is by their owne grant the man of syn of whom the Apostle here speaketh c. Therfore the church of Rome is the Temple of God also that here is spoken of I answer This argument I might wholly grant and not hurt the cause I plead for For though the church of Rome be the Temple of God which Paul speaketh of yet followeth it not that it is Gods true Temple or true Church which is the point that should be concluded seing the scriptures often speak of things as once they were though so they continue not still as also they speak of things according to the outward pretense and shew that is made of them though in deed and trueth they be nothing less The first is manifest by these and other like instances Abigail is called the wife of Nabal 1 Sam. 30. 5. though Nabal was then dead and his wife maried to David Simon is still called the Leper Mat. 26. 6. though he was then clensed of his leprosie The king of Tyrus an heathen man that lived in Ezekiels dayes is sayd to have been in Eden the garden of God to have been upon the holy mountaine of God and to have walked in the middest of the stones of fyre Ezek. 28. 13. 14. meaning that he had been in Gods church on mount Sion among the people of God although not he himself but Huram his predecessor many yeres before in the dayes of David and Solomon was the man that became a proselyte in Israel and helped to build the Temple 2 Chron. 2. 3. 16. even as if a man should speak to the Bishop of Rome at this day and tell him what he was for a Bishop in th'Apostles dayes and how now he is degenerate and become the man of syn The mountaines of Horeb and Tabor where God once gave his Law and Christ was transfigured are after still called the mount of God and the Holy mount 1 King 19. â— 2 Pet. 1. 18. because they had been for the time sanctified by the presence of God And so the Temple in Ierusalem after the Iewes had crucified Christ refused the gospel were broken off because of unbeleef and the sacrificing and worshiping in that place was ended yet is it until the utter ruine of it by the Romans called the holy place Mat. 24. 15. Thus also the Citie become an harlot is called the faithfull Citie Esai 1. 21. the wicked that hath forsaken his righteousnes is named arighteous man Ezek. 18. 26. according to their former and not their present estate And when these titles are given them it is not to justifie them at all but to aggravate their syn So for the second that things are called according to the outward appearance and pretext set upon them though they be in deed false is evident by these and the like examples false Gods which are but idols are called gods usually so one Prophet calleth those the Philistians gods 1 Chron. 14. 12. which an other calleth their images 2 Sam. 5. 21. False prophets are called Prophets 1 King 22. 6. 22 and Balaam a Soothsayer among the heathens Jos. 13. 22. is called a Prophet 2 Pet. 2. 16. The evil spirit whom the witch of End or raised up for Saul is called in the scripture Samuel 1 Sam. 28. 11. 12 15. 16. 20. by reason wherof the Papists contend that it was Samuel in deed and not the Divil urging the letter as mine opposite doth urge against me this phrase of the Temple of God The idolatrous Temple which Ieroboam made in Israel in honour of the God which had brought them out of Egypt is called the house of their God Amâ—s 2. 8. yet that it was his true house or temple I never heard of any that would affirme though it was the true God whom they worshiped therin for Baal with his house was then destroyed out of Israel 2 King 1â— 27. 28. Now mine opposite hath given us a good rule in this his last book when answering the Anabaptists he sayth The word of God is not the bare letter or outward syllables but the intendement and meaning of the holy Ghost by whom it was given Which should carefully be observed by the due consideration of the scriptures with the circumstances therof and by the conference of other places of scripture and the proportion of fayth layd togither Which whiles the Anabaptists neglict they look on the scripture partially and press the letter extreamly without consideration of the true and right meaning therof These words of his are true the more it is to be lamented that he himself would so press the letter against me and not weigh the meaning of the same by it self and other scriptures and the proportion of fayth layd togither In alleaging this text he layeth downe the words thus There shal come an apostasie or falling away wheras the Apostle sayth except there come an apostasie or falling-away first which word first may intimate that the church should fall away from the love of the trueth before the man of syn should be revealed and this is apparant by the 10. verse where the people whom Antichrist seduceth are sayd to be them that perish because they received not the love of the trueth that they might be saved Or if the word first which mine opposite leaveth out be understood before Christs coming then is it meant of the apostasie or the falling away so called by an excellencie as exceeding all other And is not to be referred to Antichrist the head onely but to Antichristians the bodie also who after other synns should fall away with Antichrist and be damned with him as in the 11. verse it is sayd God shall send them strong delusion that they should beleeve a lye shat they all might be damned who beleeve not the trueth but had pleasure in unrighteousnes So that by the whole scope of this scripture it is evident the Apostle divideth not the people of the church of Rome from the Bishop and ministers of the same as if the people should be Gods true Temple Christs true Church under his covenant and so in the state of grace when the Bishops and ministers are the Divils Temple Antichrist the man of syn and so in the state of damnation but maketh both bishops and people deceivers and deceived all of them under wrath and condemnation otherweise then my opposite would perswade For he pleading thus The Apostle speaking of Antichrist describeth him thus There shal come an apostasie c would have men think that the Bishop and ministers of the church of Rome are the apostasie and the people not contrarie to all the scope of this scripture contrarie also to Paul in 1 Tim. 4 1. where he foretelleth of some that should apostate or depart from the faith giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of Divils meaning it of the people deceived by false teachers yea it is contrary also to mine opposites own graunt who
true change as in Phil. 3. 21. he sayth Christ shal transfigure our vile body that it may be conformed to his glorious body yet in the former place he useth the word but for a counterfeyt change And that the people which worship Antichrist as God are called the Temple of God for name shew and pretence I have before manifested Obj. He doth abuse the scripture c. as if Pauls words were not plaine to such as will understand that Antichrist exalteth himself above all that is called god so that he as God sitteth in the Temple of God and therfore is not the true God but the man of syn c. Answ. Some may think by Pauls words that Antichrist should openly profess himself to be God and above all Gods yet the Pope who is the head of Antichrist professeth himself to be the servant of the servants of God to be but the minister of Christ and Paul teacheth the same when he calleth his working the mystery or hidden secret of iniquity 2 Thes. 2. 7. Even so some may think by the Temple of God is meant the true church of God the people that in Christ are builded-togither for an habitation of God through the Spirit and that Christ dwelleth in their harts by â—aith Eph. 2. 21. 22. 3. 17 yet the Papists who are Antichristians doe beleeve that man of syn that exalteth himself above all that is called God to be a most holy man and Christian bishop they are of his saith worship and religion trusting in his pardons for remission of their synns c and therfore are no better Christians then he but children of perdition with him and are by Paul in the very same place counted among them that perish because they received not the love of the truth that they might be saved therfore God hath sent them strong delusion that they should beleeve a lye that they all might be damned who beleeve not the trueth but have pleasure in unrighteousnes 2 Thes 2. 