a man to be no man because he is not so tall as another but I see R. E. and his Catholick would have all Shoos made by their Last though they will not fit every mans feet Faith is the gift of God there are divers degrees and measures according to the mind and good pleasure of the giver so that he that hath received any measure or degree must not be excluded as having no faith though he attain not to that degree that some do enjoy and the Apostles Doctrine was that every one should be perswaded in his own mind and if any was otherwise minded they were to be let alone till God revealed it to them And whatsoever people or Church though they claim infallibility that teaches a contrary Doctrine unto this we have good reason to suspect it to be that hasty driving and overdriving spirit that would force a faith where God hath not given it not to be the infallible spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ of which the Church of Rome hath given a vehement cause of suspition by their cruelty and tortors they have exercised towards them who could not receive their Principles and own their Judgment in all things But R. E. the Lay-Gentleman blinded thy eye when he made thee call into question the truth of Scripture and that it proceeded from the infallible Testimony of Gods spirit and if thou had a certain feeling of the same in thy self and in thy own Conscience to let this go and make this void as an insufficient ground to receive Christianity upon to lean to a prop without thee and to be judged by men who have been as fallible and changable in their Judgments as the Moon which have assumed the name of Catholick Church whose Testimony thy Instructer I perceive told thee ought to be received concerning what as is pretended to be revealed or not revealed by God yet all must be obliged to stand to their Judgment though never so repugnant to the Doctrine of Christ and practice of the Church of Christ in the first Primitive times truly so called yet it is granted that the Church of Christ are the dispersed Members through the World though not of it agreeing in one faith being in the power of God and being led and guided by the Holy Ghost their Judgments ought to be received which cannot as lead by the Spirit fail in giving true Judgment in matters of faith which pertains to Salvation but as men they may fail and as erring from the spirit they may fail and infallibility is not intailed to the persons of any men but as they continue in the grace of God and walk in the spirit and bring forth the fruits thereof nor to any place or City but as they continue in Covenant with God for the promise of God was to Jerusalem and Mount Zion and to many other places and people in divers Cities where the glory of God once appeared but now through their Apostacy and unbelief and disobedience they are desolate as to the presence and power of God and their Sun is set and they are covered as with the shadow of a Cloud but this true Church whereof I have spoken was seen to fly into the Wilderness for time times and a half and that since the Apostles days and then was she not so visible and universal as she had been before and the man child was caught up unto God now if thou reckon the Roman Church to be this true Church shew the time times and half a time wherein she fled into the Wilderness and how long she hath been there and when was the time of her return and if ever she was there how that will hang together with your assertion that she hath been visible and so universal this fiften hundred years and if this could be proved that Rome hath been so whether doth it not rather demonstrate her to be the Whore that sat upon the many waters which waters are Nations Kindreds Tongues and People and what Church instance if thou can doth lay claim to the Nations Kindreds Tongues and People to be yours and to rule over so many Kings of the Earth as you lay claim to be universally of your faith and of your Church which gives us a shrewd character to believe that indeed you are mystery Babylon besides the blood of the Saints that have been shed under the name of Hereticks by this visible Catholick Church among the Nations this twelve 100. years doth give clear evidence that it can be reckoned or imputed unto none but you But I would not grate too hard upon thee being but a new convert but when thy instructer had made thee doubt of thy own state and question the foundation whereupon thou hadst received christianity the next thing he labours to make void is the Spirit of God its Testimony which thou did lay claim too but I feel had little portion in what thou said at last he makes thee doubt of the infallibility of this spirit which thou had spoke on might for ought thou knew be the spirit of error and thou not able to distinguish betwixt the spirit of God in thy self which is infallible and the spirit of error nor to distinguish betwixt their opperations he perswaded thee that all was uncertain and therefore no confidence to be given to any spirit or faith in ones own particular which is the most absurd and ridiculous thing in the world so to judge For if there be no certainty or assurance given to any man or means to every man wherein he may be assured of the certainty of Gods will then whither should any go or upon whom should any lean seeing that no credit can be given to any thing that any man believes and this were but tossing up and down men from mountain to hill that they might never have rest for their souls And as for Jer. 17. and Eccles. 9. Rev. 3. The heart of man is deceitful c. No man knows love or hatred c. And because thou sayest I am rich and increased with goods and have need of nothing c. These Scriptures was brought unto thee to make thee more blind the first is spoken of the degenerated estate where deceit bears rule and not truth the second is spoken of visible enjoyments which are common to all and the third was spoken to one who had erred from the spirit and was exalted in pride because of external performances but having lost the power was miserable c. But what of all this doth this any whit at all detract from the certainty and assurance of the Spirit of God in them that hath it what shall we reason thus because some have been led aside and are deceived by their own hearts lusts that therefore all may be deceived even them that have the spirit of God God forbid and we have some what more to answer an Arian a Jew or a Turk if they should urge the like knowledg and feeling
it Where R. E. hath read of a visible Church with two heads I know not and to take it for infallible I intend not and where is Peter called a visible Rock and the chief Pastor among the Apostles doth not this contradict Scripture doth not Christ say the Gentiles exercise Dominion one over another but it shall not be so amongest you he that will be greatest among you let him be your servant and he that will be chief let him be your Minister and as for thy visible and militant Church we read no such words in the Scriptures of truth we read of a Church of God and of the first born whereof Christ was the Rock and the foundation and another foundation can no man lay then that which is laid which is Jesus Christ 1 Cor. 3. 11. and Paul saith in the 10. ver as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation I hope R. E. will not be so impudent as to say he had laid Peter or that he had preached up Peter to believe in for the remission of sins nor for the foundation of faith for that had been contrary to the Apostles commission and their Doctrine for saith the Apostle We have not preached our selves but Christ the Lord and our selves your servants for his sake And I may say to thee R. E. as Paul said to the Corinthians when they were striving about Men 1 Cor. 3. 21. therefore let no man glory in men for all things are yours or as he saith in the 1 chap. 13. ver was Paul crucified for you or were you baptised in the name of Paul were they not carnal that so gloried was Peter crucified for us or were we baptised in the name of Peter is not your visible Church carnal who thus judges that Christ intended Peter to be the foundation of his Church for what was he or the rest of the Apostles but Ministers by which many believed and if thou had been present it is very like would have instructed Christ what to have said and bidden him have spoken after the Grammer Rule and Construction upon that Rock I will build my Church for Peters faith in Christ is to mediate it seems and his confession too remote and anticedent to be the Rock meant in the 16. of Mat. 18. and therefore Peter must be imediate and the Rock upon which Christ hath doth and will build his Church but as imediate as he was and a sure a Rock as he was when he began to rebuke Christ he turned him about ver 23. and said unto Peter Get the behind me Satan thou art an offence unto me for thou savours not the things of God and so say I to R. E. and his Catholicks they savour not the things of God but it is thy private spirit and your own Interpretations and not the mind of Christ and how far anticedent is Peter's Confession of Christ the Son of the Living God is it not in the 16. ver and wherein was Peter blessed but in this that it was revealed to him that Christ was the Son of the Living God the Rock of Ages and the foundation of his Church and as for thy visible Church with its two heads indipendent head and dependent head which sure must have two bodies where they can be found but that I shall leave to R. E. and I hope from the grounds that thou hast here laid which did appear so clear to thee that none will be afraid not judge that such a visible Church with two heads is to be rule and guide to all to whom all is to submit under pain of Damnation which is to have Peter for its Rock which if he had been living he would have denyed you all as seters up of Men and â—leighters of Jesus Christ the Rock of Ages the Foundation of the Church the Head of the Body the Rule of Life the Judge of quick and the dead the Law-giver directer instructer and preserver of his Church for ever but R. E. goes on and saith it only remains that we consider which among all these congregations now on Earth which pretend themselves to be this Church of Christ for having once found her and knowing that she is so assisted with the Holy Ghost that she cannot teach us an error we shall no more dispute the verity of her Doctrines then we would have questioned the Articles of Faith taught by the holy Apostles or the words of Christ himself wherefore if this Church this infallible guide shall teach us that Infants ought to be Baptised and that it is as lawful to desire the Saints departed to pray for us as to desire the Prayers of them that are alive and that the body of Christ our Saviour is really and truly present in the Sacrament of the Alter or any other article of Faith we shall no more doubt it then the first Christians did the verity of what the Apostles taught them Among all those Congregations on Earth that looks upon themselves to be this Church and spouse of Christ there is one if thy eye could behold or if thou could discern it but before thou can there is an eye in thee must be put out and there is a wisdom in thee that must be confounded and turned into foolishness before thou can discern it in its glory as it is but however that is it undoubtedly which is begotten into the faith through the publication of the immortal word of Life who are translated from death unto life who have received the power and spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ and meets in his name and power and doth witness his presence among them and have received a measure of that infallible Spirit of truth which leadeth into all truth and out of the pollutions of the World and are dead unto the World and baptised into the sufferings of Christ and are crucified with him who keep unviolated his Statutes and commands without adding to or diminishing from who walk in the order of the Gospel and are not conformable to the world nor to that which fallen men sets up but to the power of God which worketh in the hearts of all that believe to the framing of them a meet habitation for God to dwel in and abideth in the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles and are sayers and doers speakes the truth and doth the truth and holds the truth in Righteousness and the faith once delivered to the Saints in a pure heart and a pure Conscience who prayes in the spirit and with understanding who publisheth the truth and declares it in the spirit reaching to the Consciences and to the witness of God in all that hears who rejoyce only in Christ Jesus the great power of God and the wisdom of God and hath no confidence in the flesh nor fleshly performances whose faith stands not in words but in the mighty power of God which she hath received according unto the promise of God this Congregation or Congregations
