impenitent offendors may be reteyned in the Church as members This he must proue or ells all that he saith is nothing to the purpose seing we chardge their Church as heynously guilty of and wilfully obstinate in these transgressions But insteade of prouing he slilie seeketh to chaÌ„ge the question by turning yt from these open prophane and wicked to Hypocrites wicked persons which remaine in the Church whose children he saith ought to be baptized Wherin besides â—hat he beggeth the question assuming in a stronge imagination that which he shal neuer be able to proue That these parish assemblies are the true plaÌ„ted and established Churches of CHRIST and these vngodly multitudes true members therof he furder so doubleth and windeth betwixt these two starting holes the hypocrites and the prophane as one cannot knowe whereto find him or wherof he affirmeth It being graunted that the children of hypocrites ought to be baptized he wil â—hervpon conclude that the childreÌ„ of the prophane also Which if yt be denied then he wil make no conscience to giue out that we denie baptisme to the seede of Hypocrites in the Church Thus standing vpon no grownde he flitcheth fleeteth vp and downe seeking in an euil conscieÌ„ce to shifte off the truth wherwith he is pressed First presupposing that al these multitudes of prophane wicked are within the Church Then endevouring to proue that al the children of such prophane and wicked as he termeth within the Church and to professe Christ ought to be baptized Wherin before we come to the consideration of his reasons we must note vnto the reader in his Proposition expresse contrarietie error and sacriledge Contrariety in that he with the same mouth in the same senteÌ„ce pronounceth them as prophane wicked and also as faithful and members of the Churh such to whom the Covenante and the seales therof belonge Error in that he thus iudgeth and blasphemeth them if they be faithful members of the Church As on the contrarie if they be prophane wicked to iustifie their profession whilest they are obstinate in such sinnes Yea furder to harden them therin to giue the seale of the Couenante vnto their children in respect of their profession which caÌ„not be donne without open wilful sacriledge for if they be to be iudged prophane wicked then are their children also vntil they make profession of their owne faith to be held of vs as prophane the deuised writteÌ„ professioÌ„ of their Church cannot sanctifie or iustifie either the one or the other vnto vs. Moreouer the Church cannot denie to receaue those Parents or that Parent vnto the communion of the Supper whose infantes they baptize in that estate And thus by Mr. Giffards diuinitie may the bodie and bloude of Christ be prostitute to the open prophane and wicked whom he thus proueth within the Couenant THe interest of Gods Couenant saith he doth not depend vpoÌ„ their next Parents but vpon the antient christiaÌ„s their fore-Fathers For when God saith I wilbe thie God and the God of thie seede the promise is made to a thousand generations Exod. 20 So Leui paied tithes vnto Melchi-sedec because he was the loynes of Abraham Yea al the whole nation of the Iewes were in the loynes of Abraham and therfore holie within the Couenant For if the first fruictes be holy so is the lumpe if the roote be holy so are the boughes Rom. 11. Yea though manie of them were wicked idolatros reprobates yet euen in the worst tymes were they Circumcised and yt was not disalowed But the Lorde caleth the children of those wicked idolators his children Thou hast taken thie Sonnes thie Daughters which thou broughtest fourth vnto me and sacrificed vnto them to be consumed thou hast slaine my Sonnes and giuen them by causing them to passe through vnto them Ezech. 16. 21. BEhold into how manie errors mischieues and blasphemies they fal which in this maner spurne striue against the truth euerie worde becomming a snare vnto them to hold drawe them vnto their greater iudgments If th'interest in Gods Couenant as being the seed of the faithful vnto the sight of the Church depend not vpon the faith of the next parents but vpon the antient christians their fore-Fathers within a thowâ—and generations c Then ought al to be receaued and none to be kept or caste out of the Church Then is the whole world within the Couenant of the Church holie al being â—pronge within far lesse then a thowsand generations of manie faithful and lineallie come from the Patriarck Noah Then ought by this rule the Israelites vnder the lawe to haue circumcised all their captiue Canâ—â—nites and heathen that came into their power Then ought the Church nowe also to baptize all the seede euen of the most wicked and vngodlie whether Turcks Papists Idolators c because they are all â—pronge of faithful Parents within lesse then a thousand generations But because we reade in the Scriptures that Gods Couenant only belongeth vnto the faithful and the seales of his couenant are nowe only committed to his true established Church Seinglawes rules are giueÌ„ by God vnto the Church to whom and how to administer the faid seales Seing none can enter into this Church but by this true outward profession of faith obedience neither anie remaine loÌ„ger there theÌ„ they keepe the said faith and obedience outwardly Seing baptisme only belongeth and is giuen to the members of this Church and vnto their â—eede and can to none other be giueÌ„ without heynouse sinne and sacriledge We doubt not to pronownce and reiect these doctrines of this false Prophet as most blasphemous and diuelish As â—ending to the open breach of al Gods lawes and ordinances to th'vtter abolishing of the truth and feare of Gods iudgments to the taking away of al faith and godlines out of the earth to the bringing in of al Atheisme confusion to the prostituting and prophaning of the holie things of God And therfore al true Christians by the commandment of God are to auoide and hold accursed the aucthor and bringer of such doctrines and so much the rather in that he so wretchedly and bouldly falsifieth dismembreth peruerteth and abuseth the holie Scriptures thervnto AS to proue that the Couenant dependeth not vpon the outward faith of the parents but vpon the faith of their godlie ancestors he voucheth Exod. 20. I wil be thy God and the God of thy Seede the promise is made saith he to a thousand generations But he wittingly suppresseth the next wordes of the sentence of them that loâ—e me and Keepe mie Commandements which shewe to whom this Couenant is made and belongeth and the conditioÌ„ on our part As the former part of this senteÌ„ce verse 5. sheweth howe we may forfeite this Couenant Namelie by breaking and coÌ„temning the lawe of God in whose loue we cannot remaine except we remaine in his obedience Iohn 14. 21. 15. 10. So that the Lorde
also yet you wil hold no part of that execrable Idoll good The Papistes hange the first wordes of the Gospel after Iohn about their necke for manie purposes shall we not saye that this or their Agnus Dei are abhominable Idolls therfore Coniurers vse diuers Psalmes and scriptures in their magical incantations diuers Collects with as litle euill as most of yours shall we nowe allowe anie part of their Coniurations are they not altogether accursed The Scriptures then we see may be abused yet no way iustifie anie part of the wicked action or naughty thing to which they are applyed The Scriptures are holy good of themselues yet when they are thus violently rent dismembred constrayned peruerted abused ioyned to these idolatries they no way iustifie any part of the vvorship but make the whole more execrable We can saye then that those Scriptures vvhich you thus prophane and abuse to your idolatries aboue-said as your idoll feastes and all your idol vvorship and ministration are in their due place true vse holie reuerend gratious But vvhen they are abused peruerted and ioyned to patch vp this idolatrie they make the whole the more execrable All the Scriptures then of God are holy pure and all the whole Masse-Booke and English seruice-Booke and euerie part therof are detestable Idolls All which Idoll and euery part therof vve can condemne and yet preserue the sacred maiestie and aucthoritie of the Scriptures All this your festered conscience blasphemous mouth could to your furder iudgment confesse in our name though Sathan that speaketh in you by and by sought to quench it by deriding our holie suffrings Our baÌ„des vnto vs are comfortable glorious vnto God and shal rise vp and be produced in iudgment with this idolatrous murderous generatioÌ„ of your horned cleargy But now to the Scriptures be you alledged If you were demaunded where you learned to mumble ouer that Scripture by you falsely caled the Lords prayer fiue tymes in your Morowe-Masse and to vse yt at all assaies to to saye yt ouer the sick ouer the deade ouer the weomen in Churching ouer the marryed c should not your holie Father the POPE be founde the aucthor of all this Also if we should aske you where you reade and how you could proue that blasphemous Article of your faith That CHRIST discended into Hel what scripture could you shew or alleadge for yt Thus are euen those thinges wherof you glorie tourned to your shame if so be that you could be ashamed of anie thing Yet howsoeuer you maye harden your heart and your face against the manifest truth by this sleight discussing of your worship doctrines and administration euen by this litle which is alreadie said all men may discerne what kinde of ministers blinde guides you be Also anie that had but once seene the Church of Rome might easilie by the â—â—ea-spotts freakes you speake of knowe her daughter of England at the first blush For as the Mother such the Daughter is in al her limbes features and proportions Hetherto we haue spoken of some odious fowle faultes and errors in perticular founde in this their worship or Leitourgie the furder examination wherof and searche of the rest that remaine we leaue to the furder diligeÌ„ce of others And nowe touching this their seruice-booke and Leitourgie in general this we saye 1. IN that they presume to giue and enioyne their