Gentiles converted to the Faith The Argument is clear and undenyable GOD the Searcher of hearts hath born witnesse to the Gentiles by giving to them the Holy Ghost as well as to the Circumcised Jews and without putting difference purifying their hearts through faith in JESUS CHRIST Preached by the Gospel alone without Circumcision and other Ceremoniall Performances Therefore it is his will that Circumcision c. bee not imposed upon them as not being necessary to Justification and Salvation This is the plaine and sole intention and drift of that Passage of Scripture But sure I am 't is to little or no purpose for Mr. Lockiers purpose For howsoever it be true that 't is clear from this Text that there was a work of effectuall saving grace amongst these Gentiles spoken of and I do agree with him this far that it were dangerous yea most clearly false and contradictory to the words of the Text to affirm that these expressions might not mean effectuall saving grace yet I say first that the Apostle Peter was not here speaking of this work of saving grace as the necessary qualification for constituting persons capable of Visible Church-membership 2. Albeit in these expressions spoken of the Gentiles there be not definitely a restriction to some only as M◠Lockier would seem to insinuate that we say yet the expressions are such as may be verified being understood of some only and not of all and every one because they are indefinitè Any Boy that hes learned the Rudiments of Logick knowes that there are enunciations particular which speaks of some of a kind definitely and enunciations universall which speaks of all and every one of a kind definitely and enunciations indefinitè which in their form speaks neither of some only nor of all and every one of a kind definitely but indefinitely of the kind and that such indefinite enunciations may be truely exponed either particularly of some only or universally of all and every one proratione materiae contingentis vel necessariae according as the nature of the things contingent or necessary leadeth us But now will the Author upon serious deliberation say that which he hes uttered here viz. that what the Apostle speaketh in the Text of the Gentiles indefinitly viz. that God had purified their hearts by believing must be understood universally of all and every one of them that were turned to Christianitie Nay I know he 'll salve the matter with his qualification according to what Christian can discern of Christian and so far as men c. But 1. This is an addition to the Text whereof there is not the least insinuation in the Text. 2. Yea the Text speaks clearly of such a purifying of hearts as is in veritate rei seu objecti i. e. indeed because it speaks of it in relation to the knowledge and Judgement of GOD the searcher of hearts whose Judgement is alwayes according to Truth But men esteemed to have hearts purified in the charitative judgement of men let them be the most discerning men may notwithstanding not have purifyed hearts indeed section 14 The Author having done with what we have hitherto been considering concludes and draws towards the Proposal of his Doctrine thus Having thus painfully and plainly laid the foundation by the Word and by a simple and sincere judgment thereupon without the least respect to any party or self-interest in the world as he knoweth to whom in this as in all my wayes I desire humbly to refer my self I build thereupon this doctrine c. pag. 7. To which It may be humbly conceived that the Author might have spared to speak of his painfulnesse and plainnesse c. and suffered the deed to speak alone for it self and other men to judge thereupon remembring that Let another man praise thee and not thine own mouth But to passe this grant that there has been some painfulnesse in the preceeding Discourse yet if therein there has been plainly or at all by the Word of God a foundation laid for the ensuing Doctrine I submit to be judged by any impartiall discerning man upon consideration of what hath been answered Thus I have done with the first Section wherein if I have been somewhat large yet I desire and hope the Reader will pardon it considering that the Discourse I have been examining is laid down as the foundation of the Doctrine following and that besides the Text sundry other Scriptures brought in to make the Text speak for it were to be considered SECTION II. Mr. Lockyers Doctrine pondered and the State of the Controversie between Us and the INDEPENDENT BRETHREN touching the necessary Qualification of Members of the VISIBLE CHURCH cleared section 1 MR. Lockiers determination touching the matter of a Visible Church is pag. 7. fine and pag. 8. propounded in these words The proper and allowed matter of a Visible Church now in the dayes of the Gospel is persons truly converted such as God who knoweth the hearts of all men can bear witnesse of as indeed sealed for his by his Holy Spirit thus far he hath in a different Character and then addeth it would seem by way of some explication I say this is the matter we ought now to take to raise again the Tabernacle of David and none other not one other no not in a whole Church so far as men truly converted and very spirituall are able to discern and judge section 2 First I desire humbly to know of the Author why he restricteth this Doctrine touching this point to the Visible Church now in the dayes of the Gospel For 1 I had ever thought it the received Doctrine of all Orthodox Reformed Divines that the Churches of the Old and of the New Test are of one and the same nature as to essentials and that the difference between them standeth in accidentals only 2. Why do many of his way-bring Arguments for this his Tenet touching the allowed matter of a Visible Church from Passages of the Old Test spoken in relation to the then Church 3. If the Visible Church in the dayes of the Old Test might have consisted of others as allowed matter then are described here which his restriction insinuateth i. e. of persons not truly converted c. then to borrow his Arguments brought afterward 1. Either Christ was not the Rock and foundation of that Church and that Church not a building being and bearing upon him as a superstruction or else then there might have been no Symmetrie but Antilogie and Antistasie no agreement but a fighting of the materials of the building with the foundation and one with another and yet the building might stand well enough such incongruous superstructions and unsuiteable to the foundation were good enough then 2. Either that Church was not the Church of the living God such as in which God lives dwels and walks or then God did live and dwell in dead persons who only make a Profession of Religion and then either the Church was
to a member of another Congregation as Mr. Hooker ingenuously acknowledges Surv. Part. 2. admission and ejection of members should only be into and from a particular Congregation A child should be Baptized into a particular Congregation only and not into the Universall Church And one Excommunicated cast out only of a particular Congregation because the power extends no further Way is made to let in all errours and heresies and as many Religions as there are particular Congregations and none can hinder it in an Ecclesiastick way and many more absurdities should follow as Learned and Godly men have judiciously observed Contrair to those Assertions is my second Part imployed for vindication of the true way of Government which Christ has instituted in his Word and in great mercy set up in this Church to wit by his Ministers and Officers not Lording over the people of God in a Papall or Prelaticall way as this Author either mistakes or calumniats but Ministerially under Christ the only Lord of his Church Ruling them according to the Rule of his Word in a way of rationall obedience And that in a way of communion and association of Churches and subordination of lesser associations unto greater and larger as the Lord grants by his providence conveniency On this I have not insisted so largly as the matter it self might afforded occasion of discourse Because it has been by learned and reverend men already so fully debated the proofs of the truth so clearly made out and all contrary Objections so abundantly discussed and satisfied that I had little or nothing to adde Yet I trust I have through the Lords help in some measure discovered the insufficiency and invalidity of what is brought by this Author who I wonder much should have adventured to present the world with such a discourse upon the mater after so learned labours of others as are extant upon the same I have also in two Appendices taken into consideration what is said upon these same points by some in Aberdene lately turned aside from the truth in a Letter of theirs directed to some Godly men in the South May 1652. The reasons moving me hereto were 1. Because of their correspondence with Mr. Lockiers Peece and it seemeth they have been in a manner his proselytes Then having some time had more particular and intimat acquaintance with some of them it would be to me mater of much rejoicing in the Lord if I could be instrumentall to discover to them the we knesse of the grounds whereupon they have fallen from their stedfastnesse that so if possible which I wish from my heart they might be moved to remember whence they have fallen to repent and to do their first works And finally tâ—… what ever should be the effect as to them the irrelevancy 〈◊〉 the causes of their departure being laid open others might see no cause why any should be shaken with their fall And blessed be God there are not yet many in this Land that have followed them in this What may be afterward the Lord who sees the thoughts of mens hearts afar off knoweth Times indeed are sifting And the ignorance of many the base earthly time serving minds of others unadvised principles in some who may be sees not yet the far end of their consequences may prove an advantage to seducements produce more defection from the profession of the truth if temptations continue then as yet we have seen But let temptations and trialls be what they will the Cause of Christ even that part of it which I stand for here the order Government of this Church which he has appointed in his Word and thereby made known to this Church shal stand firm It has been a cup of trembling to all that have hitherto laid siege against it and a burdensome stone to all that have at any time burdened themselves wâ—…h it to cut them in pieces it will yet prove so to all who will adventure to do the like And turn their back upon it who will Christ will not want his witnesses to bear witness unto it Even if need be by not loving their lives unto the death And O but that man might count himself highly favoured of God whom he should honour with that dignity as that eminent servant of Jesus Christ Mr. Welsch spoke in relation to himself of suffering for some branches of the same cause wâ—…ged in his time But having detained your Lordship too 〈◊〉 I present this testimony I have given to it according to my weak measure to you commending it not only to your favourable acceptance but also to your judicious censure and your self unto the Grace of God who has called you unto the uâ—…ained love of the truth and is able to preserve you therein â—…lameable unto the end I am Your Lordsâ—… most humble Servant in the Lord James Wood. AN ADVERTISEMENT TO THE READER ALbeit it hath pleased Mr. Lockier to prefixe unto his Book two Epistles of his own and a third of three of his friends containing many sharp invectives against this Church and strange Commentaries upon the Lords dispensations toward us as striking against our Church constitution and Government Yet I shall not detain the Reader with scanning of the same being confident that upon the clearing and vindicating of the truth in the following Treatise these discourses will be found by the Godly and Judicious to be not only bitter against Brethren in affliction proving them to be Physitians of no value but injurious to God and his Truth in ascribing our calamities to our adhering thereto and judging of the truth of our Religion by the Lords outward dispensations toward us An Index of the Sections PART I. Concerning the Mater of the Visible Kirk SECT I. MR. Lockier his Analysis and explication of the Text Act. 15. 3. for laying a ground to his Doctrine concerning the Mater of the Visible Kirk considered p. 1. SECT II. His Doctrine pondered and the state of the controversie between us and the Independent Brethren touching the necessary qualification of Members of the Visible Kirk cleared p. 16. SECT III. His first Classe of Arguments from Act. 9. 26. and 2. 47. and Heb. 3. 5 6. brought as directly holding forth his Doctrine Answered p. 31. SECT IV. The Authors Texts which he calls hints and shadows of his Doctrine p. 40. SECT V. Examination of the proof of his Doctrine by induction p. 56 SECT VI. ExaminatioÌ„ of his proofs brought under the name of reason p. 83 SECT VII A short modest reply to the bitter use he maketh of his Doctrine p. 102. SECT VIII The Objections he maketh to himself and his Answers thereto considered p. 107. SECT IX Some Arguments confirming our Doctrine and everting the adverse opinion about the necessary qualification of Members of the Visible Kirk p. 127. APPEND Wherein is Examined so muc◠〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that Letter written by these of Aberdene who lately have sepâ—…ted from this Kirk upon the
1 2 8 9. Mr. Cottons way cap. 3. sect 2. pag. 54 55. sect 3. pag. 56 57 58. So in a word their Doctrine in this point is that none are to be received members into externall fellowship of the Visible Church but such as are already true heart-converts indued with saving grace and having reall internall fellowship with Christ in the judgement of charity grounded upon such triall and evidences as we have heard section 15 As for our judgement in the controversie I mean of the Church of Scotland at which the adversaries especially this with whom we have to do mainly hath an eye Albeit we know no Protestant Church in the world differing from us in this but the Independents scarcely shall you find any of our adversaries directly make a proposall of it what it is but for the most part as they give intimations thereof here and there would bear men in hand that we do allow any whosoever professe the Christian faith although their lives and conversations were never so wicked and prophane to be fit matter and members of the Visible Church Which is I must say much want of ingenuitie in them and great injurie done to us as will appear shortly So Mr. Lockier along this Peece intimating our Doctrine speaks alwayes of persons meerly professing the things of God But I wonder much how that did fall from the Pen of Reverend Mr. Hooker speaking of our judgement Surv. p. 1. c. 2. pag. 20. The pinch of the difference lyeth in this whether such as walk in a way of prophanenesse or remain pertinaciously obstinate in some wickednesse though otherwayes professing and practising the things of the Gospel have any allowance from Christ or may be accounted fit mater to constitute a Church this is that which is controverted and should have been evicted by Argument he is speaking to Mr. Rutherfurd Good Mr. Hooker where did you ever read such an assertion as this in Mr. Rutherfurd or any of ours I need not stay upon vindicating Mr. Rutherfurd in this he will do it ere long himself I shall only plainly propound our Judgment upon the Question in these two Conclusions section 16 1. Conclus True heart conversion regeneration sanctificatiâ—… inward saving grace in reality of existence or conceived at 〈…〉 to be in the judgement of charitie is not requisite as the qualification necessary in the Ecclesiastick Court in order to admitting persons to be members of the Visible Church Or thus to the same purpose it is not necessary nor requisite to the effect that persons be accounted fit mater of the Visible Church that they be such as upon tryall and approven evidences may and ought to be conceived in the judgement of charity by the Church already inwardly regenerate sanctified taken into reall fellowship with Christ And therefore we judge it altogether unwarrantable to put such as are desirous of the externall fellowship of the Visible Church to such tryalls touching the work of saving grace in their hearts in order to admitting into Church-fellowship and as antecedently necessary thereunto as is tanght and practised by Independents and set down summarly here a little before section 17 2. Conclus A serious sober outward profession of the faith and true Christian Religion together with a serious profession of forsaking former sinfull courses if the person be one coming out of heathenisme or some false Religion or an outward conversation free of scandall at least accompanied with obstinacy if he hath been a Christian in Profession before and a serious Profession of subjection unto the Ordinances of Christ A serious profession of these things I say as such considered abstractly abstractione simplici from the work of inward saving grace and heart-conversion by true Repentance and Faith is sufficient qualification in the Ecclesiastick Court to constitute a person fit mater to be received as a member of the Visible Church and accounted 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 i. e. amongst these that are within If it be asked what I mean by a serious profession I Ans Such a profession as hath in it at least a morall sincerity as practick Divines are wont to distinguish tho haply not alwayes a supernaturall sinceritie i. e. that I may speak more plainly which is not openly and discernably simulate histrionick scenicall and hypocriticall in that hypocrisie which is grosse but all circumstances being considered by which ingenuity is estimate amongst men giving credit one to another there appears no reason why the man may not and ought not to be esteemed as to the mater to think and purpose as he speaketh from whatsoever habituall principle it proceedeth whether viz. of saving grace and faith or of faith historicall and conviction wroâ—… by some common operation of the Spirit A man that hath such a profession as this and desireth Church-communion I say the Church ought to receive him as a member And albeit I deny not but where there is just or probable ground of suspition that the profession hath simulation and fraudulent dealing under it as in one new come from a hereticall Reâ—igion or who has been before a persecutor of the faith and professours thereof there may be a delay in prudencie and time taken to try and prove if he dealeth seriously and ingenuously but that tryall must not be to cognosce upon the truth of the work of saving grace in the heart Pastours indeed ought wisely and diligently try and acquaint themselves as far as they can with the spirituall state of all the members of their flock that they may the better know to divide the Word of God aright giving to every one their suitable portion that beginners may be promoved in the grace of Christ and such as are yet in a naturall state may be awakened to slee from the wrath to come But I utterly deny that such a tryall of persons touching the truth of the work of grace in their hearts is antecedently and in order to their admission necessary and in duty incumbent to the Church that is to admit them section 18 Having thus stated the Question and bounded the differences about it it would follow that we should in the next place bring Arguments to confirm what we hold for truth and to refute the contrary Which method we would have followed were we not upon the examination of a particular Peece of an adversary whose method we resolve to trace step for step Therefore proceeds now to consider his Arguments what force they have to confirm his or infringe our Doctrine Afterward having considered what Objections he brings against himself as ours and his answers to the same we shall adde some such other Arguments as may be satisfactory to Readers and the Author may if he think fit take to his consideration SECTION III. Mr. Lockyers first Classe of Arguments viz. Texts of SCRIPTURE Act. 9. 26. Act. 2. 47. Heb. 3. 5 6. brought as directly holding forth his Doctrine answered section 1 HIs Arguments are of four
