌ„ not the popish church be compted which plucketh vppe the vines planted by God and in the steede of them setteth thornes and thistles after the deuises of men 17 Terra viuentium THe land of the lyuing in scripture signifieth this present life as I trusted to see the goodnesse of the Lorde in the lande of the lyuing that is Although I was neare death yet I beleued that God woulde preserue me in this life Psal. 27. And vnto Doeg he sayeth Psal. 52. God shall destroy thy roote out of the lande of the lyuing that is Out of this life Also Ezechias in his psalme Esay 38. I shall not see the Lorde euen the Lorde in the lande of the lyuing that is I shall no more praise God in his temple here in this life And when you shall bring forth a place of scripture where it is proprely applied vnto the church it shal be an easie matter to proue that we onely are the liuely members of Christ which abide in his body receuing all benefites of life from him which is our heade And easie it wil be to proue that you are the lande of the deade men which are strangers from the life of God Ephes. 4. which are aliue in this worlde and not deade vnto Christ. 18 Regina in vestitu de aurato circundata varietatibus ALthough this saying alleaged out of the 45. Psalme be figuratiuely ment of the church as it is literaly spoken of Pharaos doughter whom Solomon maried yet being alleaged not after the trueth of the Hebrue but after the error of the olde translation I will not interprete it contrarie to my conscience as S. Ieronym â—ayeth according to that corrupt version but according to the trueth of the text which is The Queene in a garment of golde of Ophir As for compassing with varieties it is not in the text By this figure the spirituall magnificence of the church of Christ gathered of the Gentiles is set forth vnto vs and therefore let not the Papistes dreame that material golde is the ornament of Christ his spouse but as it is before sayed of the whore of Babylon 19 Ecclesia magna 20 Populus grauis DAuid in the 35. Psalme promiseth that he will geue thankes vnto God after his deliuerance in a great companie and solemne assemblie of people such as was wont to come together at the holy meetings in the Sanctuarie This is the true and the simple meaning of this text And it were to violent an interpretation to inforce it to be a prophesie of the church of Christ although it be true that the church is a great congregation and a mighty people yet remembring therewith that in comparizon of all the worlde it is as Christ him selfe calleth it A litle Flocke 21 Archa Noe. IN the Arch of Noe as S. Peter testifieth 1. Pet. 3. but a fewe namely 8. soules were saued in the water euen as many as were obedient vnto the voice of God the whole worlde beside were drowned Wherefore how fewe soeuer we be As the Papistes say we are not many so long as we obey the voice of God we doubt not but we shal be saued in the Arch. And the Papistes with all their vniuersality and multitude despising the lawe of God shall perishe with the wicked worlde 22 Tabernaculum altissimi THe old Tabernaecle was a figure of the true Church and we know that none shall dwell therein but such as be described in the Psal. 15. Therefore let the Papistes bragge as long as they list of the Tabernacle of the highest yet shall they not dwell there neither shall they rest in his holy hill because they be not indued with such vertues springing of true and a liuely faith As in that Psalme be set forth 23 Ager area Dei. THe church is the feelde and flower of God in his feelde he soweth none but good seede the chaffe shal be purged from his flower The Papistes are some of these tares whome the enuious man hath sowed while men were a sleepe and the chaffe which after it be purged from the corne together with the tares shal be burned in the vnquencheable fire 24 Mater fidelium IErusalem that is from aboue is free which is the mother of vs all which embrace Iesus Christ as our onely Redemer from the bondage and curse of the lawe As for that steppe mother of Rome which bringeth men into captiuitie through ceremonies and traditions of men Begetteth vnto bondage as Agar did and is become the mother not of the faithfull but of abhominable fornication Apocalip 17. 25 Nutrix Christianorum THe church of Christ is the Nurse of ChristiaÌ„s which bringeth them vp and feedeth them first with milke and afterwarde with stronger meates according as they are able to receue it 1. Cor. 3. Heb. 6. But Rome which feedeth her babes with poyson of mans traditions in steede of the milke of God his word will rather see them famish than they shoulde taste of God his worde maye well be a nurse of Antichristians but neuer did good vnto Christians 26 Ecclesia orthodoxa TRue opinions are confirmed out of the worde of trueth wherefore our church which holdeth no doctrine but such as is tried by the worde of truth most truly may be called the true beleuing church Contrarywise the Popish church which so manifestly dissenteth from the worde of trueth that she dare not be iudged thereby but most blasphemously submitteth the same to her corrupt and false iudgement maye iustly be called a false beleeuing church 27 Vna Sancta Catholica 28 Apostolica THis hath bene often proued before And namely in the first second third and fourth demandes of this last Article 29 Vxor de latere Christi sicut Eua de latere Adam AS S. Augustine sayeth The church of Christ is taken out of his side as Eue was out of Adams side which so long as she obeyeth the voice of her â—usbande is not deceiued by the serpeÌ„t But if she be absent from him that she be not instructed by him she is deceiued by heretikes Augusti De Genes contra Manichaeos libro 2. cap. 24. 26. by which place of Augustine it is proued that the Church may erre if she be not ruled by the worde of God. 30 Domus Pacis THe church may be called the house of Peace because there is in it Peace and agreement in the cheefest Articles of the Faith or because in it is taught vs the
and tranquilitie we haue through Gods singular goodnes vnder the happy gouernment of our Soueraigne Lady enioyed these many yeares looke to those Churches of God in Fraunce and the lowe countryes of Germany which within these twenty yeares haue bene for the most part planted growne vp flourished altogither vnder the heauy crosse and most sharp persecution what carnall pleasure hath allured them what worldly voluptuousnes hath and doth still intise them in so great multitudes to embrace this doctrine whereof if they tast neuer so smal they see present daunger of death or losse of all their goods with banishment Surely this is the Lords doing and it is marueilous in our eyes But to conclude this man if he can not haue loue and praise for his valiant enterprise yet by patient bearing of hatred and reproch he maketh full account of satisfaction for his sinnes O miserable conscience of the Papistes which haue no peace with god through faith in his infinite mercy but seeke to satisfie the streightnes of his eternall iustice by such beggerly shiftes as these which also he is so vncertaine whether they wil serue his turne that he feareth lest he lose al his labour if he happen to lose the streight line of the Churches truth which in these darke daies a man may quickly lose What say you M. Allen is it so hard a matter to keepe the streight line of the Churches truth in these darke dayes Why Where is the citie builded vpon an hill that can not be hidden Where is that visible and knowne Church which can not erre If that which was wont to be the only rule of truth among Papists faile you try an other rule of the Protestants and as Augustine exhorteth you search the word of God in the holy Scriptures