¶ The Supremacie of Christian Princes ouer all persons throughout their dominions in all causes so wel Ecclesiastical as temporall both against the Counterblast of Thomas Stapleton replying on the Reuerend father in Christe Robert Bishop of VVinchester and also Against Nicolas Sanders his Uisible Monarchie of the Romaine Church touching this controuersie of the Princes Supremacie Ansvvered by Iohn Bridges The Princes charge in his institution to ouersee the direction of Gods lawe DEVTER 17. After he shall be settled in the throne of his kingdom he shal write out for himself in a volume the copie of this Law taking the same of the Priests of the Leuitical tribe and he shal haue it with him reade it al the days of his life that he may learn to fear the Lord his God and keepe the wordes and ceremonies of him which are written in this law c. ¶ PRINTED AT LONDON by Henrie Bynneman for Humfrey Toye 1573. · HONI · SOIT · QVI · MAL · Y · PENSE · E. R ¶ To the moste high and moste excellent Princesse Elizabeth by the grace of God Queene of Englande France and Ireland defender of the Faith of Christ and in earth next vnder God of the Church of England and Ireland in all Ecclesiastical and temporall causes the supreme Head Gouernor ALbeit most Gracious Soueraigne I might be vvoorthily noted of presumption in dedicating these my trauailes to your Maiestie as vvel for the basenesse of my skill calling as for the vnreuerent demeanour of the aduersaries that here I ansvvere vnvvorthie vvhom your Highnesse should deigne to loke vpon yet bothe bicause the matter entreateth moste of a Princes estate and that vpon the chiefest point therof belonging in general to al Christian Princes but in especiall to your Maiestie against vvhom they chiefly direct their malice and in maintenaunce vvhereof your Maiestie direct your gouernement and herein haue giuen a mirror to al christian Princes to folovv and be partakers in their common vveales of the lyke blessings wherwith God hath beautified your Highnesse and established youre authoritie I thought it therfore not vnfit setting my self and them aside with all such by matters as incidently fal out in disputation betvvixt the Bishop and master Feckenham of me these my aduersaries â–ª to conâ—…ecrate this argumente of Supremacie to youre moste excellent Maiestie as to vvhom chiefly in your dominions next vnder Christ it dothe pertaine VVhich your Highnesse so nobly maintaines by practise of godlie gouernment hovve euer we by the vvord and argument do defend it There is no controuersie at this day betvvixt vs and the enimies of the gospel more impughed thaÌ„ this one of the Supremacie nor more bookes compiled more libels scattered more vaunts made of truth on their partie more sclaunders deuised of oure doctrine and your Maiesties Title more secrete conspiracies and open treasons against your Royal person and state of the Realme than our aduersaries make only for this Supremacie Shall Sathan then vse al this double diligence in promoting the pride tyrannie of his Antichrist the man of sinne the foreigne vsurper of all Christian kingdoms and shall the children of god be negligent in defence of the kingdom of Christ of the Lordes anoynted of the dutifull office and lavvfull authoritie of their naturall Soueraigne â–ª Other meanes I graunt may be had to suppresse their furious dealing And God bee blessed therefore that hath furnished your Maiestie vvith povver couÌ„sell authoritie lavv vvisedome learning vertue courage and al other Princely habilities â–ª suffiâ—…iet to maintein your Highnesse Title protect that portion of Christes Church vvhich he hath committed to your most Gracious gouernment in peace and truth prosperously 〈◊〉 your enemies VVherein as your Maiestie hath euer most zâ—…lously sought and set forth the glorie of god â—…e hath so glorified you again as he hath promised 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 glorificabo that your highnesse may say as king Dauid sayd â–ª he hath deliuered you out of your enimies hands and defeated all their purposes he hath established you a kingdom here on earth in peace and righteousnesse and hath prepared in heauen a Kingdom for you in glorie and eternitie Novv although this be so cleeâ—…e that euen the enimies themselues coÌ„fesse God vvorks vvith you God fights for you God hath takeÌ„ your hart into his handes that haue taken his quarel into yours yet sith the 〈◊〉 do mutteâ—… sclander your Highnesse to take suche kind of GouernmeÌ„t on you as vvere not coÌ„petent as the Pope had vvont to do your Highnes is furthest from if this your claime be not proued to be grouÌ„dedon Gods vvord if those enuious be not coÌ„â—…inced by euident argumeÌ„ts of the seripture al the foresaid prosperitie is couÌ„ted but earthly blessings and such as other vvorldly Princes haue All the due authoritie is 〈◊〉 but extorted violence neither is the mouth of the adoersarie stopped neyther is the mind of the subiect satisfied And therfore vvhen al is don â–ª there is no better meanâ—… to may 〈◊〉 this Title than euen by learning 〈◊〉 for to me it to the vttermost and to fight vvitâ—… the vveapon of Gods vvord for it vvhicheâ—…s sharpeâ—… to vvoâ—…nde the aduersaries heart and conscience than any tvvo edged svvord But some vvil say this is sufficiently done by otherâ—… learned labours vvhen both in the dayes of your Maiesties Father of most renoumed memorie euen the best learned of our aduersaries did not only confesse it but vvrote so effectually in defence therof that shamefully aftervvard reuolting their guiltie conscieÌ„cebore vvitnesse against themselues nor they coulde euer ansvvere their ovvne vvritings And also after that in the godlie gouernment of youre Highnesse blessed Brother many other more excellent fathers in vvriting did confirme it And novv lastly in this your Maiesties happie Reigne diuers famous and lerned men to the further confirming of the godlie and confounding the enimie therein haue vvritten vppon this argument Yet sith oure aduersaries haue neuer doone thervvith but sette on a freshe lyke to him that vvhen in vvrastling he was euer cast of pride and vainglorie vvoulde neuer acknovvledge that he had any fall I thought good to make euident to all your Maiesties subiects euen to the enimies themselues the places vvhere they shamefully fel and lie stil in their errour rather than to vvrastle vvith such vvarblers And yet if they start vp again to trie a further pluck vvith them and by the strength of Gods inuincible truth so to ouerthrovv them that as fast as they boast cauill and sclaunder the truth of our cause and the goodnesse of your Maiesties quarell shall shevve it selfe the cleerer although the simplier handled A number of other vvhom I knovve coulde haue done it farre better vvho may also at their discretions further trauaile in it And in deede vvhere the most of this vvas done a good vvhile sith it vvas layde aside thus long expecting if any other vvould attempte it
doo Will ye haue a woman weare a mans apparell it is flat forbidden by Gods worde Will ye haue a Quéene fight hir self in a battaile and breake a speare as a king may do In déed some mannish women as the Quéene of Amazons Thomyris Semiramis and other haue so doone but it is not sitting And by your owne reason the imbecillitie of theyr kynde doth cléere them And a number of such other things may be reckoned vp Shall we now saye the Quéene is not supreme gouernour ouer these persons and causes bicause hir selfe can not doe them Likewyse for a king that is a chylde you know he can not fight in battell himselfe neyther can he himselfe sit in iudgement and debate rights and wrongs in ciuil doubtes manie mo things can he himselfe not doe euen bicause as ye say he hath a defect in iudgemeÌ„t Hath he therfore in these ciuill and temporall thyngs no supreme gouernment Thus ye sée still your examples faile yea they make cleane agaynst you for as a supreme gouernor may wel be a supreme gouernor in those things that he himself can not do so a christeÌ„ princes supreme gouernmeÌ„t ouer al ecclesiastical persons in al ecclesiastical causes is nowhit hindred although the prince he or she yong or old can not do the functions ecclesiastical nor be an ecclesiast person The second argument is that he so often and al the Papists vse of the excellencie of the minister in his ministration aboue the Prince To this he citeth the saying of Saint Paule Let men â—…o esteeme vs as ministers of Christ and dispensers of his mysteries To whiche ministerie kings are not called And here is againe alledged the storie of â—…ziae that presumed to offer incense and was punished with â—…eaprie The effect of all the argument he knitteth vp thus Siergo minister c. If therfore the minister of the Church of Christ exercise a greater and more diuine ministerie than the king or any other prince howe is the king the Supreme heade of that churche wherein he seeth certaine ministers greater than himselfe I answere this is a fallation secundum quid ad simpliciter We graunt in the respect of his ministerie the minister is aboue all Princes But this pertayneth to the actions and function of the minister and not to the ouersight and direction that all those actions and functions be orderly done Nowe this béeing but a common argument Master Saunders vrgeth it further by comparison of eyther estate the Prince and the Priest from the olde Testament to the newe saying Ac nimirum illud c. And thys namely I seeme to take by my right the authoritie of any Christian king in his christian kingdom is not greater than was in tymes paste the authoritie of any Iewishe kyng among the people of the Iewes for if the Citie of God to whyche Chryste of his owne name hathe giuen a newe name maye verily bee the more woorthie but can not be inferiour to the Churche of the Iewes â–ª Surely then it followeth that a christian king ouer his christian kingdome can not obtaine more power than a kyng of the Hebrue nation did obteyne among the Hebrâ—…wes For howe muche the more any Common weale is subiecte too their earthly Kyng the authoritie of that common weaâ—…e is so muche the lesse But the authoritie of the Churche of Christe is not lesse than the authoritie of the Synagoge of the Iewes bycause in the churche of Christe those thinges were fulfilled to the verie image of the things whiche in the Synagoge of the Iewes were scarce figured by the naked shadowes As the truthe in deede in greater than the image so againe the image is greater than the shadowe but this is euident that the authoritie in times past of the only king is lesser than the authoritie of his christian kingdome or of hys Bishops But if it be so then the christian king which is both lesse than the church and the bishops of his kingdom cannot be immediatly vnder Christ the head of the churche This argument is intricate and full of many inuersed cringle crangles to shewe a face of déepe and subtill knowledge beyonde the simple mans capacitie whyche kynd of reasonyng is more suspicious than to edifying The effecte of the argument standeth all on this The greater authoritie is giuen to a christian king the lesser haue the Priestes and the churche But the priestes and the churche haue not lesse authoritie but aboue a christian king Ergo the king hath not supreme authoritie To the Maior that the greater authoritie is giuen to a christian king the lesser haue the priests and the churche he sayeth nothing And yet some what is to be sayde thereto it is not so cléere as he makes it For sith eyther of these thrée haue their authorities in dyuers considerations the Priests authoritie may be greater than the kings authoritie in one respecte that is of his diuine actions and ministerie and yet in an other of the gouernement and publike direction the kinges authoritie is greater than his And so althoughe the Churches authoritie in one respecte be greater than bothe the Kings and the Priestes as they are bothe but membres and children of the Churche yet in regarde that the one is a Pastour and the other a gouernour and both of them Fathers and guyders as it were vnto the church their authorities againe are greater than the Churches And this also sheweth the falshood of the Minor that the Priestes and the Churche haue not lesse authoritie but are aboue the prince Which is not true but in suche respectes as nothing hinder the supreme gouernement that we giue the prince But Maister Saunders to confirme this to bée simply true the prince to be inferior to the Priests and people will proue it by his comparison of the state of the olde and newe Testament And first he will haue the state of the olde Testament in the Churches gouernement to be a figure of the newe But in the estate of the old Testament the Prince was vnder the priest and the people Ergo it must be so in the new To the maior we graunte him the gouernment of the Church in the old testament to be a figure of the churches gouernment in the new testameÌ„t And remember this well that here M. Saunders buyldes vpon For if he himselfe shal be found to swarue from it afterwarde when he findeth it shall make agaynst hym then let him blame himselfe and let vs note bothe inconstancie and cantradiction in him who playeth the snayle puttyng in and out his hornes and will say and eate his worde as he thinketh best to his aduantage And this is the fashions of them all in the examples of the old testament as we haue séene the practise of M. Feckenham M. Stapleton which is a subtile false and vnstedfast kind of dealing But go to we denie the minor that in the state of the