10. 11. 12. Who now except they be blinded with affection can think that Paul calleth such people the Temple of God otherweise then in respect of their profession of Christianitie and boasting that they are the onely good Christians when they are in deed the sworne servants of Antichrist and synagogue of Satan as Rev. 3. 9. Object Difference is to be put between the man of syn that sitteth between the temple wherin he sitteth he sitteth as God yet the temple wherin he sitteth is the Temple of God Answ. There is in deed such a difference as is between the pastor and the flock understanding by the Temple of God the church of Rome at this day such a difference as is between the seducer and the seduced both adjudged to destruction 2 Thes. 2. 10. 11. 12. Rev. 14. 9. 10. 11. Other differences if men feigne that the pastors or hierarchie are the man of syn sonns of perdition and the idolatrous people which be of one faith and religion with them are men of God and in his covenant of grace it is farr from the trueth Object See the like in the cases that fell out at Jerusalem and the Temple there when Baals idol of indignation was set at the entrie of the house of God Ezek. 8. 3. 5. and when Antiochus Epiphanes and his officers profaned the sanctuarie and citie of Jerusalem and set the image of Iupiter Olympius in the Temple and seat of God Dan. 11. 31. 36. who would not now put difference between the idols and persons aforesayd on the one hand and between the Temple and citie of God wherin they were set and which they polluted on the other Answ. The examples are farr unlike first Rome is not Ierusalem but Babylon Rev. 17. Secondly the Temple and holy things in Ierusalem being made of senseless stones and matter they could not be polluted with syn in themselves as the living stones of Christs house the people now may soon be and turned into a synagogue of Satan as the christian churches in the Apostles dayes are now long since turned to be Turks and Papists Doth not the Law plainly teach us this for in the yerely cleansing of the Sanctuarie it was because of the uncleannesses of the sonns of Jsrael and because of their trespasses in all their synns Levit. 16. 16. and for no uncleannes or syn in it self Thirdly the example of Antiochus is fit but wrong applied for he speaketh onely of Antiochus and his officers wheras both he his officers and his people the common souldjers were they that defiled the sanctuarie of God as it is sayd in the storie Antiochus went up against Jsrael Jerusalem with a great multitude and entred proudly into the Sanctuary c. 1 Maccab. 1. 20. 21. So in applying this he would have the Pope and his officers the hierarchie to be the man of syn as Antiochus and his officers the multitude of papists at Rome he wil not have to be as in deed they should be counted answerable to Antiochus soldjers but they must be the Temple of God answerable to the Temple of Ierusalem a most unjust resemblance For the Temple then was a mere patient and suffred that abuse at Antiochus hands so the thing answerable hereto should be if he would have made a fit comparison the Christians Gods true Temple which suffer for the truthes sake at the Antichristians hands such as are opposed to the worshipers of the beast and those that receive his mark of whom it is written Here is the patience of the saincts here are they that keep the coÌ„mandements of God and the faith of Jesus Revel 14. 9. 12. and againe I saw the soules of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and for the word of God and which had not worshiped the beast nor his image c Rev. 20. 4. And such I never doubted but they were the true Temple of God but I deny that the church of Rome at this day is such a people or such a Temple they are the marked soldjers of Antiochus the Pope and honour him as God in the temple of God their pretended christian church with high impietie Or at least they are like the Apostate Iewes which turned to Antiochus religion and became heathens with worse impietie 1 Maccab. 1. 13. 14. 15. 43. 52. Of this sort is his next allegation where to make his reader merry he likeneth me to the old man of Athens which would compell the Iewes to call their Temple by the name of Iupiter Olympius because Iupiters image was set up in it 2 Mac. 6. 1. 2 so I would have the church of Rome called Antichrists church c. I answer if the church the people of Rome were now mere patients amongst whom Antichrist cometh in by violence they not consenting unto him any more then Gods temple did to Iupiters image it should be foolishnes in me to call it Antichrists church Or to put the
see the Lord Mark 16. 16. Heb. 12. 14. Rom. 11. 20. 21. 22. 23. Though these conditions even in men are the worke of God in them Heb. 8. 10. 12. Whosoever is born of God overcommeth the world synneth not but keepeth himselfe and the wicked one toucheth him not 1. Ioh. 5. 4. 18. And they that teach otherweise destroy the Gospel and open a gap to all profanenesse and licentiousnesse Jf God sayth he break the covenant on his part when men break it on theirs then should there stil be a new entring into the covenant again between God and man and a new baptisme dayly received againe as the signe and seale thereof Answ. God alwayes breaketh not the covenant on his part when men break it on theirs but calleth them often back unto repentance Psa. 89. 31 34. Exo. 32. 33. chapters But to some that are hardned and wil not repent he breaketh his covenant visibly casting them out of his church cutting them off Rom. 11. 20. 22. giving them a bil of divorce Jer. 3. 8. removeth the candlestick Rev. 2. 5. Otherweise if a man comming from Iudaisme or paganisme to the Christian faith and Church doe againe revolt from Christ to Iudaisme or paganisme and for obstinacie in his sin is cut off by the power of Christ from his Church he must still be reputed in the covenant of God visibly on Gods part which is most untrue seeing God on his part hath cut them off and given them a bill of divorce If any such returne the covenant must be renewed Hos. 2. 7. 19. 20. 2. Cor. 6. 17. 18. yet the seale of the covenant once given is not to be repeated as a Christian revolted to paganisme and cut off from the Church is not when hee returneth baptised againe Because though he was visibly cut off even of God for his syn yet by his returne it appeareth that hee still belonged to his election of grace which was to man invisible whiles he continued cut off Yea though he received the seale after a false manner when it was not due unto him yet when hee turneth to the Lord it is not repeated As the Israelites which were circumcised after they were divorced from God Ier. 3. 8. had no new circumcision in the flesh when they turned unto God Ezr. 6. 21. 6. If such were the baptisme of the Church in Rome c. then should it be likewise in the East Churches and in all Churches of the world when they fall into sin breaking the covenant c. Answ. I deny the comparison For Rome is revolted from Christ to Antichrist and fallen from grace by the Apostles rule Gal. 5. 4. and is become dead in syn Rev. 20. and is not the true Church of Christ but a Man of syn and whore of Babylon 2. Thes. 2. Rev. 17. which things are before proved Such is not the state of all Churches that syn and break the convenant till for their hardnes and contempt of God they be also cut off as Rome is which when they bee then have they no true sacraments any longer among them 7. If there baptisme were indeed a lying signe and fiction then would it follow that there should be no salvation for any members of those Churches reteining the baptisme there received For the signe hath reference to the covenant and thing signified and so a lying signe must have respect to a lying covenant And by a lying covenant there is no salvation to any c. Answ. The covenant which the Church of Rome hath made with Antichrist is a lying covenant and hath lying signes to confirme it and God hath sent them strong delusion to beleeve a lye that they all might be damned who beleeve not the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousnes 2. Thes. 2. 