20. 4. Esai 63. 18. he now wil have them answerable to the Iewes I then blamed and stil doe that men should make Gods holy courts citie and people to be figures of Antichristians of their church and worship But mine opposite to make his words seem to hang togither sayth that now J teach that the Temple of God spoken of 2 Thes. 2. 4. is Antichrists Temple church bodie c. Be it so yet of that scripture there was no controversie betwen M. S. and me and as the house of the Lord God of Jsrael in Ezr. 1. 8. is meant of his true ten ple but the house of their God in Amos 2. 8. and in Hos. 9 8. is meant of an idolatrous Temple so by the Temple of God in Rev. 11. 1. may be understood his true Temple and yet the Temple of God in 2 Thes. 2. may be understood of the Temple of Antichrist And this I sayd upon mine opposites interpretatioÌ„ which wil have the Temple in 2 Thes. 2. to mean the people or church of Rome which are in deed the Gentiles in Rev. 11. the Sodomites Babylonians Egyptians that tread down the Lords holy citie and have built a new Babel For otherweise if he did understand Antichrists sitting in the Temple of God to be his treading down of his Temple as here he treadeth down the holy Citie having ruined and burnt it and keeps it from being reedified as the Babylonians did during their reigne I would not have contended with him about it But then his applying of it to the church of Rome which the Pope hath builded honoured garnished as a most gorgeous harlot would be altogither unfit and agree no better then Babylon did with Sion But of that place 2 Thes. 2. we have spoken at large before Wheras heretofore he pleaded that Antichrist doth not wholly take away the church of God and every trueth and ordinance of the Lord and I answered Neyther did the Deviltake away every trueth and ordinance of God from among the heathens but they reteyned many rites of Gods worship received from their fathers c. First he blameth me as shifting c. for not saying the Divil took not wholly away the church of God from among the heathens I answer if by church he understand the order and constitution of the church the heathens strayed not furder from it then Antichrist hath by his counterfei catholik church and whosoever wil bring them to the trial it wil soon appeare Or if he understand by Church Gods people as he hath now his people in this Romish Babylon Rev. 18. I also say that the Divil took not away the church wholly from the heathens for God had many elect among them whom by means he called from heathenish idols to the true faith of whom there are many instances of sundry persons in the scriptures and I doubt not but there were many moe whose names are written in the book of life The dispersion of Israel among the nations might bring many heathens to the faith as we have an instance in Esth. 8. 17. To that which I sayd that the Divil did not take away wholly every truth and ordinance of God from among the heathen he answereth it is nothing to the purpose seing they are not the church and people of God under his covenant neyther doe so injoy any of them Answ. First I spake of the heathens of old whiles sacrificing was Gods ordinance as the examples that I alleaged shew He answereth of the heathens now whose state is much worse by refusing or falling from the Gospel Secondly his answer is true also of the Antichristian heathens Rev. â—1 2. if it be applied unto them for they are not Gods church and people under his covenant neyther doe they so injoy any of them but they are in the bondage and covenant of Antichrist as before is proved So my answer was to purpose his reply is but the begging of the question Object Take an instance sayth he in one of the particulars which he mentioned where he sayd that the heathens reteyn baptismes or washings among them yet when any of them leave that estate and come to the faith and church of Christ they are to be baptised into the Lords name c. but so may not be doen with those that have received baptisme in the church of Rome or any other apostate churches when they leave such estate c. Answ. First he wresteth my words spoken of the heathens of old which reteyned baptismes or washings whiles they were Gods ordinances and applieth them to their washings now when they are none of Gods ordinances I sayd the ordinances of God reteyned in other nations besides Israel as Altars sacrifices c and alleaged authors before Christs coming in the flesh he setteth down these as my words the heathens reteine c. Had I thus altered the case I should have been charged with shifting and that justly But I acknowledge not tho legal washings sacrifices altars c. of Gentiles or Iewes to be God's ordinances now as they were before Christs death That which he sayth of baptisme not to be repeated I grant and so must he have doen for circumcision among the heathens such as reteyned it for a divine ordinance as they did their sacrifices I instanced the Colchians Egyptians Ethiopians and the Samaritans which latter Mr. Iohnson acknowledged to have still used circumcision and yet were not Gods true Church But this he passed over and answereth not Now he would bring in the heathenish washings at this day which is a plaine tergiversation But of Baptisme we shall speak more hereafter Of Revel 18. 