TO THAT QVESTION SO often and so insultingly proposed by our Aduersaries asking vs Where this our Religion was before Luthers time IT is a common question and often propounded by Papists in an insulting manner ouer vs Where our Religion was before Luthers time As though wee could not answere to the demand nor fetch our Religion from any more ancient or better Author but they are deceiued in both And that I may not be tedious in prefacing I answer I. It was and is written and contained in the holy Scriptures the Canonicall Books of the old and new Testament II. The same hath been and is written in the hearts of Gods people such as the Lord from time to time effectually hath called according to euerie mans measure as they haue bin taught it and learned it out of those books of holy Scripture For this must we know that no other doctrine of Christian Religion was or is written in mens hearts by Gods Spirit then that which the same Spirit inspired the Pen-men of the Scriptures to write in those Bookes The necessarie truths of doctrine therein contained as God had promised hath he written in the hearts of his people Ier. 31.33 34. 2. Cor. 3.3 And for these ends that they might know God and know him to be their God and they his people Ier. 31.33 34. that they might make profession thereof and obediently set themselues to the practice of that his blessed will Ezech. 11.19 20. 36.26 27. III. That it was also written in learned mens labours agreeing with those holy Bookes as they found the truth therein taught vnto them by the Prophets and Apostles So as the doctrine of our Religion is no other then that which the Scriptures doe teach the Church and true People of God haue beleeued and professed nor no other then that which is to be found in the writings of y e holy ancient Fathers and of learned men before euer Luther was borne That our Religion was thus before Luthers time I proue by these ensuing reasons I. Argument From holy Scriptures wherein our Religion is written and taught in euery point THat Religion which is in all and euerie point thereof written and prescribed in holy Scriptures the Canonical books of the old and new Testament was before Luthers time For the Scriptures were written many hundred yeeres before Luther was in beeing and the Pen-men thereof had a care to practise the same But this our present Religion in all and euerie point thereof wherein we differ from our Aduersaries is written and prescribed in the holy Scriptures the Canonicall bookes of the old and new Testament as is in euery particular point prooued exactly by those of our side And therefore was it before Luthers time The Minor I thus prooue I. By the publike Records of our Church here at home as the publike authorized Catechisme shorter and larger by the booke of Homilies by the book of Articles and our booke of Common-prayer Out of which wherein soeuer we differ from our Aduersaries nothing is found besides as wanting warrant of Scripture much lesse any thing contrarie thereunto but euery thing grounded vpon and fully agreeing with the same II. By Gods Spirit the Author of the Scriptures which doth further our Religion in the hearts of the people through the reading and interpreting thereof which the Spirit of God would not doe if our Religion were not that which the Scriptures teach For would the Author of the one approue of the other if they were not both one If hee should further a Religion contrarie to the Scripture hee should be contrary to himselfe allowing and making good that in mens hearts by inward operation which he hath disallowed by the Scriptures which are of his diuine inspiration It is euident to all that are read in the Scriptures that they condemne all Heathenish al Heretical and Idolatrous Religion likewise all will-worship all vaine inuentions of men the seruing of God by humane traditions by the precepts and doctrines of men so as if our Religion were any such Gods Spirit would not grace it nor so knit mens harts vnto it nor so effectually worke by it in mens consciences nor so perswade vnto it as he daily doth by the Scriptures If they shall denie that Gods Spirit doth any such thing as we suppose I would faine know of them what other spirit it possibly may be that doth so leade men to esteeme so much the Scriptures doth excite men to the studie of them and to make them the onely rule of doctrine and life to heare belieue rest and delight in them and so to worship God onely as herein he requireth to be worshipped and to reiect whatsoeuer is not warranted by them in euery necessarie point of faith And that onely vpon this perswasion that the Scriptures are Gods word that they are endited by his Spirit and written by his holy Prophets and Apostles If this be not the Spirit of God which doth thus magnifie the holy Scriptures in the heart of euery sound Christian what spirit then is it Certainely it must bee either the Spirit of God or of Man or of the Deuill But neither of these two latter therefore the former I. It is not the spirit of man that can and doth thus worke for first the spirit of man perceiueth not the things of God till Gods Spirit acquaint him with them Secondly they be foolishnesse vnto him Thirdly his wisdome is enmitie with God so as Gods wisdome in diuine mysteries and mans wisdome can neuer agree in one Fourthly the spirit of man sauoureth the things of the flesh and not of the Spirit of God Fifthly his heart is continually euil till he be regenerate Sixthly and lastly it is euidently knowne by too much miserable experience that man loueth not the studie of the Scriptures he cannot delight in them hee cannot away to frame his life after them euery one that hath any sparke of diuine knowledge knoweth this to bee true from his owne naturall corruption both in himselfe and others also Now can any reasonable-minded man thinke that such an auerse spirit as is in man so disaffecting the holy Scriptures and the studie thereof that it can be that Spirit which perswadeth and draweth men contrary to it corrupt selfe to embrace that Religion which is grounded vpon the Scriptures and to presse to the obedience thereof Yea can it bee mans spirit that worketh loue to such a Religion which so opposeth mans corruption as the worldly wise Politician derideth it the pleasurable man hateth it the greedy of gaine cannot abide to bee ruled by it and the haughtie spirit which hunteth after the pride of life hath it in great contempt so as none in very deed but onely such as doe denie themselues doe forsake the world and can bee well contented to take vp their crosse and follow Christ either can or will embrace the same II. It is not the spirit of Satan For although hee
lawfull and free generall Councell which the Conuenticle of Trent was not till then we are not to be condemned of obstinacy and so as yet no Heretikes Thirdly we neither haue neglected nor yet doe neglect the true Catholike Churches authority into which wee are receiued by Baptisme For we very willingly desire to heare her sentence but where can that bee except in a generall Councels determination therein to heare the Catholike Church speaking to vs from the Scriptures we greatly long for we readily submit vnto Let her thus speak that we may know her Iudgement and we will hearken thereunto As for the Church of Romes authoritie we doe not acknowledge it ouer vs because it is not nor euer was in her best estate the Catholike Church but onely a particular Church which now also is a party questioned And therfore her authoritie for her selfe against vs is no more of vs to be regarded then by them our Churches authority for her selfe against them Seeing then that by their definition wee are not conuinced of heresie wee are not out of the Church as Heretikes II. Not as Schismatikes For albeit we haue no departed from this Romish Church yet are we no Schismatikes First for that we keepe communion with the Catholike Church into which we by Baptisme