but in his immediatly preceeding words he has done that the decrees of this Synod were binding only materially as matters revealed in the Scripture and not formally can withall Answer this Question affirmatively that this Synod had an authoritative power as such an Ordinance as a Synod Erit mihi magnus Apollo nay I shall say Mr. Lockier can make contradictories agree well enough See we then his Answ to this A forrain Eldership rightly constituted hath particular authority i. a power of preheminent and prevailing counsel though not a power of jurisdiction to constrain their results to be practised or to censure Ecclesiastically in case persons who have the result of things produced by them do not follow them They have as an Ordinance of God a power of preheminent and prevailing counsel That is their result ought to be preferred and prevail more upon our hearts then what Interpretation other single persons and ordinary helps ordinarily afford Answ First here ere I come to the main businesse note shortly some few things 1. We never attributed authority to a forrain Eldership over any persons or Churches Mr. Lockier here saying that a forrain Eldership hath peculiar authority if his meaning be according to his words if he understand authority indeed that is an Eldership extrinsecall to Churches yet hath peculiar authority over them goeth farther then ever Presbyterians did and indeed goeth clearly contrary to truth and in terms speaketh very like the Prelatick way which attributed to a forrain Eldership the Prelate and his Cathedrall authority over all the Churches in the Diocaese But indeed his words and his sense agree not For his peculiar authority is no authority as we shall see anone 2. We say yet it is but an odious feigned description of that power of jurisdiction we attribute to Synods and other associated Presbyteries when it is called a power to constrain their results to be practised as we have discovered it before 3. It is yet a grosser misrepresentation that we attribute unto such Presbyteries a power to censure persons Ecclesiastically in case they have the result of things produced by them and do not follow them Did ever any Persbyterian say such a thing as this that a Synod or Presbytery has power to censure persons who have their results by them and does not follow them For example that a Synod in Scotland hath power to censure persons in England or France that have their results by them and does not follow them or that any Presbytery hath power to censure persons of the Church within the bounds of their association who may be have their resultâ— by them and not follow them If this has been said out of a mistake and ignorance we pity it and wishes the Author to know our Doctrine better ere he take upon him to represent it to others If it has been of purpose to render our Doctrine odious let his own conscience judge what sort of dealing this is section 13 But to come to the purpose in hand Mr. Lockiers clear and plain answer at last to this place of Act. 15. 28. is that that Synod exercised no power of jurisdiction but a power of counsell or advice only He calls it indeed a peculiar authority But when he makes it to be but counsell that is to give it a bare name for credits sake And to deny it the thing of that name Counsell or advice is but an act of charity and if good of wisdom and prudence and not of authority 'T is no other act but that which one man may do to a Church one brother to another one woman to another yea as Mr. Rutherfurd saith Abigail to David a maid to Naaman That the Author saith it is a power of preheminent and prevailing counsell that it ought to prevail more upon our hearts than the interpretation of single persons and ordinary helps availeth not For preheminent counsell is still but counsell and so that which is attributed to the Synod differeth no wayes from that which is competent to any single persons to do or one sister and equall Church to another but only gradually And suppose a company of Christians Pastors or others met together not Synodically being persons of known piety and understanding in maters of Religion their counsell would be such a preheminent and prevailing counsell that it ought to be preferred and prevail more with our hearts then the interpretation of single persons So hereby there is no peculiar authority or power granted to that Synod as such an Ordinance of God If yet it shall be said that their counsell is preheminent and prevailing ought to prevail more upon our hearts c. not only upon this ground that they are many pious and understanding men and liker to find out the minde of God in his Word then single persons But also because they are such an institute meeting a Synod To this I cannot see how Mr. Lockier can say this having but now told us that the decrees of the Synod bind materially as being the will of God but not formally as the result of the Presbytery For what else is it to say that their results ought to prevail more upon our hearts because the result of such men as a Synod but that they are binding formally as the results of the Synod 2. If there be a preheminency or power of prevailing in the decree of a Synod so that there is an obligation upon our hearts to be more prevailed with over and above that preheminency and power of prevailing which is in the counsâ—l of a company of pious and understanding men met occasionally not in a Synod which certainly ought to be preferred and to prevail more with our hearts then the interpretation of single persons I would ask what is that different power if it be not a juridicall power and consequently of censure upon disobedience For if it shall be said it is not juridicall power but only dogmaticall or doctrinall then I say this is competent to every single Pastor For a truth of the Gospel taught and delivered by a single Pastor ought to be beleeved and obeyed i. e. bindeth to obedience and faith not only because it is Gospel but because it is doctrinally taught by a Minister and so that preheminent and prevailing power shall differ from the power of a single Pastor but only gradually and is the very same in kinde and so no peculiar authority or power of a Synod as such an Ordinance of God But now whereas Mr. Lockier asserteth that this Synod at Jerusalem Act. 15. had not nor did exercise a juridicall power but only a power of counsell or advice We assert the contrair which is abundantly proven by sundry learned Writers treating upon this subject and maintained against all Objections made to the contrair by Opposites We refer the Reader for satisfaction to these namely Mr. Gillespy Assert of the Govern of the Church of Scotl. Part. 2. c. 8. Aarons Rod Book 2. c. 9. Arg.
no other means of dealing against them but by the Word and other spirituall Ordinances if you do not give a toleration to them let all men of common sense judge the Passages of Scripture hinted at by the Author for putting a colour upon this opinion of his are miserably abused For the former the parable of the tares I refer the Reader to Mr. Rutherfurd For the latter Zachar. 4. 6. Not by might nor by power but by my Spirit saith the Lord of Hosts Certain it is from the whole context that the Lords meaning there is this Because the people lately returned from Baylon and now imployed in the work of building the Temple were much discouraged in the prosecution of the work by the thoughts of the greatnesse of the work of the greatnesse of the power and opposition of their enemies and of their own weaknesse he would have them to know that it was not by the power of the creature but by his own power that that work was to be carried through and that therefore they ought not to be discouraged seeing his power was sufficient to bear down and remove the greatest impediments and to make the weakest means effectuall to accomplish the work 5. It is true that the word and other Ordinances are mighty through God to cast down strong imaginations of vain men but is it therefore a good Argument and Consequence the Word of God and other Ordinances are mighty through God to cast down such strong imaginations as Haereticall Doctrines Ergo the Civil Magistrate has nothing to do to suppresse the teaching of them by his Sword and power If so then it will as well follow he has nothing to do to suppresse or punish the out-breakings of carnall lusts in adulteries thefts murders c. Why For I beleeve the Word and other Ordinances of God are mighty through God to cast down these as well as the other The Author addeth Order is but making to in Church and State and therefore things are but disorderly in this Nation Warres make Lawes mute Answ 'T is well that at last he acknowledges that it is so that errours are tolerat for that is the charge he is answering to and that this is disorderly which yet how it can consist well with what he hath now been saying in the preceeding words I see not but if the excuse for this be relevant I leave it to God and all judicious indifferent men knowing the progresse of matters these ten or twelve years and what ought to have been done and might have been done had men been willing to have it done for setling truth and removing things contrary to sound Doctrine as was undertaken by Covenant and Oath to the most high God to be done section 17 He shutteth up all thus SECT 58. Finally Christians take this answer to all that may be further objected To be enquiring is honourable but to be ever learning and never practising is dangerous It was an heavy curse that Jeremiah wished upon himself Jerem. 20. 17. It is an heavy curse indeed upon that poor soul concerning whom it may be said the womb of truth is alwayes great with him alwayes in pangs and throws with him but cannot bring forth Forsooth Sir you have soon done with it We must take this for answer to all that may be further objected against that you have been pleading for Stand not upon these Objections but fall to practice down with our Church Government and Churches to the ground this to my conception is the scope of these words else I confesse I understand them not sure this man has had a wonderfull conceit of what he has been saying in this debate that thinks we should all be so convinced hereby of the truth of that which he has been pleading for that tho we had twenty Objections moe against it then he has touched as indeed we have many yet we should step over all and do what he biddeth us I will crave leave to say it I think no man of understanding beside himself will have such a conceit of it As for us we tell him we are not now to be enquiring about the matter he has been Disputing against I mean whether it be truth or if the contrary maintained be him be truth We have declared before God Angels and the World that the Religion established in this Church by the mercy of God in Doctrine Worship and Government of the Church is the truth of God taught in his Word and we are sure it is so and as we are bound by the will of God and our vowes and Covenants to abide in the profession and practice of this truth So we trust that God will establish our hearts with his grace to abide therein As for such as are fallen away from it we lament their case that if they have been moved by any of these things presented by this Author that they should kythed so ready to be turned about with every wind of doctrine the God of grace awaken them to remember whence they have fallen to repent and do their first works Amen APPENDIX Wherein is Examined what is said in the forementioned letter of the new Independents of Aberdene for the Independent Congregationall and against the Presbyteriall way of Church-Government section 1 THese Authors usher in what they say on this purpose with this preface Touching Presbyterian Government indeed when thoughts of Questioning it were first born in upon us we did a long time suppresse them as tentations Because we had so solemnly though too implicitely engaged to the maintenance thereof Yet afterwards knowing that Truth cannot losse by a search we brought the maters to the ballance of the Sanctuarie And now after seeking of God as he was pleased to give us grace and using all helps which we could have we professe so far as we can see with reverence to precious and learned men of another judgement the Congregationall way comes nearer to the paterne of the Word then the Classicall forme And to us it appears c. section 2 Indeed when these thoughts were born in upon them they had just cause to look upon them as tentations and for ought that they have brought for justifying them here they may justly yet look upon them as tentations as we trust shall appear in the consideration thereof But here 1. It may be just mater of enquiry to others and haply may be of good purpose to themselves to reflect and consider when these thoughts began first to be born in upon them at least when they began to out any thing of them Did we hear any thing of such thoughts in them but since the late great revolution of State in this Kingdom after Worcester and how soone thereafter did we hear of them by some of the number although others thought fit to suppresse them some longer This may seem to be ground of searching of heart which is deceitfull above measure 2. It seemeth by the Authors own
confession that the bearing in of these thoughts upon them at first has been from no good cause or principle Not from the Spirit of God unlesse they will say it has been by an immediate impulse or Enthusiasme For say they it was after a long times suppressing of them that they began to consult with the Word of God about them for that is as I conceive to bring them to the ballance of the Sanctuary 3. If implicitely they engaged themselves to the maintenance of the Government desined and settled in this Church sure then if they will reflect upon the nature and tenor of the engagement they may find themselves to have committed in the very act more sin than they insinuate here or I will name For let them look back again unto the Nationall Covenant and they shall find that they not only engaged themselves to the maintenance of the Religion professed in this Church in all the points thereof But also declared and protested themselves under Oath after due Examination of their own consciences in maters of true and false Religion to be throughly resolved of the Truth thereof by the Word and Spirit of God and therefore to believe with their hearts confesse with their mouth and subscribe with their hands I do indeed â—ear that many did run unto that Engagement without such conviction of mind upon clear warrand of Gods Word found by Examination of the maters And as to do this with so solemne and dreadfull an attestation of God that they did it upon conviction of conscience was horrible guiltinesse So it may wel be apprehended that God in his holy judgement has suffered many for the discovery of the falshood of their hearts may be in mercy to some may be in wrath to others to revolt from these their former Engagements I wish from my heart these Brethren so I will yet call them if they will yet be so called by us if it be true which they say now that they engaged implicitely whereas they protested before God that they did it upon through conviction they would consider this lay it to heart and yet againe bring their present way to the ballance of the Sanctuary I have been with others witnesse of some who having engaged in the cause of God in these lands and caried themseves therein for a long time resolutely and actively and having afterward foully lapsed into contrary courses when they have been brought to Repentance for their backsliding Have declared that they found that their back-sliding had arisen from this that their engaging in the cause at first and going on in it formerly was not upon conviction from grounds of the Word of God but implicitely and for by and extrinsecall respects 4. It is not competent to me to question nor will I question their diligence in seeking of God when they began to enquire about this matter tho it be a thing usuall now-a-dayes for men to set out naughtiest wares with this inscription after seeking of God but as for using of all helps they could have to be cleared I think some thing may be questioned For besides helps of mens Writings upon this purpose might they not have used the help of the advice of the Judicatories of this Kirk and represented the grounds of their doubting to some of them Acts of Generall Assemblies require this that before men vent any innovations in matters of Religion they should first peaceably represent their Reasons to the publick Judicatures And albeit they may haply say that the very matters they were questioning was the Authority of these Judicatories Yet humility if they had not overweening conceits of their own wits above the judgement of these Judicatures and charity if they had so much as they ought towards the Church wherein they were born baptized instructed some of them had been for some years Ministers and acting in association in the established Judicatures thereof might it seemeth led them to so much But if they accounted the Judicatures unworthy the consulting with might they not have used the help of conference with some of these precious and learned men whom they professe to reverence If they did consult with any of them before they were determined in the matter yea before they did vent their new judgement is more then I know or can learn But come we to their determination and the confirmation of it section 2 So far say they as we can see the Congregationall way comes nearer to the patern of the Word then the Classicall form Here it may be asked why they say only that the Congregationall way comes nearer to the patern and not simply that it is the way conform to the patern of the Word What does the Congregationall way it self come somewhat short of the patern and is there a third way distinct both from it and the Classicall that comes full up to it Is there here a reservation for a further light It may be we may hear somewhat of this ere all be done But go we on to their desinition or proposition of the Congregationall way To us say say it appeareth that Christ hath furnished a Congregation with their Eldership with compleat power of Jurisdiction and censure within themselves There are here two things asserted by the Authors which accordingly they intend to prove by their two Arguments respectivè afterward built upon the passage of Scripture which they cite 1. That by Christs appointment the power of Ecclesiastick jurisdiction and censure is in the Congregation i. e. the body of privat professours and the Eldership jointly both being to concur formally in the acting thereof and not only in the Eldership 2. That any one single Congregation with its Eldership has compleat power of jurisdiction and censure within it self supreamly and without subordination to any larger or superiour Preâ—…yterie But for further clearing of their minde here it were requisit they should explain these two things to us 1. Whom they mean by the Congregation contradistinguished from the Eldership whether the whole collection of Church-members or only men and those of years of discretion If the former then Women and Children must be joint with the Eldership in the power of jurisdiction and censures If this be their minde we would know it and they would speak it plainly If the latter then it is not the Congregation but some part of the Congregation with the Eldership that has the power of jurisdiction and censure or else Women and Children are not parts constituent of the Congregation and then let them tell me where shall they find the name of the Church in all the Gospel in this notion taken for the Eldership with the â—ale-professours of adult years excluding Women and Children 2. Suppose the whole Eldership of a Congregation be scandalous and censurable who has the power of jurisdiction and censure to exercise toward them If jurisdiction and censure should be exercised towards them as I suppose it should be who has it and