11. 12. Therefore by the covenant and seales of that Antichristian synagogue wee cannot say that any one by the promise of God shall be saved But by the covenant of grace which God communicateth with his elect in that and other false churches many are saved but that is not the covenant of the church Of which poynt I have spoken before in answer to his 2. Argument for the church of Rome His reasons are the same againe and againe repeated Here further note how by his argument the popish Masse may bee justified thus If the Lords Supper or Masse in Rome be an idol a lying signe and fiction then is there no salvation for the members of that Church reteyning the Masse For a lying signe must have respect to a lying covenant and by a lying covenant there is no salvation to any But the church of Rome by mine opposites plea is in the covenant of salvation which is the true covenant therefore it also hath the true signe and seale of that covenant in their Masse or Babylonish Supper For our Lords Supper is the true signe and seale of the forgivenesse of synns and covenant of grace Mat. 26. 26. 28. Luk. 22. 19. 20. If hee yeeld not this then hee must say that they have two covenants the one of life and salvation sealed to them by baptisme the other of death and damnation sealed unto them by the Masse or Supper So they shall goe both to heaven and hell by their double covenant 8. Finally sayth he the baptisme of those Churches is from heaven and not of men and is derived unto us from the Apostles of Christ through the loynes of the church of Rome c. Therefore is no idollor lying signe but the true sacrament and ordinance of the Lord Math. 21. 21. 28. 18. 19. with Rom. 6. 3. 4. Heb. 7. 9. 10. 2. Chron. 30. ch Answ. I deny this his conclusion it being but a begging of the question which he shoud have proved It is not their baptisme which is from heaven they are fallen from heaven and become a Beast or kingdom Ecclesiasticall arisen out of the earth Rev. 13. 11. they are gone out from the Apostolike Church and become Antichrists 1. Joh. 2. 18. 19. Mine opposite himself hath granted that the Pope and his Hierarchie are Antichrist the Man of syn the Beast never maried to Christ. Again he sayth in this his Chr. plea p. 3. Jn baptisme the action is wholly enjoyned layd upon the baptiser and not upon the baptised The baptizers in Rome are the Priests which be a part of the beast and Man of syn on them the whole action lyeth as he sayth Now is this baptisme from heaven Did God ever bid Antichrist baptise The whole action then of popish baptisme lyeth upon them that are confessed by him to be Antichrist yet this baptisme he wil have to be from heaven 2. They were not in the loyns of the primitive Christian Church either by nature or by grace otherweise then all nations in Moses time were in the loynes of the primitive Church in Noes time 3. We have not our baptisme frō them but from God who hath delivered us from
their God and the Chaldee paraphrast as ancient as the Apostles age expoundeth the house of their idols they contradict not one another seing the same thing may be Gods in shew and the divils in deed and trueth for even Satan himself is transformed into an Angel of light 2 Cor. 11. 14. Obj. When the Apostle describeth the mysterie of Antichrists iniquitie would he teach the church that the place of his sitting is the Temple of God if he meant that it were in deed the synagogue of Satan and the temple of Antichrist For that Antichrist should sit in the temple of Antichrist and synagogue of Satan what mysterie is there in it All the world would easily perceive that these agreed very well and most fitly togither But for Antichrist to sit in Gods temple and Christs church this is in deed a mysterie Answ. The mysterie of iniquitie began in the true church but continued not therein alwayes for when it was discerned the church eyther cast it out or soon degenerated into a synagogue of Satan if it accepted Antichrist for God as the Church of Rome doth at this day Which I further manifest thus 1. The Apostle sayth As ye have heard that Antichrist shal come even now are there many Antichrists c. They went out from us but they were not of us for if they had been of us they would no doubt have continued with us but they went out that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us Who is a lyer but he that denyeth that Jesus is the Christ he is Antichrist that denyeth the Father and the Son Whosoever denyeth the Son the same hath not the Father 1. Joh. 2. 18. 19. 22. 23. This scripture teacheth us first that all hereticks departing from the faith of Christ are generally Antichrists though they reteyn the name of Christians still as did the hereticks in th'Apostles time 2. That such are gone out from the church and are in deed none of it though they pretend to be the true church as all hereticks have doen. 3. That both teachers and people departed from the faith and church of Christ are comprehended under the name of Antichrists and not the Bishops onely 4. That whosoever is Antichrist especially the great Antichrist he denyeth the Son Christ and consequently God the Father Now let us apply these things to the Bishop and hierarchie of Rome whome mine opposite granteth to be the great Antichrist If the Pope and his hierarchie be Antichrist then are they none of the Apostolik church but gone out of the same but they are Antichrist by my opposites owne confession Therfore they are none of th'Apostolik church The Pope and his hierarchie are both in and of the church of Rome the heads teachers and principall members of it of the same faith religion and worship but they are not in or of the Apostolik christian church as before is proved therfore the church of Rome is not an apostolik Christian church If the church of Rome denyeth both the Father and the Son then is it Antichrist as the Apostle sayth and so no true Christian church But the church of Rome denyeth both the Father and the Son therfore it is no true Christian church If the Pope his hierarchie deny both the Father and the Son then the church of Rome also denyeth them for they beleeve as the Pope and hierarchie beleeveth have one and the same religion with their preists But the Pope and his hierarchie deny both the Father and the Son otherweise they are not the Antichrist as mine opposite sayth they are therefore the Church of Rome also denyeth both the Father and the Son Now seing it is thus how is it possible that it should cōtinue the true Church of Christ otherweise then by lying pretext and ostentation And this is the mysterie of inquitie if men could comprehend it that the Bishops and people of Rome being at first Christs true church departed by degrees from the faith worship of God til they came joyntly to beleeve lyes and to worship creatures idols and divils Rev. ◠30. and became a Beast or Antichristian kingdome yet with two hornes like the Lamb Christ Rev. 13. blaspheming Gods Tabernacle them that dwel in heaven that is the true church they pretend themselves to be the onely true church of Christ and that all other are hereticks they pretend succession even from th Apostles dayes without change of religion and so they sit in the temple of God or for the Temple as if they none but they were the Temple and church of God the Pope being the head of this sinfull corporation of this Beast or kingdome and exalting himself above God Christ whiles yet he calleth himself Christs vicar and the Servant of the servants of God and by strong delusion keepeth his people in beleef of lyes that togither with him they all might be damned who beleeve not the trueth but have pleasure in unrighteousnes as the Apostle sayth 2. Thes. 2. 