and then vndoubtedly you shall finde the truth and the Church also that is the piller of truth though the dayes be neuer so darke or your eyes neuer so dymme if with like humilitie you would submit your self to the iudgment therof as you pretend to doe to the ministers and pastors of your faith and religion The Lorde if it be his will open your eyes that you may see the truth and geue you grace when you see it that you striue not against it to your owne destruction THE PREFACE VVHEREIN BE NOTED TWO SORTES OF HEretikes th one pretending vertue thother openly professing vice And that our time is more troubled by this second sort With a briefe note of the Authors principall intent in this Treatise 1 ALthough heresie and all willfull blindnesse of mannes minde be vndoubtedly a iust plage of God for sinne and therefore is commonly ioyned with euill life both in the people and preachers thereof as the historie of all ages and sondry examples of the Scriptures may plainely proue yet by the gyle and crafty conueiaunce of our common enimie the deuil falsehod is often so cloked in shadow and shape of trueth and the maisters thereof make such show of vertue and godly life that you would thinke it had no affinitie with vice nor origine of mannes misbehauiour at all So did he couer the wicked heresies of Manicheus Marcion Tatianus and the like with a fained flourish of continency and chastity so did he ouercast thenimie of Gods grace Pelagius with thapparance of all grauity constancy and humility and so hath he alwayes where craft was requisite to his intent made shew of a simple sheepe in the cruell carkase of a wily woulfe This good condition S. Paule noted in him in these wordes Ipse enim Satanas â—ransfigurat se in Angelum lucis For Satanas his owne person shapeth him selfe into an Angell of light And that his scholars play the like part our master Christ of singular loue gaue his flocke this wachword for a speciall prouiso Attendite à falsis prophetis qui veniunt ad vos in vestimentis ouium intrinsecùs autem sunt lupi rapaces Take heede of false prophetes that come in sheepes vesture but within be rauening wolues He sawe that seeth all things that the outward face of fained holinesse might easily cary away the simple he detected the serpentes subteltie that none might iustly pleade ignorance in a case so common and withall for thenstruction of the faithfull he gaue falsehoode and her fortherers this marke for euer that conuey they neuer so cleane or close yet their vnseemely workes should euer detect their fained faith But all this notwithstanding if we deeply weye the whole course of thinges we shal finde that this counterfaiting of vertue and show of pietie is not the perpetuall intent of the deuils deuise but rather a needefull shift in forthering his practise there onely where faith and vertue be not vtterly extinguished then the full ende of any one of all his endeuoures For this may we assuredly finde to be the scope pricke of al his cursed trauel to set sinne and her followers in such freedome that they neade not as often els for their protection the cloke of vertue nor habite of honestie but that they may boldly encounter with the good and godly and in open ostentation of their mischiefe ouer runne all trueth and religion VVherefore as he often cloketh subtell heresies in honest life and vertues weede so when he by likelihoodes conceyueth hope of better successe and forther aduentures he theÌ„ openeth a common schoole of sinne and wickednesse where mischiefe may with out colour or crafte be boldely mainteined This open schoole of iniquity and doctrine of sinne he once busely erected in the gentilitie by the infamous philosopher Epicurus and his adherents teaching to the singular offense of honestie pleasure and voluptuousnesse to be thonely ende of all our life and endeuours The which pleasaunt sect though it euer sence hath had some promotours yet the very shade of fained vertue and worldely wisedome of those dayes with ease bare downe that enterprise This broade practise was yet further attempted euen in Christes church first by Eunomius who doubted not in the face of the world to auouch that none could perish were his workes neuer so wicked that would be of his faith And then by Iouinianus who taught the contempt of Christian fastes matched mariage with holy maidenhood and afterward to the great wonder of all the Church perswaded certaine religious women in Rome to forsake their first faith mary to their damnation For which plaine supporting of vndoubted wickednesse S. Hierome calleth them often Christian Epicures boulsterers of sinne doctors of â—ust and lecherie Neuerthelesse the force of Gods grace which was great in the spring of our religion the sinne of the worlde not yet ripe for such open show of liceÌ„tious life speedely repressed that wicked attempt For as S. Augustine declareth it was so cleare a falshoode that it neuer grew to deceiue any one of all the Cleargy But not long after with much morâ— aduantage
the like practise was assayed by Mahomet the deuills onely dearling by whome numbers of wiues togither often diuorcies and perpetuall change for nouelty was permitted By which doctrine of lust and libertie the floure of Christiandom alas for pity was caried away At which time though our faith Christes church were brought to a small roome and very great straights yet by Gods grace good order and necessary discipline this schoole of lust hath bene reasonably till our dayes kept vnder and the grauitie of Christian maners as the time serued orderly vpholden TO THE PREFACE 1 IF you had not promised and professed an orderly proceding in this cause we woulde neuer haue enquired whether good order would require that an heretike should haue bene first defined before he were diuided And especially in this controuersie where either partie chargeth other with heresie it had been conuenient that the right definition or description of an heretike had bene first set downe that men might thereby haue learned who is iustly to be burdened with that crime For an heretike is he that in the Church obstinatly mainteineth an opinion that is contrary to the doctrine of God coÌ„teined in the holy Scriptures which if any of vs can be proued to doe then let vs not be spared but condemned for heretiks But if iust proofe therof can not be brought against vs but contrarywise we be able to shew manifest euideÌ„ce that our aduersaries doctrine is cleane contrary to the Scriptures of God then let the name of heretikes be applied to them to whome the definition doth agree with further punishment due to calumniators that slaunder other men in that whereof they are guilty them selues Nowe to the matter of this Preface which as the argumeÌ„t declareth consisteth of three partes wherof the first is that there be two sorts of heretiks the one preteÌ„ding vertue the other opeÌ„ly professing vice This part is shewed in three leaues following In the substaÌ„ce of which point I will noâ— differ with you yet something will I note in your handling thereof as occasion moueth me First you affirme that heresie and all willfull blindnesse is vndoubtedly a iust plague of God for sinne I mislike not your affirmation but I maruaile how you can affirme this and be a good Catholike when we cannot say halfe so much but we are charged by you to make God the author of sinne But such is the force of trueth that oftentimes the enimies thereof them selues when they speake without contention cannot auoyed a true confession God therefore as this Papist can not now deny punisheth sinne with sinne not as an euil author but as a rightuous iudge Proceding further you say that Christ hath geuen all heretikes this marke that