God and righteousnes and truth from Ierusalem But it doth not follow that we knew not these testimonies but by HN. his ministerye before his new doctrine was broched the Church of Christ was not ignoraunt of that corner stone Christ Iesus of his holy priesthod of his holy sacrifice these thinges were truly understood and knoweÌ although HN. had neuer written Touching Christ his comming as a theefe we know it is ment of his second comming although you would gladly haue it to be the comming of HN. with his new blasphemyes The watchmeÌ vpon mount âphraim are the teachers of Christ his Church of which number your HN. is none his cryes are from Flaunders and not from Sion You place two speciall vertues Loue and Truth as a face and âositenaunce to your doctrine but if wee should examine the same by the word of the Lord then your Loue is but pretenced For your Loue should be knowen by louing the Lord Iesus who loued vs first But the loue of HN. hath besotted your hartes who by his doctrine is enemy vnto our Lord Iesus who onely is to be beloued And for truth you onely vse the word barely without substauÌce what trewth you vse in this your libell will appeare by reading to euery indifferent minde if your Loue and trueth be no better then is here expressed then I may well affirme that little Loue and small truth is to be found in this your libell Vitell. BEhold I ley in Sion a stone of foundation a proofe stone a costly corner stone to a fast foundation who so beleueth in him let him not hast For I will make the iudgement to a measure lyne ând the righteousnes a ballaunce Esa. 28. b. Luke ⪠â0 b. Rom. 9. c ⪠Pet. â â A falsâ ballance is abhomination vnto the Lord but a full weight pleaseth ãâã ââll ⪠Prou. 11. â A âight ballance ⪠and waight is of ãâã Lord ⪠and all powndeâ in the sack ⪠are his workes Prou. 16. Should I sayth the Lord Iustifye the vnright ballance and the false waightes in the sacke wherethrough their rich men doe much vnright and their anhabitâuntes deale with lyes and haue deceitful tongues in their throats Mich. 6. b. ãâã ⪠Therefore will I begin to plague you and make you desolate because of your sinnes Miche 6. Awake now all and repent and remember to be obedient vnto the law and commaundementes of the Lord to the end that ye in the day of the Lord be not found intangled or held captiue of your sinnes nor plagued with the plague of the vngodly Whosoeuer now in the ãâ¦ã Lord will escape the plagues of the vngodly and bide preserued inâthe godlynesâ ⪠Let him beleve in Iesus Christây eiâen asâ the ãâã sayth and turne him about ãâ¦ã of a childe and apply him to be obedient vnto the requiring of the word of Iesu Christ and of the doctrine of his lorâ ⪠And so let euery one come and assemble him to the mount Sion to the cominaltyâ of Saynteâ and to the stone the fast foundatioÌ which is laid of God in Sion and build him thereon to a spirituall house in all loue and coÌcord and to an holy priesthod For to offer spirituall oblacioÌs which are acceptable vnto God through Iesus Christ. 1. Pet. 2. I through the grace of God which is geuen to me haue layd the foundation lyke a wise architect and an other buildeth thereon but let euery one take heed how he buildeth theron For an other foundation can no man ley then there is leyd which is Iesus Christ. 1. Con. chap. 3. b. This description of Sion my beloued haue I writteÌ ãâã geue thââby the louers of truth to vndââstand whether they have read any of the bokes of HN or noâ which are named the most holy seruice of louâ that the scriptures which the Lord hath set forth through his elected miâist HN. are brought forth out of Sion according to the promises of the lord For it is written that the Lord will bring forth his loue out of Sion his word out of Ierusalem c. Also that the same HN ⪠hath taught all men to repaire to his mount Sion and builde thereon the which is in his works declared at large as is before rehersed Answere HEre is set down a large description of Sion of the corner stone foundation and many places of holy scripture heaped together but to no other end that can be perceiued but to amaze the Reader that your doctrine should thereby beare a face and countenaunce of trueth and come from Sion Ierusalem but we tel you truely that your new vpstart heresies with your new termes are not testimonies of Sion but from Bethell Dan Gilgall your masking shew is now discouered your vizards pluckt of Your painted words are opeÌ to the world your suttle âleightes made manifest here are many places quoted but none applied If we shal assemble to SioÌ as you require then must we leue your HN. your Family For by Sion is vnderstood the doctrin of the prophets Apostles and Euangelistes from which the Lord assisting vs we will neuer depart and whatsoeuer doctrine may be proued by theseâ we reuereÌtly embrace gladly receaue what doctrine soeuer is contrary here unto that we reiect cast of of which number the doctrine of HN. and his Familye are because it agreeth not with that Prophets Apostles nor Euangelistes You geue the louers of truth to vnderstand whether they haue red any câ H N. his bookeâ or not ãâã so that there may be âonets of truth although they neuer red H N. nor his bookes as you grauÌte this vnto vs now so you will deny the same hereafter as shall appeare you would still haue vs beléeue that H N. teacheth no doctrine but builded vpon Syon as appeares by his workes his bookes are to be seene his doctrine is out of his own imaginatioÌ being deluded by an erroneus spirit to disquyet the Ioyfull proceedinge of Christ his gospell and to exercise his church according to this saying necessââst haereses esse c. It is necessary that heresies be c. There was neuer heresse in the world but would dispute argew and reason and deny no conference with any but this HN. thinketh it sufficient that he tell his Familye that he hath learned his doctrine by gods owne mouth and no man may speake against him nor his doctrine but by and by he is condemned for a blasphemer of the holy ghost So sharpe and quick are these Elders of the familye in iudgement it is tyme for you to helpe your decaying state with some face shew of wordes For your Familye doubt not doe espy your poysoned doctrine which lay hid from them vnder your darke speach and vnaccostomed phrases his workes declare his doctrine to come from his owneacute braine by illusion of Sathan and none geueth testimony of him but himselfe and you his deceiued
acknowledge themselues to be felow Elders with the Elder HN. and magnifie his office and calling abouâ measure and protest with great vehemency that such wonderfull workes as are brought forth through the same HN. could not be wrought unles the Lord God were with him And these strange names of their Elders do maruelously astonish our English people Elidad as I haue learned is an Hebruâ word and signyfieth dilecâus Dei. the beloued of God which is a proper title belonging to our Sauiour Christ. This is my beloued sonne c. And that we generally are in him and by him beloued there is no dout so is be still the beloued And that some of their Elders name themselues Fidelitas so others that belike are not come to so high degree name theÌselueâ Amatores Charitatis It is a world to see how these men delite in such vayne shewes of piety and thinke to get credite by these coloured meanes which to the godly seemeth ridiculous and too too fond And thus much coÌcerning the bokes in latin by occasioÌ of the Dutch wherin note this Christian Reader that wheras the Italian Pope would haue all in latin this other Pope and dutch Antichrist would haue all in Dutch as a predestinate tongue to open his prophesies and misteries of that Lord. All the quotations of holy scripture that HN. vseth to proue that he is rysen from the dead to iudge the world do proue in deede that Iesus Christ hath rysen from the dead must they therfore auouch HN. his resurrection See good Reader the presumptuous spirite of Sathan so setled in these for âorne âdames ⪠that through the eating of that forbidden fruite wherethrough they would become as god that is deiââed they are wholy become sathanified or diuilyfied Strange names I confesse but very significant propeâ for such strange Christians Was not Christ Iesus mightely declared to be God by the resurrection from y dead If this resurrection were the mightyest declaration or argument proofe that Christ was God iudge Christian Reader ⪠if HN. maketh not himself not only God but Christ and so the promised séede And in deede you your selfe Vitell haue affirmed him to be a Prophet before in thiâ place you cal him a priest geue him also the name of a king and then is he Christ a new Messiaâ for by his resurrection he maketh him selfe god Such an Antichâist â thinke should neuer haue beene heard of if that the Children of God had not beene warned in the gospell that many false Christes should come into the world and such dangerous dayâs that if it were possible the elect of God should be deceaued But blessed be God whâ euer is ready to preserue his electe by Christ sâ that perish in âecoiuable wayeâ they shall not such a care hath the Lord ouer his Now HN. and his ââistes office shall appeare where through the Lord will receaue all men O impudent wretâhes haue we not a deliuerer euen the Lord Iesus who doth not onely receaue vs but continually protect vs and minister to vs all thinges both heauenly and earthly which are expedient for vs but will you blasphemously open your mouthes that wee shall be receiued by the Priestes office of your HN. No godly Christian can heare this without griefe What âerogatioÌ is this to our merciful Lord and Sauiour that now a wretched man possessed with a lamentable spirite shall take vpon him his office and calling where through we shall be receaued Oh manisefâst impietye Oh exeârable iniquitye which no patience can beare Seing you publishe âuch doctrine in writing with deliberation what doctrine doe you teâch in corners to your Family where no maÌâare open hiâ mouth agaynst any blasphemy that you doe vtter ⪠In such credââ are you ââept but wo worth y hed that seekes to ãâã the simple with such horrible doctrine Your ãâã âayd that I know not HN. but as it was sayd to Serinthus the heretique I know him to be the first begotten sonne of SathaÌ But the Lord hath geuen his Church the spirite of trueth to direââ them from all such vâyne boastes of iniquitye So lykewise O Lord geue thy holy spirit to the simple seduced in y Familye ⪠that they may behold the blasphemyes which their Elders in wickednes doe teach agaynst the son of God Christ Iesus Vitell. FVrthermore you write very vntruly of HN. where you say that no man be he neuer so learned or godly can vnderstand or interpreat the scriptureâ for I am sure there are no such wordes written by him therfore I must needes say they are lyes and false iudgementes with wrong interpretatioÌs almost all what you write of him and of his workes and euen so are most of your interpretationâ which you alledge of Christ and his Apostles doctrine For if so be they I meane HN. his bookes might be perused of vnparciall Iudges then your iudgement would be found euen lyke their iudgement which coÌdemned Susanna but the Lord raysed vp Daniell which is the iudgement of God and deliuered the giltles vnto whome we commit our cause For he will iudge vprightly and reward euery one according to his deedes Aunsweâe WHat HN. hath pronouÌced of all other mens vnderstaÌding of the scripture I will here agayne set down that the reader may iudge who is in the lye Therefore it is assuredly all false and lyes seducing and deceitfull what the vngodded or vnilluminated men out of the imagination or of their owne knowledge and out of the learnednes of the scriptures bring forth institute preach and teach they preach in deede the letâer and the imagination of their knowledges but not the word of the liuing God. And in an oâher place âo diuâ ⪠codem cap. ãâã theÌ esteme themselues so holy as they will they are a false Christianitye and Diuells sinagogue or schole c. with many other places to lyke effect so that HN. still teacheth his Familye that it is geueÌ to the Familye of Loue to vnderstand the secretes thereof Now let the indiffereÌt reader iudge whether HN. exempt not all but him and his from the true vnderstanding of the scriptures all men which are not godded with God he tearmeth fleshly minded and earthly in cogitations and intreateth whole chapters of such men he sayth That a fleshly and earthly man out of his naturall and scripture learned vnderstaÌding hath not any sight or knowledge at all thereof he iâ so vtterly voyd of the same that he cannot vnderstand the smallest title thereof much lesse expound the same according to the trueth to an other c. So that it appeareth pâayne that nono but HN. and his illuminat Elders can vnderstand the samâ ⪠ââccording to trueth You say if HN. his bookes might be perused of vnpartiall Iudges then should his case be found as innocent as Susanna Those vnparcial Iudgeâ that you would haue are you and your fellow Elders in the Familye For I doe truely affirme that no
