Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	antiquity_n	church_n	true_a	1,708	5	5.8552	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A90523	A defence of church-government, exercised in presbyteriall, classicall, & synodall assemblies; according to the practise of the reformed churches: touching I. The power of a particular eldership, against those that plead for a meere popular government, specially Mr Ainsvvorth in his Animadversion to Mr Clyft. &c. II. The authority of classes and synods, against the patrons of independencie: answering in this poynt Mr Davenport his Apologeticall reply, &c. and Mr Canne his Churches plea, &c, sent forth first by W. Best, and afterwards for this part of it, under the title of Syons prerogative royall. By Iohn Paget, late able and faithfull pastour of the Reformed English Church in Amsterdam. Hereunto is prefixed an advertisement to the Parliament, wherein are inserted some animadversions on the Cheshire Remonstrance against Presbytery: by T.P.	Paget, John, d. 1640.; Paget, Thomas, d. 1660.	1641 (1641)	Wing P166; Thomason E117_1; ESTC R16734	348,418	298

certain_a as_o it_o be_v certain_a that_o he_o which_o by_o force_n repell_v force_n be_v arm_v with_o public_a authority_n he_o distinguish_v their_o jurisdiction_n in_o respect_n of_o the_o cause_n judge_v by_o they_o and_o repeat_v this_o their_o authority_n again_o in_o the_o 28._o the_o n._n 28._o next_o animadversion_n and_o though_o these_o two_o kind_n of_o government_n civil_a and_o ecclesiastical_a do_v use_v a_o different_a manner_n of_o compulsion_n he_o say_v 29._o say_v n._n 29._o nihil_fw-la refert_fw-la nos_fw-la de_fw-la rei_fw-la substantia_fw-la agimus_fw-la coactionem_fw-la uterque_fw-la habet_fw-la sed_fw-la hic_fw-la spiritualem_fw-la ille_fw-la temporalem_fw-la etc._n etc._n it_o skill_v not_o we_o entreat_v of_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o matter_n both_o of_o they_o have_v a_o coactive_a power_n or_o a_o compulsion_n but_o the_o one_o spiritual_a the_o other_o temporal_a etc._n etc._n a_o most_o evident_a assertion_n of_o synodall_n jurisdiction_n and_o that_o they_o be_v not_o to_o direct_v only_o by_o way_n of_o counsel_n but_o to_o correct_v also_o by_o way_n of_o censure_n to_o these_o i_o may_v add_v many_o other_o testimony_n of_o junius_n but_o these_o evidence_n already_o cite_v may_v be_v sufficient_a to_o show_v that_o he_o be_v not_o of_o this_o strange_a opinion_n touch_v the_o independency_n of_o church_n and_o that_o mr_n daven_n therefore_o have_v abuse_v his_o reader_n and_o seek_v to_o blind_v their_o eye_n when_o for_o the_o credit_n of_o his_o cause_n he_o will_v have_v it_o think_v that_o junius_n be_v of_o his_o mind_n while_o he_o profess_v that_o he_o do_v full_o agree_v with_o he_o sect_n x._o his_o pretence_n of_o agreement_n with_o dr_n whitaker_n examine_v m_o r_o dau._n to_o colour_n his_o opinion_n as_o if_o it_o be_v no_o singular_a conceit_n of_o mr_n jacob_n and_o some_o few_o other_o make_v mention_n of_o the_o centurioator_n as_o if_o they_o be_v of_o the_o same_o mind_n yet_o he_o allege_v not_o their_o word_n to_o prove_v the_o same_o but_o instead_o of_o other_o he_o choose_v out_o dr_n whitaker_n as_o if_o he_o have_v be_v a_o favourer_n of_o this_o opinion_n which_o it_o be_v likely_a that_o he_o never_o hear_v of_o and_o say_v argum._n say_v apol._n reply_n p._n 237._o 238._o whit._fw-la de_fw-la conci_fw-la quest_n 5._o argum._n to_o these_o i_o may_v add_v