and the childe after the sixth yeare of his gouernement beyng deade God placed a woman ouer the kingdome of Englande who also ought to haue bene furder from gouerning the Church than a childe for euen the kinde whiche at the laste displeased not in a childe so displeased the holy Ghost in a woman so farre as pertaineth to the gouernment of the Church that he in whom Christ spake doubted not to write I permitte not a woman to teach in the Church If you recken the yeares of King Edwardes raigne to inferre by the taking of him awaye so soone Gods misliking of his gouernement as you still shewe your malicious and ouer saucie constructions of gods iudgementes so ye bewray withall the foudnesse of your argumentes Did not Quéene Marie raigne a shorter while than hée and why note ye not the yeares of hir raigne also but this you ouerpasse in sylence and turne your argumente to hir kynde in that shee was a woman to argue Gods displeasure for the Princes gouernemente of the Churche but ye alleage nothyng that ye alledged not before oute of Sainte Paule I permitte not a vvoman to teache in the Churche neyther to vsurpe authoritie ouer the man but to bee in sylence Trow you Maister Saunders this is to bée stretched to gouernemente that no woman maye haue anye authoritie to gouerne a man if ye construe it thus howe will ye make your former saying good that the ryghte of a kingdome pertayneth no lesse to vvomen than to men alledging the examples of Debora Athalia and Alexandra and the lawe Num. 27. ye muste néedes therefore confesse that he speaketh there no otherwyse than â—…ée dothe 1. Corinthians 14. of women not simply but of suche women as are wiues Neyther of all authoritie but of authoritie ouer the husbande Neyther of all speaking exhorting or commaunding but of the publique ministerie of preaching And thus doth your owne Cardinall Caietane expounde it Docere supple publice c. neque dominari directe hoc respicit vxores to teach to wite publikly c. neither to rule this is directly spokeÌ„ of vviues And so Catharinus hic locus manifeste de coniugata intelligitur c. This place manifestlye is vnderstoode of a vvife in the same sence vvherein it is read in another place let vvomen holde their peace in the Churches for it is not permitted to them to speake but to bee subiecte euen as the lavve saith But by the vvaye vvee muste bevvare that iniurie be done to none Although by no meanes it be the office of anye vvoman to teache notvvythstanding if anye vvoman bee endued vvith singular grace of God for God is free from all lavve that coulde bee able to doe these thyngs vvhen it shoulde bee thought meete shee vvere not to be hindred chiefelye hauing the gifte of prophecie but it vvere lavvfull for hir to speake freelye As is read of Olda and Debora that iudged the people of Israell as is apparant in the booke of the iudges Doth not the Apostle also warne that the former holde his peace if it be reuealed to another For we know that that glorious and one of the most deere spoâ—…ses of Christ Saint Katherine of Senes taught in times paâ—…e and hath made sermons yea euen in the publique consistoâ—…e of the Pope although she toke not vpon hir these things but with good leaue of Christs owne vicaâ—… who best knewe in 〈◊〉 to be the true spirite of God and the feruencie of charitie to be giuen hir to edifie the Churche in those troublous tymes when the scisme raigned c. Thus farre and furder saith this Popishe Bishop whereby it appereth that the Papists theÌ„ selues vnderstande not this sentence of Saint Paule for a simple debarre to all women no not to preache in the open Churche if neede so required so that she haue the Popes leaue And can the Pope giue leaue in a time of scisme to maintaine his factioÌ„ when two or thrée Popes striue for the triple diademe and to Saint hir for hir labour And shall it not be lawfull for a Christian Quéene not attempting hir selfe to preache to set forth by the authoritie due to all princes suche lawes whereby gods truth maye be preached by those that are lawfully called therevnto may not a Quéenâ—… by vertue of hir royall office in the open assemblye of hir owne subiects speake exhort persuade and commaunde hir people being also the Church of Christ to abolish al errors and receiue the onely truth of God was it lawfull for the Empresse Irene to publishe hir decrees in the Churche for the erecting of Images against the worde of God and is it not lawfull for the Quéenes Maiestie by publique decrées to pull them downe and forbid the worship of them according to gods worde this sentence therefore euen by theyr owne witnesse is but wrested to debarre a womans gouernment of the Church But Maister Saunders procéeding on his argument for Quéene Marie saith To the same purpose it came that the greate goodnesse of God called such a Queene to the rule of the kingdome that both sawe this selfe same thing and confessed it For Queene Marie not onely toke not this proude title of the head of the Church but also when she was admonished of others â–ª that she would be like hir father she brought forth most weightie reasons why she ought not to do it VVhervpon she chiefely exhorting therto that title was omitted and the proper honour restored to the successors of Peter If the title as ye saye M. Saunders be proude Quéene Marie had done wel to leaue it but your Pope not ouer wel to take it howbeit this title as King Henry and King Edwarde before toke it was no proude title but a title of their charge and duetie And therefore she ought to haue retained it nor did well in leauing it and rendring it to a foraigne prelate that had nought to do therwith And in whoÌ„ in deede it is both a proude and an Antichristian title both spoyling Christian Princes of their principall office in their particular estates and also bereauing Christ of his glory ouer his vniuersall Churche Neither can he claime it as successor of Peter Peter neuer hauing the possessioÌ„ of it And what waightie reasons soeuer she persuaded hir selfe withall to shake it off she taking the kingdome on hir the waight and burden lay still on hir charge before god And if your reason be ought of the effect and sequele of this hir refusall into what extréeme miserie was this Realme broughte in so shorte a time by the Legates spoyling by the Prelats burning by the Italians pilling by the FrenchmeÌ„s winning by the Spaniardes oppressing and by gods diuine Iustice scourging the Realme with strange diseases droughts waters dearthes to conclude the Quéene hir selfe and crowne impouerished all the Realme in daunger of perpetuall thraldome and vtter vndoyng if God of his infinite mercie
But sith none hath aduentured on it I thought it my dutie to yeelde to the godlie and vrgent requestes of those personages that vnderstanding I had priuately delte therin required the publishing of my labours to the vvhich I condescended a great deale the vvillinger partly bicause it touched vvithall the defence of that Reuerende fathers innocencie and learning the Bishop of VVinchester vvho had although briefly yet most orderly and exactly handled this questioÌ„ before and vvas oppugned by this aduersarie neither vvas it for diuers causes thought so coÌ„uenient for the Bishop himselfe to ansvvere and I for my part was bounde in so iust a cause to defend him But chiefly for that it spared not most opprobriously to slaunder your most excelleÌ„t Maiestie your title your state your gouernment your most honorable and godlie CouÌ„saile your nobilitie your Bishops your clergie your magistrats your iustices your people and all estates of your dominions your doctrine your faith your religion yea the truth and glorie of God vvhich your Highnesse defendes to all vvhich I and all other are bounde in principall I thought not good therefore to stay it any longer and suffer these vncircumcised Philistines blaspheming the truth of God reproching the Lords anoynted and rayling on the hoste of Israel to stand thus and vaunt vnansvvered but lette this ansvvere that I had thus farforth made in priuate â–ª come abrode to others Promising god vvilling by your Maiesties fauourable protection to deale further vvith them and to shevvethe continuall practise hereof hovve in all ages since Christendome began to flourishe vnder the Great Constantine that christian Emperors Kings and Princes haue dealte as doth your Maiestie in the ouersight of Ecclesiastical matters till the Pope by little and little encroching on them not onely spoyled them of this their chief authoritie but of their temporal estates and vvorldly kingdoms yea of their goodes liues also In the meane season for this that is here alreadie ansvvered vnto I most humbly craue your Highnesse acceptation vvhose right is here defended by truth from sclanders that by iustice defendeth our right from iniuries Most hartily beseeching almightie God as he hitherto hath vouchsafed so to blesse preserue continue and prosper your Royal Maiestie to the loÌ„g establishing of your Highnes Throne to the vtter vanquishing of all your spirituall and bodily priuie and open enimies to the godlie comforte and quiet gouernment of all your faithful subiects and to the prosperous aduancement of Gods euerlasting glorie thorough Iesus Christe AMEN Youre Maiesties humble and obedient subiect IOHN BRIDGES The Preface to the Reader IT is nowe a good while since deare Christian Reader that this maister Stapletons Counterblast was blowne ouer the seas from Louaine against the Reuerende father in Christe the Bishop of Winchester or rather against the Quenes Maiestie and hir Supremacie was thus farre answered vnto as here is nowe set foorth Which may easily be perceiued by the reading for there is little or nothing altered except a sentence or two here there added as things haue falne out since I speake this that thou shouldest not here loke for any great or exquisite penning thinking that after so loÌ„g a leysure some more notable and exacter answere should come forth Our aduersaries vaunt much of their wittes herein and chieâ—…y this my matefellow master Stapleton to be verie fresh pregnant in readinesse of answering for he is his mothers sonne and hath it on his fingers ends Howbeit I may say to these as Apelles sayd to one who when he had drawne a picture Lo quoth he I did this apace Some thinkes quoth Apelles it is so ruÌ„ningly done And thus it falleth often out with our Loâ—…anists writings but Sat cito si sat bene It is soone ynough if it be well inough say I when all is done The reasâ—… why this answere came forth no soner are these First I kept it priuate to my self abyding if either the Bishop against whome it was made or any other woulde aunswere to it Secondly I heard at the length that Maister Nowell the Deane of Poules trauayled in it whose learning and wisedome being suche as all the aduersaries could neuer withstand I surceased to proceede any further Thirdly when I perceiued he set not out his answere neither I thought it best to lay myne asyde also Thinking that either he was stayed vpoÌ„ som weightier consideration than I did know or else that he did thinke the boke not worth the answering at al as in very deed to the lerned marker it is not M. Nowel had answered Dorman in muche like matter before which were the occasioÌ„s why it slept so loÌ„g But since that time as many haue mused and talked much on the matter so they haue not a little marueiled why nothing was said vnto it The argument was great and waightie not so muche whether nowe the Supremacie belonged to the Pope as whether it pertained