be iudge So doe we value your detestation as you his It were well for you if you eschued these enormities lesse and hell more Your sinfull subiection to these vnchristian humours will proue more fearefull then to our Antichristian enormities SECTION XXII The Church of England is the Spouse of Christ. SHE may be your Mother you say and not the Lords Wife It is a good Mother that hath Children and no husband Why did you not call her plaine whore Your old Embleme is As is the Mother so is the Daughter These are the modest circumlocutions of a good sonne who cares not to proue himselfe a bastard that his mother may bee mark't for an Harlot Be you a true Lo-ammi but England shall neuer I hope proue an Apostate Israel We haue no Calues in our Dan and Bethel none of Ieroâ—oams Idolatry VVee haue still called God Ishi and neuer burnt incense to Baalim It is your sinagogue that hath fallen away from vs as Israel from Iuda But these children were bidden to plead Gods command shields them from the note of vngracious Abraham must sacrifice his sonne and this sonne must condemne his Mother shew vs either our equall desert or your equall warrant VVhere hath God proclamed our Church not his By whose hand hath he published her diuorce You haue shamed her wombe not she her bed not God her demeanure Your tongues are your owne who can forbid you VVe know you will plead and excuse and censure and defend till all the world be weary we may pray with Hierome to this sense that of the Psalmist Increpa Domine bestias calami yet wee see your pens tongues and presses busie and violent I will not apply to you that which Augustine of his Donatists Though truth compell you to be dumbe yet iniquitie will not suffer you to be silent But if you write whole Marts and worlds of volumes you shall neuer be able either to iustifie your innocence or excuse your fault In the meane time the noyse of your contentions is so great that your truth cannot bee heard Learned Iunius and our learnedst Diuines and neighbour Churches haue oft heard your clamors neuer your truth So little haue you of this and so much of the other that we are ready to wish as he of old either our selues deafe or you dumb SECTION XXIII How the Church of England hath separated from Babylon THe spirit of your Proto-Martyr would hardly haue digested this Title of Babylon Mother of Gods people a murdering Step-mother rather She cannot be a Mother of Chilâ—ren to God and no Church of God Notwithstanding Gods people would he say may be in her not of her So Babylon bore them not but Sion in Babylon But I feare not your excesse of charity You fly to your Doctors challenge and aske what we say against you for vs which Rome wil not say for her selfe against vs Will you iustifie this plea of Rome or not If you will why doe you reuile her If you will not why doe you obiect it Heare then what we say both to you and them our enemies both and yet the enemies of our enemies First we disclaime and defie your Pedigree and theirs The Church of Rome was neuer our Mothers Mother Our Christian faith came not from the seuen-hilles Neither was deriued either from Augustine the Monke or Pope Gregory Britanny had a worthy Church before either of them look't into the world It is true that the ancient Roman Church was Sister to ours here was neare kindred no dependance And not more consanguinitie then while she continued faithfull Christian loue Now she is gone a whoring her chast Sister iustly spitteth at her yet euen still if you distinguish as your learned Antagonist hath taught you betwixt the Church and Papacy Shee acknowledges her Sisterhood though she refraines her coÌ„uersation as she hath many slauish and factious abettors of her knowne and grosse errors to whom we deny this title affirming them the body whereof Antichrist is the head the great whore and mother of abhominations so againe how many thousands hath shee which retayning the foundation according to their knowledge as our learned Whitakers had wont to say of Bernard follow Absolom with a simple heart all which to reiect from Gods Church were no better theÌ„ presumptuous cruelty It were well for you before God the world if you could as easiely wash your hands of vn-naturall impiety and trecherousnesse as we of bastardy vniust sequestration There can be no bastardy where was neuer any motherhood wee were nephews to that Church neuer sons vnlesse as Rome was the Mother citie of the world so by humane institution we suffered our selues to bee ranged vnder her Patriarchall authority as being the most famous Church of the West a matter of courtesie and pretended Order no necessity no spirituall obligation As for our sequestration your mouth and theirs may be stopt with this answer As all corrupted Churches so some things the Church of Rome still holds aright a true God in three persons true Scriptures though with addition a true Christ though mangled with foule and erroneous consequences true Baptisme though shamefully deformed with rotten traditions many other vndenyable truths of God some other things and too many her wicked Apostasie hath deuised and maintained abhominably amisse the body of her Antichristianisme grosse errours and by iust sequel heresies their Popes supremacy infallibility illimitation transubstantiation idolatrous and superstitious worshippe and a thousand other of this branne In regard of all these latter we professe to the world a iust and auncient separation from this false faith and deuotion of the Romish Church which neither you will say nor they shall euer proue faulty yea rather they haue in all these separated from vs who stil irrefragably professe to hold with the auncient from whom they are departed In regard of the other we are stil with them holding and embracing with them what they holde with Christ neither will you I thinke euer prooue that in these we should differ As for our communion they haue separated vs by their proude and foolish excommunications if they had not wee would iustly haue begunne from their Tyranny and Antichristianisme from their miserable Idolatrie but as for the bodie of their poore seduced Christians which remaine amongst them vpon the true foundation as doubtlesse there are thousands of them which laugh at their Pardons Miracles Superstitions and their trust in merites reposing only vpon Christ we adhere to them in loue and pitty and haue testified our affection by our blood ready vpon any iust call to doe it more neither would feare to ioyne with them in any true seruice of our common God But the full discourse of this point that honourable and learned plesses hath so forstalled that whatsoeuer 〈◊〉 say would seeme but borrowed Vnto his rich Treatise I referre my Reader for full satisfaction
be free both in your profession and gift You giue vs to haue renounced many false Doctrins in Popery and to haue imbraced so many truths We take it vntill more You professe where you sticke what you mislike In those foure famous heades which you haue learned by heart from all your predecessors An hatefull Prelacy A deuised Ministery a confused and prophane communion and lastly the intermixture of grieuous errors What if this truth were taught vnder an hatefull Prelacy Suppose it were so Must I not imbrace the truth because I hate the Prelacy What if Israel liue vnder the hatefull Egyptians What if Ieremy liue vnder hatefull Pashur What if the Iewes liue vnder an hateful Priesthood What if the disciples liue vnder hatefull Scribes What are others persons to my profession If I may be freely allowed to be a true professed Christian what care I vnder whose hands But why is our Prelacy hatefull Actiuely to you or passiuely from you In that it hates you Would God you were not more your owne enemies Or rather because you hate it Your hatred is neither any newes nor paine Who or what of ours is not hatefull to you Our Churches Belles Clothes Sacraments Preachings Prayers Singings Catechismes Courts Meetings Burialles Mariages It is maruell that our aire infects not and that our heauen and earth as Optatus said of the Donatists escape your hatred Not the forwardest of our Preachers as you tearme theÌ„ haue found any other entertainment no enemy could be more spightfull I speake it to your shame Rome it selfe in diuers controuersary discourses hath bewrayed lesse gall then Amsterdam The better they are to others you professe they are the worse yea would to God that of Paule were not verified of you hatefull and hating one another But we haue learned that of wise Christians not the measure of hatred should be respected but the desert Dauid is hatred for no cause Michaiah for a good cause Your causes shall be examined in their places onwards it were happy if you hated your owne sinnes more and peace lesse our prelacy would trouble you lesse and you the Church SECTION XXVII The truth and warrant of the Ministery of England FOr our deuised office of Ministery you haue giuen it a true title It was deuised indeed by our Sauiour when he said go teach all Nations and Baptise and performed in continuance when hee gaue some to be Pastors and Teachers and not only the office of Ministery in generall but ours whom hee hath made both able to teach and desirous seperated vs for this cause to the worke vpon due tryall admitted vs ordayned vs by imposition of handes of the Eldershippe and prayer directed vs in the right diuision of the word committed a charge to vs followed our Ministery with power and blessed our labours with gratious successe euen in the hearts of those whose tongues are thus busie to denie the truth of our vocation Behold here the deuised Office of â—our Ministery What can you deuise against this Your Pastor who as his brother writes hopes to worke wonders by his Logicall skill hath killed vs with seuen Arguments which hee professeth the quintessence of his owne and Penryes extractions whereto your Doctor referres vs as absolute I would it were not tedious or worth a Readers labour to see them scanned I protest before God and the world I neuer read more grosse stuffe so boldly and peremptorily faced out so full of Tautologies and beggings of the Question neuer to bee yeelded Let mee yet mention the maine heads of them and for the rest be sory that I may not be endlesse To proue therefore that no communion may be had with the Ministery of the Church of England he vses these seuen Demonstrations First Because it is not that Ministery which Christ gaue and set in his Church Secondly Because it is the ministerie of Antichrists Apostasie Thirdly Because none can communicate with the ministery of England but he worshippes the beasts Image and yeeldeth spirituall subiection to Antichrist Fourthly Because this ministery deriueth not their power and functions from Christ Fiftly Because they minister the holy things of God by vertue of a false spirituall calling Sixthly Because iâ— is a strange ministery not appointed by God in his word Seuenthly Because it is not from heauen but from men Now I beseech thee Christian Reader iudge whether that which this man was wont so oft to obiect to his brother a crack't braine appeare not plainely in this goodly equipage of reasons for what is al this but one and the same thing tumbled seuen times ouer which yet with seuen thousand times babling shall neuer be the more probable That our ministery was not giuen and set in the Church by Christ but Antichristian what is it else to be from men to bee strange to be a false spirituall calling not to bee deriued from Christ to worship the Image of the beast So this great Challenger that hath abridged his nine Arguments to seuen might aswell haue abridged his seuen to one and a halfe Here would haue beene as much substance but lesse glory As for his maine defence First wee may not either haue or expect now in the Church that ministery which Christ set Where are our Apostles prophets Euangelists If we must alwayes looke for the very same administration of the Church which our Sauiour left why doe wee not challenge these extraordinary functions Doe we not rather thinke since it pleased him to beginne with those Offices which should not continue that herein he purposely intended to teach vs that if wee haue the same heauenly busines done we should not be curious in the circumstances of the persons But for those ordinary callings of Pastors and Doctors intended to perpetuity with what forehead can hee denie them to bee in our Church How many haue we that conscionably teach and feede or rather feede by teaching Call them what you please Superintendents that is Bishoppes Prelates Priests Lecturers Parsons Vicars c. If they preach Christ truly vpon true inward abilities vpon a sufficient if not perfect outward vocation such a one let all Histories witnesse for the substance as hath bin euer in the Church since the Apostles times they are Pastors and Doctors allowed by Christ We stand not vpon circumstances and appendances of the fashions of ordination manner of choyce attire titles maintenance but if for substance these be not true Pastors and Doctors Christ had neuer any in his Church since the Apostles left the earth All the difficulty is in our outward calling Let the Reader graunt our graue and learned Bishoppes to be but Christians and this will easily be euinced lawfull euen by their rules For if with them euery plebeian artificer hath power to elect and ordaine by vertue of his Christian profession the act of the worthiest standing for all how
