dissanulled I know nothing can be urged in opposition to the Order of our Womens Meetings or in behalf of the mixed Meetings before mentioned The Second thing in the Order of Truth by some opposed is Our way of Marriage which though established by the Wisdom of God in our Meetings being comely and commendable even in the Eyes of sober discreet People of the World yet some professing Truth A Shame to see it are so pettish and conceited that nothing will please them unless a liberty be granted to Marry what way yea and what Persons too they please And except we will consent to and approve of such a Liberty they cry out Imposition Formality c. And they are very ready to urge the Apostles granting liberty of eating Herbs and Flesh Rom. 14. as a good Argument for them Is Marriage of no greater concern than such things According to my measure in Truth I affirm they may more plausibly contend for a liberty to put off their Hats in Salutations as the World doth for this would not so much reflect upon Truth as diversity of Marriages The World doth not regard our Gestures or Salutations as matters of Religion but Marriage is generally owned to be Gods Ordinance Wherefore if our Meetings which we believe have greater light in Religious matters than other gatherings should not agree in the manner of celebrating this Ordinance of God would they not render themselves very weak yea below the Wisdom of other Churches so called Will the Jew tolerate his Circumcision the Baptist Water-Baptism or the Bishops their Matrimony to be administred after divers ways and different forms Do not we truly conclude against all them who contend for Water-Baptism that they are all in the dark about it because they cannot agree either as to the subject or to the manner of its Administration And would they not say the same of us if we should fall into the like Controversie But blessed be God a Remnant are kept by his Power over all these vain janglings and Oppostions These Hearts are knit together in Love and Peace by his Spirit and they strive together and are strengthened by his Might to hold fast the Faith and Order of his blessed Truth But the great scruple is Propounding Intentions of Marriage to the Womens Meetings and no other Reason for it as I remember but that it was Needless A few words to this If one principal end of publishing Intentions of Marriage is to prevent Abuses and to discover deceit in either Party if there be any then all means very serviceable to this end ought not to be accounted needless But our Womens Meetings have been very serviceable to this end Therefore I know not which part of this Argument can be deny'd If it be queried in contempt of them What Service have they done which might not as well have been done by the men Ans This is a gross Reflections take heed of it It s all one as to say A Man might have slain Sisera as well as Jacâ—… Judg. 4.22 A Man might have directed Naaman to the Prophet as well as the little Maid 2 Kings 5. Men might have brought the Tidings of the Resurrection of Jesus as well as the Women Matth. 28. But who art thou that replyest against Gods Instruments Many Instances might be given of later date than the Scriptures of Gods making Women serviceable in divers things of this Nature Therefore such deserve a sharp Rebuke as would put Women out of all Service in the Church and confine them to their Houshold Affairs which I fear is indeed the Bottom and Root of the Scruple If it be replyed That these Services I instance were done by particular private Women and not by Womens Meetings and that they could freely tell their Intention of Marriage to any particular Women but not to a Meeting of Women Answ Then the scruple falls upon them as a Meeting Then the Question will be Whether their Act only of coming together be disliked or their Business The first is proved before and the other must needs be approved by these Instances last mentioned For if the Scripture testifie That God hath often blessed the Advice and Instructions of particular Women much more Reason have we to expect and hope for good Advice and Assistance from them in matters propounded to them when they are solemnly met to wait upon the Lord for Wisdom and Counsel in things committed to their care For there is an absolute Promise of Gods Presence to two or three met in his Name Mat. 18.22 Who dare say this was made only to men Much might be written upon this very Argument But I love both hearing and speaking few words and they in disputable cases especially as close to the point as possible Now I am writing about the form of Godliness I feel it necessary to add a little to prevent the fears that may enter lest some who contend for Form lose Power and turn Persecutors as others have done for their Forms when got into temporal Power and Authority That some may fall from Truth 's Principles is too true but that contending for the Form of it is either a sign they are fallen or a means to make them fall I must deny If others have turned Persecutors it s no wonder because the Principles upon which they stand if well considered do naturally lead them to Persecution And if any of them do not persecute it s either for want of Power or they refrain in Policy or esle the natural goodness tenderness of their