prescript wordes in praier they take the office of the Holie Ghost awaie quench the spirit of the ministrie and of the whole Church stop and keepe out the graces of God thrust their owne idle deuises vpon the whole Church yea vpon GOD himselfe whether he wil or no 2. IN that bie their Leitourgie they prescribe what and how much to reade at Morne to their Mattens at Eauen c teachinge the Church and ministrie to pray by nomber stint and proportion it is not onely popish but most friuolous and vayne disgracing and not instructing the Church and ministerie 3. IN that by this their Leitourgie they prescribe vnto the Church what Scriptures publiquelie to reade and when to reade them as these Chapters and Psalmes at their mattens before noone those at after noone c On all the dayes that they haue publique meetings and seruice through the yeere and soe from yeere to yeere They therebie take from the Church the holie and free vse both of the Scriptures and spirit of GOD. They therbie conceale and shut out of the Church a great part of GODS holie worde which they reade not As also abuse without order those scriptures they enioyne to be read 4. IN that they shread rend and dismember the Scriptures from the holie Order and natural sense of their context to make them Epistles Gospels Lessons select Psalmes to their festivals and Idol worship aboue-said They most heinouslie pervert and abuse the Scriptures to the high dishonor of GOD their owne feareful iudgment 5. IN that they bring in and commaunde the Apochrypha writings to be publiquelie read in the Church They both mainetaine and publiquelie teach the dangerous errors therin contayned to the poysoning and subverting of the faith of the Church They thrust these deuises of men into the place of GODS worde causing the people therebie to reuerence and esteeme them as the holie Oracles of GOD of like aucthoritie dignitie and truth and to resorte vnto them to builde their faith thervpon and therbie they bring in an other foundation into the Church besides the high iniurie donne vnto GOD therbie 6. FInallie in that by this their Leitourgie they bring in erect and enioyne a new strange kinde of administration as is aboue proued in the perticulars They make and erect a new Gospel and so must needes also erect vnto yt a new ministrie For the ministrie of Christ is only bounde vnto and wil onlie administer by Christes Testament wherein they haue a most perfect Leitourgie for the whole administration of his Church Therfore this present Leitourgie and ministrie of ENGLAND are by al these reasons in general and perticular founde and proued at once to be counterfeite vngodlie and Antichristian His wide friuolous Parenthesis from the 17. page of his booke vnto the 47. touching read prayer and prescript Leitourgies we leaue to be discussed and refuted by an other to whose writinges we referr the Reader Leauing Mr. Giffard and the whole Church of ENGLAND touching this first pointe of their worship to be compassed about with the sparckes and to walke on in the light of the fire that they haue kindled Yet this to them of our hand they shal lye in sorrowe THE SECOND PRINCIPAL TRANSGRESSION IS THAT the prophane vngodlie multitudes without the exception of anie one person are with them receiued into and retayned in the bozome and bodie of their Church IN Mr. Giffard his former answere vnto this Transgression he then not being past al shame confessed That the most Churches in England want godlie
leaue out the word Apochripha thus Only the Canonical scriptures lyuely voice of Gods owne graces are to be brought into the publick assemblies for doctrine prayer But mens writings or Collections are neither Canonical scripture nor the lyuely voice of Gods graces in such as he hath appointed to speak in y e publick assemblies Therfore no mans writing may be brought into nor imposed vpon the publick assemblies for doctrine and prayer Now where he cauilleth about the perfectnes of the rule absolute perfectnes of the graces it doth not help him For the word of God being of necessitie by the lawe and ordinance of God to be read in our owne language I trust he will not denye yt to be the written word of God for the vnperfectnes of the translatiō being to the best search the Church can make skanned by the original tongue and stil amended or at least the Church no further bound to yt then yt shal be found to be the perfect rule so likewise the lyuely voice of Gods graces are not for the imperfectnes to be excluded being Gods appointed ordinance neither is anie fault in the translation to be allowed and errour in doctrine or prayer are presently to be admonished repented of Mr. Giffard then must denye the Bible translated into our owne language to be the Canonicall Scriptures and denye the lyuely voice of Gods lawfull officers and such as are therevnto called in doctrine and prayer to be the manifestations of the spirit and vtterance of Gods graces for the assemblie or els grant the proposition firme And if hee can put dead mens writinges into the place of either of these I will yeild In the meane time I hold such translations to be the worde of God and by Gods ordinance put into our owne language to all our knowledges retayning y e words of God which word the lyuely vse of Gods owne graces in the mouth of such as he therevnto appointeth are only to be brought into the publicke assemblies for prayer and doctrine for God hath cōmanded these vnto vs as his owne ordināces in his assemblies and no other means wherby either God speaketh vnto vs or his people vnto him in the Congregation To this all the scriptures beare witnesse the word is always firme confirmed with miracles from heauen and cōmended to vs by Christ the Prophetts Apostles to be the foundation Canon light lanterne c the graces of the Spirit gyuen for the interpretatiō prayer doctrine c. CHRIST is ascēded vp into heauen and hath giuen giftes vnto men to serue their tyme minister in their place in this house These graces stil renewed not only in those called of God in this seruice for their dayly administration but newe workmen thrust forth into this haruest as the Lord of the house disposeth which graces of his Spirit are compared to two oliue branches which emptie out of themselues thorow two golden pipes Zacharie 4. 12. And to seuen thunders which vtter their voices that cannot be written Away therfore vvith your patched mass-booke yt may neither stande for a foundatiō in Gods house nor for the lyuely voyces of these thunders you make yt a monstrous Idoll by putting yt in either of these vses yet you will make yt serue for both Wee haue nothing to do with your matters of order as you vnderstand that order for tyme place wee reason of the spirituall action yt self when wee entreat of y e meanes whereby God speaketh to vs and appointeth vs to speake vnto him Wee can cast out the errours in the translation or doctrine or prayer and yet retaine Gods vvorde in our owne language and the liuely voice of his graces in the assemblie When you can do so with your deuises and newe hatched Leitourgies wee will giue eare vnto you and them till then wee thinck of your counterfeit playes and pleas for your Idolls and detestable sacriledge and high prophanation of Gods ordinances with Iannes and Iambres to resist the truth Paraphrases wee hold to be mens writinges and expositions and not the word of God nor the liuely voice of Gods grace of interpretation or prayer therefore to be excluded this place of seruice vnto God Thus you see the further you wrastle the further you make your wares the best of them odious to euerie godly conscience You say I deceiue the simple by gyuing them one crabbe amongst many apples but you may behold your best apples such as the holy Ghost hath foretold vs Reuelations 18. to be entisements to euil It is well you will grant my Propositions so sound and I would wish if such be Gods wil they might be better favoured Nowe because I wil not stand either repeating or contending about Syllogismes I will take this much yeilded of your owne conclusions which is as much in effect as I haue affirmed where you teach me thus to reason No mans writings are the vndoubted truth of God but haue errours and imperfections therfore men cannot further ground vpon them then they be consonant to the Canonicall scriptures Againe The Church is builded vpon the foundation of the Apostles Prophets therfore our faith is not to rest vpō mens writings Wherevpon doth necessarily follow that if mens writings may not be builded vpon nor rested vpon howe should you dreame it lawfull to impose them for lawes vpon the publick assemblies or to haue them there read to beare rule as the wordes of God And this you confessed in an other of your writings that God spake vnto vs out of his vndoubted worde or by his owne word If then God speake not vnto vs by mens writinges that be of priuate interpretation in the assemblie nor that they can be made groundwork to buyld our faith vpon or to rest assured vpon yt will be granted I hope that they are not to be imposed vpon the publick assemblies as lawes and rules but left to euerie mans priuate vse in their libertie as they wil answere for themselues what vse they put them to and whither they doe not prefer them before the booke of God or preiudice themselues by them This first poinct is then plaine That only Gods vndoubted worde is to be imposed brought in and maintayned in the publick assemblies as lawes and rules no other vvritings being authentick or Canonical But here Mr. GIFF. doth in effect affirme that the word of God yt self is not authentick or Canonical except in the Hebrew or Greeke Copie Wherein he goeth a litle beyond the Papists that wil yet allow the vvorde of God in latine And if it shoulde be defended that the vvorde of God vvere not the vvorde yt self that vvee haue in our owne language it wil follow that no mā could haue assurance of faith except he vnderstoode both Hebrew and Greeke yea be able soundly to interpret the scriptures in both If the translations be so far mens vvritings that yt ceaseth generally to be the vvord of God that