were admitted which is the body of Christ and wee truly members thereof in faith and loue through the worke of Gods Spirit being built vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets Iesus Christ himselfe being the Corner-stone Secondly because this Church of Rome hath falne from the faith and obedience commended by S. Paul to be in the Church at Rome in his time as appeareth in many particulars before named which the Church first planted at Rome neuer taught neuer beleeued nor practised Therefore are we no Schismatikes for leauing her in those things wherein she hath left the true and Apostolike Church at the beginning Thirdly for that wee doe not breake off from her simply but in some respect that is as farre foorth as she hath forsaken her former selfe so that if shee would returne to the Catholike Faith and Religion and forsake her Trentisme Iesuitisme and Popery the inuentions of her owne added to that which first she did professe wee want not charitie towards her to vnite our selues vnto her againe For otherwise neither our true loue to God nor true loue to his Church will suffer vs to liue with her so defiled as she is in the spirituall bond of sacred loue which knits the true members of Christ one to another Heauenly charity which maketh this vnitie admitteth not of such things into the vnitie of faith as bee taught and practised in that Church both sinfull against God and pernicious to mens soules yea vtter destruction to them without hearty repentance Fourthly wee haue a warrant yea a commandement from God to separate our selues from her for that she is become the great Whore and spirituall Babylon Reuel 18.4 This charge of God freeth vs from Schisme for there is no sin no Schisme in that which God commandeth to be done Fifthly we by leauing this Romish Church doe not deuide our selues from the true Catholike and Apostolike Church but by this separation doe we indeed returne to the vnitie of it and to our first blessed estate therein when first the Gospell was here planted in this Iland by Apostles or Apostolicall men which came hither not from Rome but from Ierusalem our Mother Church where the Lord and his blessed Apostles first began to teach and erect a Church which is the Church we returne vnto in doctrine and worship of God from which Holy Catholike and Apostolike Church wee were drawne by the vsurping and tyrannical power and iurisdiction of the Pope and his faction and the generall backsliding of this his Church So as this which they call Schisme is no Schisme in vs but a forsaking of schisme in them and is only a returning vnto and a recouerie of our selues againe to our former vnion with Christs true Church beginning at Ierusalem and planted here many hundred yeeres before the Monke Austin euer came into England Sixthly They are properly called Schismatikes saith Aquinas which of their owne accord and will separate themselues from the vnitie of the Church If this be true in the iudgement of this their owne so greatly honoured Doctor then certainely wee are no Schismatikes First of our owne accord and will we make not a separation but are inforced therto by the power of Gods commandement to come out of this Babylon to auoyde her sinnes to escape thereby her punishments She her selfe hath caused deuision and offences contrary to the doctrine which shee once receiued as the Epistles of S. Paul and S. Peter do in many particulars witnesse against her The Apostle S. Paul therefore wils vs to auoyde her and such as cause deuision and offences contrary to the Apostles doctrine Rom. 16.17 It may seeme from hence that a faction begun euen then among you Secondly we doe not separate from the Church that is from the vniuersall Catholike Church but from a Church that is the particular Church of Rome for Thomas doth not say He is a Schismatike which separateth from a Church but from the vnitie of the Church to wit the Church vniuersall which is but one For indeed no reason can bee giuen why any should deuide themselues from the true Catholike Church but good reasons may be giuen why a particular Church may be and ought to bee forsaken as wee doe giue for our departing from the Church of Rome for we are commanded to forsake Idolaters 1. Cor. 5.11 Heretikes Tit. 3.10 such as bring not the doctrine of Christ and doe not abide therein 2. Ioh. 10. and her that is called Babylon Reuel 18.4 Thirdly before we can be Schismatikes we must forsake the vnitie of the Church Now wherein stands this vnitie Standeth it only in affection of loue or also in the faith of the truth For both these graces the Apostle commendeth the Churches Ephes 1.15 2. Thes 1.3 and faith is preferred to the first place in both Scriptures We haue not forsaken the vnitie of the Faith of which S. Paul speakes Eph 4.13 For we teach the doctrine of the Apostles and no other in any thing when we differ from this present Church of Rome which hath lost her first faith of truth in many things Now can true diuine loue be there kept where faith is lost or can there be charitie to vnite where doctrine doth deuide Can light and darkenesse truth and falsehood cohabite in loue Truth and loue onely dwell together and for truths sake loue separateth from falshood wheresoeuer she finds it And therefore except they can proue that we haue lost the vnitie of faith wee haue not forsaken the vnitie of the Church in loue as the former reasons shew To conclude were the Priests and Leuites Schismatikes which left
Pet. 1.19 So is there here with vs the free vse of the Scriptures this wee commend to all sorts forbid them to none but rather hold them most religious who delight in the holy and reuerent studie of the Scriptures according to the practice of the ancient Primitiue Church in the Apostles dayes V. Then were there publike Assemblies where they met together 1. Cor. 11.18 19. Acts 1.13 2.46 and that vpon the first day of the weeke Acts 20.7 1. Cor. 16.2 These Assemblies none might forsake but all were mutually to exhort to the frequent vse of them Heb. 10.25 to beware of causing diuisions and offences contrary to the receiued doctrine of the Apostles Rom. 16.17 So haue wee publike Assemblies where wee meete on the first day of the weeke and at other times which all are bound to come vnto and none ought to forsake to preuent diuisions contrarie to the Apostolicall doctrine and to preserue the publike profession and exercise of our Religion VI. Then was there set ouer euery seuerall Assembly and Congregation such as might be able to teach hauing the ouersight of the people and care of their soules Acts 14.23 Tit. 1.5 Acts 20.28 Heb. 13.7 17. 1. Pet. 5.2 3. So is this in our Church a most excellent meanes to vphold our Religion VII Then was God onely worshipped and he onely prayed vnto in those Assemblies not Saints nor Angels nor the Virgin Marie In them prayers were made with one accord Acts 1.14 2.42 4.24 the Word read 1. Thes 5.27 Col 4.16 the Word preached Act. 20.7 the Sacraments administred Act. 2.42 1. Cor. 11.18 20 23 26. and the Lords Supper in both kinds deliuered 1. Cor. 10.16 Collections were also made for the poore 1. Cor. 16.12 and al things were performed to edification in a known tongue 1. Cor. 14. In our Assemblies God is onely worshipped to him onely we make our prayers and neither to Saint nor Angell nor to the Virgin Mary though wee honour them duly as we ought In our Assemblies Prayer is made with one accord the Word read and preached the Sacraments administred and the Lords Supper in both kinds deliuered Almes as need requires giuen to the poore and all done to edification and in a knowne tongue as in the Apostles dayes VIII Then was preached against and forbidden all will-worship though neuer so faire in shew all seruice to God after the doctrine and cōmandements of men Col. 2.20 23. also the worship of Angels Col. 2.18 the worship of Idols 1. Ioh. 5.21 and fellowship with Idolaters 1. Cor. 8.10 and 5.11 2. Cor. 6.14 18. So with vs are forbidden all these things and condemned by our Religion as is euident by our booke of Homilies booke of Articles the publike authorized larger Catechisme and other publike Records yea the forbidding abolishing and preaching against these things is an excellent meanes to vphold the purity of our Religion which in it selfe is so contrary to all will-worship humane inuentions superstition and idolatry IX Then was the exercise of Ecclesiasticall discipline for the preseruation of order for the punishing and casting out of obstinate Heretikes 1. Tim. 1.20 6.3 Tit. 3.10 as also of notorious offenders which would not otherwise bee reformed 1. Cor. 5.7 2. Thes 3.14 and those the people were to auoyd 1. Cor. 5.10 2. Thes 3.6 2. Tim. 3.5 Ephes 5.7 This godly discipline duly obserued is of great force to preserue our Religion and to keepe it in honour and estimation X. Then was there vrging and pressing to a holy conuersation both in Pastors Tit. 2.7 8. 