own Dispositions over-power their Principles for many mens natural Tempers are better than their Religions But now Truth has taught a little Flock such peaceable Principles as destroy Persecution Root and Branch How is it possible he should persecute that heartily believes Every Religions Meeting ought to have liberty worship God according to their Consciences Can men desire more Moderation That it s not lawful to hurt any mans Person good Name or Estate for matters of Religion and Conscience towards God Can civil Property be better secured from Persecution In brief our Gospel teaches our Hands to seed them that would starve us our Tongues to pray for them who curse us And the God of Peace glory to his Name has brought this little Flock into his Lamb's Nature the New Creature that cannot kill hurt or do violence to any And without this New Nature all Religion is but sounding Brass Now if any man cannot be content with this Liberty that is to joyn himself to what Meeting best liketh him but he will thrust in for Fellowship with us and will exclaim against us as Persecutors if we will not let him have a liberty which we cannot take our selves doth not such a pretending Friend become rather a Persecutor of us than we of him To force a liberty to break Order and to force to conform to it are Impositions alike to be denyed There is a caution necessary to
mind relating to these things I have observed that such as oppose the Order of Truth under pretence for Truth do frequently in their writings and speakings call upon us To keep to that which first convinced us Good Counsel Would they themselves were obedient to it But they abuse it by applying it to a wrong end For when they bid us keep to that which first convinced and withal tell us of the blessed Appearance of the Lord among Friends in the beginning their sence is we should keep to that Order and Discipline which was then among Friends Which I grant to be good and suitable for that day and time But by directing to that now they secretly insinuate a Reproof of what ever is more than was at first as if set up by Man's Wisdom as Womens Meetings Monethly Quarterly and Yearly Meetings our present Order of Marriage c. And so such Friends as now walk in this Order being thereunto led and guided by the same Spirit which convinced them in the beginning are by these pretending Friends cryed down as men of Form Apostates Innovators c. And now to shew that this is their design and sence mark but the scope and drift of W. R's Book against the Apostate Quaker as he calls them because in his meaning fallen from what they were in the beginning which he dates to be about twenty six years then last past pag. 3. 1st part But more briefly this may be seen in Anne Docwrays Paper later printed wherein there is some Rhyme but not a word of Reason to convince that what she scoffingly calls Formalities and Directories have any Evils or Absurdities in them W. R. and She exclaim much against Imposition which we disown more than they But mark how she concludes after many fine words against Forms outward Rules Contrivances c. thus But God is bringing back again his People to their first Principles and Practice whereby they were gathered into Community with him and with one another in his Life and Power By this it s as clear as the Sun that she misapplies this Doctrine as before noted Many such Instances might be given Had this Woman lived in the Apostles days might she not as readily have charged them with Apostacy when they left oft having all things common and set up Property among them Might she not have said to Paul Keep to that which first convinced thee and tell not us of ordaining Elders or Overseers in Churches Tit. 15. 1 Tim. 3. Away with thy form of sound Words 2 Tim. 1.13 That Light which met thee going to Damascus spake nothing then to thee of these things Thou art now got into an aspiring Mind and seekest Preheminence over others Thou art setting up Forms and Directories outward Rules and Prescriptions which will be but Baits for the Enemy to with-draw mens Minds from the inward Teachings of the Grace of God into Contention After this rate A. D. runs on in her Paper against the Truth of God now which may as well be applied to the Primitive Times as ours But now let us consider whether these who cry out so much of Apostacy are not themselves the Apostates Whom the Lord convinceth and converts them he adds to his Church Acts 2.47 Whom he adds to his Church them he teaches to be obedient to the Discipline therein Heb. 13.17 This is plain Scripture And the true Light in us if we keep to it will certainly satisfie us in the truth of this spiritual Rule and Government and the strength of it over our Spirits we shall as sensibly feel as outwardly we may feel the strength of another mans Body over ours by trying it But as stubborn Bodies will not yield to stronger Bodies though they dye for it so stubborn forward Spirits will despise this spiritual Government till they loose their spiritual Life 2 Pet. 2.10 A false Birth may cry but not for the Breasts That which is born of God first breathes after him and then after the Flocks of his Companions Cant. 1.7 Tell me O thou whom my Soul loveth where thou feedest where thou makest thy Flocks to rest at Neon