12. Now where he objecteth what mysterie is there in it that Antichrist should sit in the temple of Antichrist I answer it is a great mysterie in that it is doen by him and his under the name and shew of Christianitie and as the Apostle sayth after the working of Satan with all power and signes and lying wonders and with all deceivablenes of unrighteousnes 2. Thes. 9. 10. And where he further sayth but for Antichrist to sit in Christs church this is in deed a mysterie I answer it is in deed a contrarietie and impossibilitie not a mysterie for no man can serve two masters Mat. 6. 24. of whom a man is overcome of the same is he brought in bondage 2. Pet. 2. 19. to whom men yeild themselves servants to obey his servants they are to whom they obey Rom. 6. 16. Now the church of Rome yeilding unto and obeying Antichrist cannot be the servants of Christ if th' Apostles doctrine be true And after mine opposites manner of reasoning an other man might say seing Christianitie is the mystirie of godlines 1. Tim. 3. 16. as Antichristianitie is the mysterie of iniquitie 2. Thes. 2. 7. Christ must sit in the Temple of Satan as Antichrist sitteth in the temple of God for for Christ to sit in the Temple church of Christ what mysterie is there in it but for Christ to sit in Satans temple and Antichrists church this is in deed a mysterie Were not this think we good reasoning to put darknes for light and light for darknes Christ into Antichrists place and Antichrist into Christs for to finde out a mysterie But they that have their eyes opened to read the mysterie that is not onely in the Pope but on the forehead of the whore of Babylon his church will soon espie this fraud though others are bewitched with her painted face For as Satan can transforme himself into an Angel of light and his ministers
and people so doth the Antichristian of Antichrist his ministers and people This Beast hath seven heads and ten hornes Rev. 17. 3. the ten hornes are sayd to be ten Kings v. â—2 as in Dan. 7. 24. the ten hornes out of that kingdom are ten kings these kings are none of the hierarchy wherefore the whole body of this beast conteineth more then the Pope and his hierarchy The Lamb against whom the Beast with his hornes fighteth Rev. 17. 14. Mr. Iunius expoundeth to be Christ and his Church why may not we by like reason expound the Beast to bee Antichrist and his Church Finally the Beast sayth Mr. Iunius * himselfe is the Romane Empire made long agoe of civill Ecclesiastical the chief head whereof hee maketh the Pope to beâ— And the Beast of Rome sayth he of a civil Empire is made an ecclesiastical Hierarchie The Whore he expoundeth to be the spiritual Babylon which is Rome so then by mine opposites plea neither did Mr. Iunius say neither ever entred into his thought that the ecclesiastical Roman Empire since the Pope was head of it or the hierarchy was ever married unto Christ. As for the Whore the Church which rideth this Beast he calleth it the False-Christian Church over which Antichrist ruleth and Antichrists Church which title mine opposite will not beare at my hand and that Antichristian Church which the Angel biddeth cast out and measure it not in Rev. 11. 12. Mr. Iunius explaineth thus As if he should say it belongeth nothing to thee to judge those which are without 1. Cor. 5. 12. which be innumerable look unto those of the houshold onely or unto the house of the living God Notwithstanding all this Mr. Iohnson would needs measure it for the true Church House and Temple of God so well doe Mr. Iunius and he accord together To a testimony which I alleaged out of D. Fulk concerning the miserable blindnesse of people in Popery of which mine opposite sayth he might have been better aduised hee to requiâ—e me as he thinketh alleageth a speech of Mr. Broughtons who sayth Millions of millions of Romes clients are saved Brought on Rev. 13. 18. p. 203. Answ. Would he be content that Mr. Broughton should decide our controversie touching the Church of Rome Thus then sayth that author in the same book The Popes clients are the taile of the great Dragon Thence from Rome was the Rebellion to arise Man of syn Apollyon c. to set up or depose states and to have a people of his own frame and to burne the true Temple of God The Popes power driveth the Church not to be seen for certaine hundreds of yeares The Pope wresteth al that is spoken of the true Church into protection for his synagogue of Satan Rome passeth al the enemies of the Church in cruelty and idolatry Pharaoh and Nebuchadnezar were never so hardened The prophane Caesars did not so strictly hinder all use of Religion Rome hath farr passed the old Babel in idolatry The Pope followeth al heathen superstition in name staffe apparel of Caesars and Temples setting but a face of Christianity upon them All their doctrine is such that their Temples Masse and dayly profession in al things is from the unclean spirit and their whole policie is a lye The Beast which is ascended out of Abyssos that is al his eorporations millions of millions alpapists goe from their Abyssos of black ignorance unto Abyssos Luk. 8. whither the Divils shal come in their time to be tormented for ever ever These sundry the like coÌ„mendations doth the author alleaged give of the church of Rome which mine opposite pleadeth for and taking hold of a phrase wresteth it for his purpose from the mans meaning who seemeth not to speak of the popish church but of the ancient Christian for these are there Mr. Broughtons words And for Julius the captaine who was so careful for S. Paul that for his sake the liâ—e of the prisoners were spared Act. 27. God would not record this but to save millions of millions of Romes clients for S. Paul but for the unthankeful to S. Paul and forgers that Peter was at Rome who never came neere it he stil reserved Pilats holiness that Popes selfe-murder should be the reward Was not here a testimony well alleaged So in other places of his book he quoteth Mr. Brightman and others whose writings directly cross that which he pleadeth for in many things as they that read the authors may see and anone I will set downe their sayings No marvell then if hee wrest my words as where next he sayth that that which the Apostle speaketh of the Man of sin and of them that perish because they receive not the love of the truth c. 2. Thess. 2. 9. J apply for exclusion from pardon and certain condemnation to the whole Church of Rome and so to all the members thereof and that for all ages that either have been are or shal be ever since the Man of syn was seated there Answ. I sayd no more but thus God if it were granted that he is the husband of this whore hath promised her no pardon but delivered her to Satan to be seduced deluded damned 2. Thes. 2. 9. 11. 12. I speak not here of those in Rome that have withstood her whoordoms which have been many nor of those to whom at last God hath given repentance unto life which I hope are moe nor of other his elect but of the whore in generall whose damnation is shewed in Rev. 17. and 18. yea th'Apostle speaketh more particularly That they all might be damned who beleeve not the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness Behold how hee sayth they all which some evill minded man might urge against the Apostle as mine opposite doth against me But wise men know that the promises of life to the true Church pertain not to the reprobates that are in it so the threatnings of death to the false Church take not hold on Gods elect which are therein Object Jf this harlot the Church of Rome was never Christs spouse otherwise then all the world was by our first parents Adam and Noe how then hath she broken the covenant of wedlock if she never were in it how can she be called a whore in respect of Christ any more then the heathens that never knew God in Christ How can she be sayd to be in Apostasie c. Answ. Of the state of the Gentiles I have spoken before and proved them to have been all in the covenant of grace in Christ from Gen. 9. 9. c. But they generally fell from God to idolatry which is whoredom and apostasie and were in time rejected of God who renewed his covenant with one small nation of the Iewes and yet saved his elect among the Gentiles also So the Christian Churches planted by the Apostles soon fell from