will not ioy nor rest in peace vntill all your errors be disclosed and âou and your fellowes be brought to âumble your selues before the Lord without your HN. which the Lord bring spedely to passe Amen Vitell. NOw must I for want of tyme passe ouer and omit many thinges and submit my cause vnto the almighty desiring him of his goodnes for to try our cause in his ballaunâe of equitye euen with the Loue and trueth for so shall there then be expressed and testified by the light or Christ that Gods honour is declared with the Loues seruice most sincerely Aunswere THis Libel was not long enough but he muââ oâât much matter and so as he sayth submit his cause vnto the almighty c. âut if you did as becoÌmeth a true Christian you should not onely submit your cause vnto the Lord who in patience suâfreth Ipocrites to trouble his Church but also submit your doctrine to be tryed and iudged by his holy word which is a iust iudge in all causes of controuersy For if your protestation shall be admitted without exception theÌ euill doers and blasphemers of God and Christ may haue liberty to referre their cause vnto the Lord but since almighty God hath in earth a knowen Church it is requisite that euery one being required should geue account of his fayth and hope as the scriptures doe teach you would haue your cause tryed in the ballaunce of equitye a truer ballance is not then his law which is without blot or wrinkle if you would abide the tryall thereof your doctrine and your patrone HN. should be found lighter then vanitye it selfe Where you adde with the Loue trueth the Loue you so often confound that you know not your selues the meaning thereof sometyme you wil signifie Christ by that name loue sometime a vertue procéeding sometyme a qualitye of the minde sometyme for the exercise which you priuately vse where to finde the exposition of this word Loue you leue it as vncertaine then it shall be expressed you say by the light or Christ that by you God his honor is declared with the Loues seruice sincerely here is Loue agayne ioyned with seruice which cannot meane as I thinke any thing âlls but God his seruice I take it in the best part if you haue any other more secret misterye therein I leaue to your selues but touching any seruice you doe to God it is Ipocrysye so long as you serue him without Christ or with any other and Christ for he will admit no other to haue place in mens hartes but himselfe he made all he requireth all Vitell. OH what a dauÌgerous tyme is it presently in these last dayes and how vnrightly haue many vnregenerated men set vp themselues to geue iudgement with their good thinking For whatsoeuer euery one mindeth thinketh good and electeth âther falleth to that same prayseth and iudgeth he for the most best and for a righteousnes thereto also he wresteth the scripture according to his will for the scripture is seruiceable vnto euery one euen as he is minded be it whatsoeuer to be high minded in pleasant lustes either to be debased in misery to be merây or sorowfull with sighing either with thankes to be despised and persecuted or to persecute and despise one an other and many such lyke c. Answere OF the dauÌgerous tyme we are not ignorant of and more we tell you that you and your fellowes make the tyme much more daungerous and troublesome with your errors which HN. and you haue raysed vp Now you complayne that vnregenerat men haue set vp themselues you meane by vnregenerat men all others which are not illuminat nor deifâed as your Elders are The children of God for whome Christ dyed whose names are written in the booke of lyfe are regenerate although as I haue sayd before you account none to be regenerat but such as haue no motions of sinne or sinne not but you say that the same vnregenerat men with their good thinking ⪠that same he prayseth and iudgeth for righteousnes but who might worse alledge the same then you who câmmând without reason or cause your Auâhor and his moÌstrous doâtrinâ which hath in it such grosse absurdââyes and most contrary to God and his word and you are they that peâuert the scripture to set vp your Prophet and his doctrine and what is spoken of Christ doe you not wickedly apply the same to your HN. doe you not apply this place of Malarhy chap. 3. which our Sauiour Christ verefied to be propesied of Iohn behold I will send my messenger which shall prepare the way before me Againe Math. 11. he shall turne the hart of the Fathers to the children and the hartes of the children c. doe you not I say apply these places to signifye your HN. and that it is ment by him therefore there are none found such wresters of the scriptures as you And where as you affirme that the scripture is seruiceable vnto euery one therein you shew what reuerence you haue vnto y same for although you such others do abuse the scripture contrary to y purpose of y holy ghost yet are the scriptures y wisedome of God reuealed to man and is a perfit law of righteousnes and not as you vngodly and vnreuerently tearme it seruiceable vnto euery one Your companions the Papistes haue as you doe called the scripture a nose of ware a shipmans hose c. but most wickedly and falsely to both your confusions it is the power of God vnto saluatioÌ Vnto them that beleue the sauour of lyfe vnto lyfe but vnto such as you are which so vnreuerently speake thereof it is the sauor of death vnto death the scriptures doe not maintayne pleasant lustes nor high mindes as you vnreuerently suppose but they are to comfort and lift vp the sorrowfull and broken mindes and to beate downe and correa the hauty and proud stomackes If vngodly men such as you are abuse them to other purposes the fault is in the persons not in the word Vitell. WHereunto euery one wresteth the scripture and defendeth his cause therewith insomuch that euery one thinketh that he for his part hath the most best Behold with such a misery is the man plagued such manner of good thinking and vnprofitable burthen hath he taken vpon him oh that we left all such and gaue ouer our vnderstanding captiue ether suffred it to be pluâkt vnder the obedience of the loue of Iesu Christ and followed after the coÌmon brotherly loue innocently or vndeceitfully and continued concordably in prayer vnto God âl that God receiued vs to mercy released vs froÌ the sin of the ignorant knowledge and established his promise on vs to the laud prayse and honor of his holy name and to our saluation Aunswere YF euery one wrest the scripture where shall wee finde Christ his Church who is led by the spirite of trueth according to his promise thâ greatest wresters of
scarce credible But at âmden from that day to this opeÌly he durst not be séene therefore some other matter was layd to his charge then professing a strange doctrine For his credite sake it had beâ conuenient to haue geuen some reason to proue that he was accused for no other cause let the world iudge indifferently where is more probabilitye Vitell. ANd after there was iustice desired then they restored agayne his goodes vnto his children but there was much taking away by the vntrue officers for there was no inuitory taken therof but whether he went and where he had his abode that shall in tyme be manifest when as the Lord shall moue the hartes of the Magesââates to desâre to know the ground of the trueth then shall it all be declared to them but the trueth thereof is yet vnknowen vnto you therefore you may be content and not trouble your selfe therwiâh Answere THe Magâstrates you say redeâiuered hââ goodes to his children therfore they were men that imbraced Iustice and so would they haue ministred Iustice to HN. If he would â stayd but the safest way was to preuent the matter by flight you are very âriuye to HN. and his doingâs that can so redely tell what was missing now the Magestrates here shall know the trueth where he is and where he hath made his abode euer since but sure it is little to be regarded where he is and I thinke the Magestrates doe hartely wishe that he had neuer ben borne nor you neither he for deuising your new familye and you for publishing the same to our countrye and translating tâe bookes which certainly was not done lyke a godly ChristâaÌ nor a true ânglish harted man For in âeede as I am informed you are of the Dutch race your selfe and so appearâth by your vaine and curious hed salling froÌ one error to another as those countrymen are apt vnto âf the boâkâs had remained in dutch our quiet Country should neuer haue âin troubled with this new familye to the griefe oâ God his childreÌ whiâh bewaile y state that you haue brought many vnto at this day veye well assured that although ye lurke in corners and send fourth your Libels you cannot escape his handes who seeth euery corner of our hartes And as HN. by slight would not abide the triall of his matter euen so doe ye follow the same course sayle rightly by his compas for stand to your doctrine nor come to conference you dare not but priuily insinuat your doctrine where your wordes are taken for Oracles The Magestrates would gladly that you should geue a reason more agreable to truth of your dealinges and doctrine as for HN. where he became or where he is they little passe and wheâe you say that to me the trueth is vnknowen it may be as you say neither will I trouble my selfe much therein but that you of his Familye might imbrace trueth is my chiefe purpose which cannot be in my opinion holding your selues captiue to the illusions of HN. Vitell. FVrthermore you say that he doth cal himselfe Restorer of al things whereunto I aunswere that there is no suâh word written by him and yet hath thâ Lord accomplished according to his promises through the âpiriââ of Christ in him all that he hath spoken through the mouth of his seruauntâs the Prophets more where you say that HN. cannot erre or miââe the right c. I know not how hee or any one should erre whiâhâ is indewed with the holy Ghost led by the spiâite of Christ which leadeth into all trueth Aunswere THat he doth so call himselfe I haue written therein as I âinde it collected by the commissioners who delt specially in that matter but you affirme as much or more of him then I charged him with For you say that the Lorde âath accomplished through the spirite of Christ in him all that he hath spoaken through the mouth of his Prophetes and this we thinke to be very straingely auouched of you contrary to trueth the Prophecyes of such whome the Lord raysed vp to coÌfort the weake estate of his Church in the tyme of the law were fulfilled in their seasons especially such prophesyes as either touched the captiuitye of the Iewes or the destruction of their Citie also many of their prophesies concerned the comming of our merciful Messias the maner of his byrth passion death and resurrection Now to affirme that all these are fulfilled in ââ is very horââble and moÌstrous but such is your vanitye that so you may extoll the dignitye of your Aucthor you care not what vntruthes ioyned with blasphemye you vtter the lyke speach HN. auoucheth of himselfe saying what God hath spoken âhrough hâs holy Prophets what is written of Châist should also in vs and with vs beâome fâlâilled c. âow you are able by any shaddow of trueth to proue anâ of these two sayinges true it had bin requisite that you should a shewed for they carry great absurdityes both in trueth and reason Whether doe you lift vp your Aucthor by such vntrue speaches it doth appeare very lamentable to all God his children this is proude bosting and exaltation such as S. Paule did warne the Church to take heede of such I doe much maruell that Christian men with any face can write thus presumpteouslye of mortall man although you would qualisye your saying that this is brought to passe by the spirite of Christ in him but this helpeth not neither doth it stand with the will of God reueled that any mortall creature should be so exalted For if we should demaund of you how we shall know this to be true then you aunswere by his workes which I thinke you meane his bookes Yf otherwise you meane some miraculous dealing which you are priuy of and not knowen it were necessary for his credit and your honesty not to hide it any longer but simply to manifest the same Moreouer you say that none can erre which are indued with the holy ghost c. We know that the spirite leadeth into al trueth yet those vessels hauing by grace such priuiledge doe often in shew and countenaunce appeare as though the spirite were queÌâhed or as fire raked vp in ashes example here of Peter who hauing the spirite of God yet did thingâs contrary to trueth and therefore was rebuked by Paule and that worthely many in Christ his Church no dout haue bin guided by the spirite of God and yet sometymes haue shewed theÌselues humane creatures as wanting that excellent priuiledge appropriate to Christ which sayd I am trueth such is our condition we may not reach higher not to erre is a speciall title belonging to Christ our Lord and not to mortall man although lightened with the spirite we must rest conteÌt with such honor as it pleaseth him to graunt who is Lord of his creatures and not to reach so high as presumpteously to chalenge a title and dignity farre aboue our capacitye and not
good but forasmuch as your doctrine is false wicked and fantasticall therfore your prayer is corrupte and abhominable and to be despised and all princes that fear the Lord wil become vtter enemies to you â your doctrine and seek diligently to amend if it be possible your corruptions and I doute not but the Lord hath in his Church men of zealous mindes who will not see the glory of our immortall God nor the death passion and resurrection of Christ Iesus our Lord so defaced darâkned and shadowed And that his Church may be purged of such corrupt weedes which spring vp séeking to destroy that good corn which is sowed already O Lord God we humble sinners abiding in the vnity of thy holy Church doe most humbly hartely pray thee eueÌ for thy sonne our Sauiour Christ Iesus sake that thou wilt in mârcy looke vpon thy poore afflicted Church and the members thereof that by no malice of Sathan no pretence of collored speach nor no vanity of minde any of thy children be caryed away as straying from thy fould but that O Lord they may agayne be ioyned to thy flock so that so many as pertayne vnto that good shepherd of our soules Christ Iesus may laud and prayse thy name with one voyce and O Lord we most humbly beseech thee to clense thy Church from the filthy dregges of doctrine which wicked meÌ through the malice of Sathan haue deuised to disquiet thy peaceable Sion conuert thou them O Lord wée beseech thee mollify their stony hartes which haue set vp a Prophet whome thou O Lord hast not sent let them O Lord behold how farre they haue declyned from thy wayes and followed the doctrine of deceaueable men let them see from whome they haue departed to whom they cleaâe fast And although we O Lord by our offences and the manyfold transgressions wherwith we prouoke thy merciâull goodnes who doe know thy will and yet are so slow performerâ therof wherby thou O Lord doest punish our offences so that wicked men now set vp theÌselues against vs accusing vs and that worthely of the breaking of thy holy lawes So O Lord although we haue thus sore prouoked thy goodnes by our offences yet we beseech thee consider thy sonne our Lord and Sauiour whose obedience righteousnes to thy will ⪠thou hast by promise made it ours so that beloÌging to thy sonne we are shadowed vnder his righteousnes and couered vnder his winges in safety from eternall destrucâion But such is thy goodnesse O mercifull God to try thy children here in earth how stedfast we will bid battaâle against Sathan and his impes and how constant we will abide therein so that no blast nor inuation of enemies shall I hope shake that foundation of faith that thou hast plânted in vs which we most humbly desire thy maiesty to increase and that we may perseuâre and continue in the vnity of thy holy church in this life and after we may inioy tâe fruition of thy godly maiâstye and sing prâyses vnto thee world without end Vitell. O Lord let vs finde grace before thine eyes and heare ouâ humble sâpplication which we make vnto thee in the sorrowfulnesse of our haâts For a broaken hart and a sorrowfull spââite wilt thou O Lord not despise ⪠for euen there wilt thou enter ãâã and therby mââe thine habitation and sanctifie thy name from genâration tââenâââtioâ ãâã in euerlastingnes It is very true Answere O Lord we bâseech thée turne the harts of thesâ deceaueâ people and graunt them thy holâ sâirit y they