A LITLE STONE Pretended to be out of the MOUNTAIN Tried and found to be a Counterfeit OR AN EXAMINATION REFVTATION OF Mr. LOCKYERS LECTURE Preached at Edinburgh ANNO 1651. Concerning the MATER of the VISIBLE CHURCH And afterwards Printed with an APPENDIX for Popular Government of single CONGREGATIONS Together with an EXAMINATION in two APPENDICES Of what is said on these same purposes in a LETTER of some in Aberdene who lately have departed from the Communion and Government of this CHURCH By JAMES WOOD Professor of Theol. in S. Andrews EDINBVRGH Printed by ANDRO ANDERSON for George Suintoun and Robert Broun and are to be sold at their Shops 1654. TO THE RIGHT HONOURABLE JOHN EARLE of CASSILS LORD KENNEDY My Lord WHat the wise observing King uttered long agoe that of making of Books there is no end was never more verified in any then it is in the present age wherein scribunt docti indoctique every smatterer and every fancie-full head must have the Presse travel to bring forth their froathy conceptions And Presses by many are made use of as engines to discharge revylings reproaches and blasphemies against the God of Heaven his blessed Truths wayes and Ordinances For my self I can say in truth it hath not hitherto been my ambition to increase wearinesse of the flesh by much Reading And that now I come this way to the worlds view 't is not of mine own meer choise but because a necessity was laid upon me The Author with whom I have to do in this ensueing debate having not only opened his mouth to Preach in the most eminent-place in this Land but also adventured to Write and Print against the Orthodox Doctrine touching the constitution and Government of the Visible Church of Christ revileing in speciall the Church in this Land yet through its side also stricking at all the Orthodox Churches in Europe as no Church but a dead carcasse having neither matter nor form of a true Church a nest of unclean birds idolatrous c. And thereupon charging with a great deal of confidence and big words all truely Godly to come out of it and to separate from it It was by some Reverend and Godly men thought expedient that altho there appear little or nothing in what is said by him which may brangle the mind of any judicious Reader Yet because it is a thing usuall to adversaries of the Truth if what they say be it never so weak get not an Answer to brag of it as unanswerable And unsettled minds that have not their senses exercised to discern good and evill are ready to be taken with any thing busked up with gay words and so to be carried about like weather-Cocks with every wind of Doctrine as many sad examples of this time prove an Answer should be returned to him lest truth should so much as seem to suffer prejudice any way And this taske they were pleased to lay upon me Who albeit I do and cannot but ingenuously acknowledge my self one of the least and weakest Servants of Christ and that many others there are in this Church who might far more worthily acquit themselves in this service Yet durst not withstand the motion having so clear a Calling and considering withall how I stand oblidged in my station to maintain the true Religion in Doctrine Worship Discipline and Government by the mercy of God established amongst us in common with the rest of the Lords people in the Land by Solemn Vow and Covenant and more particularly by the Lords bringing me who had been in my younger years educated as to many things in a contrary way to the acknowledgment of â—he truth in a very gracious manner with a strong hand and in much long-suffering patience whereby he waited to be gracious that he might be exalted in shewing mercy on me Haply it will be matter of talking to some that this of mine has been so long in coming forth after Mr. Lockier published his But it is not unknown to many who have been witnesses to my diligence that my Answer was in readinesse within a few Moneths after his Peece came to my hands and the task was laid upon me And had come abroad if several difficulties had not interveened Now when it is to be published I desire humbly to present it to your Lordship first and under your Honourable name to the view of the world I must spare to expresse all the great causes oblidging me so to do Because to expresse them would not only be haply inexpedient But also would be I know unsavoury to your self whom I have alwayes found desirous to aprove your self in reality of wel doing but never liking well to hear of other mens euges Only this much I cannot forbear and must begge your Lordships leave to say The personall obligations which you have laid upon me by a continued tract of undeserved respects ever since the first time I was known to your Lordship would require a worthier testimony of acknowledgment then is this mean present or any thing else my small store of abilities can afford But to speak truth it is not so much any personall concernment that hath engaged my heart to your Lordship as that which hath endeared you to all who know the truth and you That grace which God hath vouchsafed upon you to walk in tendernesse and closenesse with himself in your privat course and with constant zeal to improve your publick station wherein ye have stood for promoving the interest of Religion and righteousnesse and the good of Gods people without byasse or wavering in any revolution of times wherewith many turning upon the axletree of their own self-interests have whirled about the sweet fruit whereof I doubt not but you find in these glowmie dayes and trust shall abide with you to the end through the mercy of the Lord whose gifts and graces are without repentance I will not adventure upon such severe self-denyednesse to speak more of what I have had the happinesse to be acquainted with in your Lordship I hope this testimony of my sense of the obligation I ly under to honour your Lordship shal finde favourable acceptance at your hands I will not presume for indeed it were presumption to commend my work in it I pretend to nothing therein but that through the Grace of God I have ingenuously and in simplicity tho in much weaknesse spoken for truth But the matter it self is precious and of great weight consisting of two great interests of Christ Jesus his Visible Church which is his Visible Kingdom on earth The one touching the qualifications of the persons that are to be acknowledged members of his Visible Church and so in effect comes to be a Question de sinibus of the marches of his Visible Kingdom The other touching the matter and way of the externall Visible Government thereof As to the former my Author has so straitned the bounds of Christs Visible Church that by his sentence none are to be
conversion of the Gentiles pag. 2. and 3. begin Ans That the Holy Ghost here intendeth as the principall purpose to describe a visible Church of the New Test by the proper constituent matter thereof is but the meer conceit of the Author forced upon the Text and no wayes deduceable from the words themselves the genuine purpose of the words being simply to note some circumstances of Paul and Barnabas and the other Commissioners joyned with them their journey from Antioch to Jerusalem whether they were sent for resolution upon the Question then in controversie at Antioch As 1. The Christian courteous respect that the Church at Antioch put upon them they were brought on their way 2. What these commissioners did as they were on their journey that they declared to the Christians that lay in their way that same thing that they had declared before at Antioch Chap. 14. v. 27. viz. that God had been mightily with the Preaching of the Gospel even amongst the Gentiles so that many of them as the Story relateth the particular countries and places Chap. 13 and 14. were converted to the Christian Religion 3. What effect this produced amongst the Christians to whom it was declared that they had great joy at these tydings that the Kingdome of Christ was so spreading and that even the Gentiles were brought in to it Here indeed are grounds of usefull points of Doctrine but what is all to that which Mr. Lockier intends the description of a visible Church by its proper matter A Church visible to Mr. Lockier is a particular Congregation participating together the Ordinances of Christ Doth it any wayes appear that the Spirits intention in these words is to describe unto us what sort of persons were admitted into the constitution of such a Congregation viz. as he would have it not any professours whosoever but such only as were tryed and found by truely converted and very spiritual men able to discern and judge to be truely regenerate What evidence is brought to shew that this is intended in the Text This to wit that first it is said being brought on by the Church and then sayes he what the matter of this Church is the next words tells they declared the conversion of the Gentiles Answer What must these latter words be a description of that thing which is mentioned in the first i. e. the Church viz. of Antioch for that is the Church spoken of there because forsooth the one followeth immediately after the other in the series of the narration I must say this is strange Logick and interpreting of Scripture I am not here to deny but the Church of Antioch did consist of such as are here mentioned i. e. converted Gentiles but my purpose is to shew how impertinently the Author hath chosen and made use of this Scripture to be his Text for his Doctrine concerning the matter of a visible Church section 4 That this may yet more clearly appear I desire the Reader to consider that the Historian Luke is not in these two Clauses of this Verse pitcht upon by Mr. Lockier as a ground of his Doctrine relating the words of one mans continued discourse so as the one part of them might be taken as exegetick of the other or as intended to expresse a description of the thing contained in the other but is relating two diverse actions of two distinct pâ—rties as circumstances of Paul and Barnabas journey one reall of the Church of Antioch their Christian courtesie in bringing them on a part of their way The other so to call it verball viz. the discourse that Paul and Barnabas themselves had amongst the Christians by whom they passed viz. that the Gentiles were converted to the Christian Faith so that any man that hath but half an eye may easily perceive that these terms Church and converted Gentiles stands not in the words in relation one to another as a definitum and a definitio or as a compound and the matter of which it is compounded Therefore it is but a forcing of the Text to make up of these two this Doctrine as intended in the words A visible Church consists of converted ones as its proper matter what ever truth may be in it of it self This I said before I am not questioning now but would discover the inconsideratnes of chusing and making use of this Text for that purpose and adds but this seeing in preaching the Word of GOD aright any enunciative Doctrine which is propounded from a Text if it ly not in the Text in expresse and formall or equivalent terms yet should be deduceable by good consequence from it I humbly desire that Mr. Lockier would build a clear Syllogisme upon any enunciation in this Text inferring this Conclusion the proper matter of a visible Church is converted ones for in this Text it is not said expresly and immediatly as he would seem to say in the next progresse in these words The complexion of a visible Church under the Gospel is here said to be conversion the constituting matter converted ones This much might suffice for answer to this Text as it is alledged by Mr. Lockier for to be a proof of the Doctrine intended in this Lecture for unlesse it be first supposed that conversion of the Gentiles is here mentioned and set down as a description of the visible Church mentioned before all the pains taken by him afterward to clear what is meant by conversion is to little purpose for proof of the point intended as from this Text. Yet we shall be at the pains to take into consideration what followeth in the opening up of the Text lest we seem purposely to passe over any thing which may be alledged to speak for the point maintained by the Author I confesse it had been fitter that the controversie had been first stated but I am resolved to follow the tract of Mr. Lockiers discourse that I may shunne the smallest appearance of wronging him Go we on then section 5 They declared the conversion of the Gentiles what conversion was this A meer outside conversion pag. 3. Nay would the Author say an inside truely gracious heart-conversion Ans 1. Do we any of us whom the Author takes for his Adversaries say that no more at all is meant here but a meer outside conversion He but fains an Adversary and wrongeth us by intimating so much We conceive thus that by Conversion here is meant a forsaking and relinquishing of the Heathnish and a turning unto and embracing the Christian Religion as the Nether Dutch Notes on the place expound De Bekeeringe â—…el tot de Christilick Religie i. e. Conversion viz. to the Christian Relion no wayes excluding but comprehending under it also the inward heart-turning by true faith to Christ but withall we think it cannot be warrantably said that when Paul and Barnabas made this declaration of the conversion of the Gentiles they meant that all and every one of these Gentiles turned from Heathenism to the
Invisible Church is the greatest part in Heaven and they which are in earth as one with them as one entire universall body whereof Christ is the Head are not capable of c. Ans 1. That part of the universall Church which is in Heaven is impertinently brought on the stage here Christ is speaking of those that are yet to be built or are a building therefore we say He is speaking of such as are on earth 2. Albeit that part of the Invisible Church that is on earth be not capable of visible and limited Discipline formally considered as such i. e. as the Invisible Church nor yet collectively considered as one intire body yet the Invisible Church materially i. e. these that are the Invisible Church being also a part of the Church visible and considered distributively in parrs may be capable of visible Discipline David Peter John and the rest who make up the Church Invisible as they are also outward Professours with others are capable of visible Discipline O! then you will say why Are they not spoken of here I will build my Church as they are a visible Church Ans It doth not necessarly follow for to persons standing under diverse considerations one thing may be attributed according to one consideration and another according to another section 3 As to his 2d. Observation 1. It is contrair in it self to Truth that the visible Church is to consist only of such as have a faith he means fidem quâ creditur or taken subjectivè for we shal grant it of faith quae creditur or taken objectivè which flesh and blood cannot reveal i. e. true saving faith The Church may consist of such as have not that faith and the Author addeth not here his qualification of so far as men can judge neither can it be admitted here 2. Qualifie it as he will it is a meer violenting of the Text sundry Interpretations by diverse have been given on these words Vpon this Rock will I build my Church but I think few or none ever before our Author gave such an interpretation as this The visible Church shall be constitute only of such as have true saving faith in them so far as men can judge Certainly whether we take the Church Invisible or the Church Visible to be meant here under the name of the Church Mr. Lockiers sense cannot have place For 1. Understanding by the name of Church the Church Invisible in that sentence Vpon this Rock will I build my Church Christ is not speaking of gathering and constituting a certain incorporation or society in the state and condition of such an incorporation or society and how persons of whom it is to be made up must be antecedently qualified that they may be capable of admission to be constituent members thereof but speaking of his own act of efficacious grace put forth in deed with the Ministry of the Gospel upon the hearts of some persons whom he cals his Church because they are called out from amongst the rest of the world to himself which doth not suppose them antecedently having faith and taking them as such state them in a society But indeed is the very giving to them that faith and stating them in an impregnable condition of grace and salvation Whether by this Rock we understand that faith which Peter confessed or Christ the object of that faith or Peter himself considered in regard of his Ministry of the Gospel or the Gospel Preached by him as some of the Orthodox do certainly this is the meaning of building the Church upon the Rock supposing that which I do incline most to with the most part of Reformed Divines that by the Church is meant the Church Invisible 2. If by the name of the Church here be understood the Church Visible as some later Orthodox Divines have expounded it namely judicious and learned Hudson in his acurate and elaborate Vindication of the Essence and Vnity of the Catholick Visible Church Yet it will little avail Mr. Lockiers purpose 1. Because it is a particular Congregation and the qualification of members to be admitted thereunto that he is speaking of all along under the name of a visible Church But supposing this place to speak of the visible Church it cannot be understood of a particular visible Church or Congregation but must of necessity be understood of the Catholick visible Church because it is such a Church as is to stand firm and impregnable that the gates of hell cannot prevail against it but any particular Church may be prevailed against 2. Taking the name of the Church so here the meaning of the whole sentence upon this Rock I will build my Church is nothing else but this as the learned Author but now cited well observeth that the Profession and Doctrine of this Truth that the Messiah is already come that this Jesus is the Messiah this Jesus the Messiah is the Son of God the Doctrine and confession that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh 1 Joh. 4. 2 3. and the beleeving that I am he saith Christ Joh. 8. 24. is the foundation whereon the Church of the New Test is to be built out of all which nothing more can follow as to the qualification of members of the visible Church of the New Test then this that when as the Jews under the Old Test beleeved in an indefinite Messiah to come now under the New Test none can be of the Christian Church but such as beleeves and confesses that the Messiah is come c. Now I appeal to all the Orthodox World if Mr. Lockier his commenting upon this place be not a forcing of the Text. As for what he addeth that to a body thus constitute i. e. a Visible Church so constitute as he hes been saying is the power of the keyes given and both these represented and personated to us in Peter To passe I cannot well understand how it can be said that the power of the keyes could be represented and personated in Peter possibly the Church might be represented and personated in him This belongeth not to our present Question and therefore we passe it now trusting with the Lords assistance afterward to evidence that both assertions viz. that the power of the keyes were given to a Church Visible I mean the collective Church and so to it is as the subject and that Peter in receiving them here did represent and personat the Church are groundlesse section 4 The next shadow or hint is Rev. 11. 1 2. And there was given me a Reed c. Hereupon the Author maketh much adoe 1. He layeth down grounds by Interpreting particulars in the words 1. Saith he by the Temple is meant the Visible Church the state and welfare of which though most infested of any publick condition shall not be left and ruined but be carefully looked to and raised from its corruptions intrusions and ruines made by unsound men This is confirmed by a Testimony of Marlorat hunc in
