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truth_n	church_n	faith_n	point_n	4,685	5	7.0514	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A17572	A defence of our arguments against kneeling in the act of receiving the sacramentall elements of bread and wine impugned by Mr. Michelsone	Calderwood, David, 1575-1650.	1620 (1620)	STC 4354; ESTC S120683	45,714	80

read that the blesser kneeled down before that creature vvhen he blessed but rather behaved himself as superior unto it vvhether ● vvas meat or drink or any thing els ● know not one instance to the contrary in ● the Scripture Put the case there were y● after the meat was blessed and sanctified t● our common use in the taking eating drinking what people never so barborous did ever kneele See more of this eighth Argument in the two former Treatises Defence of our ninth Argument VVEE say that we should eschew all shew of conformitie with the Papists and idolators But kneeling in the act of receiving the sacramentall elements we are in shew conforme to the Papists He telleth us that we are conforme with them in many Articles of our faith we and they agree in many points of doctrine● but therein we are conforme to the truth and true Apostolicall Church They possesse some points of truth which we doe as a theife doth a true mans purse or a Pi●ate the ship of an honest Marchant He ●aith they kneele for one end and the Pa●ist for another It is not the end but the ●ite not identitie but likenesse wherof we ●re now speaking If Christians had decked their houses with Laurell and greene ●oughes upon the festivall dayes wheron the Pagans decked theirs against the 73. Canon of the Councell of Bracara how●eit there had bene no intention to honour the gods of the Pagans yet they could not ●ave bene excused because they decked their ●ouses after the same manner and at the ●●ne time We might bring in a multitude of Iewish and Popish Rites if the different intention might be a sufficient warrant for us God made his people as unlike the idolatrous Nations as might be And so should we be as remote from all Papisticall ceremonies as may be P. Martyr in an Epistle to the Polonians sayth that rite in the administration of the Sacraments is to be embraced which is most of all and furthest removed from Papisticall toyes and ceremonies and commeth neerest to that puritie which Christ and his Apostles used Further we differ not in one generall end to wit adoration but we misapply that which they do For they are employed about their God as they think when they are taking eating and drinking And the Formalist is employed about bread and wine consecrate to an holy use which are meere creatures even in his own conceit It is conformity with all the true worshippers o● God to kneele in prayer but not to kneele before the sacramentall elements Defence of our tenth Argument WEE say that kneeling in the act o● receiving the sacramentall elements suppose it had bene indifferent or lawfull at the first invention of 〈◊〉 yet seeing it hath bene abused and polluted with the vilest idolatry that ●ver was it ought to be removed and no monumen● thereof left farre lesse should it be restored where it hath bene out of use these threescore yeares by past and cast away as a menstruous cloath He telleth us that the Ark was in the Philistimes hands that the gold brasse and Iron of Iericho was taken into the Lords treasure and other like instances The Arke was Gods own ordinance The silver the gold the brasse were not idolatrous but the civill goods of idolaters What God hath instituted the abuse of men cannot take away What belongeth to the idolater not being idolatrous not having state in the idolatrous service if it may serve to some necessary and profitable use may be retained the abuses being purged But kneeling hath state in Gods service and both had and hath state in idolatrous service and is of no necessary use When we say that Ezekiah brake the brazen Serpent in peeces howbeit it was Gods own appointed signe and reserved for a monument of his mercy 700. yeeres and that kneeling was not appointed of God He telleth us we are not bound to imitate the fact of Ezechias in the particular circumstances It is not from the breaking of it in peeces or the manner of abolishing it in particular that we do reason but from the abolishing of it in generall So that kneeling be abolished and altogether removed out of that place of divine service we shall not contend for the different manner He saith the use of the brasen Serpēt ceased The use wherefore it was first instituted ceased but the other use to be a monument of Gods mercy ceased not and might have continued longer if it had not beene abused He saith kneeling shall have a profitable use so long as the world standeth True but not kneeling before the elements of the Sacrament in the act of receiving He saith Ezekiah brake the Idoll but reserved the burning of Incense to God So they have broken in peeces the idoll of Reall presence but reserved kneeling to Christ. But we say that he abolished the burning of Incense not simply for it was a part of Gods service but burning of Incense before the brasen Serpent So we crave not kneeling simply to be abolished but kneeling before the elements in the act of receiving Defence of our eleventh Argument KNeeling in the act of receiving is dangerous being an occasion and provocation to idolatry He sayth we called it before idolatry and now onely an occasion or provocation to it We call it so now in a new argument first giving and not granting that it were not idolatry Next we say it is dangerous because it is a provocation to another kinde of idolatry beside that we spake of before to wit the grossest sort of worshipping the transubstantiated bread or Christ bodily present He sayth we are prone to prophannesse as well as idolatry But we should not give dangerous provocations either to the one or to the other He sayth the Belgick Kirks making a Canon against kneeling for feare of bread worship feared where there was no need of feare for it hath been used in the Kirk of England without any such danger Mr. Cartwrights report in a matter of fact will get credit even with his adversaries He sayth That in divers places the people have knocked on their breasts and holden up their hands whilest the Minister was in giving of it and not onely those who received it but also those who looked on and were in the Kirk Peter Martyr after the revolt of England in Queen Maries dayes writing to the Polonian Ministers a Let the evill seed and rotten roots be plucked up at the first beginning for if they be neglected at the first I know what I speak they are more hard to be taken away afterward And this is to be seen unto as in the sacraments so specially in the Eucharist that it be most sincerely done For there are there beleeve me pestilent seeds of ●dolatry which except they bee taken away the Church of Christ will never be beautified with pure and sincere worship Let not the sacraments be con●emned as empty and voyd signes