those_o who_o have_v handle_v the_o controversy_n concern_v the_o necessity_n and_o authority_n of_o council_n among_o who_o i_o will_v instance_n in_o dr_n whitaker_n who_o speak_v of_o the_o fullnes_n of_o that_o delegated_a power_n which_o christ_n have_v give_v to_o the_o church_n not_o to_o the_o pope_n which_o he_o appli_v to_o the_o key_n in_o bind_v and_o lose_v shut_v and_o open_v retain_v and_o remit_v fin_n say_v that_o this_o power_n belong_v primary_o principal_o and_o essential_o to_o the_o church_n but_o to_o the_o several_a bishop_n only_o accidental_o secundary_o and_o less_o principal_o and_o explain_v himself_o by_o a_o rule_n in_o philosophy_n which_o be_v that_o when_o any_o power_n be_v in_o two_o in_o one_o necessary_o &_o essential_o in_o another_o contingent_o and_o accidental_o it_o be_v more_o principal_o in_o he_o in_o who_o it_o be_v necessary_o and_o essential_o then_o in_o he_o who_o it_o be_v only_o contingent_o and_o accidental_o as_o the_o heat_n be_v more_o principal_o in_o the_o fire_n then_o in_o the_o water_n because_o it_o be_v in_o the_o water_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o fire_n so_o say_v he_o see_v this_o jurisdiction_n and_o fullnes_n of_o power_n be_v give_v to_o the_o church_n necessary_o and_o primary_o but_o to_o the_o pope_n only_o secundary_o and_o by_o the_o church_n it_o be_v manifest_a that_o it_o be_v more_o in_o the_o church_n then_o in_o the_o pope_n what_o that_o learn_v wright_a say_v of_o the_o church_n power_n in_o comparison_n with_o the_o pope_n hold_v in_o all_o other_o parallel_a instance_n answ._n first_o have_v mr_n dau._n repeat_v this_o argument_n of_o d._n whitaker_n full_o and_o just_o as_o it_o be_v set_v down_o by_o himself_o than_o may_v the_o reader_n have_v see_v therein_o a_o plain_a &_o evident_a testimony_n for_o the_o authority_n of_o synod_n but_o divers_a thing_n be_v omit_v in_o the_o beginning_n middle_a and_o end_n of_o it_o thereby_o the_o truth_n be_v obscure_v and_o hide_a from_o his_o reader_n in_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o d._n whitaker_n propound_v it_o thus_o if_o the_o fullnes_n of_o power_n be_v in_o the_o church_n not_o in_o the_o pope_n than_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o it_o have_v more_o authority_n than_o the_o pope_n but_o the_o first_o be_v true_a therefore_o the_o second_o also_o now_o by_o the_o church_n in_o this_o place_n he_o mean_v the_o general_n synod_n or_o council_n as_o appear_v by_o the_o title_n of_o this_o question_n note_v in_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o viz._n 5._o viz._n deconcil_n qu._n 5._o c._n 1._o with_o c._n 3._o arg._n 5._o whether_o the_o synod_n be_v above_o the_o pope_n and_o if_o he_o have_v not_o so_o mean_v it_o this_o his_o argument_n have_v be_v beside_o the_o question_n and_o therefore_o while_n d._n whitaker_n here_o direct_o conclude_v a_o fullnes_n of_o power_n in_o synod_n and_o as_o he_o further_o call_v it_o in_o this_o same_o place_n that_o high_a authority_n and_o jurisdiction_n which_o christ_n have_v leave_v unto_o his_o church_n it_o be_v manifest_a hereby_o that_o he_o do_v not_o hold_v they_o to_o be_v only_o for_o counsel_n &_o admonition_n and_o so_o be_v far_o from_o limit_v all_o ecclesiastical_a jurisdiction_n unto_o a_o particular_a congregation_n in_o the_o middle_n in_o the_o confirmation_n of_o this_o argument_n d._n whit._n say_v for_o if_o all_o this_o power_n be_v in_o the_o pope_n or_o in_o