to the ciuil Magistrate and whether the Queenes Maiestie did claime and hold it by right or no The parties in controuersie were of note as wel master Feckenham among the Papistes as the Bishop of Winchester whose estimation among vs is not more for his authoritie than his name amoÌ„g other nations for his learning Nowe when Master Stapleton stept in lyke a lustie yoncker and blewe vp this Counterblast betwene these twain so hotly hallowing for answer out of hande to be made by the Bishop therto al this while had none some did interprete it that he was a very vnfit matche for so graue a Bishop as to say the truth the match was nothing euen And therefore I wite not the Bishop if he vouchsafed not to answer him especially seing home his booke was so pestred with scoldes and scorners Rhetorike Neither will the horse of noble corage strike at euery brauling curre that barks at his heeles But when others missecoÌ„strued this to the worst said the Counterblast was so notably blown that the Bishop durst not nor was able he nor any other to answer it wheÌ„ vpon the head of all this M. Saunders Latine volume coÌ„mes forth although chiefly on the Popes visible Monarchie yet once again entring into this questioÌ„ of the Princes Supremacie with fresh matter as he bosteth with such inuincible arguments against it that all are but vnlearned starke fooles and cleane madde that do defend it and not thus content so depresseth the Princes estate that he will now proue the Pope hath interest to depose al Christian Princes and release their sâ—…biects of their sworn obedience which valiant champion vauÌ„teth also of his felow Stapletons noble peece of woorke againste the Princes Supreme Gouernment saying in his prayse Quod argumentum â–ª Thomas Stapletonus omnium copiosissimè tractaâ—…it in â—…o Libro quenâ—… 〈◊〉 eloquentia doctrina refertum contra Hornum Psâ—…udoepiscopum Wintoniensâ—… edidiâ—… vvhiche argument Thomas Stapleton hathe moste copiously handeled in that booke vvhiche beeing replenished
false Knowledge therfore is not alwayes taken so precisely to be onely of true things but graunting you this precisenesse that knowledge is only taken to be true thingâ—… yet you do yll herein bicause ye take after your ordinarie custome Pro concesso controuersum that to be graunted that is in question whether your or our part be true or false héerin Yea why maye not we saye and that wyth greater reason that you take the truthe for falsehoode and falsehoode for truthe And so you nor any of your syde notwithstanding all youre great bragges and thys your clearkly booke haue anye true knowledge VVell maye ye saye as ye doo moste falsly and to youre poore wretched soule as well in this as in other poyntes moste dangerously beleue the contrarie but know it yee can not vnlesse it were true for knowledge is only of true things and as the Philosopher sayth Scire est per causas cognoscere Do ye know whose words al these be and yet ye sée how they serue our turne far better than yours M. Sta. bycause our cause resteth on the truth which is the infallible worde of God Deus est verax God is true yours is grounded on the doctrines of men Omnis auteÌ„ homo mendax but euery man is a lier And therfore is it lesse maruel sith ignorance and falsehood knowledge truth are al one that ye account somuch of ignorance make it to be the mother of deuotion that ye kepe down the people in ignoraÌ„ce which conspireth with falshood cannot abide knowledge that is linked with truth as ye haue loÌ„g kept the truth vnder a bushel so yet you caÌ„not abide that it shuld come to the knowlege of the people perceiuing the sith knowledge hath begon to spring in the world our cause withal as the truth hath florished yours hath drouped as that falshod wherfore your freÌ„â—… haue cried out vpoÌ„ al good letters séeing that their cause hathe had no greater enimie than knowledge is no greater maynteyner than ignoraunce Qui male agit odit lucem nec venit ad lucem ne opera eius arguantur He that doth euill sayth Christ hateth the lighte nor commeth to the light lest his workes should be reproued Next vnto this you note a rabblement of vntruthes but ye neither number them in youre Calendar but onely marke them with a starre in the forbead nor in youre replie say any more vnto them than this I will not nor tyme will serue to discusse them but why woulde youre will and your time serue you to chalenge them for vntruths and not serue you to discharge your chalenge and your owne truth in prouing them so to be but go to I see there is no remedie wée must tarie your leysure vntil that youre will come on you and that your tyme will serue you Many horrible erroures and superstitions of Monkerie The. 29. vntruth reprochefull and slaunderous This was so vntrue that all the world rang of it and the Papists themselues cried out theron Although ye were in the Tower in king Edwardes tyme that was not for any doubte of the supremacie for that ye still agnised but for other poynts of religion touching the ministration of the sacraments The. 30. vntruth This was not the cause of his imprisonment as shall appeare Here in his beadroll thoughe ye sée he denyeth it â—…latly yet in his counterblast where he toucheth the same he dare not be so impudent But saith as I vnderstande so that if hée be chalenged of rash dealing to affirme that for an vntruth that he stammereth in no will he saye looke my beadroll and ye shall fynde that I denyed it flatly and boldly withoute any stammering at the matter If againe this bolde flatnesse be proued a â—…atte lie â—…ushe will he saiâ—… I referred it in saying it shoulde appeare to my counterblast where I declare no further than I vnderstode by my freendes let it light on them if it be a lie thus cunningly Maister Stapleton hath handled the matter But a manifeste lye it is that he maketh howsoeuer he auonch or mollifie the same For this was a special cause of his imprisonment as those can tell that be yet liuing who were sente to him and to others to persuade them therein And by whome soeuer hée vnderstoode it it is but M. Stapletons and his misseinformers lye And where he would excuse the matter bicause he was examined in the matter of Iustification doth it follow therfore he was not in also for the matter of the sacrament being principally then in controuersie The Bishop only said be was in for other pointes of religion and namely touching the Sacrament but sée howe pretily M. Stapl. would bleare the readers eyes with quarelling at this half point of the sentence least the reader shoulde marke wherin the Bishop principally charged M. Feckenham that hee had confessed this article of supremacie all King Edwardes dayes and so knewe and acknowledged it then contrarie to his pretence of ignorance nowe therin And this digresseth not from the matter in hand But from this M. Stapleton slippeth in great silence and sayeth not a word therto but dalieth about other matters to finde the readers play And so by his owne rule confesseth by not denying the verye poynt in hande that M. Feckenham all king Edwards time though he were in the Tower yet euer hee agnized this title then that he refuseth nowe Wherevnto also you agreed and promised to professe and preache the same in open auditorie wheresoeuer you should be appoynted Wherevpon a right worshipfull Gentleman procured your deliuerance The. 31. vntruth slanderous He was not deliuered vpon any promise of recantation but to bee disputed withall Here M. Stapl. maketh muche adoe to conuince the Bishop of an vntruth and to make it seeme more probable he citeth diuers honourable and worshipfull to witnesse and al nothing to the purpose in hand excusing M. Feckenham of that wherwith no bodie charged him and answering nothyng but by silence consessing that that he was charged withal The bishop made no mention of any conference or disputation had with M. Feckenham after his departure oute of the tower but of that conference whiche was with him maister Moreman and maister Crispine whyle they were in the Tower. When at their owne suite to the councell they desired to haue some learned men with whom to conferre especially about the sacrifice of the Masse the ministration vnder bothe kyndes and the ministration vpon a table and not an altare And at this their sute Master Storie the Bishop then of Chichester and Maister Roberte Horne then parson of All Hallows in Breadsteat now bishop of Winchester were appointed by the honourable counsel to deals with them which they did by the space of a moneth at sundry tymes till that Master Feckenham did â–ª consent with them in all these thrée poyntes and so by maister Hobbies
wordes he circumscriâ—…eth them with a parenthesis and seuereth it in the poynting as the bishop did from the text which is argument inough to any but to contentious quarellers who will euer busie themselues to séeke as they say a knot in a rushe that it was not put in as the expresse words of the text but as the opening of the sentence To returne therefore his owne wordes to him selfe with suche homely shiftes an ill cause must be furthered and with suche patit quarels a good cause must be bayted at and chalenged for lewde swaruing and homely shiftes And yet his manifest swaruing from text letter sense and all without either difference of letter or of poynting must be neither lewde nor homely shifte at all but good and Cathelike translating with him Iosaphat vsed his Princely authoritie in the reformation of religion The. 44. vntruthe The scripture termeth not any suche princely authoritie Here M. Stapleton standeth altogither on the terme of the Scripture â–ª would to God alwayes the Papistes would thus not in termes so muche as in the truthe of matter be leueled by the scripture But here he dothe it euen as the deuill obiected scripture vnto Christ not to shewe any regarde onely aboue all other to the authoritie of the scripture but to picke a quarell with the Bishop althoughe vntruthe he can finde â—…one The Bishop aâ—…ouched not that this very terme is here in the scripture nor he stoode vpon termes and therefore though the scripture termeth it not yet hath the Bishop committed no vntruthe He onely sayd that losaphat hath â–ª no small commendation in the scriptures for that he vsed his Princely authoritie in the reformation of religion If you can improue the sentence and effect of this then hardly chalenge the Bishop for an vntruthe But this can ye not doe and therefore ye flée to termes and let the matter alone whiche is the principall and is manyfest in the Scripture that he vsed his princely authoritie in those thinges that he dyd yea and your selfe confesse that he vsed care and diligence about the directing of ecclesiasticall matters that he reformed religion that he commaunded and appoynted the ecclesiasticall persons the high Priest and all other so well as temporall in their ecclesiasticall functions This your selfe haue graunted and confessed bothe in sentence and in termes also and the texte is sâ—… playne ye coulde not denie it But did he direct refourme commaunde and appoynt â–ª and all without authoritie so to doe and what authoritie had hé besides his princely authoritie Ergo euen by your owne confession he refourmed religion by his princely authoritie â–ª as the Bishop sayde And therefore euen your selfe that accuse him acquite him also of this vntruthe He did commaunde and prescribe vnto the thiefe Priests c. The. 45. vntruth There appeareth not in the scripture any suche prescription made vntò the chiefe Priestes That it appeareth in the scripture â–ª it is most euident and your selfe haue confessed it in your Counterblast cap. 13. fol. 50. to the which place where it is aunswered I remitte the Reader At the commandement of the king concerning things of the Lorde The 46. vntruth Those words coÌ„cerning things of the lord are no words of the text but falsly added to holy scripture Ye are very hastie in nicking on your score M. Sta. and so hastie that ye haue no leasure or will take none to examine your text The olde translation hath in deede iuxta maÌ„datuÌ„ regis imperiuÌ„ domini according to the coÌ„mandement of the king and the coÌ„mandemeÌ„t of the Lord. But the Hebrue text hath as those that are skilful in that tongue can tell â—…edibrei â–ª Ieâ—…oua which â—…atablus noteth to signifie In vel de rebus Domini In or concerning the things of the Lord euen as the B. saide so that he is clerely acquited by suche learned interpreters as your skill M. Stapleton â–ª will not easily confute And when ye haue coÌ„futed them then score vp