it hath of the Iewes and Paganes And more ouer it cōmeth very aptely to passe that these forgers of Interim haue made him a name of an aduerbe for as an aduerbe is a woorde ioyned to a verbe euen so the doctrine of the Interim is an adiunction to the worde of God not to opē and declare it as the aduerbe doth the Verbe but to darken and corrupte it T. It is then lyke to the glose of Orleance which marreth the text D. It is a very daungerous glose and seing then it is an aduerbe and that it signifieth in the meane time or whilest or vntill if they will interprete that woorde in the meane time euen as thou hast sayd we maye also take him in this signification In the meane tyme we die and shall be in daunger of going to hell In the meane tyme Antichrist shall reigne and the Gospell shall bee persecuted In the meane tyme they shall seeke all the meanes possible to suppresse and banyshe the worde of God and more strongly to establyshe the siege of Antichrist And to be shorte put to it all that euer thou wilte and al the euill that may happen in the worlde in the meane time whilest or vntyll will receaue it all ¶ VVhat profitte they vvhich haue beene instructed in the vvorde of God may receaue by the Councells and vvhat vertue and authoritie they haue to bring men to the fayth T. I Agree well with that that thou haste sayd but if there be a Councell holden and if it serue nothing at all for such as shall dye looking for it yet notwithstanding it shall profitte such as may liue vnto it D. And yet shalt thou not finde there by that meane all that y◠thou thinkest to fynde for if one be holden either it wil conclude for Iesus Christ or against Iesus Christ If they doe conclude for Iesus Christ and I haue bene well instructed in the word of God before hand it shall not hurte me at all that I was instructed before hand It hindreth not the cōmoditie that I maye receaue of the Councell but doth encrease it the more for I shall be so much the more glad whē I shall see that doctrine approued wherin I haue alreadye bene resolued and haue beleued it not onely because it is approued by the Councel and by men but for that it is the pure worde of God and that it alloweth it selfe and that the holy Ghost beareth me witnesse If I haue not alreadie beene instructed nor resolued either I wil credite the determination which shal haue bene made by the Councell or ells I wil not credite it For it is not a thinge that of necessitie muste betyde that euery man must beleue the determination of the Councels as soone as they haue concluded although the Councell were lawfull For it is not in the power of men which shall hold it to make all that please them to beleue it It is a worke that is onely proper to God which geueth fayth And to seke to make men beleue of force that may not be for fayth may not be inforced Wherfore if I make it seme that I do beleue it and do not beleue it I shall then be an hypocrite if I do beleue it it is greatly to be feared least that I do beleue onely vpon the credite of others being moued by the authoritie of mē rather thē by the true perswasiō of the word and of the spirite of God And so my fayth shall be builded vpon men and vpon their opinions not vpon God and his worde It shall be then no fayth but onely an opinion readie to chaunge as men shall chaunge T. It shall be as firme as shall the foundation whereupon it shall bee builded ¶ Hovv vve maye not bee the disciples of men but of Iesus Christ hovv that the vvord of god taketh not his authoritie of the church but the church taketh hys of the vvorde of God D. NOwe our Lorde Iesus Christ willeth that we be his Disciples and not the disciples of men that we haue none other maister but he for it is onely he that is gone Math. xxiii forth from the bosome of the father and that hath fullye reueled vnto vs the fathers will and all that he hath heard of him as witnesseth Saint Iohn It is very he that hath geuen vs the whole summe of the articles of our Christian fayth Iohn ii and of that doctrine we muste needes holde vnto the which it is not lawfull for anye man to adde ne yet Deut. 11. to take awaye anye thinge from it It is onely he that hath broughte vs the truth and that doctrine whiche of it selfe is naturallye certaine and immutable and of hys own nature can be none other whether men do alowe it or disalowe it It is the truth and that onely doctrine vpō the which the Church may surely dwel which she may not vpō the natural wit of mā how excellent so euer it be ne yet vpō vsage and custom how auncient so euer it be It is a truthe a doctrine not certayn and worthy to be receiued because the Church men do alow it but for that it is so of his own nature can be none other The Church doth approue it receiueth it and may neither reproue it ne yet reiect it if it be the true Church of Iesus Christ In like maner the Synagoge of Satan may nether approue ne yet receiue it in any wyse For euen as the Synagoge of Satan cā not acknowledge it but accōpteth it alway for a straunger for that she Iohn 8. is the wyfe daughter of the deuil which is the father of lies the enemy of al truth euen so by the contrary it is impossible that the true Church of Iesus Christ should not alway acknowledge it euen as the daughter doth know her mother for that she is the daughter of God which is the truth it selfe the daughter I say begotten of the incorruptible sede of his worde and the wife of Iesus which is the way the truth i. Pet. ◠Ephe. v Iohn xvi Iohn x lyfe and he by whom this truth of God is manifested and declared vnto vs. It is that sheepe that heareth the voyce of his shepeheard followeth it not the voyce of the straunger Thē the word of God receaueth not that authoritie that it hath of the church but the church receaueth her authoritie of it In so much as shew is signed and marked with the seale therof For she is to be compared to a peece of paper or parchment to the waxe which geue not authoritie to the writing seales that are written and imprinted in them but do receiue their authoritie of them are made authentike by their authoritie by the authoritie of the prince vnto whom the seale appertayneth for that he hath allowed it by his authoritie Wherefore that doctrine which of hys nature is
