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truth_n father_n true_a worship_v 5,831 5 9.4836 5 true
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A89832 Deceit brought to day-light: in an ansvver to Thomas Collier, vvhat he hath declared in a book called, A dialogue between a minister, and a Christian: but by his fruits hee is tryed and found to be neither. In which answer his lies are returned for the founder to prove; his errors laid open, read, and reproved, and he found to be the same in deeds which he accuses the Quakers to be in words. / Published in short for the souls sake, that the simplicity may bee preserved from the subtilty, lest any should believe lies, and so be given up to delusion, and bee damned, by a lover of truth, called, James Naylor. Naylor, James, 1617?-1660. 1656 (1656) Wing N269; Thomason E885_5; ESTC R202981 17,493 32

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no man cometh to the father but by me and John who saith This is the true light Joh. 1. 9. So now let all judge who have the light in them whether I am in the error who believeth what the Letter saith that Christ alone is the true light the way the truth and the life and that this is the true light that lighteth every one that cometh into the world and so owns Christ of whom the letter testifies or thou who saith The letter is the absolute rule and this light of Christ cannot convert to God without the Letter and so limits God and denies him who was the way before the Apostles was or wrote the letter and would make people believe that the writing of the Letter had taken the office of Christ and were now become absolute in ruling inlightning and converting to God and so you are become Ministers of the Letter and denies the Spirit to be able to convert to God without the Letter and so a contrary Spirit hath possessed you then was in the Apostles who was Ministers of the Spirit and not of the Letter and so contrary fruits are brought forth and this your opposition of the light is but that you may appear to be the blinde guides Christ foretold of and by your fruits you must be known Did ever Minister of Christ preach against the least light of Christ and say it was not sufficient to lead to God or that none should never be converted but by the letter Did ever Minister of Christ preach against Perfection as thou doest and thy brethren who sayes thou doest not believe that Perfection is attainable here thou may as well say Christ is not attainable here nor Faith doest not thou here minister against the end of Christs ministery and that for which he sent them forth which was for the perfecting of the saints and that they might present every man perfect in Christ Jesus Eph. 4. 11 12 13. Coll. 1. 28. and this thou ministers against and sayest thou canst not believe it and adds a lye to thy unbelief saying its an estate no where held forth in the Scripture as attainable here and so would make God a lyar and the Scripture also As for instance God said Iobe was a perfect man Iob 1. 8. 2. 3. Gen. 6. 9. Iob 8. 20. Psal 37. 37. 2 Cor. 12. 9. Phil. 3. 15. 2 Tim. 3. 17. Iam. 3. 2. with other Scriptures too many here to mention which all witness thee to belye God and the Scriptures and to be no Minister for Christ nor believer of his Ministry who art against perfection and cannot believe it this is a fruit of Antichrist none of Chrsts Ministers but they believed it and preached which thou preaches against And so by thy fruits thou art known and thy generation as Christ hath said you should But to cover thy self thou sayest it s the duty of every one to press after perfection so they must press after that which thou believes not nor would have them to believ so they must pres after that which they believe must never attain here What sort is this pressing of which is against faith yet this confusion is thy Doctrine for the Devil knows that if he can but keep them from believing they can never attain whatever their pressing be And this is the devils work to destroy the faith then set people on working yet to confound thyself thou saith in pag. 114. Let every one that hath this hope in him purifie himself as Christ is pure Yet thou goes on to thou and thee and for this would accuse as Pharisees because we use it to a single person and in this thou confounds thy self as in the rest First Thou confessest it to be the most proper and that the Scripture useth it therefore and when thou hast done thou sayest those that speak it in this Nation seem to be barbarous so that by thy confession he that speaks proper to you is a Barbarian yet must we be condemned who speak properly and you justified who have lost your proper understanding through your pride and heathenish customs and with such confused stuff as this thou proves us the most dangerous people in the world but sayest thou Thou is to me as You provided it be not made a matter of Religion hut if it be then thou abhors the ignorance from whence it comes Herein shewing thy self to be like thy father who matters not what men do so that they do it not out of conscience but if out of conscience then he ahhors that ignorance from whence it comes for a tender conscience that takes heed to his tongue the devil abhors for the devil can set the tongue on fire when all members else are wearied with his service provided he make it not matter of Religion what he speaks but if he be so precise that he make conscience of every idle word the devil abhors him for he knows that he that offends not in word is a perfect man so able also to bridle the whole body Iam. 3. 