Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	church_n	lord_n	word_n	4,134	5	3.9920	3	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A77749	Doctor Chamberlain visited with a bunch of his own grapes, gathered out of his own packet of letters: to know whether my answer to his question gave satisfaction, and that by his reply to partake of those rare gifts of the spirit, which he proffered to publish in Black-fryers Church. Also an answer to Dr Chamberlains reply, concerning sprinkling the baptized. / By Thomas Bakewel.	Bakewell, Thomas, b. 1618 or 19.	1650 (1650)	Wing B532; Thomason E601_4; ESTC R206402	21,189	30

these are falsly spoken of me although your selfe and other Lay-men amongst Anabaptists frequently do them But cavilling Anabaptists have alwayes something to say against those that are truly orthodox If our learned Ministers write any Tract then they say they have nothing but Humane Learning they have not the Spirit and if any illiterate man shall write against them then he wants Learning but if for them then say you in your first Letter God gives poor Fishermen the Spirit which he doth not to learned Clarks Then you would make the world beleeve that you are of a very humble spirit and you deserve not the title of Tyrus But Pride breakes out and spoiles all saying that which you falsely charged me withall That our Ministers durst not answer you there was none so bold yet still you would have me bear the name and keep the vice your selfe saying I presume to answer for Doctor Gouge supposing my selfe the abler man which will not follow although it may be more willing because it is like he knows the temper of your spirit better then I. Then you say that I except against you for asking Dr Gouge a question because he is ancient when as multitude of years should teach wisdom Iob 32.7 and of whom should we enquire but of them that take upon them the Office should not the Priests lips keep Knowledg Mal. 2.7 But here like Corah you say he takes the Office upon him but beware of Corahs Judgment See Numb 16.3.35.40 You charge him but condemne your selfe doing the same thing But why did not you come to learn at his mouth which is your duty from that Text Mal. 2.7 Neither do I except against asking the Doctor a question because he is ancient but because you more required his Pulpit then his Answer to make division rather then to seeke for satisfaction Neither is it fit I say that ancient Ministers should be dayly troubled with all the vain queries that Anabaptists may put unto them But then you are troubled that I should not give you leave to state your own question which was so stated that the answering of it as it was would start up more questions which would be endlesse Therefore it was my desire to confine the question onely to Sprinkling the Baptized and leave Infants for another question at this you cavil asking Whether they must first be baptized and then sprinkled which shews of what spirit you are as if I should say Such a man hath married a wife for which you should accuse me for saying he marryed her that was a wife at that time to another man Then you say That Doctor Gouge doth acknowledge That Sprinkling and Baptizing Infants is but a Tradition of the Church I question the truth of it But I say they are such Traditions of the Church as that they are not mans Inventions nor by man to be abolished Then you come to my first Argument in these words The Lord foretold that in the times of the Gospel his People should be sprinkled with clean water Ezek. 36.25 To this you propound many queries thus Whether Sprinkling here be meant Baptisme or by cleane water the elementary water and you bee meant Infants and the time then be meant the time of the Gospel with the Gentiles or the time of the glorious Calling of the Jews or whether Sprinkling doe not allude to that Sprinkling under the Law they not knowing Johns nor Christs Baptism and whether pure water be not meant the Holy Ghost in the language of Christ To this I answer Let them be Iewes or Gentiles in respect of Country bond or free male or female Infants or of full age all in the Christian Church have right to Baptisme Neither can this Text look back to the Jewish Sprinklings under the Law because it is a Prophecy or Promise to come hereafter neither can this be meant of the Essence of the Holy Ghost to be sprinkled which is uncommunicable and for the graces or operations of the Holy Ghost promised to be bestowed in the latter dayes they are no where promised to be by sprinkling a few drops But saith the Lord it shall come to passe that I will poure out my Spirit Ioel 2.28 I will poure water upon him that is thirsty and floods upon the dry ground I will poure my Spirit upon thy seed and my blessing upon thy off-spring Isa 44.3 Now see the Apostles Exposition of these Texts It shall come to pass saith God that I will pour out my spirit Act. 2.17 And saith Christ himself Out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water but this spake he of the Spirit Ioh. 7.38 39. Neither is it likely that the Promise of Grace in the fulnesse of Christs Kingdome should be no more but a few drops sprinkled which they had when these Promises were made so that it remaines that this Sprinkling here fore-told to be with clean water is the Elementary water sprinkled upon the Baptized as the outward form which may signifie all that abundance of grace promised to be then bestowed upon the Christian Church And Mr Doctor