Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	faith_n	scripture_n	spirit_n	4,731	5	5.2562	4	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A45823	A contention for truth: or, an impartial account, of two several disputations The one being on Munday, the 12th. of Feb. And the other on Munday, the 26. of the same month, in the year 1671. Between Mr. Danson of the one party, and Mr. Ives on the other, upon this question (viz) whether the doctrine of some true believers, falling away totally and finally from grace, be true or no? Published to prevent mistakes, and false reports, concerning the said conferences. By a lover of truth and peace.	Ives, Jeremiah, fl. 1653-1674.	1672 (1672)	Wing I1095A; ESTC R222598	83,987	220

a_o contention_n for_o truth_n or_o a_o impartial_a account_n of_o two_o several_a disputation_n the_o one_o be_v on_o monday_n the_o 12_o of_o feb._n and_o the_o other_o on_o monday_n the_o 26_o of_o the_o same_o month_n in_o the_o year_n 1671._o between_o mr._n danson_n of_o the_o one_o party_n and_o mr._n ives_n on_o the_o other_o upon_o this_o question_n viz._n whether_o the_o doctrine_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n be_v true_a or_o no_o publish_a to_o prevent_v mistake_v and_o false_a report_n concern_v the_o say_a conference_n by_o a_o lover_n of_o truth_n and_o peace_n try_v the_o spirit_n whether_o they_o be_v of_o god_n or_o no_o 1_o john_n 4.1_o for_o the_o spirit_n speak_v express_o that_o in_o the_o latter_a time_n some_o shall_v depart_v from_o the_o faith_n 1_o tim._n 4.1_o print_v in_o the_o year_n 1672._o reader_n lest_o thou_o shall_v suspect_v the_o candour_n and_o ingenuity_n of_o the_o publisher_n let_v i_o advertise_v thou_o of_o three_o thing_n first_o that_o whatever_o be_v say_v on_o both_o side_n by_o way_n of_o opponency_n or_o respondency_n be_v here_o publish_v without_o partiality_n second_o that_o if_o mr._n ives_n have_v add_v any_o thing_n for_o the_o further_a confirmation_n of_o his_o own_o judgement_n or_o the_o refute_v mr._n dansons_n over_o and_o above_o what_o past_a in_o the_o disputation_n wherever_o there_o be_v any_o such_o addition_n let_v the_o differ_a character_n in_o which_o they_o be_v print_v serve_v for_o thy_o information_n that_o whatever_o be_v so_o print_v do_v not_o pass_v in_o the_o disputation_n three_o take_v notice_n that_o mr._n ives_n send_v a_o letter_n to_o mr._n danson_n to_o desire_v he_o to_o appoint_v some_o time_n and_o place_n within_o a_o week_n after_o that_o they_o may_v meet_v together_o to_o view_v the_o copy_n and_o if_o need_n be_v to_o correct_v it_o that_o it_o may_v be_v publish_v by_o mutual_a consent_n but_o mr._n danson_n instead_o of_o write_v a_o answer_n send_v word_n by_o the_o bearer_n that_o m._n ives_n may_v do_v what_o he_o please_v and_o that_o he_o will_v not_o trouble_v himself_o about_o it_o a_o copy_n of_o which_o letter_n be_v print_v and_o hereunto_o annex_v for_o thy_o satisfaction_n let_v i_o close_o all_o with_o this_o passionate_a wish_n that_o while_o we_o contend_v for_o the_o primitive_a faith_n god_n grant_v we_o may_v maintain_v the_o primitive_a love_n and_o not_o think_v our_o zeal_n for_o truth_n lukewarm_a as_o one_o well_o observe_v unless_o it_o consume_v our_o charity_n to_o ash_n remember_v that_o in_o gain_v the_o knowledge_n of_o truth_n if_o we_o lose_v charity_n such_o knowledge_n will_v neither_o make_v we_o good_a nor_o happy_a vale_n mr._n ives_n his_o letter_n to_o mr._n danson_n mr._n danson_n the_o report_n of_o our_o late_a conference_n be_v very_o false_a and_o uncertain_a which_o doubtless_o must_v high_o tend_v to_o the_o disparagement_n of_o the_o truth_n