2. For the devil knows that by your words you shall be justified and by them you shall be condemned and for every idle word all must answer at the Day of Judgement And this we know though you have justified your selves and are yet in your careless way without bridle be ignorant of whose Religion will be found vain like your vain talk And further We know your way of ye-ing the proud and thou-ing the poor to be impurity though thou falsly say the scripture uses that language thou to every single person for its property and not for its puriry But what matter what thou sayes who abhors it as ignorance that teacheth to speak properly as matter of Religion but had thy Religion reached to the ordering of thy tongue we had not had such a number of shameless lyes cast upon us by thee as we have in this Book which indeed is little else but a heap of lyes But this know that he that seemes to be religious and bridleth not his tongue his religion seems to be vain Iam. 1. 26. Thou proceeds to tell of our quaking and in that like the rest thou shews thy confusion In thy 38. p thou sayes but falsly It 's a way that never came into the heart of God to bring his people to perfection by when all that do declare the way they came to God witness quaking or trembling and all that knew the Word of God trembled at it And in thy 78. pag. thou owns it in the holy men of God making thy self a lyar but sayes it is different from ours To which I say hast thou seen us both tremble or how canst thou make a difference let the wise judge but that thy busie minde must be medling to speak of that thou knows nought on that thou might shew thy envy consusion how should thou know trembling who knows no word but the letter abhors that which
of Saints And this letter of the Scripture or Apostles writing I deny to be the man Christ Iesus and that it is not the Spirit thy self confesses in pag. 22. in these words where thou sayest to say that the Scripture is Spirit that discovers much ignorance and indeed such look upon it with an idolatrous eye and sayeth further that the Spirit of God is alwayes distinguished from the Scripture My own I prove thus The Man Christ Jesus ascended but the Letter of the Apostles did not ascend nor could before it was written for then it was no letter Again if the writings of the Apostles be the man Christ Iesus then we have part of him visible here on earth and part is lost which few will say Again the visible part of the Apostles writings is paper and ink but so is not the visible part of the man Christ Jesus more might be said which plainly proves that the Apostles writing is not the man Christ Jesus and thou hast confessed they are not the Spirit and yet thou affirms them to bee the absolute rule of Saints and way of conversion so as God may not convert any but by them which he hath said of nothing but Christ himself so that if thou have not set up an absolute rule that is not Christs's and bound God to work by and all people to believe in a way of conversion and salvation that is not Christ neither in flesh nor spirit as is cleerly proved let the truth in all consciences judge and see if the liar bee not fallen into the pit he hath digged for the innocent Further let the wise judge if thou have not hereby concluded all damned who have lived and dyed since the Apostles time and have not heard the Letter written by the Apostles for if all that have been are or shall be converted since the Apostles time must be by their writings then who hath not their writings cannot be converted nor brought to God Thus hath thou limited God to a Bible to convert by and condemned all that have not one or heard one and with such blinde stuff thou goes on to discover our errors but cannot see thy own blindness Further thou hast set up a new way of converting souls then by which Abraham and Enoch and the holy men of God was converted and hath bound God to it for they was not converted by the writings of the Apostles before they was or they that writ them and so art laying another foundation then was preached to Abraham and was the soundation of the Prophets and Apostles who was converted before the letter of the Apostles was and so art he thou tells on who art preaching another Gospel and accursed And now that I have proved thee one who art setting up another way to salvation that is not Christ setting up one to rule that is not Christ and so art Antichrist I shall charge thee therewith till thou repent and shall add this thy false doctrine to the rest of thy lies by which I deny thy spirit to be of God thy book thy lies thy confusion thy feigned words and thy antichristian doctrine and all thou sayest I do