SOME OF THE PRINCIPLES OF THE QUAKERS Scornfully so called by Men VINDICATED And proved sound and true and according to the SCRIPTURES In opposition to the false Charges and lying Reports given forth against the Truth in two printed Books put forth by one Philip Taverner a supposed Minister of the Gospel in Middlesex near Vxbridge And hereby Truth is manifest and discovered and the Controversie determined by the judgement of Truth between Philip Taverner aforesaid the Accuser and Edw. Burrough Defendant of the Truth who contends for the Faith of the Gospel and for the Word of God in the Heart against all such Gain-sayers as have the form of Godliness but denies the Power and many such are in this Age And this is given forth for the satisfaction of all that desires to know the Truth of the Controversie between them aforesaid By Edw. Burrough LONDON Printed in the Year 1658. Some of the Principles of the QVAKERS scornfully so called by men vindicated and proved sound and true and according to the Scriptures In opposition to the false Charges and lying reports given forth against the Truth in two printed Books put forth by one Philip Taverner a supposed Minister of the Gospel in Middlesex near Vxbridge WHereas Philip Taverner one of Truths Opposers whether through ignorance or subtilty I now determine not hath again appeared against me and Truth in Print as in vindication of himself and his former work who about four months ago gave a false relation of a Dispute but instead of mending the matter he hath made his own cause the more vile as may appear to such who takes a perfect view of the proceedings from the beginning to the end thereof row the intent of this my Reply is to clear the Truth further and to take off hâ—s false aspersions which he hath cast upon my innocent words in my former Book in answer to his first And as for the rest of his Book which hath no relation to mine nor to the Dispute I shall pass it by The Title of my first Book was Something of Truth made manifest c. To which saist thou a plausible title to cover a railing and bitter Spirit under that it may walk in the world less suspected c. Reply My words are truth for in that book truth was made manifest to many in relation to the former dispute to the satisfaction of many and as for rayling and bitterness of spirit I do deny only I am zealous for the Lords truth to speak plainly by reproving them that gain-say it and to that of God in every mans conscience do I desire to be manifest and seeks not by flattering words to cover evil that I may not be suspected though thou seem falsly to say it but let all my enemies suspect what they will for of the Lord do I seek to stand approved and not of man for the Jew inward hath no praise of man but of God and as for rayling language and bitter words against thee I have used none but speaks the truth in plainness The next thing thou seems to stumble at is whereas I said I supposed thou hadst Ambitiously stiled thy selfe Mr. Phillip Taverner and thou now seeks to hide thy self from the force of my words to the sight of the world which appears a little to strike upon thee with some shame And thou saist thou did not prefix Mr. before thy name but the Stationer did it who saist thou was pleased to honour the man with that title c. Reply Now instead of clearing himself he hath shewed more guilt of ambition then before and my words were I supposed and not an absolute charge as he saith and had not I good reason to suppose it that it was his ambition being also contrary to the express command of Christ Mat 23. And indeed I hardly ever read any subscription like to it by the greatest and noblest of men as men account and it is a thing far above humility and not beseeming any man much less one that professes himself to be a Minister of Christ â—o subscribe himself or be with his consent Mr. such an one but he seems to cover himself from ambition because saith he he did it not himself but another I say I shall not charge him here with falsehood but I am sure it is very unusual for any man to add any thing to another mans book without his knowledg I never knew it done by any Stationer who hath had some knowledg of their wayes but yet he acknowledges it was done in honour to him to subscribe him Master and here he hath Justified the thing and shewed that he is indeed guilty of ambition who confesseth that it is an honour to him to be subscribed Mr. by another for he saith the man that did it honoured him with that title and here men may take notice what honour this my adversary looks after even the honor that Christ forbids who saith to his ministers be not ye called of men masters but the man hath honoured Phil. Taverner with titling him Mr. as he saith The next thing treated proves also that he is ambitious for he pleads much the lawfulness of titles of civil respects as he calls it And this is all to justifie the title of master to himself and thereupon hath wrested divers scrâ—ptures what though the unbeleeving Greeks used the word Master or Sir John 12. which he hath quoted is this an example sufficient for Christians to break the command of Christ Mat. 23.10 neither