there vnsemely works should euer detect their fained faith wherein you speake not onely contrary to the trueth but euen to your owne affirmation before For our Sauiour Christ hath apoynted false prophetes to be knowne by their fruites which is there false doctrine contrary to Gods worde cloked with the sheepe skinnes of fained holinesse and vertue which though it be many times discouered yet is it many times so closely conueyed that it clearly escapeth the iudgement of all men Who was euer hable to chardge that damnable heretike Pelagius with any notorious crime or wicked behauiour in his outwarde life and conuersation you your selfe confesse that there appeared in him nothing but grauity constancy and humility If his doctrine had not bene found contrary to the word of God he shoulde neuer haue bene tried to be a faulse prophete by his workes Such are many of his scholers the free will men of our time whose opinion if it were not manifestly repugnant to the authoritie of the holy Scriptures there manners are vnreprouable in the iudgemeÌ„t of mortall men The like may be said of Iouinian who if he were so great an heretike as you make him yet he himselfe as you shew after out of Augustine offended not in that which he perswaded others to doe Your last example of heretiks openly professing vice is of Mahomet by whose licentious doctrine you affirme that your faith Christes Church were brought to a small roome very great streights If this be true thaâ— you affirme that the Catholike Church must be otherwise estemed and by other notes then you are wont to describe it or else your Church by your owne assertion can not be counted Catholike For if Christes Church be brought to a small roome and great streights where is vniuersality Consent of all nations multitude of people c. that you are wont to talke of But by your discipline the schoole of lust hath bene reasonably till our dayes kept vnder the grauitie of Christian maners as the time serued orderly vpholden You doe well to qualifie your asseueration with those termes reasonably orderly and as the time serued For otherwise the whole Christian worlde should be witnesse against you and yet to shew with what reason order or opportunitie the schoole of lust hath bene shut vp before our time or yet is Wher your doctrine most preuaileth let the filthy stewes and brothel houses opened in euery citie yea and at your mother citie of Rome most licentiously of all other not onely by your gouernours permitted but also by your doctors defended let them I say beare sufficient witnesse against you 2 But now once againe in our cursed dayes the great flowe of sinne turning Gods mercy from vs with exceding prouocation of his heauy indignation towards the wicked hath made our aduersary much mâ—re bold and long practise of mischiefe a great deale more skilful The serpent passed all other creatures in subtelty at the beginning but now in cruelty he farre passeth him selfe The downefall that he hath in a fewe yeares rage driuen man vnto by thopen supporting of sinfull liuing it is sure very wofull to remember and an exceding hearts greefe to consider Looke backe at the Christian Epicures whom I now named view the men of like endeuour in al ages compare their attempts to ours their doctrine to ours the whole race of their proceedings to ours And if we match them not in all pointes and passe them in most I except the wicked Mahomet and God graunt I may so doe long though they had out of his holy schoole their often diuorciâ—s and new mariages in their wiues life excepting him therefore if ours passe not in open practise of mischiefe and supportation of sinne all the residue miscredit me for euer This is euident to all men that thinges once counted detestable before God abhorred of the priestes straunge to the Christian people punishable by the lawes of all Princes be now in case to maintaine them selues to geue vertue a checke mate and without all colour to beare downe both right and religion Thus doth sacriledge boldly beare out it selfe and ouerreacheth the promoters of Gods honour so doth incest encounter with lawfull mariage the
them but onely to terme vice by the name of vertue And then we must be examined by what right we chaunge the names of thinges that can not alter their natures Stay a while your examination M. Allen this is no orderly proceding Good order would require that you shoulde first proue vs gilty of the crimes and then to take away our excuses Howebeit I blame you not if you leaue of the proofe of those thinges which would sooner reproue your selues then conuict your aduersaries And yet that you may see howe cleare a conscience we haue in these crimes obiected I will not refuse to answere your interrogatories although by no lawfull and orderly proceding I can be compelled thereto In primis who authorised you to call that extirpation of superstition which our fathers called sacriledge To this I answere I care not what your fathers called or counted sacriledge But God our heauenly father commaunded vs to breake burne and destroy all your idols and to deface al the monuments of them Deut. 12. And all the godly Patriarkes and fathers both before Christes comming and since haue geuen vs example of obedience vnto this commaundement and the obseruation thereof they haue termed the extirpation of superstition and idolatry Or that blinde deuotion which our holy Elders named true religion we learned of our Sauiour Christ and his Apostles to condemne that for blinde deuotion which is not grounded vpon certaine knowledge of Gods word you worship you know not what saith Christ to the Samaritane Iohn 4. S. Paule chargeth the obstinate Iewes with zeale without knowledge Rom. 10. How can they for sinne and shame honour that with the name of holy mariage that S. Ambrose termeth aduoultry S. Augustine worse then aduoultery and they with al the residue of doctours horrible incest The holy Ghost hath taught vs to call mariage honorable in all men and the bed vndefiled whatsoeuer any man hath sayd to the contrary And yet diuers godly men of the auncient fathers as Hieronym and Epiphanius allow mariage in them that can not conteine although they haue vowed virginitie euen as the spirite of God also hath spoken by S. Paule Because it is better to marry then to burne Epipha lib. 2. Haere 61. Hieron Epi. ad Demetriaden And now that I haue aunswered your questions I must be bolde to demaunde the same of you what authoritie you haue to chaunge the names of thinges when you can not alter their nature Who taught you to call that religion which holy Scripture calleth Idolatry or that true deuotion which God calleth vaine worshipping where learned you to call a gluttonous feast of fish a religious fasting or a sumptuous banket of wine spices fruites and deintie conseites a streight and holy abstinence with what face or conscience can you call that ouerflowing lust of your popish vnmaried Cleargie a pure and vndefiled chastitie Finally where learned you but of the Deuill him selfe to commaund abstinence from meates and mariage for religions sake to some men at all times and to all men at some times If for these and an hundred such you can shew no better warrant then the termes of your fathers the practise of your elders or the authoritie of mortall men the curse of God pronounced by Esay against them that call euill good or good euill must needes be turned ouer vnto you But to goe on with this orderly proceding whereby we are first accused and then by and by condemned without euer being conuicted or once put to the triall Next of all lest men should maruell howe so manifest impietie could so mightely preuaile they are told that it is onely present pleasure and