this for an vntruth Although eueÌ„ then ye could not wel charge the B. therwith but the Hebrue text it selfe and Uatablus that so expoundeth it And yet you note it so bitterly for falsly added to holy scripture not marking the common practise of your owne side ordinarily to adde and to subtracte what ye please from the holy scriptures and when ye please make them not ouer holy neither howesoeuer here to aggraâ—…ate a quarell agaynst the Bishop ye thought good to terme them holy scriptures But nowe to admit that those were not the wordes of the scripture but onely the exposition of the wordes yea and that there was a negligence in the printing or copying out thereof whereby the words were printed in seuerall letters like the texte were this M. Stapl. so heynons a faulte where in effeâ—… the matter is moste true and all one with the text Did not the king commaunde them to sanctifie the Lordes house Did they not obey and come when they had so done and make an accounte to the king of all that they had done saying to him VVe haue sanctified all the house of the Lorde and the shewbread table with all the vessels thereof and all the furniture of the temple c. and see they are before the altar of the Lorde Nowe that all these things were things of the Lorde or that they obeyed the kings commaundement and made relation of al their doings to the king concerning these things of the Lorde This M. Stapleton medleth not withall nor dare denie it which is the matter in question and fully proueth the Bishops assertion agaynst M. Feckenham that they obeyed the kings commaundement concerning things of the Lorde So that in the matter of the Bishops saying there is no vntruthe â–ª as euen M. Stapleton him selfe can not denie the scripture is so playne And beeing true it argueth most expressely the vntruthe to remayne in M. Feckenham and M. Stapleton with their coÌ„federates that denie the Clergies obedience to their Princes and the Princes authoritie of commaunding them concerning things of the Lorde which the scripture heere alloweth Nowe what dothe M. Stapleton to saue his poore honestie as hâ—… termeth it but casting a cloude before the readers eyes lest he shoulde consider this he quarelleth after his maner at the printe and not so content crieth out of wordes falsly added to holy scripture where if the wordes had béene misprinted onely in a wrong fourme of letter yeâ—… the sense is all one the matter is moste true and the wordes them selues of the learned Hebritians are euen so expounded so farre are they from all false addition to holy scripture as M. Stapleton most falsly dothe exclayme According as Dauid had disposed the order by the counsell of the Prophetes The. 47. vntruthe Holy Scripture falsified and maymed as it shall appeare Bicause he appealeth in this vntruth to his Counterblast where he sayth it shall appeare in
Gods name let it there appeare where it is also answered folzâ—… For his 48. and. 49. vntruthes he alleageth no reason nor cause onely he sayth the former is boldely auouched but no way proued and the other somewhat more impudent Since therefore he hath nothing wherein to conuince them I may wel returne his boldnesse and impudencie to him selfe and remitte the tryall of the truthe or vntruthe to the discussing of Iosias ensample Nowe haue you shewed your selfe playnely herein to be a Donatist also The. 50. vntruthe most slaunderous M. Horne and his fellowes are in many poyntes Donatistes as shall appeare The triall of this vntruthe is discoursed at large in the proper place where M. Stapleton citeth it to appeare there shall be heard inough for triall of this chalenge pro contra and as the Reader on the viewe of bothe shall there finde it so on Gods name let him estéeme of it The Donatistes sayde they were of the Catholike fayth of the Catholike Church-which shifte for their defence agaynst Gods truthe the Popishe sectaries do vse in this our time beeing no more of the one or of the other than were the Donatistes and suche like The. 51. vntruthe Answere the Fortresse M. Horne annexed to sainct Bede if ye dare to defende this most sensible and grosse lye Howe happie are you M. Stapleton that euer ye buylt suche a Fortresse that ye thus can crake of so lustily bidde vs come and assayle crying aunswere the Fortresse and come if yee dare and if he come not then he dare not come if he set not on your Fortresse then this must néedes be a lye Muste it nowe truely then youre Fortresse is but a weake Fortresse if the prouing this a lye doe aunswere and ouerturne your Fortresse We néede neuer goe thither for the matter to proue your Church noâ—… the catholike Church nor to haue the catholike fayth this wil be proued in this booke well inough I warrant ye or euer it be ended ye shal sée your self more than once or twice confesse it And diuers other haue at large proued it what néede we then runne to your Fortresse In the next diuision which is the. 19. M. St. gathereth an other vntruthe but before it he setteth downe two marginall notes The first where the Bishop sayd All the sectes of the Donatistes whether they be Gaudentians Petilians Rogatists Papistes or any other sect c. Upon this word Papistes master Stapleton maketh a starre saying You should haue sayd Protestantes who in so many points as hath bene shewed resembled the Donatistes It is well inough M. Sta. and ye can let it stand til time be ye haue vntrussed all those poyntes euen from your own sloppes then ye may go perhaps like Baily hosegodowne The. 2 â–ª note is this Where the Bishop hauing alleaged a long sentence of S. Augustine agaynst M. Feckenham Thus farre S. Augustine sayth he by whose iudgement of the catholike Church c. Note sayth M. Stap. that nowe S. Augustines iudgement is also the iudgement of the catholike Churche To the which note I also adde this note withall M. Stapleton that your Church is not then the Catholiks Church whose iudgement herein agréeth not with Sainct Augustines iudgement Loe M. Stapleton howe pretily yourself begin to aunswere your last vntruth if ye holde on thus we shall not greatly néed to scale your fortresse euen this your CouÌ„terblast will encounter and ouerblowe it After these two notes he setteth downe his vntruth Your errontous opinion The. 52 vntruth M. Feckenham holdeth no such opinion The opinion there mencioned and confuted by S. Augustine is this of the Donatists that the order rule and gouernment practised be the Kinges of the olde Testament in ecclesiasticall causes ar not figures and prophecies of the like gouernment to bee in the kings vnder the newe Testament nor the order that Christ lefte behinde him in his Gospell newe Testament This was the opinion of the Donatistes in Saint Augustines time and this is yours Master Fecknams and Master Dormans opinion nowe that they are not such figures and prophecies and therfore ye confesse your selfe fol. 62. that M. Feckenham omitted the proufes of the olde Testament bycause they made against him Nowe whether this be an erroniouse opinion or no I commit you and Saint Augustine togither to scamble about it The. 53 vntruth Whither S. Augustine haue witnessed no such large and supreame gouernment as we attribute now to Princes yea whither Master Stapleton haue graunted so much or no is proued at large in the. 19. 20. Diuisions Your wilfulnesse is such that you delight only in wrangling against the truth The. 54. vntruth â—…claunderous Then are your selfe this â—…claunderer M. Stapleton that confesse Folio 62. he omitted to shewe forthe the truths of purpose bicause it made agaynst him what is this but wiâ—…full wrangling agaynst the truthe Constantine made many holesome lawes and godly constitutions wherewith he restrayned the people with threates forbidding the sacrificing to Idols to seeke after the diuelishe and superstitious soothsaying to set vp Images The. 55. vntâ—…uthe They were Idols not Images that Constantine forbad his subiects to set vp And in his Counterblast fol. 68. he sayth to say that Constantine forbad to â—…et vp Images is an open and a shamelesse lye What shamelesse outfacing is this The very words euen in the same place and many other of the booke are playne agaynst Images and nameth bothe Idols and Images also as the Bishop dothe Which withal confuteth his subtile distinction betwéene Image and Idoll as though an Image might not be an Idoll also Neither can the distinction serue your turne For Constantine forbiddeth bothe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 As for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 your selfe confesse he forbad whether he forbad Images or no these are Eusebius owne wordes in Gréeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Lib. 2. Euen so Christe our Sauiour confirmed this their authoritie commaunding all men to attribute and giue vnto Cesar that which belongeth vnto him The. 56. vntruthe This place of S. Mathew maketh nothing for the Princes supreme gouernement in ecclesiasticall things It maketh as the Bishop alleaged it to confirme al that authoritie by Christes Gospell that was due before in the time of the olde Testament Which your selfe graunt â–ª but that Princes had supreme authoritie in ecclesiastical things in the time of the olde Testament the Bishop proued before and your selfe also graunted it though ye denied such supreme gouernement as we attribute Therefore this place maketh some thing for Princes supreme gouernment in ecclesiasticall things so bewrayeth your owne vntruth and the truth of the Bishop This to be Christes order and meaning that the kings of the nations should be the supreme gouernours ouer their people not onely in temporall but also in spirituall or ecclesiasticall causes the blessed
that vve vvere baptised in Sée what a wicked slaunder to couer your disobediēce ye charge your most gratious prince withall as though she went about to make you renie that fayth ye vvere baptised in And this ye doe euen where ye pretende to kneele on your knees vvith moste humble and lowely submission Sée what cankred hearts ye beare for all your counterfayte crouching If ye knowe M. Stap. the fayth ye were baptised in at least if ye were rightely baptised and be a true Christian man it is not in the name fayth or obedience of the Pope but in the name fayth and obedience of the father the sonne and the holy ghost and this fayth the Q. maiestie goeth so little about to haue you abandon that hir Graces supreme gouernemēt is chiefly directed to this end to haue ye without any superstition error idolatrie or any other pollution therof kéepe maintein it inuiolate as in baptisme ye promised to do and therfore this is not subiect like though ye be on your knees neuer so muche to accuse hir highnesse as to cause ye to abandon the fayth ye were baptised in She requireth ye to kéepe it not abandon it neither on the soden nor at leisure And if this were all the cause of your refusall of obedience as hir Grace neuer denied you it ye doe but slaunder hir so néeded ye not haue runne away nor shew yet such disobedience to hir authoritie since she euer graunted and maynteined the thing ye séeme to craue Howbeit your counterfeite humilitie detecteth it selfe to be very stubborne disobedience And that while ye pretende to craue one thing ye entende another thing And that is ye would be borne with still to refuse her graces supreme authoritie ouer you in Ecclesiasticall causes this is the thing in deede ye meane and ye would the rather be borne withall bicause it is a matter that commeth vpon the sodaine therefore ye can not vpon the sodaine graunt it In déede M. St. ye pretende reason Weightie matters require not to be done on a sodeyne passion but with deliberation ▪ But is this so sodeyne a matter yet vnto you did ye neuer heare of this questiō before haue ye not had leasure to deliberate thereon but who seeth not that and ye had neuer so much leasure this matter would still come vpon the sodeyne to you and of reason ye must haue time to take aduisement vpō it which you will take all at your leasure and so for feare ye should become an obedient subiect vpon the sodeyne ye craue to remayne still vpon deliberation an obstinate enemie But M. St. pretēding this refusall to be for the abandoning of the faith that we were Christened in procéedeth And as we are assured all our auncetours and her Maiesties owne most noble progenitours yea her owne most noble father King Henrie the eight yea that faith which he in a clerkly booke hath most pithily defended and thereby atchieued to him and his and transported as by