4. TO prove the church of Rome at this day Gods true church he alleadged Rev. 18. 4 Goe out of her my people c. I answered These very words are taken from Jer. 51. 45. My people goe out of the midst of her where by My people the Church of Babylon is not meant but the Israelites Gods lost sheep scattred there upon the mountaines and hills whom first the King of Ashshur had devoured and lastly Nebuchadnerar King of Babel had broken their bones having burned Jerusalem and the temple with fyre c. These Israelites figuring Gods elect are called out of Babylon which God would utterly destroy c. So from Antichrists church which is Babylon Sodom Egypt are Gods elect called out an evident proof that she is none of Gods church whatsoever she pretendeth c. His replies are questions Very well sayth he But are not those words My people the words of the covenant as J sayd Answ. They are but not of any covenant with Babylon and consequently not with the church of Rome which is Babylon at this day Rev. 17. 5. 2. And were not that people now in Babylon the church and people of God under his covenant Answ. They were Gods people and his lost sheep there but their Common wealth
King and captaines 2. King 25. And he should so have applyed these Gentiles that tread down Gods holy ordinances touching his church and worship to the papists the Popes marked soldjers that have the number of his name and not to the Bishops and Preists onely For in the beasts armie there are not onely Kings and captaines which fight against Christ and Christians but all sorts of men both free and bond both smal and great which shal be slayn with the sword of Christ which proceedeth out of his mouth and all the fowles shal be fylled with their fleshes Rev. 19. 17. 18. 21. So not the popish hierarchie alone but all other of their idolatrous religion are the Gentiles in Rev. 11. whom the holy Ghost measureth not amongst his people but casteth out as profane treaders down of his holy things though mine opposite measureth them as Gods true church and in his covenant yet counteth their pastors which are as faithfull and holy as they to be wicked Gentiles So the Beast which killeth Gods witnesses Rev. 11. 7. he expoundeth the Antichristian hierarchie Locusts which are but the heads hornes and cheif members of the Beast For as in Dan. 7. the Lion is the kingdom of Babel both princes and subjects and the Beare the kingdom of the Persians and so all the rest as is there expounded in v. 23. the fourth Beast shal be the fourth kingdom upon earth and the ten hornes out of that Beast or kingdom are sayd to be ten kings v. 24. so the Beast in Rev. 13. is meant of a whole kingdom and not of governours onely And the scripture plainly ynough clâ—areth this saying And they of the people and kinreds and tongues nations shal see their dead bodies c and shal not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves and they that dwel upon the earth shal rejoyce over them and make merry c. Rev. 11. 9. 10. So not the hierarchie onely but popish multitudes also doe belong to this beast and kingdome that murdereth the witnesses of Christ. And here note how mine Opposite himself is driven to confesse that the Church of God and the Beast doe in deed differ much the one from the other but the Church of Rome both hierarchie and people are the Beast as before is prooved therfore the Church of God and the church of Rome doe in deed differ much the one from other and mine adversarie granteth that which overthroweth his own plea. This wil yet further appeare by this that foloweth Whiles the holy citie lieth ruinous troden under foot by the Antichristian Gentiles which keep it from being reedified and measured so long a time 1260. yeres there is an other great citie which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt where also our Lord was crucified Rev. 11. 8. even Babylon the great the mother of fornications and abominations of the earth Rev. 17. 5. which lyeth not ruinous but is stately built dekt and garnished glorifying her self and living diliciously which saith in her hâ—rt I sit 〈◊〉 Queene and aâ—no widow and shal see no sorow and this is the great Citie Rome which in th'Apostle Iohns time reigned over the kings of the earth Rev. 17. 18. but after that became a Christian citie or politie but soon forsook Christ and were Christians in name being in deed Gentiles and a Catholik church sitting and reigning over peoples and multitudes and nations and tongues Rev. 17. 