may discern thy truth tauâht in thy holy word and not geue eaâe vnto anâe which teach coÌtrary therto ouerthrow their deuices brig to light their deâââts for thy holy names sake That we thy childreÌ may reiâyce ouer their tâ uersioÌ so together with one voice magnifie praise thy glorious name ⪠and that those straying shââp may be brought in to thy fold again ãâã it be thy blesââd wil Reueale vnto them O Lord we beseech thee the office and death of thy sonne our Lord and Sauiour that they tasting the swetenes thereof may âorsake the confidence they haue in their perfection and that we may all acknowledge onely Christ Iesus to be perâite and we our selues dust and dung and whatsoeuer is vile let nât Sathan lead theÌ captiue but O Lord we besech thee pull them out of the Lyons mouth and conioyne them to thy holy Church out of which they haue wandred ouer long in doctrines of men Let thy strength appeare O Lord and let our weakenes be made open to them let the effect of thy Gospell breake into their hartes of stone that they may tast féele how swâete the Lord is in mercy towardes sinners and how seuere to such as iustify theÌselues And if it stand with thy good will pleasure thus to coÌuert theÌ at the sute of our earnest prayers we shall for the same geue thankes in thy Church euermore But if thy Churche shall haue thereby their tryall made knoweÌ to the world herein O Lord kéepe thy children and such as loue thâ Lord Iesus embrace the ioyfull tidinges of the Gospell in thine owne bosome that they be not led away with any pretences of pietye into error or corruption but defend them as thou hast promised that what pittye a Father hath ouer his childreÌ lyke pittye thou O Lord wilt shew vnto theÌ which we besech thee graunt vs for thy sonne Iesus Christ his sake to whome with the holy ghost be honor land prayse power and dominion from euerlasting to euerlasting So be it The state and condition of a regenerate man by the rule of holy scripture compared with the state of a regenerat man by the doctrine of HN. in the Familye of Loue. I Being in my creation at the first in most excellent state and happines hauing by diuine prouideÌce in my selfe frée choyse will to choose the good and refuse the euill described by fire and water I willingly and of mine owne accord gaue place to euill and so worthely by iustice brought vpon my selfe the heauy hand of my God and the dexteritye of his law ⪠with maledirioÌ cursse where in â had remained euerlastingly had not the Lord my God in mercy and of his speciall grace beholding my woeâââl âase without any desert of mine prouided and promised a deliuerer a Sauiour eueÌ the Lord Iesus which in âulnes of time came whome the Patriarches hoped after whome the Prophets foretold of which died for my sinnes and rose agayne for my iustification who put out the hand writing of the law pronounced agaynst me âastened it to his crosse who suffered for me y I might raigne with him who left me an example that I should âollow his steppes And which is more without coÌdition promisâd me eternall lyfe which by the onely sacrifice of his death he hath obtayned and by his paynefull
God ând one man and they were one and had in al one order being and nature For God was all that the man wâs and the man was âl that God was c. Thus man became God at the beginning For God looking vpon man looked vpon him self as the same cleerânes of his liuing Godhead Also the man looked vpon his God his gentle cleane and vnspotted manhode in all fulcomenes in all honesty and fairenes in all fashion and being according to the same Godhead And this was also all one God and the man c. God gaue the man in the beginning none other Lawes Institutions Iudgements nor Commaundements but to liue with ioy naked or vncouered before him and to looke vpon all the works of God for good and not for euil should neuer tast or féele euill death or condemnation But as the man turned âway the eyes of his flesh from his âod saw vpon him selfe that he was not the hyest Godhed it selfe but that he was also man ⪠then was he vndersought or tempted to the knowledge of good and euill to be therethrough as God. Then came a blindnes ouer man and estranged him or seperated him from his God wherethrough he could not beare the word or voice of his god nor shine before him with his naked manhoode Man did acknowledge none other God saluation nor kingdome of heauen but through the knowledge that the man had takeÌ on to him self which was nothing els but the deuill hell and condemnation Through this knowledge of AdaÌ the generations of men haue inherited a consumeable inheritaunce wherethrough men that were made or shaped to be one with God and ought to be one with another are fallen into many contrarieties and hinderlike knowledges Thus man being fallen away altogether destroyed in his vnderstanding and from the liuing Godhed and from the kingdome of heauen straunged might be brought agayne to his vpright estate in his God through his loue according as he had promysed to the saluation of the manly generation he made one new man after the same likenes or similitude of his Godhead and named him Iesus Christus which doeth signifie vnto vs the safemaking oyle of God sauing being the same is gone out from God and hath shewed himselfe vpon earth He is gone into the knowledge of men and found all their man knowledges and their scripture learnednes in all in all that they wist false and lying This false knowledge siting she vnderstandeth not Gods truth aright through her wisdome and Scripture learnednes hath Christ rebuked and taken captiue the knowledge of men and made it through Christ foolishnes to make them frée and deliuer them in this to coÌming day of his Lordlines from all their foolish knowledge Euen so hath Christ done by y sin and the righteousnes of men He is also gone into the death of men and hath borne therby one death namely his death of the crosse and so through his death hath taken captiue the death of men because that he in y last day in his comming againe may set vp the man from death through the death of the cros and make him aliue that he may bring him in his vpright estate to his God. But now hath Iesus Christ the might and Lordship ouer all destroyed things which burthened the men and the destructions which were takeÌ captiue and through the death of the cros had brought all vnder him Euen so is he with his might and Lordship risân agayne from death ouer the destruction and through the declaration of his resurrection hath he shewed to his frends and disciples which belâeued in him and hath made it knowen vnto them the might home to get y ouer winning against al y destroyed things wherewith the maÌ was incaptiued God hath ordayned a day which is the day of loue in which he will iudge the earth with righteousnes through one man he hath concluded it which holdeth beliefe before euery man seing that God hath awaked him againe from the death Hetherto the doctrine of HN. taken out of a booke called Mans falling away his Lordlines and comming agayne THe heauenly being of God and God his vpright righteousnes is become mortall in vs but yet not for euer but for a certaine season till the man shew forth vpright fruites of repentaunce The man in his youngnes is subiect to sinne vntill he haue attayned the manly oldnes in the Loue and the vpright fréedome then is the new couenaunt of perfection ereââed and all is fulfilled which is written by Moyses or that God requireth through his Prophets or what is euangelised of Christ. And if there chaunce any temptations by our Paramours which we in tymes past haue loued to come and assault vs c. but if they lay hould on vs with force and violence and that then although we cry there commeth not any power or helpe vnto vs for to withstand them in their force and violence and that they euen so rauish vs agaynst our will so are we guiltles of the transgressinges for wee haue cryed for to be released from the tyranny of the euill and there is no helpe come vnto vs of which guiltles transgressinges the law witnesseth where it sayth a woman that is violently taken in the field c. The regenerat man from his new byrth is exercised in all well doing and for that cause also he cannot bring fourth any thing els but all good and Loue. The true or vpright fredome is this that the man through the ministration of the gracious word c. his hart spirite and minde is wholy released purged and purified from all wicked nature which hath raigned ouer him that there dwell liue nor rule any other thing in him namely in all his spirite thoughtes minde soule but alone the true Godhed with his louely being of the vpright Loue and so to be wholy replenished with all y vertues of God that there flowe nothing els in him namely in all his spirite and minde but the spirituall heauenly ⪠and liuing waters Man regenerat doth veare costly treasure in earthen veâsels is of one minde with the thrée godly witnesses that heare witnes in heauen Of which thâee godly witnesses the onâ is the Loue which is God the Father himselfe The second witnes is the trueth which is the word of God the Father Iesus Christ himselfe And the third witâes is the holy spirite of Loue or of God of the truâth of Iesus Christ which is the euerlasting lyfe and the inheritaunce of all spirituall and heauenly goodes Consider where God with his Christ and spirite hath his dwelling iâ any one and bringeth forth ãâã secret treasures of the heauenly goodes thereout euen there is then truely his wisedome to be found and also the couÌcell of God according to the trueth
AN Answere vnto a wicked infamous Libel made by Christopher Vitel one of the chiefe English Elders of the pretended Family of Loue Maintaining their doctrine carpingly answeringe to certaine pointes of a boke called the displaing of the Fam. Aunswered by I. Rogers AT LONDON Printed by Iohn Daye dwelling ouer Aldersgate Anno. 1579. Cum Priuilegio Regiae Maiestatis To the right honourable Syr Frauncis VValsingham chiefe Secretary vnto the Queenes most excellent Maiesây and of her honorable Councell Grace and Peace in Christ our Lord. HAuing before this set forth a small tretise displaing a sort of men in this our countrey of England imbracing an Author vnder two letters H and N. about sixe monethes agoe I haue receaued since from the same persons sundry letters contayning matter against the doctrine publickly taught in the church of England and answering certain matters contayned in the sayd booke called The displaying of the Family of Loue which answeres some I haue put in print the rest remayn wherof this Libel is one of the chiefest and as the same doth witnesse is made and compiled by one of the chiefe of that sect and the only man which was the occasion that any of HN his doctrine became conuersant with our natiue Countrey people a thing greatly to be lamented The name of the party is Christofer Vitel sometime a Ioyner of London and infected with that infamous doctrine of Airius â0 yeares agoe ⪠whose credââe among the pretended Family of Loue is very great and therefore I haue vsed more diligence in answering the same Being Right honorable unboldened to present the same vnto your honor vpoÌ vew and tast of your good inclination towardâs the true Church of Christ and the purging out of the same all disorders and discords that therin groweth or which blemisheth that beloued bride as much as in your honor lyeth And if herein I shall seeme ouer bold or presumptuous considering my rude and vnlearned capacity I haue many examples which may serue for my excuse For where should men publishing error seeke defence but vnder the name and protection of such as through the Lords dispensatioÌ and gift of singular wit doe vnderstand falshood at the first sight and haue authoritie to correct the same and hate error and corruption of a zeale to the glory of god and a care of true Religion and by rate goodnes of nature doe loue the truth and also sufficiently adorned with corage to defend the same Accept therefore most honorable these my rude labors in âânorable part and geue iudgement where trueth lyeth Accept my serâiceable hart to further the glory of christ his church and not the simple vtterance and smal skil with les learning as by the handling appeareth Also consider the prouideÌce of our God which ruleth his childreÌ by his beck and hath appointed your honor as a speciall Patrone in his Church to heare the griefe and gronings thereof and to vnderstand and see that truth be not defaced troden downe or spurned at by heretickes or wicked Atheistes which the mixed Church is too too full of And as the Lord hath made your honor to feele the sweetnes of his sonne our Sauiour So I am perswaded that you bende your singular care and deep consideration that this our countrey of England might be free from hereticks deprauers of Christ his glory And if it might please your honor to consider the root and ground froÌ whence this strange doctrin grew the practises and meanes by which it is maintained and supported And by this litle sayd by me consider with all what might be sayd against this doctrine of H N. by men of knowledge and skill And finding the roote nothing els but singularitie ambition pride and carnall liberty The shore and pillers that vphold it wrong application of the holy Scriptures counterfaite shewes of piety c. your honor shall perceiue I dout not how litle true reason these men haue or sound argument to proue the particulars of their doctrine the body and substance being found in deede but a lumpe of olde worne heresies newly hatcht by H N. Fidelitas and âlidad men come out of the cloudes as they would haue the world beleeue And as this doctrine hath increased and spred it selfe in many shires of this Realme So if I should declare what euent doth follow in many places it were scarce credible The fountaine or foundation thereof is the opinion that these men haue that they keepe the law of God in euery point as he requyreth âer of commeth their doctrine of perfection attayned vnto in this life and as they tearme it the beginning of immortality then being made perfecte they imagine themselues to be Godded with God or incorporate to God I will vse their own tearmes with whom God in one being of his spirit is hommisied or become man. Now hauing once planted this doctrine what Sathan can worke with this perswasion is easily perceiued For when this doctrine is once beleeued that their Elders caÌnot sinne and whatsoeuer they commit it cannot be sinne because they are guyded by the spirite And when all feare to offend or conscience of sinne is excluded to all boldnes and liberty to liue after our liking a very window is opened As there is no reason to maintayn this nor truth to vphold this So it is very necessary that the simple people should be warned to beware of this so suttle a doctrine which they like very well of because their teachers and Elders vnder preteÌce of plausible precepts delyuered to the simple at the first taste of a godly life which asore any thing they must imbrace with many shewes of mortificatioÌ TheÌ must they grow to the manly oldnes in the loue which is that perfection which they dreame of But the secret part of their doctrine is hid from the most parte And all their bookes are not made coÌmon to all as containing to strong meate for weake stomaches therfore their glas of righteousnes few must looke into least their whole vanity and corruption should be espyed That booke therefore is a rare birde among this Family And this suttlety doth Sathan worke to deceaue the simple to keep certaine secret misteries and doctrine to worke admiration in the hartes of deceaued people Right honorable I haue set downe this part of their doctrine as a tast what other matters they maintayne by perusing this small treatâse shall easely be espied how their chiefe Elder HN. is exalted and called a Prophet and that his prophesies shal be proued true and also they account of HN. in office to be a priest and say that through his priestes office God will receaue all men to mercy so that our only Lord Sauiour is smally accounted of his offices are bestowed vpon HN. These thinges are too too absurd Right honorable and worthy to be buryed in silence had not SathaÌ raysed vp his impes to trouble his Church with these blasphemies agaynst which I