For why should I be as one that turneth aside from the Flocks of thy Companious Love to Christ and to his Flock cannnot be seperated So though I joyn to this Flock it s not because they are a Flock but because they are Christ's Companions And although I believe as they believe yet I can faithfully say it s not because they believe or practise this or that but because that Power which brought me from the barren Mountains blessed be his Name gave me the same Faith and led me into the same fruitful Vallies where they were feeding So by this I know and dare be bold in Truth to say not to upbraid but in Love to inform our Opposers pretending Friend ship That either they mistook at first their Opinions were not right-they took that for the Lords Anointing which was not or else they are really fallen off or to speak most moderately turned aside from the Works of the Lord Oh! that they may return with greater Zeal than ever to serve the Truth in this their day before eternal Night come over them It is very sad to see any that were first to be last but more to feel them in danger to be lost Obj. If any should Reply That our Meetings are fallen from their first Faith and have set up Formalities contrary to Scripture and Reason and therefore it s as lawful now for any one as it was for Luther formerly to oppose a whole Body when so corrupted Ans Blessed be the Lord this is not our case I do not find nor did I ever meet any impartial Friend or friendly Man that would say These our Opposers have proved any one of our Principles or any part of our Order guilty of any Errors or Evils or any way contrary to Scripture or sound Reason Neither did I ever hear they propounded a better Order or Discipline But the burden of all their Books and Papers I meet with is either against particular Persons or for Liberty Liberty against Forms Orders outward Rules c. which if they would speak plain English is as much as to say We would have a Religion like the Earth in its Chaos without Form void of Order Gen. 1. We would be a Garden but not inclosed like that in Cant. 4.12 We would be fellow Citizens with you provided there may be no Walls or Gates about your City We are for Salvation for Walls in that sence which allows no means of Salvation though lawful and honest We are for liberty of go in and out of the City which way and when we please In short they say in effect as Israel of old We would have liberty for every one to do what is right in his own Eyes Thus strange confused Notions have entred under pretence of keeping to the Light within a true Doctrine and have deceived many
THE Good Order OF TRUTH JUSTIFIED Wherein our Womens Meetings and Order of Marriage by some more especially opposed are proved agreeable to Scripture and Sound REASON By an old and true Friend to Liberty of Conscience but not to Disorder William Loddington Formality not Form feeds the Spirit of Persecution So the Service of the House of the Lord was set in Order 2 Cor. 29.35 Though I be absent in the Flesh yet am I with you in Spirit joying and beholding your Order and the stedfastness of your Faith in Christ Col. 2.5 Printed and Sold by Andrew Sowle in Holloway-Lane in Shoreditch 1685. The Good Order OF TRUTH JUSTIFIED UNITY in Spirit is the true and firm Foundation of Love and Fellowship All Vniformity and Conformity not springing from this is but Hypocrisie Where there is Unity in the Life and Spirit of Christ there will be Uniformity if no Temptation hinder in the visible Life and Order answerable to the measure received Do men gather Grapes or Grape Leaves of Thorns The Sap puts forth the same Leaf as well as Fruit in every Branch Yet the comparison holds no further than to the faithful because Men may counterfeit but Trees cannot Outward appearances beget a Name as to outward Fellowships He shall by men of the World be reputed a Quaker that is conformable to their Language and Gesture but the true Quaker or rather true Christian takes his Measures from better Foundations There are Vertues Behaviours or Operations of mens Spirits discernable to the Spiritual more or less and according as they feel Unity in these they joyn together to exalt his Glory who brought them to a sence of Life Immortal into which the Hypocrite cannot enter though from this men may fall Never more need to watch and pray that we be not deceived for Truth was never more lively counterfeited nor never did the Mystery of Iniquity work more plausibly to break Sion's Peace What more hated than Imposition What more nauseous than Formality What more ridiculous than impertinent Ceremony The Serpent knowing all this covers himself in some places with pretences for Moderation and Liberty of Conscience as it were in opposition to all Imposition when indeed it s to bring in Bondage to corruption But the Daughter of Babylon is known though decked with Pearls and fine Array glorious words of Truth This Spirit never had a fairer advantage because so many have turned Persecutors under pretences of Conformity to Religious Order and Government so that many Arguments now brought in behalf of good Order though sound and rational yet are slighted because formerly some Persecutors have made use of them to a wrong end Hence strong Delusions get over such as receive not the