1. Tim. 4.12 and in the people Rom. 12.1 2. Eph. 5. 6. This Christian-like conuersation adorneth our Religion which is onely powerfull in them which liue well for it condemneth all Libertinisme and requireth very strict obedience to God and his Word XI Then was suffering of persecution for the truth and the same foretold to accompany the godly Acts 14.22 1. Thes 3.3 2. Tim. 3.12 1.8 Phil. 1.19 which greatly furthered Religion taught by the Apostles Phil. 1.12 And so hath it done ours in these parts of Christendome as the World knoweth XII Then was taught subiection both of Pastors and people vnto Principalities and Powers as to Kings so to inferiour Magistrates sent by them All sorts without exception were taught obedience to them and for conscience sake were they bound to render to them dues tribute custome honour They were commanded to make prayers for them with thanksgiuing which was a meanes to further Religion for the Apostle telleth them that thus to doe is well-doing and a meanes to stop the mouthes of the Aduersaries that so they might leade a quiet and peaceable life in al godlinesse and honestie Rom. 13.1 7. T it 3.1 1. Pet. 2.13 17. 1. Tim. 2.1 2. This is hath bin an excellent meanes to aduance our Religion for Kings and Princes seeing that our true and Apostolicall Religion did not derogate from their lawfull authoritie did not draw subiects from their allegeance nor exempt any from their true obedience but rather maintained the right which God by his holy Word in Scriptures had giuen them they submitted to the truth and embraced our Religion shaking off the yoake of Antichrist and so tooke vpon them the authoritie giuen them of God to reforme Religion according as they were taught and had learned the doctrine of Christ in the Scriptures Thus wee see first the ordinarie meanes which the holy Scriptures prescribe and euidently shew to haue been vsed in the Primitiue Church for the planting and vpholding of Christian Religion And secondly that the very selfe-same haue been and yet are the meanes for planting and preseruing of our Religion in euery Country where it hath been receiued Which meanes are so powerfull and effectuall for this purpose that looke by how much these meanes are put in execution by so much doth our Religion prosper in spite of all worldly oppositions and gaine-sayings whatsoeuer and on the contrarie looke as these meanes either wholly or but in part are neglected or faile to bee performed so doth our Religion lose of its strength and decay amongst the people what policie soeuer men otherwise vse to vphold the same For our Religion stands by holy and heauenly meanes and not by meere worldly policie or humane deuices faire shewes to the eyes delights to the eare pleasurable obiects to delight the carnally-minded Neither can it be held by any Satanicall delusions fabulous narrations feigned miracles deceitfull iugglings nor by pretended apparitions of Angels or of soules departed nor by the bare authoritie of mens sayings Decrees of corrupt Councels Popes sentences wrangling Canonists Sophisticall distinctions of Schoolemen humane Traditions Apocryphall writings old and idle customes examples of ignorant forefathers estimation of mens persons for learning and shew of holinesse nor by any deceitfull wicked and corrupt dealing as by counterfeite and bastard writings corrupting of Councels and Fathers expunging words and
yeeres after Christ in which space was there none that might be called a Papist or Roman Catholike after the definition of the Trentists And therefore were they not their Martyrs neither did any of them professe the now new Romane Trentisme And thus wee see how by these differences they cannot claime the Martyrs Now our differences from them are all grounded vpon Scriptures and principles of Christianity and warranted by such common truth of Christian Religion as they and we doe fully accord in not one of our differences being either heresie or any part of Iudaisme or Paganisme nor euer condemned by any generall Councell in the space of these first sixe hundreds of yeeres in which these three sorts of Martyrs did liue True it is that our aduersaries call vs Heretikes and lay heresies to our charge but falsely without iust proose as our learned Whitacres Bishop Morton and others shew in answering Bellarmine his calumnies herein to the full Seeing then our differences and truths of Christian Religion taught by the Apostles and by the succeeding Pastors and belieued by the Church are the parts of that Faith and Religion which these Martyrs suffered for I conclude that in regard both of the truthes wherein wee and our Aduersaries agree and also of our differences wherein we disagree from the now present Church of Rome they were our Martyrs and none of theirs IV. Sort of Martyrs are those who suffered by and amongst these our aduersaries as the Berengarians Waldenses Albigenses Wicklife and his followers in England Iohn Hus and Ierome of Prague at Constance and many moe in Bohemia and in other places euen to Luthers time and after an innumerable multitude slaine and massacred burnt and put to sundry deathes for our Religion and for gaine-saying our aduersaries in those differences which we now stand out in against the Church of Rome at this present These were therefore our Martyrs But our aduersaries will say that these were no Martyrs but condemned Heretikes That they were Martyrs no Heretikes its cleare S. Iohn in the Reuelation calleth those Saints and Martyrs of Iesus Reuel 17.6 which should suffer for the Word of God for refusing to worship the Beast and his Image and for not receiuing his marke in their fore-heads or in their hands Reuel 20.4 and for keeping the Commandements of God and the faith of Iesus and so dying in the Lord should rest from their labours and be accounted blessed Reuel 14.12 13. But such were these our Martyrs for they suffered for Gods Word for keeping the Commandements and Faith of Iesus and for refusing to worship the Beast and Whore of Rome drunke with the blood of the Saints And therefore were blessed Martyrs and no Heretikes But they will say These held diuers errours and were not in all things wholly with vs They suffered and were Martyrs for those selfe-same things which with vs they witnessed against the Church of Rome II. Many errours are ascribed vnto them which they neuer held as Doctor Vsher Bishop of Meeth learnedly shewes III. Though in some things they should haue differed from vs yet doth not that make them not to be of our Religion For if for lighter differences in opinions men should be held not to be of the same Religion if so our aduersaries will conclude then are the now Romanists not of one and the same Religion which is now professed at Rome for one of them differs much from another in many things Neither haue they any right to the ancient Fathers betweene whom and these our aduersaries is also great difference and that in many things These Martyrs