Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	church_n	hold_v	pillar_n	2,991	5	10.6628	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A46809	The blind guide, or, The doting doctor composed by way of reply to a late tediously trifling pamphlet, entituled, The youngling elder, &c., written by John Goodwin ... : this reply indifferently serving for the future direction of the seducer himself, and also of those his mis-led followers, who with him are turned enemies to the word and grace of God : to the authority of which word, and the efficacie of which grace are in this following treatise, succinctly, yet satisfactorily vindicated from the deplorably weak and erroneous cavills of the said John Goodwin in his late pamphlet / by William Jenkyn ...	Jenkyn, William, 1613-1685.	1648 (1648)	Wing J645; ESTC R32367	109,133	166

The sum of his passage cited for an error in our testimonie is this If God should deprive men of all power to beleeve yet perswade to beleeve c. God would be like a King that causeth a mans legs to be cut off and yet urgeth him to run a Race with those that have limbs Div. Au. p. 168. Naturall men may doe such things as whereunto God hath by way of promise annexed grace and acceptation All the world even those that have not the letter of the Gospell have yet sufficient meanes granted them of beleeving these two viz. That God is and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seeke him which is all the faith that the Apostle makes necessary to bring a man into grace or favour with god They who have only the heavens the sun m one and starrs to preach the Gospell to them have also reason sufficient to judge the same judgment with them who have the letter of the Gospell for they have the Gospell the substance and effect of it the willingnesse of God to be reconciled to the world preached unto them by the Apostles aforesaid the sun moone and stars Div. Auth. p. 183. p. 186 Nor were it a matter of much more difficulty to bring antiquity it selfe and particularly those very Authors who were the greatest opposers of Pelagius as Hierom August Prosper c. with mouthes wide open in approbation of the same things for which I am arraigned at the tribunall of Sion Col. Sion Col. Vis p. 24. These men have exchanged the Fathers adjutorium into their owne compulsorium Sion Col. Vis p. 28. The question between Pelagius and the Fathers was not whether man had freedome of will in respect of good or evill but whether men notwithhstanding their freedome of will did not still stand in need of the adjutory of grace both for the performance of and perseverance in what was good Answered in busie Bishop 1. T Is you sorrow to see that they are so much as reputed Ministers your sinne to say they are onely reputed Ministers for want of mens knowing better Tell me of one man either Minister or private Christian differing from the Subscribers onely in the point of Independency who dares say thus with you If you do account your self a Minister which way had you your ordination Whether by that way that the Ministers of London had theirs who you say are no Ministers c. 2. You say The Ministers have vested themselves with the priviledge of the Church of being the ground and pillar of truth The Church as a pillar holds forth the truth either in a common way to all Christians mutuall exhortations profession practice c. or in a ministeriall way preaching administration of Sacraments c. If you say the Ministers have vested themselves with the priviledge of being the pillars of truth the first way 't is ridiculously false profession of the truth being common to every one in the Church If you mean as you must needs that the Ministers have vested themselves with the priviledge of pillars in the second respect 't is odiously false for the Lord Jesus himselfe and not themselves vested them with the priviledge of holding forth truth by way of Office Eph. 4.11 Christ gave some Pastors and Teachers 1 Cor. 12.38 God hath set some in his Church c. Busie Bishop pag. 3 4. Though no act unto which man is enabled by God such as beleeving be a foundation in that sense in which Christ is upon whom we build the hope of out salvation to be obtained by his mediation yet beleeving of the Scripture as it is an assenting to a maine and prime credendum viz That the Scriptures are by divine inspiration is a necessary foundation for other subsequent graces that are required in the Christian Religion and without which foundation all godlinesse and Religion would in a short time fall to the ground no theologicall grace can be without faith and no faith if the authority of the Scriptures fall If beleeving be no foundation why doth the Apostle give to faith the name of foundation Heb. 6.1 Not laying againe the foundation of repentance and of faith c. Bu. Bish p. 9. These words therefore questionlesse no writings c. are the conclusion and the result of your premisses in