gyve out Well consider your self before the Lord call you to accompt for defacing his truth and pleading for Baal I grant yea I were not of God if I should speake otherwise that the deare servaÌ„ts of God fall into most lothsome sinnes after regeneration that the riches of Gods mercy might appeare in their repentance through the worke of his grace Then you reason thus if ther be allwaies spottes and imperfectnes in the true Church vpon earth then al your ArgumeÌ„ts you bring against the Church of England are of no force except you will mainetaine a perfection Mâ—ne answeare is I will not meddle with your Church to proue yt a false Church in this treatise but refer you to Mr. Barrowes refutation of Mr. Gifford him that handleth that part of your booke Yet I must tel you your argument is verie simple For after the same maner you migt reason thus If ther be no true Church without spottes vpon earth then the Church of Rome is the true Church for yt hath manie spottes you all Schismatiques Againe you assume the matter you should proue It wil be proued against you that you haue not EcclesiaÌ„ a people called fourth of the world to the obedience of Christ Then that the spottes of your Church are Egiptian vlcers incurable running botches But I purposed not to deale with your Church only my mind is to shew the vnlawfullnes of this readingh and imposing mens writings vpon mens Consciences in stead of true praying Of which sinne the Lord giue you and this whole land grace to repent that so men may learne more feruently to cal vpon God The first Argument against read prayer c. No Apocrypha must be brought into the publique assemblies for there onlie GODS vvorde liuely voyce of his owne graces must be hearde in the publique assemblies But mens vvritings the reading them ouer for prayer are Apocrypha therfore may not be brought into the publique assemblies G. Gifford First touching the Proposition No Apocrypha is to be brought into the publique assemblies What can be more false Apocrypha is opposed against Canonicall If nothing may be brought into the publique assemblies but Canonicall Scripture then the Sermons and prayers of Pastors are to be banished c. I. Greenvvood IN the answere of this you will needes oppose against both Proposititions and yet have nothing to say if not to royle the doctrines deliuered with your feete least others should drinke therof The part of a wise man had beene to lay his hand on his mouth In the first Proposition you would oppose the worde Apocrypha against the liuely voyce of Gods graces when you see I said onlie that no Apocrypha might be brought into the publique assemblies And furder to explane my minde least you should willingly finde such a cauill I added this reason for there only Gods worde the liuely voyces of his graces are to be heard Where I acknowledged those liuelie voyces to be Gods ordinance yet nether to be called Apocrypha nor Canonicall How can you say then I would haue these or that these are banished if all Apocrypha writings be banished the publique assemblies Yet as I told you I take Apocrypha to be all writings but the Canonicall Authentique Scriptures But say you then I will exclude the Paraphrases vpon the Scriptures and the Psalmes in metre etc. Affirme you them to be Apocrypha as you do and can do no other and I will through Gods grace proue they ought not to be brougt into the publique assemblies First no mans writinghs are giuen to the Church by testimonie of Gods spirit and we are onlie commaunded to heare what the spirith saith therfore though mens writings be permitted to be read priuatlie of them that will and therupon called Apocrypha that is hidden they may not be brought into the publique assemblies Secondly no mans writinhs are without errour and imperfections therfore not to be brougt into the publique asseÌ„blies The Church is the pillar of truth Thirdlie the Church is builded vpon the foundation of the Prophets and the Apostles Christ Iesus being the cheif corner stone and not vpon meÌ„s writinges Therfore mens writins may not be brougt into the publique assemblies Ephes. 