all the Saints and would teach all Infidels to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts and to live godly and righteously and soberly in this present evil world Howbeit all are not so taught because they heed it not and because they receive it not and so they make the free gift of God of no effect as to life to them but it is their condemnation yet however herein appears the equal merciful and universal love of God who is no respecter of persons but hath distributed a measure of this unto all to the intent that they might have power to fulfill his will and keep his Statutes and so the fault is not in God but in them who slight and dispise his gift and so condemnation is just of every one that doth not believe and is of himself and this reprehends that false erronious narrow pinching spirit which would shut it up in a corner and tye it to one sort of Men or Sect or opinion and the masters thereof would assume it to themselves as though the Spirit of God and Grace of God were only among them and must be conveyed from them to other people before they have it and the direction and guide of every man must be sought from their mouths as though God had not given a measure of his Spirit unto every man to profit withal and to be led and taught and guided by it into all truth out of error according to Christs promise and according to the Lords promise in the days of old that though his people might eat the bread of adversity and drink the water of affliction yet their teacher should not be removed into a corner and from this quieking enlightening enlivening spirit of God the Saints of God and Ministers of Christ in the Primitive times received power and authority to propagate Righteousness and to judge deceit and the mystery of Iniquity where ever it appeared and in this their ability stood for they were made able and fit Ministers by it not of the Letter nor of Mens traditions nor of foolish fopperies which hath been introduced since and shuffled in among Christians under the name of power and authority of the holy Church and the Church of God that had received this spirit walked in it and brought forth the fruits of it whereby they were a good savour in the nostrils of the Lord and by which they adorned the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ by a holy Conversation which did manifest them to be of God and convince and stop the mouths of gain-sayers And thus we are bold to tell thee all that the Spirit of God which is given a measure of it to every man and more fulness of it to them that believe that it is the rule and the way and the means whereby all the actions words and works of all Men are weighed tryed measured and judged and Objections answered and is the alone Judge of all matters and answerer of all doubts and giveth only true and perfect satisfaction and therefore R. E. may blush and be ashamed to ever publish such a thing abroad in the World as to say that the Spirit of God is not a sufficient directer teacher and Judge but calls it a private spirit opinion humour and fancy to make the eyes of them blind who wait for its appearance only to trust to Men who pleads antiquity and power without verity And further he goes on and sayes in 22 th page of his said Epistle There is neither Jew Turk Pagan or Christian but he may put on confidence enough affirming that he is taught by the spirit of God many of all sorts doth this and yet teach contradictions and further saith that it hath no effect among them who pretend to it and that they can no more satisfie another that they are guided by the spirit of truth then many who are cast into Bedlam Answ. 'T is true many are confident and impudent enough but confidence without ground and impudence proves but little and he that saith he is a Jew and is not but of the Synagogue of Satan will soon be found out by his Doctrine and fruits and he that saith he is a Christian and led by the Spirit and keeps not the commands of Christ neither brings forth the fruits of the spirit is soon discovered to be a deceiver and deceived and such are like to teach contradictions but all such are denyed shut out with the spirit of truth but them that have the spirit of God witness a blessed effect among them for they are turned from Satans power unto God and doth witness remission of sin and reconciliation with God and are not at difference but at unity one with another and are brought out of the obstinate and perverse estate which all pretenders are in and as for contradictions they are more to be seen in the Church of Rome then many wheres else they who are but pleased and hath leisure to view over the Decrees and Constitutions of several Popes and Councils since he was elevated to be Universal Bishop over all Christian Churches by that heathen and cruel Emperour Phocus who slew his Master Mauritius to obtain the Empire he did gratifie the Pope so far that he might be cryed up as Emperour as that he should be Vniversal Bishop and this proved a better plea for the Pope because the Emperour had power to defend him and to compell all to receive his Decrees then that he was Peters Successor I say who will but look into the Constitutions and Decrees shall find such seting up and throwing down and such decreeing and such disanulling as twenty such Champions as Robert Everard will never be able to free his Catholick Church from contradictions although he is very forward to charge others though he is but a new Convert but let him not boast till he have put off his armour and it is that mad Bedlam spirit of thine that saith that among all the Nonconformists there is no one that can satisfie another that he hath the spirit of God I tell thee yes there are thousands satisfied in one another that they have the spirit of God besides he that hath it can speak to the witness of God in another which shall testifie the same and moreover their works and fruits shall and doth manifest unto others that they are born of the spirit because the fruits of it are seen as they are manifest to be born of God that do the works of God and thou must first know the spirit of God in thy self if ever thou look for it there and not hang all together upon others belief as thou doth upon thy Catholick Church before thou can know it in another and first be convinced by it and judged by it for thy ill deeds and ill thoughts and hypocrisie and time-serving and flattery and men pleasing before thou can be convinced of others Righteousness and also be convinced of the unbelief of thy own heart before thou can
one the Lay Gentleman he mentions and himself speaking to one speaks to both First Whether that any can be certain that the Christians in general is more true then the Turkes Jewes or any other and whether any can be infallibly assured of this that it is not possible for one to be mistaken in this and again the answer amounting to no more then this you conceive you are in the right you hope and believe you are not mistaken but it is possible you may be mistaken in this for every Man is a Lyer and every Man and all Men and every Church is fallible and subject to error and with these and the like words R. E. was extreamly troubled as he saith and knew not how to answer without shuffling Answer The true Christian Religion stands not only in name nor in words nor in conforming or transforming to this or that outward practice which the Disciples of Christ were exercised in which divers in the latter days in their old corrupt minds not having their hearts renewed have taken on the outside and have got the form and wants the life and the power and are not partakers of the Divine nature of Christ and such a bare profession as this has no certainty nor infallibility in it neither the assurance but that they may be mistaken and may be subject to err as well as Turkes or Jewes or any other but the true Christian Religion indeed whom Christ will own as true Worshippers of Him stands in power in life and in being obedient unto his living commands and precepts which he giveth forth unto his Disciples and manifesteth by his Spirit his Sheep hear his voice and know it from the voice of a stranger And he giveth the knowledge of his will to all that believe in the measure of his eternal Spirit which he hath given every one a measure of to profit withal and by it to be guided into all truth out of all error and this Spirit is infallible and gives certain assurance to all that receive it that they are in that way which is acceptable to God and they feel comfort unto their souls coming daily from the presence of Christ who is the Rock of Ages and the sure foundation upon which his holy Church is founded which is the pillar and ground of truth and they that are living members are not grounded upon a fallible certainty or upon a conjectural supposition or a vain hope which is without bottom but upon that which is sure and stedfast lasting and everlasting and all men in the unregenerate estate are lyers but they that are born from above are of the truth and lie not and are not subject to mistakes because the seed remains in them and walkes in the pure Religion which keeps unspoted of the World and they that have no other ground for their Religion but only without them and from the report of others are short of the true foundation for that may be truth in it self indeed which is not true to another nor he truly partakes of it and here is all the supposing conjectures and mistakes and fallible certainties which it seems R. E. and his lay Gentleman too when the axe is laid to the root of the tree indeed and not withstanding all the laying claim to infallibility and certainty its but grounded upon a report without and the traditions of men from Generation to Generation For them that believe but only because of the true report without and cometh not to witness the thing assured in their own hearts by the Spirit of the Lord these will not be long of that faith 't is true many did believe because of the Apostles Declaration and report but at last came to feel the witness of God in their own hearts testifying the self same in so much that they could say and truly too though we have believed through your words at the first yet now we have heard him our selves and that which giveth perfect assurance which admits of no doubts nor fallibleness for such evidence all true Members of Christ's Church have in themselves which carries divine authority and satisfaction in it to every particular Believer and so I say with R. E. in this it seemes unreasonable to perswade any to receive this or that for a truth when they that so perswade are uncertain in themselves neither dare say their judgment is infallible which is that old Protestant Principle indeed and also the Principle of