giuing testimonie and blessing to his ovvne word The truth wherof shall shine forth in our simplicitie the povver therof be made manifest in our weakenes to the discouerie reformation of these publique enormities in the false worship open sacrilege antichristian ministerie heinous disorder exercised and soffred in this land and to the discipation of all the delusions vaine promises and persvvasions of these false Prophetts whervvith they haue a long time for their ovvne fleshlie pompe and filthie lucre seduced the whole land dravven them into and held them in the wrath heauie iudgments of God That so the mightie hand of God working in the heart of our Souereigne Prince Nobles especiallie through your Honors faithfull counsell and furtherance and also in the heartes of all the Commons when the truth of these things shall be shevved vnto them a general and sincere conuersion to the Lord may be made euen from all things that novv are or hereafter shall be found contrarie to his holie will whither in the publique estate of all or in the priuate estate of anie For sure as euerie perticular person goeth forvvard from faith to faith as knovvledge is increaced euerie day teaching other vnto eternal life So in the publique estate of the Church no change that is made according vnto the truth as the publique error is espied ought to be held strange or dangerous But most heauenlie is that harmonie where all the members kint together in the same faith both in general and perticular with one accord goe forward in their callings and duties still amending what is found amisse and daylie indeuouring to doo better Then should there not be found anie such vnchristian contention abought the truth pleading and spurning against the truth or persecution for the truth Then should the Lords dreadful iudgments which novv hang ouer the whole land for these sinnes be auoided and his blessings in stead therof be multiplied But sure in the meane time vntil these sinnes be remoued out of Gods sight and redressed there is no peace to be looked for or asked of the Lord there is no pleading with or against him hovvsoeuer the false Prophet may goe abought to heale the hurte of this people as a light euill saijng peace peace when there is no peace and to repaire the breaches that are as the sea with vntempered stuffe and vaine visions tending vnto abdication Wherfore to the torning avvay of so great euills and the procuring of so great and inestimable benefites to our Souereign Queene and Contrie as we haue not with-holden our vtmost indeuours to the discouerie of the publique enormities sinnes of these times in all truth and freedome being readie yet furder to witnesse and approue the same if such neade be to the face of our greatest aduersaries and gainsayers by the euidence of Gods word So novv it remaineth that we instantly beseach your Honor euen in the name of God before whome we shall all of vs shortly appeare to our accompt iudgment by whome this chardge is layed vpon you the cause being novv brought and by both sides asvvell our aduersaries as vs layed open before your Honor that you would novv be a meanes to her right excellent Maiestie that these weightie and dangerous matters may be no longer wrapped vp or put off in securitie and silence lest these our soffrings and testimonies rise in iudgment with this generation but may rather be furder inquired and discussed and order and redresse taken according to the will of God Which shall no doubt torne to the high glorie most acceptable seruice of God and of your Prince to the vnspeakable benefite of this whole land and to the happie discharge of your dutie and conscience to your eternall praise in this life and in the life to come Your Lordships most humble addict in the Lord. HENRIE BARROVVE IOHN GRENVVOOD for the testimonie of the gospel in close prison Wisdome to the Reader from the Father of lightes to disceâ—ne of these times and to iudge of themselues what is right SEing the scripture speaketh euidently of the generall defection apostasie vnder Antichrist and of the abhominable desolation hauock y t he should make in these dangerous latter times where y e sunne should be made blacke as a sack-cloth of haire the Moone be made as blood the Starres cast to the earth the Heauen departe away as a booke wrapped vp euery mouÌ„taine Isle be moued out of their place And all these things are most perticularly most liuely described in the booke of the Reuelation Of Antichristes beginning increace exaltation abolishing How a great part of the trees all greene grasse should be blasted a great parte of the sea become blood and of the creatures that lyued therin dye and a greate parte of the shippes therof be destroied the third parte of the riuers of the fountaines of waters be torned into worm wood and manie men die of the bitternes therof How that falleÌ„ apostatat Starre should open the bottomles pitte the sunne airâ— be darkened with the smoke therof the earth pestered with the swarme of poisoned stinging Scorpions crowned armed Locustes that came out of the smoke of the pitte and of those innumerable warriours vpoÌ„ those strange horses that destroied such multitudes of men How the Beast should get vnto him manie heades mo hornes and vpoÌ„ his hornes Crownes how he should be inthronised receiue the DragoÌ„ his large power high CoÌ„mission how he should warre with the Sainctes and open his mouth into blasphemie against God how he should erect his Image and gyue his marke how he should kill as manie as will not worship his image and suffer none to buye or sell but such as receiue his marcke How that greate harlot that sate vpoÌ„ manie waters so gorgiously araied adorned the mother of all the whoredomes abhominatioÌ„s of the earth with that goulden cuppe full of abhominations filthines of her fornication in her hand wherwith she made dronckeÌ„ all the inhabitantes of the earth should sit vpon the Beast and be made dronckeÌ„ with the blood of the Sainctes and Martyres of IESVS And yet furder How the vials of Gods wrathfull iudgments should by his faithfull messengers witnesses be powred forth vpon the earth vpon the sea vpon the riuers and fountaines of waters vpon the Sunne vpon the throne of the Beast vpon the greate riuer Euphrates and into the aire with the peculiar fearfull plagues denounsed to be executed herevpon As also how the greate Babilon should be discouered forsaken pleaded against condempned consumed fire cast vpon her all her wares the greate milstone vpon her al her childreÌ„ inhabitantes to presse her downe to hell To conclude How Christ himself his holye armie mounted vpon the white horse of his word should warre against the Beast and against the Kinges
â—eare and together with him grow liue reigne stand and fall as the braÌ„ches with the tree Now wee knowing the plant cannot easilye be deceiued in the grafts especiallie knowing them from their cradles nourished with the milke of superstition instructed in the schole of heathen vanitie brought vp in the Colledges of more then monkish idlenes and disorder exercised in vaine and curious artes whose diuinitie is by tradition and according to their progresse degrees therin commeÌ„ded to the Ordinarie who making probation of them accordingly doth either initiate or trayne them in this idolatrons office or els giue them their full orders with his paper licence popish seale therat Thus are they either presented to a Benifice instituted inducted where they ringe their bells pay the first fruictes taxes proxes and are sworne to their canonicall obedience to his Scenes Courtes Synods c Or els as they terme them they are become Preachers either waged Chaplens mercenarie Curats or hireling teachers gaping for promotion Which being obteined they change remoue eâ—terchange according to their best aduantage In this maner being entred by intrusion they cannot but lyue by theft spoile and rapine as their popish tithes the goods of the poore and offrings of the prophane indifferently and gouerne by tyrannie and perfidie Tyrannie in exeâ—uting the popish Iniunctions euen the statutes of Omry Perfidie in betraijng all into the hands of their Lords the Bishops Thus fulfil they scriptures by which who so examineth their infinite transgressions in perticular can want no store of Argumentâ— against this Ministrie our purpose being here rather to shew some theÌ„ to set downe all or to confute anie of their odious enormities Which are so grosse that as sone as they are but manifested by the light they are reproued And it could not be if the Lord had not layd a vaile ouer their hearts that where the scriptures are read these deformities could be hid tollerated or defended But in stead of an Argument to vs you turne your speach to the simple people and giue them counsell if they doubt of your Ministerie to supend their iudgments and to inquire if ther be anie Churches of God vnder heauen and what they do iudge of the Ministerie and Church of England c. Is this the best counsell you can giue them vse you thus to appeaze vnquiet coÌ„sciences and to resolue their doubtes With what conscience can they which remaine doubtfull of the truth and lawfulnes of your ministerie frequent your prayers and preaching in the meane time vntil they may send ouer sea and be resolued from thence You know that what is not of faith is sinne But with what conscience can you vse poore soules thus that inquire the truth at your mouth to send them ouer sea you wot not whether to be resolued of your Ministerie Churches Is your Church built vpon the words of men or vpon the worde of God Is this to proue your Church Ministerie by the word of God Or to vse the old worne Arguments of your mother Church of Rome who was wont to defend her self by vniuersalitie consent What if all the Churches learned meÌ„ in the world should say you are a Church which wee must tel you by the way they all neuer did neither caanie which knoweth the word of God and your estate aright but if they should could they or all the world iustifie that God condempneth Should not a people inquire at their God from the liuing to the dead Remember yee not that it is written To the lawâ— the