Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	ancient_a	church_n	doctrine_n	1,896	5	6.2759	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A01304	A confutation of a popishe, and sclaunderous libelle in forme of an apologie: geuen out into the courte, and spread abrode in diuerse other places of the realme. VVritten by VVilliam Fulke, Bacheler in Diuinitie, and felowe of S. Ihons Colledge in Cambridge.	Fulke, William, 1538-1589.; Feckenham, John de, 1518?-1585, attributed name.	1571 (1571)	STC 11426.2; ESTC S120640	88,715	248

you vse all those Ceremonies that were vsed in the tyme of those doctors whose names you alledge or that al your Ceremonies were vsed in the tymes of those Doctours vpon whose aucthorities you would seme to grounde But to cōsider your groundes particularly that Augustine whom you call saincte Augustine was an vnlearned Monke as appereth by his questions propounded to Pope Gregorie that came into this land to corrupte the sinceritie of faithe whiche the Britons had receiued euen from the Apostles aboute sixe hundred yeres after Christe and liued twoo hundred yeres at the least after the aunciente father sainct Augustine bushoppe of Hippo in Affrica of whose pride and folie you maie reade in Galfridus Monumeth Matheus Westmin and others And truthe it is that muche superstition and false doctrine he brought in and by tyrannie mainteined as our stories witnesse but not all that you holde at this tyme for your religion in all pointes is nothyng so old And as for Beda he liued longe after Augustine But where you affirme that all youre Ceremonies haue been alwaies approued vsed and allowed throughout the vniuersall churche of Christe I can no longer forbeare you you saie more then all the Papistes in the worlde will be able to proue Touchyng sainct Augustine although the place by you alledged is not to be foūd in his vndoubted writyngs yet I confesse that he speaketh fauourably of Ceremonies cōmonly vsed to be quietly suffered and borne withall rather then vnitie to bee broken But what maketh this for your Ceremonies whiche you teache to bee necessarie for saluation and meritorious whiche if thei had been in saincte Augustines tyme or that men had so taught of theim there is no doubte but he would haue vtterly misliked theim as hereafter in place more conueniente I shall plainly declare In your next sentēce out of sainct Augustine also I must néedes tel you you plaie the suttle Marchaunt to sett for the counterfeict ware in steede of true marchandice for Augustine neuer was of that opinion that the Church hath the full aucthoritie of her husbande Christ and such gouernemente of the holy Ghost that she cannot consente but vnto true thynges neither hath he any suche wordes in al his workes For it is well knowen that the boke de dogmaticis ecclesiasticis out of which this sentence séemeth to bee borrowed is not accompted among the Authenticall workes of Augustine but forged of muche later time and falsly fathered vpon S. Augustine to steale credite from his name whiche it could not obtain of it self And yet if this saiyng were graunted to bée true it perteineth nothyng to your church which is the Sinagoge of Sathan and not the Churche of Christe Concernyng your thirde testimonie of sainct Augustine I can hardely thinke that saincte Augustine would haue an vniformitie of Ceremonies in praier and administratiō of the Sacramentes throughout all the worlde because I am able to shewe his aucthoritie to the contrary as in his 118. epistle to Ianuarius he discourseth at large And whereas you saie that the chaunge of the maner of praiyng hath broughte in chaunge of faithe in this lande it is cleane contrary for the diuersitie of faithe teacheth vs to praie otherwise then you vse for inuocation commeth of faithe as witnesseth sainct Paule Roma 10. The testimonie of saincte Ambrose although you declare not where a manne should finde it maketh little for your purpose For we agrée with hym that Schismatikes are to be abhorred but wée will not graunt to you that wée are Schismatikes as long as wée knowe that wée are members of Christe The testimonie of Tertuliane concernyng custome if it bee faithfully rehearsed of you I se not what it maketh for you For although laudable customes maie be obserued without searchyng their beginnyng what is that to your Ceremonies whiche containe manifeste impietie For you your self will not bee so madde to allowe all customes seyng many are contrary to the worde of god And although Tertuliane was to muche addicted to the maintainyng of Ceremonies and customes in some places yet otherwhiles he either expoundeth his meanyng or correcteth his errour as in his booke De virginibus velandis