thereupon It was not Gods people in Babylon that killed those witnesses Rev. 11. but it was Babylon that killed those witnesses Gods people therin Because Gods people killed not those witnesses but the Beast in his catholik citie or church therfore thinks he that citie of the beast is not his church a fayre conclusion Obj. Note here that by the great citie is meant not onely the citie it self but the whole jurisdiction authority and dominion therof how farr soever extended Answ. It is a good note and worth the marking for the great citie being the church of Rome as before is proved it followeth that the extents of that church reach further then the materiall walls of Rome even to all nations that are of the Popes religion and therfore to bound it within the Lateran parish of Rome is to restreyn that which God sheweth to be more large It were a happy day if the Popes unruly power were limited within the Lateran parish and his jurisdiction reached no further But he must have a larger scope to range in yet a while and weak warriers are they against him that plead for his whorish church of Rome that it is the true church of Christ and under his covenant of grace It is the thing that the Pope would most gladly have proved and I am well assured Babylon wil not fall til it be otherweise battered Obj. Where yet observe further that the church of Rome being fallen into deep apostasie and having the man of syn sitting ther in as God who hath that citie for his throne the things that are spoken of this citie are also applied to the apostate estate of that church of Rome and the other churches that are under the jurisdiction of the prelacie of that Sea whersoever and of whatsoever people kinred tongue or nation they be c. But shall wee therfore conclude that by the Temple of God 2 Thes. 2. 4. may not be understood the church of God Answ. How glorious is the trueth that forceth those to yeild that fight against it His former reasons that by the Citie in Rev. â—1 8. the church was not meant he now frustrateth himself But still he cleaveth to his first plea The temple of God 1 Thes. 2. is the church of God I may answer hereto as God by Ieremy did to the Iewes Trust not in lying words saying The temple of the Lord the temple of the Lord the temple of the Lord are these Ier. 7. 4. Our dispute is in what sense Paul calleth it the Temple of God whether as the true temple builded by Solomon or as the false temple builded in Samaria by the Apostate Israelites which the Prophet calleth the house of their God Amos 2. 8. as the Apostle calleth this the Temple of God Now faine he would have this Romish temple of apostate Papists to be the true temple of God and that they notwithstanding their deep apostasie are Gods true church under his covenant which I deny and have before disproved and Paul in the very same place counteth them among those that perish for beleeving lyes which shal be damned for not beleeving the trueth 2 Thes. 2. 10. 11. 12. and Christ teacheth that being worshipers of the beast their names are not written in the book of lâ—fe Rev. 13. 8. 17. 8. but they shal be tormented in fyre and brimstone for ever Revel 14. 9. 10. 11. and that the whorish church Babylon the great the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth which is drunken with the blood of the Saincts and of the martyrs of Jesus shal be destroyed for ever Rev. 17. 5. 6. 18. 21. And who now that have not their right eye blinded wil not rather say it is the Samaritans Temple then Solomons though in pretence and colour the Temple of God And seing every true church now is a particular congregation in one place but the church of Rome is a new found catholik church spred over many nations under one head Bishop the Pope it can not possibly be Christs true church having neyther the constitution faith worship ministerie order or ordinances of Christ but of his enemie Antichrist Wheras I formerly wrote Neyther is that if they meane a particular church answerable to the Temple in Israel which was not for one synagogue but for the whole nation of the Iewes and for the Gentiles that came to the faith through the world To this he sayth How greatly forgets he himself and how presently seing but a line before he sayd the Temple figured not onely the catholik or universal church Ephe 2. 21. but also every particular church by proportion 1 Corint 3. 16. 17. And may we not then apply it to that wherof it was a figure c. Answ. No for mine opposite granteth that the Temple was primarily a figure Christ but so to apply it in this place 2 Thes. 2. himself thinketh not fit I deny not but some where it may and ought to be so applyed but considering that the Temple of God wherin Antichrist now sitteth is a catholik church spred over many nations as was prophesied Rev. 11. 8. 9. I think the applying of Pauls words in 2 Thes. 2. to a particular church is neyther fitting to the type nor to the prophesie nor to the accomplishment of it which we see at this day The priests in Israel figured Christ chiefly secondarily Christians Rev. 1. 6. But to apply those things which Paul speaketh of the Priests in Heb. 10. 11. 12. to us Christians were not onely unfitting but heretical Obj. The Candlesticks and Lamps were set in the Temple of God and the church of Rome was a golden Candlestick as well as the rest of the primitive churches and this man himself sayth definitely the true churches were many of them apostate when John wrote whom yet notwithstanding Christ acknowledgeth to be golden candlesticks In any of which of Antichrist had sit as in the church of Rome I suppose this man would not deny but his sitting then should have been in the Temple of God whether it were considered as a particular candlestick it self or a branch of the great general candlestick c. Answ. 1. If the Candlesticks were churches in the Temple the church then the Temple in such respect is the catholick church for one particular church is not in an other 2. I grant that the church of Rome was a golden candlestick in th'Apostles time and I think mine opposite would not deny but then also the Bishop of Rome was a starr in Christs right hand But now the Bishop is a starr fallen from heaven and acknowledged to be Antichrist why then may not the church be fallen with him as Paul forewarned Rom. 11. 22. and the candlestick removed from it as wel as from Ephesus Rev. 2. 5. except Rome have a privilege above all other cities because it crucified Christ. 3. I grant also that
with the Holy Ghost nor any other infants there baptised Answ. We and all are by nature the children of vvrath Eph. 2. 3. and being born in Antichrists church we had not the visible covenant of promise vvhich is given onely to Christs Church Albeit God hath his elect in false Churches as among the Gentiles of old and in Israel after they vvere divorced from the Lord. Jer. 3. vvhom he can save vvithout baptisme as he did vvithout circumcision The same is answered to his fifth obiection of the same persons come to yeares And is further cleared in the* answer to his second argument for the Church of Rome vvhere he alleaged the like things And vvhere he sayth Either we have no outward baptisme at all confirming the covenant of God or else we had it before we came under the Lords covenant and in a church divorced from the Lord. I answer Wee had the outward vvashing vvith vvater as the Israelites had the outward cutting of the flesh vvhen they were divorced from the Lord Ier. 3. 8. vvhich could not then confirme Gods covenant to us or them in such synfull estate But as after vvhen they repented and turned to the Lord they had their outward cutting sanctified unto them for a signe of his covenant and were admitted to eat of his Passover Ezr. 6. 21. vvhich no uncircumcised might eat of Exod. 12. 48. so our vvashing hath been by like grace sanctified unto us for a signe of his covenant and vve may lawfully eat of the Lords Supper His 6. reason is of like na ure touching the members of the Antichristian church that they have not the Lords baptisme being not come to the Lord in true faith and repentance c. This also is before spoken of in answering his reasons for that church The Scripture sheweth them to bee departed from the faith of Christ 2. Thes. 2. 