think_v and_o speak_v and_o write_v otherwise_o or_o you_o either_o yet_o both_o of_o we_o may_v be_v deceive_v but_o somewhat_o there_o be_v which_o these_o man_n intend_v and_o will_v have_v say_v if_o so_o be_v they_o can_v have_v hit_v upon_o it_o it_o be_v a_o conclusion_n of_o the_o roman_a school_n the_o church_n can_v err_v which_o proposition_n i_o may_v both_o affirm_v and_o deny_v as_o it_o be_v propose_v the_o church_n can_v err_v the_o church_n can_n err_v for_o first_o it_o iâ—_n ambiguous_a subiectiuè_n what_o the_o church_n be_v which_o can_v err_v the_o word_n be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o must_v be_v distinguish_v and_o second_o we_o may_v consider_v it_o obiectiuè_fw-la in_o what_o thing_n the_o church_n can_v err_v and_o quousque_fw-la that_o not_o err_v do_v reach_v forth_o extensiuè_a to_o this_o purpose_n i_o difference_v church_n two_o way_n into_o topical_a or_o particular_a church_n into_o catholic_n or_o universal_a i_o divide_v also_o the_o object_n of_o err_a or_o not_o err_v two_o way_n into_o fundamental_n or_o superstructive_n for_o particular_a local_a church_n such_o as_o corinth_n ephesus_n smyrna_n thyatyra_n laodicea_n etc._n etc._n it_o be_v in_o confesso_fw-la on_o both_o side_n that_o they_o may_v err_v for_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o they_o have_v err_v both_o in_o inferior_a and_o in_o high_a point_n of_o faith_n and_o so_o have_v err_v oftentimes_o that_o through_o their_o err_v in_o fundamental_n in_o that_o sort_n they_o have_v cease_v to_o be_v church_n any_o more_o the_o catholic_n or_o universal_a church_n i_o consider_v two_o way_n conceive_v it_o to_o be_v diffusive_a or_o representative_a and_o that_o diffusion_n to_o run_v out_o two_o way_n into_o universality_n of_o all_z both_o time_n and_o place_n or_o into_o universality_n of_o time_n alone_o the_o first_o be_v so_o ample_a that_o it_o fetch_v in_o the_o apostle_n and_o all_o and_o so_o include_v within_o the_o verge_n that_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n which_o be_v now_o regnant_a in_o heaven_n and_o free_a from_o all_o error_n as_o partake_v of_o that_o bliss_n which_o lead_v infallible_o hold_v inseparable_o in_o all_o truth_n in_o this_o sense_n and_o acceptation_n the_o proposition_n be_v not_o quarrel_v the_o church_n so_o have_v not_o can_v err_v the_o second_o divide_a part_n stint_v from_o so_o large_a a_o extent_n be_v yet_o enlarge_v respective_o to_o all_o member_n to_o every_o member_n in_o particular_a of_o the_o catholic_n church_n live_v any_o where_o at_o any_o one_o time_n so_o that_o the_o whole_a aggregation_n of_o all_o christian_a professor_n make_v and_o compose_v this_o church_n and_o as_o yet_o i_o think_v the_o informer_n do_v not_o quarrel_v we_o for_o popery_n their_o whole_a stitch_n be_v against_o the_o church_n representative_a in_o a_o general_n council_n in_o which_o though_o i_o shall_v resolve_v simple_o and_o punctual_o thus_o a_o general_n council_n can_v err_v yet_o can_v i_o not_o be_v count_v a_o papist_n for_o the_o tenent_n of_o the_o papist_n if_o you_o my_o informer_n know_v it_o not_o in_o their_o school_n be_v this_o a_o general_n council_n can_v no_o way_n err_v in_o the_o decision_n final_a thereof_o which_o be_v allow_v by_o the_o pope_n by_o which_o they_o necessary_o infer_v as_o also_o they_o stick_v not_o to_o express_v that_o unless_o the_o pope_n give_v ratification_n any_o general_n council_n whatsoever_o may_v err_v in_o any_o point_n of_o faith_n of_o what_o nature_n soever_o and_o therefore_o such_o be_v their_o doctrine_n since_o the_o jesuit_n have_v domineer_v in_o their_o school_n all_o the_o validity_n and_o assurance_n of_o not_o err_v which_o a_o general_n council_n have_v or_o can_v have_v either_o in_o fide_fw-la or_o moribus_fw-la be_v only_o from_o that_o impossibility_n of_o err_v which_o the_o pope_n have_v as_o haeres_fw-la ex_fw-la ass_n unto_o s._n peter_n to_o who_o our_o saviour_n behight_v that_o impossiblity_n alone_o so_o that_o pretend_v the_o jesuit_n as_o long_a as_o they_o will_v that_o fair_a and_o specious_a show_n and_o title_n of_o the_o church_n never_o so_o much_o have_v they_o nothing_o in_o their_o mouth_n but_o the_o church_n the_o church_n the_o pope_n be_v that_o church_n and_o their_o conclusion_n here_o be_v not_o for_o the_o church_n but_o for_o he_o now_o do_v mr._n mountagu_n come_v up_o unto_o nay_o look_v he_o towards_o this_o catholic_n roman_a fancy_n and_o infallible_a