where he writeth in these woordes Hoc exigere veritatem cui nemo praescribere potest non spacium temporum non patrocinia personarum non priuilegium regionum Ex his enim fere consuetudo initium ab aliqua ignorantia vel simplicitate sortita in vsum per successionem corroboratur ita aduersus veritatē vindicatur Sed dominus noster Christus veritatē se nō consuetudinē cognominauit Si semper christus prior omnibus aeque veritas sempiterna antiqua res viderint ergo quibus nouū est quod sibi vetus est Haereses non tam nouitas quam veritas reuincit Quodcūque aduersus veritatem sapit hoc erit haeresis etiam vetus consuetudo That is to saie This the truthe requireth againste whiche no man can prescribe not the continuance of tyme not the defence of persones not the priuiledge of any regions For of these custome takyng her beginnyng for the moste parte through ignoraunce and simplicitie is confirmed into an vsage by succession and so is bosted of against the truthe But Christ our Lorde called hymself the truthe and not the custome if Christ were alwaies and before all truthe is as eternall and aunciente a thyng as he Lette them bee well aduised therefore to whom that is compted new whiche of hym is coumpted old Heresies saieth he not so muche their noueltie as truthe doeth conuict for what soeuer soūdeth against the truthe that shal be an heresie yea though it be an old custome By this testimonie of Tertuliane euery man maie see what he thought of old custome when it was alledged to deface the truthe and of what customes he speaketh when he commendeth customes namely suche as agree with the truthe and not euery blinde superstitious Ceremonie wherof a greate nomber were inuented many hundreth yeres after his death The Papiste The fifte consideration is that wheras I am not perswaded that the forme of praiers set forth in the saide boke is lawful and catholike my comyng to heare it shoulde bee an acte not onely contrarie to mine owne conscience and also to my damnable sinne but also my comyng therto should be to the weake and ignorant an occasion of ruine and deadly sinne which is called scandalum infirmorum and I am bound by the words of our sauiour Christ to auoide that saiyng wo be to that man by whom any suche offence or slaunder shall vprise and come For of my comyng thether either they muste iudge that I am a dissembler in doyng against my cōscience or els they must iudge that I am in cōscience perswaded thereunto And therby gather by mine example a likyng of that thing to be good and holy which in my very conscience I do vtterly condemne and that this slaunder shall not be so taken

we meane by the primitiue Churche I putte you out of doubte that none of vs doeth attribute vnto her suche long limites as you doe in your argumentes gathered out of the Doctours where you alledge the seconde counsaill of Nice as a determination of the primitiue churche whiche was holden almoste eight hūdred yeres after Christe Of whiche thing you were not ignoraunt but you thought it was sufficiente to fill vnlearned eares with greate blastes voide of all reason or truthe Wherefore when wee appeale to the Primitiue Churche wee meane the Churche of the Apostles and their successours so longe as thei continue in the doctrine of the Apostles whereof triall is to be made by the Canonicall writynges of the Apostles That wheras you accuse vs for departyng frō your churche as though we were of no Churche wee defende our selues to be of the true churche seyng wée retaine the faithe and doctrine of the primitiue Churche whiche without all controuersie was the true churche Now as I haue shewed you what we accompte to bee the primitiue churche so muste I declare in what thynges wee are bounde to consente and agree with the same For whiche purpose we must marke this difference whiche I suppose no Papist is so farre paste shame to deny namely that in the primitiue Churche some thynges were necessarie and immutable some thynges againe were temporall and variable Of the firste sorte is the doctrine and Sacramentes of the latter sorte are Ceremonies and politike constitutions To the doctrine no manne maie adde no man maie diminishe no manne maie alter any thyng thereof The Sacramentes beyng as Augustine calleth theim the visible woorde bee of the same nature with the doctrine On the other side Ceremonies and publike constitutions mate bee reteined or chaunged as thei make beste for edificatiō for order and for comelines And of this latter sorte are all those thinges whiche you alledge in which we differ from the primitiue churche But yet so longe as we holde still the same faithe and the same Sacramentes whiche are lefte to vs by the primitiue Churche all reasonable men will