any_o one_o man_n principal_o and_o essential_o than_o he_o die_v it_o shall_v perish_v and_o so_o the_o church_n shall_v altogether_o loose_v it_o but_o it_o be_v not_o lose_v though_o the_o pope_n die_v a_o thousand_o time_n but_o it_o remain_v with_o the_o church_n without_o which_o the_o pope_n though_o live_a can_v have_v no_o part_n of_o this_o authority_n now_o to_o argue_v on_o this_o manner_n against_o the_o authority_n we_o asscribe_v unto_o synod_n by_o compare_v they_o with_o particular_a church_n as_o he_o do_v against_o the_o pope_n compare_v with_o synod_n will_v be_v inconsequent_a unequal_a and_o no_o parallel_n instance_n because_o the_o title_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o where_o give_v unto_o the_o pope_n or_o unto_o any_o one_o person_n as_o it_o be_v unto_o a_o assembly_n of_o minister_n governor_n or_o deputy_n of_o church_n meet_v together_o in_o the_o name_n of_o christ_n in_o synod_n because_o though_o we_o asscribe_v unto_o synod_n some_o jurisdiction_n yet_o we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o all_o power_n be_v in_o they_o original_o and_o so_o to_o be_v derive_v unto_o other_o as_o be_v say_v of_o the_o pope_n and_o consequent_o because_o there_o be_v no_o such_o danger_n that_o the_o power_n of_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v lose_v and_o perish_v by_o the_o death_n of_o such_o as_o be_v member_n of_o the_o synod_n as_o may_v be_v by_o the_o death_n of_o the_o pope_n if_o all_o power_n be_v primary_o and_o essential_o in_o he_o alone_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v a_o vain_a assertion_n of_o mr_n dau._n touch_v this_o argument_n of_o d._n whit._n viz_o what_o that_o learned_a wright_a say_v of_o the_o church_n power_n in_o comparison_n with_o the_o pope_n hold_v in_o all_o other_o parallel_a instance_n in_o the_o end_n of_o this_o argument_n prosecute_v by_o d._n whitak_n he_o conclude_v thus_o wherefore_o seeing_z it_o be_v certain_a that_o this_o power_n be_v give_v unto_o the_o church_n primary_o and_o not_o unto_o the_o pope_n but_o secondary_o and_o by_o accident_n and_o see_v the_o church_n be_v represent_v in_o the_o synod_n it_o be_v of_o necessity_n that_o the_o synod_n must_v be_v above_o the_o pope_n and_o thus_o most_o evident_o he_o grant_v unto_o the_o synod_n as_o be_v a_o representative_a church_n a_o power_n &_o jurisdiction_n above_o the_o pope_n a_o power_n which_o consist_v in_o bind_v and_o lose_v shut_v &_o open_v retain_v and_o remit_v of_o sin_n as_o himself_o here_o explain_v it_o and_o so_o be_v direct_o contrary_a to_o they_o which_o allow_v no_o more_o unto_o synod_n but_o counsel_n and_o admonition_n why_o do_v mr_n davenp_v omit_v and_o refuse_v to_o name_v the_o synod_n which_o d._n whit._n so_o express_o mention_v apply_v &_o yield_v unto_o the_o synod_n that_o power_n which_o he_o there_o plead_v for_o second_o as_o for_o that_o similitude_n of_o fire_n and_o water_n though_o it_o be_v grant_v that_o heat_n be_v more_o principal_o in_o the_o fire_n then_o in_o the_o water_n because_o it_o be_v in_o the_o water_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o