hereditarie succession the worthie title and stile yet remayning in her Highnesse of the Defendour of the Faith. As ye slaunder most wickedly the Quéenes Maiestie to cause ye to abandon the faith of your baptisme ▪ so ye slaunder not only al our auncestors but that most famouse Prince her highnesse Father K. Henrie the 8. as christened in the faith of the Popes obedience hereof ye say ye are assured when it is most assured most euident false For although our fathers the Q. Maiesties father also yea many of vs our selues the Q. Maiestie also her selfe were borne and baptised when all the errours of poperie or many of them did chiefly abounde yet can no more any one of these be said now to be baptised in those errours that they helde which baptised them if they kept the right formall words of baptisme I baptise thée in the name of the Father of the sonne of the holy Ghost thā in the old time any of their childrē or they themselues could be saide to be baptised in such errours as they helde that were Nouatians Donatists Rogatists Pelagians or any other Heretikes that notwithstāding kept the right element formal words of baptisme Neither can any Papist say now to any that dissuadeth him from his popish errours that he goeth about to will him to abandon the faith wherein he was baptized any more thā a Pelagian or any such Heretike being moued to forsake his heresie could pretēd he were moued to forsake the faith he was baptised in bicause they that baptised him yea his auncesters before him were Pelagians c. Ye should therefore M. St. make your distinction betwene the faith of your baptisme and the faith that your popish Church putteth in diuers erronious pointes of doctrine As for the faith that K. Henrie the 8 ▪ the Q. Maiesties most noble Father set out in the Booke that ye mencion therby labour to stayne the Q. Maiestie as setting out a contrarie faith to her father as you for your parte M. St. shew your extreme malice nothing subiectlike to blemish her highnesse with the famous renown of her father which notwithstanding ye cā not do so for the King her father I answere you howbeit his booke were clerkly yet clerklines is one thing truth is an other what maruel if he thē wrote in defence of your doctrines whē your popish prelates hid the very truth frō him bore him in hand that your falshoodes were truth till it pleased God not to suffer so noble a Prince to be any longer deluded by such false prelates but first in this question after in other according to the measure of his merciful riches reueled the truth vnto him how chance ye speake not of his faith then what clerkly sincere doctrine he set out thē against your Pope And as for the Q. Maiestie herein which is the proper questiō now in hād followeth most zealously the steppes of her highnesse father not wherein he was abused as many other princes were by false teachers but in that he forsooke those errours he abolished those false teachers their captaines vsurped authoritie in that he obeyed the truth reueled to him before all his own clerkly bookes before all worldly glory securitie aduentured himselfe his kingdome against all his enemies in setting forth the truth gouerning his subiects after the word of god Which though it were not so plentifully set forth then nor all wéedes so thoroughly rooted vp by reason of some false Gardiners whom he trusted ouer much howbeit at lēgth thanks be to God he espied them also had procéeded furder if God had lent him furder life yet is he rather to be commended for that he did than to be euil spoken or euell thought of for that he could not throughly bring to passe in his time but left his most vertuouse Sonne King Edwarde to bring to more perfection
S. Peter S. Clement and other holy Martyrs and Bishops there as any other The summe of this argumâ—…t is this The Pope now aliue or to come for the B. speaketh of one that they would haue raigne in the Queenes place is called an archeheretike Ergo S. Peter S. Clement and other holy Martyres are called archheretickes His answere to this is thus I promise you a well blowen blast and handsomly handled I answere ye againe M. Stapl. I promise ye this is a well made argument and handsomly answered Ye bragge much for your Pope of S. Peter and S. Clement and other holy martyres Your Pope doth well M. Stapl to bragge of them for that is all the neerenesse that he coÌ„meth to them S. Peter and those Martyrs were as like your Pope and he as like them as Caiphas was like to christ If they saw his deings and his craking of them they would neuer crake againe of him but call him archeheretike to But he may crake of these holy martyrs as the Earle of Warwick craked in king Edward the fourths daies that it was a iolier thing to make Kings than to be him self a King and so may your Pope bragge that it is a iolier matter to make martyrs than to be a martyr him selfe He can make saintes he saith I beléeue it the poore saintes féele it dayly whose stoles he dippeth in their bloud So like is he to s. Peter S. Clement other holy Martyrs that where he is none him selfe as were they yet in that defect he will reâ—…oÌ„pence God with store of martyrs of his owne making And for this resemblaunce if the Pope be now touched S Peter by by is touched and he that speaketh generally of the Popes now a dayes if he name not one certaine Pope casteth out his wordes wantonly at S. Peter S. Clement and other holy Martyrs of the old time But and ye had not bene wantonly disposed M. St. your self you might wel haue perceyued whom the B. meant nothing the old Bishops of Rome of whome whether S. Peter were euer any or no is an other question and ye are well stripped out of that Lions skinne But he spake plainely of such Bishops as now vsurping the sea of Rome ye would haue to raigne in the Queenes place But let not the matter go so M. Stapleton VVith like finenesse say you ye call him archehereticke that is supreme iudge of all heretickes and heresies to I answere with the like finenesse ye take that for graunted that is chiefly denied By this fine Sophisticall figure Petitio principij your finenesse M. St. will hurt you euery boy in the scooles would hisse out such fine reasoning Ye call him archeheretike say you that hath already iudged you and your Patriarches for archeheretikes I wiste as well might the fellon at the barre in VVestminster hall to saue his life if it might be call the iudge the strongest theese of all And doubtlesse had he a Prince on his side his plea were as good as yours is Let go the Prince M. Stapleton that is to much trecherie and more than felonie though ye liken vs to the fellon to resemble the Quéenes most excellent Maiestie to an abbettour of theeues and fellons then I will answere your I wiste with an other I wiste I wiste as well the strongest theefe of all might crie stoppe theefe by any true man to saue the pursuite from him selfe and his crie were as good as the Popes crie that we not he are the archheretikes and doubtlesse hauing such confederates on his side as you to helpe to crie so with him the theeues crie might séeme more true than the true mans Especially if as you would haue the matter go that the theefe should be made iudge in his owne case to when would this theefe condemne him selfe trowe you do ye not perceyue M. Stapleton that your comparison fayleth of the indge in VVestminster hall against a fellon when saw ye there a iudge sit and giue sentence in his owne cause him selfe beyng on the one side the principall partie what Iustice or lawe call you that you should therefore let VVestminster hall alone and say at Rotâ—… in Rome or in the Popes coÌ„sistorie and where he will siâ—…te as Iudge on him selfe and vs There in déede he hath Iudged vs to be the archeheretikes but euen this vniust doyng sheweth him selfe to be the very archeheretike Otherwise if his cause were good he durst come downe from the bench and pleade with his aduersaries the truth or falshood thereof Which till he do he plaieth the parte of an archetyrant also Now say you where ye say we would haue the Pope to raigne here in the Queenes place proceedeth from your like truth and wisedome For albeit the Popes authoritie was euer chiefe for matters Ecclesiasticall yet was there neuer any so much a noddie to say and beleue the Pope raigned here the Pope and the King being euer two distinct persons farre different the one from the other in seuerall functions and administrations and yet well concurrant and coincident togither without any imminution of the one or the others authoritie I answere with the like truth and wisdome as ye reasoned before so ye frame also this reason Ye say say you we would haue the Pope to raigne in her place Ergo ye say we would haue the Pope to be King. Hereupon ye make your distinction of raigning and hauing supreme authoritie and so ye conclude there was neuer any so much a noddie to say and beleeue the Pope raigned here First your argument is faultie for putting the case ye will not for shame say that ye would haue him King here yet if he tooke from her a principall parte of her royall power did he not then raigne in her place though he claymed not to be King and since ye vaunt of wisedome what a wise distinction is this of raygning and hauing supreme authoritie to bleare the simples eyes with woordes for so farre forth as he claymeth the supreme authoritie which he doth in all supreme matters as are Ecclesiasticall and that ouer her so well as any other so farre foorth he claymeth to raygne ouer her Nowe this being a parte of her royall power deth he not clayme to raigne euen ouer the principall parte and so is King thereof But say you who was euer so much a noddie as to say he raygned here Sir this noddie is euen your Pope that maketh this clayme you your selfe for him Do you not here say although you greatly lie therin that he was euer chiefe for matters Ecclesiasticall and do not all your complices say that he raigneth for spirituall matters both here all ouer Christendome Yea I wil go further for the temporalties to I pray you sauing the reuerence of your noddie who raygned heere when for certayne dayes the Popes legate kept the crowne of Englande from king Iohn and gaue it
master Stapleton here is no small boast I trowe We had nowe néede to beware betymes for feare the Bishoppe be here quite ouerthrowne since that master Stapleton maketh so prowde a chalenge Let vs therefore take héede to hys argument on thys place VVhiche place sayeth he well weighed and considered serueth to declare that I haue sayde that the King and others shoulde receyue not onelye the letter whiche as Saint Paule sayeth doeth kyll but the true and syncere meaning withall wherein standeth the lyfe of the letter as the lyfe of man wythin hys bodie yea the eternall lyfe whereof by following lewde lying expositions of holye wâ—…itte wee are spoyled at the Priestes handes Is this the conclusion of all this great crake M. St. that the B. should be quite ouerthrowne by this sentence what one word is here not only of this sentence but euen of your owne well weighed and considered conclusion theron which hath come nere vnto much lesse ouerthrowne the Bishops assertion Which if ye would haue ouerthrowne ye should haue concluded agaynst it and thus haue reasoned Moses sayde to the people of Israell if any hard or doubtfull thing in iudgement rise vp with thee betwixt bloud and bloud plea and plea plague and plague in matters of strife within the Citie c. Go to the Priestes and vnto the Iudge that shall be in those dayes c. Ergo a Christian king ought not to chalenge or take vpon him any such supreme gouernment in ecclesiasticall matters as doth the Queenes maiestie This conclusion in déede quite ouerthroweth the Bishops assertion But who séeth not that this sentence is to farre fetched to inferre any such conclusion And therfore master Stapleton thoughe this was his buttâ—… on whiche his eyâ—… shoulde haue béene fixed and brought his proues to haue improued this yet durst he not once touche or come nighe it for very shame for if he had he sawe that euery boye in the scholes would haue hissed out his argument And therefore wilyly weighing and considering howe he might make it séeme to serue to some purpose that he had craked on so much This place sayth he well weighed and considered serueth to declare that I haue sayd that Kings and others should receyue not onely the bare letter but the true and sincere meaning withall c. at the priestes handes And is this all that this place serueth to M. Stapleton for I dare say you haue well weighed and