many Sects who differs from the pretended Catholick Church of Rome who persecuted one another about outward things even as the Heathen about their Idols and yet will need sit as Judge in Mens Consciences with their fallible spirit though I speak not of every individual person neither can I justifie the Roman Catholick Church so called who layes claim to infallibility and whatsoever they judge to be Heresie must be reckoned as such though never so manifest a truth and to place infallibility in men that may err and have erred from the spirit I like not neither for this is to give that to men that belongs to God and to make the Judgment of fallible men above the Judgment of the infallible spirit of God and this I look to be great ambition and pride in any to lay claim to the greatest things as infallibility and certainty of assurance and the most free of error and yet falls the shortest of it of any as hath been made appear by many learned and grave Men of former ages and also if a necessity were might be made appear that the Church of Rome who saith she cannot err have been as uncertain both in their Doctrine and Worship as any yea more one Pope contradicting and throwing down that which another did establish and one Council decreeing and another disanulling as I could easily make appear but that I would not be tedious to the Reader in things that have been so manifest neither do I desire to wade out into diversity of matters in so short a Discourse But that which R. E. and his Catholick instructer calleth late wild and loose opinions that men of different faiths may be saved and this countenanceth schisme and breeds rebellion as it is said 't is true faith is but one which is saving and there is no differance in that for the difference is among Men where that is wanting and only have the words and name of faith and want the life and power Neither am I so narrow spirited as R. E. and his Catholick as to exclude all out of the faith who may differ in their perswasions in some Circumstantial things if yet they hold Christ the head and what makes R. E. so verilent as to judge all in error and to be out of the true faith seeing the Protestants and all sorts of separates professe Justification and Salvation only through faith in Christ Jesus as well as the Church of Rome and it were unreasonably judged in me if I should conclude
with the like confidence to prove they were in the truth and Christianity a delusion and thy instructer said what would you reply to them We have more to reply in such Cases then time will permit now or the state of the case require seeing it is but a supposition and we take no thought what to answer the gain-sayers of truth withall but relyes upon the promise of the Father and of his Son Jesus Christ who said to his Disciples take no thought for it shall be given you what to answer in that day which promise all that are true Disciples shall find true to the end of the World but somewhat more we have to say it may be then thou said when thou suffered thy self to be made blind and carried captive with another Mans Judgment and neglected the measure of Gods spirit in thy self at home through which alone the secret things of God is revealed and in which true certainty and infallibility is witnessed and not in Men who is fallible and changable If an Arian Jew or Turk should urge their own interpretation of Scriptures which is of no private interpretation contrary to the mind of him that gave it forth I would say he perverted the words of the Scripture which is in harmony and unity one with another as to the states and conditions they were spoken to and are plain and are only read by that spirit that gave them forth except it be in some Historicall or Chronology or Genealogy of Names and Generations which might he some gathered from other hands and different hands taking notice of them as to record them there might be some variation yet the substance of the report is true but what is Calculation of yeares or dayes or reckoning up of Genealogies as to the matter of Salvation and what if we had never had them no more then we have other Histories and things that fell out among the Jewes but if there be any contradiction for ought I know we may blame the Church of Rome the most of any who will needs affirm they received all or most of the things from the Apostles and if the translations differ or be somewhat uncertain what have they been doing this fifteen hundred yeares with their infallible spirit that they could not have rectified them according to their first original and if any of the foresaid Sects should pretend the certainty of the spirit and yet not have it I should answer the spirit is known by its fruits and the fruits of the spirit are manifest and they that pretend to it and bring forth contrary fruites are manifest to be deceivers and deceived but their states are different and therefore requires different answers which time will not now permit to insist upon but over and beside all other arguments to perswade any man to or from any thing the witness of God in the party unto whom he speaketh is to be reached and that is beyond the understanding of man and greater then it and more convincing then any arguments that can be used without and he that cannot speak to this is not skilful in the word of righteousness That Christ was an infallible guide who is the way the truth and the life is granted by all Christians and that the Apostles received the promise of the Father and the infallible spirit of God which led them into all truth and this infallible assurance the Christians had that lived in the Apostles time this is granted and the Apostles were infallible guides not as Men meerly but as Men full of the holy Ghost and as Men who were filled with the spirit of God and therefore the Apostles said be followers of us as we are followers of Christ and if any controversie did arise as some there did and doutes among the then Christians the Apostles and Elders meeting together in the power of the holy Ghost did write their mindes and Letters to the Christians to pacify all and good reason that they that had believed through their word should submit unto the Holy Ghost and unto them by whom they were begotten unto God by the word of Life for the ending of strife about wordes and shadowes and outward things and they whose mindes were outward then in ages since and now ran into contention about outward things and such for the most part do erre from the spirit of God in themselves but I would have thee to take notice of this and all you Catholick Members so called the Apostles of Christ only did exhort and did not force their Decrees by penal Statutes and to be observed under the penalty of loosing life or limbes as since their pretended successors have done who have erred from the spirit and have got the Saints words and turned against the life and power but the Decrees as you call them are not many nor burdensome which the Apostles wrote at Jerusalem as the many Counsels since have made they are so endless and numberless and burdensome and so contradictory one to another in divers things who will but look into the Decrees of the Counsels since the Apostles dayes that we can find little certainty in any of their Decrees but rather as thy Instructer saith the Sword of the flesh and not the spirit hath been the rule and law to Christianity but the Masters of great wit and power and Interest have framed and made parties unto themselves and hath not Warres been raised among your selves about deciding your controversies hath not the Pope Warred against the Emperour and the Emperour against the Pope was not Wars raised about the Decrees when Pope Eujenius was deposed as a Heretick by the Counsel of Bazill and one while the Pope must be infallible as Peter's Successor and above all Counsels and Churches another while the Counsell is above the Pope excommunicates him as a Heretick and excludes his Infallibility and now where is the certainty and whether should one go or appeal for true judgment so though the Church of Rome boast of unity yet how hath one Nation made War against another and yet professing the same faith at divers times and in sundry ages And to tell thee plainly and to speak the naked truth according to the Apostles prophesie after their departure there was a great Apostacy and a great falling away from the faith and a giving heed to lying seducing spirits and doctrine of Devils and many were subverted from the faith by them that spake lies in hypocrisie and took up the Priests office for filthy lucre and they went out into the world and the world wondered after them and they had the form and the sheeps cloathing and the Saints words but were enemies to the Cross of Christ and to the power of Godliness and the Kings of the Earth were bewitched with their Sorceries and then forced all and compelled all to receive and believe such Decrees and such Articles as was then set forth by a pack of those Hirelings who minded their
own profit and their own bellies who mingled their own Inventions and traditions with the Doctrine of Christ and brought the Scripture for a Cloak and the Apostles practice for a president and could say falsly as the Apostles said in the truth It seems good to us and the Holy Ghost that these our Decrees be observed for God hath placed us as Judges and directers as them that are appointed of God himself To which all Christians are to submit and none to question and if any do question or will not obey it is the Kings and Princes duty in every Country to cause all to submit to these our Decrees and orders or else to be punished as Hereticks with death for we are the Apostles successors and we are the elders of the Church and we have the infallible Spirit and though we make Decrees contrary to what the Apostles made in their day yet none is to question that the Church was but in its Infancy then as unwasht and unswadled and in Persecution but now she is grown up to a greater stature and power and indowed with greater privilege and that may be necessary now that was not necessary then and last of all called themselves the Clergie which signifies the Heritage of God and so excluded all others but themselves And these things are true and certain and have been made good by many sufferers for Christ and this kind of Clergie or Heritage made the Heritage of God indeed to fly into the Wilderness who had the infallible spirit and the witnesses to prophesie in sackcloath and then Mystery Babylon began to sit a Queen and to gild her Cup and to fill it full of abomination and brought in Judaisme and the practise of the Apostles and their own Inventions and patched up an endless kind of worship and service consisting of out-side things in a great part in postures and gestures and meates and drinks and dayes and times and vestures and Bonnets and Caps and Coules and such other like trumpery which they made the Nations drunk with and greedy after and if any scrupled at any of those things or any other the Holy Catholick Church hath decreed it and she cannot erre for she is infallible though the errors thereof cannot be numbered and this R. E. thou rests satisfied in as thy only rule and judge and director and thou hangs all thy faith here and saith thou shall not scruple to believe what authority teacheth thee to be revealed by God no more then if thou heard God himself speaking I say unto thee as the Apostle said the Serpent hath beguiled thee as it beguiled Eve and further say as the Prophet said thou must arise and get thee hence for this is not the rest for thou wilt see thy self plunged into such a layborinth of uncertainties as thou never was before if the Lord ever open thy eye And R. E. gives an account that after his reading of some contravertal Books hath made some Collections as to himself and also declares that all dissenting judgments grants there must be a way and a rule appointed to teach us to deside all doubts to judge of all matters and to teach us the true way to Heaven with certainty but who this rule or judge is is not agreed upon by all which he hath collected into four heads First some sets up the spirit to direct them and to be this means Secondly another will have every mans own natural reason to be this rule and judg Thirdly others will set up sole Scripture and the fourth assignes the Holy Catholick Church to be that Judge and Directer Other then these he saith he never heard of any for he saith he always esteemed the Quakers Light to be either the Spirit or Natural reason but which R. E. doth not know and all the four before mentioned he saith he hath examined and treateth largely upon them all wherein he goeth about and giveth grounds and divers reason and divers Iuterpretations of Scriptures he layes wast all the former three and establisheth as he thinks the fourth as to be that way and rule and Judge and governing power to deside all doubts as that whereby all are obliged to submit unto as to Christ himself and this was that question which he was to gain satisfaction in and therefore he saith he ceased to enquire of their Doctrine or this or that article of faith and hang altogether upon this point before mentioned Answ. 