haue bent that poore skill and force I haue to displey these men with their doctrine There are many Right honorable that could better more learnedly haue confuted their doctrine but it is so vayne and childish that simple soules and meanely exersized in holy scripture are sufficiently instructed by the Lord to manifest all their abhommations The simplier sort of these men I take to be such as haue a desire to serue the Lord and yet is their simplicitye caryed away by the Elder sort or stronger men conference in my opinion is the best way to helpe the simple which the Elder sort can noâ away withall least their trecheryes should be espied âdad one of their writers geueth theÌ such a precept in his booke intituled a fruitfull exhortation to the Family of Loue in â sextion But ye shall not contend or dispute with the blasphemers and the tanglers about the scripture nor with the apostates or decliners from vs and our good doctrine or with the selfe conceited wife nor yet with any of all those that bring in variaunce and make breach besides our good doctrine of the seruice of Loue. It appeareth Right honorable by this prohibition of this Elder that conference and disputation is forbidden them especially the Elder sort but the noâces which are not enterid into the secret partes of their doctrine but are caryed away with a shew of pietye and good lyfe which at the beginning is opened vnto theÌ with fly and suttle perswasions that nothing els is sought at their handes but how the man might be made persite in Christ Iesu but after once a step be made towardes them or a tast of this doctrin then bookes are bestowed vpon them which they must reade of HN. as his exhortation his dialog his âpistles the exposition of the Lordes prayer with the Articles c. as they profite in these bookes harder to digest as the Prophesie of the spirite of Loue a declaration of the Masse the holy Lambe the Gospel or âuangâly of HN. c. last of all the glasse of righteousnes which few of this company haue the other bokes more riser printed as is supposed in Flasâders and translated by this Libeller into English as he himselfe confesseth And here I craue pardon in that I haue bin ouerlong to trouble your honor with these repeticioÌs and I would to God that I had no occasion ministred once to name these persons nor this error then should Christ his Church nor no member in the same haue needed to bend their study to publish or manifest the same The Lord of mercy geue your honor all increase of fayth with the trueth of true pietye and continue in you a zeale of Christ his Church with a care y nothing but trueth be taught therein and that the contemners thereof may be put to silence so as our God may be glorified his people edified error and heresies subuerted trueth aduanced which the Lord God graunt for his sonne our Sauiour Christ his sake to whom be honor ⪠and prayse now and euer Your honour to commaund I. Rogers To the Christian Reader CHristian Reader thou hast to peruse at thy pleasure this finale treatise contayning an aunswere vnto Christopher Vitell the chiefe âlder of the pretended âamâlye of Loue and because it was directed to me and aunsereth certaine poyntes of my former boke called the displeying of the âamily Therefore it is very meete and conuenient that since the matter toucheth me neerely and âhargâth me with much vntruth that I defend the cause I first toke in hand which I am verely pârswaded is an honest iust and godly defenâe of thâ puritye of doctrine now taught and pâblicklâ preached which this âamilye spuâne egerly against And although 2. vigilant Pastors haue leaânedly confuted the doâtâine of their Author HN. Yet this little availeth to recall them home to that found profession that some of the once âasted and least they should boâst or vaunt that they haue written or compiled anâthing which should not be aunswered I hâue thought good once agayne to bend my simple study to ânswere this libeller Christopher Vitell whole crâdit amongâst the âamilye is not small Maâuelâ not gântle reader that I being the simplest of many thousandes haue aâuentuâed to meddlâ in these disputable questions more âitter for men of learning and knowledge I graunt but since they haue made their inuectiues agaynst me it behoueth me simply to aunswere wherin I confesse many thingâs are omitted which mâght well hâue bin spoken of and many thinges are briefely touched which should haue bin dilated if leasure had serued me but since I cannot dâe thinges as I would thou hast my goodwill as I could Yf thou wouldest profiâe by reading these conferences it is expedient that thou peruse a little boke called âhe displeing of the Familye the publishing of which boke was the cause that this man being touched therein neerely hath made this Lâbell for aunswere thereunto excusing himselfe of many crimes and as much as in him lyeth keeping vp the credit of their Aucthor HN. whoâe the âamilye would not that he should be touched or blemished no not with a venew but he that listeth to marke how his chiefest schollâr or oldest ângliâh Elder Christopher Vâtel doth with might and maine culleâ and hide all the faultes of HN. as well his âoctrine and foule errors as his corrupt lyfe and conueâsation and how confidently and with a bâasen face he auoucheth that all is false and lyes whatsoeuer is brought forth neuer so probably yeâ with many witnesses thou shalt or it be long haue a testimoniall out of âlaunders of HN his whole lyfe which if the Family here in ângland would be âesoluâd with ââueth shal be vpon any oââasion published in print it nothing blâmisheth our âause although this rude and vnlâarned Aunswere be made vnto this slaunderous Libell but our God therein is greatly magnified that simple men are suâficiently assisted with God his spiâite to confute and ouerthrow this blasphemous doctrine of the Familye so gâosse and absurd it is agaynst all the holy scripture and agaynst common reason And as nothing is more in vaâiance betweene vs then how man is restored vnto that âlisle lost in Adam and his state being regeneâate I haue simply set downe my poore sâill such experience of a regenerat man as I finde in holy writâ feele in my own consciâence And also I haue collected the condition of a regenerat peâson by the doctâine of HN. as neeâe as I could collect by such bokes of theirs as came to my handes wherein if the Familye imagine that I haue not rightly set foâth a âegeneâat man after their doctrine let some of their illuminat Elders if they please set vpright such a one as they will stand vnto So shall the controuersy betwene them and vs soner come to end and tryall which if they refuse to doe then it will appeare that it is not
trueth they seeke but singularitye For although in other matters there be difference opinions yet in maâs election saluation redemption and regeneâation being the pillers and foundations of our fayth whosoeuer erreth herein cannot be saued I am also Christian reader to desire thee to amend and correct with thy pen certaine faultes escaped in this treaâise by the Printer and to amend the sence of some sentences being not rightly poynted which I refer vnto thy learned Iudgement The Lord our God blesse thee and grauÌt vs his holy spirite that we may persist and abide in the vnitye of his holy Church and patiently abide the Lord his leasure in rooting out errors and heresies which disquiet thy little flocke They are exercises of our fayth but yet blockes whereat the wicked stumble and hinderaunces of many a mans conuersion which the Lord our God foretold vs of that in the latter dayes such should come and such daungerous dayes should be that if it were possible the elect should be deceiued The complaint of a Regenerate man vnto God the Father shewing the sorrowfulnes of his haât O Lord God heauenly Father thoâ that art not only our God but the God of all the world we thy creatures the worke âf thy hands make our humble prayers and supplications bâfore thy excellent maiesty âeseeching thee O Lord not to consider vs as we aâe of our selues eaâth ashes and whatsoeuer is ãâã but as we are in Christ Iesus our Lord thy sanctified people whom thou hast chosen before all worlds to witnes thy âame in earth And to whom tâou hast made manifest thy Sonne ouâ Sauiour with an vncouered face to our great comfort âet alas we vnworthy wretches finde in our selues such heapes of sinnes and such lumpes and loades of impieties that were we not stayed in thy promyses wee should perish with mistrust in thy mercies For we know that thou art a iust God and doest visite the offences of thy childreÌ with rods and their sinnes with whips Yet thy mercy doth neuer faile vs Yea although we sinne yet are we thine We haue O Lord tasted greatly of thy mercies Many yeaâes we haue been fed with heauenly meate Long time we haue enioyed the benefite of thy gospel a blessiââ of blessinges our own conscience doth witnes yea our sinnes are so ripe and so outragious that they are ascended vp vnto the heauens and ãâã for thy iustice which we haue sore prouoked with multyplying sinne vpon since We haue not obayed thy voice We haue not harkened vnto thy seruants whom thou hast sâât We haue propbaned thy holy Sabaoth with vaine spectacles vngodly tragedies We professe thy name in our word but deny it in deedes Our vanity is too too manifest in our apparrail Our excesse appeareth in our banquets Our small reuerence towardes thy holy name in our vayne other Our merciles charitie towards thy meÌbers is too too manyfest Yea our whole life is nothing els but abuse of thy creatures with ingratitude for thy benefites So that we thy children are to expect and looke for nought els but thy heauy hand yea thy iudgements in displeasure We and our for fathers haue sinned Our Princes and Rulers our Priestes our Prophets and teachers Yea from the greatest to the least all haue followed the bypath of their own imagination deuice ⪠and haue not harkned vnto thy word to make it the lanthorne to our feete and the light to our steps Our own wayes and deuises haue preuayled We therfore O Lord our God prostrate our selues before thy maiesty beseeching thee for thy deere Sonne our Sauyour Christ Iesus sake turne not away thy face from vs in displeasure Bring not vpon vs wretches the due punishments our sinnes haue deserued Looke not vpon vs as we are of our selues but as we beloÌg to Christ Iesus for whose sake thou hast promised to deny vs nothing we aske in his name Looke vpon thy wonted mercies of old although the cry of our sinnes be great before thee yet the righteousnes of our Lord and Sauyour Christ Iesus is greater whom we interpose and put betweene thy iustice and our deserts Yea by him we appeare with boldnes before thee this day as childreÌ not as strangers saying O Our Father sanctified be thy holy name Let thy kingdome be inlarged in vs thy children Let thy will be performed in vs most obedieÌtly eueÌ as thy saints holy ones do fulfill the same before thee Geue vnto vs O Lord all earthly blessings this day that we may vse them to our comfort and not abuse them in pleasure Forgeue vs O Lord we beseech thee our dayly sinnes that we commit against thy diuine Maiesty And geue vs thy holy spirite that we may forgeue all such as by any degree ãâã trespas against vs Leade vs not not O Lord into tryall nor temptation aboue our strength for then our weakenes will appeare Delyuer vs O Lord from all those euils our sinnes dayly prouoke And froÌ all those plagues and punishments which thou hast threatned to bring vpon vs at this time Delyuer vs from the mouthes of cruell Lions which dayly gaâe to deuour vs From blondy Papistes which lye in wayte for vs and dâly conspire to bereaue vs of the most comfortable benefit of thy word and seeke to make our liues a pray vnto their greedy desires Bring O Lord their deuises to nought Let thâ liâle flock enioy the sweete comfort of thy gospell that we may praise thy holy name in our own land Roote out all secâes and heresies which are among vs which Sathan hath stirred vp to disquyet thy church And Lord if it be thy will either to conuert them or put them to silence for euermore Preserue O Lord God our gracious Queene Elizabeth in thine own bosome Deliuer her O Lord from all conspiracies tresoâs and trecheries which Sathan in his members shall deuise against her Make void their couâcels that consult against her and let vs O Lord enioy thy blessing in her long prosperous and happy dayes Geue O lord vnto her Councellors wisdome fortitude and courage to preuent all dangers and vnto our bishops and teachers geue truth in doâtrine boldnes to publish the same without ãâã And to vs thy people geue O lord humble hartes and obedyent minds that we thy children may now at the last be warned to reuerence and regard thy holy gospel and feare thy puââshmeÌtâ forsaking our vain delites in earthly things so that our whol life may be a dayly watch and looking for thy glorious coming So that in our hartes we may dayly saâ Come Lord Iesus come quikly that we maybe losed fâoÌ thâ woful vale wherein we doe nothing but prouoke thee with our sinnes ⪠Graunt O Lord we beseech thee that thy church may long enioy the liberty of thy word and geue constancy to thy members our bretheren which suffer any crosse or tribulatioÌââher in body or minde as witnesses of thy trueth Geue