from_o their_o minister_n but_o concern_v particular_a congregation_n and_o their_o subjection_n to_o ecclesiastical_a authority_n out_o of_o themselves_o though_o mr_n c._n and_o some_o other_o that_o now_o strive_v for_o the_o independency_n church_n do_v also_o affect_v a_o popular_a way_n of_o government_n in_o the_o church_n oppose_v not_o only_o the_o power_n of_o classical_a presbytery_n but_o also_o of_o particular_a eldership_n yet_o popularity_n do_v not_o necessary_o follow_v upon_o independency_n neither_o have_v they_o always_o both_o the_o same_o patron_n mr_n jacob_n though_o he_o plead_v for_o a_o single_a uncompounded_a policy_n in_o opposition_n to_o synodall_n authority_n yet_o he_o utter_o dislike_v those_o popular_a circumstance_n hold_v by_o the_o separation_n as_o have_v be_v note_v 176._o note_v pag._n 176._o before_o again_o the_o anabaptist_n though_o they_o maintain_v and_o practice_v those_o popular_a way_n of_o judge_a cause_n among_o they_o and_o 535._o and_o protoc_n embd._n act._n 101._o n._n 1._o q._n 7._o cl._n cl._n bekent_n p._n 218._o cloppenb_n cancer_n der_fw-mi weder-doop_a p._n 535._o oppose_v the_o eldership_n of_o the_o reform_a church_n as_o exercise_v a_o undue_a power_n in_o decide_v matter_n apart_o from_o the_o congregation_n yet_o they_o allow_v and_o practice_v divers_a thing_n contrary_a to_o the_o nature_n of_o independency_n so_o as_o mr_n c._n plead_v for_o it_o see_v 1._o they_o have_v 190._o have_v faukel_n babel_n der_fw-mi weder-doop_a pag._n 166_o 167_o 190._o their_o bishop_n as_o they_o call_v they_o distinct_a from_o their_o other_o preacher_n by_o they_o term_v vermaender_n that_o be_v admonisher_n and_o by_o some_o of_o they_o 2._o they_o protoc_n embd._n act._n 78._o n._n 4._o &_o act._n 80._o n._n 2._o hold_v to_o be_v deacon_n these_o acknowledge_v themselves_o 21._o themselves_o gesprec_n to●_n zierickz_n p._n 21._o to_o be_v inferior_a to_o their_o bishop_n in_o the_o ministry_n the_o bishop_n belong_v to_o some_o more_o eminent_a congregation_n of_o that_o sect_n do_v at_o certain_a time_n visit_v the_o other_o lesser_a congregation_n and_o administer_v the_o sacrament_n among_o they_o 2._o the_o anabaptist_n 215._o anabaptist_n protoc_n embd._n act._n 99_o n._n 1._o fauk_n babel_n der_fw-mi wederd_v d_o a._n &_o p._n 215._o use_v to_o excommunicate_v whole_a congregation_n at_o once_o when_o have_v be_v of_o the_o same_o profession_n with_o they_o they_o witness_v their_o dissent_n from_o they_o in_o such_o matter_n as_o for_o which_o particular_a person_n be_v excommunicate_v by_o they_o 3._o the_o cause_n that_o can_v be_v determine_v in_o their_o particular_a congregation_n be_v by_o they_o sometime_o b._n sometime_o babel_n der_fw-mi wederd_v c4_n a._n &_o c6_n b._n refer_v to_o the_o judgement_n of_o arbiter_n man_n of_o several_a congregation_n choose_v by_o both_o party_n with_o promise_n to_o stand_v to_o their_o sentence_n &_o sometime_o also_o to_o the_o meeting_n of_o the_o officer_n of_o sundry_a church_n this_o show_v that_o though_o they_o plead_v for_o popularity_n yet_o they_o do_v not_o simple_o allow_v of_o independency_n 11._o suppose_v that_o consideration_n have_v be_v allege_v by_o the_o author_n against_o popular_a government_n also_o as_o just_o it_o may_v in_o regard_n of_o the_o manifold_a disorder_n confusion_n and_o dissipation_n of_o church_n which_o it_o be_v know_v to_o bring_v with_o it_o yet_o this_o answer_n can_v prove_v it_o to_o be_v insufficient_a because_o it_o run_v upon_o a_o twofold_a false_a supposition_n 1._o that_o this_o appertain_v to_o the_o due_a liberty_n of_o the_o people_n to_o have_v their_o judgement_n seek_v unto_o for_o the_o determine_n of_o all_o controversy_n that_o arise_v in_o the_o church_n 2._o that_o this_o liberty_n be_v acknowledge_v to_o have_v