can they deny this right to persons qualified besides common graces with wisedome learning experience authority Eyther their Bishoppricke makes them no Christians a position which of all the world besides this Secte would be hissed at or else their handes imposed are thus farr by their rules of Separatists effectual Now your best course is like to an Hare that runnes backe from whence she was started to flye to your first hold No Church therefore no Ministery So now not the Church hath deuised the Ministery but the Ministery hath deuised the Church I follow you not in that idle Circle Thence you haue beene hunted already But now since I haue giuen account of ours I pray you tell me seriously Who deuised your Office of Ministery I dare say not Christ not his Apostles not their Successors What Church euer in the world can be produced vnlesse in case of extremity for one turn whose conspiring multitude made themselues ministers at pleasure what rule of Christ prescribes it What Reformed Church euer did or doth practise it VVhat example warrants it where haue the inferiors laid hands vpon their Superiors VVhat Congregation of Christendome in all records affoorded you the necessary patterne of an vnteaching Pastor or an vnfeeding Teacher It is an old policy of the faulty to complaine first Certainely there was neuer Popish Legend a more errand deuise of man then some parts of this ministery of yours so much gloried in for sincere correspondence to the first institution SECTION XXVIII Confused Communion of the prophane YOVR scornefull exception at the confused communion of the prophane multitude sauors strong of a Pharisee who thought it sinne to conuerse cum terrae filijs the base vulgar and whose very Phylacteries did say Touch me not for I am cleaner then thou This multitude is prophane you say and this communion confused If some be prophane yet not all for then could be no confusion in the mixture If some be not prophane why do you not loue them as much as you hate the other If all maine truthes be taught amongst some godly some prophane why will you more shunn those prophane then cleaue to those truths and those godly If you haue duely admonished him and detested and bewailed his sinne what is another mans prophanenesse to you If prophanenesse be not punished or confusion be tolerated it is their sinne whome it concerneth to redresse them If the Officers sinne must we runne from the Church It is a famous and pregnant protestation of God by Ezechiell The righteousnesse of the righteous shall be vpon him and the wickednesse of the wicked shall be vpon himself And if the fathers sower Grapes cannot hurt the childrens teeth how much lesse shall the neighbours But whither will you runne from this communion of the prophane The same fault you find with the Dutch and French yea in your owne How well you haue auoided it in your separation let Master White George Iohnson Master Smith be sufficient witnesses whose plentifull reports of your knowne vncleannesses smothered mischiefes malitious proceedings corrupt packings communicating with knowne offenders bolstering of sinns and willing conniuences as they are shamefull to relate so might well haue stopt your mouth from excepting at our confused Communion of the prophane SECTION XXIX Our Errours intermingled with Truth HOw many and grieuous errors are mingled with our Truths shall appeare sufficiently in the sequell If any want let it be the fault of the accuser it is enough for the Church of Amsterdam to haue no errors But ours are grieuous Name them that our shame may be equall to your griefe So many they are and so grieuous that your Martyr when he was vrged to instance could find none but our opinion concerning Christs descent into hell and except hee had ouer-reached not that Call you our Doctrines some generall truthes Looke into our Confessions Apologies Articles and compare them with any with all other Churches and if you finde a more particular found Christian absolute profession of all fundamētall truths in any Church since Christ ascēded into heauen renounce vs as you do we wil seperate vnto you But these truths are not soundly practised Let your Pastor teach you that if errours of practise should be stood vpon there could bee no true Church vpon earth Pull out your owne beame first we willingly yeeld this to be one of your truths that no truth can sanctifie errour That one heresie makes an Hereticke but learne withall that euery error doth not pollute all truthes That there is hay and stubble which may burne yet both the foundation stand and the builder be saued Such is ours at the worst why doe you condemne where God will saue No Scripture is more worne with your tongus and pennes then that of the leauen 1. Cor. 5. 6. If you would compare Christs leauen with Pauls you should satisfie your selfe Christ sayes the kingdome of heauen is as leauen Paule saies grosse sin is leauen Both leauens the whole lumpe neither may be taken precisely but in resemblance not of equalitie as he said well but of qualitie For notwithstanding the leauen of the kingdome some part you grant is vnsanctified So notwithstanding the leauen of sinne some which haue striuen against it to their vtmost are not sowred The leauening in both places must extend onely to whom it is intended the subiects of regeneration in the one the partners of sinne in the other So our Sauiour saith Yee are the salt of the earth Yet too much of the earth is vnseasoned The trueth of the effect must bee regarded in these speeches not the quantity It was enough for Saint Paule to shew them by this similitude that grosse sins where they are tollerated haue a power to infect others whether it be as Hierome interprets it by ill example or by procurement of iudgements and thereupon the incestuous must be cast out All this tends to the excōmunicating of the euill not to the seperating of the good Did euer Paule say if the incestuous be not cast out seperate from the Church Show vs this and wee are yours Else it is a shame for you that you are not ours If Antichrist holde many truths and we but many we must needes bee proud of your prayses We holde all his truths and haue showed you how we hate all his forgeries no lesse then you hate vs Yet the mistery of iniquity is still spun in the Church of England but with a siner threed So fine that the very eyes of your malice cannot see it yet none of our least motes haue escaped you Thankes bee to our good God wee haue the great mistery of godlinesse so fairely and happily spunne amongst vs as all but you blesse God with vs and for vs As soone shall you finde charity and peace in your English Church as heresie in our Church of England SECTION XXX Whether
A COMMON APOLOGIE OF THE CHVRCH OF ENGLAND Against the vniust Challenges of the ouer-iust Sect commonly called Brownists Wherein the grounds and Defences of the Separation are largely discussed OCCASIONED BY A Late Pamphlet published vnder the name Of an Answer to a Censorious Epistle Which the Reader shall finde in the Margent By I. H. LONDON Printed for Samuel Macham and are to be sold at his Shop in Pauls Church-yard at the Signe of the Bull-head 1610. TO OVR GRATIOVS AND BLESsed Mother the Church of ENGLAND THE MEANEST OF HER Children Dedicates this her Apology and wisheth all Peace and Happines NO lesse then a yeare and a halfe is past Reuerend Deare and holy Mother since I wrote a louing monitory letter to two of thine vnworthy Sons which I heard were fled from thee in person in affection and somewhat in opinion Supposing them yet thine in the maine substance though in some circumstances their owne Since which one of them hath wash't of thy Font-water as vnclean and hath written desperately both against thee and his owne fellowes From the other I receiued not two moneths since a stomakful Pamphlet besides the priuate iniuries to the monitor casting vpon thine honourable name blasphemos imputations of Apostasie Antichristianisme Whoordome Rebellion Mine owne wronges I could haue contemned in silence but For Sions sake I cannot hold my peace If I remember not thee O Ierusalem let my tongue cleaue to the roofe of my mouth It were a shame and sinne for me that myzeale should be lesse hote for thine innocency then theirs to thy false disgrace How haue I hastened therefore to let the world see thy sincere truth and their peruerse slanders Vnto thy sacred name then whereto I haue in all piety deuoted my selfe I humbly present this my speedy and dutifull labour whereby I hope thy weak Sonnes may be confirmed the strong encouraged the rebellious shamed And if any shall still obstinately accurse thee I referre their reuenge vnto thy Glorious Head who hath espoused thee to himselfe in trueth and righteousnesse Let him whose thou art right thee In the meane time we thy true sonnes shall not onely defend but magnifie thee Thou maiest be blacke but thou art comely the Daughters haue seene thee and counted thee blessed euen the Queene and the Concubines and they haue praised thee thou art thy Welbelouedst and his desire is towards thee So let it be and so let thine be towards him for euer and mine towards you both who am the least of all thy little ones IOS HALL A COMMON Apologie against the Brownists SECTION I. The entrance into the worke IF Truth and peace Zacharyes two companions had met in our loue this Controuersie had neuer beene the seuering of these two hath caused this separation for while some vnquiet mindes haue sought Trueth without Peace they haue at once lost Truth Peace Loue vs and themselues God knowes how vnwillingly I put my hand to this vnkind quarrell Nothng so much abates the courage of a Christian as to call his brother aduersary We must doe it woe to the men by whom this offence commeth Yet by how much the insultation of a brotherly enemy is more intollerable and the griefe of our blessed mother greater for the wrong of her owne So much more cause I see to breake this silence If they will haue the last words they may not haue all For our carriage to them They say when Fire the God of the Chaldees had deuoured all the other wooden Deities that Canopis set vpon him a Caldron full of water whose bottome was deuised with holes stop't with waxe which no sooner felt the flame but gaue way to the quenching of that furious Idoll If the fire of inordinate zeale conceite contention haue consumed all other parts in the separation and cast forth more then Nebuchadnezers furnace from their Amsterdam hither it were well if the waters of our moderation and reason could vanquish yea abate it This litle Hin of mine shall be spent that way wee may trie and wish but not hope it The spirits of these men are too-well knowne to admit any expectation of yeeldance since yet both for preuention and necessary defence this taske must be vndertaken I craue nothing of my Reader but patience and iustice of God victory to the truth as for fauour I wish no more then an enemy would giue against himselfe With this confidence I enter into these lifts and turne my penne to an Aduersary GOD knowes whether more proud or weake SECTION II. The Answerers Preamble IT is a hard thing euen for those which would seem sober minded men in cases of controuersie to vse soberly the frownes and disaduantages of causes and times whereby whiles men are deiâ—cted and troden downe they vse to behold their opposites mounted on high too repiningly and not without desperate enuie so are oftentimes moued to shoote vp at them as from below the bitter arrowes of spightfull and splenish discourses thinking any hatefull opposition sufficiently charitable to oppugne those aduersaries which haue them as they feele at so great an aduantage vpon this impotent malitiousnesse it commeth to passe that this aunswerer vndertaketh thus seuerely and peremptorily to censure that charitable censure of ignorance which as shall appeare in the sequell he either simply or willingly vnderstood not and to brand a deare Church of Christ with Apostacy Rebellion Antichristianisme What can bee more easie then to returne accusations Your Preamble with a graue bitternes charges me with 1. Presumption vpon aduantages 2. Weake and weightlesse discourse 3. Ignorance of the cause censured It had beene madnesse in me to write if I had not presumed vpon aduantages but of the cause of the truth not of the times Though blessed bee God the times fauour the truth and vs if you scorn them and their fauours complaine not to be an vnderling Thinke that the times are wiser then to bestow their fauours vpon willfull aduersaries but in spight of times you are not more vnder vs in estate then in conceipt aboue vs so wee say the Sunne is vnder a cloud we know it is aboue it Would God ouerlinesse and contempt were not yours euen to them which are mounted highest vpon best desert and now you that haue not learned sobrietie in iust disaduantages taxe vs not to vse soberly the aduantages of time there was no gall in my penne no insultation I wrote to you as brethren and wish't you companions there was more danger of flattery in my stile then bitternesse wherein vsed I not my aduantages soberly Not in that I said too much but not enough Not in that I was too sharpe but not weighty enough My opposition was not too vehement but too sleight and slender So strong Champions blame their aduersary for striking too easily you might haue forborne this fault it was my fauour that I did not my worst you are worthy of
