by saincte Augustine that Christe is that rocke whereon the Churche is builded and not Peter nor Peters chaire vnlesse you take Peters confession made before be came at Rome to be his Chaire and then ye make with S. Augustine and vs against the Pope for Rome was not his chaire before he was bishop there You see that Peter is here the figure of the whole Churche in makyng his confessiō not of the churche of Rome onely you see that as Christe is the rocke so representeth Peter the christian people and not the people of Rome onely muche lesse the Pope onely you see that Petrus to saie the Churche is builded vpon Petra Christ and not Petra Christe builded vpon Petrus Peter you see that suche as will haue Peter beyng a man to be their rocke to builde vpon bee sectaries and heretikes diuidyng them selues from Christe despisyng hym and choosyng men and that thei onely be true Christians whiche wil not builde vpon Peter nor vpon any other man but vpon the rocke onely whiche is Christ hymself you see thei that builde vpon Peter maie saie I holde of Cephas whiche is Peter but thei that builde vpon the rocke maie saie I holde or I am of Christe Wherefore I conclude that all that builde vpon the Pope or his chaire as it were vpon the rocke as thei bée called so bee thei in deede Papistes not Christians as were all those false orders of hypocrites who forsakyng to builde vpon the rocke Christ and buildyng vpon men woorse then Peter Paule or Apollo a thousande tymes forsooke to saie Ego sum Christi I am of Christ I am a Christian and saied Ego Franciscanus ego Dominicanus c. I am of Francisce I am of Dominike a Franciscane a Dominicane a Bernardine yea an Augustinian cōtrary to this doctrine of S. Augustine whiche argueth that those hypocrites were neuer of his institution as thei falsely feigned thē selues to be And as S. Augustine witnesseth with Erasmus that Christe is Petra and not Peter nor Rome Peters chaire or see so hath Erasmus felowe witnesses enough of the auncient doctours of the churche yea and generall Councelles too that Popes were heretikes and therefore their chaire was not the rocke but waueryng and vncertaine sande the buildyng whereon did runne to the ruine of heresie Nowe you maie see good readers the cause why M. Dorman hath thus alleged vnto you sainct Hieromes sentence headlesse leauyng out the mention of Christ whom onely S. Hierome acknowledgeth for the head that the wordes of the rocke nexte folowyng might seme to be spoken of Peters rotten chaire or of ruinous Rome and not of our Sauiour Iesus Christe who liueth and reigneth for euer With like fraude did M. Dormā leaue also that whiche nexte foloweth in S. Hierome of the house without the whiche he that eateth the Pascall lambe is a prophane or vnholie man and the arke of Noe without the whiche all that bee perishe by the floudde For though that place might seeme to make for M. Dormans purpose concernyng the supremacie of the bishop of Rome as Erasmus hath noted yet he knowyng or some manne warnyng hym that it is in deede nothyng to his purpose for that the house without the whiche the Pascall lambe maie not bee eaten the Arke without the whiche no man can bée saued frō the floude by all olde doctours is interpreted to bee the one vniuersall churche of Christ and by none to be the churche of Rome and therefore like a wise man orels a false Fore hath he let that folowyng alone also as he cutte of Christe the head goyng and ioigned nexte before and so he hath tolde you a tale bothe without head and taile thereby to proue the Pope who is Antichriste to be the head of Christes churche Dorman Fol. 14. Saie vnto them as saincte Hierome saied vnto the Ibidem heretikes Vitalis and Miletus because thei are aduersaries to this seate that you knowe them not that thei scatter are schismatikes altogether out of the churche that gather not with Peters successour Nowell By your leaue sir you saie vntruelie that saincte Hierome saieth he knoweth not Vitalis and Meletius whom you call Miletus because thei were aduersaries to the seate of Rome but because thei were aduersaries to the true doctrine of the moste blessed Trinitie which Damasus did defende Saincte Hieromes woordes are these Non noui Vitalem Meletium respuo ignoro Paulinum Quicunque tecum non colligit spargit hoc est qui Christi non est est Antichristi That is to saie I knowe not Vitalis I refuse Meletius Paulinus I knowe not Whosoeuer dooeth not gather with thee he scattereth that is he that is not of Christe is of Antichriste Thus farre sainct Hierome I praie you maister Dorman what is in these woordes but thei maie as well bee spoken to saincte Augustine bishoppe of Hippo in Afrike or to saincte Ambrose Bishoppe of Milane or to any other godlie Bishoppe holdyng the truthe of the blessed Trinitie againste Vitalis Meletius and Paulinuus teachyng erronious doctrine and vsyng vnfitte termes thereof Here is neither mention made of this seate or that or the aduersaries thereto as causes why sainct Hierome should not knowe these menne but because thei taught false doctrine and Damasus taught true and therefore gathered not with hym but scattered and were not of Christe but of Antichriste therefore did saincte Hierome not knowe thē he beeyng a Romaine would not acknowledge their errours cloked vnder a straunge and newe inuented Greeke ternie But beeyng a Romaine prieste he well knewe Damasus the Romaine Bishoppe and so consequentlie his owne bishoppe as euery man is bounde to knowe his owne godlie Bishop he knewe his true doctrine and plaine Latine termes whereby he vttered the plaine truthe plainelie and therefore so knowyng hym and his doctrine he ioigned with hym in communion not for the seates sake or for that he was Peters successour therein but for the truthes sake whiche he beeyng Peters successour in truthe of doctrine more then in seate or Chaire did professe Againe the cause why saincte Hierome did not knowe but reiected Vitalis Meletius and Paulinus was not for that thei did not submitte them selues to Damasus as to the supreme head of the Churche or for that cause tooke them to bee enemies as maister Dorman would haue it seeme for there was no suche matter then in question but because thei did not agree with Damasus in the truthe but taughte falselie of the greateste poinctes of our religion and would haue wrapped the same in obscure and strange termes therby to deceiue the more therefore did sainct Hierome not knowe thē This is the true sense of this place good readers as al learned that wil reade it shall easily perceiue Wherfore maister Dorman thus corruptyng and falsifiyng Saincte Hierome by takyng awaie from hym and addyng to hym what he liste and drawyng the woordes of sainct Hierome concernyng the doctrine of
in the scriptures declared to be so by God appoincted so is there no disorder that seuerall churches haue seuerall bishoppes to their heades but is moste necessarie for all good order so to bee And so is that sentence of Nazianzene generally takeÌ„ nothyng against the gouernance of seuerall bishops in seuerall diocesses no more then it is againste the ciuill regiment of seuerall gouernours in seueral countreis For as it is apperteinyng to God onely to our sauior Christ his sonne by their almightie power wisedome to gouerne all y e world all the church so is it enough and to muche for any one man well to gouerne a little parcell therof And so to returne to Nazianzene his saiyng VVhere is no rule there is no order Truthe it is but where one Bishop as one head is in euery diocesse there is some rule therefore there is some order VVhere many rule there is seditioÌ„ It is true if many magistrates haue equall rule in one coÌ„mon wealth or if many ecclesiasticall persones haue equall authoritie in one seuerall Churche wee confesse it is like to their phantasie who would haue many equall Goddes to rule the worlde But one seuerall ruler in one seuerall dominion one seuerall bishop in one seuerall diocesse dooe resemble one God rulyng one whole worlde and one Christ ruling one whole churche so well as earthly creatures maie resemble the heaueÌ„lie creatour But one earthlic man by gouernyng all the whole worlde or the whole churche throughout the worlde to resemble God or Christe is a presumption vnhearde of but onelie in the Pope of Rome Let therefore seuerall rulers and Bishoppes holde themselues contented with seuerall dominions and diocesses accordyng to Gods ordinaunce For it is false that suche seuerall rulers in seuerall places doo cause sedition and it is prooued false by the ciuile gouernemente of diuers rulers in diuers couÌ„treis for so it staÌ„deth for the moste part throughout the worlde at this daie Wherefore M. Dorman and D. Hardyng maie as well saie that the worlde is seditiously gouerned by diuers princes as the Churche by seuerall Bishoppes But as Nazianzene euer dreamed of one Emperour ouer all the worlde to auoide seditioÌ„ though he teacheth there is one God no more did he though he teache one Christe yet euer dreame of one onely head bishoppe or Pope ouer the whole Churche throughout the worlde to auoide schismes as dreamyng M. Dorman phantasieth and thinketh all men that bee awake to dreame too as he dooeth He speaketh further in his sleape and saâ—eth Howe shall wee then saie Our Lorde loueth Syon aboue all the tabernacles of Iacob What this dooeth meane or to what purpose it is I knowe not And I beléeue M. Dorman when he waketh if euer he wake can not tell hymself For Pighius out of whoÌ„ he borowed it is a sleape and neuer will wake to tell his dreame Dorman fol. 7. There is no doubt therefore but that Christe hath prouided for his churche whiche he redemed so dearely as with the expence of his owne moste precious bloud a iudge and chiefe ruler to ende and determine so many controuersies as he knewe should molest and infest the same Thei caÌ„ not saie that are aduersaries kicke againste this truthe that this whiche I allege was in the olde lawe and in a shadowe that these daies and this tyme requier other maners For that argumente hath their Englishe apologie soluted and pronounced that so to saie were Plusquam ridiculum seeyng there was then idem deus idem spiritus idem Christus eadem fides eadem doctrina eadem spes eadem haeredit as ideÌ„ foedus cadem vis verbi dei the same God the same holy ghost the same Christ the same faithe the same doctrine the same hope the same heritage the same couenaunte the same strength of Goddes woorde Nowell M. Dorman is so mightie in reasonyng and hath so many and so good groundes that he is full of conclusions as you sée We graunt Christe hath prouided for his churche so dearely bought and beloued of hym as well as he did for the Iues better too For wheras thei had but one chief bishop for their whole nation he hath by the ministerie of his Apostles prouided euery greate citie euery Diocesse of suche a one that thei maie bee the better gouerned and lesse pained to traueill farre for the decision of their doubtes and controuersies Wherefore in these poinctes wee make no exception to your olde shadowe nor require no new maners But as thei and we haue one God one spirite one Christe one faithe one doctrine one inheritaunce and so foorthe that so in like maner there bee one like ecclesiasticall â—egâ—ment that euery one diocesse countrey or nation haue in like wise one bishop to bee their iudge and determiner of doubtes as had the nation of the Iewes But M. Dorman dealeth not truely with the Apologie The Apologie declareth that the church of God was muche obscured and broughte to a small number emongeste the Iewes and it shâ—weth thaâ— it hath in like wise also been obscured and broughte to a small number emongest Christians The aduersaries of the Gospell who are the corrupters thereof and would haue no corruption nor decaie of the Churche now noted or knowen saie although the Churche of God was obscured and brought to a little number in the old lawe and in the shadowe and figure when nothing was perfite yet can it not be so in the time of the Gospell the tyme of grace and perfection c. The Apologie replieth That defence can not serue for there was the same God the same spirit the same Christ c. then as is now and therefore as the Churche decaied then so maie it and hath it decaied now M. Dorman handleth the matter as though he could prooue by the Apologie that because there was the same God the same Christ the same holy ghost c. in y e Iuishe church as is now therfore must there be one head bishop ouer all the christian churche dispersed throughout y e world as there was one head bishop ouer all y t Iues. Whiche foloweth no more then that we must haue circumcision now for that the Iues had it then Vnlesse M. Dorman thinke he may mingle In lente vnguentum thinges moste impertinent together and prooue quidlibet ex quolibet all thinges of euery thing at his pleasure Dorman Fol. 7. But yet this I proteste that apon the auctoritie of ther Apologie whiche with me is in that conceit that it is with all honest and learned men that is to saie taken as in deede it is for a fardle of lies I am no whitte the bolder to reason thus Nowell Here is at once a protestation and also a confutation of the Apologie For other confutation or answere to it then this and suche like as you shall heare hereafter haue thei not hetherto made Wherefore as iustlie might we chaleÌ„ge all the
erat sancta quę apud impios non erat Nunc autē aut tales aut peiores facti sunt Christiani quales sūt hęretici aut gentiles adhuc autem maior continētia apud illos inuenitur quamuis in schismate sint quà m apud Christianos Qui ergo vult cognoscere quae sit vera ecclesia Christi vnde cognoscat nisi tantummodo per scripturas Sciens ergo Dominus tantam confusionem rerum in nouissimis diebus esse futuram ideo mandat vt Christiani qui sunt ī Christianitate volentes firmitatem accipere verae fidei ad nullam rem fugiant nisi ad scripturas Alioqui si ad alia respexerint scandalizabūtur peribunt non intelligentes quae sit vera ecclesia That is to saie Let them that bee in Christianitie flie to the scriptures And wherfore ought al Christians at this time to flie to the scriptures Because in this time sith heresies possessed those Churches there can bee no proofe of true christianitie neither can there be any other refuge of Christians desiryng to knowe the true faithe but the diuine scriptures For before it was declared by many meanes whiche was the true churche and whiche was Gentilitie but now thei who would knowe whiche is the true churche can knowe it by no meanes but onelie by the scriptures Why so For all these thinges whiche are properly Christes in y e truth the same hath heresie also in schisme Heresie hath churches likewise and the diuine Scriptures likewise Bishops likewise and other orders of clearkes Baptisme likewise the sacramente of thankes geuyng likewise and all other thinges to conclude euen Christ himself He therefore that would knowe whiche is the true churche of Christ how can he knowe it in so greate cōfusion of likelihoode but onely by the scriptures Further the churche of Christ might be knowen before by the maners of it when the conuersation either of all or of the moste parte of Christians was holie whiche was not so emongest the wicked But now Christians are become either suche or woorse then be the heretikes or Gentiles yea there is greater continencie emongeste them though thei bee in schisme then is emongest the Christians He therefore that would knowe whiche is the true Churche of Christe how can he knowe it but onelie by the scriptures The Lorde therefore knowyng that in the last daies there would be so greate confusion of thinges dooeth commaunde that Christians whiche be in Christianitie willyng to haue the suertie of true faithe dooe flie to no other thing but to the scriptures Els if thei haue respecte to other thynges thei shall stumble or faile of the truthe and perishe not vnderstāding whiche is the true churche Thus farre that aunciente author whose sentence and verie woordes though for auoidyng of prolixitie alittle intermitted I haue truely rehearsed You maie see that this auncient writer will not allowe that you beeyng the one partie should claime to your self the name of Christians the name of the churche the names of bishops and the names of the cleargie and so to take vpon you as iudges to condemne the other partie but that bothe you and wee must be iudged and tried whether we be in Christianitie and in the true church by the scriptures You see the names of the churche of Bishops and cleargie whiche are common to heretikes with Christians can not prooue you to bee catholikes for that heretikes vse the same names but that bothe you and wee muste knowe by the Scriptures whether wee bee in the true faithe or no for that as he saieth in this confusion of thinges bothe the true churche and the true faith must bee knowen by the Scriptures onelie and by no other thyng and that whosoeuer goeth aboute otherwise to knowe them shall stumble and perishe Wherein this author dooeth agree with S. Augustine S. Hierome S. Chrysostome and with all the olde Doctours of the auncient churche Whereby al men maie well vnderstande that it is not our newe opinion as M. Dorman would haue it seme but the olde true perswasion of all the auncient doctors and godly fathers of the primitiue churche that the Scriptures as moste indifferent and certaine ought to be iudges in controuersies in religion rather then Doctours then Councelles then your Churche then dead menne then angelles yea that the scriptures should bee iudge and not thei And that the true sense of scriptures if doubte rise thereof maie bee and must be gathered by the conference of the scriptures who doo clearly expounde themselues For the declaration whereof the said doctors doo so often and largely write that the rehersall thereof would fil an huge volume but I did thinke that this much would suffice But you Papistes will neuer allowe the Scripture as iudge nor the sense thereof to be certaine vntill it come to the exposition of the Churche and you will bee that churche that must so expounde it your self that is you will graūt no sense to be true but your own sense But wee deny that you are the true Churche that hath this autoritie of determinyng of the sense of the scriptures And if you will saie still your are the churche neither will nor can proue it but onely by so saiyng we be not so voide of all sense and vnderstāding but that we perceiue you will haue no sense but your owne and that you will be still bothe parties and iudges in your own causes againste vs as the Iuishe high Prieste Phariseis and Scribes would needes be against Christ and his Apostles who did by your iudgemēt as it semeth allege the scriptures for themselues againste the saied high Prieste Scribes and Phariseis in vaine for that thei being the churche as you now be were the iudges of the sense of the saied scriptures by Christ and his Apostles alleged And I am sure that the high Prieste with his Iuishe churche was able to saie as muche for the ordinarie succession of the high Priestes his predecessours euen from Aaron vntil his time for antiquitie for consente and for vniuersalitie againste Christe and his Apostles so fewe in comparison and as it seemed latelie starte vp as you are able to saie for your churche or against vs. But yet we doo thinke that the woorde of God as it was alleged by Christe and his Apostles against the saied high priest and his churche so maie it and ought also to be alleged by vs against your high priest and your churche and that the same woords of God whiche shal iudge bothe you vs in the worlde to come as is saied ought also to be iudge betwéen you and vs here in this transitorie worlde for so dooeth our sauiour Christ teache so doo S. Chrysostome S. Augustine and S. Hierome with all the auncient doctors of the Churche teache also as hath been partely besore specified crie you neuer so muche to the contrarie and make you neuer so many exceptions to the scriptures and claime