'T is true it is granted by all that there must be a way and a rule as the means appointed of God to answer all doubts and to give satisfaction to every man of the certainty of that which he believes and who this way and judge and rule is every one ought to be satisfied and the four heads into which thou hath collected the whole Controversie of all dissenting Judgments in Christianity takes up the whole as to this particular which have ordinarily been holden forth among Christians But I judge thou dealt not wisely in thy Inquisition and search for satisfaction to hing all on this pin but rather to have examined further as concerning matter of Doctrine and matters of Faith held forth most especially of this party to whom thou was so much inclined and see how thou could have swallowed down that Doctrine of Purgatory and sacrifice for the Dead and Justification by a Man 's own works and of Bread and Wine after the words of Consecration by the Priest is Transubstantiated into the very body and blood of Christ and becomes whole God their Saviour and Redeemer for these are principal things either greatly necessary to Salvation or greatly unnecessary and when thou had tryed and found these to be so repugnant unto the Doctrine and faith once delivered among the Saints in the first Plantation of the Gospel this might have put a stop unto thee that thou could not so easily close with their judgment and pretended infallibility who pretends to be only guids and yet leads into the greatest errors in matters of greatest moment But as to the four particulars mentioned I shall not stand to trouble either my self or the Reader as to speak much what of that which is no part of my faith or judgment but only to vindicate the truth against the many false conceptions of changable men And first of all R. E. begins to treat of the spirit and perverts the Scripture at his first on-set and saith as touching the spirit bearing witness in secret with our spirits or as he saith in plainer terms the private spirit this saith R. E. I considered could not be the means to convey faith unto the World nor the rule guide or judge which I enquired after nor indeed the true spirit of God which he promised to his Apostles Secondly Those who pretend this guidance do not believe God but themselves only and their own perswasions which tell them they have the spirit of God but they can give no other account but they
are verily perswaded so or no other answer but I am sure it is the spirit of God and I am a good man and an honest man and I believe my self but other reasons or evidence can they give none Thirdly This pretending of a private spirit is against 2 Pet. 1. 20. That no prophesie of Scripture is of private interpretation Answ. This Man beats all together beside the Anvil what ever the matter is but that he is blinded and confounded in himself he sets but up a shadow and then fights with it for instead of proving the Spirit of God not to be a competent rule judge and guide and instructer in all matters of Faith necessary to Salvation he goes about to prove a private spirit a pretended spirit a spirit of error is not a sufficient guide and Judge and in this he fights without an adversary and fills the world with noise and darkness and the air with smoak and would cloud peoples understandings with multitudes of words that tend not to edification with a quareling wrangling spirit which is not for peace but I see he hath delighted in contention and sported it self in varience and like the son of the bond-woman his hand against every man Secondly I wonder why R. E. quotes so much Scripture as for the proofe of his matter in hand seeing that it is one of his great pleas that it is insufficient as to be a rule or a guide or a judge as to answer any doubts or give any satisfactory solution to him that is enquiring and seeing he hath given in so many reasons against it as insufficient and as much as in him lay to invaluedate and set it at nought and hath laboured to set it at oddes and to make contradictions in it as to render it insufficient for matter of probation in any thing which is in controversie or how he can judge that others should receive them and his sometimes false rendering of them or his own interpretations upon them seeing he denies them as uncertain as they are translated and insufficient and not fit to be a rule and who this man hath conversed with I know not that should ever affirm a private spirit or their own spirits to be a sufficient rule or guide to walk by such I deny and leave them and thee to quarel together about your imaginations and thoughts and conceptions or else the conceptions of other men who are as uncertain and fallible as the first and shall assert the sufficiency of the spirit of God teaching ruling guiding and judging all true Christian men in that certain everlasting infallible truth which is necessary and satisfaction to the souls of all them that do believe in it and shall deny all the pretenders to it who run into heaps and heads and quarels and fights one with another about shadows and can give no other account or manifestation then I am sure I have the spirit of God and I ought to be believed and I am a good man and the like which thou saith thou could never receive any other evidence or testimony and what though many have pretended to the spirit and the guidance thereof and in the mean while have brought forth the fruits of the flesh and their own imaginary false conceptions and hath put on confidence enough to say so as thou thy self it may be hath had a share in in times past shall this make the Spirit of God insufficient and uncertain in its teachings to them that believe in it and have received and bring forth the fruits of it and have the deeds of the flesh mortified by it God forbid Thirdly Why hast thou perverted the Scripture as I said at the first onset Rom. 8. 16. The Spirit it self bears witness with our spirits that we are the Children of God and this thou hath put in in a distinct Character to be taken notice of as though it were Scripture and renders it thus the Spirit being witness in secret with our spirits or in plainer termes the private spirit Thou must repent of this and take heed how thou calls the spirit of God a private spirit for it was that publick spirit which manifested it self among all the Patriarks and Prophets and by which they spoke forth the words and mind of God unto the people and prophesied of things to come and through it alone is the deep and weighty things of God revealed and was and is the only way and means by which Christ promised after his Ascension to lead guide instruct and comfort his Disciples in all truth and that it should bring to their memory whatsoever he had spoken that they were to be without care or thought for through it the Father should give them what to speak and what to answer before Rulers and Councils for his Names sake And here the sufficiency of it is proved to any reasonable man who hath the least savour or discerning of the things of God and this is that publick spirit by which the Apostles published the Everlasting Gospel of peace and which Christ the head of the Body his Church had received without measure and this is a private twyning creeping spirit of thine who hath been lost in thy own imaginations and following thy own forward rash spirit and hath found no certainty in thy self of Gods spirit to stay thy mind upon nor no patience to wait upon it but reaching grasping at things in thy dark mind last of all hath brought in thy verdict for the devil against the sufficiency of the holy spirit of God its guidance amongst his people in the later days that is thy fond conception as to say that the Spirit of God is expressly against the 2. of Pet. 1. 20. which thou calls a private spirit all along 't is true no prophefie of Scripture is of private interpretation but the holy Men of God spoke it forth as they were moved by the holy spirit which was publick and conversant among them with them and in them and they that have it can receive them as they are written and can read them and understand them as they were spoken and doth see the intent of the Holy Ghost in so speaking unto different states and conditions notwithstanding the many Copies thou tells on and diversions and different translations which thou would make a great Mountain on and raise it up so high to make the Scripture uncertain and low as not fit to be taken notice on as to answer any doubt or to be any rule or guide or any example or president for any thing that I can perceive by the course of thy Spirit which in the truth is fathomed and comprehended though it is as uncertain as the way of a Serpent upon a Rock yet they that have the spirit of God sees beyond all and hath unity with the words and minds of the Spirit of God notwithstanding the many corruptions and defects in translations and the many foul hands it hath