Scriptures Surely you euen ioyne Scriptures as you separate your selues This is right as your Pastor to proue all members of the visible Church elect and pretious stones cytes 1. K. 7. 9. where is speech only of Salomons house in the Forest of Lebanon his Porch for his Throne his Hall his Pallace for Pharachs daughter and when hee comes to describe the office of his imaginary doctor thwacks fourteene Scriptures into the margent whereof not any one hath any iust colour of inference to his purpose and in his discourse of the power of the Church that hee might seeme to honour his margent with shew of textes hath repeated sixe places twise ouer in the space of sixe lines For these of yovrs you might obiect the first to the Cainites not to vs Cain was cast out worthily Doe wee either denie or vtterly forbeare this censure Take heed you follow him not in your voluntary exile to the land of Nod. The second you might obiect to those mungrell Christians that match with Turkes and Pagans There are sonnes of God that is members of the visible Church and daughters of men which are without the bounds meere Infidels it is sinne for those sonnes to yoake themselues with those daughters What is this to vs Noah was righteous the multitude disobedient Who denies it yet Noah separated not from that corrupted Church till the flood separated him from the earth but continued an auncient Preacher of righteousnesse euen to that peruerse and rebellious generation But it sufficeth you that Caine and the Giants were separated from the rest We yeelde it what will follow hence saue onely that notorious malefactors must be cast out and professed Heathen not let into the Chruch VVe hold and wish no lesse your places euince no more These before the law In Leuit. 20. 24. 26. God chose out Israel from other people This was Gods act not theirs a sequestring of his Israelites from the Gentiles not of Israel from it selfe yours is your owne and from men in all maine points of your owne profession But therefore Israel must be holy If any man denie holinesse to be required of euery Christian let him feele your Maranatha In Nehem. 9. 2. The Israelites separated themselues from the strangers which were Infidels whether in their marriage or deuotion Neither Gods seruice nor an Israelites bedde was for Heathens This was not the constituting of a new Church but reforming of the olde If therefore you can parallell vs with Pagans and your selues will bee Iewes this place fittes you Lastly what if there be an hatred betwixt the world Christs true Disciples Ioh. 17. 14. 16 what if Peter charged his auditors to saue themselues from the errours and practise of that froward generation whose handes were yet freshly imbrued with the blood of Christ Act. 2. 40. What if the same which Peter taught Paul practised in separating his followers from hearing some obstinate and blasphemous Iewes Act. 19. 9 VVhat if the Church of Corinth were Saints by calling 1. Cor. 1. 2 and therfore must be separated from the yoake of Infidels 2. Cor. 6. 17 Are these your patternes Are these fit matches for your brethren baptized in the same water and name professing euery point of the same true faith vsing for substance the same worshippe with you Hee that saith he is in the light and hateth his brother is in darkenesse 1. Ioh. 2. 9. SECTION VI. What separation is to be made by Churches in their planting or restauration BVT all these examples perhappes are not so much to warrant what you haue done as to condemne the Church of England for what shee hath not done for such a separation she neither hath made nor doth make but standes actually one with all that part of the world within the kingdome without separation Loe here the maine ground of this Schisme which your Proto-Martyr Barrow hammers vpon in euery page an ill constitution Thus he comments vpon your wordes For where such prophane confuse multitudes without any exception separation or choice were all of them from publique idolatrie at one instant receiued or rather compel'd to be members of the Church in some parish or other where they inhabited without any due calling to the faith by the preaching of the Gospell going before or orderly ioyning together in the faith there being no voluntarie or particular confession of their owne faith and dueties made or required of any and lastly no holy walking in the faith amongst them who can say that these Churches consisting of this people were euer rightly gathered or built according to the rule of Christs Testament In his words and yours I finde both a mis-collection and a wronge charge For the former the want of noting one poore distinction breedes all this confusion of doctrine and separation of men for there is one case of a new Church to be called from Heathenisme to Christianity another of a former Church to be reformed from errours to more sincere Christianity In the first of these is required indeede a solemne initiation by Baptisme and before that a voluntarie and particular confession of faith and therefore a cleare separation and exception of the Christian from the Infidell In the latter neither is new Baptisme lawfull though some of you belike of olde were in hand with a rebaptization which not then speeding succeedeth now to your shame nor a new voluntary and particular confession of Faith besides that in Baptisme though very commendable will euer be prooued simply necessary to the being of a Church so long as the erring parties doe actually renounce their doctrines and in open profession imbrace the truth and as generally in the publique confession so particularly vpon good occasion giue iust testimonies of their repentance This is our case we did not make a new Church but mended an old your Clifton is driuen to this hold by necessity of argument Otherwise he sees there is no auoiding of Anabaptisme Mended saith your Doctor and yet admitted the miscelline rabble of the prophane Say now that such separation were not made Let some few be holy and the more part prophane Shall the lewdnesse of some disanul Gods couenant with others This is your mercy Gods is more who still held Israel for his when but fewe held his pure seruice Let that diuine Psalmist teach you how full the Tents of Israel were of mutinous rebels in the desert yet the piller by day night forsooke them not and Moses was so farre from reiecting them that he would not indure God should reiect them to his owne aduantage Looke into the blacke censures and bitter complaints of all the Prophets wonder that they separated not Looke into the increased masse of corruptions in that declined Church whereof the blessed eyes of our Sauiour were witnesses and maruell at his silent and sociable incuriousnesse yea his charge of not separating yee knowe not of
what spirite you are Nowe you flye to constitution as if notorious euils were more to tollerable in the continuance then in the collection of assembles Sar di had but a few names that had not defiled their garments God praises these biddes them not separate from the rest Thyatirâ— suffers a false Prophetesse the rest that haue not this learning yet are bidden but to hold their owne not to separate from the Angell which hath not separated Iezebel from the Church SECTION VII What separation the Church of England hath made YOur charge is no lesse iniurious that the Church of England hath made no separation Concerning which you haue learned of your Martyr and Ouerseers so to speake as if before her late disclamation of Popery in Queene Elizabeths time she had not beene Her Monuments could haue taught you better and haue ledde you to her auncient Pedigree not much below the Apostolike daies and in many discents haue shew'd you not a few worthy witnesses and Patrons of Truth all which with their holy and constant of-spring it might haue pleased you to haue separated from this imputation of not separating Will you know therefore how the Church of England hath separated In her first conuersion she separated her selfe from Pagans in her continuance she separated her selfe from grosse heretiques and sealed her separation with blood in her reformation she separated her selfe from wilfull Papists by her publique profession of Truth and proclaimed hatred of errour and she daily doth separate the notoriously euil by suspensions by excommunications though not so many as yours Besides the particular separations of many from the acknowledged corruptions in iudgement profession practise All these will be auowed in spight of all contradiction with what forehead then can you say the whole Church of England hath not at all separated After all your shifts and idle tales of constitution you haue separated from this Church against the Lord not with the Lord from it If there be Christ with vs if the spirit of God in vs if Assemblies if calling by the word whatsoeuer is or is not else in the Constitution there is whatsoeuer is required to the essence of a Church no corruption eyther in gathering or continuance can destroy the truth of being but the grace of being well If Christ haue taken away his word and spirit you haue iustly subduced els you haue gone from him in vs. And when you haue al done the Separatists Idol visible Constitution will proue but an appendance of an externall forme no part of the essence of a true Church and therefore your separation no lesse vain then the ground then the Authours Lastly if our bounty should which it cannot grant that our collection was at first deepely faulty cannot the Raâ—ihabition as the Lawyers speake bee drawne backe In contracts your owne similitude a following consent iustifies an act done before consent and why not in the contract betwixt GOD and his visible Church Loe he hath confirm'd it by his gratious benedictions and as much as may bee in silence giuen vs abundant proofes of his acceptation That after-act which makes your baptisme lawfull why can it not make our Church SECTION VIII Constitution of a Church BBut for as much as Constitution is the very state of Brownisme Let vs I beseech you inquire a little into the Complexion of your Constitution Whether Physicke or Lawe or Architecture haue lent you it sure I am it is in this vse Apocryphall Neuer man vsed it thus scrupulously till your times Though what neede you the helpe of Fathers or Schooles new words must expresse new Paradoxes It is no treason to coyne tearmes What then is Constitution Your Doctor can best tell vs As the Constitution of a Common-wealth or of a City is a gathering or vniting of people together into a ciuill policy So saith he the Constitution of the Common-wealth of Israel and of the City of God the new Ierusalem is a gathering and vniting of people into a Diuine Politie The forme of which Polity is Order which Order is requisite in all actions and Administrations of the Church as the Apostle sheweth and specially in the Constitution thereof So that next vnto faith in God it is to be esteemed most necessary for all holy societies Hence Paul reioyced in the Colossians order and faith To this Constitution therefore belong a people as the matter secondly a calling or gathering together as the form wherof the Church consisteth The Constitution of the Church of England is false in both VVhy so Haâ—â— we not a people Are not those people called together To preuent this you say our Constitution is false not none VVhy false Because those people haue neither faith nor order For faith first VVho are you that dare thus boldy breake into the Closets of God the hearts of men and condemne them to want that which cannot be seene by any but Diuine eies how dare you intrude thus into the throne of your Maker Consider and conferre seriously VVhat faith is it that is thus necessarily required to each member in this Constitution Your owne Doctor shall define it Faith required to the receiuing in of members is the knowledge of the doctrine of saluation by Christ 1. Cor. 12. 9. Gal. 3. 2. Now I beseech you in the feare of God lay by a while all vnchristian preiudice and peremptory verdicts of those soules which cost Christ as much blood as your owne and tell mee ingenuously whether you dare say that not onely your Christian brethren with whom you lately conuersed but euen your forefathers which liued vnder Queene Elizabeths first confused reformation knew not the doctrine of saluation by Christ if you say they did not your 〈◊〉 iudgement shal be punished fearefully by him whose office you vsurpe As you looke to answere before him that would not breake the bruised Reede nor quench the smoaking Flaxe presume not thus aboue men and Angels If they did then had they sufficient clayme both to true Constitution and Church But this faith must be testified by obedience so it was If you thinke not so yours is not testified by loue Both were weake both were true Weakenes in any grace or worke takes not away truth Their sinnes of ignorance could no more 〈◊〉 Gods couenant with them them multiplicity of wiues with the Patriarches SECTION IX Secondly Order VVHat wanted they then Nothing but Order and not all Order but yours Order a thing requisite and excellent but let the world indge whether essentiall Consider now I beseech you in the bowels of Christ Iesus whither this be a matter for which heauen and earth should be mixed whether for want of your Order all the world must be put out of all Order and the Church out of life and being Nothing say we can be more disorderly then the confusion of your Democracy or popular state if not Anarchyâ—
but the men Shall we say this is too much malice or too little wit and conscience Euen in the Lord Protectors daies that holy man reports that after the Scriptures restored and Masses abolished greater thinges followed these softer beginnings in the reformation of the Churches Learned and godly Diuines were called for from forraine parts a separation was made though not so much willing as wilfull of open and manifest aduersaries from Professors whether true or dissembled Commissioners were appointed to visite euery seuerall Diocesse Euery Bench of them had seuerall godly and learned Preachers to instruct the people in the truth and to disswade them from Idolatry and Superstition The Popes Supremacy not thrust but taught downe All wil-worshippe whatsoeuer oppugned by publique Sermons Images destroyed Pilgrimages forbidden the Sacraments inioyned to be reuerently and holily ministred Ecclesiastical persons reformed in life in doctrine Processions laide downe Presence and attendance vpon Gods word commanded the holy expending of Sabboth dayes appointed due preparation to Gods table called for set times of teaching inioyened to Bishoppes and other Ministers all shrâ—nes and Monuments of Idolatry required to be vtterly taken from publique and priuate houses All this before his Parliament By that all bloody lawes against Gods trueth were repealed zealous Preachers encouraged so as saith that worthy Historian God was much glorified and the people in many places greatly edified What neede I goe further then this first yeare Heare this and be ashamed and assure your selues that no man can euer read those holy Monuments of the Church but must needes spit at your separation After that sweete and hopefull Prince what his renowmed sister Queene Elizabeth did the present times doe speake and the future shall speake when all these Murmurers shall sleepe in the dust The publique disputations zealous Preachings restaurations of banished religion and men extirpations of Idolatry Christian lawes wise and holy proceedings and renewed couenants with God are still fresh in the memories of some and in the eares of all so as all the world wil iustly say you haue lost shame with truth in denying it Yea to fetch the matter yet