them patience we beseech thee that they may abide whatsoeuer thy Maiestie hath determined so that euen in tormentes they may witnes thy holy name Graunt vs O Lord our God these our petitions or so many as are expedient for vs thy children for thy deere Sonne our Sauiour Iesus Christ his sake To whom with thee ⪠the holy Ghost be al honor praise glory dominion power for euer and euer Amen A short reply after the order of a proface By the meanes of certayne slaunderous wordes as followeth from C. V. THERE IS NOTHING more necessarye for the reedisying of God his Gospell in a common wealth then foâ euery such vnto whome the Pastorall office is committed With all expedition to beate downe by the aucthoritye of the same word all vpstart heresies And opinions by the which the true Church and congregation Is disquiâtâd ⪠of lâte theâefore as one poore member of the same in a preface To the tituled worke agaynst those which are called the Familye of Loue liking tâeÌ to a Cormorant Fowle was for that I espied By the manner of writinges and imaginatiue prâctise Somewhat slyly couered ouer as the Snake vnder the greene hearbe from their HN. an Onacratoluâ câept in this our natiue Countrye of EnglaÌd through simplicitye But rather I feare me hipocâisie to the bosomeâ of many supposed wise men the more by the meanes of a second Mergus C. V. Whome heretofore by vttered vow at Paules Crosse âecanted as I thinke the same error which he now stiffely defendeth Neuerthelesse sithens which tyme Hath in coâners drawen companyes togethers of the which sâme haue refâained ⪠and others yet tâo many abidiââ I thârefore somewhat to further the goodwil of the Author agaynst that Familye their error and not their pââsons and for the hopes sake which is layd vp in store through Iesus Christ our âord and Sauiâur did by preface ⪠forewarne the vewers of the sayd bâoke to be heedefull of such so pestileÌt a sect who vnder the title of sundry senteÌces of holy scriptuââ Hâue as in a maââ knit fast through the webbe of the Spider Many âely âlyes whose vnstable mindes more wauering theÌ such slender wings haue ben are and will be except the grace of God make them more heedefull so fast tangled that it will be scarce possible to pluck them out I doe once agayne euen as one greatly compelled make aunswere agaynst that which herein followeth by those wâome I hoped their conuersion and not detection whose wordes haue sayd me to be Diueled with the Deuill I doe consider these wordes to bâ sayd to me by the lyke intention as to my L. and maister Christ that he had Belâebub the chiefe Deuill yet wâââe ââue And the reprouers false Their wordes This blasphamous Batman with his slaundering and lyâng blasphemeth the holy Ghost for he nameth the Familye of Loue a Corniorant Fowle And an sereticall sect whereas notwithstanding there is ãâã Catholick Church nor comminasâye of Saintes but the Familye of Loue And herein he condemneth the holy Scriptures the Lawe and the Prophets as also Christ and his Apostles Moreouer he sayth that the Lord his elected Minister HN. is of the seede of certayne sectaries â Whereas his doctrine is altogether agaynst all Sectaries If it be blasphemy to reproue an error then haue I not done well if it be lying to detect a falshode I will reaunswere if slaundering them that slaunder other in one is the fault to this first God his worde doth teach me to defend his Church the Queenes Maiesties lawes her common wealth whereto my conscience aunswereth by the trueth that if you take not better heede you will fall from heresie to treason and so into contempt of your religion Of your loyaltye And true seruice of God of the which take heede for the holy Ghost is iudge betwixt vs both I doe name the Familye of Loue the selfe same as before till I doe perceaue you to be otherwise minded except you vse this policye That when your Religion will hold no longer you will then say we vnderstode not your mindes and so therereby exâuse your follyes You say there is no Catholick Church nor comminaltye of Saintes but the Familye of Loue surely your loue is so secret if we vnderstand it not you much lesse perceaue it but in secluding all that be not of your Family What shall be sayd of all the godly in the world before your HN. whome now to culler doe call the holy name What say you of our gratious Queene Her noble Counsaile the leaâned Byshopâ And disââet preachers of the Lordes Gospell What thinke you of the excellent ouâces both Oxford ⪠Cambridge from the which they are not now to learne of their true loue in god Of your HN. Neither of C. V. Who cunningly hath ioyned together that which we know Christ to be the ouââcommer and C. Vitell the Ioyner to be bât a deceiuer Your Argument must haue an Interâection when you say He condemneth the holy Scriptures the lawe and the Prophetes all which three âââuerence loue and obây ⪠by the Lord God his assistance you ad as also Christ and his Apostles is it enough to condemne any before the cause why ⪠your Vocatiue must haue a Datiue to your selfe be all these except you ãâã the greater heeâe I ãâã also vettrly deny your HN. Hârry Niâholas to be the Lordes elected Minister ⪠otherwiâe then suâferâd to peruert the congregation And also I say to you Chrisâopher Vitell ãâã you ãâ¦ã and while there is yet tymâ ãâ¦ã to God whome in this âtâr you hâue greatly offended your Prince much aâused ⪠anâ many your fellow disorderly ãâ¦ã by your vngodly collections thorow which ãâ¦ã you haue continued too long as to your ease you may thinke So to their payne it may be assured If now your doctrine be agaynst all Sectaryes Then be as good as your word and âly these errors ⪠els as weedes are cut of with sickle and sithe for hiâting the good herbes so must euill membber from a common wealth Fare well Fidem fero mihi fama fuco An Aunswere to a wicked and infamous Libel made by one of the chiefe english Elders of the pretended Familie of Loue. Vitell. Testimonies of Sion of the ââst stone of fouâdatioâ layd therein of âhe iudgement and righteousnes and of the holy priesthood and spirituall oblation through Iesus Christâ brought fourth through the Lordes âlâcââd minister HN. loue Trueth BLessed is he which watcheth for the day of the Lorde which shal come as a theefe in the night Math. 24.1 Thessa ⪠5. Peter 3. For the tyme shall come that the watchmen vpon mount Ephraim shal crye come let vs goe vp vnto Sion to the Lord our god Iere. 31. Mich. 4. Zach. 8. Answere TO what purpose these places of holy scripture are collected I am ignoraunt of because they want dew explication we know that from Sion came the law of
agreing with our frayle condition and nature But such is our vanitye not guided by the spirite of God to aduaunce our state and calling aboue our degree and condition by the setting on of our enemy Sathan Vitell. NOw I doe maruell why you be so enuious agaynst that name HN. wil you not permit the Lord to geue names to his ministers according to the worke that he will accomplish by them or doe you think that the names are geueÌ to the outward creature then are you much deceiued No my beloued the seruauntes of the Lord are children of Loue ascribe no names of holynes as dew to the outward person For they know that they are but fraile eaâthen vessels beare their names according to their vertues whiche God hath geuen them and submit them humbly and obediently as serviceable instrumâts to serue the lord their neiâhbour therfore I would councell you to looke iâto your selues marke what ãâã good thinking spirites rule ãâã wherethrough ye blaspeme diâpiâe dishonor the tâple or tabernaâlâ of the Lord. Answere AGaynst the two letters of HN. I am not enuyous only against such doctrine as he doth teach contrary to the scripture whereby you as an Ipocrite haue seduced the people and led theÌ into error and corrupt wayes to hinder the Lord of his purpose it resteth not in mortal man If HN. be a name signifiyng some office why hath neither he nor you manifested y same but plead ignorance that it signifieth some hâe misterye which you nor we know not now as HN. is a name geueÌ by the Lord as you affirme according to the worke that he will establish by him so doth his fellow Elder âidelitas looke for lyke credit whose wordes I will repeate as they be written in his booke called A distânciâe declaration of the requiring of the Lord c. In the First chap. 1â seâion âe hath these wordes following but fire or bend alwayes all your sight oâ me Fidelitas and consider how that the Lord hath choseÌ me euen froÌ my very byrth out of my Mothers wombe to the obedience of the requiring of his word For that I with you and yee also with me according to the requiring of the testimonyes of his gracious word should become vnited therein and so to growe of one vniforme being with ech other in the same c. You shew vs in the 29. sexion that through HN. his priestes office the Lord will receaue all men in mercy but for Fidelitas office as yet we know not what it is and in deede there were neuer any that would challenge such names as these elders doe affirme that they signifie their office and calling certayne players vpon stages would declare thââr names representinâ cârtâine âeââueâ to seâ out their matters somâ wââe callâd truâth some hope some âaithfulnesse but in sadnes to set âowne such names to siâniââe ãâã which thâ Lord as yâu affirme will accomplish by them is meere impâetie But where the Lord geueth names it appeareth by their calling and such aâe their workes and sayinges as geâeth testimony sâfficient to their vocation âut âour HN. cân shew no sufficient markes wherby any but seduced persoâs should geue credite to his wordes onely a paânted shew and barren heaping vp of woâdes darkly appliâd without conclusion or sence sauing you and such lâke that finde great misterâes in his sentences carying such credit among you as is not seeming Christians The Lord gaue names to sundry vnder the law as Isaack Sampson Iohn âaptist c. But doth it follow that HN. is a name geuen by the lord Proue vnto vs that the Lord hath established his name your friuolous cauill that HN. signifieth ãâã will not serue such bables are scarce sufficiâÌt to meâk children therefore you must deuise some better ãâã Some of your Familye haue written that HN. signifieâh some greater matter then either you ⪠or wee can tell of such incertentyes hoâ you auâuch of your HN. For vncertayne doctrine must haue certayne âidden misteryes to amase the heares mindes or els no doubt ⪠the drift of doââ me would easely be espied Therefore you must deâise some hidden sââretes whereby to cary a shew of profâââd mâtter That names are geuen by men in these dayes and not by God there is no doubt or question but you would sayne haue HN. to be a name geuen of God to signifie a calling you geue vs no reasân so to thinke but woulde haue vs beleue it is so because you say so then were we vayn heads and vncânstant mindes For we depende so stricktly vpon the scrâptures of God that no spirite no ãâã nor no Angel teaching other ãâã can be a coâted or beleued amongst vs so ceâtayn is our faith and so inuincible is that truth which by the Scriptures we held In that you tâe Children of y loue ascribe no names of holynes vnto the outward person it is a mistery we aâe ignorant of we simply geue names to our children in baptisme without signification of holynes touching the Inâant the names may signifie holynes but that the person carrying the same name shall be indewed therwith that are we ignorant of If you haue such hidden misteries among you it were good the world should not be ignorant of it We commit the successe and euent of such hidden secrets to the lord Of enuyous good thinking spirites that rule in vs you councel vs to looke to without your councell God willing we meane to follow the councel of the Lord our God which willeth vs not to beleue euery spirite c. And yet I neuer heard before of enuyous good thinking spirits But such a grace you haue not only to forge new doctrine but new names of Spirits also In speaking against HN. you wold insinuate that we blaspheme despise and dishonoâ the temple or tabernacle of the lord Doth it follow necessarily that they that speake against HN. blaspheme despise c. And is he the temple or tabernacle of the Lord vndoubtedly we are all deceaued then For I assure you we take him to be an erroneous spirit a fantastical hed possessed with pride of minde Sathan blowing the belowes The Lord working therby the exercise of his church If you haue other opinioÌ of HN. warrant or grouÌd so to do haue you none But beâause you will not beâeeue the truth therefore are strong illusions sent whereby you might be deceaued Looke into the holy Scriptures with a more single minde and it shall be easily perceiued Vitell. MOrâouer you say that the illuminat âlders sin not I would you knew what you say forth you should vnderstand that they do lord and preuaile with God and Cââist ouer the sinne and haue no pleasure to commit sinne therfore they teach men the godly obedience whereby they might be frends with God but they that haue pleasure in sinne are the seruants of âinne and are enemies to the Lord. Answere I Haue sayd that the