truth as the deuill is the father of lyes who is in dede a very aūcient father but not so auncient as is God the father of all truth ¶ Of the argumentes taken of the multitude T. WHat sayest thou of the argumentes taken of the multitude D. If it were lawefull to alledge the multitude of mē the fooles and wicked should alwayes haue the better for they are alwaye the greatest nomber Wherfore we are forbidden in law to folowe the multitude for to do euill And our sauiour Iesus Christ hath willed vs to passe thorow the straite way for it is that waye that leadeth to eternall life cōtraryly forbiddeth vs to folow the large thorow the which many passe for that way leadeth to destruction Esech 20 ¶ Of the argumentes of tyme auncientie T. WHat sayest thou of those that alledge long time auncientie D. Ther is no greater reason in the alledging of time auncienti then in the alledging of the multitude For what is more auncient in this world then lying rebellion and disobedience manslaughter violence extorcion whoredome Idolatrie villeny and all kinde of wickednesse and abhomination for they haue had their beyng euen immediatly after the beginning of the world as soone as men were borne into the world T. These thinges haue begon at the least euen from the tyme that the deuil hath bene in the world whiche is as ancient as any man that euer was for he is the auncientest of al creatures and the father of al the euill that euer was is or shal be in the worlde and it is by him that it is entertained encreased and maintained ¶ Of the fall of the deuill and of his children vvhose predecessour he is D. IN dede it is very well sayd of thee for our Sauiour Iesus Christ doth call him not onely a lyar but also the father Iohn 8. of lyes For albeit that God did creat hym an Angell and in the same truth that is in God yet he could not so continue but did falle from truth into lyes whiche is the originall of all other euils euen as truth is the fountaine of Iohn 8. all goodnes He is also called a mansleyar and a murderer from the begynning And bycause that Cain did by and by folow him S. Iohn sayeth that he is the sonne of the deuill Iohn 3. and that he slew his brother bycause he was of the wicked And in the same place he saith also he that sinneth is of the deuil for the deuil sinneth euen from the begynning In the whiche Saint Iohn hath folowed the maner of speakyng of his master Iesus Christe who called the Iewes childrē Ioh. viii of the deuill for that they were lyars and murderers of the seruauntes of God and of hym whiche was and is the very sonne of God which thyng proceded of the very hatred that they had agaynst the truth which was preached vnto them by Iesus Christ and his Disciples ¶ Of the predecessours of the vvicked and infidels and hovve the auncientie of sinnes doth procure Gods vvrath vpon men and doth not excuse them T. IT foloweth then by this accoumpt that such as folow and do the worke of the deuill ar the deuils sonnes successours D. The matter is playne wherfore thou mayest easely perceyue by this what predecessours such kynd of mē may alledge that will folow any other order of lyfe then that whiche hath ben taught vs by God what cause they haue to glory of auncientie and of old worldes Let them thē alledge the deuill for their most auncient father and with his lyes fight against the eternal truth of God let the mansleaers and murderers alledge Cain and the Sodomites those whose name they beare All these kyndes of mē and al other wicked ones haue fathers very auncient they do folow one doctrine and one sorte of lyfe whiche is very auncient but truth vertue holynes innocencie God which is there father are yet more auncient for the deuil sinne and lyes of the whiche he is author haue had their begynnynge and raigne and therfore they shall once haue an ende But God is eternall without begynning and without end and so is his truth whereof he is father and of all vertues els And therfore God doth not onely not supporte heresies errours superstitions and Idolatries bycause of their auncientie but contrarylye he threateneth the Idolaters and wicked ones that the longer that they haue continued in sinne and folowed the same the greater vengeaunce he will send vppon them Wherfore it is spoken by the Prophet Esay Behold Esay 65. it is writtē before me I will no longer hold my peace but will yelde and throwe into their bosomes your iniquities with the iniquities of your fathers also saith the Lord and immediatly after whereby I will yelde agayne vnto them in their bosome the measure of their first worcke The Lorde speaketh this vppon good occasion for if the father haue ben wicked and the sonne is yet more wicked the iniquitie of the father doth not amende that of the sonne and make it vertue and not vice T. No but doth encrease it much more for the more of our predecessours that haue ben rebels against God so much the greater is our faulte D. It semeth vnto me that those which alledge their predecessors aūcientie to maintaine therby their errors and abuse do euen like as doth a traitor whiche would excuse and purge him selfe to ward his prince whom he hath offēded through his treasons that should alledge in his defence that his predecessours haue alway bene traitours liued in the like infidelitie towardes their prīces as he hath done towardes his Thinckest thou not y◠this excuse wer very lawful mete to appease the prince T. Euē so mete that it mought occasiō him to cut cleane frō the earth so wicked a race to the ende they should neuer be any more heard of D. It is euen so ¶ Hovv that none may so vvell alledge aūciētie as the faithful may hovv that al the allegatiōs of the vnfaithful are nothing els but clokes to couer their hipocrisie vvickednes T. FOr so muche as it is so it semeth vnto me that if auncientie might haue place there are none that may so wel alledge auncientie as may the true childrē of God D. No mā may deny yt. For God is the aunciēt of all worldes Esay xli Daniel vii Apoc. 12. 13 the first the last whose truth they folow by the which they are made his true lawfull children Wherfore these men may lawfully alledge cōmaunde vnto their children that whiche the Lord spake by Ieremy searche you out among Ierem. vi the auncient pathes whiche is the good way walke in the same T. I do thincke that those reasons whiche thou hast alledged are sufficient ynoughe to confute and shame those kindes of mē the vse these colours of predecessours of the multitude of times ages to