therefore though they might differ from vs in some things the Light then not shining so clearely as now it doth were our Martyrs Thus wee see all the Martyrs from the beginning to be ours and so haue our Aduersaries none at all which may be properly called theirs for the first 600. yeeres For if they claime the first three sorts it s but as they doe agree with vs for in their differences from vs the Martyrs are none of theirs The fourth sort are clearely our owne and are Martyrs in defence of our differences from them But for their differences they haue no Mrrtyrs of Iesus for such Martyrs as be his Martyrs suffer for his sake for Gods Word for his Faith and Commandements but their differences are not Gods Word nor the Faith nor Commandements of Iesus neither suffered Papists here for Religion but for treason rebellion disloyall acts for denying due obedience to lawfull authority and for standing in defence of forraine power and the authority of the Whore of Babylon the murtherer of Saints and of that Antichrist the Pope as hee is prooued sufficiently so to bee And therefore I conclude our Religion to be before Luthers time III. Argument From the Writings of the ancient Fathers THat Religion which is to be found in the writings of the ancient Fathers as professed and taught by them in the first 600. yeeres after Christ that was before Luthers time But this our present Religion in the poynts of doctrine wherin we differ from our Aduersaries is to be found in the writings of the ancient Fathers as professed and taught by them in the first 600. yeeres after Christ Therefore was this our present Religion in the poynts of doctrine wherein wee differ from our Aduersaries before Luthers time The Minor I thus prooue All the differing Religions of greatest note which were euer since Christs ascension are one of these Iudaisme Gentilisme or Paganisme Arianisme vnder which I comprehend all heresies Mahometisme or Turcisme the present Religion of the Church of Rome which may be called Trentisme or Iesuitisme commonly called Papistrie and this our Religion termed The reformed Religion or Protestancy which wee professe and teach with an vnanime consent in the Harmonie of Confessions otherwise then the Church of Rome now doth But those ancient Fathers taught not Iudaisme nor Paganisme nor Arianisme or other heresies which in those dayes rose vp nor Mahometisme Ergo either the Religion of the now Church of Rome or ours with either of our differences one from another But not so this of theirs For those differences on their part whereby a man becommeth a Romane Catholike or Papist the ancient Fathers with one consent neuer taught The differences are mentioned before for all which if they can produce the vnanime Consent of those Fathers in 600. yeeres space we yeeld them the Fathers but if not then are they ours as they that taught and professed our Religion For they not onely taught all the maine poynts of faith which we and our aduersaries doe agree in but also all the principall differences with vs wherein we and our aduersaries doe differ as Polanus hath largely prooued to whose learned paines I referre the Reader Therefore this our present Religion was before Luthers time IV. Argument From the witnesse of our very
Aduersaries THat Religion which is to be found in the publike records of the Church of Rome and in the writings of learned men therein from the very first foundation of it vnto this day that was before Luthers time This I hope may passe for current But this our present Religion is such a religion and therfore before Luthers time The Minor if they deny is thus confirmed I. There are amongst them the holy Scriptures which they acknowledge to be the Word of God but by those Scriptures may all our Religion be proued and fully confirmed in any thing wherein we differ from our aduersaries And therefore this our Religion is to be found among them II. There is that which is called The Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed which they professe the Articles whereof we hold and therein is contained the summe of our Faith III. There is the Lords Prayer the paterne of all true Prayers according to which onely we teach how to pray aright and thereafter doe frame our prayers IV. There is the Decalogue and ten Commandements which though defectiuely set downe in their Catechismes the second being left out yet are they wholly set downe in their Bibles which ten Commandements are the summe of our morall obedience and of our duties towards God and our neighbours V. They acknowledge the two Sacraments Baptisme and the Lords Supper both which we doe administer VI. There are common tenents of Christianitie which all Christian Churches haue euer held wherein we they doe fully agree VII There is their Seruice Booke wherein though many abominations are to be found yet in other things it iustifieth our Religion and Seruice As may appeare by comparing our Seruice Booke with it out of which ours was for the substance thereof taken Against which they cannot iustly take exception neither are they able to prooue by Gods Word by the ancient Councels and consent of the ancient Fathers any thing Idolatrous Heretical or any way vnlawfull wherein soeuer it differeth from theirs VIII There may also be found their accord in generall termes with vs in those things wherein for the particulars we and they bee at oddes and doe disagree as Master Perkins giueth instance in one and twenty particulars and the like may be done in many other points IX And lastly there is to be found all and euery point of our Religion particularly wherein wee differ from them which either wee affirme or they deny or we denie and they affrme and the same iustified by the writings of the learned amongst them For proofe hereof I referre the Reader to my Lord of Couentrie and Lichfield his Catholike appeale and Catholike Apologie first and second parts to my Lord of Meeth his booke de Chri. Eccles succes statu to Illyricus his Catalog Test Veritatis to Ioh. Ã Munster his Nobilis Discursus to Doct. Feild his fourth booke of the Church who proueth seuen and twenty particulars of our maine differences out of their owne Writers And if the writings of their learned men doe not iustifie our Religion I would know why they doe not suffer such writings to passe without purging For if such things were not for vs and against them they would not put out nor alter nor so indeed corrupt Authors or inhibite them to passe abroad as they doe which one act of theirs sheweth that our differences might bee prooued euen by their owne Writers if they might decide the controuersies betwixt vs and them Thus we see how our Religion is to be found amongst them not onely in the points wherein wee doe agree but euen in all our particular differences in which wee stand out against the preualent faction of that Church which alwaies hath ouer-borne the truth which by others of more sound iudgement in that Church hath been from time to time published and maintained And therefore this our now present Religion was before Luthers time V. Argument From the beginning of our Religion here before Austin the Monke came to this Iland THat Religion which was here in this Iland of Great Britaine before Austin the Monke came into it that was before Luthers time for this Monke came in many hundred of yeeres before Luther was borne But this our present Religion was here in this Iland of Great Britaine before Austin the Monke came into it Therefore was it before Luthers dayes The Minor I thus prooue I. The Christian Religion taught at Ierusalem by the Apostles and other Disciples of Christ was our Religion as by the first Argument is prooued from the Apostles writings But that same Christian Religion was here taught and that either by some Apostle as Simon Zelotes or some Disciple of Christ as Ioseph of Arimathea as some of our side haue prooued fully and our Aduersaries yeeld vs. Now if that which