these thine elect and therefore I cannot tell how to feed them It is not necessary or a Pastour to feed the Elect that he know distinctly who are the singular persons by the head but for feeding by publick Doctrine it is sufficient that he know them confusedly that they are there in the Congregation and if he have any grounds of a positive judgement concerning particular persons that indeed gives him further advantage to apply himself to those in a more particularly applicatory way If indeed it were the Ministers work to feed efficaciter to give the increase as the Apostle expresseth the actuall efficaciousnesse or efficiency of grace and they were required to feed the elect that way I confesse if the Lord did not distinctly point out the particular persons to them then they might make such a reply Lord I cannot search into thy secrets to perceive who are these c. but the efficiency of grace is in Gods own hand alone and the Minister has upon him but an externall morall suasive administration which he is to dispense for the good of the elect but he needeth not for that know them distinctly it is enough he knowes they are there where he dispenseth them and let God discern and waile them out from the rest 3. It is a groundlesse supposition and contrary to the truth that in the current and common sense of Scripture that redeemed being spoken of spirituall redemption from sin and eternall wrath as for the name sanctified it is not in this text and therefore is impertinently brought in here is taken for redeemed visibly though not really I doubt he can bring many passages of Scripture wherein it can with any appearance be so exponed yea visibly redeemed is an expression in my judgement strange to Scripture Let this suffice us in answer to Mr. Hooker in this particular We doubt not but Mr. Rutherfurd will have more full and acurate considerations on it section 10 I shall adde a word or two for proofe that by the Church redeemed by the blood of Christ cannot be understood all and every one of the Visible Church but only the Elect desiring Mr. Lockier to take the same to his consideration if the Church which Ephes 5. 25 26 27. Christ is said to have loved and given himself for that he might sanctifie and cleanse it be not the Visible Church as such and so all members of the Visible Church then neither is it so to be taken here the consequence and connexion of this proposition is necessary and clear because the attribute enunciate of it in both places is all one upon the matter for what else is it that Christ loved the Church and gave himself for it that c. but that he redeemed it by his own blood But that Eph. 5. by the Church is meant only the elect i. e. the Invisible Church is the constant Doctrine of all Orthodox Divines in their disputes against the Remonstrants universall Redemption for the Redemption of the elect only and likewise of all Orthodox Divines writing against Papists on the Question concerning the members of the true Invisible Church the Mysticall body of Christ and also upon the Question of the Visibility of the Church I instance but a testimonie of one viz. Learned Whittaker de Eccles q. 1. c. 9. tert arg where you shall find him not only affirm but solidely prove this we say reasoning thus from the place Christ is not the Head * This is to be understood of such headship as has allusion to the head of the naturall body which hath a reall influence into the body so no doubt Christ is an head in a politicall sort to the Visible Church having a morall influence by command c. but of that Church which he shall save which he shall present to himself on the day of Judgement glorious not having spot or wrinkle But only the predestinate shall be saved Ergo. only the Elect belong to the Church of Christ i. e. the Church mentioned there and to Bellarmin's answer that Christ is Head to that Church which he shall not save he saith falsissimum esse Read that whole paragraph and you shall find sundry other solide Arguments brought by him from that context to prove that only the elect are that Church spoken of there 2. Again I desire him to look forward from v. 28. to ver 30. of this very 20. chap. of the Acts and see what the Apostle saith also of your own selves shall men arise speaking perverse things to draw away Disciples after them Whether we expone of your own selves of the whole body of the Church of Ephesus or particularly of the Elders and Officers thereof is all one to our purpose It will not be denied that the Officers were members of the Church of Ephesus and as Christians were partakers of the common Priviledges and Titles competent to the Visible Church now if Paul shall be conceived to speak that redeemed by the blood of Christ let it be out of the positive judgement of charity and so far as he could judge universally of all the Visible Church of Ephesus how could this consist with what he saith v. 30. * Surgendi verbo quo utitur significat iam lupos illos fovere clandestinam perniciem donec occasione sibi datâ erumpant Calv. in loc that he knew there was some amongst them presently fostering secret and clandestine wickednesse who would afterward openly kyth apostatize from the truth and become seducers of others Could the Apostle have a judgement such as is mentioned of such that they were Redeemed by c. Sure understand the Word v. 20. as Mr. Lockier would and we shall have clearly contradictory judgements of Paul at once I judge the Church of Ephesus Universally all and every one of you Redeemed and yet I know some among you are lurking traitours who will kyth afterward he sayeth not may be some of you will but positively some of you will section 11 For the Church of the Philippians is cited chap. 1. v. 6. and chap. 4. v. 15 16. For the latter I see nothing in it that hath any colour of a ground for his point nor yet doth the former hold forth a proof of it The Apostle writeth to all the Saints at Philippi and v. 6. declares the confidence that he had that God who had begun the work in them would perfite it to the coming of the Lord Jesus Will it follow hence that all and every one of the Visible Church of Philippi were reall Saints so far as man could judge * The 6. vers by the Orthodox writing-against the Remonstrants upon the head of perseverance is applyed only to the Elect and true Believers in the judgement of verity or truth of the thing it self See Ames Coron art 5. arg 2. proving this by solide reasons no Logick will evince this from these words cited If he had taken in the 7. vers he might had a
But hence it followeth not that there must be such a homogenealnesse in the Church Visible as Mr. Lockier meaneth that it be endued with true faith and have the Spirit dwelling in their hearts And as to the reason of the connexion of the proposition we answer such a homogenealnesse is not requisite for such a derivation as is from a head politicall to its politicall body this derivation being only morall by commands prohibitions and the like morall actings But Christ is not a Head in the latter sense as the head in the naturall body is to the Church Visible as such nor is the Visible Church a body to him in this sense but only vocatione activâ and in externall profession Neither is that derivation from Christ unto the Church whereby it groweth up in the Lord unto the Church as a Visible Church or considered according to its visible constitution But unto the Church Invisible internall Mysticall as such section 5 His 2d Reason is thus shortlie If the Visible Church be the Church of the Living God the pillar and stay of truth and consequently such as should bear up the truth into the World and be a stay to truth holding it out firmly and faithfully in the midst of all tryalls and such as in which God lives and dwells and walks Then none can be mater or members of the Visible Church but real Saints For why Doth God live and dwell in dead persons who only make a Profession of Religion Will such persons be a stay to truth and the things of God Will they be a stay to truth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 firmamentum as the firmament to the stars who fall from Heaven themselves And so how can God have glory in the Church throughout all ages But the Visible Church is the Church of the Living God the pillar and ground of truth 1 Tim. 3. 5. in which God lives dwells walks Ergo c. Ans Mr. Lockier still in this as in all his other Arguments shews that in propounding his Doctrine he added that qualification truely gracious so far as men can judge but dicis causa and in shew to avoid for a while the odium of the greatest Anabaptists Tenent of the mater or members of the Visible Church For such as may be gracious and Godly so far as men can judge mens judgement being not infallible in this as himself confesseth may be destitute of the power of Godlines in their hearts and so such as will not hold out truth firmly in the midst of all trials may be but dead persons and so such as in whom God doth not live walk and dwell 2. As to that first property and character attributed to a Visible Church from 1 Tim. 3. 15. by Mr. Lockier First I would aske him if in good earnest he meaneth that to be a property of a Visible Church rightly constitute in its mater as it should be that it will bear up the truth and things of God firmly and faithfully to the world in the midst of all trials Sure this is the very thing that Papists alledge from this place for the unerrabilitie and indefectibilitie of the Visible Church against which all Protestant Divines disputes Yea it is much more for Papists attribute this only to the Catholick Church Visible acknowledging that all particular Visible Churches may erre and make defection and let the truth and things of God fall down excepting only the Roman Church because they make it to be the Catholick Church virtually but Mr. Lockier acknowledges no Church Visible but an Independent Congregation and will have this to be the property of any particular Visible Church and therefore propounds the subject of his conclusion here thus a Church Visible i. e. any Visible Church now let me put him further to it either there was never a Church Visible rightly constitute for mater from the beginning seeing all the first constitute Churches have made defection and let truth fall down which if he say besides that it is absurd in it self I ask why then did he a little before bring us paterns of right constitute Churches from these first mentioned in Scripture Or if they were right constitute how comes it that they made defection and did not bear up and hold out the truth and things of God but did let them fall If he answer that came to passe because they kept not a right constitution for their mater I repone that taks not away the force of the Question For that same if it was so was a not bearing up and holding out firmly and faithfully the things of God and so the Question returneth upon this 2. But to answer directly to the place though Interpreters have some variety amongst themselves about the meaning of it Yet never one of them acknowledges that Interpretation which Mr. Lockier gives but opposeth it and refuteth it in Papists Some indeed expone the attribute the pillar and ground of truth much as he doth but these by the Church to which it is attributed undâ—rstand not the Visible Church but the Invisible of Elect. So Whittaker de Eccles q. 3. c. 2. illa quidem Ecclesia quae est columna firmamentum veritatis nunquam potest deficere Sed quod assumit adversarius illam Ecclesiam esse Visibilem illud affirmo esse falsissimum Invisibilem enim esse affirmo demonstro c. and often otherwhere Others again understand the subject as he doth by the Church to be meant the Visible Church of Ephesus but these expone the attribute the pillar and ground of truth not of what the Church Visible will do alwayes de facto but what is its duty and dignity elogium hoc Ecclesiae dignitatem officium describit Non autem quod in ea perpetuâ luce fulgeat Gomar specul ver Eccles c. 2. So Wal. loc com de Eccles milit Resp 1. Hoc dicitur de Ecclesia Ephesinâ que tamen periit 2. Ergo respectu officii sic vocatur See more concerning this place in learned Gomar in the place cited also in his commentar upon the Gallatians c. 2. in the second Tome of his works pag. 244 245. where you have an excellent discourse of the diverse Orthodox Interpretations thereof both ancient and moderne Divines We passe here Camer Interpretation of this place joining these words pillar and ground of truth not with that which goeth before but that which followeth section 6 For the 2d property and character out of the 2 Cor. 6. 16. We Ans With all Protestant Divines that it is not the Visible but the Invisible Church that is the Temple of the living God in which he liveth dwelleth and walketh See Whittaker de Ecâ—ces q. 1 c. 11. pag. 442. To omit many other Arguments for proof of this take but this one from the Text the Temple of the Living God in this place is taken in such a sense as that it is spoken and praedicated of singular persons
by reason 〈◊〉 their gift of discerning perceiving in the persons true inward saving grace section 5 But to this supposing that which we shall make good in the proofe of the assumption they did admit them upon their first making professâ—… without delay or further enquirie I rejoyn thus If the Apostle â—…d admit them 〈◊〉 discerning and judging positively reall grace in them then that discerning and judging of theirs eithe◠〈◊〉 proceed from and was the act of an 〈◊〉 ordinary gift of an 〈◊〉 and Propheticall Spirit or from 〈◊〉 ordinary gift of dâ—…cretion common to beleevers 1. It cannot bâ— said that it was from the former For 1. I require a proof thereof from the History of Scripture because this Question beiâ—… about 〈…〉 of fact the probation is incumbent to my adverâ—… 〈◊〉 the affirming party But he shall 〈◊〉 be able to 〈…〉 of this from the History of 〈…〉 such 〈…〉 â—…dinary Propheticall gift of discerâ—… 〈…〉 of that 〈◊〉 E. G the gift of Diting and 〈…〉 â—…nicall Scripture was not inherent in the mind of the 〈…〉 way of 〈◊〉 permanent â—abite whereof they might make◠〈◊〉 â—…eir own will in ordinary But was present to them by 〈◊〉 â—…ansient motion or â—…scation of 〈◊〉 Spirit Now albeit it be true that the Apostles â—…meâ—mes de fâ—cto had such an extraordinary and Propheticall inspiration whereby they discovered secrets of mens spirits as 〈◊〉 had in the mater of Ananias and Saphira Acts Yet what warrand have wâ— to beleeve that they were to 〈…〉 an extraordinary gift of discerning the spirituall estaâ—… 〈…〉 â—…narily and when they were to go about the receâ—… 〈…〉 into the fellowship of the â—…ble Church We know 〈…〉 had a promise of infallible illumination and inspiration of the Spirit foâ— leading them into all truth â—n delivering unto the â—…urch the maters of faith and juris divinâ— by word or writâ— But that they had a promise of such extraordinary illuminatâ—… 〈…〉 â—…tation of the Spirit for discerning such maters of fact 〈…〉 conversion and â—aith of 〈◊〉 to be assâ—ent to them in passing judgement when they 〈◊〉 have occasion we no where 〈◊〉 in the Word of God 3. 〈◊〉 that discerning and judgemâ—… 〈◊〉 by suâ—…â—n extraordinary gift as this it had been certaâ—… 〈◊〉 â—…fallibleâ— But we finde many to have been admitted by the Apostles who â—…ward positively discovered themselves to be but gracelesse mâ—… section 6 2. But if it shall be said that their â—…dgement in this matâ—… 〈◊〉 the act of the ordinâ—… gift of discerning 〈…〉 â—s this proceedeth discursively 〈◊〉 the outward 〈…〉 to conclude of the inward state and conâ—…ution of 〈…〉 â—…ose and fountain then I say the â—…wâ—rd 〈…〉 they proceeded as the medinâ—… or Arguâ—… to câ—nclude the persons whom they admitted to be truely converted and as Mr. Lockier hath it such as God the searcher of hearts did 〈…〉 sealed by the Spirit for his so far as men truely converted and very spirituall can discern Was either their present profession of the faith and subjectioÌ„ to Ordinances simply considered by it self as such or that profession takeâ—â—…ther with some other outward eminent effect accompanying or as connotating some circumstance of profession in that 〈◊〉 rendering it signifâ—… of more as to true inward grace in the heart then 〈…〉 materially is ordinarily and in other times This enuâ—…â—nceive is sufficiently full supposing 〈◊〉 now wâ—… that â—…ted them upon their first professing without delay of time 〈◊〉 â—…her tryall and discoveries section 7 Now to resume these if the 〈…〉 said we might be soon at a point and agreement upon the mater in this Question toâ—…hing the qualification of Church-members necessary in foro Ecclesiastico For this is the very thing upon the mater that we assert and stand for viz. that serious profession of faith and subjection to the Ordinances of God is sufficient And that having this further tryall and 〈…〉 of the soundnesse of the work in the heart is not 〈…〉 foro Ecclesiastico for the â—…mission of persons into the â—…ship of the Visible Church If it shall be said that it was not that profession alone by it self but together with some other outward â—…ble effect accompanying it such as was that mournfull humâ—… expression of these Acts 2. 