madness_n nothing_o less_o he_o direct_o pitch_v upon_o the_o church_n representative_a in_o a_o general_a council_n without_o the_o pope_n i_o mean_v without_o the_o pope_n as_o head_n or_o exceed_v the_o bound_n and_o limit_n of_o a_o patriarchicall_a bishop_n i_o go_v not_o unto_o all_o thing_n discuss_v or_o determinable_a in_o a_o council_n but_o rest_n upon_o that_o which_o be_v fundamental_a nor_o do_v i_o resolve_v it_o as_o certum_fw-la &_o de_fw-la fide_fw-la or_o tender_v it_o unto_o other_o to_o be_v believe_v i_o say_v no_o more_o but_o i_o see_v no_o cause_n why_o i_o may_v not_o so_o resolve_v and_o that_o also_o but_o upon_o supposition_n if_o the_o council_n be_v true_o general_n indeed_o and_o of_o such_o none_o yet_o ever_o err_v that_o ever_o i_o yet_o read_v or_o observe_v in_o point_n fundamental_a and_o therefore_o i_o see_v and_o see_v no_o cause_n but_o a_o man_n may_v say_v such_o a_o council_n shall_v never_o err_v in_o fundamental_o but_o concern_v fundamental_o if_o your_o stitch_n be_v against_o they_o i_o answer_v with_o b._n morton_z in_o his_o appeal_v the_o belief_n of_o some_o article_n be_v so_o absolute_o necessary_a for_o the_o constitution_n of_o a_o 443._o true_a church_n as_o a_o reasonable_a soul_n be_v for_o the_o essential_a be_v of_o a_o man_n in_o such_o as_o these_o be_v show_v i_o a_o error_n dr._n reynolds_n himself_o though_o maintain_v the_o contrary_a be_v not_o able_a in_o his_o vi_o conclusion_n out_o of_o all_o his_o read_n and_o yet_o therein_o be_v his_o excellency_n to_o afford_v we_o so_o much_o as_o a_o piece_n of_o a_o example_n in_o antiquity_n for_o a_o general_n council_n err_v in_o fundamental_o and_o i_o be_o persuade_v no_o man_n live_a can_v instance_n it_o of_o such_o only_a do_v i_o speak_v and_o in_o such_o only_o do_v i_o conceive_v infallibility_n and_o so_o as_o i_o conceive_v it_o the_o promise_n of_o our_o saviour_n may_v and_o do_v hold_v he_o shall_v lead_v you_o into_o all_z truth_n as_o also_o that_o other_o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n where_o two_o or_o three_o be_v gather_v together_o in_o my_o name_n i_o be_o there_o in_o the_o midst_n of_o they_o the_o church_n of_o england_n may_v seem_v to_o have_v be_v of_o a_o contrary_a mind_n in_o her_o determination_n and_o to_o have_v teach_v and_o prescribe_v to_o be_v so_o teach_v that_o such_o general_n counsel_n true_a and_o lawful_a not_o only_o may_v err_v for_o possibility_n but_o also_o have_v err_v in_o reality_n for_o artic._n xxi_o we_o read_v thus_o general_n counsel_n may_v not_o be_v gather_v together_o without_o the_o commandment_n and_o will_n of_o prince_n and_o when_o they_o be_v gather_v together_o for_o as_o much_o as_o they_o be_v a_o assembly_n of_o man_n whereof_o all_o be_v not_o govern_v with_o the_o spirit_n and_o word_n of_o god_n they_o mayerre_n and_o sometime_o have_v err_v even_o in_o thing_n appertain_v unto_o god._n which_o decision_n of_o the_o article_n be_v not_o home_n to_o this_o purpose_n first_o the_o article_n avouch_v that_o general_n counsel_n have_v err_v which_o can_v be_v understand_v of_o my_o limitation_n fundamental_o because_o there_o be_v no_o such_o extat_fw-la of_o any_o general_n council_n true_a and_o lawful_a second_o thing_n appertain_v unto_o god_n be_v not_o all_o fundamental_o but_o point_n of_o piety_n god_n service_n and_o religion_n which_o admit_v a_o very_a large_a interpretation_n for_o many_o thing_n appertain_v unto_o god_n that_o be_v not_o of_o necessity_n unto_o salvation_n both_o in_o practice_n and_o speculation_n in_o these_o haply_o general_n counsel_n have_v err_v in_o those_o other_o none_o can_v err_v the_o council_n of_o nice_a determine_v the_o controversy_n of_o easter_n it_o be_v not_o fundamental_a i_o put_v the_o case_n that_o in_o it_o they_o err_v it_o be_v a_o thing_n appertain_v unto_o god_n in_o his_o service_n this_o may_v come_v under_o the_o sense_n and_o censure_n of_o the_o article_n but_o this_o touch_v not_o my_o opinion_n concern_v only_a fundamental_o three_o the_o article_n speak_v at_o large_a concern_v general_n counsel_n both_o for_o debate_v and_o decide_v i_o only_o speak_v of_o the_o determination_n wherein_o it_o may_v be_v possible_a they_o nor_o can_v nor_o shall_v err_v that_o may_v and_o have_v err_v in_o the_o discuss_n in_o that_o very_a council_n of_o
