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A13255 A mustre of scismatyke bysshopes of Rome otherwyse naming them selues popes, moche necessarye to be redde of al the kynges true subiectes. Cum priuilegio. Swinnerton, Thomas, d. 1554.; Robertes, Johan, pseud. 1534 (1534) STC 23552; ESTC S104852 33,594 89

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quarell that castyng their best weapons from theym ronne home to their wyues say they be driuen to flye for faute of weapon / and desyre a podynge in the stede of a sworde God sende euery good man in a iust cause somwhat more wyser coūsayle than he were lyke to haue of suche men whiche euen at the fyrste choppe / ye and without any study to confesse they be but beggers and haue no ware to fell Is not a mannes money well bestowed vpon suche merchauntes as crye creke euen at the. fyrsts brunte These be they that wyll beat● downe all the worlde with then gonne shotte But if other men had ben driuen to suche shamefull shyftes by them good lorde what exclamaciōs wolde they haue made And as for the perpetuall virgynite of our lady / no man douteth of it that I knowe But in the meane tyme I desyre my maysters the papystes with the proctours of bycherly buggersters to tell me as they wyll abyde by whether they byleue the perpetuall virgynne of our lady to be comprehended in scrypture written or no all be it I knowe that in some places they haue sayd naye all redy But as for that I wyll take no holde of it but gyue them for this one 's the priuylege of cornisshmen that is to tell their tales twyse for at the fyrst tellyng it may fortune they were not well aduised or ꝑaduenture the mens wyttes were rauysshed or as the cōmune saying is breched Neyther is it good maner to take a man at the worste An other cauellacyon haue they that This cauelacion toke the patriarche of vnthriftes out of doctour dronkarde is this How knowe ye say they which is the true worde of god Whervnto I answere that as concernyng our outwarde knowlege thapostles ꝓphetes haue left their myndes therof behynde them in writyng by the whiche we may discerne the true worde of god frō dreames fantasyes Well say they agayn But how be ye sure that thapostles ꝓphetes dyd write that same worde the ye red● as who sholde say it is possyble that ye may be deceyued that the byble whiche ye haue loke vpon may be falsly intytled be none of thapostles prophetes doynges Whervnto I make answere that as concernyng the outwarde knowlege we haue as moche and good assuraūce that it is the very selfe same worde that Chryst his apostles the ꝓphetes taught as that same sorte which ye cal the churche / that is to say the preestes monkes ●●eres chanōs abbots bysshops c. and haue herde Chryst thapostles the prophetes teche preche as often as euer did they / sene thē as often as euer dyd they Wherfore as cōcernyng the outwarde tytle knowlege as I said before we be so wel assured therof as they ben and receyue no knowlege of thē no more thā they receyue of vs. Neither haue they any better know lege in this behalfe than we haue Than procede our wyse dreamyng doctours further / affirme that we of the tēporaltie haue none other knowlege assuraūce of the true worde of god but bycause the churche that is the clergye as they meane beyng assured which is the true worde which not by the instruction techyng of the holy goost doth certifie tell vs by the same spirit which is that same true worde of god It is an olde sayd sawe good reder that a man shal soone ●ceyue a thefe by his own tale These olde bottell bretherne be so subtyl that they wote not in the worlde what they say I ●myse you they ben excedyng connyng in wrastlyng by the armes / but whan they cōme to the collers they ben choked vp forthw t as the deuyl wolde / cast in theyr owne trip Let vs marke well their wordes and se what they haue won by their owne tale and cōfession If the holy ghost as they cōfesse and as there is no doute eustructeth the churche teacheth her to discerne the true worde of god from false dremes and fantasyes / than is it as false as euer god almyghty was true or is that we of the temperaltye haue no other knowlege or assuraūce whiche is the trewe worde of god but by the spirytualty for as moche as we by the redemptyon that is in Christ Iesu be of the same churche that is enstructe taught made perfyte in all verytees or truthes For loke howe the holy ghost enfourmeth teacheth all the hole holy catholyke churche of god / euen so he inspyreth teacheth euery trewe and lyuyng membre of the same in all veritees and truthes necessary to their saluacyon But truthe it is that the papysticall spyritualtye with the doctour of the vnwriten worde be not of the churche of god / ergo they be not enstruct by the holy ghost and consequently knowe not the true worde of god wherfore of good cōgruence