similitude of maners that ioyneth so many vnto vs And for proofe hereof men must call to remembraunce the first entrance of this misery how these preachers haue had certaine persons in admiration for their owne aduantage We refuse not the triall but let men on Gods name call to remembraunce howe our doctrine beganne to be restored in these last dayes I pray you what priuate aduantage could they by any likelyhood be supposed to seeke which incurred manifest daunger of their liues by the least suspition of their profession or what persons could they haue in admiration when all Princes great personages were their greatest persecutors but they wanne them by flattery and sewed them cushians vnder their elbowes and laid pillowes vnder their heades This is in deede a sore accusation but where is the proofe Forsoth to such as made no store of good workes they cast onely faith vnder their elbowe to leane vppon O impudent blasphemer which of vs euer taught that such a faith as is not liuely fruitefull of good workes did euer profite any man but to the increase of his damnation To such as were burdened with promise of chastity they made a cushen for their ease To such as had rashly vowed that which they could not possibly performe not we but S. Paule sayth if they can not containe let them marry for it is better to marry then to burne S. Ieronym otherwise an vnmeasurable aduancer of virginitie dispraiser of mariage Ep. ad Dem. speaketh of virgins that professed chastity and liued vnpurely c. apertè dicendum est vt aut nubant si se non possunt continere aut contineant si nolunt nubere It must be plainly sayd vnto them that either they should marry if they can not containe or els containe if they will not marry Epiphanius lib. 2. haer 61. calleth mariage for such men not a cushen for their ease but an holsome medicine against their disease and the wound of burning and that sayth he was the doctrine of the Church in his time To such as cast an eye vpon Church goods they borowed a pillow of Iudas why was not this solde and giuen to the poore If euer any man hearde this text alleged by any preacher for such purpose let that man be counted such one as M. Allen termeth him if no man were heard euer to speake after that maner let M. Allen be taken for a man of such truth as he sheweth him selfe to be But it is a small thing to breake the bondes of modestie in a fewe poyntes if a man striue not to passe impudencie it selfe in shamelesse lying Commit what you list omit what you list your preachers shall prayse it in their wordes and practise it in their workes Sauing that vaine glorious affecters of painted eloquence be sometime so carefull of their wordes that they forget their matter I would haue thought that the father of lies him selfe the continuall accuser of Gods Sainctes would haue feared for euer losse of his credite to haue vttered so vnseemely a sclaunder of vs But I suppose that this disciple of his more regarding how finely then howe truely he inueyeth against his aduersaries had such pleasure in allusion of these termes commit and omit praise and practise words and workes that he respected
Gods iustice howe can the same suffering be mitigated by masses pardons merites c. or cleane taken away by a pardon of Iubely à poena culpa Againe howe can the merites of an other abate his punishment which must suffer him selfe to aunswere Gods iustice If the iustice of God be not aunswered by the offering of Christ how is it aunswered when any mans suffering is by any of your meanes mollified or taken away But it sufficeth you that your forefathers more then a thousand yeares agoe called that place of sufferance purgatory But I pray you what is it called in the Scripture either of the olde testament or the newe or in the first and second hundreth yeares after Christ Diuerse errours be older then a thousand yeares but age can neuer make falshoode to be truth and therefore I waye not your proude bragges worth a strawe I am one of the least of Gods ministers and not worthy in respect of my greatest infirmities of the lowest place in his Church yet by his grace and the authoritie of his holy word I shall be able to ouerthrowe both this and all other babylonicall bulwarkes that are cast vp by Sathan and all his instruments For the defence of popish heresie against the tâ—uth of god And neither the myst of mens inuentions which you call the light of apostolike tradition shall be able to darken the truth of the Gospell nor the errours of mortall men which you terme the force of Gods trueth shall beare downe thauthoritie of Gods holy spirite And as for the torment of conscience by inward acknowedlging of the truth openly withstanded it is not like you could so liuely describe it if you had not experience of it in your selfe Our consciences most humble and harty thankes we yeald to the infinite mercy of God are washed white and purged from all blacknes by the precious bloud of Christ which is the propitiation for our sinnes that cleaue vnto him by true liuely faith and open iudgement shall one day shew that all obstinate Papistes which seeke to establish their owne iustice shal be voyde of the iustice of God while they wrastle to come out of purgatory they take the high way to fall headlong into hell God lighten the eyes of them that are blinde of simplicitie and confound all such as sinne of malicious wickednes The excuse of your sharpe speach perhaps might seeme probable if you did not vse intollerable sclaundering and rayling which neither by zeale of trueth nor example of godly fathers can well be shadowed much lesse warranted THAT OFTEN AFTER OVR SINNES BEFOR GIVEN BY THE sacrament of penaunce there remaineth some due of temporall punishment for the satisfying of Gods iustice some recompence of the offences past CAP. I. 1 AS it is most true and the very grounde of all Christian comfort that Christes death hath payed duely and sufficiently for the sinnes of all the world by that aboundant price of redemption payed vppon the Crosse So it is of like credit to all faithfull that no man was euer partaker of this singular benefite but in the knotte and vnitie of his body misticall which is the Church To the members whereof the streames of his holy bloud and beames of his grace for the remission of sinne sanctification be orderly through the blessed Sacraments as condethes of Gods mercy conueyde All which Sacraments though they be instituted and vsed as meanes to deriue Christes benefites and bestow his grace of redemption vppon the worthy receiuers yet like effect or force is not by the meaning of their first author and institutor emploied vpon all receiuers nor giuen to all the Sacraments That may well appeare if we marke the exceding aboundant mercy that is powred vpon al men at their first incorporation and entraunce into the houshold of the faithfull by Baptisme In which Sacrament the merites of our masters death be so fully and largely caried downe for the remission of sinne that were the life before neuer so loden with most horrible offences that in this misery man may commit yet the offender is not onely pardoned of the same but also perfectly acquieted for euer of all paine or punishment other then the common miseries of mankind which his proper offences before committed by any meanes might deserue And no lesse free nowe then the childe after baptisme which onely originall sinne brought thither So sayth S. Ambrose by these wordes Gratia Dei in Baptismate non quaerit gemitum aut planctum aut opus aliquod nisi solum ex corde professionem The grace of God in Baptisme requireth neither sorow nor mourning nor any other worke but onely an hearty profession of thy faith VVhereby he meaneth that after