was taught at Ierusalem was ours then must it needs be ours which Simon Zelotes or Ioseph of Arimathea did here teach at the first planting of it being before Austins time for can any say that these brought from Ierusalem hither any other Religion then the Apostles deliuered there II. That same Religion first taught did continue here in succession from the Apostles dayes and was held at Austins comming as our aduersaries the Apologists do proue and doe take this also for an vndoubted truth that the Britaine 's of Wales receiued the faith of Christ by preaching of the Apostles and held that Faith at Austins comming Now the Faith taught by the Apostles being the same with ours as the holy Scriptures beare witnesse against all gaine-sayers it is cleare by the Apologists proofes and their owne acknowledgement of the continuance thereof from the very beginning that this our present Religion was here in this Iland of Great Britaine before Austins comming III. Here were many which suffered Martyrdome in Dioclesians reigne before Austines dayes but it is prooued before in the second Argument that all the Martyrs of Christ were of our Religion And therefore was that our Religion which was here before Austines time IV. Before Austines comming the Church of Christ here was not subiect to the Romish Church for first they kept not their Easter after the Romish fashion but as the Easterne Churches kept it whence our Religion came Now if they had been of the Romanists tutoring the fierie spirit of Victor who attempted to excommunicate the Easterne Churches would haue compelled the Britains to haue kept their Easter as hee did Secondly they administred Baptisme not after the ceremonious fashion of the Romanists Thirdly they refused to doe what Austin required neither would they acknowledge him their Archbishop though sent from Rome by the Bishop there Fourthly both the Britaines Scots and Irish Bishops so vtterly reiected the Romish Bishops as Bishop Daganus denied all communion with them yea and refused to eate bread with them in the same Inne so little regard had they then to the authoritie either of the Romish Church or
Looke beyond Luther OR AN ANSWERE TO THAT QVESTION SO OFTEN AND SO INSVLTINGLY PROPOSED BY our Aduersaries asking vs Where this our Religion was before Luthers time WHERETO ARE ADDED SOVND PROPS TO BEARE vp honest-hearted Protestants that they fall not from their sauing-faith BY RICHARD BERNARD OF Batcombe in Sommersetshire LONDON Imprinted by Felix Kyngston and are to be sold by Edmund Weauer at his shop at the great North-doore of Pauls 1623. TO THE RIGHT WORSHIPFVLL Sir WALTER ERLE Sir CLEMENT COTTEREL KNIGHTS And to their vertuous Ladies euersoundnesse of Faith with the power of Religion and constancie in both most heartie wished Right Worshipfull I Should maruell to see any once professing the truth to turne from the light vnto darkenes from the true Worship and Religion of Christ to the superstition and idolatrie of Antichrist but that I read that our first Parents beleeued Satan before God that men loue darkenesse more then the light and that fornot louing the truth and delighting in vnrighteousnesse God giueth such ouer to beleeue lyes that they may bee damned Could it else otherwise be that so many in this so cleare light of Gods Gospel should fall away What haue our aduersaries now more to pleade for their cause then heretofore they haue had What can they now say which is not alreadie fully answered by our learned men They put out indeed new bookes new in regard of the writing and printing but the reasons one and the same in older written and printed bookes this is in shew a putting of more strength to vphold their ruinous building but not in substance yet thus they beguile the simple and vnstable-minded By many waies they seeke to deceiue and beguile people but especially by accusing our Religion of falshood and nouelty and affirming theirs to bee the true and most ancient faith in both which they speake very vntruely For touching this their present Religion as it differeth from ours and as it is Popery it is but a new vpstart Religion a patcherie of Iudaisme Paganisme and Heresie a Religion deuised by men and not hauing God for the Author How farre our Religion is from falshood and noueltie I haue here indeuoured to shew answering to that question so often propounded Where it was before Luthers time If any of our aduersaries or all of them together dare to goe plainely to worke for hitherto they haue not and first set downe ours and their accord wherein and how farre we and they in euery thing doe agree to cut off hereby all needlesse strife and contentions Secondly then truely and faithfully without equiuocall termes to deliuer their distinct differences from vs that so euery one may rightly discerne whereabout we do contend and what indeede their now present Religion is which we call Popery bing seuered from our common agreement Thirdly to bring these their differences to the due triall of Scriptures the common principles of Christianitie and the true writings of the ancient Fathers in the first Ages then will it clearely appeare to euery one of indifferent iudgement whether ours or theirs be the true Religion and whether ours or theirs be the false Church In the meane space till they proceede thus vprightly and sincerely I hope no Protestant in earnest will be insnared and catched by their deceites Let such as in the plentifull meanes of knowledge wilfully liue in ignorance or hauing knowledge liue lewdly without feare of God loue of truth and power of Religion be the prey for craftie Foxes for these be the fittest subiects for them to worke vpon and these only preuaile they with receiuing a iust punishment for their contempt of sauing knowledge or for their consciencelesse liuing contrary to their knowledge For there is no man of right vnderstanding and that makes conscience of his waies louing the truth walking humbly before his God being acquainted with Gods Word and praying for Gods direction that God either will giue ouer or that can in reason submit vnto this false Antichristian Church if he doe but seriously consider of such things as will worke if not an absolute condemnation yet a most iust suspition of her to be naught as first the vilifying of holy Scriptures locking them vp from the common people as if Gods Word were infectious Secondly her thrusting vpon the people her feigned traditions all besides and many of them against Scripture Thirdly the absurd and vnreasonablenesse of their Latine Seruice which the people vnderstand not Fourthly their idolatrous praying to Saints worshipping stockes and stones and reliques of the dead Fifthly their grosse conceit of Christs corporall presence in the Sacrament Sixthly the feigned miracles and notable coozenages therin found out here and in other Countries the boasting of them a farre off but not able to worke the like among vs. Seuenthly the shamelesse grosse belying of our doctrine and slandring the liues of our learned men as Luther Caluin Beza and others Eighthly the citing in defence of their Religion counterfeit Authors so knowne to be and so condemned to be by the learned on their owne side Ninthly the not permitting freely our bookes among them as wee doe theirs among vs. Tenthly the tying of the people to the Priests lippes and not permitting them to trie their doctrine as we doe The vniust curses dissembling practices and mercilesse cruelties vsed to vphold their Religion swearing for swearing by equiuocations ment all reseruations and Popes dispensations massacres and powder-plots and bloodie persecutions Twelfthly The auoyding of a free generall Councell to heare and determine our differences Who is he that shall consider of these things with iudgement but will suspect this Romish Church to be none of Christs Church if withal he adde hereto the consideration of the differences betweene the wisedome below by which that seate is guided which is earthly naturall sensuall deuilish and the wisdom from aboue by which Christs Church is guided which is pure peaceable gentle easie to be intreated full of mercy and good fruits without partiality and without hypocrisie as Saint Iames writeth I doubt not but that you haue already considered of these premisses and that you are resolued that this is the true Religion and the good way wherein you walke euen the ancient Catholike and Apostolike veritie grounded vpon Scripture and the principles of Christianitie taught by the holy Fathers and Doctors of the Church and confirmed by the blood of blessed Martyrs My desire is that God would continue your loue with encrease of zeale towards the same more and more To this purpose are these my endeuors which I present vnto you praying your fauourable acceptance of my good meaning and hearty wel-wishes and worthie respect vnto your selues and to all that wish well to Sion and pray for the peace of Ierusalem God let them and you with yours to prosper which loue it Amen Your Worships in all Christian seruices to be commanded Richard Bernard Batcombe Sept. 26. Looke beyond Luther OR AN ANSWERE