further If the Reader shall looke backe to the daies of their Puissant Father King Henry the eight he cannot but acknowledge especially during the time of Queene Anne and before those sixe bloody Articles a true face of a Church though ouer-spreade with some morphue of corruptions and some commendable forwardnesse of Reformation for both the Popes Supremacy was abrogated the true doctrine of Iustification commonly taught confidence in Saints vntaught the vanity of Pardons declared worshippe of Images and Pilgrimages forbidden learned and godly Ministers required their absences and mis-demeaners inhibited the Scriptures translated publickly and priuately inioyned to be read and receiued the word of God commaunded to be sincerely and carefully preached and to all this holy Master Foxe addeth for my conclusion such a vigilant care was then in the King and his Councell how by all wayes and meanes to redresse Religion to reforme errours to correct corrupt customes to helpe ignorance and to reduce the mis-leadings of Christs Flocke drowned in blinde Popery superstitious customes and Idolatry to some better forme of Reformation whereunto he prouided not onely these Articles Precepts Iniunctions aboue specified to inform the rude people but also procured the Bishops to helpe forward the same cause of decayed doctrine with their diligent preaching and teaching of the people Goe now say that suddenly in one day by Queen Elizabeths trumpet or by the sound of a Bell in the name of Antichrist all were called to the Church Goe say with your Patriarch that wee erect Religions by Proclamations and Parliaments Vpon these premises I dare conclude and doubt not to maintaine against all Separatists in the world that England to goe no higher had in the daies of King Henry the eight a true visible Church of God and so by consequent their succeeding seede was by true Baptisme iustly admitted into the bosome therof and therefore that euen of them without any further profession Gods Church was truly constituted If you shall say that the following Idolatrie of some of them in Queene Maries daies excluded them Consider how hard it will be to prooue that Gods couenant with any people is presently disanulled by the sinnes of the most whether of ignorance or weakenesse and if they had herein renounced GOD yet that GOD also mutually renounced them To shut vppe your Constitution then There is no remedy Eyther you must goe forward to Anabaptisme or come backe to vs All your Rabbines caâ—not aunswere that charge of your rebaptized brother If wee bee a true Church you must returne If wee bee not as a false Church is no Church of GOD you must rebaptise If our Baptisme be good then is our constitution good Thus your owne Principles teach The outward parte of the true visible Church is a Vowe Promise Oathe or Couenant betwixt GOD and the Saints Now I aske Is this made by vs in Baptisme or noe If it be then we haue by your Confession for so much as is outwardly required a true visible Church so your separation is vniust If it be not then you must rebaptise for the first Baptisme is a nullity and if ours be not you were neuer thereby as yet entred into any visible Church SECTION XII The Aunswerers title AS for the title of Ring-leader wherewith I stiled this pamphleter if I haue giuen him too much honour in his Sect I am sory Perhappes I should haue put him pardon an homely but in this sense not vnusall word in the taile of this Traine Perhaps I should haue endorsed my Letter to Master Smith and his shadow So I perceiue he was Whatsoeuer whither he lead or follow God meetes with him If hee lead Behold I will come against them that prophesie false dreames saith the Lorde and doe tell them and cause my people to erre by their lies If he come behinde Thou shalt not follow a multitude in euill saith God If either or both or neither If he will goe alone Woe vnto the foolish Prophets saith the Lord which follow their owne spirits and haue seene nothing Howsoeuer your euill shall bee reproued by the light of Gods word Your coniâ—â—ction I cannot promise your reproofe I dare If therupon you shall finde grace to see and heale your errours we should with all brotherly humblenesse attend on foote vpon your returne on Horse-backe but if the sway of your mis-resolued conscience bee heady and vnresistable and your retyring hopelesse these not solide reasons these pretty pamphlets these formall flourishes shall one day be fearefull and materiall euidences against you before that awefull Iudge which hath already sayd That iudgements are prepared for the scorners and stripes for the backe of fooles SECTION XIII The Apostacie of the Church of England I professed
to bestow pitie and sorrow vpon you and your wrong You entertaine both harshly and with a churlish repulse What should a man do with such dispositions Let him stroke them on the backe they snarle at him and show their teeth Let him shew them a Cudgell they flie in his face You allow not our actions and returne our wrong Ours is both the iniurie and complaint How can this be You are the agents we sit still and suffer in this rent Yet since the cause makes the Schisme let vs inquire not whose the action is but whos 's the desert Our Church is deepe drencht in Apostacie and wee crie Peace Peace No lesse then a whole Church at once that not sprinkled or wetshod but drencht in Apostacie What did we fall off from you or you from vs Tell me were we euer the true Church of God And were we then yours We cannot fall vnlesse we once stood Was your Church before this Apostacie Show vs your ancestours in opinion Name me but one that euer taught as you doe and I vow to separate Was it not Then we fell not from you Euery Apostacie of a Church must needs be from the true Church A true Church and not yours And yet can there be but one true See now whether in branding vs with Apostasie you haue not proued yours to be no true Church Still I am ignorant Queene Maries dayes you say had a true Church which separated from Poperie chose them Ministers serued God holily from thence was our Apostacie But were not the same also for the most part Christians in King EDVVARDS dayes Did they then in that confused allowance of the Gospel separate Or I pray you were Cranmer Latimer Ridley Hooper and the rest parts of that Church or no Was there any other ordination of Ministers then from them Reiect these and all the world will hisse at you Receiue them and where is our Apostacie What Antichristianisme haue we whereof these were freed But you leape backe if I vrge you farre from hence to the Apostles times to feâ—ch our once true Church from farre that it might bee deare You shall not carue for vs we like not these bold ouer-leapes of so many Centuries I speake boldly you dare not stand to the trial of any Church since theirs Now I heare your Doctor say this Challenge sauors of Rome Antiquitie is with you a Popish plea We haue willingly taken vp our aduersaries at this by pretence their owne weapon You debarre it in the conscience of your owne nouell singularitie Yet your Pastor can be content to make vse of Tertullian alone against all Fathers That such things are iustly to be charged with vanitie as are done without any precept either of the Lord or of the Apostles And the Apostles did faithfully deliuer to the nations the Discipline they receiued of Christ which we must beleeue to be the tumultuary Discipline of the refined house-full at Amster dam What all in all ages and places till now Apostates Say if you can that those famous Churches wherein Cyprian Athanasius Ambrose Hierome Austen Chrysostome and the rest of those blessed lights liued were lesse deepe in this Apostacy then ours O Apostaticall Fathers that separated not yea say if you dare that other reformed Churches are not ouer the Ankles with vs in this Apostacy What hard newes is this to vs when as your Oracle dare say not much lesse of the Reformed Churches of Netherlands with whom you liue Thus he writes For not hearing of them in other Congregations in these countries this I answer That seeing by the mercie of God we haue seene and forsaken the corruptions yet remayning in the publique Ministration and condition of these Churches if they be all like to these of this Citie we cannot therfore partake with them in such case without declining and Apostasie from the truth which we haue our selues already receiued and professed See here to partake with them in Gods seruice is Apostacy If so in the accessoryes Alas what crime is in the principall It were but Apostasie to heare an English Sermon a Dutch is no lesse Woe is you that you dwell still in Meshech Good men it were not more happy for you then the Church that you were well in heauen No lesse then Apostasie Let no Reader bee appalled at so fearefull a word this is one of the tearmes of Arte familiar to this way Find but any one page of a Duch printed volume without Apostasie Excommunication Commingling Constitution and suspect it not theirs Heresie is not more frequent at Rome then Apostacy at Amsterdam nor Indulgences more ordinary there then here Excommunications Common vse makes terrible thinges easie Their owne Master Sl. for holding with the Dutch Baptisme and read-prayers is acknowledged to be cast our for an Apostate yea their Doctor Mr. Aâ—nsworth is noted with this marke from themselues there is much latitude as happy is in their Apostasie For when Stanshall Mercer and Iacob Iohnson were to be chosen Officers in their Church and exception was taken by some at their Apostacy answere was made It was not such Apostacy as debarred them from office it was but aslippe Iohn Marke whether as Isychius and Theophilact think the blessed Euangelist or some other holy Minister is by the whole Parlour at Amsterdam branded with this same Apostasie who departed indeed but from Paul in his iourney not from Christ in his faith and therefore his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is expounded by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Act. 15. 38. why do we think much to drinke of an Euangelists cuppe Yet let this ignorant Epistler teach his censorious answerer one point of his owne that is the Separatists skill and tell him that hee obiects two crimes to one poore Church which are incompatible want of Constitution and Apostasie Thus writes your Master of vs If it were admitted which can neuer bee proued that they sometimes had beene true established Churches Loe here we neuer had true Constitution therefore we are not capable of Apostasie If we once had it and so were true Churches heare what your Pastor saith As Christ giueth to all true Churches their being so wee must leaue it vnto him to take it away when and as he pleaseth And therefore since he hath not remoued his Candlesticke nor taken away his Kingdome in spight of all obiected Apostasies we still continue so and by consequent your separation vpon this ground is most vniust An Apostate had wont to bee the fearefull surname of damned Iulian Tortus was an easie accusar to whom yet we may say with Elihu Num dicis regi Apostata Behold now so many Apostates as men Holy Cyprian describes him by forsaking Christs colors taking vp arms for Gentilisme in life or herefie in iudgment And Augustine telles vs there cannot bee a greater sinne then Apostasie making else-where this sinner
worse then the Infidell And the olde vulgar can giue no worse tearme to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 where he findes it yea to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 rebels themselues What doth this brand to a Church not Christian onely though you denie it but famous Of whom is truely verefied after all your splene that which the spirit writes to the Angel of Ephesus Laborasti non Defecisti Say if you can what Article of the Christian and Apostolike faith haue we renounced What heresie maintaine wee Wherein haue wee runne from the tents of Christ What hold we that may not stand with life in Christ and saluation VVe challenge all men and Diuels in this point for our innocence Distinguish for starke shame of so foule a word or which is better eate it whole and let not this blemish be left vpon your soule and name in the Records of God and the world that you once said of a Church too good for yours Drencht in apostacy If we crie Peace whiles you crie Apostasie surely we flatter whiles you rayle betwixt these two dangerous extremes wee know an wholsome meane so to approue that we foster not security so to censure that we neither reuile nor separate and in one word to doe that which your Pastor could exhort the separators from your Separation for euen this Schisme hath Schismes If we should mislike yet to rest in our differences of iudgement and notwithstanding peaceably to continue with the Church Had you taken this course you should neither haue needed to expect our pitie nor to complaine of our cruelty Surely whether our loue be cruell or not your hatred is whereof take heede least you heare from old Iacob Cursed be their wrath for it was fierce and their rage for it was cruell How can you expect compassion when you breath fire and write gall Neuer mention the fury of others indignation till the venemous and desperate writings of Barrow and Greenwood bee evther worne out with time or by the Thunder-bolts of your not rare censures be strucke downe to hell whence their maliciousnesse came I forbeare to recapitulate how much rather had I helpe to burie then to reuiue such vn-christian exprobrations SECTION XIIII The Separatists acknowledgements of the graces of the Church of England INgratitude and vnnaturalnesse to your Mother is obiected In that you flie from her yea now wo is me that you spit in her face and mark her for an harlot VVould God the accusation were as farre from being iust as from being triuiall Yet perhappes you intend it not in the lightnesse of this charge but the commonnesse you haue caused me to smart for my charity yet I forbeare it not VVhat is your defence That you haue done her no wrong to your knowledge Modestly spoken but doubtfully we know your wrong but we know not your knowledge it is well if your wrong be not wilful an ignorant wrong is both in more hope