our sinnes be once thus freely wiped away in our first regeneration there is no charge of punishment or penaunce for farther reliefe of the same But now a man that is so freely discharged of all euill life and sinne committed before he came into the family if he fall into relapse defile the temple of God then as Gods mercy alwaies passeth manns malice euen in this case also he hath ordayned meanes to repaire mans fall againe That is by the Sacrament of penaunce which therefore S. Hierome termeth the second table or refuge after shipwracke as a meanes that may bring man to the porte of saluation though lightly not without present dammage and daunger In which blessed Sacrament though Gods grace haue mighty force for mans recouery and worketh aboundantly both remission of sinnes and the discharge of eternall punishment due by iust iudgement to the offender yet Christ him selfe the author of this Sacrament as the rest meant not to communicate such efficacie or force to this as to baptisme for the vtter acquieting of all paine by sinnefull life deserued For as in Baptisme where man is perfectly renewed it was semely to set thoffender at his first entraunce on cleare ground and make him free for all thinges done abrode so it excedingly setteth forth Gods iustice and nothing impareth his mercy to vse as in all common welthes by nature and Gods prescription is practised with grace discipline with iustice clemency with fauour correction and with loue due chastisement of such sinnes as haue by the houshold children bene committed Nowe therefore if after thy free admission to this family of Christ thou doe greeuously offend remission may then be had againe but not commonly without sharpe discipline seeing the father of this our holy houshold punisheth where he loueth and chastiseth euery childe whom he receiueth VVhose iustice in punishment of sinne not onely the wicked but also the good must much feare VVhereof S. Augustine warneth vs thus Deus sayth he nec iusto parcit nec iniusto illum flagellando vt filium istum puniendo vt impium God spareth neither the iust nor vniust chastising th one as his childe punishing the other as a wicked
example of King Dauid is counted a great and speciall bulwarke of this cause which notwithstanding is answered euen as the rest Dauid the child of God was beaten with the mercifull rodde of Gods fatherly correction and set as an example to Gods children of all ages to shew how God abhorreth murder and adultery And although the payne were bitter for the tyme as all chastisment is yet no doubt but he receaued great profite thereby Heb. 12. And as for the plague for numbring the people it fell vpon them for their own sinnes as the text is playne The saying of Gregory that God leaueth no sinne vnpunished which is pardoned if it be vnderstood that all the sinnes of the faithfull are punished in Christ which became sinne for vs it is most true But if he meane that God punisheth all sinnes that he pardoneth in the partyes them selues it is contrary to the manifest worde of God and infinite examples of the Scripture The Publicane the prodigall childe the debters all clearely remitted doe playnly proue that God freely forgiueth iustifieth rewardeth the penitent sinners without exacting any punishment of them for aunswering of the debt satisfying for the sinnes abusing his fatherly clemency Luke 7. 15. 18. Finally for auouching myne aunswer I would wish no better authority of the auncient fathers then euen that which M. Allen him selfe allegeth out of Augustine contra Faustum lib. 23. cap. 67. that the punishment of Dauid was flagelli paterni disciplina the chastisement of Gods fatherly scourge as he doth most playnly declare the same in his booke de peccatorum meritis ac remissione lib. 2. cap. 33. and for a flatt conclusion contradictory to M. Allens assertion I will vse the very wordes of Chrysostome in the 8. Hom. vppon the Epistle to the Rom. Vbi venia ibi nulla erit poena Where there is forgeuenes there is no punishment The double and doubtfull shiftes of our aduersaries pressed by this conclusion are remoued and it is proued against one sort that these foresayde scourges vvere in deede punishments for sinnes remitted And agaynst thother sect that this transitory payne hath often endured in the next life CAP. II. 1 ANd the weight of this foresayd grounde hath euer pressed the aduersaries of truth so sore that beholding as it were a farre of what inconuenience this might import they euer busily endeuored to stay the beginning of their likely ouerthrow But yet as it was and will be for euer noted in false teachers they seeke diuerse escapes so disagreable that one hindereth an other and neither of them helpes their owne cause One sorte not so impudent but a great deale more foolish then their fellowes agree by force of the places named and euidence of the examples that there is punishment to be suffered and some temporall paine remane at to be discharged in this world after remission of sinne but for the next after this life so fearde they be of purgatory they will haue none at all Thother secte maisters fearing what might follow on that graunt in no case will confesse that there is any payne due for sinne in this world or the next after the fault be once remitted For Caluine capitaine of this latter baÌ„d saw well that if any debt or recompense remaine to be discharged by the offender after his reconcilement it must needes â—ise by proportion weight continuance number and quantity of the faultes committed before VVhereby it must of necessity be induced that because euery man can not haue time either for the hugenesse of his sinnes past or his late repentaunce or his carelesse negligence to repay all in his life that there is all or some part aunswerable in the next world to come And therefore boldly and impudently as in case of this necessity he aduentureth to deny with shame that any of all these painfull miseries be as punishments for the sinnes of the sufferers but certaine fatherly checkes exercises of patience and vertue rather then afflictions enioyned for sinnes VVhich vaine shift hath no bearing by reason or text of Scripture but onely is vpholden by the exercised audacity of the author CAP. II. 1 IF M. Allens titles of his chapters were as sufficient reasons as they be bolde affirmations there were no man able to stand against him But I can well compare them to the arguments of those vayne fables that were wont to be printed in english of Beuis of Hampton Guy of VVarwick such like where the arguments shew how such a Knight ouercame such a Gyant how such a sorcerer wrought such a miracle which are tould as confidently as though they were true and yet there is no man of meane witte so ignoraunt but he knoweth them to be fayned fantasies Euen so with M. Allen to affirme is to proue to deny is to confute briefly in his titles and at large in his chapters But if he would as he pretendeth haue remoued all those reasons that we bring against his false conclusion or any of them all he must haue proued that Christ hath not satisfied the iustice of God perfectly by his death and suffering that God doth not freely forgeue vs our sinnes that he is stil an angry Iudge against them that put their trust in him He must haue proued against Ezechiel that what tyme so euer a man doth truely repent the Lord doth not put all his sinnes out of his remembraunce against Dauid that he hath not remoued our sinnes from vs as farre as the East is from the West Against S. Iohn that if any man sinne after Baptisme Iesus Christ is not our aduocate with the father and propitiation for our sinnes If he could say any thing against these reasons authorities with an hundred more of the same sort he were worthy to be heard But because that is to hard a matter for him to take in hand without all shame or shew of truth most impudently he fayneth a contrariety betwene Melanthon and Caluine but not once noting by one letter where the same is to be found in any of their workes lest their manifest wordes out of the same places being brought against him should reproue his shamelesse lying Melancthon he saith acknowledgeth some temporal payne after remission of sinnes to be discharged in this life but not in the life to come Caluin wil haue none at all O brasen face and yron forhead doth Caluine deny thafflictions of this life or Melancthon affirme that they are suffered for satisfaction of our sinnes Doth Melancthon deny the passion of Christ to be a perfect aunswering of the iustice of God or Caluine affirme thereby to be taken away the mercyfull correction of God Would God that all that professe the religion of Christ agreed in all pointes as truely as they doe in this But admitte that M. Melancthon or any man beside should graunt that the sufferinges of the godly in this life are some parte of satisfying vnto the iustice of