be_v take_v from_o they_o as_o if_o they_o have_v be_v once_o in_o full_a possession_n of_o it_o or_o that_o this_o be_v the_o main_a reason_n for_o deny_v that_o pretend_a liberty_n to_o the_o people_n because_o of_o their_o infirmity_n or_o miscarriage_n in_o the_o use_n of_o it_o these_o thing_n as_o they_o be_v untrue_a in_o themselves_o so_o they_o be_v unjust_o obtrude_v upon_o the_o defendant_n who_o have_v give_v no_o occasion_n to_o such_o pretence_n we_o maintain_v on_o the_o other_o side_n that_o this_o be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o people_n privilege_n because_o it_o be_v not_o due_a unto_o they_o by_o any_o divine_a warrant_n and_o herein_o we_o be_v further_o confirm_v see_v such_o a_o order_n be_v in_o outward_a appearance_n and_o according_a to_o undeniable_a experience_n in_o the_o anabaptist_n brownist_n &_o other_o attend_v with_o manifold_a disorder_n confusion_n &_o dissipation_n of_o church_n 111._o though_o it_o be_v grant_v that_o the_o people_n have_v be_v oftentimes_o wise_a in_o their_o choice_n &_o sound_a in_o the_o faith_n then_o their_o minister_n which_o yet_o three_z of_o those_o place_n 7._o place_n act._n 3.26_o zozo_n l._n 7._o c._n 7._o theod._n l._n 2._o c._n 7._o here_o allege_v do_v not_o prove_v there_o be_v nothing_o in_o they_o to_o that_o purpose_n for_o which_o they_o be_v cite_v yet_o that_o be_v not_o enough_o to_o disprove_v the_o foresay_a assertion_n unless_o he_o can_v show_v that_o ordinary_o they_o be_v so_o qualify_v &_o endue_v with_o such_o ability_n as_o be_v requisite_a for_o the_o orderly_a exercise_n of_o judiciary_n power_n in_o the_o congregation_n this_o be_v not_o only_o contrary_a to_o experience_n but_o also_o to_o the_o reveal_v will_n &_o wisdom_n of_o god_n in_o dispense_n his_o gift_n several_o unto_o the_o member_n of_o the_o mystical_a body_n of_o his_o church_n appount_v some_o to_o be_v of_o mean_a use_n and_o in_o subjection_n to_o other_o 1._o cor._n 12_o 14-31_a heb._n 13.17_o we_o must_v either_o straiten_v the_o limit_n of_o the_o church_n further_o than_o christ_n himself_o have_v allow_v we_o by_o shut_v the_o weak_a &_o feeble_a out_o of_o his_o fold_n or_o else_o acknowledge_v that_o all_o the_o member_n be_v not_o fit_a to_o be_v use_v in_o the_o judicial_a try_v &_o determine_v of_o cause_n the_o next_o thing_n that_o mr_n c._n 94._o c._n chur._n pl._n p._n 94._o pretend_v to_o answer_v be_v touch_v the_o antiquity_n of_o classical_a and_o synodall_n government_n from_o those_o word_n of_o the_o author_n that_o the_o power_n which_o the_o classis_fw-la exercise_v be_v ancient_a etc._n etc._n that_o he_o name_v it_o the_o old_a beat_a path_n etc._n etc._n the_o author_n indeed_o have_v use_v these_o word_n upon_o just_a occasion_n not_o as_o any_o reason_n or_o argument_n to_o justify_v the_o lawfulness_n of_o this_o power_n as_o mr_n c._n seem_v to_o insinuate_v but_o to_o declare_v the_o truth_n in_o the_o matter_n of_o fact_n rather_o than_o in_o the_o controversy_n of_o right_n and_o this_o may_v easy_o appear_v to_o those_o that_o look_v upon_o the_o place_n 105._o place_n pag._n 72._o &_o 105._o allege_v out_o of_o the_o author_n book_n when_o a_o unjust_a complaint_n be_v make_v that_o he_o have_v subject_v the_o church_n under_o a_o undue_a power_n of_o the_o classis_fw-la that_o he_o bring_v it_o under_o etc._n etc._n he_o answer_v that_o power_n which_o the_o classis_fw-la exercise_v be_v ancient_a the_o same_o power_n which_o