1â— Which albeit myne opposite before laboured to make it differ from the Church of Rome yet I also before took away his reasons And here himself yeildeth so much as wil overthrow him For Note here sayth he that by the great Citie is meant not onely the citie it self c. for as one wel writeth the citie is not onely the Town or peece of ground conteyned within the compâ—sse of the walls therof togither with the Citizens and inhabitants having order and goverment c. but also the whole jurisdiction and goverment of the cite in all places perteyning therto So the streets of this citie reach farr even to all places under the jurisdiction therof and comprehend sundry peoples and kinreds and tongues and nations as here is sayd Wherupon it is fitly compared to the great citie Babylon c. Where yet observe further that the church of Rome being fallen into deep Apostasie and having the man of syn sitting therin as God who hath the citie for his throne the things that are spoken of this citie are also applied to the apostatle estate of that church of Rome and the other churches that are under the jurisdiction of the prelacie of that Sea whersoever and of whatsoever people kinred tongue on nation they be Which application therof J doe also acknowledge as it is observed by and according to the word of God Rev. 11. 8. with Esai 1. 10. Ier. 23. 14. Ezek. 16. 2 -46 Rev. 14. 8. and 17. and 18. c. with Esai 21. 9. and 48. 20. Jer. 50. and 51. 1 -45 Ezek. 16. 2 -35 and c. 23. Ziaoh 2. 6. 7. Thus farr he yeildeth Wherupon it is evident to all that will see how this great citie the glorious church of Rome that killeth Gods witnesses in it is a farr different thing from the holy Citie which that church treadeth down and keepeth from being reedified as the Babylonians having ruinated Ierusalem kept it from being built againe during their reigne So then his comparing of Rev. 11. 8. with Esai 1. 10. and Ier. 23. 14. seemeth to be an unequal match by which he would make the church of Rome as truly Gods as Ierusalem and the Temple were Gods in Esaias time and Ieremies when wicked Iewes likened to Sodomites and Gomorrheans worshiped in them For 1. Ierusalem then was standing here it is tuined and lyeth unbuilt unmeasured cast out from all measuring by the reed of Gods word 2. Sodom and Babylon are never in scripture called the holy citie as Ierusalem is yet here he would have that which God nameth Sodom Egypt Babylon to be in deed Ierusalem 3. Neither Esaie nor Ieremy doe call the holy Citie Sodom or Gomorrha but the wicked people in that holy citie Which may fall out in the truest church on earth that there may as slagitious persons be in it as any in Sodom So in the church of Christ and his Apostles there was Iudas a Divil But Antichrists citie hath no other name then Sodom Egypt Babylon and Rome by whose power and politie Christ was crucified and this name is given it spiritually that is in spirit and trueth as being no way inferiour but beyond them rather in all impietie cloked with hypocrisie In deed Bellarmine pleading for the Pope contendeth against Hierom that Jerusalem might be called Sodom and citeth this very text Esai 1. 10. ye Princes of Sodom but Mr Iunius on whom mine opposite so much relyeth as wee shall see anone answereth
time of their apostasie 2 King 9. 6. c. I answered the Question was not hereby prooved For 1. The Antichristian church is Babylon Rev. 16. 19 and 18. 2. and out of her that is Babylon are Gads people called Rev 18. 4. Now to prove her Gods church they flee to Jsrael wheras the Gentiles were her true types Rev. 11. 2. 9 18. though all the wickednes and hypocrisie of apostate Israel is also found in this Romish Babel His reply is Let the reader judge whether the point in hand touching that phrase of Gods people to imply the covenant of God be not proved by the example of Jsrael Ans. I leave it also to judgment whether the Question touching the church of Rome be proved hereby As for the phrase of Gods people in that church I never denyed it to imply the covenant of God to some visibly as the Martyrs of Christ killed in that church to other some according to the election of grace which shal appeare when they obey theyr calling and are come out of her as before I shewed Moreover he sayth the question was about the Temple of God 2. Thes. 2. wherabout he alleaged that terme and estate of the people of God Rev. 18. 4. but J flee to Babylon c. Answ. A plaine evasion The question was about the church of Rome as before I shewed from his own graunt To justifie her to be Gods church he alleaged 2 Thes. 2. for one proof Rev. 1◠for an other Rev. 18. 4. for a third and now the state of Israel for a fourth His other repetitions I have answered before I alwayes distinguished in Rev. 11. between the Gentiles the Antichristians and the holy citie and court which they have destroyed troden under foot and stil doe Neyther have I denyed but the idolaters in Iudah and Israel were types of Antichristians in part but this I sayd and still say that the more full and perfect type of them is by the holy Ghost shewed us to be in the Sodomites Egyptians and Babylonians Rev. 11. 17. 