of amends and of mercie But is not this caution added rather for that you thinke no hard measure can possibly be a wrong to so vile a Church I aske and would be denied No you doe freely and with all thankefulnesse acknowledge euery good thing she hath VVhatsoeuer you doe to vs I will not any more in fauour of you wilfully wrong my selfe you haue bidden men now to take you as a complete Separatist and speake this for your selfe and yours Let the Reader now iudge whether the wrong of your Sect be wilful and acknowledgment of our good free and thankfull Your first false-named Martyr shall giue the first witnes of the titles of our Church VVho saith he that were not drunke and intoxicate with the VVhores cuppe could affirme this confuse Babell these cages of vncleane Birds these prisons of foule and hatefull spirits to be the Spouse of Christ And else-where he calles the people of our Church Goates and Swine Is this any wrong to your knowledge The same Author They haue not saith he in their Churches any one thing in their practise and proceedings not one pin naile or hooke according to the true patterne Doe you not now freely and thankefully acknowledge our Churches good things VVhat is more ordinary with him and his brother in euill I. Greenewood then to call our worthie Ministers Baals Priests Cainites the marked seruants of Antichrist sellers of the VVhores wares worshippers of the Beast Is this yet any wrong to your knowledge Pastor Iohnson sticks not to say that the Ministerie and worshippe of the Church of England were taken out of the VVhores cuppe and plainely stiles our Church as which of you doe not daughter of the great Babilon that mother of whoredomes and abhominations of the earth yet more That Hierarchy Worshippe Constitution and Gouernement which they professe and practise being directly Antichristian doe vtterly destroy true Christianity so as their people and Churches cannot in that estate be iudged true Christians Do you not now freely and thankfully acknowledge our good things What can any Diuell of hell say worse against vs then this That we are no Christians Or what good can there be in vs if no true Christianity If wee denied euery Article of the Christian Creed if we were Mahumetans as your good Pastor stickes not to compare vs if the most damned Heretiques vnder heauen what could he say but no Christians Your teacher and Pastour which is a wonder agree For your Doctor Ainsworth makes this one head of his poysonous Counterpoyson that Christ is not the head Mediatour Prophet Priest King of the Church of England You their Disciple are not yet promoted to this height of immodestie yet what are your good things Euen to you we are Apostates Traytors Rebels Babylonish This is well for a learner Hereafter if you will heare me keepe our good things to your selfe and report our euill Yea that your vncharitablenesse may bee aboue all examples monstrous You doe not onely denie vs any interest in the Church of Christ but exclude vs what you may from all hope and possibilitie of attaining the honour of Christendome For when a godly Minister protested to Master Barrow the trueth of his ministerie vpon the approbation also of his people hee receiued this answere from him Though you had such allowance it could nothing auaile but rather ouerthrow your Ministerie they being as yet vngathered to Christ and therefore neither may not in this estate chuse them a Minister nor any exercise a Ministerie vnto them without hainous sacriledge O desperate iudgement we neither are Christians nor can be No Christianitie without faith no faith without the Ministerie of the word no word to vs without sacriledge What are we that the very offer of bringing vs to God should be criminall These are your acknowledgements of our good Who haue learned of your Pastour to kisse and kill all at once to
blesse and curse with one breath your mercies are cruell SECTION XV. The vnnaturalnesse of some principall Separatists BVT who can wonder at your vnnaturalnesse to the Church that heares what measure you mete to your owne Errour is commonly ioyned with cruelty The outragious demeanures of the Circumcelliones in Augustines time and more then barbarous tyranny of the Arrians before him are wel knowen by all Histories and not enough by any God forbid that I should compare you to these Heare rather of Nouatus the father of a not-vnlike Sect of whom Cyprian reports that he would neither bestow bread on his father aliue nor buriall on him deade but suffred him both to starue and stinke in the street and for his wife least he should be mercifull to any hee spurned her with his heele and slew his owne childe in her bodie What need I seeke so far I grieue to thinke and report that your owne Pastor hath paralleled this cruelty His owne brother which is no lesse sauadge though one of your Sect is the publick accuser and condemner of him in this crime to all the world who after a pittifull relation of his eight yeares quarrels with him and foure years excommunication in his Epistle before a large volume to this purpose writes thus After all these hath not our kind carefull and old Father come a long iourney to make Peace Hath he not laboured with you the Elders and the Church to bring you to peace Hath hee not vsed the helpe and counsell of the Reformed Churches herein Yet will you not be reclaimed but adding that sinne aboue all haue also â—â—â—strously excommunicated your father the peace-seeker c. and straight How oft desired he you as if he had beene the sonne and you the father euen with teares that you would repent In a word how came he and I to your doore shewing you that it might bee vpon his departing you should see his face no more c. Yet you forced him by your ill dealing still to leaue vpon you his curse and all the curses writen in Gods booke against vnthankfull and disobedient children Thus farre a brother concerning a brother against father and brother Other strangely-vnkind vsages of both I had rather leaue to the discouery of Master White and this miserable plaintiue who haue written enough to make an enemy ashamed But whereupon was all this fearefull broile in a pure Church For nothing but a little lace and whale-bone in his wiues sleeue The Troian warre could not be slaundered with so weighty a beginning As for your Elder Daniel Studly whom your Pastor so much extolleth if Master Whites Apostasie may be your shift against his relation let him speake who should haue beene a fellow-elder with him banished for your trueth though erected by your censure Marke saith G. Iohns of this Studly how the Lord hath iudged him with vnnaturalnesse to his owne children suffering them to lie at other mens feete and hang on other mens hands whiles he his wife and her daughter fared daintily and went prankingly in apparell euen in this place of banishment It is no ioy to me to blazen these or your othersins would God they were fewer and lesse in vs all Onely it was fit the world should know as how vndutiful you are to your common parent so that Father Brother Children beare part with your mother in these your cruelties SECTION XVI what the Separatists thinke themselues beholden to the Church of England for IF then such bee the good things of our Church What good can you acknowledge to haue receiued from her Nothing giues what it hath not A Baptisme perhaps Alas but no true Sacrament you say yea the seale of gracelesnesse and mischiefe As little are you beholden to the Church for that as the Church to you for your good acceptation Why are you not rebaptized You that cannot abide a false Church why doe you content your selues with a false Sacrament especially since our Church being not yet gathered to Christ is no Church and therefore her baptisme a nullity What else doe you owe to the liberality of this Step-dame You are close your Pastor is lauish for you both who thus speakes of himselfe and you and vs I confesse that whiles I was Minister in your Church of England I stood in an Antichristian estate yet doubt I not but euen then being of the Elect of God I was partaker through faith of the mercy of God in Christ to saluation but as for you Master Iacob and his fellow-Christians whiles you thus remaine you cannot in that estate approue your selues to haue the promise of saluation Behold here the Church of England gaue you but an Antichristian estate if God giue secret mercy what is that to her Gods superabundant grace dooth neither abate ought of her Antichristianisme nor moue you to follow him in couering and passing by the manifold enormities in our Church wherewith those good things are inseparably commingled Your owne mouth shall condemne you Doth God passe ouer our enormites and doe you stick yea separate Doth his grace couer them and do you display them Haue you learned to be more iust then your Maker Or if you be not aboue his iustice Why are you against his mercie God hath not disclaimed vs by your owne confession you haue preuented him If Princes leisures may not be stayed in reforming yet shall not Gods in reiecting Your ignorance inwrapped you in our errours his infinite wisedome sees them and yet his infinite mercie forbeares them so might you at once haue seene disliked stayed If you did not herein goe contrary to the courses of our common God how happy should both sides haue beene yea how should there be no sides How should wee be more inseparably commingled then our good and euill But should you haue continued still in sinne that grace might haue abounded God forbid you might haue continued here without sinne saue your owne and then grace would no lesse haue abounded to you then now your sinne abounds in not continuing What neede you to surfet of another mans Trencher Others sinnes neede no more to infect you then your graces can sanctifie them As for your further light suspect it not of God suspect it to be meere darkenesse and if the light in you be darknesse how great is that darkenesse What so true and glorious a light of God and neuer seene til now No worlds times Churches Patriarches Prophets Apostles Martyrs Fathers Doctors Christians euer saw this truth looke foorth besides you vntill you Externall light was Gods first creature and shall this spirituall light whereby all Churches should be discerned come thus late Mistrust therefore your eyes and your light and feare Isayes woe and the Iewes miserable disappointment we wait for light but loe it is darkenesse for brightnesse but we walke in obscuritie SECTION XVII
Would God this point were throughly known and well weighed on all partes The neglect or ignorance whereof hath both bred and nursed your separation and driuen the weake and inconsiderate into strange extremities This say we for our selues in no more charity then truth But for you how dare you make this shamelesse Comparison Can your heart suffer your tong to say that there is no more diffrence betwixt Rome and vs then there is betwixt vs and you How many hundred errours how many damnable heresies haue we euinced with you in that so compounded Church shew vs but one mis-opinion in our Church that you can proue within the ken of the foundation Let not zeale make you impudent Your Doctor could say ingenuously sure that in the doctrines which she professeth she is farr better and purer then that Whore mother of Rome and your last Martyr yet better If you mean saith he by a Church as the most doe that publique profession whereby men do professe saluation to be had by the death and righteousnesse of Iesus Christ I am free from denying any Church of Christ to be in this land for I know the Doctrine touching the holy Trinity the natures and Offices of the Lord Iesus free iustification by him both the Sacraments c. published by her Maiesties authority and commanded by her lawes to be the Lords blessed and vndoubted truthes without the knowledge and profession whereof no saluation is to be had Thus he with some honesty though little sense If therfore your will do not stand in your light you may well see why we should thus forsake their Communion and yet not you ours Yet though their corruptions be incomparably more wee haue not dared to separate so farre from them as you haue done from vs for lesse Still wee holde them euen a visible Church but vnsound sicke dying sicke not of a consumption onely but of a leprosie or plague so is the Papacy to the Church diseases not more deadly then infectious If they be not rather in Sardies taking of whom the spirit of God saieth Thou hast a name that thou liuest but thou art dead and yet in the next words bidds them awake and strengthen the things which are ready to die And though our iudgement and practise haue forsaken their erroneous doctrines and seruice yet our charity if you take that former distinction hath not vtterly forsaken and condemned their persons This is not our coolenesse but equality your reprobation of vs for them hath not more zeale then headstrong vncharitablenesse SECTION XXIIII The Separation made by our holy Martyrs BVt how could you without blushing once name Cranmer Latimer and those other holy-Martyres which haue beene so oft obiected to the conuiction of your schisme Those Saints so forsooke the Romish Church as wee haue done died witnesses of Gods truth in that Church from which you are separated Liued Preached gouerned shed their blood in the communion of the Church of England which you disclaime and condemne as no Church of God as merely Antichristian Either of necessity they were no Martyrs yea no Christians or else your separations and censures of vs are wicked Chuse whether you will They were in the same case with vs wee are in the same case with them no difference but in time eyther their blood will be vpon your heads or your owne This Church had then the same constitution the same confusion the same worshippe the same Ministery the same gouernement which you brand with Antichristianisme swayed by the holy hands of these men of God condemne them or allow vs. For their separation They found many main errours of doctrine in the Church of Rome in the Papacy nothing but errours worth dying for shew vs one such in ours and wee will not onely approue your separation but imitate it SECTION XXV What