contend_v for_o on_o which_o side_n the_o way_n soever_o it_o may_v lie_v i_o have_v therefore_o prevail_v with_o a_o person_n who_o take_v a_o exact_a account_n of_o both_o day_n conference_n in_o character_n to_o transcribe_v a_o fair_a copy_n in_o order_n to_o the_o print_n thereof_o to_o prevent_v further_a mistake_n and_o lest_o you_o or_o any_o else_o shall_v suspect_v the_o faithfulness_n and_o impartiality_n of_o the_o scribe_n i_o think_v good_a to_o give_v you_o this_o advertisement_n viz._n that_o if_o you_o will_v appoint_v a_o time_n and_o place_n sometime_o in_o the_o next_o week_n and_o send_v i_o word_n on_o monday_n next_o that_o we_o may_v meet_v to_o examine_v and_o if_o need_v be_v to_o correct_v the_o copy_n so_o that_o it_o may_v be_v publish_v by_o consent_n and_o without_o partiality_n i_o shall_v willing_o wait_v upon_o you_o otherwise_o if_o i_o hear_v not_o from_o you_o i_o shall_v correct_v the_o copy_n as_o impartial_o as_o i_o can_v without_o you_o and_o dispatch_v it_o for_o the_o press_n with_o all_o convenient_a speed_n and_o however_o you_o may_v think_v of_o i_o i_o have_v charity_n enough_o to_o subscribe_v myself_o sir_n walbrook_n march_v 2_o 1671._o your_o love_a friend_n jer._n ives_n reader_n whereas_o there_o be_v divers_a and_o frequent_a repetition_n occasion_v by_o the_o prosecution_n of_o the_o argument_n and_o answer_n of_o each_o side_n which_o may_v well_o have_v be_v omit_v if_o mr._n danson_n will_v have_v meet_v to_o have_v correct_v the_o copy_n but_o by_o reason_n he_o will_v not_o meet_v it_o be_v think_v necessary_a to_o publish_v all_o lest_o the_o omit_v any_o thing_n shall_v have_v be_v judge_v a_o piece_n of_o partiality_n vale_n a_o contention_n for_o truth_n the_o people_n be_v assemble_v after_o a_o account_n give_v of_o the_o occasion_n of_o the_o meeting_n this_o question_n be_v propound_v by_o mr._n ives_n whether_o the_o doctrine_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o be_v true_a or_o no_o mr._n danson_n it_o be_v false_a mr._n ives_n i_o shall_v then_o prove_v it_o true_a as_o far_o as_o god_n shall_v enable_v i_o major_a if_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o imposibility_n of_o any_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n be_v false_a then_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o possibility_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o be_v true_a minor_n but_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o impossibility_n of_o any_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o final_o and_o total_o be_v false_a ergo_fw-la the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o possibility_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o be_v true_a mr._n danson_n i_o deny_v the_o minor_a that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o impossibility_n of_o any_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n be_v not_o true_a mr._n ives_n i_o prove_v the_o minor_a if_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o impossibility_n of_o any_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n be_v true_a than_o it_o ought_v to_o be_v believe_v but_o it_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v believe_v ergo_fw-la it_o be_v not_o true_a mr._n danson_n i_o deny_v the_o minor_a prove_v it_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v believe_v but_o we_o shall_v entangle_v ourselves_o i_o know_v not_o how_o by_o this_o way_n of_o dispute_v hypothetical_o mr._n ives_n you_o shall_v not_o teach_v i_o how_o to_o wield_v my_o sword_n mr._n danson_n hypothetical_n syllogism_n ought_v never_o to_o be_v allow_v except_o it_o can_v be_v put_v