all these and is sufficient to lead out of all ungodliness and worldly lusts and to do that which is acceptable in the sight of God and this all sects since the Woman cloathed with the Sun fled into the Wilderness viz. the true Church and all parties hath laid claim to and excluded all others that were not of their opinion as from having any share in it as though it were given only to such a company of men that succeeded the Apostles and by arts and parts and natural Language in the course and term of years and at such and such places as the Apostles were sometime conversant at and other sects besides you who have kept more nearer in Conformity in Doctrine and Worship and unto the Apostles then you have done they have laid claim to the spirit of God and to the free Grace of God only extending it self to them under such a quallification as though the Spirit of God and free and saving Grace of God had come by Generation or by succession or because of such and such a quallification or conforformity in outward practice as I said as though the free Grace of God and the infallible Spirit of God had been given to you and had been bequeathed and intailed to you or any of you under such and such a denomination and because inhabiting at such a place and thus you would limit the holy one of Israel and to stop the wind to blow where it listeth and circumscribe the infallible means which God hath given unto all Mankind for a direction and a guide a rule and a judge and pinch it up into a narrow corner and yet shut up all under condemnation who do not believe and yet exclude all but your selves from the sufficient meanes and guide and way whereby they may believe away away with this narrow partial pinching spirit for God will not be limited neither can be either to Men time or place but as they keep in Covenant with him and keeps their first love and integrity in the certain truth revealed in the first publication of the Gospel which the Roman Church above all other hath wonderfully apostatised from especially in this one thing which she can never clear her self of to wit Persecution in taking away the lives of many under the name of Hereticks and suppose any had been so as doubtless there are such yet we never read that it was Christ or the Apostles way to kill them and destroy them but on the contrary denyed them and warned others to beware of them and to have no fellowship with them and so left them to the World neither that they exhorted or stired up either Kings or Princes to take away the lives of any who did believe or not believe what as they declared to be truth but on the contrary when the Disciples in the days of their infancy would have commanded fire to have come down from Heaven as did Elias Christ rebuked them and told them they knew not what spirit they were of and again love your enemies and do good to them that hate you How your Catholick Church hath kept this precept I leave all Nations to judge where your power hath been known suppose real Schismaticks and Hereticks as some such there hath been in the world how you have done good to them and how you have loved them is manifest except you judge that shuting them up in Prisons racking tortering and cruel torments and at last of all death was in love to them and in doing good to them which methinks any reasonable man should blush and be ashamed to think or say But an old Plea comes to my mind which some of the members of the Church of Rome hath alledged to me in the days of my youth when I was conversant with them and among them in a friendly neighbourly and sober discourse of things of this nature before mentioned it was said unto me the Roman Catholick Church is that Church whereby Christianity hath been conveyed to all Nations and the great Oraccles thereof delivered unto us and the Scriptures also came from us by which you know the Mysteries of the Kingdom of God and the knowledg thereof came unto all and all her Children ought to be subject unto her as the true mother that brought them all forth and if any went astray either into Heresie or Schisme which might not only hurt themselves but also others ought not the Mother in natural love to her Children to correct them and ought not they to bear her correction and submit unto it and hath not she power to correct her Children when they go astray unto which is answered Christianity that which is truly such and them whom God will own to be Christians was dispersed through the Nations by the power of God and we say that the Church of Rome hath begotten Christendom into that mould and frame into which they are now cast more by force and awe then any sound Doctrine and as for the Scriptures coming from her that we deny We know they came from the Apostles and from the Primitive Christians according to the will of God and have been preserved to this day though through many polluted hands they have come and we know how much your rage was kindled that ever it should be Translated into the English Tongue and many felt the effect of it to the loss of their Lives as I hope many in England doth well consider But suppose a true Mother have many Children and suppose some do swerve and go astray from her precepts and under pretence of correcting of them she shut them up in Goals and nasty holes and afflict them with sundry kind of torments and at last of all kill them and destroy them what Judgment will be given by reasonable Men of such a Mother but this that she is become unnatural and cruel and hard hearted and degenerated from the nature of a loving and tender Mother and deserves not to have or ever to have had any Children and such a kind of Mother hath your Church been to all that have dissented from her that I may say of her as the Prophet Jeremiah said especially in these latter ages the Sea Monsters and Dragons of the Wilderness draw out their breasts to feed their young ones but the daughter of my people is become cruel Seventhly and lastly We know that God willeth that all Men should be saved and come to the knowledg of the truth and hath given that and doth give that unto every man that is come into the World whereby every man that doth receive it is capable of fulfilling the will of God and this gift comes not by the will of Man nor is received in the will of Man but in its own will even in the will of the giver and this free gift of God is the free and saving Grace of God which hath appeared unto all Men to wit every man that is come into the World which teaches
believe others but thou hath been so busie abroad in quareling and contending about words and names and empty shews without substance and life that thy mind is all over grown with thorns and briers scrawling and scratching and entangling thy self and others so that that which should savour the things of God is over grown in these and it s buried and to them that are like heaths in a desart knows not when good comes neither doth know what they enjoy that dwell in the fat Vallies and the Pharisees had such unbelieving hearts though Christ was the express Image of God and did the works that never man did yet being without faith and without reason they said he was a Blasphemer and all his works was done by Belzebub and would never be convinced that any thing he did was of God and that spirit is near thee which would represent the fruits of the Spirit to be delusion and them that bring them forth like them in Bedlam and what though Turks Jews Pagans Mahomet and the false Christians do pretend to the spirit and guidance by it and yet bring forth the fruits of the flesh doth this make the spirit of God void or the certainty of it to them that believe or do make their fruits of none effect God forbid thy ignorance is manifest but here thou ceases not thy tongue being thy own and thou being at liberty and speaks thy own words which in the end shall become thy burden Thou vapours and vaunts over them to wit all the Nonconformists and saith what can you say for your selves any of you which these Enthusiasts who have gone before you to maintain their errors but the rule and judge and then thou concludes that which God hath appointed to be rule and judge to all the world and capable of being known and heard by all and cannot contradict it self nor must be contradicted by any under pain of damnation if you cannot shew it to have been your rule you ought to lay aside your folly as destructive to humane society and them that hath pretended the spirit the strongest party and sword upon the vote will prove it self the most convincing spirit and force the weaker spirits to submit or cry for thou concludes the Nonconformists have no other Testimony to try your contradicting spirits in matters of greatest moment but force and success if you have I pray you inform me what it is Ans. If the wind had not turned into another door divers Nonconformists believes we should have had another song from thee if time had but favoured thee so far as to have granted thee the privilege of thy Troop to be Captain which name thou holds up yet i' th pride of thy heart though thou have lost thy force success and pay which was the greatest plea when time was with thee and not long since too which makes thee measure every Man's foot by thy Last and thou might have received information before thou had made a conclusion had been the part of a wise man before thou had set thy self as Judge over all thy former fellowships which thou fainedly pretends so great love to and before thou had discovered their nakedness if it be nakedness to all the world in such a publick insulting bravado as this like Goliah of Gath and as for what some Nonconformists both to the Church of Rome and to the Church of England too which thou creeping and sneakingly flatters and saith its established and therefore thou will not meddle thou might have said dare not for thy spirit is well enough seen by them only to have the spirit of a slave and not a free member of the true Church of God and it s no part of vertue nor honour for thee to insult and glory over them who are in suffering and adversity when as thou dare not meddle with them who are as contrary to thee as the former this is but the spirit of a Coward and is ignoble and base and ever so to be accounted by all the Children of Light who dare put all to venture which they do enjoy on this side of Immortality and to suffer the loss of all visible things for their Testimony and the truth which they believe and for bearing witness against that which is contrary unto their faith as did the valiant Primitive Christians of old and that which some Nonconformists can say is more then thou can believe although demonstrated in the evidence of the spirit of God with sound reason and evident example from the Scriptures of truth and though thou and thy former fellowships then and thy new fellowships now have made this vapour which for ought I know might lay your hands upon your mouths all considering what contradictory Doctrines and fruits hath been brought forth since the night of Apostacy entered in and all the World wondered after the Beast some hath this to say he that pretends to the Spirit and the thing cometh not to pass that they speak or prophesie let him be accounted a false Prophet again they that pretend guidance of the spirit as some formerly have done and yet bring forth the fruits of the flesh as variance hatred emulation strife contention heresie false Doctrine persecution force and violence let them he counted as truly they are deceivers and deluders which have gone out into the world and deceived a great part of Mankind of which Rome hath not had the least share clear it when thou can Moreover he that pretends to have the spirit of God and layes down another foundation to build upon in matter of Faith in matter of Rule in matter of Judgment in matter of Doctrine then that which the Lord of Life and Glory hath laid down he is a Deceiver and an Antichrist but R. E. hath laid down another rule another way another Judge another foundation for Faith and let himself make the Conclusion if he once dare joyne to true Judgment other Foundation can none lay then that which is already laid to wit Christ Jesus the Foundation of the Prophets and Apostles and of the Church of God by which they were all builded up as a holy Habitation for God to dwell in through the spirit Again the Apostle saith All Judgment is committed to the Son both in Heaven and Earth and again he saith himself I am the Way the Truth and the Life and none can come to the Father but by me and again the Spirit of Truth shall lead and direct his Disciples into all truth and sealeth unto them their Justification Redemption and Salvation And this R. E. would lay all wast and void and why because many hath pretended to it and hath fallen short therefore all the aforesaid things must be laid aside as uncertain and not to be trusted unto and a certain sort of Men called the Apostles Successors who have sought their gain and worldly Interest and to enlarge their Dominions and to make themselves Lords over Mens faith and over Mens