3. 7. Men and Brethren what 〈…〉 which was sufficient to supply the place of a continued 〈…〉 of their conversation for 〈◊〉 and â—…ing into their experimentall work 〈◊〉 their heart 'T is true that in some at their 〈◊〉 imbracing the Christian faith and Religion we finde some 〈…〉 of that kind accompanying it reported in the â—…ory But 〈◊〉 will say that it was so with all and every one of the many thousands whom the Apostles received and baptized when as the sacred Story in speaking of these who imbraced the Christian Faith and were baptized seldome mentioâ—… or insinuateth any such thing If the 3. be said that it was thâ—â—…fession considered not 〈…〉 such but as connotating soâ—… 〈…〉 of the 〈◊〉 viz. the dangâ—… of persecution that profeâ—… 〈◊〉 Christian 〈◊〉 brought men under then which is the thing Mr. Lockier layeth the great weight on as we did see before pag. 24 25. and that Profession of Christian Religion so cirâ—…stantiate was more pregnant to signifie a great deal more touching inward grace then the same profession for mater doth now or ordinarily out of that case I repone 't is true perseverance and constant holding out in the profession of Religion under the crosse and actuall pressure of persâ—…tion is a good evidence to ground a positive charitable judgement of an honest heart and principle of grace within 〈◊〉 and undertaking the profession when it may probably 〈…〉 is noâ— nothing to this purpose But I desire it ma◠〈◊〉 â—…mbred â—ere that aâ— the Christian Profession then was 〈…〉 dangâ—… of persecution thâ— it was not alwayes actually â—…cuted Some time the Church had rest round about so 〈◊〉 Gospel then was accompanied with greaâ—â—nd many wonders and miracles which are mightily operative upon the minds of men to draw them to the following a Doctrine or way of Religion even without any spirituall heart-change And therefore I think that no man can in reason say that Profession of the Gospel lyable unto danger of persecution yet together accompanied with so great miracles and 〈◊〉 in as to â—ignifying and discovery of inward grace so 〈◊〉 profession the same upon the mater when there is not 〈◊〉 danger and withall neither are there such wonders and miracles accompanying it Further let it be considered that besides that the â—acred historiographer more frequently mentioneth the circumstance of miracles and wonders then that of the danâ—… of persecution in reporting mens bringing to the profeâ—… of â—…ristian faith besides this I say we never read marked in the story that that circumstance of the danger of persecution was taken into account by the Apostles for passing judgement upon the inâ—…â—…cerity of Conversion when they admitted to
Gospel like behaviour which is requisite to be a ground of esteeming persons beleevers what at least is requisite and must concurre to make it up and lesse then which will not serve That so we might have the generall determinat rule whereby cognition is to be made and estimation to be passed upon all professours of the truth that they are beleevers or otherwayes For certainly while as they say but indefinitly such a blamelesse and Gospel behaviour and tells not what is requisite to make up such a behaviour they leave the mater in a mist of uncertainty and for ought we can see devolves the weight of that estimation upon mens apprehensions without a rule If they say they were writing an Epistle to friends and could not therein say all that is to be said in the mater I Answer that if they could have told it it might been said in short bounds and it was as necessary for clearing their mind to have been told as the Thesis they have set down it self But yet let them point us to such a rule in the Word if they know where it lyeth For my part I professe humbly I could never yet see in the Word of God an universall definite rule whereby judgement may and ought to be passed upon all and every professour of the truth by others that they are to be held for true beleevers or otherwise 5. When as in the designation of the persons that are fit to be admitted members of the Visible Church they with Parents joyn their children I do heartily acknowledge their Orthodoxy in this beyond others of that way who have omitted wholly that addition and wishes they may continue in that point of truth considering how easie it is as the Authors of that Epistle themselves may perceive by experience in others that went off with them first by that step they have gone on to slide into that other of excluding the Infants of beleevers from the Visible Church But now I would know whether they acknowledge such Infants members compleatly I mean in actu primo or not If they say the former they are at a disagreement with others of the Independent way If they say the latter then we must have another distinction of constitute members and so many sorts of members of the Visible Church and so also we must have many sorts of qualifications of members section 4 But now take the mater of the Thesis as it is that the necessary qualification to make one of years fit to be admitted a member of the Visible Church is together with profession of the truth such a conversation as may make a man to be esteemed i. e. positively judged a true beleever or Regenerat person I shall not here adde any new reasons to what I have brought before But shall come briefly to consider if these present Authors have brought any new strength of reason for that Tenet Only I would desire them in the fear and love of the truth to consider if they can find in the Word of God amongst all these many whose admission into the fellowship of the Visible Church of Christ is mentioned therein any instance of persons or one person who after their first professing Christian faith and Religion was what ever their behaviour and course had been before to that very time delayed of their admission to be Church-members untill they should be seen and found with that their profession to joyn such a blamelesse and Gospel-like behaviour as the Authors requires many of them no doubt untill that time had been of a very blameable and un Gospel behaviour and course of life And certain it is that to be seen joyning with profession of the truth an unblameable and Gospel-like behaviour requires some delay and length of time For my part I could never yet see any instance of this kind but on the contrary finds that persons as soon as they once embraced the profession of the Christian faith albeit to that very time their behaviour had been most blameable were forthwith baptized and so admitted members into the Christian Church Consider this I beseech you dear brethren if so ye will yet suffer your selves to be called and exhorted by me section 5 But now we come to the grâ—…nds of confirmation of their thesis Such say they were the Churches founded by the Apostles which ought to be paterns to us as appears by the title given to them Saints sanctified justified washed by the blood of Christ For Answer we refer to what we said before to that same inductive Argument in Mr. Lockier now in a word only to make this Argument good it must be alledged and made out not only that all and every one of the Churches founded by the Apostles at least such as are mentioned in Scripture were actually and defacto consisting of such members as were all and every one Saints justified c. in the positive judgement of charity But also were in their gathering constitute of all and every one formally considered and taken in under the notion of such upon tryall found and judged to be such But 1. 'T is not so much as alledged by the Authors that they were so gathered and constituted nor can these titles let them take them as they will import any thing of this 2. Nor suppose these titles should import that the Churchâ—… to which they are given were eventually consisting of such members as were all and every one such Does it follow that all and every one of the Churches founded by the Apostles were so I mean even such of them as are mentioned in Scripture Because these titles are not given unto all and every Church founded by the Apostles or Apostolicall men in the Apostles time We give instance of the Churches Smyrna Pergamus Thyatira Sardis Laodicea nay had the Authors duely considered what is said of these Churches Revel 2 and 3. I think they could not in reason said what they say here Nor 3. Doe these titles import necessarily that the Churches to which they are given did de facto and eventually consist of all and every one such These titles may and must at least of some of them be understood of their visible body synecdochically by a denomination taken from the better part as I would rather say of the body communiter confuse not universaliter section 6 The Authors of the Epistle touches not at the two former exceptions which yet are sufficient to overturn this Argument and I doubt not but one of the Authors he that as I conceive has been the Penner of this Epistle a man well enough acquainted in Argumentation and able to discern what may be alledged to be defective in an induction might well perceived but only labours to infring the third We cannot say they acquiesce to the common Answer that these expressions are to be understood of the better part Answ Yet as good and as judicious as you the whole stream of Interpreters untill Anabaptists
not conceive this exhortation tho to a duty of common obligation yet particularly intended and directed by the Apostle to the elect and truely redeemed amongst them not distinctly by the head and name pointing them out but confusè in the Visible Society they were amongst 2. Passing that assumption of the first syllogism the assumption of the second which is brought to prove the major of the first is as loose viz. that all these persons to whom the exhortation is directed or are exhorted to flee fornication are exhorted by that Argument taken from redemption as their condition This may well be denyed for why may not an exhortation to a common duty directed to a whole society mixed of persons of different spirituall conditions be pressed upon all by some Arguments common to all such as that whereby this exhortation is pressed vers 18. and upon some by some speciall Argument relating properly to them There can be no circumstance of the context alledged to prove why it may not be conceived to be so here supposing that the exhortation is directed to all But 3. To beat out the bottom of this Argument I prove from the very Text it self that the Apostle here speaking to the persons whom he calleth redeemed speaketh of them as such in the verity of the thing or object i. e. as truly and really redeemed and consequently cannot be conceived to speak it of all and every one in the Church of Corinth as the Authors themselves will confesse I doubt not I prove it thus these whom the Apostles calls Redeemed here they are such as might and ought themselves to know and be assured that they were Redeemed and had the Spirit of God dwelling in them But only such as are in realâ—ty and the verity of the thing Redeemed c. may and ought to know and be assured of this of themselves Therefore the second Part of this Argument is clear because otherwise a man might and ought to know and be assured of a lie concerning his estate which is deluded presumption The first part is also clear from the Apostles words v. 19. What know ye not that your bodies are the Temples of the Holy Ghost c. That know ye not so frequently used by the Apostle especially in these Epistles to the Corinthians and in this very Chapter five times imports a certain assurance of the thing he is speaking of and therefore here the Apostle imports that these whom he is speaking to as redeemed and having the Spirit dwelling in them they are such as may and ought to be assuredly sensible that they were redeemed And is not this place parallel to that of the very like expression 2 Cor. 13. 5. Know ye not that Christ is in you Which all Protestant Divines presse against Papists for proving Believers certain assurance and perswasion of grace and salvation Therefore I conclude That the Apostle by these whom he calls the Temple of the Holy Ghost understands them that are such indeed and in truth of the object and not in the judgment of charity And what an incongruous interpretation were it to put upon these words Know ye not that ye are the temples of the Holy Ghost redeemed with a price this sense Know ye not that ye are accounted in the judgment of charity temples of the Holy Ghost c. 4. Yet I think it cannot in truth be said that all and every one in the Church of Corinth were judged positively by the Apostle in the judgment of charity gracious renewed and sanctified ones even because of the grosse wickednesse he in these Epistles expresseth himself to have known to be amongst them section 7 The last exception the Authors of the Epistle goes about to obviate thus Neither hath it any weight with us to the contrair which is objected that there were grosse faults amongst them as divisions intemperance questioning the Resurrection incest Will not Lots drunkennesse Davids adultery Peters deniall prove these to be sins incident to the Saints tho justly censurable as the incestuous was excommunicate a man who once as is spoken of Gaius hath been approven of the truth it self though he be overtaken with grosse infirmitie albeit for it he be censurable according to the nature of his offence yea the highest Ecclesiastick Censure passe against him yet he is to be esteemed as a brother 2 Thes 3. 15. Answ 1. Tho that objected hath not with you yet has it had with many judicious and godly men in the Church of God both ancient and moderne much weight to the contrair I name for the present but one there be no doubt of many others because of the Controversie he is upon in making use of this consideration The godly Orthodox and ancient Augustine ad Donatist as post collationem cap. 21. where disputing against the Donatists maintaining separation from all other Christian Churches because of the mixture 〈◊〉 many wicked ones amongst them from that place 2 Cor. 6. 14 15 16 17. just as these Authors of this Epistle do afterward from that same very place ut non sit ovum ovo similius answers them from the consideration of these many grosse wickednesses expressed by the Apostle as abounding in that Church that there were many gracelesse persons amongst them yet they neither made nor were commanded to make separation from that Church I humbly desire the judicious Reader to be at the pains to read the whole Chap. and I shall but point at two or three remarkable Passages of it here see the Margine * In eodem quippe ipso populo CorinthioruÌ„ quod dicimus demonstramus ne forte arbitrentur prophetarum tantummodo moris fuisse non ad Novi Testsed ad Vâ—…eris consuetudinem pertinere sâ—c arguere reprehensibiles quasi omnes in eo populo arguantur sic allo qui laudabiles quasi omnes illi laâ—dantur Ecce ad Corinthlos sic Apostalus loquitur Paulus vocatus Iesu Christi per voluntatem Dei Sostheneâ— frater Ecclesiae quae est Corinthi sanctificatis in Iesu Christo vocatis sanctis Quis haec avdiens credat in Ecclesia Corinthiorum esse aliquos reprobos quandoquidem verba ista sic sonant velut ad omnes directa sit laudatio Et tamen paulo post dicit Obsâ—…ro autem fratres ut id ipsnm dicatis omnes non siâ—t in vobis schismata In ipsis etiam Corinthiis ibi erant qui non credebant resurrectionem mortuorum quae singularis sides est Christianorum Attendamus verbailla quibus Câ—inthiorum Ecclesiam in principio Epistolae sic laudat ut dicatâ— Gratias ago Deo meo semper pro vobis in gratia Det quae data est vobis in Christo Icsu quia in omnibus divites facti est is Ecce sic erant ditati in Christo in omni verbo in omni scientia ita ut iis nihil decsset in ulla graetia ut in illis essent qui resurrectionem
these Mat. 3. be called many yet their might been Pharisees many more ten to one beside of whom that Luke 7. 30. might be said Now considering that the Publicans and other such common people tho all of them were not baptized of Iohn yet generally they shew themselves more obedient and respective to the Ordinances Ministred by Iohn as also they did unto Christ himself then the Pharisees did albeit some of them also might been disobedient to him and not baptized by him it may be clearly enough seen that the Pharisees were much behind them in this and that Christ might justly chide the Pharisees as worse then the Publicans for the cause mentioned speaking of them indefinitely tho all and every one of them had not been in the blame This is not unusuall in comparing two sorts orders or conditions of persons to blame the one as worse then the other in such a particular respect in an indefinite speech when the one is more generally blame-worthy that way then the other tho may be some of the party blamed are free of the fault and some of the party commended may be deep enough in that fault This much for clearing Iohn Baptists procedure in admitting persons to baptism viz. that he did baptize persons coming to him upon their first profession withour delay or waiting for discoveries of true heart Conversion and Saintship in them section 12 Having ended this Argument from Iohns order of baptizing they tell us that many moe and more pressing grounds from the Word might be alledged to make forth this point But we are loath say they to be tedious only sure wee are holinesse becomes the House of our God It is certain our Churches are not constitute according to this rule in the full extent of it Yea alas few of our most precious men will acknowledge it to be the rule Answ 1. Albeit the Authors conceiving to their knowledge many moe grounds to be in the Word of God for making forth their point and having set down here but some few of them omitting the rest might without incurring the hazard of animadversion alledged that they passed these others being loath to be tedious because to wit they were writing an Epistle not a Tractat Yet their purpose being in this Epistle to give an account of their thoughts as they say in the beginning in this mater to some Godly men I humbly conceive that when as they say that there might be alledged more pressing grounds which I doubt not but they speak as even to their own knowledge for their point then they have alledged but they are loath to be tedious by setting them down This censure might justly be put upon it that either it is an open writing themselves with their own pen knowingly foolish wrongers of their own cause When as purposing to pick out some few grounds of many for giving an account of their belief to men whom they would give some satisfaction to and draw to their judgement and side they leave out the grounds that are most pressing for making out their point But verily I think some of them at least not so simple as to have committed wittingly and willingly such an errour Or it is give me