separation England hath made THE Church of England dooth not now wash her hands of Babilonish abhominations but rather shewes they are cleane Would God they were no more foule with your slander then her owne Antichristianisme Here will bee found not pretences but proofes of our forsaking Babylon of your forsaking vs not so much as wel-coloured pretences You beginne to be ingenuous while you confesse a reformation in the Church of England not of some corruptions but many and those many not sleight but maine The gifts of aduersaries are thankelesse As Ierom said of his Ruffinus so may we of you that you wrong vs with praises This is no more praise then your next page giues to Antichrist himselfe Leaue out Many and though your commendations be more vncertaine we shall accept it so your indefinite proposition shall sound to vs as generall That we haue reformed the maine corruptions of the Romish Church None therefore remaine vpon vs but sleight and superficiall blemishes so you haue forsaken a Church of a foule skinne but of a sound heart for want of beauty not of truth But you say many not All that if you can picke a quarrell with one you might reiect all yet shewe vs that one maine and substantiall error which we haue not reformed and you doe not more embrace those truths with vs which we haue receiued then we will condemne that falshood which you haue reiected and imbrace the truth of that Separation which you haue practised The degrees whereby that strumpet of Babylon got on Horse-back you haue learned of vs who haue both learned and taught that as Christ came not abruptly into the world but with many presages and prefigurations The day was long dawning ere this Sunne arose so his aduersary that Antichrist breaks not suddenly vpon the Church but comes with much preparation and long expectance and as his rise so his fall must be graduall and leisurely Why say you then that the whole Church euery where must at once vtterly fall off from that Church where that man of sinne sitteth His fall depends on the fall of others or rather their rising from vnder him If neither of these must be sudden why is your hast But this must not be yet ought as there must be heresies yet there ought not It is one thing what God hath secretly decreede another what must be desired of vs If we could pull that Harlot from her seate and put her to Iezebels death it were happy Haue we not endeuoured it VVhat speake you of the hyest Towers and strongest pillers or tottering remainders of Babylon we shew you all her roofes bare her walles raced her vaults diged vp her monuments defaced her altars sacrificed to desolation Shortly al her buildings demolished not a stone vpon a stone saue in rude heapes to tell that here once was Babylon Your strife goes about to build againe that her tower of confusion God deuides your languages It wil be wel if yet you build not more then we haue reserued SECTION XXVI The maine grounds of separation YOV will now
sought not rather strife then satisfaction his Maiesties speech in the Confer at Hampton Court might haue staied the course of your quarrelous pen No reasonable minde but would rest in that gratious and Royall determination Lastly Why looke you not to your owne Elders at home euen your handfull hath not auoided this crime of Non-residency What wonder is it if our world of men haue not escaped SECTION XXXIIII Our loyaltie to Princes cleared theirs questioned YOV that confesse our wisedome and honesty must now pleade for your owne your hope is not more of vs then our feare of you To depose Kings and dispose Kingdomes is a proud worke you want power but what is your will For excommunication it is cleare enough While you fully holde that euery priuate man hath as much power in this censure as the Pastor and that Princes must bee equally subiect with them to these their censures Let any man now deuise if the Brownists could haue a King how that King could stand one day vnexcommunicated Or if this censure meddle onely with his soule not with his Scepter How more then credible is it that some of your assemblies in Queene Elizabeths daies concluded that shee was not euen in our sense supreame head of the Church neither had authority to make lawes Ecclesiasticall in the Church It is well if you wil disclaime it But you know your receiued position That no one Church is superior to other No authority therefore can reuerse this Decree your will may doe it yea what better then rebellion appeares in your next clause While you accuse our loyaltie to an earthly King as treasonable to the King of the Church Christ Iesus If our loyaltie bee a sinne where is yours If we be traytors in our obedience what doe you make of him that commands it VVhether you would haue vs each man to play the Rex and erect a new gouernement or whether you accuse vs as rebels to Christ in obeying the old God blesse King Iames from such subiects But whose is that so vnsauorie weede No Bishoppe no King Know you whom you accuse let me shew you your aduersary it is King Iames himselfe in his Hampton Conference is there not now suspition in the word surely you had cause to feare that the King would proue no good subiect Belike not to Christ VVhat doe you else in the next but proclaime his opposition to the King of KINGS or ours in not opposing his As if we might say with the Israelites O Lord our God other Lords besides thee haue ruled vs If we would admit each of your Elders to bee so many Kings in the Church wee should stoope vnder Christs ordinances Shewe vs your Commission and let it appeare whether we be enemies or you vsurpers Alas you both refuse the rule of his true Deputy and set vp false Let this fearefull doome of Christ light where it is most due Euen so let thine enemies perish O Lord. SECTION XXXV Errours of Free-will c. fained vpon the Church of England GOe on to slaunder Euen that which you say you will not speake you doe speake with much spight and no truth VVhat hath our Church to doe with errours of vniuersall grace or freewill Errors which her Articles doe flatly oppose what shamelesnesse is this Is shee guilty euen of that which shee condemnes if some few priuate iudgements shall conceiue or bring forth an error shal the whole Church doe penance would God that wicked and heretical Anabaptisme did not more growe vpon you then those errours vpon vs you had more neede to defend then accuse But see Christian Reader how this man dragges in crimes vpon vs as Cacus did his Oxen VVe doe forsooth part stakes with God in our conuersion wherein in a deuised Ministery the meanes of conuersion we ll fetch 't about There may be a Ministery without a conuersion and êconuerso There may be a conuersion without a Ministery VVhere now are the stakes parted yet thus we partstakes with the Apostle that wee are Gods fellow-labourers in this great worke Hee hath separated vs to it ioyned vs with him in it it is he as we haue proued that hath deuised our Ministery yea your selfe shall proue it it is his peculiar to appoint the outward Ministerie that giues the inward grace But hath not God giuen inward grace by our outward Ministery Your hearts shall be our witnesses What will follow therfore but that our Ministerie is his peculiar appointment SECTION XXXVI Kneeling at the Sacrament of the Lords Supper OVR Kneeling you deriue like a good Herald from the errour of Transubstantiation but to set downe the descent of this pedigree will trouble you wee doe vtterly denie it and challenge your proofe How new a fiction Transubstantiation is appeares out of Berengaries recantation to Pope Nicholas The errour was then so young it had not learned to speake shew vs the same noueltie in our kneeling Till of late men held not the bread to be God of old they haue held it sacred This is the gesture of reuerence in our prayer at the receite as Master Burgesse well interpreted it not of Idolatrous adoration of the bread This was most-what in the eleuation the abolishing wherof cleares vs of this imputation you know we hate this conceit why doe you thus force wrongs vpon the innocent Neither are we alone in this vse The Church of Bohemie allowes and practises it and why is this errour lesse palpable in the wafers of Geneua If the King should offer vs his hand to kisse we take it vpon our kneees how much more when the King of heauen giues vs his sonne in these pledges But if there were not something more then iust reuerence why do we solemnely kneel at the Communion not at Baptisme Can you find no difference In this besides that there is both a more liuely and feeling signification of the thing represented we are the parties but in the other witnesses This therefore I dare boldly say that if your partner M. Smith should euer which God forbid perswade you to rebaptise your fittest gesture or any others at full age would be to receiue that Sacramentall water kneeling How glad you are to take all scraps that fall from any of ours for your aduantage would to God this obseruation of your malitious gatherings would make all our reuerend bretheren wâ—ary of their censures Surely no idolatry can be worse then that Popish 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The Bread and the Crucifixe striue for the hier place if we should therefore be so tyed to kneele before the bread as they are tyed to kneele before the Crucifixe their sentence were iust They adore the Crucifixe not wee the bread they pray to the Crucifixe not we to the bread they direct their deuotions at the best by the Crucifixe to their Sauiour wee doe not so by the
Treatisours Good things may be receiued from ill handes If the matter of any prayer be Popish fault it for what it containes not for whence it came what say you against vs in this more then Master Smith your stout Anabaptist saith of our baptizing of Infants Both of them equally condemned for Antichristian Still therefore wee boast of the free and cleare ayre of the Gospell if it be annoyed with some practicall euils we may be foule the Gospel is it selfe and our profession holy neither can we complaine of all euils while we want you SECTION LVI The iudgement of our owne and our neighbours of our Church THat which followeth is but wordes a short answere is too much That all Christendome magnifies the worthinesse of our Church in so cleare euidences of their own voyces you cannot denie and now when you see such testimonies abroad lest you should say nothing you fetch cauils from home Those men which you say complaine so much of their miserable condition vnder the Prelates impositions haue notwithstanding with the same pens and tongues not onely iustified our Church but extold it you haue found no sharper aduersaries in this verie accusation for which you malitiously cyte them How freely how sully haue they euinced the truth yea the happinesse of the Church of England against your false challenges and yet your forehead dare challenge them for Authors So hath their moderation opposed some appendances that they haue both acknowledged and defended the substance with equall vehemence to your opposition neither doe they suffer as you traduce them for seeking another Church-gouernement looke into the Millenaries petition the common voyce of that part I am deceiued if ought of their complaints sound that way much lesse of their sufferings deformitie in practise is obiected to them not indeuour of innouation That quarrell hath beene long silent your motion cannot reuiue it would God you could as much follow those men in moderate and charitable carriage as you haue out-run them in complaint It pleaseth you to deuise vs like pictures vpon course Canuasse which shew fairest at farthest attributing forraine approbation which you cannot denie to distance more then to desert How is it then that besides strange witnesses we which looke vpon this face without preiudice commend it God knowes without flatterie we can at once acknowledge her infirmities and blesse God for her graces Our neighbours yea our selues of Scotland know our Church so well that they doe with one consent praise her for one of Gods best daughters neither doe the most rigorous amongst them more dislike our Episcopall Gouernement then embrace our Church what fraud is this to flie from the Church in common to one circumstance wee can honour that noble Church in Scotland may we not dislike their alienations of Church-liuings If one thing offend doe all displease Yet euen this Gouernment which you would haue them resist to bonds and banishment who knowes not begins to find both fauour and place what choice other Churches would make as you doubt not so you care not If you regarded their sentence How durst your reuile her as a false harlot whom they honour as a deere sister If you were more theirs then we you might vpbraide vs Now you tell vs what perhaps they would doe we tell you what they doe and will doe Euen with one voyce blesse God for England as the most famous and flourishing Church in Christendome your handfull onely makes faces and enuies this true glorie Who yet you say despise not our graces no more then we those of Rome See how you despise vs while you say you are free from despight How malicious is this Comparison as if we were to you as Rome to vs and yet you despise vs more Wee graunt Rome a true Baptisme true Visibilitie of a Church though monstrously corrupted you giue not vs so much Thankes be to God wee care lesse for your censure then you doe for our Church We haue by Gods mercy the true and right vse of the word and Sacraments and all other essentiall giftes and graces of God if there might bee some further helpes in execution to make these more effectual we resist not But those your other imaginary ordinances as wee haue not so wee want not Neither the Chaldeans nor any Idolatrous enemies could make Sion Babylon nor the holy vessels prophane so as they should cease to be fitte for Gods vse but they were brought backe at the returne of the captiuitie to Ierusalem Such were our worshippe ministery Sacraments and those manifold subiects of your cauils which whiles you disgrace for their former abuse you call our good euill and willingly despise our graces SECTION LVII The issue of Separation ALL the sequell of my answerer is meerely sententious it is fitter for vs to learne then replie Where the truth gaines say you God looseth not I tell you againe where God looseth the truth gaineth not and where the Church looseth God which indowed her cannot but loose Alas what can the truth either get or saue by such vnkinde quarrels Surely suspicion on some handes on others reiection for as Optatus of his Donatists Betwixt our Licet and your Non licet many poore soules wauer and doubt neither will settle because wee agree not Thankes are not lost where new fauours are called for but where olde are denied while your Posie is Such as the mother such is the daughter where are our olde our any mercies They are vnthankfull which know what God hath done and confesse it not They are vnfaithfull to God and his Deputie which knowing themselues made to obey presume to ouer-rule and vpon their priuate authoritie obtrude to the Church those ordinances to bee obserued which neuer had being but in their owne idle speculation Your Sequestration and our confusion are both of them beneficial where they should not and as you pretend our confusion for the cause of your Separation So is your Separation the true cause of too much trouble and confusion in the Church Your odious tale of commixture hath cloyed and surfeited your reader already and receiued aunswere to satietie This one dish so oft brought foorth argues your pouertie The visible Church is Gods drag-net and field and floore and Arke here will be euer at her best sedge tares chaffe vncleane Creatures yet is this no pretence for her neglect The notoriously euill she casts from her brest and knee denying them the vse of her prayers and which your leaders mislike of her Sacrament If diuers through corruption of vnfaithfull officers escape censure yet let not the transgressions of some redound to the condemnation of the whole Church In Gods iudgement it shall not wee care little if in yours Wee tell wicked men they may goe to hell-with the water of Baptisme in their faces with the Church in their mouthes we denounce Gods iudgements vnpartially against their sinnes