1. Tim. 4. to bedead in syn Rev. 20. to bee under the vvrath of God Rev. 14. 9. 10. 11. Our opposite himself sayth of that church She is a notorious harlot and idolatress and of the Hierarchie the ministers of that church vvhich have the same baptisme vvith the people and doe administer baptisme to that people he sayth they are the Man of Syn the son of perdition 2. Thess. 2. the Beast Rev. 13. concerning vvhom he could not endure that vve should aske his proofe that ever they were maried unto Christ. And are such a people and Hierarchy remaining in that estate come to the Lord in true faith and repentance If they have brought themselves by their idolatries heresies and innumerable synns into a woeful estate vvhat are we that we should justifie those vvhom God condemneth Let false prophets preach peace unto them wee must notwithstanding declare the judgements of the Lord vvhose wrath is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who deteyn the truth in unrighteousness Rom. 1. 18. 7. Finally sayth he Wheras they say the outward washing need not to be repeated and yet say also they have renounced the Romish Baptisme as an impure idol in their abuse they use shifts and contradict themselves For if the outward baptisme be an Idol why doe they reteyn it Jf not why have they renounced it Answ. I have formerly shewed the shift and contradiction to be in himself who pleaded against the Anabaptists that there is but one baptisme and now against us would have two 2. I have also shewed that Gods ordinance turned into an idol or lye the lye the idol is to be renounced the truth of the ordinance reteyned so doe we That sayth he which they speak of their abuse is a shift Difference is to be put between a thing abused and th' abuse therof The scriptures are the word of God and not an impure idol to be renounced though they be abused by the Papists and themselves c. Answ. when he hath nought ells to answer he casteth reproches and calleth my reason a shift Would he have me so impious as to call Baptisme the Lords supper or other divine ordinances idols unless for the syn and abuse of men which turne them to idols as the trueth of God was turned into a lye by the Gentiles Rom. 1. 25. And doe not I put that very difference which himself here putteth how then is it a shift in me more then in him The scripture in it self is alwayes pure yet popish heresies falsly gathered from the scriptures are most impure these we reject but hold fast the scripture Water in popish baptisme is Gods good creature Antichrist hath turned it and the action with it into an abominable idol as if it gave grace and washed away syn by the work doon of a sacrilegious priest This abomination we reject the creature of God is of his grace sanctified unto us and we reteyn it Now follow his other reasons to prove it no idol but true baptisme 1. Because an Idol c. is an invention of man in the worship of God wheras Baptisme in those churches is of the holy things of God a true signe of his covenant c. Answ. The first is granted him the latter is denyed and he but beggeth the question For neyther doth the church continew in Rome which th'Apostles planted neyther doth the true baptisme there continew any more then the true Supper of our Lord turned by them into an abominable Mass or any more then the true ministery which is changed by his own grant into a man of syn a Beast and the great Antichrist Or any more then the true Censure of excommunication which they profane against such as forsake their idolatrous church 2. Els those churches should not have a mixture of Gods ordinances with their own inventions c but should be utterly deprived of all and every one of Gods ordinances But they have such a mixed estate c. Answ. He concludeth nothing but should conclude therfore it is no idol to them in their abuse but Christs true baptisme This I deny And first I answer that all the heathens had before Christs coming a mixture of Gods ordinances with their own inventions yet were they not therfore in the covenant of grace neyther had they the true signes and seals therof 2. as mens inventions are idols so Gods ordinances may by men be turned into idols as are the sacraments in Rome For is not the wheaten God in their supper an Idol what mouth wil deny it Mine opposite pressed with it passeth it over alwayes as if he could not see it That thing alone would have convinced this and many other his reasons of like sort if he durst have medled with it 3. Jf their baptisme were an idol then it should be syn in them to reteyn that baptisme still c. Ans. How often shall we have repetitions of the same thing He hath been answered the idol ought to be put away the ordinance of God ought to be reteyned If the Iewes had
sayth the use of gold and silver for idols is forbidden very wel and is not the use of water bread and wine for idols forbidden also The use of gold to make the images of Cherubims was commanded Exod. 25. 18. but if the Gentiles had made themselves golden Cherubims they had been idols and syn to them for God commanded them not So water bread and wine are commanded the Christian church in her sacraments but to the Antichristian church God commandeth not these til they repent turne to Christ then and not before may they use them for holy signes Psalm 50. 16. 17. Prov. 21. 27. 9. 13. 17. 18. In this his tenth errour or exception is also answered which is about the very same thing but that he delyteth in multiplication 11 Touching the relation which is the mayn thing in a sacrament that it should seale up unto them the forgivenes of synns and as they blasphemously say quite take away synns and conferr grace so it is a vaine idol and nothing But the Sacraments in their relation are not onely seals but signes also Gen. 17. 11. Rom. 4. 11. c. Now by their assertion the baptisme aforesayd sheweth nothing at all to the mind and so is a vaine idol and nothing and that which it sheweth to the eye is but as the gold and silver of the heathens idols which if it were true then in deed there should be nothing of Gods ordinance nothing of a true sacrament c. And can they then blame the Anabaptists c. Answ. That there is no true relation in the popish baptisme is sufficiently proved the persons being Antichristians out of the covenant and without promise in that estate That they have the true material things of washing with water in the name of the Father c I have alwayes granted though these materials are abused by them to idolatrie as the Iewes abused their sheep and bullocks to abominable sacrifices That of the gentiles silver and gold is true also touching the matter which is Gods good creature further comparison I made not though he corrupted my words Object Whether think they that the baptisme received in the truest Churches doe seal up to hypocrites the forgivenes of their synns If they think not whether they wil say that the baptisme of those churches hath not the relation which is the mayn thing in a Sacrament Jt is generally held that Simon Magus who was baptised by Philip was an hypocrite and that his baptisme did not seal up unto him the forgivenes of his synns wil they therfore say that the baptisme ministred by the Euangelists had not the relation c Besides that thus the relation of the sacramentes should depend wholly upon man and not upon the Lord or his ordinance at all Answ. To passe over his forme of writing how he asketh questions when he should prove or convince I answer his question is from the matter in hand and so is deceitfull We speak of the outward visible church of Christ and ordinances belonging therto also of the visible Antichristian church and ordinances there abused He leaveth this and runneth to hypocrites which men can not discerne and whom therfore we must leave unto God among other secrets Deut. 29. 