testimonies if they speake not it is because there is no light in them But yee are gone out of the way yee haue caused manie to fall by the Lawe yee haue broken the Couenant of Leâ—ie saith the Lord of hostes therfore haue I made you also to be despised and vile before all the people because you kept not my Wayes but haue bene partiall in the Lawe Yea the iudgments of God are alredie fallen vpon you you all as he speaketh by his Propheâ— being couered with a spirit of slumber euen strickeÌ„ with the blindnes of Elimas groping the way in the noone light because you haue peruerted the straight waies of the Lord and being thus miserable and blinde out of the way not only perceiue it not but loue darknes more then light refusing the light when yt is brought you yea despising yt because of the fewenes and basenes of them that bring yt you And in this Pharisaicall pride procede after your accustomed maner of blaspheming terming vs fewe vncharitable Anabaptists Donatists c. Thus fulfill you the measure of your forefathers thus dealt they with all Gods faithfull seruants that were sent vnto them yea euen with CHRIST himself refusing him for his simplicitie reputing him emong thieues deceiuers c We looke for no better vsage at your hands the seruant is neither greater nor better then his Maister if they haue done thus to the greene tree what shall not you doo to the drie Yet so far are we from all danger or harme by theis curses that God turneth them forthwith vnto vs as a blessing and to a comfortable assurance both of the fellowship of the faith and of the suffrings of CHRIST Blessed are you when men reuile you and say all maner of euil against you for my names sake c. Againe through the mercies of our God all the iniâ—ries you can offer vnto vs cannot ouercome our charitie or breake our patience In the one we possesse our soules in the other we will not cease to praie for you euen as for our selues and be redie to doo you anie good we can Now to those poore soules whome you like miserable phisitians thus cure we giue this aduise yet not we but the Load That they beware of Wolues in sheepes clothing That thei â—ollow not blind guides too far That thei marke diligentlie and auoide such as transgresse and abide not in the doctrine of CHRIST not walke after the rule of the Gospel That thei turne away from such as make a shew of godlines but denie the power and practize therof deceiuing with faire wordes the hearts of the simple talking of CHRIST but denijng him in deedes Further we send them not to mans worde nor ouer sea but to Gods worde which is neere them euen in their mouthes and in their hearts Let them therby trie the spirits before thei belieue them Let them therby measure their Temple their Altar and their Worshippers and especiallie their owne hearts that thei may be wise to that which is good and simple concerning euil If the latter part of your answere had bene put in the beginning to haue 〈◊〉 downe what maketh a true Minister of Christ you approued your Ministrie accordinglie we had suffered lesse iniurie and you lesse blame NotwithstaÌ„ding because it is neuer to late to repeÌ„t if this your offer be according to your heart we most
as in the same faith obedience seeke the coÌ„munion and fellowship of the faithfull are to be receaued as members into the Church And that only the childâ—en of such by the one Parent are to be baptized We hold furder that howsoeuer the dearest children of God doe may fal yet are they still â—enued by repentance And that all such as continue obstinate in their sinne after due admonition are not by vs to be esteemed faithfull but to be held wicked prophane although the Church should refuse to cast them out This vve hope in anie christian or sober iudgment will not be founde To call all suche prophane and to condemne them as infidells which professe the faith truly and coÌ„tinue outwardly obedient although in some weaknes and infirmities as this malitious accuser falsly sclandereth vs. Nether shall we be founde to intrude into Gods iudgment seate to rend and teare vp the weake plantes in desperate and sauadge maner vvhilest we affirme those rowtes and multitudes of Atheistes Papists Idolatros heretickes blasphemers extortioners wronge-doers couetous proude vayne and light persons glottons dronckardes adulterers bawdes whores and whoremasters theiues murderers and other such like flagitious vngodly persons which were receiued into and are retayned in their Church as members to be esteamed amongst the wicked and prophane of the world and not as the right plants true members of the Church in this estate We are taught to knowe and iudge the tree by the fruictes and easily can discerne these Vines of SODOME from the Lordes Vines these stincking weedes these nettles thornes thistles from the Lordes pleasant plantes the sweet incense trees oliue pome-granate figge trees of the Lordes walled Orcharde of his Church We cannot mistake the mountaines of these Leopardes and Wolues for CHRISTES sheepfold the cages of these vncleane and hatefull birdes for the holie assemblie of Sainctes Neither may vve nowe flatter and dissemble contrarie to the evident truth of God and our owne conscience to iuâ—tifie and blesse the wicked to call the churle liberall to saye to the wicked they are righteous and to them that despise the Lorde they shall haue peace as this vvretched man doth for his bellye Who being in league with his Ordinarie and in couenante with Hell is not ashamed to stand a Priest of all these abhominations to the most abhominable seeking to pleade for and iustifie both terming these rowtes of all sortes of wicked vngodly persons the Sainctes the assemblies of them the Church and sheep-fold of CHRIST calling the most hateful and horrible sinnes they daylie commit but their infirmities and weaknes the most execrable blasphemies and idolatries but the spotts bleamishes of their Church What then shall we iudge of their sinners and sinnes if these be their Saincts infirmities bleamishes But there are none so bad as we that speake against these holie assemblies of these Sainctes and that for these their bleamishes infirmities c. Al that feare God may tremble at our intollerable wickednes Mr. Giffard saith That teare vp these weake plaÌ„tes yea whole assemblies that vnfeinedly sorrowe and mourne for their sinnes and studie to please God We are they that take vpon vs to plucke vp al the darnel though we be commaunded the contrarie lest we plucke vp the wheate Math. 13. What spirit leadeth vs and possesseth him and his Church as also how they sorrowe and mourne for their sinnes Let th'ocasions of these controuersies betwixt vs their tyrannie our sufferings and this his present writing declare Wee blame and witnesse against manie most heynous horrible sinnes So far are they from acknowledging the same that they wil not be confessed amongst the bleamishes of his Church Yea insteade of repeÌ„tance they persecute he blasphemeth and in euerie sentence of his booke casteth at vs in his furie these his fire-brandes poysoned arrowes and deadly dartes wherwith his whole Booke is seasoned insteade of better grace and al for shewing admonishing them of their sinnes Vnto this place Mat. 13. which he bringeth against vs for plucking vp the tares he must acknowledge these his weake plaÌ„tes euen al the prophane multitudes deluge of people to be those tares or ells he cannot vse yt against vs or blame vs for plucking them vp This if he confesse then can they not be held in this estate the children of the kingdome that tender wheate that blossomed and made fruite Then hath he granted vs as much coÌ„cerning this poynte as we require yea and iudged them as far as we iudge which is not concerning their future but their present estate Their election or reprobation we leaue to that great hous-holder the maker and iudge of all conteyning our selues within the rules of his reuealed worde whose iudgmeÌ„ts we cannot lighten or pronownce the wicked innocent against whose iudgmeÌ„ts who so spurne or resist but stomble at that rocke which wil grind them to powder If Mr. Giffard vnderstand the field in this place to be the Church he choseth rather to insist in the errour of others then in th'exposition of our Sauiour himself who saith verse 38. That the field is the worlde the good seede are those Children of the kingdome but the tares are the Children of the wicked one If yt should be vnderstoode of the planted Church then were al the rules ordinances censures and gouernment of the Church vtterly abolished TheÌ„ might al be receiued in and none at anie tyme for anie offence cast out of the Church c. Then also could not the ciuile Maiestrate put anie offendor to death for that were to roote out the Tares Neither can these Tares be vnderstoode of those hypocrites whose sinnes appeare not for then could not the Disciples discerne iudge and seeke to roote them vp Or being so vnderstoode be compared to those multitudes of prophane whose heynous sinnes are manifest Let the Tares then be the children of the wicked one and not the Sainctes of CHRIST Let the tares be in the worlde and not in the Church seing our Sauiour himself so pronounceth them and instructeth his disciples so to thinck of them Yet let not his disciples in anie inordinate zeale seeke to roote them vp seing they haue nothing to doe to iudge them that are without But let them rather by al meanes seeke their ingrafting in instructing them inal gentlenes if so be that God at anie tyme wil giue them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth that they also may be partakers of the like mercie and grace with them WHat then hath Mr. Giffard gayned by this place That the opeÌ„ prophane such as neuer made true voluntarie profession of their owne faith other then that prescript verbal confession which is enioyned to them al in their Seruice-booke which a childe of 4. yeeres olde may say after the Priest as wel as they may be receaued into the Church Or that al sortes of open wicked grosse