that confesses that Christ is come in the flesh only in word and because others hath said so and doth not witness sin condemned in the flesh and turned from and to have power over it the same is a false witness and is an Antichrist also and also we have other things to try spirits by we know a proud angry hasty perverse spirit is not the spirit of God a persecuting Lording Spirit is not the spirit of God and again they that teach a contrary Doctrine to the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles they have the spirit of error again they whose practice and conversation is not suitable to the practice and conversations of Christ and the Apostles and Primitive Christians that they are in the spirit of error again they that would force a faith by any humane constitution or law which is repugnant to the Law of God or by force of the sword or any carnal weapons they have the spirit of error for the weapons of the Lamb and his Followers are not carnal weapons but spiritual and yet mighty through God to the beating down of the strong holds of wickedness and to prevail over the Powers of darkness again the Testimony of God in every mans Conscience which is an unerring Testimony this savours the things of God and by this the things that be not of God are discerned and this will put a perfect difference between the spirit of truth and the spirit of error but what can be said to a man in unbelief that hath closed his eyes The next thing which R. E. saith he consider'd was that the Natural reason of every man could not possibly be rule and judge that I sought for for saith he if reason were to be rule and judge then it would follow contrary to Scripture that it is not impossible to please God without faith and it would likewise follow that every Religion would be truth consequently contradictions would be true consequently there would be many Religions and no faith at all for reason excludes faith as in the 26. page of his Book Thy tongue is thy own and thou art at liberty and goes whether thou wilt speaks what seems good in thy own eyes hath never yet known another to gird thee and lead thee whether thou would not I stand not to vindicate every mans Judgment neither to prove other mens conceptions but seeing thou hath taken in hand to lay all Mountains wast afore thee that stands in thy ways thou hast raised up some in thy discourse for others to stumble at and hath spoken many false things without distinguishing and puting a difference between Light and darkness between Natural reason and Spiritual reason I could not chuse but say somewhat Although it is no part of my belief that the Natural reason of any man or every man is able to be rule judge and guide to any man in the things of God yet faith is not in opposition unto pure reason neither is pure and spiritual reason in opposition to true faith but in harmony with it and one with another as they are the gifts of God but the Natural reason of all the fallen sons of Adam is corrupted and is too short and too narrow too cross and too perverse as to be rule and judge in the things of God for the Natural man by all his endowments in the transgression perceives not the things of God for they are spiritually discerned and the things of God that are spiritual and eternal are above the reach of Natural reason and yet thy consequence is false for faith doth not exclude pure reason and faith doth not make blind the understanding but enlightens it and though it is impossible to please God without faith yet it is impossible that that faith should be without reason the Apostle desired to be delivered from unreasonable men that had not faith so it is manifest they that have faith have reason and them that have no faith are unreasonable and where thou hath borrowed this rule I know not that a man must believe that which he doth not understand seeing the Apostle saith to the Romans even of the Gentiles who had not the Law nor the Scriptures that that which may be known of God was manifest in them for by that it is manifest they understood the mind of God and knew him for Paul saith further when they knew God they glorified him not as God but were unthankful c. and again he that believes must know that God is for none can believe in that which is not for to perswade any to believe in uncertainties which is not manifest in the understanding doth rather beget unbelief and doubting then true faith but thy paths are so full of darkness I shall not traduce them and thy consequences is false for pure reason teaches not contradictions neither doth teach that there is no faith at all neither is faith excluded by pure reason as thou ignorantly saith in the 26. page and is it not reason that I should believe in him whom I know is the Creator and Governour of all the World and pure Religion is so far from excluding faith that they that have true faith have reason and stands not in opposition to faith but this I conclude that the reason of fallen men is corrupted and is an uncertain thing to relie upon and so not a competent Judge in matters of so high concernment as touching everlasting Salvation The third thing which thou treats upon is against them who have pleaded that the sole Scriptures are sufficient of themselves to teach true faith from time to time to direct rule and govern us and to be rule and judge and to supply the place of Christ and the Apostles As I said it is not my intention to vindicate other mens quarels which is no part of my faith notwithstanding I should be sorry but that every thing had its true weight and measure and shall not in the least detract from the price value and true worth of the words of truth to wit the Scriptures of truth which were spoken forth by the spirit of truth and by the holy Ghost as it gave utterance but as men erring in their Judgments runs sometimes to the right hand and sometimes to the left hand and walks not in a straight path some men are seting them up above that which they were intended for and placing them in the stead of God Christ and the Spirit and others are too much debasing them and disesteeming them as that they would set up the Judgment of variable and changable men who hold and teach things in contradiction to the Scriptures and repugnant to the mind of the spirit in them that spoke them forth But first of all I say not against thee in this thing that the sole or whole Scriptures are not sufficient of themselves to teach true faith and give the knowledge of God without the spirit for many have got the words and yet
hath not received the spirit nor the power which the Scriptures declare of such wrangles and contends with the words and opposes the life and the power the Jews had the Scriptures and knew by them where Christ should be born and knew by them what his works should be when he was manifest and yet rejected him unto whom all the Prophets bore witness from Moses to Samuel and from him to John and they were never intended by God as to be set up as Judge and Guide to wit the words without the power and Spirit of God yet notwithstanding though I cannot set them up in the place of God and Christ and the Spirit nor contend ignorantly as some have done that they are the author of true faith and that they are the eternal word of God which the world was made by that they are the light and the way the truth and the life and that they are the desider of all Controversies and sole and absolute and only Judge of all matters of faith and of all matters that ever hath been or ever shall be in controversie to the end of the World without the spirit of God neither am I of that ignorant mind as some are that the Letter and the Spirit is unseparable as that whosoever hath the Scripture must needs have the Spirit or whosoever hath the Scripture must needs be infallible without the Spirit all that are of the aforesaid Judgment are but wranglers for the most part about words and contenders against the power of God and godliness and brings the words to oppose the life and them that have the spirit and walk in it for a Natural man may read the Scriptures and yet not perceive the things of God neither perceive the mind of the spirit but wrest to their own destruction as Peter saith because they are unlearned untaught by the spirits teaching though otherwise learned enough in Languages Tongues and Speeches Secondly Yet I cannot detract from them neither undervalue them or disesteem them as uncertain or of no use or of little use but what ever themselves declare themselves to be that I own them to be to wit the Words of God the words of Christ the words of the holy Prophets and Patriarkes and Apostles who were endued with the Holy Ghost and spake forth the Scripture as they were moved thereby in several ages of several things and unto several states and conditions as they were led thereunto by the holy Spirit and they are a certain declaration of things that were done and believed and practised by the Jewes under the first Covenant and by the Apostles and Primitive Christians in the New Covenant and contain many precious and holy precepts and commands doctrines examples exhortations admonisions reproofs and instructions and are as lively examples and holy patterns for all the Saints in light to follow by which we are given to understand what Faith what Hope what Patience what Love what mercy what long sufferings what consolation and what vertue and what inheritance the Saints in light were made pertakers of through faith in Christ Jesus Likewise what Doctrines were held forth and what practice they used in the Primitive times when they walked in the order of the Gospel and had fellowship with God the Father and the Son and one with another in the light of the Gospel which is the power of God through which they witnessed Salvation and remission of sins and published it unto others that they might believe Thirdly The Scriptures testifies of Christ and were written that they might be believed and received and read that there by every one that believed might be made wise to Salvation through faith in Christ Jesus 2 Tim. 3. and instructed in Righteousness that the Man of God may be perfect throughly furnished with all good works and whosoever doth teach any Doctrines contrary unto the holy Men of God who spake as they were moved by the spirit of God which dwelt in them the Scriptures are witnesses against such that they have not the Spirit of God but are led by another spirit which brings forth contrary Doctrine and another faith then once was delivered among the Saints and whosoever brings in sets up other precepts constitutions orders and practices in point of Worships in opposition and contrary unto those practices which were held forth in the Primitive times and would set up other Traditions then the Apostles delivered either by word or writing such are manifest to have the spirit of error and are innovaters and bringers in of other things as necessary in point of Worship among Christians which the Apostles and Ministers of Christ did not see necessary then and yet they wanted no part of the Councel of God for Paul said he had declared the whole Councel of God and further more they said we have the mind of Christ and Christs mind is not variable Fourthly Though divers of the Writings of the Prophets and Apostles be lost doubtless as is evident by divers places of Scripture yet blessed be God that there are those preserved which do bear witness of the one thing absolutely necessary unto Salvation and of the Ministrations that were appointed of the Lord for the Church of God to observe both in the first and second Covenants so that Christians of this last age are not left without example and president which all ought to have an eye unto and a diligent regard and though there be divers Coppies of that which is called the Original Tongues and divers Translations yet he unto whom the Spirit of God is given and waiteth in the measure of Christs Light shall receive it doth see and shall see the mind and will of God in every age and the mind and intent of the spirit in them that spoke forth the Scripture and can receive the matter therein contained as though they had heard them speak that spoke it at the first and though the Translaters were Men yet I have such an honourable esteem of their labour that I believe they have not varied wittingly and willingly from the best Coppies that was extant in their age neither that they were altogether void of the Spirit of God in such a good work which conduced to the benefit of Mankind but were assisted by it for so good a work and there be many figures and trophes improprieties of speech mysteries and difficulties yet all these comes to be made easie and plain to them that are witnesses of the same spirit that gave them forth and though there be deversity of judgments and professions of Religion one clashing again another and thwarting another and contradicting another and all will seem to bring the Scripture for their proofe which yet canuot maintain and prove every thing good especially when their Doctrines contradict one another This is granted it is only their private interpretation and not the Scripture and for want of that Spirit that gave it forth for that alone gives the true