into_o a_o categorical_a mr._n ives_n hypothetical_n syllogism_n be_v always_o allow_v as_o well_o as_o categorical_a but_o that_o be_v not_o the_o question_n mr._n danson_n go_v on_o take_v your_o course_n mr._n ives_n sir_n i_o shall_v not_o tie_v you_o up_o when_o you_o come_v to_o be_v opponant_fw-la i_o shall_v use_v categorical_a syllogism_n by_o and_o by_o my_o minor_a proposition_n be_v this_o that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o 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impossible_a to_o be_v do_v then_o my_o major_n be_v true_a but_o the_o scripture_n no_o where_o command_v the_o not_o do_v nor_o caution_n we_o to_o fear_v the_o do_v of_o what_o be_v impossible_a to_o be_v do_v ergo_fw-la my_o major_n be_v true_a mr._n danson_n i_o deny_v the_o minor_a that_o the_o scripture_n no_o where_o command_v the_o not_o do_v nor_o caution_n we_o to_o fear_v the_o do_v of_o what_o be_v impossible_a to_o be_v do_v mr._n ives_n it_o be_v a_o universal_a negative_a pray_v therefore_o give_v a_o instance_n where_o it_o do_v mr._n danson_n the_o scripture_n do_v for_o the_o sin_n against_o the_o holy-ghost_n be_v a_o sin_n that_o be_v impossible_a to_o be_v do_v by_o some_o true_a believer_n mr._n ives_n we_o be_v pass_v that_o now_o for_o here_o be_v the_o argument_n if_o the_o

one_o can_v witness_v that_o be_v there_o present_a vale_fw-la a_fw-la appendix_n reader_n that_o many_o godly_a and_o righteous_a man_n in_o these_o late_a time_n have_v hold_v and_o believe_v that_o it_o be_v impossible_a for_o any_o true_a believer_n to_o cease_v to_o be_v such_o and_o fall_v away_o and_o perish_v i_o do_v not_o deny_v i_o be_o also_o sensible_a that_o their_o persuasion_n in_o this_o matter_n be_v ground_v as_o they_o think_v either_o upon_o god_n election_n the_o scripture_n promise_v and_o christ_n prayer_n or_o else_o upon_o the_o absurd_a consequence_n that_o follow_v upon_o the_o contrary_a opinion_n now_o as_o touch_v god_n election_n i_o shall_v free_o grant_v and_o it_o may_v easy_o be_v affent_v too_o that_o those_o who_o god_n have_v from_o the_o beginning_n choose_v to_o salvation_n through_o the_o sanctification_n of_o the_o spirit_n and_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o truth_n shall_v never_o final_o fall_v away_o and_o perish_v according_a to_o 2_o thes_n 2.13_o but_o though_o this_o be_v grant_v yet_o it_o do_v not_o follow_v from_o hence_o that_o no_o true_a believer_n or_o that_o none_o who_o sincere_o believe_v can_v final_o fall_v away_o and_o in_o this_o case_n let_v mr._n baxter_n who_o in_o this_o point_n descent_n from_o i_o speak_v for_o i_o i_o dare_v not_o say_v he_o say_v i_o be_o certain_a that_o all_o who_o do_v sincere_o believe_v and_o be_v justify_v be_v elect_v to_o salvation_n and_o shall_v never_o final_o fall_v away_o it_o be_v my_o opinion_n say_v he_o but_o i_o dare_v not_o put_v it_o in_o my_o creed_n etc._n etc._n i_o know_v say_v he_o how_o learned_a and_o godly_a man_n do_v differ_v from_o i_o and_o deny_v the_o certainty_n of_o perseverance_n i_o know_v how_o many_o sad_a and_o shake_a example_n these_o time_n have_v afford_v and_o therefore_o i_o be_o not_o certain_a properly_z strict_o certain_a of_o my_o perseverance_n and_o so_o not_o full_o strict_o certain_a of_o my_o salvation_n see_v mr._n baxter_n direction_n page_n 16._o and_o in_o the_o end_n of_o his_o appology_n i_o be_o not_o say_v he_o so_o certain_a of_o this_o doctrine_n of_o perseverance_n as_o i_o be_o that_o christ_n be_v the_o son_n of_o god_n and_o the_o redeemer_n of_o the_o world_n i_o never_o say_v he_o find_v the_o doctrine_n of_o certain_a perseverance_n in_o any_o creed_n