reason y● by theyr own reson they must bylene 〈◊〉 whan we say vnto them this is the true worde of god not we them For that they be none of the churche approueth saynt Paule in the .viij. chapitre to the Roma●s saying But if any mā haue not the spiryt of Christ that mā is none of his The papistical spiritualtie with the prophete of lytell verait haue not this spirit of Chryst ergo they be none of his sorte by the wytnesse of his seruaūt Paule Yea how can they for shame be so bolde to saye that they haue his spiryte whan they be al vtterly voyde of the fontes aseribed appropriate to them that haue the spirite Oneles they coulde make good fortifie these lytle prety ones that I shall adnōbre to be the frutes of Chrystes spiryte as ambicion pryde lordlynesse enuy malyce disdeyn preuy open murdre oppressyon tyranny sleuthe ease glotony with all maner of lechery brennynge drownynge hangyng men ī their owne gyrdels sectes scismes diuision debate cōtenciō stryfe with Symō magus Iudas the people of Sodome Gomorre with hawkes horse hoores knaues theues all that naught is and whether these be the knowen manifest fruites of the papistycall kyngdome the heed father god wherof is Antychrist of Rome / his atturney the great god of Cateway the father of vnwritten veritees / I reporte me to all the worlde And now ye se what our vnwriten euāgelistes haue won by their owne tale to what point cōclusion they be brought by their vndouted veritees Forsoth that they be neyther sure whiche is the worde of god nor yet be none of his churche / that for bycause they be not endued with his spiryt as their fruytes do well declare But the very entent purpose pollicy of the authours of the forsayd vnwritten worde was vndoutedly herafter whan they shuld haue sene tyme conuenyent / to haue denyed all holy scripture writen bothe tholde testament the newe to be the worde of god This is
truthe as he knoweth And in so doyng he must nedes call a thefe by this name thefe / a knaue by this name knaue and so forth / wherwith no good man ought to be offended Nowe leest we be to tedyous it is mete we aproche to our mater GRegory the seuenth or Hyldebrāde ●ergius the secōde of that name / before he was created pope of Rome / was surnamed / os ●●r●i in latyn / in englysshe / swines mouth hogges nose / or pygges snowte / whether ye wyll whiche Sergius bycause he was a shamed of so foule a name / vnmete for suche a dignytye as he thought dyd chaunge his name / called hymselfe Sergius So that euer synce all popes haue vsed the same / as ye se here in experiēce by Gregorie the. v●● whose surname before was Hyldebrande of whom we spake before besyde that that he was a damnable heretike of the secte of Arriane as it is very euydent to be sene in his lyfe / was also so cruell a tyraunt so leude of maners otherwyse as neuer god put life in a worse And euen here without any more busynesse as an olde rotten house blowen ouer with the wynde cometh downe in a myschefe our olde rotten raynebeaten opinyon that the pope can not erre For that ones admytted that he was an Arriane as truthe is if any credēce is to be gyuen to a worldly story than no doute but he was an heretyke condempned by the moste famous counsayle of Nece If the popes warryours wyll fyght agayne thystory and say it is of none authorite and credence I answere that they must approue it nedes if they wyll at leest approue hym that is euen next cosyne germayne to our holy father For he that wrote the booke in the latyne tonge was one Beno cardynall at that same tyme / whiche I suppose was a very good man ye and coulde erre very lytell if the pope can not erre at all Neyther is it best for the sauyng of this opinyon that ye denye the truthe of this story leest in your moste nede other men serue you of the same sauce in the thynges wherin ye wolde best be byleued as in suche thyngꝭ wherof ye haue nothyng to shewe but stories / and than ye be at a prety poynte Peraduenture it wyll be answered that lykewyse as the aperyng of one swallowe proueth not the springe of the yere no more dothe the errour of one man no not of four or fyue conclude that an other or all haue erred in dede Mary that is truthe / who gothe aboute to proue that Our argument is no more but vpon possybylite as thus Gregory the seuenth dyd erre and was an heretyke / ergo an other Fyue popes starke heretikes may so do Or thus Gregory the seuenth was an heretyke Vrbane the seconde was an heretyke Liberius was an heretyke Nouatus was an heretyke Anastasius the seconde was an heretike / and it is not vnpossyble but the rest myght be heretykes ergo all myght be heretykes Ye I dare be bolde to saye that if men wolde make so fatte heretykes as be made now a dayes they were no better all for the moste parte Some man wolde say perchaūce that myne argument is naught And than I saye agayne