Scholasticall distinction of caput absolutum and ministeriale healpe the matter nor yet Hosius declaration tendyng to the same ende how Bishops bee both seruauntes and lordes can in this case any thyng further you For there can not possiblie bee one onelie head minister in earth ouer all the churche throughout the whole worlde more then there can bee one vniuersall ciuill heade in earth ouer all the worlde it self But note the intollerable ambition of the Pope who when he saw he could not defeÌ„de the name of the Head of the vniuersall church rather then he would loose that onely sounde of this name Head of the church he qualiâ—ieth it with ministeriale to saie a seruing head of the church he might as good cheape haue been contente with the single title of a minister of y e churche And so he semeth sometyme colourablie in shewe to be contente callyng hymself seruum seruorum Dei the seruaunt of the seruauntes of God But he plaieth in deede Rex Regum dominus dominantium I knowe M. Dorman dooth so qualifie this the Popes supremacie terming him caput ministeriale the ministeriall head for that Christe is the absolute heade of all But yet in respecte of the whole churche as beyng vnder the Pope he will haue hym called caput the heade But I would haue hym to make that relation of caput and these woordes Seruus seruuorum to agree and to bee bothe caput and seruus or minister respectu eiusdem the head and the seruauÌ„t in one respecte specially claimyng suche a kinde of capitalitie as dooeth the Pope whiche can not agrée with the humble ecclesiasticall ministerie And I thinke he shall finde some difficultie and muche hypocrisie and more crueltie of suche a headie seruaunte and seruile head who if he be head he is a cruel and frantike head mangling his owne members as did Lyrurgus in his furious phrensie if he be a seruaunt he plaieth the false traitour murdering his felowe seruantes whose part at the commyng of the Lorde shal bee with hypocrites and homicides You might therefore as good cheape graunt the Pope simplie to bee minister ecclesiae a minister of the churche and therefore no head but an inferior to the Churche vniuersall But the truthe is in deede that the Pope is neither heade nor minister of Christes churche but a sworne enemie to bothe which he well declareth by his ragyng furie againste the true churche and members of Christ our head M. Dorman harpeth to muche vpon this one stryng out of tune for his purpose I meane the example of the Iewishe high prieste whiche as it declareth that it were good that euery seueral churche of euery seuerall nation had their seuerall head Bishop so dooeth it prooue nothyng that all churches of all nations must haue one onely heade in earth whiche is not possible to be That he saith as dooeth Hosius God would by this one earthly head the Pope shewe his exceadyng greate loue towardes maÌ„kinde is a manifest lie for it is euidente by experience that the Deuill the homicide the head of helle hath by this his principall minister the Pope shewed his murderyng malice againste mankinde more then euer he did by any Nerons Domitians Maximines or suche like bloudie tyrauntes And as the deuill hath vsed the Pope his ministers handes to al murders so hath that prince of darkenesse and father of lies by the Popes meanes moste darkened the light of Christes Gospell and hath vsed his polluted mouthe and tongue thereby to vtter all lies and blasphemies againste God and the truthe of his woorde Dorman Fol. 9. Because Christ is kyng of all kynges and lorde of all lordes because if it so pleased hym he could rule al this worlde muche better then it is ruled without the help of any other whereof he hath his absolute power coÌ„sidered no neede shall we therefore saie that there bee not nor neede to be any kynges here in earth VVhen sainct S. Paule called the man the head of the woman denied he therefore Christ to bee her head Kyng Saule when he was called by the Prophete Samuel caput in tribubus Israel the head of the tribues of Israel was God thinck you excluded that he should not be their head To vse examples more familier the archbishop of Cauntorburie is the heade of the Bishopricke and diocesse of London as he is of al the bishoprickes within his prouince and yet can not a man infer apon this that therfore the B. of LoÌ„doÌ„ is not the head of that his diocesse Nowell We dooe not sticke with you nor with Hosius your author about this name Head but that it maie be attributed to men as to the kynges and Iudges of Israel Saule Dauid and suche like But I praie you coÌ„sider by the waie when the scripture saieth that Saule was by God made head ouer the tribes of Israel whiche place Hosius and you dooe allege whether he wer appoincted heade ouer the tribe of Leui also that is ouer the Cleargie as well as ouer other tribes for that is to be considered We knowe that Christ is the onely heade ouer all and that he vseth kynges to bee seuerall heades vnder him vpon earth in their seuerall dominions as sigismunde in Polonia for Hosius vseth that example but we knowe aswell againe that God vseth no one kyng to be the onelie earthlie heade vnder hym ouer all the worlde whiche yet bothe Hosius and you should conclude M. Dorman if you would bryng in these examples to gather thereby that there oughte to bee one head in earth vnder Christe ouer all churches throughout the whole worlde dispersed for so should you haue prooued the saiyng of the Apologie vntrue and our argumente faultie But where the Apologie and we dooe thus reason Christe is the onelie head ouer the vniuersall churche Ergo he needeth not any other generall head in earth vnder hym neither can any mortall man be any suche head You like a good Logician stickyng to the matter dooe prooue that there bee diuers seuerall heades in the Churche vnder Christe whiche wée neuer denied no more then wée denie that there bée seuerall kynges rulers in earth vnder God though we denie that there is one onelie kyng or Emperour of all the worlde But neither by your Logike shall you euer prooue nor by your Rhetorike perswade to any reasonable men by suche vnreasonable reasonyng and examples impertinente that there is or can be any one head in earth vnder Christ either of all the worlde or of all the Churche dispersed thrâ—ughout the worlde For to gouerne the whole world or the whole Churche is the peculiar and onelie office of God and Christ and a thyng vnpossible to any earthlie manne who hath muche and to muche a dooe well to gouerns one little parcell thereof as I haue saied before And where you mingle kynges Bishops together whose offices are distincte and vse the examples of the Archebishop of
in Gods wisedome conteined in the same Suenckfeldius saieth as M. Dorman reporteth The scripture is not Gods woorde but dead letters and no more accompte to bee made thereof then of other creatures We saie the Scriptures are the verie woordes of GOD the woorde of life in the whiche life euerlastyng is to bée soughte and founde and that the Scriptures are the moste diuine gifte of God and aboue all other giftes creatures and thynges excepte onelie his onely sonne incarnate of whom thei testifie and whose blessed woorde thei be Swenkfeild saieth wee must looke to bee taughte from heauen not out of bookes and that the holy ghost vseth to come from aboue without the helpe of meanes as hearyng preachyng and readyng the scriptures We saie we maie not looke for vaine reuelations from heauen but must marke what Christ◠the heauenlie doctor and schoolemaister speaketh to vs in his holie woorde in that diuine booke of his blessed testamente as we haue receiued commaundement fró his father ipsum audite heare hym wee saie what reuelation so euer bee made contrarie or not agreeyng with Christes blessed Gospell bee it by an angell from heauen it is not of the holie ghaste but from that angell of darkenesse trāsforming hymself into an angell of light and that therefore we must come to knowlege of Gods will and to our saluation by hearyng preathyng or readyng of the Scriptures Now concludeth M. Dorman after the rehearsall of these Swenkfildes heresies saiyng thus these bee that wicked heretike his foolishe and vnsauerie persuasions We saie and these bee our true and to vs moste sweete perswasions not onelie of the profitablenesse but also the necessitie of the Scriptures that truthe healthe light life and saluation is to bee saught and to bee had in them and by them and without them can not be had and these perswasions haue wee gathered not of vaine reuelations but of the verie same holie Scriptures themselues as of the fountaine of al infallible veritie Wherefore M. Dorman you haue dooen nothyng els but bewraied your moste malicious blindenesse in saiyng that it is no other thing that the Huguenotes heretikes doo and that vve doo leane reste vpon the self same reasons and groundes as did Suenkfeldius and vvithall as in a credible matter to praie the good readers to iudge indifferently herein to beleue rather their ovvne iudgementes then you and to tell them that thei shall see and perceiue moste plainely that you lye not Wherevnto we saie we trust that not onelie indifferente readers but all other also moste partiall of your side M. Dorman shall sée and will iudge that fire is not more contrarie in nature to water nor lighte to darkenesse then are we to Suenkfeldius and our true perswasions of the Scriptures grounded vpon the sure rocke of the same Scriptures contrarie and repugnaunte to his abominable heresies waueryng vpon the vncertaine sandes of false phantasticall reuelations And therefore we doubt nothing but al wise indifferent readers will plainly perceiue that ye lie moste shamefully and will abhorre and detest your malice an deride and hisse out your blindenesse who thought them so blinde that thei could iudge no colours and your partiall readers will blushe I doubte not at your doultishe dooynges and peraduenture beshrowe your harte or rather your foolishe heade that hath handled their parte in suche slender sorte And I for our parte where you deale with vs thus not vnfriendlie onelie but moste falslie maliciouslie and pestilenilie also and dooe yet make a preface of a friendlie aduertiser of vs dooe saie to you as our sauiour saied to a like friend of his Amice ad quid venisti For as you like as did D. Hardyng your maister haue with Iudas forsaken Christ the truth whose true doctrine you call Caluins religion and ioigned against hym with the high Priestes Scribes and Phariseis in hope of worldly gaine so geue you vs as friēdlie aduertisemente as Iudas offered Christ a friendly kisse Well now we haue truelie prooued and clearly declared that we are not onelie vnlike but moste cōtrarie to Suenkfeldius and his vile heresies by you rehearsed let vs yet sée how M. Dorman would make vs to seme like vnto hym Svvenkfield saith M. Dorman dooeth saie vve must haue no Scripture c. The Huguenotes and heretikes saie vve must haue no Pope of Rome to bee head of Christes vniuersall churche Loe sir you see a greate likenesse betweene them Tarie you shall heare more matter of likelihoode yet Suenkfeldius saieth the Scriptures are but deade letters The heretikes saie the Pope is but a sinfull man as other be Hath he not trowe you shewed a verie greate similitude betwene Suenkfeldius and vs But yet he concludeth at the laste bothe earnestly and effectuously as you shall heare Finallie saieth M. Dorman the Swenkfeldians barre God of all meanes to worke by and therefore thei dooe reiecte the Scriptures to teache by for that God is the teacher himself likewise dooe the protestantes saith M. Dorman whiles thei alowe him not one heade minister to gouerne his vniuersall Churche in externall gouernement because that Christe gouerneth it hymself Whiche reason wée are contented that M. Dorman goe awaie withall when he hath prooued as clearelie that it is Gods will to gouerne the whole Churche by suche a Romishe head as we can clearelie prooue that it is his wil to teache vs by the scriptures And further M. Dorman maie bee ashamed to saie so doe the Huguenotes for so it pleaseth him to terme vs so dooe thei in likewise barre Christe of all meanes to woorke by as dooeth Swenkfield Dooe we so M. Dorman Dooe wee not allowe hym a minister to gouerne his Churche who doo allowe hym as he hymself hath ordeined in euery Churche one at the leaste to preache his holie will and to minister his holie Sacramentes accordyng to his owne holie institution But M. Dorman is not content that we allowe Christ euery where one minister except we also allowed him one al where ouer all But good M. Dorman it belongeth to one onelie Christe to gouerne his Churche all where and one onelie man shall haue enough to dooe and more then he can dooe to performe the office of a good minister of Christ some where in one onelie Parishe or diocesse Wherefore as we muche mislike the vndiscreate ambition of some worldlie Princes who when thei cānot well gouerne one kyngdome doo yet desire many so dooe wee vtterlie abhorre and condemne to the Deuill the authour hereof the excessiue and vnsatiable ambition of the bishop of Rome who neuer being able yet well to gouerne the Churche of the citie of Rome as is well knowen to the worlde nor to rule his Colledge of Cardinalles yet desireth the gouernment and supremacie ouer all churches throughout the worlde and is named in the booke of his owne Canon lawe the bishoppe of the whole worlde Yea and not content with that spirituall Monarchie chalengeth