whether_o they_o stand_v not_o therefore_o excommunicate_a not_o to_o be_v restore_v until_o they_o repent_v and_o public_o revoke_v such_o their_o wicked_a reror_n the_o censure_n of_o the_o canon_n but_o i_o proceed_v from_o ordination_n to_o execution_n of_o priesthood_n from_o the_o original_a deny_v unto_o the_o ministerial_a part_n reject_v also_o by_o they_o and_o so_o i_o shall_v have_v do_v with_o they_o chap._n xxxv_o touch_v power_n of_o priesthood_n to_o forgive_v sin_n priest_n have_v power_n to_o forgive_v sin_n not_o original_o but_o ministerial_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o ordination_n and_o communion_n book_n for_o public_a and_o private_a absolution_n the_o informer_n to_o lose_v the_o profit_n of_o their_o live_n and_o to_o be_v imprison_v without_o bail_n for_o declare_v against_o it_o informer_n this_o be_v the_o doctrine_n say_v he_o of_o our_o communion-booke_n and_o the_o practice_n of_o our_o church_n according_o that_o priest_n have_v power_n not_o only_o to_o pronounce_v but_o to_o give_v remission_n of_o sin_n chap._n xi_o pag._n 78._o 79._o mountagu_n first_o be_v please_v whosoever_o shall_v view_v or_o read_v this_o apology_n to_o take_v the_o true_a state_n and_o tenent_n in_o the_o point_n inform_v against_o by_o these_o promoter_n it_o be_v impose_v by_o the_o gagger_n as_o a_o doctrine_n authorise_v in_o our_o church_n none_o but_o god_n can_v forgive_v sin_n or_o retain_v they_o it_o be_v answer_v by_o i_o that_o in_o some_o sense_n it_o be_v true_a none_o else_o can_v do_v it_o viz._n by_o authority_n and_o right_a original_n because_o all_o sin_n be_v proper_o commit_v against_o god_n tibi_fw-la soli_fw-la peccavi_fw-la and_o that_o in_o some_o sense_n also_o it_o be_v not_o true_a for_o by_o delegation_n other_o also_o may_v do_v it_o ministerial_o god_n do_v forgive_v they_o by_o the_o ministry_n of_o man_n the_o priest_n to_o do_v this_o have_v power_n confer_v upon_o he_o by_o god_n in_o as_o ample_a sort_n as_o he_o or_o any_o man_n can_v receive_v it_o and_o that_o this_o be_v indeed_o the_o doctrine_n of_o our_o church_n i_o prove_v by_o the_o witness_n of_o a_o enemy_n and_o therefore_o the_o strong_a produce_v the_o verdict_n of_o a_o papist_n who_o confess_v that_o protestant_n hold_v that_o priest_n have_v power_n not_o only_o to_o pronounce_v but_o to_o give_v remission_n of_o sin_n which_o seem_v to_o be_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o communion_n book_n in_o the_o visitation_n of_o the_o sick_a where_o the_o priest_n say_v and_o by_o his_o authority_n commit_v unto_o i_o i_o absolve_v thou_o from_o all_z thy_o sin_n this_o be_v my_o relation_n hitherto_o of_o what_o i_o find_v so_o that_o here_o be_v commit_v crimen_fw-la falsi_fw-la by_o these_o informer_n i_o relate_v what_o one_o of_o that_o side_n say_v i_o say_v it_o not_o myself_o but_o only_o recognize_v the_o truth_n of_o his_o relation_n which_o i_o can_v not_o deny_v for_o in_o the_o visitation_n of_o the_o sick_a in_o the_o communion-booke_n the_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n be_v as_o he_o relate_v it_o so_o that_o be_v it_o not_o justifiable_a which_o be_v here_o report_v these_o honest_a faithful_a brethren_n have_v put_v a_o trick_n upon_o i_o namely_o a_o assertion_n for_o a_o bare_a relation_n as_o if_o i_o have_v justify_v what_o i_o do_v but_o report_v but_o it_o be_v justifiable_a it_o be_v the_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n the_o bishop_n of_o meath_z be_v of_o that_o opinion_n pag._n 109._o against_o a_o jesuit_n challenge_n he_o have_v do_v we_o open_a wrong_n in_o charge_v we_o to_o deny_v that_o priest_n have_v power_n to_o forgive_v sin_n and_o he_o give_v a_o reason_n irrefragable_a whereas_o the_o very_a formal_a word_n which_o our_o church_n require_v to_o be_v use_v in_o the_o ordination_n of_o a_o minister_n be_v these_o who_o sin_n thou_o do_v forgive_v they_o be_v forgive_v and_o who_o sin_n thou_o do_v retain_v they_o be_v retain_v the_o execution_n of_o which_o authority_n according_o be_v put_v in_o practice_n in_o the_o visitation_n of_o the_o sick_a and_o no_o man_n can_v say_v more_o or_o come_v more_o full_o home_o unto_o popery_n in_o this_o point_n than_o bishop_n morton_z in_o his_o appeal_v pag._n 270._o and_o indeed_o the_o power_n of_o absolution_n whether_o it_o be_v general_n or_o particular_a whether_o in_o public_a or_o in_o private_a it_o be_v profess_v in_o our_o church_n where_o both_o in_o our_o public_a service_n be_v proclaim_v pardon_n and_o absolution_n upon_o all_o penitent_n and_o a_o private_a apply_v of_o particular_a absolution_n