will abusiuely now and then alleage Scripture yet is he a deadly enemie to the Scriptures he will not leade to the right vse of them nor perswade men to frame their Religion and life after them but rather doth suggest the cleane contrarie as the storie of the Scriptures witnesseth and our owne temptations tell vs. For as a Father saith The Deuill cannot endure to haue any to studie the Scriptures that is torment and paine aboue all paines to him He hath euer been a raiser vp of persecution against such as serue God in a Religion onely grounded vpon the Scriptures as hee was in the Iewes against the Apostles and the beleeuing Gentiles so in Gentiles Infidels against Christians in the Heretikes against the Orthodoxall in our Antichristian Aduersaries against vs and in all lewde liuers the children of disobedience in whom he beareth rule and whose hearts he stirreth vp to doe his will against all such as in a more strict manner endeuour to frame their liues after Gods Word though in general together they professe one God and haue receiued the same Baptisme and doe liue together in the same Church Therefore wee see that it cannot be the spirit of Satan that perswadeth to our so holy a Religion by the Scriptures vpon which onely it is settled seeing he so deadly hateth such a Religion and the sound and zealous Professours thereof III. It is not the spirit of man and Satan together as may appeare first in Heretikes who are led by Satan and their owne spirit These being not able to iustifie their heresies by holy Scripture they fall to weaken the authoritie of the Scriptures they will not rest on them but doe flie the light of them as Tertullian and other ancient Fathers witnesse of Heretikes in their times who left the Scriptures and ran to Traditions as did the Manichees Cerynthians Basilidians Carpocratians Marcionists Valentinians Arians and others Secondly In all will-worshippers which framing a seruice to God out of their owne braines cannot away to make holy Scriptures their guide but doe leaue them assoone as they bee addicted to their owne inuentions of which God by his Prophets in Scripture often complaines Thirdly In Heathen Idolaters who haue been set on worke by the Deuill to burne the Scriptures as did that wicked Dioclesian also here in Brittaine the Infidell Saxons and in Ierusalem that vngodly Iehoiakim who burnt the Prophecie of Ieremiah which Baruch writ from his mouth at that time Fourthly In our Aduersaries now who cannot rest with the Scriptures nor will admit them as the only Iudge in controuersies nor as the onely Rule of Religion And the very reason is because they teach and practise many things out of their owne spirit euen the doctrine of Deuils which the Scripture vtterly condemneth Their Sainted will-worshippers in their Heremeticall life and their world of Monkish Orders cannot abide the rule of Scripture their holy course of life so much admired and extolled yet onely of such as know not the power of Satan in the deceiueable wayes of his vnrighteousnesse dares not stand to be iudged ruled and squared after the rule of holy Scriptures yea as holy as they pretend to bee yet neither can they nor wil they wholly frame their seruice and deuotion and life after the Word of life And therefore we see that it cannot be the spirit of Man and Satan whether apart considered or conioyned that doth perswade mooue and further to the embracing of that Religion which is wholly grounded vpon the Scriptures as ours is And therefore not being either of these it followeth that it must needs bee the Spirit of God that thus perswadeth men to our Religion by the Scriptures wherein it is contained III. Our Religion appeareth to be written in and iustified by the Scriptures for that in those places it getteth entrance and thriueth where they are permitted to be studied and read of all and to be taught as the onely rule of Religion The Scriptures are the very life and strength of our Religion as is sufficiently knowne by experience to our very Aduersaries Now how could this be if our Religion were not that which is taught in the Scriptures For the Scripture as is aforesaid doth condemne Heretikes Heresies will-worship and will-worshippers idolatry and idolaters and is the Sword of the Spirit the breath of Christs mouth that consumeth the Man of Sinne. If our Religion were heresie or wil-worship or idolatrie or the inuention of that Man of sin the Scriptures could not be the life and strength thereof seeing they oppose and vtterly condemne those things IV. Our Religion standeth and is vpheld by such holy and heauenly meanes onely as the Scriptures allow and prescribe and which we find there to bee the onely meanes vsed at the first planting of Christian Religion by the Apostles in the Primitiue Church which were these that follow I. There was then the preaching of Gods Word This meanes was prescribed by our Sauiour Christ to make Disciples vnto him Mat. 28.19 20. and the same obserued by his Apostles Mark 16.15 20. Acts 2.14 10.34 11.19 So preaching of Gods Word is the meanes by which our Religion through Gods blessing is planted in mens hearts As also it was foretold and appointed that it should bee the meanes to regaine people from vnder Antichrist Reuel 10.11 14 6. II. There was the teaching of the grounds and principles of Christianitie then called milke now commonly called the Catechisme Heb. 6.1 5 12. 1. Cor. 3.2 This hath greatly furthered our Religion euen by the testimony of our Aduersaries and is a speciall meanes to informe the minds of the ignorant in the truth of our Religion that they may not be deceiued III. Then was teaching and preaching altogether out of the Scriptures of the Prophets The Apostles taught the Gospell onely out of them Rom. 1.2 Acts 26.22 28.23 the Scriptures they cited Acts 1.16 2.16 17. by them they confuted the Aduersaries Acts 17.2 18.28 So our teaching and preaching is out of the Scriptures of the Prophets and Apostles by these we confirme our doctrine and by these chiefely doe we confute our Aduersaries IV. Then was allowed the vse of the holy Scriptures indifferently to all sorts without restraint or exception they were free to all of the Laity both men and women The Apostles neuer forbade them to any nor euer reprooued any for reading or studying of them but commended them to all sorts 2. Tim. 3.15 16. 2. Pet. 1.19 20 21. and left it written as a matter worthy prayse in religious men the Eunuch and the Noble Baereans that they read and searched the Scriptures so also in godly women for training vp their children herein Acts 8.30 17.11 2. Tim. 1.5 3.15 Yea Peter whom our Aduersaries make their Rocke in generall telleth all Christian beleeuers that they should do well to take heed thereunto as to a sure Word 2.