sauynge my charyte he vnderstandeth naught For though there were no waye to fortyfye myne argument but the cōmen maner of speakynge yet coulde I do it As for an ensample whan men say a dagger is but dethe / it is as moche to say to al men that haue any wytte as all daggers be dethe And whan they saye I wolde not truste my father if his hoode and his cote were sowed togyder or if he dyd weare a shorne crowne some wyse man wolde take it so that none suche were to be trusted / and than me thynke they be but euen a ryght bare sorte Semblably to choke them with their owne princyple whan they say the pope can not erre their meanyng is that no pope can erre and than muste the contrary nedes be trewe that whan men saye the pope maye erre it signyfyeth so moche as all popes maye erre And nowe I truste to god our argument standeth Here haue ye proued that the pope may erre with the experyence of fyue proued herctikes condempned by the testymony of the churche good autentyke stories whiche for the confutacion of this fonde princyple might suffyse after my mynde But bycause fyue make but a lytle shewe in a felde let vs passe forthe and se if we can espye the hole armye of these blyssed bretherne For the more manyfest truthe wherof ye shall vnderstande that from the yere of our lorde god CC .xliij. vnto M. CCCC .xxxiij. there hath ben .xxiij. scismes in the xxiii scismes in the churche churche amonge the popes them selues Of the whiche the .xij. scysme endured xvij yeres The .xxij. scysme .xl. yeres and the thre twenteth .xvi. yeres ¶ The .xxij. scysme aforesayde was so darke doutfull that the cronyclers can not tell all the whyle it endured beynge the space of .xl. yeres who was the right pope / no nor the best lerned men and most of conscyence that than were And yet there was euer more choyce of popes ynough for all that same tyme there were neuer lesse than two or thre at ones So that in my conceyte if the pope can not erre me thynkes one of them myght haue tryed the mater who was the true pope Neyther do I doute but euery man sayde for hym selfe I am the trewe pope But for as moche as none of them in so sayeng were alowed of thother it can not be denyed but that euery one iudged of an other that he lyed and erred bothe / and was for the defendyng of his errour an antypope or ydole yet the moste wondre of all is that it coulde not be discerned who was the trewe pope by the best lerned moste of good conscyence that than were as the cronyclers saye Vpon this it foloweth that there was neuer a true of them all or els that the clergye or churche was very symple and coulde not discerne it / and consequētly had not Christ amongest them to enstruct them by his spiryte of all truthes and than they were not the churche of god For Christe hath promysed to be with his churche to the ende of the worlde to enfourme it in all vertue Or if they lyke not that than must they saye their cronycles be false wherwith hytherto they haue founde no faute condempne them / and than we haue made a fayre brewynge Consyderynge than that the popes wolde not at those dayes whan they were two or thre at ones ye and at other tymes whan they were fyue or .vj. at ones alowe one an other / but iudged eche other to lye erre to be antypopes / what nede we any better proues that they may erre than their owne mouthes In the tyme that these .xxiij.
but denye the vnwryten worde that he allegeth to be the worde of god put hym to the ꝓses of it / and this be sure of that neither he nor any of his shall euer be able to proue it It may fortune he wyll enforce to proue it thus There be many thyngꝭ necessary to be byleued that be not wryten in scripture / this is one of them ergo this must be byleued of necessite To the maior or the first part I answere thus that as concernyng the necessite The fyrst argument that the worde o● of god written is suf 〈…〉 ●yent of our saluacyon it is false that there lacketh any thyng in scripture writen / for it is wryten Iohn̄ ʒ Sic enim deus dilexit mundū vt filiū suū vnigenitū daret vt ois qui credit ī eū nō pereat sed habeat vitā aeternā God loued the worlde so intyerly that he gaue his onely sone to th ende that who so eue● byleueth in hym sholde not peryshe / but haue lyfe euerlastyng and in the same chapytre Qui credit filio habet vitā aeternam He that byleueth the sone hath lyfe euerlastyng And Iohn̄ the sixth Qui confidit mihi habet vitā aeternā He that trusteth in me hath euerlastyng lyfe so forth in .vj. hondreth places mo Now ben all articles necessary to our byleue in Chryst in the scripture wryten they do saue vs as is before proued bycause that who so byleueth in Chryst byleueth in the father so in the hole trinite ergo the scripture writen dothe saue vs is suffycyent to our saluacyon And so is the maior / that is to wyte that there be any thynges necessary