woorde of God is the true light wherein wee endeuoure our selues to our power to walke Your vnwritten verities are more meeter for blinde Battes to flitter in Wee haue our heade and Iudge in heauen one Christe onelie and in earth one prince and other ministers bothe ecclesiasticall and ciuill to gouerne and Iudge vs accordyng to his holie woorde To iuggle and to coniure too bée your owne Popishe properties we haue nothing to doo with theÌ„ And thus I haue answered M. Dormans asseueratioÌ„s in this place by shorte poinctes which maie suffice seyng he onely saith his pleasure proueth nothing at al. Dorman Fol. 14. Tell them that you haue seen them thriue so euell apon that presumption of theirs so many heresies so many schismes and leude opinions broughte in thereby that you are at a poincte with your selues to leaue them and take that waie that Saincte Hierome in the like case hath doen before you who although his knowledge in the tongues were suche as by the reporte of moste men it passed any others in his tyme yet would not he take vpon hym in the discussyng of doutes to leane to that rule of theirs to laâ—e and conferre together one texte with an other but referryng hymself to the see of Rome he alwaies protested that by that seate and faithe praised by the Apostles owne mouth would he be counceled and ruled Beatitudini tuae id est cathedrae Petri communione consocior To your holines saieth he writyng to Damasus then the Bishoppe of Rome that is to saie to Peters chaire am I ioigned in communion and he addeth a cause whie Super illam Petram aedificatam ecclesiam scio I knowe that on that rocke Peters chaire the Churche is builded Nowell The Pope and Papistes haue thriuen so well vpon their striuyng againste the truthe of Goddes woorde that I trust all the worlde shortly will be at a poinct to leaue them Saincte Hierome saieth no where that he would not compare the scriptures together for the discussyng of doubtes as M. Dorman would beare vs in hande and S. Augustine saieth he would dooe it and exhorteth other to dooe the same S. Hieromes woordes to Damasus Bishop of Rome make nothyng againste vs nor with M. Dorman For what meruaile is it if that sainct Hierome borne in a coaste of Italie Christened at Rome brought vp at Rome and made priest at Rome would in the faith of the blessed Trinitie rather ioigne himself in communion with Damasus Bishop of Rome a learned and godlie man then with Vitalis and Meletius whom M. Dorman calleth Miletus and Paulinus who were Antiochian bishops and therefore straungers to him and also not cleare from the Arrian heresie What argument can M. Dorman frame hereof Hierome a Prieste of Rome c. ioigned hymself in communion to his owne bishoppe Damasus Ergo we Englishemen musie ioigne our selues likewise to the bishoppe of Rome that now is beyng bothe a forainer and an enemie Againe Hierome ioigned in communion with Damasus a godlie bishoppe of Rome Ergo we must submit our selues to a false vsurper and enemie of God and all godlinesse Naie it foloweth rather thus As saincte Hierome refused to ioigne hymself to Vitalis bishoppe of Antiochia and an Arrian bothe because he was a straunger and also an heretike and ioigned hymself to Damasus his owne Bishoppe and a godlie Bishop so ought wée to refuse the Pope beyng bothe a foraine vsurper and a false heretike to ioigne againste hym with our owne godlie bishops at home But will M. Dorman saie saincte Hierome addeth a cause whiche is the pith of the matter saiyng thus Super illam petram c. I knowe that vpon that rocke Peters chaire the Churche is builded whiche is the cause why S. Hierome ioigned with Damasus will he saie But he maie be ashamed had he any shame at al thus shamefully by a false parenthesis to intermingle these woordes Peters chaire in this sentence of S. Hierome and so to falsifie it as though S. Hierome had saied or ment in this place that the Popes chaire is the rocke whereon the Churche is builded And now maie ye see to what ende all M. Dormans long former drifte commeth to witte to bryng vs from the scriptures to Peters chaire that is the Popes consistorie there to bee iudged whiche now at the laste after so long suspensioÌ„ and delaie vnder S. Hieromes name but moste falsly he hath vttered For the more plain declaration wherof I will report here sainct Hieromes woordes a little more largely then M. Dorman hath dooen whiche are these Facessat inuidia Romani culminis recedat ambitio cuÌ„ successore piscatoris discipulo crucis loquor Ego nullum primum nisi Christum sequens Beatitudinis tuae id est Cathedrae Petri communione consocior super illam Petram aedificatam Ecclesiam scio Quicunque extra hanc domum agnum comederit prophanus est Si quis in Arca Nohae non fuerit peribit regnante diluuio That is to saie Let enuie auoide let the ambition of the height of Rome departe I speake to the successour of the fisher and a disciple of the crosse I folowyng no chief or head but Christ am ioigned in communion to your holines to saie Peters chaire vpon that rocke I knowe the Churche to bee builded whosoeuer eateth the Lambe without this house he is prophane or vnholie If one be not in the arke of Nohe he shall perishe when the floud is aloft Thus farre S. Hierome Now if a manne would aske of M. Dorman why he left out those twoo lines wherein S. Hierome admonisheth Damasus as the successour of the poore fisher Peter to laie aside all ambitioÌ„ whiche the greatnesse of the citie of Rome might mooue hym too and withall affirmeth that he will folowe no chief head but Christe whiche woordes are ioigned and by a participle dependyng to that whiche M. Dorman alleged whatsoeuer he shall answere thereto I knowe the true answere M. Dorman did of falsehood and corruption of the meanyng of sainct Hierome thus detrunke and mangle his sentence for he did sée that S. Hierome admonishing Damasus of humilitie and withall professyng hymself to folowe no chief or head but Christ not exceptyng Damasus case but rather affirmyng hym not to be Primum the chief maketh clearely with vs who in this controuersie of the Popes vsurped supremacie saie the same We folow no head but Christ we ioigne in communion with none but suche as folowe hym c. Furthermore he did see that the woordes of S. Hierome folowyng vpoÌ„ this rocke I know the church to bee builded might and ought to bee referred vnto Christe mentioned by S. Hierome so nere before and by Peter coÌ„fessed to be that rocke wheron the churche is builded and therefore M. Dorman left out of saincte Hieromes sentence the meÌ„tion of Christ that he might most falsly and blasphemously referre the rocke to Peters chaire as though Peters
cleane euerted by twoo witnesses euen by M. Dorman hymself chosen and wee are declared by the same witnesses to bee the verie folowers of the primitiue churche in that vsage of deliueryng of the Sacramente into the receiuers handes For the whiche yet thei charge vs as horrible profaners of the holie Sacramente But to cloke these matters where Nicephorus calleth it the distribution of the breade M. Dorman calleth it the blessed sacrament of th' altar And where Nicephorus saith he gaue euery one his part before he caused theÌ„ to sweare M. DormaÌ„ saith he caused suche as minded to receiue of hym the blessed Sacramente of the altar to sweare where as in deede thei had receiued it of him into their handes before as is also in Nicephorus booke in the margente noted by Ioannes Langus the translatoure thereof and councelour to the late Emperour Ferdinandus that the custome of the Churche then was to deliuer the Sacrament into the receiuers handes But in deede this is M. Dorman his ordinarie custome in alledgyng of authours to passe ouer with silence that whiche is againste hym and to take that whiche maketh a shewe for hym and withall to adde that is not in the authour in suche sorte as the ignorante would thinke it to be the authours verie woordes I knowe it is impertinente to entreate of the matter of the Sacramente in this controuersie of the Popes supremacie but M. Dorman of purpose as it semeth doeth mingle suche thynges by the waie whiche if thei be there answered shal make a mingle mangle of diuers matters vnpleasaunte to the reader and if thei bee passed ouer not answered as impertinent to the present treatie he trusted it would serue to intaÌ„gle the simple and withall to bee an occasion to his fauourers to triumphe in the meane tyme as though wee dissembled the matter by silence for that wee could saie nothyng to it But to retourne to the purpose againe whereas M. Dorman hath here in one halfe leafe heaped a greate number of euidente lies as it were in a packet together I haue thought good to putte the reader in remembraunce of them in order as thei lie The first lie is that after his discourse out of S. Cyprian of the Bishop appoincted by God to be the gouernour and head of the Churche he saieth the bishop of Rome is that heade whereas by S. Cyprian the contrarie is euident and that hymself or bishop Rogatian is that head whereof he speaketh as hath been fully heretofore declared The seconde is that to make warre againste the Bishoppe of Rome is the firste entrie to heresie Whereas S. Cyprian teacheth that the contempte of euery godlie bishop in his owne diocesse by suche as are their inferiours is the beginnyng of heresies The third is that he saieth Thus did Nouatus to witte that Nouatus made hiâ—yrst entrie into his heresies by makyng open warrâ— against the bishop of Rome appoincted by God to be in earth the gouernour and head of the Churche whiche is a double lie and maiestande for twoo For Nouatus began his heresies firste in Afrike and contended with S. Cyprian before he troubled Cornelius at Rome as by the testimonie of S. Cyprian is euideÌ„t Wherefore his entrie to his heresies was his proclaimyng of open warre againste S. Cyprian appoincted by God to be the gouernour and head of the Churche as S. Cyprian hymself saieth The other parte of this lie is that he saieth Nouatus made warre against him as the gouernour and head of the churche for his wordes Thus did Nouatus must nedes be referred to that whiche wente before but Nouatus tooke not Cornelius but hymself to be bishoppe of Rome as doeth by the storie euidentlie appeare wherefore the strief betwene theim was not whether Cornelius as bishop of Rome was head of the churche as M. Dorman would haue it seme but whether he or Nouatus were bishop of Rome The fourth lie is a double lie also where he reporteth that Nicephorus saieth that Nouatus holdyng betwene his handes the handes of suche as minded to receiue of hym the blessed Sacrament of the altar vsed these woordes c. For Nicephorus hath no suche wordes but he saieth thus when Nouatus was come to the distribution of the bread he geuyng euery one his parte caused them to sweare c. And this doublelie the receiuyng of the blessed Sacramente of the altar in sâ—eede of the distribution of bread and thei that minded to receiue it where as thei had receiued it alreadie into their handes he made of purpose to saue their transubstantiation harmelesse and to keepe it secrete that our vsage in deliueryng the Sacrament into the receiuers handes is agreeable to thâ—â—rimitiue churche Theâ—ifte lie is that he saieth wee doo sweare men in suche sorte as Nouatus did and that no manne can either gette any liuyng or kept that he hath without makyng of this othe Meanyng suche as Nouatus exacted But Nouatus exacted an othe of the Romaines to cleaus to hym againste their owne Bishoppe whiche was vnlawfull Wée require an othe of subiectes Englishemen of obedience to their and our naturall Prince and of renouncyng all forraine and vsurped power Again Nouatus caused them to sweare that his heresie was the truth and that Cornelius true doctrine was heresie Wee haue no suche matters in hande but are on Cornelius side againste Nouatus teachyng the same doctrine that Cornelius did abhorryng the heresie that Nouatus taught Wherefore in this manifolde fable of M. Dormans amplified by his Rhetorike looke how often he saieth so did Luther so did Caluine so doo those wicked men in our countrey as ofte as he saieth Thei exacted this othe c. If he geue not this othe c. So many tymes as M. DormaÌ„ doeth repeate these woordes this and so so many loude lewde lies hath he made one vpon an others backe whereas in deede it is neither so nor so This M. Dormans deceiptfull dealyng moste vsual vnto hym was the cause why I saide once in publike place that I had not found any one authoritie by him as farre as then I had redde truely alledged besides his vntrue notyng of the places in y e margeÌ„t Which though it sometyme happen by negligence of Printers M. Dorman yet in this booke beyng otherwise so diligently printed maie seme of set purpose to haue doen lest suche as would be inquisitiue should to spéedely finde out the lewdenesse of his allegations seruyng nothyng to his purpose vnlesse perhappes maister Dorman did neuer vse his owne eyes in vewyng of these places but did credite his collectours therein altogether as in the processe of his doynges doeth credibly appere that he did For in one leaf or little more of foure onely places by hym alledged three thereof be noted vntruely that he might therein agree with his guilefull and vntrue appliyng of places of the doctors and authors altogether impertinente to the
and in persecutioÌ„ of the true churche of Christ but who so wil read that 70. epistle of Basill shall finde it otherwise We neither worship our selues nor inforce any other to worship the Image that Basil treateth of in that 70 epistle wee are no Idolaters nor teache false doctrine we haue not many goddes lesse and greater we abate nothyng as did the Arrians but moste to our power set foorth the glorie and deitie of Christ Let the Papistes see that these poinctes touche not theÌ„selues rather We doo not sequester the holie ghost from the glorious Trinitie as did those Arrians in saincte Basils tyme whose mischief and their owne miserie he in this epistle doeth deplore and bewaile Wherefore his saiynges in that Epistle apperteâ—ne nethyng to vs who are nothyng guiltie of those crimes and heresies but they are brought in by dreaming M. Dorman without any cause and biside all purpose sauyng onely that in readyng Hosius he founde this place alledged thought good to folowe him therein and to translate it into his booke But now touchyng our verie case why did not these bishops of the Easte write their humble petition for helpe in their miseries seuerallie to the bishoppe of Rome as heade of all the churche but doo write to all the bishops of Fraunce and Italie indifferently without any mention of the bishop of Rome at al So farre of is it that thei made any speciall mention of hym as the chief or heade ouer all the churche yea placyng also the bishops of Fraunce before the Italian bishoppes though M. Dorman doo craftilie dissemble the same and callyng them altogether brethren and felowes in the ministerie whiche thei would neuer haue dooen had thei had this opinion of his supremacie that maister Dorman and other Papistes doo now defende and mainteine But in the saied 70. epistle the saied East Bishops whiche doo not once speake of the Pope doo praie the Frenche and Italian bishops to make huÌ„ble sute to the Emperour that he by his authoritie would represse their enemies the ArriaÌ„s and releue their miseries whiche maketh rather for the Emperour his supremacie in the churche then for the bishops of Rome Now where M. Dorman speaketh of persecution as he did a little before of our moste cruell practise I referre it to the iudgement of all the worlde whether our aduersaries or wee bee more cruell persecutours and whether haue suffered more persecution thei or wee and whether thei or we doo come more nere to that example of persecution by S. Basill in this 70. epistle described I praie thee good reader iudge indifferently First S. Basill sheweth that the persecutioÌ„ was moste horrible cruell and bloudie suche as was impossible to be expressed with woordes and that thieues murtherers and other offenders were more reasonablie and mercifullie dealte with then godlie men were in that persecution that thei were apprehended in the night and neither knowyng their accusers nor coÌ„uicted of any crime were banished or put to death And that there was continuall mournyng weepyng and sighyng euery where that because the persecutours had the name of Christians thei would not suffer suche as thei put to cruell death to haue the names of martyres and that neither age and a hoare white heade neither godlines and a life vertuouslie ledde had any reuerence with the persecutours He sheweth that the persecutors were riche wealthie but thei who were persecuted were poore menne and for their pouertie contemned not hauyng libertie to speake He calleth this horrible persecution fire by a figure but the persecution that wee suffer is by fire in deede by the whiche our aduersaries trie vs and sifte vs into ashes so that saincte Paules prophecie of many who in the laste daies should be tried by fire is in deede and without figure accoÌ„plished in vs. Consider I praie you good readers these circumstances of moste extreame crueltie in those persecutours whom S. Basill speaketh of and iudge whether we or our aduersaries doo the like and withall consider how reasonablie M. Dorman resembleth vs to the saied persecutours and themselues to them that were so persecuted Now where he goeth aboute to burthen vs with enuie of Churches either pulled doune or altered to other vse and of their altars destroied muche like as the rebelles did burthen Henrie the eight in the. 28. yere of his raigne we make this answere Truthe it is that the foundations of Abbeis and Chauntries Pro redemptione animarum fundatorum suorum progenitorum ipsorum c. For the redemption of the soules of their foundours and their progenitours soules c. as in the saied foundations appereth more at large were so vnsure and weake or rather wicked that thei could no longer beare suche huge superstructions and buildynges as were laied vpon them For the Idolatrie supersticion hypocrisic and wickednesse of the Monkes Nunnes and Priestes themselues were growen so greate and so heauie now that no foundacions though sure and good were hable any longer to beare and abide them Let the horrible historie of their darke dreadfull and moste diuellishe dooynges notified to kyng Henrie the eight and after to the Parliament house by the reporte of the visitours retournyng from their visitacion of Abbaies and the Monkes Nunnes themselues in their owne confessions subscribed with their owne handes bee a proofe thereof whiche beyng regestered in a blacke booke might more iustlie bee called doumes daie then any recorde this daie remainyng in Englande reuealyng suche matter as thei had thought should haue remained hidde vnto the greate daie of reuelation of all secreates if euer thei looked for it Now truly the monstrous liues of Monkes Friers and Nunnes haue destroied their Monasteries and Churches and not wée Concernyng their foundations so contrarie to the merites of Christ our sauiour that is come to passe of theÌ„ that our sauiour hymself foreshewed Omnis plantatatio c. Euery plantacion not planted by my heaueÌ„ly father shal be plucked vp by the rootes Touchyng their impietie towardes God and wickednesse of life that is fulfilled that was foreshewed by the Prophetes Esaie and Ieremie vpon Babilon and Hierusalem and consequently vpon all wicked cities and places where Gods lawe shall likewise bée transgressed where like Idolatrie like fornication bodily and ghostlie shalbée committed where shalbée founde like foolishenesse ignoraunce and blindnesse of the Pastours heades and rulers that is to saie that their busldynges shalbée made heapes of stones that brambles briers shall growe where their pleasaunte lodgynges were that Oules night scritches and Dragons shall make their neastes and houle and seritche where the voyce of bankettyng and ioye was wonte to bee heard and that their houses shall neuer bee builded againe And that when menne shall passe by and saie why hath the Lorde thus dooen to this greate Citie to these goodlie Abbeies Nunries and Fratries Answere shal bee made for that