29. To reason from the one of thâ—se to the other would bring all confusion for hypocrites are lawfully admitted into the Church as was Iudas Simon Magus and many other if upon this ground open Antichristians idolaters unbeleevers may be admitted also then the church and the world shal be one confused Babel To his question I answer baptisme in true Churches administred as th' Apostles and Euangelists did â—ealeth up to all the forgivenes of their synns unto the judgment of man and they should greatly syn and profane Gods ordinance to baptise any other Simon Magus when he was baptised it is testified that he beleeved Act. 8. 13. so by the ordinance of Christ he was to be baptised Mat. 28. 19. neyther knew they him to be an hypocrite when he was baptised til afterward Thus are we bound by the rule of love to beleeve that all rightly baptised in the Christian church have the seale of forgivenes of synns and are buryed with Christ by baptisme and that by one spirit we are all baptised into one body Rom. 6. 3. 4. 1 Cor. 12. 13. And so mine opposite beleeving the church of Rome to be Christs true church and to have his true baptisme was bound also to beleeve them all to be of one body and one spirit with himself til they manifest to him the contrary which seing they have not doen by all their idolatries heresies impieties it is not to be thought that ever people which wil call themselves Christians could doe it As for us we know the covenant of Christ is not with Antichrist or his whoreish church though therin God hath many elect but we know that his covenant is with the true Christian church and all the members of it although therin be many hypocrites and reprobates both which are manifested in time by their fruits We walk by the rules reveiled to us of God secret things are not for us to judge of until they be manifested Where he concludeth that thus the relation of the sacraments should depend wholly upon man and not upon the Lord at all it is a calumniation without all colour of proof The relation is by mutual consent the Lord offring his son Christ for salvation to all repentant beleeving synners we by grace having obteyned faith doe therby apprehend Christ for our saviour as in the word so in the sacraments His next demaund about our selves and our baptisme had in Rome is a thing againe and agayn answered without running into Anabaptistrie whither he would so sayn drive us 12. These men erre not a litle when they say that popish baptisme hath not the relation of a sacrament to them but is a vaine idol and nothing because they say of it that it quite taketh away synns Shall mens erroneous sayings and opinions make a nullity of Gods ordinances signes and seales Can not God be true though they be lyars c. Answ. Here is an other repetition of that which he forealleged in his 6. reason or errour which I there refuted Mens erroneous sayings opinions and doings doe disanull to themselves all Gods promises signes and seals which are onely conditionall if men repent beleeve and obey which grace God giveth to all that are Christs And if men beleeve not nor obey and so be damned their damnation impeacheth not Gods truth at all but confirmeth it for he hath sayd of such that they shal be damned Mar. 16. 16. Joh. 3. 36. Obj. Besides the relation in a sacrament there is also to be regarded the commandment of God who hath appointed it to be observed in the church As Christ who was without syn c yet in obedience to the Law was circumcised and baptised c. Therfore it
should be syn in the church of Rome if they should reject baptisme and not keep it Which doth plainly evince that it is not a vaine idol and nothing for then it were not syn but their dutie to cast it away and not to keep it at all but that it is the Lords ordinance c. Answ. The first is true for without the word and commandment of God it could be no seale of his covenant or have any relation at all therto The second is a deceytful reason concluding from the holy commandment of God to the unholy keeping of it in Rome It should be syn in them to reject baptisme the Lords supper professedly it is syn in them to keep them as they doe profanely It were better for a man never to be baptised or eat the Lords supper all his life then to communicate with the church of Rome in eyther of these as they profane them for we may not doe evil that good may come therof Rom. 3. 8. So his plaine eviction that it is not a vaine idol in their abuse of it is but a plaine fallacie let him apply it to the other Sacrament and it wil appear Antichrist hath transformed the Lords supper into an abominable massing sacrifice and therin worshipeth a wafer cake for his maker and redemer this he durst not deny to be a notorious idol But his reason if it be good wil prove it no idol thus It should be syn in the church of Rome if they should reject the Lords supper and not keep it Which doth plainly evince that the Lords supper in Rome though changed by them into a wicked Mass is not an idol for then it were not syn but their duty to reject it The refutation herof is this Rome and all nations syn that doe not beleeve aright in Christ and keep all his ordinances The more that they openly renounce Christ or any of his ordinances the more they shal adde unto their syn Yet in that they keep them not aright but have changed the truth of God into a lye and his holy ordinances into idols they are also great synners for which if God give them not repentance they are under wrath and damnation 2 Thes. 2. 10. 11. 12. Of this point I have spoken before in answer to his 6. reason for the church of Rome His 13. and last errour is but a repetition of former matters about the brazen serpent Gods ordinances and creatures considered in themselves c to which I have before answered shewing that it helpeth the Papists no more to clear them of idolatry herein then the heathens of old who made idols of creatures and ordinances which in their own nature and first institution were good and holy And hitherto of his errours wrongfully imputed unto us To these by his figure of repetition and multiplication he hath added from the former grounds Contradictions Abuse of scriptures Uaine distinctions and Anabaptistical assertions all which being but the same things turned and repeated and by me before cleared I count it needless labour to make the same answers againe to his empty calumniations Of Circumcision in Israel THe reason why we repeat not the outward work of baptising with water againe such as have been baptised in false churches is the example of the Israelites who after their falling from God and from the Church and after the Lord had given them the bill of divorce when they repented and turned to the Lord were admitted to the Passover without any new cutting or circumcising in the flesh 2 Chron. 30. Ezr. 6. And because I denyed them in such estate to have true circumcision which is the signe and seale of the righteousnes of faith Rom. 4. 11. mine opposite as his manner is chargeth me with very erronious and ungodly assertions and maketh a longsome discourse of the state of Israel and of words and phrases used concerning them And unto ten lines of mine in Animadv pag. 70. he giveth an answer of above 30. pages in his Christian plea pag. 65. to pag. 96. to blinde his reader with many words I wil briefly shew the insufficiencie of his answers And first that Israel after they departed from the Lord his Temple altars sacrificers and church and made new Temples altars sacrificers signes and a new church of their own divising that Israel I say from that time was not a true church I have before shewed my reasons in handling the state of the church of Rome Mine opposites first colourable reason is from such scriptures as stil name them the Lords people and the Lord to be their God and to remember the covenant of their fathers Abraham c 2 King 9. 6. c. and 13. 22. 23. Answ. I have heretofore answered that this Argument They are called the Lords people therfore they are his true church is not to be granted For 1. Things are named in scripture sometimes as they have been before though they be not so still as Abigail is called the wife of Nabal though he were then dead and she maried to David 1 Sam. 30. 