are any other Scriptures a warrant for any man so to do though for a whole page he treats only as for the lawfulness of such titles yet in the end would shut guilt from his own door that he affects not titles For he saith this he speaks not that he would have it so done to him and this his seeming justifying himself proves himself guilty knowing that he had given truly occasion for people to judg he would have it so and in the end would blind the minds of the simple with words of seeming humility that he would not have it so done to him as if he cared not for it And whereas I said in my first that I am without any prejudice towards the man viz. P. T. he saith I must give him leave to question it first from my rayling words against him secondly from my scornful pitty expressed c. saith he Reply I have no prejudice against him God is my witness and he may question what he will who is in the unbâ—lief for its manifest by his former that he questâ—ons where he hath no just occasion shewing much prejudice in himself for he said in his first relation commenting upon some of my words if by such words I meant so then it was truth but if I meant so then it was false and was not this a perfect sign of prejudice in him who had not just occasion to except against the words as they lay nor could
not condemn them but upon giving his own Interpretation of them first whereupon I said in my first answer page 14. Alas poor man must I be judged upon thy own meaning c. and yet in these words I shewed no scornful pitty to him though he faâ—sly suppose it and say it and so while he cannot believe that I am without prejudice against him he hath shewed himself guilty of prejudice towards me and my words to be seen and justly believed by many And whereas he saith it is doubtful how far I own the Authority of the Scriptures because I say in my first we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures have had hope have had hope saith he now it seems because I place my words we have had hope his unbelieving doubtful heart questions whether I own the Authority of Scriptures and would falsly conclude that through the comfort of Scripture we have no hope now and saith he are you now flown so high that you need not c. page 3. and therefore I may now answer further yea through the promise of the Lord declared in Scripture we have hope at this present that God will bring down and overthrow all such that deceives the people who are made Ministers by man and of man at Schools and Colledges and all this set maintenance by Tithes and casting people into Prison and spoyling their goods to maintain Ministers as this day in the nation many hundreds have been cast into prison and many hundred pounds worth of Cattel of bedding and all kind of goods have been distrained for to maintain the Ministry I say we have hope according to the Scriptures that God will bring down all this and your preaching for mony and bargaining with people for so much the year and your preaching what you have studied for from the Scriptures by a glass in a steeple-house where the Mass use to be said God will confound all this and poor people shall be delivered from the mouths of those deceivers that makes a prey upon them and preaches for hire and seeks for their gain from their quarter and these things with many other we hope at this present wherefore think not in thy self we now do not hope for we both do and have had hope through patience and comfort of the Scriptures Whereas I charged P. T. in my last that he had wronged both me and the truth in his Relation c. which he saith in his answer is false and he saith he doth not apprehend me and the truth so well agreed that it is possible to wrong us both ot once c. page the 4. Reply That he wronged me it appears in his not relating all that I said at the dispute the ground of this quarrel not by half and more I know and in relating more then himself spoke by far and let sober men judge whether he did not here worng me in relating a thing that passed between us and relating much more then ever he spoke and much less then I spoke if the truth of that matter were it wrong or right matter and my self also be not by this kind of dealing wronged I appeal to all honest people whilst both he and I am silent so the false dealing and wrong in his first book is upon him still according to my charge unremoved and the lie in this his last book in that he saith I say falsly when I have spoken the truth which is a lie in the highest degree in saying when I spoke the truth that I spoke falsly and his proof in that the truth and I doth not agree is because I said in my first the Saints have no need of Scriptures to teach them but the Spirit of the Father leadeth and teacheth into all truth Reply My words are Justifiable for it is the Spirit that leadeth into all truth Iohn 16. and the Saints need no man to teach them but they have the anointing within them and they know all things by the unction 1 John and the Spirit of the Father is given them by which the Scriptures were given forth and the Lord is the teacher of his people and they need not any to say to them know the Lord Jer. 31. yet they