unto_o penitent_n by_o the_o office_n of_o the_o minister_n and_o great_a power_n than_o this_o no_o man_n have_v receive_v from_o god._n in_o as_o much_o then_o as_o these_o informer_n declare_v and_o speak_v against_o some_o part_n of_o the_o communion-booke_n in_o the_o visitation_n of_o the_o sick_a for_o absolution_n in_o remission_n of_o sin_n and_o that_o they_o stand_v convict_v thereof_o per_fw-la evidentiam_fw-la facti_fw-la by_o statute_n of_o 1._o of_o elizab_n they_o be_v to_o lose_v the_o profit_n of_o all_o their_o spiritual_a promotion_n and_o benefice_n for_o one_o year_n unto_o the_o king_n and_o without_o bail_n or_o maineprise_n to_o suffer_v imprisonment_n for_o half_a a_o year_n if_o they_o be_v not_o benefice_v their_o endurance_n be_v the_o long_o the_o punishment_n allot_v be_v one_o whole_a year_n imprisonment_n which_o it_o be_v not_o amiss_o that_o authority_n will_v deserve_o inflict_v upon_o they_o to_o teach_v they_o better_a manner_n hereafter_o than_o to_o call_v that_o a_o point_n of_o popery_n which_o be_v apparent_a and_o confess_v to_o be_v the_o express_a and_o avow_a doctrine_n and_o discipline_n of_o the_o church_n confirm_v for_o performance_n by_o act_n of_o parliament_n i_o leave_v the_o censure_n of_o their_o desert_n unto_o authority_n who_o it_o touch_v and_o proceed_v to_o the_o next_o information_n upon_o the_o same_o point_n though_o with_o some_o addition_n chap._n xxxvi_o priest_n only_o and_o none_o other_o have_v commission_n from_o christ_n to_o forgive_v sin_n the_o extravagancy_n of_o puritan_n and_o papist_n both_o in_o this_o point_n informer_n and_o a_o little_a after_o it_o be_v consess_v that_o all_o priest_n and_o none_o but_o priest_n have_v power_n to_o forgive_v sin_n chap._n xii_o pag._n 83._o mountagu_n and_o be_v it_o not_o so_o confess_v when_o by_o public_a warrant_n in_o ordination_n that_o power_n be_v give_v unto_o all_o priest_n to_o do_v so_o in_o those_o solemn_a word_n of_o ordination_n who_o sin_v you_o forgive_v they_o be_v forgive_v and_o unto_o none_o but_o priest_n because_o none_o have_v else_o such_o ordination_n if_o this_o be_v not_o confess_v i_o will_v put_v myself_o to_o you_o to_o school_v to_o learn_v and_o to_o know_v what_o be_v confess_v the_o fact_n be_v apparent_a you_o can_v say_v nay_o haply_o you_o will_v nay_o certain_o you_o do_v question_n quo_fw-la jure_fw-la quam_fw-la rectè_fw-la it_o be_v confess_v the_o truth_n be_v you_o can_v deny_v the_o thing_n but_o with_o you_o puritan_n this_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n be_v hold_v to_o be_v popery_n and_o here_o you_o infer_v necessary_o that_o priest_n have_v no_o more_o power_n to_o do_v this_o than_o layman_n have_v for_o what_o else_o can_v you_o mean_v by_o and_o none_o but_o priest_n but_o either_o that_o neither_o one_o nor_o other_o have_v that_o power_n or_o else_o that_o one_o as_o much_o and_o as_o great_a as_o other_o to_o which_o you_o incline_v i_o can_v say_v assure_o no_o great_a difference_n for_o both_o be_v exact_a puritanisine_n you_o cast_v confession_n upon_o both_o one_o and_o other_o any_o layman_n may_v hear_v it_o as_o well_o as_o a_o priest_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v probable_a you_o will_v not_o be_v very_o precise_a for_o absolution_n to_o confer_v it_o on_o a_o layman_n as_o well_o as_o on_o a_o priest_n so_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v to_o both_o alike_o in_o equal_a assize_n but_o sir_n absolution_n be_v a_o part_n of_o that_o priestly_a power_n which_o can_v not_o be_v give_v by_o man_n or_o angel_n but_o only_o and_o immediate_o by_o almighty_a god_n himself_o a_o part_n of_o that_o paramount_n power_n which_o the_o god_n of_o glory_n have_v invest_v mortal_a man_n withal_o in_o which_o respect_n and_o not_o otherwise_o as_o some_o claim_n it_o have_v be_v say_v the_o head_n of_o the_o emperor_n have_v be_v subject_v unto_o the_o priest_n hand_n in_o which_o regard_n no_o earthly_a power_n be_v of_o equal_a value_n and_o assize_n unto_o it_o as_o not_o only_o the_o ancient_n you_o shall_v have_v a_o catalogue_n of_o they_o if_o you_o desire_v it_o but_z bishop_n morton_z confess_v none_o can_v arrogate_v this_o power_n and_o authority_n unto_o himself_o none_o