considered the matter that from so great a boast are so sodenly fallen into so déepe a consideration of the bare letter killing and the true quickening sense therof Wheras that text if ye would but meanely weigh and consider it once againe neyther talketh of any killing letter or liuing sense at all but of certaine doubtfull cases of strife nor can serue to confirme those sayings of Christ and Saint Paule without manifest wresting of it But to what purpose doe ye so well weigh and consider that whiche is nothing in question and that which is in question denyed and you should proue without any weighing or considering ye take it for confessed Who doubteth of this that Princes should not onely receyue the bare letter but the true sense and meaning withall at the priestes handes This Princes in déede should do which if they had alwayes done they shoulde not haue receyued so many of their lewde lying expositions as they haue done here to fore at the priestes hands who herein deceyued princes and gaue them not the true meaning and sense togither with the copie of Gods worde but debarred Princes of copie thereof of letter sense and all féeding them wyth the vayne fables and lewde lying expositions of theyr owne deuisings Wherefore Lyra noteth here vppon the Hebrue glosse Hic dicit glossa Hebraica c. Here sayth the Hebrue glosse if the priest shall say vnto thee that thy right hande is thy left hande or thy left hande is thy right hande this saying must be vpholden which thing is manifest false For the sentence of no maner of man of what authoritie so euer he be is to be vpholden if it conteyne a manifest falsehoode or errour And this appeareth by this which is set before in the text They shall iudge vnto thee the truth of Iudgement and afterward is set vnder And they shall teach thee according to his lawe whereby it appeareth that if the Priestes speake that which is false or swarue from the law of God they are not to be heard Thus sayth Lyra in confuting the Hebrue glosars of their hye Priests that sayde they could not erre and therefore what soeuer they taught must be beléeued And do not your Papistes say the same of the Pope and your selfe holde the same of your Priestes expositions that theirs alwayes muste be taken for the true sense else wherto bring ye out this conclusion In doubtfull cases of bloud and ciuill actions of strife the highe Priest and the chiefe Iudge muste determine a finall sentence Ergo Princes muste receiue not the letter of the scripture but suche sense as the Popish priestes and the Pope shall determine for the true sense in all controuersies of religion For this is the ful drift of your reason though ye dare not for shame speake so playne But this argument the more it is wayed wayeth lyke a fether in the winde and therefore ye turne the conclusion into generall words and say Ergo Princes and others muste receiue at the Priestes hands not onely the bare letter that killeth but the true and sincere meaning therof withall Which coÌ„clusion is not in controuersie but on both parts graunted they oughtso to do the Priests to deliuer to their Princes and others the worde of God and the true sense therof and the Prince and others oughte so to receiue of them the same word of God and the true sense thereof and not the priests owne deuises and expositions But since that none haue euer done more coÌ„trarie to this rule sythe it was first giuen by Moyses then haue the Popishe priestes had not Christian princes great néede to beware of Popishe Priests gloses and follow the councell of Lyra in reiecting them as other good Princes haue done to displace those false glosing priestes and place faythfull disyensers of Gods mysteries in their roomes and ouersée that their people be not deceiued in receiuing at the priests handes quid pro quo And for this cause the priest shoulde deliuer to his prince a perfect copy of the law which M. St. wickedly termeth the bare letter that killeth and thereto wresteth S. Paule wresteth this sentence of the iudiciall law among the Iewes for their time in the foresaide ciuill controuersies to be a simple rule for all christian common weales in all ecclesiastical causes excluding quite al iudgement from the prince including it in his Pope Priests alone iumbling the Prince and the people togither vnder the priests absolute determination
ought to counte the Canonicall scriptures in so much that I might not their honour which is due to those men saued improue or refuse any thing in their writinges â–ª c. And writing to Paulina of the credite to be giuen to the Scripture Alijs vero testibus c. As for any other witnesses saith he or testimonies whereby thou arte moued to beleue ought to be it is lawfull for thee to beleeue it or not to beleeue it And so saith S. Herome Quod scripturae sacrâ—… authoritatem non habet eadem facilitate contemnitur qua recipitur That that hath not authoritie of the holy Scripture is as easily dispised as receyued So saith Chrysostome Nullis omnino credendum nisi dicant vel faciant quae conuenientia sunt scripturis sanctis Thou must beleue none without they say or do those things that are agreeable to the Scriptures And againe Si quid absque scriptura dicitur c. If any thing be spoken without the Scripture the knowledge of the hearers halteth nowe graunting now staggering now and then detesting the talke as vayne now and then as probable receyuing it But wheras the scripture is there the testimonie of Gods voice commeth forth both confirming the talke of the speaker and confirming the minde of the hearer So S. Cyprian Legat hic vnum verbum c. Let him reade the onely woorde and on this commaundement let the christian religion meditate and out of this scripture he shall finde the rules of all doctrine to flowe and to spring from hence and hither to returne what soeuer the Churches discipline doth conteyne So saith Cyrill Necessarium nobis est diuinas sequi liter as in nullo ab earum prascripto discodere It is necessâ—…rie for vs to follow the diuine writinges and to swerue in nothing from their prescript rule And 〈◊〉 these Fathers so all the Doctours be plaine not to allow much lesse to determine any doctrine not onely contrarie but also besides the worde of God. Nor the Auncient doctours onely but also diuerse of the popish writers affirme that neither the Churche the Bishops the Pope nor any prouincial or generall couÌ„cel hath powre to determine any doctrine to be true or false otherwise than onely by the authoritie of the Scriptures to declare them so to be So saith Thomas of Aquine In doctrina Christs Apostolorum c. In the doctrine of Christ and his Apostles all truth of faith is sufficiently layde forth Howbeit to beat downe the errours of heretikes and of peruerse men certaine opinions of faith ought many times to be declared And of the same minde also is your great captaine Frier Alphonsus de Castro who attributing farre more to the popish Church and the Pope than he ought to do yet in this point after long disputation and argumentes on the matter he concludeth Nullo ergo modo c. It can by no meanes therefore be that the church may make any new article of faith but that the which before was the true faith and yet was hidde from vs the churche by hir censure maketh that it may be knowne vnto vs Whereuppon appeareth that my Lord Abbate did miserably erre who expounding the chapter that beginneth Câ—…m Christus which is had in the booke of the Decretall epistles in the title de Hereticis saith that the Pope can make a newe article of the faithe But he must be borne withall being ignorant nor well weighing of what thing he spake this onely I see must be laide in his dish that he Iudged beyond the slipper for it is not the office of Canonistes to Iudge of heresie or of faith but the office of Diuines to whom Gods lawe is committed The Canonistes partes are to descant of the Popes lawe Looke they to it therefore least while they couet to sit on both stooles the taile come to grounde as is the Prouerbe Thus sharpely concludeth Alphonsus against my Lord Abbate and all popish Canonistes that would intermedle with writing in Diuinitie I knowe not whether you Master Stapleton were any such or nâ—… but many of your site are euen such as he speaketh of that woulde studie bothe the Popes lawes and Gods lawes togither and so lay them both in the duste For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Christi Behal VVhat felowship is there betwene Christ and Belial Thus writeth he that neither the Pope nor his 〈◊〉 nor the Church can determine faith or hereâ—…ie without the worde of God. And so saith Ferus Cum contâ—…leris falsaâ—… doctrinâ—…m c. When you shall conferre the false doctrine ye shall finde out the errour For the onely holy Scripture is the rule of the truthe from the which whatsoeuer differeth or doth contrarie it is darnell and errour in what countenaunce soeuer outwarde it come forthe For he that is not with me is against me saith Christe Herevppon the Apostles and Disciples in the primitiue Churche did dayly search the Scriptures whether they were so or no. For oft time it commeth to passe that that is iudged errour which is not errour and contrarie wise Here therefore the Scripture iudgeth So Christe was Iudged a transgressour of the lawe but if ye conferre him with the Scripture you shall see he agreeth best therewith On the contrary the traditions of the Phariseys seemed good which not withstaÌ„ding Christ conferring with the Scripture plainly sheweth they are contrarie to the Scripture And therefore Dauid in all that octonarie desireth nothing els but to be directed by the worde of God. And the same Ferus in the eleuenth chap. of Matthew Baculus arundâ—…neus est quicquid extra verbum des traditur c. VVhat soeuer is giuen without the worde of God is a rodde of a reede For it is al onely the worde of God which we may safely leane vppon in so much that from hence thou mayst see what frowarde deceyuers they be that for the worde of God would onely set foorth vnto vs their dreames that is a rodde of a reede Hereuppon the true Apostles gloried most of all on this that they deliuered nothing but the woord of God so saith Peter Not following vnlearned â—…bles we make knowne to you the powre and presence of our Lord Iesus Christe so Paule doth glory that he receyued not the Gospell of men but by the reuelation of Iesus Christe Whereon he inferreth if therefore any preache any other thing let him be accursed As though he shoulde say â–ª we haue preached the woorde of God whereto ye may safely leane â–ª accursed therefore be he that for the certayne worde of God bringeth a rodde of a reede that is to say mannes feigninges Thus hitherto agrée euen these Papists with the auncient Fathers that nothing may be decided to be true or false neither by Church Councell Pope or any Man nor any Angell with out the authoritie of Gods worde so to iudge and confirme the same But say you by this rule it