of_o the_o church_n i_o hope_v none_o dare_v say_v that_o all_o the_o lutheran_n arminian_o and_o anabaptist_n who_o be_v otherwise_o mind_v be_v no_o christian_n much_o less_o in_o the_o first_o age_n of_o the_o christian_a church_n which_o think_v otherwise_o and_o again_o in_o his_o account_n of_o his_o thought_n touch_v perseverance_n page_n 5._o he_o say_v that_o it_o be_v the_o judgement_n of_o st._n augustin_n that_o though_o the_o elect_n shall_v never_o fall_v away_o final_o yet_o he_o also_o believe_v and_o be_v persuade_v that_o some_o that_o be_v effectual_o call_v regenerate_v and_o justify_v may_v fall_v away_o and_o perish_v and_o further_o in_o the_o same_o page_n he_o say_v that_o because_o some_o be_v so_o immodest_a as_o to_o question_v whether_o this_o be_v st._n augustin_n opinion_n i_o add_v further_o that_o i_o do_v ask_v the_o reverend_a bishop_n usher_n in_o the_o hear_n of_o dr._n kendal_n whether_o this_o be_v not_o plain_o the_o judgement_n of_o augustin_n and_o he_o answer_v undoubted_o it_o be_v and_o further_o say_v he_o bishop_n ʋsher_n be_v as_o likely_a to_o know_v as_o any_o man_n i_o be_o capable_a of_o consult_v with_o and_o if_o any_o be_v still_o in_o doubt_n the_o passage_n follow_v which_o be_v transcribe_v out_o of_o st._n augustine_n may_v end_v his_o doubt_n august_n de_fw-mi bono_fw-mi persevere_v capt._n 8._o &_o 9_o ex_fw-la duobus_fw-la autem_fw-la piis_fw-la cur_n huic_fw-la donetur_fw-la perseverantia_fw-la usque_fw-la in_o finem_fw-la illi_fw-la autem_fw-la non_fw-la donetur_fw-la instructabil●ora_fw-la sunt_fw-la judicia_fw-la dei_fw-la that_o of_o two_o both_o be_v 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understanding_n and_o dissent_v with_o modesty_n honour_v the_o contrary_n mind_v and_o be_v willing_a to_o receive_v any_o further_a evidence_n etc._n etc._n and_o page_n 17._o i_o dare_v not_o say_v that_o i_o have_v attain_v to_o a_o certainty_n in_o understand_v this_o point_n &c_n &c_n all_o the_o text_n of_o scripture_n that_o concern_v it_o better_a than_o st._n augustin_n and_o the_o common_a judgement_n of_o the_o church_n for_o so_o many_o age_n and_o therefore_o i_o dare_v not_o say_v that_o i_o have_v attain_v to_o a_o certainty_n that_o all_o the_o justify_v shall_v persevere_v and_o further_o in_o the_o same_o page_n that_o can_v be_v no_o very_o easy_a point_n which_o alice_n or_o almost_o all_o the_o church_n for_o so_o many_o age_n and_o which_o not_o only_o most_o of_o the_o christian_n of_o the_o world_n but_o also_o so_o many_o nation_n of_o protestant_n themselves_o do_v err_v in_o and_o which_o the_o choice_a man_n for_o learning_n and_o diligence_n and_o those_o that_o be_v the_o leader_n in_o defend_v the_o grace_n of_o god_n against_o pelagius_n as_o augustin_n and_o other_o and_o beside_o abundance_n of_o protestant_a divine_n can_v never_o attain_v the_o understanding_n of_o but_o resist_v the_o contrary_a opinion_n meaning_n that_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o any_o true_a believer_n to_o fall_v away_o find_o as_o error_n yea_o when_o they_o be_v and_o be_v as_o holy_a as_o we_o and_o so_o as_o like_a to_o have_v divine_a illumination_n all_o this_o be_v in_o the_o case_n it_o seem_v to_o be_v high_a self-conceited_a arrogancy_n for_o such_o a_o one_o as_o i_o to_o profess_v such_o a_o point_n to_o be_v so_o evident_a and_o easy_a and_o to_o imagine_v that_o all_z the_o most_o holy_a and_o judicious_a writer_n for_o so_o many_o age_n and_o so_o many_o at_o this_o day_n be_v so_o far_o below_o i_o in_o the_o understanding_n the_o scripture_n and_o that_o even_o in_o point_n which_o they_o have_v so_o much_o occasion_n to_o