cardinal_n bellarmine_n quod_fw-la omne_fw-la 198._o christi_fw-la beneficia_fw-la recordari_fw-la nos_fw-la faciat_fw-la you_o need_v not_o that_o help_n happy_a man_n that_o be_v ever_o in_o actu_fw-la exercitato_fw-la and_o need_v no_o rub_v of_o your_o memory_n and_o that_o worthy_a divine_a d._n white_a in_o his_o brother_n defense_n pag._n 61._o have_v these_o word_n the_o sign_v of_o the_o body_n with_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n as_o it_o be_v ancient_o use_v by_o the_o prime_a christian_n to_o these_o end_n i._o to_o profess_v that_o they_o be_v not_o ashamed_a of_o christ_n crucify_v 2._o nor_o of_o the_o persecution_n and_o cross_n which_o befall_v they_o for_o his_o sake_n 3._o that_o they_o hope_v for_o redemption_n and_o salvation_n by_o christ_n crucify_v who_o jew_n and_o gentile_n despise_v our_o divine_n acknowledge_v to_o be_v lawful_a what_o say_v m._n mountagu_n more_o in_o his_o so_o do_v we_o and_o then_o remember_v some_o abuse_n of_o it_o in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n add_v in_o regard_n of_o these_o abuse_n our_o church_n observe_v not_o so_o common_a a_o use_n of_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n as_o be_v in_o former_a age_n nevertheless_o we_o condemn_v not_o the_o same_o sign_n in_o regard_n of_o itself_o you_o do_v i_o do_v not_o and_o herein_o you_o see_v i_o be_o not_o alone_a junius_n animadv_n c._n bel._n de_fw-fr imag._n ca._n 29._o respectus_n crucis_fw-la etiam_fw-la crucis_fw-la christi_fw-la ut_fw-la historicus_fw-la non_fw-la malus_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la sed_fw-la bone_fw-la malus_n verò_fw-la efficitur_fw-la si_fw-la proficiscatur_fw-la ex_fw-la animo_fw-la praesument_fw-la mereri_fw-la ex_fw-la opere_fw-la operato_fw-la nos_fw-la in_o rebus_fw-la sacris_fw-la non_fw-la improbaremus_fw-la planè_fw-la signum_fw-la crucis_fw-la si_fw-la abesset_fw-la superstitio_fw-la etc._n etc._n rem_fw-la non_fw-la adeò_fw-la fugeremus_fw-la si_fw-la abessent_fw-la vitia_fw-la indignè_fw-la rem_fw-la illam_fw-la fermentantia_fw-la tolle_o errorem_fw-la superstitionemque_fw-la nemo_fw-la vestrum_fw-la aut_fw-la illorum_fw-la factum_fw-la improbaturus_fw-la est_fw-la m._n perkins_n in_o his_o problem_n though_o he_o fain_o will_v puritanize_v it_o and_o so_o go_v on_o heaw_v hoof_n against_o hoof_n yet_o confess_v that_o the_o father_n use_v to_o arm_v themselves_o against_o the_o devil_n with_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n but_o add_v they_o do_v not_o ascribe_v unto_o the_o outward_a sign_n any_o power_n or_o to_o opus_fw-la operatum_fw-la any_o efficacy_n as_o if_o we_o imagine_v so_o we_o say_v with_o himself_o that_o it_o be_v a_o idle_a and_o foolish_a forgery_n and_o one_o day_n you_o may_v read_v if_o you_o will_v what_o m._n mountagu_n have_v write_v against_o rosw_n the_o jesuite_n to_o that_o very_a purpose_n but_o set_v this_o superstition_n aside_o neither_o can_v any_o moderate_a protestant_n disallow_v the_o use_n of_o the_o cross_n as_o the_o father_n use_v it_o nor_o can_v master_n perkins_n refel_v it_o you_o be_v of_o tho._n cartwright_n mind_n i_o make_v no_o question_n that_o great_a apostle_n of_o puritanical_a schism_n that_o that_o reason_n which_o move_v the_o father_n to_o use_v shall_v move_v we_o not_o to_o use_v the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n they_o live_v with_o heathen_n who_o have_v the_o cross_n of_o christ_n in_o contempt_n we_o with_o such_o as_o adore_v the_o cross_n where_o first_o i_o answer_v with_o that_o incomparable_a hooker_n you_o err_v not_o know_v the_o father_n reason_n this_o be_v one_o but_o this_o reason_n be_v not_o all_o because_o they_o live_v with_o pagan_n that_o do_v despite_o it_o second_o we_o live_v not_o so_o with_o papist_n as_o they_o do_v with_o pagan_n for_o the_o state_n and_o prince_n in_o state_n be_v for_o we_o against_o the_o papist_n so_o be_v it_o not_o for_o christian_n against_o pagan_n but_o three_o i_o come_v home_o to_o you_o indeed_o the_o same_o reason_n that_o move_v they_o may_v move_v we_o to_o use_v it_o more_o frequent_o than_o we_o be_v enjoin_v more_o ordinary_o than_o we_o do_v for_o we_o live_v with_o puritan_n and_o opposite_a factionist_n that_o have_v the_o cross_n of_o christ_n in_o as_o great_a contempt_n and_o despite_n as_o ever_o have_v julian_n or_o any_o pagan_a but_o as_o the_o father_n when_o the_o cross_n of_o christ_n be_v in_o utter_a contempt_n do_v not_o superstitious_o adore_v the_o same_o but_o rather_o do_v declare_v that_o they_o so_o esteem_v it_o as_o be_v meet_v in_o like_a manner_n if_o we_o find_v the_o cross_n to_o have_v that_o honour_n which_o be_v due_a to_o christ_n be_v it_o not_o