severall long winded pages If your conclusion be crasie and hereticall your premisses must needs be so too and therefore the setting them downe could not have helped you and if the conclusion be not hereticall why do you not defend it against the accusation of the Subscribers which you dare not do but only send the Subscribers to your premisses in the thirteenth page leaving the poore 18. the conclusion to mercy Suppose you had in the thirteenth page written the truth therefore ought you not to be blamed for writing errours in the 18. pag. 21. Bu. Bush At your command I shall consult the pages wherein you would be thought to say The Scriptures are the word of God In these pages and pa. 17 you say That you grant the matter and substance of the Scriptures the gracious counsels of the Scriptures to be the Word of God As that Christ is God and man that he dyed that he rose againe c. These you say are onely the word of God and not the writings or written word when you say the matters c. are the Word of God you suppose they should be beleeved for such But upon what ground ought I to beleeve them I hope you wil not say because a province of London Ministers saith they are to be beleeved nor barely because the spirit tels me they are to be beleeved for the Word of God for the spirit sends me to the written Word bids me by that to try the spirits and tels me I must be leeve nothing to be from God but what I finde written I therefore desire to go to the written Word as revealed by God for the building my confidence upon the matters of the Scriptures as pardon through Christ c. but then J. Goodwin tels me this written Word is not Gods Word So it must be the word of vaine man and so I have no more to shew for this precious truth Christ dyed for lost man than mans word In your alledged pages you make no distinction between res credenda and ratio cudendi the matter to be beleeved and the ground of beleeving that matter The matters to be beleeved are the precious truths you speake of The ground of beleeving them is the revelation of God in his written Word The Revelation of God hath alwayes been the foundation of faith and now this Revelation is by writing the ground of faith is it is written What course tooke Christ and his Apostles to prove the matters and doctrinall assertions which they taught but by the written Word and when they would render them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 fit for belief they ever more tell

thou shouldst reject and desirous that thou wouldst remit whatever thou findest of man but shall also ever remaine thankfull to God and Reader From my Study at christ-Christ-Church London Nov. 23. 1648. A friend to thy-Soule William Jenkyn THE Blinde-Guide GUIDED Chap. 1. Directed more particularly to the reverend and learned subscribers of the late testimony to the truth with-in the Province of London Shewing the senselesse raylings the grosse untruths the shamelesse boastings expressed by Master Goodwin in his Pasquill called The youngling Elder With a recitall of sundry weake and erroneous passages contained therein THe reproached in Mr. Goodwins Pamphlets have more need to be humble under their glory than to be patient under their disgrace no scriblings are so scurrilous and no scurrilities are so honourable as are those which drop from his pen. 'T is rare to meet with that Christian who doth not more than conjecture that there is much worth in every thing against which he expresseth much wrath His Antagonists never could do him good with their will● but he hath ever done them good against his will By writing against his errours they could never make him better but be hath ever by rayling against the truth and them made both to be better beloved I suppose Master Goodwin rather noteth than liketh that abundant estimation which your testimony findeth with the faithfull The stones that this Shime● hath cast against it God hath turned into pearses and made of them a Crown of honour for it Your testimony opposed errour and God hath made it to vanquish infamy He who directed you to make it usefull hath himself made it accepted God hath caused your testimony like the sun to rise on the evill and on the good and rather than it should not refresh them that did desire it to diffuse its beams on them that did not deserve it It hath shined upon the unsavoury dunghill as well as the pleasant garden the close and noysome alley as well as the sweet and open Country No wonder then if its successe have been as various as its objects When its welcome warmth visited the Countries Warwickshire Essex Norfolk Devonshire Yorkshire Northamptonshire Lancashire Wiltshire Somersetshire how sweetly fragrant was the savour which instantly they breathed forth Who hath not gratefully resented the pleasant odours of zeale and learning scattered through the Kingdome by the Ministers of sundry Counties in the many attestations to and approbations