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A49581 A compendium of the art of logick and rhetorick in the English tongue Containing all that Peter Ramus, Aristotle, and others have writ thereon: with plaine directions for the more easie understanding and practice of the same.; Dialectica. English Ramus, Petrus, 1515-1572.; R. F.; Aristotle. 1651 (1651) Wing L433; ESTC R215450 104,257 346

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argument is that which argueth not by its own nature but taketh force from some artificiall argument Q. It seemeth by this when a hidden truth of things is more subtily searched for that this argument hath small force of proofe A. So it is but in civill and humane things oftentimes this argument effecteth the greatest trust from the moving arguments if wisdome vertue and good will be present Q. VVhat is it called A. In one name it is called Testimoyn Q. What are the kindes of Testimo●y● A. Divine or Humane Q. What may be comprised under the head of Divine Testimony Q. Not onely the miracles of the gods but also the answers of prophets and fortune-tellers are counted amongst divine Testimonies Q. Give example A. All these are brought forth Cat. 3 For that I may omit saith the Orator the fires seen in the night from the West and the burning of heaven as also lightning and earthquakes with other many things done to us Consuls as those which are now done do seem to proclaime the gods immortality And a little after At which time when the Araspatians were come together out of all Hetruria they said that slaughter burning perishing of the lawes civill and domesticall war and the fall of the whole City and Empire approached unless the immortall gods pleased by all reason by their power should change those destinies At length when he had said that they mocked at the answer of the Arispatians and that they did more regard the signe of Iove turning to the East He then said But is not he so present that it should seem to be done at the beck of the mighty Iove that when this morning before my doore by my command and conjuration the Judges being then in the house of Concordia at the same time there appeared a signe which being turned towards you and the Senate both you and the Senate saw manifestly laid open who they were that were against the health of all men Q. Give another example A. That of Tibullus is more short But if that oracles true things do tell Then this in our name see thou do declare That he doth promise Delius to give To be thy spouse with whom thou'lt happy live CAP. 33. Testimony from humane law and sentences Q. What be the kindes of humane Testimony A. Humane Testimony is common or proper Q. What is common A. Law and a famous Sentence Q. What is legall testimony A. Legall testimony is both unwritten and written Q. Bring forth authority for this A. Pro Mil. For there is O ye Judges a law not writtē but born with us which we have not received learned read but taken drawn expressed from Nature as if our life should be in some hazard force danger either of theeves or enemies all honest reasō were to be sought of safety but if the twelve Tables will have the night thee●e yea the day theef too if he defend himself after any manner killed without punishment who is there that will thinke him that is slain to be punished when as there is a sword reached to us to kill that man by the Lawes themselves Q. What are famous Sentences A. Proverbs Q. Give example A. They be such as these Pares cum paribus facillimè congregantur Spartam nactus es hanc exorna Q. What may further be under this head A. Sayings of wisdome also Q. Give example A. Nosce teipsum Nequid nimis Sponde praestò ad detrimentum Q. What is Proper testimony A. Such as this of Plato 1. ad Quint. fratr And then truely Plato the Prince of wisdome and learning thought those cōmon-wealths blessed if either learned and wise men governed them or those that did govern placed all their study in wisdome and learning Q. Proceed to further example A. Such were in the Poets AEneid 4 Learn justice and admonitions and contemn not the rich So in Homer 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ajax led out of Salaminus 12 ships The Magatenses were overcome by the Athenians Q. What are testimonies of the living A. Testimonies of the living are not only when it is inquired of ground felling of wood and such like business but also there are testimonies of obligation confessing oath Q. Give an example of obligation A. Phil. 5. For I dare bind my faith P.C. to you and the people of Rome that truly when no force constrained me I durst not do and I feared an opinion of temerity in a thing greatly hurtfull I promise and swear P.C. to become alwayes such a citizen to Cesar as he himself is and as we ought chiefly to wish or desire Q. Have we not an obligation set forth sometimes with a pledge A. Yes Virg. Eclog. 3. Wilt then by turnes we hand to hand do try What either can and prove each by our deed I le pawn this heiser which lest thou deny She twice hath come already to the payle And two twins suckles at this time Now say What pawn thou 'lt gage with her to countervail Q. What are the kindes of confession A Confession is free or extorted by torments Q. What is this later properly called A A question Q. Give example A. Such an argument there is against Milon who● Cicero derided Go to then VVhat or how is the question how where was Roscius where was Casca Doth Clodius lay snares for Milon he hath done surely the gallows He had done nothing Q. What further may be reduced hitherto A. Hitherto may be referred the argument which we use when we bring forth our approbation and experience of our affirmative Q. Give example A. Ver. 4. Even Volcatio if he had come freely would he have given a little book he shall come he shall be tryed no man truely receiveth it Ter. Spend thy time in letters in the woods in musick It is meet for youth to know these liberal things I will give diligence Q. Give a poeticall example A. Ovid. Trist. 3. The which that thou mayst better credit me Try thou my pains beleeve it then to be Q. Give an example also of the Testimony of an oath A. AEneid 6. I swear by th' gods and all in earth unseen I have departed from thy shore ô Queen Q. This reciprocation seemeth to be more obscure as because the testimony is true the witnes is also true A. So it is and thus much sufficeth to have spoken of Invention the first part of the science Dialectica THE SECOND BOOK OF PETER RAMUS His DIALECTICA of Iudgement CAP. 1. What Iudgement is Q. HItherto the first part of Dialectica in Invention hath bin expounded the other part followeth in Judgment What then is Iudgment A. Judgment is the second pa●t of Logick of disposing arguments to be judged well Q. How are they judged A. Every thing is judged by a certain rule of disposition Q. It may be thought then that this part of Logick is called both Iudgment and Disposition from hence A. So it is CAP. 2. An aff●rmative or negative Axioma