others might by the readyng therof obtayne vnderstanding c. The Scripture is the power of God to saluatioÌ„ by it we knowe God and Christ by it we knowe our selues by it we are taught our duety toward our neyghbour by it we learn to obei our prince by it we know the true Prophet froÌ„ the false the Scriptures ar to be preferred before al the writings of men it is the touche stone wherby we ought to examine Ad Reginaâ— derecta fide the doctrines of men Cyril sayth it is necessary for vs that we folow the holy Scriptures not to swarue in anye thyng that is commaunded in them S. Ambrose vpon the. 1. Epistle to the Corinthes 4. chap. saith what soeuer is not receiued froÌ„ the handes of the Apostles is full of wickednes Cyprian in Sermon â— de lapsis And how dare they ordeyne and decree any thing without Christ whose hope and fayth vertue and glorye is whollye in hym Origine vpon Ezechiell Homili 7. lette vs folowe no man and if wee will folowe any wee haue Christe set foorth to vs to followe The actes of the Apostles are set forth vnto vs we know the doings of the Prophetes by the holy volumes that is a sounde exaÌ„ple to folow Theophilactus vpoÌ„ the Epistle to the Romains the last chap. sayth They whiche bryng any thyng beside the determinations and doctrine of the Apostles they bryng in offences heresies and dissensions Ireneus aduersus Valentini similiuÌ„ scripta lib. 2. cap. 56 â–ª Leane to the holy Scriptures which is the sure and vndoubted truth it is a sure stone wherwith to build when ye leaue this cleaue to any other doctrines c. S. Augustine in his prologue of his 3. boke of the trinitie sayth Obey not my writinges as thou wilte the Canonicall scriptures for what so euer thou shalt finde in theÌ„ that thou beleuest not the same beleue without douting but in myne if Authority of the wrytingâ— of the fathers thou finde any thing wherin thou art not persuaded thorowly beleue it not assuredly Againe in his 112. Epistle which he writeth to Paulm he speaketh to the like end IteÌ„ in his 2. boke of Baptisme against the Donatists 3. chap. he saith you alwayes alledge to vs the letters of CypriaÌ„ the sayinges of CypriaÌ„ why take you authoritie of CypriaÌ„ for your Scisme refuse his exaÌ„ple to trouble the church who is he that doth not well know that the Canonicall scriptures as wel of the olde as of the new Testament are conteined within limites which ar certain that the same is to be preferred to the writings of al the Bishops yâ— haue ben hereto fore so that we may not in any thing doute or dispute of it to wit whether yâ— all yâ— therin is be true or no but it is lawfull to repreheÌ„d the writings of the Bishops which were writen before or which wer writen after the coÌ„firmation of the Canonical scriptures either by word c. Moreouer Origene vpoÌ„ the Prophet Ieremie in his 1. Howelie sayth we must needes call to witnesse the holy Scriptures for without theÌ„ no maÌ„ ought to credite our sayings or writings S. Hierom vpon s Mathew fayth That which is spokeÌ„ without the authoritie of the scriptures euen as it is spoken so may it be reiected conteÌ„ned vpon Ieremie 9. chap. sayth The error of fathers mothers of auÌ„cesters ought not to be folowed but the authoritie of the scriptures the coÌ„mauÌ„demeÌ„t of God whiche he teacheth vs c. And within fewe lynes after he sayth Assuredly thorowe ignorauÌ„ce of the law men shall receiue Antichrist for Christ c. S. CypriaÌ„ to Cecil in his 3. boke of his Epistles 3. Epistle saith yf you do that which I coÌ„mauÌ„de you I will not cal you my seruauÌ„tes but my frends And also that Christ ought onely to be herd the father hath borne witnes from heauen saying This is my welbeloued sonne in whom I am well pleased heare him wherfore if it be so the Christ onely ought to be herd then ought we not to looke what any man before vs hath thought good to be done but that which Christ who is Christ and not custom is to be followed before all hath done for we are not bouÌ„d to folow the custome of meÌ„ but the truth of God for so much as God sayth by his Prophet Esay in ye. 29. chap They honor me in vain teaching the coÌ„mauÌ„demeÌ„ts doctrines of meÌ„ And again in the Gospel Mathew 15. you reiect the coÌ„mauÌ„demeÌ„t of God to establishe your own traditions And therfore deare brother if anye of our predecessors eyther through ignoraunce or simplicitye haue not obserued that which the Lord hath taught vs to do by his example or doctrine that same may be refused for the symplenes therof may through the mercies of the Lord be pardoned him c. And shortly after he sayth if we be the elders ministers of God Christ I fynd not that we ought to follow any but God Christ for somuch as he saith in the Gospel of Iohn chap. 8. I am the light of the world he that followeth me shal not walke in darcknes but shal haue the Diuiâ—â—â—um institut lib. 6. cap. 8 light of life LactaÌ„ti ' Firmian ' in his 6. boke of his godly institutioÌ„s 8. chap. sayth we ought not to follow meÌ„ but god The canons decrees of the Popes in the. 9. distinct ca. Noli cap. Ego cap. Negare dist 24 1. quest ca. Non affermam ' say thus Men must dwell vpon the holy Scriptures not vpon the sayings of men how holy soeuer they be c. S. Chrisostome vpoÌ„ S. Iohn sayth in the end of the. 16. homelie That meÌ„ of occupatioÌ„ do seeke striue to be excellent in their occupacions Gredi desire of corporall things and carelesnesse of spirituall things but the christiaÌ„ can not render reasoÌ„ of his religion if these handy occupations were not knowen it were but losse of money but the coÌ„tempt of the christiaÌ„ religioÌ„ carieth with it destruction of the soule yet we tranayle in so great miserye madnes that we bestow in theÌ„ all our studie care but the things which are most necessary for vs and are most sure fortes of our saluation we esteme not at all It is it that letteth the heathens froÌ„ acknowledging their errour and causeth theÌ„ to scoffe at vs for albeit they are grouÌ„ded onely vpoÌ„ lyes to do al that which they do to defend the ignominie of their doctrine we which serue the truth dare not once opeÌ„ our mouthes to defend that which is ours why should they not condemne our great imbecillitie haue vs in supicion to be crafty disceitful why should they not speake euil of Christ as of a lyar who by his fraud should haue abused the simplicitie of the multitude we are