of your testimony Some of us have seene the letters of the learned Spanhemius highly approving of it as an eminent expression of your faithfulnesse to Christ and his truth A Declaration and exhortation pag. 34. The many testimonies which the truth and cause of Christ the Covenant and Presbyte●iall Government have lately received from that cloud of witnesses of the Ministry in leverall Counties of England after the example of the worthy Ministry of the City of London against the errours of Independency Anabaptisme c. are unto us matter of great praise and hearty thanksgiving And who observeth not the frequent and respectfull mention that the famous and faithfull Generall Assembly of the Church of Scotland maketh of your testimony in their Declarations of most publique concernment These indeed were the breathings of the more sweet and open places when warmed with the zeale of your witnessing to the truth But who can expect the like from the unsavoury dunghill or the noysom alley though joyntly enjoying the same bounty from the beams of your testimony with the other Those stinking exhalations those muddy streames I meane the suming and foolish pamphlets arising against your testimony out of that alley of errours where Master Goodwin lodgeth whose composition is mud and blood are a supersufficient testimony of the contrary In his other impure pamphlets he outgoeth all his complices in wickednesse But in his two last wherein God did leave him to oppose Christ in your testimony he hath even out-gone himselfe I know not one in the world left him to contend with for mastery in the black arts of lying and reviling unlesse it be his stygian teather In which respect as his tearmes of youngling and novice are notes of no disgrace to me so neither is his hoary and hereticall head found in those wayes of unrighteousnesse an ensigne of over-abundant honour to him 'T is true his expertnesse in lying speakes him Captain of the Cretian Band and his skilfulnesse in reviling a Doctor fit for the ducking-stoole though not for the chaire hut these preferments rather deserve pitty than provoke envy As ambitious to give the world a view of his maturity in the forecited sins he addresseth himself against the reverend subscribers of the late testimony in multitudes of passages after such an odiously false and reproachfull manner as thousands of moralliz'd heathens in the world would blush if but desired to do the like A handfull in stead of a vast heap which might be given are these which follow To this effect he breathes out reproaches Master Jenkin his reverend and beloved brethren Epistle to the Reader p. 4 5. are these fals-fingered men these opprobria propudia generis humani The shames and blots of man-kinde the vilest of men Their cage is defiled cleane birds forsake them and it stands all of this nation in hand whom either the interest of honour or conscience toucheth speedily to quit communion with them In his former pamphlet Syon Colledge was visited in this latter 't is excommunicated in neither 't is prejudiced In casting upon you the names of blots and spots of mankinde he is but your scullion to make your integrity shine the brighter by all these reproachfull smutchings and as he willingly detracts from your reputation so he unwillingly adds to your reward What he relates of the foule and forsaken cage clearely shewes that he accounts meetings for prayer preaching purity of reformation alms to the poore reliefe to the aged and for increase of brotherly love to be the foule defilements of a place of which the Ministers having been guilty in their meetings at Sion Colledge he knoweth that in stead of shunning communion with you the faithfull with a holy scorn neglect his excommunioating of you The truth is most of those whom he accounts to be of his own party forsake and abhominate him if they have any thing of God in them onely they being I fear under the tentation of carnall policy have not as yet fully declared against him for which the Lord pardon them Master Bridg lately of Holland whose judgement in this particular I shall not mention without respect said but a little while since among sundry Ministers of my intimate acquaintance That some brethren of them were resolved to repaire to Master Goodwin by way of advising him to desist from maintaining his erroneous opinions touching the Scriptures and if he refused so to do they resolved he said to quit communion with him with these or with words to