Romish Bishops Yea the Centurists and other Protestants haue obserued out of Galfridus that before Austines comming there was here amongst the Britaines the profession of more pure Christianity then that which Austine brought from Rome Its babbled out by our aduersaries that this Austin conuerted this Iland but this is most vntrue for Saint Aidan and Saint Finan were the Lords instruments to gaine many here to Christ Saint Aidan recouered from Paganisme the Kingdome of Northumberland whereunto belonged besides Northumberland it selfe the Lands beyond it vnto Edenborow Frith these Countries Cumberland Westmerland Lancashire Yorkeshire and the Bishopricke of Durham Saint Finan regained not onely Essex and Middlesex but also the large Kingdome of Mercia conuerted first vnto Christianitie which Kingdome did comprehend vnder it these Countries Glostershire Herefordshire Worcestershire Warwickshire Leicestershire Rutlandshire Northamptonshire Lincolneshire Huntingtonshire Bedfordshire Buckingamshire Oxfordshire Staffordshire Darbyshire Shropshire Nottingamshire Cheshire and halfe Hertfordshire These holy men are they which vnder God are to haue the prayse and not Austin who brought some but few in comparison of these to the profession of Christ but withall besmeared them with Romish superstitions And such others as were already Christians hee endeuoured to loade with humane inuentions and vnnecessary ceremonies and was if not the cause yet the occasion of the destruction of many and of the miserable and mercilesse slaughter of the godly Monkes at Bangor to the number of 1200. for that these poore Monkes would not submit to him whom they saw to be too proud and not so humble a man as a man of God ought to haue been V. That this our Religion was here before Austin it may appeare by that publike doctrine of the Church which was taught about the time of Gregory who sent in hither this Austin concerning the blessed Sacrament altogether agreeing with our present doctrine and plainely opposite to the doctrine of the now Church of Rome For in an Homily of the Saxon Tongue appointed to be preached on Easter day throughout euery Church the bread is acknowledged to be naturally corruptible bread and corruptible wine truly Christs body and blood yet not so bodily but spiritually and nothing therein to be vnderstood bodily but all spiritually If this was the publike doctrine so fully herein agreeing with vs so contrary now to the Romish beliefe in their transubstantiated bread for deniall whereof they haue murthered so many and now hold it still so maine an article of their Romane beliefe how can it be otherwise imagined all things also before considered withall but that the Religion then was our religion now and not this of the Church of Rome VI. It cannot be denied if our Religion bee the same which was planted by the Apostles in the Easterne Churches from which our Religion was brought hither as is afore deliuered but that then this our Religion was before Austines time But that ours is the same the Apostles writings written to the Churches shew Secondly an Apostle or some Apostolicall men here taught it Thirdly the writings of the Greeke Fathers for 600. yeres space after Christ which is all the space from Christ to this Austin giue testimonie to our Religion in the maine points thereof as is prooued before in the third argument Fourthly it is euident euen by those things which yet the Churches at this day in those parts doe hold with vs and wherein wee and they agree against the now Romish Religion For the Greekes denie the Popes Supremacie Purgatorie and Prayer for the deliuerance of soules out of it the necessitie of Auricular Confession Meritorious satisfaction of the iustice of God Transubstantiation carued Images and Statues They deny that Saints departed heare our Prayers They administer the Sacraments in both kinds and allow Ministers marriage They mixe not water with wine they vse not vnleauened bread They admit not priuate Masses nor the Circumgestation or Adoration of the Sacrament nor the publike seruice in an vnknowne tongue They teach the assurance of saluation in Christ and renounce the merit of workes All which are opposite to the now Romish Religion and are the truths of our Religion taught by the Apostles and holy ancient Fathers from the beginning in the Easterne Churches wherein they are not falne from that which at first they receiued as they be in some other things which they teach and practise VII The Religion which we professe is the same which was at Rome at the time of the three conuersions of England as they call them and therefore was this our Religion before Austines comming and here professed when hee came in The first conuersion was in the Apostles dayes but in their daies was our religion at Rome as Saint Pauls Epistle written to the Saints there and other of his Epistles declare as also the Epistles of Saint Peter whom they would faine haue to haue been at Rome to which our Religion agreeth wholy and fully wherein soeuer wee now differ from the present doctrine of the Church of Rome Let their writings be Iudge from which our aduersaries haue greatly erred as is euidently prooued in all the maine poynts of the Christian Faith And therefore was it our Religion then professed at Rome and not this new Romish Faith The second Conuersion they make to bee in Eleutherius dayes who wrote as they acknowledge vnto our King here called Lucius If here was any conuersion wrought it was to our Religion and not to the present Romish Trentisme as may be clearely gathered out of that Epistle of Eleutherius and which they doe approue of as written to the same Lucius First Eleutherius there telleth the King that he had receiued the Law and Faith of Christ Secondly as hereby shewing him where this Law and Faith was to bee found he telleth him againe immediatly vpon these former words that he had receiued both the parts of the scriptures Thirdly he so commendeth the Scriptures to the King and his Councell that thence by Gods grace they themselues might take a Law to rule the Kingdome This Bishop did not take vpon him to prescribe them Lawes hee alloweth them being Lay persons as they now speake to meddle with the holy Scriptures and from thence and not from him nor from his Lawes nor from the Lawes of the Romanes to take a Law to liue by This Bishop therefore held the Scripture sufficient for a direction and guide to a whole Kingdome hee held them not so obscure but that the King and his Councell by Gods grace though but young Christians might learne out of them the wil of God how hee would haue a Christian Kingdome gouerned Fourthly this godly Bishop calleth Lucius Gods Vicar in his owne Kingdome and alleageth Scripture to prooue it hee was not then swolne vp with the pride of Antichristian Supremacy nor conceited any temporall power ouer kings as now the Popes doe Lastly hee puts wholly the care of