search_v into_o and_o so_o many_o and_o great_a advantage_n to_o understand_v i_o do_v not_o say_v he_o i_o dare_v not_o presume_v of_o this_o thus_o far_o and_o much_o far_o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n the_o learned_a though_o in_o this_o point_n the_o dissent_v mr._n baxter_n in_o his_o book_n of_o the_o sain●s_n perseverance_n so_o that_o not_o only_o from_o scripture_n but_o from_o the_o general_a consent_n of_o all_o antiquity_n the_o docrin_n of_o the_o possibility_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fall_v from_o grace_n final_o may_v consist_v with_o a_o election_n of_o grace_n and_o god_n choose_v man_n from_o the_o beginning_n through_o the_o sanctification_n of_o the_o spirit_n and_o belief_n of_o the_o truth_n from_o whence_o we_o may_v see_v that_o though_o there_o be_v a_o number_n that_o shall_v certain_o be_v save_v according_a to_o a_o election_n of_o grace_n yet_o there_o may_v also_o be_v many_o that_o may_v have_v true_a justify_v faith_n that_o may_v fall_v away_o and_o perish_v who_o never_o be_v in_o this_o number_n of_o elect._n so_o that_o this_o doctrine_n of_o the_o possibility_n of_o some_o true_a believer_n fahe_v away_o final_o no_o way_n interfer_n with_o the_o doctrine_n of_o election_n not_o do_v those_o scripture_n that_o speak_v concern_v election_n so_o much_o as_o call_v the_o truth_n of_o this_o doctrine_n in_o question_n the_o other_o ground_n of_o the_o impossibility_n of_o any_o true_a believer_n fall_v away_o final_o be_v a_o mistake_n of_o scripture_n promise_n here_o let_v i_o give_v notice_n of_o two_o kind_n of_o promise_n in_o the_o scripture_n about_o this_o matter_n first_o such_o as_o though_o they_o seem_v to_o be_v absolute_a yet_o they_o have_v condition_n employ_v in_o they_o second_o of_o such_o scripture_n as_o promise_v the_o performance_n of_o those_o condition_n the_o first_o fort_n be_v as_o follow_v mat._n 19_o 18._o you_o that_o

the_o sense_n be_v true_a that_o you_o first_o give_v in_o answer_n to_o this_o argument_n upon_o which_o we_o have_v be_v argue_v so_o long_o or_o it_o be_v not_o true_a if_o it_o be_v true_a why_o do_v you_o not_o keep_v to_o it_o if_o it_o be_v false_a why_o do_v you_o give_v it_o in_o for_o a_o interpretation_n for_o first_o you_o answer_v that_o paul_n labour_v to_o prevent_v the_o come_n to_o pass_v of_o that_o which_o he_o know_v be_v impossible_a to_o come_v to_o pass_v which_o be_v his_o final_a apostasy_n and_o now_o you_o substitute_v a_o contrary_a interpretation_n viz_o that_o paul_n labour_v to_o prevent_v the_o lose_n that_o esteem_n and_o reputation_n which_o he_o have_v among_o christian_n if_o this_o latter_a be_v the_o sense_n than_o he_o labour_v to_o prevent_v the_o come_n to_o pass_v of_o nothing_o but_o what_o be_v possible_a to_o come_v to_o pass_v which_o be_v contrary_a to_o the_o first_o interpretation_n therefore_o pray_v which_o be_v the_o true_a sense_n the_o latter_a or_o the_o former_a mr._n danson_n the_o latter_a mr._n ives_n why_o do_v you_o give_v we_o the_o former_a then_o i_o shall_v therefore_o desist_v and_o argue_v no_o further_o but_o here_o the_o reader_n may_v take_v notice_n that_o in_o mr._n dansons_n give_v this_o last_o answer_n viz_o that_o paul_n labour_v to_o prevent_v his_o do_v those_o thing_n that_o may_v make_v he_o lose_v the_o esteem_n and_o approbation_n he_o former_o have_v he_o justify_v my_o major_a proposition_n in_o word_n at_o length_n for_o who_o ever_o look_v back_o shall_v find_v it_o run_v thus_o pag_n 17._o that_o which_o paul_n use_v all_o diligence_n and_o labour_n to_o prevent_v be_v not_o impossible_a to_o come_v to_o pass_v mr._n danson_n