18. As the Priests of Aaron were types of Christ but Melchisedek was a more full and perfect type of him as the Apostle proveth in Heb. 7. Againe if that which he striveth for were granted him namely that Israel in apostasie typed out Antichristians and that Israel was notwithstanding a true church yet wil it not follow therefore the Antichristian church of Rome is a true church also For the apostasie and idolatrie of Rome is farr greater then Israels as I have elswhere shewed and can easily confirme against any that shall gainsay it 2. Mr. Io. himself maketh Antiochus and his captaines which were of the worst sort of heathens to be types and figures of the Pope and his hierarchie which are the Bishops priests and Deacons of the church of Rome as before we have seen Yet would he not admitt of this conclusion therfore the Bishops Priests and Deacons of the church of Rome are heathens as was Antiochus So his reasoning for Israel though it were true will be no sound proof for Rome Types figures and similitudes hold in some things not in all and it is a very easy thing to deceive men by figures similies allegories But the plaine doctrines in the scripture they are a sure ground and if any doe wrest a type or similitude against them it is to be rejected what colour soever it hath Now mine opposite reasoneth not from these doctrines which would soon end the strife For the scripture plainely sayth that Antichrist the man of syn is the son of perdition and all that beleeve his lyes and folow him are damned 2 Thes. 2. 3. 10. 11. 12. That Antichrist is a lyar denying both the Father and the Son 1 Ioh 2. 22. they that are of God doe overcome him they that are of the world hear him Hereby is knowen the spirit of trueth and the spirit of errour 1 Joh. 4. 3. 6. They that belong to the Lamb Christ on mount Sion have his Fathers name written on their foreheads Rev. 14. 1. and worship not the beast nor receive his mark Rev. 20. 4. but they that belong to Antichrist and have not their names written in the book of life doe worship the beast and receive his mark and shal be tormented for ever Rev. 13. 8. 16. 14. 9. 10. 11. But the church of Rome beleeveth Antichrists lyes worshipeth the Beast and his idols receiveth his mark and is partaker of all his abominations Who now without open injurie to the word of God can make this people the true church of Christ and in the visible covenant of grace On the other hand my Opposites reasons are drawen from that figurative phrase the Temple of God 2 Thes. 2. and the type of apostate Israel and an objection cast in the way to stumble at that else we must be baptised againe as if men that can not tell how to avoyd an inconvenience must run into a mischief to justifie those whom God cōdemneth And upon these and the like grounds are his reasons framed as may be seen throughout his work with some few props of humane authoritie to undershore them Though this brief answer might serve unto all his discourse about the state of Israel yet for to help the weak reader that might stumble at some things layd in his way I wil annex a few moe observations Vnder his wonted title of Errours evasions contradictions c wherwith he chargeth me this is 1. That the Temple of God 2 Thes. 2. 4. is no more Gods temple then Ieroboams idol temples in Jsrael and Bels temple in Babylon yet also J sayd it was to be understood of Gods church people invaded and destroyed by Antichrist c. Answ. This his tautologie I have before answered and cleared my self both of errour and contradiction For that Antichrist should destroy Gods temple and church I proved by the example of the Babylonians burning the Citie Temple of God and captiving his people and by the measuring of the new building Rev. 11. That this being doen Antichrist should have an other Temple and church of his own frame which he should call Gods and Christs I shewed by the Beast arising from the sea and from the earth with hornes like the Lamb Christ Rev. 13. which beast is a kingdom spiritual or ecclesiastical politie a great whore Rev. 17. by Antichrist adified adorned mainteyned which stil he pretendeth to be the ancient catholik church and temple of God Now further for Ieroboam that drew Israel into syn he confesseth that he was a type of Antichrist though he sheweth not wherin But Ieroboams syn was in making a new House or Temple and a new altar to sacrifice in unto God and new priests with new signes as Calves to worship God by 1 King 12. In these things then he must be a type of Antichrist who accordingly if he answereth to his figure must erect
he wrong me as if I made the church of Rome damned and dead for ever that is as if there could be no mercie shewed to the papists for repentance and turning to the Lord. They are onely the reprobate multitude which are damned and dead for ever Many of that church yea even of the hierarchie whom my opposite holdeth to bee the Man of syn the son of perdition being dead in their sins God hath in mercie revived and raised with Christ as he did in the churches of the Gentiles Eph. 2 1â— Coloss. 2. 〈◊〉 But such as are not raised from the death of Antichrist and quickned by Christ they perish for ever And wee speake of that Church now remaining in her synfull death unto which so continuing no salvation is promised but assured destruction threatned 2. Thes. 2. Rev. 14. 9. 10. 11. Thus we see how notwithstanding all his turning and winding and backing his errour with learned mens names these Gentiles the church of Antichrist and worshipers of the Man of syn are by the sentence of God dead in sins as were the Gentiles before Christ gave them life That such of them as the Lord shall in mercie raise up out of the grave of poperie shall escape the second death the rest doe remain under Gods wrath dead in syn and shall die in torment In the end to that which I shewed of that whores death otherweise and of her burning with fire Rev. 18. 