sort are very neare approchyng to the nature of the first bycause that those that do abuse the knowledge of God do coÌ„monly fall from this degree of euil into that other extreme degree of wickednes whereof we euen now spake I do place in this raÌ„cke those that do wittingly resiste the truth do make warres against the people of God as did BalaaÌ„ not for that they haue so great a hatered agaynst the truth as haue these others of whome we haue already spoken but they do it to mayntayne theyr Num. 24. â—â— Peter ii worldlye pompe and for their particular commoditie or els that they are corrupted by suche as do resiste the veritie as is aforesayd T. The number of such is greate For the chief thing that maketh men to resiste the worde of God is for that it is contrarie to their ambition glorye and couetousnes and to all theyr pleasures and corrupte affections But among all there are none more worthy to be accompted suche Balamites then the learned men that are at this daye in Christendome whose nomber is greate whiche set out for hyer to Antechrist and his adherentes both theyr pennes and tongues to cursse or speake euill of those that they knowe ryght well that God doth blesse and to hinder the course of the worde of God and the reformation of hys Churche Wherefore I do not greatly maruell if that God oftentymes doth throw suche men into a reprobate sence whiche do so wickedly turne the truth of God vnto a lye and his iustice into iniustice and in this sorte oftentymes Roma i. they become in the ende the greatest aduersaries of God his worde that the earth doth beare to the ende that they may fill full the measure of their iniquities For such a wickednes and frowardnes doth well deserue suche a punishement and vengeaunce at the handes of God whiche is the most horrible that may light vpon men ¶ Of such as do resist the truth persecute the same through ignoraunce and zeale vvithout vnderstandyng and of the excuse of the ignoraunt D. THese people are farre woorse then are these of whom we nowe meane to speake whiche do not offende but Roma 10 through ignoraunce and of a zeale that they haue towarde God which is voyde of knowledge as many haue done before our tyme and namely Saint Paule in the tyme that he was a persecutoâ—â— of the Christians for he him selfe confesseth that he did it of ignoraunce wherefore there is more i. Timo. i hope in these kynde of men then in either of the others T. But I would gladly know whether these men shal be excused by their ignoraunce or no. D. Our Lorde Iesus Christ sayth that the seruauÌ„t that knoweth his maisters will and doth it not shal be more greuously beaten then he that is ignoraunte Luke xii thereof and doth it not yet for all that both shal be punished He sayth also that those whiche haue throwen the Gospel from them shall receaue greater punishements in the daye of iudgement then those of Sodome and Gomorha Math x Luke x vnto whom God hath not offered so great grace yet for al that he sayth not that those of Sodome and Gomorha shall escape the iudgemente T. This is a maruelous and a horrible threatnyng ¶ Hovv that the vvaÌ„t of the knovvledge of God his truth raigneth not in man vvithout his great faulte T. THen if those that are ignoraunt in the doctrine of the Lord and by meanes of their ignoraunce do not foâ— low it at all shall not be excused by their ignoraunce howe much lesse shall they that are not onely content to be ignoraunt of it but do openly persecute the same For there is no ignoraunce in that behalfe but that a great péece of the fault is in our selues For in how many sondry sortes doth God dayly declare him selfe to vs By howe many meanes doth he call and as it were drawe vs vnto hym We do all knowe that there is one God whiche is the Lorde of all T. That is verye true D. If he bee the Lorde of all then all men are bounde to obey his lawes and ordinaunces T. That is but reason D. We can not obserue and kepe them but firste we muste knowe them and vnderstande them Wherefore before all other thynges we must seke for thys knowledge and vnderstandyng For there is nothing more honest more profitable nor more necessarie for vs and contrarywise there is no thynge more vnhonest more worthy of blame nor more hurtefull then is the ignoraunce of the lawe and of the will of God For if the ignoraunce of any thynge that is worthie to be knowen men hauynge meanes to attayne to the knowledge thereof be to be condempned and that so muche the sooner in so muche as the knowledge of the thynge is more commendable and more necessarie how much should we esteme vnhonest and intollerable the ignorauÌ„ce of the law and of the wil of God Of the whiche the knowledge is more necessarie for vs then is the lyght of the sunne and the vsage of the fire and water without the whiche this humane lyfe can not continue T. I confesse no lesse For in as muche as the soule of man is more excellent then is the body euen so are the thynges more excellent more necessarie that do concerne the soule or at the least both soule and body together then are those which appertayn onely to the body For if the soule be well and in good case the body can not be but well but if the body be well entreated and delicately vsed and the soule euill entreated and negligently looked vnto the euill entreatie of the soule shall in the ende make the bodye partaker of the same ¶ Of the greate care and diligence that is in men to get those thynges that do appertaine to this present life and of their negligence and carelesnesse that they doo vse as touchyng those thinges that appartayne to the life eternall D. THerfore I do not a litle maruel to se the great paines and trauayles that men take to maintayne this casuall and miserable lyfe whiche is as it were of the continuaunce of one day in comparyson yea in dede very short and full of sorow and miserie whiche life also many do not passe thorowe euen to the end and yet do they learne many Artes Sciences and occupations through great diligence labour and trauaile to the end to be by them sustained and maintayned in this present life that there are so few that haue any care to learne that Art and Science by the which we may attayne to that eternal and most blessed lyfe which shall coÌ„tinue with vs for euer For what is the whole age of a man euen froÌ„ the day of his byrth to the day of his death T. It is as it were the tyme of one day and is more shorte to some then to others If we shal