illuminate Elders in the Family sinne not you deny it not but wish y I knew what I sayd you say that they preuayl with God ouer sinne But we deny that any preuayle with God ouer sin otherwise then in the person of Christ. And herein you teach false docârine to the people For your wordes are false that we preuaile with God and Christ ouer sinne Nay we affirme that we preuaile with God by Christ which accepteth vs for his sake and although you acknowledge neuer so much that this is brought to passe by Christ in vs yet we tell you playne that it standeth not with his good will and pleasure so to do but that contynually we should be petitioners to him for grace to keep vnder sinne that sinne raigne not in vs that sinne beare not rule in vs or haue dominion ouer vs as the Scriptures vse to spâake but that we preuayle against sinne so that we extinguish it in our own persons It is a doctrine of Sathan and not froÌ the lord In this and the like doctrine doth your Author and you shew a manifest pâoofe whence your errors are suckt euen from the Pope who teacheth that we may fulfill the law If it be so then may we be righteous by it and haue no neede of christ Such hereticall and imptous doctrine contrary to the scriptures you teach and therfore your Author and you worthely despysed The Pope in his doctrine of Opera superââ ãâã and you with your doctrine of perfection to be wrought in vs in this life do so extenuat the death and passion of our Lord and Sauyour Christ that the poore oppressed burthened sinner loaden and âroning vnder the burthen of sinne can finde smal comfort Therfore the church of christ grounded vpon the Prophetes and Apostles Christ Iesus being the chiefe corner stone of this foundation doubt not in truth and humilitie of spirite to acknowledge still iâ vs while we are in this life a battaile or combat against sinne to striue to fight but not to conquere to tryumph or to preuayle but by faith in Christ in whose person we conquere we tryumph and we preuayle So that to be ouercome or be subdued vnder sin we cannot because we haue a valiant and most victorious conqueror who still imputeth his conquest and victory ours yet so as sinne and the motions therof still remayn in âs to our great exercise that feeling our wââknes our want and our need we âight in our necessitye haue recââse vnto our Captayn our Sauyour and delyuerer But that we in our persons should pâeuayle ãâã sinne as you affirmed is false wicked and damnable doctrine but such fauour hath falsed with you that you greedely embrace this as though Christ or his Apostles had taught it whereas it is against all the doctrine of Christ and his Apostles and against all examples in the scriptures David sayth ãâ¦ã S. Paul sayth Christ Iesus came into y world to saue sinners of y which number I am the greatest if doing our best we must acknowledge our selues vnprofitable seruauntes where is become your doctrine of perfection neuer heard of in Christ his Church our âumayne state and condition is so lifted vp and stast with pride by your doctrine of perfection that penitent sinners find smal grace in whom you impute scarce hope of saluation except they attayne the perfection on whome shall Christ hys death take place to whome shal the vertue thereof extend if none shal be saued but such as be perfect in whome no sinne resteth or remayneth you take away all comfort from sinners to whome the Gospell belongeth and our onely comfort in distresse the effect wherof by this your doctrine is denied miserably do you herein deceaue your setuâs and other They that haue pleasure in sinnâ are seruaunts to sinne as you affirme but to haue pleasure in sinne that sinn raygne in vs or haue dominion ouer vs continually we affirme that they are markeâ and tokens not of the children of good but contrary yet we doubt not to âââirme the remnants the motions lustâ and roÌcupiscence incident to our frayle nature still to lurke in our bodyes notwithstanding we be in the fauour with God and made righteous by Christ his death and passion for so it standeth with his good wil and pleasure that his grace should be made perfect through our weaknes Therefore you with your doctrine of perfection doe extenuate his death as much as in you lyeth We are not in humbling our selues enemies vnto y lord but you by exalting your selues except ye repent will be taken enemies both to God and all good men Your schollers in the Family doe blame vs in their wrytings affirme that we in confessing our imperfections ⪠and sinnes which contynually doe assault vs dayly and hourely We are as they say ⪠Aduocates for sinue and you teaching a perfection are mainteners of righteousnes but more truely may it be sayd of you that you with your perfection are enemies to y grace of God manifest to vs by Christ Iesuâ our Lord and do thereby blaspheme as much as in you lyeth the glory of hys passion and death appropriate only to sinners you may with the pharasies brag of your perfection and obseruation of the law but we comfort ourselues with these and the lyke sayings of holy Scripture Christ Iesus came into the world to saue sinners So God loued the world that he gaue his onely begotteÌ sonne c Behold the lambe of God which taketh away the sinnes of the world c. Vitell. FArther you say they may ioyne with any congregatioÌ or Church and liue vnder the obedience of any Maiestrâte It is true we are obedient vnto all Maiestrates where wee dwell for âhe peaces cause and obserue their politick ordinances which are to a good protectioÌ of their subiectes ââd the land but we consent not vnto any thing which is agaynst God or hys commaundements also we accompâ none vngodly but such aâ obstiâatly blaspheme the Lord hys ordiââunces and despise his most holy seruice of loue although they be ignoraunt of the waye vnto lyfe For we confesse that there is no man righteousnes vntill the Lord deliuer hym from his vnrighteousnesse and through hys Christ make hym righteous and then may he say that the Lord is hys righteousnes Aunswere THat you may ioyne with any Church c. I did affirme beyng led by many reasons so to do for you perswaded many in Queene Maries raigne to go to Masse your brethren in Flaunders which are of your Family do the lyke you also with vs come to Church and ioyne with vs in praier in âeuing thanks in heâring the worde preached c. Yet hauâ you priuate conuântickles and meetings forbidden by the law wherin you shewe not your obedience to the Maiestrates aâ you affirme but your wilfull stubburnes and frowardnes you ioyne with all to wyne all but more iustly you flatter
with all to deceaue all How do you obserue the politik ordinaunce of the Maiestrate in printing your bookes and publishing them to the Queenes subiectes contrary to the law made in that behalf your obedience cânsisteth in wordes but not in ãâã âhârefore with more truth you might saye we will not be obedient to Maiâstrates In that you coÌdescend âoâ iâ anye thing contrary to God c. Therin you say well but I would you were found herein true of your promise for then your HN. and hys doctrine with hys prophesies should not haue such credit amoÌg you as appeareth if his doctrine be not directly agaynst the Lorde our God and hys commaundementes I apeale vnto the iudgement of all God his Children that shall reade these conferences You accompt none vngodly but such as blaspheme the Lord and despise his most holy seruice of loue Whome you accompt blasphemers before is declared iâ any speake aagaynst your HN. or your Family of loue Ipso faâto he is a blasphemer then all the worlde which doe despise your Familye are blasphemers your conclusion must needes fall out euen so whereby appeareth what reuerent opinion you haue of any and of al that are not of your Family if you learned this of HN. consider better of it for very shame of y worldâ if no reuereÌce nor feare of God can moue you You confesse that there is no man righteous vntill the Lord deliuer him froÌ hys vnrighteousnes but howe we are deliuered you wee greatly vary we according vnto the holy Scripture do acknowledge Christ to be our righteousnes which he hath wrought perfectly in him selse which by fayth wee apply to our vnrighteousnes hys obedieÌce his loue his pacience c. we by fayth apply to our disobedience to our hatred to our impacience c. all what was in Christ is made ours by grace yet still wee in our earthen vessels are coârupt sinâull and vâyde oâ anye suche vertues as the law requireth But âou on the contrarye affirme that by Christ working in vs by hys spirite we are made righteous and so clensed from our vnrighteousnes that we are chaunged into hys perfection so that in all our actions wordes and thoughts nothing can âlow oâ pâocâede from vs but sucâe as procâede ârom Christ because we are guyded by the same spirite but whether you or wee speake truth let the holy Scriptures beare witnesse then may be say that the Lord is his righteousnes it is very true but how and in what manner the Lord may be sayd to be our righteousnes is to be vnderstoode we acknowledge y hee in hys owne person is our righteousnes and sanctificatioÌ but you will haue hys righteousnes wrought in you by his spirtie the difference coÌsisteth in the maâer we acknowledge in him all strength all piety all obedience and in our selues all weakenes all vngodlinesse and all disobedience but you will needes haue all in all to be in vs whiche to much blemisheth hys glory and triumph if we shoulde also in our persons triumph our triumph standeth not in doing but in beleeuing in him which did Therefore as you haue charged vs wrongfully to be aduocats for sinne so may we rightly call yâu Patrons for our corrupt rotten and earthen vessels Vitell. MOre you are offended at the confession of the Familye of Loue vnderstand the matter well that there is no man coÌpelled therevnto but if any one be wounded or trobled in his coÌscience then he may to his coÌfort make his euel thoughts or els what manifest vnto a priest or Elder aâcording vnto the counsell of the holy scripture Also I thinke it is an ordinauÌce in the Church of England that if any one be troubled in minde he shall come and aske counsell of the person or minister and I thinke he must then make manifest his thoughtes c. And the Catholiâk ReligioÌ holdeth thought word and deede but there are many that will compell men to deâlare their thoughts ⪠whiâh ãâã nââther pâiestes nor Ministers of the âord Aunswere TOuching your coÌfessioÌ which âou acknowledge to be voluntary and not coaâted I haue signified my dislyking your Auâthor HN. doâh say it is expedient that they of his Familye make maniâest all that hath bin coÌmitted both what it is wherevnto our nature draweth vs vnto here it apppeareth ⪠if you follow your Author directly he leueth the matter not so voluntary as of necessitye And this must be done as you say vnto a pâiest or Elder to please the Papitles I thinke you haue added this worde priest but we tell you that such manner of confession the scriptures allow not of if any be wounded in conscieÌce he may to his comfort repayre to any godly or learned preacher âo shew his griefe and to receaue counsell and comfort to his consolation by the scripture agaynst the prick of conscience or the law which troubleth many miÌs mindes but that of necessitye he must make manifest all thoughts all what our nature doth incline vnto there is no warrant what ordinaunce is in the Church of England you haue not shewed but that he must of necessitye make manifest his thoughts it is vntrue it is left frââ onely by way of perswasion men are moued to repaire in such extremitye to their learned and godly pastors and by no ordinaunce but this appeareth that you accompt not your selfe as any member of this Church of England no maruell for you holde it more safe to professe HN. his Familye then to be an obedient child of Christ his Church Whereof England is a speciall part What the Catholick religion holdeth touching confession is no cloke to shaddow your dealinges with all for we tell both you and them that such a confession as both you and they hold is not agrâeing with trueth The Papistes vrge men and accompt them heretickes that deny it and you hold it as an expedient thinge neither haue you both any warrant so to doe Some doe compell men to declare their thoughtes which are neither priestes nor ministers as you affirme who they are you tell vs not yet I suppose you meane the coÌmissioners who âxamining your Familye touching their fayth and doctrine found them so suttle by your instructioÌs that in y end they required theÌ to declare their knowledge what they thought of their Author HN. and I thinke the Magistrate authorised by the Prince may in such cases require vs to maniâest what opinion we haue of any Author or what we thinke of him but you haue taught them to say we know him not and therefore to commend him or discommend him wee may not such sleightes you deuise wheÌ the Magistrats requireth a trueth at your handes and here is also declared your obedieÌce to rulers your Elders are safe when the poore country people are brought before the Magistrates but when will any of you the âlders come voluntarily and defend your doctrine and proue it good by souÌd argumeÌt it
now he beginneth to be knowen and by the great credit and admiration you haue him in the more detestable will he be reputed as a seducer of such men as cannot content themselues wiâh such trueth as the scriptures containe but must haue a Prophét raysed vp out of FlauÌders a banished man and one that dare not shew his face in any countrey openly and you had rather imbrace his noueltyes then the wholsome doctrine conteyned in the olde and new testament Vitell. NOw concerning his bookes they be of such Aucthoritye as he affirmeth them but where as you say that he sayth all is false and lyes whatsoeuer is taught c. marke wel what he writeth and adde nothing thereto and it shall be found true what he writeth more where as you say he commendeth the Pope and Cardenalls with the Masse and other ceremonyes there is none commended but in their right order if you marke the matter well Answere HIs bookes I affirmed that they were in crâdite amongest the familye of equall auâhoritye with the scriptures and that they were written with the same spirite to this you auÌswere that they are of such aucthoritye as he hath affirmed thereforâ note well what you say for neuer any since the Apostles tunes had so impudent a face as openly to publish such a detestable lye if this come not from the spirite of pride I know no proud bosting spirites all the Fathers in the primitiue Church euer reuerenced the holy scripture and submitted all their bookes thereunto Austen desired not to be credited or beleued but as his workes might agree with the holy scriptures all men in generall haue euer acknowledged themselues in their writinges to be subiect to error onely the scripture to be without blemish but this man will haue HN. and his bookes of equall aucthoritye with the scriptures written with the same spirite thus doe you runne from one impietye to an other and in the highest degree of blasphemye But I pray you looke vpon the matter better before you say he is a prophet now his bookes are of equal aucthoritye with the scripture whether will you lift vp your HN. aboue all condition of fraile man the higher he is exalted the more greuous will be his fall without repentaunce it is Luciferian pride thus to attribute vnto mortall man but you make HN to be a name of office and not of a creature such misteryes requireth falced where trueth and simplicitye imbraceth playne dealing Now you say that HN. doth auouch all to be false whatsoeuer is taught by any other therefore heare his owne wordes and then discerne and sée God his trueth and his godly and heauenly workes are vnknowen vnto all fleshe and vnto all fleshly and earthly men but it is geuen to the children of the kingdome the comminaltye of the Loue to vnderstand the secret misteryes thereof You say it will be found true what he writeth If none but the comminaltye or Familye of Loue doe vnderstaÌd the scripture then it was not rightly vnderstode before there was any mention of your Familye Now for commendatioÌ of the Pope Cardinals and Masse he sayth hee commendeth none buâ in his right order this speach is ambigâus in his right order For simply I thinke none of them haue any shaddow of right order neither is their callinges nor doctrine grounded vpon either right or good order Your Author belyke alloweth the Masse or els he would not haue taken such paynes as to