vpon vs with the banishyng of that one Bishoppe and heade and onely saith so I doo saie the contrary is moste true and will also in place of this treatie coÌ„uenient not onely saie but proue that where the Pope hath had the greateste authoritie there hath he brought in with hym as well all miseries mischieues and destructions vpon the common wealthe as also all superstitions hypocristes errours and Idolatries into the Churche And for this present tyme it shall be sufficient to admonishe the reader that in all respectes wée bee now in farre better case without the Pope in more quietnesse peace securitie plentie of thynges c. then wee were of late vnder the Pope and that therefore M. Dorman doeth moste euideÌ„tly and falsly fable when he saieth that a thousande and more miseries haue rushed into this realme with the refusall of that one bishoppe and heade Dorman Fol. 3. And as this is confessed by the moste auncient fathers that haue written sence Christes tyme that by this meanes we firste reuolt from the churche by contemnyng and not acknowledgyng the heade so muste our retourne thither againe bee by the contrary that is by reuerencyng hym by acknowledgyng hym by humble submission of our self to hym Nowell It is none otherwise confessed by other moste auncient fathers then you haue alreadie heard it confessed by S. Cyprian and Basill whom he hath without all shame alledged for that purpose whereas thei speake not one woorde of that matter neither acknowledge any suche heade And as thei remained in the Churche of Christe neuer acknowledgyng the bishop of Rome as heade of the Churche so doo wee likewise reâ—ectyng his falsly vsurped supremacie nothyng doubt but wée remaine in the Churche of Christe whose sworne enemie we doo knowe that false vsurper to bée and therefore none of Christes Churche so farre of is it that he can be the heade of the same Dorman fol. 3. So did those that after their fall with Nouatus S. Cyprian receiued into the Churche againe apon their submission testified in these woordes Nos-Cornelium Episcopum sanctissimum Catholicae Ecclesiae erectum à Deo omnipotente Christo D. nostro scimus Nos errorem nostrum confitemur Circumuenti sumus perfidiae loquacitate factiosa amentes videbamur quasi quandam communicationem cum homine schismatico habuisse Syncera tameÌ„ mens nostra in ecclesia semper fuit Nec ignoramus vnum Deumesse vnum Christum esse dominum quem confessi sumus vnum Spiritum S. Vnum Episcopum in Ecclesia catholica esse debere VVe saie thei acknowledge Cornelius to bee erected by God almightie and Christe our Lorde to be the holy bishop of the catholike churche VVe confesse our errour we haue been circumuented ronnyng madde by the factious babblyng of treacherie wee seemed to haue communicated as it were with that schismaticall manne Nouatus yet was our sincere mynde alwaies in the Churche Nor wee are not ignoraunte that there is one onelie God and one Christe our lorde and that in the catholike churche there must be one holie ghost and one bishoppe Nowell Maximus Vrbanus and Sidonius whom M. Dorman meaneth neither reuolted from the Churche by contemnyng and not acknowledgyng this heade he speaketh of nor retourned to the Churche againe by acknowledgyng of any suche heade For in those daies Cornelius bishoppe of Rome was not acknowledged to bee heade of the Churche by any man liuyng suche ambition and false vsurpation of the bishop of Rome to bée heade of the Churche beyng vnknowen to Cornelius then bishoppe of Rome and to all other bishoppes of Christendome also But to make the truthe in deede knowen to the reader how these menne reuolted from the Churche and how thei retourned I shall out of saincte Cyprian and histories Ecclesiasticall declare the veritie of the matter After the death of Fabâ—anus bishoppe of Rome Cornelius was lawfully chosen by the cleargie and people to be his successour there Nouatus who was of that opinion that suche as for feare of tormentes and death had renounced the Christian saithe though thei repented therefore were not to bee receiued into the Churche againe made a greate stirre against Cornelius who with saincte Cyprian and all catholike bishoppes helde the contrary that is to saie that the Penitentes ought to be receiued after due discipline executed vpon them But the faction of Nouatus waxyng greater Nouatus or as saincte Cyprian saieth Nouatianus would haue intruded hymself into the Bishoprike of Rome and tooke hymself and was taken of his faction to bee lawfull successour of Fabian and the true bishoppe of Rome and Cornelius to be an vsurper as one that did communicate with suche as had renounced their faith Wherevpon grew this question and controuersie whiche of them twoâ— was a catholike bishoppe holdyng the truthe and truly and lawfully chosen by God and whiche was the intruder and not of the Catholike churche but an heretike And amongest others Maximus Vrbanus and Sidonius priestes of Rome ioigned themselues to Nouatus against Cornelius holdyng Nouatus opinion and takyng hym for their Bishoppe And thus thei reuolted by fallyng to heresie and refusyng Cornelius their bishoppe and by ioignyng themselues to Nouatus an vsurper and heretike and not by deniyng Cornelius as bishop of Rome to be the head of the churche â–ª as M. Dorman fableth But afterward Maximus and his felowes repeÌ„tyng their deede did forsake Nouatus as an heretike and vsurper and retourned to Cornelius againe as their true Bishoppe to ioigne in faithe and communion with him as with a catholike bishop or a Bishoppe of the catholike Churche whiche is all one And thei doo acknowledge that he was erected by God into that Bishoprike of Rome and so consequently Nouatus to be a false vsurper and heretike and so no bishoppe of the Catholike churche Wherefore it is euident that when M. Dorman saieth that those men retourned againe to the Churche by this waie that is to saie by acknowledgyng Cornelius to bee the heade of the vniuersall churche he saieth moste vntruly And hath corrupted and translated this place falsely remouyng the woorde sanctissimae from his place and in steede of Cornelium episcopum sanctissimae catholicae ecclesiae Cornelius a bishoppe of the moste holie catholike Churche as saincte Cyprian doeth write he hath Cornelium sanctissimum episcopum ecclesiÄ™ catholicÄ™ Cornelius the moste holie Bishoppe of the Catholike Churche to make a better shewe for his purpose as though Maximus Vrbanus Sidonius with others had acknowledged Cornelius to be erected by God almightie to bee the moste holy Bishoppe of the Catholike and vniuersall Churche and so to make for his supremacie ouer the whole Churche Whiche is neither written here nor els where neither euer was meante by Maximus or his felowes nor by saincte Cyprian hymself But this is the true sense of those woordes Nos Cornelium Episcopum sanctissimae Catholicae ecclesiae erectum à deo
hundred yeres after Christes departure taken Nowell And I folowyng your order M. Dorman doo affirme and will proue the contrarie to all and euery pointe of your diuision that is to witte Firste that it is not profitable muche lesse necessarie that the Churche of Christe here in earth should haue one chief heade and ruler vnder Christe to gouerne the same and that for diuers and sundrie vrgent and moste weightie causes Secondarilie that no prieste can bee any suche one heade of the Churche here in earth Thirdly that of all priestes the bishop of Rome can not be that heade for that he is no Bishop but rather a temporall vsurper and tyraunte contrary to Gods expresse woorde and that all suche places as are by you M. Dorman and others alledged out of the scriptures and doctours for the said bishop of Rome his supremacie apperteine nothyng at all to that purpose Dorman fol. 4. That Christes Churche here in earth must of necessitie haue one chief heade and gouernoure vnder Christe to rule the same Nowell M. Dorman doeth well begin with this part firste to proue that there must of necessitie be one chief heade and gouernour of the whole Churche vnder Christ for if there ought not to be suche an one heade and gouernour at all he did well perceiue that consequently the bishop of Rome could not be that head and gouernour Wherefore it being throughly proued and manifestly declared that M. Dorman faileth in the proufe of this first pointe as I doubt not but it shal bée so proued and declared I truste that all wise men shall vnderstande that this first and principall part and staie of the whole beyng ouerthrowen his whole treatie of the bishop of Rome his supremacie shall altogether fall to grounde with it without any further batetrie to y e same or vnderminyng thereof to be made Dorman Fol. 4. The truthe of this proposition good christian readers is not onely by the whole order and forme of the estate of Gods people in the olde lawe whiche was also the true churche of God long before the comming of our sauiour into this worlde but by the daiely experience also of câ—uile and politike gouernement most manifestly confirmed Nowell Of the estate of Gods people in the olde lawe who as thei were one seuerall people so had thei one highe prieste what can you gather further but that likewise in euery Diocesse or countrey it were good to haue one chief prelate or bishop to rule in the cleargie Whiche we denie not nor euer did deny But of this matter M. Dorman geueth vs occasion to saâ—e more hereafter Dorman Fol. 4. For who is there so blinde that he seeth not that in the whole frame of this worlde there is no kyngdome so mightie no realme so puissant no citie so populous no toune so wealthie yea on the contrary parte also no village so little no family so small finally no so cietie of men no not of those that haue wrapped them selues in league to robbe and spoile that can any while continue without a heade to gouerne them If therefore to liue vnder the gouernment of a heade be a matter of suche importaunce as without the whiche neither great nor little riche nor â–ª poore good nor badde can stande how muche more necessarie shall wee thinke it in Christes Churche here militant in earth where the diuell in his members is coÌ„tinually occupied in raising of schismes in stirryng vp discorde to vexe and molest the people of God to haue this wholesome prouision for the appeasyng thereof and the restoryng of the same beyng troubled to quietnesse againe Nowell This reason he had in D. Hardyng his booke who borowed it of Pighius whiche beyng taken out of S. Cyprian his epistle to one Pupianus thei haue violeÌ„tly wrested to a wrong sense For S. Cyprian maketh this reason directlie againste them for the proufe of his owne authoritie being bishop of Carthage and for the authoritie of euery Bishop in his owne diocesse Now to the matter VVho is so blinde ê™ M. Dorman now surely I truste no man is so blinde but he can see that M. Dorman reasoneth blindlie and without all reason gatheryng thus that because euery kyngdome hath his seueral kyng euery people citie toun village house yea euery companie of the eues robbers haue their seuerall gouernour or heade put to and you will also as dooeth saincte Cyprian out of whom D. Hardyng and M. Dorman vndiscreatly tooke the occasion of this argument euery hiue of Bees hath his capitain Bee therefore should it folowe that all Churches or the whole churche dispersed throughout the whole world muste haue one heade You should M. Dorman if you would haue reasoned reasonably haue taken aswell saincte Cyprian his conclusion as you haue taken his antecedent and haue concluded with him Ergo in like wise euery diocesse and euery Churche ought to haue their seuerall heade prelate or bishop who is to bee obeyed by all their owne cleargie and wee would haue graunted the coÌ„sequencie and consequent as thei saie For by this meanes saincte Cyprian concludeth that Pupianus did wickedlie in disobeiyng sainct Cyprian hymself who was his bishop But neither saincte Cyprian nor any other learned man doth vse these examples or similitudes any where to proue that there ought to be one head or gouernour ouer all churches or the vniuersall churche but hath the cleane contrary saiyng thus Singulis pastoribus portio gregis ascripta est quam regat vnusquisque gubernet rationem sui actus domino redditurus That is to saie A portion of the Lordes flocke is appointed to euery pastour by himself the which euery one ought to rule gouerne who shall geue accompte of his doyng to the Lorde And so foorth moste plainlie againste the supremacie of one and for that due gouernmente of euery bishop ouer his owne ture This is saincte Cyprian his reason this is his conclusion M. Dorman But if you like your conclusion so well that you will nedes coÌ„clude that there ought to bee one generall heade of all Churches you must thus begin As there is one generall gouernour or kyng ouer all the worlde one generall head ouer all people all cities tounes villages and houses one capitaine thief and robber ouer all thieues and robbers one kyng Bee ouer all hiues of Bees throughout the whole worlde so muste there bee one onely heade in earth ouer all Churches throughout the worlde But as no man is so blinde but he seeth the falsehood of this antecedent so is I trust no man so blinde but he séeth the absurditie and inconsequencie of your former conclusion of one generall heade ouer all Churches gathered out of an antecedent and vnlikely similitude of the seuerall gouernours that euery kyngdome countrey people citie and toune and euery companie of menne seuerally haue I merueile he alledged not Homer the Poete and Aristotle the Philosopher also for the
Christian readers you shall wel perceiue that this is no newe deuise or fantasie imagined by me I will here laie before your eyes the iudgemente of certaine notable menne whom God gaue to his churche to serue for a wall for the same against the incursions of the wicked Phylistines his enemies In whom you shall moste plainlie perceiue this order in Christes Churche to bee so necessarie that the onelie breach and lacke thereof hath been by theÌ„ taken to be the high waie verie path that leadeth to all heresies Nowell M. Dorman maie bee carelesse no man taketh the Popes supremacie to be his deuise and inuention it is knowen to bee the inuention of the ambitious Popes themselues whom the diuell hath set a woorke to trouble the quiete state of Christendome and to bryng all errours into Christ his Churche and to laie the foundation of the kyngdome of Antichrist Dorman Fol. 5. And firste to beginne with that blessed martyre of God sainct Cyprian hath he not concerning thiâ— matter in an epistle by hym written to Cornelius then bishop of Rome thiese woordes Neque enim aliunde obortae sunt haereses aut nata sunt schismata quà m indâ— quèd sacerdoti dei non obtemperatur nec vnus in ecclesia ad tempus sacerdos ad tempus tudex vice Christi cogitatur That is neither yet truely doo heresies arise or schismes growe of any other cause then thereof that menne obeye not the Prieste of God neither doo thinke that there is in the Churche in the steede and place of Christe one Priest and one iudge for the tyme. Nowell Either M. Dorman had not with sufficient diligeÌ„ce reade and noted that long epistle written by sainct Cyprian to Cornelius Bishop of Rome or els he deepely dissembleth that which he there perceiued For though the epistle be written to Cornelius yet it is for a great parte writteÌ„ of Cyprian hymself and many of the sentences in that epistle yea this verie sentence whiche M. Dorman here alledgeth for Cornelius his supremacie as Bishop of Rome by the tenure of the epistle appeareth to bee written speciallie of saincte Cyprian hymself Bishop of Carthage in Afrike rather then of Cornelius as afterward at large shal be declared And further it appeareth that this sentence and all other sentences of the authoritie of the Prieste or Priestes Bishoppe or Bishoppes for saincte Cyprian in that epistle doeth ofte chaunge the number and sometyme speaketh as of one sometyme as of many or all Priestes and Bishoppes doo indifferentlie appertaine as well to euery and all Bishoppes of all cities and diocesses as to either Cornelius or Cyprian For that he here saith Sacerdoti dei non obtemperatur The priest of God is not obeied is asmuche as Sacerdotibus dei the Priestes of God are not obeied As when the scripture saieth Regem honora honoure the Kyng is as muche as though it had saied Let subiectes of all places honour their kynges Touchyng these woordes Neque vnus in ecclesia ad tempus Sacerdos ad tempus index vice Christi cogitatur that is to saie Neither is one Prieste in the Churche for the tyme and iudge for the tyme in Christes steede thought vpon I haue declared at large before how that saincte Cyprian taketh all Bishoprikes to be but