to go vp to Ierusalem and there to be tryed in the assemblie of the highe Priestes So Athanasius abandoned the councels at Lyre Smirna and Ephesus â–ª So Maximus abandoned the Councell at Antioche So Pauiinus abandoned the Councel at Milayne So Chrisostome abandoned the Councell at Constantinople And so we abandoned the Popes violent councels at Rome and Trident that we might say with Dauid Non consedâ—… iâ—… consilio 〈◊〉 cum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 non introâ—…bo odi ecclesiâ—…m maligâ—…atium cum impijs non â—…edebo I haue not sitten in the counsell of vanitie I will not enter in with wicked doers I haue hated the Churche of the malignant and I will not sitte with the wicked These Councels we haue abandoned M. Stay. but no generall Councels wherein all things are tryed to be truthe or heresies by the touche of the worde of God and not by the Popes the councels or any creatures dâ—…cree besides Omnis homo mendax euery man is a lyer and the worde of God is onely the truthe of doctrine And therefore in all Councels we must crie with the Prophet Adlâ—…gem ad testimonium Let them râ—…nne to the lawe of God to the testimonie of his worde quod si â—…on dâ—…xerint iâ—…xta verbum hoc non erâ—…t eis â—…x 〈◊〉 If the Councell declare any thing to be heresie not according to the worde of God the morning light the 〈◊〉 of righteousnesse shall not shine on them but they shall erre in the shadowe of death But sayth Ambrose 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vs eâ—…rare non possis followe the â—…pture that thou mayest not erre And if the Councell do not follow them we are made free from following yea licenâ—…ed to abandon and accurse those Councels by your owne Canons Sâ—… quis prohâ—…t vobâ—… quod a Domino 〈◊〉 est rursâ—…s imperâ—…t fieri quod Dominus prohibet exeâ—…rabilis sit ab omnibus qui dilâ—…nt Deum If any body forbid you that that is commanded of the Lorde and agayne commaunde that thing to be done that the Lorde hath forbidden lâ—…t him be accursed of all that loue the Lorde And your Abbote Panormitane willeth vs so to estéeme of your Councels without the scripture that plus credendum vel simpliâ—… lâ—…co 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 qâ—… toti simul conâ—… we muste more beleeue euen a simple lay man alleaging the scripture than all the whole Councell togither And your famous doctor Iohn Gersoâ—… Chauncelour of the vniuersitie of Paris sayth Prima veritâ—…s 〈◊〉 stat c. this truthe standeth first to weete that any simple man beeing not authorized may be so excellently learned in holy writ that we muste more beleeue his assertion in a case of doctrine than the Popes declaration bicause it is euident that we must more beleeue the Gospell than the Pope Neither sayth he thus for the Pope alone but euen for your Councels yea for generall Councels in sacris c. VVe must more beleeue an excellent learned man in the scriptures and alleaging the catholike authoritie than we muste beleeue euen a generall Councell Thus by your owne doctors yea by the Pope him selfe that sayth no proofe oughte to be admitted agaynst the Scripture we may and muste abandon your Councels wherein many things besides and many thinges expressely agaynst the Scripture are determined for truthe and the expresse truthe of the scripture is condemned for heresie And therefore where ye say we renounce them onely for this cause bicause they grounde not them selues on the authoritie of the Scriptures ye shewe a good cause to cleare vs of all heresies and errors and shewe sufficient cause withall why we admitte not your Councels nowe your obstinate frowarde heresies to be suche that ye can not aâ—…ouche for them nor defende them by the holy Scriptures The authoritie whereof if those your Councels doe adâ—…itte as did the olde generall Councels then the clause in the Act of ParliameÌ„t doth no more abandon your Councels than it reiecteth those foure firste or any other that grounde their proues thereon But ye haue some better reason belike why ye set vp this fourth markâ—… of abandoning the Pope and his councels to be exemplified in the olde Testament Partly and most of all say you I say it for an other clause in the Acte of Parliament enacting that no foreigne prince spirituall or temporall shall haue any authoritie or superioritie in this realme in any spirituall cause Either your fingers itche master Stapl. at this clause wherwith ye be pidling so often before ye come to the proper place where this is handled more at large Or else ye do vse the figure of anticipation so mutch and so impertinently to puffe vp your counterblast withall But were it the chiefest cause why ye set vp this marke bicause we reiecte all foraigne authoritie then hath the Bishop hit this marke also at the full euen in all these examples Excepte you can on the other side proue that these godly Princes admitted in their dominions the authoritie of any foraigne Prelate ouer them Of which till you shal be able to bring profe the commaunding and directing of their owne priestes as is sayde before yea euen of the highest Priest of all is argument sufficient to inferre that they admitted not any other straunge Priest ouer them all straunge Priests then béeing heathen Idolaters and therefore this clause of foraigne prelates is also by the Bishop out of the olde Testament fully proued But say you The Popes authoritie ecclesiasticall is no more foraigne to this Realme than the Catholike faythe is foraygne You say so M. Stapl. I will beare ye witnesse but ye shoulde proue it and not say so onely Neuerthelesse be it not foraigne then is he not excluded by that clause nor ye néede so storme thereat that it should be the cause moste of all why ye haue sayde all this and nowe ye lyke it vvell inough saying And yet mighte the Pope reforme vs well inough for any thing before rehearsed Why rehearsed ye this clause then and found most fault therwith since those words hinder nothing his clayme Sauing that say you he is by expresse words of the statute otherwise excluded How chaunce your quarell then M. Stap. is not at that exclusion But wilily ye sawe well inough that he is exempted euen in that he is a foraigne powre And had his name not bene exempted yet the clause that before tâ—…kled ye so muche though now ye would make so light thereat did fully exclude your Pope bicause he is a foraygne power Or elsefull fondly ye quarell moste at that wherat ye had no cause Yes say you there is a cause why I mislike this clause agaynst foraigne authoritie For then I pray you if any generall Councel be made to reforme our misbeleefe if we wil not receiue it who shall force vs And so ye see we be at libertie to receiue
both the Scripture S. Hierome maketh no differeÌ„ce but only the custome institution of the Church The Apostle saith he writing to the Philippenses cap. 1. saith With the Bishops and the Deacons by them vnderstanding the Elders sith in one citie as in Philippos many Bishops ought not to be Agayne Act. 2. he saith Looke to your selues and to all the flocke in which the holy ghost hath placed you to be Bishops And he spoke vnto them of the onely citie of Ephesus But this appeareth more expresly to Titus the. 1. Where he saith for this cause I haue left thee at Crete that thou shouldest correct those things that want ordeine Elders through out the cities eueÌ„ as I haue apointed to thee if any be blamelesse the husbaÌ„d of one wife And streight he setteth vnder it a B. must be blamelesse And whoÌ„ before he named an Elder he calleth now a Bishop And in the. 4. of the. 1. to Timothie Dispise not saith he the grace of God which is giuen to thee through the imposition of the handes of an Elder that is to say of a Bishop S. Paule called him selfe an Elder when he was the Bishop that ordeined him Thus far more at large DuraÌ„dus concluding at leÌ„gth Sic ergo Thus therfore saith S. Hierome that a Bishop and an Elder Olim fueruÌ„t nominâ—… synonymâ—… c. were in the old time diuerse names betokening one thing indiffereÌ„tly and also of one administration â–ª bicause the Churches were ruled by the commune Counsell of the Priestes But for the remedie of a scisme least each one drawing the Churche after him should breake hir it was ordeyned that one should be aboue the rest et quâ—…ad nomeÌ„ c. And so far forth as stretcheth to the name that he onely should be called Bishop and that so farre as stretcheth to the administration of some Sacraments and Sacramentals they should be reserued to him by the custome coÌ„stitutioÌ„ of the Church And this would Hierome expresly 93. Dist. cap. legimuâ—… in Esa. super epistolam ad Tit. recitatur Dist. 93. cap. Olim presbyterâ—… c. Consuetudo aut institutio Ecclesiae potest dare Iurisdictiâ—…nem sed non potestatem ordinis aut consecrationis quare c. He therefore that counteth this erroneouse or perilous let him impute this to Hierome out of whose saying in the fore alleaged chapter Legimus in Esa. the foresaide authorities are takeÌ„ VVhere also he putteth an exaÌ„ple That it is of a Bishop in respect of priests as of an Archdeacon in respect of Deacons vnlesse the Deacons choose one among them selues whom they call Archdeacon c. In the end DuraÌ„dus recoÌ„ciling Hierome saith and the authorities alleaged by Hierome withstande it not bicause according the name and the truth of the thing euery Bishop is an Elder and on the other parte so farre as stretcheth to the name euery Elder hauing cure may be called a Bishop as superattendent on other although the consecratioÌ„ of a Bishop or of the chiefe Priest be larger than of a simple Priest or Elder but peraduenture in the pâ—…imitiue Churche they made not such force in the difference of names as they do now And therfore they called a Bishop euery one that had a cure Thus writeth Durandus of the auncient Fathers opinions And will ye compt him or them Aerians too And this also doth your institution in Coâ—…aine Councell confesse N on est tamen putandum VVe must not for all this thinke that he ordeined Bishops another order from Priests for in the Primitiue church Bishops and Priests were all one The which the Epistles of Peter and Paule the Apostles S. Hierome alâ—…o and almost all the auÌ„cient ecclesiastical writers do witnesse And chiefly that place of the first Epistle of S. Peter the â—…ist chapter is euident to declare this For when Peter had said The Elders that are amoÌ„g you I also an Elder with you beseech which am also a witnesse of the passions of Christ and paâ—…taker of the glory to come that shal be reuealed He ioyned vnder it Feede or guide the slocke of Christ that is among you and ouersee it not by compulsion but willingly according to god VVherein it is spokeÌ„ more expresly in the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is to say Superattendent from whence also the name of Bishop is drawne VVherefore Priesthood is esteemed the highest order in the Churche In the meane time no bodie is ignorant that this order is distinguished againe by a certayne order of offices and dignities Thus do your Schoolemen and Diuines witnesse First that in the Substance Order or Character as they terme it there is no difference betweene a Priest and a Bishop Secondly that the difference is but of Accidents and circumstances as degrées of dignitie Iurisdiction Honour c. Thirdly that in the Primitiue Church this difference was not knowne but they were méerely all one and the same Fourthly that this difference was taken vp by custome consent and ordinance of the Uniuersall Church when it once began to be dispersed in al the world Fiftly that it was done for the auayding of factions and sectes that grewe in the time of the ministers equalitie euen anon after the Primitiue Churche and some of them in the Apostles time But quite contrary to this Iudgement of your Diuines are all your Canonistes your Diuines make seuen orders Et in hoc saith Angelus de clauisio concordant coÌ„muniter theologs On this the diuines agree commonly but the Canonists holde that there are nine orders according to nine Hierarchies that is to wite the first notch or psalmist and the order of a Bishop and that the first notch is an order the text is in C. cum contingit ibi do Anto. canonistâ—… de 〈◊〉 quali or similiter quod Episcopatus est ordo quod imprimatur Caracter indiâ—…io meo facit inconuincibiliter tex in C. 1. de ordinatis ab Episcopo c. sic secundum Canonist as erunt nouem ordines And so according to the canonistes there shal be nine orders Great ado your Scoolemen and Canonistes make about this in so much that Aerius heresie will draw verie néere to one of you light on which side it shall But your selfe may holde on both sides M. Stapleton being both a Bachelour in the one and a student in the other As for vs ye do falsly burden vs Our doing is apparant therein acknowleging all due obedience and reuerence to our Bishops But as for your Popishe Clergie there is in déede litle differeÌ„ce in this point or none which barrell is better herring B. or Priest both starke nought or rather neither of them eyther true Priest or B. by S. Paules description Secondly you obiect that Aerius said there was no difference betwene him that fasted and him that did not fast wherein also as in the other your conscience haue ye any knoweth that ye