they_o have_v long_o before_o i_o either_o know_v they_o or_o they_o i_o etc._n etc._n again_o when_o there_o be_v mention_n make_v of_o those_o of_o his_o side_n he_o answer_v for_o my_o part_n i_o abhor_v this_o side_v i_o desire_v to_o walk_v in_o the_o old_a beat_a path_n of_o that_o discipline_n and_o government_n practise_v by_o these_o reform_a church_n and_o establish_v in_o their_o class_n and_o synod_n etc._n etc._n be_v not_o here_o just_a cause_n to_o use_v these_o word_n to_o this_o purpose_n for_o which_o they_o be_v apply_v he_o speak_v chief_o of_o the_o antiquity_n of_o this_o government_n in_o regard_n of_o the_o state_n of_o that_o particular_a church_n &_o of_o those_o with_o which_o it_o be_v combine_v concern_v which_o mr_n c._n himself_n can_v deny_v but_o that_o he_o have_v speak_v the_o truth_n but_o suppose_v it_o be_v utter_v in_o general_a with_o reference_n unto_o the_o joint_a consent_n of_o the_o church_n in_o all_o age_n giving_z testimony_n unto_o the_o exercise_n of_o this_o power_n may_v not_o this_o be_v a_o weighty_a &_o profitable_a consideration_n to_o be_v commend_v unto_o the_o serious_a thought_n of_o those_o that_o offer_v to_o oppose_v it_o let_v we_o hear_v what_o mr_n c._n say_v to_o this_o i._o c._n answ._n i._n sundry_a error_n be_v as_o ancient_a as_o the_o apostle_n time_n etc._n etc._n repl._n 1_o this_o do_v not_o prejudice_v the_o constant_a practice_n of_o this_o or_o any_o other_o truth_n nor_o the_o regard_n that_o be_v to_o be_v give_v unto_o the_o custom_n of_o the_o church_n of_o god_n according_a to_o the_o direction_n

congregation_n let_v we_o see_v what_o his_o own_o witness_n say_v d._n whitaker_n that_o be_v next_o allege_v by_o he_o do_v by_o many_o argument_n show_v the_o profit_n and_o necessity_n of_o synod_n and_o to_o this_o end_n he_o cit_v many_o 56._o many_o deconc_fw-fr qu._n 1._o c._n 3._o p._n 15.16_o &_o q._n 2._o c._n 3._o p._n 55_o 56._o place_n of_o scripture_n both_o from_o the_o old_a &_o new_a testament_n he_o allege_v at_o large_a etc._n large_a p._n 17._o etc._n etc._n 7_o or_o 8_o cause_n for_o which_o they_o be_v profitable_a and_o of_o great_a use_n and_o fruit_n he_o speak_v also_o of_o such_o synod_n as_o be_v not_o only_o for_o discuss_v and_o conclude_v of_o matter_n by_o way_n of_o counsel_n and_o advise_v but_o of_o those_o that_o have_v power_n to_o 21._o to_o p._n 21._o judge_v and_o condemn_v obstinate_a offender_n by_o a_o public_a judgement_n and_o as_o occasion_n require_v to_o anathematise_v or_o exclude_v from_o the_o fellowship_n of_o the_o church_n he_o maintain_v that_o those_o which_o be_v lawful_o call_v unto_o synod_n have_v authority_n of_o decide_v and_o determine_v controversy_n by_o etc._n by_o ibid._n q._n 3._o c._n 3._o p._n 95.96_o etc._n etc._n definitive_a sentence_n or_o suffrage_n he_o say_v that_o 470._o that_o depontif_n rom._n qu._n 4._o p._n 470._o appeal_n be_v of_o divine_a and_o natural_a right_n and_o can_v be_v deny_v in_o controversy_n about_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n and_o person_n and_o thus_o by_o the_o testimony_n of_o their_o own_o witness_n my_o adversary_n do_v offend_v both_o against_o the_o law_n of_o god_n and_o the_o law_n of_o nature_n in_o deny_v appeal_n and_o in_o not_o allow_v the_o action_n and_o judgement_n of_o a_o particular_a congregation_n to_o be_v judicial_o examine_v by_o a_o synod_n or_o classis_fw-la the_o several_a testimony_n of_o d._n whitaker_n to_o this_o purpose_n