After the sinnes of man be pardoned God oftentimes punisheth the offender the church punisheth him and man punisheth him selfe ergo there is some payne due after sinne be remitted Secondly this payne can not alwayes be discharged in this world eyther for lacke of space after the remission as it happeth in repentaunce at the houre of death or else when the party liueth in perpetuall welth without care or cogitation of any satisfaction therefore it must be aunswered in an other place Thirdly the common infirmities and the dayly trespasses which abase and defile the workes euen of the vertuous of their proper condition doe deserue payne for a tyme as the mortall offence deserueth perpetuall Therefore as the mortall sinne being not here pardoned must of iustice haue the reward of euerlasting punishment so it must needes followe that the veniall fault not here forgeuen should haue the reward which of nature it requireth that is to say temporall payne And therefore not onely the wicked but the very iust also must trauell to haue their daily infirmities and frailty of their corrupt natures forgiuen crying without ceasing forgeue vs our debts Quia non iustificabitur in conspectu tuo omnis viuens For no man aliue shal be able to stand before the face of God in his owne iustice or righteousnes and if these light sinnes should neuer be imputed then it were needelesse to cry for mercy or confesse debt as euery man doth be he neuer so passing holy To be briefe this debt of paine for sinne by any way remayning at the departure hence must of iustice be aunswered VVhich can not be without punishmēt in the next life then there must be a place of iudgement for temporall and transitory paynes in the other world The whole discourse made before hath geuen force enough to euery part of the argument the Scriptures doe proue it the practise of the Church confirmeth it all the doctors by our aduersaries graunt agree vpon it If they haue any thing to say here I make them fayre play the ground is open the reasons laide naked before their face remoue them as they can Lette them deale simply if they meane truely and not flourish as they vse vppon a false ground that in flowe of wordes they may couer errour or in rase of their smoth talke ouerrunne truth And that euery man may perceiue that we haue not raised this doctrine vpon reason only or curiositie although the graue authoritie of Gods Church might here in satisfie sober wittes we will now by Gods helpe go nearer the matter and directly make proofe of Purgatory by holy Scriptures reciting such places of the olde and new Testament as shall proue our cause euen in that sense which the learnedst and godlyest fathers of all ages by conference of places or other likelyhood shall fynde and determine to be most true Alleaging none els but such as they haue in the flour of Christian faith noted and peculiarely construed for that purpose which now is in question That the aduersaries of that doctrine may rather striue with the said saincts and doctours then with me that will as they shall well perceiue do nothing but truely reporte their wordes or meaninge Or rather that such as haue erred in that case by giuing ouer light credit to the troblesome teachers of these vnhappy dayes maye when they shall vnderstand the true meaning of the Scriptures the constant doctrine of the Catholike Church the wordes of all auncient writers the determination of so many holy Councels the olde vsage of all nations by humble prayers obteine of God the light of vnderstanding the trueth and the gifte of obedience to his will and worde Or if there be any so sattled in this vnlickely sect that he purposeth not to beleue the graue writers of olde times nor receiue their expositions vpon such places as we shall recite for that preiudice which he hath of this owne witte and vnderstanding yet let him not maruell at my simplicity that had rather geue credit to others then my selfe Or that in this hote time of contention and partaking in religion I do repose my selfe vnder the shadow of so many worthy writers as anone shall giue euidence in my cause CAP. V. 1 TRiumphing before the victorie and that is more before the encontry of hāde strokes for we come to ioyning but now you will now win your spurs or els it shal be a blacke daye with all Protestantes I will be as shorte in mine aunswere as you are in your arguments And that I may put on an armour of proofe to beare of your terrible haileshot your first argumēt hath neither good forme nor matter no more hath your second no more hath your third If you or any for you will prepare your selfe to geue a bitter charge either I or some other shal be redy to shape you an other aunswere But because here is nothing in this briefe ioyning but which hath bene largly discharged before in aunswere to your longe excursions it were nedelesse to make such vaine repetition as you doe especially in your last shorte argument in which space all the substaunce of your large booke might easily haue bene placed only to fil vp a competent length of the fift chapter and with such a tedious inlarging of a superfluous matter as a yong practiser of Rhetoricke would be ashamed to vse in a fayned declamation much worse becomming an auncient master of arte professing to trusse vp his arguments by Logicke to make a perfect perswasion As for the promisse of further proofe both out of the Scriptures and out of the doctors that followeth after this gallant ioyning and lusty challenge shall haue no preiudice of my disabling of the meane to perform it vntill it appeare by playne conference of his arguments and myne aunswers that his words are but winde and his promisse but pratling That Purgatory paines doth not onely serue Gods iustice for the punishement of sinne but also cleanse and qualifie the soule of man defiled for the more seemely entraunce into the holy places vvith conferēce of certaine places of Scripture for that purpose CAP. VI. 1 IF we well cōsider the wonderfull base condition and state of mans nature corrupted by our first fathers disobedience and more and more abased by continuall misery that sinne hath brought into our mortall life we shall finde the worke of Gods wisedome in the excellent repaire of this his creature to be full of mercy and full of maruell But proceding somewhat further and weying not onely his restoring but also the passing great anauncement to the vnspeakable glory of the elect there shall reason and all our cogitations vtterly faint and faile vs. The kingdome prepared is honored with the maiestie of the glorious Trinitie with the humanitie of Christ our Sauiour with the blessed Mary the vessell of his Incarnation with the bewtifull creatures and wholy vndefiled of all the ordres of Angels There can nothing doubtlesse