administration of prohibition from the Sacraments The vanitie and follie of this idole suspension most plainely appeareth vnto al men by the litle good it doth in anie of these Parrishes where al prophanenes and iniquitie stil aboundeth The Bishop his Chauncelor or Commissary may with one worde of their mouth heale the greatest wounde the Parrish-Priest can make with this Suspension whatsoeuer Mr. Parson saye They haue power to absolue anie that he bindeth and how cheape their absolutions are is not vnknowē to anie whore master in al the Parrish The Bishop hath power to make and to depose Ministers at his pleasure he hath power ouer the whole ministration he prescribeth howe whē to whom they shal administer What truth then is in these wordes that the Bishop cannot take away that power which their seruice-booke giueth them when he may absolue the partie disanul the suspension depose the Minister c. In that he saith the Bishop is but a Minister and no Lord ouer their faith and conscience The same will euerie Popish Priest say of their soveraigne Lorde the POPE to preserue the dignitie of their ministerie The POPE writeth himself but the seruant of the seruants of God What Lordlie authoritie the Bishop hath exerciseth and in what seruile subiection the Priestes all the Parishes stand vnto their Courtes iurisdiction shal hereafter more appeare when we come to the discussing of those poyntes In the meane while we willingly assent vnto Mr. GIFFARD that the christian reader shall iudge whether their seruice-booke be not a fit Portesse for such Priestes and this suspension a fit toole for such worckmen Still affirming euen with wonder that if the iudgmentes of God were not vpon their right eye and vpon their right arme they might perceaue how their Lordes the Bishops dresse them and how this weapon they allowe them wanteth both edge and poynte c. Thus hauing finished his answeare to our assumption he procedeth to a former answeare where he denied the Consequence That where wicked prophane men are receiued into reteyned in the bozome of the Church there the couenant is disanulled with them and they are no longer Godes people but a false antichristian Sinagogue To disproue this he alleadged that there were but fewe true worshippers that frequented the Temple amongst multitudes of prophane vngodly men To this he now addeth the examples of the Church at Corinth and of the seuen Churches in Asia c. We before answeared stil answeare that there is no comparison betwixt or Argument to be drawen from those Churches which were rightly gathered established and these confused Bibilonish Synagogues of theirs The Israelites were a peculiar separated people vnto the Lorde from the worlde The people of these other Churches were wonne caled and gathered vnto CHRIST by the preaching of the Gospel euery one entred into the Church by the voluntarie professiō of his owne faith No vncircumcised or Gentile might enter into the Temple to offer any gift there All nor yet the greater part of the Citie of Corinth nor of these other parts of Asia were not receiued into the Church as members But here in their Church of England al the whole land is receiued in and that immediatly from open idolatrie without any voluntarie professiō of their owne faith by the people in perticular yea without the preaching of the Gospel going before to call them vnto the faith Therfore in these reasons he but beggeth the questiō and assumeth that which he ought to proue Namely That these multitudes of all the prophane al sorts of wicked persons were sometymes rightly gathered vnto and entred couenant with the Lorde hauing the true ministrie gouernement of CHRIST set ouer them and nowe being fallen into some sinnes are not cast out but stil retayned in their Church This if he had donne then had there bene some cause y ◠he might haue brought against vs th'examples of these Churches Then should not we haue needed to haue shewed him his follie twise Yet this if he had donne the contrarie wherof is manifest to al that remember the beginning of her Maiesties raigne or but behold the present estate in the same or rather in more confusion sinne being more encreased Yet then we should easily haue put difference betwixt those Churhes that amēded at the Apostles admonition and these which reiect all the rules ordinances ecclesiastical of CHRISTS Testament as pernitious and intollerable to th'estate of this land and persecute al such as admonish them of and will not partake with them in their idolatrie sacriledge WE also in our former writing shewed him how the faithfull seruants of God in the idolatrous dayes of Kinge ACHAS MENASSE AMON IEHOIAKIM c refrayned from the Temple being so polluted and defiled and mixed not themselues with the wicked in idolatrous worship This Mr. GIFFARD confesseth to be true and that it was theire duetie so to doe But he saith we do not argue whether the godly did ioyne with the wicked in idolatrie but whether the wicked were suffred and did ioyne with the godlie in true worship To the question we haue aboue spoken Only this by the waye we drawe from his owne confession That if the godly in those dayes did wel in separating from not cōmunicating with the wicked in those times of publick idolatrie then cānot we be blamed which separate withdrawe our selues from these prophane assemblies where such abhominable idolatrie and sacriledge is publickly vsed and enforced as we haue aboue proued and thus are we by him cleared and iustified Againe we convince him of his owne mouth thus If the faithfull did well in those tymes to withdraw and separate themselues from the wicked in their idolatrie which then was publickly set vp Then was not the publick estate of the Iewes in those tymes of vs to be held the true Church of God For the godly maie at no tyme separate from the true Church of God nor repayre vnto the false Church And thus by himself is an end put at once to all his cauils wherbie he hath endeuored to prooue the Iewes in these most corrupt tymes to be the true outwarde church of God and to accuse vs of heresie that affirme where such heynous transgressions are obstinatly defended persisted in by the whole Church there the Couenant vnto the iudgmēt of the faithful is disanulled there the faithful may not communicate And verie ignorant is Mr. Giffard if he thinck that the wicked and prophane may either be receiued into the Church or retayned in the Church as members The wicked prophane which were neuer entred into the Church may ought to be caled to heare the ministrie of the worde of God in the Church as the meanes wherbie they may be caled vnto the faith and so vpon their profession be receiued as members into the fellowship cōmunion of the Church But vntil they make open voluntarie
profession of their owne faith obedience they cannot be receiued as members or haue communion with the Church Then vntil Mr. Giffard proue that the prophane multitudes and open wicked which neuer made anie voluntarie profession of their owne faith and obedience may be receiued as members into the Church he cannot iustifie these Parish assemblies of England or convince vs. Furder we graunt that wicked men such as fal away from their profession and obedience shal daylie arise in the church ells there should be no cause of Excommunication But when their sinne is publicke then ought the Church to ceÌ„sure it and if they be founde obstinate to caste them out ells were there no vse of ExcoÌ„munication We graunt also that the Church sometymes of negligence delaying in due tyme to caste out such wicked is notwithstanding if they amend vpon admonition to be held the true Church of God And this our aduersarye himself Pag. 56. acknowledgeth that we confesse although now forgetting himself his heart being fraught with malice he bursteth foorth in the gall therof accusing and sclandering vs to hold these heresies That where any wicked and open sinners worship together with the Church as members of the Church there the Couenant is disanulled with the whole Church Againe that where corrupt maners breake forth in those that professe the Gospell they be not only vtterly voyde of fayth which offende but also all they that worship together with them though neuer so much grieued at their sinnes are fallen from the Couenant Thirdlie that we make the stablenes of Gods Couenant to depend vpon the worckes of men and not of the free grace and mercie of God How could this accuser drawe these heresies from this assertion It is the Church of CHRIST vvhich hath the power to Excommunicate though it fault much by negligence in executing the same Doth not the expresse contrarie herein appeare How can he then reconcile these chardges of his vnto this proposition of ours Or can he produce any one sentence that euer we wrote or spake conteyning such odious doctrines as these Yf not these heresies must stil retourne to his owne throate as to the sepulchre froÌ„ whence the sprange these chardges must remayne vpon his reckoning not vpon ours WE hold that the open prophane and wicked such as were neuer caled vnto the faith caÌ„not be receiued into the Church as members before they make open and voluntarie profession of their owne faith and obedience He that hath from the beginning distinguished light from darcknes hath alwaies made difference and separation betwixt the world the Church caling the one the Sonnes of God the other the daughters of men preseruing the one in his Arcke drowning the other in the floode he chose and separated to himself out of the whole world one peculiar Nation and people to be his visible Church to whom no prophane which made not professioÌ„ of the same faith might be admitted or ioyned in their worship The worde Ecclesia or Church we knowe to be a companie caled forth from the world as were CHRISTS Disciples and the faithfull in all places at the first gathering of the Church Againe we hold that such as are dulie entred into the Church falling from their profession and after due admonition remaine obstinate and hardened in their sinne ought by the Church to be excommunicate And if the Church being admonished stirred vp vnto their duetie refuse to obey execute the commandemeÌ„t of God that then vnto the faithfull it ceaseth to be the true Church of