as odious untruths as ever dropt from a Cretians quill For. First I affirm that the Errours of Master Goodwin were mentioned and set downe in the Catalogue in that fulnesse and order wherein they are now expressed nay distinctly read in the bearing of Master John Downame before be subscribed his band to the paper for the witnessing against them 2. No sayings of Mr. Goodwin or of any other of the Sectaries mentioned in the Catalogue were put into the Catalogue of Errours after Master Downames hand was obtained The former Master Downame hath acknowledged to two or three Reverend Ministers that went to him on purpose for enquiry at the same time expressing to them his abhorring of Mr. Goodwins opinions mentioned in the Catalogue which I rather relate because he termes Mr. Downame learned and one of the best spirited men I like the expressions with this note that such men most detest Mr Goodwins Errours Two detestable lied are contained in that relation of his pag. 78. To. Eld. where he saith That not long since some of his followers came to me to propound their scrup●es about the Dectrine that I had taught concerning the nature of a true Church and that contrary to my 〈…〉 promise I denyed conference with them and that I refused to dispute with them unlesse by writing The truth is this many Sectaries observing how sundry Christians I desire to mention it with humble thankfulnes were strengthened against the Schisme of Independency by the Sermons which I preached neer three yeeres since concerning a true visible Church were filled and cut to the heart with madnesse At which time some of Mr. Goodwins followers upon a Lords day toward evening came to my house sundry of my Christian friends in my owne parish coming with them to observe as I conceive their deportment Where one or two of Mr. Goodwins followers that had a minde to speak more than the rest discovered that shamefull ignorance in cavelling that divers of those that flood by and some of their owne party as afterward they confessed blush●d to hear them my self also wondring at their empty impudence they being so farre from bringing any objection against what I had delivered that they were not able without my prompting them to tell me what particular passage in my Sermon it was against which they took exception Only they knew that what I had delivered made against them and they were resolved that they would not like it But so far was I from refusing conference with them that I entertained neare two houres discourse with them at that time though I had preached twice that Sabboth my body being thereby very faint and weary expressing also the greatest forwardnesse and willingnesse to informe and satisfie them whensoever they pleased and desiring them to that end to come to my house for indeed I much pittied them To be short it wat at length propounded by one of my friends that my self and two Ministers might dispute with three of theirs who were of a contrary judgement concerning the points in controversie for the satisfaction of the unsetled Gentlemen This motion I embraced most willingly and desired them to certifie so much to their Ministers which they promised to do and upon advice taken with some reverend brethren concerning the fittest and profitablest manner of managing the said disputation I made this offer under my hand in writing and sent it by some of the unsetled Gentlemen viz. That I would send their Ministers the heads of all my Sermons with all those positions contained in them that opposed the way of separation and if they would ingage to answer them in print I promised also to publish a reply in print to that their answer that so all the world might see on which fide the truth lay But this offer savouring too much of plaine dealing and love of the light their Minihers accepted not pretending their mighty imployments The Ministers refusing the discussion of the controversie by way of writing though solicited thereto by my Letter what followed why now my Gentlemen to make up in sobriety what they wanted in setlednesse having it seems leisure enough earnestly desire that I would engage with them in writing This I refused holding my self close to my former offers that if any of them were unsatisfied I would endeavour most willingly in a private way of conference to inform them conceiving that this might content them who aimed at information and not at ostentation In this relation therefore of Mr. Goodwins I charge him with these two broad faced falsities 1. His saying That I refused conference with his followers whereas I earnestly invited them to come to me for that end 2. His saying That I was advised by my brethren to dispute with his followers only by writing whereas I never was advised or offered at all to dispute with them by writing my offer to dispute by writing or printing being onely made to their Ministers or those so called In a coole requitall for these three rotten and false stories in two of which he basely slanders so many of his betters I shall onely succinctly shew how much more he hath abused himselfe in his Youngl Elder than he hath all or any of you by his foule and false representations For the wronging of his owne reputation if at least it could be made worse than it was before by his late pamphlet called The Youngling Elder to say nothing here how cheap and worthles he hath made his scriblings