declare to proceed from the Spirit of the false Prophet the lyar and slanderer and one that goes about to set up a way and rule absolute which is not Christ and so another Gospel and foundation and no modesty can blame me for charging thy false doctrine upon thy head being first thus plainly proved and haddest thou thus proved before thou had slandered thou had shewed more of Gods wisdome and less of thy own wickedness but the lyar hath been thy tongue for lies like a bow with which thy bowels must be filled yet canst thou not enter the truth but thy arrows are driven back on thy own head And as that spirit of lies hath its enmity against Christ and would set up another so it doth oppose his light which is the light of the world and thou heaps up a deal of confusion to disprove the witness that Iohn bare of Christ Iohn 1. 9. who saith This is the true light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world and this light Iohn came to bear witness unto that all men through him might believe vers 7. and this he saith was in the beginning and Christ saith Iohns witness was true Ioh. 5. 33. but saith the lyar that is but the common natural light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world and is not able to lead to God and thus they who likes thy testimony better then Iohn's or Christ's they may believe thee and deny Christ and his Ministers blinde guides how are you like to tell what the light will do or not do who have been opposers of it ever since it was preached but hath not followed it to the end are you like to know whether it leads did you ever follow it at all if so what evil hath it led you to you confess it reproves and manifests sinne and doth not the apostle preach this for the light of Christ Eph. 5. 13 14. but you have an imagination that Christ is the light onely to inlighten you that call your selves believers but who must inlighten the rest Christ saith I am the light of the world he doth not say I am the light of such a form or such a people who are of a self-separation but I am the light of the world he that followes me shall have the light of life but you who never followed it saith there is not life in following it so your blinde testimony who were enemies to the light of the world stand against the testimony of Christ and the children of light John 8. 12. But saist thou if this be true that Christ lighteth every one that cometh into the world which light being taken heed unto will lead to God then Christ died in vain and in vain hath he said I am the way the truth and the life which is as much as if thou had said if Christ be the light of the world which lighteth every one which cometh into the world and leads to God in vain did hee come into the world to testifie the same in preaching and suffering without which it could not have been manisest and believed But your blindness hath been so cleerly laid open and the light proved even that which is the light of the world to be the way to the Father the truth and the life as I need not say much to thy blinde opposition onely take these two Scriptures and shame with thy blindness who would perswade people that the light of the world is not the way the truth and the life or that there is any other way but the light of the world Joh. 8. 12. Joh. 14. 6. if these be one then art thou blinde and if not one then how should thou speak truth who said I am the light of the World the way the truth and the life
watchings in fastings in wandrings hunger and nakedness having no certain dwelling place in tumults often in necessities in stripes in whipping mocking stoning and imprisonment c. Let us see if it be your manner to dispute in the Idols-Temple against their Idols-worship that deceives souls and preach in the streets and markets daily c. and all this freely without hire These are the Apostles wayes and this is the Apostles word let us see if you be converted according to it and that your God is the same theirs was and will carry you forth in the same way and work and that you dare trust him therein And as we see you in the Apostles works so we shall be engaged to believe that you are converted by their Word which was before the letter was and the light thereof in all consciences will confess to you and that this is the living God whose wayes is righteous that you preach for all to worship and then we shall own you and the Apostles words will own you and your practice but where you are now we cannot nor can we worship with you that for God that which cannot save you from that wicked lying spirit that acts you nor lead you into the same work that it hath done all his Ministers in all ages for we know that God whose Word is Righteousness and his wayes Truth and what Ordinances he sets up that will we worship in for those Ordinances are spiritual and have life in them wherein God dwells and in them by him we shall be kept And the clear water we know wherein our bodies are washed and the blood of cleansing and the bread of life which was broken for us and is given to us by which we live and own the Apostles practices to follow Christ in our measures for which we