2.20 and 1. Cor. 3. Fourthlie if we might bring in anie mens writings into the publique assemblies theÌ„ all mens writings which we iudge agreable to the Scriptures But this is forbidden Ecclesiastes 12.11.12 My proof of the first Proposition to this If anie mens writings are to be brougt into the publique assemblies by Gods commaundement because they are agreable to the Scriptures as you in an other place alleadge then all that are thought agreable to the Scriptures ought of necessitie by the same commandement and if ther be no commaundement then none are to be make Authentique which God hath not made Authentique For that were to set man in the place of God No mans writinges cary that maiestie that the penne of the holy ghost No mans writinges are Cecuromenai Authentique confirmed by signes and wonders from heauen sealed by Christes blood that not one worde or title shal be vnfulfilled The Scriptures are all sufficient All men must walke by that one rule To thinke ther were not rules ynoug prescribed by the Lord for his house were blasphemous and papisticall Now for the explication interpretatioÌ„ etc. and speach vnto God in prayer God hath giuen giftes vnto men to pray and prophecye and ordeyned his ministerye of Pastors Teachers whose liuely voice is appointed to be the mouth of God vnto the people and of his people vnto himself in the publique assemblies And thâ—se graces are not Apocryphall for no prophecie of the Scripture is of priuate interpretatioÌ„ idias epiluseos to euery one to giueÌ„ the manifestatioÌ„ of te spirit to proffit withal Most excelleÌ„t meÌ„ serue but their tyme in the publique asseÌ„blies Now I may coÌ„clude a I beganne That only Gods holy word the liuely graces of his holy Spirit are to be heard offred vp vnto him in the publique assemblies Where then in way of answere to the Minor Proposition you say you see not how our speach vnto God should be Apocrypha It answeareth not me who deny an other mans writing to be our speach in prayer vnto God But conuinceth your self by your owne mouth thus True prayer ys not Apocrypha but all mens writings are Apocrypha Therfore meÌ„s writings is not true prayer Here when you haue nothing to say for your self you woulde make me belieue that I accoÌ„pt the Psalmes and the other formes of prayer in the Scripture to be Apocrypha when they be read though a litle before you confessed you had in your last writing donne me wrong therin I do accoÌ„pt the reading of theÌ„ for praying to be a grosse and superstitious abuse of theÌ„ yet theÌ„ to be holie and canonical Scripture And here you haue flatly ouerthroweÌ„ your self saying the worde Apocrypha is
then wee thinck of your counterfeit playes and pleas for your Idolls and detestable sacriledge and high prophanation of GODS ordinances with Iannes and Iambres to resist the truth Paraphrases wee hold to be mens writinges and expositions and not the word of GOD nor the liuely voice of Gods grace of interpretation or prayer therefore to be excluded this place of service vnto GOD. Thus you see the further you wrastle the further you make your wares the best of them odious to euerie godly conscience You say I deceiue the simple by gyuing them one crabbe amongst many apples but you may behold your best apples such as the holy GHOST hath foretold vs Revelation 18. to be entisements to euil It is well you will grant my Propositions so sound and I would wish if such de GODS wil they might be better sauoured Nowe because I wil not stand either repeating or contending about Syllogismes I will take this much yeilded of your owne conclusions which is as much in effect as I haue affirmed were you teach me thus to reason No mans writings are the vndoubted truth of God but haue errours and imperfections therfore men cannot further ground vpon them then they be consonant to the Canonicall Scriptures Againe The Church is builded vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets therfore our faith is not to rest vpon meÌ„s writings Wherevpon doth necessarily follow that if mens writings may not be builded vpon nor rested vpon howe should you dreame it lawfull to impose them for lawes vpon the publick assemblies or to haue them there read to beare rule as the wordes of God And this you confessed in an other of your writings that GOD spake vnto vs out of his vndoubted worde or by his owne word If then GOD speake not vnto vs by mens writinges that be of priuate interpretation in the assemblie nor that they can be made groundwork to buyld our faith vpon or to rest assured vpon yt will be granted I hope that they are not to be imposed vâ—on the publick assemblies as lawes and rules but left to euerie mans private vse in their libertie as they will answere for themselues what vse they put them to and whither they doe not prefer them before the booke of GOD or preiudice themselves by them This first poinct is then plaine That only GODS vndoubted worde is to be imposed brought in aÌ„d maintayned in the publick assemblies as lawes and rules no other writings being authentick or Canonical But here Mr. Giffard doth in effect affirme that the word of God yt self is not authentick or Canonical except in the Hebrew or Greeke Copie Wherin he goeth a litle beyond the Papists that wil yet allow the worde of GOD in latine And if it shoulde be defended that the worde of GOD were not the worde yt self that wee haue in our owne language it will follow that no man could haue assurance of faith except he vnderstoode both Hebrew and Greeke yea be able soundly to