be_v allege_v 133-141_a allege_v p._n 39_o &_o 133-141_a before_o and_o apply_v at_o large_a to_o declare_v his_o judgement_n in_o this_o controversy_n though_o d._n whit._n do_v 178._o do_v deconc_fw-fr q._n 5._o p._n 178._o grant_v as_o be_v here_o allege_a against_o i_o that_o ecclesiastical_a authority_n be_v in_o the_o church_n principal_o primary_o and_o essential_o etc._n etc._n he_o do_v not_o hereby_o contradict_v himself_o or_o deny_v the_o power_n of_o synod_n where_o minister_n do_v judge_n by_o virtue_n of_o their_o call_n and_o deputation_n from_o many_o church_n the_o authority_n of_o church_n be_v manifest_v in_o they_o and_o by_o their_o service_n therein_o the_o like_a testimony_n allege_v from_o saravia_n and_o schola_fw-la parisienfis_n be_v 170._o be_v p._n 170._o before_o answer_v yea_o the_o school_n of_o paris_n do_v sufficient_o 2._o sufficient_o schol._n paris_n p._n 1_o 2._o explain_v this_o matter_n by_o a_o fit_a similitude_n show_v that_o ecclesiastical_a authority_n be_v in_o the_o church_n primary_o and_o instrumental_o in_o the_o minister_n as_o the_o power_n of_o see_v be_v in_o man_n principal_o but_o instrumental_o in_o the_o eye_n as_o man_n see_v by_o his_o eye_n so_o the_o church_n exercise_v ecclesiastical_a authority_n by_o the_o minister_n and_o ruler_n thereof_o and_o so_o judge_v of_o all_o crime_n and_o offence_n the_o testimony_n of_o bell_n next_o allege_v be_v in_o like_a manner_n to_o be_v understand_v whereas_o from_o 4._o from_o regim_fw-la of_o chur._n ch_z 2._o sect_n 4._o he_o they_o object_v that_o excommunication_n precise_o and_o chief_o pertain_v to_o the_o church_n and_o that_o she_o have_v authority_n to_o commit_v the_o execution_n thereof_o to_o some_o special_a person_n for_o that_o purpose_n and_o choose_v for_o that_o end_n this_o do_v no_o way_n condemn_v but_o rather_o illustrate_v our_o practice_n agreeable_a thereunto_o and_o that_o the_o meaning_n of_o this_o author_n be_v not_o repugnant_a unto_o we_o it_o appear_v more_o plain_o by_o another_o of_o his_o writing_n etc._n writing_n bell_n motiv_o l._n 2._o c._n 4._o concl_n 3._o etc._n etc._n where_o he_o evident_o declare_v his_o mind_n that_o synod_n have_v power_n to_o exercise_v ecclesiastical_a authority_n and_o to_o proceed_v judicial_o with_o delinquent_n even_o to_o depose_v &_o excommunicate_v though_o it_o be_v the_o pope_n himself_o upon_o due_a conviction_n and_o to_o this_o end_n he_o allege_v the_o confession_n of_o many_o popish_a writer_n and_o far_o more_o true_o and_o upright_o then_o mr_n can_n have_v do_v in_o this_o controversy_n as_o for_o d._n willet_n if_o he_o speak_v but_o to_o the_o same_o effect_n with_o bell_n as_o they_o say_v than_o the_o same_o answer_n may_v serve_v but_o for_o the_o place_n allege_v synop_n count_v 4._o qu._n 4._o p._n 2._o i_o find_v no_o such_o matter_n there_o they_o allege_v p._n 2._o when_o as_o there_o be_v no_o second_o part_n of_o that_o question_n but_o in_o the_o same_o book_n he_o give_v plain_a evidence_n against_o they_o he_o acknowledge_v synod_n to_o be_v 105._o be_v synop_n papi_n cont_n 3._o qu._n 1_o p._n 105._o a_o wholesome_a mean_n for_o the_o repress_v and_o reform_v both_o of_o error_n in_o religion_n and_o corruption_n in_o manner_n he_o allege_v the_o consent_n of_o antiquity_n to_o prove_v that_o our_o opinion_n be_v ground_v upon_o truth_n and_o scripture_n namely_o that_o those_o which_o be_v lawful_o call_v unto_o synod_n 109.110_o synod_n qu._n 3._o