And as for all thy Collections out of the Prophets of the promise of God to his Church Isaiah 54. and 56. and of its indowments and glory and excellency and of his puting his spirit in them and of his word in their mouthes and that it should not depart from the seed nor the seeds seed for ever this is granted and the promise is not to Men as Men but to the seed which is not many but one but Israel was this true Church then in the time of this Prophesie though it have relation to future ages also and if R. E. looks that this promise should be to Israel after the flesh the Church then visible and in being he mistakes himself and he egragiously errs and contradicts the Scripture in sundry places which saith your house is left unto you desolate their Sacrifices ceased the Glory of God departed from them their Prophets prophesied a divination of their own brain and their visions were as visions of the night and the Lord spake not to the most of them yet they said falsly thus saith the Lord in their revolted estate for they were erred from the spirit and gone from the seed and joyned to another seed and their holy flesh was departed from them though as men they had the same flesh still go learn what that means and yet notwithstanding all this the promise of God was not violated neither unfulfilled on Gods part for the promise was not then neither now is to Natural Generations or that which is born after the flesh or to men as men and Creatures but as they are the seed and as they are Men of God and as they are born again and new Creatures and if thou will have an intailing here it is intailed which cannot be cut off for the Covenant stands not to Men in such a place that carries the name of Office or Authority but as they are led by the Spirit the infallible Judge rule or guide as they walk by this and in this they cannot err and they erring from this they are subject to be deceived and to be mistaken in all things and every thing of which there is evident examples in the Scriptures of truth in divers ages of them that professed themselves members of the Church of God and so visible as R. E. speaks of yea and the greater part too that have erred and their paths hath been reckoned by the Lord as crooked and perverse and their Habitants full of cruelty and this is given for an instance the visible Church of the Jewes did err and go aside notwithstanding all the promise of God to them and as they looked that it still belonged to them because they were invisible profession though they had turned their backs upon the Lord and their hearts too and violated his Covenant yet still as I said the promise of God and the Covenant of God is not made of none effect nor broken on Gods part but stands with the seed for ever who are circumcised in heart and who worshipes God in spirit and truth and in uprightness of heart and hath no confidence in the flesh nor fleshly privileges nor external performances but only trusts unto the gift of Righteousness manifest in them by which Justification comes upon all that believes and the fulness of the blessing of the Gospel of Christ and the fulness of the promise of God but these things I know though they be holy faithful and true are a sealed Book and hid from all eyes living in the flesh who hath not been baptised into the death and suffering of Christ. Fourthly That Christ by his own mouth and the mouthes of the Apostles did promise that there should be a Church which the Gates of Hell should not prevail against and this Church was established upon the Everlasting Foundation and the Rock of Ages and was indued with power from an high and with a great measure of the spirit of God according unto Christ's promise which more plentifully was poured forth after Christs departure and after his Ascension and great gifts were given unto them the word of Knowledge the word of Wisdom the Interpretation of Tongues the gift of Tongues the gift of Prophesie the gift of discerning Spirits healing the sick working of Miracles c. and all these foresaid gifts were given for the work of the Ministry for the perfecting of the Saints for the edifying of the body of Christ till we all come into the unity of the faith and the knowledge of the Son of God and unto a perfect man and to the measure and stature of the fulness of Christ Ephes. 4. 11 12 13. And all these were instrumental through the Spirit of God which was with them and in them the only means to bear witness unto those things that they had learned and believed and to publish the word of faith abroad unto the World and for all these aforesaid ends above mentioned which though R. E. and his Catholicks will need lay claim to the succession by way of office yet by their Doctrine denies in part the very end wherefore such gifts were given to wit the Doctrine of Purgatory for if they did perfect the Saints or were brought up to the knowledge of the Son of God and to perfect men in Christ Jesus and to be without sin what need had there been of raising up this damnable Doctrine out of the pit to purge from sin after they be dead seeing they were to be perfect men while they were alive and the Ministry was given for this end but yours it seems cannot have these effects on this side of the Grave and therefore they must perfect them in the grave and so be Ministers in another World And this Church thus gathered and endued before mentioned with the infallible Spirit of God if any that did sometime believe and were joyned unto it did walk disorderly as not becoming the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ they were to be admonished and exhorted and if they persisted in their disorder it was to be told to the Church or the whole body and if such a one would not hear the Church he was to be reckoned as a Publican or a Heathen and to be denyed as to have any fellowship with him till manifest repentance was shewn but we never read that this Church did shed any mans blood or burn any or give consent to destroy any instance if thou can though obstinate and Hereticks too and in this amongst many other things the spirit of your Church is seen to be contrary to the Primitive Church and you out of Christs Doctrine but R. E. argues further and saith but if Christ by his Spirit doth not preserve this Church from all possibility of teaching error instead of truth I may receive such errors as may damn me unto which I say Christ by his spirit doth preserve this Church from all possibility of teaching error if they continue in the guidance thereof and err not
from the Spirit of Christ as some Churches did which were as truly Christian and might lay claim unto Christs promise of preservation out of error as ever Rome could do and yet fix of the Seven Churches of Asia were reproved by the Spirit of Christ some of them for holding gross error and some for suffering it but where was the fault did not Christ perform his promise to his Church or to these and other particular Churches as Corinth and Galatia yes but there was an erring from the spirit but all that R. E. goes about is to prove which he will never be able to do that Christ is bound by promise to make it good to them that he hath once promised unto though they perform nothing of their part in taking heed to his direction and thus would limit the Lord and let men go free without obedience to his commands and he cites Mat. 28. 2â— how the promise of Christ was and lo I am always with you even to the end of the World but he hath done as the Devil did when he brought it is written to Christ left out half the words so R. E. hath left out the Conditions on the Disciples part and that which was their duty teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I command you then loe I am with you c. But R. E. likes not obedience it seems unto Christs commands and yet he will needs be a sharer in the promise and of the Power that was given and bind God unto that and he and his Church to be loose to do and to teach what they will but as to all the Scriptures he hath brought and minced them and cut them in peece meale and all the Inferences he makes this we acknowledge without multiplicity of words that whatsoever was promised to the Church of Christ and the Disciples of Christ As the Church of Christ and Disciples of Christ the same promise of Christ doth belong to the Church of Christ and Disciples of Christ in every age and stands upon the same condition viz. obedience unto his will and that they still do teach and no other thing but what he commands them then he is with them according to his promise but let not R. E. nor his Roman Catholicks look if they teach things repugnant to his mind and contrary to his will and press upon others to believe that which Christ hath never taught that then the promise of God will be so intailed to them as that they cannot err and here the deceit of thine and your hearts hath led you aside and this is one of the cuning sleights of men and craftiness whereby you lay in wait to deceive and by this you have deceived many because God hath made such large promises unto his Church how that they should be led into all truth and preserved out of error and you are their successors and must needs inherit this promise by way of intail and you cannot err you cannot be deceived because the Apostles was infallible therefore you must needs be infallible though you err and go aside never so much from the infallible spirit the true guide and judge of and in the Church of God as though you had been born to infallibility and the spirit of truth had comed by succession but the inward Light which thou scoffes at and the spirit of truth which thou calls a private spirit often hath discovered you and your spirit though thou boast of fifteen ages that your Doctrine hath been held by the Pastours and Teachers in your visible Church as in the 57. page of thy Epistle suppose I should grant the fifteen hundred years which I neither can nor will but I will lead thee to the sixteen hundred years and try thee and your Doctrine that you have held this fifteen hundred year if it be so as thou saith but this thou likes not but seeing thou pleads antiquity let us come on and joyne issue prove us Transubstantiation in the first hundred year nay I will give thee five hundred more and if I gave thee five more thou would hardly prove it before the Council of Trent prove us the Doctrine of Purgatory in the first hundred year and if thou take two it shall not offend me prove us the forbiding of Ministers to marry in the first hundred year and abstenance from Meats as though they were unclean which are created by God for the use of Believers prove us that Man hath a twofold right to the Kingdom of Heaven as your great Bellarmine saith the one by Christ the other by a Man 's own works prove us Invocation of Angels and prayer and Sacrifice for the Dead the first hundred year after Christ prove us their selling of Pardons in Christs and the Apostles days for Money prove us seting up of Images as to put Men in mind of the Saints deceased and of their Works prove us Baptism of Infants with Cream and Spittle and signing with the Cross and Godfathers and Godmothers and let us have some example beyond bare report for we dare not relie upon your infallible spirit in these things therefore convince us for we are gain-sayers and upon good ground and we do look upon all these Doctrines and many more not to be of such a great age as thou tells on neither to have any affinity or congruaty with the Church of Christ in his or the Apostles time nor sundry years after but rather look upon them as Doctrines of Devils and a very novelty a further Scripture R. E. urges 1 Tim. 3. 