proofe out of the holy Scripture that he may be fully established in his faith and the aduersary heretike wholy confounded in his misbelefe If he list not rather as I heartely pray to God that he may geue ouer that vnnaturall plea holden to long against the Catholike Church our mother Geue eare then vnto the wordes of our Sauiour written in the Gospell of S. Matthew Esto consentiens aduersario tuo cito dum es in via cum eo ne forte tradat te aduersarius iudici iudex tradat te ministro in carcerem mittaris Amen dico tibi non exies inde donec reddas nouissimuÌ„ quadrantem Be at agreement with thine aduersary speedely whiles thou arte with him in the waye Lest that aduersary deliuer thee vp to the iudge the iudge commit thee to an officer by whome thou may be cast into prison surely I say vnto thee thou shalt not get out till thou haue discharged the vttermost farthing Now being desirous of the trueth and true meaning of this letter for the vnderstanding maketh all because there may arise by the darkenesse of that figuratiue speach some diuersity of sense let vs indifferently wey euery worde and with diligence examine the circumstances of the texte whereby any light may appeare And first being admonished to agree with our aduersary we may right well know that he meaneth not by the commoÌ„ enemie of our kinde that rometh about seeking whome he may deuour for his cruell assaultes must onely by resistaunce be withstand Neither the worde which the Euangelistes there vsed can properly signifie any malicious enemy that by hatered of our person is become our deadly foe as those which be skillfull in the language is wherein they wrote do confesse But rather as well the worde as the iust consideration of the place driueth vs to acknowledge that this our aduersary here signifieth our brother which hath iuste quarell against vs in iudgement for that we woulde not geue eare vnto him sharply admonishing vs of our faultes being therefore an aduersary to our viceis and fleshly coÌ„uersation In which sort to vs that are flesh and bloude and redy to euill from our youth all be aduersaries that preach Christ the amendement of licentious maners repentaunce of our lothsome life past or els vse against vs the rodde of correction and bodyly punishment that our soules may be saued in the day of the appearing of our Lorde To this kinde of aduersary Christ councelleth and commaundeth vs for our great good to agree and consent whiles we be here in the way of this our pilgramage and transitory life lest all these meanes which he wroght to reduce vs to the perfection of a Christian godly life be as it were a witnesse of our contempt him selfe our accuser before the iudge that shall so iustely reward euery man according to his deedes that is Christ him selfe to whome the father hath geuen all iudgement VVhose ministers being Angels either good or badde for the execution of iustice vpon sinners shall at his appointment cast vs into the prison and dongion there to be holden from life and liberty till we haue paide the last farthing the toleration of which bondes shall recompense the debtes which by wel doing and much mourning in the way of this world we refused to pay as S. Augustine piththely speaketh in these wordes Si non reddit faciendo iustitiam reddet patiendo miseriam he that paieth not his debt by dooing that which is iust right he shall pay it by suffering misery VVhich we trust the pitifull paines of that prison through the only desertes and merites of Christ our Lorde and God shall so discharge that after the payment either pardoned or fully made we may haue ioyfull accesse to his blessed presence For the forme of speache vsed in like ordre of wordes by both the Euangelistes doth vs plainely to vnderstande that we may through Christ make full payment thereof Ells he woulde not by likelihood haue saide that we shoulde not scape forth till we had discharged â–ª the vtmost farthing but rather that seuere iudge would haue geueÌ„ charge that the offender should be bouÌ„de hand and foutte and cast into the darke doungion of euerlasting daâ—nation prepared for the deuill and his angels which is the second and euerlasting death Namelâ— the worde of Imprisonment so well agreeing therevnto that it may not well admit any other meaning but a place of temporall torment For a prison is a place of correction chastisement of such as be on liue in which as longe as life lasteth a man may be in hope of liberty though his bondage for a time be neuer so vntollerable but when sentence of death is once pronounced in this worlde or damnation in the next then we may right well knowe Gods mercy to be shutte vp and the party desperate of all recouery Neither the name of Imprisonment in Scripture is lightly taken for the place of euerlasting punishment nor can by confereÌ„ce of the sundry partes of this letter haue here conueniently any such sense CAP. X. 1 HEre according to M. Allens orderly proceding is alleged for purgatory a place out of S. Matthew where Christ saith to him that neglecteth to reconcile him selfe to his aduersary before he came to the iudge that he shall be cast into prison from whence he shall not come vntill he haue payed the vttermost farthing The meaning of Christ is playne that he shall neuer come out no more then that wicked seruaunt which was cast in pryson vntill he shoulde pay the whole debt which was ten thousand talents Matth. 18. But before we goe any further let vs se how the doctrine of this chapter agreeth with that we had in the chapter next before Theâ—e we were told that purgatory serueth but for veniall sinnes or else for such mortall sinnes as by forgeuenes in this life obtayned are made veniall trespasses But here not onely vices and fleshly conuersation but also contempt of all that preach Christ and repentaunce of our lothsome life past c. are sayd to be the debt that must be discharged in purgatory to the vttermost farthing then the which no vice is more mortall nor farther from forgeuenes For he that not only leadeth a lothsome life but also contemneth all those meanes that Christ hath wrought to reduce him to the perfecton of a Christian godly life I vse his owne wordes how can he haue remission of his sinnes in this life and yet M. Allen dare promise him that the toleration of bandes in the prison of purgatory shall recompence his debt and bring him from thence into the blessed presence of Christ. M. Allen hath the most passing faculty of any that euer I heard to build one thing in one leafe and to ouerthrow it him selfe againe in the next Neuerthelesse I can not abide that he should promise a pardon of that payment