interpret the Scriptures in both If the translations be so far mens writings that yt ceaseth generally to be the word of GOD that is not written in Hebrew or Greek and mens writinges not to be grounded or rested vpon where shall our assurance stand And might not Mr. Giffard as well say the Hebrew and Greek Copiâ— are but paper ankyâ—ck many faults and errours by the print in vowells accents letters and so conclude we had not Authentick or canonicall Scriptures at al except mens erronious writings might be of equall authoritie in the assemblie that the Scriptures must he not beare with mee in accompting him an Atheist or Libertine in thus reasoning Hence then we see whiles you go about to abase the Canonicall Scriptures and extol your patched Leâ—tourgie you fall into manie blasphemies as I haue before told you Wee hold yt the word of GOD in what language soeuer stil reiecting the errours in the print in the translations etc. as they are knowne vnto vs and not the word yâ— self for the imperfections or errours in the translation and print Now when you can make that which remayneth the vndoubted worde of God not agreable only but an Authentick approued Canonicall Scripture authorised from God to be the verie eternal foundation and rules limitts and lawes giuen by himself vnto his people you may lift vp your 〈◊〉 DagoÌ„ into this place if there be some truth in their writings as what mens writings haue not some and the holy name of GOD verie much yet is that truth in the Scripture yt self and here so mingled with chaffe that it were not only vnprofitable and a hinderance of the true vse of GODS worde but an abolishing and defacing of the word yt self the maiestie whereof ought to terrifie you from this presumption And where you say that you decide not controversies by anie translation but by the Authentick Copies of the Hebrew and Greke I trust you speak only of such as are able by the interpretation thereof so to decide controversies and holde it not vnlawfull for anie such as haue not that help to convince errour by the powre of the word and conferring one place with an other in anie translation according to the analogie of faith though I grant we ought to vse the best approued But if this were not lawfull surely no man might prophesie in the Church which hath not the gift of interpretation of the tongue neither might any affirme any Scripture to be true but they wich haue knowledg of tongues How blasphemous is this gâ—are whiles you are ignorant of the powre wisdome and agreement of the word and Spirit and diuersitie of giftes giuen vnto men The Word and the Spirit approue ech other and beare wâ—â—ness ech of other in what language soeuer GOD giueth yt to our vnderstanding Prophesie and knowledg of tongues are two seueral giftes not alwayes giuen to one member but distributed as God in his wisdome hath appointed 1. Cor. 12. and prophesie commanded for the more excellent Cap. 14. But this is sufficient in this place that the word of God is the word of God in what language soeuer and to accompt yt being verbatim translated or at least so far foorth faithfully translated mans writing were blasphemie but mens writings can neuer be so holden the authentick Scriptures of God how agreable to the woâ—â— soeuer they be My argument is then firme and thus left vpon you Those writings which be not the word of God being imperfect and neuer without error may not be imponed as lawes and Canons vpon the publick assemblies or there be read or interpreted or offred vp in worship But such are al mens writings that be not the authentick word of God yt self The publick assemblies are only bound to the reading and interpretation of the Scriptures which God hath ordeined to be read in a knowne language aÌ„d for prayer and prophesie hath ordeined the liuely voice of his owne graces in the mouth
Eauen c. teachinge the church and ministrie to pray by nomber slint and proportioÌ„ it is not onely popish but most friuolous and vaine disgracing and not instructing the Church and ministerie 3. In that by this their Leitourgie they prescribe vnto the Church what Scriptures publiquelie to read and vvhen to reade them as these Chapters and Psalmes at their matteÌ„s before noone those at afternoone c. On all the dayes that they have publique meetings and service through the yeere and so from yeere to yeere They therebie take from the Church the â—olie and free vse both of the Scriptures and spirit off God They therbie conceale and shut out of the Church a great part off Gods holie worde which they reade not As also abuse without order those Scriptures they enioyne to be read 4. In that they shread rend and dismember the scriptures from the holie Order and natural sense of their context to make them Epistles Gospels Lessons select Psalmes to their festivals and idol