as_o lawful_a for_o we_o to_o retain_v it_o in_o that_o estimation_n which_o it_o ought_v to_o have_v and_o in_o that_o use_n which_o it_o have_v of_o old_a without_o offence_n as_o by_o take_v it_o clean_o away_o to_o seem_v follower_n of_o their_o example_n who_o do_v cure_v wilful_o by_o abscission_n that_o which_o they_o may_v both_o preserve_v and_o heal_v so_o that_o worthy_a hooker_n most_o learned_o and_o right_o for_o your_o resolution_n i_o be_o enjoin_v to_o use_v it_o in_o baptism_n and_o so_o be_v you_o i_o do_v so_o use_v it_o do_v you_o i_o scarce_o believe_v you_o do_v it_o willing_o i_o be_o not_o enjoin_v to_o use_v it_o in_o other_o action_n place_n or_o time_n but_o be_o i_o inhibit_v to_o use_v it_o so_o show_v where_o how_o by_o who_o i_o see_v reason_n to_o myself_o peradventure_o to_o use_v it_o so_o or_o so_o and_o thus_o do_v or_o may_v other_o as_o well_o as_o i._o it_o be_v superstition_n you_o say_v pardon_v i_o if_o i_o take_v not_o your_o word_n for_o gospel_n prove_v it_o superstition_n and_o i_o yield_v the_o rule_n of_o your_o conscience_n be_v not_o the_o square_a of_o i_o nor_o shall_v be_v except_o it_o be_v more_o regular_a perfect_a and_o exact_a than_o it_o be_v enjoy_v your_o opinion_n to_o yourself_o let_v i_o alone_o with_o i_o in_o thing_n indifferent_a that_o be_v not_o prohibit_v by_o lawful_a authority_n any_o way_n for_o say_v the_o xxx_o canon_n and_o i_o embrace_v it_o thing_n of_o themselves_o indifferent_a do_v in_o some_o sort_n alter_v their_o nature_n when_o they_o be_v either_o command_v or_o forbid_v by_o a_o lawful_a magistrate_n and_o may_v not_o be_v omit_v at_o every_o man_n pleasure_n contrary_a to_o the_o law_n when_o they_o be_v command_v nor_o ùse_v when_o they_o be_v prohibit_v till_o then_o at_o least_o i_o may_v use_v the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n you_o say_v it_o be_v popery_n but_o you_o must_v remember_v that_o all_o your_o word_n be_v not_o gospel_n nor_o all_o popery_n that_o displease_v a_o puritan_n chap._n xxv_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n approve_v vnadvised_a informer_n noveller_n reject_v informer_n hemention_v and_o approve_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o ancient_n they_o sign_v say_v he_o their_o forehead_n their_o hand_n etc._n etc._n mountagu_n it_o be_v true_a he_o mention_v that_o practice_n of_o antiquity_n it_o be_v false_a that_o he_o approve_v it_o in_o that_o passage_n of_o he_o for_o he_o bare_o relate_v it_o and_o no_o more_o but_o you_o know_v his_o heart_n peradventure_o by_o instinct_n for_o though_o it_o then_o drop_v not_o from_o his_o pen_n what_o he_o think_v thereof_o yet_o see_v you_o put_v he_o to_o it_o to_o discover_v himself_o he_o have_v do_v it_o and_o do_v assure_v you_o he_o do_v approve_v it_o and_o it_o seem_v strange_a to_o he_o that_o some_o few_o pigmy_n of_o these_o time_n shall_v presume_v to_o control_v the_o practice_n of_o those_o ancient_a hero_n of_o former_a age_n and_o to_o do_v it_o so_o with_o a_o high-hand_n wherein_o unadvised_o they_o run_v upon_o that_o rock_n which_o of_o all_o they_o can_v endure_v to_o fall_v upon_o for_o they_o confess_v therein_o that_o popery_n be_v ancient_a which_o m._n mountagu_n say_v all_o the_o papist_n in_o the_o world_n can_v prove_v for_o they_o say_v in_o direct_a term_n m._n mountagu_n approve_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o ancient_n and_o that_o which_o he_o approve_v be_v by_o themselves_o censure_v for_o popery_n nay_o more_o they_o profess_v themselves_o therein_o papist_n that_o give_v so_o much_o credit_n unto_o popery_n as_o to_o confess_v it_o so_o direct_o to_o be_v ancient_a out_o of_o this_o ground_n è_fw-la lege_fw-la â—alionis_fw-la because_o they_o have_v now_o more_o than_o once_o inform_v against_o i_o for_o popery_n i_o may_v as_o well_o pay_v they_o in_o their_o own_o coin_n howsoever_o let_v all_o noveller_n know_v i_o have_v rather_o venture_v to_o approve_v a_o suppose_a error_n with_o those_o ancient_n the_o learn_a in_o the_o primitive_a church_n of_o old_a than_o a_o imaginary_a truth_n or_o not_o so_o good_a with_o these_o youngling_n according_a to_o that_o dictate_v of_o the_o council_n of_o niee_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d chap._n xxvi_o the_o testimony_n of_o s._n athanasius_n vilify_v by_o the_o