leave to say it a meer windy word to say the least inconsideratly uttered And how sinfull a thing it is so to speak especially in maters of this kind they are not ignorant 2. But is that word Psal 93. ult Holinesse becometh thine House for ever hinted at to close up the mater one of these more pressing grounds for making forth their point O! but first this is an Old Testament Scripture spoken in relation to the then Churches of the Old Testament whatever the place importeth as well as to the Gospel Churches Now why then did you before as seems with your Master restrict your Doctrine concerning the qualification of Church-members to the Gospel Churches Or if you will now disown that restriction is it your minde that this Holinesse you plead for was also the rule of admitting Members to the Visible Church under the Old Testament Then sure Moses was in a great fault who walked not by this rule in his practise about Church Members as no man can deny Far be it from you to say it Brethren when the Lord hath given him a Testimony that he was faithfull in all his house 2. We shall not here mention the diverse interpretations of these Words of the Psalm given by severall interpreters see Calv. Pareus in locum the most genuine interpretation I conceive to be Either to take them as our English translation renders them Holinesse becometh thine House and so as holding forth the duty of these who are the Lords House Or thus rendring them to thy house beautifull holinesse viz. belongeth as their peculiar priviledge bestowed on them by thee but whither of these wayes they be taken they make nothing to the Authors point Not taking them in the latter interpretation as is evident the Authors I beleve will not say that God by the efficacy of his Grace works Holinesse in all and every Member of the Visible Church Nor yet taking them in the former According to which the simple meaning of them is no other but that which is expressed in the latest edition of the English Annot. on the place a holy life and conversation becometh them that professe themselves to be servants to so great and glorious a Majesty and who of us will deny this this importeth what is the duty of all that professe themselves to be in so neer a relation to God as his House which is to be Holy in the Truth of the thing or object and not only so to cary it before men as to be esteemed by them such in charity which men may doe without the reality or Trueth of the thing And this we grant that men professing themselves the people of God ought in duty as they would answer their profession to be truely Holy But what is this to the point of the qualification necessarily requisite in persons in foro Ecclesiastico that they may be admitted to the externall fellowship of the Church Wherefore 3. we confesse our Churches were not constitute according to this rule I mean of the Holinesse spoken of in that passage of the Psalm Nor indeed could they nor can ever any Churches in this world be so constituted because it is true Holinesse in the reality and truth of the thing that is spoken of which falls not under the cognition of the Ecclesiastick court to be a rule of admitting persons unto the constitution of the Visible Church 4. I know not well whom they mean by these few at least precious men whom they insinuate to acknowledge their rule Except they mean themselves who have sinfully separated themselves from the Church of Christ But I may say they have no cause to weep and say alas for the precious men that will not acknowledge their new rule of
of Elderships and Presbyteries of more Congregations consociated that they may lawfully be and of diverse sorts is confessed But there are these points especially concerning them of which there is controversie between us and our Brethren section 4 The 1. is concerning the nature of their power over the severall Congregations or Churches consociated in them Our Brethren of the Independent way attribute no other power unto them but of counsel perswasion to informe and hold forth unto the Churches what is commanded by the Word of God to exhort perswade them to their duty to obedience of what they find commanded in the Word But allow them no authority and jurisdictionall power to enjoine their determinations from the Word authoritatively under pain of Ecclesiasticall censures So Mr. Hooker in the forecited place pag. 2 3. 't is true he calls this power of counsell by the name of Authority And so Mr. Lockier from him Sect. 30. but an authoritative power of meer counsell advice and persuasion may be justly counted a Chimaera But we shall not contend about names Call it authority or power or what you will the thing it self is nothing else but brotherly counsell which hath no binding force formally as issuing from the Presbyterie But bindeth meerly vi materiae materially in regard of the thing which is propounded by them as it is a Scripture truth or command as is confessed by Mr. Hooker And this is no more then one Brother may do towards another and one sister Church may do to another Mr. Cotton in the Keyes ch 6. seemeth to attribute more power to a Synod They have sayeth he power not onely to give light and counsell in mater of truth and practice But also to command and enjoine the things to be believed and done The expresse words of the Synodicall letter imply no lesse Act. 15. 27. It is an act of the power of the Keyes to binde burdens and this binding power ariseth not only materially from the weight of the maters imposed which are necessary necessitate praecepti from the word but also formally from the authority of the Synod which being an ordinance of Christ bindeth the more For the Synods sake This in the letter of the words is a flat contradiction to what Mr. Hooker sayeth He sayeth they have only a power of Brotherly counsell Mâ— Cotton not only that but also to command and enjoin He sayeth they bind only materially because what they determine is either expressed in or infallibly collected out of the Word Mr. Cotton not only materially but also formally from the authority of the Synode Yet I conceive for all such fair words in the intention and reall meaning of the Author little more is understood than what Mr. Hooker sayeth at most nothing more but a Doctrinall power which is competent to any single Pastour as M. Caudrey sheweth Vindiciae clav c. 6. pag. 53. We on the contrare assert that by warrand of the Word of God the Presbyteries of associated Churches Classicall or Synodicall have a power and authority of Spirituall jurisdiction whereby they authoritatively discerne maters Ecclesiasticall and impose these decrees under pain of Ecclesiastick censures and may inflict Ecclesiastick censures upon the disobedient and refractory in the particular Congregations within the combination or association Only let it be observed here that this authoritative and juridicall power we attribute to such Presbyteries of discerning maters Ecclesiasticall and imposing their determinations under pain of censure is not Autocratorick and absolute binding absolutely by vertue of their authority But Ministeriall and adstricted in its determinations to the rule of the Word of God So that that obligation formall which floweth from the authority of the Judicatory into the decree in actu exercito presupposeth that materiall obligation of the thing decreed as contained in the Word of God else it hath not place section 5 2. Point of Controversie is that the Independent Brethren doe not allow the standing use of such associated Presbyteries But only occasionall We assert that by warrand of the Word of God some such Presbyteries are of standing use as standing ordinary juridicall Ecclesiasticall Courts We say that Classicall Presbyteries in the ordinary settled case of Churches are necessary standing Courts for administration of Ecclesiasticall Government and also that Superiour Presbyteries Synodicall may be warrantably of standing use where and when conveniently moe Presbyteriall or Classicall Churches may have and injoy actuall combination as of Yearly Provinciall Synods as in the Churches of the Low Countries are more frequent Provinciall Synods and yearly Nationall Assemblies as in the Churches of this Kingdome of Scotland 3. Point is concerning subordination of lesser Assemblies to greater The Independent Brethren deny altogether subordination of Inferiour Assemblies to Superiour as juridicall Ecclesiasticall Courts Albeit they acknowledge that difficulties arising in a particular Congregation in matters of Government there may be a going out to an Assembly of more Churches and if need be full satisfaction and clearing not being found there there may be a going forth yet to a greater and more large Assembly Yet they say that is elective and only by way of reference and arbitration and only for counsell and direction and assert that a particular Congregation is the supream Ecclesiasticall Juridicall Tribunall under Jesus Christ upon earth So that a person although wronged by an unjust sentence there as they are not in their determinations infallible suppose sentenced to Excommunication which cutteth him off from the benefit of Church Ordinances and fellowship of Christians in all the Churches of the World he may have no appeal from their sentence to another Superiour Judicatory to have his processe juridically recognosced and the injurious sentence rescinded but must ly under it without any Ecclesiastick remedy till death unlesse that particular Congregation be pleased themselves to revoke their sentence So doth Mr. Hooker tell us Survey par 3. c. 3. pag. 40 41 43. and par 4. pag. 19. We on the contrary assert that both the Law of Nature and the positive Law of God revealed in his Word both in the Old and New Testament holdeth out to us a juridicall subordination of lesser Assemblies Ecclesiasticall unto greater so that appeals may be made from Inferiour and lesser to Superiour and greater Assemblies That it is both against the Law of nature and the positive Law of God to place a supream Independent Ecclesiasticall juridicall power in a particular Congregation yea or in any lesser Assembly when as a greater and Superiour is to be had and may conveniently be had We assert also that that series and gradation of this subordination which is acknowledged and maintained by Protestant Churches viz. of Congregationall Classicall Provinciall and Nationall Assemblies is lawfull and agreeable to the Word of God section 6 Whereas there are these three principall points of Controversie concerning the matter in hand The thing Mr. Lockier propoundeth to dispute against
and serve tables And therefore it was necessary some Officers should be ordained who 's more proper and chief work it might be to see to that businesse Yet certainly the Apostolick office containing in it eminently the power of all inferiour Officers in the Church it was an act formally belonging to their office and no Question even after these ordinary Officers were appointed particularly to attend that businesse yet the Apostles did not then altogether cease from joining in acting thereanent where they might conveniently without hindring their main work the preaching and spreading of the Gospel section 8 But in all this where are joint voices and suffrages of Officers Elders and Brethren of diverse particular Churches commissionated to this work to make up this Presbytery we speak of Answ There was joint acting of Officers of more Congregations than one the many Congregations whereof the Church of Jerusalem did consist whether they were distinguished and fixed in Members and Officers or not is all one and these Officers Elders to these Churches the Apostles who as they were Officers so were Elders too and acting as Elders because in a mater competent to ordinary Elders and jointly 2. Brethren not Officers may be present in such a Presbytery and speak and give their consultative judgement orderly But as no constituent parts of this Presbytery in our judgement nor according to the truth 3. When the Presbytery of more Congregations than one is made up of all the Elders of these Congregations assembled together personally a particular commission for that is not necessary Indeed in such Presbyteries as all the Elders of the severall Churches meet not personally but by some of their number delegated it is as in Synods necessary that these who make up such a Presbytery be commissionated from their severall Churches respectivè Yet by that commission they get not power simply to act the acts of Government therein that they have by their ordination to their office but a particular warrand and call to act that power hic nunc for the good of the Churches in the combination section 9 In the same SECT viz. 25. from what he has answered to the former passage he labours to answer other two places 1. That Act. 6. 3 4 5 6. about the choosing of Deacons and their ordination To which his answer is The Apostles as extraordinary persons layed hands on these But what appears from hence of such an Eldership excerped and commissioned from severall Churches as Presbyterians now assert and use is yet to find Answ 1. I wonder that Mr. Lockier should obtrude upon us such a naked Assertion that the Apostles did lay hands upon and ordain these Deacons as extraordinary persons i. e. as Apostles and not as Elders without making the last essay of answer to that reason brought by the Reverend Assembly of Divines against the dissenting Brethren asserting the same Ans to the reasons of the Dissenting Brethren pag. 52. I present it here in their own words that the Reader may consider if it be not of such weight as Mr. Lockier had cause to take it unto consideration if he had not thought fitter to dictate to then by light of reason to convince the judgement of his Readers As for that ordination Act. 6. we doubt not to say that in it they did act partly as Apostles partly as Elders In constituting an office in the Church which was not before they did act their Apostolicall authority But in ordaining unto that office men whom the Church had chosen they did act as Presbyters And we doubt not but that our Brethren will herein concur with us For if they will not say that they did herein act partly as Apostles and partly as Elders they must say they acted either only as Apostles or only as Elders If only as Elders thence it will follow that all Elders have power not only to ordain men but to erect new Offices in the Church If only as Apostles then hence is no warrand for any Elders so much as to ordain men unto an office But I yet wonder so much the more at this Assertion of Mr. Lockier here remembering what he had delivered before SECT 10. where he drawes an Argument from ordination of Elders performed by the Apostles for regulating the ordination of Elders in Churches now and thereupon alledging tho groundlessely that the Apostles in ordination took in the people to concurrence with them concludeth that now also they ought to concur formally in that act If they had acted as extraordinary persons as Apostles the people could not concur jointly with then in such an act nor could it been an Argument brought as a patern in ordinary Now if they acted not by their extraordinary office and power in ordaining Elders what reason is there to say that in the ordination of these Deacons they acted in that way 2. As to that but what appears from hence c. We say supposing that the Church of Jerusalem was made up of many Congregations and these Congregations were one Church which are proven from other Scriptures we find from hence for proving such a Presbytery as we speak for Officers of these Congregations meeting together for Government and joining in an act of Government ordination of Church Officers viz. The Apostles doing this and that as Elders which is the thing it is brought for by Presbyterians Which tho-by it self makes not a full medium to prove that Presbytery yet with the other suppositions taken with it makes very much to prove it section 10 2. Place is Acts 20. 28. The Elders there are shewed not to be Elders of many Churches which Paul sent for but the Elders of the Church v. 17. of one Church of the Church of Ephesus and charging them to attend to the stock and not to flocks ver 28. here is no joynt veice of various commissioned Elders Answ To passe that some of his own the Dissenting Brethren in the Assembly once in their Reasons against the instance of the Church of Ephesus make these both Elders and flocks to whom the Apostle speaketh to be of all Asia not only of Ephesus where no doubt there were more particular Churches To passe this because indeed these same Authors a little after when it may serve their turn they confine them to Ephesus We grant 't is true they were Elders of one Church the Church of Ephesus But withall we say that one Church was not one single Congregation but made up of more then one and consequently was one Presbyteriall Church This is proven by sundry Learned particularly by the Reverend Assembly of Divines in their instance of the Church of Ephesus and all the Reasons of the Dissenting Brethren brought to the contrare fully discussed in their Answers threunto As for the Authors Grammaticall Argument they are called Elders of the Church in the Singular Number not Churches and they are bid attend the flock not flocks Ergo it was but one single