worship aboue-said They most heinouslie pervert and abuse the Scriptures to the high dishonor of God their owne feareful iudgment 5. In that they bring in aÌ„d coÌ„maunde the Apocrypha writings to be publiquelie read in the Church They both mainetaine and publiquelie teach the dangerous errors therin contayned to the poysoning and subverting of the faith of the church They thrust these devises of meÌ„ into the place of Gods worde causing the people therebie to reverence and esteeme theÌ„ as the holie Oracles of God of like aucthoritie dignitie and truth and to resorte vnto theÌ„ to builde their faith thervpoÌ„ and therbie they bring in an other foundation into the Church besides the high iniurie donne vnto God therbie 6. Finallie in that by this their Leitourgie they bring in erect aÌ„d enioyne a nevv straÌ„ge kinde of administratioÌ„ as is aboue proued in the perticulars They make and erect a new Gospel and so must needes also erect vnto yt a new ministrie For the ministrie of Christ is oÌ„ly bounde vnto aÌ„d vvil onlie administer by Christes Testament vvherein they haue a most perfect Leitourgie for the vvhole administration of his Church Therfore this present Leitourgie and ministrie of EnglaÌ„d are by al these reasons in general and particular founde aÌ„d proved at once to be counterfeite vngodlie and Antichristian Hitherto Mr. Barrow aÌ„d much more in his books afore named as the reader there may fynd Now to conclude the end of publishing these things is to stirre vp al that feare God seriously to mynd what true prayer is and to be carefull to vse it aright according to the word off God which in al thinges faith without which it is imyossible to please God must alway respect and build vpoÌ„ Rom. 10.17 and 14.23 Heb. 11.6 Iosh. 1.7.8 That so we may in this as in all other dutyes of godlynes learne to performe it so as whereby we may be coÌ„forted of God and God may be glorifyed off vs in Iesus Christ. 1603. FINIS ¶ TO THE CHRISTIAN READER TOvvching the treatises follovving know Good Reader that Mr. GREENVVOODS first vvriting concerning read prayer c. vvas by the Prelates taken from him Wherevpon he desired Mr. GIFFORD vvho vvrote against him and had the copy of it to publish it also to the vvorld But he vvould not do it and so by their meanes it yet remayneth suppressed For vvhat cause thou mayest vvell conjecture vvith thy selfe These things Mr. GREENVVOOD himself signifyeth here in the Treatise ensuing Novv if by any meanes that first of his come into thy handes be thou entreated for the truths sake eyther thy selfe to publish it or to deliver it to such as vvill That so the vvhole matter and cariage of it may better appeare to all men for the â—urther manifestation of the truth in this behalf In the meane tyme these are published for thy benefit The Lord give thee so to vse them as may be for his prayse and thy comfort in Christ Remembring alvvay that he is Mediator not for any false vvorship vvhatsoever but for that onely vvhich is according to his vvord Which poynt vvell mynded as it ought vvould soone end the question here controverted and all other the like vvith all such as feare God Mynd it therefore and so farevvell in the Lord. The preface 1. Cor. 2. 11. What man knoweth the things of a man if not the Spirit of man which is in himself Euen so the things of GOD knoweth no man if not the Spirit of GOD. 12. Now we haue receiued not the Spirit of the world but the Spirit which is of God that we might knowe the thinges of GOD giuen vnto vs. 13. Which things we also speak not in the words taught of mans wisdome but in wordes taught of the Holy Ghost we compare spiritual thinges to spiritual thinges My first writing being about that spiritual exercise of praier and true inuocacion of Gods reuerend name whereby the distressed soule of man loaden with the burden of sinne compassed also about with so many deceitfull enimies contynual assaults of Satan rebellion of the flesh entisements of the world etc. seeketh daylie help of God the Father giuer of all good giftes hauing thorough IESVS CHRIST free accesse by the direction of his holy spirit for all occasions to vnburden yt self of whatsoeuer grief or occasion of thankes yt is moued with I ought still and by Gods assistance shall keepe me in the meeknes of the spirit not witstanding his vnchristian railinges sclanders and reproches against me and the truth I then shewed that no other prayer could vtter and ease the seuerall occasions and distresses of this conscience and that no other mans writing could speake for this soule vnto God but the heart and mouth of him that prayeth for himself or is chosen the mouth of many vttering to God his or ther mindes for their present wantes or occasions of thanckes giuing according to the will of God as neede and occasion vrgeth and the spirit