God and of his woorde and in what sorte they should liue that they wyl vnderstand and knowe no more in that behalfe then they do already know for that they do already knowe as muche as they ought to knowe euen as though a man in thys whole lyfe tyme were able to come to suche perfection of knowledge and vnderstanding of godly thinges that nothing mought be added therunto D. Saynt Paule who was taken vp into the thyrde 2. Cor. 1◠13. heauen and did there vnderstand of thinges of the whych it is not lawful for any man to speake was neuer of that opinion For he doth declare that all that euer we may vnderstād vpon the earth of those matters is nothing els but 1. Cor. 13. as we should behold a thing in a glasse or in a darke cloud or mist Wherfore whilest that we do liue in this world we must thinke that we are alwayes lyke vnto little children as touching thys godly vnderstanding and that we haue neede to profit and increase in the same dayly euen as doo the little children that are at the schoole and that we shall neuer see it as it is vntyl that we be with God and see him face to face and know him as he hath knowen vs. For if ther be no man of so excellent a spirite that euer maye attayne vnto the perfect vnderstanding of humaine and visible thinges nor yet of one of those sciences that appertaineth vnto this earthlye lyfe howe great presumption is it then for mā which is wholy created ignorant as touching godly things so muche to challenge to him selfe the knowledge and vnderstanding of those thinges of the which the Angels themselues cannot perfectly vnderstand T. Surely it is a great presumptiō of vs if we thinke that we be more perfect then are the Angels ¶ Of the true knovvledge of God and of the true maner hovv to knovv hys vvyll and of the contemplatiue and actiue knovvledge of the same D. OF the other parte there is one thing to be considered in the knowledge and vnderstanding of the wil of God which thing fewe men doo note That is that we may not iudge of that science and knowledge as wee doo of diuers humane sciences of the onelye knowledge wher of many men hold them well satisfied wythoute anye further practise of the same For thys godlye knowledge consisteth not onelye in contemplacion requiring nothing but contemplatiue teachers to instruct the mynde of man but requyre also the wyll and actiue Teachers and practisers And for thys cause Christ doth not say onely hee that wyll knowe but he that wyll doo the wyll of hym that sent me he shall knowe of my doctrine whether it be of God or Ioh. 7. whether I speake of my selfe For there are that for curiositye and for some other affection that they haue that are desyrous to know the wyll of God but not to that ende to direct their lyues according to the same And therefore our Lord Iesus Christ declareth playnlye by these wordes that there is nothyng that letteth men from the knowledge of the truthe of God but onelye the wante of the feare of God and of good wyll to obey and honoure hym Wherefore it followeth that there is no true knowledge of God but onely that whyche is ioyned wyth thys good and prompt wyll and that none can iudge of the Lordes doctrine but those that are of suche a mynde T. If the matter be so a man may not thinke that he vnderstandeth or knoweth anye thing althoughe he haue all the holye scriptures by hart and that he can deuise and discourse thereof at pleasure lyke an Angell if he haue not the effecte of that doctrine imprinted in hys hart and that hee bee as it were clothed wyth the same in such sort as he may put the same in practise at all tymes ¶ Of the true study of the holy scriptures and of the true fruite that commeth of the same D. THat is verye true For if it were sufficient to haue onely a bare knowledge of Gods woorde and so beholde it in the ayre wythout hauing of the wyll reformed by the same the deuill shoulde in thys sorte exceede al men in religion For hee hath knowledge and vnderstandyng inoughe if that he had a wyll according to the same And therfore it is not onelye needefull for vs to heare the word of God and to studye the same for to vnderstande that that is contayned in that same doctrine and then to proceede no further and to make it as it were a studye of Philosophye contemplatiue But we doo chiefly neede to wrap and clothe vs therein and to put in vse and to practise in our lyues that whych we doo vnderstande and knowe or els to what ende doth our knowledge and vnderstanding serue For to what ende doth a manne learne an occupacion Is it for that he wyll neuer vse it or els onelye to talke of it wythout practising the same Wouldest thou thyncke hym perfect in anye occupation that neuer did practise the same nor neuer declared hys experience by anye peece of hys woorke T. No truelye D. Wouldest thou then thinke hym to be a good Christian that onelye doth boaste hym of the name and knowledge of Christianitye wythoute the declaryng of the same by hys woorkes T. No in deede ¶ Of suche Christians as are ignoraunt of the vvorde of God and of those that abuse theyr knovvledge in the same D. ANd nowe whyche thynkest thou more woorthye of blame eyther hee that doth knowe no occupacion and woorketh not or els hee that hathe a good occupacion and hadde rather to loyter and to be slothfull and idle then to woorke at hys occupation T. Thys last man whiche doth moste abuse the gyfte of God Wherefore if I shoulde see suche men in necessitye I woulde not verye wyllynglye geue almes to hym that hath had so small care to learne some occupacion whereby he myghte iustlye lyue muche lesse to geue vnto hym that had rather fast and become a begger then to woorke and trauaile for hys lyuing when he maye D. And howe wouldest thou handle hym that hath a goodlye wyt and is well exercised and very excellent in some occupacion and doth trauayle in the same wyth all diligence but not to doo anye thyng wherby the glory of God or the wealth of hys neighbour might be auaunced but rather to let and hynder both the one and the other and to lyue in all villanye and filthines T. I would iudge hym woorthy to be hanged or at the least to be whipped For if the others be worthy to be accompted vnprofitable and wicked this kinde of man is much more woorthye to be so accompted of in as muche as he is not Matth. 24. and. 25. onelye content to hyde in the earth the talentes that God hath geuen hym and so to keepe them wythout yeldyng any profyt of them but that woorse is hee bestoweth them