one Bishoprike as the faithes of all men are but one faithe Vnafides saieth sainct Cyprian vnum baptisma vnus episcopus cuius à singulis in solidum pars tenetur There is one faith one Baptisme there is one Bishoprike the whiche euery Bishoppe hath wholie for his parte So that wheÌ„ he speaketh of one Bishoppe one iudge in the churche for the tyme or of the bishop whiche is one and ruleth the Churche absolutelie he meaneth euery Bishop in his owne diâ—cesse without exception if he speake speciallie he doeth meane the Bishop of that citie or diocesse wherof he entreateth whether it be y e bishop of Rome Carthage or any other place For the moste manifest proufe whereof note these woordes of saincte Cyprian to Pupianus who was stubborne againste the saied Cyprian whereof it hath been before entreated Vnde enim schismata c. Whereof saieth sainct Cyprian doo heresies and Schismes spryng but of this that the Bishoppe whiche is one and ruleth the Churche is through the proude arrâ—gant presumption of certain contemned and set at nought and beyng the man by Goddes approbation allowed and honoured is of vnwoorthy men iudged And a little before this place Tâ— te episcopum episcopi iudicem iudicis ad tempus à deo dati coÌ„stituis Thou doest make thy self a Bishop ouer the Bishop and a Iudge ouer the Iudge by God for the tyme appoincted Thus muche saincte Cyprian to Pupianus who despised the saied Cyprian so appoincted by God to be the Bishoppe and Iudge for the tyme as he there saieth Now in his epistle to Cornelius he saieth thus Neque enim aliunde c. Neither doo heresies arise or schismes grow of any other cause but hereof that menne obeie not the Prieste of God neither dooe thinke that there is in the Churche in the steede and place of Christe one Prieste one Iudge for the tyme. Compare now these twoo places together and you shall finde them all one in effecte And that S. CypriaÌ„ nor any other could haue vttred in diuers places one sense more nearelie vnlesse he would haue vsed the same woordes altogether But it is moste manifeste to all men that will reade these epistles that in the first place by the bishoppe whiche is one and ruleth the Churche by the man by Goddes approbation allowed by the coÌ„temnyng of whom heresies and schismes doo spryng and arise by the Bishoppe or Prieste and by the Iudge for the tyme by God appoincted S. Cyprian hymself beyng Bishop of Carthage is ment and by hym that despiseth the saied Bishop is Pupian meant who did despise the saied S. Cyprian Wherefore either it muste folowe that saincte Cyprian is the heade of the vniuersall Churche seyng those woordes whiche by M. Dormans iudgemente appoincted that head apperteine to him orels as the truthe is in déede that any Bishop is called by saincte Cyprian the Bishoppe whiche is one and ruleth the Churche or the iudge for the tyme in the Churche in Christes steede or place for all is one and that then the speciall bishop of that place whiche is intreated of whether it be Rome Carthage or any other is meant and so consequentlie euery Bishop in his owne diocesse is that one Bishop that ruleth in the churche and that iudge for the time in the steede of Christe And that in this place saincte Cyprian meaneth no supremacie of any one Bishop but the equalitie of all Bishops it maie bee moste euident to them that will read the whole epistle and note how ofte he speaketh of all Priestes and Bishops As Sacerdotibus tantus honor conceditur so great honor is geuen to
a proude and slaunderous toungue Emongest other places he allegeth this texte He that saieth thou foole to his brother c. is guiltie of hell fire whereof he inferreth how can thei then escape the iudgemeÌ„t of God the aueÌ„ger who spake suche thinges not onelie to brethren but also to Priestes And so procedyng alledgeth out of the Scriptures againste those heretikes whiche had so railed on him as out of Deuteronomium the 17 chapiter and out of the first booke of Kinges out of the 8. of Mathewe and the 10. of Luke the 23. of the Actes of the obedieÌ„ce and reuerence due to the high priestes and to the Apostles And all this he writeth speciallie to confirme his owne autthoritie beyng so vnwoorthilie railed on behinde his backe as is moste euidente by the continuauÌ„ce of the processe After whiche foloweth the place by M. Dorman alledged of the priest of God who is not obeied and of one prieste and one iudge in the churche in Christes steede not regarded Whiche woordes he speaketh of hymself so abused by those heretikes so railyng on hym behinde his backe as by all that goeth before from the firste entrie of speakyng of hymself and his owne wronges and still continuyng the treatie of hymself and his owne matters and also by these woordes folowyng it doeth moste plainly appere Caeterum dico dico enim prouocatus c. But I saie saieth sainct Cyprian for I saie beyng prouoked to witte by suche railers vpon him as he began firste to speake of I saie beyng sorowfull I saie beyng coÌ„pelled when a bishop is placed in the roume of his predecessour beyng deade when he is chosen peaceably by the voice of all the people beyng in persecution defended by Gods helpe ioigned faithfullie to all his felowe bishops tried and allowed of his people in his bishoprike foure yeres sufferyng so many persecutions euen at this verie time in the whiche I doo write to you these letters cried for to be throwen to the Lions when such a brother is assaulted of certaine desperate and wicked persones it appeareth that thei whiche doo so assaulte him be the enemies of Christe Thus farre saincte Cyprian whereby it appeareth that he hath continued and doeth still continue to write of hymself by the verie woordes prouocatus dico I saie being prouoked c. and by the circumstances of his complaintes to Cornelius for suche vnworthie despisyng of him and railing vpon hym by suche his disobedient inferiours and by the circumstance of the matter time where he saieth that he who was of his people allowed foure yeres in his Bishoprike is the broother so assaulted beyng the Priest of God is so despised beyng the iudge in Christes steede for the tyme is not regarded as he saied before Whereby it is moste manifest that sainct CypriaÌ„ meaneth himself and not Cornelius who was bishop of Rome but thrée yeres or as Platina and others saie but twoo yeres So that these woordes of one priest one Iudge in the Churche for the tyme in steede of Christe whiche M. Dorman hath alledged for the supremacie of one heade of the vniuersall Churche can not possiblie be taken as spoken of Cornelius Bishop of Rome but are directlie spoken of S. Cyprian hymself Bishop of Carthage in Afrike as I doubt not but all learned and discreate men readyng the epistie will iudge Wherefore it falleth out by M. Dormans diligence that Carthage whiche is in Afrike and in the possession of the Infideles should bee the see of the supreme heade of the Churche and not Rome Now the truthe in deede is that as this place is here alledged by sainct Cyprian with a number of scriptures there like wise rehearsed for the mainteinaunce of his owne authoritie in his Bishoprike so doo thei likewise apperteine to the authoritie of euery other bishop in his own diocesse who is there th' one priest and the one iudge in the churche in Christes stéede for the tyme. And neither these nether any other suche places were euer alleged by S. Cyprian for the supremacie of any one Bishop ouer al the churche Let S. Cyprians woordes next before the very place by M. Dorman alleged proue this that I haue saied Cum haec tanta talia multa alia exempla praecedant c. That is to saie where as these suche and so greate examples with many other doâ—e goe before by the whiche the sacerdotal authoritie and power is by Goddes goodnesse established what maner of men thinke you bee thei whiche beyng the enemies of Priestes and rebelles againste the catholike Churche are feared neither by the threatnynges of the Lorde forewarnyng nor with the vengeaunce of the indgement to come For hereof rise heresies and schismes that the prieste of God is not obeied c. as maister Dorman hath alleged out of this place of S. Cyprian You maie see that where S. CypriaÌ„ saieth now The priest of God as speaking of one immediatly before he said The priestes as of many as it is all one to saie Obeie thy superiour and Obeie thy superiours Whiche also declareth that the woordes nexte folowyng of one Prieste and one Iudge in the Churche in Christes steede doo apperteine to all Bishops that is to euery one in his owne diocesse and not one to be ouer all the churche Concernyng the Apologie maister Dorman his owne example of ciuile gouernemente â— little before alledged plainlie declareth that he dooeth vniustlie finde fault with it For as the Apologie with vs denieth not but that euery king in his own realme euery meaner magistrate in his office is in Goddes steede or place a Iudge for the tyme so doeth it not denie but that euery Bishop in his diocesse is in Christes steede or place iudge for the time But as the Apologiâ— denieth that euery one Kyng is or can bee in Goddes place iudge ouer all the worlde to rule it but euery kyng is in Gods steede Iudge in his owne kyngdome or kingdomes as God doeth appoinct for he geueth to diuers kynges many kyngdomes but to none all so doeth it deny that any one bishop is or can be in Goddes place iudge in the vniuersall churche or in al churches throughout the worlde Wherefore the Apologie is herein vniustlie blamed of you M. Dorman neither dooeth S. Cyprian who died an holie martyr and is no doubt a sainct in heauen holde with you against the Apologie but with it against you most plainly in this and all other places whiche you haue vntruelie alleged and all reasons that you haue vnreasonablie gathered and violently wrested against it out of S. Cyprian And I trust that of this suche like vndiscreate allegations it will appeare to the wise reader how little cause M. Dorman had to triumphe as though S. Cyprian were of his side altogether and withall so insolentlie to raile vpon vs saiyng that it were better with S. Cyprian to liue and die in the obedieÌ„ce of this Priest
be lawful for any mā vnder any other bishop to appeale to the Bishoppe of Rome as to the highest iudge ouer all ecclesiasticall persones and the said Zozimus as the maner of falsaries is did counterfeite a decrée to that purpose and put it in writyng and labored to put it in executiō by mainteinyng one Apiarius a priest of the diocesse called Siccēsis in Afrike against his bishop called Vrbanus whiche Apiarius beyng by his saied bishop for his moste wicked life excommunicate appealed to the saied Zozimus Bishop of Rome If ye aske me how I prooue that I haue saied to witte the saied Zozimus Bishop of Rome to be a corrupter and falsarie I answere I prooue it not by twoo onely but by twoo hundreth and .xvij. good witnesses the whole Councell of Afrike in the whiche so many Bishops were assembled and emongest them was saincte Augustine the beste learned of all bishops and equall in vertue and godlinesse with the beste not onely of his tyme but of all ages with Orosius Prosper and many other bishops notable in learnyng and vertue Thei al as in their epistle to Celestine one of the successours of this Zozimus appeareth testifie that there was no suche matter for the Bishop of Romes superioritie as was by Pope Zozimus alleged neither in their vsuall copies of the Nicene Councell neither in the authenticall examples whiche were sent them by Cyrill Patriarke of Alexandria and by Atticus Patriarke of Constantinople whiche authenticalles agreyng with their owne copies and all other copies euery where had no suche thyng as Zozimus alleged but had the cleane contrary for that the sixt and seuēth decrée of the saied Nicene Councel make the Patriarkes of Alexādria Antiochia and Hierusalem equal with the bishop of Rome And the saied 217. Bishops made a decree in that Africane Councell that no sailyng ouer the Sea with controuersies nor appellations to the Bishop of Rome nor sendyng of his Legates laterall into their countries as iudges should bee vsed accordyng as by the epistle of the said whole councell sent to Pope Celestine plainly appeareth In the inscription of whiche epistle thei doo acknowledge the saied Celestine none other but Bishop of the citie of Rome for this terme Papa Pope was in those daies cōmon to any notable Bishop of what place so euer he were For the whiche it pleased D. Hardyng to call the Africanes emongest whom S. Augustine Orosius and Prosper with many other learned godlie Bishops were schismatikes as those that submitted not their neckes to the Pope and folowyng Hosius his author he saieth that Afrike continued in this schisme 100. yeres to wit from Boniface the firste to Boniface the seconde And M. Dormans iudgemente is that all suche are out of the state of saluation and in damnable case folowyng the iudgement of Pope Boniface who doeth saie declare define pronounce for the man as in a matter of weight laieth on loade of woordes that of necessitie of saluation all men must bée subiecte to the Bishop of Rome But I had rather bée a schismatike frō that false vsurpar with S. Augustine Orosius Prosper and those 217. godlie and learned fathers and with the Patriarkes of Alexandria and Cōstantinople Cyrill and Atticus ioignyng with them in the truthe of the Nicene Councell and so beyng I thanke God doo little feare any damnation other then to their fagottes and fire then to bee with the corrupter and falsarie Zozimus bishop of Rome a counterfeite catholike and in deede a false schismatike frō Christ and the truthe Though Hosius goeth about in vain to defende the cause of this corrupter moste impudently goyng about to prooue that neither in Gréece nor Afrike nor els where there was any true copie of the Nicene Coūcell remaining but onely with the Bishop of Rome whiche how credible it is I leaue to the discreate readers iudgement But of this matter M. Dorman geueth me occasion to speake more largely hereafter After this Zozimus his successour Bonifacius the first Celestine the first with all others almoste folowyng Zozimus steppes and ambition haue with toothe and naile striuen for this supremacie and for that purpose did sticke still to the falsified Nicene Canon and haue likewise falsified other Councelles in sundrie places and haue forged a great many of the epistles now abroade in the names of the olde Popes Clemente Anacletus Euaristus Telesphorus and other their predecessours whome thei make to write almoste of nothyng els but of the prerogatiue of Peters chaire the see of Rome whereas those godlie olde fathers euer subiecte to persecutiō and death neuer thought of any suche matters neither had luste or leasure to occupie their heades and pennes about such ambitious matters as by the true stories of thē doeth moste plainly appeare and shall hereafter at large bee declared And whereas this Leo refused the title of Oecumenicall or vniuersall Patriarke geuen hym by the said Councell of Chalcedon and apperteinyng to hym of right as Pighius saieth though maister Dorman doo denie it there muste needes bée some errour And it is greate marueile that Leo would so ambitiously chalenge in his epistle the same title in effect whiche he refused so freely offered vnto hym by the whole Councell And it maie seeme that if the Popes iudgemente bee aboue the Councell as Pighius doth teache the Councell did erre in geuyng hym suche a title and if the Councell in this poincte did well as Pighius saieth but M. Dorman denieth either the Pope should haue receiued the said title offered or not haue claimed the like of those who would not gladlie graunte it vnto him Wherefore I trust no reasonable man will disalowe our exceptions to suche witnesses in their owne cause Yet besides these causes of moste iuste exceptions to this Pope and all other Popes in their owne cause of their falsely vsurped supremacie I will goe otherwise to woorke with M. Dorman I saie that Leo here bee it these bee his woordes whiche yet is in controuersie saith vntruely If M. Dorman aske howe I prooue it I would firste aske hym whether he hath truely translated this place And if he haue howe he can make these woordes in this epistle there is one digniti◠common to all Bishoppes to agree with these folowyng there is difference of power emongst them and it is geuen to one to bee aboue all the reste whose iudgement is of moste authorite and how this manne is not in dignitie differyng from the reste And if maister Dorman thinke he can well enoughe frame this Iarre I saie further I will proue the saiynges of Leo vntrue by twoo witnesses againste this one by indifferente witnesses against this partiall witnesse in his owne cause by witnesses without and aboue all exception againste this witnesse vnto whom so many and so iuste exceptions maie bee taken I will proue I saie his own witnesse of hymself false and M. Dorman too by M. Dormans owne