giueth vtterance And I furder proved that onlie this prayer pleaseth God and is grounded of faith to this effect I brought many reasons out of Gods worde admiring the ignorance of this age wherin hauing had the gospell of Christ thus manie yeares in our owne language to search and try al things by whole congregations do make no other prayer to God then reading ouer certeine numbers of wordes vpon a booke from yeare to yeare moneth to moneth day to day c. the same matter and words as they were stinted euen out of that Portâ—is englished out of Antichrists masse-booke besides priuate reading of mens writings instead of praying And seing this counterfeit shew of worship and pretended prayers was made common marchandize in euery assemblie by this Antichristian priesthood and that al men euery where were compelled to bowe downe herevnto and to offer by such counterfeit sacrifices I perceaved the first principle of Religion which is to inuocate the name of
consider how it lyeth vpon him whiles he speaketh out of the mouth of the Beast if he repent not to turne from his euil wayes Let it further be weighed how ignorantly he chargeth me to condemne al Churches for this finale examplifying of this Egiptian darknes Idolatrous worship and exalting mens writings into this defacing of Gods word and true worship they neither being guylty of such a sacrilegious Leitourgie as this Egiptian Calf hatched at Rome neither are to be presently iudged no Church for others sinne till they ioyne obstinacie to their transgression But shift the matter as you wil or rather as you can appeare before God I wil not make lesse the sinne or the iudgment due to sinne for mens persons no not of whole Churches if they shal be guilty therin My desire is by discouerie of the sinne to bring men to repentance and vnto the awe of God in his worship who are guyltie besides your selues in such sacriledge as to abrogate the Leitourgy of Christ and set vp an other or to restraine Gods true worship and to giue life to the image of the Beast it shilleth me not let sinne be sinne and GOD righteous and them examine yourselves if they or you be cleare I reioyce neither do I thinck or can charge them with such Idolatrie as is here erected I take it you wil be found the sclanderer of other Churches to hide your owne filthines But saith Mr. Giffard those Scriptures are against the adding of humane preceptes and lawes to be kept as parâ—â—s of Gods wurship to â—ind the conscience to seek righteousnes and the forgiuenes of sinnes or the merit of eternal life in them or against such rules of gouernment as God hath set to be perpetual In which we must take your meaning to be this that you grant where anie humane precepts and lawes be enforced as a part of GODS worship or as lawes to bind the conscience or when righteousnes is sought in them and forgiuenes of sinnes by observing of them or merit by them or if they be against such rules of gouernment as GOD hath let to be perpetuall if the additions or constitutions be such as anie of these then such lawes and constitutions are against the perfection of the word of God against Christian libertie and in the chief things which concerne Gods worship against the ground and foundation of our faith and so a thing most detestable and accursed which our Sauiour CHRIST refused iustly to obserue with the blinde Pharisâ—is wherein you haue granted as much as I euer affirmed For is not your whole Leitournie being an other then CHRISTS Testament your whole reading mens writings in place and in stead of laying forth your owne present wantes and occasions in prayer to God humane constitutions aÌ„d made a parte of Gods worship at least such pretended worship as you thinke good enough for him Weygh the matter vnrightly Againe whither your whole Antichristian gouernment offices Courtes and ministerie be not constitutions and ordinances against such rules of Christs gouernment as be perpetual and an innovating of his Testament examine which you shall soone perceiue if you looke but what Christs perpetuall ordinances offices officers and lawes for the guyding ordering and gouerning of his CHURCH be prescribing euerie one their place dutie and limits iointly and seuerally and not finde your ministerie registered there but a strange Leitourgie and worship borrowed from the Pope which came out of the bottomlesse pit confesse your sacriledge in suppressing CHRISTS whole ministerie and ordinances and erecting an other for the perpetuitie of his euen to euerie naile and pâ—â—n The holy Ghost sheweth that only to be his ministerie till we be all a perfect body in him and his whole ministerie and ordinances a kingdome that cannot be shaken Hebre. 12. Ephes. 