these things I am confident shall be accomplished although you taxe me with Lay-ignorance and to be talketive and you beleeve that these mistakes will make them to keep the staff in their own hands and not to suffer such though never so zealous and devout to betray their cause To this I know not whom you mean but God forbid that for any private cause any Power on Earth should suppresse the Truth although they have the staff of power in their hand But then you conclude All that can be said upon this place is onely a Promise what God will do and not a Command what man must do Ans It may be the outward form of Baptism by sprinkling of water for all that for God may do it by Instruments The Pharisees heard that Jesus made and baptized more Disciples then Iohn though Jesus himself baptized not but his Disciples Ioh. 4.1 2. And they came to Iohn saying He that was with thee beyond Iordan baptizeth Ioh. 3.26 but not himself But admit it was Christ himself that baptizeth yet it is with the Holy Ghost when Iohn baptizeth with water Mat. 3.11 Thus Christ makes the outward Forme by Sprinkling effectual by sanctifying and cleansing his Church with the washing of water by the Word Eph. 5.26 And thus Christ when he washed his Disciples feet washed and cleansed their Souls from sin or else they had had no part with him Ioh. 13.8 and yet not without that outward Form But then you are troubled that I should say That water in the Sacrament signifies the Blood of Christ saying Where doth the Scripture say so But I say if you take away the thing signified from the Element you destroy the Sacrament much like the Papist who will have the Element of Bread turned into the very Body of Christ But in so doing you spoile the Ordinance as well by plunging

Anabaptists who hold all things common and it may be some of them are not very cleanly and so not fit to plunge the faces of some where the talls of others were newly washed in this is not decently nor in order Mr Doctor 3. But we are said to be buried with Christ by Baptism Rom. 6.4 therefore the baptized is to be plunged under water Answ In this Text is no mention made of baptizing with water which is the outward form of Baptism only we are said to be baptized into the death of Christ and after death buried with him by Baptism Now Jesus Christ a long time after he was baptized of Iohn in Iordan saith I have a Baptism to be baptized with Luk. 12.50 which was his death and burial and he saith to the sons of Zebedee Ye shall drink of my Cup and be baptized with my Baptism Mat. 20.23 that is they shall dye and be buried and rise again at the last day and also in this life they shall receive the things signified that is the body of sin shall dye by the death of Christ and their sinne shall be buried or covered by the burial of Christ and they shall rise to newness of life by the Resurrection of Christ and these are all expressed in that text Rom. 6.2 4. This is the doctrine of Baptisms spoken Heb. 6.2 but I say here is no mention of the Form of Baptism therefore no warrant from this Text to plunge the baptized under water Now if we should bring all those Texts that speake of Baptism to prove the outward Forme wee should runne into such a labyrinth that wee should not bee able to get out as for example Paul speakes of baptizing the dead saying If the dead rise not at all why are they then baptized for the dead 1 Cor. 15.25 Now although here be more in this Text to prove the Forme of Baptisme then in that Rom. 6. yet wee may not at all ground any Forme of Baptisme from it first because the party is dead and so unfit to make a member of the Church by that solemne admitance Secondly Any woman may wash the body when it is dead but none may baptize any Christian with that Form of Baptism given to the Church but the Ministers of the Gospel which are sent to preach and baptize Mat. 28.19 Thirdly This washing the dead carcasse was done without any words of institution therefore not the Form of Baptism given to the Church Therefore from such Texts as these we have no warrant to plunge the baptized in or under the water To all this you say when I bid my man wash a cup or glasse doth it signifie nothing unlesse I bid him doe it with water Let him that is diligent so reade and satisfie himselfe with the Texts Rom. 6.4 Col. 2.12 1 Cor. 1.6 Answ Baptisme doth not always signifie washing but Death and Burial and sometimes Doctrines Act. 18.25 neither doth washing always signifie baptizing for then if you should say to your man wash my cup it were all one as to say baptize my cup and so your wife might say to her maid baptize my dishes when they are foul But these New-Lights are nothing but palpable darknesse from the Prince of Darknesse Then you tell me that you will not be at the charges of printing a Satisfaction to every one that scribles having spent and lost so much for the Publique and repayd with so much Injustice and Ingratitude nor will you meddle at present with the lawfulnesse or unlawfulnesse of your Ministry not His it seemes Now if your losses be so great why did you print at all and who doe you blame for your losses and that requitall of Injustice and Ingratitude And then you begge a praise of your patience and excuse your pride and pray to winne mee to the Trueths of God in Christ To this Prayer I shall joyne with you in that word Amen and then I am sure if the Lord heare and grant it I shall never turne Anabaptist May 2. 1650. Imprimatur I. D. FINIS