explicat euery ceremonye therein in his booke called A declaratioÌ of the Masse but thus with subtiltye of speach you would faine say somewhat to defend your Author be his sayinges neuer so monstrous Vitell. FOr in that booke named a ioyfull message of the kingdome of God Christ though ye deâidingly call it his gospell is declared that âPapa signifieth an olde Father in the holy vndeâstanding Now althogh he be not indued with the holy vnderstaÌding yet is the name not the worse in it selfe For the Lord hath ordeined gouernours spirituall and temporall and they represent the maiestye of God although now certayne gouernours gouerne not according to the rule of righteousnes yet is not therefore the name euerthelesâe of reputation because it is an ordenance of God therefore let vs despise no name that belongeth to gouernours neither yet also any gouernour nor any man els for we haue all sinned haue neede of the grace or mercy of the Lord. Answere THe booke in lattin is called EuaÌgelium Regnâ gospell of the kingdome but this man is the translator thereof and hath qualified it calling it a ioyfull message of the kingdome the title is arrogant and presumptuous the doctrine therein worse as will appere in print ere it be long the pope hath found among manâ enemies one freÌd although his doctrine is spokeÌ against euery where yet this maÌ would gladly képe and retayne his bare name belonging to a gouernour in office we coÌdeme not the name his doctrine not agrââing with the word is by the same word condemned so is yours For significations of names ⪠wâe will not contend a part of your deuinity lyeth therein neither do wee despise any name but is euell doctrine be shadowed or vnder any name cloked then wee inuey agaynst the doctrine vsing the name as wheÌ inuectiues are made agaynst the Pope or HN. it is not ment of the persons but of the doctrine And surely the Pope did neuer exercise so great a Popedome in the West Church as your HN. a new Pope doth among you of his Familye and as the papistes which tooth and nayle seeke to maintayne euery absurd and senceles part of the popes doctrine with all their power witte and skill EueÌ so do ye of his Family maintayne your Nâ and whatsoeuer vnsauery doctrine he teacheth it maâ not be discredited nor he cannot therein erre or misse the right in such reputation haue you placed mortall man. You say we all haue sinned haue need of y grace or mercy of the Lord y all haue sinned you truely confes but that all doe dayely sinne you cannot beleue especially you the ââders of the holy vnderstandinâ but in humilitye of spirite you and wee ought to coÌfesse not onely that we haue sinned but dayely and hourely do sinne and haue neede not onely of his grace but his mercy also although you speake of grace or mercy but wee craue his grace and mercy his grace to guide vs and his mercy to deliuer vs. Vitell. MOreouâr you are greatly offended because hee sayeth that none shold take iâ haÌd to teach or preach but the illuminate elders whiâh arâ Godded with God or incoâpoâatâd to God and with whom also God in one being and power of his spirite is hominisied or become man And those you call proud speaches and because âN vseth them ye despise him althoughe they be no strange words or speches in thâ dutâh language ⪠therfore in so doing you despiâe the
Lord. Answere I Am offended in zeale of Gods ãâã agaynst your generall doctrine wheâof this is a part that none may teach the truth but y illuminat âlders Your HN. further sayth Therefore it is assuredly all false and lyes seducing and deâeitfull what the vngodded or vnilluminate men out of the imagination or riches of theire own knowledge out âf their learnednes of the scriptures bâing forth institute prâach and teaâh c. Now looke wel and behold whether HN. condemne not all others but his illumined Elders who are Godded with God c. which in dâede I haue rightly tearmeâ proud speaches such as neuer any godly wryter in Christ his church durst euer speake or write âou would colour the wordes by the ducth tongue saying they be not straÌge speches in that language but certainly a strange and monsterous doctrine is therby taught and far disagreeing from the written word and far ânbeseeming any Christian. And here if I should dilate what a meaning you haue in these wordes Godded with God I should increase this treatise ouer much yet I will somewhat touch it as you and your Author haue expressed it in wryting I will vse your own speach as followeth See and marke my beloued in the beginning when God had made all things well thâ was the Lord one Lord of his kingdome and one God of his worke and there was also no more but one God and one man and they were one ⪠and had in all one ordeâ beinâ ⪠ând nature For God was all that the man was and the mâ was all that God wââ Thus monstrously and blasphemously you haue taught god and man to be one in nature now compare this godhead with God or incorporated to God and easily it is perceiued that you meane God and man to be one this were worthye to be buryed in silence but that now the patrons defeÌd such blasphemies it is tyme to cleare the Church of Christ that such proude and Luciferian voyces shoulde not bee heard or once named yet this man will proue that HN. cannot erre and none that know the truth can condeÌne HN. It is a pitiful thing that men hauing anye sence or feeling of God or godlines should so vaynely wryte or publish to y world such absurd horrible doctrine neuer heard of before and yet the Aucthor must needes be a prophet and his doctrine to proceede from the Lord nowe in despising thys and the like proud speach of HN of necessitie I am counted to despise y Lord thus still you drawe HN. hys matters that who so speaketh or wryteth agaynst hym be wryteth and speaketh agaynst God whether will you exalt your Auâthor ye vnbeleuers surely aboue all that is called God but wyth your father you will be cast headlong so low where to late you may bewaâl your contempt of God and godlinesse looke in tyme to this and the like part of your doctrine oh ye Ipocrites Vitell. FOr asmuch as the Lord hath seen it for good to bryng foorth hys most holy seruice of loue in the duch language although it seeme grosse and barbarous to you so shall it from henceforth be counted a language amoÌg those languages wherin the Lord hath erected his law and the priestes office thereof and the seruice of the beliefe with hys priests office Like maner shall the most holy seruice of loue be brought foorth through the Lorde hys elected minister HN. with his priests office where through the Lorde will receaue all men in mercy whiche humble them vnto hys word of grace according to the requiring of hys lawe and ordinaunces be erected and remayne from generation to generation for euermore for loue peace and righteousnesse shall remayne in eueâlalastingnes Aunswere THe Dutch language must nowe be accounted amongst those learned tongues wherein the law and gospell were written and this he auoucheth the Lord hath seene it for good that it shal be euen so you now take your authors office in hande For you Prophesye that from hencefourth this shall come to pas the law the seruice of the beliefe and the Priestes office must be brought forth in y Dutch Language I cannot but say notwithstanding your false Prophesye that the Dutch Language you vse especially in such straunge inuented wordes and confused compositioÌ is barbarous sith that âârtayne other of your bookes that haue learned to speake latine a toung by nature propriety plaine copious and eloquent are also new fangled in name and barbarous in phrase of purpose to be blasphemous in doctrine which you nor any of your Familyâ haue as yet as I thinke translated they want a certayn father and therefore haue no certayn names but borrowed as Theologica Germanica Augustinus Elutherius c. Their new deuised latin wordes are such as Aegoitas Ipsietas c. Their doctrine is that Adam is nothing els but vetus homo and Christus is nothing els but Nouus homo The history of Christ his birth hys miracles passion death resurrection c. they regard not but allegor is vppon euery part thereof most daungerously and vngodly teachingâ vncertayne significations without coÌâort making no accompt of the history Confidently to beleue the truth of the history they say is to abide in the letter which killeth Those bookes contaynâ playne doctrine which the Libertynes hold and also the doctrine of perfection whiche you hold to be in this life ⪠but especially this principle that when this perfection whiche you dreame of is come to the man then is he illuminate and deiffied and God in him hominified so that in all his actions wordes and thoughtes he can no more coÌmit sinne or anye euill then God or Christ can commit sinne or euill the reason is rendred because God or Christ dwelleth in the man and hath thâ gouernment of all hys actions thoughtes c. And when ye are pressed in conference to shewe that man thus hauing Christ dwelling in him if he at any tyme doe bring foorth any euill that in resemblaunce maâ appeare as sinnes they are not so to beâ accompted of say you because Christ dwelleth in the man which doctrine is wicked false and diuelish as I haue often tolde your fellowes in other places Christ dwelleth in vs by the participation of his holye spirite and guydeth our actions els should wee haue no strength to resiste sathan or flesh nor the intisements of the world but taketh not away thereby our humayne imperfections but he keepeth lustes and all wickednes that they raigne not ouer vs or rule in vs or haue dominion ouer vs yet wee ceasse not to be sinners or commit sinne that is your owne doctrine but hath no foundation or warrant in the worde Other bookes also are of such lyke name and doctrine as Elidad and Fidelitas whereof I fearâ me that you were the traÌslator The doctrin wherof I meane not to touch in this place onely this is to be noted that the parties
godly or learned man in all ChristeÌdome will allow your HN. and his bookes for true doctrine you for your part haue trauelled the most part of this 10. yeares and yet I cannot vnderstaÌd of any godly âr learned man that imbraceth your doctrine onely some erroneus spirites whose heddes haue bin intoxââated with other horrible heresies doe ioyne with you in these your wicked attempes also certayââ vnlearned country people with whom by your sugred speaches and fayre wordes you haue not a little preuailed to the destructioÌ of their soules If you would choose any godly and learned men to heare your reasons and argumentes thâ matter might quietly be debated you doe but in wordes make a shew aâ though you would stand to indifferent and vnpârciall iudgement But when it commeth to tryall you will be iudged onely by your selues which is the safest way to cloke your impietyes Vitel. THerefore consider what you haue done for I am sure you are not appoynted a iudge by the Lord but Christ will come with his Saintes and iudge the world and all nations with righteousnes and he will send his Aungells for to kepe and to gather the corne together and they shall bring the corne into the Barne but the weedes shall be cast into the vnquenâhable fire therefore iudge you nothing before the Lord come whilest you cannot as yet discerne the hearbes from the weedes nor the corne from the chaffe for with the same iudgement that you iudge shall you be iudged in asmuch as you are guilty ⪠in the same which you falsely iudge ouer others Aunswere I Am not appoynted a Iudge but Christians must not be lyke Horse and Moyle that haue no vnderstanding I onely admonish you as is euery maÌs duty of such doctrine as you teach to the poore people which is corrupt and therefore knowing the same I haue manifested it to the world that your cause might sooner if you be disposed come to tryall and that trueth might appeare where it is You further discourse of the second comming of Christ I hope you meane it not otherwise but in the resurrection of all fleââ I writ this because HN. in the preface of his booke called a good Instruction of the vpright sayth the 2. division sayth these wordes For as much theiâ as that now in this same newest day the comming of Iesus Christ as a Lord in his maiestye from the right hand of God his Father appearâth and becommeth manifested vnto ãâã with full clearenes of his heauânly illumination âccording to the scripâââe c. Here HN. telleth that Iesus Christ is come and is manefest to you of his Familye and that he is come from the right hand of God his father Our fayth is that he shall come from theÌce in the end of the world but HN. telleth his Familye that he is come therefore your wordes and your Authors agree not this is very suspitious doctrine touching the resurrection and this augmenteth more suspition that one of your Family being asked before many witnesses touching Christes comming to iudgement did aunswere playne that he was already come meaning his second comming I could name the partye yet my hope is that you teach not so heathnishly of our resurrection and of Christ his glorious comming to Iudgement Vitell. MOreouer you affirme in your wrighting that you and all that are as your are whome you âall God his children doe feele your selues wounded with sin vnto death but by grace geuen from aboue that wholesome medecine Christe Iesus whose passion hath purged whose bloud hath cleÌsed whose death hath cured all your diseases and maladies c. So you confesse you neede not any more for you are clensed and cured of al your diseases wherefore do you then condemne HN. which doth teache none other doctrine where through men shal come to lyfe euerlasting but through the passioÌ death and bloud of Iesus Christ but you are clensed as you say and therefore haue you no more neede of Christ nor of hys safemaking oyle of the godly saluation for you affirme that ye are all cleane and I would ye were clensed through Iesus Christ for then coulde yee neither slaunder nor lye Aunswere I Haue sayd that all God his Children feele themselues wounded with âhâ vnto death c. the remedy I hauâ also shewed as you haue set down but your conclusion is false and cannot bee collected of my wordes that I neede not anye more because I am clenseâ and cured for we need his prouidencâ still to protect vs and his grace to defend vs in all our actions for wee arâ stil subiect to âall into sinnes not withstanding in the purpose of God we bee hys elect and to our comfort do feele the Lorde worke in vs a hate of sinne which is a testimony to our conscience that we pertayne vnto the Lord Iesuâ yet so as the dregges of sinne with the motions thereof lurke in our bodyeâ although you deny it our battayle against âinne is continuall and shal neuer haue end vntill our earthly tabernacle shal be turned to dust contrarâ to your doctrine of perfection you askâ why I blame HN. whiche teacheth no other doctrine I would be nor you did not but how contrary you speake vnto the truth doth maniâestly appeare You charge me agayne vntruely that because we are clensed wee neede no more of Christ this woulde you haue but our needâ wee still acknowledge our wantes we vtter and yet doubt nothing of our deliuery from sin hell and death and although wee acknowledge this our redemption and forgeuenes of our sinnes yet so as the remembraunce thereof still worketh repentaunce in vs and also wee often feele the law to presse vs the iustice of God to terrefie vs our coÌscience to accuse vs in such trouble are often the children of God but stil by grace giuen vs through fayth wee acknowledge Christe Iesus who hath interposed himselfe betweene vs and the law betwene vs and the Iustice of God c. with such conflictes doth the Lord still exercise hys ChildreÌ and so doth hereby schole vs that feeling our want or neede and our miseries we might flee to him for streÌgth for mercy for help but I doubt whether you in your Family with your presumtuous doctrine of perfectioÌ do féel any of these exercises the godly Christian is partaker of ⪠Now you wishe that I were clensed through Iesus Christ for then coulde I neither slaunder nor lye âoe here appeareth vnawares that you when you are clensed can sinne no more but for my owne part I acknowledge and I doubt not but verely beleue through Christ that my sinnes by his death are clensed and yet subiect both to lye and slaunder Although I know not neither is it yet manifest vnto me that I haue wittingly either belyed or slaundered either you or your Aucthor or maliciously haue written any thing agaynst you yet it may be that I haue bin informed otherwise then trueth in