by the scores of pages spent in such raylings as the common observations and light of every reader doth confute scum and scurrility making up his whole book I shall onely observe how shamelesse and ridiculous he is in magnifying and extolling himself pretending himself to be the most dreadfull adversary that ever put on gowne or ●antlet bragging and swaggering and boasting and ranting and rufling in the beginning of his book as if he would bury ten such younglings as my self in one furrow of his brow and as if he would affright the whole world into a forbearance of quetching against him by the terror of my example when as alas in the sequell of his booke he is so wretchedly weake and ridiculously empty that instead of making me to bleed with his force he onely makes me to blush at his folly Speaking concerning my hazardous adventures in dealing with him pag. 3. he thus insults Little doth this poore man know what be hath done Presbytery lies bleeding at the soot of my writings and is as good as broken in peeces by them it is shaken shattered and dismantled by them When I write I feele the strength of God neare me pag. 17. I have had to do with the keenest sons of high Presbytery pag. 5 Ep. whose little finger had more weight than Master Jenkins loyns and yet I have laid all their attempts and writing in the dust as well they did deserve and therefore this young man was of no

saith Ames and the forme of the Scripture stands in the manifestation of the true Doctrine in words which came from the immediate revelation of the holy Ghost saith Gomarus Materia Scripturae circa quam est tota verae religi●nis doctrina ad salutem necessariae Ecclesiae forma Scripturae esi t●tius doctrina de ver●● religione ad s●lutem necessariae ex imme●●●●● revelatione sp●● sancti conceptis ipsius verbis significatio Gomar de scrip s●●n Disp 2. Id. Ibid. ut verbum non scriptum sermonis signo enuntiatione sic contra verbum scriptum literarum notis descriptione ●●n ●at and both matter and words are preserved by the providence of God so pure this day Foundation that they are still the foundation of Religion the matter the foundation which we must beleeve or the objectum materiale this you grant the writing by the appointment of God the foundation why we must beleeve or the objectum formale into which our faith must be last resolved and this you deny and I maintaine against your following cavils Religion it being the thing in question betweene us Whereas Religion may signifie either the matter of it viz. the things beleeved or the habit of it i. e. the beleeving of these things I assert that the Scriptures are the foundation of Religion not as Religion is considered in it self or in the matter of it but as it is in us True and proper and considered in the grace and habit of it Whereas you joyne together True and proper words of a vast difference 't is affirmed that the Scriptures are the true foundation though not the proper as Christ when he cals himself the vine the doore spake truly though figuratively and so not properly So that the question is not whether the foundation or fundamentals the great articles of faith be contained in the Scriptures this Master Goodwin acknowledgeth Divine Author pag. 17. repeated in your last book sect 37. Nor is the question whether ink and paper be the foundation a conceit so sencelesse that it would never have come into the head of any man but Master Goodwin and such as are left of God to blaspheme inke and paper being the externall matter of any writings whatsoever as well as the holy Scriptures But the question is whether Christian faith which believeth the truths of Christian Religion necessary to salvation be built upon the divine authority of the written Word in which God hath been pleased to reveale those truths This Master Goodwin denyeth in sundry passages in his Hagiomastix and in his Divine Authority of the Scripture This he disputes against in his Youngling Elder and in this sense he endeavours to answer what I bring in Busie Bishop Hagiom sect 28. he denyes it to be any foundation of Religion to beleeve that the English Scriptures or the books called the Bible are the Word of God Div. Auth. page 10 he denyes the English Scriptures and the Hebrew and greek Originals themselves to be the Word of God c. Yo. Eld. page 29. he saith When I deny the Scripture to be the foundation of Religion I meane by the Scriptures inke and paper And whatever else is found in them or appertaining to them besides the truths matter and gracious counsels concerning the salvation of the world which are contained in them c. In direct opposition to which detestable passage I assert that by Scriptures or foundation of faith we are not onely to understand the gracious counsels or their materia circa quam as Gomarus speaks the doctrines of salvation but their form also or the signification from God of these Doctrines in the written Word or in