Congregation ' tisfilly and might well be said among Children but may blush to come out before understanding Men. By this Argument when our Saviour sayeth upon this Rock will I build my Church And the Apostle 1 Cor. 12. He hath set in the Church First some Apostles c. And Ephes 5. He loved his Church and gave himself for it Because it is in the Singular Number Church not Churches in all these places Therefore it must be only one single Congregation meant in all of them When as it is indeed the whole Catholick Church and not any particular singular Congregation So the name flock in the Singular Number why may it not be taken collectivè for such a flock as contained in it diverse particular flocks as Gen. 33. 13. yea and in the very present Metaphoricall sense 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Luke 12. 32. little flock and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 John 10. 16. one Sheep fold tho both in the Singular Number yea and in the latter place with the Cardinall number added to it one signifieth the Church Catholick and so comprehendeth many particular Flocks Folds and Churches As to M. Lockiers last words in this Sect. here is no joint voice c. indeed we grant that in that meeting there was no joint voting of Elders Because these Elders then were not meet to act in Government but had been sent for by Paul to receive direction from him concerning the managing of their charge But supposing that which is proved from other places that there were more single Congregations in Ephesus then one we find here these Congregations held forth to be one Church and there were many Elders over these many Congregations as one flock one Church And that is enough for our purpose The next place he meeteth with and which he calleth one of the most weighty indeed it is so weighty to the purpose we are on that it crusheth the new supream Independent Tribunall erected by our Brethren in single Congregations is that concerning the Synod Act. 15. 28. To this the Author Answers 1. Here sayeth he is an Eldership of severall Churches indeed met But as touching the coercion of their power as such excerped Eldership enforcing their results upon other Churches this is the other thing to be brought in to make up the businesse we Dispute against Answ First 't is well Mr. Lockier acknowledgeth that was an Eldership of severall Churches even a Synodicall Presbytery a Synod as himself calls it afterward Sect. 29. Some of his side have said otherwise the Dissenting Brethren in their Reasons against the Assemblies allegation of Acts 15. for subordination of Synods That Ass was not a formall Synod but only a reference by the particular Church of Antioch unto this particular Church of Jerusalem and no other But we think Mr. Lockier speaketh the truth that it was a Synod 2. We must here again note his invidious misrepresenting of our Doctrine We do not ascribe to that or any other Synod a power of coertion to enforce their results upon any but an authoritative juridicall power to enjoyn authoritatively their determinations agreeable to the Word of God and to censure the disobedient and disorderly with meer spirituall censures as admonition Excommunication which import no enforceing â— propriety of speech Nor do we say that that or any other Synod hath power thus authoritatively to enjoyn their determinations upon other Churches we say they have this power only in relation to these Churches associated in the Synod and none other So not that which Mr. Lockier sayeth but this is the other thing to be brought in to make the Presbytery we speak for what ever it be that he Disputes against which oftentimes is his own fiction an juridicall power authoritatively enjoining its determinations and which may censure with spirituall Ecclesiastick censures the disobeyers and disorderly And this we doubt not will be found in this place Act. 15. section 11 After this the Author pretending to be clear and full in answering this place he premitteth two things which Reverend Hocker hath also Survey Part. 4. c. 1. 1 That the Apostles tho they were extraordinary Officers yet in this meeting they did not act as such because they joined with them ordinary Churches what ordinary Churches is contradistinguished unto I know not well and Officers and all Disputed and enquired And so here was left a samplar to all succeeding generations In this we agree with him Only by the way we note that we see not why he should have said before Sect. 25. that in the ordination of Deacons the Apostles acted as extraordinary persons seeing there also they joined the Church with them in the election of the persons to be ordained His 2. premisse is that the sentence decreed in that Synod was not Scripture because they decreed it as still it was when the Apostles moved by the proper Spirit of their Apoâ—…olicall station according to that 2 Pet. 1. 21. but what they decreed was by debate found out to be either expresse in Scripture or undenyably deduced from thence So by one of these wayes was found to be Scripture and was therefore decreed and injoyned by them upon others And then goes out a while in clearing this which we need not insist on And to passe other things that might be noted in this second premisse granting both what would he infer hereupon That in the close of Sect. 28. So that what they produced by debate was materially binding for asmuch as what they produced was for the matter of it no other but the will of God but not formally as the result of such a Collegiat Eldership Answ This last followeth not upon any thing in the former premisses For tho their decrees were not Scripture because decreed by them but decreed by them because found to be Scripture or agreeable to generall rules of Scripture and therefore injoined by them to the Churches It followes indeed that their primary and fundamentall obligatorinesse is materiall And were they not such they could not formally as decrees of the Synod be obligatory or binding But it doth not follow that simpliciter they are not binding formally as decrees of the Synod The obligatorinesse of decrees of a Synod formally as decrees of a Synod is secundary subordinate and regulate but for that it is not no obligatorinesse at all Yea one of his own contradicts him in terminis in this Mr. Cotton speaking of the decrees of this very Synod Keyes c. 6. this binding power is not only materially from the weight of the matters imposed which are necessary necessitate praecepti from the word but also formally from the Authority of the Synod section 12 But come we to his clear Answ he brings it in by way of reply to an Object Had then this Synod no authoritative power at all For what end then is the Ordinance This indeed is a pertinent Question propounded by the Author to himself And if he asserting as
Having briefly noted thus upon Mr. Hookers two Syllogismes we return to our Author section 18 In the close of this his first Argument for confirmation thereof he addeth thus That here they did acquiesce viz. in â—inding the Churchâ—… to which they sent only by way of counsel and materially and did not further meddle with any juridicall processe upon them appears by these pacifick words which would they were written not with ink and pen but with the spirit of the Lord upon all Presbyters hearts who are so turbulent in these 〈◊〉 Froâ— which if you keep your selves you shall do well Ans Mr. Lockier is here in a great mistake while as he insinuateth that if the Synod did not meddle with juridicall processe viz. as I conceive to censure upon them to whom they sent the decrees that it must then be said they acquiesced in meer giving of counsâ—ll 〈…〉 Court or Judicatory had no other act of authoritativâ— Jurisdictioâ— but processing persons to censure When as the making 〈◊〉 authoritative imposing of constitutions which indeed makes persons liable to censure in case of disobedience is an act of juridicall Authority though there be no processing personâ—â—o censure presently joined therewith And that 〈◊〉 this 〈…〉 and authoritatively I mean Ministerially impos◠〈◊〉 â—…tions upon the Churches the they went 〈…〉 to 〈◊〉 â—ny of them hâ—s been abundaâ—…ly proven by the Authoâ—… 〈…〉 2. Yea they did actually put â—orth a 〈…〉 the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 schisme and disseâ—… 〈…〉 Teachers by stigmatiâ—… 〈…〉 Teacherâ— and 〈◊〉 them by declâ—ring them 〈…〉 the Church â—oâ—…tters of souls and â—acitely 〈…〉 words unto whom we gave no such 〈…〉 â—o â—e 〈…〉 of the Apostles and Elderâ— of Jerusâ—… 〈…〉 to Preach this Doctrine Thâ—… 〈…〉 of censure and â—ended to more if they 〈…〉 incorâ—igible and obstiâ—…◠But 〈…〉 good earâ—est when as he sayeth 〈…〉 of the Synodicall Epistle to 〈◊〉 Churchâ—… 〈…〉 to these matters 〈◊〉 give couâ—sell 〈…〉 Churches and wish that for thâ— purpose they 〈◊〉 Wrâ—…en not with 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 c. as if forâ—ooth because the Synoâ—â—nd their decrees in an Epistle which was a respectfull way because they recommend the practice and obediâ—… of them by the goodnesse thâ—reof this did necessarily imporâ— they did not enjoin them by authority but only advised them by way of Christian counsell Verily such reasoning â—…red with such a â—hetoricall wish Would they were Written c. I think may blâ—sh in the present of any intelligent man As for that bitter â—ccuâ—…tion the Authâ—r gives in against all Presbyters he meâ—… Presbyteriâ—ns not Presbyters of his own way sure as turbuâ—ent persons we wish the Lord may lay it to his conscience but not to his charge For ouâ— selves it being cast upon us for no other cause but for standing to the maintainance and avowing of the Cause of Jesus Christ and the due authority of his Ordinances we shall â—…ntly 〈◊〉 our selves with that of his Blessed are ye when men 〈…〉 you and shall say all manner of evill against 〈…〉 for my sake so persecuted they the Prâ—pheâ—s which were before you section 19 His second reason aâ—…edged to prove this Synod did exercise only a power of counsell Sect. 3â— in 〈◊〉 iâ— this much The conâ—roversie decided in this Synod being between the Church of Antioch and some Judaizing Tâ—achers it is evident that one side in the Synod was a party to wit them of Antioâ—h Now for these who were a party and â—ontested against their opposites to be judge in their own cause and to be juridicall upon their Antagonists by their own power cannot equiâ—ably or conscionably be imagined It is saith Hooker against rule Answ I remember this very objection is one of the grounds of thâ—… Protestation and Declinator made by the Remonstrants against that 〈…〉 Reverend Synod of Dort Because to wit a great part of the Members of the Synod were their adverse party had by Preaching and Writing before condemned their Doctrine 〈◊〉 errour and that the Law of Nature doth not permit that 〈…〉 be judge in their own cause Which 〈…〉 unanimous suffrage of the 〈…〉 â—ull and the reasons whereupon they did 〈◊〉 it which are to be seen in the acts of the Synod â—ess â—9 do abundantly refuse this reason alledged to prove that this Synod 〈…〉 did only exercise a power of counsell and 〈…〉 authoritatively determine the mater 〈…〉 Not being willing to fill up much paper with transcriptionâ— I 〈◊〉 the judicious Reâ—der to the suffrages of these reverend and learned Diviâ—… themselves for more full satisfaction For the present brieâ—… it is a grosse mistake of our Author and Mr. Hooker from whom â—e hath it that these Commissioners of the Church of Antioâ—h members of this Synod if the Synod did juâ—…dically and authoritatively judg and determine in the mater that was before them did judge in their own cause if he mean their own proper private cause the â—…ter of their judgement was not the proper private cause 〈◊〉 any member of the Synod but the publick cause of GOD and his Church the doctrine of justificatiâ—… which the Judaâ—…ing Teachers did corrupt and the peace of the Church which they disturbed Now thâ— persons cannot be both an adverse party and Judge in their own private cause which concerneth themselves yet in a publick cause this may be Even in civill maters this may and must be in some cases The persons that constitute the supream Judicatory of a Nation suppose the Parliament they are both adverse party and Judge in publick causes as in maters of treason c. Especially this exception from that Maâ—ime which is alledged that persons cannot be both adverse party and Judge in their own cause must not have place in maters and controversies of Religion otherwise there could be no judiciall way at all for condemning false and haereticall Teachers For certain it is that all Ministers of Jesus Christ are oblidged by their Calling and the Commandement of God not only to teach and instruct the people of God positively in the truth â—ut also to reâ—ute the errors and stop the mouths of opposers and adversaries of the Truth so that when any broach and vent errors in the Church of God the Ministers of Christ must not stand neutrals and indifferent but must and ought both by word and wriâ— reâ—uâ—e â—nd 〈◊〉 them and be an adverse party to tâ—…m Must they therefore because they do their duty in opposing Teachers of errors in their severall particular stations be uncapable in an Assembly to judge and condemne these errors and abettors of them judicially Verily this were nothing else but to proclaim 〈◊〉 to 〈…〉 spirits in the world to teach and spread 〈…〉 without any controlement in an Ecclesiasticall way And veâ—…ly this principle That persons that are an adverse party to false Teachers in maters of Religion cannot be Judgeâ— on the controversie between them and these Teachers was very far from the the thoughts of
never so tender if rightly informed as they did eat so with good satisfaction they might eat it And generally what is not ordinarily to be done by a positive laâ— in an extraordinarie case when necessity requires may be done and a tender heart have good satisfaction in the doing of it even in things divine 2. The nature and constitution of Gods Ordinances is not estimat and defined according to what shape the hearts of men are apt to conceive he has put upon them but according to what his own word saith of his will concerning them It was yeelding to this aptitude of mens hearts in conceiving Gods shaping of Ordinances that baptizing by private persons and even midwives did spring from into the Church of God 3. The ordinary and expresse rule that we speak of that single Congregations should not exercise acts of jurisdiction of publick and common concernment by themselves alone without associat Elderships relates to the case when association may be had But when association cannot possibly be had as if a Congregation be in a remote Iland or divided from all other Churches by some other insuperable impediment of fellowship we say that in that case of necessity it is the ordinary rule to that Congregation to act as it is alone by it self If it shall be said seeing when it is that way alone it may exercise these Ordinances within it self then if other Congregations being in a capacitie to be joined with it may not exercise them alone it is abridged off the former liberty it had before when it was alone by it self I answ this is no abridgement of its liberty but only a strengthening of their power in things of common concernment As suppose there being five Elders in a Congregation while as they are only these five they may act in the Government of that Congregation Yet if other fix be added to them they may not now act without these yet this is no abridging of any liberty they had but a strengthening of their power The truth is that a Congregation in an incapacity of association with other Congregations exerciseth and dispenseth all these Ordinances within it self not as being one single Congregation but as being the whole Church A Congregation in such a case is as if there were not another Congregation in the world and that is to be the whole Church interpretativè Just as there being in a Congregation five Elders only these five act all things belonging to Elders in the Congregation not because they are such a definite competent number but because they are the whole number Because if they did act as being such a definite number they could not admit any moe to joyne with them in the work section 9 Further it is saith he confessed by our Brethren that the Judicatures of Classes and Congregations do not differ specifically but only in extension Then if they differ only in extension the intrinsecall power of the Elders of the Congregation is the same with the Elders of Classes And then there is no specificall act that the one puts forth but the other can put forth too as occasion shall require can Ordain and Excommunicate as the Collegiat Church and so is the Congregationall Church compleat if the Classicall Church be Answ 1. Mr. Lockier is not well enough acquainted it seemeth with the judgement of all Pâ—esbyterians concerning the difference between Congregationall and Classicall Elderships when as he sayeth that they confesse there is no specificall or formall difference between them if he were acquainted better with them he would find some to be of that mind that tho there be Elders of a single Congregation yet that there is not a Presbytery of a single Congregation having power to exercise Ecclesiasticall jurisdiction and I confesse it is hard to find any pattern in the Word of God of such a Presbytery But 2. When as he sayeth that in the confession of Presbyterians they differ only in extension he mistakes the judgement of the most part of all Presbyterians who and that indeed according to truth hold that the power of a Classicall Presbytery as to the exercise of Government not only reaches a larger object i. e. differs in extension but also more acts of jurisdiction as Ordination Excommunication which the Eldership of a single Congregation as one single Congregation cannot exercise and that is to differ intensivè But I suppose all were granted which is asked here that Classicall Presbyteries differ not specifically from Congregationall that their power of jurisdiction differs only extensivè that there is no specificall act exercised by the Classicall but the Congregationall may exercise in it self when occasion requires and so that it is compleat this way which is just such compleatnesse as we mean when we say that a Boy is a compleat Man tho all this were granted does it hereupon follow that larger associate Presbyteries juridicall are uselesse devices of men No wayes as has been shewed before Altho it were granted that the Eldership of a particular Congregation may exercise all these specificall acts there may be many cases wherein it may be not only expedient but necessary that the matter be judged and determined by an associate Presbytery as when it is a matter of great difficultie when other Congregations are much and nearly or equally concerned when there is division and difference in the Congregationall Eldership or Church that the matter cannot be agreed upon and determined amongst themselves when there is an appeal propter malam administrationem vel malam administrationem praesumptam c. section 10 Finally SECT 46. If the particular Church had not been compleat to do its own work without a forrain an associate Eldership the Apostles would have mentioned something of this combineing of Elderships and when this might been surely the Church of Christ durst not neglect the use of it And yet we find not the one and do find the other the Apostle when he took his leave of the Church of Ephesus commends it not to associat Elders but both Elders and people as one flock to the grace of God Act. 20. 32. Answ 1. Let it be so that the particular Church is compleat to do its own work Yet 1. Is not every Congregation as a part of the whole body of the Visible Church of Christ to look to the work of fellow members and parts and of the whole according to its measure and proportion of power Should one member say to another I must see to my own work Ought I to care for thee Are there not matters of publick and common concernment 2. No particular Church is politically so compleat as to do every work of its own in every case as has been shewed but it will in this stand in need of an associat Superiour Eldership 3. It hath been abundantly proven by the Authors we referred to before that Scripture is not silâ—nt but often mentioneth the thing of associated Presbyteries and all