to the saluacyon of our soules vnwryten in scripture proued false Mary otherwyse to speke of necessary thyngꝭ truthe it is that there be many thynges necessary to be byleued of cōgruence and good reason that be not in scripture / as to byleue that false harlottes shrewes wyll neuer be true And that poules steple can not ryde .xl. myles vpō a day no though Lyncolne mynstre were the horse The maior or fyrst parte of their argument aforsayd is proued vntrewe also by thautorite of saint Augustyn Ad fratres Saynt Augustyn in the boke wryten to the chrysten bretherne / lyuyng in wyldernesse in heremo sermone .xxviij. Satis enim nouit charitas vestra quod tota perfectio nostre vite et edificationis ex euangelio accipitur Your charyte sayth saynt Augustyne knoweth perfytly that all the perfectyon of our lyfe edifycacion is taken out of the gospell Nowe myne olde popysshe papystes where is become your worde of god vnwriten necessary to be byleued to the saluacyon of our soules Saynt Augustyne saythe that all the perfectyon of our lyfe and edifycacion is taken out of the gospell If all be taken out of the gospell howe is any thynge vnwritten Ye and he sayth not only all / but addeth ther vnto perfectyon edifycacion whervpon it foloweth that your worde of god vnwritten is of no perfection nor edificacion / and thā it is not necessary to be byleued to the saluacion of our soules But pe●aduēture ye wyll vse your olde shamlesse fassyons and saye that he includeth in this worde gospell the gospell of god vnwritten Non sic impij noc sic Not so ye wicked not so / for he expoūdeth himselfe of what gospell he meaneth in his .xxxviij. sermon to the christen bretherne lyuing in wyldernesse Legite sacram scripturam inquit ille in qua quid tenendum et quid fugiendum sit plene inuenietis Rede ye holy scrypture sayth saynt Augustyne in the whiche ye shall fynde at full what is to be helde and what to be auoyded How say ye now dothe not saynt Augustyne cōmaunde vs to rede holy scripture but who can rede that that is not written / wherfore ye se that he speketh of the worde of god written / and he addeth therto that we shall fynde in it at full that is to saye to euery wyse man suffyciently ynough what is to be holden what to be auoyded Howe lyke ye this worde at full whiche before he called all the perfectyon and edifycacyon of our lyfe And yet we fynde not in scripture your worde of god vnwritten wherfore I conclude that it is not to be admytted and helde for as moche as all thynges that are to be holden ben as saynte Angustyne saythe comprehended in the worde of god written at full And a lytell after Et quid tenendum et quid vitandum est apertissime demonstrauit And it hath shewed vs saith he menyng of holy scripture moste clerely openly what is to be helde what to be refused Howe say ye to these termes most clerely openly More ouer to come to holy scripture agayn / saynt Luke in the fyrst chap. of thactes aproueth saint Augustynes wordes thus Superiore quidē volumine diximus de omnibꝰ Theophlie que cepit Iesus The seconde argument tum facere tū docere c. In our first volume or boke saith Luke we haue writen of al thingꝭ o Theophilus which Iesus both practised taught c. Howe say ye now to theuāgelist Luke he excepteth nothīg that Christ dyd or taught wherof he hath not writen wherfore if ye wyll be so good not to be discontent that Christ dyd and taught al thīgꝭ necessary to our saluaciō / than must ye nedꝭ cōfesse that they be expressed writē of Luke though my new olde maysters haue not the wytte to espy them out and than I put no doute but in the hole bodye of the scrypture written they be sette forthe at full and at large / and so as for your worde of god vnwritten ye may laye it vp to an other yere that there come some derthe of the worde of god written But what name shuld I haue better for these noble diuynes than to call them doctours dreamers or gospellers ymaginatyfe doctores imaginatiui / for all that they proue is by dreames ymagynacions scyence ymagynatyue Paule the fyrst chapiter to the romaynes The thyrbe argument saythe thus Non enim me pudet euangelij Christi Siquidem potentia est dei ad salutem omni credenti I am not asshamed of the gospell of Christ saythe Paule For it is the power of god to saue al that byleue trust or stycke surely thervnto I meruayle sore howe our ymagynary fe doctours or gospellers can auoyde me this place of Paule Paule reputeth the gospell of god to be of suche power and suffyciency to saue all that byleue it and than is the scrypture written suffycyent to our saluacyon / and nothyng vnwritten pertaynyng to the same Do we lacke any of the gospell thynke you than lacke we a pece of our saluacyon Fynally if our ymaginatyue euangelystes byleue that we lacke any parte of it for bycause they can not tell howe moche that parte is nor