that witness this do not make the Scripture of none effect but owns it in its place yet not as their teacher for then they should deny the new covenant Jer. 31. and then something besides the Spirit leads into truth and they have something to teach them besides the anointing but if this be all the proof that can be given against me that I and the truth doth not agree I doubt not but all spiritual men will see the emptiness and weakness of the witness against me and will be more confirmed rather then shaken that I and the truth doth fully agree though P T. speaks otherwise falsly against me And as if I had contradicted the Apostles words which he quotes against me who saith whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning which Scripture I do own and no way contradict it s the Error of his Judgement which so judgeth for even they for whom the things that were written were for their learning yet they were led into all truth by the teachings of the Spirit and they were taught of the Fathet and what was written to them was not written because they knew not truth or to teach them truth 1 John 2.21 let him learn what this means The next thing he notes whereas I said I then proved at the dispute meaning by many Scriptures that some were perfect in this life 1 Cor. 2.5 even perfect without sin Iohn 1.47 1 Joh. 3.7 and to gain say this he hath brought â—John 1.8 If we say we have no sin we deceive our selves and the truth is not in us and saith he who speaks truth in this E. B. or the Apostle as if I had spoken contrary to the Apostle Solomon also saith he teâ—s us there is not a just man upon earth that doth good and sinneth not which also he brings as a witness against what I have affirmed Reply It s true I held forth a state of perfection to be waited for and attained unto upon earth and I am not ashamed of my principle neither is it found too light for that Scripture 1 Cor. 2.5 doth testify that some were perfect upon earth in the dayes of the Apostles and if they were so the same is to be waited for and witnessed in this age for the hand of the Lord is not shortned and that Scripture 1 John 3. whosoever abideth in him sinneth not and whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin ver. 6.9 doth clearly manifest there is a state upon earth free from sin wherein power is received and felt over all temptations and over the devill even such an estate that the wicked one cannot touch such that are born of God and this was the thing I held forth and do vindicate against
fear to conclude so evil against me as he did not proving the contrary to what I said and in that I did charge darkness and blindness upon him so I do and may still till he repent for doth he not accuse me falsly in many things as in saying my principles are too light c. but proves not particularly his charge and in his first book accused us as if we had a Pope in our bellies which words are both lies and scornful and are not these things true signs that he is in darkness and blindness and so my charge is not false upon him Then he saith he will not judge E. B. hastily c. Answer hath not thou falsly judged me already in many things as I have shewed yea and the Lord in time may let thee see thy judgment is false and awaken thy conscience to repentance and then shalt thou confess I have done thee no wrong but the wrong dealing lyes at thy door so that by what is said the title of thy book is a lie and utterly false which is some principles of Edw Burroughs called a Quaker examined and sound too light Reply Now in this I shall not be judge altogehâ—er in my own cause but leave this to the view of sober men and require their judgement when they have read this soberly over what one particular instanced by him is proved to be unsound or too light for according to the testimony of the holy men of God in Scripture thereby may I confirm the truth of what I have and do hold forth and to every mans conscience do commend my self to be approved in the sight of God and good report or bad report of men I regard not but treads over them both and wherein the truth is wronged I am bound to give my evidence for it and against its opposers and that is the very end of this my present work to contend for the truth and not for mastery though truth doth give me mastery over deceit and to hold forth the same faith light and truth which the Apostles witnessed before the Appostacy which hath been clouded in all this dark night of Appostacy which hath been over the world for many ages since the man child was cought up to God and the woman fled into the Wilderness spoken of in the Revelations but now the light is made manifest and the glory of the Lord is revealing and the day is dawned and the night is over to many and the subversion of this Ministery now in England is clearly seen from what the Ministery of Christ was in the dayes of the Apostles And now as concerning this controversie between Phill. Taverner and my self who ever is not satisfied herewith but desires a full and true account of the matter may peruse his first book called the Quakers Rounds c. with my first answer called something of truth made manifest