Tâ—uth Sime reprehendas errantem patere me quae so errare cum talibus Aug. Hiâ—r Fr. Iohnsonin his Anâ—w to T. VVh p. 26. Aunsw ag Broughton p. 17 These Dutch Ch. offend not only in practicall disorders but in their Constitution Gouerament wâ—â—sh p c. Troubl and Excom at Amsterd p. 10. Brown charged with it by Barr. Letter to M. Egert â— Iohnson ibid. p. 194. Fr. Iohnson Inq. Act. 15. 38. Departing â— not going with them Barr. Pres. to the Separation dâ—fend In his obseruations p. 251. VVe doe not there condemne the parish Assemblies as separated from Christ but trâ—ue them not as yet gathered to Christ. So Conser â—â—th Sperin p. 9. Fr. Iohnson Inquir pag. 36. H. Bar. Obseruat 242. No faults disanull the being of a Church vntill contempt of Gods word be added thereunto after due conuiction The faults errors of a Church may be seuerely reproued and conuinced according to the quality thereof and yet the Church not be condemned N. B. Iob. â—4 19. Vulg. edit Câ—pr Epi ad Cornel. Non est maius pechcaatum quam Apostat are a Deo Aug. in Ps. 18. Prou. 6. 12. Iob 34. 18. Ezec 2. 3. Apocal. 2. 3 Thou hast laboured and not giuen in Tertâ—l de Pat Si hominibus Plaâ—â—tâ—r Dominus offenditur sivero illud entimur laboramus vt 〈◊〉 dco piacere 〈◊〉 maledicta debemus humana contemnere confessed by M. Iohâ—s loc seq Inq. of Th. VVhite p. 65. Gen 49. 7. Sep. But I will not discourage you in this affection least we find few in the same fault the most in stead of pitty and compassion affoording vs nothing but fury and indignation Cypr. de sâ—â—â—plic prael Quid facit in corde Christiano luporum seritas canum rabies August Confess l. 9. c. 9. Qualâ—a solet eructare turgens indigesta discordia Seâ— The first action laid against vs is of vnnaturalnes and ingratitude towards our mother the Church of England for our causelesse separation from her to which vniust accusation and triuiall querimony our most iust defence hath beene and is that to our knowledge we haue done her no wrong we do freely and with all thankfulnesse acknowledge euery good thing she hath and which our selues haue there receiued H. Barr. Praef. to the separ defended Causes of separ def p. 12. Confer with D. Andr. Praef. to separ def Gyff refuted touch Donat. Obseruat of M. H. Bar. p. 239. Fr. Iohns Reas. 9 ag M. Iac. p. 74. Iohns ag M. Iac. Except 3. Nota Bene. Ibid. Counterpoys pag. 127. 131. Barr. Confer With M. Sperm as Bar hims hath written it pag. 9 Fr. Iob. 7. Reas. aga Iac p. 64. G. Iohns Praef. to the Pastor Russin l. 2. Eccl. hist. c 3. Aug. Epist. Possid in vita Aug. Euseb hist. eccl Damnis grauissimis caedibus afficiebant armati diuersis telis Socrates l. 2. c. 22. 30. Cypr. l. 2. Ep. 8. Nouati pater in vico fame mortuns nec postea ab illo sepultus Sic Optat. l. 1. Purpurus Donatista occidit sororis filios c. G. Iohns Discourse of troubles and Excommunications at Amsterdam printed 1603 Ibid. p. 5. Discouery of Brownisme Vid. G. Iohns booke Inq. into Th. VVh Discou Same Epist. p. 15 They say Fiâ—â—a â—ponsae Mihi accusatio etiam vera contra fratrem displâ—cet Hieron aduersus Ruffin Bar. exam before the Archb. and L. Anderson Browne state of Christians d. 39 Qui non habet quod det quomodo det vox Donat. Opta l. 1 Barrow supra Fr. â—â—hns ag M. Iâ—cob p. 41. 〈◊〉 2. Sep. The superabundant grace of God couering and passing by the manifolde enormitiâ—s in that Church wherewith these good things are inseparably commingled and wherein we also through ignorance and infirmity were inwrapp ed. Sep. But what theÌ„ should we still haue continued in sinne that grace might haue abounded If God haue caused a further truth like a light in a darke place to shine in our hearts should wee still haue mingled that light with darkenesse contrary to the Lords owne practise Ge. 1. 4. and expresse precept 2. Cor. 6. 14. Gen. 1. 2. Es. 5. 20. VVoe to them that put darknesse for light Es. 59. 9. Deu. 21. 22 23. Sep. But the Church of England say you is our Mother and so ought not to be auoided But say I we must not so cleaue to holy mother Church as we neglect our heauenly father and his commandements which we know in that estate we could not but transgresse and that heynously and against our consciences not onely in the want of many Christian Ordinances to which we are most straightly bound both by Gods word and our owne necessities Mater Ecclesia mater est etiam matris nostrae Aug. Ep. 38. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Nemo per exteriorem violentiam corrumpitur si interior innocentia custodiatur c. â— q. 3. Custodi c. Ad docendum populum Israeliticum omnipotens deus prophetis praeconium dedi non regibus imperauit Aug. l. 2. contr Gau. c. 11. Barr. causes of scpera def p. 6. Brow Reform without tarrying Aug. contr Petilia n. l. 2. Optatus Mileuit lib. 3â— Barr. 2. Exaâ—â—iâ— nation before the L. Archb. and L. Chiefe-Iustice compar with his reply to M. Gyff Art 5. â— Sam. 24. 6. Num. 16. 3. Counter poys p. 230. 2. Chr. 13. 2. Chr. 14. 15 2. Chr. 29. 2. Chr. 30. 2. Chr. 34. Ezr. 2. 3. 2. Ezr. 4. 23. 24 a August Ep. 58 Pastores autem doctores quâ—s maxime vt discernerem voluisti eosdem puto esse sicut tibi visum est vt non alios Pastores alios Doctores intelligeremus sed ideo cum praedixisset Pastores subiunxisse Doctores vt intelligerent Pastores ad officium suum pertinere doctrinam Barr. ag Gyff inueighs for this cause against the Consistory of Geneâ—a Fr Iohns complaints of the Dutch and Fr. Churches Discription of a visible Church cannot make a Distinct. in the Definition of their Offices State of Christians 119. Descript. of vis Ch. H. Clap. Epist before his treatise of sinne ag the holy Ghost Brownists fourth Position Trouble and â—xcom at Amsterdam Fr. Iohns in a Letter to M. Smith Nulla necessitas maior est charitate Hâ—eron Apol. ad Ruff. Fr. Iun. de Eccl. Sed accidunt persaepe tempora quibus aut noua Ecclesia generatur aut altera pars interumpitur scilicet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 et tamen Ecclesia esse non dâ—sinit formà nimirum essentiali adhuc permanente Act 7. beg Cypr. l. 3. Ep. 9. Meminisse diaconi debent quoniam Apostolos id est Episcopos praepositos Dominus elegit Diaconos autem post ascensum Domini in caelos Apostoli sibi constituerunt Episcopatus su Ecclesiae ministros Rom. 1. 8. 1. Cor. 1. 5. 1. Thess. 1. 7. Gal 4. 15. Phil. 1. 2. Sep. But also in our most sinfull subiection to many Antichristian
enormities which we are bound to eschue as hell Fr. Iohns ag M. Iacob Bar. Gyff refuted i. Transgress p. 28. Sep. She is our Mother o may she be and yet not the Lords wife euery mother of children is not a wife Ammi and Ruhaeâ—ah were bidden to plead with their mother Apostate Israel plead that she was not the Lords wife nor he her husband Ho. 2. 1. 2. Cypr. de simpliâ— Praelator Adulterari non potest sponsa Christi incorrupta est Pudica 1. Kin. 12. 29. Hos. 2. 16. 2. 13. Sep. And though you forbid vs a thousand times yet must we plead not to exccuse our fault but to iustify our innocency And that not only nor so much in respect of our selues as of the truth which without sacriledge we maynot suffer to be condeÌ„ned vnheard And if you yet heare her not rather blame yourselues as deafe then vs as dumb Hierom. ad Eustoch Epitaph Paulae ex Psal 67. August contr Epist. Parmen li. 1. Epistol Iuni. ad Separ Giff. refut 2. transg Sep. Is not babylon the mother of Gods people whom he therefore commandeth to depart out of her least being partakers of her sinnes they also partake of her plagues Reuel 18. 2. Answ. forâ— speach to Counter poys Sep. And to conclude what say you more against vs for your mother the Church of England then the Papists do for their mother and your mothers mother the Church of Rome against you whom they condemn as vn-naturall bastards and impious Patricides in your separations from her A Simone Zelota Niceph. Alij a Ios. Arimath cuius hic sepulchrum cernitur Angli Pascha Graeco more celebrarunt Iacob Armin. Disp Cant. 8. 8. Fr. Iun. lib sing de Eccle. Phil. Morn du Plesses Lib. de Eccles. cap. 10. Counterp p. 171. 1. Pâ—nry Exam. before M. Fanshaw Iust. Yong. Fr. Iun. l. de Eccles M. Hooker Eccles. pol. Du Plesses l. de Eccl Iacob Armin. disput D. Reynolds Thes. D. Feild of the Ch. Reuel 3. 2. Sep. And were not Luther Zuingliâ— Cranmer Latimer and the rest begot to the Lord in the wombe of the Romish Church did they not receiue the knowledge of his truth when they stood actuall members of it whoÌ„ notwithstanding afterwards they forsooke and that iustly for her fornications Sep. But here in the name of the Church of England you wash your hands of all Babylonish abominations which you pretend you haue forsaken and her for and with them And in this regard you speake thus The Reformation you haue made of the many and maine corruptions of the Romish Ch. we do ingenuously acknowledge and deâ— withall imbrace with you all the truths which to our knowledge you haue receiued in stead of them But Rome was not built all in a day 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hierom. Apol. aduers. Ruffi 1. l. 1. â—tissa est mihi â—audatio tua id est accusatio mea Bonum ex integra natura malum ex singulari defectu Sep. The mistery of iniquity did aduance it selfe by degrees and as the rise was so must the fall be That man of sinne and lawlesse man must languish and die away of a consumption 2. Thes. 2 8. And what though manie of the highest Towers of Babel and of the strongest Pillers also be demolished pulled down yet may the building stand still though tottering to and fro as it doth and only vnderpropped and vpheld with the shoulder and arme of flesh without which in a very moment it would fall flat vpon and lie leuell with the earth Bar. Gr. ag Giff. Confer Eam passim Peâ—â—y in his exa Sep. You haue renounced many false Doctrines in Popery and in theire placâ—s embraced the truth Exod. 1. 2. 3. c. Ier. 20. 1. Ier. 5. vlt. But what if this truth bee taught vnder the same hatefull Prelacy in the same deuised office of Ministery and confused communion of the prophane multitude and that mingled with many greeuous errors Iohns Pres. to his 7. Reas. Iohns 7. Reas. p. 66. Tit. 3. 4. Psal. 69. 4. Mat 28. 19. Eph. 4. 11. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 3. 1. Act. 13. 1. Tim. 3. 9. 1. Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 15. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Discourse of the Trouble excem at Amst. Certaine Arg. ag the Com. with the Minist of England Counterpoys Vbires convenit quis non verba contemnat August de Ordin 2. Brow state of Christians Perplexae sunt istae duae initates in hoc seculo inuicemque permixtae donec vltimo iudicto dirimantur Aug. de Ciuit. d. l. 1. 33. Eze. 18. 20. Orig. Vnusquisque propter proprium peccatum morietur in proprid iusticiâ viuet c. Fr. Iohns Artic. ag the Dutch Fr. Answ. ag Brough ton Discouer of Brown Troubles and excom at Amst. Charact. pres Cypr. Ep. 2. Iidem in publico accusatores in occulto rei in semetipsos censores pariter nocentes Damnant foris quod intus operantur â—arr Conser with M. Hutchins c. D. â—ndr Sep. Shall some generall truthâ—s yea though few of them in the particulars may bee foundly practised sweeten and sanctifie the other errours doth not one heresie make an hereticke and doth not a little leauen whether in Doctrine or manners leâ—uen the whol lumpe 1. Cor. 5. 6. Gal. 5 9. Hag. 2 13. If Antichrist held not many truthes wherewith should he countenance so many forgeries or how could his work be a mistery of iniquitie which in Rome is more grosse and palpable but in England spun with a finer threed and so more hardly discouered But to wade no further in vniuersalities wee will take a little time to examine such particulars as you your selfe haue picked out for your most aduantage to see whether you bee so cleare of Babels Towers in your owne euidence as you beare the world in hand Inquir into M. white p. 35. Mat. 13. 33. M. Bredwell Hierom. In hoc Ignoratis quia malo exemplo possunt plurimi interire Sed per vnius delictum in omne populum Indaeorum iram dei legimus adue nisse 1. Tim. 3. 16. Sep. Where say you are those proud towers of their Vniuersall Hierarchie One in Lambeth another in Fulham and wheresoeuer a pontificall Prelate is or his Chauncellor Commissary or other subordinate there is a Tower of Babel vnruinated To this end I desire to know of you whether the office of Arch-bishoppes Bishoppes and the rest of that ranke were not parts of that accursed Hierarchie in queene Maries dayes and members of that man of sinne If they were then as shoulders and armes vnder that head the Pope and ouer the inferiour members and haue now the same Ecclesiasticall Iurisdiction deriued and continued vpon them wherof they were possessed in the time of Popery as it is plaine they haue by the first Parliament of queene Elizabeth Why are they not still members of that body though the head the Pope be cut off