once_o and_o again_o deny_v this_o major_a proposition_n and_o now_o he_o confess_v it_o in_o this_o latter_a interpretation_n for_o he_o say_v that_o which_o he_o labour_v to_o prevent_v the_o come_n to_o pass_v of_o be_v nothing_o but_o what_o be_v 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be_v debate_v be_v whether_o or_o no_o some_o true_a believer_n may_v fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n you_o state_v it_o so_o the_o last_o time_n do_v you_o not_o mr._n ives_n i_o sir_n mr._n danson_n now_o because_o the_o last_o time_n so_o far_o as_o i_o be_v able_a to_o apprehend_v there_o be_v only_o two_o argument_n that_o be_v urge_v by_o this_o gentleman_n that_o have_v any_o thing_n of_o wait_n i_o shall_v therefore_o in_o the_o first_o place_n urge_v something_o by_o way_n of_o retortion_n upon_o he_o from_o his_o own_o argument_n mr._n ives_n pray_v tell_v i_o whether_o you_o be_v now_o a_o responding_z to_o my_o argument_n or_o whether_o you_o be_v argue_v as_o a_o opponent_n mr._n danson_n i_o be_o now_o opponent_n mr._n ives_n you_o may_v urge_v they_o argument_n wise_a and_o then_o sir_n the_o question_n be_v this_o whether_o it_o be_v impossible_a for_o any_o true_a believer_n to_o fall_v away_o total_o and_o final_o from_o grace_n and_o you_o may_v remember_v that_o we_o may_v not_o put_v any_o deceivable_a term_n upon_o each_o other_o by_o impossible_a we_o understand_v the_o word_n in_o opposition_n to_o such_o as_o either_o have_v may_v might_n or_o can_v fall_v away_o and_o then_o with_o respect_n to_o true_a believer_n we_o understand_v such_o as_o have_v true_a faith_n in_o opposition_n to_o hypocrite_n or_o such_o as_o whatsoever_o truth_n they_o may_v believe_v do_v not_o believe_v the_o article_n of_o the_o christian_a religion_n or_o of_o the_o christian_a faith_n we_o also_o understand_v by_o fall_v away_o total_o whole_o to_o renounce_v the_o christian_a faith_n and_o by_o final_o so_o to_o depart_v from_o the_o faith_n as_o at_o last_o to_o perish_v eternal_o and_o by_o the_o grace_n of_o god_n we_o mean_v the_o love_n and_o favour_n of_o god_n that_o man_n may_v fall_v away_o from_o it_o and_o perish_v mr._n danson_n no_o sir_n i_o do_v not_o mean_v so_o mr._n ives_n what_o do_v we_o mean_v by_o fall_v away_o and_o be_v damn_v which_o be_v the_o sense_n of_o my_o argument_n the_o last_o day_n mr._n danson_n there_o be_v no_o such_o term_n in_o the_o question_n mr._n ives_n ay_o but_o how_o do_v we_o prosecute_v it_o the_o last_o time_n what_o be_v then_o the_o sense_n of_o the_o question_n let_v we_o not_o deceive_v one_o another_o mr._n danson_n we_o mean_v the_o grace_n of_o god_n in_o we_o and_o not_o the_o grace_n of_o god_n without_o we_o mr._n ives_n do_v you_o believe_v a_o man_n may_v fall_v away_o from_o the_o grace_n and_o favour_n of_o god_n without_o he_o and_o not_o from_o the_o grace_n of_o god_n within_o he_o well_o then_o let_v we_o never_o differ_v about_o word_n when_o we_o agree_v about_o sense_n you_o know_v i_o do_v by_o my_o argument_n the_o last_o time_n endeavour_v to_o prove_v that_o true_a believer_n may_v loose_v the_o favour_n of_o god_n or_o else_o what_o do_v i_o mean_v when_o i_o say_v paul_n may_v become_v a_o reprobate_n mr._n danson_n there_o be_v only_o to_o my_o remembrance_n but_o two_o argument_n use_v by_o you_o the_o last_o time_n that_o be_v of_o any_o seem_a force_n the_o one_o be_v in_o the_o 1_o cor._n 9_o ult_n about_o the_o apostle_n paul_n and_o this_o be_v the_o issue_n that_o you_o do_v urge_v it_o to_o that_o it_o be_v altogether_o needless_a and_o unnecessary_a that_o paul_n shall_v have_v any_o caution_n give_v he_o or_o that_o he_o