God and ought to be auoyded vntil they repent The Church of CHRIST must euer be obedient vnto CHRISTS voyce which voyce when they openlie despise wilfully resist they are a companie of rebells not a companie of Sainctes When they fal away from the faith they fal away from the Couenant of God when they obstinaâ—lie persist in sinne wilfully despise Gods voyce they fal away from the faith Faith belieueth reuerenceth and obeyeth Gods worde so far as yt is reueled vnto them and neuer wilfully despiseth or reiecteth anie anie part of the same God can neuer be seuered from his worde they that despise reiect Gods worde despise reiect God himself Christ ruleth and reigneth by the scepter of his owne worde they that are not subiect vnto but wilfully disobey that word are not subiect vnto Christ haue not him a Kinge but a Iudge ouer them Seuere lawes iudgments are set downe in God his worde against presumptuous sinne yea against al sinne wherof they denie to repent God hath executed these iudgments vpon the Angels that sinned vpon the original world vpon the Nation of the Iewes Neither wil anie vayne titles of Church Couenant c. excuse or deliuer them being founde in the like transgressions from the like iudgments God is iust his iudgments are alike pronounced executed against al as against one being founde wilfully remayning in the transgression of his lawe Nowe then vvhilest vve conclude that vvhere the people were neuer rightly caled vnto the faith or gathered vnto CHRIST and orderly ioyned together in Christ But multitudes of prophane al sortes of vvicked persons idolators Atheists c euen the whole land without any choice any separation receiued into their Church as members without any voluntarie profession of their owne faith that in this estate they cannot be esteemed the true planted Churches of CHRIST With what conscience or truth can this vngodly man herevpoÌ„ defame divulge vs to hold this heresie that where corrupt maners breake forth in those that professe the gospell they be not only voyde of fayth which offend but all they also which worship together with them though neuer so much grieued at their sinnes are falen from the Couenant How can he liken these rowtes of prophane Atheists and wicked persons of the world to the faithful seruantes of CHRIST in his Church or compare their open wickednes which they commit even with greedines to the faultes eskapes of frailety or negligeÌ„ce in y e Sainctes Againe whilest we affirme That where open obstinacie is ioyned vnto publick sinne whether yt be in the whole Congregation or in any perticular member there that Congregation or that member cannot by vs be iudged faithfull or within the outward Couenant vntill they repent with what feare of God or shame of men caÌ„ this maÌ„ publish vs to hold that where any open grosse sinne is committed by anie and they stil through ignorance or negligence are suffred in the Church there the Couenant to be disanulled with the whole Church And so we to fall into this heresie To make the stablenes of God his Couenant not to depend vpon mercie and free grace promised and bownde with an oathe but vpon our worckes yea vpon the worckes of other whom we must iudge THis heresie after he himself hath deuised in our name he procedeth to coÌ„fute yt with manie wordes shewing the stability
Gospellers Pistelers Singing men Singing boyes Vergiers Sextines The seruile Ministrie is diuided into these seueral offices Of Parson Vicarâ— Curaiâ— Deacon or half-Priest Church-warden Sideemen Quest-men Parrish Clarck But now to distinguish or describe all these offices according to their seueral orders and cannons to shewe their original processe and contynuance in their seueral tymes occasions and circumstances were not onlie a labor to me intricate and vnachiueable but to the reader tedious and vnprofitable as withdrawing them from the certaine and vnvariable rules of Gods worde to the vncertaine and variable reportes of meÌ„ Sufficeth it therfore that we finde not in al the booke of God anie such titles names dignities offices giuen or to be giuen to the Ministrie of Christes Gospel but we finde them rather those names of blasphemie written vpon those heades of the Beast For if it be blasphemy for anie mortal maÌ„ to receiue assume or chaleÌ„ge those names titles dignities or offices which are peculier and proper to CHRISTES sacred person alone Then are these chief Ministers of the Church of England these Arch-Bishops Lord Bishops highlie guilty of blasphemie that chaleÌ„dge assume vnto themselues some one of them to be the Primaâ—e of al the Bishops in England Ireland an other to be an Arch-Bishop a Metropolitane others to be Lord Bishops the leaste of these Anakims to reigne ouer I knowe not how manie hundreth Churches Bishops That Christ is the onlie Primate and Arch-chiefe Bishop and Prince of Pastors the Apostle Peter giueth euideÌ„t testimonie 1 Epist. 5. Cap. 4. versâ— as also the holie Ghost Hebr. 13. 20. That Christ is the onlie Lorde Bishop euery where appeareth in the scriptures and that al other christian Bishops are but seruaÌ„ts fellowes is fownd Iohn 13. Luk. 22. Mat. 20. Mar. 10. where Christ himself in expresse words with vehement chardges forbiddeth euen his Apostles I say not such blasphemous titles onlie but all other wordlie titles of honor all ciuile iurisdiction and secular power ouer others and such arrogancie and presumption one ouer an other as these pontificall Prelates and Lordlie Bishops vsurpe most directly wittingly willingly against the commandmeÌ„t of Christ. Which they thincke to put away abrogate by a second lawe of the Prince ParlameÌ„t who they saye haue cast these honors titles vpon them and therfore neither caÌ„ they refuse neither may others blame them for this except they shew theÌ„selues disobedieÌ„t to her Ma tie and enemies to y e State We wil answeare these their criminatioÌ„s of state matters at anie tyme before competeÌ„t iudges In the meane while let them answere vs in good conscience whether they iudge it lawful for Princes to giue or at anie hand for themselues to receiue such titles dignities c as Christ hath so expresly often forbidden them And whether their holy Father the Pope might not so iustifie his exaâ—tation and supremacie by the Emperors donatioÌ„ y e confirmatioÌ„ of manie NatioÌ„s States Councels through manie ages If it be here alleadged that these titles which we so stand vpoÌ„ are but ciuile accomplemeÌ„ts giueÌ„ them by the Prince but trifles no matters of substance to preiudice their ministrie they being preachers of the worde Yet must they acknowledge them inhibited verie seuerely ofteÌ„ by Christes owne mouth And therfore they by this allegation laye the blame vpon Christ that forbad them and not vpon vs that hold theÌ„ vnlawful intollerable in the ministrie Furder if they be merely Civile let them theÌ„ answere whie they are how they may be thus ioyned to ecclesiastical persons offices And if they be such trifles whie then these graue Fathers these holy men so violently contend with and bloodely persecute their bretheren for them And this also let them consider acknowledge that these triffles or titles they vsurpe are prooued most execrable blasphemies names vvritten vpon the heades of the Beast and not vpon the members or Minister of Christ. And in their best allegatioÌ„ that they are directly contrarie to the commaundement of Christ who prohibiteth his Ministers all such titles howsoeuer Mr. Giffard alleadge against al coÌ„science and truth that they exercise no Lordship ouer the faith and consciences of men the vntruth wherof shal hereafter appeare yet this Lordship they receiue exercise euen in the best consideration is expresly coÌ„trarie to the commandement of Christ and such as no true Minister of the Gospel either wil or may receiue plead for or iustifie ANd now that we may come a litle nearer their Ministrie it would be knowen what office these Lordlie Prelates these Primates Metropalitanes Arch Lord Bishops exercise in the Church of Christ. For euerie Minister must be of necessitie in som perticular office I speake not nowe of the offices they beare in the commoÌ„wealth as to be Peres of the Realme Lordes of the Parlament Iudges of ciuile causes in Courtes Iustices of the peace c but of their ecclesiastical offices as being Bishops whither they haue anie of the ordâ—narie and permanent offices as Pastors Teachers Elders Or of those extraordinarie temporarie offices which are nowe ceased of Apostles Prophets Euangelisâ—es And sure by their magnificent stile glorious titles extraordinarie power irregular aucthoritie and inordinate rule I should rather iudge theÌ„ of these extraordinarie offices saue that I finde those wholie nowe ceased not expedient or to be loked for and also that th'estate behauioure and doings of those Bishops accorde not to those offices First Apostles these Bishops are not in that they haue no immediate caling from God or confirmed by God vnto that office Neither doe they execute yt as Christs Apostles did they goe not from place to place from countrie to countrie to preach the Gospel to call the people to the faith to gather plant Churches Neither haue they receiued such measure of grace or can ratifie and approue by such euideÌ„t testimonie power and wonders the doctrines rules and ordinances which they deliuer vnto and impose vpon their Churches to be of God Yet seing they lay a newe and an other foundation then the Apostles haue laide deliuer other doctrines rules and ordinances as appeareth by the whole ministrie worship ministration ordinances and gouernement of their Church then the Apostles haue taught and left seing also they vsurpe a greater power and preeminence one ouer an other One being a Primate an other an Arch-Bishope c then the Apostles did Wee neuer reading of anie Primate Arch or Lord Apostle Peters chayre now not standing in EnglaÌ„d They had neede to confirme their offices calings doings power by no lesâ—e miracles testimonies theÌ„ the Apostles did if they wil haue their ministrie doings allowed receiued which if they should doe and draw fire from heaueÌ„ yet ought we to belieue hold fast that perfect â—oundation which CHRISTES Apostles haue layde that authenticke alsufficient worde which