offended and to esteem and account as we do a sentence of non-Communion by them by Churches against us upon such scandals wherein they are not satisfied an heavy and sad punishment and to be looked upon as a means to humble us and an Ordinance of God to reduce us If those men pillars of the Independent way had accounted as Mr. Lockier does Presbyterian Churches to be idolatrous would they have professed to hold retain such Communion with them Nay do they not themselves alledge all these things as Arguments to evidence that they are far from the mind of those who accounts them false Churches All this say they is more then as if in nothing they were to be complyed with nor their Churches to be communicated with in any thing which should argue Church Communion more is said and done by those who account them false Churches section 3 His second obj Sect. 49. Answ Sect. 50. is but a fiction set up by himself that he may seem at least to gain a victory We use not to reason so many has been converted under Presbyteriall Government doth not this seal it to be of God We know many have been and doubts not but some are at this day converted under Papall Government which is very Antichristianisme But this Sr we tell you that Presbyteriall Government in the exercise thereof has been the blessed means under God of Converting souls reduceing them from their sinfull wayes to God and his Son Christ Jesus the terrour of evill doers the preserver of his Church the Hedge that has guarded the Vineyard of the Lord from Foxes the very Hammer of Errours Haeresies and Haereticks and therefore is so much at this day maligned and hated of all such that in these lamentable times has turned aside unto their loose and erroneous wayes 'T is true Presbyterians takes it for no good Argument to prove Episcopall Government to be of God that many were Converted under it and believes it was a Government of mans invention Yet Presbyterians never thought of Churches under Episcopall Government in which the truth of the Gospel was Preached and Sacraments administred according to Christs institution for their substance as you think of Presbyteriall that they were false Churches But something more of this in considering his next Objection and Answ thereunto which fully unbowels the Authors design against Presbyterian Churches section 4 The Objection he frameth to himself is this But many Godly being in the Presbyterian way is it not more proper to purge then to pull down all To make use of the root and not up with root and branch To which his Answer in summe is that it was just so objected by the Godly in England when the Presbyterians would have down with our Episcopall Church But it behoved to be up root and branch So must now the Presbyterian The Lords controversie has come about to it and means the same And thereupon he gives his plain and faithfull warning to his dear Brethren Does this man know of what spirit he is To speak so Edomitelike of all Presbyterian Churches Down with them raze them to the ground up with root and branch of them Hoc Ithacus velit magno mercentur Atridae I think the man has wished a peece of acceptable service to Antichrist and his father the Devil Lord grant him mercy of it 'T is none of our pleading for the Presbyterian way that many godly being in it therefore simply purging of Presbyterian Churches were more proper then rooting up and pulling down all If any man Sir has come to reason with you thus poorly for Presbyterian Churches we doubt not but ere that time he has dealt treacherously against the truth We tell you the Presbyterian way is Gods way instituted in his Word the contrary whereof you but beggingly suppose in framing your Objection but has not nor ever will prove Yet this we affirme that albeit there be in Churches corruptions not only in the conversations of many persons but also in some things in the Worship and Ordinances yet if they be not such corruptions as everts and destroyes the foundation and substance of Religion But there is therein the substance of the Gospel orthodoxly Preached the Sacraments for their substantialls agreeable to their institution the way to be kept is purge out the old leaven And there is neither in Old nor in New Testament warrand for separating from or pulling down and rooting up such Churches And as to that Mr. Lockier alledgeth that Presbyterians would have down Episcopall Churches Either he has not understood or misrepresented Presbyterians mind in that matter Indeed Presbyterians were zealous to have the corrupt office of Prelacy plucked up root and branch because a plant that God had never planted in his Church and could not hear of a purging or circumcising of it that some would been at by clipping from them officialls and such other appendicles and limiting them thus and thus But that the whole frame of Churches that were under Prelaticall government should be razed down to the ground pluckt up root and branch cast all in a heap of ruine that out of the ruines thereof their should been picked out here and there some stones to build up new Churches it never entered in the thoughts of some Presbyterians Nay but on the contrary even in the time that Prelats possessed their Government sound Presbyterians as with the one hand they did fight against Prelats the corrupt Officers So did they at that same time with the other hand against Separatists with whom Mr. Lockier here agrees maintaining the Churches of England to be true Churches from whose communion it was not lawfull to separat Witnesse amongst sundry others that grave and judicious peece written by sundry non-conforme Divines jointly in the times of Prelats and published by Mr. Rathband An. 1604. section 5 But Mr. Lockier in his SECT 53. goes about to prove that it is not purging that must be applyed to Presbyterian Churches but they must be pulled down and pluckt up root and branch or utterly separated from His discourse in summe commeth to this much When the forme of Churches or their matter is right tho many things may be done amisse then purging may be used but when matter and forme both are corrupt and naught as it is in Presbyterian Churches For forme knit by situation and by forrain forinsecall Elderships For matter three parts of four naught prophane Atheists of Elders and people So that the Church state is quite dead 'T is not a man but a carcase not a Church but a nest of unclean birds a den of theeves to depart is proper But to talk of purging such the dead is discourse full of weaknesse if not of unwillingnesse to see and censure our own shame â—…sw Verily Sr I am of the mind that any judious man that reads your discourse in this Section will account it such as is full of that which ye charge on others weaknesse
walk together c. 4. And our Brethren when they protest against an Assembly do not submit unto it section 7 Here is sweet stuffe forsooth very Brounisticall separation ingrain'd That if any things be corrupted in a Church suppose wicked and scandalous persons be retained therein and admitted to Ordinances albeit therein be the true Doctrine of the Gospel Preached and worship for the acts thereof and other Ordinances for their substance right Godly Christians must separate from such Churches and may not in the very instituted Ordinances of Christ and true exercise of worship joyn with such Churches wherein such wicked persons joins with them This is the drift and upshot of this passage as any discerning man may perceive tho it be very intricately and confusedly expressed We shall not need to fall upon a refutation of this vile errour which has been so learnedly and fully refuted of old by the Orthodox Ancients especially Augustin and Optatus in Donatists by the first Reformers in the fantastick Anabaptists See particularly Mr. Rutherfurds Learned Disputes on this purpose in his Peaceable Plea and in his Due Right of Presbytery I shall for the present note but some few things on that which Mr. Lockier hath here section 8 And first to the propounding of the case in the Object as it is so generally and comprehensively expressed If things be corrupted in the Church and I protest against them may I not go on with that Church We owne not the affirmative of it We acknowledge that it is not lawfull to go on with any Church in the practice of things that are corrupt in it 2. We acknowledge further that there may be such corrupt things in a Church or a society taking unto them the name and profession of a Church as that it is not lawfull to go on with such a Church or join with them in Church communion at all as where the Worship is grossely idolatrous or Doctrine is publickly taught or professed contrary to the very foundation of Christianity But bring the case to the particular corruption instanced by the Author and then we say that if in a Church through negligence or loosnesse of discipline corrupt members be admitted or wicked scandalous persons be admitted to the Communion the Godly indeed ought in an orderly way to testify against such a corruption to say to Archippus to the Minister and Rulers take heed to your Ministry to mourn for such abuses in the Church But ought not to separat from that Church and the exercise of the true Worship and Ordinances of Christ therein But may go on and partake with that Church in warranted acts of Worship participation of the Sacraments in the exercise of all Gods instituted Ordinances and yet be free of the sin of corrupt fellow partakers of these Ordinances and of the sin of Rulers sinfully admitting such enjoy Gods presence in the Ordinances as well as if all joining with them were holy and good and to say that other mens wickednesses in abuse of Ordinances prejudices or defiles these Ordinances to me using them aright for my self and testifying against mourning for others abuse thereof is a wild errour contrary to the stream of holy Scripture both in the Old and new Test as has been abundantly demonstrated by these I last mentioned section 9 Now for his exceptions against this To the first to protest against a thing as evil and wicked and yet daily and continually to go on in the acting of that thing and practizing it is indeed a wicked mocking of God and man But daily and continually to go on in the exercise of a lawfull and necessary duty in the company of wicked persons against whose wickednesse I do testifie and does all that is incumbent to me in my station is not to mock or dissemble nor to do the thing I protest against I am but a mere passive or has no concurrence to the wickednesse of others But there is here in Mâ— Lockiers words a grosse supposing or begging of the very thing mainly in Question viz. That if wicked persons be admitted to fellowship in a Church as to the communion of the Lords Supper that the thing a Godly Christian ought to protest or testifie against is all joyning in the Ordinance when such wicked persons are joining therein with them This is a very begging of the thing in Question and utterly false The thing the Godly ought to testifie and protest against is the wickeds presuming to abuse the Ordinance and the Rulers sinfull permitting them so to do But to say he does or should protest that no Godly person ought to use the Ordinance of God or performe warrantable Worship when wicked persons either thrust themselves in with them or negligent Rulers permits them so to do is to suppose the thing in Question and is unwarrantable yea contrare to the current streame of the practise of the Godly under the Old and New Testament both yea to the practise of Jesus Christ himself in the Church of the Jews To his second exception 'T is true in practicall things it is not so much a mans word as his practise which gives the dislike But the Question is whether the performance of a lawfull and necessary duty of worship or exercise of a true Ordinance of Jesus Christ for instance partaking of the Lords Supper to remember his death till he come againe when and where wicked and scandalous persons will thrust themselves in to do it prophanely or are permitted by Rulers so to do be such a practicall thing as I am oblidged to dislike as a thing unlawfull for me to do this is the Question the negative whereof we hold to be the truth of God held forth in his Word The instance produced by the Author for clearing this his second exception viz. of a man in an Idolatrous Church protesting against the Masse and yet still going to Masse is so grossely and absurdly impertinent that one may wonder how it could be alledged in this purpose by an intelligent man The Masse is even upon the mater one of the grossest Idolatries that ever was in the world And for a man to go to Masse when he pretends to protest to go against it is to adde to commission of Idolatry mocking of God and sinning against light professedly So that Mr. Lockier needed not make it a mater of doubting how well such a practise should please God or deliver the man from guiltinesse But what is this to participating of a true Ordinance of Jesus Christ for instance the communion of the Lords Table in a Church not Idolatrous but may be negligent and loose in the exercise of Discipline and permitting wicked scandalous persons to participate in that Ordinance when the Godly participating with them testifies against such abuse in the Ordinances Nay can it be freed from great rashnesse I will not say that which I might to parallel these two together But yet farther to bring in as a parallel
are against Anabaptists all their writings shew and how much they lay to our charge for ushering in and countenancing this Tenent Answ How we holding Baptism to be the seal and solemn admission of Visible Church members do gratifie the judgement and practice of the Anabaptists in that which is Anabaptism their excluding of Infants of Christians from Baptism I professe my self one that cannot see The Author would have done well to have assayed to shew us how that any way advantageth their Tenent Indeed he sayeth true that Presbyterians are much against Anabaptists Doctrine But would hereby fasten a peece of dottage upon them Because that being so much against that Doctrine they yet maintain a Tenet concerning Baptisme that much gratifies it but let him assay to clear this for it is not enough to say any one may see it What ground there is to looke upon his Tenet concerning the allowed matter of the visible Church as tending to Anabaptism we have shewed before in the 1. part of this Examination But it seems to me that in this place the Author does not a little gratifie the judgement of the totall enemies of Baptism and Socinians that accounts it needlesse amongst Christians While as he averres that there may be a Church he must mean a Christian Church else he speaks not to purpose before baptism and that even before they be baptized acting eminent Church acts as making to themselves Ministers If this to averre that persons may be a Church without baptism and men may be Ministers of a Christian Church without baptism if this Assertion be not advantagious to enemies of Baptism I leave it to the Authors second thoughts section 14 His last Ojection But since this opinion prevailed we see a vast toleration of all strange and damnable Doctrines This indeed is an heavy prejudice against your way and the thing in fact is too too palpably true and you could not here deny it but only goes about to extenuat yea and in a great measure to justifie it and so much the more sad is this charge against you that not only hath this thing eventually followed since your opinion has prevailed But it tends to this in the very nature of it while as it attributes to every single Congregation may be of seven or ten persons an Independent supream Ecclesiasticall power in matters of Religion so that if any such Congregation should hold and teach any Haereticall Doctrine there is no Ecclesiastick power on earth that can authoritatively interpose to reclaim or censure them And for the Civil Magistrate he say you must take heed how he useth his sword for a weed-hook in these maculis mentis But now briefly see we what the Author returneth in answer to this charge section 15 We are willing to be a terrour to evill works and as unwilling to be a terrour to good We are not so well skilled in divine things as to tell what every thing is in the bud We are patient more then some would have us till the bud blossome and bear and when we see the fruit naught upon all occasions we give our witnesse against it by dispute discountenance and otherwayes as we understand the Word to warrand us Answ Alas Sr are you so ill skilled in Divine things as that you cannot tell what these many vile errors vented and taught by many in these lands are which yet to this day are permitted without any terrour used against them and think you that terrour enough against such things to Dispute against them as for discountenancing them we professe we can find no discountenancing of any maintaining errors amongst us more then those that are most orthodox and for your other wayes of witnessing against them we know not what it is forsooth Sr a bold Haeretick will care much for all your Disputes yet I beleeve it is little testimony even this way that this Author has given against the grosse errours of the time let him shew if ever he has moved his tongue or imployed his pen against Anabaptism Antinomianism Arminianism Socinianism and other grosse errours which he knowes aboundeth amongst his Countrey-men both at home and in the Army in this Land as 〈◊〉 has done with much bitterness against the Government of the Church of Scotland which yet is according to the truth of God and if not he personally * I know not if Mr. Lockier has taken the Covenant yet the supream Representative of his Nation and many of the prime Officers of the Army stand bound by the Covenant and Oath of GOD to maintain and defend section 16 But saith he if Tares and Wheat must grow together into the World till the end thereof the Civill Magistrate had need to be wary how he useth his Sword for a Weed-hook in maculis mentis spots of the mind lest Presbytery get a by-blow amongst the rest Some mens weapons to fight in their quarrels are to us as Sauls Armour to David too heavy we cannot tell how to wield them Because we take a litle stone and a sling when others would take an halter and a crosse do we then give a vast toleration Not by might nor by power Civill but by Gods Spirit in his Word and other Ordinances we fight in these quarrels Which weapons the not so terrible to look on yet are mighty through God to east down strong imaginations of vain men Answ 1. They are not meer maculae mentis that we think the Magistrates Sword should medle with But to extenuat damnable Doctrines vented to the high dishonour of God and seduceing of souls from the Truth of God to the destruction of their souls under the name of spots of the mind favours little of the true zeal of God and to reckon in Presbyterie amongst these is to call light darknesse for which I pray God grant the Aâ—thor Repentance 2. If the Civil Magistrate must use the Sword to be a terrour to evill works either he must use it as a Weed-hook against such Haereticall Doctrines or you must say that Haereticall Doctrines are no evill works which is to contradict the Word of God in terminis Philip. 3. 2. 3. It is but an odious intimation that we would have an halter and crosse taken against the teachers of every erroneous Doctrine Indeed there be some blasphemous Doctrines and not a few of them in the time As a halter or a crosse is too little for the obstinat venters of them * I have heard with mine ears soÌ„e boldly avow that every man anointed with the spirit is as much a Christ as JESUS the Sonne of GOD. but there are others wayes whereby the Civil Magistrats might imploy their power for suppressing false Doctrines from being brought forth to the dishonouring of God if they were as zealous for Gods honour as they are for their own interest 〈◊〉 4. While as you do here take off the Civil power from medling with these strange and damnable doctrines and allowes