Love of Truth that they may be saved Yea some who I believe did in love receive it yet not keeping to it are drawn into opposition to its Order whereby Divisions and Offences arise contrary to the peaceable Doctrine of Christ Jesus our Lord. Two things are principally pretended to be the subjects of their Dissatisfaction viz. our Womens Meetings and Order of Marriage But alas if these two things were removed other Dissatisfactions would spring up and others after them till and Order and Government were dissolved They know not what Spirit it is which makes them stumble give it an Inch and it will take more Nay some have even lost all their Profession of Religion by doing so Now because I am verily perswaded in my own Spirit that good Words and fair Speeches deceive many simple hearts I feel a freedom for their sakes some are so far gone pure Reason doth not reach them to write something of what the Lord not man nor by Man opened to me about these matters that after my searching and trying them I might be established glory to his Name in his blessed Truth and enabled in some measure to give a Reason of my Hope and Practice 1. As to the First then this Question in my Understanding contains the whole matter Q. Whether it be agreeable to Scripture for our Women Friends to meet by themselves or to sit speak and act equally with men in Meetings of Business of an outward or temporal nature or tendency Answ I put Scripture in the Question because I know its a common Objection That Womens Meetings are not to be found there Is not this plain limiting the Spirit of the Lord to those only times when that was written as if nothing of Order hereafter may or must be necessary and expedient but what was so in those days There is a general Rule not the worse because Superstition hath abused it in 1 Cor. 14. That all things be done Decently and in Order but the particular Circumstances of Decency and Order are left to the judgment of Christians in every Age a the Lord shall direct them But to come closer to the Question it s very clear to me that our Womens Meetings are plainly agreeable to the scope and fence of the Apostle Paul in 1 Cor. 13.3 where he weightily argues and earnestly presseth us to take notice of it saying I would have you to know That the Head of the Woman is the Man If so then if our Womens Meetings consist with the Headship they are justified by this Scripture but such Meetings as are destructive to it and take it away cannot be lawful That the first are consistent with this Headship and the other destructive appears by what follows If Women be taken into Mens Meetings appointed for outward or temporal Concerns with equal freedom to sit speak and act with them then I see no Headship man hath For if he hath any it must be either in Temporal or Spiritual matters In Spirituals he hath none for the same Apostle Gal. 3.28 affirms That Male and Female are all one in Christ that is in services purely spiritual relating only to Christ and the Soul such as Prayer and Prophecy Therefore in 1 Cor. 11. equal freedom is given to the Woman as much as to the Man to Pray and Prophecy But on the other hand Women Friends meeting by themselves may without the least suspition of usurping Authority over the Men confer and reason together how to serve Truth in their places in such things as are most proper and suitable for them still submitting to the Wisdom of God in the Mens Meetings Whereas being mixed together if a man should make a motion about any business and a Woman should stand up and signifie her dislike of it though in most mild and tender words would not any Man yea an Unbeliever if he should come in and hear it would he not conclude the Women in such Meetings had as much Power as the Men Let none Reply It matters not what Vnbelievers say for Paul himself was very careful that nothing might be done in the Church of Christ that might stumble Unbelievers as hereafter will be noted from 1 Cor. 14. Wherefore he knowing Man's Headship to be owned
by the Law of Nature commands the VVoman to be covered when she prayes or prophecies which Covering vers 10. is called Power on her Head because it was to signifie to all that should come into the Meeting that though she had equal freedom with Man to pray or prophecy yet nevertheless she still was to own and did own the Man's Power over her in visible or temporal things But the Man praying or prophecying is to be uncovered in testimony that there is no Power in any Creature above him And to answer all Objections in ease this his Epistle should come where People did wear no Coverings on their Heads then he directs them to Nature's covering to confirm this Headship The Womans Hair saith he vers 15. is given her for a Covering and she is not to cut it off nor the Man's to be worm of a length like the Womans for that would be a shame in Nature vers 14. for it would signifie he hath lost his Headship Thus we may observe how zealous the Apostle is in this matter there was no need to write this to distinguish their Sex for that was as plainly manifest by their other Garments in those days as well as ours This Headship of Man over the Woman being only in Temporals hinders not their Spiritual Unity So the Headship of God mentioned in the same Verse takes