witnesses sainct Cyprian and sainct Hierome brought in by hymself for the proofe of his parte and that whiche is more I will prooue it by the verie same places of sainct Cyprian and sainct Hierome whiche are by Doctour Hardyng and maister Dorman here alleged that is to saie by the thirde epistle of the firste booke of the epistles of sainct Cyprian and by the epistle of sainct Hierome to Euagrius And I doubte not but as of his three witnesses brought for hym one is no witnesse but suche as if one would saie aske my self whether I bee a theefe or no so the other twoo witnesses who bee moste woorthie credite shall proue my cause true I truste and maister Dorman a verie liar Wherein I doo thus proceade First I will putte the reader in remembraunce yet once againe of Saincte Cyprians owne woordes before touched written in the same epistle by maister Dorman alleged whiche are these Cum statutum sit omnibus nobis c. whiche maie bee thus translated whereas an order is taken or statute made emongeste vs all and it is also reasonable and right that euery mannes cause be there hearde where the faulte was committed and whereas a portion of the flocke is assigned to euery bishoppe by himself whiche euery one ought to rule and gouerne and must geue an accompte of his doynges to the Lorde these whiche bee vnder our gouernaunce ought not therefore to runne about to witte from one Bishoppe to an other neither to breake the agreable concorde of Bishoppes by their guilefull temeritie or rashnesse but ought there to make answere in their causes where thei maie haue accusers witnesses of their crimes excepte it seeme to a fewe desperate and caste awaie persones that the authoritie of the bishoppes that bee in Afrike is lesse then the authoritie of others whiche Bishoppes haue alreadie geuen iudgement of them their cause is alreadie heard sentence is alreadie pronounced against them neither dooeth it agree to the graue iudgemente of Bishoppes to be blamed of the leuitie of a mouable and inconstant mynde whereas our Lorde dooeth saie Let your speache bee yea yea no no. Thus farre saincte Cyprian M. Dormans owne witnesse euen in the same epistle by hymself alleged And this sentence of saincte Cyprian touchyng the determinyng of controuersies in the places where thei dooe rise and that no appellations shal bee made to any bishop of an other Prouince yea and that namely not to the Bishop of Rome nor that he shall sende any Legates Laterall to heare or determine foraine matters dooeth the whole Carthaginense councell approue and allowe wherein was saincte Augustine Drosius and Prosper with 217. moe learned and godlie Bishoppes assembled as I haue before noted The same sainct Cyprian euer agreyng with hym self in this veritie of the equalitie of al bishops which is the ouerthrowe of the supremacie of one dooeth applie many suche places of the scriptures as are customarelie but moste falsely alleged now a daies by this authour and other aduersaries for the proufe of the popes supremacie ouer all Bishoppes to the declaration of the equall authoritie of euery Bishoppe in his own diocesse as the place of Deuteronomium concernyng the obedience due to the high Prieste out of Numerie of the disobedience of Chore Dathan and Abyron against Aaron out of the Actes of the Apostles touching Saincte Paules woordes I wiste not that he was the high Bishoppe for it is written thou shalt not speake euill to the prince of thy people All these places I saie doeth saincte Cyprian allege for the authoritie of Rogatian an Africane Bishop and againste the disobedience of the saied Rogatians oeacon against his bishop And the same places dooeth sainct Cyprian likewise againe in an other place allege for his owne authoritie beeyng Bishop of Carthage and against the stubbornesse of Pupianus towardes hymself So that saincte Cyprian doeth in all places maintaine the equalitie of bishops and withal ouerthrowe the supremacie of one ouer all directlie againste this place by you as out of Pope Leo alleged But in no place is sainct Cyprian more effectuous and piaine concernyng this matter then in his booke intituled De simplicitate praelatorū where he hath these woordes Dn̄sapostolis oībus post resurrectionem suam parem potestatē tribuit mox Hoc erant vtique caeteri apostoli quod fuit Petrus pari consortio praediti honoris potestatis That is to saie The Lorde after his resurrectiō did geue like orequall power to al his Apostles The other Apostles were the veric same that Peter was beeyng indued with like felowship both of honour and power Thus farre saincte Cyprian who beyng in so many places so directlie againste this vsurped supremacie of one and for the equalitie of all Bishoppes it is to be wondered with what face M. Dorman hath been so bold and busie with S. Cyprian in this his treatie of the popes supremacie Now let vs heare S. Hierome M. Dorman his second witnesse and euen in the same epistle by M. Dorman alleged also Where Saincte Hierome speakyng of the authoritie of Churches and Bishops and makyng thē all equall and none aboue an other hath these woordes Nec altera Romanae vrbis ecclesia altera totius orbis estimanda est c. Wée maie not thinke that the Churche of the citie of Rome is one and the Churche of the whole worlde an other Bothe Fraūce and Britaine now called Englāde Afrike and Persie lande the East countreis and Indie and al barbarous nations woorship one Christe and obserue one rule of truth If you seke for authoritie the worlde is greater then the citie of Rome wheresoeuer any bishoppe is whether he be at Rome or Eugubium at Constantinople or at Rhegium at Alexādria or Tanis he is of the same merite of the same priesthoode The power of riches or basenesse of pouertie maketh not a bishope either higher or lower But thei be al the successors of the Apostles But thou wilte saie how dooe thei at Rome a◠the testimonie of the deacon ordein the priest What dooest thou allege to me the custome of one citie what dooest thou chalenge for the lawes of the Churche the vsage of a fewe whereof presumptiō hath risen Thus farre sainct Hierome Vpon the which place Erasmus in his Scholies noteth that Eugubium Rhegium and Tanis were base and little tounes and that sainct Hierome matcheth in paires and couples a poore simple little toune with a noble citie to she we therby that the dignitie of the Bishop is not estéemed by the greatnesse of his diocesse or citie but that all bishops bee equall in office Now let vs compare these twoo sainct Cyprian I saie and saincte Hierome bearyng witnesse with the truthe with Leo onely bearyng witnesse to hymself Leo saieth In the holie Apostles themselues there was a differēce of power and that it was geuen to one to be aboue all the reste On
the contrary parte S. Cyprian saith The Lorde gaue like and equall authoritie to all his Apostles all the Apostles bee indued with like felowship bothe of honour and power Thus saieth S. Cyprian in his booke intitled De simplicitate praelatorum Of the simplicitis of priestes noting them as double faced prelates that teache or attempt the coÌ„trary Againe Leo saieth Out of this forme is taken our difference of Bishoppes that in euery Prouince one bee chief and of moste authoritie and the bishop of greater cities to haue greater care and consequeÌ„tly that he who sitteth in Peters chaire should haue charge be heade of the vniuersall Churche Thus saieth Leo and thus he saieth because he hymself would be Lorde and head ouer all the churche S. Cyprian saieth Euery bishop hath his seuerall portioÌ„ of Christes flocke to rule and gouerne for the which he must geue an accoÌ„pt vnto the Lorde And that those who are vnder the charge of the bishop of one countrey maie not appeale to a bishop of an other nor the cause determined by one Bishop maie be called in question before an other for that the authoritie of one Bishop is not inferiour to an other nor the authoritie of the bishop of Afrike is lesse then the authoritie of the bishops of Italie or Rome it self for his woordes haue euidentlie that relation and that none thinke the authoritie of one bishop to be lesse then the authoritie of an other bishop but a fewe wicked and desperate men Thus you see how your owne witnesses are at square and there is yea and naie betwéene this your Leo and S. CypriaÌ„ in these matters S Hierome agreing with S. Cyprian saith All churches worshippyng one Christ and obseruyng one rule of truthe are equall with the churche of Rome all bishoppes bee the successours of the Apostles and of one priesthoode and of the same merite and dignitie Thus saieth S. Hierome But Leo saith contrary that it was geuen to one to be aboue all the rest that thei who be appoincted in greater diocesses or cities haue more care and authoritie and that th' onely see of Peter hath charge of the vniuersall Churche is heade therof Thus saith Leo. S. Hierome saith The lesse diocesse or toune or the poorer estate maketh not the bishop lower or lesse in authoritie the greater prouince the greater citie the greater riches make not a Bishop greater in authoritie And though Leo doo make neuer so muche of Rome and set it aboue the vniuersall Churche S. Hierome saith Th' authoritie of the vniuersall churche is greater then the authoritie of the churche of Rome as the worlde is greater then the citie of Rome And he saith further What dooest thou allege me the vse of the one citie of Rome for a lawe of the churche wherof riseth presumption of a fewe against all men I thinke y e fire and water are not of more contrary nature then are S. Cyprian and S. Hierome contrarie to that epistle alleged by M. Dorman as Leo the Popes epistle nor that any witnesses brought againste a man by his aduersarie euer haue more directlie testified againste him then these twoo witnesses S. Cyprian and sainct Hierome brought in by D. Hardyng and M. Dorman for them dooe testifie againste them euen in the verie places by themselues alleged besides their consonancie with themselues in al other places and the consent of S. Augustine and twoo hundreth and moe Bishops agrecyng with them againste this Leo. What should one iudge of these meÌ„ bringyng in together three witnesses of the whiche twoo are moste directlie againste them and againste the thirde also who alone seemeth to make with them that thirde as in his owne cause to bee suspected and further to bee doubted also whether it bee he in deede or an other vnder his name and suche as he is the woordes of his testimonie either manifestlie falsified or els at the least in diuers copies beyng not onely diuers but cleane contrarie as hauyng in one copie it is so in an other if M. Dorman slepte not it is not so And yet bothe these impossible bothe to bee true bee one mannes testimonie of one and the same matter and in one and the same place also Were these menne so blinde that thei did not see this or so shamelesse that seyng and knowyng thei durst yet allege suche witnesses for them So blind bussardes thei tooke all menne in the worlde sauyng themselues to bee Surelie me thinketh it to bee an harde case and a silie shamelesse shifte for menne to bee driuen to allege those authours and to bring those witnesses for them whose testimonies dooe thus conuicte them and quite ouerthrowe their cause and withall shame them vtterlie And verie miserable is the Pope and Poperie being driuen now at the laste to the patrocinie of suche proctours who openyng and bewraiyng the weakenesse of the groundes and foundations thereof so long tyme heretofore by ignoraunce of the worlde iudged sure will themselues bryng all Poperie beyng alreadie of it self ruinous to speedie and vtter destruction For the whiche also all godlie and suche as loue the truthe haue greate cause to geue God greate and hartie thankes for that these causes as desperate beyng forsaken of almoste all learned graue men M. Dorman with suche other as he is haue thus taken them in hande and that suche leude matters haue founde at the proctours and patrons moste méete for them Dorman Fol. 6. Hetherto haue you harde good readers beside the experience that we haue of ciuile policie and worldlie gouernemente the opinions also of saincte Cyprian sainct Hierome and holie Leo all three agreing in one that there must nedes be one iudge in Christes church in his steede that the health of the churche dependeth vpon the authoritie of the chief Prieste that if his authoritie bee not aboue all the reste there will so many Schismes breake in vpon vs as there bee Priestes that for the auoidyng of that mischiefe there was one chosen euen amongest the Apostles to gouerne the reste Last of all that that vsage in Chrisâ—es churche to haue one head is no newe inuention as some men falslie report but taken from the example of the Apostles theÌ„selues Nowell Hetherto haue you heard good readers how of the experience of ciuile policie and worldlie gouernment wherein euery seuerall countrey citie and companie haue their seuerall Princes rulers and heades maister Dorman would moste lâ—udely gather that al churches dispersed in all countries cities tounes villages nations peoples and laÌ„guages impossible to be knoweÌ„ and more impossible to be gouerned but of Christ onely the onely head of that vniuersalitie should haue one onely heade here in earth You haue hearde also how ignorantlie if he did not vnderstand how shamelesly if he did vnderstande he hath alleged S. Cyprian and S. Hierome for him beyng bothe in all other places vniuersallie and in the verie speciall places also by
Ambrose Aurelius Prudentius and other Christian writers answeryng that false sclaunder is moste euidente to bee seen And as iustlie might you charge the Apostles and their doctrine with those schismes sectes and troubles as you dooe charge vs with these that haue risen in our daies Where it is well knowen to the worlde that our learned men haue by their writynges more oppugned and repressed the said sectes then all the Papistes haue dooen In deede wee must needes confesse a truth that whiles we al remained vnder the quiet obedience of your Romishe heade in one doctrine of his traditions there was a coloured kinde of quietnesse concorde and loue emongest all the members of that one heade the subiectes of that one gouernour and ruler and specially emōgest the cleargie of that one churche who had in possessiō the riches and rule of the worlde with not onely quietnesse but thankes also of thē that were bothe oppressed and robbed So blinded were thei with ignorance the mother of suche deuotiō brought in by the said Popishe cleargie by hidyng in vnknowen tongues and withdrawyng of the light of Gods woorde whiche should haue shined and guided our steppes better But when that Christ the authour of that light as he hymself and by his Apostles bewraied the errours of the Iuishe traditions by the saied light first springyng withall troubled their vnitie concorde in the doctrine of suche traditions and their quietnesse in their Synagoge so settled before so now the same our sauiour in the tyme by his wisedome appoincted who of his goodnesse would not suffer vs seelie straiyng shéepe to wander in darkenesse of suche errors nor of his iustice could suffer your head the Pope with his adherentes to deceiue his people any longer by the same light of his holy woorde againe springyng shinyng to vs sittyng in suche palpable darkenesse and in the shadowe of death hath disclosed that your head and you for the mainteinaunce of his and your fathers false traditions haue obscured hidden broken and forbiddē the lawe of God our heauenlie father and shinyng before vs hath exhorted vs to folowe and walke in the saied light and hath warned vs to forsake bothe your doctrine and woorkes of darkenesse By this occasiō is there risen a like schisme betweene you and vs as was betweene S. Paule and the Phariseis with whom he was broughte vp from his childhoode before By this occasiō of the light your greate gaine and riches mainteined by the darkenesse of ignoraunce and deuotion of seelie soules deceiued sufferyng themselues to bée robbed is decaied as was the gaine of Image makers shrine makers and other artificers of superstition in Ephesus by the preachyng of S. Paule By this meanes is your quietnesse troubled your reste interrupted your good cheare marred your pompe abated your estimation decaied and the yoke of your tyrannie shaken of our neckes This maketh your Romishe head and you crie as you doo and barke againste vs as heretikes and schismatikes as did the high priest and other Iuishe priestes and Phariseis crie out againste Christe and his Apostles This maketh your head and you to persecute vs moste cruellie and to adiudge vs to death as did your aunciente fathers persecute and iudge Christe and his Apostles If this bee to make schismes wee confesse our selues schismatikes from you who haue firste made your selues schismatikes from Christe and his Apostles To whō as wée doubt not but wée haue ioigned our selues in the truth of his Gospell so haue you in déede in persecuting of vs for professyng Christes Gospell and the doctrine of his Apostles ioigned your selues with the old Synagoge of Satan and the Iuishe Priestes and Phariseis who for the same cause persecuted Christe and his Apostles to death moste cruellie But if that you could with vs embrace the truthe of Christes Gospell walke with vs ioinctly in the light of his woorde there should bee more true quietnesse as well of consciences as of bodies more sincere loue more godlie vnitie peace ioy then euer there was wordlie quietnesse loue ioye in the darkenesse of Poperie Which because you refuse to doo despisyng the peaceable wayes of the Lorde you are guiltie of all these schismes and troubles and not we And so finallie for this part of purgation of our selues againste your sclaunders of schismes and troubles as by vs raised dooe we allege the effecte of the same Parable of the strong manne so quiet in his house vntill a stronger then he came and disturbed him whiche Christ our sauiour in like sclaūder rehearsed for defense of hymself If the reader shall thinke that I haue been to tedious in answeryng this matter here but touched by M. Dorman as it were by the waie I truste he will beare with me therein for that M. Dorman as he beganne and floorished the first face of his booke with blotting vs by this sclaunder of schismes so hath he hetherto cōtinued in the same and applied all his allegations out of S. Cyprian Basill Hierome Nicephorus and others chieflie to that purpose and omitteth not in euery other leafe hereafter importunately to repeate the same folowyng therein Eckius Pighius Hosius and generally all the aduersaries that speake or write againste vs who doo moste vehementlie and continuallie burthen vs with the crimes of schismes and fectes and of the disturbaunce of the quiet state of the churche and worlde at their pleasure termyng vs Heretikes Schismatikes Huguenotes Caluiniās Lutherans and Zuinglians Neither are thei contented herewith but doo also play with pictures verie pleasantlie as thei thinke in the whiche thei painte out a multitude of suche heretikes or rebelles as our confederates or alies whose opinions wee doo moste abhorre and against whom we continuallie bothe preache and write And all this doo thei for that thei are not ignoraunte that suche though moste false sclaunders beyng yet so importunelie and continuallie laied to our charge are of muche effecte to offende the mindes of the weake and simple to stirre vp their hatred against vs. And therefore thei vse suche constant asseuerations for argumentes as in their schooles thei are taught to doo when thei are destitute of due proufes whiche hath also caused me for the simplear sortes sake once at large to answere and earnestlie to repell that false vsuall sclaunder of schismes troubles laied vpon vs by those who are themselues moste guiltie thereof For I truste that no reasonable reader will thinke vs to bee suche onelie for that it pleaseth them maliciouslie so to misname vs and onelie to saie we be suche seyng their tongues and pennes are their owne to vse as thei liste and not in our power For as wee haue no religion but onelie Christes so desire we to be called after the names of none but his as we bee so to be named christians and beyng Christians we care not to bee called heretikes of heretiques or schismatikes of schismatiques suche as in