out till they haue payed the vttermost farthing Those must passe the fiery floode by horrible fordes of skawlding waues VVhereof the Prophet maketh mention thus And a firy streame ranne before his face The space of passage shall be measured by the matter of sinne according to the encrease of our offensies the discreite discipline of that flame shall reuenge againe and looke how farre in wickednesse our foly did reach so farre this punishment shall wisely waste And like as Gods worde compareth mans soule to a brasen potte saying Set the potte empty ouer the coles till the brasse thereof of waxe hote So there thou shalt see periury angre malice vnfructefull desires sweate out which did infect the purity of mans noble nature there the pewter and leade of diverse passions which did abase the pure golde of Gods image shall be consumed away All which thinges might in our life time haue easely bene wiped away by almes and teares Such a strait accompt loe will he kepe with man that for mans sake gaue him selfe to death and being throust through with nailes hath fastened the dominion of death also So farre hath Emissenus spoken and his wordes be so weighty that they haue bene counted worthy rehersall in solemne Sermâ—ns and Homilies of the Antiquity to stirre vp their hearers to the necessary awe of Gods iudgements with much prouocation of vertuous life S. Augustine hath the selfe same discourse almost no word thereof chaunged VVith this addition Ideo fratres charissimi conuertamus nos ad meliora dum in nostra potestate sunt remedia Therfore deare brethern let vs turne and amende by time whilest the remedies be yet in our owne dealinge And in an other place thus he toucheth the scripture alleaged Apparebit Deus Deorum in Syon sed quando post peregrinationem finita via si tamen post finitam viam non iudici tradamur vt iudex mittat in carcerem The God of Gods in Syon shall appeare but when mary after our pilgramage be past and the iourney ended Excepte it sâ— fall out that after our iourney here we be deliuered vp to the iudge so the iudge send vs to prison To this place also S. Bernarde doth sâ—eetely but yet fearefully allude in this exhortation Volat sayth he irreuocabile verbum dum creditis vos cauere poenam istam minimam incurritis multo ampliorem Illud enim scitote quia post hanc vitam in locis purgabilibus centupliciter quae fuerunt hic neglecta reddentur vsque ad nouissimum quadrantem Our worde not possible to be called backe flyeth farre and whilest you seeke to auoyde a litle griefe here you incurre much greater For assure your selfe of this that after this life in places of purgation all negligencies past must be repaide a hundreth foulde home againe till the discharge of the last farthinge 4 As for this authority of Eusebius which hath serued for a patch to peece vp so many homilies of so many diuerse men as a Cuckowes song vttered in diuerse places semeth neither to haue Eusebius nor Augustine nor any other good author to be the father of it but euen some cowled cuckowe that hath left this egge in so many birdes nestes to be hatched vnder their winges and to be counted for one of their chickens but that your voyce doth soone bewray it And here a man may note a great peece of cunning in them that had the writing out of bookes about those times when errours began to take strength that not onely whole workes were falsly intitled to diuers good authours but also patches inserted to their owne workes And if any thing by them were once spoken that sounded to the confirmation of those errors that was thrust into diuers places of their writings lest it should scarse be espied in one And hereof it commeth that such sayings in Augustine Chrysostome and other as seeme to allow prayer for the dead be so often repeated in their writings and especially in homilies that were taken of their mouthes by Scribes and Notaries But who so euer was the father of this sentence as he speaketh friendely for the paynes of purgatory so he sheweth him self an vtter enemy to the release of the same So doth that Augustine which addeth his exhortation to these wordes by him repeated But the other Augustine which writeth vpon the 103. Psalme sayth that God shall appeare to them onely which are not cast into prison when they be departed out of this life therfore I muse wherefore those wordes are here brought in For Augustine as I will shew afterward vnderstandeth that prison for hell and eternal tormeÌ„ts Bernard although he be too yong to depose in this cause yet he speaketh not so much to auouch the paynes of purgatory as to deny the remedy or remission of them wherefore his testimony helpeth not purgatory so much one way as it hindreth the Papistes gayne an other way 5 Here now let our aduersaries in this bright shining trueth blinde them selues let them boldely bost of their accustomed impudency that the Catholickes haue no scriptures nor apparence of scriptures or if they stande with vs for the meaning let them shape with all their conueyaunce any one shifte to aunswere these doctors words Or if the vniforme consent of so many of the best learning and greatest wisedom in the whole Church may haue no roome with them let them shew whereupon their owne credits be growne so great that without reason likelihood or authority men must needes beleue them It is a straunge case that what soeuer they auouch it must be Gods word what meaning so euer they make for maintenance of their wicked foly it must be termed the true sense of Scripture And the truth it selfe shewing all force in the conference of diuers places of holy writte in weight of reason in the workes and writings of all antiquitie shall be so lightly regarded I would to God the people pitifully deceiued by such vayne flying talke could beholde the vpright wayes of truth or could learne by the playne dealing of our side to require some grounded proofe of these newe doctors deuises They may well perceiue if they haue any necessary care of those weighty matters touching our saluation so neare that the Catholike neuer aduentureth to bring any Scripture for his purpose but he will be sure for his warrant to haue the same so expounded by the auncient fathers of our faith lest by his rashnesse he deceiue other and father some falshood vpon the holy writers of Gods will which were horrible sacrilege But on the other side if a man might pose M. Caluin or Flaccius or such other of that light family what doctor or Scripture they followed in the exposition of S. Iames his place for the anoynting with holy oyle when they were not ashamed to giue this sense of that Scripture that it were good to call the elders of the people that had
breaketh her faith of Baptisme shal be damned for mariage is not worth a rush For S. Paule sayth not she shal be damned for mariage but because she hath reiected the first faith that is such wanton young houswifes procede so farre that at length they forsake widowhood christianity and all But if M. Allen were posed where he findeth this worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the Scripture vsed for a vowe or promise made to God perhaps he would aunswere he is no Graecian then let him pose D. Hardinge or some other with the same question and with all let them shew how the first faith can be expounded for the last vowe that a body hath made if he haue made more then one For the Papists holde that these women made one vowe in baptisme an other of there widowhood What so euer M. Iewell hath affirmed against the Papistes he hath so substantially and learnedly defended that he neede not to haue any other man to aunswere for him Therefore if it were not to choke M. Allen in his owne coller I woulde trauaile no farther in this question The Church you say can not erre and that company is the Church which hath the Pope for their head if therefore it can be proued that the Pope and all they that take his part haue erred it is sufficiently shewed that the Church may erre S. Augustine was in this error as you will not deny that the Sacrament of the body and bloud of Christ was to be ministred vnto infants but of the same opinion he affirmeth that Innocentius Bishop of Rome and all the Church in his tyme was therefore the Pope and all the Church did erre reade Augustine contra Iulianum lib. 1. cap. 2. where he sayth of Innocentius Qui denique paruulos definiuit nisi manducauerint carnem filij hominis vitam prorsus habere non posse which hath defined that infantes except they eate the flesh of the sonne of man can haue no life at all in them And by eating the flesh of the sonne