p._n 109.110_o have_v determine_v voice_n and_o power_n to_o give_v sentence_n and_o give_v instance_n in_o the_o council_n of_o antioch_n where_o paulus_n samosatenus_fw-la be_v condemn_v and_o cut_v off_o as_o a_o enemy_n to_o the_o truth_n etc._n etc._n he_o avouch_v that_o 123._o that_o qu._n 7._o p._n 123._o they_o have_v authority_n to_o judge_v examine_v suspend_v punish_v and_o depose_v etc._n etc._n and_o thus_o d._n willet_n full_o accord_v with_o we_o in_o this_o point_n that_o there_o be_v a_o superior_a power_n to_o judge_v the_o cause_n of_o particular_a congregation_n d._n tailor_n next_o allege_v afford_v they_o no_o help_n whereas_o he_o say_v that_o 712._o that_o com._n on_o tit._n 3.10_o p._n 712._o excommunication_n be_v the_o common_a action_n of_o the_o church_n and_o not_o of_o any_o private_a person_n or_o person_n we_o also_o affirm_v the_o same_o thing_n our_o profession_n and_o practice_v always_o have_v be_v never_o to_o excommunicate_v any_o without_o common_a consent_n of_o our_o church_n but_o have_v we_o do_v unjust_o at_o any_o time_n therein_o we_o may_v just_o have_v be_v subject_a to_o the_o censure_n of_o a_o synod_n or_o classis_fw-la and_o yet_o then_o also_o the_o minister_n and_o deputy_n assemble_v in_o the_o name_n of_o many_o church_n can_v with_o no_o reason_n be_v account_v private_a person_n and_o though_o we_o think_v ourselves_o bind_v to_o ask_v counsel_n of_o the_o classis_fw-la according_a to_o the_o order_n of_o these_o church_n before_o we_o proceed_v to_o cut_v off_o any_o member_n of_o the_o church_n by_o excommunication_n this_o prove_v no_o deprivation_n but_o a_o direction_n of_o our_o power_n now_o whether_o i_o have_v just_a cause_n to_o blush_v for_o deny_v to_o the_o church_n of_o god_n that_o due_a power_n which_o the_o learned_a of_o all_o profession_n do_v grant_v unto_o she_o as_o mr_n can_n and_o will._n bdoe_v without_o blush_a 86._o blush_a ch._n pl._n p._n 86._o charge_n i_o let_v the_o judicious_a &_o impartial_a reader_n judge_v sect_n v._o touch_v the_o testimony_n of_o english_a nonconformist_n under_o the_o title_n of_o this_o kind_n of_o witness_n they_o allege_v against_o i_o the_o replyer_n to_o d._n downame_n mr_n parker_n the_o author_n of_o the_o english_a puritanisme_n d._n ames_n mr_n baines_n mr_n bates_n mr_n fenner_n mr_n udall_n the_o english_a church_n at_o frank_n ford_n and_o mr_n hooker_n these_o be_v etc._n be_v ch._n pl._n p._n 86_o etc._n etc._n here_o produce_v and_o in_o another_o 23._o another_o p._n 23._o place_n unto_o which_o he_o refer_v we_o for_o the_o same_o purpose_n he_o cite_v also_o the_o protestation_n of_o the_o king_n supremacic_n d._n fulke_o and_o our_o countryman_n in_o new-england_n for_o answer_v hereunto_o first_o concern_v some_o of_o these_o that_o seem_v to_o be_v of_o mr_n cannes_n mind_n in_o deny_v the_o authority_n of_o synod_n in_o the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n observe_v how_o idle_o and_o superfluous_o he_o allege_v they_o against_o i_o when_o as_o he_o know_v that_o i_o myself_o do_v acknowledge_v and_o note_v so_o much_o before_o as_o namely_o the_o judgement_n of_o 74._o of_o answ_n to_o w._n b._n p._n 74._o mr_n hooker_n 27_o hooker_n ib._n p._n 27_o d._n ames_n and_o the_o author_n of_o the_o book_n entitle_v english_a puritanisme_n by_o who_o also_o the_o protestation_n of_o k._n supremacy_n be_v say_v to_o be_v write_v these_o i_o have_v confess_v to_o be_v opposite_a unto_o i_o in_o this_o