whole companie of Papistâ—s beeyng at so good leisure as thei are that thei haue not hitherto answered the Apologie so loÌ„g abroade in their handes as we are blamed of many for that your bookes lately set foorth are not foorthwith answered It is a pleasure for M. Dorman to shoote at rouers to range as he liste in railyng here and there and to call the Apologie a fardle of lies But it is not so easy for maister Dorman nor D. Hardyng to answere it piththilie to the satisfiyng of the learned readers Whiche neither thei bothe nor their whole Romishe cleargie shal euer be able to answere to any purpose But I maie iustlie replie to M. Dorman as the truth is that this his booke is nothing els but a fardell of lies ragyng railinges packed together as I truste I haue in deede notified to the discreate reader for that is passed ouer of it hetherto doubte not of like successe in the rest And I thinke that all honest and learned men in déede will so muche more like the saied Apologie when thei shall vnderstande that it so muche mistiketh M. Dorman and other of like honestie and learnyng as he is Dorman fol. 7. But because I haue perceiued that God in that people in their lawe and priesthoode shadowed out vnto vs like a cunning workeman the whole forme and proportion of his churche as witnesseth saincte Paule Lex vmbram habet futuroruÌ„ bonoâ—â— non ipsam imag inem rerum The lawe conteineth a shadowe of the good thynges to come but expresseth not manifestly the truth of thinges therefore I thought I might well reason from the shadow to the bodie from the resemblaunce image to the truthe thereto answering FroÌ„ the whiche kinde of reasonyng saincte Paule sometymes absteined not as when he laboured to proue that the lawe of the gospell would beare that thei whiche preached the gospell should liue thereby he reasoned after this sort Nunquid secundum hominem haec dico â–ª Speake I this as a man That is to saie proue I this by worldly reasons An lex haec non dicit Saieth not the lawe so toe And so goeth he forewarde and proueth yet by this texte of the olde lawe Thou shalt not moosell or binde vp the mouth of the labouryng Oxe as though he should haue saied it was so in the shadowe therefore it must be so in the bodie and in the truth signified by that shadowe Thus ye se good readers that I maie saie with saincte Paule haue I proued onely by reasons fetched from the dooynges of men by examples of all common wealthes and societies well gouerned that in Christes common weale there must be also one to rule Haue I affirmed this because sainct Cyprian saincte Hierom blessed and holy Leo so saied VVho yet were while thei liued here but men although now sainctes in heauen Nunquid non lex haec dicit Saieth not the lawe so toe Nowell You take to muche pain M. Dorman to prooue y t you may lawfully with S. Paule allege out of th' old testament for the proofe of good causes as he did We blame you not for that you allege out of th' old testament but for your guilefull vntrue application of places of the old testament of the doctors to suche purposes as thei apperteine nothyng vnto at all naie are moste contrary to the same I would you and all other aduersaries of the truth would as you saie with sainct Paule reason from the shadowes of the olde lawe to the truthe therby figured but you haue dooen otherwise For you dooe not with sainct Paule but with Pighius and Hosius vse this place not bringing vs by shadowes to the truthe as did S. Paule but by your shadowes of Ceremonies you haue darkened the truthe brought vs quite awaie from it You haue by this your reason so was it in the shadowe therfore it must be so in the bodie in the truthe signified by that shadowe not onely placed your Romishe head ouer the whóle Christian Churche but also of Christians you haue made vs Iewes and your selues of ministers of the Gospell haue you made Iewishe Aaronicall Leuites You haue on Aarons robes you vse his gestures you haue brought in his incense his censers his altars his candelles his candlestickes his belles and his banners his gold and his siluer into the seruice and Temple of God Of the whiche then beginning S. Hierome in his time muche coÌ„plained And would to God you had doen no woorse then thus made vs and your selues altogether Iuishe by your shadowes imitatyng and counterfaityng the olde lawe I would ye had not also by bringyng in of Idols by inuocations of dead menne by your charmes and witchecraftes contrary to all Gods lawe both old and newe made vs altogether moste wicked Ethnishe Idolaters and withall made a marte and set a sale all this your religion thereby to robbe séelie Christians both of their witte and money yea and of their soules health too whiche is moste of all as it is euidente to all the worlde you haue dooen But now to proceede with M. Dormans reason from the shadowe to the bodie from the figure to the truthe from the Iuishe churche to ours In the Iuishe churche all the people menne wemen and children had the Scripture in a language that thei did well vnderstande the Leuites and priestes in the Iuishe churche had wiues and children in the Iuishe churche there were no Images ergo it must be so now in our churche For God like a cunnyng workeman in that people in their lawe and priesthoode shadowed out vnto vs the whole forme and proportion of his churche now it was so in the shadowe therefore it must be so in the bodie and in the truthe These bee your owne woordes M. Dorman To proceede Maie it be proued by reason onely that thei who are bounden to obeie Goddes lawe oughte to vnderstande and knowe Goddes lawe Dooeth not the lawe saie so too Maie it bee proued by reason onely that ministers of the Churche maie haue wiues Maie not one reason with S. Paule Vnusquisque propter vitandam fornieationem habeat vxorem suam Et qui se non continent nubant Nam melius est nubere quà mvri That is to saie Let euery man for the auoiding of fornication haue his wife And suche as caÌ„not conteine let theÌ„ marie for it is better to marie then to burne Dooeth not the lawe saie so too Maie it bee proued by reason onely that Images ought not to bee in the temples and that men whiche haue life and reason ought not to boow and scoupe to insensible blockes or stones Dooeth not the lawe forbidde it to If you will denie my argumentes and thinke these reasons vnreasonable as I thinke you will yet I trust you doo against your own woords and forme of reasoning And good M. Dorman asâ—oile me of
vnto your selues as beyng the churche the interpretatiō thereof yet suche are both your doctrine and dooynges and so contrarie to the woorde of God whervpon the true churche is builded that we muste needes thinke that you are not the true church of God And whether you so bee or no seeyng it is in question and a greater doubte and controuersie emongest men I am sure then can bee about the sense of any place of the scripture you shall neuer bee able to make any exception vnto the Scripture as no competent iudge in controuersies but we shall be able tenne tymes more to make exception to your Pope and his churche as no indifferent nor meete iudge Wherefore cease once to bragge of that as the vndoubted iudge of all doubtes whiche is it self emongest men of all other doubtes the greatest doubt that is whether you be the true church of God or no. Whiche is with vs in deede no doubte nor with any that hath any vnderstandyng in Goddes woorde and iudgemente in true religion For we certainlie knowe by the woorde of God vpon the whiche as the true churche is builded so is it by the same to be knowen that you bee not the churche of God for that you so swarue from the woorde of God As for vs that wee are at your handes though we bryng so euidente scriptures for vs so reiected and condemned wee take it the better for that wée vnderstande that our sauiour Christe and his holie Apostles likewise allegyng the scriptures yea and further by their woonderfull woorkes and moste godlie life confirmyng the same were by the high Priestes Phariseis and Scribes reiected condemned and siaine an eternall documente that in this worlde no persone nor doctrine can satisfie al men or shall be taken for a iudge of controuersies aboue all exception and quarellyng seyng that Christe hymself so teachyng so woorkyng so liuyng was excepted vnto as a Daemoniake or one possessed with the Deuill as a friende to sinners as a wine drinker and seeyng that heade corner stone was as vnprofitable to the buildyng of Gods churche and his holie woorde also as false doctrine reiected by the high priestes Scribes and Phariseis who would needes be the iudges of all themselues And wee conceiue good hope that as our sauiour himself with his holie Apostles teachyng the truthe though reiected and murdered by the said high Priestes Scribes and Phariseis haue wonne vnto them the iudgementes of all godlie men and wemen against suche vnrighteous iudges so we likewise teachyng the same truthe of our Sauiour reueiled in his holie Gospell though of this high priest and Romishe Caiphas with his adherentes Popishe Scribes and Phariseis reiected condemned and murthered shall against suche vniuste iudges winne vnto vs the iudgement of all godlie menne and wemen as to the greate decaie of their false superstition successe of the truthe is this daie thankes bee to God partlie come to passe in a greate parte of the Christian worlde Dorman fol. 8. But of this I will entreate more largelie hereafter In the meane season that theie will haue of Christes Churche here in earth no other head but Christ hymselfe therein thei fare me thincketh not muche vnlike to a certaine felon of whom I haue heard that beyng areigned at the barre for a felonie when he had pleadid to the indictement not guiltie and was after the manner demaunded how he would bee tried he would suspectyng his owne case and knowyng that if he satisfied the lawe in putting hymself apon the triall of the coūtrey there were no moe waies with hym but one make thereto no other answere but onely that he would put hymself apon God the righteous Iudge of all ▪ who although he said truely that God was the chief iudge of all as the protestantes do in calling Christ the head of the church yet was ther in his case an other iudge here in this world vnder god by whō he must haue byn tried as there is in theirs an other heade here in the churche to order them and kepe thē vnder in whō Christ the chiefe head of all vseth in all necessarie knowledge to giue answere And as the felon knewe well that there was an other iudge beside god appealed not to him as though before him he should haue byn acquitted proued not guiltie but onely to gaine a longer time of life and libertie so doe I doute not our aduersaries the protestantes And truely to bothe theise kinde of men beyng bothe theeues the one sorte doyng violence to the bodie the other to the soule if suche pleas mighte be allowed how soeuer thei be coloured with the name of Christe betwene them bothe thei would freely rob the bodie and murther the soule Nowell Now proceadeth he pleasantlie and by a parable of a certaine felone all to shaketh vs out of our cloutes as he praied he might be suffered to dooe In the handlyng whereof it maie seeme he hath dealte as he was wonte when some of his felowes had forgotten their partes in the plaie to holde men occupied for the time by suppliyng that defecte with some pretie conceites or tellyng of some merie tale thereby to make the auditours to laugh and the lesse to marke the mased memorie of his mates and so to saue the matter from vtter marryng as muche as in hym might lye In like wise dooeth maister Dorman here for where he hath to proue that of necessitie there must be one onely chief heade here in earth ouer the Churche whiche is in deede the firste and moste necessarie parte of the whole treatie of the Popes supremacie and the verie foundation of all whiche not proued or els leudly proued all the reste commeth doune vpon their heades For the whiche so greate a matter little beyng as yet saied by M. Dorman and nothyng in deede and lesse remainyng behinde to bee saied the man beyng destitute of all carnest matter piththie reason and good authoritie turneth himself to his accustomed arte and by a pretie tale of a certaine felone all to shaketh vs as he before threatned he would dooe out of our masking cloutes as he termeth them and this he dooeth to supplie other defectes thereby and to make this first parte moste necessarie of all to be piththily proued by suche patchyng of i◠vp at the leaste a quarter as bigge as his seconde part of this treatie to witte that no prince or lay man maie be the onely head of the whole Churche for that priestes haue more to doo in ecclesiastical matters thā thei haue Whiche so long an impertinente parte had M. Dorman put vp in his purse and passed ouer with silence he had spared a greate deale of paper ynke and labour and of other mennes tyme also a greate deale more and had hurte his cause no more thereby then if he had lefte his dagger sheathe behynde hym when he came out in haste to plaie his parte in the pagiaunte But