only handled after this simple forme of division but also apart one from another Q. Give example A. Pro Arc. But least any should wonder that we say so that there is a certain faculty of wit and this reason or discipline of speaking neither that we have truly given our selves altogether to this study For all Arts which pertain to humanity have a certain common hand and are contained as it were in a certain knowledg amongst themselves Q. Shew the force of this example A. Art is the Genus Poesie and Eloquence the Species Q. Is not the Genus handled also by the Species A. Yes Q. Give example A. Ovid de Trist. 4. Fill thy sad matter with thy vertues grave Hot glory doth decay it none can save Who had known Hector if Troy well had been Through publick vices way to vertue'● se●● Thine Art ô Typhis lyes if in the sea There be no floods if men be well truly Then Phoebus Art decayeth instantly That which they hid and is not known f●● good Appears at last and shews where evi●● stoo●● Q. But are there no speciall example● fitted to this kinde A. Yes such as this Attic. 7. Wil● thou leave the city what if the Frenchmen come The common-weal●● he saith is not in walls but Altars and Religion Themistocles did the same and a whole host of Barbaria● were not able to take one city B●● Pericles did not so who in the year almost before fifty when he kept nothing but a wall our city before being taken they kept the tower notwithstanding CAP. 28. Distribution from the Subject Q. What is the other distribution A. The other distribution is of Agreeings after a certain manner Q. What are Agreeings after a certain manner A. The subjects and adjuncts Q. What is the distribution from subjects A. The distribution from Subjects is when the parts are subjects Q. Give example A. Cat. Thy maiden-head's not wholly thine I ween One part thy father gave the part between Thou of thy mother had'st so that to thee None but the third remaineth for to be Therefore resist not two cast not away The thing thy parents gave to thee I say Q. Give example out of some Orator A. Cic. Tnsc. 1. There are therefore three kindes of good as I un●erstond from the Stoicks to whose use oftener then I am wont we give place There are therefore those kinde● of good which may be externally enjoyed of the body Also because others ar● to be undertaken they are therefore called good There are other divine things which do more nearly concern us and are heavenly so that those who have attained them why may I not call them after a manner blessed yea most happy CAP. 29. Distribution from adjucts Q. What is distribution from A●juncts A. Distribution from Adjuncts is● when the parts are Adjuncts Q. Give example A. Of men some are sound some sick some rich some poor Q. Give a poeticall example A. Virgil Georg. 1. divideth th● world into five parts the middle scorc●ing hot the other two extream col●● the two last temperate Five zones the heavens do hold the ●i●dle hot The sun there burns cold in it the●● is n●● But on the right and left ha●● there i● seen Rain frost and cold that 's bitter sharpe and keen The two last temperate yet in them is Mortality and many sicknesses Q. Give an Orators example A. Caes. Bel. Gal. 1. All France is divided into three parts of which one the Belgians inhabite the other the AEquitans the third those who in their tongue are called Cetts in our language the Gaules CAP. 30. Definition Q. What is definition A. Definition is when it is explicated what the thing is and that interchangeably may be argued with the thing defined Q. What are the ●●●des of Definition A. A Definition is perfect or imperfect Q. What is the Perfect definition callde A. This is properly called a Definition Q. What is the Imperfect called A. A Description Q. VVhat is a perfect Definition A. A Perfect definition is a definition consisting of the onely Causes which constitute the Essence such as the causes comprehended by the genus and form Q. Give example A. After this manner is a man desined viz. by the genus a living creature we understand as it is said a Corporeal Essence full of life and sense which is the Matter and a part of the Form of a man to which if thou addest reasonable thou comprehendest the whole form of a man by the whole faculty of his Life Sense Reason Q. It should seem then that the Perfect definition is nothing else then an universall symbol of the Causes constituting the Essence an● Nature of things A. So it is Q. Give an example A. the Arts have such definitions Grammer of well speaking Rhetoricke of pleading well Dialectica of disputing well Arithmetick of numbring well Geometry of measuring well CAP. 31. Description Q. VVhat is Description A. Description is a definition defining the thing from other arguments also Q. Give example A. This is the description of a man A man is a living creature mortall capable of discipline Q. Are not proper circumstances also mingled with common causes sometimes A. Yes Q. Then it seemeth that succint brevity is not alwayes in this kinde A. No oftentimes it desireth a clearer and greater explication Q. Give an example out of some Orator A. In Mil. Glory is described But yet of all rewards of vertue if there be a reason of rewards the greatest is glory this one comforteth us touching the shortness of our life causeth that we are present with the absent of dead maketh us to live To conclude by these steps we do seem to ascend into heaven Q. Give a poeticall example A. AEneid 4. Fame is described From Lybians temple cometh forth great fame Nought swifter then ill news which bears this name Moving she goes by going strength she gets She feares at first at last with windes she fleets VValkes on the earth her head she lifts to th' skie Earth brought her forth the gods were angery In Coeus and Encelladus his land She was at last as I do understand Her feet were swift her wings most hurtful were A horrid monster wicked ful of feare As many feathers as upon her are So many eyes attend her every where So many tongues so many mouths do sound So many ears do listen her around In night she flies through heaven and in the shade About the earth she goes no noyse is made She ●itteth by the light on houses high And causeth townes to quiver fearfully As well a bruiter of things false that be As messenger of truth and verity Q. Procced to further example A. Such are the descriptions of plants and living creatures in Physicke also of rivers mountains cities in Geography and History CAP. 32. Divine testimony Q. You have expounded the Artificial arguments the Inartificiall followeth Tell me then what an Inartificiall argument is A. An Inartificiall