in opposition to a false account c. And then his second book called some principles of Edw. Burroughs c. and then this my last let them be all read in order and soberly by such as are not satisfied about the matter and I doubt not but thereby you may be resolved who is in the truth and who is in the error and they may see that my last book he hath not faithfully answered but passed by many material particulars and in something hath no way seemed to clear himself of what I have truly charged upon him but he remains under the guilt of my charge and to the sight of Christ in every mans conscience and to all whose judgements are thereby guided I do refer my selfe to be judged and what I have written I leave to be judged And divers other things there are held forth hy Phill. Taverner which I have said little to but they are recorded as his principles among a great number of the Priests and professors in a book answered to go a broad called the Priests and professors principles and the Quakers answer to them whereby all that desires further to be satisfied may in reading many hundreds of particulars sayings and affirmations of doctrine held forth by preaching and print by the Priests which are answered and the errour of them shown to which I refer my reader to know more if what I have here written be not enough for the manifestation of truth is my crown and life over all the world London 20 of the seventh month 1658. FINIS
not perceive the things of God nor know them yet this is not contrary to what I say that Christ Jesus lighteth every man that comes in the world which light Christ is sufficient and he changeth men from Natural to spiritual as they are brought to beleeve in Christ that hath lightned them and he opposes me as if I should say or hold forth that the Natural man perceives and knows the things of God and that the natural man hath faith which I never spoke nor entered into my mind to say so he hath drawn his evill consequence from my words and then confounded his own Conception but my words remains untouched for my saying and intent is that Christ lighteth every man that comes into the world and his light is sufficient to give faith and to change a man from natural to spiritural and to give him the perceiving and knowledge of the things of God and of his spirit and my words nor intent is no contradiction to the Apostles words though P. T. falsly judged so for want of better understanding I suppose rather than through subtilty at this turn and thus my principle is proved sound and the title of his book a lie And whereas I said that Christ wrought righteousness perfectly without us and also fulfils righteousness in all that believes and no man is justified by one of these without the other or that hath not the other pag. 12. of my first He saith whether I do not confound justification and sanctification he leaves all rational men to judge c. Reply That Christ wrought righteousness without us is not denied by him nor that he fulfils the righteousness of the Law in the Saints he cannot well deny let him read Rom 8.4 and that no man is justified by the righteousness that Christ wrought without who beleeves not nor is converted to God but in the power of Satan this all the Children of God beleeves and knowes that none are justified by Christs righteousness without but who are converted to God and hath received Christ and he is in them for else they are reprobates and not justified and so I am not ashamed of my principle though he would slander it to be too light for he that hath not Christ Gods righteousness within him is a reprobate and not justified by any righteousness without neither do I confound justification and sanctification which he falsly charges me with for they are one in Christ for he is made unto us sanctification and justification and the man that is in the pollutions of the world unsanctified is not justified but condemned so none are justisted by a righteousness without them but them that are sanctified by him within this I own and do not deny and men that are in the save corrupt reason with him must not I be judged by and also I do justifie if any work be wrought by us in the strength and power of grace and not in our own strength then it is the work of Christ in us the work of Gods own righteousness and that no work or word is justified but what the spirit of Christ leads unto and though P. T. ignorantly commenteth upon these words yet are they words of truth and righteousness and all that he saies against them proves not the contrary And whereas I did ask him which he had ignorantly affirmed in his Relation VVhether that righteousness which Christ works in us in his strength and power and not in our own is called our righteousness which he seems to answer but he hath mis-understood my words for I meant not Ours by enjoyment but Ours in the sence the Prophet speaks when he said our Righteousness is as filthy Raggs I know the Righteousness that Christ works in us by his Spirit and the power of his Grace is Ours by enjoyment in the second Adam as the gift of God to us but not Ours in the first Adam in the righteousness of the Law in the state not