informer_n the_o testimony_n of_o other_o father_n concern_v the_o efficacy_n &_o power_n of_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n informer_n he_o cit_v and_o approve_v the_o testimony_n of_o one_o of_o they_o by_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n of_o christ_n all_o magic_a spell_n be_v disappoint_v sorcery_n and_o witchcraft_n come_v to_o nothing_o all_o idol_n be_v abandon_v and_o forsake_v mountagu_n qvà m_fw-la contemptim_fw-la one_o of_o they_o and_o be_v not_o that_o one_o worth_n the_o name_n deserve_v he_o no_o respect_n from_o your_o great_a self_n your_o uncircumcised_a lip_n may_v well_o be_v sweeten_v with_o the_o name_n of_o that_o certain_a quidam_fw-la as_o you_o call_v he_o out_o of_o contempt_n go_v to_o it_o roundly_o quid_fw-la haesitatis_fw-la and_o with_o those_o profane_a one_o call_v he_o without_o more_o ado_n sathanasius_n for_o athanasius_n be_v the_o man_n there_o name_v to_o your_o hand_n a_o man_n deserve_v better_a of_o god_n church_n than_o you_o and_o all_o your_o divine_n put_v they_o all_o together_o if_o you_o misdoubt_v the_o testimony_n to_o be_v forge_v because_o it_o be_v forget_v to_o name_v the_o place_n it_o be_v in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr incarnatione_fw-la verbi_fw-la pag._n 61._o and_o be_v former_o remember_v by_o he_o in_o the_o tract_n against_o the_o gentile_n pa_n 1_o if_o you_o call_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o relation_n into_o question_n athanasius_n word_n will_v pass_v where_o your_o bond_n will_v not_o go_v currant_n but_o you_o shall_v have_v mo_z witness_n to_o speak_v to_o the_o same_o purpose_n epiphanius_n relate_v of_o a_o christian_a young_a gentlewoman_n 10._o that_o be_v quit_v from_o the_o wanton_a assault_n of_o a_o young_a man_n by_o sign_v herself_o with_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d that_o in_o it_o god_n may_v remonstrate_v his_o wondrous_a power_n and_o again_o the_o same_o father_n say_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d the_o magician_n and_o sorcerer_n prevail_v not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d for_o the_o woman_n find_v help_v in_o the_o sign_n of_o christ_n and_o through_o faith_n in_o he_o which_o be_v gladius_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d against_o puritan_n and_o papist_n against_o he_o for_o the_o bare_a sign_n against_o you_o for_o the_o sign_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d where_o the_o name_n of_o christ_n be_v invocate_v and_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n make_v there_o sorcery_n and_o witchcraft_n can_v do_v nothing_o if_o you_o list_v to_o see_v more_o and_o hear_v more_o evidence_n to_o this_o purpose_n you_o may_v look_v upon_o that_o which_o nazianzen_n have_v of_o julian_n the_o apostata_fw-la in_o his_o first_o invective_n which_o theodoret_n have_v of_o a_o certain_a jew_n lib._n 3._o cap._n 3._o which_o epiphanius_n of_o another_o rom._n jew_n josephus_n by_o name_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d say_v chrysostome_n we_o have_v also_o spiritual_a conjuration_n the_o name_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o the_o power_n of_o the_o cross_n nec_fw-la mirum_fw-la est_fw-la quòd_fw-la haec_fw-la signa_fw-la valent_fw-la cum_fw-la à _fw-la bonis_fw-la christianis_fw-la adhibentur_fw-la quando_fw-la etiam_fw-la cum_fw-la usurpantur_fw-la ab_fw-la extraneis_fw-la qui_fw-la omnino_fw-la suum_fw-la nomen_fw-la ad_fw-la istam_fw-la militiam_fw-la non_fw-la dederunt_fw-la propter_fw-la honorem_fw-la tamen_fw-la excellentissimi_fw-la imperatoris_fw-la valent_fw-la faith_n s._n august_n or_o whosoever_o write_v the_o lxxxiii_o quest_n to_o dulcitius_n now_o what_o say_v you_o to_o 79._o that_o testimony_n of_o one_o of_o they_o if_o you_o will_v not_o admit_v the_o doctrine_n because_o m._n mountagu_n deliver_v it_o i_o can_v name_v you_o one_o will_v say_v and_o approve_v as_o much_o who_o you_o dare_v not_o deny_v to_o be_v of_o credit_n or_o style_v a_o certain_a one_o of_o they_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n say_v b._n jewel_n be_v have_v in_o great_a regard_n among_o christian_n and_o the_o more_o both_o for_o the_o public_a reproach_n and_o shame_n that_o by_o the_o common_a judgement_n of_o the_o world_n be_v conceive_v against_o it_o and_o also_o for_o that_o most_o worthy_a price_n of_o our_o redemption_n that_o be_v offer_v upon_o it_o therefore_o the_o faithful_a which_o believe_v in_o christ_n in_o all_o their_o talk_n in_o their_o whole_a life_n and_o conversation_n use_v so_o much_o the_o more_o to_o