letters or writing And page 39. Yo. Eld. he disputes after his manner dotingly a weak hand best beseeming a wicked work against the written Word If it he impossible saith he to beleeve that the matter of the Scriptures is the Word of God if I be uncertaine whether the written Word be the Word of God or no how came the Patriarchs who lived in the first two thousand yeares of the world to beleeve it since it was uncertaine to them whether such a word should ever be written Here 's more opposed than ink paper viz. the written Word I shall now examine his arguments having briefly premised these following considerations for the further explaining of the question 1. The end of mans creation was to glorifie God and to save his owne soule 2. The right way of Gods Worship and mans salvation could not be found out by the light of nature but there was necessarily required a supernaturall revelation of this way 3. God was therefore pleased to manifest his own will concerning it 4. This he hath done from the foundation of the world diversly after divers manners 5. In the infancy of the Church and while it was contained in narrow bounds God manifested his will without the written Word by dreames visions audible voice c. 6. When the Church was further extended more increased and to be set as a City upon an hill and when impiety abounded in mens lives God commanded this his will formerly revealed to be set downe in writing 7. God did infallibly guide holy men whom he did chuse for his Amanuenses that they did not ●rre in the matter of his will or manner of expressing of it 8. He ordered that his will sh●uld be written in such Languages as were best knowne and underst●od in the Churches unto whom his truths were committed 9. He hath given a charge to his Churches to have recourse to these writings onely to be inforn●ed what were the truths and matters of his will and to try and prove all doctrines by those writings 10. Therefore the onely instrument upon which the Church now can ground their knowledge and beliefe of the truths matters gracious counsels of God revealed for his owne glory and their salvation is the written Word or holy Scriptures These things thus premised I come to your arguments which you are pleased to honour with the name of Demonstrations To prove that the Scriptures are not the foundation of Religion Arg. 1 Yo. El. pag. 32. your first argument is this If Religion was founded built c. before the Scriptures were then cannot the Scripture be the foundation of Religion but Religion was built and founded beso●e c. therefore Answ Eccius Euchiri Tit. 1. Bailius q. 1. Bellar●de verb. dei l. 4. c. 4. Should I tell you that your demonstration if demonstration if must be called is stollen out of Papists in their writings against Protestants it would by you be accounted but a slight charge brasse cannot blush For answer I deny your consequence Though Religion was built and stood firme before the Scriptures were it followes not that the Scriptures now are not the foundation of Christian Religion Though the Scriptures were not alway heretofore the foundation of Religion it followes not but that

they must be now the foundation thereof God teacheth his Church and revealeth his will diversly he hath varied the wayes of his administrations and his will being presupposed the Scriptures are now necessary as a foundation which in former times were not The learned Rivet tels us Rivet ● 1. c. 1. Aliud tempus alios mores postulat Deus pro multiformi su● sapiemia administrationis suae rationem volait variare Consequentias a lversariorum meritò ridemus fuit aliquando Ecclesia cum non esset Scripture ergo he● tempore Ecclesia potest c●rere Scriptura prae suppositâ Dei veluntate nobis necessariam esse Scripturam asserimus Meritò ridemus We account it a ridiculous consequence That because formerly the Church was without the Scriptures therefore now it can want them The same solution doth Gerra●d also make Exeg p. 16. Quia non nisi per Scripturas c. Because God in the businesse of our salvation would not deale with us but by the Scriptures upon this supposition they are now necessary The like saith Whitaker Whitak de perfec Scrip. cap. 7. Partibus olim D●us se familiariter ostendit atque iis per se voluntatem suam patesecit tum Scripturas non fuisse necessarias fate●r at postea mutavit hanc docendae ●● clesiae rationem scribi suam voluntatem v●lait rumnecessarta esse scriptura ●●●pit Alia illorum alia horum temporuam ratio God of old time familiarly made known himselfe to the Fathers and by himselfe manifested to them his will and then I confesse the Scriptures were not necessary but after God did change the way or course of teaching his Church and would have his will written then the Scriptures began to become necessary The materiall object of the faith of those that lived before the Canon was put into writing was the same with ours they built their faith upon