saying of the Prophet is come about That there are like people like Priest Al this Mr. G. in his festered coÌ„science knewe before and that his shamelesse assumption would not passe with his adversarie with whom he had to doe and therfore he leaueth the proof of this assumption as also of his office and entraÌ„ce and yet againe assayeth by a newe argument of the effectes together with that which is properly adioyned to the Ministrie of CHRIST to proue his Ministerie THat ministerie with the'xecution wherof there is ioyned the effectual grace power blessing and operation of the holy Ghost to the true conuertion of mens soules is not a ministerie of the Diuel nor of Antâ—christ nor cometh not in the life and power of the Beaste but is indeed the true Ministerie of CHRIST But such grace power blessing operation is founde in the Ministerie of England Therfore First here stil must be obserued a begging and assuming of a true Ministrie which as yet is not proued Neither doth this reason proue a Ministrie so much as shew the infallible effectes of true doctrine true preaching whether it be by Ministers or by other faithful which haue the gift of prophecie knowledge interpretation vtterance c. For far from the truth is it to thincke that only Ministers beget and winne to the faith as some most shamelsse Bishops and sencelesse Priestes of this age haue published and mainetaine Then might they aswel with the Papistes permit the worde of God only vnto Priestes yea suffer none but Priestes to speake of the worde or holie doctrines if this vse and end of the worde were taken away if the blessing and power of God should not goe with his holy word and truth in the mouth of all his seruants both to cal vnto the faith an to super-edifie in the faith Ells should al dueties in families all mutual exhortations admonitions conferences cease But hauing the commandement of God to al these the euidence and testimonie of the blessed and comfortable effects following the faithful testimonies of al Christes Disciples in all ages and contynual experience hereof amongst out selues dayly we dare affirme that others besides Ministers may conuert soules and begeate faith So then this argument of the effectes proueth not so much a true ministry as it doth proue true doctrine For no false doctrine can beget true faith though manie which be no Ministers may beget true faith Mr. Giff. theÌ„ reasoneth verie corruptly deceiptfully in attributing the conuertion of soules as proper peculiar to the ministrie which is not so and in bringing these effectes to proue a true ministrie which only are to proue true doctrine And nowe to Mr. Gif his assumption Wee denie that any false ministrie hath promise of blessinge or is sent of God for the conuertion of soules but on the contrarie we finde it accursed and sent of God for the seducing of the reprobate The ministrie then of the Church of EnglaÌ„d being proued false in Office Entrance and Administration can haue no such promise or blessing of God as Mr. Giff. assumeth If it be demaunded then whether al vnder this ministrie be damned I say it is a newe question and kept secret to the Lorde who onlie knoweth who be his when how to call them It becometh not vs to giue anie such finall iudgment of matters not knowen vnto vs Yet this wee may be warrant of the whole scripture saie That the waies of the false Churche and ministrie are the waies of death and haue no promise of saluation But for the persons wee iudge charitablie euen so longe and so far as wee may measuring them by our selues as wee sometymes were hoping and not doubting but God hath manie thousandes deare elect there yea euen in the Popish Churches whom he in his due tyme by his appointed meanes wil cal If Mr. Giff. here insist say that many of those thousandes are couerted by their ministrie Therfore their ministrie is not in the power of ANTICHRIST or of the Diuel but of God hauing that sure seale that worcke of the holie Ghost We haue aboue answered that this rather approueth the doctrine then the ministrie and is to be attributed to the worde of God rather then to the person of man Furder that the false ministrie hath no promise of blessing Yet doe wee not herebie restraine the infinite power of God from sauinge or calinge his elect euen by the doctrine of the false Churche which though it be so throughly leauened corrupted peruerted abused yet can the Lorde bring the truth of his lawe and gospel which is there read and after their maner preached in such sorte â—o the eares consâ—ieÌ„ces of his chosen as it shal both shew them their degenerate estate â—ow guiltie they are of the breache of Gods lawe howe lyable to his wrath and also shew them the true meanes of their restoring redemption reconciliation saluation Yet this doth neither iustifie the false Minister of his ministration no more then when a young Boye dumbe Minister or vnbelieuing prophane person reading the holie scriptures or some other booke of true doctrine some of the hearers God so opening their vnderstaÌ„ding should therby be brought to the ackowledging and faith of Christ the feare loue of God c. This Boy reading Priest prophane person by reading is proued a true Minister a true preacher a true christian Or these that are thus wonne comforted c to seeke no other Minister or meanes of their saluation then thys reading by these persons Let the doctrine then in that poyncte wherby men are thus begotten to these beginninges of faith or to anie encrease therof be alwaies true and sounde so far foorth the maner tyme of apprehending be the worke and power of God the meanes instrumeÌ„tes of conuaying or bringing variable at the wil appoynctment of God Yet are we only to sâ—eke vse and rest in those meanes which the Lord hath ordayned for our instruction and leading foorth in the wil and wayes of God which meanes only haue warrant promise of blessing vnto vs howsoeuer the Lord by his infinite power and worcking can and no doubt doth saue some in Turckey amongst the heathen in the false Church amongst the false worshippers by what meanes yt pleaseth him yet may not we herevpon either resorte vnto or remaine in these forbidden places in hope of these effectes because God if such be his will can saue vs here or if it be not his will to saue vs theÌ„ no true Church of ministry caÌ„ auaile vs. This were most highly and dangerously to tempt God a reprobate kinde of reasoning God his wil vnto vs is that we alwaies obey and rest in his reueiled wil and not to presume vpon his infinite will and power which he keepeth secret vnto himself This caused the holy Martyres and faithfull at all tymes and vs the Lordes most vnworthy witnesses at
therfore we suffer because wee wil not denie this faith But by his owne argument he hath turned himself and their whole Church and Priesthood out of the folde whiles they are not gathered vnto CHRIST alone by his doctrine only but maintaine Antichristes lawes orders his seruantes they are to whome they gyue themselues to obey To proue his former reason hee aledgeth the custome of the olde time in Gods Church and the scripture yt self Reuel 2. where the Nicolaitanes are meÌ„tioned Arians of Arius Montanistes of Montanus Nouatians of Nouatus Pelagians of Pelagius Donatistes of Donatus The doctrine we do graunt that wicked Heretikes Scismatikes may iustly be named of the aucthors and leaders But heresie and schisme we denye to be maintayned by vs And you hauing neuer conuinced vs of heresie neither can proue your Churche to be the true apparant established Church of Christ must gyue accompt for your malitious sclandering of vs and numbring vs among such hatefull heretickes as the Arians c. If wee be Christians then must you gyue accompt for this offence which is not only done to vs but to his truth and to himself You affirme in an other place that you had rather gyue accompt for to much charitie shewed to the wicked yea for iustifijng an euil man then for coÌ„demning the iust being iguoraÌ„t that the woe is pronounced against both But here you haue forgotteÌ„ your self herein and by sclandering the truth you know what danger you incurre Luke 17. 1. 2. Math. 18. 7. He draweth the original of Brownisme as he termeth yt from Donatus and sayth Browne was the cheife renewer therof yet afterward saith ther was a Church of them eighteene yeeres agoe in London wherin one Bolton was a cheife doer whose fearful end is not forgotteÌ„ For the original of our profession we fetch yt from Christ and his Apostles practize of the Church in the Apostles time as all the Martyres from time to time haue done according to the light they sawe For Donatus and Browne they must answere for themselues We are buylt vpon the foundation of the Apostles Prophetts IESVS CHRIST being the chief corner stone Other foundation then this can no man lay wee offer our workes to be tryed hereby It is Mr. Giffard himself that so wel may remember the fearfull end of Bolton for yt is true that as I haue heard he stood against your ministerie for Cappes Surplus Crosse with many other your Romish trynckets as I haue heard your self haue done after reuolting and become a conformable member of your Churche hanging himself yt is a remembrance for Apostates Donatisme saith he in old time about twelue hundreth yeeres past was condemned as approued detestable schisme heresie The Brownistes and Donatistes shal appeare to agree together as two peices of cloth that are of the same woll same threed colour working and bredth If this man had read with iudgment the holy scripture as concerning the general defection Apostasie with the encrease decrease of Antichristes kingdome hee would haue blushed to haue entred this comparison For the Donatistes wee haue not to deale yet if the right eye were not blinded hee might haue considered better the Donatistes causes of separation and ours and it woulde not haue seemed so like together the times causes persons from whome and maner of their separation must be better weighed which because he hath taken in hande to perticulate afterward I wil only shew one here wherin we make such a difference as al his other are but trifles The Donatistes held still the same worship gouernment offices officers entrance and the same administration of sacraments c that the other did from whome they did separate and as it seemeth receiued whole Cities and Contries to be the Church as before so that their separation was more like the sectes and schismes amonst your selues you from the Papists the Martinistes from you the forward Predicants as they are called from the Bishops then any such separation as we by the coÌ„mandemeÌ„t of God make from false Church false ministerie false Sacraments Antichristian gouernment c vnto the true ordinances of Christ Heretickes and Sectaries make schisme but this true conuertion from the euill to the good from the false to the true fewe finde yt although it be the plaine commandement of God Reue. 18. 