converted and that was the strength of my Query where that Righteousness wrought in us by the Spirit and strength of Christ and not in our own is called our Righteousness ours as in the first Adam but I see thou hast not understood the meaning of my Query for weakness of understanding and then how should thou rightly answer it Also I Queried How Christ working Righteousness in us by the power of grace not by our own strength can be called the righteousness of the Law which he had affirmed now I meant the righteousness of the Law in the flesh and not in the Spirit I know the working of Christ both in us to will and to do by his Spirit and strength and power of Grace is the fulfilling the righteousness of the Law by Christ in us but it is not the righteousness of the Law in the flesh wrought by us as unborn again but to this thou hast not answered but hast answered thy own conceiving and not the innocency of my Queries And whereas he stumbles and is offended because I said No man is justified in any word or work but what they are lead unto by the Spirit and those words and works the Spirit leads unto are justified and no other words or works and from this he would falsely conjecture I hold a justification by works and by something without or besides that which Christ wrought without I say no by the deeds of the Law shall no flesh living be justified but yet he that moveth and leadeth into words and works of Truth and Righteousness the same doth justifie the Creature in the words and works which he is lead unto and this is not in opposition to the Apostles words which he seems to bring against me Rom. 5.8 9. Whiles we were sinners Christ dyed for us much more being justified by his blood we shall be saved from the wrath this is not contrary to what I say for we do own the blood of Jesus to justifie but yet not such who are not cleansed by it and lead by the Spirit into all truth but it is they that are justified only who are lead into all Truth by the Spirit such are justified by his blood in the Spirit and saved from wrath who are born of the immortal Word but they that remain in sin are not justified nor saved from wrath Then he Queries VVhether I shut pardon of sin out of doors I answer no for they that are lead into all Truth by the Spirit their sins are pardoned and forgiven and remembred no more but blotted out and cannot be read for they are cleansed from it and commits not sin then he asks VVhether I grant two formal causes of Iustification the one forgiveness of sin the other inherent righteousness I say both the cause and the work of Righteousness is in God his free love and mercy which is over all his works and they receive the work of it and the gift of it that are lead by the Spirit as the effect
I refer the Reader to understand more of P. T. his folly and the manifestation of truth And wheeras he again charged the Quakers with a Spirit of jeering and scorns and jeers are not a fruit of the Spirit saith he c. Reply He here again charges falsly for we know that Scorning and jeers after the flesh are not works of the Spirit nor fruits of it but that we have denyed and it s cast out neither do we scorn or jeer any saving as in Isa. 37.22 Then he no less then confesses his wrong dealing who in his last changed R. G. word from called to owned which word is of much consequence in that place but would cover R. G. by saying that R. G. did not undertake to prove the Scriptures considered as meer writings but the thing contained in the Scriptures to be the word of God c. Reply Here P. T. hath endeavoured to mend the matter by his conception and meaning given to R. G. words now the words of R. Goodgroom was he said he would prove the letter the word and upon that brought his Argument and is not the letter meer writings and nothing else but when they see they cannot make good their own words then they turn of the strength of reproof by they meant so or they meant so and no man ever yet could or can prove in all the Scriptures that the letter the writings are called the word but as I still confessed that which is written of is the word and the writings are the words that declares of the word which was in the beginning but P. T. would fain reconcile this difference between us say they the writings the letter are the word say I that which is written of is the word now betwixt these are great difference as spiritual men may judge as much as between a dead Trumpet and a liveing breath sounded through it nay its hard to reconcile that which is contrary in nature they must leave preaching for money and cease to take Tythes and gifts for preaching before I can be at unity and another birth must speak and live in them and that which now lives in them must be slain and their Crown laid down before reconciled I can be to them or they to me though I have no envy against persons more then the Saints had with them that opposed the truth nor no weapon shall I use against them saving that that is Spiritual and the sword that goes out of the Lambs mouth and all the many Scriptures which he quotes pâ— 23. doth neither say nor signifie that the letter the writings are the word or so