15. the Church of the living God the pillar and ground of truth and may we not relie of that pillar that God hath erected for us saith he and he that hears you hears me and go teach all Nations and lo I am with you always and yet if after all these promises if the Church may not be believed except she teacheth according to the Scriptures and be only infallible but when she doth her duty then the Church hath no more privilege then the Devil hath for so long as he teaches conformable to the Scripture he may be believed and so long as he teaches truth he may be believed saith R. E. in page the 58 59. Answ. The Church is in God 1 Thes. 1. and is the pillar and ground of truth she is in the world though not of the world and though the members thereof be visible in the world yet the world that lies in wickedness never owned them as such neither saw the glory of this Church but always persecuted it and was so far from owning it as rule and judge as it altogether gainsayed its direction but they that did believe in the word of life and were separated from the world and hated by it were willing to hear the Councel and to receive the instruction of the Church of God and the Church only medled with their own Members as in matter of Judgment and not of the
Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles was nay blush for shame they brought in the Prophets for the peoples sake to prove that they had testified of the same before and had declared the coming of the just one besides they commended themselves to the witness of God in every mans conscience and upon waiting upon the Lord and in the measure of his spirit they found the things even so and by searching the Scripture as the Bareans did and found the things even so as had been declared of but upon due consideration we find not these foresaid Doctrines so propounded as to have the Testimony of the Prophets and Apostles neither doth your Doctrine and worship answer the Witness of God in every Man's Conscience and so to deny you is not to make God a lyer but God true the Prophets and Apostles and the witness of God true and you lyers who contradicts them and their Testimony and the power of God and would assume it to your selves though you be erred from the spirit and would put all under the name of infallibility and by such heavenly arguments as R. E. calls them to wit the Miracles aforesaid by which you have deceived the Nations and blinded the eyes of the people but the time is come and Light and Life is broken forth that the skirts of the Whore must be discovered and her nakedness must appear and her fornications and adulteries shall be manifest unto all so that you shall not proceed much further And I hope by this time in E's words it will appear evident to all whose eyes God in any measure hath opened that this Catholick Church so called is manifest in what hath been said to R. E. not to be the Church of Christ neither their Doctrines and practice devinely propounded neither she taken from henceforth as the only infallible judge rule and directer in all matters of faith which all are to receive upon pain of damnation as R. E. saith though she sit as a Queen and hath known no sorrow but on the contrary she to be a blind guide that hath bewitched the Kings of the Earth and the Nations which are waters which is the universality R.E. boasts of with her inchantments and sorceries which from henceforth shall not be taken as infallible but fallible and as that Church that hath not conveyed the true faith which was once delivered to the Saints but rather hath spread abroad error and false Doctrine and the traditions and inventions of Men instead of the Doctrine of Christ and would put off all this under the name of Authority and power from God and sufficiently propounded and infallibility and under the penalty of the highest curse upon not receiving it but the Sun is risen which hath discovered all your deceit lay down your carnal weapons Cain's weapons and your humane power by which you have prevailed more by force and cruelty upon the Nations then by found Doctrine or that plea of being Peters successors I say come forth with your spiritual weapons which the Church of God had in the Primitive times and prevail as far as you can but oh you want these and therefore you are necessitated to take up force and violence the Dragons power to compell all to come to your Church Further R. E. in his Postscript hath been confident of what he hath declared that it is of such force what he hath said for the Roman Catholick Church so called that he believes what he hath said cannot be answered and he saith his confidence doth not misbecome him and that it is improbable to be answered and that he hath not yet done his All neither in his first nor second Edition but hath somewhat more yet of great moment to speak as to prove the Church of Rome this only and infallible guide Unto whom I say it had been good not to have boasted when he put on his armor but when he puts it off and methinks having been so unstable and unsetled as he hath been formerly he should not have been so confident in opposition to Wisdom as to give such a challenge and make such a vapour of as that it is improbable to be answered and it is more then any of you or all of you can answer as his own words are page the 89. these words are not becoming a man indeed who saith he hath learned meekness and humility of heart and hath such great bowels of Charity as he professeth he hath page the 86. The substance of what he hath said or written which he reckons so profound and unanswerable and to be more then any or all the Nonconformists can answer they have been answered over and over again before R. E. was born by many Learned sufficient and good Men whose Reasons and weighty Arguments about the Premisses have not been made void unto this day but hath prevailed with many not only to the convincing but also to the turning of many from that usurped Authority of the Roman Church and hath discovered the errors false Doctrine and evil practices notwithstanding their pretended infallibility which R. E. will not be able to answer if particulars should be descended unto and though R. E. may reckon the reasons that he hath laid down which he hath the most what taken at the gainest and reckon them as impregnable yet I hope they will not appear so to an understanding eye which is enlightened by the spirit of the Lord nor to them who are of a sound Judgment what others have done to answer his bold Challenge I know not because I am shut up in a corner for the Testimony of Jesus and for the word of God but methinks them that are concerned should not let such boasts go unreproved neither such false Doctrine nor false suggestions as R. E. hath made to villifie and debase and set at nought all things and every thing that seems contrary unto the judgment of this pretended Catholick Church and seeing that he shuts out all Nonconformists as to be Members of the Church of God and to be without all Rule all Order all Government and to come under the great penalty of damnation by not submitting unto whatsoever this pretended Catholick Church doth impose how repugnant soever it be unto the Doctrine of Christ and how contrary soever it be unto the Spirit of God yet all must be received without question though it be that which the Spirit of God sometimes called the Doctrine of Devils but now it must become holy and of divine authority and sufficiently propounded and so received because as R. E. saith this Church cannot err I say unto him and unto all men and to the witness of God in every man either the Church in the Apostles days did err and teach false Doctrine or this pretended Catholick Church because they teach contrary one to the other and do walk by a contrary rule and as R. E. saith infallibility cannot contradict it self and he hath granted that the Apostles and Primitive Christians had an infallible spirit and did not err then let R. E. and all take a view of the Roman Doctrine and compare it with theirs and they shall find it as far wide one from the other as the Heavens is from Earth or light from darkness so that for the truths sake and for the Doctrine and faith sake that was once delivered among the Saints and for the Nonconformists sake who cannot bow their knee to Baal neither snbmit to the injunctions of changable men instead of the Doctrines of Christ. I could not do less then give Answer unto the substance of R. E. his Epistle which he boasted of to be more then any could answer and to reprove his false Doctrine and error which he would perswade all unto and not to question because the Church of Rome hath propounded it as infallible most of all those Doctrines are denyed and I cannot but give my Testimony against them as to be false and that which leads people into error and let R. E. when he brings forth his all prove to us that Infallibility as intailed to the Pope by succession and Prayer for the Dead worshipping of Angels worshipping Relicts worshipping Images Transubstantiation Purgatory sprinkling of Infants prove to us from the Scripture in thy next that these were Apostolical and Infallible Doctrines delivered and taught by the Church of Christ in the Apostles time or in the first hundred years after Christ and thou will not only gain me but many more to receive and imbrace the Catholick Church of Rome for an absolute rule and guide unto which all on earth ought to be subject unto which if thou do not we will take it for granted thou dare not least thou ingage thy self in such a Controversie as thou never ingaged in yet by which thy and your folly will more and more appear unto all I shall not trouble neither my self nor the Reader any further in traducing R. E. in his multiplicity of words although the main and weighty Arguments and reasons as R. E. looks upon them is answered which I commend unto thee and to the witness of God in every Man's Conscience to try and search out where the difference and weight lies and the truth and as the measure of Gods Spirit in every Man's Conscience doth close with or against if it can what I have said about R. E. his Epistle for unto that I dare stand to the judgment of and in it as every one believes and walks I bid my Reader Farewell F. H. Westmerland this 18. of the Fifth Moneth 1665. THE END Faults that have escaped the Press through the negligence of the Printer the Friendly Reader is desired to pass by or correct Some of which are these PAge first line 28 29. for Nonformists read Nonconformists p. 2. l. 3. for and read as l. 7. the point or stop should be after over p 3. l. 16. the point should be after the word Director and not after unto l. 37. for fanedness read fainedness p. 6. l. 34. for Christian read Christians p. 19. l. 24 for minds read mind p. 31 l. 35. for legable read legible p. 44. l. 35. for habitants read habitations p. 57. l. 28. for 9th read nine