the true seruauntes of God ¶ Of the vveakenesses that haue bene founde at the Councell of Nice in them that vvere there gathered and assembled and vvhat holy and excellent personages there vvere present at the same T. THou speakest as yet but in generall I praye thee let vs now come to particular examples D. We spake lastly of the Councell of Nice but thinkest thou that all the decrees of the same be as wel founded vpon the holy Scriptures as were the disputations arrestes and determinations which were there agreed vpon against the Arrians T. I haue no occasion to doubt it if I see not the contrarye D. If all those which are named vnto it were there determined there are some touching the discipline of the Church very supersticious curious and an other sorte rigorous and curious inough Moreouer I see no greate apparence in that which forbiddeth men to knele when they praye on the Sondaies and on the day of Pentecoste I leaue that whereof Gracian maketh mencion vnder the same title concerning the consecratioÌ„ of temples or churches because it is to beastly and to vnworthy of such a Councell On the other part how much wanted it that it was not forbidden the ministers of the church to vse their lawfull wiues yea by the common consent of all suche as dyd there assiste directlye agaynst the worde of God if one Paphnutius had not had more of the spirite of God in that behalfe then all Hist trip li. 2. c. 13. 14. Euseb hist ecâ—l li 10. â— the reste of the Councell who letted that determination by the very worde of God Moreouer in the same Councel was not the Emperour Constantine greatly ashamed to heare the Bishops and pastours of the church which were men so greatly estemed for their doctrine and holynes of life so to accuse the one the other being personages of so greate honestie and to contend and outrage one an other as it had bene a number of women that had chidden Was he not constrained to caste all their accusations and libells of euil report which they had prepared the one against the other in to the fire For he well vnderstoode that these affections and particular causes which they had one agaynste an other shoulde hinder the principal causes for the which they were assembled For many of them were more affectionate to their particular causes then to the common cause and desired more theyr victorie then that of the truth There were there three hundred and threscore Byshops by accompte in that Councell the flower of Christendome amonge whom was thys Paphnutius a Byshop of Egipte of whom wee haue alreadye spoken a very man of God who had endured muche for the truth and had the gifte of myracle Spiridion Bishop of Cypre who was a very excellent personnage there was in lyke sorte present Paule Neocharien Martyr who had both hys handes burnte in the persecution of Maximian and many other suche lyke who had the gifte of miracle and had behaued them selues valiauntly and constauntly in that persecution if then the imperfections weakenesses and affections wer so great among the Byshoppes in suche a companie that Constantine was all amased and ashamed to see at suche a tyme that so worthy personnages shoulde shewe them selues in suche sorte men and so subiecte to their affections let vs then thincke what myght bee in our tyme and what assistaunce of the holy Ghost wee may hope for in suche a companie as shall there assemble T. It is easie to discerne ¶ Of the greate contearieties discordes dissentioÌ„s that haue ben in many of the auncient Councels betvvene the Byshops and the Ministers of the Churche D. LEt vs procede and for greater proofe of that whiche we haue said let men see in the hystories of the Church what the partialities the bandes and dissentions of the Bishops haue done in the Councels holden in Tyr in Ierusalem in Antioche in Sirmie and at Constantinople Moreouer Sozo 2 c 25 hist tri li 1. 2. 33. lib 2 c. 10. c. 30. lib. 4. c. 10 Rut 1. c. 28 hist Tri. lib 9. c 12. Theâ—do â— c. â— lib. 4 c. 24. lib 5 howe hath the Councell of Alexandrie troubled that of Calcedonie and the Councell of Antioche that of Ephesus There arose so great trouble in Christendome and it was so denided and was so full of sectes Scismes heresies and humane affections that if men shoulde haue gyuen more place to the fauour of Emperors kinges and princes to the assembles of Popes and Bishops to the authoritie of Councels to the arte and eloquence of Orators to the subtilitie vnderstandyng of Philosophers theÌ„ to the truth it had ben nedefull to haue abrogated cassed vndone and abolished that whiche had ben agreed determined and hollyly confessed for Christe and for the Christian doctrine in the Councels of Nice Millane Sardice Corduba and such like many other Councels whiche were holden after them would haue ouerthroweÌ„ all that euer was determined and agreed vpon in them which had not much lesse apparence then the others Yf they had not so much or more And the matters wherof the differences did growe were of no small importaunce For there was question of the diuinitie of Christ agaynst Hist Tri. li. 2. c. 20. Soz. 3. the Arrians for the whiche the Bishops of the East and Weast did celebrate holde Councels the one against the other the one sorte condemnyng the cause and doctrine of the Arrians the other sorte approuyng and maintaynyng the same ¶ Of the contradiction of the Popes and of their Decrees and Ordinaunces the one sorte contrarie to the other T. THou doest declare vnto me things very vnpleasaunt and offensiue to those that are Christians D. There is yet much more as well of Councels as of Popes whiche will be the presidentes of them For how many Popes haue there bene that haue condempned and abolished that which their predecessors haue established ordained What a noÌ„ber hath there ben of them whiche haue euen as the auncieÌ„t Romaine Emperors did who when they possessed the Empire after the decease of their predecessors did abrogate and make of none effect all that euer their predecessors had established and ordeyned Behold one Pope shall make lawes and shall cause a Councell to be holden for his purpose in the which he will ordaine what so euer shall please him and shall commaunde it vnder payne of excommunication and euerlasting cursing that the same shal be kept and obserued among the Christian people And after him there shal come an other whiche shall abolishe all that and shall do cleane contrarie he shall excommunicate and curse all those that will do that whiche before was commaunded vnder payne of excommunication and dampnation T. Yf it be so the Christian people can not chuse but stand alwayes a cursed D. It is certaine For it is an impossibilitie to obserue and kepe their Decrees and ordinaunces without