extol_v and_o magnify_v the_o same_o thus_o as_o theodoret_n report_v the_o christian_n every_o where_o in_o their_o common_a resort_n and_o open_a market-place_n publish_v and_o proclaim_v the_o victory_n and_o triumph_n of_o the_o cross_n the_o which_o as_o chrysostome_n say_v they_o be_v not_o ashamed_a to_o set_v as_o a_o posy_n to_o any_o thing_n that_o they_o do_v and_o to_o any_o thing_n that_o they_o possess_v likewise_o god_n that_o the_o world_n may_v more_o deep_o think_v of_o the_o death_n of_o christ_n wrought_v oftentimes_o strange_a miracle_n by_o the_o same_o now_o be_v not_o this_o as_o good_a popery_n as_o m._n mountagu_n allege_v and_o approve_v one_o of_o they_o see_v more_o if_o you_o be_v so_o dispose_v in_o his_o fourteen_o article_n against_o harding_n chap._n xxvii_o popery_n be_v not_o the_o sign_v with_o but_o the_o adore_v of_o the_o cross_n strange_a effect_n which_o god_n have_v wrought_v of_o old_a adhibito_fw-la signo_fw-la crucis_fw-la &_o may_v do_v still_o by_o the_o virtue_n of_o christ_n death_n and_o passion_n which_o that_o sign_n do_v represent_v informer_n he_o profess_v that_o he_o know_v no_o cause_n of_o such_o distraction_n and_o disaffection_n betwixt_o we_o and_o the_o papist_n for_o the_o reverend_a use_n of_o sign_v with_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n etc._n etc._n mountagu_n for_o this_o use_n betwixt_o any_o not_o alone_o nay_o not_o at_o all_o we_o and_o papist_n for_o he_o name_v no_o papist_n no_o more_o than_o puritan_n it_o be_v a_o gloss_n of_o your_o own_o none_o of_o my_o text_n and_o yet_o i_o will_v not_o desire_v to_o have_v it_o expunge_v though_o i_o may_v put_v it_o off_o unto_o that_o frantic_a puritan_n parker_n and_o his_o furious_a follower_n that_o indite_v the_o poor_a cross_n of_o felony_n murder_n adultery_n and_o all_o the_o sin_n against_o both_o the_o table_n i_o know_v no_o reason_n why_o they_o shall_v charge_v we_o marry_o those_o of_o your_o short_a cut_n they_o may_v both_o charge_n and_o challenge_v for_o be_v singular_a in_o their_o own_o conceit_n against_o consent_n of_o antiquity_n for_o the_o reverend_a pious_a and_o religious_a use_n of_o sign_v ad_fw-la omnem_fw-la omtum_fw-la gestum_fw-la habitum_fw-la with_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n be_v no_o popery_n which_o be_v a_o grand_a abuse_n and_o a_o sacrilege_n commit_v by_o they_o in_o adore_v the_o cross_n and_o give_v unto_o it_o divine_a worship_n and_o ascribe_v effect_n unto_o the_o bare_a sign_n ex_fw-la opere_fw-la operato_fw-la which_o antiquity_n never_o do_v not_o then_o when_o god_n show_v great_a wonder_n and_o magnify_v his_o power_n most_o of_o all_o at_o the_o use_n of_o it_o which_o you_o can_v disprove_v nor_o deny_v though_o you_o ramble_v and_o be_v ready_a to_o grind_v the_o tooth_n at_o it_o helen_z adore_v the_o king_n of_o theodosii_n heaven_n and_o not_o the_o wooden_a cross_n say_v s._n ambrose_n in_o regard_n of_o that_o great_a and_o profane_a abuse_n of_o it_o in_o the_o roman_a church_n we_o do_v abstain_v from_o the_o more_o frequent_a ordinary_a public_a use_n of_o the_o sign_n which_o otherwise_o be_v lawful_a and_o we_o may_v practise_v it_o much_o more_o than_o we_o do_v be_v it_o not_o for_o scandal_n but_o i_o add_v in_o the_o conclusion_n i_o can_v tell_v some_o experiment_a effect_n thereof_o you_o mean_v in_o my_o own_o experience_n by_o myself_o or_o some_o other_o of_o my_o acquaintance_n what_o i_o mean_v domino_fw-la you_o have_v no_o authority_n to_o examine_v i_o whatsoever_o you_o have_v give_v out_o among_o the_o brethren_n in_o this_o point_n i_o may_v by_o all_o law_n in_o term_n of_o ambiguity_n expound_v myself_o therefore_o prate_v you_o in_o corner_n what_o you_o please_v i_o may_v intend_v this_o that_o i_o can_v out_o of_o my_o read_n afford_v the_o gagger_n who_o have_v relate_v none_o some_o example_n of_o strange_a work_n wrought_v by_o god_n in_o the_o time_n of_o old_a at_o the_o use_n of_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n and_o some_o i_o have_v former_o make_v you_o acquaint_v withal_o out_o of_o epiphanius_n nazianzen_n chrysostome_n and_o other_o who_o much_o grave_a and_o respect_a authority_n in_o the_o church_n you_o though_o apt_o dispose_v thereto_o dare_v not_o trample_v under_o foot_n as_o little_a account_n as_o you_o even_o now_o make_v of_o the_o ancient_n as_o i_o tell_v the_o gagger_n before_o that_o i_o can_v afford_v he_o father_n for_o the_o use_n thereof_o he_o have_v