some thinges yet so as hitherto vntouched of you except we should take your bare word agaynst many witnesses Vitell. FVrther you write of two men which weâe before a worshipfull Iustice Anno 1561. which you affirm to be of the Fam. of loue what they were that is that but of HN. his doctrine at that time they knew not also you affirme you knowe what but seeing you will âeedes slaunder vs we will in the patience of Christ beare thât and hâpe âpon the goodnes and mercifulnesse of the Lord desiring him to geue you a better minde Aunswere TOuching two meÌ examyned before a worshipfull Iustice I haue collected that they were of the Family of loue you answere the doctrine of HN. at that time they knew not but this is certain one of them is liuing knoweth you but to well and is a welwiller to your Family and scoller of Allin but what they were you aunswere that is that Such suttle aunsweres are fittest for men of your profession you know what they were it seemeth and in deed they were of your hatching although for further increase of knowledge ⪠Allin their neare neighbor did more instructe them and lead them forward into your error Plain dealing would haue put men out of doute seeing you know what they were But since they haue bewrayed your doings ⪠in secret you regard them not For some of your Familye haue aunswered that by compulcion and threates they made their confession others say playne they were not of our Family you are ashamed of them now that they haue disclosed your secret conference You say I affirme I know what I thinke you meane touching your owne person wherein I haue vttered you to be y onely man y hath brought this wicked doctrine of HN. which lay hidden in the Dutch tongue among our simple English people to their euerlasting destruction except the Lord in mercy open their eyes that they may see into the wicked monstrous drift of your Author HN. and repent theÌ and so turn vnto the Lord Iesus from whome they haue departed following a stranger an enemy to Christ and his gospell set vp by Sathan who enuieth the prosperitye thereof The Lord geue you hartes to vnderstand and also geue euery one of you a better minde Vitell. COncerning Christopher Vâtell of his aât or his small skill in learning he knoweth it also neither doth he make any boast of any thing that he âaÌ for he knoweth if he haue any goâd whether it be godly or maâly that ât commeth fâom aboue for all goâd coÌmeth from the Father of light with âhome there is no variablnes âeiâher is he chaunged into daâkenes but all what is neither gâdly âoâ manây that commeth out oââhe âlâsh of ãâã or âlâshfly wisedonâ ãâã the ãâã gâod thinking his ãâ¦ã âhiâh bringeth ãâ¦ã holyââs a counterfaâte riâhteouââes as also many manner of religions or chosen God seruices sectes or errors c. Aunswere TOuching this Christopher Clitel in Latten Vitâlus or Vitulus I haue sayd he is a ioyner by occupation a wauering minde and vnconstaÌt delighting in singularitys alwayes held hereticall opinions almost this 36. yeares wise men haue noted 3. euills being once rooted in man are seldome or neuer voyd of some spice of y same disease that is Lunasy Ieolously and heresye and it so falleth out by this mans example who in king Henryes raigne was vnconstant in king Cowardes raigne a dissembler and in Queenes Maryes raigne a playne Arryan and now in this our Princes raigne a chiefe teacher of the Familye of Loue now he hosteth of nothing surely there is no cause but rather to sorrow that many poore people by you are deceiued and abused and their simplicitye caryed away by your suttle speaches You say what so is godly or manly that is from aboue the phrase is somewhat difficult I think you mean spirituall and earthly But where you adde what is neither godly nor manly y coÌmeth of the flesh of sinne c. Here is a distinction more scholasticall then meane wittes can attaine to if by godly and manly you place manly as contrary to godly then is manly taken in the euill part and so not from aboue excepte you will haue euell thinges from aboue which cannot be The thirde distinction is ambiguous for of our corrupt nature wee bring forth fleshly wisdome imaginations c. And herevnto are we by nature subiect if the Lord by his grace doe not guide vs and lead vs and deliuer vs yea and so deliuered if he still doe not protect and gouerne vs we shall be ready to fall agayne and agayne therefore we dayly craue at his handes saying deliuer vs Lord from such euels as by our owne corrupt nature we are subiect vnto Here are also 2. phrases I thought not good to let pas vntouched the one the mans good thinking and this is taken in the Family in the euill parte If his thought be good it is from aboue why despise ye it The other is chosen God seruices If it be a seruice of God then you doe not well to place this phrase with sects and errors But these men haue a delite to publishe strange Religion and to set it forth with strange phrases also For so they may speake like their Author they care not how vnlike the holy scripture they write Vitell. ANd all these come hereout because the man will iudge the âorkes of the Lord with his naturall wisdome or lernedenes And heâout namely out of the wisedome of the flesh sprang all Christopher Vitelles errors but not out of any other maÌs councell or bookes Answere ALl errors sectes and couÌterfaite righteousnes as this man saith come of this that man will iudge the worâes of the Lord with his naturall wisdome lewdnes Touching man simply which S. Paul calleth Ammalis homo the âleshly minded man knoweth not the things that are of God yet it is also affirmed that no man can say Abba Father without the spirite of god This man would perswade that there is now some secret teaching froÌ God by reuelation which is proper to this Family and therein they haue a speciall gifte they litle regard the ordinary way and meane to attayne knowledge and the true sence of the holy scripture It is not to be denyed that almighty God hath taught his children by his holy spirite in reuelations extraordenary but that now the sonne of God is come into the world eâen the wisdom of the Father with an vncouered face shall we now in this light looke to be taught by reuelations or inspiratioÌs he hath by his wisdome established an ordinarye way of teachinge in his church wherunto we must stand obâdyent except we will deny his ordynance Faith commeth by hearing of the word of God If we haue faith we shal not want other excellent vertues she is neuer alone but loue charitiâ humilitie patience c. waite vpoÌ her as handmaydes Hath not the Deuill deluded many
the word are you your selues as is before shewed that euery one thinketh that he hath the best part as you say For mens thoughtes we referre to his knowledge that is Scrutâtor cordium remum Also you affirme that man is plaged with such a miserye and burthen but we rather say oh miserable man out of whose corrupt nature springeth such presumption and wickednes to be vnder the obedience of the Loue of Christ Iesus is our whole care and studyâ to him onely we cleaue on him we call vpon his mercy we depend and carefully seeke indeuour to be obedient to his will for he is our hope our anker hold our mercy seate our only coÌfort in all distresse of mind our phisitioÌ in sicknes our gouernour in health our peacemaker the onely purchaser of our health and saluatioÌ he is all in all with vs and wée enioy all in all by him and through him and if this sayth were also planted in you then would your HN. be banished out of your hartes and your perfection would soone quaile and in humilitye of spirite you would âith vâ fall downe before this méeke Lambe Christ Iesus and say peccauimus cum patribus nostris c. We haue sinned with our Fathers without which Christ no flesh that is no creature liuing is iustified in his fathers sight and Christ his death is proper to none nor bâlongeth to none but sinners and such aâ feele sinne or are laden with sinnes What shall then become of you Iusticiaryes with your perfite state which sinne not to follow brotherly loue is also to be wished both in you and vs and I pray you doe euen the same theÌ shall you not séeke out y simple people whose capaciti is lyke vnto ware which will easely receiue any print or marke seek not with your fly and suttle perswasions to seduce theÌ with your corrupt doctrine ⪠vnder preâence that you seeke onely the godly lyfe which Christians should follow whereas in déede you séeke to leade theÌ from Christ to HN. from the âomfort of the holy scriptures which sheweth how mercy is offred to all penitent sinnârs vnto a perfite state of lyfe which must be attained in this world which neuer any Christ Iesus except could attayne vnto and so you corruptly leade them away from all comfort in Christ Therefore we will not let to desire the Lord in mercy to preserue his childreÌ from your infected poyson Vitel. THerfore speketh the lord through his Prophet Zacâary Iudge righteously and let euery one shew goodnes and mercifulnes vnto his brother and let no man deale vnrightly with another nor with the widowes fatherles sââangers and poore And let no man imagine any euill against his brother in his haât but alas they will not haue ââgard hereupon but âuâne theâ backs saith the Lord vnto me and stop their eares that they heare not and harden their haââes as hard as a diamont For that they should not be obediât to the law the word which the lord sendeth in his spirite through his prophets Aunswere TOuching the saying of âachary we wish the very same that euery one shew mercy and deale rightly with his brother with the widow and fatherles strangers and poore c. But can you alleadge these places haue no regard to folow the exhortatioÌ your selues how rightly do you deale with your brethren that being required to vtter your faith which you hold you deal suttelly and deceitfully with such as with well vnto you and seeke your health and delyuery from error Now regard you that no man imagine euill in his hart against his brother when as you call vs free ânes Libertiâes and wicked blasphemers c. Who turnes their backs who stoppes their âares who harden their harts Haue not you turned from Christ to HN Haue not you stopt your eares against all holesome admonition which the holy Ghost hath plentifully in the holy scriptures set forth and only bent your harts vpon the bookes and wrytyngs of HN Haue you not hardened your harts and bent your faces against a manifest truth and placed HN. a prophet priest by whoÌ God wil receiue all vnto mercy On whom may this propheticall speach or exhortation be better applyed then vpon your selues and yet will not I goe about to excuse my selfe and others that we do therein what is required but only let y world see that these men of the Family cry out and apply the sayings of the Prophets against vs and for themselues they suâpose it belongeth not to them to take waâning thereby in so perfecte a state do they remaine Vitell. O God prepare the harts of the people to the lowlynâssâ that they might stand mindeâ in humility to the Loue and loue the comming of thy Christ in his lordlânes through whom the whol earth shal be âudged with righteousnes which shall moue all might and violence and bring it vnder his obedience and render vnto thee O almighty God the kingdom all power and glory to the end that thou mayest be all in all O god geue this into the harts of the gouernors that they may see it And illuminate all kinges princes Lords and potentates with thy godly wisdome that they may feare thy holy name stand submitted vnto thy Loue and her seruice and might turne them from all violence and misuse and that the world may be inhabited to thy praise in the Loue and in all righteousnes and that all men in true repentance for their sinnes might be turned vnto thee And the horrible plagues of vngodlynes which are come ouer the world for their sinâes cause cease and haue an end Answere THis part coÌtaineth a prayer which this man maketh for all that they might staâd minded in humility to the loue as I haue often complayned of the confounding this word Loue and the signification therof so here I will tâke it in y best part to signifie God to whom we craue continually his grace to huÌâle our harts that we may euer standâ obedyent to his will and that we may look for that ioyfull coÌming of Christ Iesus whose appearing shal be to the comfort of his elect to their surpassing ioy but as a terrible iudge to the wicked despisers of his mercy offered and to such as haue sât vp in their harts any other besides him or follow any other but him or delite in any other sauing hâm No violence can resist him no strength preuail with him but as you say all shall be brought vnâer his obâdâence âhere as you pray that all kings princes c. may âeaâe thy holy name and stand submitted to thy loue âere is loue takeÌ in another sence therfore you intricatly vse this word Loue wherby your meaning can not easily be found out For here loue and her seruice is meant such doctrine and seruice âs you teach which you wiâh all princes were partakers of if your doctrine were a truth in dââde then were your prayer