4. a commandement to be kept vndefiled till the apearing of IESUS CHRIST his Scepter an euerlasting Scepter the Sonne as faithfull in his house as Moses a servant in the Tabernacle who made all things according to the paterne So that it is to be wondred Mr. Giffard should think anie part of Christs gouernment should not be perpetuall that was giuen by his Apostles the master buylders and layers of the foundation wherby all actions should be tried to the worlds end May not Mr. Giffard as wel cal into question the perpetuite of the TestameÌ„t as the lawes and rules for the governmeÌ„t of his Church Now if your whole false Hierarchie Offices Officers Lawes Worship be plainly other then Christs as in our other writings are proued and shame will inhibit you to deny how can you be so drunke with the cup of the Whores fornication to think you haue no constitutions lawes or traditions which are a part of worship and against such rules of Christs gouernment as the Apostles haue prescribed for the ordring of his howse and the same ordeyned for all Churches til we become all a perfect bodye in him But if Mr. Giffard wil shew himself so voide of al conscieÌ„ce aÌ„d truth to say al their traditionall worship and Antichristian Offices and ordinances be neither part of their worship nor constitutions disanulling the ordinances of Christ yet wil he confesse I doubt not this kinde of worship and gouernment to be imposed as matters to binde the conscieÌ„ce being all the seruice of God they haue seeing hee woulde also haue al that obserue them not to be censured and excommunicat for this marchandize yt were a sore matter a man should be cut of from Christ and his Church gyuen ouer to Satan and the iudgment ratified in heauen against soule and bodye for a matter that byndes not the conscience As though the soule and bodye howsoeuer some things perteine to the one or is done by the one as proper worke there of were not both to be counted when the conscience shal be opened to answere for all done in both or by eyther of both even whatsoeuer wee haue done in soule and bodye and Calvine would but diuide the soule and the bodye in Ciuile causes But Maister Giffard would goe a note further â— namely that in the seruice of GOD in such causes as the transgression deserue excommunication to be no matter bynding the conscience But it may be Maister Giffard doth suppose that except the constitutions ecclesiasticall be such as righteousnes be commanded to be sought in the doing them and forgiuenes of sinnes and merit by them all is wel Then besides the other hbuses granted he must de demanded whither those traditions of the Fathers which our Sauiour Christ and his Disciples refused to observe were imposed as meritorious whervnto wee answere No For in the superstitious washings of cuppes of beddes with al such trincketts wee see to be no such matter Marke 7. and Christs words in saying they layde the commandements of God aside to set vp their owne traditions doth shew wherin the sinne was namelie to do and observe such things of vaine glorie
the true God through the meditation of Christ in spirit and truth with heart and voyce for our present wantes according to the wil of God was never yet sincearly taught by these time-seruing Priests But as an agreeable service to the humors of earthlie minded men which haue not the spirit of God this ware was thrust vpoÌ„ al people they well knowing that such a ministerie and such a Church of wordlings could neuer haue stood without such a Samaritan worshipp and Egiptian calf and like earthlie deuised to counterfeyt a Religion al men inclyned to some And long have I heard this pretended worship inveyed against by many sometymes zealous for the errours and confused order therof Yet could I not heare anie to sett downe or teach which was the true prayer that only pleased God manie contriving divers formes of wordes as though they had knowen the heart of man counselled them to reade them day vnto day yeare vnto yeare at evening morning dinner Svpper c. by portion measure and stint as an offering to God what state soever the soule were in not teaching the difference betweene reading vpon a booke and prayer vnto God all this tyme. So that true and only prayer hath not beene taught al this tyme and those that knewe how to pray aright neglect it this reading being most easie as they thinke and they aâ—test therunto compelled in the publique assemblies thus to mocke with God after the manner of the papists mattins true zeale no where founde but in the persequted remnant These my first writings caryed abroade by such as desired true instruction and willing to make others partakers of such benefites as God imparted vnto them yt fell into Mr. GIFFORDS hand Who as yt seemeth being a marchaunt of such ware fynding the gayne of the priesthood to depend here vpon or as he saith the peace vniformitie of the Church made head vnto yt and that not with