the people of Israel once the people of God in Dauids and Salomons dayes and many hundred yeeres before when Idolatrie vnder pretence to worship no false but the true God was set vp and they not suffered then to do their office vnto the Lord as their office required If they were not no more are we For why doe we forsake the Romish Church Is it not because she hath set vp a new manner of seruice vnto God new kinds of Priests new Holy-dayes new Sacraments new Orders and will not permit the Lords Seruants and Ministers to do their Offices vnto the Lord as he hath by his written Word prescribed Therefore seeing we are not guiltie of Schisme we are not as Schismatikes out of the Church into which by Baptisme wee are receiued III. Not as excommunicate persons For if we be neither Heretikes nor Schismatikes vpon what other ground will they iudge vs to be proceeded against There are other causes for which men are excommunicate but in this question our aduersaries cannot pleade any such Againe I aske if wee bee excommunicate who hath pronounced the sentence Is it the Romish Church By what authoritie Their Church is not the Catholike Church but only a particular as ours is and it is by vs questioned and therefore in reason it cannot bee both a Partie accused and also a Iudge against vs in her owne cause Thirdly we doe appeale from her vnrighteous iudgement to a lawfull generall Councell where vpon earth our cause is onely to bee heard and decided lawfully Till which time wee for any censure of this Church of Rome doe remaine in the true Church into which by Baptisme wee are admitted out of which as yet we are not lawfully iudged to bee by any lawfull and supreme authoritie as either Heretikes Schismatikes or as excommunicate persons Therefore Christian-harted Reader thou that art a member of the Church of England though thou beest no Romanist assure thy soule that thou art of that Church which is vndoubtedly a member of the True Ancient Catholike and Apostolike Church in which abiding thou maist through the merits of thy blessed Sauiour obtaine eternall life if thou so beleeuing doest demeane thy selfe as it becommeth a good Christian and a Protestant in earnest And for thine owne more certaine assurance and stable abiding let me aduise thee to a few things Haue a care to keepe thy Couenant in thy Baptisme that thou mayst be better perswaded that God keepes his with thee and so to be one of his in the true Church Labour to feare God for it is the beginning of wisdome and the secrets of the Lord are with such as feare him and he will shew them his couenant Psal 25.14 Haue euer a loue of the truth and God will not giue thee ouer to beleeue lyes for this is a iudgement befalling such as loue not the truth beleeue it not but take pleasure in vnrighteousnesse Be a doer of the Word and thou shalt know the doctrine whether it bee of God or no. Beware of affected ignorance and carelesse neglect of knowledge but vse the meanes appointed to attaine vnto it Exercise thy selfe much in prayer beg of God wisdome and hee will giue it thee his Spirit and he will vouchsafe it thee pray against sedition and God will keepe thee frequent the company of such as haue knowledge the feare of God before them the loue of the truth in them and make conscience of their wayes Aske aduice of faithfull Teachers listen not to false Teachers feare to be seduced And further that thou mayst both defend the truth and also be able according to thy measure receiued to resist the aduersaries I. Learne carefully the truthes of God necessarie to saluation set downe in holy Scriptures Such truths are very manifestly and plainely deliuered either in expresse termes or by an vndoubted consequent drawne from thence and all such necessarie points as concerne all are written in the Scriptures as their Bellarmine confesseth With these Scriptures acquaint thy selfe and being an ordinarie Christian doe not trouble thy selfe about obscure places for plaine and easie places will bee sufficient to confirme thy faith in any thing necessarie for thee to beleeue and practize in the way of saluation II. Be well grounded in the Catechisme the parts whereof are the Creed the Lords Prayer the Decalogue and the doctrine of the Sacraments for these are the compendium or short summe of all Christianitie These well vnderstood will furnish thee with reasons to withstand seducers There is not any thing of which they shall speake but the same may be brought to some head in Catechisme as either concerning Faith and so referred to the Creed or concerning Prayer and so referred to the Lords Prayer or concerning obedience and so referred to the Decalogue or ten Commandements or else touching the Sacraments the Seales of our Faith III. Adde to these certaine considerations by which thou mayest defend the truth and ouerthrow falshood as the common law of Nature common reason right vse of senses common experience common equitie common charitie common honestie the witnesse of knowne Martyrs whereto adde the corruption of our nature allowing or disliking of any thing By the plaine euidence of Scripture by the Catechisme and by these considerations mayst thou trie all things which be necessarie for thee to stand vpon If a seducer come to thee and that he will needs deale with thee obserue two things first not to regard what he saith if it be not about necessarie points Secondly see that his confirmation or confutation bee onely by either some or all these three aforenamed to wit plaine Scriptures the parts of the Catechisme and those considerations from whence if hee cannot proue his assertions beleeue him not If he begin to tell thee of Councels ancient Fathers and the Churches custome in all Ages answere him first that the three former are knowne to thee the Bible common at hand the Catechisme in thy remembrance and the consideration of such as are without difficultie but as for these three last great reading and learning and knowledge in Historie are required to vnderstand them well and to cite them truly They are for the best learned of the world and not for any of the common sort ordinarie men cannot iudge aright by them neither will any such presume to thinke such abilitie to be in them if they would take notice of diuers things concerning Councels Fathers and the Churches custome I. Touching Councels they must know that they are not only subiect to errour but also haue erred that they haue contradicted one another that some of them haue been carried by a strong faction that ancient Fathers would not rest euer vpon the sole authoritie of Councels that Papists themselues though they pretend them yet doe not wholly resigne their iudgement vnto them that there are some counterfeite and forged Councels and counterfeite Canons added