Christ they beleeved the same truths for salvation but the formall object of their faith or the ground of beleeving those truths differed from ours in the manner of its dispensation Di●ine ●e●elation was the foundation and ground of their faith and is of ours also but divine revelation was afforded to them afone manner and to us after another God hath spoken in divers manners Heb. 1.1 The authority of the revelation is alwaies the same the way of making that revelation hath frequently been different sometimes immediately by visions a lively voice c. at other times by writing as now in these latter times upon which consideration I flatly deny that because their Religion stood firme before the Word was written or before God revealed his will in writing therefore our religion is not built upon revelation of God in writing concluding my answer with that excellent passage of Tilenus Syntag. Disp 2. Licet plane eadem sint quae olim voce qu●que deinceps scripto fuerunt tradida 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tamen fidei nostrae 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 scriptis duntaxat nititur Although the things which were formerly delivered by voice were altogether the same with the things asterward delivered in writing yet the certainty of our faith only depends upon writings Your second Argument to prove that the Scriptures are not the foundation of Religion Arg. 2 is because The foundation of Religion is imperishable even as is the Church you fay which is built upon it now you say any booke and all books whatsoever and consequently the Scriptures we perishable therefore no books and consequently not the Scriptures are this foundation If Master Jenkins Bible be the form 〈◊〉 of his Religi●n then is his Religion no such treasure but that thi●ces may breake through and steale it from him 〈◊〉 bearing that Plat● had given the definition of a man that he was a living creature with tw● feet with●et feathers gets a 〈…〉 off all his feathers while he was alice and throws him in among some of Plato's 〈◊〉 wishing them to behold their Master ●ato his man If some such odde conceited fellow should use means to get Master Jenkins ●ible and having defaced rent and torne it should cast it into the midst of his auditors and say Ecce fundamentum Religionis Jenkinianae I chold the foundation of your Master Jonkin it might prove a more offectuall conviction unto him of his folly than seven demonsirative reasons c. You say the foundation of Religion is as the Church unperishable This position Answ if you understand of a simple and absolute unperishablenesse I deny for though both Church and Scriptures upon which the Church is built be unperishable exhypothest divinae providentie in regard of Gods providence which he hath promised shall preserve the Scriptures and Church yet of themselves they might perish It was possible in it selfe that Christs leggs as well as the leggs of the thieves might have been broken but Gods pleasure presupposed it was altogether impossible As for your arguing from the tearing of my Bible to the abolishing of the Scriptures you shew your self as good as your word for this is one of the arguments which you bring to the shame of those that charge this errour upon you my self among sundry others being ashamed of your child shnesse herein have you any such ground of assurance from God that any one particular Bible shall not be burnt as you have that his written Word shall not be utterly removed from his Church or can the perishing of my Bible prove that God will suffer the Scriptures to be utterly taken away Reverend Mr. Bifield upon the first of Peter ver 25. p. 506. will tell you though this or that patticular Bible may be destroyed yet that the Word abideth for ever in the very writings of it If all the power on earth saith he should make war against the very paper of the Scriptures they cannot destroy it but the word of God written will be to be had still It is easier to destroy heaven and earth than to destroy the Bible So he you say the Scriptures are as imperishable as the Church but can you conclude because the Church in it self may faile and may cease in this or that particular place therefore that it may be overthrown in all parts and places of the world And therefore for that contemptible because profane scoffe of Platoe's man or a living creature with two feet without feathers had you added one accident more that he is animal latis unguibus it would more properly have belonged to your self than animal rationale your nayles being much sharper than your arguments a fit cock for such a cock-pit as you game in Your third argument is Arg. 3 That if any books called the Scripture be the foundation of Religion then may Religion be said to have been founded by men It would be to no purpose haply to tell you that this is a popish cavill Answ however to the Reader it may not be unprofitable to know so