purpose as the fruite of his labour sheweth to edifie others but standing himself a minister to this Liturgie having made shipwrack of that conscience he sometimes was thought to haue with all bitternes of spirit and carnal wisdome having no more savour of grace in his writings then there is taste in the white of an egge fleeth vpoÌ„ me with vncharitable raylings sclanders c And loadeth not only me but al the faithfull that walke by the rule of Gods worde with opprobrious titles of Donatists Brownists Anabaptists Heretiques Schismatiques seditious foolish frantick c. to bring not onely vs but the truth of God into contempt with our Sovereigne Prynce and all that feare God for he ceaseth not with laying al reproches he can devise vpoÌ„ our persons as one of those Locusts Reu. 9. whose similituds are like vnto horses prepared to battell whose faces like men but theyr teeth as the teeth of Lyons But also perverteth blaspheameth and by al meanes de faceth the truth offered him Wel seyng the natural man perceaveth not the things of the spirit of God I speake not here of the giftes of the spirit but of the grace of God which sanctifieth the same many hauing Charismata that haue not Charin. And seyng I am alreadie thus rent Gods truth delivered by me troden vnder his feete I will followe the councell of Salomon who forewarneth me that he vvhich reproveth a skorner receaueth to himself shame and he that rebuketh the vvicked himself a blot And so tourne me from him leauing him to the consideration of his owne words where hee saieth in his Epistle to the reader He that seemeth most zealous in Religion and refrayneth not his tongue hath but bitternes in his heart in stead of heauenly zeale And though nothing els can be looked for at theyr handes that are Apostate from that light they have sometymes themselves published of which sorte the worlde was never more full yet for the good of Gods chosen scattered abroade and for the defence of Gods trueth I cannot holde my tongue And for the more playnenes I will answeare as to him though I minde not to haue anie more to do with him till God giue him repentance Wishing grace by the direction of Gods holy spirit to him that readeth to weigh both sides vprightly and to follow the truth to his owne saluation IO. GRENWOOD GEORGE GIFFORD To condemne and ouerthrow read prayer ye bring as the ground or foundation of all your matter this Sentence GOD is a Spirit and to be vvorshipped in Spirit Iohn 4. This Scripture in deede is cleare and strong to cut downe al Carnal worship as disgreeing from the nature of GOD. And if any mayntaine that the very bodily action of reading is the worship of God it may fitly be alleadged against them c. IOHN GREENWOODS ANSWER Wisdome is Iustified of her Children IT is agreed vpon and consented vnto on both sides that seeing God is a spirit and onely requireth such to worship him as worship him in spirit and truth all carnall worship is cut downe hereby of what sort soeuer as disagreeing from the nature of God And that all fantastical deuises of men namely whatsoeuer is not warranted in his worde is carnall worship a wearisomnes vnto him and lothsome in his sight So that no man ought to intermedle attempt or practize anie thing in shew of worship whereof they haue not sure grounde of his worde For euen our God is a consuming fire Now to put away all your bodily distinctions and earthly cauils I still affirme as I haue proued the stinting imposing mens writings vpon publique assemblies to haue them read ouer by number and stint or any other way as a worship of God in stead of true inuocation is a meere deuise of man and so carnall worship as also all other reading of mens writinges publiquely or priuatly in this abuse for praying to God Yet say you to apply this Scripture Iohn 4.22.23 in this manner against read prayer is friuolous where I appeale to all mens consciences for the weight therof It is friuolous you say except I can proue that a man cannot pray by the spirit of GOD with sighes and groanes vpon a booke or when prayer is vttered after a prescript forme c. At the first step you go about to alter the question All our prayers ought to be vttered after a prescript forme euen that perfect rule and forme our Sauiour gaue to his Disciples and al posteâ—ities But this is nothing to the matter For the other which is nothing but a begging of the question I alleaged certayne reasons to this effecet First that those sighes and groanes in reading instead of praying were not of fayth seeing in praying the sighes and groanes that proceede of faith minister matter to praye without a booke Secondly that you did but barely affirme the question in calling it prayer by the spirit when one doth read seing reading is not praying at al for as I then alleadged to inuocate the name of God in