7. 8 and of the joy which the heavenly multitude shal have at her destruction Rev. 18. 20. 1â— 1. 2. 3. mine opposite seemeth to assent referring it to the Citie resembled as he sayth by Babylon and Babylons destruction that was of old Rev. 18. with Ier. 50. 51. Thus the truth hath wrung out at last an acknowledgement from him as the feare and light of his conscience made him acknowledge at the first For he began with the Church of Rome thus acknowledging it to be fallen into most sinful and deep defection and apostasie and so to be a notorious harlot and idolatres This notorious harlot the holy Ghost calleth Babylon the great the mother of horlots and abominations of the earth Rev. 17. 5. which is meant of the Citie Rome v. 18. but of an ecclesiastical state such as is in that citie at this day And that Babylon or church it is whole destruction is threatned in Rev. 18. and for which there shall bee ioy and singing Alleluiah for that God hath judged the great whâ—re which did corrupt the earth with her fornication and shed the bloud of his servants Rev. 1â— 1. 2. 3. c. For the destruction of this great whore which in deed is no other then the Church of Rome mine opposite sayth with me they shal be so farr from mourning at her funeral as they shal rejoyce with the heavenly multitude and sing Hallelujah when the Lord hath given Sodoms judgement on her and they see her smoke rise up for evermore Rev. 19. 1. 2. 3. Of his own mouth now let him be judged with what truth equity conscience he hath pleaded for the church of Rome to bee the Temple of God the church of God in his covenant of grace and to have his baptisme the seale of his covenant even in that adulterous and most sinfull estate wherin she standeth at this day under her Pastor Antichrist whom she honoureth and worshipeth beleeving his lies serving his idols and trusting to merit heaven by the wicked works which that Man of syn hath taught her But that God for a reward of his popish errour in advancing the Ministers above the church and the pastor above his fellow ministers gave him over to this second errour who would have thought that a man of understanding would so bitterly have inveighted against me for denying her to be Christs true Church and that he would for defense of such a notorius harlot have forsaken and written against his own former good testimony which hee witnessed against her Gods counsels are unsearchable and let all that feare him heare what the Spirit sayth unto us Hearken unto me now therefore ôye children and attend to the words of my mouth Let not thine heart decline to her wayes goe not astray in her paths For shee hath east downe many wounded yea many strong men have been slain by her Her house is the way to hell going down to the chambers of death Prov. 7. 24 27. Of other Writers TO his citations of Polanus Keckerman c. I answered That diverse men were mistaken in judging of that rotten Church of Rome which would help these our opposites nothing who have seen and acknowledged better and now goe back And I instanced sundry others contrary minded as Mr. Carwright Mr. Perkins D. Fulk D. Willet Mr. Bale all our country men who deny the church of Rome to be the true Church of Christ. Mine opposite replieth that I say in particular of Polanus that he was mistaken and in this for that he sayd that Antichrist must sit in the Temple of God not Jewish or at Jerusalem but Christian c. wherein as his manner is he drepraveth both my words and meaning For I never dreamt that Antichrist should sit in the Iewish Temple at Ierusalem but in the Christian Church falsly so called as Mr. Iunius nameth it in Annot. on Rev. 11. But Polanus pleadeth otherwise for the church of Rome as mine opposite hath set down his words Chr. plea. p. 212. And in that I iudge he was mistaken and not I onely but many moe with me men of greater learning and before me though mine opposite leaveth it with this reproch That all in my judgement are mistaken hereabout but my selfe and my followers And presently after to that which I alleaged from Mr. Cartwright Perkins c. he wisheth they had written more advisedly and more soundly And why even for his former often refuted reasons of the Temple of God and Baptisme in that church wherein he doth but beg the question and answereth not them For I named to him Mr. Perkins reasons that the Papists doctrine doth rase the very foundation of Religion and his 4. arguments in a treatise for that purpose Now to these he answereth not one word But the Temple of God the Temple of God and Antichrist must sit in the Temple of God and Martyres out of the Church of Rome and where else had they their baptisme these are his common bucklers To which I have answered before And now that the Reader may further see how not I onely but many before me even such as he nameth in his book for him as D. Whitakers Mr. Broughton Mr. Brightman and others are direct against him I will set down their testimonies What Mr. Bale Mr. Cartwright D. Fulk M. Perkins and D. Willet have written I have shewed heretofore and them hee regardeth not Whereas Bellarmine would conclude from the protestants graunt that the church of Rome