called though Moses Deut. 5.5 said he would shew them the word of the Lord did he then shew them the letter the writings the Scripture I say no therefore he did not call the writings and the letter the word of God as you affirmed and seeks now to prove but thou perverts Scripture and proves nothing to purpose and though many times the word of the Lord came to such a Prophet and such a Prophet as thou hast proved in Hosea Ioel and others yet did the writings and the letter come to them or that which the letter and writings declares of let wise men judge that nor all thou canst say doth prove that the writings the letter is the word of God or that ever any of the holy men of God called them so so that till better proof be given which I never expect I need not revoke any thing that I have said contrary viz. that the letter and writings are the word or by the holy men of God so called but still I say the writings and letter are not the word but the thing written of is the word of God that lives for ever Then in that I charged R. Goodgroom with saying when I had my Bible in my hand at the dispute I had the thing signified in my hand said he which thing P. T. in his first relation had much falcified but now he seems to acknowledg the thing and excuses it by supposing it was a slip of his tongue the highest matter of offence in it as for the words not only my self but divers others do well remember them spoken by R. G. thy fellow disputant and had he or you then confessed a slip of the tongue it had gone no further but in that thou in thy first relation gave a wrong account thereof and had laid down the thing quite otherwise then he spoke it this made the matter more a transgression and thy account to be false neither am I ready to catch words from the mouth of my apponent as thou charges me but that charge is justified against me and the truth I must needs make use of it to shew the folly of such men that will so do even out of their own mouths often and by their own words to confound them and would thou have me to give away a just cause through nâ—glect of hearing and taking notice of such foul words as to say I had the thing in my hand that was signified of in the Bible when I had the Bible in my hand and so set deceit a top on me for want of repoving evil I am otherwise taught do thou judge what thou wilâ— and herein my principles are found to agree with the Scriptures for it saith a man shall be justified by his words and by his words shall he be condemned And as for my answers to his queries raised from some words of mine written in a book called the Standard c. my answer saist thou is little else then asserting the same thing over again c. now I say its needless here to transcribe the Queries and answers over again but let them be looked in my first booke Iled something of truth made manifest c where it may be seen that my answers are sufficient and laid down to the satisfaction of all reasonable men that desires to be resolved though thou say there is as little evidence of truth in the last as in the first but doth not at all discover the falsness of them in any particular which had been right for thee to have done and not to have charged evil in general upon my answers and prove nothing but who will believe him except such as takes his words for an oracle for them that have received the good undestanding cannot believe him Then in the conclusion he charges me with harsh kind of censoriousness because I said what can be in the heart of such a man that can draw so bad consequence from such upright words when in his former he had concluded that I held forth giddy doctrine and weakned the authority of Scriptures to beget undervaluing thoughts of them and such like because I had affirmed the truth in saying the divel and Pharoah spoke something that 's written in Scripture and had I not reason to question what is in his heart who had the boldness without
accuseth some of Englands Ministers to be VVolves in Sheeps cloathing himself is found also guilty except I say he can make appear a perfect difference between his Call Practice and Maintenance and theirs which he is never able to do or to justifie that he is not of the same nature and by the same Spirit but contrary to theirs that he accuses and fears to be VVolves in Sheeps cloathing and I have as much ground to suspect him to be one of the Wolves in Sheeps cloathing as he hath ground to suspect his own companions and Generation to be such and in that he saith some of the Quakers have been found guilty of Blasphemy and that some of them are found vain light persons or heady and high minded he doth here secretly charge and prove nothing for Blasphemy we are come out of and have denied all lightness after the flesh and high-mindedness and if any such come among us they are denied and are not of us till they be converted to God and turned from all evill but this his secret charge against others is but that himself may seem clear then he asks Are all guilty of preaching for Hire and divining for money c. and he bids me not condemn the generation of the righteous and then confesses they take that which the State allows or that