5. Solomon was begotten of Uriahs wife wheras she was then Davids Mat. 1. 6. Jesus was in the house of Simon the Leper Mat. 26. 6. so named because he had been a Leper c. 2. They were so called in respect of their profession that they would be so estemed and named though in deed they were without the true God 2 Chron. 15. 3. as O thou that art named the house of Jakob c. Mic. 2. 7. 8. Thirdly in respect of their calling unto him and his covenant afterward though for the present they were none of his as Jn that day J wil marie thee Jsrael unto me for ever c. Hos. 2. 18. 19. 20. 23. Thus the Gentiles were called Christs sheep because they should after be brought into his fold Ioh. 10. 16. and God had much people in Corinth an heathenish citie Act. 18. 10. 1 Cor. 12. 2. And the Jewes to this day are Gods people and beloved not for their present state which is cursed but for the promise that they shal hereafter be graffed againe into Christ Rom. 11. 11. 20. 23. 25. 26. 9. 4. with Esa. 59. 20. 21. Ezek. 34. 23. 30. Hos. 3. 5. Fourthly in comparison with the Philistines and other heathens they were called the people of the Lord because they never renounced their God in name and professedly but pretended the contrary Fiftly that God did not presently cast them off in respect of calling them to repentance and of their dwelling in the land or as the scripture sayth in 2 King 14. 27. of putting out the name of Israel from under heaven For his covenant was to punish them by degrees Levit. 26. 16. 18. 21. 24. 28. 33. and at last if they repented not to scatter them among the heathens til their uncircumcised harts should be humbled and they rued their former syn and then
Elias prayer against Israel and Gods answer J have reserved to my self 7000. men who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal Even so then sayth he at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace c. By this we are taught 1. That if a few or any one of a people be reserved of God though the multitude be cast away yet it cannot be sayd absolutely that God hath cast away his people And this may lead us to understand why God called Israel his people in their apostasie because some he kept from falling into it some he brought out of it by repentance 2. That those are in deed Gods people whom he foreknew the rest are cast off Now those which are foreknowen of God are described thus that he also did predestinate them to be conformed to the image of his sont them he also called them he also justified them he also glorified Rom. 8. 2◠〈◊〉 Thus are we led to judge who are Gods people when we see their calling justifying and gloryfying that is their sanctification â— Cor. 3â— â—8 by which iâ— charitie we are to judge of their predestination and estate in grace 3. That as the remnant of the Iewes which imbraced the gospel were the election of grace that is the people whom in charitie we should judge to be elected of God according to his grace and the others are blinded hardned cast off til God give them repentance so in Israel they that kept themselves from the coÌ„mon idolatrie of Baal inwardly and outwardly and reteyned the true service of God were his election of grace and to be judged his true people the others that synned in Baal were dead til God gave them repentance unto life Thus the Apostles exposition and application of those 7000. in Israel may help us to judge of their estate aright And not because circumcision was unto them the seale of grace and of forgivenes of synns to conclude that therfore it was likeweise to them that served Baal for so we should prostitute Gods grace and the seals therof to such as God condemneth and rejecteth Fiftly he instanceth the worship of Baal by Iudah Ier. 7. Judg. 2. c. Wherto I answer as before that Iudah in her constitution remayned a true church though corrupted Israel being a false church as hath been manifested Neyther was the defection universall and open as in Israel As for such in Iudah as so fell from God and would not be brought to repentance the Prophet telleth them they trusted in lying words when they sayd The Temple of the Lord the Temple of the Lord c. Ier. 7. 4. 8. the Lord threatneth to cast them out of his sight and forbad his Prophet to pray for them Jer. 7. 15. 16. So their circumcision became unto them uncircumcision Rom. 2. 25. To this he objecteth Though mans idolatrie c may make Gods sacraments improfitable to himself yet can they not make them lying and deceitfull signes but that in the Lords ordinance they are unto all and therfore also unto them his true signes and faithfull seals on his part of forgivenes of synns and life eternal For shall the infidelitie of man turne the truth of God into a lye God forbid Answ. I have before answered that all Gods ordinances are in them selves and on his part holy faithfull and true They are true seals of forgivenes of synns but to such as are worthy partakers of them in faith otherweise they seale judgment unto men 1 Cor. 11. 27. 28 29. And it is not his ordinance that open and obstinate idolaters and wicked men should administer or receive them Ezek. 44. 9. Numb 15. 30. 31. Levit. 7. 20. Psalm 〈◊〉 1â— 17. That men may turne the truth of God into a lye the Apostle plainly teacheth Rom. 1. 25. so may they the truth of his ordinances into lyes But the truth of God as it is in himself or his faithfulnes is unchangeable if men beleeve not or sanctifie him not they perish by the judgment of God which is according to trueth and his faithfulnes suffreth him not to save such unless he make them first new creatures and beleevers Joh. 3. 36. 1. Joh. 5. 10. 12. Sixtly he expoundeth Israels death in Hos. 13. 1. to be by the exposition of sundry writers not death in syn but slayn for their synns or their estate overthrowen or neer utter destruction c. Answ. Both may be true that first they were dead in syn and after destroyed civilly for their syn Gods judgmeÌ„ts are according to mens deserts he destroyed not the Amorites Egyptians and other nations til their iniquitie was full Gen. 15. 16. Wherfore to condemne the exposition which I gave because an other consequent folowed upon it as the ruine of Achabs house or the like is no fitme argument And to his many expositors whom he citeth I oppose one greater then all even th'Apostle in Rom. 11. before spoken of who sheweth the election of grace to be in the 7000 that worshiped not Baal and not in the multitude of the Baalists And if they were not of the election of grace then were they dead in syn though he and many say the contrary Finally he alleageth the sayings of the Prophet before and after The Lord found Iakob in Bethel and there he spake with us c Therfore turne thou to thy God c. Hos. 12. 4. 5. 6. 9. And yet am J the Lord thy God from the land of Egypt and thou shalt know no God but me I did know thee in the wildernes c. Hose 13. 4. 5. Answ. I have before shewed that the prophets speak to Israel as a corporation or body which after a sort continueth one and the same through many generations when yet as touching their particular persons or generations they are different contrary as godly fathers in the state of grace and life may beget wicked children without grace and in state of death Ezek. 18. 9. 10. 13. 14. 17. 18. c. So the King of Tyre had been in Eden the garden of God a proselyte in the Church Ezek. 28. 13. not that heathen king then living but his predecessor Huram long before 1. King 5. So Paul speaketh of the Iewes cast away of God as the same people till their last calling Rom. 11. And I doubt not but a man preaching to convert them at this day might apply unto them the like sayings I am the Lord thy God from the land of Egypt thou shalt know no God but me J led thee in the wildernes c. But alwayes in such general phrases the promises of grace belong onely to such as beleeve and turne to the Lord the others that remaine hardned shall perish And hitherto of his exceptions against the scriptures which I cited although as I shewed if they had continued Gods true church in the land yet wheÌ„ they were for obstinacie in their synns cast