4. and the way to saluation Acts. â— 40. For indeed it is not enough to forsake the false wayes but to seeke the antient wayes of the Lord and to walke in them that wee may finde rest to our soules Mr. Giffard his setting downe of the causes of the Donâ—â—istes separation bewrayeth himself to seeke onlie the defamation of the truth without shew of reason First he sayth that in the persecutions by the Romish Emperours manie being as they were then termed proditors and traditors of the Bookes of God the holy vessells their bretheren c there was a rumor that such offences had bâ—ne committed by some Nowe saith he there came certeine Bishops from Numidia to Carthage a famous Citie in Africa to ordeyne a Bishop and found Cecilianus alredye ordeined and placed in the seate c. Thus farre I trust it will be granted me his peeces of cloth are not both of a woll for the difference I refer to the obstinate heynouse traÌ„sgressions wherwith we haue chardged these parrish assemblies Further the Brownistes as he in the spirit of blasphemy termeth them approue of no such Bishop or Bishoprickes no such seate nor ordination as they came about Well the Bishops of Numidia were wroth that they could not ordeine In this poinct his threeds are not proportionable Wee thrust not our â—elues beyond our lyne in these actions neither do any thing in the high matters of God through ambition These things are all founde amongst your selues the kingdome through enuie diuided for al your chiefest strife hath bene whither a Sinode of parrish Priestes or a Lord Bishop should create your Priestes this being your principal contention the one side must needs be Donatistes He procedeth and saith thesâ— Bishops of Numidia ioyned together and layed a crime vpoÌ„ â—â—â—cilianus they say his Ordeyner delyuered the holy books was a Traditor wherevpon they would haue Caecilianus reputed no Minister of CHRIST but the sonne of a traditor In this M r. Giff. discerneth not colours The Brownistes separate not for anie one mans person through envie they shewe other causes whie they repute your whole ministerie to be a false and AntichristiaÌ„ ministerie and not the true ministerie of the Gospel they allowe not ordination by one man but proue the offices entrance and administratioÌ„ of your ministerie to be wholly Antichristian and herevpon wee repute them no true ministerie of Christ. For the triall of this matter saith hee there was no assemblie of learned Pastors to iudge in this case according to Christs ordinance but furor dolus tumultus did beare the swaie Here M r. Giffard
the hearing of the publick doctrine prayer of y e Church but to enter Couâ—nâ—t or be receiued a member it is to be done by doctrine faith and repentance Neither did the kinges of Iuda compel the Priestes to receiue anie vncircumcised or Idolatours into y e fellowship of the Church Faith is the gift of God wrought by his Spirit word The Prince may coÌ„pel to the meanes therevnto but not enforce faith The Donatistes resisted the Magistrate so far as they durst saith he and wheÌ„ Iulian the Apostata shewed them fauour their circumcellioÌ„s made reuel in companies walking with clubbes staues did spoile beate such as lighted in their hands c The impatient heare of Browâ—istes is not vnknowen c. Let this lawlesse man shewe where euer anie of vs haue resisted the Magistrate or spokeÌ„ euil of the ruler of the people or gone about to reuenge our selues by any violence or vnlawful meanes As for his prophesie what we would be if we had power it layeth open himself to be a malicious false Prophet to incitate the Magistrate with lying dreames Let him better consider and he shal find that this Antichristian Prelacie hath bene not only the procurers but shedders of much innocent blood vsurping ciuile power And how they haue behaued themselues towards their soueraigne Kings Princes let y e Records be searched in your Church are found dayly treasons bloodshed c and most plentifull in your mother Church of Rome This then is but the false report of Sanballat and Tobia to hinder Gods Temple Nowe admiring Mr. Giffards clearing of the Donatistes of errour affirming they differed not from the other Churches in doctrine as also manifest or al least protest our innocencie from these and all other errours in the perticular course handled or els where to be found I will set downe three or fower grosse errours before him which we detest in the Donatistes as That he which or deineth a Minister as it seemeth they allowed ordinatioÌ„ by one maÌ„ is the head of him ordeined yea the fountaine and the other the riuer therfore if the head be holy the other is therby made holy and so on the contrarie if the first be wicked That the conscience of him that gyueth may wash the conscience of him that receiueth That when hee which baptiseth is manifest a good man hee gyueth faith hee is the original the roote the head of him that is by Gods spirit renewed That those which are baptised by a wicked man though in a lawfull office ought to be baptised againe That it is lawfull in some respectes to kill themselues That the Magistrate cannot compel vs to that which is good That we haue free wil after regeneration I wil not now iustifie Mr. Giff. explaining of their mindes whether in these or anie other wee handled I take al in this matter from his record which I hope hee will not affirme to be false As for his learned Fathers how they haue wrasted the scriptures new Testament and old in more then twenty false expositions and flat contradictions of the scope of the whole Canon of the worde to iustifie opeÌ„ iniquitie by slightes and tollerat it in the publicke assemblies with all their doctrines of separating in heart and not in bodye at comon meates and not at holy communion that all nations should be the apparant Church c wee leaue them al denying to enter controuersie with dead men wishing Mr. Giffard to spread such deceites in other mens names no more but to come orderly to some christian triall by the Booke of God In the meane tyme hee seeth wee neither hold of Donatistes nor of Augustine but followe faith in a pure conscience to our knowledge readie to be instructed wherein wee erre And when hee hath made such a lardge discourse to proue vs Anabaptistes Montanistes Arians Pelagians Nicolaitans c we shal in stead of conflicting with a beater of the ayre and vnconscionable sclanderous rayler demand the end and vse of his labours and nowe leaue him to his accompt for his defacing and blaspheming of the truth wishing all men to beware of such methodes of imposture I. G. FINIS A FEWE OBSERVATIONS OF Mr. GIFFARDS LAST CAVILLS ABOVT stinted read prayers and deuised Leitourgies HAving heretofore written an answere to Mr. George Giffards pretended defence of stinted read praiers deuised Leitourgies and since receiued an emptie replie wherin he doth nothing lesse theÌ„ yeild to any sound reason alledged but vngodlily cauilleth at and peruersly wrasteth the sence of so much as he toucheth I seeing no cause of further strife his former convinced to intermedle againe with perticular handling of his chaffe smoke his reasons in effect the same before answered haue only thought it my dutie to illustrate vnto the Readers some few brief poincts abused by him that they may the better be able to iudge of the former writings wherevnto with these few helpes following I refer the trial WHERAS I alledged out of the 8. to the Rom. and out of the 4. to the Galath that in the verie time action of our praiâ—ng to God the spirit of God was the only instructor and the only help no other help mentioned or that can be collected in the Scriptures Mr. GIFFARD hauing granted that reading prayer is not praying doth now answere that how soeuer the Scripture doth extol magnifie outward helpes meanes yet when they are compared with God which worketh all in all by them or when the scripture will set forth the efficacie worke to be his alone they are either not mentioned or els if they be mentioned so cast downe as if they were nothing God buyldeth his Church saith he by the ministerie of men yet Paul is said to plant Apollos to water but God to gyue the encrease 1 Corinth 3. and therfore to gather from those places Rom. 8. Galat. 4. that there neede or may be no outward help or meanes in the verie action and instant of praying is far awrye In which answere it euidently appeareth he is so bent to turne away all truth raise new strife as ther can be no expectation of agreement There is no sequence neither doth the Scripture alledged proue his owne reason so that nothing hangs togeather No man doubteth but that sometimes and in some places of Scripture the outward meanes of begetting and encreasing faith is only recited and sometimes the secret work of Gods spirit only sometimes both when yet they are not diuided but goe together and all of God both inward worke outward meanes though in way of coÌ„parison I neuer so read but rather the one repeated for both For shal I say that wheÌ„ the word of God preaching therof is â—hewed to be the power of God vnto saluation that the inward worke of the Spirit is therfore not mentioned because the other is of God theÌ„ both inward outward meanes being of God Gods owne worke