steade of that horrible voyce and of the Trompettes and of the thunders whiche dyd shake the heauen and also the earthe whyche made the Mountaynes to tremble and rynge whiche accordyng to the testimonye of Dauid is Psalm xxix of that force that it breaketh and teareth downe the Ceders of Libanus and maketh them to leape lyke Calues and the Mountayne it selfe lyke younge Vnicornes and it maketh the greate floudes of water to come and also to returne and it cutteth a sunder the flames of fyre and launceth them forthe as dartes and maketh the wyldernesses to shake and dothe vnclothe the forrestes and maketh the Mountaynes to breake and the Hyndes to Calue Wee heare that sweete and louynge voyce of the chylde Iesus the Sonne of GOD the true Immanuell Math. 1. 2. Esay vii Luke ii Math. xi by whome we maye lawfullye saye GOD is wyth vs wee heare that amyable voyce whiche saythe Come vnto me all ye that are laden and weeryed and I wyll case you and you shall fynde reste to youre soules Take my yoke vpon you for it is easye and lyght Wee heare that sweete voyce that comforteth all those whyche are poore and myserable whiche come to hym and declareth to all poore and wretched synners the grace Esay 61 Luke 4 Heb. v Mat. 27. and the mercye of GOD and the forgeuynge of synnes whiche prayeth wyth lamentynge and teares for poore synners Yea euen for hys verye ennemyes and is hearde and doth reconcile vs to God It is he that hathe broughte to vs from heauen the resolution of the greate Councell of God to the whiche all the Patriarches Prophetes haue consented and agreed The which he hath confirmed Heb. iii Rom. 3. 5 not only by signes and miracles which were much more excellent then euer were those that were wroughte by the handes of Moyses but also by his deathe by his resurrection and by his ascension and laste of all by the holye Ghost whome he sent to his Apostles and disciples in wonderfull maiestie in the likenes of firy tongues and with a founde from heauen as it had bene of a mightye wynd Mat. 27. 28. Luke 24 â—cte 1. 2. 3. which was sodenly risen but more louyng theÌ„ the fire and whirle windes which were perceaued and sene in the Mount of Synay T. The difference is very great ¶ Of the last seale and of the laste declaration and confirmation of the doctrine of God and of the nature and vertue of the holy Ghost D. IT is he that was the great seale of the whole eternal purpose and Councell of God by whom he declared with greater authoritie theÌ„ euer he did how he did put his church in lawfull ful possession of his holy spirit with signes and testimonies declaring his nature vertue For it is a wind Iohn iii. whose spring and rising none doth know whose being and nature is vnsearcheable who by his power beateth downe all those that resiste him and pourgeth and refresheth the soules and consciences and geueth life comfort and health to all those which geue ouer theÌ„ selues vnto him It is a fire which lighteth which pourgeth which doth warme heate the hartes and the tonges of the chosen of God which proueth the faythful and the vnfaythfull and consumeth al the reprobates wherfore in vayne do the enemies of God conspyre agaynst thys mightie winde in vayne do they kindle their fires and lighten their fornaces to quenche and put out this diuine fyre in vayne doe they holde their Councels to blotte out the decrees of thys eternall Councell of GOD sealed with such a seale For when we haue Iesus Christ the very sonne of God which was sent vnto vs froÌ„ Iohn 1. 6. the bosome of the Father we haue hym that bringeth the true seale and printe and the very marke of God with the which he is signed and allowed of the father to witnes vnto vs that he did sende him vnto vs as he vpon whom we ought onely to dwel And euen as he is allowed by God his father as is that which is allowed by the authoritised signe and seale of a prince so doth he also marke with the seale of his holy spirit al those which are marked with the seale of his eternall election which is sure according to the testimonye ii Tim. ii of Saint Paule And therfore he saith that the Lord dothe know all those that are his and that it is he that doth streng then vs and it is he that hath annoynted vs and marked vs and hath geuen vs in our heartes the earnest of the holy Ghoste for the daye of oure redemption Wherfore euen as the children of God be marked with thys marke and seale euen so can they not denye hym whose sygne and seale they ii Cor. i. Ephe. 1. 4. beare but for their parte also do seale and alowe the truthe of God in receiuing hym which he dyd send with his seale Seyng then that it is so we may not alledge the multitude Iohn 3 to take away the authoritie of that smal companye of sixe score personnes in the which the Apostles were who by the vertue of the holy Ghoste whiche they there receyued haue published the determinations of this great Councell For the truth and the Spirit of God ar bound neither to times places nor persons no not in dede vnto them which do possesse the seate of the very seruauntes of God and doo abuse their office and are gouerned by a contrary Spirite For al be it that the Bishoppes the Priestes the Scribes the Pharises the Councel of Ierusalem did occupye the place of the true seruantes of God and had authority ouer the temple and ouer the people and had all the worldly power and pompe on their syde did brag of the promises of the word of God Yet for all that the holye Ghost did neuer preside in their Councel as he dyd in the Councell of this small companie and their decrees agaynst the truth had not so great power to ouerthrowe it as the decrees of this small companye had to establyshe confirme and aduaunce it and to destroye all lyes and vntruth ¶ Of the examination of the true Christian doctrine and of the spring and laste determination of the same and of the curses agaynst those vvhich do falsefye it D. THese be the decrees of yâ— which it is written in the Prophets The law shall come forth froÌ„ Sion the word Esâ—y ii of God froÌ„ IerusaleÌ„ it is not sayd The law shal come forth froÌ„ that Mount Capitoline or Palatine or AdueÌ„tine or from any other of the seuen which are in Rome but froÌ„ the mount Sion froÌ„ Ierusalem therefore it behoueth vs well to consider whether the doctrine that is set forth vnto vs for Christian be agreable to that law word which came froÌ„ Sion Ierusalem and not to that which came forth from Rome froÌ„ the Mountaines of