iudge that notwithstandyng your reasons wee haue suche agreance with the primitiue Churche as may proue vs to be members of the same For it is the vnitie of faithe and Sacramētes not of Ceremonies and constitutions that ioigneth vs vnto the bodie of Christe as witnesseth sainct Paule to the Ephesi iiij One faithe one baptisme one god c. Now let vs particularly consider your tenne differences The Papiste First it is written howe the beleuers in the Primitiue churche had all thinges in common And no one man did reckon the thing that he did possesse to be his owne or priuate The aunswere Firste it it is a sporte to see howe to make a shewe of a greate multitude of dishes and to fill vp the noumber of tenne you diuide one matter into fower quarters whiche is of the cōmunitie of al thinges that was in the primitiue Churche whiche should haue been serued all in one mease but for fashiōs fake That thei had all thynges common one while in Hierusalem it is very true but that thei had so alwaies and in all places it is most false for saincte Paule exhorteth the Corinthians to giue almose to the poore liberally j. Cor. xvj and he willeth Timothe that he charge thē that be riche in this worlde to be ready to distribute vnto that necessitie of their brethren j. Timoth. vj. which neded not all if all thynges had been common This was therefore a variable order and constitution whiche continued but a shorte tyme neither was it profitable but onely then when the noumber of the disciples was but small in comparison and liued all in one place at Hierusalē The Papiste Seconde in the Primitiue Church suche of the beleuers whiche were possessors of Landes and Houses soulde theym and powred it doune before the Apostles but the beleuers of this oure late reformed Churche are not come to that perfection nor yet are aminded so to doe The aunswere This is all one with the former for how could thei haue had all thynges common if euery man had reteined his houses and landes to his priuate vse And yet no manne was compelled to this communitie for Peter saieth plainlie to Ananias that he neded not to haue sold his land neither to haue brought the price but of his free will. But whereas you accoumpt it a perfection to haue all thynges cōmon I muste bée bolde to tell you ye sauour of Anabaptistrie for although it was then expediente for thal tyme emong a fewe yet it were not tollerable to bee vsed as a pefection emong all the churche of Christ But would bryng a meere confusion and disorder of all thinges beside that it is vnpossible that all Christian men in all places should haue all thynges common The Papiste Thirdly in the primitiue churche Christes Apostles and their successours were chiefe gouernours of the beleuers and of such goods as they had in common amongest theim diuision vnto euery manne was made therof by the appoinctment of the Apostles according as they thought it nedefull or necessarie And because Ananias the husbande of Saphira wente aboute to kepe backe a portion of that comon mony for the which they sould their Landes the Apostle S. Peter did strike theim bothe with sodaine death But in this our reformed Englishe church beside that the beleuers are at no suche appoinctment of the Bishoppes and successors of the Apostles they doe by their lawes spoile theim of all they haue by takyng from them so muche of their temporall landes and so muche of their goods for firste fructes tenthes and subsidies as they liste And therfore in this poinct it hath no agreans with the order of the Primitiue church The aunswere The Apostles kepte not that gouernement long in their handes but committed it ouer to the Deacons as it is declared in the sixte chapiter of the Actes by which it is manifeste that it was no perpetuall order whiche in so shorte tyme was altered For in suche thynges the Churche maie institute and chaunge as often as it shall seme expediente But whereas you charge our Prince to bee a spoiler of the churche by withdrawyng the landes and gooddes thereof by takyng firste fruictes tenthes and subsidies you shewe your self what an honest subiecte your are We for our partes acknowledge that it is in the Princes power to increase or diminishe the stipend of the ecclesiasticall ministers as shal be thought expedient and that it is our dueties to paie all suche taxes tributes and subsidies as by lawfull aucthoritie are laied vpon vs But I meruaile why you should accuse our princes for taking of subsidies as though Popishe princes doe not take subsidies of their Cleargies also and moste of all when the Pope who hath no aucthoritie to demaunde one penie hath extorted suche infinite sommes of money for annates firste fruictes palles pardons and suche other