shall_v make_v use_n of_o any_o caution_n to_o prevent_v that_o which_o be_v impossible_a as_o to_o the_o event_n and_o against_o that_o i_o shall_v direct_v my_o argument_n mr._n ives_n i_o will_v prevent_v you_o a_o little_a i_o be_o now_o stand_v in_o the_o place_n of_o a_o respondent_fw-la and_o you_o be_v oppenent_a and_o what_o ever_o you_o argue_v do_v it_o distinct_o and_o do_v not_o encumber_v your_o dispute_n with_o what_o i_o say_v as_o opponent_n but_o make_v what_o advantage_n you_o can_v in_o the_o prosecution_n of_o your_o argument_n of_o whatever_o i_o say_v then_o and_o if_o you_o will_v not_o do_v thus_o i_o will_v not_o answer_v you_o my_o reason_n i_o shall_v give_v you_o be_v this_o because_o it_o will_v bring_v we_o back_o again_o into_o the_o place_n where_o we_o be_v before_o of_o my_o be_v opponent_n and_o you_o respondent_fw-la and_o to_o what_o you_o say_v as_o to_o the_o apostle_n paul_n you_o may_v remember_v you_o answeredme_v that_o paul_n and_o so_o other_o may_v labour_v to_o prevent_v the_o come_n to_o pass_v of_o that_o which_o they_o know_v be_v impossible_a for_o to_o come_v to_o pass_v with_o respect_n to_o the_o decree_n of_o god_n though_o not_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o thing_n now_o we_o argue_v and_o discover_v that_o a_o great_a while_n so_o long_o that_o at_o last_o you_o give_v a_o answer_n that_o be_v direct_o contrary_a to_o your_o first_o answer_n that_o you_o stand_v so_o long_o upon_o mr._n danson_n i_o do_v not_o mr._n ives_n sir_n you_o tell_v i_o that_o paul_n may_v labour_v to_o prevent_v his_o be_v a_o reprobate_n or_o castaway_n that_o be_v as_o you_o at_o last_o interpret_v the_o word_n a_o man_n that_o may_v not_o be_v approve_v that_o be_v to_o say_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o christian_a charity_n than_o sir_n i_o tell_v you_o he_o labour_v to_o prevent_v nothing_o but_o what_o may_v come_v to_o pass_v and_o then_o i_o ask_v which_o of_o these_o sense_n be_v the_o true_a sense_n of_o the_o text_n and_o you_o answer_v the_o latter_a and_o then_o i_o tell_v you_o you_o have_v spend_v half_o a_o hour_n and_o more_o to_o no_o purpose_n about_o the_o former_a sense_n if_o the_o latter_a which_o be_v contrary_a to_o it_o be_v the_o true_a sense_n mr._n danson_n you_o tell_v part_n

condition_n there_o be_v also_o a_o true_a sense_n in_o which_o it_o may_v be_v say_v he_o be_v beard_n in_o all_o such_o prayer_n because_o he_o do_v not_o pray_v for_o the_o pardon_n of_o his_o enemy_n but_o upon_o condition_n of_o their_o repentance_n now_o if_o they_o have_v repent_v and_o have_v not_o be_v pardon_v than_o christ_n be_v not_o hear_v in_o this_o prayer_n but_o if_o they_o remain_v in_o impenitency_n and_o be_v never_o pardon_v he_o be_v nevertheless_o hear_v in_o this_o prayer_n and_o now_o you_o be_v to_o prove_v that_o what_o he_o pray_v for_o in_o this_o prayer_n for_o his_o disciple_n perseverance_n he_o pray_v for_o absolute_o and_o not_o conditional_o or_o else_o you_o do_v not_o argue_v of_o my_o distinction_n mr._n danson_n why_o so_o mr._n ives_n i_o will_v show_v you_o why_o if_o christ_n pray_v for_o some_o thing_n that_o be_v not_o effect_v upon_o the_o person_n non-performance_n on_o their_o part_n and_o yet_o in_o this_o he_o may_v be_v say_v to_o be_v hear_v than_o the_o prayer_n you_o mention_v must_v be_v of_o this_o kind_n or_o absolute_a and_o if_o it_o be_v absolute_a show_v it_o mr._n danson_n if_o christ_n be_v hear_v always_o in_o what_o he_o pray_v for_o than_o this_o be_v a_o absolute_a prayer_n ●●●ves_n and_o must_v he_o not_o when_o he_o pray_v for_o the_o conversion_n of_o other_o and_o the_o forgiveness_n