are counted the off-scouring of all things unto this day and till then think not that we shall worship your tradition which brings forth a lye that cannot save the Founder for that wherein God dwells not is but a likeness empty and so your practice proves your way whereof it is Surely in vain do you setup Idols the Lord is risen your carved Images are lighter then vanity All the idols of the heathen are void of Righteousness truth is wanting in their inward parts they have deckt them with colours they have covered them with words they cry Come bow and worship but doth not consider that a lye is in there right hand there is none that considereth once to say in himself What is this that I am doing What profit is there in that to which I fall down is this the living God for whom I am thus contending that is not able to plead for himself and defend himself with righteousness with judgement and equity to plead against his enemies in their own hearts that cannot strike thorow the loynes of his adversaries cover me with innocency and peace while he covers his Enemies with confusion Is this he whose Word endureth for ever from generation to generation who hath left me to seek counsel in the Letter and without his Spirit and to consult with men how to keep up his Ordinances and to go to carnal weapons to avenge him on them who cast down his Altars who cut down his Groves and declares against the way of his worships Oh foolish people is this he that pleads the cause of his people who cannot plead for himself in Judgement nor for you in Righteousness Let him put spiritual weapons into your hands let him fill your hearts with Righteousness and your wayes with equity let him cover you with innocencie and preserve you in patience till he have made your light to shine in darkness that therewith he may confound his Enemies let him cause truth to spring in the earth and faith to bud and blossom that righteousness may cover you from the storm and the effect thereof may be peace then shall all your Enemies be ashamed and confounded before you for his power shall pass before you to make the earth to tremble at his presence whom the carnal sees not let it be proclaimed before him The Lord our righteousness gracious and full of mercy whose eye goes thorow the world and who will by no means clear the guilty And if this be the Name of your God let it be written upon you let the Zeal thereof be as a mark in your fore-heads and his sighteousness upon you as a Brest-plate that all may say this is the Lord bow before him there is no other who maketh his people lights in whom he holds forth salvation and healing to the Nations Surely this is the Lord and this is work and to him shall the world bow and his Saints confess his Name for ever Verily in the Lord our God is salvation strength Righteousness is thy right Name Judgement goes before thy face to confound thine Enemies thy light is as a fire to consume the wicked and by the same is thy Word declared therewith thou sends the rich away empty but the poor thou satisfies with goodness everlasting thou hides thy way from the subtil that thou mayest set the Prisoner out of the Pit that he may possess the gates of his Enemies and go in and out and feed in safety thou makes him strong that was feeble but strikes through the loins of the wicked thou dries up the depths of the sea that thy ransomed ones may pass over Our enemies sees and are troubled rage hath seised upon them in travells they are with mischief they are pained to bring forth and their birth is a lye Their son cannot save them they have brought forth darkness and folly Counsel and peace is not in him therefore they stagger in Judgement but thou Lord God gives us light as in the beginning the ancient of dayes is our stability things of many generations hast thou set before us the foundation that is unmoveable is discovered therein thou hast set us as upon a Rock so that the Floods of the ungodly cannot move us thou hast lifted up an Ensigne and the Heathen are angry the pride of the Nations hath gathered against thee thou hast set up judgment against them in the streets of wickedness and hath sent out the Lamb amongst the Beast of the field upon his head thou hast placed a defence thou hast covered him with righteousness as with a garment thou hast covered thy Enemies with thick darkness and their Armies with a cloud they grope at noon-day thou hast smitten the horse with blindness and his rider with madness they have risen up against thee they are confounded they are driven back their arm hath failed and thou savest thy people with a mighty salvation the meek sees it and rejoice it glads the soul of the innocent to see thee Praise our God in the beauty of holiness all that are come to the peaceable habitation Sing unto the Lord a new Song you people of good understanding who knows the root of righteousness where it springs and are fed with the dew of heaven whose hearts the Lord hath opened for himself that he may fill you with goodness that you may bring forth as a watered garden that the Lord may take delight in his own and dwell in you for ever The End