which they have given by persons and justifies it and saith he it is not a preaching for hire c. page 19 of his last Reply All that I charge to be guilty are so for I charge not the guiltless but ask the country people ask them how many of their teachers are clear and hath not money Tyths or other things for preaching and I have taken heed of condemning the righteous and yet dare not let the guilty go unjudged and unreproved and therefore them I do reprove and now in the end he hath justified preaching for hire though he in the same page seemed to deny it but whether is that a maintenance according to Gospel ministery as practised in the dayes of Christ and his Apostles or whether that comes not under the account of preaching for hire in taking gifts of the State and gifts of persons which thou justifies no such maintenance did Christ alow to his ministers as to take sums of money yearly for preaching nor such things never were justified by Christ but into whatsoever house you enter eat such things as are set before you saith Christ and that is Balaams practices to take gifts of the State or of great men for he would have taken the gift of Balaac so by their own account the best sort of Englands teachers for some of them thou pleads not for goes for gifts and rewards as the false brethren did in the daies of the Apostle for though you would seem to clear them of preaching for hire yet hast thou proved them guilty of preaching for gifts and rewards and is not their taking gifts from the State and persons which thou justifies a perfect preaching for gifts and rewards as ever the false brethren which the true Apostls declared against and so out of thy own mouth they are proved such even the best of them which thou vindicates as goes in Balaams way preaching for gifts and rewards and is it not time now for people to cease from you who are found by thy own confession in Balaams way and the way of the false Apostles preaching for gifts and rewards from persons and from the State and so out of thy own mouth I am justified and your selves condemned Then whereas I said who are dumb Shepheards which do not gather you to God c. And he saith there are many who lift up their voyce as a Trumpet to tell people of their sins c. Reply It appears true through all the nation that people are not gathered to God for doth not wickedness a bound and people shew forth an unconverted state and what though many may out of Hypocrisie and for ends to themselves cry against sin in others and live themselves in the same people hereby is not profiâ—ed at all for such as have run and not been sent doth not profit the people for while themselves live in that which they cry against in others the power of the Lord is not with them to convert sinners but for a better discovery of the teachers of this generation I refer the Reader to a book called A just and lawful tryal of the Teachers c. wherein they are set forth what they are at large The next thing he hath observed is where I charged him in my last to have given a relation of much more than he spake said I I believe four times as much and much less then I spake at that dispute at this he seems to be offended yet confesseth himself guilty but not guilty so much as four times well but many that were there present who have not forgotten the matter may truly seal to my charge in this particular he seems not to clear himself at all but is forced to confess himself guilty by silence that he related not so much by far as I spoke and yet called his relation a faithful account but was thereby proved unfaithful though now he would seem to cover himself and blame me for charging him too deeply but my words remains true upon him that his former work was neither perfect nor altogether honest and in this he hath no whit amended it but the rather made his weakness more manifest as the honest reader may judge Then whereas I charged him with a vain light scornful Spirit because his first book he called the Quakers Rounds and he would excuse himself from my charge saies that it was a name according to the nature c. Reply My charge on him was true for his title did savour of a scornful spirit for the name Quakers was given in scorn and derision and he to that end do use it and as for going rounds of which he speaks himself is the most guilty as before I have shewed in denying a thing and then confessing it And whereas I charged that his former was not a faithful account though he called it so I proved my charge which he is not able to remove that it was an unequal and false account by relating much more then himself spoke and much less then I spoke and this he confesses still and that I am sure made it a false account and untrue and he clears not himself of it though he say Christ spoke many things at several times which are not particularly related yet Lukes relation and Iohns relation was true c. Riply Their relation was true in that wherein they took in hand to relate they did relate truly but he hath tâ—ken in hand to relate that which he hath not done truly as in my first I did make appear as may be seen it s called something of truth made manifest c. to which