kneeling intendeth to adore Christ bodily present by transubstantiation The Lutheran by consubstantiation The chiefest of our opposites will not have us to be curious to understand the manner of Christs presence For sayth Hooker All things considered and compared with that successe which truth hath hitherto had by so bitter conflicts with errors in this poynt shall I wish that men would more give themselves to meditate with silence what we have by the sacrament and lesse to dispute of the manner how The Bishop of Rochester commendeth the simplicity of the ancients who disputed not whether Christ were present Con sub in or trans in the supper What is this but to permit every man to adore upon what intention he pleaseth But let the formalist be as free as may be both of the Popish and Lutheran conceit yet he is guilty of Idolatry two wayes First in that hee kneeleth by direction before a creature Next in that he doth kneele for reverence of the sacrament As for the first suppose it were true that they kneeled not for reverence of the symbols yet there is no difference betwixt them and the more tollerable sort of Idolaters Durandus Holcot Alphonsus Mirandula and the rest in their worshipping of Images The Doctor sayth here and againe pag. 55. that they worship not Christ in the bread nor by the bread nor the bread it selfe but directeth the worship of their hearts and bodies immediatly to Christ in the heaven So sayth that finer sort of Papists that the cruc●fix or any other image is not either the materiall or formall the totall or partiall object of their adoration but that they direct immediatly their worship to Christ or the Saint He bringeth in Martyr pag 74. saying For there both by words and visible signes we are stirred up both to acknowledge and to worship Christ himselfe So sayth Swarez that the image is not in their opinion objectum quod the object of their adoration but onely at the presence and sight of the image the person represented by the image is called to remembrance that the image is an occasion a mean and signe stirring up a man to adore the principall person represented and that before it he worshipeth the principall after the same manner as if he were present For to direct worship by the image is in their sence no other thing but to direct it immediatly to the principall before the image as Bellarmine declareth The ●●mboles are then to the kneeler objectum a quo s●●nificative sayth Doctor Morton a signifying object to move the heart and consequently the body to adoration No more is the image to these Papists and their adoration is as abstract from their object as the kneeler is from his But sayth the Doctor there is difference betwixt images and the sacramentall symbols The first are the invention of men and forbidden to be used in the worship of God the other are Gods own ordinance and commanded to be used in his worship and cōfirmeth this his saying with the testimonies of Martyr which needed not For we deny not that they are commanded to be used in Gods worship as the worship of God is taken in a large sense for his publick worship and all the parts therof the preaching of the word ministration of the sacraments c. But they were not commanded to be used in the worship of God as it is taken in a strict sence in statu accommodato ad adorationem for adoration properly so called to fall down before them and worship Christ absent The force of this argument must be this Whatsoever thing God hath commanded to be used in his publick worship we may lawfully fal down before it and worship God by way of adoration properly so called The sacramentall symbols are commanded to bee used in Gods publick worship Therefore we may fall down before them and worship God The weaknes of this argument is seen in the proposition which I hope they will not maintaine If the Iewes had fallen before every significant object commanded by God to be used in time of divine service they had continually committed Idolatry P. Martyr professing in Oxford at that time when kneeling was enjoyned to pacifie the Papists somewhat who had made some stirres pretending that the Sacrament was prophaned was loath being a stranger to contradict the prescribed order and his great friends who called him to that place He was forced afterward to defend what he had written before and through the importunity of Gardiner his adversarie was driven to plaister the English adoration with such speeches as cannot be well allowed But even then when hee was excusing he was wishing it were not and was ever warning them of the danger of it and l●st after the experience of the miserable revolt of England he uttered his minde very freely in an Epistle to the Polonians His testimonies shall be cited in the own place howbeit in a part some of them be already cited in the answer to Doct. Resolu●us and therefore I proceed When we alledge a principle out of Perkins That und●● the new Testament it is idolatrie to direct our worship to any creature or place and in speciall to the bread on the Altar or in the hand of the Minister he granteth that Paraeus saith in effect as much But saith he they speak against the Papists And so much the worse say I if others be guilty of the like fault It is Papistrie Superstition and Idolatrie against which they write wheresoever it be And it is Papist●y Superstition and Idolatry whereunto at this present wee oppose our selves He ●aith that ●●elcatius writeth that Christ is to be ●●●●ed in the Mysteries But doth hee not tell how To wit that the eyes of our faith are ●o be lifted up to heaven and the same say we and do more often inculcat● the same then our opposites What is this to the prostrating of our bodies whereof T●●lcatius did not dreame He saith they k●●●l● not as the Papist doth when the bread is carried in procession or at the elevation but when they receive the bread when as it is notoir that they kneele a long space before they receive But let it be so that they kneele onely when they receive do they not kneele before it when they receive it What matter of the length or shortn●●se of the time or the act of receiving If it be unlawfull at any time even for a moment or in any act God never ordained that any act of his service should be performed with any sinne but rather in case there lay such a necessity on a man that he cannot performe service to him without sinne that he should omit his service For God will not accept of sinne in no case Next why will they make scruple to kneele at the elevation seeing it is then consecrated it is objectum a quo significative it is in the ministration of the Mysteries in the time of