and them Thus we flatter thus wee deceiue if yet they will needs run to perdition Perditio tua ex te Israel Our Clergie is so Romish as our Baptisme If therefore Romish because they came thence wee haue disproued it If therefore Romish because they haue beene vsed there we graunt and iustifie it That auncient confession of their faith which was famous thorough the world we receiue with them If they hold one God one Baptisme one heauen one Christ shall we renounce it Why should wee not cast off our Christendome and humanitie because the Romanes had both How much Rome can either challenge or hope to gaine in our Clergie and Ministration is well witnessed by the blood of those Martyrs eminent in the Prelacie which in the fresh memories of many was shed for God against that Harlot and by the excellent labours of others both Bishops and Doctors whose learned pens haue pulled downe more of the wals of Rome then all the corner-creeping Brownists in the world shall euer be able to doe while Amsterdam standeth It is you that furnish these aduersaries with aduantages through your wilfull diuisions Take Scilurus his arrowes single out of the sheafe the least finger breakes them while the whole bundle feares no stresse wee know well where the blame is our deseruings can be no protection to you you went from vs not we from you Plead not our constraint you should not haue beene compelled to forsake vs while Christ is with vs But who compels you not to call vs brethren to denie vs Christians your zeale is so farre from iustifying the wicked that it condemnes the righteous SECTION LVIII The Brownists scornefull opinion of our people How scornefully doe you turne ouer our poore rude multitude as if they were beasts not men or if men not rude but sauage This contempt needed not These sonnes of the earth may goe before you to heauen Indeed as it was of old said that all Egyptians were Physitions so may it now of you All Brownists are diuines no Separatist cannot prophesie No sooner can they looke at the skirts of this hill but they are rapt from the ordinary pitch of men Either this change is perhaps by some strange illumination or else your learned paucitie got their skill amongst our rude and prophane multitude we haue still many in our rude multitude whom wee dare compare with your teachers neither is there any so lewd and prophane that cannot pretend a scandall from your separation Euen these soules must be regarded though not by you Such were some of you but ye are washed c. The wise hearted amongst vs doe more then suspect find out our weakenesses and bewaile them yet doe they not more discouer our imperfections then acknowledge our truth If they bee truely wise wee cannot suspect them they cannot forsake vs Their charitie will couer more then their wisdomes can discouer SECTION LIX The conclusion from the fearefull answere of Separation MY last threat of the easier aunsweres of whoredomes adulteries then Separation you think to skoffe out of countenance I feare your conscience will not alwayes allow this mirth Our Consistories haue spared you ynough let those which haue tryed say whether your corrupt Eldership be more safe iudges If ours imprison iustly yours excommunicate vniustly To be in Custodie is lesse grieuous then out of the Church at least if your censures were worth any thing but contempt As Hierom said of the like It is well that malice hath not so great power as will you shall one day I feare finde the Consistorie of heauen more rigorous if you wash not this wrong with your teares That tribunall shall find your confidence presumption your zeale furie you are bold surely more then wise To proclame we haue no need of such criers doubtlesse your head hath made Proclamations long now your hand begins What proclaime yee Separation from the Communion Gouernment Ministery and worship of the Church of England what needed it Your act might haue saued your voice what should our eyes and eares be troubled with one bad obiect But why separate you from these Because they rise vp rebelliously against the Scepter of Christ The Scepter of Christ is his word he holdes it out we touch and kisse it What one sentence of it doe we wilfully oppose away with these foolish impieties you thrust a Reed into your Sauiors hand say Haile King of the Iewes and will needes perswade vs none but this is his rodde of Iron Lastly vpon what warrant Of his will and Testament you may wrong vs But how dare you fasten your lies vpon your Redeemer and Iudge What clause of his hath bid you separate We haue the true Copies As we hope or desire to be saued we can find no sentence that soundeth toward the fauour of this your act Must God be accused of your wilfulnesse Before that God and his blessed Angels and Saints we feare not to protest that we are vndoubtedly perswaded that whosoeuer wilfully forsakes the Communion Gouernement Ministerie or worshippe of the Church of England are enemies to the Scepter of Christ and rebels against his Church and annointed neither doubt we to say that the Mastershippe of the Hospitall at Norwich or a lease from that Citie sued for with repulse might haue procured that this separation from the Communion Gouernement and worshippe of the Church of England should not haue beene made by Iohn Robinson FINIS A Table of all the Sections contained in this Booke THE entrance into the worke fol. 1. The answerers Preamble fol. 3. The parties written to and their crime fol. 6. The kindes of separation and which is iust fol. 8. The antiquitie and examples of separation fol. 12. What separation is to be made by Churches in their planting or restauration fol. 16. What separation the Church of England hath made fo 19 Constitution of a Church fol. 21 Order 2. Part of Constitution how farre requisite and whether hindred by Constraint fol. 23. Constraint requisite fol. 24 Constitution of the Church of England fol. 26. The Answerers title fol. 31. The Apostasie of the Church of England fol. 33. The Separatists acknowledgements of the graces of the Church of England fol. 39. The vnnaturalnes of some principall separatists fol. 42. What the Separatists thinke themselues beholden to the Church of England for fol. 44. The Motherhood of the Church of England how farre it obligeth vs. fol. 45. The want of pretended Ordinances of God whether sinfull to vs and whether they are to bee set vp without Princes fol. 48. The bonds of Gods word vniustly pleaded by the Separatists fol. 51. The necessity of their pretended Ordinances fol. 52. The enormities of the Church in common fol. 55. The Church of England is the Spouse of Christ. fol. 56. How the Church of England hath separated from Babylon fol. 57. The Separation made
by our holy Martyrs fol. 62. What separation England hath made fol. 63. The maine grounds of Separation fol. 65. The truth and warrant of the Ministery of England fol. 66. Confused Communion of the prophane fol. 70. Our Errours intermingled with Truth fol. 71. Whether our Prelacie be Antichristian fol. 74. The iudgement and practise of other Reformed Churches fol. 77. Our Synodes determination of things indifferent fol. 78. Sinnes sold in our Courts fol. 81. Our loyaltie to Princes cleared theirs questioned fol. 84. Errours of Free will c. fained vpon the Church of England fol. 86. Kneeling at the Sacrament of the Lords Supper fol. 87. Whether our Ordinarie and Seruice-Booke be made Idols by vs. fol. 89. Marriage not made a Sacrament by the Church of England fol. 95. Commutation of Penance in our Church fol. 98. Oath ex Officio fol. 99. Holy-daies how obserued in the Church of England 100. Our approbation of an vnlearned Ministery disproued fol. 102. Penances inioyned in the Church of England fol. 103. The practises of the Church of England concerning the Funerals of the dead fol. 104. The Churches still retained in England fol. 108. The Founders and Furnitures of our Churches fol. 110. On what ground Separation or Ceremonies was obiected fol. 112. Estimation of Ceremonies and subiection to the Prelates fol. 114. The state of the Temple and of our Church in resemblance fol. 117. Whether Ministers should endure themselues silenced fol. 119. Power of reforming abuses giuen to the Church and the issue of the neglect of it fol. 121. The view of the sinnes and disorders of others wherupon obiected and how farre it should affect vs. fol. 124. The nearenesse of the State and Church and the great errours found by the Separatists in the French and Dutch Churches fol. 127. Conuersation with the world fol. 132. The impure mixtures of the Church of England fo 133. The iudgement of our owne and our neighbours of our Church fol. 137. The issue of Separation fol. 140 The Brownists scornefull opinion of our people fol. 143. The Conclusion from the fearefull aunswere of Separation fol. 144. Errata Read welbeloueds for welbelouedst Epist pa. vlt. Conâ—iction for coniunction pag. 32. line 19. Vncharitablenesse for vnchariblenesse pag. 47. line 18. Optat. lib. 3. for Opt. lib. 30. marg pag. 49. Rules of Christ for rules Christ. pag. 50. line 1. Places onwards for places onwards pag. 66. line 18. Our Ministerie for your Ministerie pag. 67. line 8. That houses for what houses pag. 80. line 16. waryof for weary of pag. 88. line 16. shrifte for strife pa. 99. l. 12 Enuie for annoy pag. 103. line 13. Ingenuously for ingeniously pag. 104. line 19 which are in for which are in pag. 107. line 13. Besides many quotations in the margent are misplaced the matter will leade the Reader to the right place The words of the aduersarie are onely those which haue this Note of Sep. set before them Meam iniuriam patieÌ„tertuli impietatem contra SpoÌ„sam Christi ferre non potui Hier ad Vigilant Zach. 8. 19. Matth. 18. 7. Otho Frising ex Philon. Vr. Chaldaeorum Ruffiin Ecclâ—s hist. l. 2. c. 26. Dan. 3. Vid. Treatis of certainâ— godly Minist ag Barr. 1. Retorted Sâ—p It is a hard thing euen for sober minded men in cases of controuersie to vse soberly the aduantages of the times vpon which whilst men are mounted on high they vse to behold such as they oppose too ouerlie and not without contempt and so are oft times emboldened to roule vpon them as from aloft very weake and weightlesse discourses thinking any sleight and slender opposition sufficient to oppresse those vnderlings whom they haue as they suppose at so great an aduantage Vpon this very presumption it commeth to passe that this Author vndertaketh thus solemnly and seuerely to censure a cause whereof as appeareth in the sequell of the discourse hee is vtterly ignorant which had he beene but halfe so carefull to haue vnderstood as hee hath beene forward to censure hee would either haue beene I doubt not more equall towards it or more weightie against it * 2. Confuted * Hier. Marco presbyt De cauernis cellularum damnamus orbem in sacco cinere volutati de Episcopis sententiam ferimus Quid facit sub tunica paenitentis regius animus Cypr. l. 3. Ep. 9. Haec sunt initia haereticorum vt sibi placean vt praepositum superbo tumore contemnant Harison once theirs in Psal. 122. of Brown Antichristian pride and bitternes Bredw pref M Brinsly his pref to the 2. part of the VVatch. Optat. Mil. de Donat. Collegae non eritis siâ—o litis fratres estis c. Disclaimed by themselues Answer against Broughton page 21. Separat schism M. Giff. an ignorant Priest Barr. p. 64. Confer of D. And. M. Huchius with Barrow M. Spr. 3. 〈◊〉 siderat Iren. l. 1. Per singulos dies nouum aliquod adsectant c. * Bar. Confer with Hutchins fo 1. Browne estatâ— of true Christians Defence of true Christians against the Doct. of Oxford Iohnson against Iacob passim Barr. against Gyfford Sepa As this Epistle is come to mine hands so I wish the answere of it may come to the hands of him that occasioned it Intreating the Christian Reader in the name of the Lord vnpartially to behold without either preiudice of cause or respect of person what is written on both sides and so from the Court of a sound conscience to giue iust iudgement To M. Smith and M. Rob. Ring-leaders of the late separation at Amsterd Charact. of the Beast written by M. Smith Pref. Be it knowne therefore to all the separation that we account them in respect of their constitution to be as very an Harlot as either her Mother the Church of England or her Grandmother Rome is c. Iterato Baptizatus scienter it erato Dominum crucifigit De consecr dist 4. Qui vis c. * The crime of separation how great Sep. The crime here obiected is separation a thing very odious in the eyes of all them from whom it is made as euermore casting vpon them the imputation of euill whereof all men are impatient And hence it commeth to passâ— that the Church of England can better brooke the vilest persons continuing communion with it then any whomsoeuer separating from it though vpon neuer so iust and well grounded reasons Vid. Iohnson Preface to his Inquirie Esay 5. 20. M. Penry in his Disc. of this subiect Num. 16 31. â—xod 32. 30. Prou. 21. 2. Sepa And yet separation from the world and so from the men of the world and so from the Prince of the world that raigneth in them and so from whatsoeuer is contrarie to God is the first steppe to our communion with God and Angels and good men as the first steppe to a Ladder is to leaue the earth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Num. 18. 14 Num. 16. 9. Deut. 10. 1. Exod. 13. 12. Leuit. 15. 21. Deut.