of_o other_o and_o when_o he_o pray_v that_o the_o world_n may_v believe_v be_v he_o not_o hear_v then_o and_o do_v not_o christ_n in_o the_o same_o prayer_n john_n 17_o pray_v that_o all_o that_o believe_v may_v be_v one_o as_o the_o father_n and_o he_o be_v one_o now_o if_o this_o prayer_n be_v absolute_a how_o come_v it_o to_o pass_v that_o there_o be_v so_o many_o sad_a division_n among_o christian_n ●id_v not_o christ_n pray_v that_o all_o true_a believer_n may_v be_v keep_v from_o the_o evil_n of_o the_o world_n how_o come_v it_o to_o pass_v that_o many_o of_o they_o fall_v into_o many_o worldly_a pollution_n if_o these_o prayer_n be_v absolute_o hear_v and_o the_o thing_n effect_v how_o can_v there_o be_v either_o such_o fowl_n pollution_n or_o such_o great_a division_n among_o true_a believer_n all_o which_o plain_o show_v that_o christ_n pray_v for_o these_o effect_n upon_o their_o use_n of_o such_o mean_n as_o that_o they_o may_v thereby_o obtain_v both_o unity_n and_o purity_n in_o like_a manner_n he_o pray_v for_o their_o perseverance_n in_o grace_n upon_o the_o condition_n of_o their_o use_n of_o mean_n as_o pray_v watch_v etc._n etc._n but_o there_o be_v no_o absolute_a prayer_n for_o such_o perseverance_n as_o you_o fancy_n mr._n danson_n he_o be_v not_o hear_v in_o that_o prayer_n as_o a_o private_a person_n mr._n ives_n show_v that_o distinction_n in_o the_o bible_n where_o do_v the_o scripture_n say_v he_o pray_v for_o some_o thing_n as_o a_o public_a person_n absolute_o and_o every_o thing_n come_v to_o pass_v as_o he_o pray_v for_o in_o that_o capacity_n and_o at_o other_o time_n that_o he_o pray_v as_o a_o private_a person_n and_o he_o be_v then_o hear_v only_o in_o some_o thing_n mr._n danson_n i_o have_v show_v you_o luke_n 23._o father_n forgive_v they_o etc._n etc._n mr._n ives_n suppose_v that_o prayer_n be_v not_o answer_v according_a to_o your_o way_n of_o explication_n as_o to_o their_o be_v actual_o pardon_v yet_o than_o it_o make_v against_o you_o since_o you_o give_v that_o reason_n why_o true_a believer_n can_v not_o fall_v away_o because_o the_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n faith_n himself_o father_n i_o thank_v thou_o thou_o have_v hear_v i_o always_o and_o that_o he_o be_v hear_v in_o all_o he_o pray_v for_o and_o thence_o you_o infer_v they_o can_v not_o fall_v away_o that_o be_v true_a believer_n because_o christ_n pray_v for_o their_o perseverance_n and_o be_v hear_v in_o all_o he_o pray_v for_o but_o be_v there_o not_o the_o same_o reason_n to_o conclude_v that_o all_o christ_n crucifier_n shall_v be_v forgive_v and_o that_o the_o world_n shall_v all_o believe_v in_o he_o because_o christ_n pray_v for_o these_o thing_n if_o it_o shall_v be_v say_v christ_n pray_v for_o the_o world_n and_o his_o enemy_n as_o a_o private_a person_n and_o so_o it_o may_v not_o come_v to_o pass_v why_o may_v it_o not_o be_v say_v he_o pray_v for_o the_o perseverance_n of_o all_o believer_n as_o a_o private_a person_n and_o so_o some_o may_v fall_v away_o notwithstanding_o but_o if_o it_o be_v say_v he_o pray_v for_o believer_n absolute_o and_o without_o condition_n why_o may_v it_o not_o be_v say_v he_o pray_v so_o for_o the_o world_n and_o his_o enemy_n mr._n danson_n so_o that_o if_o you_o suppose_v in_o the_o one_o place_n he_o be_v not_o hear_v and_o in_o other_o place_n he_o be_v than_o you_o must_v admit_v of_o that_o distinction_n of_o his_o pray_n as_o a_o public_a and_o a_o private_a person_n mr._n ives_n i_o deny_v the_o consequence_n for_o when_o christ_n pray_v that_o they_o may_v be_v convert_v he_o pray_v as_o be_v do_v for_o 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