Pigghius who might for his writing be called Hogghius wel inough one of your chiefest porkelings in his defence of the inuocatioÌ„ of Saincts against the worde of God He groyneth out this saying Ego certè maiore ratione c. Truly I will with greater reason denie thee the authoritie of all the Scriptures than that thou shalt call me into doubte the beliefe and authoritie of the catholike Church since that vnto me the Scriptures haue no authoritie but all onely of the Churche What a wicked and swynish saying is this of a proude Popish borepigge against the euerlasting worde of God that it hath no authoritie at all from God the author of it but all from man all from the Churche of Rome for that is the Catholike Church that he meaneth the Pope his College of Cardinals and his assemblies of Priests for this they call the oecumenicall and representatiue Church All the authoritie that the worde of God hath it hath it from them alone Which if it were true then indéede as he saithe by better reason he may denie all the Scriptures than so much as call into doubt the beléefe and authoritie of the popish Bishops and Priests Why may they not then adde too and take from and make what and as many Ceremonies as they please and good reason to But since it is no reason that the worde of God should be thus trod vnder the foote of man that Gods worde should giue place to mans worde that Gods worde should haue all his authoritie of the worde of Priests and none at all of God that the Wiues worde should controll checke mate and châ—…ks vp hir husbandes worde that the wife may speake and appointe as much as she thinkes good and the husbande which hath but a few wordes to say can not be heard that the wiues worde should beare the streake and giue authoritie to the husbandes worde according to the common saying As the good man saith so say we but as the goodwife saith so it must be if this be no good reason nor any reason but cleane against all reason then may we replie to Pigghius and you M. St. that with better reason â–ª all your Churches authoritie and beleefe ought net onely to be called in doubte â–ª whether it agrée to Gods worde or no but also ought to depend wholy and onely on the authoritie of Gods worde And rather than the authoritie of the worde of God should be called into doubte much lesse denied as wickedly he presumeth to speake it were much better reason that he were cast into the sea as Christ saith and in sléede of a milstone that all his ceremonies were hanged aboute his necke all such blasphemous swine as this Pigghius were caried hedloÌ„g into the sea with him Yea saith Christ Heauen and earth shall passe but my worde shall not passe If your Catholike Church M. St. were the true wife and spouse of the Sonne of God she would with all lowlinesse humilitie reuerence here regarde obey Christ hir husbandes worde And be content to be commaunded by it not to countermaunde it not to thinke it were not of force vnlesse she gaue authoritie thereunto not to adde or diminishe to or from it not to commaunde one thing when he commaundes another not to compell the children and houshold of the faith to obserue hir worde more than hir husbandes not to haue twentie commaundements for hir husbandes tenne not to vse other fashions and customes than hir husband bids hir yea such as he forbids hir not to haue all the wordes and hir husbande not one worde yea to shut vp his mouthe and not to heare his worde these are impudent whores and bolde strumpets fashions a godly Christian matrone a vertuouse and faithfull spouse would neuer do thus But since your Church doth thus call hir catholike so fast as ye lust she is nothing else but a common catholike queane and not the humble and faithfull spouse of christ And your selues that defende hir haue good reason indéede to defende your Mother but such Mother such children that to holde with their mother dispise their Father and make hir worde to giue authoritie to his and say that with better reason they may denie the authoritie of their Fathers worde than so much as make a doubte of the beleefe and authoritie of their mother Yea that is a good ladde I warrant him and a well taught childe that will helpe the Mother to beate the Father is he not worthie his Mothers blessing for his labour but suche bastarde rebelles shal be sure of the Fathers curse For indéede they are not his Children Ues ex patre vestro Diabolo estis You are of your Father the Diuell Qui ex Deo est verba Dei audit propterea vos non auditis quia ex Deo non estis He that is of God heareth the worde of God therefore you heare it not bicause yeare not of God. The true children of God aboue all other thinges yea more than Father mother wife children fréendes yea than their owne life loue God and the hearing of his woorde Otherwise they were not worthie of god Thus do all the shéepe of Christ 〈◊〉 meae vâ—…cem meam audiunt My sheepe heare my voice As the Father hath bidden them Hunc audite c. This is my welbeloued Sonne in whom I am delighted heare him that is to say Leuell all your faith and life by the onely authoritie of his worde Who onely knoweth the Fathers will and in whom all the treasures of his fathers glorie are couched Who is the wisedome of God the truth the way the life and the worde it selfe The Sonne which is in the fathers bosome he hath declared it Heare him Auditus autem per verbum Dei But hearing commeth not by the Mothers authoritie but by the worde of God. Thus did the godly children vnto God whome we call Fathers vnto vs both before in Uigilantius time Nullum imitemur c. Let vs follow none saith Origen and if we will follow any Iesus Christ is set forth vnto vs to follow the Actes of the Apostles are described and we acknowledge the doyngs of the Prophets out of the holy volumes that is the firme example that is the â—…ounde purpose which who so desireth to follow goeth safe Thus also saith Cyprian both for Gods worde for your Mothers ceremonies The Heretike saith let nothing be deuised of newe besides that which is by tradition deliuered From whence came this tradition came it from the authoritie of the Lorde and of his Gospell or came it from the commandements of the Apostles and their Epistles for indeede that those things which are written ought to be done God witnesseth and setteth forth to Iesus of Nauee saying let not the booke of this law departe out of thy mouth but thou shalt meditate therein day and night that thou obserue all things
ordering directing publike peace and iustice but also as much or rather much more most of all godlinesse true religioÌ„ Ecclesiastical matters and Ecclesiastical persons to liue blamelesse in their spirituall vocations so well as the laytie to liue in peace and iustice And that in al these points the Prince is the knitting togither iointurâ—… of the one so well as of the other Which flatly argueth that the direction and preseruing of both causes persons next vnder God doth appertaine to his gouernment being both knit alike to his authoritie What false dealing what blearing of eyes hath the Bishop here vsed hauing faithfully set downe the Emperours owne wordes which as they fully shew Theodosius his minde so they fully proue the present question conclude the Princes supreme authoritie so well in Ecclesiasticall matters as in temporall To all this master Stap. thought best to answere not one worde but to let it goe telling vs that the Emperours sayings or doings serue nothing for our pretensed primacie and that this is wandring in an ob scure generalitie This may well be called a Counterblast M. Stap. If this be sufficient answere to the bishops allegation let others iudge Ye complayne it is obscure it may perchaunce so appeare to your eyes bleared with affection or rather blinded with wilfulnesse So is the Gospell obscure to those that would not sée and the sauour of death to those that perish Cleare light is noysome to dimme sights Euery body saue you and suche as are bleared by you may easily sée a farre off the playnnesse of these proues Nowe where ye say he wandreth in an obscure generalitie wherof can not be enforced any certayne particularitie of the principall question Otherwhiles M. St. ye coÌ„playne of particularities require the B. to proue generalities or else ye crie it commeth shorte Héere the Bishop hauing proued this generalitie by your owne confession nowe you quarell at generalities I perceiue nothing will content a froward brabbler but any other that liste not to quarell will soone perceiue that this generalitie that ye complayne of bothe comprehendeth the particulars also satisfieth that that ye call so often for to proue a supreme gouernemeÌ„t ouer all ecclesiastical matters in general which fully answereth euen to the othe likewise Neuerthelesse sith you would slip away by wandring about particulars This Epistle of the Emperour sheweth his supreme direction and gouernment euen in particulars and that principall particulars also This Epistle béeing directed from the foresaide Emperours to Cyrillus a chiefe ecclesiasticall Prelate and Patriarche of Alexandria after the Emperours as is before sayde haue declared this their generall care and gouernment â–ª so well ouer ecclesiasticall matters as temporall But when say they to Cyril we vnderstoode both by our loue to God and our mynd louing hys truthe that these thinges mighte bee obteyned in those that are godly wee haue nowe often thought it very necessarie by reason of those thinges that haue happened luckyly to haue a Synode moste deare vnto God of those moste holy Bishoppes whiche bee euery where c. And so shewing the cause of their delaye and the necessitie of the Ecclesiasticall matters they commaunde Cyrill with other Bishoppes not to fayle buâ—… be readie at Ephesus at Whytsontide nexte following For saye they the Copies of the same Synode are already sente out from oure Maiesties to the bishoppes beloued in GOD throughout all the Metropolitane Cities that thys beeing doone bothe the trouble whiche hathe happened on these controuersies be dislolued according to the ecclesiasticall rules and those thinges corrected that are vnseemely committed And that godlynesse maye be towardes God and profitable establishement to publique matters Neither let any thyng be seuerally innouate in any matter of any person before the holy Synode and the common sentence of it to come And we are fully persuaded that euery one of the Priestes moste deare to God both forbicause of the ecclesiasticall and publique matters beeing throughly moued by this our sanction or Edict will spedyly make haste towardes this councell with diligent endeuour and to their habilities consulte vpon these matters being so necessarie and apperteining to the good pleasure of god As for vs we hauing muche care of these things wil suffer no man lightly to be wanting neither shall he haue any excuse before God or before vs if any out of hande do not diligently appeare at the foresayde tyme in the place determined c. Thus euen in thys Epistle in particularities also doth Theodosius shewe his supreme authoritie But you will say these are not principall particulars the principall particulars are to dispute vpon the questions to resolue the doubtes to debate the matter and to indge and determine which parte is the truthe thereof These partes say you are the principall these partes belong not to the Prince but to the Priestes That these thinges master Sta belong to those that for their function haue the knowledge and profession of them no man denieth no more than that lawyers shoulde haue the lyke debating trying and determining the truthe of any doubte in the lawe But this nothing hindreth the Princes supreme authoritie and gouernement in his lawes no more dothe it in the debating trying and determining doubtes in any ecclesiasticall matters in the discussing wherof the Prince is ignoraunt debarre his supreme authoritie and gouernment in all suche cases debated or defined These doings therfore though they be the principall in respect of the examining of suche doubtes yet in respects of the ordering directing disposing setting them out and maynteyning them the Princes dooinges are farre more principall particulars As when a doubte in the lawe aryseth to call all the Lawyers togither highe and lowe what estate soeuer they bee off to appoynte them the place and tyme of meeting where and when to directe and order their assemblie and what they haue iudged to be the lawe therein to ratifie and allowe it to sette it foorthe and maynteyne it this dooing theweth the Prince to be the supreme gouernour in all Laive matters thoughe he neyther debate nor determine the truthe thereof Sithe therefore Theodosius dyd thus muche as this that is héere shewed and as that héereafter to whiche ye referre your selfe shall further declare this is inoughe to argue hys supreme gouernement in all Ecclesiasticall matters euen by these particulars If all this proue no supremacie why graunt ye not thus muche to Princes nowe that ye sée these Emperours had then howe chaunce your Pope wyll neither suffer the Emperours nowe to summon a Councell to cite and call the Bishops togither to assigne them a place whereto they shal resort and kéepe their Councell to appoynte the time to méete and begin their Councell in Howe chaunce your Pope will not suffer Princes in their seuerall dominions to haue the like synodes but will do all either generall or Prouinciall by him selfe or by