not away the Unity of God and Christ Jesus himself rightly divides this word of Truth for in John 10.29 speaking of his spiritual Power to save his Sheep he saith I and my Father are one But in chap. 14.28 relating to the concerns and sufferings of his Body then he saith My Father â—s greater than I. So Male and Female are all one in Christ that is in Spirituals but Man the Head in Temporals Obj. If any reply This Headship is only to be understood in Family Affairs Ans In granting this they grant the other also unless they will say Man is Head in some small private Concerns but in publick and weighty matters the Woman is to be his equal in Power This renders the Apostle very weak in writing so earnestly for so small a matter which indeed requires no Proof at all But further if this Objection were true then these Gestures of covering and uncovering the Head before commanded should only be used in private Family Prayer or Prophecy where the Headship thereby signified is only to be in force Obj. 2. But I have heard it hinted That Women might be with Men in Meetings of Business provided they were silent as if they were in such Meeting the Apostle relates to when he commands Women to be silent 1 Cor. 14.25 and 1 Tim. 2. Answ Then must they sit as useless Spectators not daring to speak what may open in their Understandings touching any thing among them But a little to explain these Scriptures there is not the least ground to suppose the Apostle diverted his Mind from Meetings of Worship to Meetings of Business when he said Let the Women be silent for in this 14th chapter he writing principally about Prophecy recommends some Circumstances necessary to be observed which he would have every man that thinks himself to be a Prophet or Spiritual to own as Gods commands vers 37. Two Scandals he labours to prevent 1st When any speak with Tongues which he would not forbid though he commends Prophecying in plain known Language before it that there should be an Interpreter ready or else it were better to be silent vers 28. and the Reason is in v. 23. Because if an unlearned Man or an Vnbeliever should come in he would say they were Mad. Mark how careful he is of Truth 's Honour that Unbelievers Mouthes might not be opened against it And 2dly he commands That Women should then be silent that is when any speak with Tongues above their Understanding it is not permitted unto them to speak in the Church that is by way of asking Questions there But if they will learn saith he that is if they have a desire to know the meaning of any thing there spoken in a Tongue unknown to them let them ask Mark ask at home For if a Woman should but ask or desire a Man in the Church to explain himself it might be apt to be taken for a Command by Unbelievers if they should come in and so that might occasion another Scandal That Christian Women did usurp Authority over the Men. Wherefore writing to Timothy he requires the same thing to be observed by the Women there telling him That they were to learn in silence with all Subjection or Quietness and not to teach or speak in any such way as might look like usurping Authority over the Men either in the Church or indeed in any other place for that would stumble even Unbelievers they could not endure that And so he gives two Reasons why Man is to have this Headship Because Adam was first formed v. 13. Secondly Because Adam was not deceived that is by the Serpent but the Woman being deceived was in the Transgression v. 14. And this in short is the plain sence and substance of these two Scriptures compared together which are so often mis-applyed to wrong ends and practices this day But now all this doth not forbid a Womens opposing a wrong Spirit if it shall dare to speak in the Church Woman or Child as well as Man in the movings of the Spirit of God may do that Nor doth it forbid a Womans Praying or Prophecying for then he had contradicted what in chap. 11. of the same Epistle he allowed of Thus the Scripture so plainly asserting Man's Headship by true consequence condemns all Practices that overthrow it And truly I often admire that some whom I know to be ingenious and rational in other things should not see how they cloud themselves at present nor foresee the future Inconveniences of such Meetings they contend for Obj. 3. I once heard a kind of arguing against this Headship from the state of Adam and Eve before the fall As if Truth 's Principles did lead us to joyn Man and Woman together now in ordering all things as they two did in Paradise Answ I own Truth presseth to that Perfection in Spirit He that is in Christ is a new Creature as to the spiritual part being baptized into that Spirit which knows no distinctions according to Flesh as of Jew or Greek Bond or Free Male or Female But to turn this into an Argument for outward things and to say if any one be in Christ his outward Body is a new Creature not of the same Flesh and Bones nor liable to the same Distempers as before and so to make void all distinction in the natural Sex States and Conditions is great Darkness and contains such Absurdities as run all into Confusion I shall say no more to this particular There is more light in one Sun than in many Stars Until this Principle of Man's Headship in Temporal things be