goodwil will bestow vpon vs and coÌ„trarely that God by his great goodnes and mercy doth fight agaynst our malice and frowardnes euen as to bestowe of hys graces vpon vs will we nill we and to withdraw vs froÌ„ these bottomles pittes of wickednes into the which we go about to throw our selues most willingly ¶ Of the cause of the fall and â—uyne of mankind and of the remedy and meane hovv to recouer the same D. THat same was the first fountaine and spryng of all the disorders mischiefes that euer entred into the worlde That same was the very pathe that our first parentes tooke That same was the very meane by the which they fell from that hye degree and state of felicitie peace quietnes and ioye in the whiche God had placed theÌ„ in the beginnyng throughe the whiche they haue dampned them selues withall their rase and are fallen into this greate disorder and confusion in the whiche we are euen at this present bycause that we as their proper children folow eueÌ„ the selfe and same councell that they folowed Therfore seyng that we do knowe the cause of the euill why do we not trauayle to finde out the remedies contrary to the same for so much as the euil doth procede of that that we refused to folow the councell and will of God and folowed the councell and persuasioÌ„ of the deuil Let vs now leaue the deuill withall his intisementes and persuasions and let vs enquire at the mouth of God and take councell of him howe to learne to knowe his will and to folow the same and then all disorder and confusion shal be cleane put away and euery thing shal be brought into good order For in dede the onely wil of God and the obedience thereunto belongyng is the mother and nource of al good order It is onely she that doth beget it nourish it and maintayne it and is the onely rule wherwith if you measure all things wel al disorder shal be chauÌ„ged into good order ¶ Of the difficultie that is in men to acknovvledge their errours and faultes and of the argumentes that they hold of auÌ„cient custom and of the authoritie of their predecessors and of auncientie and of the multitude vvherevvith they arme them selues T. I Do like all that whiche thou hast sayde very well but there are very fewe that will take that waye for there are that are so hard harted and obstinate that a man shall not make them beleue that they ar in errour what reason soeuer he bryng agaynst them out of the booke of God nor they will not acknowledge their abuses faultes although they be so filthie and apparent that euery man doth see theÌ„ and that euery man doth handle them These men alledge their predecessours and say that they wil be no wiser nor better then they for they say that they wer honest men and wise ynoughe for to know the wil of God Wherupon they conclude that if those wer dampned they wil be also dampned with them An other sort alledge auncieÌ„t customes and the multitude of men and the continuance of tyme and the auncienti of their order of lyfe ¶ Of the proces that men brynge agaynste God and of the shyftes that they seeke to cloke their rebellion agaynste hyâ— vvorde D. FOr so muche as men wil not be brought to that passe to yelde that obedience vnto God whiche they owe vnto him but will go to the lawe with hym it must nedes come to passe that they searche out some shifte and some starting holes and excuses to giue some shew to their cause Wherefore if we shall gyue them place they will neuer be vnfurnished of shiftes But it is greate follie for them to pleade their cause with God for he must be the iudge and not they wherefore they may well assure them selues that all their reasons and excuses shal be of no greate value before hym when they shal be wayed in the ballances of hys iustice and iudgementes But bycause that men haue bene alwayes accustomed to flatter them selues and that they do so dilighte in their errours that it is a hard matter to bryng them to acknowledge them selues to be so foule and filthie as they are I am well contented that we do examine their fayre discourses and their goodly allegations T. I would be very glad therof ¶ Hovv that al false Religion may be vvel defeÌ„ded if that antiquitie the authoritie of predecessours may haue place D. LEt vs nowe see what foundation that hath whereof you haue nowe spoken There is no errour secte heresie false doctrine nor wickednesse so greate but that it may easely be defeÌ„ded if such reasons mought be allowed For a Iewe a Turcke and a Pagane may well alledge as much T. I confesse the same D. If then these ChristiaÌ„s as they name theÌ„ were Iewes Turkes or Pagans borne they woulde so continue because they were so borne also their predecessours before them T. There is no doubt of it D. These kind of men haue none other reason to main tayne their order and maner of lyfe but onely wilfulnes obstinacie by the which they do right wel declare that they haue not well considered what the Lord sayth by his Prophet Ezechiell Walke not in the wayes of your fathers nor be Ezech. 20 you filed with their Idoles for I am the Lord your God you shall walk in my commaundements see that you swarue neither to the right haÌ„d ne yet to the left haÌ„d It is also writteÌ„ you shal not do as those the ar gone before you neither file Leu. 18 you your selues as they haue done Take hede that you do not according to the custome of the land of Egypt in the which you haue dwelled Nor yet after the custome of the land of Chanaan So the you walke not in their statutes but se the you obserue my ordinaunces that you giue good hede to my coÌ„mauÌ„demeÌ„ts to the end that you may walke in theÌ„ Let vs coÌ„sider also how the spirite of God did blame reproue the auÌ„cieÌ„t 1. Reg â—â— Samaritanes These people did not hearken at all but did liue according to their auÌ„cient custome These people then feared the Lord but yet they serued their Idols notwtstaÌ„ding They folow their auncient custome euen to this very day They do not feare the Lord nor kepe that ceremonies that iudgements the law the coÌ„mauÌ„demeÌ„t that the Lord gaue to the son of Iacob which is surnamed Israell If our predecessours haue walked in the wayes of the Lord we may iustly alledge theÌ„ for God hath coÌ„mauÌ„ded vs to folow such personages not for their own worthynes for they are but meÌ„ as we are not Gods but bycause that they haue followed in the way of the Lord which saith that it is he that is the Lord our God not our fathers For he is the most auÌ„cieÌ„t father that we haue which onely is the father of veritie