the highe priest or bishop as was Moises to Aaron To procéede Chore Dathan and Abyron rebelled against Moises and Aaron who were specially by God appointed to be their gouernours and his ministers but what apperteineth that to vs who doo obey our natural Prince appoincted by God to be our gouernour all as well ciuil magistrates as ecclesiastical ministers of god vnder our Prince And therfore dooe we as we must néedes renouÌ„ce the authoritie of y t foraigne vsurper of Rome sworne enemy to our prince and couÌ„trey who is not our gouernour nor the lawfull minister of almighty God but a foraigne false vsurper and the Diuels bailie generall chalenging suche a superioritie as none can holde by any tenure but from the Diuell him selfe It is you Papistes that are the successours of the rebelles Chore Dathan and Abyron who leauing the obedience due to your own natural Princes for the seruing of a foraigne false vsurper of Rome doo rebeli not onely against Moises that is to saie your gouernour by God appointed but against God himselfe also You rebell against God and his seruaunt Moises alwaies you set vp and mainteine Idolles and Idolatrie contrary to the manifest woorde of God geuen by his minister Moises You doo charge the Apologie vniustly For it saieth truely that Christe néedeth no suche one onely head ouer all his churche as the Pope would séeme to be neither can there be any suche but Christe him selfe onely as hath at large bene before declared But when M. Dorman so speaketh as though we would haue no gouernours at all in Christes churche for that we refuse that one vsurpar he dooeth deale deceiptfully with the simple and impudently with vs. For we acknowledge that as Moyses and Aaron were gods ministers by him appointed to gouerne his peculiar people Israel so hath God likewyse appoincted to euery seuerall countrey their Moyses and Aaron their owne Princes and pastoures or bishops whiche ought likewyse to be obeied as Moises and AaroÌ„ were to be obeied of the Israelites And that those who doo disobeye them doo sinne by rebellion as did Chore Dathan and Abiron This appeareth to be true by S. Cyprian who dooeth alleage this example of the rebellion of Chore Dathan and Abiron against suche as be stubborne and disobedient to their owne seuerall bishoppes as was one Pupianus to himselfe and as was the African Deacon against Rogatian his African byshop In the whiche epistle also S. Cyprian alleageth manie other places of the scripture falsely applied nowe adayes to the proufe of the Popes supremacie for the authoritie of euery bishop in his owne diocesse But this place of Douteronomium is neither by S. Cyprian nor any other but onely Papistes alleaged for proufe that the byshop of Rome is to be obeied by any sauynge onely Romaines or Italians his inferiours Concerninge the reason made by Chore Dathan Abiron that the people ought not to obey their gouernours because thei be al holy that therfore the magistrates ought not to lifte them selues aboue the Lordes people it is not our reason as M. DormaÌ„ saith it is the reason of the popish swarmes of their counterfeite hypocrites falsely called religious yea of the whole popish clergie who haue procured of their father of Rome immunities from all obedience to their naturall Princes appointed by God ouer them as was Moises ouer the Israelites It is therfore Chanon Chore Dathan Dane Monke and Abbot Abiron with their complices of false Friers and other hypocrites that were so holy shauelinges that they might not for any crime were it neuer so hainous bee tried by the lawes of their countrey nor aunswere before their naturall prince They cried as did Chore Dathan and Abiron they were the holy people of the great lorde of Rome and that no temporall lorde might lifte vp him selfe aboue them And thus they shewed themselues to be the very children of their forefathers Chore Dathan AbiroÌ„ as truely as M. Dorman dooth falsely obiect it to vs. Now whereas M. Dorman alleageth the apologie as thus reasoning that the churche hath no neede of any other ruler because Christ is vvith it Truthe it is if M. Dorman dooe meane one onely head of the vniuersall churche For Christ néedeth no such generall gouernour seyng he is both present himselfe continually by his spirite as he promised also for that he hath in euery peculiar countrey church his Moises Aaron that is to faie his seuerall deputies in his stéede euery where here in earth for that no one mortall man can possibly suffice to the gouernaunce of the whole worlde or churche whiche woordes followyng in the Apologie M. Dorman of his accustomed sinceritie omitteth vtterly For it is the especiall woorke of Gods omnipotent wysedome as first to haue created the whole worlde and instituted the whole churche so vniuersally to gouerne the fame reachynge mightily from ende to ende ouer all and swéetely disposing or gouerning all thinges where as séely man ouercharged with the goueruaunce of a little percell is euer founde guiltie when it shal be said vnto hym Redde rationem villicationis tuae ReÌ„der an accompt of thy Stewardship At the lasâ—e he concludeth with a terrible denuntiation as it were thunderyng in a kinderkinne and lightnyng out of a brighte Basen moste terribly that we must folowe Chore and his fellowes swallowed quicke by hell as rebellious wretches againste the Popes Monarchie vnlesse we repent But wee feare no necessitie of suche horrible damnation vpon M. Dormans Muste For as wee are moste farre from rebellyng againste our naturall soueraigne and other Goddes ministers appoincted to gouerne vs and therefore no partakers of Chore and his fellowes rebellion so trust we in God to be moste farre from their moste horrible destruction And wee geue warnyng to M. Dorman with his maister doctour Harding and all suche as thei bee who for maintenaunce of a forraine Pharao against their conscience as is to be feared doo disobeie their owne naturall prince and that vpon the pretence of holinesse and spiritualitie and are therein moste like to Chore Dathan and Abyron rebellyng againste their owne speciall gouernours by God appoincted as thei did that thei make speede by vnfeined repentaunce to mollifie Gods moste iuste wrathe that thei folowe not Chore Dathan and Abyron in horrible damnation as thei haue folowed them in damnable rebellion Dorman Fol. II. But yet let vs good readers that nothyng maie remaine that might in any wise seeme to blemis he this truthe goe one steppe farder For as yet will our aduersaries I know wel saie that I neuer came where it grew For our case saie thei is farre otherwise then you take it seyng that we vtterlie denie not that Christe woorketh by meanes but onely swarue from you in that we take those instrumentes and meanes to be other then you doe For the scripture wee saie whiche Christ hath lefte to vs is the
the conference of scriptures for that heretikes haue vsed the like And what if Arrians Anabaptistes or other heretikes will not bee satisfied with conference of places and textes of scripture Is it not well that all true Christians be satisfied thereby Dooe not thei allege Doctours and Councelles for them aswell as scriptures As though M. Dorman could deuise vs a waie that should satisfie all heretikes without all contradiction or exception on their parte whiche shall neuer in this worlde be brought to passe For our Sauiour Christe hymself the soonne of God neither by the authoritie of his diuine persone nor by the truthe of his heauenlie doctrine nor by the confirmation of the same by his wonderfull miracles neither by his example of moste vertuous life neither by al these together did satisfie al men but that many yea those who of reason leaste should the Priestes Scribes and Phariseis made exception to his persone and life and were not satisfied by his doctrine It M. Dorman therefore dooe mislike the Scriptures or the conference of textes for that all men will not be thereby satisfied sure I am that he shall neuer bee satisfied in this worlde as one that might by that reason mislike also of our sauiour Christ hymself as no-sufficient iudge And thinketh he that Popes of Rome menne of suche life suche partialitie suche ignorance suche vntruthe suche falsehoode suche briberie Simoniakes poisoneâ—â— murtherers shall satisfie all menne in all their iudgementes of all causes and controuersies yea in their own verie causes wherein thei be parties and that without all exception The deuill thei shall and that maie I saie truely Wherefore I dooe coÌ„clude though our sauiour Christ were to the high Priestes Scribes Phariseis and other wicked a stone to stuÌ„ble at and a rocke of ruine his Gospell either an offence or a mockage so farre of was it that he did satisfie theÌ„ yet is he and his holie woord whiche is the vertue the wisedome of God the true iudge in all controuersies doubtes of religion whatsoeuer the high prieste or his adherentes the Scribes and Phariseis dooe faie to the contrary or be M. Dorman neuer so angrie therewith Dorman Fol. 13. If your hartes good readers bee moued vvith these heresies in the readyng as truelie God I take to vvitnesse myne vvas in the vvrityng abhorre those that teache them shonne and auoide suche principles and groundes as haue been the foundation not of these onelie but of all that novve reigne in the vvorlde and maie bee of any other hereafter that any desperate heretike listeth to inuente Sticke to those by vvhiche all heretikes haue been and these shal be to ther vtter coÌ„fusion vanquished Shrinke not rashelie from that fundation vvhereon your elders and forefathers fastenyng theÌ„selues haue passed ouer so many hundred yeres in the true confession of one God one faithe one truthe to them that hauyng yet scarse fourtie on their backes haue notvvithstandyng emongest them creapyng all out of the filthie neast of one Martin Luther so many faithes and yet no faith so many truthes and yet no truthe neuer a one agreyng vvith the other as there be madde frantike heades emongest them Geue no eare to that subtill generatioÌ„ vvalkyng in the darck like blinde Battes vvithout a head vvithout a Iudge and all to the ende their iuggeling might not be espied Nowell O pitifull harted manne but yet farre better Oratour then tender harted who when he drawyng towardes an ende of this his first parte that is to witte That the vvhole churche must needes haue one onelie heade and thinkyng that he ought to haue some matter of weighte to mooue affections vpon and findyng none in his purposed matter bringeth in the rehearsall of the Arrians and Anabaptistes heresies whiche it is knowen to the worlde that we dooe moste abhorre and vpon them as it were vpon our heresies dooeth this Rhetorician russhe into these vehemente affections whiche he mooueth here but as I thinke stirreth no wise manne excepte it be to laugh at his foolishenesse Where he speaketh of desperate heretikes sainct Cyprian so calleth all suche as thinke one Bishoppe inferiour to an other as dooeth maister Dorman and suche other Papistes as hath been before declared Maister Dorman adourneth the Popes chaire or see of Rome with many glorious titles but nameth it not as yet neither a greate while after partly for that a periphrasis or circumscription was here more meete for amplifications sake and partelie for that when he had reiected the scriptures he thought it not good by and by to saie that all heretikes whiche by no meanes can be vanquished by the scriptures muste bee vanquished by the see of Rome or Peters chaire or Popes theron sittyng but to auoide all shewe of absurditie he compasseth the matter and at the laste stealeth vnto the see of Rome vnder S. Hieromes name That he exhorteth you to sticke to those by whom all heretikes haue been and these shal be to their vtter confusion vanquished meaning the Popes of Rome as is afterward euideÌ„t I aunswere If force fire and fagoties faile them not for other meanes to vanquishe haue not the Popes nor knowe thei any thei will no doubte vse their cruell furie againste vs as thei haue dooen and yet haue thei as I thinke neither gotten any greate gaine nor made any greate conqueste but if Gods woorde maie bee heard I doubte not but the Popes chaire of pestilence shal be shortly ouerthrowen and he with all Papistes vanquished to their vtter confusion Where he calleth the Popes chaire for it he meaneth as after he dooeth declare the foundation whereon our elders forefathers staâ—ed them selues many hundreth yeres in the confession of one faithe and truthe c. the contrarie is moste true that the Pope hath as muche as in him hath lien subuerted the faithe and truth of Christ and destroyed Christian menne and Christendome moste horribly sith his false forged supremacie in these our latter daies hath gotten creadite Our faithe and doctrine haue as many yeres on their backes as haue the scriptures whereon thei are grounded as hath the Primitiue Churche and olde aunciente Doctours wherewith in all necessarie pâ—inctes of religion thei agrée throughly It is the Pope and his supremacie and other Poperie that is builded vpon a late and sandie foundation and therefore shortlie to bée subuerted and â—ooted vp Concernyng diuersities of faithes disagréeynges and Schismes whiche M. Dorman so often repeateth he dooeth nothyng els but caste their owne dounge at our heades laiyng the peculiar and proper faultes of the Papistes to our charges accordyng as I haue at large before declared and as I truste sullie satisfied the discreate reader therein That whiche maister Dorman speaketh of franlike heades hath allusion to his maisters case when he forsooke the truthe and reuolted to Poperie â–ª The worlde knoweth wee bee not subtile but are sore encombred with the craftie generatioÌ„ of Papistes The
rotten chaire or ruinous Rome were the rocke whereon the churche of our sauior Christ is builded And to make the purposed wickednesse of these aduersaries of the verie rocke Christe and his truthe who care not what thei allege for the maintenaunce of their desperate cause of the Popes supremacie though theÌ„selues dooe knowe it serueth nothing for their purpose at all more manifeste to all the worlde I lette the reader vnderstande that Erasmus in his scholies or annotations vpon this epistle whiche M. Dorman were he not asleape muste needes see did warne him that he should not after this sorte so falsifie S. Hierome in this place For though he coÌ„fesse that S. Hierome might seeme by this place to thinke that all churches ought to be vnder the Romaine see or at the leaste not straungers from it yet when he noteth vpon these woordes I knowe the churche is builded vpoÌ„ that rocke he saieth Super illam PetraÌ„ c. Non super Romam vt arbitror nam fieri potest vt Roma quoque degeneret sed super eam fidem quam Petrus professus est quam hactenus Romana seruauit ecclesia qua non alia minus laborauit haeresibus That is to saie Vpon this rocke not vpon Rome I trow for it maie come to passe that Rome also goe out of kinde but vpon the faith whiche Peter professed and the whiche hither to the Romain churche hath kept then the whiche church no other hath been lesse infected with heresies Thus farre Erasmus cleane contrary to M. Dorman and all Papistes who would haue the Romaine see to bee the rocke wheron Christes churche is builded and that the said see can not possibly erre Yea and further the same Erasmus in the beginnyng of his argument vpon his treatie againste the Luciferians whiche is nexte to his twoo epistles to Damasus hath these woordes Nulla haeresis grauius afflixit totius orbis ecclesias quà m Arrianorum adeò vt Romanum quoque pontificem ipsos inuoluerit imperatores That is to say No heresie hath more greuouslie afflicted the Churches of all the worlde then the Arrians in so muche that it hath wrapped in the Bishop of Rome and the Emperours themselues Thus farre Erasmus It pleaseth M. Dorman sometyme to allege Erasmus against vs whose authoritie if it bee good doune goeth the Pope and all Poperie for if the bishoppes of Rome haue been infected with heresie their Chaire is not that vnmoueable rocke as M. Dorman would haue it Now if M. Dorman did not see these notes of Erasmus vpon the place by hym alleged out of S. Hierome I praise his diligence he maie of Dorman bee called Dormitantius as sainct Hierome whom he falsely allegeth called Vigilantius and more iustlie bothe by nature and sounde of name maie M. DormaÌ„ be so called then euer was Vigilantius by sainct Hierome But if M. Dorman did see Erasmus note and dissembled it as he did see these S. Hieromes woordes I folowyng no heade but Christe nexte and moste necessarilie ioigned to the sentence by hym alleged and yet of purpose cutte them of by the necke then is M. Dormans candor and sinceritie vsuall to hym throughout all his booke moste woorthie of plentifull Popishe praise But if Erasmus iudgemente and authoritie be nothyng woorthe but onelie when he seemeth to speake againste vs then I will yet in Christes quarell that he is the Rocke not Peters rotten chaire bring foorth one witnesse not onely greater then Erasmus but also equall with S. Hierome and aboue all Papistes in creadite and authoritie S. Augustine in his 13. Sermon vpon the Gospell of Mathewe hath these woordes Quia tu dixisti mihi inquit Christus Petro Tu es Christus filius Dei viui ego tibi tu es Petrus Simon quippe antè vocabatur hoc autem nomen vt Petrus appellaretur ei à domino impositum est hoc vt ea figura significaret Ecclesiam Quia enim Christus Petra Petrus populus christianus Petra enim principale nomen est ideo Petrus à Petra non Petra à Petro quomodo non à christiano Christê° sed à Christo christianus vocatur Tu es ergouÌ„quit Petrus super hanc Petram quam confessus es super haÌ„c Petram quaÌ„ cognouisti dicens tu es Chrstus filius dei viui aedificabo ecclesiam meam id est super meipsum filium dei viui aedificabo ecclesiam meam Super me aedificabo te non me super te NaÌ„ volentes homines Ä™dificari super homines dicebant ego quidem sum Pauli ego autem Apollo ego verò Cephae ipse est Petrus Et alij qui nolebant aedificari super Petrum sed super Petram ego autem sum Christi Apostolus autem Paulus vbi cognouit se eligi Christum coÌ„temni diuisus est inquit Christus Nunquid Paulus pro vobis crucifixus est aut in nomine Pauli baptizati estis Quomodo noÌ„ in Pauli sic nec in Petri sed iÌ„ nomine Christi vt Petrus edificaretur super PetraÌ„ non Petra supra PetruÌ„ c. That is to saie Because thou haste saied to me saieth Christe to Peter Thou art Christe the sonne of the liuyng God I dooe also saie to thee thou art Peter for before he was called Simon but this name that he should be called Peter was geuen him of the Lorde to th' ende that by that figure he might signifie y e churche For because Christe is Petra the Rocke Petrus is the Christian people For Petra is the principal name and therefore Petrus cometh of Petra and not Petra of Petrus as Christus Christe is not named à Christiano of a Christian but Christianus a Christian is named of Christus Christ Therefore saith Christ Thou art Peter and vpon this rocke which thou hast confessed vpoÌ„ this rocke whiche thou hast knowen saiyng Thou art Christe the sonne of the liuyng God I will builde my churche that is vpon my self beyng the sonne of the liuyng God will I builde my churche I will builde thée vpon me not me vpon thee For men y e would be builded vpoÌ„ men did saie I am of Paule I of Apollo and I of Cephas that is of Peter And other who would not bee builded vpon Petrum Peter but vpon Petram the rocke did saie I am of Christe And the Apostle Paule wheÌ„ he did knowe that he was chosen or preferred and Christ despised by some men saied is Christe diuided Was Paule crucified for you Or were you Baptized in the name of Paule And as not in Paules name no more were ye baptized in the name of Peter but in the name of Christ that Peter might be builded vpon the rocke not the rocke vpon Peter and so foorthe Thus farre S. Augustine And the same interpretation and defence that Christ is the rocke and not Peter doeth sainct Augustine againe in his Retractations repete and maintaine Wherefore you see maister Dorman